Author Topic: Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out  (Read 19697 times)

vunil

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #15 on: March 12, 2005, 02:48:52 PM »
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Did this person do a major projection on me? If so, I usually react very little. A projection comes with a hope for a strong reaction from the projectee. That can set off a big drama which is usually pointless and painful. If I don't react much to the projection or very carefully to it, they have to deal with the feelings themselves.


Bunny, that paragraph gave me a major doozy of  an "aha"!  Thanks a lot. I am getting projected on a lot right now (pregnancy seems to get people to really want to project on you-- maybe because now I'm really wide, like a movie screen? :) ).  It is hard to know how to react-- it's like getting stuck with little forks repeatedly.  I'm going to try not to react, just like you say, so that they have to play out their drama on their own.

Anonymous

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #16 on: March 12, 2005, 03:07:15 PM »
vunil wrote,
 
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Keep in mind that the "what to do" is really topsy-turvy where N's are concerned


Precisely, vunil. For me the consequences of doing the wrong thing (appeasing him) in the short run were peace and tranquility. The consequences of doing the right thing (asserting my rights and independence) were, and are, something like placing my head in a hornets nest. For me the challenge is to keep doing the right thing despite the stings.
Hope your work situation improves.

mudpuppy

mum

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #17 on: March 12, 2005, 03:21:36 PM »
You guys (I say that without gender) are awesome.  

Bunny, I did call one of my sisters long distance, and she knows this persons MO very well.  I did stop shaking, and still think I handled it well.

Mudpuppy, the hornet's nest is a  great visual (you are an extremely witty guy, your wife must be laughing all the time!).  I did indeed, stick my head in one.  Totally worth it.

Vunil, it's as if you knew us.....soooo many times I would have played out the other scenario with her (going with her, feeling bad later).  She has been away for a year, so I guess my transformation is shocking her.  I'm sure to hear about it!  As far as being pregnant, I forgot!  Oh yeah, it IS like being a walking advertisement: "Dump you unsolicited advice here!  Tell me scary birth stories!"  I used to try to think of it as everyone sharing...and as I learned after my first...NO birth is the same.  It will be unique and unlike anyone else's...just as it should be.

Back to sticking up for ourselves: Practice practice practice.  That's what changing habits is all about.

vunil

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2005, 03:38:33 PM »
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That's what changing habits is all about.


Amen!  

Maybe one benefit of your friend coming back into your life is as a little marker for how much you've changed.  That's kind of cool to think about.

I've posted on other threads similar experiences I've had where it's as if I'm seeing my friends for the first time, and my relationship with them.   It's weird when you realize someone has been bossing you around forever and now you don't want them to and won't let them.  But weird in a good way...  

I get projected on not just from people with kids, who actually don't do it as much (except, for some reason, to explain to me what to eat), but more from my single friends who haven't had children.  It is just stirring the pot a lot for them I think.  I can imagine it would, and have empathy, but when they are "explaining" to me that adopting is just as good as having one's own child, and having kids when you are older may shortchange the child (I am older),  it gets weird. I mean, they are right on both counts but it's clear it is projection on me and not really a compliment... Ah well.

Anonymous

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #19 on: March 12, 2005, 03:38:46 PM »
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your wife must be laughing all the time!).


Usually at me. She's says I remind her of Herman Munster, the way I'm always crashing into things and being generally helpless. :oops:
She's an absolute saint so its OK.

mudpuppy

Anonymous

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2005, 03:49:42 PM »
I think pregnancy and mothers w/small children trigger a lot of "stuff" in other people. Then they feel compelled to verbalize it and are intrusive. Somehow their inhibitions fly away and it's "okay" to say virtually anything to women who are pregnant or have small children. Feel free to protect yourself from intrusions.

bunny

mum

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #21 on: March 12, 2005, 04:34:38 PM »
When I was preganant, people (usually older women) would touch my baby belly...people I didn't even know.  It was so strange.  I had a fantasy that I would do the same to them and they would be in shock!  Mostly I would just say, um, excuse me? and that usually snapped them out of it.
Little kids were the funniest.  At the end of a long day of teaching art, my apron would look like a handprint fest....the kids would make any excuse to get close to me and "accidentally" touch my belly.  I tried to not freak out, and just saw it as pre-birth welcoming!
And Vunil, if this is your first....get ready!  It's the people who don't have kids who have ALL the answers (when you don't even ask), while the ones with kids say, "heck if I know...let me know if you ever figure it out!!!!"

mum

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #22 on: March 12, 2005, 04:35:46 PM »
geez, I really am a college grad, but my typos are atrocious (so's my spelling...)preganant?????

