The "Bad Mommy Taboo"

[Hopalong]

I found two things especially in finding the right T for me:

1) a T who was not religiously doctrinaire, who'd respect my agnosticism
2) a T who had children or grandchildren

Other than that, smart and compassionate and human.

(My favorite former T was just in a wreck. He's okay but he was hurt.  )

Hops

[axa]

Hi yall,

Read something yesterday which went like children of alcoholics do not know what normal is.  Somehow this rang through for me and makes some sense around why I have been in Nhell so often.

axa

[Dazed1]

Hi Axa,

"Read something yesterday which went like children of alcoholics do not know what normal is."

As far as children of Ns finding out what is "normal", there's a book on that subject which is called
An Adult Child's Guide to What's 'Normal' by John C. Friel Ph.D., Linda D. Friel M.A.   I read it and loved it. 

Thought I'd also share other books I've read and found very helpful (yes, I should post this on the other board):

If You Had Controlling Parents: How to Make Peace with Your Past and Take Your Place in the World  by Dan Neuharth

Why Is It Always About You? : Saving Yourself from the Narcissists in Your Life  by Sandy Hotchkiss

Boundaries (Fireside/Parkside Recovery Book)  by Anne Katherine

I'm kinda embarrased that I've bought all these books (and many, many more similar ones), but, they've really turned me around.  For me, it's money very well spent.

I believe you're in the UK.  All the above books can be found at amazon.

Enjoy.  You may have to buy a new bookcase; I did!

dazed

[Leah]

Hi Dazed,

Well if you are embarassed about all the books you have bought and read on the Nish subject etc., then I ought to be ashamed 

Not read this one though ......

If You Had Controlling Parents: How to Make Peace with Your Past and Take Your Place in the World  by Dan Neuharth

Will now toddle off to amazon and check that one out!!  sounds like something that may be positively helpful at this time along my journey. 

Bookshelves heaving and groaning 

But you are right Dazed, these books are money well spent, life changing ... life saving .... empowering when the  come on.

Leah

[Dazed1]

Leah,

Good to hear you're a book junkie too .

The Dan Neuharth book was the first one I read in my journey to recovery.  It was really good.

I just started reading another book:  Breaking the Cycle of Abuse by  Beverly Engel.  I like this book because she goes beyond the intro to Ns.  She talks about whether the Ns can be "cured". 

What's really depressing is that she basically says that male Ns can be cured if they want to, but that female Ns cannot be cured because female Ns usually do not want to be cured.  Her conclusions are based on her experiences as a T.

I've taken a break from reading this one cuz her conclusion re:female Ns cannot be cured just bumed the hell out of my.  Gotta absorb her conclusion and then go back and finish the book.

dazed

[Leah]

Dazed,

Definately a book junkie  can't walk by a bookstall, book fair, without being drawn to yet another 'must read'   

Breaking the Cycle of Abuse by  Beverly Engel.  I like this book because she goes beyond the intro to Ns.  She talks about whether the Ns can be "cured". 

What's really depressing is that she basically says that male Ns can be cured if they want to, but that female Ns cannot be cured because female Ns usually do not want to be cured.  Her conclusions are based on her experiences as a T.
 

Well Dazed, my Nmother actually finally told me "that she did not want to change" last spring, as she said "why should I?" which was a slap in the face to me, but, there again, I don't have false hope.

It is depressing when it's your mother, for anyone

Breaking the Cycle of Abuse by  Beverly Engel reviews as an excellent book, be interested to know you final thoughts on it.

Warm wishes

Leah

[Gaining Strength]

I haven't been keeping up with this thread until today, when I read this:

It is part of the futile exercise of trusting the untrustworthy, seeking love from the unloving, seeking care from the uncaring, seeking mercy from the merciless.

Boy, Storm, that is so powerful.  It gets right to the matter.  I have lived that futile life.  I think I have stopped doing those things but I know I have not stopped grieving that my mother and father could not love or care or be trusted.  That still stings. - GS

[BonesMS]

It's been awhile since anything was discussed in this thread.  Since we have some new people, who appear to be struggling with the "Bad Mommy Taboo", I thought it might be a good idea to bring this back up.

