Really down tonight . . .

[tayana]

I don't know why.  I spent about thirty minutes writing in my journal about my feelings, but that didn't seem to help.  I know what's really wrong.  I'm just really down and sad.

[Ami]

Write about it,Tayana. Is it that you feel so "stuck"in all these self destructive habits( feeling worthless etc). Is it that you tried so hard to get out of the 'hole" and your M is still in your head?
  I was soooo down today and after everyone's post,love, caring and a few laughs,I feel good. I am amazed how much better I feel actually.I was really,really hurting today.
  I don't feel alone anymore.
  Why don't you write about it.I would like to hear.                        Love    Ami

[Certain Hope]

(((((((((((((Tayana)))))))))))))  Great big hugs to you... I know how that sadness can just pour itself on in a drenching way.

You've been doing so many positive, wonderful things and taking such solid steps into a new life.... I just know that all those good things are adding up, even as we type! Please know that you are not alone in the sadness... and don't lose heart. It's weird... when I gave up feeling upset about feeling sad, it got alot easier... hmm... doesn't make much sense in print, but it's true nonetheless.  : ) Anyhow, you're fighting some tremendously difficult battles, I know, so please just be patient with yourself. Gee, I could sing a chorus from "Tomorrow", but my kids'd prolly toss maters at me... so I'd best go now.

Love to you,
Carolyn

[Hopalong]

((((((((((Tayana)))))))))))))))

Maybe you're lonely?
You're working on establishing NC for the first time, ever, with the toxic woman who filled up your spaces and crossed your boundaries so much you forgot you're as entitled as anybody else to a whole, happy life, with healthy friends who love you and enjoy you and share meals and gatherings.

For a while, as you hold this lifesaving boundary to keep your mother from invading any more, you might feel empty?

Have faith. Once you protect this raw new space in yourself, it will grow a skin, that will let it breathe and grow...as you venture out.

It is very painful, this stage of your growth. But it IS growth and you have done magnificently.

One day at a time.

love
Hops

[tayana]

Here's some excerpts from my journal . . .

I feel guilty because

* I should call my parents
* I should ask how they are doing
* I shouldn't be so cruel
* I think I might be wrong about distancing myself and need to smooth things over.

I am angry because

* No one seems to care about me
* No one wants to see me be strong and independent
* No one understands how much I hurt
* No one offers to do things that are truly helpful
* I want to call her
* I'm always the peacekeeper and I'm tired of it.

I'm frustrated because

* I want to meet new people but I'm scared to
* People take advantage of me and I don't know how to stop them
* I don't know what good parenting skills are
* I should be happy to see my kid in the evening and I'm not always
* I don't like homework or homework battles
* My boss isn't working harder on my promotion
* My son doesn't help out around the house enough
* I have to undo all my mother's n'ism's on my kid
* I never have time for me
* My job is dull, boring and unchallenging
* I don't know how to manage my money, save or invest it.  I just want to spend, spend, spend
* My best friend lives in Ohio, and I wish she was here.
* I'm lonely.

Hops, some of it is that I'm lonely.  I think some of it is just anxiety that's out of control.  Some of it might be hormones.  I just want to sit and cry.  I've been snippy all evening, and nothing I do has made any difference.  I still feel down.

I honestly think some of it's nerves from M having a friend over tomorrow night.  I can't describe the anxiety the thought of that causes.  I feel guilty for that too.  I'm worried that this kid isn't really going to be a friend, or is just coming over to make fun or something.  I want M to have friends, and I want him to get to do things like this.  I'd rather he didn't do it in the middle of the week though.  We had a little talk about that.

I'm trying to keep the two front rooms of the apartment nice, so that it's not cluttered up.  It feels nice when it's not cluttered. 

I don't know what's wrong.  I just want to be left alone, and yet I don't want to be alone.  A lot of times I'm fine being alone.  I usually like being alone.  I've been a little off all day today.  I think after my co-worker's comment this morning, I just never could get the thought that he could be right out of my head.

[lighter]

We want good things for you and we understand the forces and pressures you're under.

Covert and otherwise.

