Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: onlyrenting1 on December 23, 2004, 11:17:04 AM
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My N-husband wrote this comment to his friends, I thought it was odd.
Quote >>>"Maybe it is just me but I think OJ & Peterson are innocent , I've been married 26 years & I haven't thought about killing my wife so especially with OJ . No father would leave his kid to wake up & find their mother slaughtered no matter how much they fought "<<<<Quote
WOULD YOU THINK THIS IS A STATEMENT TO VALIDATE HE IS RATIONAL? OR REALLY THINKS ABOUT IT ???
My N-H has never been Violent. OJ, was Scott, never appeared to be.
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I think he's a narcissist who believes that OJ and Scott Peterson share the same views, feelings, and ideas that he has. Everyone is exactly like him, I guess!
How did you see a quote that he wrote to his friends?
bunny
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Thanks for responding.
My husband has a web site and because we share the same dialup connection I can see his chat room replies.
Only the members can see what is being said. He doesn't know I can see this so I check it often to see what is going on. I'm nosey....
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Maybe he thinks he knows the absolute truth about some things (what men will and won’t do, maybe) and he probably can’t imagine that some people aren’t exactly the same as him.
Perhaps he has limited imagination, no empathy and is afraid of entertaining the idea that some people might be brutal killers.
Or he’s being deliberately challenging to whoever he is writing to and doesn’t believe what he’s written at all.
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How do you know that he doesn't know that you are looking at this stuff?
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Because he has made comments how only members can see it. Of course I'm not a member. I know because I'm his wife and he would love to be very upset with me if he knew. But there is always a chance. I just don't believe he knows by other comments I've read.
Bunny, You think he's just a big N and thinks others think like him.
view life as he does.
OK, this is another view of an N I hadn't digested yet.
Maybe he is searching how others view the Idea of killing your wife and how sane he is to think he would never...
Not sure what to think just thought it ODD onlyrenting1
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If he's an N, then he is probably consumed with defending himself, thus tends to mentally associate with the feelings of the accused.
So... I think he was being sincere in saying he could never imagine himself murdering his wife and mother of his children... and thus can't imagine how OJ or anyone else could either.
Honestly, I'd take comfort in it. Not comfort in the fact he's NPD, but in the fact he's stated to a neutral crowd of listeners that he could never imagine doing such a thing.
-Gene
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Quote >>>"Maybe it is just me but I think OJ & Peterson are innocent , I've been married 26 years & I haven't thought about killing my wife so especially with OJ . No father would leave his kid to wake up & find their mother slaughtered no matter how much they fought "<<<<Quote
Hi OnlyRenting,
Honestly, I think it's really hard to try to accurately decipher a deeper meaning in what he said.
At face value, it just sounds like regular chat room banter to me. A lot of people are talking about the Scott Peterson ordeal at this time, and you would find both those who would disagree with what your husband said, and those would would agree.
If we look at it more closley specifically because it is someone with NPD saying this, then I would say that I think N's could either identify with other abusers and thus defend their innocence (as they feel defensive about it personally) like someone already mentioned, or very openly condemn and abhor the behaviors of the others, all the while committing the same and worse, themselves. My xN always talked the moral and emotional high ground, condeming others who violated these things, but did not behave it himself in many ways.
So again, it could go either way, and I'm really not at all certain that you can gage much from just that chat room statement. It is living with him day in and day out, and observing many things that can give you the best idea on his stance about, or possible propensity vs. not toward physical violence, if this is your concern.
BlueTopaz
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BT thanks for your perspective.
I don't expect to get a whole lot of insite on this chit chat.
All of this N-Stuff is still new to me. It's difficult to know somethimes what is truley,Factual, and honestly going on in an N's head.
I heard it mentioned about S.Peterson, being an N. I know it's the Buzz right now and It's likley why he was talking about it.
I just thought it odd.
In my phase of knowledge and observations I'm looking at all the signs big and small.
I would like to think as I digest What an N is and his behaviors I can make a decision to either save this relationship or let it go.
My Husband is also about to come into a lot of money and sometimes I get the feeling he would consider our daughter and myself as a Big anchor. I don't fear him to hurt anyone but again I'm only on alert.
My Love for my husband is being set aside for now until I sort things out.
My Observations are daily and I learn so much from reading the message boards. Most of all I'm learning about myself.
Please keep sharing your thoughts...Thanks
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onlyrenting1,
My Husband is also about to come into a lot of money and sometimes I get the feeling he would consider our daughter and myself as a Big anchor. I don't fear him to hurt anyone but again I'm only on alert.
I might feel uneasy, too (about the OJ/Scott Peterson comment). You've mentioned thoughts about ending the marriage and moving elsewhere. You've also mentioned your N-husband is in poor health and it's one reason you feel obligated to stay in the marriage. Doesn't knowing he'll have financial resources free you up to make decisions in the best interest of you and your daughter? Have you considered that his coming 'into a lot of money' might be one reason you're staying in the marriage?
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Guest
Question: Do you stay because of the hope of money?
This question can be complicated after being together for 26 years you find emotion and family all ties in.
1...After 5 years of little money on his part if I left him, setting up 2 house holds as Divorced people do, is not possible for either of us.
So we stay together to help eachother at this point. (Yes)
2..If money came into the picture he would be able to support himself and set up another house hold on his own. I would feel better knowing our daughter could come visit him in a house rather the homeless shelter.
(YES)
If we move as a family I would have a better job and family to help us emotionaly as well as financialy. I would like to be with family for our daughter and my husband also. We're on our own here.
Sometimes this is important to my husband then he changes his mind.
My Husband may decide not to move because he has N- issuies.
I plan on moving because of family and a better Job.
After his bodycast comes off were planning on moving.
N-Issuies I see are -
1. Not being able to work the job he used to do.
finding substantial work may require his brothers help.
(the ego may not allow this)
2. Being obligated can be difficult for anyone.
My husband may only think of how he may need to bite the bullet for his family. This may be too much.
3. He may decide to stay here in hopes something (his mother's money) or W.Comp settlement will save him from not having his ego threatend.
If he cared about this family he would want us all including his brother's kids to have an Aunt and Uncle and a cousin in their life too.
I just now told him the job I have here is cutting hours for most people.
He said "well if someone ask you to take another job that pays more take it. Don't say I kept you from taking a better job."
I told him "well then I should move now to Dallas, where their beggin me to come up there, they need help. Then he stops cold.
So it's not even about where I will be and what matters to me. I have 5 years with this company and health insurance that we all need.
I'm trying to hard to sort this out, I think....What ever Happens, Happens.
People get ugly when money comes into play. I have always worked hard and find it kinda of scary how people change because of money.
Maybe I watch too much news and Forensic TV.
Thanks for your time. onlyrenting
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onlyrenting1- has your husband ever showed things like compassion and empathy toward you?
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Guest
I feel like this is such a trick question. Like If I say " Yes "then no problem he wouldn't kill you. I'm glad to get that straight.
Could you give me some yes and no questions on compassion and empathy? I think it would be at what levels it could apply.
He Loves animals he can be so caring for helpless animals and becomes quite emotional over them. I knew this was a big plus to me when we met.
But when were talking about divorce he threatens to put our dog to sleep because it would be difficult to move with a large dog.
I tell him I will put him to sleep before that would happen.
I guess what makes an N tick and function are at all different levels.
He has never been physical, he loves animals and has never hurt one.
Give me some examples of how he could show me empathy and compassion. I will then be able to look at that with an honest answer.
Sorry for being stupid but I'm N-numb and would like to look at this question as you are meaning to put it to me.
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Thanx for your reply. Sorry--maybe it is me that should have been more clear.i was asking because i was wondering how you knew he was NPD for sure. People with full blown NPD do not habitually show compassion and empathy toward their partners--so that is why I asked. i was wondering whether he was ever diagnosed or whether you began to read about NPD and it made you think--but you are still trying to decide if he is NPD versus maybe another kind of personality disorder or even versus just having anger management issues or something else entirely.That kind of thing.
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Dear onlyrenting1,
I have never been in a 26-year marriage, so I can only imagine the myriad incidents, behaviors and examples you must be sorting through to determine whether your husband is an N, has N-traits, or as it's been suggested, has other undetermined issues. I certainly can understand the numb feeling you describe.
Had it not been for our couples counselor mentioning NPD, I might never have been able to pinpoint what really went down with my ex-fiance. It wasn't until after the breakup and I was seeing this counselor individually that I began to investigate NPD. The more I learned, the more it became clear that this was the crux of the situation with my ex-N. Prior to that I had only considered that he was an alcoholic who wouldn't embrace recovery.
At first everything I read or learned applied to him -- his tendencies and behaviors. Gradually during the weeks, then months, after the breakup I began to look at myself. Since most of the focus during the relationship had been his needs, his agenda, even his kids and their problems, I allowed him to become the center of my universe. It became necessary to shift the focus back to me: what I did, my behaviors and tendencies. Admittedly, I didn't like what I saw -- a woman who had given up her freedom, sense of independence and sense of self in exchange for an unhealthy relationship that ultimately hijacked my life. I even allowed the relationship with my daughter to take a back seat.
My point in sharing this is to convey the idea that we run the risk of continued codependency if the N remains the focus in our lives. Without outside help we may think we're diagnosing behaviors, traits, etc. but I wonder if this isn't better left to a professional? Otherwise the pattern continues -- we're obsessed about our Ns -- which is right where they want us.
So I am wondering if you've considered counseling? This might give you the balance and perspective needed to sort through all of this.
Best,
bludie
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onlyrenting,
If you think that your husband could contemplate murdering you, then your choice isn't about money, it's about personal safety and survival. It doesn't matter whether he is officially a narcissist if you're afraid of him and don't trust him. The issue is: will this man murder you if you become inconvenient? If you think he would, then I don't exactly understand the conflict. I would escape with my life.
bunny
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Merry Christmas.
Question to Why I think or Know he has NPD
This how it happened.
1. 5 yrs ago after my husband had the 1st of many surgeries.
Both my daughter an I went to a counselor, this was to help us both try and understand his behavior. bottom line we didnot know he was N and so the focus was "Well he is in pain and he will feel better after he heals."
2. I was concerned that the meds he was on and the depression he had was he sucidal, I ask for his Physcolgical report and the resceptionist gave it to me. There was a Diag with N behavior. (no other Disorders)
All this time until I read this Message board I believed N was selfish.
the report only said the Diag....and maybe his behavior like he appears to be surpressing something..
So I know he is ... All of you confirm the behaviors I now see to be true
I would go to a thearpist with another view now and this may be helpful
I would not even consider him going because It would all be my problem. And he is right. I have believed he would get over the attitude after the pain was gone, but now I know It's changes I need to make to move on.
Thanks Have a great Day YOU ALL HAVE BEEN SO HELPFUL PLEASE KNOW I'M SO THANKFUL FOR ALL YOUR TIME AND UNDERSTANDING.
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Bunny,
I do not believe he would murder me. no boubt in my mind.
But what I think and believe appears to be fooling me.
Do you believe Scott would murder Lacy?
I heard the Amber Fry tapes, Scott, never became angry. more like no emotion. Anger is an emotion...so maybe that is good?
My N-husband appears to be non-violent and maybe possessing some lower level N-behavior.
I'ts the search for what is real and what is the Fake N.
The Fake N is so charming and wants to be with his family.
or is this the true N.
My Husband is Non trusting and makes comments that I must be having affairs everytime I work late for OT. not Happy that I'm bring in more money.
When I went to Dallas, he got so upset he wanted a DNA swab of my daughters mouth because maybe she wasn't his.
She had to stay with a friend while I was gone because it worried me to leave her with him... She cried when she was at school and told her friends her Dad said he wasn't her father.
I'm the same all the time I go to work and come home every nite.
Never in our marriage have I given him a reason to worry.
He lies to family and tells them crazy stories..
If we divorced I'm sure he would spin tales and I would want to be prepared.
I would want his family to help me before all this would happen and try and understand why he treats them in his N-way. Maybe have support going my way as to my decision to move on.
If all these are lies, If I can know what to expect from him I will be able to handle the storm with greater strenghth.
If I thought there was a way to just Ignore his lies and put some boundries that would work, maybe I could deal with him.
I have been on this board everyday looking for clues and making decisions to better my home enviroment setting these boundries and thinking about myself more.
Living with an N in pain and it's all about him ALL the time has been slowly put in the back of my mind.
Every time I'm here writing means It's about me.
Soon I will not want to think about the N or even care to figure it out.
I will just say this is the way it is but for now I need to change my mind set about my life......I also find it helpful to share and know others are in some of the same struggles as I.
Thanks Bunny, Hope your having a great Christmas. Thanks for spending your time to write to me.
I decided not to deal with my other N-family this year so I'ts been all about reconizing the N's and setting them back a peg or two for me.
I consider it my Christmas Gift to myself.
Onlyrenting
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A great xmas gift to yourself onlyrenting :) Thanx for answering about the N diagnoses.
It looks as if at least one of your main worries is how far your husband would go with his abusive streak if you made a big change in the relationship or even left it.if you both couldn't agree on living in the same place for example, which is tied in with the money issue which seems like a provocative one on its own as well.
He already made a very weird and cruel comment about putting the dog down if you separated.this is more telling about him than what he said about scott peterson.
The more you write about him the more clear it is to see that he has the qualities of someone with full blown NPD.this may sound like it is coming out of left field but when N is being wildly irrational such as constantly accusing of affairs and even going as far as wanting a DNA swap of your daughter's to prove it is his, i would urge you to be very careful regarding **him** sexually. they are often projecting their very own behaviors that they are doing or have done in the past, onto their partners and then chastising their partners for it. this includes affairs or sexual promiscuity many times.Not uncommon at all, and i can't tell you how many partner's of N's have found this out later.
but what stands out to me the most is your own gut feelings that seem to be nagging at you regarding your safety.i would listen to that little piece of intuiton.i know you mentioned you didn't think he would hurt you or your daughter-- but it is followed by a **but** "no one thought that of scott" or **but**"what i think seems to be being proven wrong". what i am saying is that your internal instincts, voices intuitions are your best friends right now in helping you make the decisions you need to & they are so important to listen to.
well-- i'm glad you are having a fairly peaceful xmas.you deserve it. my thought are with you & i wish you strength in all of this.
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Do you believe Scott would murder Lacy?
I heard the Amber Fry tapes, Scott, never became angry. more like no emotion. Anger is an emotion...so maybe that is good?
Scott Peterson is a cold-blooded, calculating individual. Your husband sounds highly emotional and paranoid by comparison. Please put your daughter's welfare above his.
take care..
bunny
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Bunny, emotional and Paranoid?
Check this out, we exchange gifts and were making dinner.
He gets pissy because we all went to help out and he thought our 12 yr old made a face like she didn't want to help. so he got mad and said forget just throw it all away.
I can't believe I did this but I took the cucmbers he was cutting and threw them out And said fine lets just thow is all away.
My daughter's mouth just dropped that I did that.
He went and stuffed himself away in our room.
My daughter and I were playing games and having some fun.
He just came out and said he didn't want his gift from me, then I said fine and gave him all of his gifts back.
Out daughter got his and my gifts.
I have just had enough and Im tired of putting up with this crap.
I'm sure I could've been more mature but I just lost it.
I'm not upset and didn't let it ruin my day... Just didn't feel like fixing it and making it better. Acting like he does to me just appeared to be what I needed to do.... Onlyrenting
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onlyrenting,
You did good!!!!!
Not immature. GOOD GOING!!!!!
This is how to deal with him. He will learn much faster from your not putting up with crap. It's called boundaries.
congratulations!
bunny
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Bunny, COOL..........
Thanks for the support I had a big smile on my face.
So I'm reading this and My N- says ok he will be out on the 1st and will be picking up the Divorce -papers.....And be sure and not contact his family.
right now he's letting me know don't worry he will just mail them to me.
I'm just typing away trying to Ignore him with no response.
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Dear onlyrenting1,
You go girl. Don't let him ruin the day. Ignoring him right now is best -- Ns hate indifference. And as I read your last few posts it's made me thank my lucky stars. I've felt a bit blue all day thinking of last Christmas (we were together in the desert southwest with my ex-Ns family -- sounds idyllic but it wasn't). The lunacy you're describing of an N making everyone around them nuts, especially during a holiday, is just the bit of reality I needed to have interjected in my day.
Thanks and hang in there.
bludie
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Just didn't feel like fixing it and making it better
Hi OnlyRenting,
Merry Christmas to you, and to everyone. And Congrats...
Maybe he has come to expect you to be in that placatory role as the one who tries to make the results of his faulty behavior better, and I think you did the best thing by stepping out of it.
Doing so is also something that can help to give you your sense of confidence, power and strength back, where your thinking on what to do regarding your relationship with him can be much more balanced, and where you can feel a greater sense of control over the situation.
Best...
BT
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All of you being in my life right at this moment is giving me so much support that I need. I will keep you posted. I get a feeling things may escalate.
I'm having a great day... I promise will stop fixing the bad behavior.
1. Doing this on Christmas Day is a bunch of crap.
....He is the one all alone.
My daughter and I are fine. We had some apple pie and watched some good movies.
She is sitting here reading to me and were both not worried.
I will just wait and see if he goes thru with getting the Divorce Papers.
This is where I need to be, Him thinking this is his Idea.
(my daughter doesn't know what he said. He may want to send some pain and make sure she knows about his plan to get a divorce)
All of this will be my fault somehow, but that's ok.
My daughter will likley get some flack. I may need to let her stay at a friends house while I'm at work. She is on vacation and it might work out for the best.
Keep watching for my post . I'm looking to get some good direction from you very wise ladies. Thanks so much... Onlyrenting
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when N is being wildly irrational such as constantly accusing of affairs and even going as far as wanting a DNA swap of your daughter's to prove it is his, i would urge you to be very careful regarding **him** sexually. they are often projecting their very own behaviors that they are doing or have done in the past, onto their partners and then chastising their partners for it. this includes affairs or sexual promiscuity many times.
Onlyrenting-BT again:
I was just back-reading some of the messages in this thread. I don't know how you feel about this issue (it's a very heavy one) and I only want to say that it is a really good point to always keep in mind with N's.
When they get unaturally crazy-vehement about something so "twilight zone" nonsensical, it can be a "red flag" that they could be projecting what they are doing or have done in the past. I used to be on some message boards for N partners, and stories of insane accusations were later found out to be projections of an unfortunate reality, too many times.
It does not at all have to be so by any means of course, but their relentless irrational accusations about anything, can at the least, serve as an important "heads up" flag.
BT
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BT
I know what you're saying. I wish I could use that excuse to say he is the one having an affair. It would make it easier to think, Please go be with the other woman.
He has accussed me of having and affair with anyone I want to be friends with or have a relationship with anyone at work, men, women, black,white and now his own 10 yr older brother.
His own brother made a comment ,my Husband told him he didn't like him to e-mail me.
His brother said it was tho he was being accused of doing something sexual with me over the internet.
Even now as I have been on the internet working on my Geneology while chating with you ladies. I will be accused of taking up arms with the MEN haters of the world.
He doesn't know that I think he is an N so he is not thinking I'm taking forces up against him. But if he knew he would be making remarks.
I get tired of this crap too...
I try and just blow it off and agree with him.
"Yea that's what I'm getting dressed for in the morining to go out and be the whore that I am. And you love me so much you understand my Nempho needs...Im so lucky...."
I just don't play the paranoid game of thinking he's saying this to get the guilt off of himself. However, I will keep in mind when he says this again I should point out those that accuse are the one's doing the DEED!
I wonder there must be another reason like wanting control that he does this..
Thanks, this is so undermineing to any relationship. Onlyrenting
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My N- says ok he will be out on the 1st and will be picking up the Divorce -papers.....And be sure and not contact his family.
right now he's letting me know don't worry he will just mail them to me.
I'm just typing away trying to Ignore him with no response.
What a joke. There will be no divorce papers (unfortunately). He's just trying to bait you. Keep ignoring him.
bunny
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It could be an added discomfort that since he has lied to his family so much, his brother communicating with you might make him nervous in terms of what would come out if the two of your spoke. He would probably be imagining the two of you scheming against him, and find this highly threatening as well.
No, it would not serve you at all to worry about all kinds of things where you don't see anything strange in your environment. Only to be safe and remain very prudent, particularly when some of these behaviors (projection) are very "N-common", so you would be able to immediately recognize a sign of something strange should it come up, for what it could really mean.
I wonder there must be another reason like wanting control that he does this..
If he is accusing you of having affairs with even women that you might like to be friends with... Accusing you of that with just anyone and everyone that you speak with, then it sounds like it could also be a control and isolation issue.
Many abusers try to isolate their partners from all outside contacts (family, friends, co-workers) in order to attempt to maintain control and keep the status quo (how the abuser wants it) within the relationship. To them, outside influences in any form are threatening. They do not like anything that might cause you to change the way you think (they have you where they want you), or might cause you to change anything within relationship.
They also fear abandonment in that you will "see the light" in talking with others, and leave them.
More distant than their needs, is that they may not want others to hear about how the relationship is, either.
One way they are able to succeed with the isolation is to create sheer hell around the issue of their partner talking with anyone else, and it just becomes too emotionally traumatizing and destroying to face the abusive, vile, dumbfounding in irrationality, barrage of punishment that never tires of being dished out. So, the emotionally weakened partner complies in order to keep the peace :(
BT
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Bunny, thanks for getting back..
Just as I was reading your wonderful message I was dealing with this bull.
I think you're correct. It's to bait me.
Its crazy how something so small turned into this. the over reaction and hypersensativity. I can't believe I used to think this was his pain and Meds.
He is still tucked away in our room, all alone on christmas.
Our dauther and I have had a great day...
I will be home tomorrow and will see how it goes.
I'm sure he will hope all will be ignored like it never happened.
Thanks again for being there, I appreciate it so very much.
Wishing you the very best..onlyrenting1
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BT
One way they are able to succeed with the isolation is to create sheer hell around the issue of their partner talking with anyone else, and it just becomes too emotionally traumatizing and destroying to face the abusive, vile, dumbfounding in irrationality, barrage of punishment that never tires of being dished out. So, the emotionally weakened partner complies in order to keep the peace
You got it...
The lies to his family, to keep that covered up at all cost.
This would be why he doesn't want us to have the contact.
I don't advertise my contact with his brother because I know my N-H is funny like this.
I stayed with his brother's family in Dallas, when I went up for my Interview.
His brother shared with me some of the e-mails my husband had sent him. It's my husbands reactions to me being with his own brother that Promted me to look into the N-bhaviors.
I was concered for his brother and how my husband was treating him.
Reaching for a possible reason for such behavior I took a chance and thought could this report I read a few years ago give me any clues.
Even reading Medical jargon is not enough it's the real stories from this web-site that has given me the most understanding.
And Here I am finding out more about what the Hell I've got myself into.
My brother-in law is a medical doctor and is focused on helping me with just getting his brother medical help before he ends up in a wheelchair.
He wants us to be near him for many reasons but my husband may sabatoge all of this as you put in the quote above.
I clue his brother in on some of what I have found but try not to burden him with my problems.
I reveal what I've learned only when something arises so he understands why he gets treated the way he does.
This quote is so exactly what I go through....everytime I tell myself I will not let him do this to me.
I get so far but never like I'd like to take friendships or relationships.
It was part of what I believed was to strengthen the Marriage. Letting friends go and keeping close to your husband and his needs.
But now I see I just kept the peace.
Thanks for helping me face these things I have chosen to let slide in the past....onlyrenting
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It was part of what I believed was to strengthen the Marriage. Letting friends go and keeping close to your husband and his needs.
But now I see I just kept the peace.
A normal husband doesn't ask his wife to let friends go. That is a sign of way too much control. Way too much. Keep up the good work, keep talking to whoever you want, and don't let him isolate you.
bunny
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It was part of what I believed was to strengthen the Marriage. Letting friends go and keeping close to your husband and his needs.
But now I see I just kept the peace.
It is really the opposite. In healthy relationships, appropriate outside friendships enhance/strengthen the primary relationship because they help keep individuals emotionally healthy on a personal level. It is so innate, "normal" and natural to want to have outside interactions where you can experience communication with different others and express different parts of yourself. This is an important part of the human experience. And wanting relationships with ones family needs no explanation.
It is great (albeit a scary time too) that you are having so many insights now...
Keep up the good work, keep talking to whoever you want, and don't let him isolate you.
Ditto... Please do not let him isolate you. I really feel for you because of what you go through when you go against this. This time in your life really seems like it is a major turning point for you, and your relationship with your husband.
Take good care.
BT
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Bunny and BT.
I will make efforts to get with friends. My daughter has School friends and I have plans to go to dinner with my daugther, her little friend and her mother. We have been before after school actiivtes.
I just don't make it a habit.
Today My daughter and I went shopping. As we were getting ready.
My N-H who is still keeping himself lockup in our room, made his entrance with
"Oh so you will be gone for a few days, (I said a few days?) then he came in where I was and made comment
"so are you staying with one of your big dick black boyfriends."
(sorry this is rude let me know if this is too much for reading here, next time I could put in a generic comment like he said something rude)
I tried not to show any reaction and shut the Bathroom door where I was getting ready.
As we were walking out the door ( I couldn't contain my mouth ) I said
"You know those that accuse are always the ones doing the Deed themselfs or thinking about the same things you accuse me of"
We went shopping and had a great time.
I know My husband has this surgery in just a few weeks
I don't know if I can contain myself.
I guess as I learn more about all of this and I will have the tools to set my boundries and make it for another month or so.
I went to a Web site
bludie has in one of the threads.
I Pasted and copied some information (20 types and signs of the N)
there is more data with each only copied over data on some
THE CONTRACT BREAKER
TOUR "SOUL MATE"
BLAME-GAME NARCISSIST
THE CONTROLLER/MANIPULATOR
12. THE RAGER flies off the handle for little or no provocation. Has a severely disproportionate overreaction. Childish tantrums. His rage can be intimidating. He wants control, attention and compliance. In our hurt and confusion we struggle to make things right. Any reaction is his payoff. He seeks both good or bad attention. Even our fear, crying, yelling, screaming, name calling, hatred are his objectives. If he can get attention by cruelty he will do so. Defense Strategy: Manage your responses. Be fully independent. Don't take the bait of his verbal abuse. Expect emotional hurt. Volence is possible.
15. THE PARANOID NARCISSIST is suspicious of everything usually for no reason. Terrified of exposure and may be dangerous if threatened. Suddenly ends relationships if he anticipates exposure or abandonment. Defense Strategy: Give him no reason to be suspicious of you. Let some things slide. Protect yourself if you anticipate violence
. THE IMAGE MAKER . THE IMAGE MAKER
VACUUM is the cruellest blow of all. We learn his lack of empathy. He has deceived us by his cunning ability to mimic human emotions. We are left numbed by the realization. It is incomprehensible and painful. We now remember times we saw his cold vacant eyes and when he showed odd reactions. Those closest to him become objectified and expendable. Defense Strategy: Face the reality. They can deceive trained professionals
. THE SAINTLY NARCISSIST
This one is on PROJECTION:
Has your P ever accused you of the most vile, cruel lies? Has he said things that ripped right through your heart? Accused you of being crazy? Twisted everything you say into something grotesque? Most of us have experienced that with the P in our lives. We are left emotionally reeling. The hurt can be nearly unbearable. You were likely experiencing 'projection'. To make things simple, the P is accusing you of doing what they are THINKING, DOING OR PLANNING. It is very hurtful to us when they project their thoughts, feelings and impulses.
There was more intresting information I will digest it in time and will it apply it in my life RIGHT NOW...
the site was a very helpful thanks.
Onlyrenting..
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so are you staying with one of your XXX XXX XXX boyfriends."
This guy is unbelievable. You may not realize that most men would NEVER in a million YEARS talk to a woman this way!!!! They'd rather die! And if your daughter has ever heard this kind of language from him...well...I think you've given this jerk enough of your time. I would escape from him while he's in the hospital.
bunny
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Bunny,
When my daughter and I got out to the car I told her I felt like just leaving right then.
We were thinking of our dog who was in the house and she remembered his comment that he would be putting the dog to sleep if we split up
because she was a bigger dog and not easy to move with.
She was very angry he had said that.
We decided to go shopping and just forget the whole thing for a while.
She didn't hear his XXXXX comment to me. But she knew something was said.
I'm with you..Leave While he is in the body cast and can't come after me.
He said he was leaving on the 1st so we will see.
Our 27 yr wedding aniversary is DEC 28th.
He keeps bringing up about how I'm having sex with everyone else and I will no doubt be too busy with all my BigXXXX to be worried about him.
I'm reading about Projection and will see if their recommendations,not to take this personal and not to react will help.
..He made a comment about how I threw out his cucmbers on Christmas.
He bought My daughter a CD player and it's not playing the CD's
so he said "just thow it out since I was throwing out everything else."
Looks like I will get this one thrown in my face every chance he gets.
onlyrenting
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onlyrenting1,
My ex-N forgot all sorts of stuff - dates, bills, appts., etc., but he had an encyclopedic and photographic memory when it came to using the past as ammunition to punish.
For your own peace of mind it would be interesting to see how long you could observe silence around him. Nothing. Nada. Zip. No interaction. No comments. No come backs. Just silence. Avert your eyes when he walks in the room and talks then leave mid-sentence without uttering a peep. In reading that Vaknin site posted above, there was an article on the power of silence. As we know, Ns hate to be ignored or treated with indifference.
I agree with bunny. This guy is toxic and doesn't deserve your time (or the privilege of being near/around his daughter). Think about giving you and your daughter a present on your anniversary. Go shopping again or make an appointment for a girls' day out -- manicures, facials, massage; pamper yourselves. Leave him out of the picture entirely. Let the galut sit home on your anniversary and wonder what you're up to...Hang in there and keep us posted.
Best,
bludie
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Bludie,
I read on Projection from the web site you left on your thread.
For your own peace of mind it would be interesting to see how long you could observe silence around him. Nothing. Nada. Zip. No interaction. No comments. No come backs. Just silence. Avert your eyes when he walks in the room and talks then leave mid-sentence without uttering a peep. In reading that Vaknin site posted above, there was an article on the power of silence. As we know, Ns hate to be ignored or treated with indifference. >>>quote
I did just this today.....I'm not upset. I had a great day at work.
I took my daughter to work with me, so he was all alone today.
This morning I plugged my ears so I didn't have to hear him.
I began to hear him say some RUDE things this morning while I was in bed.
I plugged my ears so I don't know or care to know what He was saying.
Then I got up to get ready for work and was in the Kitchen.
He started in again comming up with some more RUDE comments.
I started banging the pots and pans around kinda loud like I was looking for something.
I Kept telling myself (what I read on the web site about projection)
PUT WHAT EVER IT IS HE'S SAYING ON THE SHELF DON'T TAKE IT PERSONAL.
IT HELPED TO VISUALIZE HAVING CONTROL OF THESE WORDS AND PUTTING THEM SOME WHERE OTHER THAN INTERNALIZING.
Then in the middle of his Rude Comments
I said "OH the Dog needs to be fed."
(He got up walked past me , got the dog her food and sat back down to continue his Rudness.
I left in the middle of the Rudness and said "OK" to what ever he was saying "well I'm getting ready for work".
(like I'm sure what ever he was saying I had listen intently)
and I walked out.
My Daughter and I came home, made dinner. He was watching T.V.
and appeared to be ok. He was making light conversation with our dauther. He has now gone to Bed.
(nobody has cried or got upset just N-Numb)
So I'm writing you this and I get an e-mail from His brother.
nothing specific but the jest of the e-mail is
My husband has contacted him about some drama.
His brother is worried that my husband will back out of the surgery and will be in a wheelchair. He is asking me to make sure he has this done.
How much do I reveal about the N-Disorder. His brother is a medical doctor not a physcologist.
I have told him a little and asked if he wants to know more about what I know. I told him to expect lies and to ask me if he wants the truth.
Also his brother is being delt with like with some boundries and is now throwing a fit.
If his brother tells my husband that I have told him his brother has NPD it will cause all kinds of problems.
I have peace dealing with this so everything I do won't be I'm treating him a certain way because I think he has a disorder.
I will keep reading and applying...Great site just in time for me.
I think for now It worked to be quiet no reaction. no looking upset. no comments.
Yeah....onlyrenting.
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Onlyrenting1,
Good for you in ignoring the lunacy. Bravo! As for your Ns brother, I am not certain. Only you know how productive it would be to try and explain the NPD syndrome outright. Being an MD, one would hope his brother would be interested and, certainly, have some understanding of personality disorders.
My advice on this one is to meditate or pray about it. I've found with friends that trying to explain much of this (the aftermath of my relationship with my ex-N) has become tedious and, in some cases, adversely impacted friendships. As has been wisely pointed out to me, people are so immersed in their own lives it becomes burdensome to hear all about my situation, much less NPD. Of course, your situation may be different.
As to insisting your N opts for surgery, you might calmly but firmly inform his well-intentioned brother that you are doing everything in your power toward the best for all concerned (especially you and your daughter). However, your N is really the only one who can make his own medical decisions. If your brother-in-law is very insistent, perhaps he can write a letter directly to your N. Detachment is difficult but I think it's key in preserving/improving your own mental health.
Best,
bludie
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Hi Bludie
Leave him out of the picture entirely. Let the galut sit home on your anniversary and wonder what you're up to...Hang in there and keep us posted.
My daughter and I went out and got a hot fudge sundae.
I got off work, it was raining but I was determined to go do anything to say were celebrating.
My daughter asked (Grumpy, MyN) if he wanted to go he said no.
Then she said are you going to wish Mom happy aniversary?
He said "happy aniversary",she said say it to MOM.
Then she didn't hear it like she wanted and said he was being mean.
He got up and went back to our room and stayed there.
I didn't say Happy Aniversary to him and maybe it would've helped. I just didn't have it in me. I'm just not up to giving him the chance to ruin my day.
I just wanted to drop a note, let you know it made me feel better.
Thanks for your support....I'm still reading,digesting and gathering information to make educated decisions. Keep me posted on other sites that would be of intrest. ...onlyrenting
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http://www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/dsm-iv.html#npd
http://www.mhsanctuary.com/narcissistic/resources.htm
http://www.bpdresources.com/
http://www.faqfarm.com/Health/Narcissism/
Hey onlyrenting1,
Here are a few links to resources that might help you. I view the Vaknin stuff with a grain of salt, so to speak. The book I am currently reading: "Why Does He Do That?:Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men" by Lundy Bancroft has been helpful; particularly chapters 6 and 9.
Glad you got through the day. Sorry it wasn't more festive but at least you're stepping aside the spew and venom for you and your daughter. Having a close relationship with a fairly precocious daughter, I had to be careful not to use her as a confidante with my relationship problems :oops: Wasn't always successful but it's a good thing to keep in mind with kids. They grew up too soon as it is anyway, right?
Best,
bludie
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Hi bludie,
I thank you for the web sites. I have just been reading off the web site from your other thread.
A few things got my attention
1. Narcissists are not only selfish and ungiving -- they seem to have to make a point of not giving what they know someone else wants.
Thus, for instance, in a "romantic" relationship, they will want you to do what they want because they want it and not because you want it -- and, in fact, if you actually want to do what they want, then that's too much like sharing and you wreck their fun and they don't want it anymore.
They want to get what they want from you without giving you what you want from them. Period. If you should happen to want to give what they want to get, then they'll lose interest in you. ^
It kinda got me depressed not only things of my past but about my future.
I wanted to move to Dallas to have a better job and our daughter would have family.
- It's want I want, NOT gona Happen.
- and don't get the Idea that I like the Idea becasue then I'd be a copy cat because it was all his Idea.
Now that you give him everything he wants, he doesn't want it anymore.
Another thing that keeps hitting me. is There is no reaching an N.
I have read story after story how people will expect the N to understand reason. Not gona Happen.
I have not read one happy story.
Therapy never works, no medicine to change their thinking to understand reason.
I once believed there was 1 symptom (selfish) now I know of 20 and most of them describe my N.
I find no loop holes and If I leave my husband, Our daughter will have no choice but to grow up.
I'ts not what I wanted for her. I was duped, but realize If I want something good and happy, My-N will take it from us.
I have little hope but will find the courage to take another step forward and say a lot of prayers to be lead in the correct direction.
Thanks ....onlyrenting
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If I leave my husband, Our daughter will have no choice but to grow up. I'ts not what I wanted for her.
She didn't hear his XXXXX comment to me. But she knew something was said.
We were thinking of our dog who was in the house and she remembered his comment that he would be putting the dog to sleep if we split up. She was very angry he had said that.
She may not have heard but she very well may have & was just too embarrassed because of the content, to say that she did.
Sadly because of N it seems like your daughter has already had to grow up. *Her* Christmas was ruined too-- the dog comment & just the whole ongoing environment she has to live in with this crazy guy.she doesn't have the maturity to rationalise and deal with all of this the strong way you are trying to.This is also her *father* not her husband so it has to be affecting her a lot.
Onlyrenting1 said: when my daughter and I got out to the car I told her I felt like just leaving right then.
Bludie said: I had to be careful not to use her as a confidante with my relationship problems Wasn't always successful but it's a good thing to keep in mind with kids. They grew up too soon as it is anyway, right?
I agree with Bludie.it is really something to think very much about.it might even be hard to realise that you are doing it if you are sometimes & there is no blame.only to watch for it.you have so much of your own things to worry about and it is a very hard time but if you can somehow set some special thoughts of focus aside for your daughter.maybe talking with a counsellor or something.i think she must be very deeply affected by all of this.
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Thank you Guest.
I agree with all of your wisdom.
This A.M. My N is telling me how he doesn't want me worry about him and taking care of him with his very long recovery.
