Hobug

[Hopalong]

That is so wonderful, Amber.

She gave that back to you too -- the goodness of a caring ritual, done in true spirit.

I'm so glad.

love to you,

Hops

[sKePTiKal]

Thanks!

[towrite]

I used to love Christmas. I'm a giver and I was never happier than when I could give gifts to people I cared about. Buying the gifts and cooking for them. After many years, I experienced a shift. I got almost nothing back. I think I expected them to love me more or give me approval b/c of my gifts. But nothing happened. The emptiness and disappointment I felt finally got to be too much. I was giving and giving, hoping to get back, and when that didn't happen, I felt that big hole inside of me acutely. So I have stopped.

Unlike you, Hops, I do have 2 family members left, but it feels like none. My dad is gone, my middle brother is gone, just my NM and baby brother left, but there is no sense of belonging. So it feels like I am alone. Of my 2 good friends, whom I usually give to, one has sworn off Christmas giving and the other is too poor to give anything except friendship. I always believed in, cherished, fought for the sense of family. But I did that alone. So now, I have to accept my aloneness and the dogs and I will be alright, have a good Christmas meal, and sit by the fire. And wait for Jan. 2.

[Hopalong]

(to PR...and everybody)
--------------
Maybe you could use some mental PHamily, especially this year, hon.

If I were in your shoes holiday slippers, I'm sure the contrast would be painful. Your having just lost a loving, life-full and delightful non-bio elder on the one hand vs. bio-Sad Sack and his bioNic* Mum.

*BioNic.  Wish I could patent it for its multi-functioning, but I'll settle for a short WDC (Word Dedication Ceremony), to wit:

Ahemm. Harrrumphh. Ting-ting!

"Thank you for coming. We appreciate your attendance at these outdoor ceremonies on a cold winter's day. After your aptly-named iceberg lettuce has finished freezing under the dried bits of ch, no, car, no, ch, bits of either shredded cheddar or carrot, depending on what you ordered and the proximity of your plate to the large magnifying glass that is being passed from table to table to aid in the defrosting of the lunches through the vehicle of concentrated beams of sunlight, I would like to take just a very brief moment to remind you why we are gathered here. It is not the nation's VES' highest nor its only honor, but it is one I persoNally, being your most Humble Hops the Honorable Host and Might I Add, Inveterate Speech-Giver who, Modestly, Just Loves the Sound of My Own a well-turned phrase, or perhaps, if I might put it another way, and drag out my intr, given my remarkable skills at spinnnnnnnning graNdeur into even the sm-- rather, Who Vastly Respects the Prodigious Insight and Outputs, respectively, of our dear Member who is Honored Here Today, and particularly by my Humble Introduction.

On this day of the 12th of December in the year of Our Lord (or perhaps not all Our Lord, but whatever Lord suits for filling in the blanks and infusing this sparkling assemblage with a sufficient sense of awestruck importance) and among the assemblage of important personages gathered here, or at least they are very important to Your Humble Host, Ms. Hopalong, or perhaps they have simply felt called to witness out of their dear and well-placed loyalty to Myself, and for which I, Hopalong, most humbly thank and acknowledge them for their perspicacity, sagacity, alacrity, and splenectomy, but then, my own accomplishments, considerable though they might be, are not the purpose of this gathering....errr, what was my purpose? Oh, yes! Beg your pardon.

Ting!-ting!-ting! Ladies, Gentlemen! Errrr, Mud-things! I have not finished my remarks. Please, may I have your atteNNNNNNtion! Ting!-ting! Ahem! I suppose I may have to turn up the microphone, there could be a probl ... oh? No need? Why, thank you for your applause. That is very kind. My goodness, I was never expect... Why, I am quite overcome. Look, how very long this ovation is. Good Lord, this isn't all about ME, oh heavens, I simply can't express how undeserv--. Really, you're all stand--  Hello? Hello? Is this thing on? Oh, good. Now, Ladies, Gentlemen, it is my great hon-- SIDDOWN! Security! Nobody gets out of the square until I'm finished!

Yes, as I was saying, my brief remarks, this simple introduction of our event, have been my great honor to perform...and now I shall make the presentation, just as soon as the fleet of jets have completed the formation overh---
RUMMMMBLE RUMMMBLE BLASSSTTT ROARRRRRRR THUNNNNNNNDER SWOOOOOOP

My.
Those flyboys are just so fond of me.
They simply insisted...

