Struggling

[James]

Darren....something else. As children we are very vulnerable and rely on our caregivers as protection. When parents fail to provide this and present a danger to our very self one of our brains' automatic and unconscious solutions to protect us is the abilty for us to form illusions thereby escaping the pain we cannot feel then. Abuse does exactly this......as we are abused the tremendous pain we feel as the child without protection fearing death cannot be carried by the child alone. Illusions then form in its mind where he/she begins to think its about himself this assures better control and provides protection in his thinking. He feels more in control. Breaking these illusions produce a lot of pain as an adult but what we are feeling is the pain of the child back THEN. The very real fear of death by the child still survives in the adult and thats why we so strongly resist change and have a difficult time understanding why this occurs. How many of us as adults live now is really how were were then. All of this seems real because of our repression of very strong and dangerous feelings. Difficult to break down that sort of defense system. Trusting others is a good place to start if they are trustworth and we feel safe as we share old fears we have been unable to process before.  James

[James]

Darren....you might want to visit the topic Leahs life and see what i posted there. I have been able to process traumatic memories as far back as 2 months old. I see them in feeling form and then know the fear i felt then. In this particular post i wrote of one of the most intense feelings i have ever know. I wound up hidding in the bathtub recently before i found it's source. Can you imagine what would out of the clear blue drive a grown man to seek safety in a tub? I have never felt something that intense  in the arena of fear.. It was just the way it was then not now but with this very important insight i'm freerer than ever to challenge and move past old fears and things really are changing. It's just amazing IMO.   James

[Ami]

Darren....something else. As children we are very vulnerable and rely on our caregivers as protection. When parents fail to provide this and present a danger to our very self one of our brains' automatic and unconscious solutions to protect us is the abilty for us to form illusions thereby escaping the pain we cannot feel then. Abuse does exactly this......as we are abused the tremendous pain we feel as the child without protection fearing death cannot be carried by the child alone. Illusions then form in its mind where he/she begins to think its about himself this assures better control and provides protection in his thinking. He feels more in control. Breaking these illusions produce a lot of pain as an adult but what we are feeling is the pain of the child back THEN. The very real fear of death by the child still survives in the adult and thats why we so strongly resist change and have a difficult time understanding why this occurs. How many of us as adults live now is really how were were then. All of this seems real because of our repression of very strong and dangerous feelings. Difficult to break down that sort of defense system. Trusting others is a good place to start if they are trustworth and we feel safe as we share old fears we have been unable to process before.  James

This is very profound, James.I must feel many deep, scary feelings that were there when I was "forced" to give up my power.
 I CAN understand hiding in the bathtub---very well.
 When I was in college, in the basement of my dorm, were the professors offices. At night, no one was there,so I would sit in the dark, curled in a ball.
 I MUST be my own mother. I have abdicated my life ,up to this point. My H is my substitute mother--bleh. . I thought I found my "good" mother, and I found my "real' mother.
 I have been looking for my mother in everyone and everything,and still are.
 My answer is to BE my mother, a good one, this time.
 The thought seems daunting,but has a sliver of wonder and hope , too.
                   Hugs to you, James             Ami

[darren]

Darren....you might want to visit the topic Leahs life and see what i posted there. I have been able to process traumatic memories as far back as 2 months old. I see them in feeling form and then know the fear i felt then. In this particular post i wrote of one of the most intense feelings i have ever know. I wound up hidding in the bathtub recently before i found it's source. Can you imagine what would out of the clear blue drive a grown man to seek safety in a tub? I have never felt something that intense  in the arena of fear.. It was just the way it was then not now but with this very important insight i'm freerer than ever to challenge and move past old fears and things really are changing. It's just amazing IMO.   James

Thanks for the suggestion, James, I will definately take a look at it.  I think as a child that I learned to escape into fantasy worlds to avoid the feelings of the moment, and I'm still lost in it today.  To this day I still work out conflicts (and sometimes create them) entirely in my imagination.  If I have bad feelings, or desire good ones, or have a conflict, I create imaginary scenarios to deal with it and avoid reality altogether.  As a child it kept me safe, but as an adult its not practical and a little weird... its a hard habit to break and unhealthy.  I'd like to deal with life in a more adult way, but tis hard when something like this was ingrained in you at such a young age.  If I have a problem, I can't work it out, but just imagine thats its all different.  As I grow older, its becoming less effective and I'm left with dealing with these issues in a real way... though... its a bit like being thrown into the world without any of the tools other people have.     

[James]

Ami... in my case the thought of a mother isn't such a good thing since the one i had is N. In my life i sorta use that term as learning to give myself protection and the care that i never had. It's only now that i'm really facing what happened so that is a challenging and difficult learning process for me to develop. I'm so sorry you felt like you had to curl up in a ball that. But i'ts nice you could allow yourself to do that. Kindness towards your ownself!!  James

[James]

ami i had those scary feelings inside but i really didn't know they existed, at least not consciously. For me i felt it important to have both intellectual and emotional of awareness of this to move out of it's grip. I was so lost, really had no idea what was going on, i feel i gained a understanding of what had happened thru reading books on the subject. Miller and lots of others. Eventually finding these feelings began to be the focus of what i thought a recovery might be about so thats where i headed as best i could. I'm sure there must be many aproaches to this. I have my therapist and see that she's been trying to provide me with a environment that allows me to explore myself, safely,  hopefully in ever increasingly deeper ways.  It seems like one feeling as it occurs leads to another going deeper until i finds a bedrock of sorts that signals original damage as a child. I'm not sure if one can ever undone everthing but it's probably not necessary. My defense system works in some areas but its simply overwhelmed in others and i think thats what gives me so many problems. I am making progress in these areas though just as i described. I feel i make the most progress when i open up about something painful. Is this similar to what you do?  James 

[James]

Hi Darren........I can relate to what you wrote. It was the same way in my life. I retreated and lots of times lived in an imaginary world where i seemed to play over and over old traumas hoping to "think" out a new ending. It kept me in a continuous loop and isolated. Ultimately it is the old experiences i suffered and the resulting fear that i had THEN that keeps this sorta thing alive. When i break this pattern and reach out to other people and share my fears/feelings i get different results and can see this helps so much. The old fear of my parents keeps me stuck but doing it with people other than my FOO really helps me to see that there is a different way. No feelings in my family were acceptable. the only ones they tolerated were "happy" ones. How could i be happy in such an environment? I had to leave my true feelings behind and force my self to their idea of who i should be. Inside i was so angry and that was so unacceptable to them and my fear of that alone grew inside my head because i had no way to express it and no one to help me understand myself with compassion. I feel similar that i was turned out into a strange world of other people where i did not have the emotional skills to get by.  James

[Ami]

Your last post about being inculcated by your abusive parents and then being turned out in the world with no "emotional skills" is what I mean by being"underwater".
 You( and I) had lies and distortions we HAD to buy in order to survive. We had to EAT the bitter, toxic food (lies and diistortions about ourselves),in order to survive. It was NOT our fault, just as my current state of shock , after Scott's death was involuntary.
 We had to morph and become "weird" in order to survive.
 Then, we blamed ourselves when we had "issues". We beat ourselves up for our deficits.
 As Alice Miller says, the rage and blame needs to go back on the abusers. That is one of our goals ,in healing. You are doing that, James.
         Love   Ami