Religious VS Spiritual

[Hermes]

 ""Religious people make you feel condemned . Spiritual people make you feel accepted. "" (Ami).

Yes, there is a big difference between the two, Ami.  I am glad you have found this person who helps you.

Hermes

[Overcomer]

Funny...

I do not get the phone reference, Carolyn.....

I believe that even if our motives are pure and we truly seek to be more spiritual and less religious, we can fall into traps.  Rituals, if you will.

I find that the older I am I am more set in my ways.  Things need to happen pretty much the same way every single day of my life.  Routines.  Get up.  Have coffee.  Etc.

You could try to do a morning devotion.  Then a Bible reading.  And before you know it it is the act that is important to you, not what you get out of it.

John Eldrege says Christianity has become a series of tips and techniques.  Seven ways to grow a great church.  Five ways for a good quiet time.  ETc.  He talks more about the story of your life.  I have heard him speak and he was instrumental in changing the way I think about religion.....

[Certain Hope]

Oh, Kelly... I meant that I'm glad you can post more now, without the limit of characters, as with posting from your cell phone.

Have you read The Sacred Romance, by Eldredge?   

And I hear you about getting too comfy with our rituals. If someone needs help from me and I tell them they'll have to wait, because I am busy at that time doing "my devotional"... well, then, I need to wake up!

Love,
Carolyn

[Leah]

Religious people make you feel condemned . Spiritual people make you feel accepted.

[/b]


Genuine, true, walking in the Spirit, daily, Christians, ought to make one feel accepted.

As the Word sits rightly in their heart.

Sadly, that is not always so.   "Forgiveness is the key, and leave it with God"

Leah x

[Leah]

Hi Kelly,

It is ever so easy for a Spiritual Christian to lose sight of the simple true faith and have a "Religious Spirit" [ Pharisees ] as I have witnessed, sadly.

True Spiritual Relationship faith, is having a teachable heart, humble and contrite (as the Bible teaches us).

No power, no control, no competition, "Blessed are the Nobodies"

Working out one's faith, in a close relationship with God, through Jesus Christ His Son, Walking in the Spirit each day, with a humble contrite teachable heart .... simple true faith and belief.

With a childlike heart.  (not childish)

Worshipping in Spirit and in Truth.

I have gone "Back to Basics" as I think, as Christians, we lose that "First Love" and become complacent, or worse still, walk in the flesh, and we don't know it.

Leah x  (Ms Nobody)


PS >  Knowing that we are saved, and so filled with love and joy, that we love one another, in spirit and in truth, as He loves us.

With the fruits of His spirit, within us, each day.   "You shall know them by their fruits"                             


"Relationship  =  true Intimacy"

[Certain Hope]

Another example, Kelly, which I heard recently...

In a country where a certain animal is considered sacred, a mother may sit by and allow her only child to starve to death, while that animal destroys her home, rather than to slaughter and cook it to feed her suffering child.
That is what religion does to people.

[Overcomer]

Yes, nice to be able to blab without the phone but fun to be able to check where ever I am!!

Yes, I have read the Sacred Romance and the Journey of Desire and Waking the Dead.  I have not read Wild at Heart or Captivating or Epic but I want to..

I saw John speak right when Sacred Romance came out.  He touched my heart.  I finally heard somebody talk about how God made him feel.

[Certain Hope]

Exactly, Kelly.... talking about how God made him feel... about what God had done for him...

instead of some long listing of all the things he was supposedly doing for God  (which is religion).

[Overcomer]

He talks about EMBRACING LIFE!!  (not yelling, John just talks with exclamation points!!)  He talks about nature and beauty etc.

In the Sacred Romance he talks about how heaven is not drinking kool aid out of a styrofoam cup in a church basement...........it is beauty and passion and awesomeness and happiness and glory etc.

It is not about religion but relationship................maybe that is a better word.  Not even spirituality but relationship.

[Certain Hope]

He talks about EMBRACING LIFE!!  (not yelling, John just talks with exclamation points!!)  He talks about nature and beauty etc.

In the Sacred Romance he talks about how heaven is not drinking kool aid out of a styrofoam cup in a church basement...........it is beauty and passion and awesomeness and happiness and glory etc.

It is not about religion but relationship................maybe that is a better word.  Not even spirituality but relationship.

Exactly again    So awesome! SOooo much I regret that I didn't have this relationship when my own older children were very young, yet I know that God is faithful to draw them to His heart, just as He has drawn me. Relationship, yes. And it's not about feeling spiritual... it's about being - for all intents and purposes - a Spirit-indwelt child of the living God!

Amen.

[Leah]

Working out one's faith, in a close relationship with God, through Jesus Christ His Son, Walking in the Spirit each day, with a humble contrite teachable heart .... simple true faith and belief.

It's that simple!

Leah x


Relationship means true intimacy

[Overcomer]

Preach it!!!  It is this thing that you cannot describe.  It is NOT going to church.  It is not being extremely demonstrative in your worship.  It is not doing devotions every day or reading your Bible everyday (although those things are great as long as those things are not the goal.....)  It is not hanging a cross in your home.  Or burning incense.  Or laying in your garden communing with Mother Nature.  It is not going on a Missions Trip.  It is not serving communion.  It is not singing songs.  Although you could do any of those things........................if you want and if it is not some misguided.....something................or other.

It is about taking off the mask.  It is about being real.  It is about being vulnerable.  It is about admitting mistakes.  It is about acknowledging that without His love and acceptance and guidance you are bound to screw everything up!!

[Certain Hope]

Preach it!!!  It is this thing that you cannot describe.  It is NOT going to church.  It is not being extremely demonstrative in your worship.  It is not doing devotions every day or reading your Bible everyday (although those things are great as long as those things are not the goal.....)  It is not hanging a cross in your home.  Or burning incense.  Or laying in your garden communing with Mother Nature.  It is not going on a Missions Trip.  It is not serving communion.  It is not singing songs.  Although you could do any of those things........................if you want and if it is not some misguided.....something................or other.

It is about taking off the mask.  It is about being real.  It is about being vulnerable.  It is about admitting mistakes.  It is about acknowledging that without His love and acceptance and guidance you are bound to screw everything up!!

Amen, Kelly.

That last part in bold is almost exactly, word for word, what I wrote in closing, in the last letter I sent to my parents.
I get no response to that whatsoever. They love their "religion".

Carolyn

[Leah]

That's the beauty of it all, Kelly

It's not about walking through the front doors once a week, for an hour or so.

It's inside, with a close relationship, that simply exudes, because, just because, it's all consuming, and overflows, like oil !

Leah x

[Overcomer]

Yep, I get the same "deer in the headlights" look from my mother.  Almost like, "how dare you say these things to I, your Queen Mother, who owns and establishes the universe and everything around it..................you know not....................be gone!!"