It's crazymaking..... there's a reason it's crazymaking.

It makes no sense and I think we get buried when we keep going back and trying to make sense.

Trying to explain and re interpret why we can't have a normal relationship.

Why we can't call and check in and have it not topple us over.

We can't.

And there will never be a reason, that makes sense.

To us or anyone else.

It's an excercise in acceptance and making peace with something.

When we feel it deeply enough inside, then we can't be moved out of it again into trying to figure out how to change it.

It's the hope and trying, that our hearts want to do.... would willingly do..... that keeps us so sad..... unable to move ahead without taking steps backwards, IMO.

I guess we just have have to be hit over the head with the facts, then we can put it down and turn away to better things withoiut the guilt and the "I shoulds" and the comments of people (who know nothing) triggering us.

Think how far you've come.  You never thought you could do that.

You'll move through this too, Tay.

You'll be happy and it's just part of the process...... to worry and fret and wonder.... feel guilt and sadness.

I think getting free always catches me by surprise. 

One day..... I'm just not so distressed any more.  For no particular reason.  And I wait for it to come back, sort of cringing, lol.

But it doesn't and I'm thankful. 

2 steps forward 1 step back but you keep moving ahead.

[axa]

Feeling sad is human.  Feeling the loneliness is a way of moving through the loneliness, I also know this is true.  I am struck by how hard you are on yourself.  I am wondering if you would post here a list of what you have achieved in the past months.  I would really like you to do this if you can.  I know how easy it is to get into the downward spiral.  Can you challenge yourself to check the reality of your amazing steps.

I read your list and it made me sad to think of how you are beating yourself up.  Of course you are not perfect you are just like the rest of us, faltering through life in the best way you can.

Please stay posting

axa

[Ami]

Dear Tayana,
   A thought hit me.I could be wrong.However,it is what Amber and I talk about,often.It is feeling like we have to "punish" ourselves(take away our joy) b/c we couldn't make it O.K. for the N mother. We are "bad" b/c we couldn't make it come out differently i.e. make then "good"
   Also, there is a need to punish yourself WHEN you separate from the N mother. It was "brainwashed" in us to never ,ever become separate individuals. It was really bad and selfish to have your own identity.
 You were "killing" her,in a sense.
  What was HORRIBLE for me was that my M always ridiculed me for being "too dependent" and 'needing too much love ' when all the time she had iron strings attached to me---- BLEH.
  My guess is that you are going through  "guilt" at trying to 'escape" the iron chains.I think that you have a type of survivors guilt. You want to have some sort of a decent existence and you feel that doing that will "kill" her.
   Read about my dream last night. I 'sacrificed" myself for my M --so that she could live. What a freakin price to demand from a kid.  Please, compost what does not fit.You can make some vegetables                              Ami

[Poppy Seed]

I think it is great that you wrote out your feelings.  It is good to look at them on the outside, I think.  Are you able to talk yourself out of the "should" list??  I have really battled with some of those feelings as I learn to detach.  I am not sure where that guilt comes from.  I thought that when I started to take important steps toward self care that I would feel peace or something similar.  But, the guilt poured in.  My Melody Beattie Book calls that "afterburn".  I am finding more strength as I listen to the quieter part of me that knows self care feels good and less to the guilt.  I am hoping the guilt will burn off.

With regards to the angry list....

Change that NO ONE word.  It is not good for you.  It is black and white.  Change those statements to 'I' statements. 

I care about ME.

I want to see myself strong and independent.

I understand how much I hurt.

I can do things for myself that are truly helpful.

This is SOOO hard for me.  I want someone else to feel these things for me. I often wish I had a best friend or big sister that I didn't have to explain everything to.  Someone who always had the right thing to say or who would always guide me to my best self.  Maybe someday there will be such a person in my life...but for now I am "it".  So, I try not to allow myself to focus outward onto what others are not doing.  I am being my own guardian, my own best friend.  Hard like heck to do...but I am feeling a growing confidence in myself.

I think that you are charming!!  You will meet people!!  When it is time.