And now to our purpose. Stand up, PR. Right by me, yes...no, don't get between me and the microphone. Fine, nice, yes. Thanks. You just stand there, I'm still talking.

Ting! Ting!
The alternate spelling and type treatment of the term "bioNic" is hereby dedicated to Ms. P. R., aka Amber, aka The Artist Formerly Known as Twiggy, aka "hon". This public ceremony is conducted in honor of Ms. PR-A-TAFKAT-h because of her energetic, committed, generous, and unflaggingly inspiring contributions to the members of the VESMB, all of whom are likewise offered the new "bioNic" to take home--

Everybody! Look under your chairs! Everybody gets a "bioNic"!

Now, stop squealing and jumping up and down. Everyone must remain in their places. Where is your dignity? PR, don't drop your plaque.

Yes, yes, I suppose you can make a comment, if you want. Make it snappy, I have closing remarks...

[Gaining Strength]

And wait for Jan. 2

Yes, I understand.

[sKePTiKal]

uh........ OH! OW! (you're standing on my foot!!)

uh - thank you. (ahem... cough - cough... damn cigarettes!)

Long live "bioNic"... uh, maybe not... but long live the usage!


Hops et al - I've been protesting for a while that "I'm OK - really". And it's been more or less true, each day. OK - some days, a lot less. I found myself at the hairdressers to buy more goop for my hair - and absolutely no wallets; no cash; no cards. I'm so anal, I NEVER do that.

Then I see my "other" SIL - married to BIL - at the service last weekend and we both lose it and block traffic - babbling a mile a minute... BUT

I feel bouncy, and funny and happy and... oops! I just got flowers again!....

but I will gladly endorse the term "bioNic" for ongoing usage in place of FOO - which only recommends itself from the old joke: if FOO sh#%&s... wear it.

OH - and if anyone's doubting the value of PHamily... I'm hear to tell ya, those are the folks responsible for the fact that I'm still babbling & typing away.... !!!!! I started building PHamily.... oh, about 1970... to replace the moron bioNics.

And I really really like this word, Hops...more later - life calls, AGAIN...

[sKePTiKal]

thanks a bunch hops - more than I can say right now.

[Hopalong]

PR, you're totally welcome, hon, and I was really just amusing myself...humor's one of those things that often flops in translation, but I had a fuNNy fantasy anyway!

"bioNic", in my mind, is an adjective, meaning (when fitting), "biological and narcissistic".

So, a bioNic mother is indeed someone's mother, but also a person greatly afflicted by NPD/narcissism, which renders people mechanistic in their emotional lives and ways of relating, as though they came with bionic pumps where others have more vulnerable (and interesting) hearts.

Could be a non-related person, too, such as a bioNic spouse or acquaintance.

I do love words.
xo
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

It's a reaaaal good word for it, too!

I smell Barbie doll plastic, see the metal rods & gears inside... and I know it's going to feel cold and hard; not like a real human at all.

[Hopalong]

A Hobug thing...

Gennulman, who along with his sister was an absolute ROCK for me during the terrible 2 years of battle with my brother...is triggering guilt and frustration and I want to handle this honorably and without Nishness. Advice welcome.

For two Christmases, feeling utterly lost, I accepted every invitation from them. For 2 Tgivings, I spent the meal with them (also taking my dear old--95--friend, whom they were delighted to meet, to a large group evening). It was nice. But also a little odd (his sister had a lot of "power" over me until the legal settlement was solved and she is a very forceful person, so it was difficult sometimes). For two Christmases, while he house-sat for his sister (amazing place) -- he invited me to join him there for a peaceful Mas afternoon drawing and listening to music, which at that time, was utterly perfect. I really did enjoy it. I just don't want to continue it.

This year, after the emotional tumult of the year with my D (who does not do anything about holidays, which is more painful than usual because of her behavior this year, but is generally something I've made my peace with) -- I made a proactive decision NOT to make plans for the holidays. Or, to be free to do exactly something I want to do that day (like SPCA dogwalks) or nothing at all, or accept another invitation if one appears. And privately, particularly not to spend them with Gennulman and his sister's family. They have a kind of engulfing nature that I am feeling uncomfortable about, and I just had the sudden feeling that if I didn't put on the brakes, I'd be expected to be their Tgiving stray and his Xmas comfort for the rest of my life. I could sense his growing expectation of me doing these events with him/them months beforehand and I just had a very strong desire to set a boundary around it.

