Author Topic: Pregnant N sent me away  (Read 28855 times)

hardtotrust

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Pregnant N sent me away
« on: February 16, 2008, 05:55:23 PM »
Hi,

I am somewhat reluctant to share my present problem here, because I have been discussing it with some people and most do not seem to understand it.

I am sure most here have heard, when looking for friendship and validation, comments like “if it was that bad, why did you put up with it?”, that really doesn’t help, to say the least.

But since most people here have been through horrific relationships, I guess they will understand what is happening.

Well, let’s get started. Understand that many things here were not known at the time they happened.

After a long life filled with narcissists, beginning with parents, I was in a point in my life in which I thought I had reached the record of crazy-making relationships and nothing worse could happen.

Of course I was wrong.

What happened is a little complex and it isn’t possible to explain it in a single post, but let’s move on.

Since it would take a looooooooong time telling all the story, I will start a little bluntly, just stating the present situation and adding more information for those who may want to help.

My N ex girlfriend, let’s name her Tina, got pregnant last year. It was completely welcomed. Two days later I watch as she and her mother discuss the “guest list”. A day later I am asked if I wanted to get married this day or that day. It was strange, but since I loved her and there was a baby coming, I didn’t bother to discuss it.

But some days later we decided to cancel it.

At the same day, she sent me away. She said she wanted “to be alone for the moment”, which she confirmed later. I was trying to talk to her about how we were going to deal with the situation, but she received a call and had to go out and buy a parrot  :shock:. I mean it, I am not joking. Her mother supported her and told her she wanted to go along.

Now, two months later, she is still pregnant and we are not seeing each other. Actually, there are so many bad things that happened, that I really think is best for me to never see her again, avoiding humiliation being the first reason.

The first problem is that later I found a lot of reasons to be suspicious of who the father of the child is.

Now, I am in a tight spot, because if I am not near during the pregnancy, I may feel guilty later if I find out it is my baby. But if I stay close, it is very dangerous for me, the relationship was so humiliating, she made me feel suicidal. Also, people warned me that even if the baby is not mine, I may get attached and won’t be able to get away (we know that it is already very difficult to get away from the N him/herself).

It has been an extremely hurtful situation. In the beginning it was devastating to see any pregnant woman or small baby.

Depression hit very hard.

What now? It is not possible to discuss things with her, it is her way or...

Even if she compromises, she forgets whatever she said a moment later.

Any comments?

Thank you.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2008, 11:58:04 PM by hardtotrust »

Gabben

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Re: Pregnant N
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2008, 06:13:33 PM »
Dear Hardtotrust,

I hear your anguish and heartache, I'm sorry that you are going through this.

For me I want to hear more of the story. For instance I was a bit confused, I mean, did Tina ever really give you a clear reason as to why she is avoiding you, if that is what she is doing? It seems that she just broke things off rather sudden and without any explanation, unless I am missing something? It must hurt.

Can you explain why she broke-up,if indeed you are the father, or why she is being so obtuse.

It seems that she cheated on you?

Forgive me for all of the questions.

I'm sorry to hear that you have had to suffer the N pains too.

Thanks for trusting us enough to share your story.

Lise

Certain Hope

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Re: Pregnant N
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2008, 06:29:55 PM »
Hi, Hardtotrust,

When a situation is as complex as this, my first instinct is to look into practical options.

Possibly you might research the laws in your state as they pertain to paternity?

I don't know whether the duration of the relationship factors in to the legalities or what sort of tests might be done and when...  but if Tina is personality disordered, it's highly unlikely that you'll get the truth from her.
For your own sake and for the benefit of the child, it seems important to establish paternity asap... do you think?

Do you know when the baby is due?

I am so sorry... wish there were a simple solution.  I hope you'll post and share here as much as you feel comfortable and just get some of your concerns and pain out into the open air. That alone does so much to ease the load, I know.