I see he has written his brother a letter, he mentioned his thoughts on getting out of town and having the surgery in Dallas.
I will be looking for a therapist for our daughter who specializes in the N.
We both went a few years back and were told he was this way because of the Pain he was in. Now I have a direction for us both.
This Man is her father and she is at an age where she could understand divorce.
Her saftey is a concern, divorce can take your control away from her enviroment. The N lies and I need to play that game with some knowledge behind me.
I have to go to work ....Thanks, I will pray about it.....onlyrenting
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onlyrenting,
Your daughter would likely welcome divorce as a relief from the daily abuse her father dishes out. He may *think* he's only abusing you and not her, but that isn't the case. He's abusing everyone in the house. If she keeps seeing these interactions, it becomes her role model for her own marriage.
bunny
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Bunny,
I agree I need to find myself in a better marriage to show her that this is not the way a marriage should be.
onlyrenting
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Christmas day my husband had this sound system set up.
Just finding a lie and wanted to face it and also share. in my prior thread he had gotten upset and gave my gift to him to our daughter. Maybe it was his guilt about the sound system.
I asked him if it was new? He lied said no he bought it along time ago and just put it away in his storage.
I checked his web stie message board and found this note to his friends.
He took it back to his storage place the next day so there wouldn't be any disscussion about it, I guess.
N-H wrote:
santa got me a new sound systen THX or what ever, it's much better than dolby 5/1 I watched I Robot on it the sound track was better than the movie, then i noticed how few DVD's offer it they all offer 5/1 but only a few have THX
Just another N-lie...onlyrenting
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Happy New Year!!!
Hope all had a great new year.
Just to let you all know My Dauther and I went with her friend and her mother to dinner and then exchanged gifts in the lobby of a very festive Double tree hotel. It was a lot of fun.
We invited my N-H but he didn't want to go. He wanted to go with only us two, I explained I wanted to spend time with friends and the more the merrier, he didn't want to feel like the 5th wheel.
I asked twice and felt no guilt when we got home after midnight and he was stilll up and home alone.
We will see how today goes. I see My N-H is cooking something hoping it won't end up in the trash if he decides to be pissy.......
Note on information on his message board
Today I see he's telling friends how he wants to buy an expensive TV but for now he has spent so much on our aniversary he can't afford it.
Very Intresting
N-Husband
I've been comparing pices circut City is cheaper than best Buy & The Good Guys $ 5800
Fri 31st 12, 04 | 23:57
Pierre
I'm gonna take Mrs Joe & lil dreamer to Dave & Busters for dinner , & I just spent too much on my 26th anniversary so I;m tight. I WANT THAT SONY HD WIDESCREEN !!!!!!
Fri 31st 12, 04 | 23:55
Pierre
is it really almost 2005. New years Eve? I'm gonne b 30 again pretty soon
Fri 31st 12, 04 | 23:51
1. What he wants no disscussion with me.
2. He's on SSI after 5 years with little money and he wants something almost 6,000. ( this can only be when he gets his inhertance)
3. how he knows it sounds great that he spent money on his Wife.
Funny.... 1st thing.... he said to me today, he wants to see all my receipts on the bills I have paid and the food I have bought.
onlyrenting
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Happy 2005 to you, too, onlyrenting1 --
Glad to hear you're spending time with friends and not hanging around the house getting caught up in N-drama.
I have lots of curiosity as to what my ex-N is doing and have a few ways of still tracking his activities but have resolved to NOT indulge my curiosity since I realize it really hurts me when I do this.
Although these are small steps, I DID NOT drive by his new place to see where he is now living. Although I had legitimate reason to be in his city over the holidays, and I had gone so far as printing directions on MapQuest, I sat in my car for what seemed to be quite a while upon leaving the airport. After some internal debate I decided it was turning a corner emotionally to NOT investigate his new environs. Although I am still curious, I realized that knowing more about his new life would lead to increased speculation, rumination, analyzing. Heck, with my luck, he may have walked out at the precise time I was driving by and that would have opened up a whole, new can of worms.
So I am pleased that I took this small step. The reason I mention this, onlyrenting1, is that I wonder whether tracking his Web posts feeds same? Perhaps it's different when you're married. But I wonder if this detracts from your efforts to detach....just a thought.
Best,
bludie
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Hey Bludie
So I am pleased that I took this small step. The reason I mention this, onlyrenting1, is that I wonder whether tracking his Web posts feeds same? Perhaps it's different when you're married. But I wonder if this detracts from your efforts to detach....just a thought.
Happy new year, I know you are in an advance stage of this game and so I will consider your wise thoughts on this, to let go.
I want to let go and yet not blind to some important reasons to leave this relationship.
I have some thoughts on why I check on my husband.
1. to understand how his N-mind works without reservations from him.
2. I want to look at what he may really believe about us.
3. to stay one step ahead of the N-game
4. to confront myself with his lies.
It was a long time before I ever belived my N-H was capable of lies.
He always appeared truthful and honest to me. for years I thought "I don't think he has ever lied to me". I was and may still at times be Gulible.
I was hurt about the purchace of the sound system lie at christmas. We are in such a financial bind. His mind is on material purchaces When
We need to save every penny.
He didn't buy or do anything on our aniversary but to his friends he blames "all the money he spent on me" is why he can't buy what he wants.
N's-lie and somehow to see it in writing makes me come to grips about where his heart is. Being married you need to be aware about money. He confronts me at every turn how I'm spending money.
Today my husband was upset about our money situation and was pushig for a fight. He told me not to worry about the rent and for our daughter and I to find another place to live. He was going to pawn everything so he could pay for the rent.
(He is worried about his surgery in 10 days and may backout wanting to blame me why he can't or won't have it done. I'm his STRESS)
I got off work, he appeared to be ok, I didn't talk to him about the rent.
I got our daughter and myself ready to leave without saying anything to him.
Anyway my friends Birthday was today, my daughter and I went to dinner with her and her daughter, we had a nice time.
AND I HAD NO GUILT ABOUT THE MONEY.
ONLYRENTING1
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Like I said, onlyrenting1, it's probably different when married. The reason I bring it up is to help keep the focus on you and your recovery from all of this.
I was so accustomed in my last relationship to feel that the money was his even though he said it was ours. And, yes, it's very illuminating but painful to realize the dishonesty that rolls off the tongue of an N. I, too, thought my ex-N was an honest person because of his outward demeanor (and the fact that I try to be honest). But in the months during and after our breakup I can see the deception and know now that if it was easier to --- he lied -- if it achieved his agenda -- he lied -- if it made him feel superior or win the argument -- he lied. So on and so forth.
Glad to hear you had a nice dinner out with friends.
Best,
bludie
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Hi Bludie
Thanks so much for your efforts to respond.
It's like living near the train tracks at first the rummble and noise is disturbing but after a while your brain says this has no affect on me anymore, the shock value is over.
Bludie wrote
And, yes, it's very illuminating but painful to realize the dishonesty that rolls off the tongue of an N. I, too, thought my ex-N was an honest person because of his outward demeanor (and the fact that I try to be honest). But in the months during and after our breakup I can see the deception and know now that if it was easier to --- he lied -- if it achieved his agenda -- he lied -- if it made him feel superior or win the argument -- he lied. So on and so forth.
Soon I will not even care to look at the devistation. I will accept it move on with little or no thought or time spent to figure out why someone thinks this way. I appreciate your efforts to keep me focused on myself
I know it will take a lot of mental effort to change my way of thinking.
Thank you so much onlyrenting
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"I agree I need to find myself in a better marriage to show her that this is not the way a marriage should be" Don't agree..studies have shown that women are MORE unhappy in marriage then on there own. Not saying that this is right or wrong but what is wrong is that you are unhappy in this relationship and N's don't change so there will be no light at the end of this particular tunnel. Maybe it would be better for your daughter to see you have light-hearted fun with a few not serious boyfriends (if you leave this marriage), and for her to see that people will come and go throughout life and that it is not a big disaster for this to happen. I don't believe that people should stay in bad relationships for the sake of the children and I think one stable parent is far better then two unhappy parents.
The main thing is however, that he sounds like he just wants to ruin everyones fun just because at times he realises that the world does not revolve around him. You sound like you are doing well though and managing to treat him like the child he really is. I think that usually with N's this is impossible, there is simply no pleasing them and victims spend (no waste) sometimes many years of their lives trying to make it work when nothing will work. From reading your posts I have every faith that you are getting ready to make a change for the better.
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littlebird
From reading your posts I have every faith that you are getting ready to make a change for the better.
Thank you so much for your encouraging words to me.
Living with an N and having this as my only place to bounce off my state of mind, I appreciate the encouragement.
Please know any perspective to get me going in a healthy direction means alot.
I can't expect to jump into another marriage before my daughter is 18teen, If I find some great role models I will be happy for now.
I have an agressive role model search as an ongoing goal in my life as we speak.
thank you again, I'm in a battle for my mind and soul and want to know I have a chance to win once in awhile. Onlyrenting
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Your stories of how he tried to put a downer on the xmas festivities amused me...theres nothing like xmas to bring the N temprament out of hiding. Xmas being a time for GIVING presents and SHARING joy. the N just sees no point or profit in this because it dosn't involve GAIN for him. Infact it involves a DEFICIT of attention for him. Being so wary of N's as I am, I decided a few years back not to have them around me in any shape or form near Xmas which is a special time for me and my daughter.
Mind you, an N knows no happiness anyway even if someone came and hit them with a big happy hammer, they would still be miserable scrooges,
Bah Humbug and all that!
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Littlebird,
I really hope you had a nice holiday. How old is your daughter?
If you're a single parent my hats are off to you.
I have been working on steping out of my comfort zones.
I guess a scary part for me is having a 12yr old and the way the world is today with child molesters and the like, having strange men around her worries me. If we do move to Dallas, she will have her cousins and family, They are great role models. I can start with that and grow from there.
I did invite my N-Husband to go on New years, but I think it was best as you say
Mind you, an N knows no happiness anyway even if someone came and hit them with a big happy hammer, they would still be miserable scrooges,
Bah Humbug and all that!
I like the "Happy Hammer" quote...I think I may wrap one up with a bow and all and put his name on it ...
littlebird Thanks for your time to reply....Onlyrenting
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It's the weekend and looks like the begining of D-Day.
The N-is puffing around packing his stuff like he's ready to move. His car won't start and he can't leave like he wants right now. I offered a jump he said no...He's been trying for over an hour.
He was pissy and started in about how I'm the whore then the next minute because I question him I'm Gay he's the man and not to question him. Where's the Happy Hammer? (as suggested by littlebird)
I'm not taking the bait, everytime He comments how I better save my money and he's bought the food and not to eat his stuff.
I told him "to bad I'm not going to starve for him."
But I'm so N-numb not saying much or reacting like I even care.
I was disappointed he's not leaving now He said he was leaving after Feb. 1st. He says he will live like a King and I'm getting nothing.
Our Corp Office left me a message to call them on Monday.
I really need to move to afford to live. He doesn't know they called me and I don't know for sure what they will say....Please say some big prayers for me. I need a big raise and help to come up with the money to move.
I e-mailed his brother to let him know I will not commit to moving or buying a house with my N.
I can move and get a job and if he wants to help me with a rental, ok. I let him know that my-N will not allow his help
and there could be no mention if he wanted to help us.
I decided to send some N data I found on the links offered by Bludie, His comment was this is his brother and he believes he does have problems.
to let him go and not force anything on him. I have no tears...just sad that he can't see those that wanted to care.
He clues me in on how his parents were poor role models for my husband and he is turning like his own mother.
My N-will go in on Monday for his pre-op. then Wed. the 12th he will be in for 5-6 days. (rest for us)
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onlyrenting,
It sickens me that this "man" (term used loosely) calls his wife and the mother of his daughter a whore. I can't wait until Wednesday.
bunny
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Onlyrenting1,
Although your day didn't get off to a pleasant start witn the N machinating around the house, I have to thank you. Each time I start to reminisce about the fascade-laden 'good times' with my ex-N, one of your posts reminds me of what daily life was actually like.
The name-calling is awful. You sound steadfast in trying to detach from it. Maybe another time for you and your daughter to go get an ice cream or watch a movie? I hear the "Meet the Fockers" flick is quite entertaining.
Hang in there and keep posting. I am very much hoping you hear good news about your job.
Best,
bludie
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Hi Bunny and Bludie,
Bunny,
I see myself detaching by calling my husband an N-H, maybe it's too painful to think this is no longer my husband and is now only an N-H, not worthy of being reffered to as Husband.
My N-H never got his car started.
My daughter and I hopped in my car and went running around. We had a lot of fun. We were laughing about some dumb stuff, we're both looking forward to him leaving in a few days.
He was getting some stuff packed into his van showin us how he was marching out the door and going to be gone and now his car won't start.
The other day my car wouldn't start and I was late for work, he was chucklin about it and didn't offer me a jump . I was praying for my car to start and it did, I was only 15 min late. I was feeling a little like he got his, for laughing at me.
It's going to be a long weekend, I think it would be a good time on Sunday, to do what you suggested and go see a funny movie.
His brother is offering my husband a way to get out from under us and see's it's for the best. With promises he gets help only if he gets the surgery.
His brother said he was sorry for the way we're being treated and to take this job and get out there to Dallas. He said to do what's best of us and not worry about my Husband.
He believes that after the surgery maybe the tenison between us will lighten up.
I already told my-brother-in law I want nothing to do with my N.
He was talking on the phone to his brother and I heard my-N say:
"I DONT WANT TO STAY HERE, THIS IS NOT THE REFLECTION OF WHO I AM. I WANT MY ENVIRONMENT TO CHANGE TO REFELCT WHO I AM INSIDE. "
I have mentioned this Idea of an N, to my brother-in law but never to my N, it's funny how he described exactly what everyone else already know's about him.
I'm looking forward to next week and what changes will come about.
Thanks for checking on me. I'm saying alot of prayers to keep strong, have guidance, doors open to happier days and stay emotionally healthy.
onlyrenting[/quote]
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HI,
Just wanted to give you all an update.
My Husband made it through the 5 hr surgery and lived.
He refused a ride from me to the hospital, but I called him just the same to make sure he made it.
I was at work while he was in surgery. Of all the times to happen, all the phones went dead no calls in or out.
I borrowed a friends cell to call the hospital,letting them know I didn't have a cell and borrowed this one just to call to let them know the phones were out.
hours later the Doctor called my friends cell to let me know everything was fine. (my friend had the phone shut off, so anyway I haven't talked to the doctor and My husband is too out of it to tell me any details.)
I have talked to him this morning, and he was only interested in getting the neighbors phone number that took him to the hospital.
I have not called him again and will not unless he calls us.
I asked my daughter if she wanted to talk to him, she said no.
I love my Father with all my heart , he is still alive. I know how lucky I am to have him. I wish my daugher could know the love of a father it can be is so wonderful. I'm sad she has been hurt by her Dad, I know how I felt about my mother, I was glad when they got divorced.
She is 12 and maybe I would have a could chance not to have an ulgy custody battle.
I talked to our Cor. Office and they were checkin on my time line to come up to Dallas. They will find me something just let them know when I'm ready to pack my bags.
My husband's brother finally said the N-word, He admitted he understood his brother was hurrassing me and that he reconized he was Narsisstic.
I felt like he was going to still help us out what ever the decision to stay married or not. He wants me to take this job and not worry about anyone but my daughter and myself.
I still expect my Husband to have a bad attitude, I will try and not pressure him too much while he is healing. But I'm leaving the state and already have moving plans to keep, with our without my husband.
I will let you know how things progress. My Dauther and I are feeling more relaxed without him here. ..thanks .onlyrenting.
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Glad to hear you and your daughter are experiencing some peace right now, onlyrenting1. It must be a relief as well to have your husband's surgery past you. Somewhat begrudgingly, I hope he heals quickly and can get on with his life, too.
It's also good to know that your BIL is supportive and that your job plans are moving along. It will be a busy time for you but keep up posted.
Best,
bludie
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Onlyrenting,
Thanks for the update. I'm so glad your BIL sees the light and will help you and his niece. I look forward to your moving, hopefully without your abusive H.
bunny
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Hi,
I just stoping for a few moments, I have been very busy.
We got a call late last night, my N-H was staying longer, another
4 days, because of a blood clot in the lungs. My daughter talked to him,
I was asleep.
Today He said they are giving him shots in the stomach to desolve the clot.
My BIL called, said that this would be common and not to worry.
My husband expained it to me like he almost died. His heart racing to a 180 vs 90. I don't know and I would expect my husband could make it sound worse than it is.
I have been busy getting things ready to move. Today My BIL and I disscussed plans for him to fly with a round trip ticket, letting my husband fly to Dallas while we would drive the u-haul.
We talked in lenghth about our 26 yr relationship and why we should plan on getting out to Dallas together. Basic Idea we need each others Income to make it.
My BIL, also believes maybe my NH is feeling my changing attitude towards him. That I should lay low, not push divorce while he is in recovery for our daughters sake.
I think its the timing, My N-H having the Idea in his head he won't need his family anymore because his brother would be helping him. The possiblity of no money worries.
Me being enlighten about his real possibility of throwing out his family without a second thought. I already knew he was flaky, but not the thought of being tossed out like the trash.
These thoughts were escalated with the upcoming surgery, the move,
Our 12 yr old, the apple of his eye or his N-supply growing up . lack of money. My NH was really having thoughts of no money problems for himself.
Part of my BIL's plan was to get My-H to get the necessary surgery,.
My husband does have feeling back in his legs and toes. it is so far, a success. If he had not had the surgery it would be the wheelchair.
It was the fork in the road, if the nerve had died there was no recovery.
He explained he would not be supporting my husband, he was saying anything to get him to go thru with the surgery for all or us.
He said he would only help out if we went out there as a family.
He would not allow my husband to flake out on us. He has responsiblity for us and he would not be part of making it easy for him, to run.
He wants me to get this job but not say much about it to my husband. Plan on moving in the next 6-8 weeks and if he doesn't want to go, then leave him. He will help my daughter and I out if that's what happens.
I haven't gone to see my H. He knows our daugher is upset with him. He made comment not to force her if she didn't want to see him. He said he looks bad and its best if she didn't see him.
I will keep packing up stuff while I have some peace for the next few days.
My daughter is having her friend spend the night then 6:45am Sunday she has a Cheer camp and game at UCLA to attend.
Thanks for being there for me to bounce my thoughts. onlyrenting
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Hi Onlyrenting,
I noticed something you said in an earlier post that contradicts what you've just written.
About your BIL-
I felt like he was going to still help us out what ever the decision to stay married or not. He wants me to take this job and not worry about anyone but my daughter and myself.
Then
He said he would only help out if we went out there as a family.
Maybe you misunderstood him earlier, but I wonder whether your BIL is controlling things a little too much, or even that you're relying on him too much. It's great that you have him, healthy families should help one another but they shouldn't be telling you what to do. You have to make the choices that are best for yourself and your daughter, and that's when your BIL should be supportive.
All the best
Karin.
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Karin,
This referance was to focus on my husband not to come out to Dallas, on his own.
That the orginal plan was for us to come out as a family.
He will not help my husband without us.
He wants me to get this job but not say much about it to my husband. Plan on moving in the next 6-8 weeks and if he doesn't want to go, then leave him. He will help my daughter and I out if that's what happens.
[/b]
And I totally agree about the control factor. No doubt you put yourself at risk for this type of obligation. However, Have you looked at the prices in CA to live. I feel desparate and worried. The job with our corp office will allow me a better income and the cost to live in Dallas, will be less.
My BIL, lived near us here in CA years ago. I remember the pull and tug for control. He is 10 yrs older and may want control to some degree.
I will have my own job, its my husband that needs more help because of his failing health. It's him who is on SSI and needs to get back on his feet. His brother wants to help him but not without us as a family. He is only letting me know that he will not take my H alone as my H tried to make me believe he would.
Got to go up at 5 am...Onlyrenting
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Who can be sure what his problem is however if he really believes either of those creeps are innocent then his judgement on anything is worthless.
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Jundo,
Thank you and amen.
onlyrenting
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posting with an update
HE'S HOME
N's, must be very difficult for even the doctors to deal with.
I talked to his doctor for the first time after a week. He tells me about how they would be transfering him to a rehab for 10 days to help with the physical re-hab and the withdraw on morphine. With-in hours I find my H at the front door.
he said they were being mean to him, he didn't like it there and he wanted to come home. (I know noone likes the hospitals)
he now needs shots every 12 hr and a trip to the hospital for the next 5 days. I will do my best to keep the peace, take time off work to be here
and see how things go.
I must say I had a peaceful time while he was gone, I hope he sleeps alot. I moved most of my important stuff to the garage, packing up things as I go. He will be in the house, not able to see how close I am to move out quickly if I need to.
I called the hospital last night to make sure he didn't leave without their ok. The docs may have not been able to talk sence into him. I'm being told they will call me back, and all they knew he was discharged, he didnot leave without permission from the doctors.
onlyrenting
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I have been reading the threads you ladies have been posting. I found the book "Now We Are Six" a very good book. It encapsulates the behavior and attitudes of N's perfectly. The short line is.......Narcs have an arrested development. They are still 6 years old. You all know how difficult kids can be. i.e. Now your my best friend, and now you are not. See my pretty new toy, don't you wish you had one like it? No you can't play with it because I don't like you today. On an on. Describes n's to a t. I had to deal with lost and "forgotten" anniversaries the whole nine yards.. Patz
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Onlyrenting,
It makes sense that he would dash home where he can abuse and control to his heart's content. They won't put up with that in rehab. I hope you can move and get away from this creep very soon.
bunny
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onlyrenting1,
Good to hear from you! Take care of the caretaker and don't get sucked into his manipulations; even if he is post-surgery. Hope, as bunny said, you can make a change in your situation soon.
Best,
bludie
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Thanks so much Guest, Bunny and Bludie,
Guest,
I found the book "Now We Are Six" a very good book. It encapsulates the behavior and attitudes of N's perfectly
I strongly agree about the age six, maybe even 5. I will look into this book. does this book or any you know of suggest how to break away with your sanity? Dealing with a 6 yr old would be difficult for others to understand.
I have notes on the Betty Broderick thread,where there is a question on any books to break away with proper preperations.
Maybe legal,proff, or when childern are involved.
Bunny and Bludie you both are so much a comfort to me.
Bunny, you have away of looking at situations with direct honesty and getting the true focus with a dead on resolution.
Bludie, I know you are still going thru hell yourself. I see myself being faced with moving to a new town and having a child to be concerned about. Trying to see thru the Mudd slinging and keeping my thoughts focused on the important things.
I'm looking to your growth to know there is hope.
Sometimes I think the light at the end of the tunnel is the on coming train.
This makes me want to stop and deal with where I'm at with caution.
Trying to prepare being smart. Taking into consideration my daughter.
Leaving anytime sooner I may have found myself in an ugly custody battle. Maybe the laws will look at her age giving me more rights.
I found on another thread about Co-dependency. I see I have some of those traits.
I will be looking into how to improve on myself so I don't fall
into the this trap again.
I will work very hard at seeing myself and my own problems giving them as much attention as I have with the problems of the N. Some of these areas with co-dependency I have grown away from and others I didn't know were part of this dependency.
I find myself breaking away from, what about the N (where there may be only little or no help to change)
and wanting to heal myself praying I will have the strength to will to change.
Thanks again for all your direction and hope to us that there is light at the end of the tunnel. onlyrenting
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Hello, Only renting. I apologize in advance for perhaps sending you ideas that have already come your way, but I didn't have time to read everything...but did read your last post. I feel for you, as it seems we all do. I divorced my ex N 8 years ago, and am still in a legal battle with him over my freedom to relocate with my children. Because of this, I have a perspective now, on what I did legally and emotionally 8 years ago, that came back to haunt me recently, and perhaps you can use this info.
I highly encourage you to take the giant plunge into the unkown (that's what the fear of leaving the cheating, selfish N felt like to me). YOU are far more important than him....why? It's YOUR life. Don't buy into the old thoughts that "to be a good person" you must take his shit and forgive him over and over. Yeah, I know, he is sick and you can see the real person under it and you can fix him. Funny how they get you thinking about them them them.... Your life has to be about YOU or you are no good to the people who really deserve a healthy you: you and your kids. After sooooo long, I have only in the last few years started to break from the terror this man can instanly put into me. Stay with therapy, read everything you can, talk to everyone who makes you feel wonderful about yourself, acknowledge and let go of your pain, and don't take on anyone elses....just as this is your life and you get to own it, it's their life, and they have to own it. Your kids will be fine as you get healthier. HE may never do this, so give it up. NEVER stay with someone out of pity or fear. Neither one of those things is love.
If you are not already there, get to therapy, by yourself, right away. If you don't feel good inside about your therapist (no offense, men, but I recommend another woman), then get another one right away, one who you feel empowered with. Trust yourself with this. I know I was well trained to NOT trust myself for years, but practice that...it will save your life. It will help to choose a therapist who has dealt with the courts and child custody as well. Do not quit the second you figure the "break up" is over, because you really will need a supportive source to run things by during the legal decision making, who will help you see if your decisions are based on old fear patterns or new healthier choices. Had I done that, instead of the giant "YAHOO! the weight is off my neck...party time!" that I did, I would NEVER have written some things into my parenting agreement that I did. Freedom awaits. Recite after me: "I am beautiful, I am strong, I am worthy of my dreams!" This will take work and struggle but it will be the best thing you ever did (except maybe those kids)Good luck!
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Mum, thank you for the heads up.
I will need to look for a therapist with the legal background on child custody?
Can you elaborate on the idea of once you believe your free, you have hell to pay for later.
What would be something to consider. I have a 12 yr old girl.
I think you said you have an older son and your H has been able to take him because of his age and gender? Im not sure if I have this correct.
When Im looking for a theapist it should be a woman?
Do I ask specificly for someone that deals with an N/co-dependant/child custody?
Does it help to have proff my H is a self-absorb N, with total Neuroticism. Do you know what Neuroticism is?
I have a medical evaluation on him and found this other word I need to look into.
I want to play it smart and have some basis covered. Im working on getting moved now. Just getting all my ducks in a row before I leave.
Thanks for you valued insite.....Onlyrenting.
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Onlyrenting1,
I don't have advice on the child/custody/legal stuff but just wanted to encourage your documenting as much as possible. This may help legal professionals in addition to keeping your own recollection accurate in case it would come up in court or legal negotiations. In the month-long aftermath of my ex-N's departure, he went to great lengths to undermine me emotionally, financially, legally and otherwise. I wrote everything down: every conversation I had with movers, storage units, utility companies, banks, lawyers, etc. I also kept a log of how often he called and saved all the e-mails. It just pays to CYA as much as possible, not only for your sake but for your daughter's.
By the way, was REALLY sorry to hear about her school situation this week. What else could be going on to make life crazier?!? I'll be thinking of and praying for you while you walk through all of this. Thanks for keeping us posted and take care of YOU during this challenging time.
Best,
bludie
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Onlyrenting,
Your therapist will be involved with you solely regarding therapy. They will not have legal expertise (unless they are also a family law attorney which is unlikely) but in any case they won't give legal advice. They won't evaluate you or your child for a custody case. That would be done by a third-party whose only task is the evaluation (i.e., you aren't their therapy patient). A therapist tries to stay completely out of the court system due to confidentiality. If they stand up in court under oath, they would have to reveal anything you've said in confidence. They don't want to do that. Any therapist who says they will testify for you in court is making a huge error and you should not see that person.
Bottom line: see a therapist for your own support and see an attorney for the family law stuff.
bunny
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Hi, only renting. I still can't figure out the quote in reply thing here, so I will attempt it this way.
If you are in the states, I don't think it will be difficult to find a therapist who deals with child custody, divorce, etc, as many times they are issues together. The question may be to ask if they have experience with the court system and if they know how things work where you are or will be. If they don't know, they should be able to find out or refer you. This may also be better handled by your attorney.
I'm not quite sure what I said that inspired you to ask me to elaborate on "once you believe you're free you have hell to pay for later".
I think I may know where that came from, so let me be more specific. When I finally seperated from my ex, I was so happy to have finally come that far, that I didn't go the rest of the way toward healing myself. I was just so relieved to end it. Because I was still afraid of him and didn't want to fight with him, I agreed to things in my custody decree just to get it over with. He still bullied me and I was such an open wound, so I agreed to say that neither one of us could move from our present county....and I gave him the majority of every single weekend with the kids. Both of those things I am now fighting to change in court.
I guess my point was, that had I continued with therapy at that point and continued to strengthen myself, I may not have agreed to those very punitive (for me) items. And the "party" stuff: well after so many years of put downs and criticism, I did the very typical "date every cute guy I could" thing. It seemed like fun, (no the kids didn't meet them!) but it was just one more way of not dealing with my pain. I thought things were great because men were giving me attention, but like anything else one does to ignore/stuff/escape it didn't help and kept me from seeing what I should have seen about my old fear based patterns with the ex.
To clarify about the kids: I have two children and they are both with me, the ex agreeing even recently that I should indeed stay the custodial parent (he is not that much of a fool, the kids would never go for anything else, anyway).
As far as needing to find a therapist with experience in the other disorders your (soon to be?) ex has: talk to one...I would be willing to bet most have seen it all.
I think it's probably an advantage to you to have medical evaluations of your H and everyone who has said this is correct: document EVERYTHING!!
Another legal point: Please look into the statutes in your state regarding relocation with minor children. Most states have very specific rules on how to do this with timing and notification being a huge part of it....even if you have full custody, there are laws regarding this. California is currently the only state where the custodial parent has a presumptive right to move away with the children and even that is being challenged again.
Get a good lawyer....don't be scared and get just anyone in a hurry, take the time to research leads. Don't be afraid of the depressin news that is out there regarding move aways, it can really get you down, and the only way you will create what you want in this life is to focus on what you want, not what you don't. A helpful website (although you will need to practice letting go of the negativity you may pick up there) is thelizlibrary.org
I wish you the best. Stay confident and happy, keep focusing on the good stuff and wash the rest away (all the time). It will work out for you.[/quote]
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Bunny is absolutely right. An attorney needs to handle the legal stuff. Absolutely. I do have a therapist who was a former mediator for the family courts, and because of this, was very helpful for me in dealing with the emotional impact of preparing for and appearing in court. That was lucky for me, but probably not a usual situation, now that I think of it.
Talk to a good attorney, and get a therapist who empowers you...and don't let other's well intended ideas and experience (like mine) make you do anything at all....trust yourself. Thanks, Bunny for the clarification!
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Mum, Bludie, Bunny.
What I ment on my elaborate discription was
you think you're free from them, all is done, but later time goes on and they can still give you trouble.
Maybe there are loop holes with the kids you didn't see coming.
Can he come back and try and change things or say your not a good parent. Try to take your children or tell lies to cause people to question you. (cuse you a hellish revenge only an N can dish out)
Had I done that, instead of the giant "YAHOO! the weight is off my neck...party time!" that I did, I would NEVER have written some things into my parenting agreement that I did
I understand you to say,
stay with a therapist while you encounter the legal battles, so you stay focused.
maybe you thought it was ok without the support and now you are stronger and wished you would not, have agreed with the H demands so easily.
Good advise.
When you make a parenting agreement, is it what ever you want?
can you explain.
should I go to the library and find something on this?
this is why I get a lawyer to write this up for me?
I'm poor and won't be able to afford a lawyer, My husband has been on SSI for over 5 years we are down to nothing material.
My H has never been physical but how do you prove the mental abuse.
having this medical report has only a brief statement "self-absorbed Narsisstic, thats it. I will keep writing things maybe I should keep copies of the the emails his brother has sent regarding his behavior too.
(to use the quote function)
1. highlight from your data source
2. right clk,copy
3. rt/clk paste onto the reply box .
4. highlight, move up to the top and press the quote btn)
Bludie,
financially, legally and otherwise. I wrote everything down: every conversation I had with movers, storage units, utility companies
Why the movers and rental units.
He has a rental unit to keep his stuff out of the garage. (tools and machines).
By the way, was REALLY sorry to hear about her school situation this week. What else could be going on to make life crazier
Thanks for your concern, I'm glad its friday.
I decided not to share this with my husband. I felt like a single mom, dealing with the kid problems on my own.
I could not believe it when I got the phone call from the nurse at school. First I thought it was the hospital for my H, then realized it was about my daughter. (never in a fight before)
Now Im spooked I went out to my car and my tire was flat, a big hole no nail just a hole. I locked my car behind our fence instead of leaving it parked outside the gate. I didn't tell my daughter, I wondered if it was done in retaliation to the police filing.
I dont follow the boxing circut, but Sugar Shane Mosley (a famous boxer) and his wife Jen come in for us to fix their computers.
He wrote my daughter a note about her fight
("keep your head down and watch the uppper cut")
I gave it to her to show her friends. It made her feel important with the kids.
she was feeling uneasy because the kids said she didn't fight back (this girl 3 times bigger).
I think I may have hit her back. I grew up with 3 sisters and a twin brother, we fought all the time.
she is an only child and has little reason to be fighting.
I told her she didn't need to explain, not hitting back.
I guess I will need to show her some blocking moves or work on defending herself before this happens again.
Most of them expected to see a fight that day, I'm glad she walked away or she would have been expelled with a host of other problems.
My husband still does not know.
The N's will turn things around. I could picture him saying something mean like she deserved it. She has a smart mouth and I can just picture she may have said something to this girls friend about the way she played the vollyball. She may have thought nothing, but it may have sounded like she had an attitude. Just the same if this girl had a problem with it she should have dealt with it, not get someone else involved.
At 12, even looking a certain way could cause problems.
Somtimes she gets angry at her dad and will say it with an attitude, it would open a door for him everytime.
I am working on dealing with her dad getting better, he said the surgery was a complete failure. I don't know how he figures this. He has feelings in his legs and they fixed 3 herniated disk. He said his hip hurts and he wants an x-ray and write up on what they did.
I had to go the the doctors today to get paper work on the blood test he needs for the blood clot. I told the nurses that he is difficult and will not follow directions. The nurse said the doctor wants us both to come in to talk about the results. I came home to get him to go but he said not today. No surprize.
I know I have written enough for now my daughter wants on the computer
thanks so much for responding......onlyrenting
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Why the movers and rental units.
He has a rental unit to keep his stuff out of the garage. (tools and machines).
This was just the case in my situation not necessarily with yours, onlyrenting1.
Is there a legal aid clinic you could contact? Perhaps with your husband's disability you would qualify for assistance. Otherwise, the State Bar of California has a Lawyer Referral Service http://www.calbar.ca.gov/state/calbar/calbar_generic.jsp?cid=10182&id=1403 If it's like most states, they can probably refer you to a family law lawyer who would do an initial consult for a nominal fee. I think it's between $25-$50. The lawyer can give you recommendations and advice about how to proceed. At least you'd have some idea of what to expect.
As for the car - bummer. Too much stuff on your plate, right now. Deep breaths. Try to do something nice for yourself this weekend. This whole situation with your husband didn't evolve overnight and it can't be unravelled in a day either. Take care and know you can come here for support.
Best,
bludie
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Bludie,
Thank you for the web site, I'm sure I will qualify for some assistance.
I found about 10 Women lawyer phone numbers in my local area,
this is a good start on having some of my questions answered.
I kept busy around the house trying to get rid of some old junk.
still keeping my focus to move.
My husband was being his nice self today.
Its like you can see it in his eyes when he is his nice self, as well as his mean self.
One time he asked me what I thought of his eyes, I said they looked like shark eyes. (blue, cold,sometimes deep blue, far away) I didn't think much of it then, I was just saying my thoughts. I used to think why would I say that. Now Im looking closer and saying I can see it in his eyes. It's very odd.
Bludie, thank you again, I appreciate your time and all your efforts to help me think through my very clouding thoughts.
onlyrenting
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Onlyrenting1,
Here are other links that may give you more legal information:
http://www.eddylaw.com/vol2_no1_art4.htm
http://www.bpdcentral.com/bks/spy.shtml You sound as though you're really sorting through things, onlyrenting1. Looking at your situation but also examining why/how you got there. The truth will set us free and the only ones we can change are ourselves. Keep us updated and hope you and your daughter have a better week.
Best,
bludie
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HI, I just wanted to let you all know where my plans are going here.
My H, is up and walking, driving and He wants to move out of the state and leave us ( we are OK and look forward if he leaves)
He said he didnt want us to move to Dallas and told me he was going to go get a gun and shoot me then himself .
(I doubt he would shoot himself of course, I would be dead so why would he bother)
I told him I would call the police if he ever said that to me again.
He said he was mad and doesnt want us to move with him. His brother told him he was making a big mistake and he needs to get it together and didn't want him to move there without us.
His brother was going to help us as a family and is so upset with him. My N-H wants me to convince his brother I really dont want to go and not to be upset with my N-H. We are the horrible ones and he just is not wanting to be married anymore or care to raise a teen.
Im looking into the laws of California where we live, and what happens if he moves to Dallas. I have found some good web sites from Bunny, and Bludie and want to know all I can. I found a place to look for some free legal help and working on getting this in gear in the next few weeks.
I have some tax money comming and would need to move out of our house (rental) if my H moves out first and leaves me where I cant afford to stay. so I have been packing and moving things in the garage. Im almost ready and would be taking my daughter out of school but have no choice.
things are still unclear where I will live but very clear I will be moving on without my N-H. That is so clear from both of our views.
We had some bad wind and the Electricity has been out for 12hrs.
Its late but wanted to share got to go.
.Onlyrenting
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onlyrenting,
I would take his threat very seriously. I think he is extremely dependent, childlike, and unable to face life without his family to control/abuse. Plus it makes him look bad and "lose face."
