Author Topic: My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This  (Read 67648 times)

sleepyhead

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #165 on: March 08, 2005, 12:45:07 PM »
Longtire: Glad you have a therapist that you get along with. Good luck! You say that it is your problems coming up, and that is true, your problems are what made you choose your wife in the first place. But that doesn't take away the fact that her treatment of you have made your problems worse. You had the wound, but having it constantly digged into by your wife will just infect it. All you can do is to aid the healing best you can and use plenty of disinfectant (this board, therapist, any supportive friends etc.). But I do believe that it is hard for the wound to heal while you have someone digging into it. I wish you could get away, but I also now how hard it is to get up and go. Whatever you do, take care of yourself.
Rip it to shreds and let it go - Garbage

Anonymous

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #166 on: March 08, 2005, 01:01:54 PM »
Quote from: longtire
I grew up in a house where neither of my parents had ANY facility with their feelings.  They did not discuss their feelings, problems, solutions, approaches, understandings, etc. EVER that I remember.  Not only was none of this modeled for me, when I tried to express my feelings, my parents acted like they didn't know what I was talking about.  I received NO, NONE, ZERO validation for my existence, feelings, worth, reasons for existing, etc.


Yep. this is the main issue, imo. Your parents neglected you so terribly that you're confused when it comes to self-knowledge and self-agency. They didn't even mirror that you existed at all. This was tragic parenting. In fact I feel pretty pissed off toward them. But if you have a good enough therapist who can be a role model to you, and if you can internalize his modeling, things will change for you. Internalizing does take some time, it happens in small increments. So be patient and keep up the good work.

bunny

Brigid

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #167 on: March 08, 2005, 01:31:04 PM »
Mudpup,


Quote
Maybe the other letter was an F, for Forgets what he is.


Or maybe is stands for f_ _ _ _ed up!  Just kidding.  Its what an older sister can say to her wise guy younger brother.  And you are part of that not-so-intelligent hairy gender.

I also needed to practice my new found quoting ability.  Sorry for interjecting.

Brigid

Anonymous

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #168 on: March 08, 2005, 01:43:13 PM »
Quote
Or maybe is stands for f_ _ _ _ed up!


Gee whiz, thanks sis! Glad you enjoy practicing on me. :lol:  :lol:  :lol:
Actually the same thing crossed my mind when I wrote the original post.

mud

Brigid

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #169 on: March 08, 2005, 01:47:53 PM »
Did anyone see the segment on the Today Show this morning where they were talking about toxic relationships.  The first thing they discussed was Narcissism.  Katie was interviewing a woman who is a psychologist and a man who is a psychologist and columnist on relationships.  The first thing the man said when Katie mentioned this topic was "get out."  She quickly dismissed him and said they did not want to promote the ending of marriages, but both of those people made it pretty clear that you were doomed if you were in this kind of relationship.  They said the only hope there was would be for the N to recognize the deep wound inside themselves that caused this behavior to develop and get intense therapy to heal it.  They also admitted that this rarely happens as N's do not feel they have a problem and it is everyone elses' fault.

I realize that I am saying things we all know, but it was the first time I've heard it discussed on television.

Brigid

longtire

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #170 on: March 08, 2005, 02:34:52 PM »
I wanted to explain something I said confusingly earlier.  I believe that I have to find my source of self-esteem and self-worth inside myself.  It is great to have people like all of you here to help prop me up.  The problem comes when I'm around someone like my wife instead of all of you.  If I don't have a strong sense of myself that I carry around with myself, then I will fall victim again.  I wasn't trying to say that all people are scary, but there are SOME people who are scary and I want to be able to survive contact with them.

Thats my goal.  But I really do feel ungrounded and unanchored inside.  I know what I see/hear/feel/smell/taste.  I know what I feel (emotions).  I know what I think.  I know what I believe.  I don't know if any of it is "right."  I don't know if I am really connected or if these things are just a figment of my imagination.  Who gets to determine right?  HOW do you determine right?  It seems like this sense is something you HAVE to get from other people.  I imagine that usually, as a small child your parents or guardians tell you certain things are right and certian things are wrong.  Lacking the ability to judge, most children accept these judgements as universal truths.  When they grow up and become more aware they can then go back and challenge these beliefs as an independent adult.  But still, they have the security (correct or not) of right and wrong to fall back on.  Myabe (I hope) I'm missing something here, but its seems like this security comes about for most people by blindly accepting what their parents/authorities/society tells them.  How do I acquire this for myself now as a thinking, judging, independent adult?

I can see how many people are damaged by picking up twisted judgements from their unhealthy parents.  This is even a step deeper.  Growing up I got the message that none of these internal things matter, that they are irrelevant.  These internal things felt like they were *me* though, and I wasn't willing to give that up.  I went into a shell to protect myself (the things inside).  No wonder I believed I was an alien growing up.  I was too aware of and too connected to my "stuff" to be able to give it up as my parents did.  Probably because I already had to rely only on myself even before that age.

