Author Topic: Despair vs Survival  (Read 2319 times)

rosencrantz

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Despair vs Survival
« on: April 04, 2004, 05:41:49 PM »
I don't really understand what's going on any more.

Aren't you getting a little bored with baiting me??  I'm not really flattered by your attention, you know.  Just struggling with my own issues.  Perhaps being a bit too 'clever'.  But you know I won't give up.  If I give up, I die.

A couple of posts have managed to leave me feeling suicidal this afternoon.  Does that make you feel good?  Well, congratulations - if that's the best you want out of your own life.  I'm sorry you had such a bad life.  My mother did that to me, too.  I struggle with that.  Not that I  ever told anybody.  I can't ask for help.  It would mean asking someone to choose between me and my mother.  I couldn't do that.  And anyway, I'd lose.  I'm on my own here.  I've always been on my own.   All alone.  Isolated.  An only child.  Struggling.  Hidden away.

That's why nobody knows how much pain I'm in.  Nobody ever knows. I won't feel sorry for myself.  I won't cry.  That's how I chose to handle my mother, too.  I didn't realise.  The means of survival - resistance - was my choice but that's what she tried to do.  "If only you'd cry, I'd know I'd got through to you."  But I will not be beatem down by spite and obfuscation.  You can try to make me crazy.  You can try to beat me down all you like.  But I won't give in.

I don't ask anyone to rush to my side, I don't manipulate people into supporting me (like my mother would).  Do I?  In fact I do the opposite - keep out - you don't have to rescue me -  I will look after myself.  I'll take responsibility for myself.  I will face the consequences.

But why the baiting?  Why the 'meanness'?  Why not answer a simple question with a simple answer?  Why?  Why define me in ways which don't make sense?  

All I can see is that I'm exposed again and it won't stop.  But I won't stop, either.

As I said, I don't understand what's going on any more.  No - I give up trying to understand.  'Understanding' means bad things happen.  I had a happy time on this forum until one particular thing happened, and it's been spitefulness and craziness and revenge ever since.  But, if I dare to say that, I'll just get clobbered all over again.  OK - I dared say it - so come and get me again.

But that's all about my mother, too.  NO - it's here, too.  And I'm just totally, totally, totally out of my mind with :shock:  And all that comes next is how tedious and boring all this is.  Well, I have a right to be heard too - you hear my pain now - you put up with me being boring and tedious.  You can say 'Here we go again' as much as you like.  You can sigh as much as you like.  I'm here and I'm staying put.

MY PAIN GETS HEARD, TOO.
R
"No matter how enmeshed a commander becomes in the elaboration of his own
thoughts, it is sometimes necessary to take the enemy into account" Sir Winston Churchill

Wildflower

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2004, 07:09:11 PM »
In another post, I asked you go out and play, and I hope you are because I can tell you’re incredibly drained right now, but when you’re feeling better and have time, there’s one little thing you said here that really struck me.

Quote
I can't ask for help. It would mean asking someone to choose between me and my mother. I couldn't do that. And anyway, I'd lose.


I don’t know your mother, but I can tell from what you've written here that she’s been misbehaving for a long, long time.  Misbehaving in ways that have deeply hurt you.  You’ve pulled through, though, and you have a life now, even though you’re sorting through so much at this time.  But what I want to know is, why would I, Wildflower, have to choose between you and your mother if you asked for help?  I’m not trying to take your statement personally, but I am wondering what you mean by saying this…what’s behind this.

Again.  No need to respond right way.  I was just wondering if this might be something that gets in the way.

Take care,
Wildflower
If you want to sing out, sing out
And if you want to be free, be free
'Cause there's a million ways to be, you know that there are
-- Cat Stevens, from the movie Harold and Maude

Karin

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2004, 10:24:55 PM »
Rosencrantz,
I want you to know that I can see now how much pain you are in. It's more than what you want to admit to and I want to let you know that you will find support here, so don't ever think that you're alone.
Some of us are in a position to be able to support you, some aren't. You CAN ask for help, especially here. I really don't think that anyone is 'out to get you'.
 
You said you were 'very hurt' when your mother asked for her jewellery back. I remember thinking when I read that if I were you I would've told her that she can't have them back, she gave them to you and she could shove THAT up her.. etc. I learnt that it was up to me let go of my mother, because she couldn't. And when I did, she did. Peace at last.

You are terribly confused, that's obvious and I think you need to refocus on your mother and not let recent other events blur what the root of your problem is; your mother.

Keep going, you'll make it.
Karin.

Wildflower

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2004, 10:40:25 PM »
Hi Rosencrantz,

I hope I'm not being an annoying buzzing bee right now, but this has been banging around in my head since reading your post:

Quote
"If only you'd cry, I'd know I'd got through to you." ... You can try to beat me down all you like. But I won't give in.