Take good care,
Carolyn

Ami

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Re: Pregnant N
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2008, 07:33:47 PM »
I am sorry , Hardtotrust,  for all the pain and stress you are experiencing. It sounds like it is a complicated situation.  The other posts gave wise suggestions. My heart goes out to you.         Ami
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

hardtotrust

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Re: Pregnant N
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2008, 11:53:35 PM »

did Tina ever really give you a clear reason as to why she is avoiding you, if that is what she is doing? It seems that she just broke things off rather sudden and without any explanation, unless I am missing something? It must hurt.
Can you explain why she broke-up,if indeed you are the father, or why she is being so obtuse.

Well Gabben, as it happens with Ns, nothing is clear about her motives. Let me explain what happened at the end.

On a Sunday, we were looking for a house to buy. While we were at it a guy called her, asking her to go out on a date. I found that extremely disgusting, because although we had been together for only about 2 months, it was strange that someone was still calling her.

Besides that, I have to mention that during our relationship, I discovered a lot of signs (including her own stories) and received information that she was extremely promiscuous before.

For starters, she was never able to end contact with her former ex’s, affairs etc. For example, one day as we checked her e-mail, there was one in which a guy patient of her lamented that she couldn’t made it to their date, but he was looking forward to it. As Ns regularly do, she stated that he was crazy, that he discovered her e-mail and made it up.

There’s A LOT more about this subject.

When she received that call, I got sickened by her behavior. After she hang up, she said, with some pleasure “Wow, it’s the third that has called me”. I told her “Listen, we may get married because of the child, but we won’t live together, because I won’t be able to watch things like this happening everyday”.

Later that day I saw that she had received a message on Orkut from one of her former lovers (20 years old, she was 35). The message itself wasn’t intimate, but still it was contact, which I repeatedly asked her to break in order to show that she had changed her ways. The answer was always the same “You have a confidence problem. I know what I am doing”. BTW she didn’t have the same confidence the day A MALE FRIEND of mine called me to go out on a Saturday night, it was like an earthquake.

The following day I phoned her and told her “My baby isn’t going to grow up in a promiscuous environment”. Answer: “Don’t try to take her away from me. Listen, the moment I choose I can take it off and get another one”.

After an extremely long list of evil things that happened for the short time we were together (as a couple, actually I had met her about 7 years before), I decided that if I married her I would have to divorce soon after, so I gathered the courage to tell her that I wanted the legal/civil marriage canceled (there was still the more social/public ceremony).

The day after, I went to her house to talk. That’s when her mother intervened and announced that the ceremony would be canceled, because most things couldn’t be available in such short notice at the end of the year and she wanted the best for her daughter. She told us to postpone it and marry after the baby was born.

Then there was the call about the parrot. Tina told me we were going to talk later.

Later I phoned her and she told me she wanted “to be alone for the moment”. I told her things couldn’t be that way and it would be definitive. She didn’t argue. I phoned her again, tried some suggestions, she didn’t change her position.

On the same day she phoned me, asked me to take my things away from her home.

A few days later, desperate, I phoned her and asked to see her. She received me as sometimes before, talking about herself, how many patients she had, the things she had to do etc. After some time I went away.

On that night she called me and I asked about her and the baby. I told her I was going there to visit the baby. She resisted and didn’t let me in her house. I had to knee down at the garage and talk to the baby “Someone told me today how we are going to meet. I am dying to hear your cry”. (a friend of mine had had a dream about me and the baby).

On the following Sunday, I phoned her and she made it clear that she wanted things to stay as they were.

I am telling you these things because about a month later she called me, her aunt at her side, from her aunt’s house and “invited” me to go to the next ultrasound. I argued that she had sent me away.

She told me “you know pregnant women act differently”. That would be her first excuse. The second one is that “I was controlling her” (meaning I wanted her to break contact with former lovers).

So, yes, she did break contact without any explanation and later, when questioned, came with these excuses.

