sad memories

[Hopalong]

I'm sad and weary about this, but it will pass.
(RM, no offense, but I need not to respond to you on this thread.)

Since I first started embracing RM I was working hard to heal a lifelong sorrow. I did, in a way. My welcome was sincere...but I realize now that the belief system practiced by my grandfather, passed down to NMom, and that impacted me (and for all I know, my D and future generations) is something completely unaswerable. It does remind me of fanaticism. And the world is full of fire and hurt because of it. I think I'll read that book Richard recommended. Hope RM will too.

I realize my effort to be compassionate is not wasted because I visualize the innocent, malleable child inside anyone with such ferocious ideas of what should be taking place within human beings. I can, because I was a little child in that climate. (Only at times, because it was my relatives, not my immediate family.) Made a big impact though...and some scars I carry still.

Those raging minsters and heartless images of hell and condemnation were devastating to someone very small (I was a premie, stayed tiny for years) and sensitive (absurdly so). After 50 some years I've made a lot of real progress with all of these, but among the things I've had to battle I can trace to that voice in my childhood:

anxiety disorder
sexual repression (and later, acting out)
self-loathing as a female
despair
depression
dependency
tolerance of abuse
helpless repetition of trying to "fix" unkind people

In an odd way, though, I am grateful for this experience in a way someone else mentioned. Once I shake off my disappointment at how it turned out, I realize I feel affirmed. Choices I made in parts of my life that are not conventional but involve listening to the deepest voice within me, and letting it be my own. Not something dictated by anyone who claimed the right to tell me who I am or should be, or to have the only book worth reading.

I think it's why I became a poet.

Thank you for listening,

Hops

[Sela]

Piping up here Hops.

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((Hops)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Wish I could do more to help.

I'm sorry this has happened and for all you've been through. 

Your efforts to be compassionate were not wasted on me, Hops.
I saw you do it and it helped me too.

Keep listening to your own voice Hops.  It's a beaut. 

Sela

[pennyplant]

Since I first started embracing RM I was working hard to heal a lifelong sorrow. I did, in a way. ...

I realize my effort to be compassionate is not wasted ....

In an odd way, though, I am grateful for this experience in a way someone else mentioned. Once I shake off my disappointment at how it turned out, I realize I feel affirmed. Choices I made in parts of my life that are not conventional but involve listening to the deepest voice within me, and letting it be my own. Not something dictated by anyone who claimed the right to tell me who I am or should be, or to have the only book worth reading.

....

I think it's why I became a poet.

Dear Hops,

I hope that the healing you have sensed as a result of this episode will soon feel good and substantial and like the real accomplishment that it is.

Your compassion is never wasted.  For my part, your compassion is a very important aspect of why I come to this board.

Here is a question that occurs to me but doesn't have to be answered--do you address these particular memories in your poetry?

Pennyplant

[MarisaML]

(((((Hops)))))

This is very sad.     I'm very sorry that this happened to you.  It does help to talk about it though, doesn't it?  Poetry is a great way to express emotions and feelings.  I write some too. 

[Hopalong]

Thanks so much, Sela, Penny, Marisa.
I feel better. Your comfort and kindness truly made me feel loved and not alone.
It was like a chasm between me and the family once I broke the chain of their tradition.
But chasm also means space, freedom, room to expand my notions of spirit...

Love, Hops
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Healing&Hopeful]

((((((Hoppy)))))))))

You are such an amazing person hon, and such an inspiration to me.  While I haven't personally had any dealings with raging ministers, I did read about Fred Phelps, which took it to the extreme and where his children were without voice and I could imagine how they must feel.  The really sad thing about that is most of the children were so brainwashed that they stuck by him. From memory only two children managed to get away and build their own lives.

My advice to you would be trust in the wonderful, kind, loving and honest person who I see when you post.  Also with this experience... do you believe that you've done everything you could despite the outcome?  (the answer here is yes btw  )  How about mentally taking ownership of what you are responsible for, and passing the rest back to the other person... maybe imagine passing a wad of paper with all their responsibility back to them?  One thing I try and do when somethings bothering me is to imagine it written on a piece of paper, then mentally screw the piece of paper up and throw it out of my brain (Yep, I do sound bonkers!   ) but maybe this can be a way of shaking off your disappointment.

