Voicelessness and Emotional Survival > Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
healing
Wildflower:
--- Quote ---No, not 'wrong'! But hey -I'm probably getting too complicated as usual. If what I say has no meaning, isn't 'speaking' to you - then it's me that's 'wrong' - no probs!!!
--- End quote ---
Hmmm. Well, I have to admit I was a bit miffed, R, so I guess I got defensive for a minute there, because this is how your comments came across to me: You weren't listening to me after all, but it was really my fault. If I were better at communicating, you would have listened to me, but I'm not, so you didn't. That's what I heard, and my prickly defenses came up online. Does that make sense? :?
So no, you're not being too complicated. I'm just not sure I'm hearing you correctly.
Thing is, if there's something I'm doing that gets in the way of people understanding/listening to me, I want to know about it. And if there's something I can do to change it, I'll do my best, as always. I may not be able to change immediately, though. Even if I can intellectually understand what's going on, you know what I mean?
Wildflower
rosencrantz:
Hello Dear Wildflower. I know you'll know I meant no harm. And it really isn't anything to feel badly about at all. Quite the opposite. I think I mean you shield your MEANING behind words that protect other people from the HARM of your meaning. So people hear you are protecting them but don't necessarily pay attention to the meaning/content of your message as a result.
Here I'll try another way to say it :
"If I say that nothing you could say can harm me, does it mean to you that I'm not listening" seemed to be an accurate statement.
It occurred to me that, if i'm concentrating on you saying to me "I hope this doesn't hurt you" then I'm not listening to the main CONTENT of what you're saying, only the 'last thing you said' which is about 'not hurting'. So I hear you are 'not hurting me' but I'm not sure I've really been listening to the rest of what you are saying AS A RESULT.
Just as I (me, R) often hide my meaning by adding a post to/about someone else after I've written something very meaningful about myself!!! :lol: (yes, I 'see' me do this, too!! Too clearly sometimes!!!) so it just occurred to me that you hide your 'meaningful content' behind a spoken wish to prioritise 'not hurting'.
In my case, I suspect i'm hiding in order not to experience that terror : rejection!!! :lol: I see myself doing these things and get very exasperated with myself. I seem to see more than I can actually control. The only option is to laugh at myself in order to 'be on my own side' in growing.
But I'm really, really sorry if I'm still hitting a raw nerve. I think that the way you heard me was not the meaning I had intended. But is it time for me to put that spade to rest again, and stop digging???! I must be half way to Australia by now!!! :wink:
Hugs
R
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging!
Anonymous:
--- Quote from: Wildflower ---
I haven't read Healing the Child Within but I will now. Next to a box of tissues, of course. I've actually been looking for some readable texts on child development so that I can have a better understanding of what was normal at various ages. As in, was it normal to think x, y, z at that age? Or was that a sign of something bad going on? Or was that a healthy sign of me rejecting something bad? Not that I buy that everyone has the same experiences growing up - but boy would it be useful to have a yardstick. :wink:
Wildflower
--- End quote ---
or was that a healthy sign of me rejecting something bad????????????????
What an interesting thought?????????????
(((HIG)))
CG
Anonymous:
Hi Wildflower, Rosenrantz, Portia.
Well aren't I naughty posting. Someone spank me pleeease!!!!
oh, harder, harder!!
Gosh you guys are going into some deep stuff here. How ya' feein' Wildflower?? ((HIG)) How ya feelin' Rosencrantz?? ((HIG)) How ya feelin' Portia?? ((HIG)) You were so cool being so honest about your first thought, emotions, reactions and feelings.
That was such an interesting self-observation Rosencrantz about your tension/attention relieving posts that you use to draw-fire or as a distraction. It's very interesting, because I often use humour sort of the same way, sort of :?: I make some comment, I expose something very deep and personal about myself, and then out of the blue it's followed by a totally hilarious joke and that's how I get myself "off the hook" or out of further analysis. :D
And Wildflower, if you hadn't said you were miffed (is that Latin for Pissed-Off) over Rosencrantz's comment I probably would have missed it all on first read. I'm so glad you communicated you were, that is so fair and just of you. :D :D and it gives the other a chance to clear up any misunderstanding, or explain, or reframe or even apologise if necessary. :D :D Very adult stuff happenin' here.
I wish I was like that a lot more in the world, instead of imploding all over the show. Then, at other times I feel like that big fat guy in the dining room scene who overeats in Monthy Python's 'Meaning of Life". I get so full of other people's, mine, and life's stuff, then I explode. :roll: :roll: :roll:
(sigh)
Gotta go, I'll be back
(((HIG)))
CG
Wildflower:
Hi R,
Ah. I think I get it. Hmmm. I suppose I could leave it at that, but I really want to be heard this time, okay? :D Otherwise, I’m afraid this will either simmer down below or crop up again and again, and I don’t want either of those because I really value you, R.
--- Quote ---I know you'll know I meant no harm.
--- End quote ---
Absolutely. No question in my mind about that. Still need to say this, okay?
--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---Dear Wildflower. If I say there's nothing you could say that could hurt me, does it mean to you that I'm not listening? I'm listening.
--- End quote ---
Caught red handed. Talk about reading me like a book. But I’ve got to work on that, don’t I? That and worrying all the time about hurting people. So it’s my issue and it’s been duly noted to self. No worries. But thanks so much for posting that.
--- End quote ---
What I was trying to say to you here was don’t worry about my issues (because you had enough of your own to deal with). I’m on it. Thanks for acknowledging that I probably felt ignored (I did, but I’m okay with it), but that’s my deal (I felt ignored as a child and I’m sensitive to it now but I’m learning not to be). Don’t worry about it (please). Too subtle, hunh? :roll: Okay, add that to my list of issues. :lol: Oh, and that's what I look like when I'm deflecting :wink: .
