Author Topic: spirituality--a reading I love  (Read 3116 times)

Hopalong

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spirituality--a reading I love
« on: February 27, 2007, 06:39:06 PM »
Hi all:
I'm sure I'm not the only non-Christian who comes here seeking (and receiving!) love and support. Thought I'd share this reading...I really like it. Spiritual answers are different for many, but sometimes the questions are the same. XXOO, Hops
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What Song  by Victoria Safford

What if there were a universe, a cosmos, that began in shining blackness, out of nothing, out of fire, out of a single, silent breath, and into it came billions and billions of stars, stars beyond imagining, and near one of them a world, a blue-green world so beautiful that learned clergymen could not even speak about it cogently, and brilliant scientists in trying to describe it began to sound like poets, with their physics, with their mathematics, their empirical, impressionistic musing?

What if there were a universe in which a world was born out of a smallish star, and into that world (at some point) flew red-winged blackbirds, and into it swam sperm whales, and into it came crocuses, and wind to lift the tiniest hairs on naked arms in spring when you run out to the mailbox, and into it at some point came onions, out of soil, and came Mount Everest, and also the coyote we've been seeing in the woods about a mile from here, just after sunrise in these mornings when the moon is full? (The very scent of him makes his brother, our dog, insane with fear and joy and ancient inbred memory.) Into that world came animals and elements and plants, and imagination, the mind, and the mind's eye.

If such a universe existed and you noticed it, what would you do? What song would come out of your mouth, what prayer, what praises, what sacred offering, what whirling dance, what religion, and what reverential gesture would you make to greet that world, every single day that you were in it?



"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

seastorm

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2007, 08:30:33 PM »
Hops

I celebrate your sense of poetry. That was lovely.

There are many poets who have written about creation. One wrote that our world is really held in a drop of water that is the dew on a rose. There are many meanings to that.

I think it is ok to not be a Christian. I approve of Hindus, Jews, Muslims, gay people, poets, accountants, everybody. What we have in common is more important than our differences.

Sea storm

Hopalong

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2007, 11:56:36 PM »
Thanks, Seastorm.
Welcome is a good thing.

 :)

Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Stormchild

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2007, 08:21:48 AM »
Here's a reading I particularly like. Although it comes from C.S. Lewis and is therefore Christian in origin, its position on basic interpersonal / intrafamily ethics [and the importance of having any spiritual conversion start at the center and move outward] applies universally.

This is from "The Screwtape Letters", Chapter III: [for background, Screwtape is a senior demon, writing to his nephew Wormwood, who is the assigned 'tempter' to a specific human being in WW II London. Wormwood's 'patient' has undergone conversion to the Christian faith, so Screwtape is suggesting ways in which to render that faith void: here, he discusses family life. Elsewhere, he discusses romantic love - I'll find that excerpt and post it this evening, it provides some amazing insight into the 'fatal attractiveness' of Ns and abusive persons. The reference to the 'elder brother' is about the parable of the Prodigal Son.]

Again, if you are not a Christian, don't read this as Christian literature first and foremost. Read it as a universal spiritual precautionary tale. Lewis has some very sharp psychological insights here. Noteworthy.
 
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MY DEAR WORMWOOD,

      I am very pleased by what you tell me about this man's relations with his mother. But you must press your advantage. The Enemy will be working from the centre outwards, gradually bringing more and more of the patient's conduct under the new standard, and may reach his behaviour to the old lady at any moment. You want to get in first. Keep in close touch with our colleague Glubose who is in charge of the mother, and build up between you in that house a good settled habit of mutual annoyance; daily pinpricks. The following methods are useful.

      1. Keep his mind on the inner life. He thinks his conversion is something inside him and his attention is therefore chiefly turned at present to the states of his own mind—or rather to that very expurgated version of them which is all you should allow him to see. Encourage this. Keep his mind off the most elementary duties by directing it to the most advanced and spiritual ones. Aggravate that most useful human characteristic, the horror and neglect of the obvious. You must bring him to a condition in which he can practise self-examination for an hour without discovering any of those facts about himself, which are perfectly clear to anyone who has ever lived in the same house with him or worked the same office.

