I'm depressed

[bearwithme]

Hi Bear,

I say, so what! 
You were angry and rightfully so.  Just because she is your mother does not give her the ticket to (mentally abuse you or yours).  So you think you lost it?  You showed her the door (with some choice words) and?  So.  Long time coming.  Then even more bully of putting her hands and shoving you....Well bear honey...you shoved her out the door...don't let it hit you in the ass. 

You didn't do anything wrong.  You wanted her out.  So would I.  I probably would have done the same including leaving myself when it was that engaged (in moment) if she would not. 

You did the right thing. 

You cooled off.  You were in control.

Your a pretty stand up person!!!
Please try not to be depressed over something you lost control or snapped over....I don't think you have.....
I think if your D was older she think your a pretty Stand Up Mom....herself.   
Again....Bear.......So you let her have it.....

Long time coming....
Forgive yourself...you had the right to be angry, livid, and you controlled it...You left and coolded off.

We get angry.  We are human.

I like your "matter of fact" attitude here.  I think it's smart of you to think that way and I need to apply this a bit more.  Yeah, so what?  I'm human for pete's sake!  Well, I was never treated like a human as a child with my own feelings so that's where it comes from.  If I showed any emotion, especially anger, then I was a selfish, mean, awful, self-centered daughter.  I also never learned to forgive myself, only learned to forgive NM.  I learned very well how to punish myself for mistakes because she let me know that I was too stupid or too slow to "figure things out on [my] own."

Twoapenny wrote:

I asked her if she was going to be like this all day at which point she just went back to the bedroom and started to pack.  I lost it big time, screamed and shouted at her, slammed the door shut when she tried to leave and stood in front of it so she couldn't get out, I yelled and swore and really let rip.  She just stood there.  Eventually I opened the door and screamed at her to leave, then I chased her out onto the street shouting at her as she went.  She told everyone she was forced to flee for her own safety, I turned on her for no reason and attacked her and she had to run for her life.  I AM SO GLAD I DID IT!!!!!

Ahhh, I stood up and cheered when I read this!!  It is so relieving to know that I'm not the only one who's "lost it."  I'm happy you did this too!  I love the part where you chased her out onto the street!  Wow...that is so like a movie and so honest!  I'm just beside myself knowing you did this and you survived and are happy and healthy and moving on so gracefully, etc.  Thank you sooooo much for sharing that.  I love it!

Butterfly:

Your feelings were honest.  I know in my case, it might have been the first time I was ever honest in expressing my feelings about my mother to my mother.  Don't fear the truth, Bear.  I am attempting each and every day to acknowledge the truth about my life and do all in my power to make sure the poison stops with me and does not creep into my young ones.  Every day (hour) that I am successful, I can smile.  And, I can love myself and forgive myself for not perfectly getting it right.

You made me cry   but in a joyful way.  I need to smile after each hour I'm away from that crazy monster, yes, I am successful now, too and need to express love for myself as I was only taught how to love NM and never learned to love myself and it's a hard thing to learn after all these years.

The cops or guys with straight jackets would have to be called for somebody. 

Worn: that is too funny!  Great and true!!

Swimmer: the image of your daughter pulling the wagon for a block is just so profound to me and my eyes welled up.  You are much like me and I often jump in the car with my daughter when I feel "tight" and take her to go see the ducks and birds, something in nature always pulls me back to earth.

Logy:  thank you for the reminder about apologizing to MY family.  My NM is not my family anymore and she doesn't deserve an apology.

Thank you all for being here for me and having the guts to tell your "lost it" stories.  It takes a lot of bravery and honesty to share those moments where most feel they may be judged by their actions of thought of as the one with the problem...and we know that is not the case with an N.

Bear

[bearwithme]

I just wanted to say that I'm doing much better today than yesterday, thank you.

Out of nowhere, I walked into a Catholic church this morning to be close to God. (Mind you, I practice no religion and I don't go to church) but I wanted to prove that I could be close to God, too.  My NM shouted that she is the ONLY one who has God in her life and that she is the ONLY one who is close to God and that she is the ONLY one that is forgiven by God and that she is the ONLY one who knows how God works and that she is the ONLY one who can claim God has taken over her life.  She reads the Bible constantly and goes to countless Bible study classes and seminars.  She gives all her money to her church and church friends when my brother is claiming BK and I struggle to find a job.