But I think I see now why you’d want to bring this back up (big open issue left unanswered :?: ).
Actually, though, I think (emphasis on ‘think’) I’ve already conquered the bit about obsessing over whether I hurt people, because I finally understand WHY I felt that way (that’s what all that fuss was about a week ago Friday :roll: :wink: ). So I doubt I’ll be saying that again – at least, not with those intentions. :D
Can I tell you a story? My boss has been trying to get me to delegate more work over the past couple of years. It’s been a bit of a learning experience (understatement :roll: ), and even something as simple as this has forced me to address why it may be so difficult for me to let others help out (answer: because I couldn’t trust anyone else to be there for me growing up, and when I did, it was a big mistake). But I’ve addressed those fears, and I’ve learned to delegate – and I’ve learned a lot of other things along the way. So here I am, feeling good about myself and about how much effort I’ve put into learning to trust others when my boss comes up and says, "You need to learn to delegate." :shock: :roll:
The truth is, I have been doing a really good job. He just reacted to the fact that I was still holding on to one area of the project. I was holding onto it because it was my creation - and it was extremely complicated. I was waiting for the other team members to catch up by delegating out other pieces - and they even admitted to being intimidated by this piece. I had every intention of delegating this piece out when it was time, but when my boss said that to me, I forgot all my plans and intentions and I felt like all the hard work I’d done had either gone unnoticed – or I hadn’t done a good job after all. All this effort I’d put in? Nada. No good. Worthless. :(
I bet most people wouldn’t have reacted the way I did (by immediately doubting myself), but I think that’s a normal reaction for ACONs who have been taught their reality, well, isn’t real. :wink:
--- Quote ---Just as I (me, R) often hide my meaning by adding a post to/about someone else after I've written something very meaningful about myself!!! (yes, I 'see' me do this, too!! Too clearly sometimes!!!) so it just occurred to me that you hide your 'meaningful content' behind a spoken wish to prioritise 'not hurting'.
--- End quote ---
I have noticed that you often deflect analysis of your own issues by addressing the issues of others, and that’s okay. :) I haven’t said anything before because I figured you either knew and were working on it, or when you were more comfortable with being vulnerable, it would go away on its own. In short, I didn’t see any point in … pointing it out to you. :wink: Besides, I still listened to what you said when the spotlight came back to me because often these moments have been filled with some dead-on observations. :D Just as CG's deflections result in some hilarious stories (that cause hiccups, btw :lol: ). But this time, R, you kinda hit a big raw nerve, and I felt much the way I did after my boss told me I needed to learn to delegate.
--- Quote ---I finally (I think) figured out what it is you do for me not to listen/hear!!
You get me (anyone?) concentrating on whether I feel hurt/damaged instead of concentrating on WHAT YOU SAID! And as my attention flickers over your words, I register that I don't feel hurt and so I respond to THAT question - but in the process of doing that, i'm ignoring all the words of wisdom and support you offer!!! Can you see how that works?? Can you see how to make it different so you DO get heard better??
--- End quote ---
I couldn’t hear ‘words of wisdom and support you offer’ (but thank you for that). All I could hear was :
“what you do for me not to listen … “
“You get me (anyone?) concentrating on whether I feel hurt/damaged”
“Can you see how that works??”
“Can you see how to make it different so you DO get heard better??”
And all I could think was, gosh, is everyone ignoring me? :shock: I thought it was just a communication thing between me and R, but now I want to go back and read all my posts to find out if I’ve been ignored. Have I been doing this to my parents and that’s why they ignore me? After all this time, it’s really all my fault??? :shock: :shock: :shock: And I thought I had a handle on this “hurting people” thing, but if R’s bringing it up again and asking me whether or not I understand how to change the way I communicate – maybe I still don’t get it??? :shock:
But I do get it. And while I know I may backslide from time to time, I hope it won’t be much of an issue in the future.
--- Quote ---I think I mean you shield your MEANING behind words that protect other people from the HARM of your meaning.
--- End quote ---
Quite aside from my own issues about worrying how I hurt people, I feel very strongly that I should be careful with people here on this board. They’ve been shoved into boxes and beaten up by the needs of others. I don’t want my needs to be added to their lists, and I don’t want to push anyone any farther into their boxes. Or even into new boxes.
Besides, for those I haven’t had a chance to get to know (and even those I have), I don’t know where they are in their process of healing. I don’t know what their triggers are. I don’t know how long they’ve been working on an issue (and are frustrated by it). I don’t know if what I have to say was something they figured out a million years ago. And I don’t even know if I understand enough to be able to understand them - because I’ve got my very own set of blinders 8) . So I’m careful. And - I hope - respectful.
So I’m not trying to hide something harmful behind words of comfort. I really, truly, simply want to be supportive in any way I can – whenever I can. Even if that means stepping away sometimes. That’s just who I am (even took a while to recover that bit), and I’m proud of it. I over-tip at restaurants and in cabs for similar reasons (and thankfully, this tipping habit has rubbed off on my friends :D – when they’re with me at any rate :wink: ). Sometimes I can’t be supportive, though, because I’m struggling with my own stuff or because I need to go back out into the real world and take care of my, er, life :wink: . Which is yet another reason why this board rocks: so many other really supportive people on this board. :D
So, I’m crossing my fingers (big time) and hoping that you understand that I’m telling you all this so that we can be on the same page. And that being on the same page with you is important to me.
(((hugs)))
Wildflower
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