Author Topic: Dear Hopalong  (Read 5587 times)

lighter

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2008, 10:13:09 PM »
lighter
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     Re: Sending love to Shame Slayer
« Reply #9 on: Today at 08:28:34 PM »     

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Oh Hops.... what a thing is organization, for the artsy type?

My stomach flipped when I read about going into rooms and not knowing why you were there.....

so been there...

done that.

::sending you strength and energy for when the church volunteer calvary arrives::

Time to edit and send things back out into the universe: )

Lighter


 

Hopalong

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2008, 10:21:19 PM »
Thank you Lighter (and thanks for moving it off the Shame Slayer thread)...

I am moved by your ability to send support and caring in the midst of your own lonely hard walk.

Maybe when we walk into rooms and don't know why we're there, we're just supposed to stop, and breathe, and wait, and feel the air in the room, and notice it's just a box, and we can still breathe...

I really did feel unhinged today. I felt crazy. It scared me.
I was making no sense. I couldn't figure anything out.

I'm stunned I've come up against the same lesson in love.
The change is that this is a good man. Eccentric and brittle in ways, but good.

But it's still the same lesson, isn't it?
I so don't want it to be...another letting go.

How many of those do I have in me?

love
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Hopalong

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #17 on: June 29, 2008, 10:33:16 PM »
This is hard but I am saying the truth: I feel incredibly needy of your voices, your advice.

Is there any way I can not bolt? Run away from this man?

The risk of loving? I shouldn't take it?

It feels like what I do. I love.

Am I screwing up? HELP.

love and gratitude,
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Ami

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #18 on: June 29, 2008, 10:35:52 PM »
I understand that scary, unglued feeling, Hops. It hurts so badly . You feel like you are losing your mind,on top of it all. I understand.I  am really sorry, Hops.     Ami


PS You are normal to want love, comfort, and a sense of connection, especially now, with all the changes in your life. My intuitive feeling about this man is that  he may need a little space away from the relationship to get his bearings. It does not have to be over, I don't think, do you?


 
« Last Edit: June 29, 2008, 11:20:22 PM by Ami »
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

Certain Hope

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #19 on: June 29, 2008, 10:46:04 PM »
Hops,

Loving is only un-risky when you can live joyfully with whatever the other person offers in return - whether that's alot or none - and not feel disappointed... or lessened by it. That means - even if it's nothing near what you've given, nowhere near half of the time.  Relationships are not 50/50, you know? They're 100/100...  and I think that some people are simply not capable of that.

 You are a 100 percent kinda woman, imo.

Only your heart knows what you can stand...


Love,
Carolyn

Hopalong

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #20 on: June 29, 2008, 11:31:45 PM »
Ann, you are so very kind to me.
I truly feel it, and I thank you.

Why are you so kind?
You are a generous person.

Hugs to you, and thank you for calming me.

love,
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Hopalong

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #21 on: June 29, 2008, 11:34:14 PM »
Ami,
Thank you for your compassion. You do understand those feelings.
It helps to hear someone say, been there, know that.
I appreciate you knowing and naming...crazytime.

Makes it feel less crazy.

hugs
Hops
PS--You could be right that it doesn't have to be over. Wouldn't it be wonderful if he found he wanted me more than he wanted to the way he's always been? He did tell me he knows it is a position of fear. I don't know if I'm wanting to smash that hope because it's so scary or if I should be marching right for the Exit because these things "always end". And if this one could end peacefully, in friendship, it would be different. I am torn between wanting to wait and hope and realizing that my fears of loss can make me either clutch or run, and either clutching or running is the end anyway.