When my mother was in her teens, my grandmother used to randomly go into her bedroom (invade her space) and refuse to leave until my mom 'admitted' that she hated her.  Of course, my mom would finally get beaten down into saying this in order to get my grandmother to leave her alone.  And I'm sure, on some level, my mom DID hate her for making her crazy like that, but it was still a horrible thing to make my mother say.  How traumatizing? :shock:   And in a kind of twisted way, my mom wasn't allowed to do the normal teenager thing and hate her mother.  Even that was taken away from her.  It just struck me that it may have been a similar experience to hear your mother accuse you of being unfeeling and refusing to leave you alone until you "broke".

Anyway...not sure if that helps.

Take care,
Wildflower
If you want to sing out, sing out
And if you want to be free, be free
'Cause there's a million ways to be, you know that there are
-- Cat Stevens, from the movie Harold and Maude

Anonymous

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2004, 11:44:07 PM »
Quote
A couple of posts have managed to leave me feeling suicidal this afternoon.


Nobody can MAKE you feel any feeling . . .

FEELINGS ARE A CHOICE!!  TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR OWN FEELINGS AND HOW YOU CHOOSE TO FEEL!!

Stop blaming everyone else and look in the mirror!  Take a break and get yourself together and take responsibility for your own actions.

Wildflower

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2004, 12:03:37 AM »
Hi Guest,

Quote
FEELINGS ARE A CHOICE!! TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR OWN FEELINGS AND HOW YOU CHOOSE TO FEEL!!


I hear what you're saying in terms of it being important to take responsibility for ourselves, but I'm not sure I agree that we have control over how things make us feel.  For instance, I couldn't control how rejected and attacked I felt as a child - though I tried to.  Controlling my feelings only caused them to go down into a deep place to be dealt with later.

But I think we can control how we react to and to some extent, how we internalize, certain words, events, actions.  We can choose to leave a situation that is hurtful to us (like taking a break and getting some fresh air), and we can choose to leave an abusive relationship (though, boy, is that ever tough).  And we can choose not respond to people who we feel are attacking us.

Respectfully,
Wildflower
If you want to sing out, sing out
And if you want to be free, be free
'Cause there's a million ways to be, you know that there are
-- Cat Stevens, from the movie Harold and Maude

phoenix

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2004, 12:29:08 AM »
bye

Anonymous

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2004, 03:06:09 AM »
Hi Rosencrantz, I seem to have been posting to you all over the board today. Hope you're feeling better. I read some of the responses here and had a few moments to share a few thoughts.

First, I connected with Wildflowers question. Why would I choose your mother? Is she that good at influencing everybody?

Secondly, I admired your open writing and honest communication of what you were feeling in your head and heart. Peeking into your private moment, you allowing us to share that was very human, very connecting. :lol:

Thirdly, don't be ashamed of expressing your true feelings. Isn't that exactly how we all got to be voiceless in the first place? By denying and repressing our feelings I mean.

And lastly Rosencrantz, I don't think our feelings are a choice. I do think that the emotions and actions that follow are, but not our feelings. I agree with the Jungians here. Jung constantly insisted and maintained that our feelings and emotions are separate and different. Language inadequacies and translation created a big misunderstanding. But I base what I believe on this.

Whenever my children feel sad and upset by something I don't try to convince them that their feelings aren't valid. I validate them, cuddle them and talk with them. I look for ways to understand why the 'something' made them feel bad or upset. Then I either agree with them and comfort and support them, or I try to show them my alternative perspective, and cuddle support them and comfort them. I never tell them, stop it, or say what you're feeling is nonsense.

Why things left you feeling suicidal this afternoon is important, and not to be trivialised or repressed or ignored. Haven't we all done too much of that?  :roll: I believe something had this effect on you? It would be good to understand why. Have you worked out why? Yes it's been difficult times here recently, and it's bought some things to the surface for you. Please don't push them back down. Let them rise to surface and explore them if you feel up to it. You made a damn good start here in this thread.

I'd ask anyone who wants to tell Rosencrantz to STOP, to 'Feck Off' (Father Ted). :lol:  Go and participate on another thread. Leave her thread alone. She was shouting at the moon, please give her the freedom to explore her feelings and thoughts here in safety. If you don't like it, go and analyse why you don't. :lol:
How does it go? "Analyse This" (Middle Finger In Raised Position.)

People do care about you Rosencrantz. I'm certainly not telling you what to do, putting any expectations on you, or insist that you continue analysing how you feel. I 99% expect that next time you post you'll be wearing that firm British stiff upper lip and be in control as ever. I'm just saying that if you want to there are warm hearts here that care and are willing to explore with you. Just like you've done with us at different times. Look at some of those beautiful responses you've had here from Wildflower and Pheonix and Karin and know how much you are loved and appreciated.  

Bye for now

Guest

rosencrantz

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Despair vs Survival
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2004, 02:24:22 PM »
Hi - Thanks.  Guest, I think you're wonderful.  I see how you deal with some things here and -!  :)  So cool.  I thought I was finally able to come back here to talk with folk after having worked through some other stuff but I've just seen some more nasty stuff and I've come over all peculiar.  So I won't try just now.  But I'm in a better place this evening.
BFN
R
"No matter how enmeshed a commander becomes in the elaboration of his own
thoughts, it is sometimes necessary to take the enemy into account" Sir Winston Churchill