Bones

[isittoolate]

I can add to this about my mother, but she wasn't BAD. She was unaware.

She did not know that all her 5 children would have different personalities/characteristics, needs etc., and she never noticed the little blond one pulling away, shy, not talkative, wetting the bed, scapegoat of the other 4.  She was never educated about this.

I think she was expected to churn out the free farm hands for my N father.

Izzy

[cats paw]

BonesMS,

   Just wanted to say thanks for noticing that some of us are still struggling with this issue.  I thought I had gotten it more than I have, but I think I must have gotten it on more of an intellectual level.  I also think that for the past ten or so years I have unwittingly slipped back into the parentified child role. It did not happen overnight- I started out as my adult self when my mother had bypass surgery.  I forgot some of what I had learned about her, but I still had not yet experienced that which was to be revealed by some of the things she chose to do to me- whether conscious or unconscious, intended or not.
   It is so very sad that she needs N supplies, because she has needs that can not be met.  My heart breaks for her knowing that she will die this way.  I wish I could be the all giving daughter who could make it all better, but I've found that each thing I do is received with a cursory thank you, but in the next sentence she is demanding the next thing and killing two birds with one stone by the implication that what was just done for her was not quite good enough.  And I am sick of looking at me through her reality.  I have learned that it can't be all me, because I see her eventually devalue everyone.  Can everyone possibly be that much of a failure or so uncaring?  Methinks not.

   Bones- in light of what you wrote about on this thread- some of the hurtful things that were said about you that you mentioned, I again want to say congratulations on the MS.

   I will revisit this thread, and reread what all of you have posted on it, and also write again. Oh- and Stormchild- I've got "When You and Your Mother Can't Be Friends" somewhere in the books I had put in boxes a long time ago.  I might pull it out of mothballs and revisit.

   Leah, Dazed-  Glad there are other "book junkies"!

cats paw

[Lupita]

Why do you think a mother compete with her daughter? An inscent child? And the mother do not see the poor little baby as a little baby but as a woman that is stilling attention, love, bilongings, etc that belong the the mother? I never felt that way for my son. My mother did for me. She always competed with me. I will never understand why. To the point of causing me damage, of all kinds. Just, why, just why.

[cats paw]

Oh Lupita,

  I can hear the pain and struggle with your cry of "Why?"  Can you talk about it some more?  The pain you feel?

  You have not let this defeat you, you are coming here and doing things for yourself in your life.

   Talk to us a liitle more about your pain over this, if you are able.

cats paw

[BonesMS]

BonesMS,

   Just wanted to say thanks for noticing that some of us are still struggling with this issue.  I thought I had gotten it more than I have, but I think I must have gotten it on more of an intellectual level.  I also think that for the past ten or so years I have unwittingly slipped back into the parentified child role. It did not happen overnight- I started out as my adult self when my mother had bypass surgery.  I forgot some of what I had learned about her, but I still had not yet experienced that which was to be revealed by some of the things she chose to do to me- whether conscious or unconscious, intended or not.
   It is so very sad that she needs N supplies, because she has needs that can not be met.  My heart breaks for her knowing that she will die this way.  I wish I could be the all giving daughter who could make it all better, but I've found that each thing I do is received with a cursory thank you, but in the next sentence she is demanding the next thing and killing two birds with one stone by the implication that what was just done for her was not quite good enough.  And I am sick of looking at me through her reality.  I have learned that it can't be all me, because I see her eventually devalue everyone.  Can everyone possibly be that much of a failure or so uncaring?  Methinks not.

   Bones- in light of what you wrote about on this thread- some of the hurtful things that were said about you that you mentioned, I again want to say congratulations on the MS.

   I will revisit this thread, and reread what all of you have posted on it, and also write again. Oh- and Stormchild- I've got "When You and Your Mother Can't Be Friends" somewhere in the books I had put in boxes a long time ago.  I might pull it out of mothballs and revisit.

   Leah, Dazed-  Glad there are other "book junkies"!

cats paw

You're welcome, Cats Paw.

Bones