I'm not even sure what to call what I lack.  Is it self-esteem?  Is it self-worth?  I love myself and believe that I am a caring, loving person with a lot to offer others.  Neither one of those terms seems to really fit.  Is it self-attachment?  I'm not sure if there is such a word, but that feels closer to me.  I can attach to other people, pets, places, things, art.  Its me that feels like *I* am unattached to the world somehow.  I float close by, but am not actually connected.
longtire

- The only thing that was ever really wrong with me was that I used to think there was something wrong with *me*.  :)

Anonymous

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #171 on: March 08, 2005, 02:45:10 PM »
HOW do you determine right?

Longtire, this is one way, by testing yourself against things you might not agree with.

Like speaking up when someone makes a racist/sexist/cruel comment in your presence. By knowing what your own values and morals are and not being afraid to voice them. By testing yourself in those values in morals - do I really think that? Or have I changed my mind?

I think we're all constantly changing, almost different people from one 'time' to the next 'time'.

Can you list activities, ways of being, that you don't agree with? That you couldn't do or be? For me knowing what I'm not is a huge help.

Brigid

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #172 on: March 08, 2005, 06:30:31 PM »
Longtire,
I saw my therapist today and we talked about this whole issue of hanging onto a relationship even when you know it is not healthy.  When I read your struggle I know I could have been you.

My T says that my reason for wanting to hang on was due to having had such a lousy childhood and never feeling that I was part of a family, loved or cared about.  He is still amazed at how little grief I have demonstrated over my mother's death in early January.  When I got married and had my children, I finally had the family I had longed for all my life.  That desperation to have that intact family kept my blind, deaf and dumb to the quality of my relationship with my H.  I allowed him to neglect me and treat me like a piece of the furniture because I did not want that family to come apart.  It was far from perfect, but it was better than what I had grown up with and I was so happy with my children.

I don't know if any of this resonates with you, but I just thought I would pass it along.

Brigid

ZsaZsa

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #173 on: March 08, 2005, 07:00:31 PM »
OMG! Wow! It's time to cut your losses and get on with your life! You don't need to be around someone who only has selective memory or who is constantly controlling you...you are already emotionally detached from S...now lets move on and have a happy life! Remember..this is the Show not the dress rehearsal! What a great guy you sound like...it's S' loss! As old "Blue Eyes" would say "pick yourself up, dust yourself off and get back in the race...that's life"
I don't pull any punches, I call it like I see it! I hope you aren't offended!

God Bless, ZsaZsa

mum

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #174 on: March 08, 2005, 08:39:24 PM »
Hey, Longtire. Your musings on "self" make me think of "the Power of Now" by Ekhar Tolle.  He had a life changing experience when his formerly miserable "self" said " I can no longer live with myself"  then he realized we all have two distinct "selves".... One is our life situation and one is our life. Realizing the distinction has helped me tremendously.

Another book I thought of here, was "The Secret of the Shadow (the power of owning your whole story) by Debbie Ford.  Her premise is similar..we are not our "story".  Our stories help to make us into who we are, but we  do not need to be limited by them.

Bottom line....all esoteric nonsense aside...soon you may get to a point where you will need to (crass, I know, but) S..t or get off the pot!

I realize when I over think things that I am practicing avoidance.  Which can be good....but not when it gets me "stuck".

Don't overdo the thinking.  How are you FEELING and what do you want to feel like in your life? Don't worry about HOW to get there....just try to feel what you want.  Then relax....it will come (or maybe it has?)

Anonymous

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #175 on: March 08, 2005, 09:09:01 PM »
longtire,

An idea: Rent or watch movies/tv that show someone behaving in ways you'd like to emulate and internalize. [One suggestion is the original Kung Fu TV series with David Carridine.] Have fun with it.

bunny

longtire

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Comments and replies over the past few days - random
« Reply #176 on: March 08, 2005, 11:54:20 PM »
On reflection, I believe that the joint counselor was/is invested in "their techniques" working rather than fixing the problems.  For example, when she told me that I should have talked with my wife and gotten her viewpoint early in my marriage I told her that I did that in a soft spoken, passive body language way.  She told me that I obviously could not have.  I couldn't have done it "correctly" without the awareness from their Imago retreat.  I was offended at the time, but now, I'm thoroughly disgusted.  I think that this is why I feel like she sided with my wife.  My wife bought into the whole Imago thing and got to claim that I had never done it right before.  Yeah, OK forget that I've been mentally and spritually aware my entire life, and forget that I went through 7 years of therapy, and forget all those self-help books I read, and even forget the fact that I thought about my marriage and my wife and what I could do to help improve things WAY more than was healthy, I hadn't taken her class yet!!!!  How could I possibly do ANYTHING right without that.  :evil: I'm starting to wonder if the counselor has some supressed N tendencies and may feel some sort of bond with my wife or despise me for being the victim all those years.  In any event, the counselor completely failed to address the fact that there was (verbal) abuse going on in this relationship and that "standard" couples therapy would be HARMFUL until that was addressed.  Now that I've had a couple of weeks of distance, I feel traumatized and missed by the joint counseling, though some good came out of it for me.

