Voicelessness and Emotional Survival > Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Is It Always N Behavior to Violate Others' Boundaries?
Certain Hope:
--- Quote from: gratitude28 on August 12, 2007, 07:26:48 PM ---CH,
Your point about anger is funny. My NM only shrugs and giggles if corrected. She never gets upset about it - I am pretty sure because she doesn't think she did anything wrong.
Love, Beth
--- End quote ---
Dear Beth,
I'm not sure what to make of that. Npd-ex always had some backwards responses - the opposite of what would seem appropriate - but he also was so extremely defensive that any suggestion he'd made a mistake would arouse instant fury. He didn't always act that out immediately, though... sometimes you'd just catch the flash in his eyes and know that you'd be paying for it later. Very passive-aggressive.
Might be an interesting thread? How does N respond when corrected... hmmm...
Love,
Hope
BonesMS:
--- Quote from: Gaining Strength on August 12, 2007, 01:55:43 PM ---Bones - CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!! That is Awesome!!!!
Sorry the one person who went with you to add support to your magnificent day actually detracted from your celebration of your magnificent accomplishment. Now you know and you clearly are good at drawing that boundary. What ever her problem it is big enough to interfere in a true relationship. Isn't that sad for her?
Way to go - girl!!!!!
--- End quote ---
Thanks, GS!
I'm finding it interesting at the range of behaviors an N will go through in an attempt to force people to do what they want...at all costs.
Bones
BonesMS:
--- Quote from: teartracks on August 12, 2007, 02:13:12 PM ---
Dear Bones,
Re: Is it always N behavior to violate others boundaries?
First your traveling companion exhibited over the top N behavior.
I think we all violate the boundaries of others from time to time, but not maliciously. The difference is that N's won't hear you when you explain that they have overstepped a boundary. They will do the same thing over and over again even though you have been clear that their behavior is not acceptable. They will lie, deny, manipulate, set you up for more, - well you know the gig, right?
On the other hand, a regular person will hear you when you explain that they have overstepped a boundary, they know that no means no, they will apologize and mean it, correct their behavior, feel remorse, talk it through, pursue mutuality, work with you to clear the air, and so on. Once the two have talked through the incident, both will feel like they have moved forward. From there, the normal flow of interaction and communication can take it's healthiest course.
Congratulations on the Masters!
tt
--- End quote ---
Thanks, TT!
Your explanation is right on the money!!!!! I couldn't help but notice that whenever this "friend" hears the word "NO", she gets this blank look on her face, what appears to be a glaze over her eyes, and then she will attempt to force others to do what she wants while acting pseudo-stupid. Or she will insist on repeating the same thoughtless behaviors over and over again while giving herself "excuses/permission" to keep repeating those thoughtless behaviors. I'll give a couple of examples:
Example #1: About 14-15 years ago, one of her sisters was expecting her only child and she was on medical bed-rest as her pregnancy was high risk. "Friend" had been going over to her sister's home to do her housework, (laundry, etc.) for her. Sister explained how her maternity bras needed to be laundered because (a) they are delicate and (b) they are expensive. "Friend" ignored these instructions, threw them into the regular laundry and RUINED them! Then put on the pseudo-stupid routine and wondered why her sister was so ANGRY at her! Shortly afterwards, when several of us were planning and working on a baby shower for this sister, Mom started creating a family heirloom potato salad from an heirloom recipe that had been handed down from mother to daughter for SEVERAL generations. "Friend" attempted to FORCE her mother to change the recipe and add other ingredients. Mother told her "NO", the recipe doesn't need those other ingredients....leave it. A minute or two later, "friend" asks her mother if she wants celery. Mother, again, told her "NO, the recipe does not need it." This was repeated over and over again for about 30-45 minutes until Mom started yelling "NO means NO!" And yet, "friend" kept repeating the same question acting pseudo-stupid. Finally I chimed in with "What part of the word "NO" do you NOT understand?!?!? Mom has said 'NO, she does NOT need celery! Please STOP!!" "Friend" gave us both the blank stare and the glazed eyes.
Example #2: A whole group of us had made dinner reservations at a very expensive upscale restaurant in a very upscale area. (This was a special treat for all of us.) The group of us talked and agreed that we would all meet at Mom's house at 4:00 p.m. and carpool down to the restaurant as parking was at a premium. (I was the only non-family member in the group.) At 4:00 p.m., everyone EXCEPT "friend" and her husband had arrived. (Dinner reservations at this restaurant was at 7:00 p.m.) After waiting, I was ready to go ahead and leave "friend" behind while the rest of us carpooled to the restaurant. However, because I am a non-family member, I was overruled by the others and we continued to wait. FIVE HOURS LATER, here comes "friend" and her husband while she is exclaiming: "Ooooooooooohhhhhhhhhh! I ought to be spanked!" I was FURIOUS!!! Her family was LIVID and they all tore into her so I didn't have to say anything at that time. Her family members said it all for me! Her response? That same psuedo-stupid behavior, blank stare and glazed eyes. (Later on, when she attempted to do the same thing with me and I had the opportunity to say what I thought about her continuous tardiness, instead of apologizing and changing the behavior, she responded with: "BUT.....I said I ought to be spanked!" I pointed out to her that does NOT constitute an apology because the behavior has NOT changed. She was simply giving herself permission to do it again to others and that is NOT appropriate!
At the time these incidents occurred, I didn't know about N-behaviors! Now it's all starting to make sense!
Bones
BonesMS:
--- Quote from: Ami on August 12, 2007, 02:29:32 PM ---Dear Bones,
I have a slightly different take on it. When I read your post,it hit me that she 'can't help it". Whatever she was doing, she was doing it,subconsciously.
My question to you, though, is why didn't you end the friendship at the Great wall of China? Love Ami
--- End quote ---
Thanks, Ami.
I understand where you are coming from. One of the reasons I have not ended it recently is because her mother is in the end stages of Alzheimer's and is totally at her mercy. I have been acting as an advocate for her mother, since Mom cannot defend herself, and plan to continue to be Mom's advocate for the limited amount of time she has left on this Earth. (Mom will be 90 at the end of this month.) After she is gone, I'm sure the connection will end.
Bones
BonesMS:
--- Quote from: isittoolate on August 12, 2007, 02:54:42 PM ---Congratulations, bones, on your Masters
Such terrible behaviour on the part of your 'friend'.
AS I read through all the responses, my question is, "Did she not realize that there were others observing her offensive behaviour?" I cannot imagine doing that to a friend, let alone in puiblic, and not feel any sense of 'misbehaviour'.
How terribly weird and does anyone know an N who would draw negative attention to him/herself? I'm stunned!
Congrats again
Izzy
--- End quote ---
Thanks, Izzy.
I think she was so self-absorbed that she just didn't notice what others thought....or maybe she didn't care what others thought.
Bones
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