$$$$$

[Portia]

Hi Beth

When he was alive, my step-father controlled all the cash, mother didn’t have a bank card. Now I know why. She spends like there’s a bottomless bucket. I worry about her future (although I imagine she’s got a lot of money, but I really have no idea) but then I think, what can I do? She’s in control, it’s her life. I can only try and control my life, irksome though it can be to hear about what I deem wasteful spending. I guess I need to not listen, or to devise some way of not hearing it!

H&H

I remember being fed by friends’ parents too. Some people were very kind to me.

[mia]

I know my parent's generation would work and save for something they "wanted".  Nowadays it just seems that so many of us want that immediate gratification. 

What??? 
I actually should work and earn the money before I go out and buy everything under the sun??? 

I have so many friends who are up to their eyeballs in debt.  They all live well above their means.  They have beautiful homes, cars, clothes, jewerly, etc which they are paying an arm and a leg for in finance charges.  Heck, I know one family that financed a $10,000 swing/play set.
First, what kid needs a 10,000 playset and secondly something is very wrong if you find yourself financing a swing set.

But hey, it's the American way.

I don't like debt.   I pay everything off as soon as I get the bill. I find that keeping everything on one charge card really helps me keep track of my spending.  When the bill comes it shocks the heck out of me.

[Hops]

I am so glad this thread got started...$$$ is such an important issue, and many people find it taboo or too painful to talk about.

Portia, you mentioned that you live on $5K (well, I guess that's pounds, not dollars!  ) annually. Do you mind sharing anything about how you manage it? When my mother passes, I may be in very similar straits. I do ZERO "stuff" spending. Two areas I can cut back a little are any meals out (I had been doing cheap lunches to have a chance to socialize...I still want to do that but think if I bring food every day I could load up on healthy snacks before I meet them, and then just order soup and water) and the other is the occasional movie night w/friends. Again, I hate to give that up because I love socializing, but I can ask that we go to the matinee which is cheaper. And I recently signed up for a $6/month Netflix...which is a great way to have my escapism at home. The third thing I can cut back on (and it's about time) is bailing out my 25 y/o daughter, who'd come to take my coffers (which are drained) for granted. And with the job about to evaporate, that's ridiculous. I've told her I can't do it anymore.

Anyway, anyone else, too? If people have any stories of how they live or lived in the past and managed well waaaaaaay below the usual "comfort" level, I think they'd be so valuable to hear.

Thanks!
Hops

[Sugarbear]

My husband and I have no debt except for our mortgage. Our only expenses are that and the monthly bills. We discussed cable tv, and decided that it was an unnecessary expense. I don't own a cell phone. We have one older car and one car that is around 2 years old. We go out to eat a few times a week, but it is the less expensive places that two people can eat at for under 20$ and we have an "entertainment" budget that still allows us to put a nice chunk of money into savings every month.

We paid off our school loans, car notes, and any extra expenses several years ago, and we pay off our credit cards in full every month. If we don't have the money, we don't charge it.

We both have good 401Ks, and a cushion amounting to several thousand in the bank in a savings account for unexpected repairs/vacation funds. We started our savings in our late twenties, and now in our early 30's, it is looking like we are well on the way to being financially secure and able to retire early.

I also HATE debt... I have gone without or saved up over several months/years to be able to afford something that I just had to have... I treat those things as "I deserved it, but also I EARNED it."

We have a few really nice pieces of furniture, that we saved for because we both thought they were worth it. We are planning a trip to Ireland, but it took us three years to get the funds for it... it will be paid for BEFORE we book the tickets!!

I don't understand the mentality today that has people living above their means or having debt for things that they can't afford. I know the American average is something like 10,000 dollars on credit cards, but that just boggles the mind... how on earth can those people sleep at night?? I would be in a state of permanent freaked'outedness (I know that isn't a word ) if I had that hanging over my head!

[Hopalong]

Thanks, Sugarbear. Good to know there are youngish people who do get started and plan so maturely. Good for you and your H...what a sane and serene thing to do.

