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The worst thing anybody ever said to me (the eating disorder that will not die)

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Twoapenny:
Erin, have only skimmed through the posts but the thing that struck me was whether you could change your goal to perhaps something health related rather than weight?  Say being able to do a certain number of sit ups or run a certain number of miles or swim a certain number of lengths - that sort of thing, rather than having a number in mind that you 'fail' by not getting to?

My guess is that you put youself through hell to try to please your mum, you got to this ridiculously tiny weight that she wanted you to get to - and then you still weren't good enough.  I'd guess that somewhere inside your body remembers that and stops you doing it again.  So I'm wondering if changing the goal would help you get to know your body in a positive way and see it as a living, breathing, incredible organism that needs to be fueled in the right way, rather than seeing it as something disgusting that's only acceptable if you get to a certain magic number?

I agree with all the 'love yourself as you are' stuff being difficult - I feel happier slimmer because I just feel better for it, because it generally means I'm eating well, exercising and generally happy with myself.  Just a quick thought for now! :)

Redhead Erin:
Phoenix and Tup,

There is so much in your replies, and for some reason I can't take it all in right now.  The ED has become bigger than Mom or me or all the food in the world.  It's not even entirely about food any more. It has grown to be about my likability as a friend to other women  and my incompetence and inability to achieve my life's goals in general.

If I cannot manage my own weight, how on earth am I going to manage anything else in my life? I could not achieve even this one goal, so how can I possibly achieve any others?  And I certainly don't want anyone to hate me for my success (Don't hate me because I'm beautiful....)

As for striving for an unrealistic weight,  I really am not.  I am working with a trainer, and have looked at a bunch of weight charts, and the goal I have in mind (145 pounds) is really on the high end of my healthy range.  It is the weight I was supposed to be in the Army. 

Tup, I considered what you said about changing my goals from a weight goal to something else. This took a little thought because I really am quite shallow in this respect and it really is all about my looks.  I am an exotic dancer by trade and a pin-up model as a hobby.  There is no way this cannot be at least partially about my looks. I looked up the measurements of my favorite pin-up idol, Bettie Page. http://www.bettiepage.com/gallery/bikini/index.html# This is what I found:

Height: 5 feet 5 1/2 inches
Weight: 128-130 (during 1950's)
Measurements: 36 - 24 - 35

According to Marilyn Monroe's dressmaker, Marilyn measurements were 35-22-35.  Hardly unattainable. 

I cannot do anything about the bust measurement except build up my pecs, but the waist and hip measurements are within my ability to change. 

I really want to give this issue some more attention, but my dumb husband is sitting next to me, bugging me about a 4-H project and I cant focus on it right now.  More later.

Redhead Erin:
HEre is one bit of the puzzle:

Mom always gave me to believe that women hate other women whom they perceive as more attractive than themselves. She herself was once pretty, but she never kept up with herself and for the last 40 years has been just as plain as dirt.  Yet she was bitter and jealous of good-looking women, always insinuating they were either trash  or sluts, and generally selfish or irresponsible for investing the time and money to make themselves look nice. 

Unfortunately, I have seen Mom's theory that all women hate hate pretty women this proven time and again at my work.  Granted, dancers are some of the cattiest, nastiest, most vindictive women on the planet, to be sure.   I know my work is an artificial environment where every woman's self worth and earning potential is related directly to her perceived outward attractiveness.  However, years of being exposed to that toxic environment only served to reinforce the original message.

Now I am trying to transition out of dancing into a new career and to spend more time doing things with my family.  Doing things with my husband and son means meeting the wives or mothers of their friends.  Many of these women have not made their appearance their first priority.  It would be logical to assume that, if they do not appear overly concerned with their own appearance, then they likely do not care about  mine. 

However, my fears get the better of me and I am terrified to the point of aloofness that they will think poorly of me for investing so much time and energy in my appearance.  I am afraid they will think I am a rotten bitch or worse, that I am out to get their men.  These ideas come directly from my mother, who told me in as many words, that that is what women think of attractive women. 

So once again I am in a quandary.  I don't want to sabotage my weight loss, but I don't want to alienate my new friends, either.

Hopalong:
Dolly Parton goes to the revival? Or to the 4-H meeting?
Or kind of an Erin Brockovitch style in a buttoned-up culture?

Women internalize the sexism around them, and some lash out at
themselves and other women. I just approach every single female
I meet as my ally whether she knows it or not. Make more friends
that way.

I can understand that some women would blame you automatically
for "man stealing" if they know your line of work. These would be
the same women who blame/attack the horrible "other woman"
for "seducing" their husband/s. I do think there's moral culpability
in others' marriages if one steps into that space. However, I also
always found that sad and unfair. HE broke a vow by being disloyal
or disrespectful or straying or leering. Why is she pilloried for it?
(Because our culture hates women, that is why. And so the world.)

And, I have a lot of amateur armchair theories about why women
go into sex work or just dancing work. I know there are proud and
liberated exceptions but I think most go there from hurt. And the
industry takes advantage of their hurt. And the world rolls on and
the club owners and pimps get rich. The injustice of that bothers me
a lot more than the flaunting of sexuality.

My inner prude has learned a lot from hearing about your life, Erin.
Thank you for sharing it here.

I'm wondering if there's any sort of women's group, support group,
class, workshop etc., where you can get to know women during a time
where the focus is OFF the vessel and ON the content...when really
everybody in the room is there because they need to share their
"contents" in an authentic way with others.

Couple of my closest friends I would never have "picked out"
based on obvious things...but we got to know each other slowly,
and in real ways. And now I see the contents.