So, I sat down in this church and looked up at this giant wooden cross with a carving of Jesus on it.  The sides of the church were floor-to-celing, stained-glass windows of all the Saints and the nativity scene with a baby Jesus.  A painting of the last supper and a lit candle in the front and a white cloth laid over a table with what looked like a big Bible on a stand.   The church was completely empty and silent with only the creaking of the heavy-beamed ceiling, which was lit up from the sunlight that shined through the giant stained-glass windows.  I was alone, but was I.

I sat there for a while and then smirked and said quite sarcastically aloud, "See, I can be close to you, too."   I'm glad no one heard me (except for God, that is).

Bear

[swimmer]

Nice to hear today is better Bear:)  It warms my heart to hear how you enjoy ducks and birds with your daughter.  I bet she just adores you!!  A daughter IS a gift.

Thx for sharing Bear, great to hear about your journey.  Your strength is inspiring!     

[Sealynx]

Bear,
BRAVO!!!
I think your tirade on the lawn was wonderful! So some luggage got tossed around, mom heard her behavior adequately defined with a few four letter words, and your family got to see that you are human and can only be pushed so far. Nobody died. We all have a breaking point. We all needed permission to break as children but we never could because we couldn't walk away, drive around the block or get an apartment.

When I was a child I let people walk all over me and to this day my mother ridicules my behavior. Why did I do that? Because I knew how sick I felt whenever she flew into a rage and I knew if I tried to stand up to anyone she would either do the same thing to them (and my battle an excuse for her rage) or do it to me. It was a double bind situation. Either other kids abused me because I was a wimp, my mother abused them and they took it out me later, or she abused me. I had to keep all the rage inside. I've been tempted to throw my mother out with her luggage a few times, but the luggage is mine and I don't want to break it. I got it for graduation and my parents promptly took it and went to Europe. They were too cheap to buy their own.
S

[bearwithme]

Sealynx:

I had to keep all the rage inside. I've been tempted to throw my mother out with her luggage a few times, but the luggage is mine and I don't want to break it. I got it for graduation and my parents promptly took it and went to Europe. They were too cheap to buy their own.

Hey, you could always replace your luggage!  I'll (and I gather donations from the board) help you with that if need be! $$$$

Bear.

[Sealynx]

LOL...Thanks Bear. Actually Blue is no longer my favorite color. I'll let you know when they hit the lawn

[bearwithme]

I've got word that NM has spread the word to all relatives and other people that "I'm sick" and that "I need help."  That I "have anger problems, etc."  She is relentless.  She is on the God bandwagon and won't stop. 

I am so tired.  I need sleep and help.  This angers me and I'm depressed at the same time.  I'm a lot better than before but I want to be better.


Bear

[nolongeraslave]

All I can say is GO BEAR! Wow. What courage and strength to put her in her place. She deserved it, giving all what she did to you.  When we stand up to NM, it can make us feel lousy b/c they trained us to be this way..like we're the bad one.

I hope you recover..Wait..You WILL recover.  Moms like that are like people who hit us with a dangerous object, and it just takes awhile for us to get back up and running. 

She can bs all she want calling you sick and that you need help. We know it's not true.

[bearwithme]

thank you NAS.  Each hour that passes I try to smile a little more.  Although, the depressed/sad feelings are still there and they flow in and out of me quite often.  I wonder about that and will take it up with my therapist tomorrow.  He is very excited for me to get started on a new road of "recovery" and to organize this mess which I have allowed into my very private life.

You have all been just wonderful on this thread.  I can't believe how much support I received and how I have my own cheering section.  Hee hee, it feels really good!!   I will hang on to this for a long time.

Does anyone here still feel sorry for their NM'S?  Does anyone still feel depressed or sad about the "bad" times, i.e., confrontations with their N or full-blown fights with their N? 

Is anyone here embarrassed by their actions in any of the flare-ups with their N?  Just curious...

Bear

[swimmer]

Feel bad for my actions??  There is always a feeling I'm bad overall.  But specifically.... I'm a little embarassed and regretful I didn't speak up more.  I just found it was exhausting and distracting to stick up for myself, so I let too much roll off my back.  My mother was always ashamed she had a daughter that spoke up, so I learned to gracefully be assertive with most people.  I really let my mother have it at certain turning points of my life though.

