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End of the Road Farm

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sKePTiKal:
Hmmm.

Seems Holly/Matt have chosen to do this the hard way -- ie, maintain a friendly respectful but still breaking up situation. Except Holly has noticed he's kind of working his way back into - well, if I'm just nice to her so she stays, then it can go back to what it used to be. She's been working hard all week winding up the production stages - and will likely have to work Monday too. So, there's a weekend where they can really talk. She's going to suggest an overnight at a friend's cabin to be somewhere OTHER than home to talk.

What she wants is a lot more independence and time off from the "same old same old" to determine - each of them - if they want to try to seriously work through their impasses. The summer would give them that space to decide. And it's not like they wouldn't talk; or even see each other during that time. Just in the space of last weekend, I watched her resettle into her "Holly-ness" from the various roles she maintains at work and at home with Matt. She has some serious depth to her and will most likely address her feelings for Matt in excruciating detail. I won't be privy to any of that until she's processed it into coherent form.

I think she's probably at the point, that this is now about her and her choices... and less about being the only one doing heavy lifting in a relationship - and not having much to show for it at the end of the day. So until I hear otherwise, I'm "doing" what needs "doing" by myself around here.

Hopalong:
Sounds like a good approach to me.

Being "best friend" to your child in this, her adult situation, and hearing every blow by blow might set you up for more destabilizing enmeshment, which you don't deserve. And can hurt you.

No unnecessary extra pain for Amber, is da rule.

Why can't we all have our own Carolyn Hax to drill us on boundaries???? I need her reminders over and over, it seems. (So nice that she's available....)

xxoo
Hops

sKePTiKal:
Well, it's INTERESTING Hops. Holly and I are really close. No doubt about it. But she became independent, at an earlier age than normal... for periods of time. She would move back home for months too, until she finally got her own place, by herself, at 18.

My T knew her from tai chi, as well. And when we were working through the boundary issues... I was worried precisely about enmeshment. Her comment was that Holly was so strong in herself, that I shouldn't worry about her at all -- in that way. And Hol and I have talked about it in detail at length... and we're both OK with the way it is. She knows I worry about her... and she reminds me that she's 40. LOL. I really don't have a thing to worry about with boundaries and Holly. She's been telling me to F off and mind my own business for so many years... and I say OK... and we only "analyze together" when she's trying to identify all her options or is afraid her perception is skewed one way or another.

Same with me; turn about is fair play between us. And yes, I chafe and squirm under that kind of "helpful comments" too. But we can do it, and keep on rockin' & rollin'. She was the toddler with temper tantrums; serious tantrums... and waited to really start talking. And when she found out that I could talk her through the intense emotional moments... if she talked to me... till the "waters calmed", she quickly internalized that as one of her "superpowers". She only very rarely shows that intensity to people... it freaks people out. But not mom. I let her vent it all, only saying enough to show I'm actively listening and getting what she's saying... and then she engages rational brain again on her own.

I was very young then, when we figured out how to do that. Before she talked, and during a tantrum, I just hugged her real close and absorbed the energy until it was spent. The comfort of that touch and security helped them go away completely. I guess I instinctively knew what to do because that was how I needed to be mothered. And wasn't. She would be fine in a short amount of time... and we'd go back to whatever was going on... as if it was completely normal. In time, she managed those times herself with lots of finesse and skill... and compassion for others. She knows that her intensity in those times is scary to people. It's like being in a lightning cloud and tornado all at the same time.

And when it's reversed - and she's doing that for me (there have been times) - people simply look at us as if OMG... there isn't going to be any going back from what's coming out of their mouths; and I'm uncomfortable in this situation... and when the energy is dispersed... we're just fine, but everyone else is confused. All in the space of maybe 5 minutes. LOL... There was a commercial awhile back for gelato. An Italian couple just going AT IT... and it's all resolved with a spoonful of the ice cream... until something else sets them off. It's like that.

The connection between us is strong enough to absorb it all, not infringe on each other's autonomy/independence, and not take offense or take the intensity personally - no matter what words come out. I don't know if that's a more primitive level of "socialization" or interaction... or if it's actually more evolved. Don't know; don't care. It's what works for us. LOL.

Hopalong:

--- Quote ---when she found out that I could talk her through the intense emotional moments... if she talked to me... till the "waters calmed", she quickly internalized that as one of her "superpowers"
--- End quote ---

That is amazing mothering, Amber. You have trained her not just to be dependent only on you for that level of understanding, but to internalize that kind of process and become her own "calmer."

No wonder she is so strong as an adult today. She understands her own intensity but now is realizing that she won't be dependent only on you, to be the only person who can understand and weather her storms. Very very hopeful.

I am awed. So now I'm back to picturing your own personal storm-savvy Viking to come shelter YOU in that kind of accepting, resolute embrace. You deserve it.

xxoo
Hops

sKePTiKal:
I think she's learning to not "depend" on anyone else to absorb it and help her dissapate it. It's NICE when there is someone there to help; just not necessary.  As much flailing as I've done the past few years, adapting to being alone, I'm finding there's just not much occasion for needing to deal with my own intense "storms". They're more like an average summer thunderstorm that freshens the air, removes humidity, and cools things off a bit.

If you've ever seen the History Channel series "Vikings"... while I strongly identify with the shield-maiden/mom/wife/farmer Lagertha... I also really really enjoy/understand Floki - the boat builder, who's always got one ear open to the Gods, to try to understand the mystery of life around him.

Independence matters to Hol. Responsible independence, and she forms strong connections with people too. She's always been socially oriented and very compassionate. But I raised kids to be independent; to think for themselves and not ONLY seek approval from their peer group; and to understand that the effort required - mentally, physically, emotionally - to maintain independent self-hood. I can not conceive of wanting kids to be dependent on me that way... shudder to think of such a thing! Ugh.

 :shock:

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