PLEASE BE CAREFUL.
I hope he goes away but I'm not counting on it.
bunny
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Onlyrenting1,
I agree with bunny. A balanced person -- even in the heat of anger -- should never make such threats. Do you have relatives in the area where you and your daughter could stay if things get heated? Are you still planning to move to Dallas (sorry I've been away from the board for a while so I may be behind in your posts). Any chance you could get an apartment in the same school district?
The reason for my last question is because I've dealt with the aftermath of my daughter changing high schools. Although I see some long term advantages (smaller school and she's in with a better crowd now) it's taken months for her to adjust. To minimize the impact on your daughter it might be worth exploring. Or perhaps the school would allow her to continue even if she's out of district.
Even though your daughter may be relieved when your husband is out of the picture, I bet she'll experience ambivalence. She is is likely to be sad and confused for a while because it is a huge change. The more you can stabilize her world, the better.
Just some ideas. I know you've got a lot going on and it really sounds like you're moving forward and handling it well. Keep us posted and, as always, hang in there.
Best,
bludie
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Thanks Bunny and Bludie, for your continued support of me.
This is such a nitemare, Yes I have relatives, but to impose on them would be so beyond anything I would want to do. I have an N mother and even though she lives far away her poision travels with my sisters.
I do have a nephew who I could run to if I had to.
I told my H if he was leaving as I understood him to be planning on, I would be giving a 30day notice today to the landlord.
Now he said is staying here. Great, He is planning on having the Dept of Rehab help him with job placement.
I guess he, like you said Bunny, would lose face with his family in Dallas.
His brother is so livid with him he knows he would not be welcomed.
I will be getting my taxes back, I have them being prepared monday and expect a direct deposit into my account in the next weeks.
I will be making this my last month here if at all possible.
My daughter is upset and does not want to leave her friends. She is in 7th grade Jr. high I know it would be difficult for her. She wants to stay until after 8th grade, it will only get harder. If I think too hard I would talk myself out of it until June.. maybe if she only has to adjust a few months then has the summer to make friends it should work out. She makes me worry if her Dad is here she would suddenly feel torn to stay here.
Sometimes she wants to leave and other times not.
My H says he wants to leave us, willing to move out of state and with a threat if we go with him, he would shoot me, but now he changes his mind, so Im thinking it may be away to subject us to his control.
He may want to know where and what my plans are.
I get a gut feeling I may need move on this faster than I thought yesterday.
Or he could just be realizing he is not welcomed in Dallas now and will not want us to go either but still leave or go away, as long as he cant enjoy living near family so neither should we.
this is almost like killing us both without a gun.
I think tomorrow I will be in the legal aid office before I go into work.
if I get the papers started and find out how to protect myself I will feel better. I worry if he thinks something is up, he may get his own plan in place before I can have the money to move. I need to be careful.
My H has never been physical never hit me, and he is fine now, we dont own a gun, I know he was just very upset and he says things that are so beyond what you or I would say. I hope I can convey all of his feelings to a legal aid to get proper custody.
He may be like someothers who may not even care about all the legal stuff, but then may try and talk me out of it or demand mediation even after all of this. I will find out if and when I would need any documentaion I have on his unstable condition.
He is on morphine and lots of other drugs, with him its more than drugs, but maybe this would be easier to explain than the N behavior disorder?
Lots to think about. onlyrenting
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onlyrenting1,
I feel for you having to face such a tough situation. In my case, I am fortunate to have the time and resources to sort things out before I jump. Tho after my recent experiences, I am getting real clear that things are not going to work out for me with my wife.
This is such a nitemare, Yes I have relatives, but to impose on them would be so beyond anything I would want to do. I have an N mother and even though she lives far away her poision travels with my sisters.
I do have a nephew who I could run to if I had to.
Do you have any friends you can call on? You may be surprised what people will do for you if you give them the chance. I have long been held back by shame that if people found out about my situation they would blame me and cut ties with me. People's reaction have been exactly the opposite of my fears and I have gotten more support and help than I could have imagined since I shared my story.
My H says he wants to leave us, willing to move out of state and with a threat if we go with him, he would shoot me, but now he changes his mind, so Im thinking it may be away to subject us to his control.
He may want to know where and what my plans are.
I get a gut feeling I may need move on this faster than I thought yesterday.
Or he could just be realizing he is not welcomed in Dallas now and will not want us to go either but still leave or go away, as long as he cant enjoy living near family so neither should we.
this is almost like killing us both without a gun.
My H has never been physical never hit me, and he is fine now, we dont own a gun, I know he was just very upset and he says things that are so beyond what you or I would say. I hope I can convey all of his feelings to a legal aid to get proper custody.
From your descriptions, I don't agree that "he is fine now". He will only be fine when he is willing to feel all of his feelings and faces his issues. Has he done that yet? Abuse doesn't have to be physical to cause fear, injury and pain.
I think you should go with your gut feeling and start things moving as soon as possible. You can always stop later if you decide it isn't the right approach for you. At least this way you will know what is involved and what you need to do to be able to make that decision.
Be safe, be happy.
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Longtire,
The N is never just fine, but when ever there is peace we're doing fine for the moment.
From your descriptions, I don't agree that "he is fine now". He will only be fine when he is willing to feel all of his feelings and faces his issues. Has he done that yet? Abuse doesn't have to be physical to cause fear, injury and pain
Feel ???? all of his feelings. ( he has a diagnosis along with being an N, for surpessing what ever it is anger or feelings )
He has no Issues, = (N)
I understand verbal abuse, is abuse. some of us have grown up with one or more N parents, I can be numb to Verbal hurts.
I called the legal aid to move on filing papers and making an appointment before I went to work today but had to to leave a message.
I will not take the comment about the gun, out of my head, it is giving me a big slap in the brain to get the hell out of here.
I can't let this one go, I believe this is a turning point for me.
It was not apparent his distain for both our daughter and myself until he believed he would be better without us if he moved to Dallas alone.
I believe now his hate for us will only get worse. his Feelings are now in the open for all to see. He will now need to make sence of this hate.
It makes no sense, only in his mind.
Today he pushes my daughters buttons, she asked him to stop, she gets mad at him and sounds like a B**ch.
He later tells me how much he hates her.
I asked him to never say he hates her to me, Im her mother and right now, what comes out of his mouth has no weight with me.
So it now becomes a chore to know who to correct for the bad behavior.
He has no respect for us and I dont want my daughter to learn disrespect.
it comes to a point where her feelings won't be ignored.
Because of the hurt that he continues to display to us both, Im having a hard time with sheilding him from her wrath. I don't care about him right now, Im so hurt myself, I find Im in such disbelief of my life.
Im angry but understand Im not alone. all the help of those who share their understanding of what I am just learning. The stories I read and maybe didnt even know was a feeling worth deal with, gets me through a difficult day. I have come to depend on this board for guidance and to validate the crazy things that happen with an N.
I want to leave, Im making my way to this goal. I feel more brave everyday. I remember how I just up and left home 2 weeks after my 18th birthday.
I had more friends then, no children and not the same difficulties to consider.
I had my fill of my N mother, no plan just packed a few things, said I was going out (left a note I wasn't comming back) imposed on some friends and stayed with my older sister until I got my own place.
I have been here before, not having a plan with a child is risky and very scary to me. Being married to an N makes having friends difficult.
I make friends easily but I like my home life simple. My husband in the past makes every friend a threat to him, so I dont bother to encourage relationships.
I find as I begin to mentally break away I want to be happy, I do not want miss this past 26yrs.
I wonder when I look at the family picture on my key chain if its time to put it away. My husband looks like a younger Mel Gibson so very handsome, I had the auburn redish hair (now its miss Clairol)with big green eyes, but the looks are fading for both of us.
I want to do something now before I get any older. We are all unhappy, I need to be strong for us all and move on the best we can.
Thanks for letting me share... onlyrenting.
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Onlyrenting said: "My H has never been physical but how do you prove the mental abuse.
having this medical report has only a brief statement "self-absorbed Narsisstic, thats it. I will keep writing things maybe I should keep copies of the the emails his brother has sent regarding his behavior too.
"
Hi sweetness. This jumped out at me right away. If there is a future fight in court (for custody or anything, even you asking for a restraining order against him...) the smartest thing you can do is to get copies of those emails and put them somewhere in a safe place. Judges want to see proof, or they won't give it any weight. Try to gather and store as much information as you can about him, to protect yourself and your daughter from him.
If he said he would shoot you, that is a threat and it is illegal to threaten anyone. I am so worried about you. Please take care of yourself and get somewhere safe as soon as you possibly can. You have been suffering with this too long, imo.
I hope the best for you...I truly do. [/quote]
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Onlyrenting1,
You are doing amazingly well amid all these trying circumstances. Don't get discouraged and take the time you need to get all your affairs in order so you can make a clean break. Mum's advice has merit. When the heat is on, and our lives are stress-filled, it's easy to just want relief. It sounds as if you're taking the necessary steps to move ahead thoughtfully and carefully. I am very glad you're seeking legal advice. Is the plan still for you and your daughter to move to Dallas? If so, is your Ns brother still willing to help?
I called the legal aid to move on filing papers and making an appointment before I went to work today but had to to leave a message.
I will not take the comment about the gun, out of my head, it is giving me a big slap in the brain to get the hell out of here.
I can't let this one go, I believe this is a turning point for me.
I think it is very wise to be aware and alert. Throughout your posts it has sounded as if your husband is becoming more desperate and volatile.
He has no respect for us and I dont want my daughter to learn disrespect.
it comes to a point where her feelings won't be ignored.
Because of the hurt that he continues to display to us both, Im having a hard time with sheilding him from her wrath. I don't care about him right now, Im so hurt myself, I find Im in such disbelief of my life.
Encourage your daughter to spend as much time with friends as possible. This will not only shield her from his button-pushing behavior but allows time to connect with friends that she'll miss if you do, in fact, move.
You're doing great, onlyrenting1. We'll continue to be here for support. My best to you.
bludie
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Onlyrenting:
I have read with dismay about your situation. I can only support you in how you are trying to get out it. I too was married for 25 yrs to an N. You are just busy slogging along trying to survive and then one day you wake up.........it has been all about them at your expense. I went to dinner with a group last night, they are all about in our age group. All of them were married except me. There was one couple I will call X. They had recently married for the 2nd time. As I begin to listen to this couple it was apparent that the woman had married for economic reasons alone. As you are preparing to extricate yourself from this horrible situation, my desire is that you will find a safe, secure, peaceful place. I hope you have the means to support yourself. No one deserves what you are going through. The nature of N's really come out when money they have squandered is gone, the looks are fading, the health is failing..........in essence the bubble he has lived in.......reality is tapping him on the shoulder. That is when they really begin to take it out on others around them........they want you to maintain that image of what he was like years ago. If anything you deserve a peaceful life for the remainder of your "good years" without an N and N family members dictating to you. Patz
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Naomi, Bludie, and PATZ
the smartest thing you can do is to get copies of those emails and put them somewhere in a safe place. Judges want to see proof, or they won't give it any weight. Try to gather and store as much information as you can about him, to protect yourself and your daughter from him.
If he said he would shoot you, that is a threat and it is illegal to threaten anyone. I am so worried about you. Please take care of yourself and get somewhere safe as soon as you possibly can. You have been suffering with this too long, imo.
I will be printing off those e-mails, getting medical reports showing the meds he is on and his physological reports. Do you know what this means?? Total NEUROTICISM I found this in the same report with Narc.
Im sleeping on the couch and can't look at him, I give no eye contact.
I have this thing about the gun comment, I cant ignore it, We know about how this threat started with the comment about OJ and Scott Peterson.
I feel Im messing with fire as I continue to make plans to move. He said he was staying here so I think he expects Im moving out but not sure where or what to do as he watches me packing.
Bludie, Encourage your daughter to spend as much time with friends as possible. This will not only shield her from his button-pushing behavior but allows time to connect with friends that she'll miss if you do, in fact, move.
You're doing great, onlyrenting1. We'll continue to be here for support. My best to you.
Thanks for your special insite to my daughters plight. I am trying to consider her well being in all directions. Im still planning on moving to Dallas. They are hiring now, Im told now is the time if im going.
I know she doesnt want to move and would miss her friends.
I can't commit to staying here because of we can't afford it.
Im waiting for a friend to do my taxes, I need to figure out what to do with the moving plans. I have a friend who is asking an across country truck driving company to haul my car and the best way to get my stuff moved.
Im not going to count on my husband or his brother to help me.
Im not going to push his brother to help me. He knows about the threat from my husband. He tells me to indeed call the police if I feel the need, and confirms with me my H is unstable and to lay low.
I have not gotten any e-mails from him regarding our last conversation. Maybe he feels dishearten and has changed his mind. Maybe realizing a sadness about this whole situation and not sure how to proceed.
He encourages me to take the Job and move to Dallas and I know he wants to help. I think we're all trying to find our grounding as my H's plans change with the wind.
I had been moving unnoticeable things in the garage, extra dishes, my daughters stuff , throwing old clothes, but today Im removing noticeable things from our bedroom, it says I dont belong here anymore.
I was gone most of the day, I got a ticket and had to go to traffic school.
it was an 8hr day. I came home, He was watching TV with our daughter, took her to buy a CD, and had bought a pizza.
This gets me worried , I see him as the Vampire trying to pump back the blood in his N-supply. I know he will turn quickly with a cruel word or to suck our emotions dry. It makes me sick now, I spent the time moving stuff in the garage to get my mind off him trying to be part of the family, he hates so much.
He said he is not going to Dallas, and is staying here. He sees me removing my things but not saying anything about it. Never a sorry or recognition of any hurt feelings. No surprize, its the typical lets forget about it, I choose not to go into it with him, I just dont care.
Patz
If anything you deserve a peaceful life for the remainder of your "good years" without an N and N family members dictating to you. Patz
Patz, how do you deal with 25 years, as Im packing I go thru many memories and try to not get chocked up. I look back on the reasons I stayed and put up with it. It really was because I loved my husband and wanted to make it all work. I thought it was his physical pain causing his major problem.
with the knowledge of the N my thinking has now changed and I don't see the same reasons to make it work anylonger.
Did you have kids? I think as my daughter gets into the teens, life is hitting him, its not all about him.
I don't have the funds like I wished I had, because I have been supporting us, My husband has had 5 surgeries in 5 years. he is on SSI/Workercomp/Disibility, its complicated.
Money has been tight and is the reason we planned to move.
Thinking about being with other men,having them around my daughter. The single life, being single and around other married couples,
it's all sounding depressing. I will just wait for it all to happen and just go with the flow, What else can you do.
thanks for the encouragement to keep me going in a positive direction.
.....onlyrenting1
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I so feel for you onlyrenting1.
Just want to say, don't be too afraid of being on your own and single, I'm enjoying it more than I ever thought I would. The stronger I get, the 'problems' (such as being the odd one out) are less important.
You're going through the worst now, and when you leave, your strength and courage will see you through.
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Onlyrenting1,
You're dealing with a very overwhelming situation. Some days will be harder than others. You're showing an amazing amount of fortitude, strength and tenacity. Don't underestimate how far you've come.
Thinking about being with other men,having them around my daughter. The single life, being single and around other married couples,
it's all sounding depressing. I will just wait for it all to happen and just go with the flow, What else can you do.
It's very normal to be wondering about this but that is too far off in the future. Stay focused and get yourself out of there. Safety has to come first. There will be time to process your emotions later. There are bound to be plenty of mixed emotions. Try to steel ("numb," as you have referred to in past posts) yourself right now and remember the threat he made. That's no small thing. Don't let doubt and reminscing undermine your intuitions about his volatility. You need to get out of there - first and foremost.
When you get to Dallas and get on your feet, you can get some counseling or help for you and your daughter to process these very overwhelming emotions. Maybe it's best that his brother isn't involved. You can truly make a clean break for the time being.
My heart and prayers go out to you and your daughter. You're doing a wonderful job of keeping things together amid your sadness. Keep going and try to stay focused.
{{{onlyrenting1}}}
Best,
bludie
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Kaz, thanks for the encouragement.
It is scary and I worry. Often I would go to family functions by myself, my H always found a reason to suddenly get in an argument and not want to go. All of these years together but somehow I feel alone. I will surely adjust more quickly than I imagine. hence the name (onlyrenting)
I have an early morning meeting, got to go.....onlyrenting
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Dearest Only:
On reflection, the only thing that kept me going was my only child. Early on it was apparent that my son was autistic. I had to stay put because I have a very dysfunctional family. Even though I was educated (self made I might add), I could not continue my teaching because my son needed so much help. I begged continually for my husband to move us to another location because the services in our area were so lacking. It was about his job, (he could have easily gotten another because of his education), it was about his organizations, it was just continually about him. I had to stay for 22 years because of economic reasons. He then decided he was going in business for himself and got us deeply into debt. I realized he had to go.........I told him I was moving regardless, that he would have to support us because of the documentation on my son. If he didn't find a decent job to retire debt, then the court would make him do it. I had to get out. He lied to me about the nature of who he was for about 15 years of our marriage. I found out when he came from overseas he was a cross dresser. Devastated is not the word. When you see a window of opportunity Only, take it whatever you need to do.
Your N is very unstable. When he confronts you finally about things missing and he seea you are really leaving, get the police to escort you out. Your daughter will eventually come to gripes with who and what he is. Right now keep a log of his activity, his threats, his e-mails. Whatever documentation you need for court. In fact I would go to the police station without his knowledge and let them know how on edge he is. Ask them the best way to leave and keep them apprised of the situation. You can also use this in court, because you have offically reported it to the authorities. He has threatened you and your daughter the police need to know that they have a potential problem on their hands. Silence is your worst enemy. Let as many people who are in authority know what is going on.
He is a mentally ill individual dictating your life. You need to view it in that fashion. You cannot reason with people who are not rational. The OJ and Peterson case is exhibit A as for psychopathic behavior. Someone on another message board wanted how your reality is real or distorted.
I think a distorted reality is that individual trying to shape the norm to the shape of his twisted reality. It is like looking at the shape of an egg and saying this egg is square and it bounces. This is distorted thinking. Reality is the egg is oval and it will break.
Reality is your N is mentally ill. Rational humans do things that are not counterproductive. To stay in the distorted reality and to shape your life, your persona to that kind of thinking will also make you ill and continue to endanger you life. It took me about 7 years to finally get things together. It will not happen over night. I assure a day does not pass that I do not thank God above for the peace, quiet and security I now possess. There is no enough money in the world, or another man, I might add that I will exchange this for. Much love and hugs to you. Patz
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Onlyrenting:
Couple of thoughts:
Decide what you want your life to feel like. (looks like you know that).
Let that drive you, nothing else, not even fear. If you really look at fear, it's suppose to help you, not become a way of life. Immediate, physical fear of your ill husband is telling you something...you are wise to heed it. Psychological fear that he has cooked up for you to keep you stuck is the stuff you need to ignore (can I really do this, doubts, etc).
Don't worry about men/dating/future relationships. I was so happy to find out that after 13 years of berating, that I actually was attractive, and I married another, more "flashy" N without even knowing what drove my choice. If I had been "clear" I never would have had that second marriage. YOU count now, your daughter counts now.....not a man's opinion of you (however flattering it may be). Don't even worry about it now.
You daughter will recover from moving. No kid wants to move... or hardly ever. A healthy, happy mother and home is far more important to her in the long run. Far more! Be very careful and get lots of solid legal backing on the move. Don't be scared by this, just be smart....courts can be stupid with the "best interests" of the child translating into "split them down the middle, half to each parent" without even considering if one parent is bad for the child. I would make sure your ex can't accuse you of "taking" his child away from him... In her vulnerable state (7th grade....got one myself), it could be very easy for him to manipulate her and feed on her fear of moving, and sorrow for him (my ex is expert at that one).
Remember this is not about making other people in your life "comfortable" for the moment (not even your child). It is about you taking care of you, and this is the best demonstration of how an adult woman should do life that you can show your daughter. Imagine the power she will see....and know for herself.
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Bludie,MUM,Patz,
Try to steel ("numb," as you have referred to in past posts) yourself right now and remember the threat he made. That's no small thing. Don't let doubt and reminscing undermine your intuitions about his volatility. You need to get out of there - first and foremost.
Thanks for all your support,
I will try to steel up, and keep my focus. I dont truly expect my emotions are going to be stable right now, so I will not put to much energy into them.
I will not let my changing feelings direct me, my anger, my sadness, my fear, they all come and go.
Patz
I would go to the police station without his knowledge and let them know how on edge he is. Ask them the best way to leave and keep them apprised of the situation. You can also use this in court, because you have offically reported it to the authorities. He has threatened you and your daughter the police need to know that they have a potential problem on their hands. Silence is your worst enemy. Let as many people who are in authority know what is going on.
I will do this and have it on record as a backup, I will not let him know about it. I have told his brother, but I agree the people of authority is the key.
I think a distorted reality is that individual trying to shape the norm to the shape of his twisted reality. It is like looking at the shape of an egg and saying this egg is square and it bounces. This is distorted thinking. Reality is the egg is oval and it will break.
To stay in the distorted reality and to shape your life, your persona to that kind of thinking will also make you ill and continue to endanger you life. It took me about 7 years to finally get things together. It will not happen over night
[/quote]
I will keep this in mind. I honeslty feel as I have the power to see the true shape of the egg and know its not going to bounce.
I may have in the past believed its true shape but needed to battle the idea it would not bounce with my N. This is no doubt a danger and I know now the battle will be lost so I can no longer stay for the fight.
As I understand he will never see he has a problem, he already is on so much medicine his mental state is unstable. I would have in the past have tried to understand all of this as a passing mental state. I nolonger believe it can be helped, feeling hopeless.
Mum
happy mother and home is far more important to her in the long run. Far more! Be very careful and get lots of solid legal backing on the move. Don't be scared by this, just be smart....courts can be stupid with the "best interests" of the child translating into "split them down the middle, half to each parent" without even considering if one parent is bad for the child. I would make sure your ex can't accuse you of "taking" his child away from him... In her vulnerable state (7th grade....got one myself), it could be very easy for him to manipulate her and feed on her fear of moving, and sorrow for him (my ex is expert at that one).
I think this is a very fearful and risky part for me. I will be prepared.
make sure it all will be apparent what Im dealing with. My daughter is feeling she wants to be able to see her Dad once a month. I understand I need to be cooropertive with the courts on this. Im worried I want to move away and now he decided he wants to stay here.
I will be looking at all of the points and consider them with some legal advise. Having him agree to let me move may not be as difficult as I imagine. We will see.....
Thanks for all of your thoughts I will be making some phone calls before I go to work on Monday. I have to go the court house about my traffic ticket and will inquire then on some questions.
My h- is trying to be nice right now asking us both to go to the movies
I told him no thanks, dont think he is too happy. It really gets me how he can be so mean never say sorry and now act like nothing has ever happend. I will be numb to lure.....
.onlyrenting
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onlyrenting1,
Hang in there. We all have feelings of fear, not being able to cope by ourselves (well non-N's of us do). The great thing is that you are an adult even when it doesn't feel like it. You can do a lot more than you believe right now. Feel your feelings, accept that's how you feel, then pick yourself up and do what you need to do to be safe and happy. I feel a lot of strength in you each time you post. I believe that you can do (and already are doing) everything you will ever need to do.
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longtire
I feel a lot of strength in you each time you post. I believe that you can do (and already are doing) everything you will ever need to do
I need to believe this with all my heart, I wonder if my writings can be some what clumsy to what I really want to convey. I need to be stronger than my H and the encouragement goes along way.
I will stay positive for my daughter. I was proud of her. My H, wanted us to go the the movies,I said no thanks. I asked her if she was going, she said NO.
I asked her why? she said because he will get her down there then make remarks about the moive she would want to see, put it down in some way. She gets fustrated with the mixed messages he sends.
I dont want to make her decisions or sway her, if she can do her own thinking not be swayed then she too will be stronger, not be swayed as the emotional wind changes in our house hold.
thanks again ....onlyrenting
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Dear Only:
I remember well when I first went out on my own, the waves of anxiety, the fear. However, take it one day at a time. Things may seem over whelming right now, but just bear in mind the fact you are making plans. You are going forward, however painful, it feels, you are moving forward.
I equate all of this much like to getting into a boat on a river. The boat is at the dock, you see the river winding ahead of you. You see the N on the dock. You keep motioning to him to get in the boat, he just shakes his head no and is glued to the dock. You see the captain in the boat telling you it is about to leave. You look at the N you look at the boat, you decide to get in. You keeping looking back, and you still see the N on the dock, thinking you will come back. The boat is leaving and your getting futher and futher down the river. You are reaching the point where you are rounding the bend, you can no longer see the dock, the N. You just know that the scenery is changing and your on the river of life. You can now disembark at any time and go on to your appointed destination. Patz
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Patz
This senario, hits me so hard. When I was staying with my BIL in Dallas
he was telling me how he was trying to help my H and all of us.
throwing him the life saver, hold on we want to help you, you're drowning, but my-H won't take the life saver.
It's like the boat is in at the Dock waiting for us all to get in, but the N refuses to go. He not only refuses to go, but says we can't go either.
The same life saver is being offered to us all, but he won't let us hold on before we drown.
I may be at the dock trying to get in the boat or being offered a life saver and he's holding a gun or a threat not to take it, But he forgets I know how to swim.
I don't have to have the boat or need the life saver, Im a great swimmer and will keep this in my head thanks for the visual.
I do understand the Idea about him staying on the dock and moving around the bend no longer seeing the difficult past. It makes me very emotional to think about this picture, especialy how right now he is trying to be very nice to me.
This swimming thing just came to me...I'm taking the flippers to give me a little extra speed.
.thanks onlyrenting
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Dearest Only:
I kept this image in my mind of how I was doing by going back to see my N husband. Every time I would get back in the boat I would sail a little further down the river. I would go back, he was still stuck on the dock. Pretty soon I would be so far down the river, there was a point of no return. If you can keep this image in your mind, it will help you to move forward, even if you have to swim. Believe it or not if you jump in to swim there will be a life saver to haul you on board. Just reach out to as many of the life savers around you right now.
Yes, it is emotional when the dock is out of sigt, you are rounding the bend and it is new scenery. No N in sight, only memories. I assure you as you continue on your destination, the memories become like a video. It is not you in the film at all, but some other creature. The person you have become does not resemble the person in the video at all. You have become someone and something else. The life before and after the N is startling. Many hugs, Patz
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Patz
or not if you jump in to swim there will be a life saver to haul you on board. Just reach out to as many of the life savers around you right now.
the life savers are a comfort, swimming in the wide open ocean of life can be scary enough. I will be accepting and keep it in my mind to reach out.
The person you have become does not resemble the person in the video at all. You have become someone and something else
.
The change has already begun, it's still making me want to cry, but maybe its tears of joy about my future not so much the past. not sure about the tears but I will tell myself its joy not sadness for now.
I'm swimming in the big ocean maybe not one will notice.
Today there was a police officer in the area, I asked his thoughts on the comment about the gun. He gave me his card and a case number, called it citizens assist.
It would be documented and understood he gave me advise about the situation.
I feel better the goal was accomplished without any drama.
onlyrenting1
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I love the river analogy. I got it last night for my situation:
I stepped off the dock onto what I thought was my boat. It was only after the boat had left the dock and was too far from land that I realized I got on my wife's boat instead! To make things worse, its heading in eactly the wrong direction, directly into huge waves and a fierce storm. I'm terrified, but she just ignores the storm and pretends like nothing is wrong. Finally, the boat turns back toward land again. I'm poised to jump off the boat, swim to shore and get on my own damn boat this time! I keep telling my wife that I'm leaving but she ignores me just like she ignores the still raging storm and huge waves.
Today there was a police officer in the area, I asked his thoughts on the comment about the gun. He gave me his card and a case number, called it citizens assist.
It would be documented and understood he gave me advise about the situation.
I feel better the goal was accomplished without any drama.
Good for you onlyrenting1! I admire your ability to take advantage of the situation and your judgement in deciding whether this police officer was open to hearing your situation. Brava!
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Wow, powerful river analogies. Considering I live along the ole Miz I'll keep this in mind next time I'm watching the locks.
Onlyrenting1, beautiful. A+ -- You handled the gun/police situation like a champ.
Patz, I appreciate so many of your insights and yours, too, longtire.
Best,
bludie
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longtire, Bludie, Patz,
Longtire wrote
I stepped off the dock onto what I thought was my boat. It was only after the boat had left the dock and was too far from land that I realized I got on my wife's boat instead! To make things worse, its heading in eactly the wrong direction, directly into huge waves and a fierce storm. I'm terrified, but she just ignores the storm and pretends like nothing is wrong. Finally, the boat turns back toward land again. I'm poised to jump off the boat, swim to shore and get on my own damn boat this time! I keep telling my wife that I'm leaving but she ignores me just like she ignores the still raging storm and huge waves.
This was great, (it made me laugh, kinda unexpected)
The way the storm gets ignored. Im getting the ignoring the storm now. Lets pretend we all love each other, see Im behaving.
I may ask one more time but ony if it's my boat, if he will get in the boat like, Patz says. Maybe we can move get out to Dallas then see if the enviornment make a differance. I don't know,but Im leaving with or without him.
I was hearing about his surgery and how he learned he has Osteoporosis( ?) I said Im sorry I don't want to know so please DONT tell me about it.
He now has RA along with this too. So Im done, remember you dont care about us so PLEASE!!!!!STOP. He said thank you for being honest, OK I wont mention it again.
I get home and he's talking to Our D, telling her so she will hear it but me indirectly.
I'm just letting the waves settle before the next big storm comes in.
I plan on being on my own boat before then. The police officer said to call them to come out if I needed help leaving peacefully. Working on the trip to the lawyers for the D-papers and some guidance on the child custody.
it maybe Friday am. I testing the waters and which way the winds going to blow.
Longtire :
Good for you onlyrenting1! I admire your ability to take advantage of the situation and your judgement in deciding whether this police officer was open to hearing your situation. Brava
At first he said just call, if I need them.
(we don't own a gun and he felt it was his meds talking)
I then asked for his card and the date I talked to him and what it was about, he then gave me the case number and called on his dispatch for the Citzens assist.
Bludie
Onlyrenting1, beautiful. A+ -- You handled the gun/police situation like a champ.
You all are giving me the confidence, Thank you so so much.
Onlyrenting....
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Dear All:
Using the river analogy was the only way I could cope. Also another theme that is very helpful is one I call the "Island". You are stuck on the island with the N. Everything on the island is about the N. There is no way off. Then you look up and you see that island is in the river. The river is streaming by on either side of you, it is the river of life. You see many people, many occuptations, many destinations streaming by. Then you see the one lone boat coming your way, you make a jump for it. It is the only way off the island of isolation. You just know you have to make any attempt, because life is passing you by on either side. We all live in the stream of life and it is flowing. You must flow as well.
Congrats! Only.........please contact as many people as possible about your situation.........it is the way off the island. Much love, Patz
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Onlyrenting,
Awesome idea to tell the police officer about the threat. It doesn't matter if you don't own a weapon. He made a very serious threat on your lives. Separation is the most dangerous time. I'm glad you're protecting yourself and your daughter!
Keep up the great work,
bunny
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Hi Bunny,
Separation is the most dangerous
I'm wondering why now he is being all sweet, trying to strike up conversations. I don't engage. He just asked me something, I just didn't respond. He got up and went in the other room.
He must be testing me to see if I will forget what he has done to us.
I am not going to forget. I haven't been able to say much more than I don't want to know, what's going on with him. I asked him not to tell me.
I need to be careful with my next step. It is the plan to leave. I guess I can only imagine the dangers you speak of.
I'm guessing the route to take first. Once one-step down that road, the next steps need to be quick.
Im trying to get into talk with some legal aid on my plans to move to Dallas and what would happen if he wont let me go, even if we cant afford to live here.
Im afraid to remind him Im still leaving to Dallas, he thinks he had the last word with his threat. I know when I mention my job called me and wants me to come up now or asap. He will freak.
Thanks bunny
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I'm wondering why now he is being all sweet, trying to strike up conversations. I don't engage. He just asked me something, I just didn't respond. He got up and went in the other room.
He must be testing me to see if I will forget what he has done to us.
I am not going to forget. I haven't been able to say much more than I don't want to know, what's going on with him. I asked him not to tell me.
Part of the push-pull behavior of an N trying to keep you off guard. While our guard is down they study us to gather more ammo'. Sounds paranoid but I think it can be quite true in some cases. At least that is the conclusion I am drawing on this God-forsaken night. :(
Best,
bludie
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Hello All:
I think bludie is right here. Narcs are like sharks. They smell your weakness from miles away. They are very adept at zeroing in on the "soft spots" and manipulate them like crazy. I don't think it is paranoia at all to keep your guard up. I remember my N when he wanted me to do something he knew I was against, he would be all sweetness and light. Just trying to maneuver you into a position of weakness so he can get what he wants. Afterwards, it was if you did not exist again. Patz
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Today I went to Legal Aid, and I don't qualify. I make too much money. but I will attend a workshop on monday 8Am, They will help me fill out leagal papers.
This morning I told my H, I plan on moving to Dallas, After what he said to me I have no choice but to depend on myself.
He made comment like "You just want your way"
So I get home from work sitting on the table is a letter with my name.
I said what is this about,?
(thinking he went to the court house before me,Damm) He said this is what you need to know (something like that)
Its a letter all about his health issuies.
It starts out "this is the 411"
How the doctors say he could Die, with any stress the blood clot could dislodge.
Along with he needed therapy until further notice, then Workerscomp legal battles, he is planning on paying the March Rent, so he's not going anywhere.
(my Medical is paying right now and he could move and have therapy there.)
I said nothing and made it sound like I tore the letter up.
Bludie,
Part of the push-pull behavior of an N trying to keep you off guard. While our guard is down they study us to gather more ammo'
PATZ Narcs are like sharks
I know he is using this letter to use my weekness, that I should care.
I wouldn't leave him while he is down, thats what he counts on.
I know he planned to move with out us and would not care if I was in need. If his brother had made it easy for him he would have been gone.
So I will let him think this letter will make me change my mind, I need to keep him off his guard. tommorrow, I will let my work know I will be in to work a little late that day. I don't know what to expect or what I will learn.
I will keep your visuals about the Island and the boat in my head, and keep reaching out to others as I go step by step.
Thanks so much, I know you all are having your own struggles, Ive been reading the other threads and appreciate your time to keep in touch.
Onlyrenting
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Only:
Yep, just let him think the letter hit your "soft spot", then get on the boat and sail away. Patz
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I need to keep him off his guard.
That's (unfortunately) right, onlyrenting1. Not only keep him off guard but keep him guessing. As I've learned in the last 48 hours, N's can be very calculating. This was evident when I saw my ex-Ns vehicle parked in front of our neighbors (the ones who seem to be ignoring me these past months) yesterday. Either he is playing the 'she-done-me-wrong' song or trying to evoke their help in keeping tabs on me. I will not go to the neighbors and inquire about this. I'll just be weary of them from now on.
Anyway, keep moving forward onlyrenting1. These analogies of yours and Patzies are sustaining.
Best,
bludie
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Hi Onlyrenting:
I have just read through this entire thread and I first want to say that I have seen you growing and growing over this time. You are gaining knowledge and keeping your focus on improving your situation and I admire your courage and determination and perseverence. You will get on that boat, swim the river, whatever it takes, to be free of the situation you are dealing with and you will be glad for it.
Your H sounds so much like my father. Always twisting, lying, exagerating, using his health as a hook to draw pity and give guilt from/to others, belittling and degrading his own with words, pretending to be sweet and nice when nothing else works, using serious threats to instill fear and keep control, always going to move/leave and never intending or doing so because his greatest fear was being left alone to face himeself and face his own life by himself....and his own self-hate.
I think this latest threat/trying to control---telling you not to go to Dallas--figgering you have nowhere else to go/trying to get your D to the movies/being nicey nice to you.......is his last ditch attempt to....keep you......control you in any possible way......stop you from leaving. He knows in his head that you are leaving and he is terrified??? He will finally be left alone, his greatest fear???? His colours will be revealed to the world....that his wife.....left him....and even all his lying will not be able to hide this fact from himself???? It will add to his self-hate???
I think you are doing a fantastic job of not falling for his manipulative ploys and his desperate attempts to control you. And best of all you are not letting him rule you....keep you......freeze you in place....with fear!!
Keep a smile in your heart.....and a positive life for yourself in your mind.....see yourself free and happy, with your daughter also feeling the same and enjoying her life, her freedom...to bring friends home and feel comfortable about it....to speak without being demeaned, or hurt for having an opinion, or expressing her feelings. Your daughter will later thank you for making a loving, happy home for both of you.
I remember the fear at the thought of leaving my father's house and also a marriage that was causing harm to my children and myself. I remember I had to acknowledge that fear and I had to tell myself that I would not let it control my choices, my decisions, my behaviour. It is hard to act....when one is frozen in fear.....so I admire how you are planning and taking these steps....acting......without letting it get under your skin and take hold. Keep doing that, Onlyrenting and soon you will be Owning-not-Onlyrenting!!!
My prayers will be for you and your daughter to have safety and freedom and peace of mind in a happy, healthy home that you can afford and enjoy.
Do not fall for his ploy to guilt trip you into staying with him because he could "die" because of any stress!! If that were true, he would be dead by the stress he already experiences from his own terror of...the surgery...of his fear that you might not being faithful to him.....of his own child seeing through him and his fear that she does not love him (and so he says he "hates" her...to protect himself from feeling what he knows is the truth....that there is little to love about him???). So he projects his fear by trying to instill it in you. And you.....are too smart to accept it.....too strong to allow it to control you!!!
