N parents create children naive about close relationships?

[Portia]

I was one in a field of one, and crap

Hiya CJ, I got this image of you standing alone in a field, standing in a cow-pat (cow sh*t). And a video-tape of Texas Chainsaw drops from the sky out of nowhere and lands about 20 feet away. Curious but not startled, you walk over to pick it up…hey this is the start of a David Lynch film! Have you seen any of his? Blue Velvet? My image isn’t funny, but then it is, kind of tragic-comedy (I hope).

You were in a field of one – past tense? If so, where are you now? And can I ask: what’s your image of ‘Everyone Else’? How do you see them, in groups of types? I ask because my views about Everyone Else are changing all the time. P

PS. You are an ‘outsider’ to me, in the most positive of ways. How you see you is not how I see you.

[cj]

I can't really answer those questions, these days. I guess my self feels so vague and shattered or, 'not there' that whenever I do ponder them, theres just a big emptiness in my head and no answers.

You were in a field of one – past tense? If so, where are you now? And can I ask: what’s your image of ‘Everyone Else’? How do you see them, in groups of types? I ask because my views about Everyone Else are changing all the time. P
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[Portia guest]

I can’t help myself asking questions Cj, I always want to know more. That big emptiness isn’t a problem though is it? Ha ha, another question! Sorry. Have you read Nic’s posts on page 15 of the Ramble thread? (-rhetorical question, no answer asked for). Everything changes. What’s clear today might be confused tomorrow. I felt sad and depressed yesterday; today I feel optimistic again.

I don’t have answers either. But I’m beginning to like some people, just a few, very much. Some people are wonderful, honest, imperfect, sad, happy, humble human beings. They make life worth living for me.   But I do have a problem: I keep getting so emotional, keep finding things that make me cry, or make me angry-sad, that my eyes are starting to look a little bloodshot. I’m worried the neighbours might think I’m going nuts! Ha ha ha…have I told you about their problems? Boy, there’s no way they’re thinking about me. (((Cj)))

Anyway, sorry Flower, I’m rambling on your thread, I’ll pack myself off to reply to some more real human beings on the proper thread. Hope things are progressing – positively - with your daughter. P

[Cj]

I have so many preconceptions (re:baggage) when I come to speaking to people, even on a thread. I am very wary. Scares me how vulnerable it makes me feel really. The emptiness is a problem Portia, because I want to feel alive. And not so scattered I'm constantly confused/exhausted. People make me very curious too btw. Although I am trying to stop the analysing and concentrate more on emotion, because trying to work everything out is driving me insane. Sometimes I feel like the lawnmover man. HA. You know when he learns 'everything' in a fell swoop, but doesn't learn the emotional experience and other parts of experience to go with all the knowledge. Like reading about France, but never having been, and thinking you know it. I am really not sure how to put it, but if you've seen it, I'm sure you get my meaning. Even if its not exaclty the same, I'm not sure it even is hmmmm. ha. I never used to feel much emotion, for years. Its actually scarey. I've just realised how horrific that movie is lol, only after 30 viewings. Well, what the hell, I might be crap, but I think I'm pretty interesting. I either shut down feelings, or they weren't developed very well to start with. I haven't seen Blue Velvet. It looks quite disturbing. I'm not sure I like disturbing movies now.
But yes, I am starting to like people, and feel for them, which is good. I have gotten round to seeing other people aren't just threatening to me, and to be avoided, and nothing else. God I feel humbled. :S But yeh, I relate to the being to emotional, I worry I am like that, and thats why I cut off so long ago. I don't really want to be 'too sensitive for this world'. Such a cliche ha.

.

I can’t help myself asking questions Cj, I always want to know more. That big emptiness isn’t a problem though is it? Ha ha, another question! Sorry. Have you read Nic’s posts on page 15 of the Ramble thread? (-rhetorical question, no answer asked for). Everything changes. What’s clear today might be confused tomorrow. I felt sad and depressed yesterday; today I feel optimistic again.

I don’t have answers either. But I’m beginning to like some people, just a few, very much. Some people are wonderful, honest, imperfect, sad, happy, humble human beings. They make life worth living for me.   But I do have a problem: I keep getting so emotional, keep finding things that make me cry, or make me angry-sad, that my eyes are starting to look a little bloodshot. I’m worried the neighbours might think I’m going nuts! Ha ha ha…have I told you about their problems? Boy, there’s no way they’re thinking about me. (((Cj)))

[Portia guest]

Cj, how are you? You sound okay, in fact, you sound good.   I’m curious about people too, I don’t understand them and want to. I’m starting to understand people like my mother and it’s both painful and good. Painful because they hurt, but they won’t let you near them and they won’t change themselves. Good because it is stopping me banging my head against a brick wall. Okay, I still do it, but I stop sooner! Ouch, ouch, oh sod it.
Reasoning and emotion, thinking and feeling. As soon as I try and make myself do something differently, consciously, a kind of ‘dumb wall’ springs up. It’s a bit like trying to look directly at a shadow that’s appeared at the corner of your eye. Once you look directly at it, you can’t see it. I sort of let things – feelings/ideas – creep up on me. Sorry that’s my best explanation and not very helpful.

I laughed when I realised I didn’t have to be a perfectionist about healing! I didn’t have to do it the ‘right’ way! I can totally screw it up and have another go. Great.