You are a good mother.  Maybe you don't have it all mastered.....but show me a mother who did?????  You are doing better than you know.  The beauty of parenthood isn't in the perfection of it.....it is in the process.

People won't stop taking advantage until you set the boundary.  And you WILL set the boundary but not before you are ready. 

Much love to you Tayana.

[tayana]

Axa,  I took your suggestion and a few minutes to make a "positive list" even though some of the things on it are rather trivial.

Excerpt from journal, the positive list:

* moved out of parent's house
* dealt with the emotional fallout of moving
* concentrated on the positive aspects of moving with M
* dealt with M's anger and rage because we moved, am still dealing with the occaisional, we should move back.
* established new, positive routines, cooking together, exercise, etc.
* found summer activities for M
* got M settled in new school
* made homework low key and less structured
* stopped the constant yelling and criticism
* got a rat (hamster)
* trained the dog to s pend the day alone
* installed shelf in laundry room
* organized the house
* donated and sold lots of stuff
* still have money in the bank
* survived
* dev. a positive relationship with M's teacher
* sent M to camp
* learned to make bread

That's what I came up with after about five minutes.  I don't know that I would call some of those things accomplishments, really.

Ami, my mom has frequently told me that I'm the reason she's sick, and she's told me before when I've done normal, healthy things that she'll either be in the hospital or dead when I get back.  I understand exactly what you're saying.  It's a horrible choice isn't it, especially for a child.  Either die a spiritual death or kill your parent.  Terrible choice. 

Poppy, writing out my feelings helps a little.  I wish I could say that a good nights sleep helped, but it didn't really.  I feel just as bad today as I did last night.  I don't really sleep all that well, and I got up extra early this morning to pick up things. I think part of my problem is that M is supposed to have company tonight, unless the other boy changed his mind.  For M's sake, I hope not.  But a teeny little part of me, the very selfish part, hopes he doesn't come.  It upsets my routine, and I don't like that.  In fact, knowing that I might have other people in my house, turns on this switch.  The house has to be perfect.  It has to be clean and swept and shiny with no piles or trash or shoes or toys everywhere. 

I felt the switch come on last night, and I know where it came from.  Having company at my mom's house, even if it's just my brother, meant that it had to be cleaned from top to bottom, everything had to be perfect.  We had to cook a big meal, and that had to be perfect.  We couldn't just order pizza or have burgers or something.  I can't turn this switch off.  Just the thought of having someone beside M and me in the house makes me feel jittery, sick, obssesive-compulsive, and sad because I shouldn't feel like this over having another 10 year old in my house.

Change that NO ONE word.  It is not good for you.  It is black and white.  Change those statements to 'I' statements. 

I care about ME.

I want to see myself strong and independent.

I understand how much I hurt.

I can do things for myself that are truly helpful.

Poppy, I can do the last three, but not that first one.  I'm not sure I do care.  I feel like I'm trying so hard, and I'm just failing miserably.  Last night M told me he's depressed because the kids at school didn't like him, and I tried to explain that he has one friend and he should concentrate on having one really good friend rather than having everyone like him.  He didn't understand.  See?  That's what I mean.  I'm obviously not doing something right because I make all of these changes and nothing really changes.

I had to apologize to my son and explain that I didn't feel good last night, and that's why we were talking about depression.  I was trying to explain that I felt really sad, and I didn't mean to be so irritable. 

I took him to Earth Club this morning, and I asked him if he felt better about things.  he said no, that he still feels sad, but when he got to his club he was all smiles.  He seems really happy, but I know that sometimes the exterior hides something dark inside.  He won't talk about his feelings though, no matter how hard I try to get him to.  He said he felt a little better, but he still didn't smile.  I was teasing him this morning, after he told me he never smiled.  I caught him smiling. 

I do have a really good friend who helps me, and I"ve helped her.  It's just that she lives in a different state. 

I'm supposed to see my doctor on Monday.  That seems so far away.  Maybe that will help.

[Poppy Seed]

Tayana,

You are planting right now.  You have been hauling off the weeds and rocks!  Now the soil is ready and seeds are sowed.  You need some rain and hot sun to help it all grow.  But by and by, the harvest WILL come!  Just take yourself home and feel the satisfaction that comes after a hard days work in the fields.

