Author Topic: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)  (Read 9012 times)

Anastasia

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Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« on: February 13, 2008, 07:46:14 AM »
1.  Does anyone have any statistics that state approximately how many ACN's end up in therapy?  I'm guess most of us that are educated enough to use the services of a therapist, but never have seen any hard evidence on the subject.

2.  Any statistics on how many of us ACN's end up attempting to commmit suicide?  Or are hospitalized after being raised as an ACN?

3.  I have never seen any help groups for Adult Children of Narcissists similar to Adult Children of Alcoholic (ACA) groups.  Are there not enough of us to do this? 

4.  I have been doing reading on being an ACN, and NOW understand why it took me obtaining a psychology degree in college and then wasted years waiting for the internet to be discovered (so I could read about it on the net) to figure out if my Nparent was just a narcissist or a sociopath or psychopath.  The more I read, the more I realize that the resulting damage to their child is the same whether they be a psychopath or a narcissist.  All I can say is that you computer babies have no idea how lucky you are, but then, each generation seems to be able to say that, eh?

I see what a herculean effort we ACN's have to make to overcome our tortured childhoods.  God bless each and every one of us.
   

reallyME

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2008, 09:28:45 AM »
Here is yet another question:

Are Adult Children of N's also N's themselves?  I'd venture to say what I have always said.  A child raised by an N, generally becomes an N, bpd or at least codependent or dependent

gratitude28

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2008, 09:45:17 AM »
Laura,
In my earlier years, I had lots of N traits, but I don't believe I retain many of them. I don't believe that I am Narcissistic, in spite of being raised by N(s). I believe my sister has very may N traits, as she is the Golden Child, but I also do not believe she is an N as she does have some feelings/emotions. So I disagree with your theory.
Anastasia, I also believe we are very lucky to have the internet to find one another. I know this has helped me tremendously.
Love, Beth
"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable." Douglas Adams

reallyME

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2008, 09:56:53 AM »
gratitude, it's fine to disagree, but it's not my theory actually. 

Anastasia

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2008, 11:25:01 AM »
Not all of us become narcissistic, have bi-polar disorder, become dependent or co-dependent at all.  Some of us become SO independent and so protective that they don't let anyone really, really in.  I am one of them, and working on getting heathier.
Yes, I was told by my therapist of a couple years that I was narcissist--but in a HEALTHY way.  I figure it gave me drive and ambition.
Yes, it would become so easy to be sick as the nparent, but alot depends on your own resiliency, your own soul, your own experiences and how you experienced the narcissist's actions, I feel.
My half-brother was raised by a Ngrandfather, and he is an N to the max.  None of his immediate family sees it, of course, as they are too busy either kissing his ass or getting out of his way totally.  Me...I totally dropped the rope and have nothing to do with his abusive nasty mouth anymore.  I am sure he feels he "won," which is more than okay with me.  I have lots of peace of mind without that overbearing, obnoxious bigmouth telling me off daily.  Don't care to see him, talk to him or have any contact with him.  I am a happy girl now.  And to think I put up with that crap for 30 years!  What kind of fool was I?
It takes alot of work to be able to let people in, but I am working on it daily now.

Leah

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2008, 11:52:52 AM »
Not all of us become narcissistic, have bi-polar disorder, become dependent or co-dependent at all.  Some of us become SO independent and so protective that they don't let anyone really, really in.  I am one of them, and working on getting heathier.
Yes, I was told by my therapist of a couple years that I was narcissist--but in a HEALTHY way.  I figure it gave me drive and ambition.
Yes, it would become so easy to be sick as the nparent, but alot depends on your own resiliency, your own soul, your own experiences and how you experienced the narcissist's actions, I feel.
My half-brother was raised by a Ngrandfather, and he is an N to the max.  None of his immediate family sees it, of course, as they are too busy either kissing his ass or getting out of his way totally.  Me...I totally dropped the rope and have nothing to do with his abusive nasty mouth anymore.  I am sure he feels he "won," which is more than okay with me.  I have lots of peace of mind without that overbearing, obnoxious bigmouth telling me off daily.  Don't care to see him, talk to him or have any contact with him.  I am a happy girl now.  And to think I put up with that crap for 30 years!  What kind of fool was I?
It takes alot of work to be able to let people in, but I am working on it daily now.



Dear Anastasia,

At last!  I resonate with complete accord of what you have expressed.

My Counsellor (or T) explained to me, after I said "I don't know how I got through it all" ... that Childhood Resiliency, she strongly affirmed, made the difference, in Survival, with an Independent spirit and soul.

The book I am presently reading, verifies, and explains how Childhood Resiliency forms a Survivor Personality, which personally validates and affirms.

Generalizations in my view, are invalidating.

However, Resiliency and a Survivor Personality does not guarantee popularity, as is my personal life experience to date, and guilt is the weapon employed.