      2. It is, no doubt, impossible to prevent his praying for his mother, but we have means of rendering the prayers innocuous. Make sure that they are always very "spiritual", that he is always concerned with the state of her soul and never with her rheumatism. Two advantages follow. In the first place, his attention will be kept on what he regards as her sins, by which, with a little guidance from you, he can be induced to mean any of her actions which are inconvenient or irritating to himself. Thus you can keep rubbing the wounds of the day a little sorer even while he is on his knees; the operation is not at all difficult and you will find it very entertaining. In the second place, since his ideas about her soul will be very crude and often erroneous, he will, in some degree, be praying for an imaginary person, and it will be your task to make that imaginary person daily less and less like the real mother—the sharp-tongued old lady at the breakfast table. In time, you may get the cleavage so wide that no thought or feeling from his prayers for the imagined mother will ever flow over into his treatment of the real one. I have had patients of my own so well in hand that they could be turned at a moment's notice from impassioned prayer for a wife's or son's "soul" to beating or insulting the real wife or son without a qualm.

      3. When two humans have lived together for many years it usually happens that each has tones of voice and expressions of face which are almost unendurably irritating to the other. Work on that. Bring fully into the consciousness of your patient that particular lift of his mother's eyebrows which he learned to dislike in the nursery, and let him think how much he dislikes it. Let him assume that she knows how annoying it is and does it to annoy—if you know your job he will not notice the immense improbability of the assumption. And, of course, never let him suspect that he has tones and looks which similarly annoy her. As he cannot see or hear himself, this is easily managed.

      4. In civilised life domestic hatred usually expresses itself by saying things which would appear quite harmless on paper (the words are not offensive) but in such a voice, or at such a moment, that they are not far short of a blow in the face. To keep this game up you and Glubose must see to it that each of these two fools has a sort of double standard. Your patient must demand that all his own utterances are to be taken at their face value and judged simply on the actual words, while at the same time judging all his mother's utterances with the fullest and most oversensitive interpretation of the tone and the context and the suspected intention. She must be encouraged to do the same to him. Hence from every quarrel they can both go away convinced, or very nearly convinced, that they are quite innocent. You know the kind of thing: "I simply ask her what time dinner will be and she flies into a temper." Once this habit is well established you have the delightful situation of a human saying things with the express purpose of offending and yet having a grievance when offence is taken.

      Finally, tell me something about the old lady's religious position. Is she at all jealous of the new factor in her son's life?—at all piqued that he should have learned from others, and so late, what she considers she gave him such good opportunity of learning in childhood? Does she feel he is making a great deal of "fuss" about it—or that he's getting in on very easy terms? Remember the elder brother in the Enemy's story.

Your affectionate uncle
SCREWTAPE
« Last Edit: February 28, 2007, 08:27:53 AM by Stormchild »
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Leah

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2007, 10:52:58 AM »
Wow thanks for posting this ((( Stormchild ))) Have read the book and it is one of my favorite CS Lewis works.

My local amateur dramatic society performed a superb production of "The Screwtape Letters" and I understand
that Walden Media have bought the rights to make a film due for release in 2008.

Alarmingly profound examinations of human nature.

Leah
« Last Edit: February 28, 2007, 10:58:49 AM by LeahsRainbow »
Jun 2006 voiceless seeking

April 2008 - "The Gaslight Effect" How to Spot & Survive by Dr. Robin Stern - freedom of understanding!

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Leah

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2007, 11:22:18 AM »
Finally, tell me something about the old lady's religious position. Is she at all jealous of the new factor in her son's life?—at all piqued that he should have learned from others, and so late, what she considers she gave him such good opportunity of learning in childhood? Does she feel he is making a great deal of "fuss" about it—or that he's getting in on very easy terms?

That was my mother's behavior, when I told her, "I have become a christian" and she griped and griped on at me.

Does she feel he is making a great deal of "fuss" about it—or that he's getting in on very easy terms? ........... Yes, she does !!

Leah


Lewis has some very sharp psychological insights here. Noteworthy.   ....... He certainly does!!
« Last Edit: February 28, 2007, 11:27:55 AM by LeahsRainbow »
Jun 2006 voiceless seeking

April 2008 - "The Gaslight Effect" How to Spot & Survive by Dr. Robin Stern - freedom of understanding!

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Lupita

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2007, 04:54:56 PM »
Dear Hop, what religion do you have, if you have one? can you tell me about your believe? Just because I love all you write, would like to know more about your thoughts.
Lupita :)

Hopalong

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2007, 08:29:21 PM »
Hi Lupita,
I was raised Christian (Presbyterian, but my grandfather was a fundamentalist evangelist) and as an adult became a Unitarian Universalist (www.uua.org describes it much much better than I can). The church began in Christianity...but morphed from it many years ago, in the sense that UUs believe no loving god would send anyone to hell, therefore all are born saved, not sinners. (That's the Universalist, as in universal salvation, part.) The Unitarian part refers to the stance the early church took against the idea of a trinity. Jesus is regarded as a very important and powerful religious teacher and leader. So are Buddha, Mohammed, etc.