Yep, I know Lawnmower Man. With the Bond bloke as the scientist, er, Bronsen, Piers. Very scary when he injects all that stuff himself and goes on the crazed raging rampage. Just raw power and intelligence: no compassion, no empathy and such lonely hurt at the centre. Or maybe I’m putting my own interpretation on the film. Blue Velvet is disturbing, exactly. In fact, I used to *like* watching this type of film. Used to go into real trances watching, get totally lost. Maybe not now? I haven’t seen it for years. Lots of violence as I remember. Hmmm. How about Paris Texas? Used to make me howl and sob. Probably still would! Sad film about a little boy, a father and a mother. Hey..have we had this conversation before? I’m getting a déjà vu …

Humble. Humility. The opposite of arrogance. A Good Thing I reckon. We can be humble, and it doesn’t mean weak or unopinionated, it means modest. We can be strong and humble – there’s no contradiction in that I think. Hey I’m gonna disappear for a while. Coffee refuelling and stuff.

[Portia guest]

Ha ha! Brosnen! Piers Brosnen, not some weird actor cross with Charles Bronsen. Mad scientist cowboy.  

[Cj]

I've never felt worse, or wanted to live less. Thanks for your reply. I haven't seen paris texas. Actually I have :S, probably only because Natassia Kinski was in it lol. I never quite got it, well I would havem, but I just got distracted by my thoughts, or non thoughts (not about natassia kinski I might add) . In fact I'll be lucky if I even bothered watching it all the way through, such was, and sometimes is my lack of enthusiasm for anything. That said I recal your little adage about a flower growing from very little. I don't feel like watching anything much those days though.
I really wish I had the net. Actually I'm going to type out some of these threads, but its so hard keeping up with everything thats going on here. Ha, I NEED to read everything, when in fact I read, and keep up with so very little. Perfectionist again. I was thinking about how I've never really seen my mother as a seperate person, open to my judgement, and how strange that seems, and also how I never really gave much thought to my dad being absent from my life all these years, like it didn't matter, and I didn't matter. I am amazed quite simply how little I've always thought of myself, like I was nothing, my thoughts/feelings didn't matter one jot, and where that comes from. Oh, so many thoughts. Sorry, I'm not expecting answers just venting. :S And I'm so goddam tired, and don't even feel I have the energy to do all this work.

[Cj]

*On the original topic*

I dunno. I can probably recal my mothers advice on relationships in a few lines.

'You'll find someone one day' (in my early twenties)

(in reply to asking her what the pill was) *cue unneasiness at imagined terrors to come as I got older* 'Not something you need to worry about' (ok, thats s*x really, huh?)

I could never talk to her about s*x either, she was rather prudish. I don't know. Didn't feel confident s*xually herself no doubt, and took the moral high ground to try to cover up this sense of inadequecy. The scarey thing is, despite thinking I was always open minded, I myself seem to be developing this prudishness myself:S.  Whether its just because I'm not confident s*xually myself or whether  its just I'm just quite prudish anyway, and turned off by sexually flamboyant women, I have no f****** idea. Maybe I find them intimidating. I always recal a feeling when I was younger that if I did end up in a  situation with a girl, I would somehow end up hurting them by having s*x with them. The idea of women enjoying s*x and wanting it as much as men, was a weird one for me, so yes I grew upo very niave about that, or had wrong ideas. It never really crossed my mind for a second that I might be able to give someone pleasure. Er...anyway, I've rambled, but needed to get this out.

No, I don't recal any advice about relationships really:S. Then again, did I ask, no. But then, I'm blaming myself then. I recal her dislike (cough) of my father, and her sucessful relationships were far and few between. Shes not had many sucessful ones really, or many.

In fact, a lot of the time, she ended up going for men who were married, as I recal, and who she couldn't have.

Hi everyone,

When I write of my past, I should be more careful to say, "In retrospect" this or that I learned; for my foibles I write of were only realized in a painful, slow learning process. I wished this board existed years ago.

My mother didn't talk to me about life and relationships as I grew up. I feel like she intentionally didn't explain manipulation because she was busy doing it to me. I remember asking relationship advice of my mom as a teen and she had some stupid glib answers that solved nothing.

I had to learn things the hard way. I was not naive when it came to people outside my family. I could work, go to school, be involved in clubs, interests etc.. Although I was shy, I knew the ropes. It was when I tried to develop close relationships that my stunted development showed.

Any good links that discuss this area? I haven't been reading about N stuff very long so maybe this is common and has been covered already. I need perspective in this area. It is painful to admit my foibles and I blush sometimes at my own posts.  

flower

[cJ]

Incidentally I wasn't being ironic with the censoring of the S word LOL! Damn public libraries software. Censor mad....

[Portia]

Hiya Cj. I’m real tired today. All that emotion, shock, horror. Is shock an emotion? I don’t know, don’t care today. I learned something and that’s good.

'You'll find someone one day' (I’m not interested/I don’t want you to/I hope you don’t). Me? ‘Someday a man will hold your hand and..’ (= knight on white charger myth, designed again to keep me with her, create an unrealistic fantasy never to be achieved).

The Pill. “You must talk about contraception/safe sex before you have sex, it’ll probably be embarrassing.” She could have said something like that. But no, you’ll never have the need if she has her way.

Hurting them by having sex: this has to be from momma huh? Maybe you overheard things as a baby/kiddie which sounded like hurting. Pretty widespread idea I would imagine. That’s why kiddies need to be shielded from adult sex, it can be scary.
Have you had any close relationships Cj? Want to talk about it? Want any embarrassing questions answered (or has CG answered them all by now     ). Ha ha ha oh dear public libraries. I did that too, trying to browse by the hour at the library here. Not funny. Sorry. Have you got a college/uni nearby? You might get better access there: maybe you could enrol for library membership there…the atmosphere and facilities tend to be better. Public libraries are great but not for typing SEX! Try ‘fornication’ instead lol! P