I would also really love to hear anecdotes from people who DIDN'T plan well and now are playing "catch-up" or trying new economies...perhaps in middle age. I'll bet among us are people who've come up with some very smart ideas!

(Even drastic measures can be empowering, I think...would just love to hear what some of those measures are.)

Hops

[pennyplant]

Hi Hops,

My husband and I are among the middle-aged people who didn't plan.  Part of it was the way we did things.  First child born at age 18, only qualified for minimum wage jobs for a time.  Plus, some other poor decisions over the years, made from the "trenches" so to speak.

We're not doing anything too spectacular now, but are being more practical and have more to work with.  Each of us has good paying jobs now.  My husband works all the overtime he can get.  I have a pension plan at work as well as a thrift savings plan I contribute to.  My husband has some kind of 401k but no pension.  I will also have a small pension from the state due to a government job I had long enough to get vested.  These job-related successes have mostly been a matter of luck, not planning.

We did have a plan for how to cut the purse strings with our kids.  The oldest knew ahead of time that we would support him in a very basic fashion until six months after he graduated from college.  Sort of a grace period like they give for the student loan payments.  I don't know what we would have done if he hadn't gotten a job in time (it took him until four months after graduation).  During that time we only paid his rent (and it was pretty low as he had many roommates).  Since he knew ahead of time what the deal was, and since he prefers independence, it was on his mind all the time that he had to support himself by a specific date.

Youngest son will have the exact same deal.  Except he got really lucky, he has the use of a car we pay for.  He pays gas and minor expenses.  And he knows how lucky he is.  He also prefers independence like his older brother.  I've got my fingers crossed that he will be off our budget six months after graduation as well.

We have a Christmas club so that we don't have to resort to credit cards to have gifts under the tree (and we only buy for a select few people).

In general, we are not very good with money.  No savings.  Some credit card debt.  We figure when we retire, we may well have to sell our house and be down to one car.  That's just the breaks.  We do what we have to do when it comes to surviving.  We do expect to have our debts gone by that time.  But our pensions won't be much and if we can't afford property taxes and upkeep to our house, then it's gotta go.

I have grown to feel that possessions are quite a burden.  So, I'm not heartbroken that maybe we will retire to a subsidized apartment.  I know many retired people who are on a pretty low budget and they are creative and find ways to have small pleasures.  We have lots of good examples to follow.

We started out way behind the game and I don't think it is possible to make up for nearly two decades of not so great decisions and some not so lucky breaks.  Our kids may do better than us and, if so, I will see that as a success.

Pennyplant

[Hopalong]

Thank you, Penny.
That's kind of discouraging and heartening at the same time...it probablly makes a lot of difference to have a partner to face the future with. I'm glad you have such a great attitude--and I agree money can't buy happiness!

Hops

[pennyplant]

Yeah, Hops, I know I'm pretty lucky in some ways.  I've also got to own the mistakes.  We'll probably have to have some kind of part time job or other situation that helps us make ends meet.  Hopefully, I won't feel too jealous of the other people in my generation who will be wintering down south every year and otherwise doing well financially in their golden years.  That is one aspect of the past that I have pretty much been able to let go of.  I've pretty much been able to forgive our young selves for not being great with money when we really didn't have all that much to work with and did the best we knew how at the time.  And now--we are getting more and more disciplined with each passing year so, there shouldn't be anymore really sticky situations coming up that we could blame ourselves for.  Stuff out of our control?  Well, we are survivors so we'll take it as it comes.

Hops, I'm hoping that the door opens pretty soon for you.  There's an employer out there that would be very lucky to have you.  Maybe a friend will hear of something soon and let you know     .  Yes, yes, yes!!!