It seems that she cheated on you?

I am very positive about that. There are a thousand signs. For example, the second day we were formally dating, I was at her house in the morning. We had intimate moments. After that, I went out to buy a notebook for her and lunch for my mother. She said she was going to stay to help her mother. A few hours later, she wasn't there. She had gone to her ex's house, she later admitted.

Possibly you might research the laws in your state as they pertain to paternity?

Yes, CH, I have been researching. I may have the chance to force a DNA exam.

For your own sake and for the benefit of the child, it seems important to establish paternity asap... do you think?

I completely agree. If I find that it is not mine, I may have some closure. If it is mine, I will have to deal with this craziness the rest of my life, but my baby will be a blessing!

Do you know when the baby is due?

From the moment we decided to try to conceive, I took care of all of the pertaining information, including her cycles. The baby is due on August, 5th, but I believe she will arrive a little sooner.

Thank you for your posts, Gabben, CH and AMI. Right now I see how much I still need to get off my chest.

Thank you.

Ami

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2008, 08:38:26 AM »
Wow, Hardto trust.
 You have a full plate. I wish I had s/thing more to offer than support and words.Right now, you seem to be doing the best that you can with what you have.
 Did you say that you "planned " to have the baby?
 Maybe I am wrong to ask, but do you think it was 'wise" to plan a baby in these precarious circumstances?
 Maybe, I missed some of the details. I am not "all here",right now.
 Keep writing about  the pain, stress, heartache, ups and downs. You will get advice, shared hope and experience and it does help, even when the "actual" life circumstances can't be changed.   My heart goes out to you, Hardto trust.   Warmly,    Ami
 
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

hardtotrust

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2008, 09:50:09 AM »
Did you say that you "planned " to have the baby?

Yes, Ami.

We had known each other for many years, most of them just as friends, no special connection. I noticed she had some problems, but it didn't look like they were bigger than my own.

Then came her “crisis”, her therapy, the moment she overflowed me with promises, compliments, dreams, plans etc.

That's when we decided to give the relationship a try. I am 40, she was 35, we are successful, all we missed was a solid relationship and family. So, later, as we talked about our desire to have babies and since we already knew each other for a long time, we decided not to use contraception methods.

From that point on, my desire to have a child grew up, due mainly to two reasons: first, my age, I already had waited too long (solving my own family issues, I was terrified of repeating my family history). Second, during the whole relationship, I had stomach and digestive problems, losing about 25 pounds. There was a friend of mine doing chemo. I got afraid I had cancer. I got really scared I wouldn't have another chance in the following years, at least.

The day we found out she was pregnant was the happiest day of my life. For me it was unbelievable. I was raised to be invisible, but now I would have my own family.

There's also a third reason, maybe the worst. Before the relationship I was having sessions with a NLP therapist. It helped me a lot.

But then she went to the same therapist. And the therapist who had helped me a lot with my personal issues, decided to push for the relationship (later I discovered he always does this with everybody). So, believe it or not, instead of helping me to analyze why I was in a relationship that was no good for me, he invested all our time in trying to convincing me that everything was fine, I had to stop being negative and that I had to go for my happiness...

I had a lot of confidence in him, due to our previous work. But in the end, I found out he was the perfect N assistant, confusing me.

All these things together, besides my feelings for her, prevented me from getting out earlier.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2008, 09:56:28 AM by hardtotrust »

Certain Hope

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2008, 09:56:50 AM »
Dear Hardtotrust,

About this:

The following day I phoned her and told her “My baby isn’t going to grow up in a promiscuous environment”. Answer: “Don’t try to take her away from me. Listen, the moment I choose I can take it off and get another one”.

Is she saying that she can abort this baby any time she wants?

I'm so sorry... she really does sound like a trip... and so does her mother.

Carolyn

hardtotrust

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2008, 10:34:48 AM »

Is she saying that she can abort this baby any time she wants?
I'm so sorry... she really does sound like a trip... and so does her mother.