Anyways.... I NEVER regret my reactions to my mother.  She buys all this stuff I'll never need to cover her vile nature.  I see a blowout as a maintenance of truth and dignity rather than a blowout.  Christianity gives me the strength to know that the truth is the moral standing I can take to find joy.

[Hopalong]

Yes, I did regret it. Still do.

But I forgave myself. So it is a regret I accept and I am not disabled by it. What I mean is, I am sorry but I am not ashamed. The difference is "right regret" (for me) and self-loathing (embarrassment = shame).

I was sorry because (and this is easier for me because her form of N was so suppressed into "virtue" that, for example, she never struck me, verbally abused me...she just...drove me crazy with her lack of empathy, her invasiveness, her lecturing and hectoring me until I thought I'd lose my mind, her apparent empathy void, her inability to get outside her own script for even one moment for me, except a couple times--which memories I hoard like gems of healing)...

I was sorry because she was a very old human being. And she was a child, and she had been damaged in a toxic family. And she passed on a legacy she knew nothing about. She still didn't deserve cruelty.

To her, my blowing up and raging was cruel. She was 95. I SCARED her by yelling and storming. She had no defense to this. She was in her 90s. I believe one doesn't emotionally abuse the very old, even in the name of sticking up for oneself. And it must have been an experience of horror for her.

I do not feel good about scaring a person so old who had done her best for me. No matter who she was.

But I do and I mean this truly, also I truly do forgive myself. I understand how I'd been pushed past my limit when she threatened me with the arrival of my brother that night...how manipulative and wrong it was for her to do that. I was furious and rightly so. And I was terrified, because he was a monster to me.

It was a lifetime of fury and fear. Still, my anger wasn't purely righteous. In that moment it was, but my motives with her were not always perfectly Florence Nightingale. I am responsible.

But as I found forgiveness and compassion for her, helpless in her wheelchair and frailty at the hard hard end of her life 14 months after a stroke...I have found it for myself too.

It was when the blaming stopped. I think it can only stop when one is safe, when one has support and love in one's life, and community, and compassion for yourself. Then you can see an N is probably a damaged child, and feel sorrow for them. But in many cases, still, you may need NC forever. And just work through that forgiveness cycle alone if that's what you find you want to do.

It doesn't require subjecting yourself to harm. Ever.

And sometimes it isn't time to forgive the N yet. And sometimes probably never, I'm no judge of when that shift takes place. We all have a right to our own path.

We have to forgive ourselves. I just know it. Otherwise, life is a waste. And I guess if I believe in forgiveness as a principle, I believe it's probably good for it to go beyond myself. I haven't forgiven my brother yet. Dunno when that will happen. But I'm not regretting that. I'm in the position I need to be until he is completely out of my life.

We weren't strong enough to fight back all along the way, our instincts were overpowered by many forces (the Ns and the culture and more). And sometimes, people just freaking snap. I did.

So...the healing first had to be forgiveness of myself. With her, it just came about because I took care of her. I saw her body. I watched her lose her health, a breast at 95, eventually her mind, her ability to walk, her personal dignity, and then, her life. So...after witnessing it, I couldn't stay mad. I'm generally not wired to.

Then my attention turned to healing myself. I had already begun...and forgiveness of myself, compassion for myself, was the part I was missing. I've learned it. Many many many people and processes helped.

There's enough love in the universe for all of that to happen.

I'm sorry you're hurting, Bear. I understand why. You will heal, hon. Be on your own side. Be kind to the Bear in the mirror. You didn't mean to lose control. You had been hurt too much for too long and it all came out at once.

love,
Hops

[bearwithme]

I'm a little embarassed and regretful I didn't speak up more.  I just found it was exhausting and distracting to stick up for myself, so I let too much roll off my back. 

Me too.  I wished I had the tools to do this earlier in life.  To assert myself against the bully in our house.  I just feel so late in doing this.  Well, so be it.  It had to come at a time when I was mature enough to do it I guess.  Thanks Swimmer.  You have great input for me and we share so many similar experiences.

We have to forgive ourselves. I just know it. Otherwise, life is a waste. And I guess if I believe in forgiveness as a principle, I believe it's probably good for it to go beyond myself. I haven't forgiven my brother yet. Dunno when that will happen. But I'm not regretting that. I'm in the position I need to be until he is completely out of my life.