What I need is strength to be and wait.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2008, 11:37:54 PM by Hopalong »
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

changing

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #22 on: June 29, 2008, 11:37:27 PM »
Hi Sweetie Hops-


You know Darling Hoppy Girl- it hasn't been that long that you two have been keeping company. Maybe this whole legal/familial pain in the Hops is making you feel isolated and unstable- your daughter in another state, etc and your mom and bro in a judicial civil war...Maybe this man isn't trying to control and get intense all at once (I think that is a good thing)...maybe he is not forever (I can't know this)...maybe this level of involvement is right for what you are doing now-only you would know. But he seems like he is trying to keep harmful drama away and that is good... It can be so hard to deal with so much alone, especially when it involves one's inner circle and one's security- how blessed is the soul who has someone who will be with them no matter what...

I definitely understand- but Hoppy you can make it, I know. And there are lots of darling men who would be thrilled to keep company with you, and someone who is the One (I am a foolish romantic but I believe this) it may or may not be the Gardener, but you are taking tentative steps now... There is no failure here- you have to choose carefully, and deserve friendship, love, adventure...

Do you know that Michel LeGrand/Arthur and Marilyn Bergman song "I Wish You Love?" It may come to that - bittersweet but good in its own way, apart from expectations...or it could be "The Wedding March"- only time will tell... I am sending you my best joy vibe ... The best is yet to come Hoppy!!!!

Love,

Changing
« Last Edit: June 29, 2008, 11:39:10 PM by changing »

Hopalong

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #23 on: June 29, 2008, 11:39:22 PM »
Aww, gad, Changing, you got me bawling again.

Thank you.
I can't say more just now how wonderful that was.

thank you.

love
Hops
Got it. It was you saying, There is no failure here.That was the answer I've been straining for all day.

thank you thank you. I believe you're right. Just got some oxygen back in my heart.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2008, 11:41:36 PM by Hopalong »
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

changing

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #24 on: June 29, 2008, 11:45:38 PM »
Dearest Hoppy-

You don't know yet how wonderful you are and how fabulous the life you and the lucky fellow you choose will turn out- but you will know... and I will rejoice with you!!!

RRRROOOFFF (Love and Blessings In the WOLFIE Language )

Changing
« Last Edit: June 29, 2008, 11:47:43 PM by changing »

sea storm

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2008, 02:42:37 AM »
Hi Hops,

You have bravely told the story of your relationship with the gardener. The slant is a bit on the iffy side.  He wants space and to keep it light hearted sort of.  This doesn't sound like you.  These biker boys who are part angel, part pirate are short term usually.

I trust your judgement but sense that passion is at play here and that you are losing yourself a little.  I would like to see you take back your power and not stick around for a waiting game.  You deserve that whole wonderful, messy  love of your life feeling. 
I cant help but think that you were very vulnerable after your mom went to live somewhere else, sibling rivalry surfaces like a nuclear submarine, and you faced so many changes. Your brother seemed to be able to reduce you to small child. The up side of that was that you got to see what it must have been like as a child having to live with the two of them in the house and no escape.

Meanwhile reap the harvest and experience yourself as a full blown woman again. Good for you. Just dont give away the farm. Your heart is might big and I am just a little afraid that you are that kind of gal. They are the best in my books but they can be so vulnerable and end up in jackpots that it takes a miracle to recover from.

Thinking about you, Hoppy.

Love,

Sea storm

axa

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2008, 04:01:20 AM »
Hiya Hops,

So sorry about the unevenness of your relationship with garden man.  Just been skimming the thread and need to go back and read it properly to comment but wanted to say thinking of you.  I also want to add that you must be EXHAUSTED from years of caring for your mother, the responsibility and then there is brother from hell.....come on girl, give yourself a break. 

I went to a wedding last week and watched people dancing together.  I suddenly felt very alone and had a longing for sharing with someone but when I thought about this I knew that this was the needy part of me back in action.  The part that drives me into unbalanced relationships with weak boundaries (Carolyn's thread in mind here).  I realised that I had been slipping on going out and meeting with friends/theatre/films which keep me connected with the alive and happy part of me.  This has taught me something about its not so much that I want someone else.  It is when I abandon myself I get the longing for an other to come in and make it right.  I am learning about taking care of myself and growing up.  When I go into waiting and hoping mode I want someone.  When I am in adult mode and living a full and engaged life, my aloneness feels like freedom.  Just my thoughts,

much love

axa

CB123

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #27 on: June 30, 2008, 07:18:34 AM »
Oh, Hopsy!