No-one ever needs; guilt,doubt, or insinuation, thrust into one's soul, one's self.

Much diligent hard work is required along a sometimes lonely path in working through, seeking and finding, in order to heal, and find one's self.

Grateful thanks to you Anastasia, for insightful validation, from sharing of your own self, truly valued and appreciated.

Love, Leah



I see what a herculean effort we ACN's have to make to overcome our tortured childhoods.  God bless each and every one of us.
   

Herculean effort, I agree, sheer hard work, digging for one's authentic self, but, worth every tear along the way.

God Bless you Anastasia
« Last Edit: February 13, 2008, 01:23:19 PM by LeahsRainbow »
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Iphi

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2008, 12:02:08 PM »
I see what a herculean effort we ACN's have to make to overcome our tortured childhoods.  God bless each and every one of us.

Hear hear, Anastasia.
Character, which has nothing to do with intellect or skill, can evolve only by increasing our capacity to love, and to become lovable. - Joan Grant

Gabben

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2008, 12:14:39 PM »
Here is yet another question:

Are Adult Children of N's also N's themselves?  I'd venture to say what I have always said.  A child raised by an N, generally becomes an N, bpd or at least codependent or dependent



Dear Anastasia,

Some of us become SO independent and so protective that they don't let anyone really, really in.  I am one of them, and working on getting heathier.

This is true I have come across an article once that talks about the child of N's and how high functioning they can come to be, almost too smart for their own good.


To Laura's post:
Absolutely -- that is me, child of an N parent becomes an N or carries some harsh N traits. 

I an a recovered alcoholic (codependency) I used to suffer form BPD tendencies, although never full blown. An in my early twenties I wore a facade of togetherness (my sh*T don't stink kinda attitude)  that was stripped off of me when a boss fired me and told me to look at myself....guess what? I looked at myself and I did not like what I saw. I saw it all, my manipulation, my lack of self, my lack of integrity, my dishonesty, my lies, my anger, my self-hatred I could go on. It was as if my veneer was just swiped off my face -- it hurt.

I'll never forget that moment that I saw myself...I was 21. I called suicide prevention hotline and I said " I do not want to kill myself but I just figured out that I thought I had everyone fooled but the only person I was fooling was me -- What do I do now, how can I face others and the world?"

The guy on the other end of the phone told me that, first, it was remarkable that I did come to terms with myself, second, that it was not the world or others that I could not face it was myself and my goal was to begin to face myself, daily.

For over 3 years I had been in therapy but at that point I got a new therapist, went to AA meetings, attended ACA meetings and built up a network of support women who were doing their original pain work, going deep and healing. It took me another 5 years just to work through the layers of defenses but I found my wounds, pain and original trauma of abandonment.

Think of me as hope, hope and recovery for the N's BPD's, and codependents of this world.

Today, at almost 40, I spend my days not hurting others, working to love others more than myself with no reward for self as well as I do not suffer from major depression or addiciton (well, I smoke occasionally), only very little loneliness steming from childhood memories and patterns.  I have no eating disorders, I do not act out sexually, I am happy with me and more at peace with life surrounded by good friends and more dreams fulfilled than I could of ever imagined.

Do I still suffer? Heck yes. Past suffering, yes.

Life is life and my history still creeps up to meet me. But I have non destructive tools to cope and a core-self that I work to nuture.

I do not self-destruct anymore. I practice rigorous honesty which is the key to overcoming mental and emotional disorders and the severely painful wound of abandonment.





« Last Edit: February 13, 2008, 12:19:18 PM by Gabben »

Hopalong

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2008, 01:23:56 PM »
Hi Anastasia,

I have so many Nspots that sometimes I look in the mirror and see a dalmatian.

In between them I am a pleasant shade of pink.

Hi Lollie. Thank you...I know that when I bang into my own selfishness I am chilled and horrified. And that is the main time when I most wish I had a companion in life. I wouldn't even have to say much, just go tuck my chin on his shoulder ("him" who thinks well of me) and absorb a little of his forgiving kindness.

Aw, almost made myself cry. In a 'good' way.

love,
Hops
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Leah

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2008, 01:30:40 PM »

There hasn't been a whole lot of research done in this area, so I do not think it is safe to say that an adult child becomes either A, B, C, or D. There are a few patterns that have emerged, and not all of them point to adult children developing a PD. It's actually quite triggering to make that generalization, as many adult children try so hard not to become what their parents are, and I wouldn't be surprised if others chimed in to disagree with you. Speaking for myself, I felt a huge surge of energy when I read your post!


Hi Lollie,

Wow!  Love ALL of your post, thank you, the list is awesomely astute.

Leah x
Jun 2006 voiceless seeking

April 2008 - "The Gaslight Effect" How to Spot & Survive by Dr. Robin Stern - freedom of understanding!

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reallyME

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2008, 02:19:00 PM »
thanks Lollie, I stand corrected in that I will say MANY children raised by N's can turn out to have various dysfunctions.  Did I put that more fairly?