((((((((((Onlyrenting)))))))))))
GFN
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Hi again, Onlyrenting:
I think you had asked about this and I happened to come across this info.
Neuroticism
Chronic negative affects, including anxiety, fearfulness, tension, irritability, anger, dejection, hopelessness, guilt, shame; difficulty in inhibiting impulses: for example, to eat, drink, or spend money; irrational beliefs: for example, unrealistic expectations, perfectionistic demands on self, unwarranted pessimism; unfounded somatic concerns; helplessness and dependence on others for emotional support and decision making.
Hope today is going well for you.
GFN
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GFN I so appreciate any idea on this word. I was not quite sure how I missed it before but I see the word TOTAL, I guess it means he's a big ball of turmoil, hope impulsive will not include dangerous behavior, and somatic does that mean with the body, hypochondria?
TOTAL Neuroticism
Sounds like a bad combo with N disorder. I looked on Google and understood it as some emotional imblance.
Like the Narc word = selfish,
the meanning of Selfish never became more clear than from reading this message board and how it effects daily life.
Bludie
I will not go to the neighbors and inquire about this. I'll just be weary of them from now on.
Bludie, I would want to know what side of the fence they stood on. maybe
knowing or having an Idea what could be going on, you may find they are on your side and would want to help you somehow.
It's Patz's referral to the Island.
I see you on the Island and maybe reaching out you will find them as alies not the enemy.
Today Saturday, I will be working on gathering papers e-mails, types of information to state my case to the courts.
My H is trying to engage with the family like he's a father today.
I will be busy going thru the garage again, I want as little as possible to move. Im getting close but always find more stuff to let go of.
I feel like Bludie, sometimes as I come accross things my H gave part in,
I want to give it all back. Bludie, like the money your EX helped you to get the house, the only way to feel like they don't have any hold on you is to give it all back. Then I think, forget it too bad for him, if it was something I helped him with, it still would be all his, no concern for my efforts.
My car, he helped with the first 500.00 I payed for the remainder and all the insurrance , but he often reminds me how if he had not given me the first 500, I wouldn't have the car. (forever in debt to him) Forget how I went to work every day brought home a check paid for the car so it added to his good credit.
His motive to help me, was I needed to find a job. I had been on disability and a company lay-off, my car had died.
I was riding my bike to a part time job, I had until I could get going on a full time job . He had to share his car.
(I purchaced this car with my own cash) how fast he forgets this.
Your EX, what was his motive to help buy the house you are in?
I bet it was a selfish motive. Maybe so he would have you in debt forever to him.
Got to go, thanks GFN and Bludie
Onlyrenting
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I have been out in the garage sorting stuff, My H asked if I wanted to go with him and our daughter, I said no.
I decided to look on his web site and he is reffering to some music he just received its kinda scary how he points out a story about a shooting the statement below.
Its about a true story. The wife of Andy Williams, Claudine ? She was in the alps and has an affair with the ski instructor, Kills him gets off as an accident.
H-wrote this:
how can ya shot somebody 6 times by accident?
Fri 11th 02, 05 | 14:49
pierre
There is the song on these cds, Claudine about the minister of canada's in the 70's. wife who shot her ski instructor 6 times in colorado & the judge called it an acciedent it was gonna be on, some girls, but she file a lawsuit
Fri 11th
Just got me spooked....onlyrenting
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Here is the story of Claudine Longet:
----from imdb.com----
Shot lover, Olympic skier Vladimir "Spider" Sabitch, on 21 March 1976 at his Aspen, Colorado home after he had told her to move out, she and her 3 children 'cramping' his lifestyle. At the sensational trial that followed, Longet claimed the gun had discharged accidentally as Sabich was showing her how it worked. She was covicted of criminal negligence and sentenced to 30 days in jail, which she served following a vacation with her defense attorney, Ron Austin, whom she later married. In 1978, she signed a confidentiality agreement with Sabich's parents after they agreed to drop a $1.3 million civil suit against her.
----
You have good reason for concern because your husband is fantasizing about killing someone and getting away with it. BE VERY CAREFUL.
bunny
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Thanks Bunny,
I feel like I want to go vomit.
sorry, I can't seem to respond. I will come back later.
onlyrenting
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Onlyrenting1,
Please take some time and jot down phone numbers to local abuse shelters. Without causing you more alarm it's just good to be prepared. Also, have a duffel bag packed and in the trunk of your car for you and your daughter. That way if you need to take off suddenly you're not without essentials. Also, please purchase a can of pepper spray or mace. Have it handy. Pay attention and trust your gut. Better safe than sorry. What a creep. I'm sorry but he really is. :evil:
Best,
bludie
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Part of what my H, does is listen to music from all over the world.
this set is the Rolling Stones, I remember the album years ago.
These CDs' are concerts from another country, so he will listen and talk about intresting aspects. It may be an intresting fact, but it's just one to many times for me to have him referance about killing.
His brother just e-mailed me but I couldn't bring my self to share how Im doing or what is going on with me.
We have a mutual famliy friend and I had given this friend his phone number, he was thanking me and is talking about his trip to NY and will be gone for the week so I didn't want him to worry. He asked how are things but I said nothing about me or the family. I'm feeling stund right now.
I will be making up my own pepper spay and do as you advise about the packing away for both my D and myself. I will be on guard. I will look up those shelters too. I will however call the police and kick him out before I attempt to leave on the streets with a child.
He is being extra nice right now and yesterday took my D to the movies.
She said he acted irritated and at times was not very nice.
I know he has a rod and 4 huge bolts in his back and sitting may have caused some aggravation. I will expect all of this to add to his already unstable condition.
onlyrenting
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Well, onlyrenting1, you always have so much to consider with your situation. Try not to feel too alarmed. If possible just stay aware. His health being compromised may be an asset in this situation. Is he still taking a lot of pain meds?
Best,
bludie
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Bludie,
He has gone some where with our D, don't know where. I imagine to the mall. So I took the time to get some stuff out to the car just incase.
He is on morpine and I don't know what else. It gets tiresome to try and second guess what an unstable person would want to do to you. You think you know someone and find out they may not be the person you thought you knew. I will keep my guard up. I would think he could plead insanity if he tried something.
I have the e-mails, doctor reports, letters from him, we will see how far I get on Monday at the divorce work shop.
My hope is they will help me with the legal right to leave. he says he wants to leave us, I have a letter from my employer about job placement in Dallas.
Letters about moving there and the fact he is on meds that may be imparing his judgement for our well being and need for survival.
I don't know what the courts will say but I will throw it out there and see
what happens.
onlyrenting
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Morphine is powerful stuff. I would think this contributes to your not knowing what to expect.
Have you broached the subject with him that you're planning on filing for divorce? If so, what has been his reponse? Sometimes it sounds as if he wants to leave and then not. Him leaving for his brother's is out of the picture for now, right? How soon would your company want to move you? Would it be possible to move to Dallas, not tell him what you're up to with filing for divorce, and then work on it from there? I suppose not. Child custody is an issue.
I'm not sure I have all the facts, onlyrenting. Let us know.
Best,
bludie
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Onlyrenting, I know you have a million things to think about, but if he is driving, with your daughter in the car, on morphine.....you need to tell someone. This doesn't sound safe and possibly an endangerment issue with your daughter. This may help your case with custody and relocation. Ask someone about it Monday and please tell someone at that workshop what is going on!
Bless you....sending you strength.
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Bludie, and Mum, thanks for responding,
My H-and D are home from the movies. He's trying to confuse our D. She, for now is feeling he cares about her so I will let that alone.
She doesn't want to move and It could be his ploy to have her stay here in CA, with him and her friends.
No I have not brought up about Divorce. I wonder if it's a good Idea.
1. I'm not a Corp level employee so I dont qualify for a moving package.
I have our Corp. level Director asking me when am I going so he can help with placement.
2. His brother told him he's not going to help him run, without his family.
So, my-H is saying he is not going to move now. He is staying and will be paying next months rent. I told him I was giving my 30 day notice to the LLord, he said don't do that he was staying here.
3. I would like to leave not tell him where Im going, say Im moving to Vegas. Get his mind off of Dallas, throw him off. Or tell them both Im moving around the block get them both off guard.
Maybe she will relax and not hold on to the idea of leaving her friends so much. her dad would not be her ace in the hole to get what she Thinks she wants.
I have: a list of meds he is on, e-mails stating how he was going to be moving without us, letters from HR in Dallas awaiting my interview showing I have plans to be employed.
I told him I wanted to move to Dallas, He has made it clear he wants out of the marriage, I need to plan on making a living on my own,
He says I just want my Way.
Made comment like for me to go ahead but our D was staying here.
This was Thursday. He is now reaching to be nice and Im not giving him to much to work with. I will make plans on Sunday, to take my D some where so he can't play his game with us. Now Im worried.
onlyrenting.
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Onlyrenting,
Please tell someone about all of this tomorrow. Your ex has said he wants out of the marriage. Go with that. No teenager wants to move. Friends are very important to them...but those in a healthy home will make more friends. I know how you are torn, for the sake fo your daughter, believe me.
I had a dream last night, perhaps inspired by your tale, but I woke up thinking it was you. There was a woman, it was not me, but I felt I was experiencing her pain/ or was in her body, knowing what was happening. She was isolated in a small room with a man that was half beast. It was as if he had been bitten by a rabid dog and was becoming rabidly insane...he even looked wolf like at times.
She was afraid of him and he was threatening her. She convinced him to open a window for them both to breath the air, or perhaps it was an airduct (like the ones people crawl through in the movies)... but she saw in this that she had an opportunity to escape. They both got onto a small roof, (and this is so strange after reading your post, but they were in Las Vegas). There was no way to get off of the roof but a perilous jump and she felt that if the man/beast let go of her she would fall and surely die, but if she didn't break free he would hurt or kill her. Then she saw a gardener below her. He had earphones on, so he didn't notice her at first. She kept screaming at him, HELP ME. I remember thinking: this is cool, usually in a dream I can't scream at all, but she is keeping at it and getting louder!!
The man/beast tried to hold on to her and put her back in the building but she just screamed louder and louder. The gardener finally noticed and about 5 more people appeared. When it became clear the gardener would help you, the man/beast tried to attack the gardener by jumping onto him and a huge fight ensued with several other people joining in. The woman was not in the melee, but watching it, trying to catch her breath. They got the beast and held him tight and took him away. He was not dead, but he was controlled.
I was there again, in my own form, and I hugged the woman who sobbed with relief. She kept saying, "I did it".
Ok, dream analyzer I am not. I just liked that happy ending, and thought you might too.
Bless you!
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onlyrenting,
Your husband does NOT want out of the marriage. He wants everything to stay exactly the same, with you and his daughter to abuse and control. I don't think he can conceive of a life without you around. He is totally dependent on you for his emotional survival. Without you, he will feel like he has nothing to live for.
I consider him dangerous. I would NOT mention divorce to him. I would phone a woman's helpline or shelter (Phone #'s are at the beginning of phone books) to get advice on how to leave safely. You're doing a lot of preparation (good work), but I'd also seek advice from some social services for domestic violence. They've seen a thousand similar situations.
bunny
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Mum, WOW, Below she has no Idea about any writings I simply said what do you think about this dream, this is what she wrote
This is how my 12yr old sees this dream from her perspective.
The woman traped is obviously you and the beast is someone who you are either in a realtionship with or live with . the gardner is someone who was before not able to see what was going on but now is able to help you and all the other pepole are pepole who where you may not see it but they care about you and how it was that the beast was half man half beast it is someone who at times could be the person and other times be a jerk pretty much dr. jackel and mr.hide you just have to relize that pepole care about you and you need to get away from the beast.
onlyrenting
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Hi Onlyrenting:
Bunny has made important points. Even if she is incorrect and there is no danger, what will it hurt to call the nearest shelter and get whatever info they may have to offer?
Knowledge is power.
GFN
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Onlyrenting. Please don't be afraid. Look fear in the eyes and stare it down. You said tomorrow you are going to a divorce workshop. Don't leave there without expressing your needs to someone. Someone there will be a good resource for you. Don't stop "screaming help". Get some. Good luck.
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Bunny, I know what you say is exactly the way he is thinking.
he will feel like he has nothing to live for.
This concerns me, I'm so torn and feel like his Rabbid mind will not let go of his distorded reality.
I'ts so difficult when his threating words and willingness to leave us, if given the chance could be his fear of losing his control of us.
Telling him to get in the boat before we drown, but he stays frozen on the dock, left alone to face the man in the mirror.
It becomes such emotional upheavel for me. I may try one more time to get him in the boat, before tomorrow. I will tell him to let us go to Dallas VS I'm filing divorce papers. I will still go the workshop.
he needs to get where he will have help in the future from family.
if he continues to not to get in my boat, I can see what his plans are for being on his own without us. I need to force the issuie. It will likley be lies comming from him but I need him to say what he thinks is his reality.
He is trying to be nicey nice and I believe it is his Idea of not wanting to leave us, but we all stay and drown.
I'm confused sorry, I need to force the issuie while he is being nice. the only way to bring out the surpression of where his reality is.
will let you know how it goes
onlyrenting
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Hi mum, bunny and bludie.
I just explained my intentions to my H's brother he simply said to let him know what my plans are and he will help us get settled.
I should not tell my H anything if Im fearful of his reaction.
I have not mentioned anything today to rock the boat here. I have a big pit in my stomach and guess until I speak with these people tommorrow I will know better how to proceed. I was feeling brave, but have not had the courage to look my fear in the eyes. I may only test the water with the idea of my job opportunity and taking it now and have him meet us there.
My H is home now, my D and I are going to a friends house to visit her maybe have pizza and watch a move.
Just for kicks....Here sign this divorce paper and Happy Valentines day?
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Onlyrenting: Just wanted to say goodnight. Try to get some sleep, focus on what you want to create for yourself, keep breathing and letting go of the pain every minute. Feel inside how you want to feel. Keep your focus on that. Good luck tomorrow.
I feel sure that everyone of your supporters here is sending you love and light....let that energy carry you, you are not alone. Remember: good things happen to you.
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onlyrenting1, Wow, I'm so impressed with your daughter's dream interpretation! Is this something you've talked about with her before? In any case I think it shows that your daughter is very aware for her age. You're influence on her shows.
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Mum, Guest and all,
On the dream interpetation, I had her sit down and type her thoughts.
I came back and typed the notes on the top about what I was having her do.
I must say I was impressed by her insights. I try and not put words in her mouth, so she will stand stong in her own thoughts. I submitted what ever she typed, thought it would be intresting from her. I was too close to the story line. Thought Mum might get a Kick out of it.
My D wrote
the gardner is someone who was before not able to see what was going on but now is able to help you and all the other pepole are pepole who where you may not see it but they care about you
I read Mums, dream to her, leaving out any clues about it being directed about myself. I wanted her to hear the story and see if she could understand with any depth.
First she tells me it could be about a young girl and her cruel Aunt. Her Aunt was the beast, I asked her to sit down and type what she thinks, I was surprized what she wrote.
I had only just read it myself when I read it to her, she clued in on the Gardners head phones, she added the part about a relationship and the Jerk-Dr Jeckel , Mr Hide.
I was surprized about Mum's dream, It was telling about how I feel.
I think I wanted to test my D to see if she could understand the terror of the beast holding onto you, if you let go you pludge to your death. But what a happy ending, there are people who care and want to help.
It gave me hope and I decided to reach out ask for a life saver from my BIL. I told him if I found I needed help would he be there for us.
He said just let him know how he can help.
The H was being nice today, we left after he came home with rental movies to watch. Went to our neighbors house, drove to get pizza and took one of the movies he brought home and watched it over her house.
It was sad, she kicked her H out because like my H he has medical problems, He has a pump inside his stomach and tends to overuse his meds, he is living back at home.
She was going to send him a valentines day card and while going thru some things in the desk she finds some Divorce papers, filled out. She was shocked to learn that she was the presenter. not sure what his goal would be by putting her name as the presenter.
We had a chance to discuss how our lives were alike.
How the meds, the pain you see them in and how they both want everyone to think it's you with the problem. Maybe he wanted his family to think she wrote the Divorce papers so they would feel sorry for him.
I did learn there was an on-line site that will guide you step by step on filing, you type everything in and print out your forms. I will be looking into this, found out about somethings to get prepared for on Monday.
We all had a nice visit, she said how at night the house gets lonely,
she was glad to have some company.
Thanks for your thoughts and prayers ......Onlyrenting
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HI,
Well there was no workshop the left hand doesn't know what the right is doing. But just the same, found out some informaiton.
I talked to an attorney on the phone, she said if I want to leave the state I can. If I have not filed Divorce papers and My H- has not filed any papers to say she can't leave. Im good to leave, so I have to keep it QT,
even from her.
Today I did tell my H- I want to start looking for apartments to move.
he said go ahead. I got back from my trip to the court house.
He had another LETTER, saying how he will only reply with a polite YES or NO, he has doctors orders not to get stressed because of the blot clot, you know he could die.
He mentions my wanting MY WAY to move to Dallas. He said he will NOT be pushed to get stressed about my plans.
So bottom line don't file Divorce papers, I may need to file later but subject to a residence time line (6mos or so) before I can file in another state.
Do any of you have some thoughts on this plan??? Get the Hell out ask questions later????
onlyrenting1
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Hi there,
Do you feel confident in the information you obtained over the phone? It's different when you retain an attorney because they then have an obligation as to their representation.
I am no authority on the law. But I do sense your concern for you and your daughter's safety, onlyrenting1. What are you leaning toward? Would it be worth getting another legal opinion to substantiate what you were told today?
Obviously, it would be a heck of a lot easier to get out now and worry about the details later. Have you thought of trying to contact a Texas lawyer and see if the statutes are the same or similar on family law matters? I've probably given you more questions than answers. Just don't want to steer you in the wrong direction. Lots to think about, huh? You're really doing a good job of doing the footwork and figuring out a reasonable way out of this mess. I admire your courage and fortitude.
Best,
bludie
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Bludie,
I feel so out of wack. I can go on-line to file D-papers, I know that now.
I will be searching for important documents that I will need and keep this as my focus. the on-line filing will make sure you file correcty, so maybe the work shop is not needed. I picked up the form for the Child/spousal support, I can still look at what I need have is done as fast as I can and submitt here in CA if thats what I have to do.
I would call another lawyer from the same legal aid and get some more feed back. I guess I wanted leave and once she said I could, I just said good enough for me.
I may want to find out about separation, how it works.
its a good Idea to check out what the laws are in Texas, what the school districts are teaching and what the difficulties would be for my D.
it may help me weigh my importance of the the time line.
My BIG fear is you give the N time and they will have it all figured out, so you get screwed. I think I will ask for the world and see if I get it.
The world would be to move everything but what would fit in my H's van, he stays here until he takes care of what ever is keeping him here. See ya when ever. have a moving van that drives your stuff, we fly. this happens in march.
I just got a note from my BIL, he said to advise him,
I'm wondering should I not involve him at all? If my H had not been on Disablity for the past 5 years I would not be so desparate.
Note from BIL:
I talked to H today and he seemed to be O.K. I honestly believe that he would not want to have you and D. leave him. He is ready to move and to go to Dallas, as you are and I think you should try to work together to make it happen. I think he feels that I am his brother and you do not get the help but he does. Like it matters to me, I only want both of you to be happy and to have a nice home for all three of you. Anyway he is trying to be more compatible and I think you should do whatever you need to get out of the environment there please advise me.
I think he wants to help, but I still get the pull from my H, his brother is the the Gardner in MUMs dream with head phones and my H will attack him so he can't or will make it difficult to help me.
will pray for guidance and strength. thanks bludie
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bludie and Only:
I have been reading this thread.
Bludie: I remember a girlfriend of mine, she divorced her bipolar N. He was stalking her by parking outside her neighbors house. She did not know this. Her neighbors would go out at 3 Am and tell him to leave or they would call the police. I think you should tell your neighbors that they should be on the lookout for him and to let you know if he is continuing to do this. Tell them to call the police. It is a horse of a different color if total strangers start calling the police on the N, when his behavior is inappropriate. They will nail his butt for doing that. My girlfriend's neighbors did this and they were able to use this in court as to his instability. Patz
Only: I really feel you need to go to a woman's shelter until you can leave. With most narcs they hear what you say but they don't understand it until they see the actual thing in progress i.e. you actually walking at the door. That is when the xxxx hit's the fan. It is all well and good for him to intellecutalize about the matter but it is entirely different when he is in pain, no one is there to hear his blathering. He will obessess about "how you done him sooo wrong". From my point of view you owe him no explanation.........your daughter is a teenager....no experience in life matters. Your first consideration must be for your safety. If you are not safe, then your daughter is not.
I also left my narc H when he was ill. It was very hard thing to do. I had to do it. He had run up about 150K in bills. He was on the computer working on "contracts", yeah right, you should have seen all the crap on that computer after he passed away. He was a total deviate. Don't let his "oh whoa is me" bs get to you after you leave either. He is a narc, will always be a narc. Call another attorney in D. If he comes to Texas, they will throw his butt in jail in a heart beat for stalking you. They are really tough over there.
I really think you should tell your brother in law that he has threaten you with a gun. Finding that stuff on the Claudine Longet and Savitch case is chilling. I saw the documentary on that. She was totally obessessed with this guy and lost it totally when he dumped her. Just reach out to as many people you can, who can help you and your daughter. You must escape this situation asap. Patz
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Patz, thanks for your direction and thoughts
My BIL, called today and asked me to let him know what I wanted to do.
come up with a plan and with a little time he would help me out.
I asked my H, what his plans were , he said he would write it down.
I got a LETTER, the letter says I'm unstable with no concerns but my own, wanting to move and take our daughter out of school would not be fair to her. He claims he is not able to move now because of his blood clot and his brother would not want to help me.
That's 16weeks until summer, the weeks are flying buy.
maybe if he wasn't the unstable one I would not be so uptight.
Thursday I will have time to investigate the time lines and speak with some other experts on divorce. I may learn it would be better to divorce here and learn what guide lines Texas follows to make a decision.
I will get with the womens shelters in the local area and what their guide lines are. I want stability for my D and now I'm second guessing taking her out at this time.
My H said something like were ok for now like we wouldn't be later, so Im going to keep plugn along preparing for divorce no later than 16 weeks.
I'm going on line now to look for the application on the divorce web site.
I could keep wishing this would be easy for everyone, but I get the feeling this will be getting more difficult before it's all over. No pain
NO gain.
onlyrenting
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HI everyone,
Well I Called a family shelter today to check out what it was about.
I don't qualify unless I will be homeless and no place to live.
they have no available places for another 2mos.
the other two numbers I was given, I called a church and the Salvation Army, would only let you leave a message.
This morning my H- made a comment about how I was the unstable one and he would want me to have a blood test ??
I told him he was the one making comments about getting a gun and shooting me. GET this, he was Sleep Walking.
This was his message on his web site chat box:
Whats wierd is as you know 3 years ago Lil dreamer could have the world from me, now as a 12 year old ,i'm limited in my indulgence ( i was Elvis & Lisa Marie )
Wed 16th 02, 05 | 23:0
I do believe as our daughter gets older he finds dealing with a teen more difficult. maybe this is common with the N's.
I looked into the moving vans and possibly just getting in a moving van and driving on my own. Of course My daughter still doesn't want to move.
I told her I just looked into some shelters incase we need to leave.
trying to not alarm her of leaving the state.
She didn't want to talk about it.
We made it another day and for now I will be glad for that.
Onlyrenting
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Only:
Is it possible for you to go by the Salvation Army in person? Look the place over and see how long you are able to stay and if they have any other reccommendations?
Yes, as your daughter really becomes more independent and having a mind of her own, there will be clashes and your H will not be able to handle it. How can he manage her when he is not a manager of his own life?
Realizing that your daughter does not want to move does not negate the necessity of getting out of your situation. As with all of us here, we are caretakers of these N's in a lot of respects and leaves very little for ourselves. Having said this, it is very important to take care of yourself because if you don't you can't take care of your daughter.
Just keep working through how to get out and keep on keeping on. It is the only way to make your situation better. Much love, Patz
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Onlyrenting1,
My goodness. You are always so diligent about following through, checking into options, and considering all possibilities. Good for you. You're amazing.
If the shelter isn't an option is there a possibility that your BIL would pay for an Inn Suites type of arrangement for a month or so? Could you just put it on a credit card or something? You don't need to go into your financials but I just want you to be/feel safe and am trying to conjecture a bit.
If the shelters can't accommodate you what are other short-term options until you leave for Dallas?
I know. I know. Always more questions. Never feel you have to answer unless you're so inclined. Just trying to help by looking at this from other angles.
Best,
bludie
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In an emergency, if you show up at the shelter door, they'll help you.
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Bludie, Patz, and guest.
Keep giving me questions to ask myself, it helps me so much.
I have so many things on my mind , you give me great direction, and I feel more confident I'm covering the unexpected.
You stay married for 26yrs, you just have no clue what is out there and available. Like Patz, son who needs to drag his feet to know he is grounded as he swings high off the ground feeling unsure of his surroundings. ( I love that thought ) Patz your son is so lucky to have you.
2. I will try and call the salvation army again and go check it out like you suggest.
3. short term plans, I have been letting a few people know I may need to make some emergency decisions and not sure what direction I will take.
I will maybe make a run to a neighbors and call the police to have him removed, first. Then move my stuff to a storage unit, take a plane to dallas get out of the area and come back later and drive my stuff.
4. My boss said I could use my sick-leave and vacation pay to keep me going that's about 5-6weeks.
5. ( I think I'm tired today and have let my guard down )
Today has been an off day from the last 2mos or so, My-H and I took the dog for a walk and went shopping together.
My H heard A message from the School probation Officer, regarding the fight my daughter was in, while he was in the hospital. I decided not to involve him under the circumstanses so he has just found this out.
He wanted to know what it was about, somehow I found myself having a conversation with him. I expalined there was no need for him to get involved it was already handled.
Somehow it leads to we need to be able to communicate, and the next thing I know he's talking about US moving, what it will cost for a moving van, gas and getting into a place to live.
I don't know what to think, I can't expect too much, I'm staying on my guard. I will be careful not to reveal any information that will come back for him to use against me.
He may want to move earlier if possible, we will see how things go.
his time line is based on what the doctors are telling him. every 2-weeks for 6mos and he has a heart doctor that will be checking on the condition of the blood clot. His blood is not doing what it needs and something is still not right with the oxygen level.
Along with some other surgeries he needs. I think the weather has him concered, they are telling him nothing but more bad news with authritis, osteoporosis? the move to Dallas with the rain, is a concern.
I would say I don't want to know about all this, You said you have no plans for us as a family.
Then he would say well you want to try and get along, so this is what he is dealing with and making decisions based on what he knows.
I guess I'm tired and want to stop for a moment to settle my thoughts about my life. He may for today decide he needs to get along.
I will take a deep breath and for one moment try and think about getting us all where we can all afford to live.
I will keep pushing for my goal to get us out from the pressure here change our environment, Being around family with good role models in all of our lives. I want this so much in my life, and still expect it.
My H may tell me all of this today, he wants to go now as a family, I may need to wait for several weeks when our daughter is out of school.
Maybe he will be more physicaly healthy then, to travel.
if he changes his mind inbetween now and then, I will still expect I won't,
so I will keep up with all of my current plans.
My H just walked in
He went down to the school and talked with the Principal. My-H is one of the few parents that helps out on a monthly basis and knew the Principal.
he wants to feel apart of the solution today, Im happy he is thinking about being a Dad, it makes us all feel a lot better about him.
He also just purchaed a small Ukalaylie, not as big as a guitar, and is showing my D how to use it. I know he may have wanted for himself, but just the same it's an interaction with the family and thats a good thing.
I feel my stress level down for the moment, maybe I will get some sleep tonight.
Onlyrenting
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Onlyrenting:
I may be reading something into your writing that is WAY off.... if so, tell me, ok? Or don't and just blow off what I say (I can take it!)
Do you want to divorce this man? I read sometimes where you seem terrified and other times where you feel ok, or are willing to act the part (shopping, etc with him).
You know, you are allowed to want out of a marriage regardless of his physical or emotional condition. He doesn't have to be a shit for you to be justified in wanting to have a life not being married to him.
If you change your mind every time you see him being normal or kind, maybe you need to decide what YOU really want.
Have you made such a decision? You are allowed to decide....(and to know that you haven;t yet.). Keep in mind that not deciding is in fact, a decision.
I thought I could only leave my ex after he did something worse than the usual crap....I waited and waited and kept letting my own needs slide based on HIM all the time....I was truly relieved when he cheated on me the final time. I felt I had a way out. The reality is that I could have left at any time. I just waited for it to be his "fault" in a major way. Just being so incredibly miserable should have been enough for me.
Hind site is 20/20, but if I had been honest with myself, years of his berating and abuse had killed my love for him long before we brokeup. I would not hesitate to call a marriage over a lot sooner under similar circumstances (oh, wait, I guess I did that with my second husband when it became clear he hated my/all children.... among other things)...funny, I just "justified" that divorce, didn't I?
Anyway, I'm sorry if this confuses you more....but forget what everybody else wants or if you are going to pass some arbitrary justification (whose?) in leaving him.
If you want out, you want out. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that...if you are miserable married to him, that is enough. It's your life, too!
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Mum,
I'm just tired today the whole battle of the N, the stress of the surgery, looking for the avenues to take for Divorce, getting ready to move, with or with out my H, my daughter and just the whole adjustment of what I'm about to change in our lives.
I'm all the things I was yesterday, I have pushed so hard to understand all the new found informaiton about what it is I'm dealing with.
I have documented proff my H is an N. Not maybe but yes he is an N.
I'm going to be dealing with him, because of our daughter, what ever thoughts I can get accross to him now, while he is being human is important to us all.
It's been over a month since he has been home from surgery, we have not been able to talk about anything.
He has been very angry about everything, his life, his health and taking it out on us.
All I have read and understood, I know how I must continue to proceed.
comming to the realaztion of all of the above is a reality and will not go away.
However, MR Hide is here today and this allows me to just take a deep breath, I've been in high gear and just feeling I need to adjust to my new way of thinking about my life.
One good day for him will not change my mind that easy. It will not change for my Daughter, We are angry with him and have been under a lot of pressure from his actions. I need to communicate with him and after 26yrs of being married, I'm so much more aware of the road I must now travel.
so don't be alarmed, or think I would change my mind on a goal.
I think what Im learnning is you must evolve to a better way of life, I have already let go of who we once were as a family, It just may be a little rest from it all today.
My plans are to move, this was all of our plan until my H suddenly started saying how he did not want his family anymore. He had been in alot of pain, being an N willing to dump his family at the drop of a hat.
It's because of this I'm understanding Why would anyone stay if someone will leave you like this. This is a classic behavior and will no doubt be in his character, But I have been married for 26yrs so this is the first time he has been willing to leave like this and been as hateful.
So my war is not over only the 1st part of my battle.
Not sure if this makes any sence or has any more understanding of the day I've had. Life here changes with the wind
please give me your thoughts. onlyrenting.
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onlyrenting,
Thoughts off the top of my head...
(1) I wouldn't take what he says at face value. He can't sustain one feeling or one decision for more than a few hours. What he says now will change very quickly.
(2) If he is nice today, how long can he sustain that? A few hours? One more day? It's obvious that he will become Mr. Hyde again given a little time. He cannot sustain good feelings.
(3) You may stay in the situation, move with him, or whatever. But realize that he is not a safe person. I know how stressed out you are and how hard you've been working.
bunny
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Hi Onlyrenting:
26 years is a long time to spend with one person, isn't it? After that long, people get very used to eachother just being around, even if a lot of the time the relationship is more like room mates who don't really like eachother all that much, rather than people who are married and love each other. It's like a habit, after awhile, and ending it is like breaking a bad habit. Not so easy but doable.
This man said he would shoot you.
He calls you horrible names and accuses you of whooring around on him.
He ruins holidays and special moments by being nasty and does not ever appologize (am I right?).
He lies to others about himself and his family.
He "hates" his daughter, remember???
He's concerned with himself and his own needs only, it seems.
I'm sure you have not forgotton these things Onlyrenting. I'm sure you could make a list that is very, very long about all of the things this man does, and has done, that are hurtful to you and your daughter.
Make that list, Onlyrenting.
And keep it handy to refer to when you feel like you might change your mind, or when he is somehow able to con you into "communicating" for a day or two. This communicating is most likely another last ditch effort to stop you from leaving him, to help him stay in control.
Is this the example of what marriage is.....that you want to set for your daughter?
Are you in love with this man and want to spend the rest of your life with him?
Is the relationship an enjoyable, give-and-take (equally with eachther), caring, considerate, honest, respectful, one of sharing and growing together, in which both people are interested in eachother's needs, not just their own?
Sometimes we have to do things that our children don't want us to do because it is the right thing to do.
Sometimes it is very difficult to do that, knowing that they will not be happy about it, or with us.
Not many children "want" their parents to divorce. They want things to work out and to just be a happy family. Your daughter will fall much more easily for your husband's conniving con-job because she is a child and because he is her father and no matter what, she wants his love and cares about him.
It's a hard thing to leave any marriage and especially after so long. You are doing a great job making plans and seeking information. Don't let him trick you. Stick with your plan.
((((((((Onlyrenting))))))))))
GFN
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Only:
The hardest thing in life is change. Even in a negative environment you "know" where things are. I also was in a 25 year marriage, that had long been over. It is scary. However, as I have pointed out, you have a long time to live. Do you really want to continue on this way? If so stay. If not, you have got to take the plunge not just for yourself but for your daughter as well.
If you will look, your situation did not happen overnight. There were many antecedents. It was an insidious thing. Many thoughts come to mind.
"Well it is really not as bad as all that". "It is just my imagination, see he is doing fine today." "I don't know how I will support myself". "What if he follow us". We use all these things to rationalize why we stay. As someone had mentioned before, in reality we could have left at any time. It is just fear of the unknown, change. The bottom line is are you willing to wake up every morning, to look in the mirror and say "Is what I am doing the right thing". If staying is right, then you will be pleased with what you see. If not, then you will continue to be fearful, stressed, unhappy, unloved............... Patz
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Bunny, GFN,
Thanks for your thoughts,
I have 16 pages of writings on this thread, I have it to remind me of my sequence of events, things he has said about us and his reactions, I will read it to remind me of all of the above.
I still slept on the couch, my H- didn't want me to, but I did. I'm not going to give in that easy.
I guess I'm making my window to escape, like in MUMs dream.
after the anger, the hurt, you begin to know what you must do,
I'm seeing a very narrow window, want to make it big enough for two.
My H- has never been physical, when I have told the authorities, people I have talked to, they give me the impression, he is in alot of pain, on meds, he's just blowing steam, would not likley do it. You all here understand, but most people I'm dealing with are not with me on this.
Most people don't understand what an N-is, I'm learning I'm still here and
only took a day-off of the anger,fear and sadness, hurt. Feelings are always changing.
I know what my reality is, just decided not to show my fear, I think the N's can sense it and stay hostile, maybe if I stay calm and do what I need to do I can keep him off his guard.
Can I get some feed back on this thought
STAY WITH ME PLEASE, THIS IS ONE DAY AND IM ONLY SHARING HOW I WAS FEELING THAT DAY, THINGS CHANGE LIKE THE WIND HERE.
ONLYRENTING
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We are not going anywhere Only. It is an emotional roller coaster right now. You must continue to keep on keeping on. Patz
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Onlyrenting: Absolutely, positively with you! I hope my post didn't cause you more trouble. You are doing a remarkable job here.
You are in a storm, that's all.. If you understand that, you can pull yourself back to the eye, where it is calm. To do that you will need to breathe in any negativity and let it go.....then refocus on what you WANT. How would having what you want FEEL inside? What emotional feeling would you have it it were a done deal?
Now focus on that feeling and you will start (you already have ) bringing it to you. If you focus on the confusion, the storm, and feel that all the time, you will have more of the same. Letting go of the crap on a regular basis is key, though, or you have no room for the good stuff!
It all starts with INTENTION, so knowing that you intend to let it go will be necessary. Knowing what you want is always essential to creation.
If you want, I can elaborate on this rather simple ABC process of changing energy. I do it in my body all the time and it has changed my life. It's easier than it sounds and not all that "whitelight/airy fairy", either.
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Mum,
send me these steps if you like, I'm open
I can elaborate on this rather simple ABC process of changing energy
Mum, I was stepping out and willing to take what ever reaction I got.
I know Im in a storm of emotions, I know this is a journey and I will stay with my goal to have a happier life.
Part of being honest with the my ups and downs, allows me to see where Im weak. Dealing with the weaker areas of my life will give me more confidence, try to laugh at myself, learn, move on, be aware from others of what I may not see.
I risk being dissapointed in myself and sensing dissapointment in others.
Why did I feel this way? I don't have all the answers just that I did.
I'm evolving, a work in progress and changing daily. I have childhood N-Mother Issuies. I don't understand sometimes why I do what I do and may fall down sometimes, but I won't stay down for long.
I have an address for the Salvation Army and will go buy and speak with them and check it out.
I will be looking into a support group on abuse, these people may be a better resource for me. I would meet other women with children and see what is available and with some better understanding on what to do and where to go.
Don't give up on me ......I'm here to learn and grow ...onlyrenting
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You are doing a great job!!! OK - 26 years of marriage 'matters' but not if it has been abusive and related only to your husband's 'needs'.
LOOK AFTER YOURSELF - It's very difficult to become your own 'parent' but ask yourself this: "What advice would you give to a close friend of yours in the exact same position as this"............
Stand outside of yourself for a moment and answer this question.