I hope you'll keep writing your poetry... I read a really sad story recently where a Mum lost her little boy, and although she functioned for years, once the children had left home she couldn't see passed her grief.  She was sectioned as her depression was so bad, and the pyschiatrist recommend she write poety... at the end of the story she said she felt like a huge wait had been lifted.

I see such a valuable person in you Hoppy.... ((((((((((((((((((Big Hoppy))))))))))))))) ((((((((((((((Little Hoppy)))))))))))))

Love H&H xx

[moonlight52]

Hops           Your voice has been a calm ,safe harbor to me.Your poems are your very open heart reaching out to show compassion What a wonderful example you have been for me Hops .I guess I can only hope to try to start with my family and support them more in kindness and see where it goes.Thank you Hops for showing me that path. Well my girls would say thank you too because I am being more supportive to them .It feels good all  the way around .I do hope you see all the good you do and bringing your poetry, what a gift to bring others to understand beauty thats a good thing.Hops, my Mama was brought up in the south,Religion in the tents ,Hell fire and all.She said I sure am not going to raise my kids with all that fear(she was told if she did not get all A's in school she would go to Hell)Well anyway thats one fear I did not get.Thank you for showing me by your example what can be done to help others by compassion When is Love ever a wrong choice?
LOVE and LIGHT
HUGS
Moon

[Marta]

I feel crushed by the dirt that is being thrown around. Why was that necessary? Why? Why?

[Hopalong]

Thanks, Sela--
I am comforted today. It was just a revisiting of old bruises. I had so wanted us to all be able to be together and in a loving way. I'm not mad at or blaming RM for being who she is and doing what she believes she must--we're all doing what we know how to do. I appreciated her response to Richard's request. It just felt right to put together why my old story and this recent one overlapped. Makes me understand why I felt so invested.

Thanks, Bean. I'm touched. I'll be removing my poem as I don't like to leave them on the Net. But I'll be glad to PM it to you. (Some are published so that blows anonymity.) I'm glad you liked this one, it came from a deep place.

H&H--thanks for reminding me I can learn to let go. I can be at peace, still be compassionate, but get unhooked. I will do that. I can even engage, when tat feels right, as long as I stay conscious of where and why an old bruise is aching.

Marisa--if you'd ever feel comfortable doing so, PM me one of your poems to read. It'd be an honor.

Moon--I love what your Mama said. I would like to hear more about her...she's not an N, right? I'm glad someone else here understands what it's like to have that experience/influence in the family. Your kids are SO lucky to have your as their Moony Mom. XXXOOO.

Marta--I'm sorry you're feeling crushed. I didn't mean to throw dirt on anyone, especially RM. I am grasping understanding and compassion again. Sometimes healing is messy. Have a peaceful Tuesday.

Hops

[ANewSheriff]

Hops:

You are such a poet!

I can see how the current climate would drudge up old and painful memories for you.  There are few subjects that will get hearts racing and blood pressures rising like religion and politics, eh?

I guess I have come to a place in my life where I have thrown in the towel in regards to trying to suggest alternative ways of thinking in these cases.  The very suggestion that there could be alternative interpretations or more than one valid view of an issue just seems to incite people who are dug in and unwilling to shift their thinking in any way, shape, or form. 

I have found that instead of my thoughts or questions being received as a means to learn more, they are thought of as severely as evil or as simply as misdirected and misguided .  Either way, I have gotten old enough to know that there is no way to win in these circumstances. 

Thank you for the courageous post.

ANewSheriff         

[Hop guest]

Thanks, Sherrif.

That is practical, sane advice, and I appreciate it.

Peace in the OK Corral...

Hops

[movinon]

Hops,

I'm sorry all of this has brought you pain, and the one thing I know about pain is there is healing on the other side if a person is willing to see it through - and I see that you get this.