PP

[moonlight52]

Hi    Well I just got back from a new Doctor .One my hubby and I really like .We found out today I have 3 complications from previous
surgery and it looks like we need to take out a loan to pay for the surgery I need now to repair the complications.At least we have a Doctor that really knows what is wrong .And thank goodness its not life threating but looks like we will have to take out a loan.Funny we pay so much into our health insurance and because of these exclusion clauses we are not covered.Well at least like my hubby says I
will have my heath back and we will just pay off the loan .Sometimes life can be unfair .But sometimes life can be so grand.
Love
Moonlight

[Hopalong]

So sorry to hear that, Moon, but thank heaven you're not in danger.

Did you reach a dead end already with your appeal of the insurer's rejection? Or can that process continue? (Perhaps you're paying for it with a loan up-front, but will keep fighting in order to get reimbursed? I HOPE SO!)

Grrrr. I loathe these "insurance" companies that insure little but their own profits....when you really need them for serious things is when they like to pull the plug. Exactly the opposite of what should happen.

(((((((((((((((((Moon))))))))))))))

Chin up, Moon...your health matters more than anything else, dear.

Rooting for you,
Hops

[Portia]

Hiya Hops, no problem, I’ll talk about sweaty armpits if you like! Yes £5k a year or thereabouts. How? I don’t buy stuff. I live in this tiny one-bed house which I bought in 92 at the bottom of the market. Paid off the mortgage in 2001 when I stopped work. (I owe a mortgage of £1 which means they keep the deeds safe for me.) I don’t have children, no pets, tiny heating and electricity bills (small houses cost less to maintain too). Everything I buy, bar consumables (food, wine, cigs) I think ‘do I need this?’ (yes, I ‘need’ chocolate). I fly Ryan Air to Spain using the net offers at exactly the right moment (£2 plus taxes = £25 return…crazy, pollution rating is terrible and this service won’t last). I don’t socialise at all, bar a trip every six months on the train to see some family. I don’t eat or drink out in the UK (way too expensive here in the south) and don’t go out to spending events (movies, anything…). I love my library.

But I’m running out of saved cash and I have to work! At least I can see some different opportunities available and those old suits – they still fit me. I just refuse to wear heels these days. I can’t quite believe I used to wear them! What for? Just to put my back out? That’s crazy. I see younger women hobbling to our local train station every morning in them and I look at their posture, their backs and think – who’s the one that’s nuts here? Anyway, shoes, let’s not. Manolo Blahniks?  Perleeease! And yes, living on less is easier if you don’t work. Going to work costs money.

(((((Moon))))) healthcare is one area where no country seems to have it right yet.

[gratitude28]

Portia,
I wish you a wonderful and fulfilling job. I think it's stellar that you had this time to regenerate and live without outside influences! No wonder you are such a thoughtful person!
What do you want to do for work??????
It's true... it DOES cost money to work!
Take care.
Love, Beth

[write]

I directed a lovely concert this lunchtime, and received compliment after compliment for my black and white sequinned skirt. And top.

The former cost $6 because someone had burst the button, it took me 30 seconds to make new with a new button.
The top my sister sent from the sales in England, tesco I think she said.

So not only is it thrifty but I get a good feel beacuse it was a thought-out gift from my sis!

***

once we tune in somehow though- these bargains seem to become more frequent.

My ex says it's because I am more tuned to the world...I wonder if it might possibly, crazily be the universe is more attuned to me?!

[Hopalong]

Bravo, Write! Sounds very classy, that getup.

Wish I could hear the music (don't know if it's choral but I love music of almost all sorts...)

Hops

[Portia]

Beth, thank you, I heard! What do I want to do? I don’t know! But I’m getting there. Hey, I figured it was have a total breakdown (mental and physical) or give up going out and get my head sorted. Best use of two years so far.

Write,
loved the hot water bottle story too. But hang on what’s so bad about a douche….? Except ladies: don’t use them, they’re not good for you!

You want one of those butterfly shaped tops, black silky stuff with black, white and silver sequins, size about UK 14? I don’t want it. Can’t see myself doing that again.  Ebay! That’s what I need to learn!

The universe is not separate ….. you are a part of it and it is a part of you…oh zen again, better go, brain’s run out for the day