We weren't strong enough to fight back all along the way, our instincts were overpowered by many forces (the Ns and the culture and more). And sometimes, people just freaking snap. I did.

So...the healing first had to be forgiveness of myself. With her, it just came about because I took care of her. I saw her body. I watched her lose her health, a breast at 95, eventually her mind, her ability to walk, her personal dignity, and then, her life. So...after witnessing it, I couldn't stay mad. I'm generally not wired to.

Then my attention turned to healing myself. I had already begun...and forgiveness of myself, compassion for myself, was the part I was missing. I've learned it. Many many many people and processes helped.

There's enough love in the universe for all of that to happen.

Your journey to heal seems so right for you and it happened the way that it did for you to pay attention to yourself, this I see, how you forgave yourself yet have regrets that don't immobilize who you are.  Wow.  I appreciate you wisdom and hope that I can forgive myself and heal.

I just want everything to be over and for it to all go away so fast but I know that this is a process and a journey to a happier place.

thank you for helping me.

Bear 

[seastorm]

Dear Beawithme,

Ten days with your mother sounds like an eternity. You must have felt very strong to attempt that. This shows a lot of goodwill on your part, given the history.

Your mom wanted to make you WRONG. There was no way to please her. Mine had a way of pressing every button I had and poking me with the psychic equivalents of red hot pokers and then she would be aghast when I went ballistic. Come to think of it if you look back and imagine her face and demeanor, she had a faint smile on her lips and an implacable look overall.  That is the dance these crazy moms do. Get you going and then say in a little girl voice," I didnt do anythiing and why is she being such a big meany and bullying me and yelling and screaming and tearing out her hair?  This is such a racket.

You described how she then went on to slander you and tell people you are insane, unstable and to even threaten you with god knows what because you put your hands on her. She put you through the blender. Thoroughly. And to top it off, she is your mother so you crossed no man's land with her and ended up feeling about three years old and a really bad girl.
Your mom deserves a flogging or something.

One good thing about it is that you can just imagine what you felt like as a little kid with no resources, experience, education or maturity to deal with this kind of person.  This is what she did then.  She can still get you there. And she has no conscience or insight about it.

I really feel sorry for you. You dont deserve this.  No need to apologize.  None. Finally you felt the fires of hell well up in you and you acted out.  It was time to say ," Back off Buster!!!!!!" and you did. You must be a lot healthier now if you can stand up for yourself, even if you did go a bit opera. 

Seems to me that you stood up for yourself and that is great. You got to see the movie as an adult. You explain it clearly and rationally. You take responsibility for your part. I hope you give that little girl in you a lot of love and validate her for surviving around such a mother.

Sea storm

[bearwithme]

Seastorm wrote:

if you look back and imagine her face and demeanor, she had a faint smile on her lips and an implacable look overall

You got it!  Whoa. I am so not alone in this world.  Thank God.  Yes, the smirk.  The smile.  My husband was ultimately disturbed by this as when I left and she was in his face, he said, "Bear, I was a bit nervous for the first time because I sensed that she got enjoyment out of what had just happened."

Seastorm, thank you for your input and cheering me on.  I realize now what you and everybody has said that 10 days is too long.  I just want to be "healthy" and happy like everyone talks about here and that long of a time with NM is just unreasonable.  What was I thinking?  I wanted her to stay so that my and my husband could go out a few times at our leisure.  NOT WORTH IT!!  (sorry hubby:(

Bear.

[seastorm]

Thanks for sharing your experience. It helped me see it again and remember not to forget why I stayed away. I could never stand it without turning into raging volcano. It made me hate myself to be like that, and if you asked me what exactly she was doing I could not explain it very coherently, if at all.  Hearing you explain it let me see it again through adult eyes. To be objective, detached.

This is one unhealthy puppy you have for a mother. I really hope you are coming down from the oozie attack. You are not a bad person. You offered her a welcome into your home. If my daughter invited me for ten days I would be tapdancing with happiness and on my very best behaviour so that I could enhance her life, her family and our relationship.  If I ended up creating complete havoc I sure would not feel good about it and blame her.  It just isn't rational.

I really send  blessings to you.  It hurts not to get your mom's blessing. But she is incapable of it.


Love,
Sea storm