The other thing that popped into my head was how the more
intentionally I try to love myself, the less my distress over aging.
I don't LIKE the changes, but I don't feel ASHAMED. Gradually,
I'm beginning to interpret each one positively. Earned. Like
weather. So...as a mountain or stone is formed and weathered
and those are beautiful, that's how I'm looking at old bodies.
(Might as well practice with my own...)

"History Detectives" on PBS last night had a episode/section on
a lost image of Betty Paige.

Hops

sKePTiKal:
Oh jeez - don't have a lot of time this a.m. - but Penny: this is sooo well said, and helpful, and easier to understand than how I describe my inner "resistance" -- that paralyzes me, then "defeats" my wish to achieve my goals, and ultimately leads to self-sabotage:


--- Quote ---My guess is that you put youself through hell to try to please your mum, you got to this ridiculously tiny weight that she wanted you to get to - and then you still weren't good enough. I'd guess that somewhere inside your body remembers that and stops you doing it again.  So I'm wondering if changing the goal would help you get to know your body in a positive way and see it as a living, breathing, incredible organism that needs to be fueled in the right way, rather than seeing it as something disgusting that's only acceptable if you get to a certain magic number?
--- End quote ---

Our bodies DO remember - they want their current "security blankets", their normal "comfort zone" habits... of eating poorly, inactivity, etc. (and the body doesn't "think" per se... and so doesn't realize that it's avoiding/denying... what our emotional and rational goals are. Those original, wounding experiences can be SOOOOO painful at the time - that it's even felt at the body level. This is a negative "body memory"... when we find ourselves struggling up the "gravel mountain"... one step forward.... 15 back... and it's composed of a toxic combination of things. I've tried working one color thread out of the toxic ball of yarn at a time... and I just want to set the whole damn ball on fire - frustration, lack of patience with myself, wanting a "magic pill solution"... but then: isn't that exactly what I experienced from mom? (the message: you can't do it right!! you're so stupid!! give it to me. And then, whatever it was - it wasn't something I achieved or created; it was mom's - I felt she stole it from me -- and I HATED the end result).

Your suggestion of changing the goal (and I'd include even the wording and how I talk to myself about it)... is practical and helpful. I call it approaching the problem sideways -- instead of a head-on confrontation. I persuade - not demand. Sort of a "body whisperer" approach. I have struggled now for YEARS with how to change those "self-uncare" or "self-neglect" habits... and what I found was that I CAN make changes... if I start with what seems like little, teeny-tiny - and totally unrelated things. I'm proud and a little embarrassed of my new habit of brushing my teeth - TWICE a day; instead of just once. It's built in and automatic now. I started out leaving myself a post-it reminder... until now, if I don't feel like brushing at night (and this does come up)... it feels uncomfortable. I don't like that feeling... so working with like/dislike is part of the change process, too. So now, I have a self-reinforcing habit to brush before bed. That was the goal. Repetition... pure, simple repetition can undo the old, bad habits.   But beware of making exceptions - excuses to yourself - or rationalizations: like, it won't matter if I don't brush tonight; it's only one night... that won't undo my progress. YES, it WILL... because it's much easier to return to old habits that lasted so much longer than this new one.

On the weight and body image - there's nothing like getting older to make you confront your issues here. You can't run and you can't hide... LOL!! So, the self-talk I'm using now - with mixed results, tho - is to talk about "training"... I'm competitive; training makes the assumption that I can "improve" from where I am now... stronger, more toned, better core muscles. The self-talk about losing weight is almost ALWAYS starting from the premise and assumption that there is something WRONG (pick a mean, negative word: lazy, no self-discipline, whatever) with where I am now. That kinda guarantees that whatever this week's goal is... is only reinforcing that old original experience of: no matter what I do, what my success is - it won't be good enough. Training starts with: here are your strengths, and weaknesses... look at what you can do now; where you are now... POSITIVE and what you want to work on. No pressure; no deadlines; no counting calories... just " I have this goal and it matters to ME, because I matter to ME. " The rest of it, is just repetition. (and I gotta work on this...)

Erin - before you lock yourself into the damned if I do, damned if I don't situation by saying achieving your body-image goal of your definition of beautiful has a guaranteed negative outcome... I gotta ask: what do you think beautiful FEELS like, inside? How frequently do you feel this now? In the past? NOT what it looks like -- that's all the societal stuff imposed our culture and collective understanding (and how often have we acknowledged beauty in people who don't meet those imposed "definitions"??)

I call it: feeling comfortable in my own skin. With the extra 20 lbs I don't want; with the skin - immune/allergy - crap I have; with the freckles that so upset my inner child; and not apologizing nor hiding the fact that I color my Andy Warhol white hair... just for ME - just so I don't have to look at it and feel that I'm sooo old, that it "doesn't matter" if I lose the 20 lbs... or get heathier... or...

it's kinda silly really - but having this hair color and consistently having a really good haircut (that I don't have to fuss with for it to look good) has been a very, very important step forward - even though a lot of women would see it as a teeny-tiny-baby step and maybe accuse me of not wanting to accept my aging. I'm reinforcing forward progress with this hair - that there's nothing "wrong" with me... and that I do MATTER, to ME... enough to, take care of myself and work toward the rest of my goals. It feels like I'm bribing myself or tricking myself sometimes... and maybe I am tricking that old "body memory" into accepting a change from it's old, yucky past... into trying something new that feels better. (All's fair in LOVE and working on oneself... getting well and healthy and happy).

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