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Optimism and the truth

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teartracks:



--- Quote ---Who would you want to help you in a dangerous situation, a "born optimist" or a realist?
--- End quote ---

Bofem! :lol:

tt



 

sKePTiKal:
Optimist (well, sometimes - I can be in an equally pessimistic mood) checking in...

Where the actual probability of a bad thing happening is higher than the person guessed - and they still don't adjust the belief in the likelihood of this happening to them, personally -- I think this "glitch" is due to the ability some people have of believing "that won't happen to me". Sort of a hold-over from the adolescent belief in invincability/risk-taking. A belief that one is the exception to the rule (or really, really "special").

Now, what I'd like to see - though I don't think I could design the experiment/study - is a measure of how that turned out for the same group of people, over time. How many had their cars stolen? How many didn't? Because then, the next study could also look at how the initial optimism - and sheer luck - reinforced the uncorrect belief of being an exception to the statistics. Or not. Would people change or moderate their scores on a scale of total optimism to total pessimism?

But let's say one scored heavily toward the pessimistic side. What is the change in belief (and overall attitude, over time) with the statistical evidence that (some) bad things really happen less often than one believes? The parts of our brains that mis-recognizes a stick for a snake, will stand down from the adrenalin rush this time... but WON'T ignore other sticks, in other situations that are snaky suspects. That association and response pattern remains. It's the bio-survival instinct... would we say that's more realistic? can it even be qualified as either optimistic or pessimistic?

So, nature vs nurture... I think it would be really hard to separate out the "nature" tendencies, because of how much impact repetition, intense emotional experience, education and prevailing social attitudes - that comes from the whole category defined as nurture - has on a person. I would propose that life experiences could actually turn a "natural" optimist into a raving pessimist... so in the lovely, perfect world of theory... it should be possible to change a pessimist into an optimist. But I believe I've read recently that there isn't any really good reason - no return on investment - for trying to change from one to the other. That optimists aren't really what we'd call "happier" or more content than pessimists. That generalization, probably applies only to the people in the middle of the range... while people at one extreme or the other, my guess, would be both be equally unhappy.

The optimist because life doesn't live up to those extremely high expectations. But the extreme optimist doesn't let go of the expectation after disappointment; the perception that all those happy things will eventually "come to pass" lives on, altered perhaps... but it's still there. Rationalization and self-soothing would be this optimist's best tools.

The pessimist would be equally unhappy, because of the PERCEPTION of being surrounded by affirmations, that life sucks. That stick-snake connection would keep someone jumpy too, wouldn't it? (Altho' they might actually experience a perverse satisfaction that - YEP; they were right this time.) And yes, an extreme pessimist can make even birthday cake seem like an evil plot... something life threatening, too.

Much as neuroscience and the ability to now track activity in the brain intrigues me, I still agree with tt that there is much about life and humans that's unknowable with any real certainty. And like FW, I'd much prefer to rely on someone who's more realistic about the risks involved in an undertaking, than someone who's too preternaturally optimistic.... as long as that risk assessment didn't simply paralyze me and set up additional obstacles to really living life. The mythical "middle way", in other words... which is almost never exactly in the middle... it wanders... just like me!  LOL...

sKePTiKal:
'morning FW!

That "warning" has kept me from saying exactly the same thing as the person who posted seconds before I did. Most of the time, someone else says it better than I do anyway. My pedantic side or creative side can get carried away so that I either bore someone to death or confuse them!!

And during the times when posting is fast & furious - sometimes literally furious as people are disagreeing vehemently - this warning has also helped me keep up with the direction a thread is taking... and avoid making a situation even worse or fanning the flames.

I do find it fascinating to try to figure out how the computer & software chooses which post to display - and which to send the great maw of cybervoid - when two people post simultaneously. Most of the time this happens to me, I think it's a good thing! I've just been babbling on about things of no great import.

This warning is more useful than the Windows warning: Are you sure you want to delete this file?

If I hadn't wanted to delete it, I wouldn't have pushed DELETE, you wretched bucket of 1s and 0s...

teartracks:


The nice thing about our examining the impact of pessimism, optimism, and realism on our lives and the lives of others is that it's not a competition.  I'm perfectly happy (optimistic) about the pessimist holding his view.  Truth be known, I'm probably as close to being a realist as I am an optimist.  Maybe I'm an optimistic realist?  

Another thing to consider is what is our interpretation of each.  I bet each of us has a different interpretation/definition in our minds.  For instance, if optimism were strictly defined as 'everything will work out fine', 'don't worry about a thing', then I'm not an optimist.  All I have to do is look a few hundred yards down my street to know that things don't always work out fine, however, that observation doesn't challenge the choice I made to live life with excited expectation.  So in my mind to examine the subject, we'd all have to start from the exact same definitions for it to be anywhere close to accurate.

Optimism to me, for instance, is a choice I've made to live life with excited expectation, that mind frame knows full well that as life for me and others  unfolds, there will be very hard times and very joyful times and everything in between.   I think my outlook would remain the same, if I changed the word optimism to one of my oldest son's made up words that used to crack me up, "dockatunia'.  Call it what you may, my outlook remains the same.  Which may mean that my view is so off track that it's not meaningful to this thread?  Oh my, is that pessimistic?

tt

Hopalong:
I'm just grateful when I realize I've spent a few hours thinking pretty cheerful thoughts.

xxoo

Hops

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