I sooooo get where you are. 

Remember the book you have recommended on relationships?  (the name escapes me, and I am settled all cozily in my bed with my cup of coffee and I dont want to go digging in the shelves for it...)  That book came to me just as I was hitting the spot where you are for the first time.  It was everything to me.  Everything.  I weathered the dance with the book in my hand and have continued to use what I learned there as the dance continues.  Go get the book--read it again.

Something that the author spoke of was that there is a natural progression to every romantic relationship (I'm convinced that it happens in all relationships).  At some point there is a pulling back by one of the partners--a retreat from the intimacy that is developing.  The natural tendency of the other partner is to move forward in response--to ask questions, to express concern.  The author points out that that behavior heightens the need for space in the initiating partner. 

The best gift you can give to him, and to the relationship, is to pull back, too.  So he can have the freedom to figure out on his own where he wants to land.  Allowing this freedom will be uncomfortable to you, but the results won't be.  Because he is going to have the freedom to move toward you--because he wants to, not because he wants to reassure you--and that is going to feel really good to both of you.

Also, just because someone says they don't think they can fall in love again--you don't have to start hammering nails into the coffin.  People say a lot of things.  Sometimes they say what they wish was true.  Sometimes they really mean what they say--at that moment.  Sometimes they say what is the opposite of what is true.  I listen to what people say, but I pay more attention to what they do. 

Okay, another thing:  you two havent been together that long.  He is actually saying exactly what he SHOULD be saying at this point.  If he was planning marriage already, I would be on a plane to come get you!  Lots and lots of time--that's what you need, and he is giving it to you with out you having to fight for it.  Lots of space to work through your very real relationship issues without also navigating the rapids of commitment.  What a gift. 

And finally....even if you two develop a long term, committed relationship, he may still be of little use in an emotional melt down.  My experience is limited--but what I have had, with husband, sons, and now a sweetheart, is that men don't do well with emotional meltdowns.  Esp. meltdowns that involve not being able to fix it.  Men are not all the same, so I suspect the extent of their desire to fix it is varied.  But I have encountered it over and over again.  Some men get angry--at the source of your pain, or at you!--and then you are left to deal with HIS strong emotions, distracting you from your own.  Some men pull back--either out of wisdom, or just out of the frustration at the feeling of ineptness they get--and leave you to struggle through your own feelings on your own. 

That feels like abandonment because women rush in and cluck and putter and empathize.  All that clucking and puttering feels like real love to us.  So we grade our man on where he lands on the scale of attention When The Sky Is Falling In.  But, I dont think that's fair (and I do it!)  I honestly have never in my life met a man who has met my tears with an offer to make me a cup of tea, bring me a tissue, and sit and hold my hand while I pour out my fears and frustrations.  I know that's what we say we want, but I just don't think it exists.  I think that we have to let our girlfriends do that for us, and let our men do something else.  That's just where I have arrived most recently!

So...maybe there are two things going on here.  One, is your meltdown over your family and home issues and your gardener's response (or lack of it).  The other may be your anxiety over where this relationship is going (or not going).  The two things may have converged this weekend, but they may not actually be related at all.  And one may not speak to the reality of the other.  And neither may be poured in stone for all time.

I have faced this stuff in my relationship,too.  Sometimes pretty well and sometimes not.  What I have learned to do is to look at stuff like this as a plot tension in our story.  (what good story doesnt have a bit of tension in it to make you keep turning the page?)  You could look at his unwillingness to spend the night like a discovery:  oh, I see.  This is going to be a kind of interesting twist in the story--we make mad passionate love, but he always slips out to go back home.  This is what "we" look like.  There is no right way to have this love affair--this is the way we have it. 