My best regards
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Serena,
Thank you for responding.
I know I want to dissolve my marriage. If I do this today or next week or whenvever it needs to be done. this it is my goal. I'm working on it and have not changed my mind on this. If I choose to be kind to my H for the sake of being in the same house and for my D then I will do this.
The day to day road to get there makes me worn out. Somedays the anger and the hurt, turns into calm and rest.
I don't understand it, just a fleating feeling.
I know my H- will do his N behavior I don't want this in my life.
I need to stay on the same track, the train I'm on had it's whistle blowing and speeding so fast I just needed to stay on the track just turn down the whistle and slowed down my speed a little.
onlyrenting
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Only:
You are doing a great job. Just continue to make those connections for support. I am very proud of you for the hard work you have done. Yes, you have some to go but if you look at the larger picture for a moment, you are already on the boat and it is beginning to float downstream. Look at the progress have you made in realtion to say 6months or a year ago. If you look, you will see you have made progress emotionally and mentally. It is the first step to letting go.
Much love, Patz
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Today I checked out what a quick place to run to would cost me, I learned if I join the AAA I can get discounted rates, costing me 70 a nite.
My D made me feel alot better today, she said if we need to move she would and she knows we may need to leave for a hotel and to be ready.
Below is my H's WEB Chat room, I can't get him to talk to me so I come here to read,never knowing what I will find.
I see he does understand about me wanting to get working in Dallas and he knows what I want and what's in it for him.
But I think he knows divorce is pending and he will no doubt not let me have what I want, so I see he understands I will have to go without him, as he states wanting to be a Super Bachelor, letting us move on without him.
how he will make a living on SSI I don't know. He must have plans.
I'm reading other post and find if I file for divorce here I may not be able to leave the state. I think I would be better to file in Dallas where I can afford to live get him to agree to let us go and file later.
I don't see all the questions and what the soft hearted comment is related to
He knows he is selfish, this is intresting.
(Im mrs joe) (Lil dreamer is our D)
I don't think I could do that I'm too soft hearted
Sun 20th 02, 05 | 18:30
Maybe I'll send them & be super bachelor here
Sun 20th 02, 05 | 18:03
pierre
I need to look at what I type !! Looking back at everything I regret. It boils down to selfishness I don't wanna be on my death bed thinking I didn't let her & Lil Dreamer have a chance at a better life. I have enough to get a nice pool home . Rightnow she needs her own Bath room & a compairable house is 500,000 here & only 120,000 there
Sun 20th 02, 05 | 17:59
pierre
It's really my brothers deal. I'm gonna start to manage his rentals. he has almost 50. Hes gonna pay me. Then he will help me ( cause he has bucks) buy some in groups) Mainly it's Mrs Joe & her move to corp headquaters I would feel selfish if I denied her
Sun 20th 02, 05 | 17:57
I will be saving this with my other notes.
onlyrenting.
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Onlyrenting: just a note to let you know how glad I am to hear from you. Keep on hanging in there. Sending you light.
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Sending you a big ((((HUG)))) Onlyrenting!
How are you doing?
GFN
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onlyrenting,
It sounds like he's rationalizing your move and trying to look like a "good guy" to his e-friends. GOOD!!! I hope he keeps up that line of thinking.
bunny
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Mum, Bunny, GFN,
Thanks for checking on me. I'm still here. I've been reading and responding on other threads. Sometimes I get board with my problems, so I like to see if Im able to learn from others.
I'm expecting my tax data to be mailed and from there will be waiting for some money to move with.
I have decided to move asap rather than wait for applying for divorce papers here. I worry if I don't, I will get stuck here longer than I want.
I read my Hs Chat notes and thought maybe he is re-thinking the move.
Yesterday My H- got his Workerscomp court date for march 23rd.
I opened the letter and hesitated to give the letter to him, because I knew if I did he would find a reason to get upset to tell us he wants us to leave.
He would be expecting a settlement or who knows another postponement, anyway if he thought he had money comming he would not want us to see any of it. Knowing this if I held onto it maybe he would keep his cool and realize what he really wants, his family or freedom.
Well I decided Im giving it to him and if he does this then so be it Well 2 hrs later my D was asked if she had seen some candy he had and she said maybe, then no, then maybe.
He went off about her lying to him. Help me, I told him I'm afraid to tell him the truth he gets unglued scary and very angry, if he would lighten up she would not be afraid of getting in trouble from him.
He got mad and said he doesn't deserve lies and If I believed he was so mean, then we don't belong together. I said OK I think you're right.
She doesn't deserve to feel sad about herself having to lie. I know its wrong for her to lie no matter what. I know why she avoids the truth with him, and I go over with her I understand why but just the same she needs to stand up to him. do you have any Ideas on this.
With him on SSI, I wonder since I'm working I may be looking at giving him support. And if I have our daughter then maybe it would all even out.
So my best thoughts are to see if he could put in writing he wants us to leave, maybe get a tape recorder and have it as a backup and leave. He said he would pay the next rent and I could use the money to leave, so I will.
I have contacted the Dallas, Plano school district to find out about the studies and will get with social services on maybe what districts are the safest to live in. I got a reply from one of the schools to contact the school counselor and they will help me with what they are currently teaching.
We have lots of rain and mud slides, Im concered about the drive on my own. His brother was going to come out but now It's getting too complicated, not sure how I will pull it off. I will look at the maps and check the weather for the upcomming days and just go.
Always lots to think about. I needed to sort this out, it helps thanks for reading and keeping in touch. onlyrenting
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Onlyrenting: So glad to hear from you. You can check for road maps and routes on line....when I thought I was going to move, I did that...but can't remember what site. I'm sure you'll figure it out.
I wish I had run like hell and just told my kids to come on.........but I waited, to do the right thing, and here I still am.
I'm with ya kiddo. Save your life...I mean that in all ways.
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With him on SSI, I wonder since I'm working I may be looking at giving him support. And if I have our daughter then maybe it would all even out.
So my best thoughts are to see if he could put in writing he wants us to leave, maybe get a tape recorder and have it as a backup and leave. He said he would pay the next rent and I could use the money to leave, so I will.
I think the courts will figure out who gets what and how it all works regardless of who wants who to leave-- so don't worry about that stuff. And in Texas I think that the spousal support laws don't tend to award that much spousal support, so that should work out in your favor, too. He will probably be responsible for child support.
I think you are very brave. Please keep us posted about your journey into this next phase of your life. We are all rooting for you!
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God speed, Onlyrenting.
Don't look back.
GFN
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GFN, I feel Brave like I did when I left home at 18teen. I told my self to have a place before I would ever do this, not wanting to impose, so I'm working on it now.
I expect my finished taxes in the mail by Friday,I sign them then I will get direct deposit and hope it will not take long for all this to happen.
I went on Map quest found directions, to Dallas (Plano TX)
21 hrs, 49 min. from CA
My daughter is also telling me how 3 of her friends are moving, so maybe she won't miss her school too much if we leave.
I feel some sick leave coming from work. They already told me I could use it if I need to.
Onlyrenting.
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onlyrenting1
I feel very touched by you and your courage in in taking care of yourself and your daughter. I stared at your last reply for about 5 mins and couldn't think to what to write. I'm just going with feelings here...
Remember that most people everywhere are good, caring, helpful people. You will find friends everywhere you go. (Unfortunately they don't usually take jobs in government or service positions.) Don't forget that this move is also a great adventure, not just for pragmatic reasons. Enjoy it! Don't forget that you have many people here rooting for you every step of the way. Good luck, and God bless.
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Dearest Only:
I read with great emotion your last few posts. I can only tell you it takes so much courage to just "face it". It is time to go, time to get on the boat and set your sail. It brings back all the emotion I experienced. I wish you and your daughter GodSpeed. I will be praying for you both. Much love, Patz
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Hi Onlyrenting:
GFN, I feel Brave like I did when I left home at 18teen.
You are very brave Onlyrenting. This reminds me of something I heard when I was a kid:
"We all have courage. We just have to use it."
I remember deiciding to believe tha and:
"Courage is not the absence of fear...it is acting regardless of fear".
It must be very frightening for you, Onlyrenting. Thinking about leaving where you've been for so many years, driving there on your own (with your daughter....but being solely responsible for her). Going so far away, to a new place. Not knowing what the future holds or how your husband will react.
I like Longtire's idea of thinking of it, believing it to be...a great adventure.
All adventures hold some danger......but the fun is what is enticing about them, right? And most adventures end up being great memories too, don't they?
God will protect you and your daughter. I hope you will have some fun on your way and enjoy the trip and the hopes and dreams for a much better future that is bound to come!
My prayers are for you this next while.
GFN[/quote]
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GFN, Longtire,PATZ, mum, Guest, Bunny , bludie
It's on your mark get ready set .........
Longtire, I do believe people will help me as I go and my daughter is old enough to understand some of what is about to happen.
She is angry at her Dad, and is willing to trust me.
I'm getting my daughters room apart as soon as I can, I've been working on putting things in the garage and now its the furniture, this next step will be disruptive . A little bit at a time things coming off the walls, closets almost bare, but yet hidden by doors not to remind me of my plans.
I've got my D down to bare minimum already, don't want to get her upset until the last minute.
I'm in daily contact with many of the employes in Dallas, I had a chance to meet them in November when I flew out for my Interview. I make friends easily and expect hearing names and matching faces will be a comfort to being on my own.
This is the dangerous part as my H admits to himself, his daughter will be leaving. I'm upset that our family dog will need to stay, this is almost too much to bare. She would be difficult to find a place to allow her. (pitbull)
I need to play it cool and will wait for the right time to leave, I have neighbors to help me load my furniture, we will see what happens.
onlyrenting
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Hi, all
I made a big commitment today with my moving plans.
Working on setting up a position for my job in Dallas.
I had to resend my resume for them to review.
The positions are so new nothing formal has been anounced.
My Corp Boss said he could help me get in but would only tell me It would be something I could qualify for.
My Corp Boss is transferring to Dallas to head up this new department.
He is married with two kids and has a 13yr old son. looking with his family to move to Plano also.
A lucky break for me, he will be driving one of his cars on the 9th, so I asked If I could travel behind him as a safety.
I have few options but taking advice from Patz to reach for the life savers as I go. With my H not wanting me to take help from his family, I'm to make it on my own power, so I will do what I can.
I have let my BIL know about moving and may need some help to find a place, but if not then I will need to sign a lease on my own, and that's fine to. Will see how far I get, hoping he can get something set up before long.
I talked to the councellor at a school I might be intrested in and he told me my D would be fine. Testing starts the end of April and they study the history of Texas so that's a required test, but not to worry.
I will need to get a resident address to be able to get her into a school.
I have lots to do.
I feel the Boat and the sails are set.
onlyrenting.
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With my H not wanting me to take help from his family, I'm to make it on my own power, so I will do what I can.
Who cares what he doesn't want???
Good work, and good luck!!
bunny
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Dearest Only:
If I can made it through, travelling with an autistic son 1500 miles to another destination, to start a new life, you can to. I cannot tell you how proud I am of you. It will not be easy, but then again, really nothing in this life worthwhile comes easy. I can only say over the last 6 years I have carved out another life. You will look back at this time and it will be as if you are reading another book, another life, unrecognizable to the one in D.
You must have the desire, the drive to want something better for yourself and daughter. Clearly this is the case. You can do this and do not let anyones opinon, threats or otherwise stand in your way. If you do not take care of yourself, you cannot take care of your daughter. This individual who is also going to D represents an opportunity.......take it and go.
Try to imagine the individuals at this site in a stadium, we all have pom poms and we all shouting "Go Only, Go Only, Go Only." The field goal is in sight!. Love Patz
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Onlyrenting,
Good for you. I am glad to hear you will be moving with an escort, and one with several people. That's very good on many levels.
I posted a few suggestions to you on the "most narcissistic comment ever" thread, at least I think it was that one. I hope my suggestions don't raise your stress level, they are meant to lower it, but your own thread started out with your concern about his comments on O.J. and Scott Peterson so I don't think I'm putting anything in your head that is not already there.
You SHOULD NOT needlessly provoke him but you SHOULD make sure you took every reasonable precaution. I would much rather know that I alarmed you and you took unnecessary precautions than I held my tongue and he turns out worse than you think he is. Just do what your instinct, intuition, heart, whatever you want to call it tells you to do. It is hard to go wrong when we really listen for that inner wisdom.
Just be safe and God bless you.
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Bunny,Patz,Guest,GFN, and all of you out there cheering for me,
Bunny,Who cares what he doesn't want???
I'm dealing with a person that has lied to his family and even tho
I believe my BIL, will be calling me today and wanting to help, I must be willing to do this on my own.
somehow when people lie there is always a question in other's minds about the truth. I have total confidence he will help me but I will only ask where Im at a dead end. He will be calling me at work, today to talk about my recent e-mail about the move.
In my mind, I can't be too needy, it's in my character to pull as much weight as I can, if it was my own family it would be different.
My BIL, can't believe we would split after 26yrs, and has tried to talk sence into my H, so Im sure he has had an ear full lately.
Guest
Good for you. I am glad to hear you will be moving with an escort, and one with several people. That's very good on many levels.
I know I will be more relaxed about the trip. It made my day, I was really happy about the Idea. We sat down and looked at the map to travel the 10fwy straight thru to D.
and Scott Peterson so I don't think I'm putting anything in your head that is not already there
My H makes comments that are out of line, sometimes not understanding what's in someones head and what makes them snap was my fear.
When someone has never hit you but says things, what will it lead to.
maybe noone knows this answer. ( Im not waiting to find out as he gets worse in his old age.
I was wathching a show last night about a married couple, having problems. The doctor told the wife her wealthy husband was a Physco,
told her she could expect him to even kill her, she was give a written warrning.
He did kill her. She went missing when she confronted him with telling everyone about his mental Issues.
Im worried, even tho my H is telling me to be sure and take certain things around the house, as to confirm he knows I'm leaving.
Patz
If I can made it through, travelling with an autistic son 1500 miles to another destination, to start a new life, you can to. I cannot tell you how proud I am of you. It will not be easy,
I will keep this in mind I know it's been done and will not be easy.
I want a better life and as the doors fly open for me I will know it's the right way. I still get emotional thinking about the next 10 days and wonder if my goal will be met with ease or my H will cause me more heartache.
I'm trying to deal with alone as much as possible not letting on when this will all take place.
Lots to do onlyrenting
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Onlyrenting,
Sorry I forgot to sign my post at 10:49 that you responded to about O.J.and Scott Peterson. Not that it matters much, just FYI.
Mudpuppy
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Hi everyone,
I'll be busy today getting things ready to get out of here.
I may find myself with out a PC computer for a while but will keep in touch as much as possible until I get it together.
Keep us in your prayers.
Onlyrenting
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I have been spending most of the day moving furniture
and my H is getting the Idea Im leaving now.
His elderly mother just called and I let her know about my moving.
she said to let her know If I need anything and to call her about the situation. She knows her son and understands why I would leave.
Now his brother is upset because, he wants us to communicate and be mature and not put him in the middle to our battles.
This may have been partly my fault, I told him not to let my H know when I would be leaving because of the saftey risk.
now he is a bit pist that we are not in communication and being honest about When I am leaving.
I think it is so difficult for others to believe what living with an N is like
onlyrenting
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Only renting, it is so inspiring and heartbreaking to follow your efforts to free yourself. Today is the one year anniversary of the day that I got on a plane with my kids and left one coast to go to the other and return to my family who I had not seen in nearly 7 years. It was absolutely terrifying, and I left everything except what we could put in a couple of suitcases. I told my partner that we were only going for a visit, but at some level he knew it was the end, and I was in knots the entire day as we went to a school play, picked up the kids, and drove to the airport. But all of that was so worthwhile, and in just a few days after we left the toxic environment of that place the kids and I were feeling so much better. It makes me cry just to remember the feeling of this incredible weight lifting off my body.
A couple of months later, with the help of my family, I returned and packed up my stuff and shipped it all away. What helped me most was being extra careful about everything related to this person -- I had the locks changed, the police notified, I explicitly emailed him that I did not want to see him, and I had some impressive family backup. It all worked, and we were able to get away. I am so glad that you will have some backup in Texas. Don't be afraid to ask for help, that is the single biggest change in my life. Before my freedom I was completely isolated and would never think to ask a friend for help. Now I ask for help when I need it and I always try to help in return, and things are easier for all that.
Hang in there, because if you can get through the next several days the sun will come out and shine on you.
Best wishes,
Mir
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Mirror,
Thank you for your encouragement, I worked very hard todayin my Ds room, moving furniture in the Garage.
Trying to get my daughter to get with the program, I know she wants to get away to, but we would be leaving or dog and we are so upset about it.
This is so hard for me, my H keeps me isolated from his family as much as possible. It is difficult in this situation when you have family members who want to help but not quite see what you are dealing with.
I have this problem too, asking is so hard, Im left with this move at the worst possible time after 5 yrs of my H on Disability and cost of living going up and up.
Before my freedom I was completely isolated and would never think to ask a friend for help.
Your life sounds like it turned around for you. It must have been difficult for you after not seeing your Ps over 7 yrs. Hopefullly they loved you and had open arms for your return.
Keeping things QT until you get to a safe place is important, but I guess when other people are involved it becomes a burden, asking for help is just no fun.
We will see how it goes. onlyrenting
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Good morning Onlyrenting:
Wow! That is fantastic about you being able to travel with your boss and his family! I'm so glad you asked him if it would be ok!!! You are a smart lady!
Sounds like it's not many days now, so soon you will be on your way and off to start a new life! Even if it is a bit scarey, doesn't it feel like a bit of a weight has already been lifted? You've made a decision and your plans are coming along very well. You have a date that you intend to leave! You have travelling companions! You are close to landing a job. These are all great accomplishments already! Keep going Onlyrenting! Soon you will be feeling even better.
I'm so sorry that you will have to leave your dog. Is there a possibility that you may find a place that will allow the dog and maybe you could get him there with you at some time in the future? I suppose there is a slim chance of that happening. Leaving your dog is definately a sacrifice for both you and your daughter. It will be tough on you both. But safety and care of yourselves are of uttmost importance for you and your daughter now and that's what has to be priority. As much as it hurts to leave your dog, it is necessary, and I admire you so much for doing this very hard thing. I wish there was a way to make it easier.
You are doing such a great job of remaining calm and packing things up. How is your husband behaving now? Is he asking any questions about when or where you are going? Do he seem as if he has accepted the fact that you are leaving or as if he is still not sure whether you are or not?
Please ask for help from authorities if you even slightly think you need it. They will come to your house on leaving day and escort you out, if you need that. It's hard to ask for help but it may be another sacrifice that is necessary to ensure your safety, right???
I'm so proud of you for doing all of these difficult things. Still praying for you.
(((((((((Onlyrenting))))))))
GFN
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Dearest Only:
I am so very proud of you. Yes, do as GFN has suggested, call for an escort if necessary to get out of town. As far as you BIL is concerned, I would tell him as little as possible. This way he is not put in the middle and if he asks why........just tell him you felt the the least he knew about what was going on, your brother could not then blame him. You are indeed taking him out of the middle. Just be careful the next few days and I know you will be. (being a mother hen here)
Just keep us all posted to let us know if we can help in any way. Much love Patz
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onlyrenting,
I thought his brother saw emails that your H wrote (maybe I'm mistaken) and realized how sick the situation was. Your BIL has *NO CLUE* what you're dealing with if he expects some kind of maturity and adult communication. Maybe his mother can spell it out for him. If he's pissed, too bad! Keep doing what you're doing.
bunny
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Hi, Bunny GFN,Patz
Thank you all for your support. Today I go into work a little later will be working on transfering med plans to the TX area.
I will call for support if I need to. My H is saying he will leave when I need him to so my lover can come over and help me move. I will be having my neighbor help me.
Most of the things I have I can get with little help.
Bunny
Your BIL has *NO CLUE* what you're dealing with if he expects
I have tried to SPELL IT OUT, he understands we want to split, but not being part of the don't tell My H, where Im going. Now that it's time to leave he finds I have asked him not to tell my H.
I wrote him again to SPELL it out,
HE'S TELLING ME DON'T ASK FOR HELP OR HE WILL SHOOT ME!
he's wanting us to leave now, doesn't care how I do it as longs as he has no part in it. He changes to scary when things aren't going his way.
why would I want to tell him anything?????
I think maybe I will call his Mom to help me SPELL IT OUT
Thanks Bunny, I was feeling lost for a moment and belived I had been telling him so he would understand, but I guess it's never clear unless you are living it.
My H- is so anaware of anything but his own life. He thinks because he told me not to get help from his brother Im leaveing for Kansas to live with my father. No job just move and get help from them.
I let him believe whatever makes him happy.
7 days go to go Lease is about up.......Onlyrenting
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Onlyrenting: I have been away, just read the goings on...I am in awe of your and your power. You might not feel particularly strong right now....but believe me, you are. Courage is admitting you're afraid but doing what you must anyway. Godspeed.
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only,
My H is saying he will leave when I need him to so my lover can come over and help me move. I will be having my neighbor help me.
What a priceless horse's ass. I'll come sit on him while you move if you want! :) I think we're in different ends of the same state so it wouldn't be too far.
Please consider GFN's and others suggestion of having some law enforcement around. It couldn't possibly hurt.
As mum and others have said, Gospeed.
Mudpuppy
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Mudpup, Mum,
1. Well what a day, I'm leaving Sunday, or likley Saturday not the 9th.
I asked my nephew if we could spend the last night at his place , where I would feel safer. Im waiting for a reply.
2. After my phone calls to my Health Insurrance my H realized I was not going to move in with my Father, with no job in Kansas, he was pist.
He said he would not want to be in the same state with me. Demanded me to take off time this week to go to a lawyer, he would pay 300.00 to disolve the marriage right then.
(so Im thinking a delay in my plans right now )
3. I talked to my BIL, he made me feel better, telling me he would not tell my H of the plans and just get there, they would be waiting.
4. I believe most the schools in D, have spring break this week, so maybe this is even better. CA schools have spring break in April.
5. My big boss is authorizing me 40hrs of sick pay.
6. The corp office called my home and work about an interview.
I get this note from my H, the Corp office called here and how he
" told his brother to fly me out to Dallas for the Interview" ????
I dont know more about this little comment, not sure if this his is attempt to show how much he cares ???
7. I have an e-mail CC to me, my BIL tells my H to Please not write to him with SHE did this, She did that. I was happy to see it from him.
I have been asking him to respond this way if my H begins to say things about me. It made me feel like maybe he had listen.
Onlyrenting for 5 more days... :lol:
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Only:
Please be careful. Hopefully your BIL will be an a support for you as you make your plans. My prayers are with you. Much love Patz
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HI, everyone,
Things are getting tense, Today my D is sick, she will be home with him and now my H is saying she is not to be pulled out of school.
She is feeling pulled not to go so Im concerned.
I said ok, trying to act cool. Hes saying she can't leave with out his permission. Im to go by myself. Im getting off early today to move on my plans and not sure what to do but be calm.
The fireworks are starting
onlyrenting
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only,
He said he would not want to be in the same state with me. Demanded me to take off time this week to go to a lawyer, he would pay 300.00 to disolve the marriage right then.
(so Im thinking a delay in my plans right now )
You know he's lying right?
Hes saying she can't leave with out his permission.
True or false?
The fireworks are starting
Document everything.
Write down notes of conversations after they occur. Contemporaneous notes carry a lot of weight in court. Keep all e-mails or phone messages. Hopefully you'll never need them, but it is better to assume you will just in case.
Does he respect or fear your BIL? If so, could you count on BIL to make N back down.
Somebody who knows more about seperation/divorce than me should give onlyrenting some advice. If she just picks up and moves what are his rights to force her back or prevent her from going in the first place?
The prayers of everyone here are with you.
mudpuppy
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Hi Onlyrenting:
He's going to push every button he possibly can, now that reality is setting in. He really, up until now, has not believed you would leave him. He is coming to realize that you are actually going to do that.
The fireworks are starting.
Is it time to call the police and tell them your plans and ask for their assistance and an escort? One little phone call? They will know whether or not you can just leave with your daughter. My guess is that you can. No one has custody yet. Establish custody asap but first.....have phyical custody. Ask the police if this is how it works? They enforce the law and must be aware of it.
I get this note from my H, the Corp office called here and how he
" told his brother to fly me out to Dallas for the Interview" ????
I dont know more about this little comment, not sure if this his is attempt to show how much he cares ???
This little comment is another attempt to try to make you think he cares.
If he cared, he'd want you to be happy and your daughter too, and be letting you go calmly, easily, without all of this mixed crap message junk. Without telling you where to live and who will and will not be removed from school. Without trying to confuse you and control you. He only cares about himself, is my bet.
Mudpuppy wrote: The prayers of everyone here are with you.
Mine sure are. God bless you Onlyrenting!
GFN
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Onlyrenting: Stay the course. Focus. Get information, but stay focused on what you want.
Can you call a woman's shelter for advice? I bet they have some. Or legal aid?
Two thoughts on calling the cops:
If you have involved them before,to report your husband, they now have a paper trail...which will work to your advantage.
However, I'm not sure they will know what to do about you going somewhere with your daughter..it's not like you are divorced and have a custody dispute (in which case, you're leaving with her would bring you big trouble).
Having been in a relocation nightmare (post divorce) I honestly think it might be better to shoot first and ask questions later.... you are not kidnapping your own child from a custodial ex...you are saving her.
Documentation IS your best bet if he balks and tries some legal stuff....
and then you have evidence of your very real fear for your safety....I can't remember, but does someone else know about this (besides the BIL?)
Don't cave in to his brainwashing of your daughter. You KNOW she cannot be left with him. Whenever I felt sorry for my ex, I would snap a rubber band I put on my wrist....that reminded me of all the CRAP so I could refocus. Your daughter needs you to be strong for her, even if she says otherwise right now. You are not telling her to hate her dad, you are simply moving forward in your life, which will be to her advantage as well!
He is trying to scare you, that is certain. Rememer, to defeat fear: go ahead and acknowledge the fear, just DON'T do what it tells you to.
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Onlyrenting1, I agree with the others. Stay on the course you decided when in a rational state of mind. Don't get distracted by emotional reactions one way or another. Feel them, just don't change your mind based on them. You have demonstrated here that you are very capable of making good decisions that you can follow through on. If you are starting to doubt or change your mind ask yourself whether you are doing so because of something your H said or did. If so, then he is influencing the decision. You are the only one who should be in control of your decisions and actions. Definitely not him.
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only,
mum said,
I honestly think it might be better to shoot first and ask questions later.... you are not kidnapping your own child from a custodial ex...you are saving her.
I don't know divorce law, but I do know something about civil law. Possession is nine tenths of the law. Not to make your daughter sound like property, but if you have her in Dallas and you didn't violate any laws getting her there you're already five steps ahead of him.
mum,
Whenever I felt sorry for my ex, I would snap a rubber band I put on my wrist....that reminded me of all the CRAP so I could refocus.
:lol: :lol:
You should have put it around his neck!
mudpuppy
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Only:
Just stay the course and keep your focus. If the narc cared about your daughter at all he would have treated you differently and her welfare would have been paramount. It is all about him. It will always be about him. Make him work at custody. Make him prove it all. Whenever you get to D, the distance will make it harder. Much love, Patz
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Onlyrenting1,
I've been away from the board for a while and tried to absorb the last several pages of posts. Just want to say I am behind you 110% in making your transition within in the next few weeks. I have been amazed and inspired by your journey which involves soul-searching, clarity, character, integrity and a whole lota' hard work. Please PM me anytime. Of course, I'll try to keep track on the board from time to time, too.
Best,
bludie
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All of you are so wonderful to my plight, I feel so much stronger with all the support from everyone. So much to think about.
You all having your keen insights is so lucky for me. WOW.
Today, I started out with some pressure, I wanted to leave even sooner.
I have not lost my focus, only waiting for the right moment.
1. I talked to my BIL, no doubt he is feeling torn. He is able to see whats going on and admitted he reconizes the N in my H.
My H is calling me all kinds of names and telling me he will block me from taking her. Im not fit to care for her and they get along fine when Im not around. ON and ON. I asked him to stop talking but he won't.
My D wants to go to school, she is feeling better, I get this gut feeling to run now, as it will only get more difficult.
I put him off guard I think.
My Father had called about their trip here in April and would be asking us to spend some time with them. I told my H we were planning on visiting the step-grand kids when they come out. He backed off.
I think he will want it to be all about him no matter what.
He was talking about how he will need money to stay here and for me to plan on helping him if Im staying this month. (no clue) I made it sound like sure what ever.
Patz
Make him work at custody. Make him prove it all.
This makes me want to split now, while I have the chance.
My D is sick and has her Star testing tomorrow, it may not be right until Friday.
I don't know divorce law, but I do know something about civil law. Possession is nine tenths of the law.
Mudpup you are one funny guy. thanks for the humor.
You should have put it around his neck!
Longtire : My H thinks he is in control, but its funny because he is so out of sink, once you feed him what he wants he goes away.
Other people are not always understanding of why I should be in control.
I have documentaion to back me up. But to here him and not knowing him you would wonder about his claims of being the sane one.
I was watching the news about the BTK serial killer.
The people that knew him all had something different to say.
The priest said he was a great guy
the neighbor said he was a Jeckel and Hide.
I know this is what we all want but using the child as a pawn lets you know the law can take this away and it is very scary.
You are the only one who should be in control of your decisions and actions. Definitely not him.
Mum,
If you have involved them before,to report your husband, they now have a paper trail...which will work to your advantage
I still have the card for the officer that took the report when my H talked about the gun and shooting me if I went to dallas, I will call him.
I had explaind about us wanting to move and how my H said we were not to go. I will let him know my plans and his advise.
My thoughts on this today, was a plan to get me gone, have me fly out for an interview. this is how unaware he is. I already flew out in November. He asked his brother to fly me again? I know he doesn't understand the way the job interviews are working and he will only understand what he wants to here.
His indecisions in my life are causing a problem for me right now. I feel like all of our well made plans are thrown out the window. Having the pressure on us all because he is being a Big N. Jerk!
This little comment is another attempt to try to make you think he cares.
If he cared, he'd want you to be happy and your daughter too, and be letting you go calmly, easily
He will be all alone, his Mom is pist, his brother is pist, his daughter, his wife, and now even the dog is going to be felling the mass of destruction he is leaving behind.
Im tired of talking about this fool. Im going to get some rest. I may find my computer will be packed away so will get intouch maybe a few more times before I get to another computer to tell you anymore.
onlyrenting 3 more days
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Hey, Only: still with you! Get some rest. Sending you strength.
I had a thought: your H is medicated, no? If so, can you put any stock in anything he says from one moment to the next? (it seems so changeable, I thought perhaps it's the drugs talking!) This may be a giant "duh" for you, if so, have a laugh on me.........just thought I'd put it out there. And if it is drugs...do you have documentation on everything he is/has been on? Might come in handy.
Calling that police officer sounds like a good idea.
Keep on.
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Mum,
He has been on morphine and a list of others.
I have a print out showing about the last 10 refills and 7 or 8 different types of meds.
He had taken too much of a drug about 2 yrs ago and they put him in for observation at the Mental place. they let him out the next day. found he mixed the meds, found himself wondering the street half naked.
I know a lot of this is the pain and drugs. this is always the first reasons in the past for my patients with it all. We all know its more than drugs, but being an N is less understandable to most. I do plan on using the Med Card as the problem. Strangers would understand better.
Bludie
I have been amazed and inspired by your journey which involves soul-searching, clarity, character, integrity and a whole lota' hard work.
I have missed you, but think about you and all your wonderful support.
WOW, I convey all of the above?? That is wild. these are very impressive thoughts to my confidence.
I wish my H knew what he had for so long. He had his chance.
Too bad he can only see himself and all his wonder, must move on, to share myself with the rest of the world now.
Im thinking of a plan for Saturday. I think I will act like I want to go with my D shopping, My H, He always leaves if we decide to go somewhere.
Get things cleaned up around the house early. get my H off guard. somehow work it out with my D to go somewhere with a friend.
let her have some fun with her friend.
Both are gone, get the truck packed with help, pick up my D were gone.
Getting my H to be gone long enough will be only a guess. If he doesnt leave when we go do our shopping it will be a surprize. Im thinking of something to make him want to stay away for awhile.
Say we're going shopping and lunch, he tries to do bigger better.
Will be thinking. Playing it cool for now...onlyrenting
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Only:
We all realize that you may have only a few days left to post, just hook up the PC as soon as possible when you get to D.
Please contact that officer. I think when you and your daugher are trying to actually, physically leave there might be a melt down. Since he has a gun this is a very big worry. Please emphasize this to the police.
He is just trying to make it as difficult as possible with all the pressure about your daughter. Just document everything that is going on, especially the dates that things happen. Maybe he won't have the energy to pursue the notion of custody with you being in D. It does take a certain amount of energy each day for him to fight the pain and take his medication to stay somewhat in reality. With you in D, and him having to manage his health it might be just to much for him to do. We will pray for this. My heart is in my throat as you plan to get out. Much love Patz
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Patz,
I will be calling a friend to help with getting D out of the house. Her daughter and mine are friends.
Maybe Friday take her some where after school. Today I will go to work and leave for a while mid day to run around, go to the post office, Drs, school about the transfer papers.
My D is planning on going to school she had been sick with a cough.
Friday after I get off work I can meet them make be sure she is with me.
Maybe have her spend the night somewhere, Saturday I call the police if I can't get him to leave while I pack. have neighbors help me.
my D is spending the night not knowing whats going on.
Im working on it, not quite gelled yet.
onlyrenting
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I still have the card for the officer that took the report when my H talked about the gun and shooting me if I went to dallas, I will call him.
I had explaind about us wanting to move and how my H said we were not to go. I will let him know my plans and his advise.
I second the notion of calling this guy. And if he is not helpful, please keep trying until you get help. The local battered women's shelter might be helpful-- they will know of officers who can protect you and/or will have other ideas for who should be there. THey might even send someone to help you.
I'm worried about this guy freaking out. PLEASE have an army of people there when you leave. Promise?
Hang in there. In a year you will look back with happiness that you did this and shock that you were ever in such a bad situation.
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onlyrenting,
I just wanted to add my voice to the support. You're doing a fantastic job.
bunny
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Good going onlyrenting! I will be holding my breath until I read your first post from big D.
Be safe. Love you.
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Dear Onlyrenting:
There is a light at the end of the tunnel.
Thoughts and prayers.
GFN
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Hi everyone,
I'm worried about this guy freaking out. PLEASE have an army of people there when you leave. Promise
?
Last night I had images of many people surrounding me, protecting me. I try and sleep but faces were poping up in my head. It was wild. I woke
up at 3am and again at 5am. As the days are passing I have run into people I have cared about and had the chance to say good-bye.
Today I called the officer and left a voice mail. He works the late shift so after my H goes to sleep I will call him on his advise. His message said he would be out for the weekend so I would want to know who else to call.
I went to my D's school, she was sick again with this fever and cold.
I found out about the transfer procedure, I can fax any papers needed.
It was then I saw a good teacher friend. She is an Art teacher, I have known her since my D was in K.
We became friends I enjoy painting, so we shared our love for the Art.
We got to say goodbye holding back the tears.
Every little thing is falling in place. There are many things going on and they are all fitting like peices in a puzzle.
Today my H, I know he is getting worried. After he tried to bully me with telling me how I was not going to take our D. I just blew him off.
agreed to what ever he said. He was telling me how he was going to have me fly out and get settled, my D would stay here, not to pull her out of school, BLA BLA.
Then Im putting things in the garage, he starts telling me He's going to have me tested for drugs, I guess I had too much energy taking a few blankets out. BLA BLA.
Next he courners me saying lets talk, "Why am I so angry with him"?
I said " it's me don't worry about it".
He is telling me lets get a long for our D. Wait and he will move us all up to Dallas later. BLA BLA
Telling me to stop and listen, he's being told he has more surgeries and whatever issue with his blood clot.
(he was sure to give himself a shot in the stomach, so we could all know about it.) - He should have thought about his condition before he pushed me out with no parachute.
I just learned he will be gone first thing Thursday 6am 1hr away to the Doctors, So Im going to go by the U-haul place. They called and have the truck ready for Saturday. Im going to ask If I can start loading it for the few hours he will be gone and park it back until Saturday. It cant hurt to ask. It would be great to get most of it packed incase things turn bad.
This is going to be difficult for my D, no matter if her Dad is not always nice to her, He has been home with her the last two days, Im sure he is sending her mixed messages about us.
She will be torn and hoping she will trust me. I know she trust me but in saying that she will allow herself to express the anger about the whole crummy situation.
onlyrenting 2 days
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Only:
My prayers are with you as you try to leave. Please keep us posted until it is time to go. Just know you are surrounded with the love of this post and that as in the "Celestine Prophecy" by James Redfield........there are coincidences in life. The fact you are running into people, other things that are happening .......cease to be coincidences and are illuminations showing you on the pathway leading to life and happiness. This post is for you, to surround you with love and protection as you go into the future. Much love, Patz
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Only: Still with you. We all are. Definately surrounding and protecting you.
Sending you strength and good fortune.
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got lucky u-haul let me take the truck for short time loaded my stuff , now only what will fit in my car as I drive to pick up the truck on sat.
feel bett got to go to work called in late after found out he would be at the docs,
bye
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One foot in front of the other, Only. Keep on.
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You're doing it Only!
God Bless you!