So I did. And courteously. I told him well ahead of time, when he passed on the invite for Tgiving, thank you very much, I appreciate being invited but won't be joining you this year. He sent me an email that started friendly but ended with a snarky criticism about my "retreating into a fetal position". Pissed me off, as I had politely declined. And I know HE wants me to be merged into his life and family in a closer or, more importantly, more codependent way than I feel comfortable with (though I absolutely benefitted from his eagerness to be enmeshed for two years, and so I feel guilty now that I'm trying to pull back).

I finally wrote him a very firm email telling him that holidays were hard enough and I hadn't appreciated the snark, and that I really mean what I say -- I do not want to discuss my feelings about them this year or make any plans.

Last night he invited me to come (if one gambit doesn't work...) for Christmas Eve. I said No (I had called to ask about his back pain, offer to help with a new bed I could get him through some contacts and he just slipped in that invite at the end of the conversation). Anyway, the exact same thing happened. It feels juvenile. He emails me later: I don't understand why you reject spending any time with your FRIENDS. Or maybe I am not one...

It really makes me angry and I think it's a huge boundary problem on both our parts. He "has none" (his own words) and I am setting a very rigid one and feel very guarded and prickly about it. Both of these things are unhealthy. But I feel so invaded by his expectations, and them am very triggered into guilt by his complaints. I get angry at the little "friend tests". This has come up with us over and over. When I am not spending time with him (even though I call and email) he goes through these times of wanting MORE TIME with me (I work full time and freelance, he is unemployed except for occasional work) -- and when he doesn't get it, I get these petulant emails about being a bad friend.

It really triggers me and also makes me recoil. I should probably just back away from this relationship and realize we can't sustain it. On the other hand, he is 90% of the time a wonderful person and I will miss him. So I don't know how to manage it well. He's not going to catch on, I don't think. And we are in the same church community.

Anyway, I left him a voicemail last night saying that I felt we were not doing well in the boundary department, that I had set a clear boundary about the holidays and he was not respecting it, and that I have shown my friendship for him in ways I can and that I am sorry it doesn't satisfy him. I specifically told him I didn't want to receive any more confrontational emails about failing "friend tests".

I think that's probably as clear as I can be with him, but the reason I'm writing here is that every time it comes up, the whole exchange "hooks" me, agitates and upsets me. So I can tell I am not "cured" of the boundary issues. That whole thing of being able to create boundaries that defend one's serenity and peace without any shame or any sense of having to justify them that I described her about a week ago, I think on Deb's thread?

Jeez. I need to do better at it myself. I'll say, I have no trouble TELLING him a boundary, but I do have difficulty not getting upset when he TESTS the boundary. IOW, I feel quite angry when he keeps sort of obsessively returning to it. Part of it is not his fault--something about his wiring means that he is genuinely upset when anything changes. He does NOT like it when a friend or a family member retreats or isn't as close as they were. So he's uncomfortable with ebbs and flows.

I could have more sympathy, except that he retreats into a sort of passive-aggressive position from which he fires snarky little criticisms about being a "real friend" that make me feel guilty (what if i AM an N? Maybe I AM a horrible selfish person?). And that triggers my own boundary/identity fears and I react by withdrawing even further.

My only 3-D friend who totally gets N issues has a simple response: "You just want to not have unhealthy people in your life." Hell, if that were true, I'd never see anybody. But I know what she means--she's particularly sensitive to boundary invasions (her bioNic mother made mine look healthy).

But I hate jettisoning Gennulman. Same time, with the alcoholism, the unreliability (when he's hired for handyman stuff) and the cycle of periodic passive-aggressive snark-remarks...the friendship does feel brittle now. And maybe it has to be over.

I find that sad and disappointing and wish it were otherwise. But I don't see us making any progress and I don't want to be preoccupied with these dramas with him.

Same time, I've been very isolated and he's been a rock. I support him as well, always interested in his wellbeing. Just not willing to be his "default companion" because something about that is despairing.

I think the cure will eventually be to start dating again, and find some hopes for a new relationship in the new year. Perhaps the fact that at one point we seemed to be heading toward romance, and then I veered away when I really faced his drinking issue...means that our transition into "just friends" was foolish. I do remain friends with a few other men with whom it was once something more, but perhaps this is just not a transition that Gennulman can be peaceful about.

He did tell me once that the last woman he was romantically involved with got to a place where she simply wouldn't have anythingn to do with him. I asked why and he said, "It was because I wouldn't leave."