So, you are the other part of the story--what do you want to be doing as he slips out to go home?  Or when you wake up the next morning, wishing he were waking up beside you--but he's not.  If you can picture who you want to be in the story--the strong woman with things in her own life that need doing--you can construct the end of that chapter with you puttering around your own kitchen in the morning, making your tea, listening to music on the stereo, choosing to have the autonomy that results from his emotional distance.  Does that make sense?

The same thing with his unwillingness to make a further commitment to you right now:  this is the real story of you, as a couple.  What will you make of it?  If you were to write a story of your romance, with you being okay with the way it is right now, what would it look like?  Can you walk that picture out? 

I have been able to do that (my issues arent the same as yours--but I still feel inexplicably clutchy at times, considering the fact that I am really not comfortable with binding commitments myself at this point).  I keep my emotional feelers out there, looking for places where I might be settling for something that really isnt okay at all.  I've hit that place a couple of times, and that's when we have The Talk.  So far, we have always resolved things.

All that is to say, Hopsy, that if any of this starts feeling abusive, or sick, or twisted, the story is over.  That's the way this one ends--the strong woman walking out the door (or kicking him through it).  The entire scenario above is based on both of you being imperfect but good people who are simply bumbling around a new relationship trying to figure out how to do it.  I think you will recognize if it ever becomes something darker.  I say, let him keep taking his space wherever he needs it, while you guard the space you need to look at everything that is going on from a bit of emotional distance. 

I'm walking this road, too, Hopsy, and it's both exciting and exhausting.

Love you
CB

When they are older and telling their own children about their grandmother, they will be able to say that she stood in the storm, and when the wind did not blow her way -- and it surely has not -- she adjusted her sails.  Elizabeth Edwards 2010

Ami

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #28 on: June 30, 2008, 09:23:01 AM »
Dear Hops,
 CB expressed what I wanted to say, beauifully.I got the book you recommended , too. It talks about the ebbs and flows of relationships and how pulling away is PART of the relationship, at times.
 It is normal, NOT abnormal. It IS very,very scary,though, especially if we have fear of abandonment, which children of N's do(out the whazoo and more)
 I think you are at a pivotal point with him. I think he has a basic interest in you and in the relationship. I think he is asking himself if you will LET him have space. Everyone asks themselves this in relationships. They want to know that they can have come and go without the other person clinging for dear life(IMO)
My advice would be cling to your pillow, another friend, but not him and he may just find that you have those special qualities that he misses. I think there is a good chance he will come back and you will go to the next level ,with him, as long as you give him the space ,now. That is my 2 cents, Hops, dear.       Ami
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

sKePTiKal

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Re: Dear Hopalong
« Reply #29 on: June 30, 2008, 09:41:07 AM »
Dear Hops - here's my two cents, sweetie...

He's still offering love - you still want love and other parts of your life are stressful... let this relationship be, for the time being.

Yes, I heard you when you said ultimately you want more, when you first described this relationship. But "prince charming" hasn't parked his horse in your garden yet - and your faithful gardener may be just what you need... for the time being anyway. Maybe this is just my hippie past coming up...

but do there HAVE to be "rules" about relationships? Do they have to fit some pre-determined pattern? Or can they just find their own state of being? And be just fine that way?

Best I can do right now; If I stop having my own emotional meltdowns about not smoking soon - I'll be back. Twiggy's bring me all kinds of strange memories and emotions right now. It's really hell dealing with the teenaged "me"; she's more wily & stubborm than even my own kids were...

But I've found the "carrot", I think. What she really wants. (ps - you were SOOOO right to look at the effects of nicotine on the brain again - it helped me figure out the "benefits" that Twiggy got from smoking...)
Success is never final, failure is never fatal.