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New thread for flirting, opposite sex relationship stuff

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sKePTiKal:
Thx, FW... that's pretty close to what I was thinking too. But I notice that this is done usually right in front of said husband... with the "out" that wifey is just teasing... don't take it seriously, etc. It just feels mean, like trying to one-up hubby's ego or put him down... for the sole reason of being considered "one of the girls" and "witty" (or snarky)... I think I'm finding a way through this; each situation is a bit different.

I don't like to pounce on hubby like that (in the name of "playing") because he does have his insecure side; his inferiority (in comparison) issues... when in truth, he's a very sensitive, sweet, and very smart person. It's precisely because he doesn't have the huge, outsized, "see what I've achieved" male ego... that I like him, too. Most women do. But I think I see the dirty laundry behind this social game... it's that the women (for the most part) haven't had their own careers; they've not competed with men on that level. So this is a mean-spirited way to "level the current playing field". And it would seriously backfire in real-world competition in the workplace.

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NLS:

try to keep the personal stuff separate from the cultural pressures, in how you think about this topic: guys & marriage. Your mom is used to them being one and the same; and accepting this as "the way things are". They are NOT.

And whether your mom wants to admit it or not, the trend in marriage statistics - especially in your generation - among white society is improving. My guess is, that even in India... the tradition of arranged marriages is giving way to modern life also. She is clinging to this one aspect... as if it's the sum total of your cultural identity. It is not. The culture can and will survive and change and adapt and grow... without arranged marriages.

However: that's an important cultural norm for your mom; a part of her self-identity and your breaking with that tradition is going to be tough on both of you. Years ago, I went through something similar - breaking with another strong cultural identity. Ironic isn't it? The word "cult" comes from culture... and one has negative connotations and the other positive.

I keep coming back to the fact - culturally and personally - that you and only you have control over that boundary; of whom you choose to be in a relationship with. That is your right as a woman in this current world we live in. I wouldn't be too eager to give that right up, just to keep mom happy, you know? It is possible to keep one's cultural heritage and identity intact, even if one doesn't subscribe to individual pieces of it.

sKePTiKal:
So, today... I'm thinking I kinda understand those women who essentially are saying: Take my hubby, PLEASE! I'm also reminded of the reports of Japanese women committing suicide after their husbands retire ...

Despite the fact, that hubs and I are together almost constantly 24/7... from the time I wake up till the time my lights go out at night... if I go somewhere to do something alone - he "gets lonely" and comes & tracks me down. He won't eat unless I do. He claims to not be able to "do" anything on his own without my assistance. If I'm here writing too long... he whines. Like a child tugging at my skirts - mommy, mommy!

Our constant struggle is over his ability to do tasks, solo - whether it's sorting and recycling his magazines, washing dishes... organizing his workspace and files, even his garage. Yet the man was very competent in his work life. And quite social, as well. And he doesn't seem to understand my need to go do things all by myself, either. This doesn't bode well for starting to do creative work again, does it? I had one of my famous "meltdowns" yesterday, because I was trying to clean up, visualize further decorating ideas, put away our creative, christmas-y mess... so that I could wrap presents. I tend to "flit" as he says, from one type of task to another if it's in my direct path. Progressively accomplishing a totality of clean, in the space. Every step I took - he was in front of me. Every move I made, there he was... and of course, he made comments and asked a lot of what are you doing now?? questions and worst of all: I was trying to work and he just stood there watching me. This is his definition of "helping".

aaaaaarrrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhh!!!

We have talked about this for 10 years. I have explained that I need time alone. With other people. Without him. That it drives me up a wall to have someone stand around and watch me work - when there are things that he could be doing. And that I resent being made responsible for cleaning up his messes... and that I can't take care of everything around the house all by myself - I need his active participation... but not in the way he likes to do this: telling me what I'm doing wrong and then inserting himself into the process, so that once again the divide and conquer strategy is sabotaged.

When he's working - he does want me to stand there and pat him on the back and make suggestions. He needs his gold stars and hubby points. The minute I turn my attention to something productive -- he stops; it's as if he needs an audience to perform. And then he's interrupting what I'm doing....

On the one hand, I feel like he absolutely doesn't understand the need to be alone that I have; why I enjoy it... and I completely don't understand his need for my attention, every waking minute of his existence either. How on earth did he put in those long hours at work without me???  I'm not buying the "I love you more" line either. It's almost as if he doesn't trust the strength of the relationship enough, for each of us to have our own individual lives within it. SIGH............. I keep telling him that was one of the other wives; not me.

[/vent]

Guest:
PR!!!


--- Quote ---aaaaaarrrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhh!!!
--- End quote ---

How about subscribing him to a riveting online forum for his fave subject?

I don't know how you cope, I really don't!

The problem we have is: who's turn is it on the pc???? Two pcs would solve the problem but hey, we'd start sending each other chat messages from across the room...

Hopalong:
NLAS, I am sorry you feel so despairing.
You need to befriend YOU, the person who is neither daughter nor mate.

It's your recognition of a SELF that needs your love, your energy and thought...not your slave self who is bullied by mother and tormented by anxiety over a present or absent or potential mate. The real and whole person inside you, whom you have rejected.

This doesn't mean you will be alone forever. You are young! I know people who married in their 40s...even a couple in their 50s.

It means until you can befriend being with yourself, no companion or label or status will fix these feelings.

I feel for you. Please don't give up.
But tackle the issue of recognizing and healing and befriending yourself, hopefully with a brilliant wise therapist.

The other people in your life aren't up to the challenge, and I believe can't help you with this deep identity healing.
You can still turn to them for connection, but don't look to your mother or any mate for this ultimate answer, the actual recognition that you really are a person. Not a label, or a role.

My wish for you is that you will assert this over and over, not just in defiance, but in experiencing love of yourself.

YOU can help yourself, with a therapist ally.

love,
Hops

sKePTiKal:
OH, FW... we don't lack for multiple pcs... his currently resides in the "office" which is conveniently located for me, as my studio space. I'm making one last effort to convince him the space has to be at least accomodating for that activity... or I'm moving it to the pool house!!!!!!!! At least it's a big house - and we can separate that way. PROBLEM is that he will always track me down... saying "I couldn't find you"... with his sad-dog look.

What he doesn't realize yet - despite setting it off multiple times already - is that in my unconscious vernacular, he is asking me to kick him. And I hate myself when I kick him. Dammit. This stuff doesn't even feel important enough for me to vent about it, but if I don't... yaaaah! crazy lady time. What a weird dance to do... like two over-stuffed turkeys fighting over a pile of grain... ACK!! to quote Bill the Cat.

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