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Mindfulness and codependence thread

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Hopalong:
Did you mean Tupp or Hops?

Me, I lose track all the time....but thought you might've been responding to moi.

:)

Hops

lighter:

--- Quote from: Hopalong on March 09, 2020, 01:58:27 PM ---That's BIG, Lighter!
About the voice control and demeanor, and not channeling father. Bravo.  Yup yup yup yup. It feels super important right now.

I notice that you often mention consequences. Knowing your background in martial arts, I'm sure you mention them in the same calm, unthreatening way. It might be challenging to NOT see dialogue or emotional interactions with loved ones in terms of BATTLE.

I never engage in battles and this speaking up for myself, even in my father's words, is new for me.... or so it seems.  Typically I just leave.  Having kids meant I COULD speak up, easily and often when necessary, bc it was for my kids.  Speaking up for myself is different, but getting easier with coaches like you and examples to help drive the info home.

Probably the most important consequences in drawing boundaries, in my experience, don't have a ton to do with others (except of course with kids). But mostly, I think, the most valuable consequences are for the self. Such as:  I think I've been talking about boundaries and reading about boundaries and watching others deal with boundaries BUT without realizing how difficult it is to do when I'm in reactive mode.  I haven't sussed out reactive vs responsive till recently and so...... the topic of boundaries has taken on a new heft and weight.  They're very real and accessible.  I didn
I didn't understand how the "light switch" flipping WAS REALLY being stuck or not stuck in reactive amygdala brain.  All the talking in the world, understanding, making up mantras just couldn't penetrate and take hold... grow.... internalize and become default and I couldn't understand why.  Knowing why is helpful.  Knowing it still comes and goes, as it is now.... I'm having a moment.... the kids see me spilling things... 3 things in 30 minutes and so I STOP, put down glass and liquids and breathe.  Post.  Examine what's going on internally.  Think about how difficult it is to remember or utilize boundaries when in fight or flight. 

--This dialogue is feeling toxic or borderline abusive to me. My consequence for myself is that I will say, "I am feeling frustrated so I'm going to take a half-hour for a walk. We can continue when I get back." (Or, later today, whatever....)Ya..... I have more trouble disengaging when I'm dealing with younger sib. There are certain people I've never walked away from, still have to fight the codependence stuff.  I can usually identify the projections and exaggerations... but it's hard to take a break.  I'll think about that.  I understand it's a good choice and appreciate your writing it out here.

--This person (non family) does not appear to be hearing me. I will state my request (same calm tone) two more times. If it's not responded to, I will say: "This is not satisfactory to me. I will find someone in a management role to see how to get it resolved." (And then exit.)I can HEAR this more clearly now.... practice it proactively.... make a habit of it.

Stuff like that. If there is any risk of internally confusing "consequence" with "punishment", it might be best to make the first priority defining consequences for the self. That de-escalates most conflicts, I think. It helps not to live in battle mode. 

You know I make all this up, right? Just my opinions. But they do come from years of pondering and thinking about boundaries, fwiw.  I wrote a big response to this post... I think it went away?  I don't see it on the board.

Anyway, I have a situation with a father at our school sending Instagram messages to underage girls..... I'll DO something about it, just not sure what yet.

AND a mother is asking me to take her child in, during this viral thing, and keep him in school, care for him bc her immune system is compromised and she doesn't want to get sick if he brings it home.
 I have a child already going to school, pretty much same classes, so she figures I'm already IN IT.... it won't matter if her child is here.  I have conflicted feelings about that... not in the feeding and staying on him with school work... getting him to school and home but with the questins.... WHAT IF HE DOES become ill?  I think it's a mistake to think about it while I'm still shooting adrenaline from oldest dd driving to the store (girls decided to buy rice, beans and tp, just in case) so it's just a very difficult day I'm not comfortable making big decisions around.  Will see T tomorrow so I'm giving self permission to let things simmer till then.

Thanks for responses, Hops.

Lighter

Hugs and kudos,
Hops

--- End quote ---

lighter:
I want to get in the yard so will just jot things down as I remember them without looking up proper spelling, etc.

T and I talked about editing and giving away STUFF in a very happy positive way.  She talked about the "basement" where we consider things and perhaps attach meaning to them or don't.  Attaching meaning to things is about seeing ourselves as THAT... that thing or connection.  When that's gone there's more room for expansion and connection to the whole.  Around here you see lots of bumper stickers like.... ALL ONE, etc.  That's what she's talking about.  Who we are without the stories defining us.

We talked about giving up meat... she's not a vegetarian or vegan though she's tried and failed bc of low energy and feeling very bad physically.  She said the gal running retreats in this part of the State eats meat and that lady said the Dalai Lama eats meat.  That every body is different and we eat for health while being mindful around those choices.

The girls and I have talked about giving up meat certain days of the week.  I'm feeling really good about that, at a minimum.

