Author Topic: Healthy community  (Read 31190 times)

tayana

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 933
    • http://tayana.blogspot.com
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2008, 02:29:31 PM »
I have been lurking, checking in on the board from time to time.  One thing I have noticed each time I have visited is the constant bickering, finger pointing, and accusations that seem to have become the norm on this board.  There is a sense of paranoia on this board now, and I have not posted for this reason.

I have found the board very helpful when I have hard decisions to make.  I've made several friends here, but I don't know how healthy this place is anymore.  We have all been abused by the N's in our life, and I can't say that I'm perfect and exhibit none of those N traits.  However, when one can't reply honestly to any thread without fear of being attacked or accused, then we are back to the same song we danced with our N's.

I have tried to leave these unhealthy situations in my past.  I am trying to start over with a new life, a new house, a new partner.  My mother contacted me for the first time in 3 months, but I didn't post about my confusion.  Why?  Because I'm just not sure how well my post would be heard here.  I have noticed in the past few months that the only threads that receive true attention seem to be those that degenerate into pointless bickering.  That's not healthy.

I have been working things out with my T, and with my partner.  I don't like to talk about my feelings.  I find it easier to write about them, but for me, the board hasn't been a place where I have felt healing can take place.  I feel like one needs to choose sides here, and if one associates with certain board members, then you are under suspicion of being a troll.
http://tayana.blogspot.com

You gain strength, courage and confidence by every experience in which you
really stop to look fear in the face. You must do the thing you think you cannot
do.
-Elanor Roosevelt

ann3

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 499
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2008, 02:30:46 PM »
Oh, yes, I agree.  The board has become a venomous cacophony.

Wish we could express how we feel without crushing other people or having others crush us.

peace to all,
ann

ann3

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 499
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2008, 02:35:08 PM »
One thing I have noticed each time I have visited is the constant bickering, finger pointing, and accusations that seem to have become the norm on this board.

We have all been abused by the N's in our life, and I can't say that I'm perfect and exhibit none of those N traits.  However, when one can't reply honestly to any thread without fear of being attacked or accused, then we are back to the same song we danced with our N's.

I have tried to leave these unhealthy situations in my past. 


Tayana,
Beautifully expressed.

love,
ann



lollie

  • Guest
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2008, 02:46:44 PM »
Hi, Hops.

This is a great thread, and I thank you for starting it.

Like you, I have thought about leaving the board this week. It's been hard for me to read many of the posts...and it's been hard for me to stop myself from reading the posts as well. The second part is beginning to concern me. This board is not quite an addiction for me yet, but it sure has taken up a lot of my time this week.

It's a tough call, because I see really good things happening here sometimes. There are many people with good hearts who share their life experiences and who, above all, really seem able to understand. But then there's the (I'm beginning to think) inevitable discord, rallying, projection, etc. that you mentioned in your post.

The strength of a board like this is that it gives people a certain level of anonymity, and with that the freedom to be more open about sensitive issues. The weakness of a board like this it gives people a certain level of anonymity, and with that the freedom to say something that in real life would get you punched in the nose.

Back in April, during a different period of conflict, I removed my story in the Member Stories section because the board didn't seem a safe place to bare my soul. I haven't reposted it yet for that reason and also because in this current climate I simply don't want any of my "story" (any of my "issues") to be weilded as a weapon against me. I had enough of that in my FOO.

I think each person posting here has their own reasons and their own expectations of what they will experience here. Back in April, I posted this:

Quote
Maybe I was expecting something different than a mirror of life on "the outside." I think I was expecting more of a sanctuary, a safe place where I could come to read the stories of other adult children, post some of mine, get a reality check, maybe read some things that were healing and would help me grow. It could be that my expectations were all out of whack. I don't know.

There are many, many good hearts here. Maybe I will see that feeling emerge again. Until that time, I will lurk and check my PMs. And I will probably get all pissed off at something someone's N mom said and post something in spite of myself.

I still feel that way. Actually, I feel even more tentative about posting than before. It's not because I'm afraid of someone else's wrath, or because I might hear a criticism that's uncomfortable for me, or because something I say might be misconstrued or misinterpreted. It's because there's a certain amount of toxicity here that seems, to me at least, to be the worst I've seen since I joined in December. And if it continues, I don't think it's good for me to come here and expose myself to it.

And to be quite honest with you, all this fighting is getting awfully boring.

Right now I am sitting right on the fence. It won't take much to push me to one side (give it some more time/things will calm down) or the other (goodbye and goodluck).

Thank you again, Hops. I appreciate your candor and willingness to start a conversation about this.

Leah

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2894
  • Joyous Discerner
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2008, 03:58:12 PM »



Reciprocal communication with respect and consideration works wonders!

Add a dose of Listening and Clarification

and share around the table with laughter ringing out now and then.


I know, I know, I am repeating myself again!   :)

Love to ALL

From an eternal optimist

Leah x
Jun 2006 voiceless seeking

April 2008 - "The Gaslight Effect" How to Spot & Survive by Dr. Robin Stern - freedom of understanding!