Something underneath that, I can relate to. It's like, feeling he's obsessive (not in an abusive way, just a kind of OCD way) and no matter what you tell him, his reality is one way, and he clutches.

Any thoughts welcome, this is a disjointed ramble. Thanks for your patience!

love,
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

Hops, I don't think you have to justify giving yourself what you need - especially at the holidays; especially as difficult as your year has been. If he keeps pressing - tell him it's your Christmas present to yourself; you're not withdrawing - you're taking a break; and you need to think about "what's next" for you.

His return to the topic after you've said - no change; it's the way I said it was - is a way to make it about him, I think. So to friend tests - I'd reply that a friend would be able to give you the space you need to regroup. But you know me! It doesn't take much for me to grab my shield & sword...

As for dealing with yourself and the feelings that have been triggered - seems you're doing OK with that. You recognized it... and while the feelings are still there they are probably a lot less intense than what you've been through in the past, right? Although, if you're as tired as I think you are... those feelings might get temporarily magnified; I know myself when tired - it's like my "throttle" gets stuck open... and it all hits me at 90 miles an hour.

The "what's next" for Hops is a pretty big step. Lots of things will change... and maybe in new unexpected ways. Taking a "time out" for you, makes absolute sense to me!

[CB123]

Hi Hops!

I dont know if this is healthy or not,  but I really dont get into these kinds of powerplays with people that I GENUINELY like and value because I have learned to not tell the truth.  I am amazed and a little uncomfortable with this stance (I have always been scrupulously honest, but I dont think it has served me well all the time).  But, in your position, I would have probably said: "I have so enjoyed the last few years and if I could, I would be two places at once.  But I have made other plans for this year, so I wont be able to be with you."

Yes, he will probably press, but I would probably be vague about exactly what I was doing except that I would make it a "done deal".  Then I could listen to his complaining and snarkiness and act almost sympathetic because we werent going to be together.  Because I ALREADY HAD PLANS.

Its difficult for most people to understand that you would rather be ALONE than be with them.  And, really, that probably does look like a heavy rejection--very very few people CHOOSE to be alone for Christmas.  I understand perfectly why you want to do it, and I dont see any reason why you shouldnt.  But I can also see why, if these are good friends, why they dont "get it".  Thus the attitude I would strive to get across is regret that I couldnt be two places at the same time.

I dont know if you can backtrack and do that?  Or if it is already done.  Or if, perhaps, this has been both an opportunity to be alone but also a test as to how deep this friendship is--can it survive your own special Hops-ness that requires understanding in this area?  Maybe that's what else you need this year at Christmas.

At any rate, I dont think you need to break off the friendship.  At the worst, if the snarkies start, just excuse yourself because you have a cake burning in the oven.  After you have done that several times, he may have had time to deal with his feelings.  I think he is as trapped in his feelings as he is trying to make you be.  Sounds like HUGE abandonment issues.

Love you
CB

[Hopalong]

Thank you so much, PR and CB...you both said things that were very valuable and insightful for me and triggered progress in my thinking.

I went to see a couple I'm close to this evening. I adore these folks, and being around them was reinforcing of my instincts to take up sword and shield to defend my boundaries with Gennulman. They both know him and were pretty adamant that I am withdrawing from something unhealthy. She views his alcoholic cycles and codependency as something I can't fix/change, and he says I didn't do anything wrong by making my own choice for how I want to pass Christmas and secondly, that a healty friend would not force guilt and accusation into a space that I already feel fragile/protective about.

We just had a joyful evening talking about everything from families to religion to politics to Christmas to their neighbors and childhoods -- we just range everywhere with great delight and comfort and affection. I realized, in contrast, there's something repressive and restricted with Gennulman, because he is so needy and covertly demanding and because I can lapse into voicehoggery and entitlement with him--that I don't have that kind of feeling of discovery and growth enjoyment with him.

When I leave them I feel like a better version of myself. When I leave him, I feel drained and don't like myself much. I am not feeling respectful of him and I don't like that. I think it's because we're not well suited to being close or intimate in a sustained way, and my boundaries are rigid and, as he says, his are nonexistent.