Around these discussions she used a word sounding like RE-A-FI.... hard e and i.   It's Buddhist word that means aligning ourselves to the truth... maybe Hops knows it?  I'm paraphrasing badly here, but want to keep moving.
  This brought her to discussion around the cross.... before it was associated with that "Jesus guy" and then she laughed.... the cross was here way before. 

If the horizontal part of the cross is our physical life and the vertical is our spiritual life.... we strive to find the middle and THEN we can rise spiritually, grow.... become more conscious and aware of our true nature, in a nutshell.  Between desire and aversion..... seeking pleasure and avoiding pain.... there is balance in the middle.

We had maybe half the appointment left so I brought up the needle/medical thing and she said we could do a small exercise around it... she wished we could do an entire appointment around it BUT that's OK bc I give blood this weekend and can observe how anything shifted, if at all.   

She gave me two choices.... have young Lighter speak to older Lighter about the experiences OR do some blinking around it.... she called it Flash.   I didn't need to imagine them in my hands and weigh them out.  I always will go for the Flash over the other.

She brought me to my happy tomato garden with all it's sites sounds and smells.... warm summer sun on fragrant tomatoes and vines.... and we did eye movements, then one blink.... many times.  Then we checked the garden and repeated but with 2 blinks.  It was easy and she kept checking in around it... how did it feel..  was it easy.  Yup.

We brought the anxiety down from 8 to 0... I couldn't find the anxiety... it was fuzzy and far away... too far to reach and I didn't try very hard.  Just let it go then went back to the garden for a minute or two and we did the eye movement again while she mixed up the blinks.... 2..... 2....  1...... 3.... 2 etc.  THIS time I noticed the eye movements were harder... my tongue wanted to help, and my eyes wanted to just blink blink blink blink blink without stopping.  I tried to focus on my breathing through all this and follow her fingers and stay in the garden and blink quickly not longer blinks, etc.

She said the medical/needle/blood stuff is very common and the difficulty in the end was about control... it's hard to release all expectations and desire for control around this.

She asked what was true about myself and I responded without thinking that I was trustworthy and honoring my intuition will keep me safe... I am safe. I trust myself to stay safe... I am safe. 

Then I went out into the nicest day I've seen in a very long time. 

I'm going to spend a couple hours in the moss garden.... feeling the sun and breeze, noticing the birds and feisty squirrels.   Let all that simmer down.

I like T's approach to different concepts from different POVs. 
Today we worked on dissolving neural pathways....building new ones. 
We worked to rea fy stories in the basement.
We worked to activate the amygdala, move the anxiety into the processing center, process then file in historic files..... memory reconsolidation..... Flash....  and so this T doesn't force any ONE way of looking at this kind of growth.  It feels like she's packing information onto a sculpture... a handful of clay on this side, then the other, then on top, then below..... which brings a more completely picture for me.

She quoted Tolle....
"Ask yourself is there joy, easy, and lightness in what I am doing?
If there isn't, then time is covering up the present moment and life is perceived as a burden or a struggle."

I really loved that and it was super timely.  There's no guru gaga ... around anything.  I think she touches on everything.... every approach, bc I'm open and willing to hear different vantage points.  IF she told me what to think, how to go about something.... I'd dig in and resist. 

She's going on 2 back to back retreats soon, which is awsome, bc I know she's on her own journey, doing her own work, and will be ravenously hungry for meat when she gets out.  She's not vegetarian but tried it...  noticed she had to plan her life around naps and feeling lousy physically. The gal running one of the retreats in this area isn't vegetarian, which surprised T.  I think the Dalai Lama eats meat... everyone's body is different, and giving up meat for a day or more a week makes good sense to me, for the planet mainly.  More about that later.

REALLY cool appointment today.  I was up and ready to go before T was..... just felt great and ready to get at the day; )

Final note from T....
becoming my own best friend.... yup yup yup.

Tup, I'm channeling you a bit here as I bought a lovely long pink linen shirt from GoodWill and enjoy it so much.... such a happy color. 

Lighter

lighter:
I walked the labyrinth today while dd had her appointment.  The gardener was there, tending and cutting back bushes. 

Studying what they did.... they laid out a huge circle then stoned in the edges with cement and filled it all with very fine gravel that felt good on bare feet. 

After I brushed my feet off in the grass I sat on the porch swing and overheard the owner talking with the gardener.  As the owner passed me on the porch I thanked him for having such a lovely yard and labyrinth.   He lit up like a Christmas tree and talked about his plans and what he wanted for the bushes to grow into as they matured.  He thanked me for spending time there and went in.

I told the gardener he was doing a fine job and HE lit up too.  He looked like Jesus from The Walking Dead.... adorable and very pleased with his work on this project. He was pleased to see someone enjoying it too.  I could picture something that lovely in all my rocks and moss, but that's just dreaming.

Lighter

Hopalong:
Boy can I see you making that happen, Lighter!

A neighborhood moss labyrinth...

LOVE IT!

A lovely dream regardless.

So pleased you had that experience today.

I'd bet YOU might have been lit up too.

Hops

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