The Truth About Abuse VIDEO

sKePTiKal

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5440
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2008, 04:35:20 PM »
Deb, having a voice and using it to respectfully disagree or stand up for yourself is a good thing. Yes, we should practice tolerance... everyone is different, sure, and at different places in healing.

Where I disagree with this, in light of the conflicts I've seen in my time here, is when "having a voice" is used to entitle someone to be mean, cruel, call names or label, and almost literally stand on a street corner shouting about how someone else here is making them a victim, hurting their feelings... in an attempt to gain sympathy and supporters. This is divisive in any community, anywhere, any time. And manipulative. Sure, it's because of abuse suffered before...

... this is why I believe that looking for help elsewhere is necessary before joining in a support community. A therapist is qualified to deal with those sensitivities and help the person get beyond this kind of behavior - we are not. There was a point in my process, where I simply couldn't have participated on any board because I couldn't be responsible for my own emotions and how I responded to others. A point where I simply couldn't read others' experiences and be understanding - because I was so triggered emotionally. In my case - I simply couldn't interact responsibly... and I didn't try to pretend I could.

There isn't any way to screen people on the web; to evaluate them beforehand. A support group should be equally open to all, I believe. But if someone repeatedly acts out the same kind behavior - all the while denying it and upsetting large groups of people - they're not being helped here and neither are we. And when the conflicts continue over time - as they have - it becomes an obstacle for me.  "OH NO... not THAT again!"

It's unfortunately like a car accident: you don't want to look - but morbid curiosity takes over. And like it or not - it affects me. When it's a long road trip, chances are there'll be more than one accident - BUT IT'S NOT THE SAME ONE OVER & OVER... like the conflicts are, here. Yes, Lollie - they get boring. Yes Hops - I spend too much time here, while at work; it's one of the few luxuries I have here; for now. I rather enjoy this place when we're not all discussing this same issue, ad nauseum... but do I really need to be here?

Probably not. Thought I might be able to "give back"... but I too have been mauled in some conflicts... so I have to consider. I'll think about my participation over the weekend.

Success is never final, failure is never fatal.

debkor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1070
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #21 on: June 13, 2008, 06:00:06 PM »
Hi PR,

I just wrote and when I was finished the site went down or my server, God!..

Anyway I wanted to say that Yes, I agree with you.  That a voice does not mean you can slander, label, name call, or shout out someone here is making them feel victim, hurting their feelings, to gain sympathy and supporters.  But it does happen. 

When I was first on here and pretty new there was a conflict then.  CB was here at the time and wrote to not be discouraged this has happened before and it will blow over and it did just to come back again, Ugh. 

I see CB has left, as well, as others. I am glad she pops in from time to time though.  There are so many good people with lots of wisdom and experiences to share on here and now again more are thinking about leaving because of conflict, over and over and over, I do understand this but it saddens me.  I enjoy the reads.  I enjoy sharing.  I enjoy the people and consider (my online) friends. And I guess it just is upsetting that so many people I have learned so much from and have given so much .. may just have had enough and I do understand.  Just a little sad.

Love
Deb




lighter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8631
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #22 on: June 13, 2008, 06:09:10 PM »
Amber....

of all the teachers/posters sharing their positive healing journey on this board....

please don't leave.

Not now.

Lighter

Gabben

  • Guest
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #23 on: June 13, 2008, 06:15:51 PM »

Where I disagree with this, in light of the conflicts I've seen in my time here, is when "having a voice" is used to entitle someone to be mean, cruel, call names or label, and almost literally stand on a street corner shouting about how someone else here is making them a victim, hurting their feelings... in an attempt to gain sympathy and supporters. This is divisive in any community, anywhere, any time. And manipulative. Sure, it's because of abuse suffered before...


Love this.....







Hopalong

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13616
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #24 on: June 13, 2008, 10:21:57 PM »
I'll say goodnight now, and goodbye for a while.

love
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Leah

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2894
  • Joyous Discerner
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #25 on: June 13, 2008, 10:23:33 PM »

Goodnight from me (((((((((( Hops )))))))))   Love, Leah

Enjoy your wonderful garden and don't eat all the blueberries at once!    :)
Jun 2006 voiceless seeking

April 2008 - "The Gaslight Effect" How to Spot & Survive by Dr. Robin Stern - freedom of understanding!

The Truth About Abuse VIDEO

Overcomer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2666
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #26 on: June 13, 2008, 10:40:37 PM »
I will miss your sense of reason!!  Please do not go for long!!!  Hopefully the board will simma donna............
Kelly

"The Best Way Out is Through........and try laughing at yourself"

CB123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 883
  • It's never to late to be what you might have been
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #27 on: June 14, 2008, 10:01:58 AM »
Hi Hopsy,

Hope you are still around enough to do some reading of your thread.  I have been off the board for a long time now, but I usually sat down with my cup of coffee and read a few posts in the morning before I headed out for my day.  I think that what you are searching for is balance and that is a good thing--and it will come with the break you are planning.

