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Shame - the ultimate voicelessness?

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Neko, what a terrible story.  I really feel for you.  Not only was it ignoring your pain, but pain that was related to female organs probably only added to the SHAME.

I have found as an adult that I tend to go to the doctor very easily, and treat myself with chiropractic and massage therapy regularly.  I no longer ignore my pain, and in fact, on some strange level, I get great satisfaction and pleasure out of taking care of myself this way.  As I mentioned before, some of the stuff may be psychosomatic, resulting from childhood emotional trauma, but it is extremely comforting to me to know that i am capable of taking care of myself now and someone will take me seriously.  

I hope you will do the same for yourself.

Anna:
Once again, I am moved and touched by your posts and need to share a little of what I'm remembering...

Insofar as being "sick" -- that was NOT allowed.  I was forced to be in school no matter what.  If I threw up in hallways, so be it.  Clean yourself up and get back to class.  Menstrual cramps were "in my head".  If and only if the nurse insisted I be taken home did she grudgingly get me.  But I paid the price when I got back home.  Usually the silent treatment.  How inconsiderate of me to interrupt her life, I was just in the way.

It's interesting to read about our own body assessments (hunger, thirst, etc).  I watch my dreams pretty carefully and I have a recurring item -- there is always a toilet in my dreams.  It seems I must always know where it is, or if it's there at all...  I have not been sure at all about any meanings because I only have one memory about having an accident.  

The family used to take long afternoon drives......  I guess one day I had an accident and peed my pants (6 yo? maybe) and they took me to my grandmother's house to get cleaned up.    I remember being humiliated and ashamed and wanted to crawl into a hole.  But that's ALL that I remember.  Anyone want to give me your two cents?

((((((((((((Hugs))))))))))))))) to you all.

rosencrantz:
Hi Anna - How could I resist two cents about a dream!!

There's a phrase for what narcissists do with all the stuff they don't like about themselves : they dump it on us.  I think that word has a more 'basic' meaning in the States than I'd give it but perhaps makes it even more relevant...

Psychoanalytic theorists refer to narcissists using 'the other'as a toilet, presumably in relation to all the c**p they hand out!  (Kernberg, I think).

Neko:
Ha - rosencrantz, the pertinence of that made me laugh out loud :lol:

("dump" can be used both ways in the US: if you say "they dump it on us" then it has the usual shared meaning, it's hard to read in the other one. To make the scatological US meaning stand out, we'd say "they dump on us", but then you're missing the "it" - anyway. This is all very weird since - honest to goodness - my parents are environmental engineers, specializing in waste treatment. Although my mother is now trying to become a therapist, using friends and family as guinea pigs.)

Acappella:
I hear ya rosencrantz,

i had a similar experience with a theapyst (but not as harsh by any means!) and have since read books by therapyts who are not so afraid of need! (at least they can actually explore it, consider it as their issue).  The two books are listed below in the third paragraph.

i asked to see my therapyst 3 times a week!  yes, that is, i was needy! i had never contacted a therapyst outside of our scheduled time - she was not the first therapyst i'd seen.  I had never asked for more than what i percieved as the normal ok amount of time, the perscribed hour a week.  I had never asked for much of anything from anyone.  It was a huge step for me to ask for more.  i was feeling very needy.  very alone.  it took courage for me to ask.  when i did, she said (to her credit) that she was concerned about too much dependence.  at least she said it and took responsibility for it being her concern rather than assuming it was my problem.  i responded in a way that i am now proud of dispite the shame i felt at the moment.  i asked if we could try it and then if too much dependence became an issue we could talk about it.  i went 3 times a week for a while and as i felt stronger and less isolated i graduated (naturally) on to other connections with other people and activities didn't desire 3 times a week any more!  feeling hunger pains is no cause for shame.  (even greed is not treated well with shame.)  

I have read two books in which the authors, both therapysts, recount their experiences in therapy and i was surprised at what they gave, the level of need they responded to was so much greateer than i would have ever asked for.  One even wrote about regreting she did respond more to a clients need.  the books are:

The Man With a Beautiful Voice by Lillian Rubin
The Gift of Therapy by Dr. Yalom, i believe his first name is irvin.  

In these books the patients/clients are encouraged to feel their needs!

i feel american society is more need phobic than some others (one i visited for 3 months) but that is another topic really.  

best to you, AND your needs!

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