GFN
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only,
I hope this doesn't sound stupid, but with all you've been through and shared here, you kind of feel like a kid sister. I and a lot of others here wish we could be there to help and protect you and your daughter (mine is twelve also). But since we can't be there physically we are there in spirit. And I'm sure like me, when people here say they are praying for you, they're not just saying that to make you feel better. We are really taking time and praying for you and your precious daughter's welfare. God bless.
mudpuppy
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Only:
What Mudpuppy stated is absolutely true. Patz
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Today's the Day! :D
Best of luck, Onlyrenting, and God be with you!
GFN
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Only:
Just checking to see if you had posted. As GFN says "Today is the day!"
Much love Patz
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Thinking of you this morning, Onlyrenting, and hoping that you are well on your way....enjoying your trip....and that you and your daughter are safe and looking forward to a much brighter future!!
:D :D :D
GFN
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Right there with you, Only. Hope you can feel it, we are all with you.
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Thinking good thoughts and praying for you and your daughter every day.
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Me too, Onlyrenting.
Maybe soon....you'll be at your new place?
Hoping and praying that all is well.
GFN
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Only:
Just checking in to see if you made it to D ok. Been thinking about you since you left. Hope the trip went ok. Much love, Patz
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ONLYRENTING!! keeping and eye out for you....thought I'd just get you back to the top of the board. Still sending you positive energy!!! I'm sure you'll let us know how you're doing when you can!!!
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Only,
Just wanted to send positive thoughts, energy and prayers your way!
God Bless!!
Screamer
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Hi, Im in the Big D.
I sent a message yesterday, but it didn't post.
This is a test
onlyrenting1
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Hi everyone, I made it to the big D.
The Drive took from friday to Sunday late.
I came home Thursday to find the receptionist asked the office help not to tell my daughter about the move yet, but the woman told her anyway.
My D was not doubt upset, so when her Dad picked her up at school, she let him know. They were both waiting for me to get home to let me know what they had discovered.
Friday my H ran down to the court house to try and stop me with court papers. I found the Divorce papers and took them just to cause him a delay.
I went to work, said my good-byes, went to the school to get my D before my H would be there to pick her up.
I had the U-haul packed with what ever I had done the day before, when he left for the Doctors, then took off.
The Police came by Sunday evening to find out if I was here and to have me call my H. My BIL said he would give me the message.
We returned the Uhaul and looked at the nearby schools today.
When I got back my BIL said my H is upset with him now, and accusing him and I of having an affair. We agreed no contact with my D unless its suppervised on a speaker phone
I just logged on and found a message from my H, not to contact him
it would be 30days for the Divorce, and expect contact from child services.
I expect no less from him.
I have been busy and will try and read thru other post when I get time on my own computer. Love you all for all your support.
I know without your support I would not have been able to pull this off.
Thanks again onlyrenting---Lease is up
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Onlyrenting> soooo glad to hear from you!! Please know that we have all been your angel wings through this, I am so relieved for you. I feel you still will have some work, so hang tough with the child custody thing. Stay centered and strong. Your daughter will thank you one day for saving her (and what an example....saving yourself!). SMILING for you!
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onlyrenting,
God bless you soooo much. You are one brave gal.
I found the Divorce papers and took them just to cause him a delay.
And one smart cookie.
We are all with you. We look forward to hearing more, and pray things will work out smoothly.
Yes, your lease is up!
mudpuppy
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Onlyrenting, I'm so proud of you. I hope that one day I can act as strong and bold as you do!
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Dear Onlyrenting:
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D
I think I have a perma-smile!!! I'm so glad that you made it there safe and sound and all!!!
You are my heroine!!!
It is late here and I am just reading and not posting but I just had to post here because
I am soooo proud of you Onlyrenting!!!
You have truly shown what courage and initiative and planning is all about!!
You caught the boat!!! :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Do be swift about getting that custody order!!! It is essential!!
I will keep praying for you and your daughter.
GFN
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Im having a problem posting
this is a test
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Only! :D
I read your posts with tears in my eyes. I am so very proud of you. We have been waiting on you to get to D. Hope the trip was uneventful and that you get your daugther into her routine.
Typical N response accusing you and your BIL of having an affair. We are here no matter what to support you! Much love, Patz
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HI Im having a problem posting
Got an e-mail agian, He is telling me about the lies he will be telling in court. then he remindes about how he tells the truth.
one for the records.
the nice thing about the police and judges they know when people are lying. He is a breath of fresh air, His honesty honors them, which they do deserve.
I have not responded back to him.
I don't know how much I can do on the child custody from here.
will need some advise on how to proceed, making some phone calls to find out what I need to do.
Working on getting a place so we can move on the school for my D.
Im so glad to be here, and thank you all so much again and again.
I know the angels were with me when we moved here, I feel confident
it was the right thing.
onlyrenting
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Hi onlyrenting,
Congrats on making it to Dallas!
Your H has NO HOPE WHATSOEVER of gaining custody of your daughter. None. But I wouldn't tell him that. Let him waste his time and energy on it.
bunny
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Hi Only:
Keep copies of all emails.
Document all phone calls, communications and get any witnesses to initial them.
Built a stack of paper, Only. You may not need it....and it may come in very handy.
Sometimes, seeking a temporary custody order can be very quick. It gives you a safe legal position.....and time to prepare, gather info, etc. to seek permanent and full custody.
Again....the woman's shelter there might be able to help or refer you in the right direction.
I agree with Bunny but I am certain that you need to get that order asap as insurance.
GFN
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Only:
Thinking of you and your daughter this morning. Hope all is going well.
Love, Patz
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Hello to all,
We are doing fine, busy with an Interview and looking into a resident to get my D into school by Monday. I only need a contract, I don't have to be moved in to get her going to school.
Im working on getting custody papers filed in the Ca courts. My Niece in Ca said she would be a mediator to hand the courts documents on my behalf. Im feeling better she may be able to help me with this.
Keeping my Hs e-mails and my BIL is keep his too.
My BIL, read over the WC evaluation regarding the self-absorbed Narrssitic Disorder. It was late and we will disscuss what the medical jargon is later today.
Wish me a good Interview today, I have two.
Onlyrenting-Lease is up :lol:
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Only: perhaps it's time for a new name....AWESOME maybe? I am so happy for you.
I am sending you power and love. Your interviews will go great. You have such positive power, I have no doubt of it.
I know you are busy, but I would like to ask you something:
What measure or importance do you think positive thinking, or negative doubts had in your journey? Equal parts? Do you think the thoughts of others played a part or are still?
This is the kind of stuff I mess with in my mind all the time, and since you have had some success lately, I just wonder.
Obviously, I believe people's positive energy and prayers assisted you, or I wouldn't be sending them.....I guess, more than anything I'm wondering how you were able to overcome fear like you did (are doing).
You are my hero!
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Mum, still having problem with posting. I only have a few minutes on the computer here. expect my new phone on next week.
We got moved in our new Place and my D starts Monday.
My job is letting me get settled and will start me on the 21st.
The interview was informal and I was told before I left I was hired.
I responed to your question about the positive feed back but it didn't post.
I described looking at fear on a scale of big or small.
Big would be something I would say that made me worry why I would not easily do something.
Positive feed back from the POSTERs here, like yourself, would give a perspective to shrink my worry making my BIG FEAR to a SMALL Fear.
The Small fear would allow me to move a step closer to the fear.
step-by-step it got me to the end result.
Without the Positive feed back I may have been frozen not able to move past the Big Fear.
I would keep in my mind about the Posters here and the feeling that people cared about what I was doing and understood what I was dealing with.
Living with an N and the confussion was difficult to understand on my own.
without YOU ALL, here was a big factor that made it possible to have the confidence to move forward.
I love you all. ....working on a new name
onlyrenting
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Wow, I just checked in and realize that the Big Move has happened. Congratulations! What great news. You sound happier and lighter already.
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Onlyrenting: You don't know who I am, but I've been following this thread for a couple of weeks now, and I just wanted to say a big WELL DONE! You have more people rooting for you than you even now. Your daughter is so lucky and blessed to have a mother like you, and you're teaching her to be a strong person who doesn't take crap from anyone. Good luck with everything!
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Only,
Your daughter is so lucky to have you for a mom. You can take such pride in the strength you have shown.
My prayers are with you that the job, new living situation, custody battle and all that goes with that moves forward as smoothly and positively as possible.
You are AWESOME. :D :D
Brigid
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only,
Just checking in; I've been keeping an eye out, watching your progress.
This will probably make you blush, but from the sound of a lot of posts here, I think you're kind of a hero. 8) 8) 8)
It took a lot of courage to stand up on your own two feet and say "I'm not gonna take this anymore!"
I hope I can stand firm against my brother as well as you have with your N.
God bless.
mudpuppy
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You all are making me feel proud of myself.
Today My D started school and is loving it.
My phone will be turned on by Tuesday, so I will be able to be on-line and communicate more with all of you.
I have lots to do, will talk later.
Thank you all so very much, I never would have dreammed so many strangers would be there for me. I am truely Blessed
Onlyrenting
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Only, you got me crying...joyful tears. That your daughter started school and loves it.........I know how good that must feel for you. Mud's right, you are a hero! Mine anyway.
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you are a hero! Mine anyway
.
Mine too! :D :D :D
mud
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onlyrenting, I consider you family. Just a member of the family that I haven't met yet due to the geographical distance between us. :) In any case, I know you have had a lot of poeple praying for you and your daughter as well as sending positive thoughts your way.
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Hi Onlyrenting
I'm very new here so a bit shy of posting on your thread, but I have to add LOUD APPLAUSE :D :D :D
You are so brave and you've gotten through so much. I'll be praying for you and your daughter too.
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Thank you all so very much for your kind support.
in 1 week 1 day
1. I drove 1,500 miles,
2. secured a better paying job
3. got a place to live,
4. my D in school,
5. my utilities
6 today my phone.
7 left an unstable marriage
8. made new neighbor friends
9. family members that are helping me with kindness,likr i never known
10 most important you all here looking to encourage me along the way.
I was looking forward to the phone being turned on so I could get together again.
Im almost afraid to look back on this post to see how far I have come.
the boat has left thr dock, I have been reaching out for the life savers along the way, things have all come together as tho I have had some brave angles looking out for me.
my H leaves me e-mails to remind me how sick he is and can't be under stress because of his blood clot. He says he must stay in CA, so for now I will get a break.
He is mad at his brother for helping me, and his brother is upset at him for being out of line. My D has said very little about him. she has been busy with her cousins, Im sure it has helped her adjust for now.
I will write more later, got to go....OR
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Only:
Number 11: Free at last, free at last, thank God Almighty, FREE AT LAST.
You did it girl! Yeah he will use Oh I am soooo sick deal to twist the guilt knife. Shoulda thought of that before you left. He will use this to get out of any further obligations to you and your daughter. Consider yourself lucky if this happens. Soooooo proud of you for getting on that boat. Your trip has brought back so many memories for me. You will get past the fear. You are strong, smart and capable to make your and your daughter's life. Well back to humanity. Love Patz
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Onlyrenting,
I've been off the board for a while; a combination of reasons. Not sure where to begin in getting caught up. BUT had to say congratulations. When I don't have two school and one work deadline I will read through the thread and learn about your saga in the last few weeks. What I did need to say, quickly, is that I AM SOOO GLAD for you. Wahoo! You did it! You've got your life back in your own hands and I am so very, very happy about this and proud of all you've done in such a short period of time.
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HI everyone,
Im still very busy, will be working on the DMV for texas.
My D is loving our place, she called several of her Ca,friends and was happy to talk with them.
She has not pushed contact with her Dad, at this time.
He sent me an e-mail to remind me how I had no Job, I was breaking up his brother's marriage.
he was moving and unless I paid for our dog to fly here he ws going to put her to sleep.
I forwarded the messages to my BIL, he told me, just stay the course with what im doing . He said his older son would help my H with the move , where ever that might be. his older son lives in San Fransisco.
He mentions nothing about our D,only expect Child services to check on
her soon.
My Niece is working on getting custody papers for me. I wrote a letter she will try using it to get the help I need.
My BIL and SIL re being most kind, they call both my D nd I to make sure we are doing ok. we are ll giving my D the encourgement to do well in school.
Its midnite here time to get some rest. Thank you all for the support,
Do I ignore him?keep printing his notes for my records, should I change my e-mail? any thoughts, he gets very rude.
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You can possibly contact a breed rescue group in your former home state to get the dog away from him. Don't contact the SPCA, they euthanize, so what's the point?
Good luck OR, you're launched and soaring!!!
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Only:
I vote for no contact. How dare he threaten you with putting the dog to sleep! He is doing all this to pull your strings to get a response. He wants to continue this little "dance" to see if he can still manipulate you. Why else would he tell you these things? The only concern he has right now is how much is it going to cost him in child support. He WILL try to use your daughter to get back at you and try to manipulate her to get what he wants. Especially when he sees that his behaviour is failing with you and his brother. I can see the "oh poor me routine" and "look what your mother has done" etc. on the horizon as your daugher gets older. Ignore him.
Just stay the course and keep your focus. Keep on keeping on. Much love Patz
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Only. I would also ignore him, although do what you can for the dog/ultimately your daughter (I assume she is attached?).
A rescue group would be good to contact...OR, look up dog transport services. If he says you could pay for flying the dog...who is the person who would get the dog to the airport? Have THAT person help you get your dog.
Best of luck. You are doing so well. You are still my hero.
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Hi only,
My perspective on e-mail is mixed. A great portion of my case against my brother is based on the rants he sent me and others. However I blocked his e-mail about a year ago and must admit it gave me peace of mind not having to listen to him.
Its hard to say. If you have a legal problem coming up with him, and it sounds like you do, his whacko e-mails could come in mighty handy. Might even force him to back down. How much do you need peace of mind? Its worth a lot.
It turns out my bro kept e-mailing me for months after I told him I had blocked his address. I guess he couldn't believe someone would not want to listen to him anymore.
You are still my hero.
OR, mum's the word, so to speak. You're still mine too. :D
mudpup
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Dear, dear Only:
You have done so much! Settled a great deal so quickly!! You are doing so very well!!! I am really and truly proud of you and happy for the good that is happening already. May God bless you with much more!!!
Now......forget peace of mind
forget his ability to push your buttons for a little while
and think.....proof.
Keep every single one of the emails he sends and forward a copy of them to someone you trust....a lawyer is best but if not....some reliable adult... as proof of date of receipt.
Keep your email addy and let the stupid son of a bees wax rant his little dumb self into as cooky looking a corner as he possibly can.
Put up your walls of emotional defense and decide not to believe one word he says or let his words cause you one moment of sleeplessness and save those ridiculous threats and comments and rants and button pushing attempts to be used later.....to prove without a doubt exactly why.......you deserve full custody with supervised visitation......at the minimu of your daughter....for her and your emotional well-being and safety.
My two cents.
Take care Only.....you are doing great but take care to keep whatever evidence of his disturbance he so brainlessly supplies you with.
GFN
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Thanks for keeping in touch
Today found out from Social security my D has 400 a month that follows her. my H will be notified in the next few days. He told me she only got $15, but 3 mos ago that changed. I couldn't find our SSI cards so I had to go down to the office,good thing I did.
He would always complain when she needed things, so I have been paying for the clothes, dances etc.
He is telling me today he is demanding our D to call him by noon on friday or he is getting lawyer.
I will only have her call when somone else is monitoring the conversation.
I have my Ca,neighbor helping me with our bit pull dog. she will let me know whats goin on.
will write more later ....OR
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Only:
Sounds good girl. :) Patz
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You go girl!
There's definitely a breed rescue org for your dog's breed, and they should be very active in CA, so your neighbor should be able to get some help right there on the spot if she needs it. You can breathe easier about that.
Be careful about taping the phone calls between your daughter and your ex, some states are very against that. You didn't say you were going to do this (just so you know I'm not inventing things and attributing them to you - Ns do that - brrrrr!) but if you can't find someone to help with monitoring the calls it would be a natural next step, so this is the time to caution you.
((((Onlyrenting1))))
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Hi to everyone
I start work today, got some new clothes too.
MyD spent the night with a new friend. she had a great time.
My BIL, has continuied his emotional support of both my D and I.
My H is still telling us, about him being on deaths bed, now he claims his face shows signs of a recent stroke.
I told him to seek out an animail rescue,he wants to fly our dog here,but we can't take big dogs. :cry:
got to go get ready for work OR
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Hi OR
Take no notice of his medical complaints; strokes don't 'show' just in your face! :wink:
I'm so happy for you and your new life,
Kaz.
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Only!
It sounds so good to hear you are doing ok! I just love the progress!
The N is going to use his "illness" to pull those strings girlfriend for all the primary gain he can get. Onset of strokes are sudden and they usually accompany slurring of speech, paralisys etc...........I noticed he "stroke" did not prevent him from still harrassing you now did it? Press the ignore button.
Post when you can. Love Patz
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I'm so glad to hear things are going well too, Onlyrenting!!!
Good luck with the new job!!! I'm sure you'll do great!
Press the ignore button.
I love it Patz!!! I agree.....if he was really ill, he wouldn't be focussing on trying to convince you of it. He'd be seeking medical attention and playing all the medical staff for every bit of special attention he could get.
I say do what Patz says and ignor (but keep copies of those emails).
Glad to hear your D is doing well and making new friends. That is so nice to hear!! :D
Sorry about your dog. Maybe the animal rescue people can find a good home for the dog? I hope so.
GFN
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GFN:
It is good to be at this board with our "family" as it were. I like to read your and Mudpuppy's insights. It is good to present our problems here and get different angles. I might see something that I have totally over looked and is important to understand. I am very proud of Only. It brings back so many memories of that road I have already traversed.
Only will look back and wonder "why did I wait so long". It is good to see the servitude of Nship broken. Patz
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hi Patz & GFN
Had a wonderful time my first day at work.
I'm able to be home before 4:30, to have the time with my D.
I agree with you both, on the ignore button.
I check my H's web site, he is writing and no mention on a stroke,he sounds fine.
He didn't write me today, so I checked out his site if he mentioned anything to them, nothing not even about us leaving him.
He writes music reviews and talks like he is just fine.
got to go it's late, ....OR
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OR: so very happy things are going well for you. Relieved as if it were me, even. YAY! You give me hope..........you really do. Keep on, brave woman!
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OR, I'm so glad that things are working out well for you. You are really in inspiration for me that we each create our own lives. Positive thoughts and prayers for you and your daughter.
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Mum, longtire and everyone
Thanks for your continued support.
I will get back on the board once things settle down a little.
Thank you all so much I'm glad I can inspire those around me.
Love you all .. got to go ...OR
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Hi Onlyrenting:
I will get back on the board once things settle down a little.
Hopefully this just means that you are busy and things are hectic.
I'm keeping you in my prayers anyway. You are definately travelling in that boat now. My prayers are that the waters will be calm and the sun will shine for you girl! You are a real inspiration!! :D :D
GFN
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Post when you can. Patz
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Hi everyone,
I have been busy with getting settled still.
My D went to a church youth group, and has more new friends with plans to do some fun things.
We will be spending time with my BIL and the family this weekend.
My H has not made any contact for two days, this is a needed relief.
The employee I have been training with, used to date a friend of mine.
they used to skydive back in the late 70s. I was looking for my pictures of her and came accross pictures of my H and I.
Im having mixed feelings of sadness, anger and working on getting used to the Idea of letting go of the 26 yrs of memories.
Its late got to go. OR
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Only:
So glad you things are going well with you and your D. Also glad to see that you BIL is helping out. This is a welcome relief in the event you need some back up.
I can relate about the memories. Just lean into the sadness and let it flow. This is something you just have to work through. I also went through all the pictures. That was then and now is now. What was true when those pics were taken are no longer true. I still have some of mine but I haven't looked at them in ages.
Glad the N has not contacted you. Pretty soon he will be just a low level hum that you can tune out. Patz
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Patz,
today the UPS left a message about a delivery, they will try again on Friday, my h doesn't have this address, hope its from a friend. With the internent anyone can find you, will find out Friday.
My D mentioned about how many divorced familys were at her school
They were talking about if Parents should stay together or not, I held my breath about what her comment was.
The day I went to leave town,I picked her up from school before my H, would be there. I went to pick up the U-haul truck keys , while I ran
to get the keys, she took off running down the street toward home.
I chased her down in my car, made her get in.
She was upset and told me she didn't want to leave her friends, our dog and her Dad. as I was driving back to the u-Haul, a guy I work with drove by,I flaged him down, he went with me to keep her from running away. (Another angel watching over me.)
she was upset said she would only stay 1 week, 2 hrs later she would stay only 2 weeks. the conversation was difficult for the travel because the past was too painful to discuss and the future was something not easy to talk about, when she wanted her friends and the old life.
we had to stay in the moment during the drive for the next 3 days. She could have picked up the phone and for awhile I thought she would run or make an escape, but she never tried or made any effort to push to contact her Dad.
So as she tells me this story today she simply said:
"Better to be divorced, the Parents aren't happy, they are upset with each other and take it out on the child".
I realized she knows the child suffers, and sees the unhappiness in her Parents.
I feel she is no longer mad at me like I knew she was on the trip up here.
She appeaars to be doing great and sees me less stressed.
I tell people my H is not able to travel because of his recent surgery, and is still in CA., for now thats the story for us both. The truth is too much to explian.
thanks for keeping in touch OR
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Thanks for keeping us posted OR.
Your daughter will get more and more comfortable as time goes by. Thank goodness for your angels. :wink:
We're all so proud of you.
mudpup
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Oh Only!
I cried reading your post about your daughter trying to run away! There you are....trying to escape a crazy situation...afraid that he might do something to harm you....and then....you have to chase your child....and keep her from running.....and she is mad at you on the trip....and all the stress and how hard all of that must have been for you dear Only!
All I can say is that you are a real inspiration to all who are tormented and who use their courage to flee bad situations.
I'm so glad things are better now for your D and that she is beginning to understand some things.
I admire your patience and your strength and your determination and I will continue to pray for you and her.
Your instincts are good Only. If that package sets off little bells.....listen to them and get help with it.
((((((((((((Only)))))))))))))
GFN
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Morning Only:
I am sorry your daughter had such a hard time. Please do not fill guilty about this (easier said than done). From her point view, her little universe consisted of school, home, mom, dad, friends and activities. In the broader sense to take in adult issues in this little world is really very skewed. The fact that she does not appear to be angry, may not be the case. Processing the changes even for you is going to take time and for her as well.
The best thing you can do at this point is to keep things as consistant and predictable as possible. Children need predictable outcomes because their fund of knowledge does not allow for all the generalizations that are necessary for adult judgements. She only knows that things have changed and is trying to intergate what she knows in the past and how that fits in the here and now. It will be a day to day thing with the both of you.
I found that if I viewed things as a stack of important papers to be dealt with. Put the most important thing on top and work through it in descending order. I reallize that problems are not worked through in a linear fashion and in fact many things occur at the same time. I worked on the things I could control......my son school, his doctors, his services, getting into a church......some of the very things you are doing. The other emotional issues would come in waves. You just have to ride those waves and recognize when you see the "crest" of those coming in yourself and child. Just watch her eating and sleeping patterns, whether is she passive aggressive about issues she was not ordinarily obstinate about, her grades in school etc.
Also know that you cannot do all the things you need to do and just put those things that are the most critical first. Cut yourself the necessary slack and don't beat yourself up. Just know that every day is a day of progress from the N and Nness you and your daughter were caught up in.
We continue to hold you close in our prayers and thoughts. Much love, Patz
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Hi to everyone,
I got my package, it was my phone, they sent me a new one, when I moved here the phone need to be upgraded.
today I got 4 emails from my H.
this is a good one for the comment section Patz stared on another thread.
Claims the mini stroke he had affecting his face is MS. The MS affects the brain and he will be able to forget about why he should Divorce me, it's all under the bridge, he only has time for the serious stuff, like his health and being a part of our D's life.
one of the 4 emails he sent today tells me how I called him a jerk, he was going to tell my D how I felt about him.
I had sent him an e-mail last week pasting and copied the rude comments he made to me.
so I re-sent it to him, help remind him what he said to me. it made comment how I was evil, a slut, having an affair with his brother. I told him I don't want to be married to him, he was a jerk.
I will let him re-read the 14 comments just because, he appears to have selective memories about only what I have said.
I met a girl at my new job, who has MS and did mention how her face
was affected and checking with a spinal tap was needed.
I'm glad he is in CA, life is so much more peaceful
Have a great Easter to All. we will be spending it with my BIL and family.
OR
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OR,
Your husband won't remember anything he said and even sending him back his own emails won't "help" his memory. He'll just say you wrote them yourself or some crap. His thinking is severely distorted. And that is kind of an understatement. you are so lucky to have escaped from this jerk!!! :lol:
Have a wonderful Easter with your BIL's family!
bunny
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OR, I think you should have posted this in the "Most N Comments" thread. Congratulations on getting out. Peace and Love.
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Hi only,
Its good to hear all of the positive things you are experiencing, especially the peace.
Have you considered just blocking his e-mail? Or do you think his continued asinine comments might come in handy if and when you end up in court?
The way I dealt with it when I finally got sick of my Ns threats was to keep my old e-mail address, but filter it so only my contact list could get through, and then set up a new e-mail account for everything else. Worked great.
I have to agree with bunny. Showing them what they said is hopeless. They can rationalize anything. Of course it might have been therapeutic for you to throw it back in his face, if so go to it. :twisted:
Happy Easter to you and your daughter. :wink: :D
mudpup
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Bunny, long, Mud,
Bunny, I know I shouldn't waste my time. You know how rude he has gotten to me in the past, I think if he got his own words back for him to read everday of his life, it would make me feel better.
for so long I would just let it go, try and not think about the crule things he would say. He counted on me to let it go, act like it never happened. bringing it back in his face to read over and over even if he tries to say they were my words,he knows they were his.
It may continuie the anger in him but at least this is the true him, not the lets forget about it then be nice to me setting me up for the next crule comment. It may be the only thing I ever send to him again. I will attach it to all my emails from now on. If only to say I'm not going to forget it.
Even if I don't I feel better saying I will.
Long, I did send that comment to the other thread.
Mud it did make me feel better to say all of the above.
He has never once said he was sorry of saying the terrible things to me or his brother. He thinks his brain cells would be better off damanged than to say sorry.
He makes me so glad I left.
Mudd, He just wrote me again I think I will read over again about changing my e-mail address take your advise.
Saying something how brain injury causes personality changes.
Again, no responsibility, now its the brain cell excuse for who knows how long. Is this a set-up for a legal excuse? hope it will back fire on him.
Talk later OR
(OR) Think this will be my new name for a while...
guess it means a life of hell with an N, ( OR ) a life with Happy in it. ???
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Hi OR,
Saying something how brain injury causes personality changes
Maybe you could convince him to go lay on the curb down at the bus stop. After five or six busses run over his head maybe he'll have a new and improved personality! :wink: :D
Maybe after eight or nine he'll be normal! :shock:
mudpup
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MUD, I'm laughing so hard right now.
I'm, making a copy and paste, sending with a reply to the comment he sent.
see if he can come up with some more great N comments.
Thanks MUD.
OR
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OR,
You're welcome. Glad to help. :D
mud
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Mud,
I just sent it to him. I took out the verbage so it sounded like I was speaking to him directly. I added to keep sending me more great reasons to keep the blame on any thing else but him.
Made my day!!!! OR
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OR,
You know, if you're going to continue to allow him to e-mail you it might be best if you just let him hang himself.
It feels quite good to let off some steam once in awhile, but if you make a habit of telling him he is in need of Ralph Cramden giving him a lobotomy he might turn it around on you. A few jabs in response to his provocations are one thing, but I wouldn't make a habit of it, if you know what I mean. No need to give him unnecessary ammo.
mudpup
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Mud, I agree not to continue with telling him things that will come back at me. I will let him send me whatever to use on him.
quote]he is in need of Ralph Cramden giving him a lobotomy he might turn it around on you[/quote]
Mud, he already has our relationship as anything or anyone as why he behaves so. I added keep sending more of his great reasons to never say sorry no responsibility for his actions. My H looks alot like Scott Peterson with the short dark hair, scary.
Here is some of what my H sent me.
Remember when Gary Busey was in the motercycle accident & they said his personality changed after his brain injury ?
When I had my MRI there are numerous places where my brain cells are dead.
I guess from MS or no blood flow
But when I say
Water under the bridge
No hard feelings
I mean it
Those brain cells are gone
Literally gone
As in “numerous white brain matter 7mm posterior, inferior frontal lobe
Small vessel ischemia processes, multiple sclerosis"
So I really mean it
I think I will contact the Doctor on this, I have already talked to the main nurse to ask the doctor please, write up how many times I have tried to get us into the office together to discus his health,.
How my H refused every time. He tells me things I don't know if they are true.
I loved this one, My H said:
I feel when you lie to someone
You have no respect for them
If you have no respect
You can't love 'em
OR
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Did you mention earlier OR that he had MS? I can't remember.
But this does put a different spin on things regarding his personality if he really does have it.
MS affects cognitive functions (concentration, memory, word finding to name a few) and alters mood along with all the physical symptoms.
It's an awful disease.
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Mudpup and OR:
What a cool reply! If I need a good come back I will call upon you Mud!
Glad to see things are progressing Only. Just keep in mind when things REALLY begin to go downhill he will use your daughter and his illness to get secondary gain. He is truly one sad individual. Patz
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My H's health issues get overwhelming.
This is new, he thought he had a "Mini Stroke", his face was affected.
they want to confirm if it is MS with a spinal tap.
If his personality changes coupled with the N-personality, should I be worried and glad I left him?
When he threated to shoot me (even tho we don't own a gun) could I expect him to follow through? He could claim insanity?
I should demand an evaluation of his mental state from someone?
This is his e-mail from today. This makes me upset to think someone gets to make lies up so others question who you are. I have had to answer to his accusations with his family and mine. I know they are such lies but still it causes questions in peoples minds . like he says below how a judge will think some of it, must be true. He has me mad today, and reminds me he believes he has MS, so lets forget it, because he has.
I don't know what your talking about
look yesterday is gone
I've never said anything i haven't believed is true
so i won't say I'm sorry for what i believe
you & i know the truth
when people have a difference of opinion
the judge says"somewhere in the middle is the truth
It's never one person is totally right
so lets just move forward
He tells me he will only be writing to our D, because she cares about him, and he senses I'm angry with him.
He Ends the letter with this
the lords prayer says
forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us
i will not say I'm sorry for what i believe
the past is the past period
no one cares about what someone else thinks
that's the way of the world
you need to let your anger go
i will never mention your name in any contact in the future with D
& if i have i don't remember
This is scary to me,
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OR,
What a sick, putrid, little turd he is.
The Lord's prayer also says 'deliver us from evil' and that's just what He did when He got you to Dallas.
I've never said anything i haven't believed is true
so i won't say I'm sorry for what i believe
There's another one for 'most N comments ever.' He's not saying it was true just that he belived it to be true. Typical N weasel words.
when people have a difference of opinion
the judge says"somewhere in the middle is the truth
It's never one person is totally right
so lets just move forward
Maybe he ought to ask Scott Peterson if that is an accurate statement.
OR, it is impossible not to be really angry with that kind of bologna coming your way. You're going to have to decide if you want to subject yourself to this crap much longer.
Maybe you ought to block your e-mail without telling him. He will just keep e-mailing and won't even know you aren't getting them. :wink:
mudpup
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Hi OR,
That was me above there as Guest asking about the MS.
From what you've written about him re. his spinal op., the feeling in his legs, the 'mini stroke', the 'dead brain cells' and him being on a disability payment, it does sound as if he has MS.
This disease comes and goes in various forms, I find it hard to believe that this is the first time you've heard that this is what he may have. With all his physical problems, surely he was investigated medically years ago and some results given to you both?
If you really didn't know, (if he kept it from you) then that's proof that you had a very dysfunctional marriage and leaving him certainly was the best thing to do for yourself and your daughter, never mind the MS.
You're apart from him now, and safe. I haven't heard of any MS sufferers turning into insane killers.
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KAZ,
My H will not let me into the Doctors with him, I have made appointments for us both to be in the doctors together and he will not go with me.
Im working on a statement from the Doctors now, to confirm my efforts, to disscuss the mental state and the fact about his condition.
Now I have moved and want something saying I tried, not leaving him in the cold as he will say.
We have been told he has RA, then a bone cancer scare. a PET scan and multipule doctors claim degenerative bone.
I have read the reports along with is brother who is a Doctor.a blood pathologist, he reads millions of cancer slides,as well as testifies in medical malpractice cases. Nothing is confirmed but the symptoms may confirm MS too.
He just e-mailed me said he would no longer send me e-mails. He is saying now for sure he has cancer, MS and will be in a wheelchair. for me to not be bitter towards him. Reminds me he feels like the girl who had her feeding tube removed ?? Missing our D.
I have not responded back to any of them, just don't know what to say. Evertime I feel sorry for him I get his BS.
OR
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Hi OR,
He certainly is a sick puppy, and I feel sorry for him too because of his medical problems. But it's OK to feel sorry for someone and not act upon it. It doesn't make you any less empathic. He doesn't even need to know that you feel sorry.
I can understand how you must get something in writing; if only just to confirm to yourself that you tried.
It's unfortunate that he has these extra medical problems along with the Narcissism, but you have to look after yourself and your daughter. First, and above all.
Let's hope that he won't send anymore emails.
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OR,
Lets just say he has RA, MS, bone cancer, scurvy, ricketts and an ingrown toenail. What does any of that have to do with his terrible treatment of you and your daughter?
Does MS make you threaten to shoot your wife?
Whatever he has, he is using it to manipulate and control you. When he can't do it through threats he tries to make you feel sorry for him.
I hope you can concentrate on what you and your daughter need, because that is you're responsibility, not fixing the unfixable or loving the unlovable.
God bless.
mudpup
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Second thoughts, you might find it hard to get anything from your doctor at this stage because of patient confidentiality. Your H chose to exclude you and wouldn't go to the appointments that you made for you both. If it came to a legal issue the doctor would be able to confirm then that your H was excluding you. Does that make sense?
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OR, here are some links -- you may find them interesting and useful. Your X-elect sounds like my Nmom, and she had both Munchausen's and Munchausen's by proxy.
http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic322.htm
(this one is pretty word-heavy at first. Go about halfway down the page.)
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Marc_Feldman_2/
(this is a whole Web page on this stuff. He's a psychiatrist who has specialized in Munchausen's Syndrome.)
hope this helps. I'm not saying your NX-elect has this, but he sure sounds like a typical case.
((((OR))))
Storm
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Oopsie, posted too fast.
OR, the above stuff does NOT mean he doesn't have MS, or any of the other stuff. My Nmom definitely had severe asthma and a psychiatric disorder, but she milked her illnesses for all she was worth, and mistreated herself enough to make the asthma into a lifelong, ultimately terminal illness (chronic obstructive pulmonary disease/emphysema).
She used illness as a way of grabbing attention, commanding sympathy, forcing others to do things for her, and evading her own responsibilities.
Sound familiar?
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Pretty hard to fabricate an MRI report.
Is there a possibility OR of getting copies of all or some of the results of the tests he's had, through your BIL? (Making sure of-course that they are copies, and not just his handwritten version).
I think it's important for you that you get to the bottom of what is the truth regarding his illnesses.
Again, it's OK to feel sorry for him, he's sick, and you're a compassionate person. But that's as far as it goes, you can't fix him. You tried your best already.
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OR:
I think Mudpup is right. MS,cancer, strokes do not cause one to threaten to shoot you. There probably is personality changes that occur (I can attest to this) with the onset of diseases. However, having said that, what kind of person was he when there were no diagnosis to blame? He was an N then and he is a more horrible N now.
When my N H had his angioplasty did he tell me before hand? No. I was at work in the hosptial and he just waltzs in and tells me he is going down for an angioplasty. Boom. Right between the eyes. When I asked him why he did this he stated "he wanted to spare" me. Spare me? It did not allow for me to make preparations for my son to be taken care of. It did not prepare for me to do things that would help us financially i.e. increasing in life insurance, it did not allow for me to contact relatives ....he did this because he lived in a state of denial. Later on when his heart problems became more severe, I begged him to go to the doctor with me so we could see what else could be done. He would have none of it. What he did do was pretend he didn't have a problem, running us increasingly in debt, pretending to be working from home when in fact he was playing around on the internet with other pathological individiuals. So I relate.
I think your N ex is not only an N but is also trying to milk his illnesses for all the secondary gain he can get. You might as well come to terms with this because this is the nature of the beast in him. This is the only thing has left to use against you, your daughter and your BIL. He has been manipulative all along but just used other mechanisms to get what he wanted. This just has to be the most convenient right now.
Keep on keeping on. Patz
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Hi OR (and all):
I'm glad you're still here posting and getting support!
The only way to accurately diagnose MS is by MRI.
I agree with the others.....MS? Mini stroke? Ingrown toenail? So what? Whatever illnesses he can use against you, to manipulate you, to make you (and especially your daughter) feel sorry for him, etc, he is using and laughing all the way!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
Gotcha!!! :evil:
Don't let him away with that. If he has ligitimate illness, fine. That is not why you left him. It's his problem and he can deal with it. He's an adult.
Threatening to shoot your wife is enough grounds for any wife to leave. Staying away is the only safe thing to do.
It is best for you and best for your child to be safe from such a person.
As to his saying stuff because he believes it, fine too.
He said you are a whore.
I guess he believes it.
He threatened to shoot you. I guess he believes that too.
Ok.....then that is a good reason to stay away.
Why would anyone want to be married to someone who threatens, calls their spouse such names, believes them to be true and continues in that direction with more insinuations and threats?
Isn't that what he's doing? Insinuating that you are the bad one for leaving poor sick him?
And you are the bad one, for not forgiving him as the Lord's prayer teaches?