I left the board about three conflicts ago!   :shock:  Yes, they do happen over and over again.  This will definitely not be the last one!  The point at which I left, I had too much going on in my 3D world to manage the relationships here. 

Frankly, we are a very complicated bunch and there is no way to keep each other on the periphery of our lives when we are here to share our hearts.  So when things get intense around here, we may or may not have the emotional reserves to handle it.  Healthy is when we pull back and take care of ourselves instead of reacting against the other hurting puppies here.  There's been a lot of reacting in the last week from emotionally drained individuals.

I find that in every single area of my life, it is when I hit the wall that I am about to do some major quantum leap in growth.  I never, ever, ever, ever grow before the hit-the-wall-point.  Well, maybe I am growing all along--or setting the stage for growth--but the major push happens when I crash and burn.  I think that there are some members here that are crashing and burning and that it is not a negative thing at all.  They are crashing and burning on their way to a lot of insight.  That's a good thing.  Painful to watch though.

The title of this thread is Healthy Community.  I like to think about that.  I have spent my life thinking about Community and what it looks like and what it means.  I think that at the end of my life, I MIGHT have figured it out.  Sheesh.  One thing that I read that has always stuck with me was by Scott Peck.  He claimed that there is no such thing as community until you have had your first conflict.  No one is being real if they are trying to avoid conflict--and it is the handling of conflict that forges the community. 

How about that????

Conflict is, by its very nature, confusing and unpleasant.  No one looks forward to it, no one looks back on it fondly.  But without weathering it--without wading into it with hip-high boots and dealing with it--there is no community.  So, there you have it--for the last week, we have been forging community.  Healthy?  Hmmm.  Well, none of us is terribly healthy--so no surprise that we have some unhealthy aspects to our community. 

Just because everyone in the community is not behaving well, doesnt mean that the community itself is unhealthy.  There is no question that some of us (maybe all of us!!!!) is forging out their recovery by using others of us as surrogate FOO.  If you go back and reread several weeks of posts, you will see how obvious that is.  I don't think that any of us can work through our FOO issues without engaging in do-overs--recreate the problem relationships, even if it is only in our own minds, and then put ourself in the hero-role instead of the victim-role.  Every one of us has been a colossal pain in the butt when we have done this. 

This week's conflict has been a major pain-in-the-butt.  Maybe just admitting that is the most we need to do.

Ami said something on another thread that I think was a sobering thought for all of us.  She was thanking the people who agreed with and supported her and commented that if it had not been for them, she would have believed the lies that her mother told her about who she was.  How many of the rest of us have that same thought pattern?  How much of the choosing of sides and rallying on one side of the other, is born out of the desperation to have that voice in our head silenced? 

Chances are we ARE, to some extent, who our N's said we were.  Our N's were able to wrestle us to the ground and make us cry uncle--not because they were speaking lies about us--but because they were speaking half-truths.  Or quarter-truths.  Or eighth's-truths.  And we chose to believe that small part about us, was all we were.  We are so much more than that. 

What's wrong with admitting that we are selfish, self-absorbed?  That we gossip sometimes?  That we arent completely loyal friends?  Why do we feel as though we have to prove that we are perfect in order to be accepted? I have been, I have done all those things.  But it isnt the sum-total of who I am.  I am bigger than those things.  I am constantly turning a corner in a labyrinth and coming across something unexpected.  I am dirty and I have skinned knees.  I have a bloody nose.  Sometimes I hurt people coming around the corner, sometimes I help them up.  Sometimes I dont realize who I ran over until I look back.  Jeez, I'm a mess.

So are you...and you... and you.  Healthy isnt being all cleaned up.  Healthy is recognizing that in each of us. 



CB

When they are older and telling their own children about their grandmother, they will be able to say that she stood in the storm, and when the wind did not blow her way -- and it surely has not -- she adjusted her sails.  Elizabeth Edwards 2010

Overcomer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2666
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #28 on: June 14, 2008, 10:12:35 AM »
CB:  That was wonderfully said!  It makes perfect sense.  I never in my life would be a part of a fight.  In 3D life I would always back down.  The fact that I yell at my mom and set healthy boundaries is uncomfortable for her but it is a major freeing experience for me.  The fact that our members can say what they want IS freeing to them.  I had a major ah ha moment here, CB.  Thank you!!
Kelly

"The Best Way Out is Through........and try laughing at yourself"

Certain Hope

  • Guest
Re: Healthy community
« Reply #29 on: June 14, 2008, 10:44:48 AM »
Dear CB,

Your post has put alot of this mess into better perspective for me.
This comment, in particular, has startled me into new awareness... and I can see that it's true!

Quote
He claimed that there is no such thing as community until you have had your first conflict.  No one is being real if they are trying to avoid conflict--and it is the handling of conflict that forges the community.

I'm so glad that you returned to share some of what you've learned with us.  Thank you.

Carolyn