Exactly, that's what she said.  :(

She learned that she can always get away with everything she does/says, like "joking" after we scheduled the wedding that her "dream was to become a widow".

About her mother, it took me a long time to notice something wrong.

Apparently, it is a successful family, everything perfect. But then I started to notice that her family, especially her mother supports EVERYTHING she does (like interrupting the conversation about the baby's future to go buy a pet or going to the ex’s house in the middle of a relationship). I also noticed that there were no hugs, sweet words, healthy exchange between the two. It was always about “I want you to help me buy this or that this afternoon”, no personal interaction. The daughter was something to be shown and appreciated, adored (she is pretty). Talk about false self! Many female friends asked me why didn’t the mother phoned me to talk about the situation, they said it would be the expected thing to do. I was surprised.

But the plot thickens.

Apparently, there are two main reasons she decided to have the baby.

First, she was getting closer to the age at which hormonal changes happens and she had decided to get pregnant anyway before her birthday on January 08, she even considered going to a semen bank before.

Second, her mother wanted it. All of her friends had pictures of her grandsons/daughters to show, she didn’t. BTW, when they were planning the marriage, her mother had a Freudian slip when talking to the people organizing another marriage, her mother said “MINE will be on December, 27th”.

Now, I would love to be doing all a father can do. But I don't know what to do. I am thinking maybe the best solution is to wait and be there for my baby when the time arrives.

All I can do now is follow the pregnancy by internet sites which explain what is happening every week.

Thank you for all help.

Certain Hope

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2008, 10:45:55 AM »
Again, I am so sorry, Hardtotrust. The more I read, the bigger mess it appears to be. You don't seem to fit anywhere into these peoples' picture of the future... only as an elementary part of their grand plan. Your work is done, as far as they're concerned, I'm afraid.

I think that the very best thing you can do is retain legal counsel and proceed to determine paternity... then take it from there.
This will likely be a battle all the way.

With sympathy,
Carolyn

Hopalong

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2008, 12:42:15 PM »
I'm sorry too, Hardtotrust.
I'm sorry for the baby that will be born into that family.

I agree with those who suggest a DNA test asap.

I would make that your absolute first priority.

Rather than worry about how to relate to her or her family right now, I think you need to see a lawyer who is expert in adoptive and family and paternity issues.

And on the good chance that this is your child, I think every single action you take from now on should be with the goal of joint custody of your child in mind. Every single one.

Document everything. Get a binder and take notes. Leave any emotion out of the document except love and concern for the child. Ask this lawyer exactly how to proceed.

You have a lot of love to give a child. The relationship with her/his mother is not good for you. But being a father can still be.

Fight for that.
(And should it not be your baby, you are free of a toxic family and can then move forward to adopt a child on your own.)

hope these thoughts help some,
Hopalong
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Ami

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2008, 01:18:56 PM »
Dear Hardto trust,
 I just wanted to say that I am not judging,at all, b/c I have made many errors in judgement,in my life(MUCHO). You have gotten wise answers,here.
  Just keep writing and reaching out b/c you will find support in all the phases that you must walk through.With best wishes and thoughts for you, Hardtotrust.                Ami
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

hardtotrust

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2008, 04:28:06 PM »

Unfortunately, I have to agree with you, CH.

That’s one of the reasons I have been so depressed, realizing how much I have been used. All I wanted now was a time machine to go back in time and dispatch her the very first moment she disrespected me, no excuses this time.

I am so ashamed what I made myself put up with. It wasn’t necessary. Every morning is a struggle to get up and face the world, always afraid to find her or someone of her family and be humiliated again.

Yes, Hopalong, DNA is a priority. In one of the few messages we exchanged, I asked her to do the pre-natal DNA, which she later declined, which is ok, because there is a small risk to the baby. She said it will be done when the baby is born, but everything she says she will do, you can expect the opposite. I loved all your advice, thank you.