Anastasia

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2008, 03:00:58 PM »
I have found some really good information on the net lately when I punched in the search column "adult children of narcissists."  Lots of explanations for the envy, the belittling/demeaning/insulting comments Nparents make to their kids to control them, the behavior of the N's children, etc. etc.  Dig in on the net and see. 
You will see how envy of their own children, hatred for having to parent their children, selfish/self-centeredness and a myriad of other qualities are the pattern for the Nparent.  Really eye-opening.
They are ALL THE SAME, all have the same symptoms, same behavior, so it was really easy for me to relate.  Yeah....however did we survive it all, I agree.

Leah

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #12 on: February 13, 2008, 04:10:29 PM »

I have found some really good information on the net lately when I punched in the search column "adult children of narcissists." 

 Lots of explanations for the envy, the belittling/demeaning/insulting comments Nparents make to their kids to control them, the behavior of the

N's children, etc. etc.  Dig in on the net and see. 

You will see how envy of their own children, hatred for having to parent their children, selfish/self-centeredness and a myriad of other qualities are the pattern for the Nparent.  Really eye-opening.
They are ALL THE SAME, all have the same symptoms, same behavior, so it was really easy for me to relate.  Yeah....however did we survive it all, I agree.


Dear Anastasia,

The destructive pathological envy of my parents in seeking to destroy their child(ren) is something that I have been researching and reading on since November 2007.   (hence Envy is the root ..... thread).


envy, the belittling/demeaning/insulting comments Nparents

Also, my experience from my parents (and my exNH too as he copied my NMother)

is ........ belittling / demeaning / insulting / invalidating.

Grateful thanks for validation.

Leah x
Jun 2006 voiceless seeking

April 2008 - "The Gaslight Effect" How to Spot & Survive by Dr. Robin Stern - freedom of understanding!

The Truth About Abuse VIDEO

Bella_French

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2008, 04:32:00 PM »
Dear Anastasia,

A group like that would be nice, I agree. I went looking on google for one, but I found this place instead. There are many adult survivors of N abuse here.

BTW, The latest article I read about NPD suggested the most usual family background for an adult NPD sufferer,  involves a parent who overly spoils a child (known as the Golden Child) and does not hold that child accountable for their wrong doings.

The `Golden Child' is the one more vulnerable to becoming N'ish or full blown NPD because the parents assign them magical qualities, and believe they can do no wrong.

Children of narcisists who are not` Golden', tend to grow up as highly empathetic individuals, with certain challenges to overcome due to being abused as children. Since the abuse varies from family to family , those challenges also vary. But we also seem to face many common challenges too.

Love bella

« Last Edit: February 13, 2008, 04:38:40 PM by Bella_French »

Anastasia

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Re: Adult Children of Narcissists (ACN's)
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2008, 12:50:58 PM »
Wow...thanks for that last post on the "Golden" child.  I have a cousin who was an only Golden child.  TOTALLY narcissistic today.  A classic NP, too, who gave her only child to the ex-mother-in-law to raise (using the excuse that she had to go to college).  I won't even keep contact with her anymore as I find her so disgusting.
I was the abused only child of a Nmother--who could do no right in her mother's eyes.  It truly has been an uphill challenge to remold myself into a self-loving, self-caring person, since my messages were always how horrible I was.  Not true, of course, and--even if you know it isn't true that you are not  horrible, a loser, a totally hopeless idiot, completely clumsy, etc. etc. etc.--it took alot of work and my sifting thru each statement and coming to a conclusion that, no, I was not horrible, a loser, totally hopeless idiot, etc.  A LOT of work.
I can remember sitting in my class in 6th grade and saying to myself, "WHY do my parents HATE me so???"  Then I sat in 6th grade and started thinking of all my teachers, all my Girl Scout leaders, all the church leaders and, of course, my classmates and friends out of school and coming to the right conclusion that, "Hey, all these people outside the immediate family really LIKE ME.  I'm invited to all the parties.  I have tons of teachers and leaders telling me I'm okay.  I have gobs of friends."  SO, I came to the right conclusion that..."Hey, it isn't ME....IT'S THEM!!!!  MY so-called parents are the ones that are crazy and screwed up!!!!"
Probaby what "saved me" is that they liked the dog (YES!), but hated ME.  They were so abusive, so belittling, so insulting, so demeaning that I mentally "spaced" from them to a degree that I could look at the situation logically and with dispassion.
But, trust me when I say this, the lack of having a mother who loves you is rough--especially if you have to live with that person while young.  And having a bipolar, highly insecure/insanely jealous (my mother was HIS mommy) stepfather...well, it has taken me YEARS to be so healthy as I feel today. 
Like I said, my psych degree, maturing and lots of work on myself has really helped me.  But what a price I had to pay for what comes SO EASILY to many!!!!!