I didn't have an emotional grounding growing up.  Now I realize that God made me the way I'm supposed to be.  There was never anything wrong with me.  My parents were not able to give me that message and instead passed on how they felt about themselves, that there was something wrong with them.  I feel exactly what I'm supposed to feel.  If that's not like anyone else then it makes it that much more rare and valuable.  I just did an inner dialogue and invited in the part of me trying to protect me by keeping me ungrounded, distanced, unconnected to the people around me.  His name is "bin" ??? and he's 3 years old.  He started protecting me after he asked for closeness and was rejected outright by my parents.  He has agreed to give up the protection to the adult me and go back to doing what he was made for, pure loving and living.  I think the problems I've had over the last day or two were "bin" putting up a last ditch fight to keep me "protected," even though the rest of me was moving toward being open and connected with people around me.

I no longer believe that leaving this marriage is about whether my wife is NPD, BPD, or anything else.  I am simply not attracted to her any longer.  I don't mean just physically, I mean I just don't see any point to sharing the rest of my life with her.  If ALL her issues fell off her this moment, I would feel the same way.  The reality is she still has all those issues which makes it even more difficult than it would have to be.  Staying, going, or otherwise.  This was more about me finding my center than it ever was about her.  I think that I've been codependent with her for so long, it took this for me to realize that ITS NOT ABOUT HER!!!  Its never been about her.  Its about me, and I'm alright.  There's nothing wrong with me except that in the past I kept insisting that there was something wrong with me.  Unintentional parental brainwashing (UPB).  Ooohh!  Look at my new acronym!   :D

I can't say that I always enjoy solving my problems and agonizing over the possibilities before taking action.  But, this is MY way to work through things.  It does work out best for me in the end to pay up front.  Don't expect me to stop complaining when I'm in the middle of it, though!

As a child I didn't get to choose my parents or what they taught me or how they related (or didn't) to me.  I do get to choose my family now.  I choose my daughter because she is just the neatest person I have ever been priveleged to know.  I choose the people here who have helped me so much with support and suggestions.  I choose a few special friends from work who can empathize and share their own experiences beyond the norm.  I'm choosing people at church who are caring, supportive, and accepting.  I even choose my parents (when I'm feeling self-sufficient).  I've done a lot of work in that area over the years!  I choose my cat, who doesn't care what else is going on in my life, he is very direct with his commands.  I don't choose "good" people or "perfect" people.  I choose people who are willing to risk sharing themselves.  Knowing the risks, they are able to appreciate the gift of my sharing as I appreciate theirs.

I own my story, even the parts I don't know about yet.  It is painful to put a new chapter into the story.  Doing that involves rewriting some of the other chapters to get everything to fit together.  When I'm done, the story is giant steps better every time.  And best of all, its MY story.  Still, my story is the past.  I have today to act and tomorrow to choose.
longtire

- The only thing that was ever really wrong with me was that I used to think there was something wrong with *me*.  :)

mum

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #177 on: March 09, 2005, 12:14:52 AM »
Wow, Longtire, I hope you print out and save that last post.  You are pretty cool.  I hear a power in this voice that sounds true and pure.
Bless you. (and congratulations!)

Anonymous

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #178 on: March 09, 2005, 06:03:36 AM »
Quote
There's nothing wrong with me except that in the past I kept insisting that there was something wrong with me.

Is this one of those phrases you write out and keep in your wallet? Can I use it too please? Great, thanks. :D

Quote
Unintentional parental brainwashing (UPB). Ooohh! Look at my new acronym!
I love your new TLA!

Aren’t cats just so great?  8) Your post is joy to read longtire! portia - hey you tempted me out of hiding! Thanks again.

Anonymous

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My Long, Long Story.........I no longer Feel Alone With This
« Reply #179 on: March 09, 2005, 10:11:01 AM »
Longtire:

You sound so much more at peace.  I'm so glad! :D

You have an amazing talent with words.

Quote
Don't expect me to stop complaining when I'm in the middle of it, though!


To the contrary, let it out!!  There will be less baggage with you later.  Two steps forward, one step forward, 1/2 a step forward, pause, another wee step, another one...keep going Longtire.  There may be a bit of back stepping once in awhile, but for the most part, you are clearly moving forward!

GFN