CB, I do know what you mean about sometimes recognizing the larger wisdom of falsifying a bit, for decorum and comfort's sake (perhaps it's really just your wise understanding that often grace needs to be beyond literal--bigger than that). That is EXACTLY true about my current relationship with my D. In order to maintain it and give it space and time to become better, because loving and staying ready for her that is a near-absolute value for me, I will suppress all sorts of present truths. (I do know we need in any relationship, even a non-critical one, to offer each other shelter from starkness and forgiveness of failings so we continually see each others' best selves--just...compassion.)

But I've also been a champ at denial in my past, and in staying in eutrophic relationships when i shouldn't. With Gennulman, especially just now after being with friends with whom there is such ease and acceptance/respect...I am not feeling that this is what's being asked. I think my not being very direct with him feeds a kind of disrespect that continues to cycle to the surface with boundary invasions and passive-aggressive jabs that are not only unpleasant but not healthy to tolerate. (I could make all the "gee, what a shame, I'm already busy" kinds of feints but that would to nothing to stop his jabs. There's a healing part of me that is just saying, No. I do not have to submit to this in order to have a good friend. There are more friends in the world for me.

I think the brutal truth is that I was needy and fearful and quite dependent during the 2 years of legal nightmare with my brother, Gennulman was new in town and feeling very needy to be needed after ending his period of homelessness (the first night we spoke he spontaneously said of himself, "I am a raging codependent") and I benefited enormously from the collision of his codependence with my need for support. As did he, honestly...as I did a loy to give him confidence and support as he was trying to become integrated into the church community and likewise, support his own family in some things they were going through. But the dynamic (particularly my dependence on--and some fear of--his dominating sister) also fed off weaknesses in each of us and created a pattern that is not sustainable for a healthy friendship. I think if I keep up fictions with him, it will be a draining and unhappy relationship.

I'm getting selfish enough, and my energy and time are both so limited...that I just don't want to make that kind of commitment. To "maintain the space" (even with white lies) for my child is worth enduring the guardedness and watchfulness that it is taking, to see where we evolve to.

With Gennulman, though I will do want to continue to cherish him as a member of my "beloved community" and always be grateful for his support...I can't keep this act up. I don't want to. I'm finding it exhausting to go through repeated spats over his wanting more than I can give if I'm going to thrive. So for that reason, I want to say NO, rather than make up stories to avoid it.

(I am glad you posited what you did, CB, because my response to it really surprised me!)

I think he's beginning an old spiral of spending his evenings in bars, has abandoned all dreams of becoming regularly employed (and he's younger than I) or self-sufficient, and his passive attitudes about his health or any goals -- plus the active alcoholism -- are just not things I want to keep grappling with. As we were first getting to know each other, my old pattern reared of thinking loving a person -- as an external source -- can get them to love and change themselves. I don't believe that any more. I'll continue to love him in the agape way. With compassion but hopefully, without caretaking.

But this time he pushed once too hard, and the passive-aggressive snark really sets me off. If it were once or twice, sure. But it's been half a dozen times and I think since our path swerved away from a romantic commitment, despite his insistence that he was just fine adapting...he has never been able to respect my choice. His resentment is always lurking. And truthfully, I'm sick of it.

Tonight I was telling my couple friends that I feel guilt because I DID benefit so much from Gennulman's involvement in my life and how I now feel the need to pull away and particularly don't want to be ungulfed by his family, which feels toxic. My friend's hubby (well he's also my friend) said I should not have to "sell my soul" to "pay back" a kindness, and that if it really was a gift of friendship there would not be a series of ongoing demands in "payment".

Thank you both again. I needed your counsel and reaction and I really appreciate it a lot.

lots of love,
Hops

[lighter]

Hops, what a benefit Gennulman's friendship has been for you.

Even the upsetting snarky stuff has brought insights and perspective.

It's OK to love Gennulman from a distance, or move beyond that friendship.

It's OK to love him the way you need to love him, even though he's unhappy and causing discomfort.

He's where he needs to be, and you're where you need to be..... though it feels alien and strange to say "No", and mean it.

It's OK.

I'm so glad you have RL friends who validate your feelings and provide healthy fellowship.

Your evening with the couple sounded lovely.

Lighter

[CB123]

Hops,

That was perfect.  Someone else to talk you through the maze of the friendship--people who know you both. That's just perfect.

I think these kinds of things happen all the time.  I think that codependent people can often make the best comforters when there's a need, but we struggle to give up that role when it is no longer needed.  I am so codependent...I will admit it.  I understand you both.

I am immensely grateful once again to this board for a place to spill out what is troubling us and get encouragement to examine it all and come up with our own best solutions.

Love
CB