Nowadays it is a very diverse group...best way I can describe it is that we believe in core prinicples that amount to the Golden Rule. Our First Principle is "the inherent worth and dignity of every human being." Politically, UUs tend to be, but aren't always, very liberal and tolerant. We've been through some laughable permutations in the effort to be inclusive, and are easy to mock. But I am deeply at home. It's become my family.

Some UUs are Christian or agnostic or deist or you name it. We even have a few earnest pagans. Some join after early painful or toxic experiences with religion. Others come to it as adults. Others are lifelong UUs. I think what brings us together is a similar attitude toward life and social justice. We have many gay members. We are not well integrated racially, but we're very involved in racial justice issues. There's an interesting list of famous UUs on the web site.

Some believe in God, or a god, some don't. We sing hymns and listen to sermons and have potlucks and all the usual... We do believe in the sacredness of community and of service.

Ask away .. I'll do my best. I am really glad there are so many different kinds of voices. And for me, different sources of the sacred.

Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Lupita

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2007, 08:43:17 PM »
Thank you Hop. Thank you for answering me. You are a wonderful human being.
Lupita

Leah

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2007, 09:11:20 PM »

Thanks for sharing Hops

I did wonder and was puzzled when you wrote that you are a non-christian

as you had previously said you lit candles at church and led a mediation

then your post mentioning your theology class.

So I began to wonder if there were two Hops  :shock:

Warm wishes and thoughts,

(( Leah ))

Jun 2006 voiceless seeking

April 2008 - "The Gaslight Effect" How to Spot & Survive by Dr. Robin Stern - freedom of understanding!

The Truth About Abuse VIDEO

Stormchild

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2007, 09:53:05 PM »
It is a dance, and we are part of the music.

Listen to Charles Ives, or to Lew Harrison, sometime. Those men somehow heard, or hear, what God hears... to hear their music is an incredible and awesome experience.

:-)
The only way out is through, and the only way to win is not to play.

"... truth is all I can stand to live with." -- Moonlight52

http://galewarnings.blogspot.com

http://strangemercy.blogspot.com

http://potemkinsoffice.blogspot.com

Stormchild

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2007, 12:36:09 AM »
Here is the passage about romantic relationships that I referred to earlier today - from Chapter XX of "The Screwtape Letters".

Lewis talks only of the vulnerability and entrapment of the male here; but it doesn't take a gifted imagination to envision the counterpoint, the sacred and infernal Adonis. I would guess that most of the women here have known at least one infernal Adonis well, and can vouch for the truth of many of the things Lewis is saying, from the woman's perspective, rather than the man's ...

Again, remember now that Screwtape is a senior 'devil' and writing to his young nephew, a junior tempter on earth. But don't read this from a solely Christian perspective. Buddhists and others consider stable, faithful marriages to be valuable to both parties involved and to society at large - it's not merely the Christian perspective that values them or wonders why we're so vulnerable to 'unsafe' romantic relationships.

*********

... You will find, if you look carefully into any human's heart, that he is haunted by at least two imaginary women - a terrestrial and an infernal Venus, and that his desire differs qualitatively according to its object. There is one type for which his desire is such as to be naturally amenable to the Enemy - readily mixed with charity, readily obedient to marriage, coloured all through with that golden light of reverence and naturalness which we detest; there is another type which he desires brutally, and desires to desire brutally, a type best used to draw him away from marriage altogether but which, even within marriage, he would tend to treat as a slave, an idol, or an accomplice. His love for the first might involve what the Enemy calls evil, but only accidentally; the man would wish that she was not someone else's wife and be sorry that he could not love her lawfully. But in the second type, the felt evil is what he wants; it is that 'tang' in the flavour which he is after. In the face, it is the visible animality, or sulkiness, or craft, or cruelty which he likes...

 ... if your man is a Christian, and if he has been well trained in nonsense about irresistible and all-excusing 'Love', he can often be induced to marry her. And that is very well worth bringing about. ... the unhappiness produced is of a very lasting and exquisite kind,

Your affectionate uncle
SCREWTAPE
The only way out is through, and the only way to win is not to play.

"... truth is all I can stand to live with." -- Moonlight52

http://galewarnings.blogspot.com

http://strangemercy.blogspot.com

http://potemkinsoffice.blogspot.com

Lupita

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Re: spirituality--a reading I love
« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2007, 06:33:54 AM »
Dear Friends: I have to pay you a compliment. Your posts are so positive, that sometimes i want to whine, I want to complain, I want to ventilate my frustration, but I see all the beautiful things that you write, and I forget about my complaints. thank you. I was coming here this morning to "cry" about my work, but after reading all these beauties, I don't want to think of bad things but good things. God bless you all!!!
Lupita