Let him go as nutty as he likes, I say.
How dare he use the Lord's prayer and try to twist it to his benefit? Since when has he shown remorse or asked for forgiveness?
He can forgive you for leaving him then!!!
He's trying to use your beliefs against you. He's trying to guilt you into forgiving him without taking any responsibility for his behaviour, without expressing sorrow, without doing anything to correct his behaviour and without doing anything to make up for the damage he has caused.
You can forgive him but don't do it because he is guilting you into it, or demanding it. Do it when you are ready and do it for your own serenity.
I personally don't believe he is anywhere near as physically sick as he is claiming. He is using too many angles and coming up with too many tricks to try to control you. He's just trying to push your buttons again...this time....instead of calling you names and threatening you.....he's trying to dig into your good heart, your caing soul, your loving self......and trying to hook you there. His mind is working very well and that doesn't usually happen when people are suffering severe illness. They focus on themselves and on getting better and give up most other trials.
Don't let him fool you. He's scaring you?? Forget it. He's a coward. Too terrified to even admit the slightest wrong he's done you. Too frightened of being alone with himself to face himself. So he consentrates on you, on how to get you back, and if that doesn't work, on how to get back at you. Also, on how to manipulate and twist and guilt and appeal to your empathy and how to get his hooks into you again.
How to scare you? How to work you? How to torment you? He's so busy working on you eh?
Let him play with himself.
GFN
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Pretty hard to fabricate an MRI report.
Yes indeedy, but not at all hard to
(a) lie about it to someone who hasn't seen it (assuming it even exists)
(b) lie about its interpretation to someone who doesn't know how to read it
(c) use the health condition as a sympathy lever to exploit others/evade responsibility etc.
that was the point I was trying to make.
Storm
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Storm,
That's why it would be a good idea for the BIL to take a peek at the original reports (like I said).
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Couldn't agree with you more, Kaz. It's a good idea for OR to have the facts on the ground, from someone she knows she can trust, so she knows what she's dealing with.
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Mud, Kaz,storm Patz thank you all for your insights.
My H has had physical problems most of our marriage, I have lived with the Idea he is in alot of pain all the time. This is why until discovering this web site was my reason to just let it go with him. I know better now and understand the need to let him go his own way.
No allowing an excuse for calling me names or treating me the way he does.
Im sure he will run the reports by his brother to look at.
his brother is giving me emotional support about dealing with the health issues.
His brother has felt the wrath of my H, for helping my D and I, he knows now the lies my H is willing to tell.
Storm, I will check intothe websites, Im almost afraid to find out anymore on my H's mental issue, the N stuff has me very worried about even being an Ex-wife.
Would you say he has the a full blow N-disorder?
GFN said
How dare he use the Lord's prayer and try to twist it to his benefit? Since when has he shown remorse or asked for forgiveness?
He can forgive you for leaving him then!!!
He's trying to use your beliefs against you. He's trying to guilt you into forgiving him without taking any responsibility for his behaviour, without expressing sorrow, without doing anything to correct his behaviour and without doing anything to make up for the damage he has caused.
OR
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OR:
At this point he will probably try to use just about anything, The Lord's Prayer included, to get what he wants. I think probably it might be sinking into his thick skull that there is no one left to manipulate and he now has himself to love and look into the mirror each day. It can now be a real love feast for him. He can ruminate to his little hearts content on "how everybody has done me so wrong". What an N. Patz
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Hi Patz,
well he said he would not ever e-mail me again, just look for the divorce papers in the mail. living so far away and him having medical issues, gives me some peace.
I only answered his e-mails because I had left with my D, not wanting him to say I didn't let him know how to reach her. He wants to write her and e-mail her,I hope she will share anything concerning with me.
I had a friend call me for the first time since I moved, she went buy our house. She found my D's expensive school books in the trash.
I had been asking my H to turn them into the school, he always ignores my request.
He threw them out just days after we left. They were in her room, why he would take and throw her things out so quick, mine I could understand.
My friend retrieved 2 of 5 books for me. The school had asked for them at the time I was enrolling her into school here. I told them to call my H, don't know if they ever talked to him, he also disconnected our phone.
She had told me she saw him at the school the day we left, looking for her, I imagine the office let him know I checked her out leaving the state. Bet he was beyond words, or he likley told them I was more than evil.
We are feeling better every day, my D is at a youth group tonight.
She had her science teacher ask her to help some of the kids in her class, because she has already studied their 7th grade program.
He gave her a test today at the high school level and she past it.
She brought it home for me to see, she was very excited about her progress, she gave me lots of hugs. Makes me want to cry.
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OR:
So much for his sentimentality with personal effects of your D. This really highlights the issue of how he objectifies people in general. Whatever was important to you or your D wasn't important to him at all. He did not even have the decency to return something that was of value belonging to your D .........which shows his lack of respect for HER. You should thank the Lord every night that you are out of there.
I am glad to see that your D is doing well in school and that she is involved in a youth group. Every day that passes is a day that is moving forward.
Keeping you close in my prayers, Patz
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Hey, OR! I am so happy for you. Your strength and courage are what is making this happen, I mean all of it. It is no big mystery why your daughter is thriving. You are showing her such power and such a positive, loving way to do life, that her blessings (and thus yours) have been just waiting to blossom into her life. What an inspiration you are.
I will keep on sending you prayers of strength and love. I feel blessed to know of your journey, so thanks for sharing it here.
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Mum, and Patz. thank you for all your support
today my H let me know he got notification from SSI,how he would block the payments by putting the payments into an escrow account until she is 18teen.
demanding to talk to her,( she talks to him at least 1 time a week,calling him from his brothers. ) I asked her to call him 4 times last week, like pulling teeth.
He wrote her a letter, I opened it (she got mad), I told her right now I need to know what he is willing to say to her,not trusting him. The letter told her to e-mail him. Don't know how he got the address,he may have the phone number too.
He tells me he would say Im unfit, unstable BLA. BLA. If I spent the money I would have to pay it back. How I need to Itemize the money.
he is demanding ablood test.
THEN the other e-mail he wrote this AM, he tells me if my job doesn't work out how he will help me move back to CA. How if he dies my D would get his SSI.
The true side of him came out after he got the mail after noon.
I already have the statement saying I have been selected and the day I will be receiving payment.
I learned he got a large back payment for him and our D. He never told me. He better had saved some of it. I read his web page, he often talks how he wants to but himself something expensive. He wanted buy himself an item that was just about 400.00. just the other day. Guess I blew that purchace for him. (Ha)
He said he has a lawyer and trying to make me think he holds some cards, if I let him talk to our D he will not fight the SSI. He feels this belongs to him only, no mention about how our D would need the money.
So much for him never to e-maail me ever again, guess I got his attention. OR
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Hi, OR. I just have to wonder about these guys. I just got another totally convoluted and contradictory email from my ex. He never really says anything, but just goes on and on, posturing and trying to look smart and tough. Like the Gary Larson cartoon of the dog: what we say to a dog: "Ginger, bad dog...get of the couch. Lay down, Ginger" and what the dog hears: "Ginger blah blah blah blah. Blah blah, Ginger".
I'm not sure if he's the dog and only hears his name, or if in trying to decifer his word-garbage, it just sounds like blah blah to me.
It's like he's a crazy person....crazy like a fox perhaps.
Well, having physically removed yourself and your daughter from his tentacles is the most important thing. Protecting yourself legally is next, if not already in place. You'll be fine. Hey, you're practically superwoman as far as I am concerned!
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MUM,I just don''t know how I would make it without the support form everone.
I just got another e-mail, he was letting me know more BlA, BLA.
he lets me know how he needs to be the one approving her SSI,
(he feels Im unstable)
how he has my address now and could call me anytime. (In upset my D gave him the address.)
He thinks I went into SSI to get his money, but not true. I couldn't find the cards to get her into the school, found out because the SSI rep, told me she was making the change. If I had not gome in I would never had known.
Now I feel worried about what trouble he wants to cause knowing my address.
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Hey, OR, don't worry. But maybe do something to protect yourself. It's probably hard for you to start letting everyone in your new life in on your issues with him, but maybe your BIL can back you up: perhaps telling the school there is a problem with dad, letting the local law enforcement know what you're dealing with? Do you have an attorney or a women's rights organization you can work with to get some muscle behind you , and some peace of mind? Don't be scared, though, he loves that. There is no need to be, as I highly doubt he will move from his couch! Just thinking a little peace of mind would be good for you. It's ok, his finding your adress was inevitable, and as screwed up as he is, unless you have a court order preventing it, he is allowed to know where his daughter is.
Have you started divorce proceedings, or custody paperwork? I know it's hard to think this way, but isn't that stuff just nothing compared to the gettin' up and leaving?
I'm still sending you lots of strength. We really do help each other here.
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MuM,
I have the Divorce papers with me here, I can't file here until I've lived here 6 mos. My H is telling me he is filing in CA, not sure what to expect. My neice was going to help me but she has not gotten back with me, will need to get with her again.
I will try not to worry MUM, send me some prayers to keep my H so busy he won't have time to worry about me. I have not responded to any of his emails in several days.
He is so mad I got his SSI for my D, Im sure he will be very motivated to give me trouble.
I will make some caalls to get some answers to my worries.
Thank you for your time, I need your positive thoughts.
OR
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Hi OR - what Mum said, plus an added endorsement for getting your BIL to talk to people, like law enforcement, as need be. They will take a male much more seriously, ditto a brother, than they will take a female, especially a wife. Sad but true.
You want to do only the things that are needful, but you want them to get done - and stay done - with minimal repetition and waste on your part.
Ditto what Mum said about him getting your address because of having a right to know where your daughter is. Not much you can do about that, at present.
Very bright light at the midpoint of the tunnel: if he acts out in ANY WAY, anything that can be construed as stalking, it's a federal offense, because he has to cross state lines to harass you. Even via email! There's a Department of Justice (www.doj.gov) web site that has info on this, I think, if you want to look it up.
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Hi OR:
I don't know the legal stuff where you are and hopefully you will be able to learn it and take appropriate steps. I'm still thinking it's important to get a custody order, even a temporary one, if at all possible.
He's still doing everything he can to push your buttons. He demands this and that???? You're unfit??? He has your address??? He'll hold the money in an account until she's 18???
More name-calling. More threats. More N-behaviour. More b.s.
I'm keeping you and your D in my prayers, OR.
Don't let him frazzle you up. He's :twisted: and you are doing just fine!!
GFN
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I will be working on getting some answers on where I can get myself answers on legal custody here in TX.
I e-mailed my BIL, Pasted and copied him the threating e-mail.
There is a part where my H says :
"Your (sister in Law ) Helped you move to NNNN XXXX TX " I know where you live, you can't play games or hide and seek.
Even if he doesn't think much of it, I let him know the e-mail was threating to me.
OR
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Hiya OR:
How about the police officer you spoke with before leaving? Do you still have his card/badge number/a way of contacting him?
Could you send this threatening email and other crazy stuff that your H has been bombarding you with, to that police officer?
I don't know what the law is where H is but there is a chance that that police officer could just go over and have a little chat with your H. In a friendly kind of hi, how are ya, way, he could ask how things are going and then make a few suggestions about giving you space, the consequences of any threats, and let H know that the police are aware of his behaviour in sending you some questionable emails.
Maybe that police officer would do that for you? I think you would have to call him and speak with him and ask him directly to do that.
Just an idea.
GFN
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OR:
Hey girl! You are doing just fine. All that stuff about the SSI is bs. I should know because I had to do a bunch of stuff with SS when my husband died. To get some piece of mind, log on to the SSI link on the SS site and it will give you chapter and verse on what is what. As long as you are in custody of your daughter you are the legal guardian, therefore you are the payee and representative of your daughter. You are obligated to spend the money on her behalf. I ususally keep all my receipts for my diabled son, denoting what is spent on food, lodging, misc. etc. The SSI people will send you a once a year accounting of what you spent. Just keep it in round numbers. They are not very hard on you as to the cent, but just in percentages of what was spent on rent, food etc. Keep all receipts until you go to court and through the proceedings so that you can show the judge that the SSI was spent on your daughters behalf. Make sure you also show how you have been able to establish a predictable, secure enviornment for your D as well.
The Ns problem is that he was counting on her SSI check for himself inasmuch he is not able to work and spends his money on things that are not productive. As far as him bothering you in D, if he is as bad off as he thinks he is, it will take all his energy every day just to live. On the other hand if he is able to get around and is faking a lot of stuff, then get a restraining order from the D police. They are much tougher in Texas. I don't blame you for being aggravated at your D, but she is still just a kid.......sigh and can't appreciate the overall picture. He is using her to manipulate things however and she is a pawn to him to get what he wants. All she knows is it is her Dad. It is interesting that it really took a lot for her to call him. This is not the half of it as she gets older and realizes what a N he is.
Keep on keeping on. Patz
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GFN aand PATZ,
My H changes with the wind, I get 2 e-mails, one 8am, ask let communicate, he tells me how the dog needs awalk and he can't take her because of his pain. How I should remember how our dog could look disappointed.
The next e-mail 1pm his time, he how he is telling SSI it's kidnapping because he can't reach my D by phone. You all know he talks to her and we have called him. He is telling me how he will claim I need physicological help and I get into his drugs or I take drugs. (not sure what kind. Claims this is why I left, I have these problems.
GFN I have the police officer's number maybe I will do as you suggest.
Patz, my H let my D know he would want to come out here to vist her in the Summer. I'm going to work fast to get the custody papers before then. I will check into the details on the SSI .
Got to go, my D is staying the night with her cousin.
OR
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OR,
This is my opinion. Maybe its right or not, you decide.
If you can stand the stress of getting this goon's e-mails I would let him keep on talking.
He is hanging himself. If he tries to make a huge legal mess out of your divorce you have a lot of ammo to defend yourself, and he is giving it to you.
Falsely accusing you of drug use, kidnapping, etc. to others and admitting it to you in writing constitutes defamation of character. Repeatedly threatening you, questioning your sanity and using your daughter as a weapon constitutes intentional infliction of emotional distress. A good lawyer could come up with a lot more.
This stuff would be a hammer if he actually goes ahead and tries to make trouble legally. Especially since he seems so concerned with his money. If you needed to use this stuff against him, any competent lawyer he hired would tell him his goose is cooked if it goes to trial. Not only would your daughter end up with her share of the SSI, you might end up with his.
I hope your dog bites him, then runs away! :shock: :twisted: Of course he'll send an e-mail blaming you.
mudpup
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Hey, OR, I think mudpup is right. Give him lots of rope to do the job.
Let him keep ranting....and get a good lawyer.
Emotionally, it might help you to simply focus on what you need, want ,etc....work toward that. You can't spend your life reacting to his behavoir (well, you know that!) so here's another place to cut that tie.
Simply go ahead with what you want. Make a list. Prioritize it. (protect daughter, self, etc etc). but be specific. Then take one little action or make one decision each day toward your goals. This will take the energy OUT of this screwed up relationship and put you on your own road.
This is something I work on every day, this seperation, or this removal of myself from the ex's energy. It's already paid off for you, and me, but it always helps to remind myself that I am on a really good solid road...and to keep on walking.
I have come to expect that if I feel really good about how my life is moving forward, he usually butts in with some garbage. I think they get crazier as we get healthier. Close the lid..."not taking any more garbage,
but thanks for the tip that you're flinging it!!!" (then I get to take action to protect myself, without letting the garbage get in emotionally)
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Mudd, @ MUM,
Mudd, I love your humor, I laughed so hard I had tears.
I hope your dog bites him, then runs away! Of course he'll send an e-mail blaming you.
I heard it said this guy goes to the doctor, complains about his pains. The doctor writes up several perscriptions, says go home now.
The patient says: " are you going to give me all the perscriptions you wrote for me"?
The doctor said:
"This one is for your Wife, this one is for your Boss, this one is for your kids." (you get the idea)
Everyone else needs to be fixed,this is why the patient is sick.
Maybe the Perscriptions were for all others to stay away,for their health.
I have not responded back on his e-mails.
Letting him hang himself,he is so good at that.
My H is so unaware of how he affects those around him. I believe he suffers from being an N so much, he thinks his agenda, to make me look bad, lie,tell others what he wants them to believe.
Having the authorities react to such legal matters will be proven to make him out as a disturbed individual. It can be a painful thing to watch.
He sent me another e-mail, telling me he is sending a package to my D.
The same e-mail tells me how he has claimed to SSI, I have kidnapped my D, how he has no contact with her. I imagine now I must get a lawyer to fight him on this.
MuM, I know how important to keep connected with a positive look at my life. Keeping the Idea that life was intended to be positive,even when it appears negative.
I will keep with a Positive intention that things are going positive in my life. I will do as you suggest, make a list of the important things to accomplish.
I heard it said if :
"You change the way you look at something, the thing you look at will change"
I imagine this can work for Positive or Negative.
We can choose the way we see life.
My N-H, has lied so much he must truely believe it all. He must believe to keep others believing his outrageous lies.
People must look at me like I'M the crazy one. Having to prove the lies, is something I am subject to, but hate the Idea.
I am not lacking in proving him as unstable, I find it so Sad to show how pitiful someone can be.
I'm doing great on all levels, in CA,I had our computer where my H was nearby, I feel so much more relaxed to write without him over my shoulder.
Now I'm working on getting a suitable computer table and a new keyboard, some of the keys fell off in the move, I 'm using my sewing table for now. Forgive the aaaaaaaaa's when you see them.
OR
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It's 1 month to the day when I left Ca.
My H just called here, first time I have said a word to him in 4 weeks.
I said "hello", he asked our D.
I had just e-miled him, he will no longer get the married rate on the car insurrance. He needs to go sign a new policy, I'm removed.
NO response to the rude e-mail he had sent me earlier today.
My D had told him my lips had swollen up (Super Chapped).
This is what my H sends me: His mother was an extreame alcoholic,
Very Sad.
If your lip is the result of abuse
I need to tell you something
Being a child of an alcoholic
I have a non-confrontational personality
Most children of alcoholics internalize abuse to feel they deserve it or it's their fault
My point
I always knew what was going on I just never confronted you on it
I'm a gentle guy you act with other men the way you acted with me
They won't be the same
now you single & ready to mingle
I think you should know that in case your lip is the result of being hit
I was special & gentle, forgiving all your mean things
Don't expect you can act that way with others
I hope you find someone who will love you & be understanding of you emotional issues
He says he always knew what was going on??? Just what I need another Lie to worry about. Jerk.
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Ewwwwwww!!!!!!!!!
OR, I think when he said he "knew what was going on," he was referring to "everything" being your fault. I don't think its a lie, I think he still blames you totally. Yuck! (Forgive me if you knew that and I misinterpreted.)
I can feel the hate/evil/denial/fantasy? in this and I'm not even involved in your situation. Please don't expose yourself to more of this unless you are taking really, really good care of yourself. Keep these Emails in a folder somewhere and only read them when you are feeling strong enough. I don't care how strong and settled someone is, this kind of thing chips away a little bit of their spirit everytime they read it.
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OR:
Glad to see things are continuing for you and your D in a positive way. I read with interest Mudpuppys response. I think if you can stand the stress, all of the ex N's wacko responses to people in general will cause the judge to just look at him and say "duh". Especially the ones about him contacting SSI and accusing you of "kidnapping" your daughter. What a laugh! Does he think he is the ONLY one calling the SSA with accusations. I bet the SSA gets so many wacko calls you would not believe.
My girl friend who was divorcing her ex N bipolar H......I remember this well.......He had to send in the support checks for the kids via the court. Well, what did he do? He would send in the checks ok but he would BURN cigerette holes in the checks. When the clerk of court continued to receive checks in this manner, she turned them over to the assistant DA. The only thing his behaviour did was put the microscope of the law on HIM. It was totally counter productive and was used in the court proceedings. Not only did he get an increase in the amount of support he had to pay, but he also was told that he had to had court supervised visits with the children. Did not go well with him at all.
The same can be said for your situation. This N will hang himself with his wacko behaviour. Just keep up with it all. Courts definately do not like out of control behaviour. This is all going to be in your favor OR.
Just keep on keeping on. Love Patz
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Hi OR:
I'm glad to hear that you are trying to focus on the good things in your life and that your life is getting better in so many ways!! Yay!!! :D
As to all these ding dong emails, I agree with what's being said....that he is digging his own grave. Keep them all as evidence.
One way to fight the urge to let his ridiculous emails cause you harm might be to try really hard to build up a sort of wall.....kinda of as Bunny described on another thread.......your brain could just go lalee la la la lo when you read the words or try to see him as a cooky man saying cooky things. I know that's hard to do but it is better than letting his words hurt you, over and over. It is sad to see his illness in black and white. God bless you for your compassion.
Now.....if he's going to be phoning......what do you plan to do if he starts trying to have conversations with you?
GFN
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Long, Patz and GFN.
Today my H told me to expect the divorce papers any day. I can just imagine how he has spun his tale of lies.
I would imagine the judge would not want to hear all the BS. it's either you want a divorce or not.
It may be mediation to work out visitation were things will get muddy.
Once I read over the papers I will be more clear. He tells me the papers are being mailed here. He mailed my D some Hunigton beach T's, and a roxy jacket.
wonder how the story "he CAN"T reach us, therfore I have kidnapped her"
will be viewed.
I have no desire to speak to my H. When I heard his voice, I was quick to hand my D the phone.
I'm really sad that things are this way. I will do what is needed to protect us. I have his e-mails and a medical evaluation I'm willing to use when it comes time. I fell so sad that life has delt these cards for both our lifes.
I have no desire to bring my H into my life, but when you have a child you do the best for all involved. I have become numb to some of his remarks, I know he has big problems, not easily fixed.
I can either choose to fire back with comments how awlful he his to me.
or understand nothing will change, be calm, let it just happen.
Have faith this is the road I must take, for now.
My D needs to call her friend for youth group tonight.
will be back OR
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Hi there OR:
I fell so sad that life has delt these cards for both our lifes.
This is a sad time and you are both dealing with losses. I wonder if it might be possible for both of you to get some support, possibly through a women's shelter? It might help to have someone outside of the family to speak with?
Personally, because your husband has made threats and seems so unstable, I'd be seriously seeking supervised visitation. I imagine visits will be infrequent because he is so far away, which is probably a good thing too.
This is not a matter of keeping a child away from her father, it's a matter of keeping that child safe while she visits with her father.
Considering all you've been through, you are holding up very well!!
How's the job going? Do you like it? Do you like the people you work with? Are you enjoying the work?
GFN
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OR:
Prehaps you should take GFN's advice since N has made threats. As always the more people you can make contact with, the safer you might be.
Again, hope things are going well with the job and your D is adapting to the new environment. Just know that I keep you in my prayers.
Love Patz
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OR,
It seems like the main concern, if he ever comes to visit, is that you take precautions to prevent him from just taking off with her.
All those cracks about you kidnapping her may very well be projection on his part. Especially if he has some crackpot scheme of keeping her SSI because she's with him. Take care.
mudpup
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GFN, PATZ, Mud, You all are so wonderful to give your time.
I'm doing great. My D is doing great. We finished another week in the big D, with each day having so many blessings. My D and I went walking the neighborhood meeting the neighbors. My D wants to babysit, one of the neighbors daughter just moved here, she is in the minestry with her church and is looking for someone to babysit for a few hours.
We went to the 1.50 movies tonight, we had a great time. Getting out together after the work week, felt great.
My H has been rather quiet. I noticed he blocked me from his chat room.
When the divorce papers are here and signed I won't care. I'm looking forward to letting go of the past and moving forward.
I like my job, and the people. I love where I live its, in a place called Plano TX. It is very nice and the people are great.
My D has a theater class, they are doing skits on divorce. She appears to have friends to speak about the effects of divorce. I know at times she is sad, but most of the time she talks about ways to keep busy, she eats good, she is doing well in school and making lots of friends.
Thanks so much for your thoughts. I see you all have lots of others to keep you busy on this board. So glad to have you all here. My days are getting brighter everyday. (this new keyboard and computer table really helps with the typing) OR
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OR,
I'm so glad to hear all the good news. You certainly deserve it. I don't have any more helpful advice over and above what has already been offered, but I wanted you to know I was thinking of you and keeping you and your daughter in my prayers.
Brigid
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Thanks Brigid, for your kind thoughts.
I managed to bring some of my art books and paints, even my air compressor. Maybe sometime I will have the efforts to get to my painting again. It is difficult to find the energy when Im working.
Thanks again and for now Im saving my efforts to close this chapter in my 26yr marriage. I have people asking when my H will be joining me here in Dallas. I have broken the Ice telling them It looks like he will be staying in Ca. At times while Im busy with work I find myself tearing, but always hold back. I have not yet had the Idea that crying would help me at this point. Maybe after I sign the Divorce papers it will be happy tears.
OR
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OR:
Sounds so very wonderful! I am glad you and your D are enjoying D. It is a very nice place. I am aquainted with Plano inasmuch as I was brought up in the Ark-LA-Tex area. You will enjoy it there and it is a growing area. The schools in that area are pretty good as well.
Glad to see that your D has hooked up with a drama class. She might be able to work out any issues with the divorce through that class.
It is hard not thinking about the last 26 years but hey life goes on. N is in CA and your in D starting a new life. There is no telling what the Lord has in store for you and your D as you make this 180 degree turn in your life.
Just post when you can and keep us updated. Your progress is tremendous encouragement to others who are also at the crossroads. I am just glad you are where you are. Much love
Patz
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The Divorce papers are here. Now the battle begins.
I have 30 days from the 6th to respond to the CA courts.
He expects me to have her back in CA before the 30th of this month.
Im to pay for it all.
Will be reading and talking with legal aid on what I can do.
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Lots of prayers being sent heavenward for you and your daughter.
Hope he's got Mark Geragos for his attorney. (Scott Peterson's and Winona Ryder's lawyer.) He'd be perfect. He'd bleed your husband dry and lose.
If good thoughts and prayers matter you've got nothing to worry about. :wink:
mudpup
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Hi OR:
My prayers for you both too.
(((((((OR))))))
GFN
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I have total faith, things will be ok.
This is total N to have no regard for anyone but himself. He had talked to my D yesterday, never saying he would demand her to come back in 2 weeks.
For reasons to desolve the marriage, one option says "unsound mind."
I plan on using that one.
I have this medical report stating he has abnormal findings, along with the N-findings, I don't know if it would be enough to hold off on putting my D in the hands of my H. This is only his request.
I will be saying alot of prayers too. If the courts blow off his e-mails, threats, and medical evaluation, then I have nothing. We will see what happens. I have talked to a legal aid in CA, they want the leagal aid here in Plano to work with me on the best way to proceed.
I have not explained anything about my H's mental condition. Not sure how it would be preceived until I can speak with someone in person.
When I was in CA and tried to explain the medical evaluation I got the cold shoulder. I was told they didn't really have the understanding and the Judge would have to look into the matter. I don't expect much from anyone at this point, but will see if I can get someone to listen.
I'm going to try and get some sleep. OR
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OR, sleep well. Keep taking care of yourself and your daughter. I am praying for you both. Stay strong as you are and expect the people you meet to help you. It will happen.
(((((((OR)))))))
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...since I posted. But onlyrenting1, I just gotta' say that I've scanned this thread from late March until the last post. As one of your fans, here on this forum, I wanted to let you know HOW MUCH YOU HAVE ACCOMPLISHED and how far you have come since first posting on this forum. I am DELIGHTED to hear you and your daughter are doing so well. You are in the home stretch insofar as legally cutting yourself off from your soon-to-be-ex-N-husband. Hang in there, keep seeking good legal advice, don't waiver and don't co-sign his bu**sh** by internalizing his threats. Bravo for freeing yourself and your daughter from what I have come to believe is one of humanity's worst afflictions: narcissism.
Best,
bludie
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Bludie,
Your schedule must be very busy,I have really missed your post. I hope all is well with you.
The leagal papers are SOOOOOOOOO much fun. I have called for legal assistance. It appears everyone has a different Idea about whats needed.
My H is asking when to expect our D at his front door, When he gets my OSC, asking the judge to give me all legal/physical custody he will be so happy.
I'm so tired today, I will wrtie some more later. I'm so gald to hear from you. Take care OR
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OR, get all the rest you can. Bludie is right, you have done a tremendous work over the last weeks and months. Don't get so distracted by all the "things" to be done that you forget your only real task: taking care of yourself and your daughter.
Hi Bludie! Its been a while since you posted. Welcome back. :)
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Long, I got some rest I feel better.
Thanks for check on me. I pushed hard this week because of the time line I'm dealing with, thinking there is always one more thing to do.
I first thought the divorce papers court stamp of the 6th was my dead line.
I called the court they said the day I signed for mail pickup was 30days from that day the 12th. My H wrote in the papers he was demanding my D home on the 30th. He can't make me do anything with out a judge.
I'm asking for temp custody until Nov. 2nd when this goes to court.
sometime in June or July the temp custody OSC will be heard.
I'm so glad I left like I did, didn't wait for any papers to be filed, or I would be stuck now. No one has knocked on my door to ask. The police came to my BIL's two days after I first left, to find out if I was expected to be there, no one else has called.
My Husbands health may change and maybe he will have money by time the hearing comes about. For now he has submitted to the courts, papers showing he is not able to take care of her.
I still have lots to do, I will try and stay focused on my D, pushed hard so I could relax a little this weekend.
Thanks OR
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OR: you sound strong...centered. Good for you. Stay that way....and if you doubt for one second, remember how far you've already come.
Bless you.
Mum
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Hi everyone,
I just received an e-mail from my H, telling me to CALL him.
He is afraid I will send him a computer virus so he will not open any more e-mails from me. I have not sent him any e-mails, he wants something else. He thinks my D will be coming home on the 30th because he wants her to.
He tells me how his brother and I are doing the nasty, how he told his lawyer all about it. Tells me if I don't sign the Divorce papers he will send someone to my work.
I have 30days and was sending them out this week.
Now I think I will wait until next week or near the 12th when they are due.
I was just hoping he could be reasonalbe, but guess not. The judges expect us to have mediation, I have been working on the visitaion schedules asking him to be with supervision.
He is saying how he will be working by the end of the year so give him the divorce now like he wants.
I have not e-mailed with more than got your e-mail, but he tells me all the lies I have told him how he NEVER lies
won't care what you do
N-H said : I have changed the name to BIL and daughter to D
I just want free of you
The only conversation we should have is about D & you can't lie anymore
I'm sick of your lies
I'm sure will never talk to (BIL) again
Also my attorney knows everything about both of you
You know I don't lie
However you & (BIL) are perfect together
You both hate me, both love adultery & both are pathetic liars
You two are perfect together, plus you both are ethically challenged
He works diagnosing VD he can check you first
I won't respond but will keep this one in his file.
He lets me know how I have done the right thing to leave him.
OR
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I'm asking for temp custody until Nov. 2nd when this goes to court.
sometime in June or July the temp custody OSC will be heard.
hi, or! glad your doing well.
im just curious..... if your daughter lives with you now, how come you have to have the proceedings in CA...?.. if im missing something let me know..
seems like the jurisdiction would be where you live. if its not, you can petition to have it changed, and you can also try to ask for an ex-parte hearing. if hes really that broke having to travel to texas (texas, correct?) to appear could be just enough advantage for you, to seal the deal.
just an quickie thought to inquire about.
a.
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I just received an e-mail from my H, telling me to CALL him.
He is afraid I will send him a computer virus so he will not open any more e-mails from me.
ROTFLMAO!!!!! If it were me, I'd start sending him emails with titles like "virus" and "infectious - do not read." Good thing it isn't me.
((((((((((OR&D))))))))))
He sounds like he's getting desparate now. I'm glad you aren't around him anymore.
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Long and Mum,
Thanks for checkin on me.
Mum: Speaking with the legal aid I would need to be a resident for 6mos here in TX, before I can do any leagal action.
The more I read Mediation is mandatory even with a lawyer. Child custody requires the parents to communicate.
I also found something in CA saying you can't move out of state once you file. Alienation of the other parent and family members. Maybe his family being here looks good, and the financial responsibility on my sholders would carry weight. My H will not communicate without spilling out his poision.
If Mediation is the first rule, getting a lawyer paying 5,000 may be a waste. Im poor and the current response papers allow attachments for reasons why mediation would not work. He is not willing to make an effort to communicate with reason.
Long: Yes he is getting very desparate. My D is still in school here and he doesn't care just wants her back. His rent is due on the 1st, her SSI check came to me this last time so he needs the money.
I will wrtie more later
OR[/i]
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OR:
This man is truly sick in the head. Make him wait, wait, wait, wait, since he is so impatient that things go his way immediately..........slo mo is called far. He is totally paranoid. Make him do all the work and just be passive aggressive. In other words do those things that are constructive for you and your D. Put him on the defensive by making him call and just getting the answering machine. If he email.....well answer him in the shortest way possible.
I am going to be really cold here and I hope you do not take offense.....the best thing that could happen is he would just go ahead and die a natural death. I know your D would miss him, but he is a person in total misery. Not only mentally but physically as well. There is no way he can possibly take care of your D. All he wants is the SSI check as he has no visible means of support.
Just save as much energy as possible and do the things that are necessary. It takes a great deal of mental energy to do what you are doing.
Just keep on keeping on.
Love, Patz
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Anna, sorry I thought it was MUM writing.
If you think some other way to have the courts changed I will look into it.
The case has been filed in CA.
I just received another e-mail, explaining how my H just was notified about the return slip for the Divorce papers. He's telling me his lawyer just now let him know. He must have legal aid helping him.
I'm sending the minimum paper work about the finances, and working on the OSC. the cost of a lawyer is 2,000 and up. I need to file this on my own, anyone know about Order to Show Cause. I need to do it asap.
I faxed the papers over but the fax was not readable. I hope I file correctly, before he decides he needs to file first.
Patz, its funny you say about him better off out of his misery.
I see his medical evaluation shows he would not committ suicide.
I imagine his life will get more difficult, I'm just as glad Im won't be there to see it.
In this last e-mail most of his comments are bible scriptures
and wants to know when our D will arrive. He sounds less hostile. I told him I picked up his papers 2weeks ago.
now you know I have no ill will toward you
I don't blame or have hostility to you
The lord said " a kings heart is like water in my hand"
So God hardened your hearts to me
I must obey God
What ever it is for distruction or rebirth it is the lords will
I will accept it that way
I do believe by medical events & legal proceedings in my personal life you are unaware of
A great new life free of health and financial worries awaits me
God also said " I chasen whom I love"
" Do not rebuke the chasening of the lord"
I need to leave to pickup my D from Cheer Camp.
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Hi OR:
I haven't read back in this thread for a bit but I just want to say:
He makes me want to huuuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrllll!!
He's so full of hogbalognawash that it's streaming out his fingertips now!!
What a load of silly stuff!!!
Stick to your plan, OR. You're doing it!! Keep plodding along and filing and getting information and all.
You are doing a great job!! Don't let his rubbish upset you or fizz on you.
He's a sick puppy. Poor pathetic little dupe. Let him rot!! :evil:
GFN
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OR,
Your lesion wrote,
What ever it is for distruction or rebirth it is the lords will
I will accept it that way
I do believe by medical events & legal proceedings in my personal life you are unaware of
A great new life free of health and financial worries awaits me
God also said " I chasen whom I love"
" Do not rebuke the chasening of the lord"
What an egg suckin', squid faced puke, to qoute Mark Twain.
It is true that whom the Lord loves He chastens.
I hope and pray He really, really, really loves your soon to be ex for the next few months. :twisted:
He also wrote,
I must obey God
That triggered my gag reflex as well GFN? I guess I missed the "thou shall threaten to shoot thy wife" commandment.
What a punk.
mudpup
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Man, OR, let him keep writing.....what a nutjob!!!
This is not a rational, sane person's writing.
All will be well. YOur daughter is doing well, you are away from a crazy person.....(terrifically obvious), so I believe you will do well in court. Keep those crazy emails comin' pal :twisted:
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OR, hang in there. Just take the next baby step. Don't worry about the steps that may come after that. You are doing a fantastic job! I agree with the others, STBXH's writing is truly bizarre. It's stupefying to consider how anyone could possibly reply to this writing with any positive effect.
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Hello, to all.
Speaking with the Legal Aid about the filing on OSC, I keep the e-mails all the damaging information for mediation. There will be a mediator for each of us. We will both fill out a questionaire along with this I add the medical information, e-mails etc. Having a physological evaluation would be costly if he wanted one for me, I already have his HAH!
The mediation will determine if he should have supervised visitations, physical custody or legal.
For now I mailed my papers regarding my income. I have put everything I thought he might have. I do believe he has money from his settlement, wants our D because of the SSI. The sooner he gets us out of the picture the better for him. He is already talking about how his health will be better and money is coming his way. I'm glad divorce suits him, so glad he's not asking to get back together. When the mediation starts he will be seen for the liar he is.
I will show them the e-mails, so they understand lets move forward to end the marriage.
OFF to work OR
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OR:
All I can say is just conserve as much mental energy as possible for the mediation. He will pull out all the "stops" to get what he wants. He has to have that SSI check just to remain even financially. That will be a long term committment he could count on. He makes me want to hurl using Scripture for his own purposes. He deserves the misery he lives in. His on Hell on earth and he dosen't even have sense enough to know it. We can see the fumes all the way into this thread from his vapid, empty life.
Keep on Keeping On
Patz
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I checked my H's web site this is what he is saying to his web Pals.
true or not Im using it with his other e-mails.
I'm gonna fly to geneva this summer & put my money in Swiss franc backed by gold this summer i wanna send Lil dreamer to the american school there
Tue 26th 04, 05 | 22:01
I have to leave and pick up my D from chruch youth group.