Anonymous

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2005, 06:57:11 PM »
OK, now I KNOW you guys are on a topic I am completely unqualified to comment on.

mudpup

mum

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2005, 08:11:47 PM »
What, mud, typos?

Anonymous

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #25 on: March 12, 2005, 09:10:32 PM »
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What, mud, typos?


No, mum, pregananacy. :wink:

mud

phillip

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #26 on: March 13, 2005, 12:28:41 AM »
Just wanted to clarify my previous post.  I will submit another example.  I have two ice cream cones, a chocolate and a vanilla.  I ask you which one you want.  You take one and I ask you why.  According to EST theory, there is only correct response.  It is, "Because I want it."  

I understand that many people are in unfortunate circumstances that they would prefer to exit, but can not.  I recall an old Pink Floyd lyric, "If I were a good man, I would understand the spaces between friends."

What does this have to do with anything?  Only this.  People will always do what seems right to them at the time.  Since we can never know all the factors that cause a person to behave as they do, judgement becomes more about us than the other person.  In many cases it is about us feeling good about our choices.  

Judgement is a reflection of our own self-judgement.  In many instances it is about being right and somebody else being wrong.  It is about adopted values to fit in or be accepted.  It is about status quo and conformity.  Yet Leo Buscaglia said often that there is a place deep inside each of us, that is totally insane.  He said most of humanity devotes much energy to keep this part hidden and unrecognized, but he added that unfortunately this is also where personal genius originates.

Bottom line, we all do what we need to to find safety.  If someone causes me grief, I no longer have that person in my life.  If I choose to keep that person in my life, I assume responsibility for that choice.  But, I cease judging that person for who he/she is.  I am more likely to be critical of precisely why I am choosing to keep this person in my life.

Just want to add that I can think of nothing that I could possibly do that isn't utilitarian.  

Maybe I am way off base here, but my life has been much simpler emotionally since I have adopted this outlook.  I am responsible for my choices and no one else.  I get to live with the results, no one else.  They are responsible for their own choices, not I.
ALL THAT IS NOT GIVEN IS LOST

                                               HASAN PAL

Anonymous

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #27 on: March 13, 2005, 02:23:23 AM »
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Bottom line, we all do what we need to to find safety. If someone causes me grief, I no longer have that person in my life. If I choose to keep that person in my life, I assume responsibility for that choice. But, I cease judging that person for who he/she is. I am more likely to be critical of precisely why I am choosing to keep this person in my life.

Just want to add that I can think of nothing that I could possibly do that isn't utilitarian.

Maybe I am way off base here, but my life has been much simpler emotionally since I have adopted this outlook. I am responsible for my choices and no one else. I get to live with the results, no one else. They are responsible for their own choices, not I.

This makes sense to me.  It's pretty much my thinking also.  I do what I have to do and others do what they have to do.

LM

Anonymous

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Sticking up for yourself vs lashing out
« Reply #28 on: March 13, 2005, 02:26:35 AM »
vunil,

I had my child at the age of 38, being an "older" mother has a lot of advantages.  Yes there are also disadvantages, but that's the same with everything in life.  Whatever the case, we are what we are.

LM

Guest from afar

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To Mum
« Reply #29 on: March 13, 2005, 05:10:21 AM »
Hi Mum:

When I read about your yoga incident with the neighbour, I identified strongly with your feelings of anxiety/anger and your behaviour. I know my partner - who is very assertive - would not feel anxious about saying "no" as he has always been able to stand up for himself. The reason some of us (victims of N's) become so angry/anxious when we are assertive is because we have now changed our behaviour in order to stick up for our rights and needs. You are simply working towards teaching others how you expect to be treated. She threw a lot of emotional blackmail at you and I think you handled it extremely well. It will get easier with constant practice. I am practising all the time. My biggest issue is that other people seem to be a lot pushier about their needs than me, even when they are not N's. It seems to be a survival instinct to insist that one's needs are met and my instinct does not seem to be as strong as that of many others.

regards

S