Thank you, Ami.

You all helped me a lot, listening, validating and suggesting.

Hugs.

Certain Hope

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2008, 04:44:16 PM »
Dear hardtotrust,

Through legal counsel, you may be able to get a court order put into place which will ensure that the baby is tested for paternity
at the safest possible time for the little one.  With that settled, it wouldn't be up to her (or her mother's) whimsy.

That aside, I can only imagine how difficult this is for you, not knowing... on top of trying to deal with the heartache.
 Just wanted to tell you that you sound like a person with such an open heart...
even if you can't find out whether you're the father till after birth, I'm betting that you have the stuff it takes to bond with your son or daughter then. In the meanwhile, I hope you'll continue to share here and receive all the support and encouragement we can offer.

Recovering from the shock of having been tangled in the web of a disordered individual is no small task, and loaded with hurdles.
What you said about being ashamed... of what you made yourself put up with...  I understand.
But the shame isn't yours... it's hers to bear and I pray that you'll push it off of yourself just as another new poster here
described recently.  Have you read posts by "nogadge" here?  You might appreciate those...
and just keep reading and posting, because it's so good to both purge your system of these toxins and to find community here.

Sincerely,
Carolyn


hardtotrust

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Re: Pregnant N sent me away
« Reply #14 on: February 18, 2008, 01:01:27 PM »

the little one

I loved that phrase! I am melting down... thinking about this little boy/girl.

I imagine it happening like this picture: http://pregnancy.lovetoknow.com/wiki/Image:FatherAndNewborn.jpg

That aside, I can only imagine how difficult this is for you, not knowing... on top of trying to deal with the heartache.

Thank you for understanding, it's been really hard dealing with all these things together. The loss of my girlfriend, the loss of the promised family, the loss of the fatherhood and partnership during the pregnancy.

Not knowing is really hard. Impossible to have closure.

If you already think it is a big mess, allow me to add some information.

A month before she got pregnant, I did a fertility exam. The result was awful. It would be very hard for her to get pregnant. I didn’t tell her about the result.

I researched, changed habits, bought supplements, changed clothes and meals, everything that could help. I was going to do a second exam, she got pregnant.

The she sent me away.

A little voice in my head kept telling me to do the second exam. I did. The results were even worse. I did a third exam later, almost the same thing.

Judging by these exams and her behavior, probably the child isn’t mine.

But last week I saw another Doctor. I did another kind of exam, found out I have to go through surgery to improve fertility.

Well, it was almost settled. It could hardly be mine. But then came the result of another fertility exam: it was unbelievably high. Much better than one I had done years before, higher than anything I read about on the internet.

And now? These results may vary daily. In the end, it is impossible to know. I’ll have to wait for the DNA, going through these extremes.

Just wanted to tell you that you sound like a person with such an open heart...
even if you can't find out whether you're the father till after birth, I'm betting that you have the stuff it takes to bond with your son or daughter then. In the meanwhile, I hope you'll continue to share here and receive all the support and encouragement we can offer.

Although I feel guilty and at the same time shortchanged for not being there during the pregnancy, if there isn't a clear conversation with her about everything, I guess it will be wiser to wait and do all that I can at the right moment.

Right now, I am postponing a decision about building or not a house. If the baby is mine, I'll build it thinking about her.

I have heard that the baby really needs the father after the first year, hope that's true, although I intend to be there much earlier.

Recovering from the shock of having been tangled in the web of a disordered individual is no small task, and loaded with hurdles.
What you said about being ashamed... of what you made yourself put up with...  I understand.
But the shame isn't yours... it's hers to bear and I pray that you'll push it off of yourself just as another new poster here
described recently.  Have you read posts by "nogadge" here?  You might appreciate those...
and just keep reading and posting, because it's so good to both purge your system of these toxins and to find community here.

I have read these posts.

Thank you very much, all the help I have been receiving here has been incredible.