I, too, have been quite triggered.  I felt the same type of finatisicm growing up in a southern Catholic family.  FEAR GOD!  In the same vein, I can remember my dad telling my mom to, "Shut up, you're JUST a women."  That setiment seemed to be backed up by our wonderful church where women were (at best) second-class citizens.  THis hurts me deeply.  I KNOW I am not second-class just b/c I don't have something hanging between my legs (sorry to be blunt).

I don't know how nurturing and compassion and gentleness that is that make-up of our gender can be so easily dismissed in favor or wars, agression and killing.  Does that make them the superior species?  I know there are gentle, loving men, but why does our society feel the need to ostracise them and sissies and hold them down?

Sorry, I got off-topic.  I know that you mentioned quite a few things and that one stuck out for me and is something I am passionate about (as a former woman-basher myself). 

Okay, looking back at your list, it all contributes (at least for me) to being "less-than" -

anxiety disorder
sexual repression (and later, acting out)
self-loathing as a female
despair
depression
dependency
tolerance of abuse
helpless repetition of trying to "fix" unkind people

sexual repression - I was taught that I was "sinful" if I had sex before marriage and that I had to be a "good girl"
despair, depression - the whole OBEY, second-class thing
dependency - Sarted out at 18 w/ my H in the military as a "dependant" - taught early on that I needed to depend on a man to take care of me - they do, after all still get the best jobs and the best pay (not thier fault - how society is).
tolerance of abuse - still alive and well in the judicial system - giving my psycho., abusive, stbxH unsupervised visitation - leads to an attitude in "can't fight the system" - my mother used to tell me, "That's just how it is."  The Catholic church told me it was my job to (take it), keep my marriage together.
Anxiety disorder/ self-loathing as a female - living w/ all the above (What is there to like growing up in a society like that?)

For the record Hops, I think you have shown TREMENDOUS caring and nurturing on the board.  You have helped me so many times w/ your kind and gentle words.

Movinon

[seasons]

Oh Hopalong, My heart really hurt for you. It hurts to know how hurt you feel right now. You are so very special, unique, loving, giving to us all. Thank you for being you, we are so lucky to have you!

I want to give you this, to all of us. As children and as adults.

Lovely ((((((((HOPS))))))))



Children thrive on positive attention. Children need to feel loved and appreciated. ( My words adults too)

Yes    Good      Fine      Very good      Very fine       Excellent      Marvelous

At-a-boy      Right       That’s right      Correct       Wonderful     

I like the way you do that    I’m pleased with (proud of ) you     

That’s good      Wow       Oh boy     Very nice      Good work      Great going

Good for you      That’s the way       Much better      O.K.         

You’re doing better     That’s perfect       Good idea      What a cleaver idea

That’s it      Good job      Great job controlling yourself   

I like the way you ______      I noticed that you ____  Keep it up   

I had fun ______ with you    You are improving at ______ more and more

You showed a lot of responsibility when you ______       Way to go   

I appreciate the way you ______      You are great at that      You're the best

Good remembering     That’s beautiful       I like your______   

I like the way you ______ with out having to be asked (reminded)     

I’m sure glad you are my son/daughter     Now you’ve got it           

I love you

You can SHOW them how you feel as well as tell them.

Smile     Nod     Part on shoulder, head, knee     Wink

Signal or gesture to signify approval     High five      Touch cheek

Tickle   Laugh (with, not at)     Pat on the back      Hug

 

We recommend the book Hidden Messages by Elizabeth Pantley (2001) for more information

Thinking of you always, seasons

[Hop guest]

I am rolling in hugs and friendship.
Sadness = GONE.
Honest!

Thank you, MO for that affirmation. Sometimes the whole one-down woman thing still grates at me. I don't feel bitter and I do truly love men...but I think as a whole, the culture has slid backward in terms of awareness. Our girls need our voices...Thanks for sharing those memories.

Seaons, you are a sweet heart. (I love looking inside that word: sweetness in the heart.)
There you have it. Thanks for that flood of kindness and support. My inner kid feels great.

Hops