Let go, if you can, of that voice that says the house has to be perfect.  That is HER voice, right?  And you are leaving that behind.  So, separate yourself from it.  Maybe you need a big mess.  Maybe M needs to make one.  Maybe you could allow a little caos and delight in the organic creativity that comes from it.  Look at it like a kid covered in mud but smiling ear to ear.  What do you focus on the mud or the smile? 

You ever feel a little more comfortable in a neighbors home that has a few dishes in the sink?  Let yourself have a few dishes in the sink!  And embrace the freedom of it.  Paint your pickett sign..."My dishes don't define me!!"  And then maybe the breaking of this chain will give you fuel to break some more!

The embracing won't come all at once.....you are planting.....but by and by the mess won't alarm you in the same way. I also think in separating yourself from that voice, your own true preferences will emerge.  Maybe you will still like it neat and tidy.  But that will come from that true place in you and you won't have guilt and shame and perfectionism wrapped up in it.  It will just be an expression of the beautiful YOU!  And it will allow your little guy that same freedom of expression.

 Some days I force myself not to fold the towels neatly.    I look at it and say "shove it" to that old perfectionistic tape playing in the background.  It is a little private rebellion....revolution maybe.  This week I have been folding my towels with no guilt/no worry.  I looked back at the stack and it was beautiful.  No guilt producing mandate to prove my goodness.  Just an unconscious expression of self.....and I put the towels away with a little smile.

Hold on Tayana.  The light will come!!!   For now, celebrate your new found freedom.(i have to force myself to this. 8 mos of forcing...  but now I have tasted it....and it tastes really good!)   Run with the wind in your hair a little!!!  One step in front of the other...each one a victory!

Pops

[tayana]

Poppy,

A lot of times I do things like leave dishes in the sink because I've been lazy and haven't emptied the dishwasher yet.  I have piles of things to be sorted.  I don't like the piles though.  It actually makes me feel worse.  I seem to do all right if there's a sort of happy balance between messiness and cleanliness, anything that crosses that line makes me anxious.

My mom came by once for lunch, and she commented on the dishes in my sink.  The paper that I still hadn't read, etc.  Just nitpicked everything.  I was so glad when she left.

I do have to force it.  And then there's days when I don't want to do anything at all.  I didn't even want to get up this morning.

I just don't feel like celebrating, and I don't really know why.  My next exercise for my journal is to create a 20% list.  I don't have to be perfect, without shame or criticism 20% of the time, and list the activities I don't have to be perfect at.

So 20% of the time . . .

My house doesn't have to be perfectly neat.
My house can be dirty.
The laundry doesn't have to be done.
Dinner doesn't have to be on time or super healthy or all that good.
My car can be a mess.
I don't have to overachieve at work.

[Ami]

Dear Tayana,
  I realized today ,at the furniture store how much I 'browbeat" myself for ALL the things I don't do right. After browbeating myself, I am too tired to do anything---BLEH..
  I think that I have so many issues about "keeping a house" .
  I read someplace that D's of cerebral N's can achieve in cerebral things ,but not emotional things. That is me. I have confidence in cerebral things like music or learning a language,but I have no confidence in my gut.( emotional decisions,trusting myself  etc)
  I think that my M was so invested in the house that I gave up in that arena.
 It is so complicated to dig your way out of N mother abuse.  I can see that I made progress BUT I have so much more digging to do..;;;;;Getting a shovel::::                  Ami
 

[tayana]

Oh Ami, I can definitely relate!  I can confidently learn new software, tackle budgeting, write a novel, but ask me to sort out my feelings, or even worse, actually share them with another person and I clam up.  Ask me to stand up for myself and I can't.

As for the house, my mom complained all the time that no one ever helped her out.  Yet, when we tried, or when we were home to do it, she either didn't feel like it, didn't have time, was too involved in other things, or else we couldn't do the task right.  She'd rather do it herself.

Let's both get a shovel, somewhere there has to be a route to China. 

[Ami]

China it is, Friend .                                                                    Ami