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OR,
I can't remember. Does your N know you visit his website? It seems like you said he does. What a N-ut.
They have a lot of very comfortable sanitariums with nicely padded walls in Geneva.
Maybe you could phone ahead, and the guys with the white coats and the big net could meet him at the airport. :roll: :x
His brains have turned to cottage cheese, and they're past the expiration date.
He just continues to hang himself, IMO.
Praying for you, that he keeps e-mailing and posting to his website.
mudpup
PS. You're my hero too. :D :wink:
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Hey Mud, you make me laugh I need as many laughs as you can send my way.
The web site is open I thought it was only for members but my D has gotten on to the site sending him little notes now and then to say hello.
Knowing that, I guess he is so wrapped up in his own world, which I don't exist in any more, he just writes what ever. I always acted like "HOW DO YOU or Whats the name of your site. "
He may know I look, somethimes he writes boring stuff just chit chat, other times its stuff about what he will be buying for him self. I have not seen anything to mention WE ARE GONE. My D had asked him to remove a photo he had of her and how her friends at the NEW school looked at his site. I don't think he wants to tell his buds a whole lot about it.
I know he talks like he is single and misses our D.
I have not talked about my H and his mental imbalance to our D.
sometimes she misses him and would like to see him and other times she won't say to much. I never tell her when to call him, I have never seen her pick up the phone to say I want to call him. She will for her friends and even our old neighbors. She never says tell my Dad hello if you see him or talks to them about him.
She did say how she thought he could be silly sometimes and she thought her sillyness came from his side of the family. I think she wants to be funny like her cousins and needs to connect somehow.
It can be a bit ODD when it's his family not mine. I want her to keep the positive influances in her life, and will not let my H take that from her.
I do believe with is poor attitude towards his brother he will no doubt try and poision the relationships.
I don't know what to think about the comments on his web site, I know he has money he didn't want me to know about. He will soon find out his lies will be exposed.
I feel sorry for my D, to think her Dad would do such harm to his family. Money does wicked things to desparate people. I hope the judge will see him for the selfish person he is. I can't bare to tell our how her uncle said he didn't even want her, how he was willing to leave to be on his own start over. I do believe he realized her SSI was worth keeping her around. He tells me how he will be working soon not to get used to the money from her.
When we go before a judge I know my D wants a Dad, she will be sad to think I would not want her to just go with him like he wants her to.
Now I will worry he will take her far away if he could.
OR
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My H just called, he talked with our D. He wants her to come out to CA
She told him she was going to camp and didn't want to come out until after June.
She had to defend me, after he told her I was doing this to keep her away from him. She told him no, she wanted to go to camp.
Just before he called he e-mailed her, she was telling me how he claimed he was only receiving 15.00 a month.
I showed her his original Divorce papers the one's I took out of our room just before I left for Texas.
He said he had over 8,000 in the savings and made over 2,200 a month.
I never showed her this but wanted to show her how he lies.
he is telling her how I only want her here with me to get her SSI money.
He told her he is putting her SSI in an account until she is 18.
SSI did call me telling me my H said he had custody of her.
They are still looking into giving her the money, I don't know for sure what they are going to do.
He is saying He will be asking for custody of her. I taked to the court today they are going to get me a date for temp custody,I call them on Friday to confirm. They have nothing filed from him for custody.
I have the old case number from 10yrs ago, she did note the infomation and will inform the court to review if it's valid or not.
He sounds upset about losing her money. if it is kept in an account that's ok too, as long as he can't get it.
I did ask the court to do an audit of the money, he has received.
He tells our D none of what I'm telling her is true, he only gets 15.00 and he is having his legal aid file kidnapping charges on me.
So much fun, Im going to bed good nite. OR
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OR:
As your D gets older, more educated, there will be no connection to her father. He is digging the hole deeper and deeper in this relationship. She may be a child right now but that will not always be the case.
Even after he is dead and gone she will continue to know the truth. The one who is mature to take care of her needs, the one who sacrificed to do what was needed. That person is you OR. He may win a few battles here and there but the one that really matters is being lost on a daily basis.
The interference of a small thing like her going to camp. Small things add up. Your D will come to realize that this is just the tip of the iceburg with this N when she gets older. She will be badgered by him to interfere with her life for his benefit and this will get old pretty quick.
Children are smarter than what we give them credit for. She knows what is going on. Just keep on keeping on OR.
Much love
Patz
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Hiya OR:
He tries to shake you up good and when that doesn't work....he tries to shake up your daughter. Why am I not the least bit surprised? :twisted:
Don't fall for it. Be calm and sure with your D. Explain that Dad has some problems and doesn't always behave nicely. Don't cover for him. Wait until you feel less emotional (have had time to think a little) and then talk to her. Ask her how she felt after the conversation? Whether she believes what her dad is saying? Let her know that if she wants to talk about anything.....it's ok and you'll be there for her. I'm sure you're already reassuring her that you love and care for her and want her to feel safe and comfortable. Tell her it's ok to say: "I feel uncomfortable with that......or talking about that.......or doing that......etc". Maybe this might help her deal with him some??
Try to help her get her fears/confusion/whatever she expresses on the table. Maybe you're already doing that. Just that I know it's hard in such a chaotic situation sometimes.
He's grasping at straws, OR. Slowly winding his own rope around his throat.
He said he had over 8,000 in the savings and made over 2,200 a month. I never showed her this but wanted to show her how he lies.
Why not? Do you think there would be something wrong in doing that?
I'm not sure.....so I'm interested to hear what you're thinking/what others think?
Hang on OR!! This won't last forever!! Thinking of you especially this Friday.
(((((((OR))))))
GFN
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Hi OR,
I have not talked about my H and his mental imbalance to our D.
Do you think she is too young to understand or do you think she might believe you are just attacking him because he and you aren't getting along?
She must realize he acts like a nut, right?
Does she ever say why she thinks he acts this way?
I'm not saying you should talk to her about it or not, I was just wondering why you haven't.
Are you concerned about him alleging PAS? That is definitely a legitimate concern.
When we go before a judge I know my D wants a Dad, she will be sad to think I would not want her to just go with him like he wants her to.
Now I will worry he will take her far away if he could.
I think she knows who has been there for her, through thick and thin.
I have faith that with the documents you have of his physical and emotional conditions and insane comments, coupled with your rational careful reactions, and the testimony of his own relatives that he will never be able to take her far away from you.
Praying for you and D.
mudpup
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HI Mud and all
Do you think she is too young to understand or do you think she might believe you are just attacking him because he and you aren't getting along?
She must realize he acts like a nut, right?
Does she ever say why she thinks he acts this way?
I'm not saying you should talk to her about it or not, I was just wondering why you haven't
Mud for reasons of protecting her self Image I choose not to grind the salt into the wound.
For so long I believed it was his Meds. I would tell her it was his medicine to have patients with his outburst.
When I discovered this web site I learned about the ways of the N and the distruction he could do without a care to anyone.
I knew I was not safe and to discolse too much to her would only scare her. She knows some things he says are WACKED. She wanted us to leave more that once.
I tell her out of love for her and her saftey not hurt to HER DAD, I need to be very careful. I don't know where I stand with my legal Issues and to protect her from a poor image of her father : He is Narrssitic, Hypocodia, emotionaly unstable.
With the pending divorce in Nov. I want her to be safe, however she knows he can be verbally abusive more than anyone.
Only now is she feeling safe to speak of hurts from him. She wants a bonding so she will pick out what ever good she can find like the cool stuff about her dad and in time will need to face the trama he has caused.
I say to much and the N will sniff it out to cause her hurt.
How do you explain N, do I use the N word for all the N things he does?
I'm also reading the Hypocondia. How do you explain that one.
Doctors have reports about his health, I don't know for sure what is real.
The fact that his health has been the big reason for putting up with his crap all this time.
I did ask her if he is telling her something she is not feeling good about to let someone know. I would want her to tell me but then it becomes a betral thing. She will tell me what he says but it may not be everything.
She has a larger support group here, I will encourage her to talk with someone.
In time as she feels safe I will expose more to her.
For now her Dad calls her, she doesn't call him. She does e-mail him.
He sends her little gifts to let her know he is thinking of her.
But will then poison the giving with something hurtful like something mean about me. She said he tells her how Im making it so she can't see him or some way he will be getting custody of her and moving back to CA.
She wants to see him for a short visit in the summer.
He expects to see her before then with out a court order. Im waiting for this OSC sometime in July. We have him settled until she comes back from camp after June, So maybe he will calm down for a little bit.
He does not know about the OSC until they give me a court day.
He has no papers filed yet but is making a fuss and may be filing something as we speak.
Our D is at a friends tonight. She loves it here and is looking forward to going to camp with her friends.
OR
If you have ideas on this let me know.
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Hi OR,
I really was just trying to understand how you have handled the issue of his emotional and physical problems with her. I wasn't advocating you do anything different than you are.
After hearing you explain her perspective and your's, you are doing it perfectly, like a good loving mom.
You're being patient and trusting her common sense and your own good influence to let things unfold on their own. I wouldn't do anything different than you are after hearing what you said. :D
You're a very wise lady. :wink:
I know its a time of uncertainty, but I have very good feelings about you and D. I hope you can stay optimistic and confident that his behavior will cost him in the end.
Prayers for you and D. It sounds like she is really adjusting well to her new home.
mudpup
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Mud, I do appreciate your thoughts regarding my D.
I want the best for her and often wonder how to deal with such fragile feelings of a 12yr old.
My H just e-mailed me Happy Mothers Day but not before he reminded me how unhappy he was. How it is something I caused for him to be unhappy, how all the holidays were nitemares but nothing he did. He thanked me for making him a Dad.
He tells me to wish the best for him in his radio . He said he love all his fans. He has been there less than a week and already he is a star amazing how the N mind thinks about his ego.
He wants me to work with him on our Divorce and having our D for him to share all his web radio stuff. He claims life is very wonderful for him since I left.
I spent the time to paste and copy my writings on this thread. I will take the time to read through it sometime. I got choaked up as I saw my life changing and how many friends I made on this thread . I am so gald I am away from my H to find peace in my life. I find things going well for myself and have a lot of support from friends and family.
I think I am gald for my H, what better N supply for him than his own ego
thinking he is a star. I think it is the best way to keep him from wanting his N supply for myself or our D.
OR
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He said he love all his fans.
Well, he said he loved you too, and then threatened to shoot you.
He may have a short career if he expresses his love for them the same way he did for you. How sad and pathetic. Its pitiful the way they think, even after they're exposed, that people still believe them.
I got choaked up as I saw my life changing and how many friends I made on this thread .
I know you poo poo it, but you have been a real inspiration to everybody here. :wink: :D
I think I am gald for my H, what better N supply for him than his own ego
thinking he is a star.
You're the genuine star not him! He's a falling star.
Have a great Mother's day, OR and God bless.
mud
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OR:
Happy Mother's Day! Glad to see that things are continuing with you and your D. Don't let the N get you down. Just think, he has his on little fan base to give him N supply. Maybe he will let you and your D alone when he really gets important! I mean Ns who are important don't have time for lesser beings such as ourselves. I am being scarcastic because I also heard from my N brother on Mother's Day. What a trip or lack of that is. It never ceases to amaze me the entitlements N think they have with all of us. Your ex NH really expects you to drop everything and ship your D off to CA because he wants it? You are doing everything just right with your D. It is a fine line that you travel.
Mudpup is right. You have done so much in the last 4 months. All of it progress. It is amazing when you finally get the peace and quite, no chaos, even the small things give you confort. Like coming in from work and no one there to "walk around like eggshells" after a hard day. Not catering to their little fanatical whims. Not taking blame or ownership of things you have no business taking owership of. It makes you really look at their lunancy for what it is.
Mudpup: I thought you might enjoy this from my N brother. He calls me to wish me a Happy Mother's Day. I told him it was very thoughtful of him. Then he is unhappy because he has not seen me in two years and if I wanted to see him..........well could he use MY frequent flier miles to come see me. If he were a destitute individiual I might consider it. However he is a millionaire and a ticket for him would not exceed $400. What is wrong with this picture. It did not occur to him that I might want MY frequent flier miles to do something for myself. Also it did not occur to him WHY I have not visited in two years. He asked me to get his ticket as if he were entitled to it. It is amazing, truly amazing. He has no concept of the word NO. Patz
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Oh my God Patz,
What an absolute and complete jerk!
He wants to use your FF miles to honor you with his presence. And he's a millionaire. You get to pay to have your millionaire Nbro abuser come and abuse you. That's one of those things that if you think about it long enough, the anger might start dissolving into laughter at the obliviousness to his own repulsiveness.
Why is it the most repugnant people on earth are always the ones who want to inflict their presence on others?
Maybe you could offer to buy him a ticket (one way) on a slow boat to China. With a hole in it. And a crew of very, very lonely ex cons. :twisted:
Sorry he's such a chump Patz.
mudpup
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Hi All:
Hiya OR! Belated Happy Mother's Day to you and all the other mommies here!!
I did ask her if he is telling her something she is not feeling good about to let someone know. I would want her to tell me but then it becomes a betral thing. She will tell me what he says but it may not be everything.
That's why it might be a help for her to know to say:
I don't feel comfortable talking/doing/hearing about ....that...." to her Dad. That way....if she doesn't want to tell you....she has an option to help her deal with his idiocy. That way she can stand up for herself to him (which isn't fair...she shouldn't have to do that....but the chances are high that she will...because he's....a big jerkdope ( :D :D )....but she may not wish to tell you about it....feel like she's betraying...etc.
Anyway OR......I'm so glad you are seeing how far you've come in this short time! You have truly gone from a bad situation to a much better one...mostly on your own....mostly because you've been brave and prudent and determined! You really are an inspiration!!
Patz: Ditto what Mud said. How ridiculous!! How utterly absurd people are sometimes eh? Hope you had a happy mother's day anyway!! :D
GFN
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Thanks, MUD,GFN, Patz
Patz, I think people with money can be like this more than we care to think. You spend yours so he can hold onto his, nice guy.
Today on the radio I heard about a brian scan study done on the guys who shot the students at Columbine school
They found defective readings in the frontal lobe the section for empathy and compassion.
I know Narrsisstic behavior is lack of empathy and compassion.
Maybe there are some levels that could cause someone to kill like these kids, Scott Peterson or other N's.
The study did not talk about N behavior only the scan results of these kids were all the same. I thought it of intrest and will look for more data on the subject.
My H sent me an e-mail explaining there were results from a brain scan with abnormal readings. I don't think I have this report but I have been thinking how he talked about getting a gun to shoot me.
I have had a lump in my stomach to think he may be so far gone.
How will I get someone to understand the connection. For now I do have the other medical report and now the brain scan that can see a physical symptom.
In the e-mail he said he would be able to forget about the past.
How I should let it go because he has.
I remember reading this afraid he could shoot me and claim he doesn't remember because of the abnormal readings. He claims it's from the MS or the major drugs he is on.
I scare myself to think I would suspect my H could kill me. I heard this today and will be adding his e-mail about the brain scan to connect the comment about the gun.
OR
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OR:
It falls into the catagory of when my N father asked me to "let by gones be by gones". This is after all the Nness. I think it must be like taking a drink of water to them. They wake up the next day as if nothing has happened. Just what did he expect you to do after he threatened to physically harmed you? Gimme a break here.
It reminds me of all typical abusers. They will beat up on you and humiliate you then the next day it is all sweetness and light. This is because of their ego being their universe. Nothing outside of it matters and only the decisions and their purpose matters. Your ex NH has to have a frontal lobe in the first place to know something is wrong! It just goes to show the extent of his "state of mind" when dealing with "perceived" problems with you.
Yeah my N brother is a real trip. This is his standard MO with most people. He gets them to PAY for the priviledge of being around him. He wants to visit ok but it has to be on his terms. Well, he can stay where he is and I certainly am not going to expose myself and my son to such Nness. Realizing of course that when he made this statement to me that I had on many occasion gone out of my way to visit him at MY expense and did not ask for any help from him. This was ok because he did not have to put out any effort. Everything is ok so long as it is on his terms. Typical N. Both of my brothers really make me so very tired with their stupid little mean N universe.
Patz
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Patz,
The study is dealing with Teens who commit crimes and the Idea the brain is not developed yet and should they be held accountable for their crimes.
I will keep reading, don't know if I can find enough to show a judge his questionable remarks about the gun and the idea he may have the ability to be harmful.
I checked his web site and see he talks about his young girl fans and meeting up with one on friday nite. I feel like I took a slug in the stomach.
Not so much I care but just the reality of his thinking.
I guess his ego is so big and he wants he buds to think he's got it goin on.
Just before the comment about the girl, he says how he put out a dedication to the mothers that have lost their children or don't know where their children are.
I hope our D does not read what he is saying about this girl he met.
I guess we both need to get used to it.
OR
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Hey. OR. Did I miss something? Is your ex REALLY so "hot" that he actually HAS a young thing interested in him? Maybe those delusional comments are more lunacy that can be used in court? OH jeeez, Louise!
He can't be for real!!
I am sorry you are hurt by this....he sounds as crazy as a loon, however.
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MUM, just felt like a physical hit in the stomach.
Don't know much more than that. I'ts the mind letting go after 26yrs.
I have never cheated on him and there has never been any time I have had to deal with another woman.
I want him to move on, like myself. He has always been flirty but to see him writing about it is a bit of a shock.
I expected him to move fast this would be the MO of an N.
he would need his N-supply young and as quick as possible. N's are like reading a book they seem to be so much alike. I will get over it, I think I will be fine.
My H is very good looking and even though he has many medical and mental problems these things can't be seen. He does take his cane to walk but maybe all of that was a lie too.
OR
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OR:
I am sorry about the post he made about the girl. It may or may not be true. The fact is he will eventually meet another female to give him the adoration he desires. It is hard when you realize it is not about you or your daughter and never has been. It is all about HIM. All the work and effort toward the marriage was about you so long as it benefited him. This is the cold hard truth with all Ns.
My N brother that I heard from on Mother's Day has this very needy girlfriend that will absolutely do just about anything he wants. This includes leaving her daughter on holidays to come be with my brother. Yet when there are family functions he will not bring her around. It is truly sad to see how Ns use and abuse people. This poor creature works for my brother, is a single mom, who has to have the pay check. She will go to his office in the 4AM time slot, manage his properties, is at his beck and call sexually speaking etc., and he might pay her 30K a year for all of this.
Hopefully if the girl is young enough that he proclaims to hook up with, it will be jail bait time. You never know these days when you start dealing with people on a one to one basis exactly what you are getting. I am just so very glad you are out of this situation. The hurt will subside as you get further and further away and really begin to see in perspective what he is and the unfortunate part you and your D played. Just hang in there and it will resolve, just make sure it resolves in the best possible way for you and your D.
Much love,
Patz
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Patz, Thank you for your thoughts, I don't know what I would do with out the encouragement.
This AM my H e-mailed me thought I was going throw up after he tells me to call him and if I was listening to his broadcast, He talked about me.
Not sure what he said about me but with the frontal lobe defect he must have forgotten he has fans that care more than I do.
I have to go to work Patz, it's sad when your heart wants family to treat you with some warmth and understanding and all you get is their cold reflections.
Hugs OR
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Hi OR,
It seems like you have an awful lot of evidence on this creep already. Would it be possible to just let him e-mail you but not read them for now? Or maybe block him altogether?
What good is it doing you to listen to him?
It sounds like maybe you should just take a break from the galoot until you absolutely have to deal with this stuff. He's winding you up like a tin soldier at the moment and manipulating your thoughts and feelings.
If you could just dump his letters and e-mails into a big bin without reading them until you need to, he would still be incriminating himself but you wouldn't have to be dealing with it now.
Or maybe just dump any new ones altogether and never read them.
He's messing you around, and you don't need that.
mudpup
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OR, I agree with mudpuppy. Take care of yourself first. Part of that may be NOT reading STBXH's EMails for a while. From the things you have posted (only a small bit, I'm sure) it sounds like your STBXH will say or write ANYTHING that he thinks will make him look better to others. It doesn't have to be true or real in any way as long as he THINKS it makes him look better, smarter, faster, more desireable, etc. Ignore his infantile fantasies, they have NOTHING to do with reality.
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Thanks Mud and Long, I will consider your thoughts about setting aside his e-mails. I will have him post our D's name if it concerns her.
Inside I am upset. I have been thinking more about the radio broadcast about the kids with frontal lobe defect who killed the kids in Columbine.
I went back and read my H's email about his medical description of the brain having several white masses 7mm on the interior frontal lobe.
Ok, he has defective brain mass can it ever be fixed, I don't know.
Will this mean until this has changed he will not be safe to take care of our D. Planning to deal with him as we divorce what precautions do I take for all of our saftey.
I understand he will continue to make himself sound wonderful to others.
I don't expect changes over night, I am so afraid for our Ds future.
Difficult enough to leave a bad marriage but to think about a physical symptom seen to relate to killer instinct, Im upset and afraid.
He just emailed me saying if Im not going to let our D come see him he will send her envelopes to write him. He has already told her he plans of fighting for custody.
I must lay out the medical reports to label him unfit.
It's one thing to say I "think" he has this N problem or something's not right but to have the evidence in front of you, it sets an impact so deep and with much confiction to accept and follow thru to protect the family.
I wish there was more hope, I just don't see any for him.
I for some reason wish I could give him a magic pill so his brain would function without having killing thoughts. How do I explain to our D what I I now understand about her Dad, when all the rest was bad enough.
I can't disscuss it with him, he would lie about any danger to us.
I wish the doctors could be more helpful with his reports but they have already told me they can't disscuss his medical reports with me.
D wants to get on the computer will calm down and talk later .
OR
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Re his medical records and the doctors:
They may not be able to talk about them to you, but there should be a way to get the records into what lawyers call 'discovery'.... Anna will know more about this. I'm not sure how far a subpoena can go with the doctors... HCFA has had an impact, and I don't know exactly what it is.
But you definitely want that Columbine parallel discussed. By someone else, preferably male and in a suit.
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OR, it makes sense to me that you would want to find a way to fix your H's problems. both for him and that it would make your and D's life a lot easier. Whether his issues are physical, emotional, or mental, I have not heard of any miracle treatment or surgery. Even if surgery removed a mass in his brain, he would still need years of voluntary hard work in talk therapy to sort out all these years of his issues. I'm sorry this situation is really hard on you and your D. You don't deserve these things. :(
He's sending envelopes so his D will write him. :roll: Yeah, I'm sure that's why she hasn't written him yet, you've hidden all the envelopes. Do kids even know how to write letters today? Isn't it all EMail and IM'ing?
((((((((((OR&D)))))))))
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OR:
Is it possible to express your concerns to a medical doctor in your area and maybe get some feed back? I think someone mentioned Anna, she might know more about the privacy issues surrounding the medical records. She might know more about the "discovery" processs and can explain it. Maybe if you could talk to another medical doctor in a general way he could help with some of your fears.
After reading your post today, I got to thinking about the issue of him and his radio BS. My last N relationship after it began to end, the N would come by to let me know how well he was doing, what he was doing blah blah. Of course it was all great, spectacular etc. It occurred to me that he was somewhat like a little 6 year old boy showing you his new toys. It was if he was saying "see how bright and shiney and new they are and don't you wish you had this". I think it is similar with this nonsense with this radio bs. He is just waving this in your face like a 6 year old. First you can play with his "new toys" and admire them and just like a 6 year old, no you can't play with them today.
I finally quit responding to all this and he got tired and went away. He was not getting any N supply, negative or positive. Maybe Mudpup is right. Just put all that stuff in a folder on the desktop and look at it later. It is to much right now. It is the same blather you have been hearing all along and really doesn't add anything.
My concern is the same you have for your daugther. It is only through your explanations about his health that might make it easier for her, especially when she is older and realizes how wacko he was during this time.
Much love,
Patz
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Long, Patz, Mud
Today my D received her package with envelopes a gift and a letter.
I let her know the docotrs found something on her Dad's brain and for now she may read something that I may need to know to keep her safe.
I decided to respond back to his e-mail from today. I have not responded back in a month and believed it would be the right time to let him know unless I had a medical report about the brain scan I would not feel safe to consider sending our D to CA. I wanted him to call his doctor to find out about medicine he might be taking to help him.If he does not make me feel safe she will not go.
He tells me how he was having more surgries and the SSI would stop because he would make them stop ( SSI already removed the Protest, he doesn't know ) but he said after surgries he would get WC.
I did not mention anything about the money, only I needed him to send his medical report to his brother to review.
His brother is in the medical field and may know something. I don't expect my H to send a report he may blow it off as nothing, but it may buy me time to delay any visits.
Im going to go to bed, last night I had dreams about men and some type of danger just so worried about everything. I feel better today.
I'm sorry if I don't respond to all the help you send my way
I only have a short time to write today.
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OR i wish you had a good lawyer to help you with ths stuff.... :( :(
I dont know much about discovery, except its the informaton lawyers ask for and reveal to each other, before the hearings begin; I dont know if he has the power to refuse or not, if you request somethng (his records) in discovery. i dont know how you can get ahold of his records otherwise. although, a good lawyer might be able to tell you your rights.
I know you can petition to have him evaluated in different ways... id really be looking into this, becuase if you can get him passing some of these evaluations as a condition to spending time with your daughter, it sounds like he probably wont pass them.
if you are able to petition that -before- he is allowed custody (or even visitation) that he pass these numerous evaluations, that he probably will not pass, it may be a stumbling block for him. but, a laywer will help a lot in getting that organised.
just some thoughts. dont be too afraid of the things in his brain..... my feeling there is to let him think he is in control of things as much as possible. a lot of times people get more violent when they feel cornered. he may be less inclined to violence if he imagines he is in control.
stay on course.
d's mom
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Hi OR,
Don't know if this will help, but this site has all the california legal codes in it.
You can learn quite a bit here. Just click on the central button that says Calif Law. It takes you to a search engine. Pretty easy but kind of time consuming.
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/
I don't know about discovery regarding medical records. If he is claiming a disability to you and you state that as a cause for supervised visits or some other legal reason it seems likely that you could at least force him to be examined again. I know if a person makes a claim in court for a personal injury the opposing party has the right to have them examined. Don't know if this extends to your case though.
Good luck.
mudpup
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Mud, thanks for the great web site I have looked lots to see.
I have to go to work, just a quick note My D just checked out H's web site where he comments about his young fans making lustful remarks.
She tells him how rude he sounds. I told her about his MENTAL concers for her own saftey.
He had not told his buds we left to Dallas. Some of them are just now getting the word he is expecting her to arrive soon. (not until I get the court making me). They are goin to know now.
Im late OR
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Hi to everyone, I have been working on my legal papers for the OSC
They got sent back for some minor details but it worked out for the best.
As time is passing my H has sent enough e-mails to prove my fears about sending my D to him in CA.
The last sheet of paper attached shows how all the other e-mails make sense. He has lied about his money the SSI money for our D even makes a threat of "do what he says or else."
He admits to having over 5,000 of our D's SSI money he has now spent on an attorney and plans on getting it back. His papers say he has no money and Im to pay for all the fees. This e-mail confirms lie after lie.
He is so mad at me for having the prior 10 yr old custody papers, telling me to stop showing it around. How is is old and not valid.
He will be upset when he gets the copies of all the emails of his rude comments, how the few times I have responded he writes back how he can't read my emails because he can't afford to be upset or his eye sight is bad. I asked him to send me a copy of his MS brain scan but I only get his response Don't worry it's not my problem. I told him our D is not going anywhere unless I feel it's safe.
I asked the Judge to please review my concerns why I can not trust my H to return our D to TX. His many health problems and mental issues with MS and his many comments about his lack of money.
He makes several comments about how I left him in the cold to die, but I have an email from his brother how he was going to leave both my D and
I, around the time he tells me he would shoot me if I move to TX.
I was going to hold back on the emails but felt unsure about the judge not getting the whole picture of the possible danger our D could be in.
Today she tells me she does not want to go to CA that my H is still saying things to make her feel he may not let her come back to TX. She wants to go to KS to see her Grandpa, my Father.
She never wants to call him and the last time he called here she was on the phone with her friend and told him she was too busy to talk.
When he does talk to her she doesn't say much it's all about him.
This is a condensed of the last e-mail.
i have a good attorney
you have 2 strikes against you
i still even though you left me at deaths door hoping i would die
play fair or else ( & it;s out of my hands) be under the judgement in court
I paid $5,800 for Desirae beneits to an attorney
I expect to recoup that money
especially for back benefits that have not been sent
This note below was the next day after the above note, unbelivable.
i don't force myself on anyone
you wanted out of the marrage
i gave it to you
d dosen't want to visit
she dosen't have to
i'm not gonna ask again
if your job dosen't work out & you wanna come here you can
i miss having you & d around
but it's not in my nature to be pushy
I can't believe he would spend any money after he pleads how poor he is, I have asked for an audit of the spending and a copy of the 5,000 check.
This memorial weekend was the time 28yrs ago we met.
I have met some nice people here and started selling Arabonne products. I think its a way to make new friends and a little money on the side.
The Minister of the chruch we go to is on the radio here, Ed Young JR. I
have met a lot of friends and going to dinner with a few after chruch this sunday. I have a nice car to drive to work and my job is going great.
Keep us all in your prayers. I will not ever want my old life back but would want somehow for my H to have healing in his mind, before he does something more crazy than he already has.
Take Care to all here and I will do the same. OR
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((((((((((OR)))))))))))
Sounds like you are starting to get more positive situations and people in your life. Take care of yourself and just keep going. You and your D are still in my prayers and your move still inspires me. :)
P.S. I'm glad to hear that it is not in your H's nature to be pushy. I'd hate to see/hear what it would be like if he was. :shock:
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You know, OR, I still think about you often...you are doing amazing things with your life. It is very sad that your daughter has such a sick loser for a dad, but you have done a wonderful thing for her, by showing her a different way to live. I have no doubt that you will continue along this path. Your ex is indeed left in the dust, but it's a choice HE made, as he does not have the mental, emotional or spiritual capacity to make any other choice. Keep on, brave woman!! His instabiltiy is very apparant in those emails... I know the wheels of justice go SLOWLY, but just do as I do...keep one foot in front of the other and keep on moving on with YOUR life. Things will settle. Happiness is already coming to your doorstep.
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OR,
So glad to hear that your life continues to improve in your new hometown. You have demonstrated such amazing strength and courage. I think some day (when life settles down a bit) you should offer your services to a women's shelter as an example of someone who did escape abuse and started their life anew. You could be a great inspiration to many women in abusive situations.
I continue to hold you and your daughter in my prayers.
Brigid
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OR:
I have been off my computer for about 2 weeks. Thought I would check in finally!
I can only reiterate that he is digging the biggest hole for himself. Your daughter is signaling that it is going to be a no for a CA visit.
He will of course blame you, brainwashing the D against him, leaving him while he was so sick, bailing out when things got tough..........blah blah blah. Well as the saying goes "what now"?
He is reaping the whirl wind of his nness. As far as him using the SSI money for the lawyer because he is so sure he is going to win? When the judge gets a load of what he has done (if in fact he has done this) he is going to have to pay it back with interest. The SSI money is not meant for lawyer fees but for your daughters support and welfare. He is not tangling with the state government but with the Feds on this level. He is a complete nut bar.
Use the emails or anything else for your security and your daughters.
Again hello everyone and it is good to be back.
Much love to you OR and your D.
Patz
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Hi OR:
I'm still thinking of you often and keeping you in my prayers too. Glad you get a chance to post and let us know how things are going.
He just keeps racking up balls against himself, doesn't he?
Good for you for having the courage to voice your concerns to the judge.
It's good to read about the good things happening for you and C too!! And the best thing is to read you saying you would never go back! That means you know you made the right decision and it feels right!! That sounds very comforting and brings peace into your life eh? So glad you're safe and happy there!!
I like Brigid's idea too! (Brigid!! You have some really cool ideas!!) If you feel like it some time, OR, I think you would be an amazing support to others trying to escape terror. That's what it is isn't it? A life of terror....wondering what might happen next......afraid to move.....in case it happens......afraid not to......in case it happens.......and then.....using your courage.......to escape .....regardless of the terror, maybe in the midst of it!! You really are a heroine OR!!!
(((((((OR)))))))
GFN
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Hi to everyone, I have been avoiding the computer so I would avoid my e-mail for a few days.
I just read an e-mail that he is telling me what Im to do
this is only an e-mail, nothing has been mailed to me and I have already requested from the courts an OSC.
Im waiting for a court date and will be sending him the hearing date when I get it. I have requested a telephone hearing so I should not have to come to court.
MY H wrote:
My attorney told me to communicate some things to you
#1 bring D on Aug 8th
#2 You make me feel D is your possession, by hiding her for over 120 days
#3 Telling me I can see her if I do what you say
I expect you to paint me black on Aug 8th.
But it is the behavior you are doing, that changed the laws to joint custody. women using the children to torture the ex spouse.
Those days are over
I had to by my attorneys request, give my version of events for the up coming Aug 8th session with us & the judge
Trials are over, it's me you & d, alone in the judges chambers
fighting only traumatizes the child
That's why divorces are no longer trials & joint custody is the modern way
Come into the 21st century or get counseling
Our D has a letter that he sent over 2weeks ago, she has not opened it and I'm not talking about it. She is afraid he won't let her come back to TX if she goes there to visit. I try not to speak of him so she won't repeat what I say. I only say what needs to be noted like for her to tell me if she has concerns about what he might say.
Patz
He is reaping the whirl wind of his nness. As far as him using the SSI money for the lawyer because he is so sure he is going to win? When the judge gets a load of what he has done (if in fact he has done this) he is going to have to pay it back with interest. The SSI money is not meant for lawyer fees but for your daughters support and welfare. He is not tangling with the state government but with the Feds on this level. He is a complete nut bar.
I have felt so numb but wanting to stay quiet inside.
At times I want to tell my H that I know he was telling me how sick he is and feel sorry for him was only to keep me off guard, I needed to be more patient with him when he would throw his fits.
People that manipulate others to get what they want.
I now understand what a scam it was.
I do see doctor reports to make be believe a lot of his problems were real.
I'ts the excuse for the abuse, I no longer allow to keep me under his control.
I write it down to tell him how hurtful it was but never send a response.
I choose not to defend myself, knowing he is unstable, makes it useless.
I do want him to get help and want the judge to review my papers to make him get help. I have a difficult time seeing what a mess he is putting himself in. I need to just let it happen to him and try not to think about him and the problems he is causing for himself.
He needs to have the Law or something break him of his hurtful ways.
I will write more later.
Bridget and all of you thanks for the encouragement to know I can be an inspration to others. Thank you all so much. OR
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Thanks for the update OR.
Don't feel so sorry for the screwup that you let your guard down.
Praying for you to stay strong.
mudpup
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I just got this e-mail from him I don't know if he is confessing he has this money and wants me to tell him what I know about it.
It sounds like he is trying to say I got this money, I didn't know how much until now but he is setting up his story for the lawyer trying to explain a lie. I think he knows he is in big trouble and how he just today got this letter????? This will be intresting.
I just got a copy of the letter for back pay from SDI
The period when i recieved $14 dollars till I went of workmans comp till you took Desirae
Now i see it was money that made you not send Desirae
I'll send a copy to my attorney
I paid $5800 for That & I have proof
Care to comment?
I wrote more but lost it all when I got kicked off the computer will write more later. OR
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OR: I have a hard time following your ex's emails. They seem very stream of consiousness (like I should be a critic, huh?)...and that consiousness is very confused.
Are you including them verbatim? I mean, is that what he really sends?
If so, I would think someone in the medical or psychological community would have to take a look at those and maybe they could interpret/evaluate them?
I think his writings (and you say he has a blog or something as well?) would be mighty interesting when it comes to getting visitation with your daughter.
Best to you, I think you are doing great!
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Mum this is a copy and paste what he sent me today.
sometimes I may not send the whole thing but this is how he writes to me. I think sometimes he writes so I will think he can't see.
I have to go to Dallas will write later OR
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Hi everyone
Wanted to say I got my OSC date of Aug 1st.
I can't tell you how much better I feel knowing I now have on record a plea to keep our D safe.
I have not received anything in the mail yet, but I'm able to access the information on-line. The on-line information is very detailed about what has been filed and who filed on what day.
I think now my H is squirmming, reaching for me to reveal what I have exposed about him.
The on-line information shows he is Pro-Per, not able to pay for the court cost. How could another lawyer take his case knowing the case is filed already?
I think from his last e-mail he will play the "I don't remember receiving the WC, SSI, back-pay" game. He makes it sound like even though he had a direct deposit account set up for our D in his name, I have somehow taken the money from him and he wants me to comment?
This will be very intresting, I hope the judge will see my H needs help at many levels, making him be accountable for taking care of his problems not to blame everyone else. Taking him out of my life where I will not be responsible for him and making it safe for all involved I will be less stressed.
For now I can make plans to have our D visit her Grandparents.
Amen! OR
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Hi OR!
Keeping my fingers crossed for you and your daughter, doesn't sound as if you need it though, you seem to have plenty of documentation of how warped his mind is. Good luck!
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Hi OR! Thanks for giving us an update. I'm sorry, but not surprised, that STBXH is still trying to make problems for you and D. I'm glad that you took a break for a few days to get away from the stress of even reading his messages. I'm sure you're already aware, but I'll say it anyway to validate you. :) It doesn't matter at all what STBXH says his lawyer says. The only thing there that matters is what the lawyers say to each other in official paperwork and what the judge says.
Keep up the great work and keep taking good care of yourself and your D. Do you get a "vacation" while she visits her grandparents? Do something fun for yourself this summer! You deserve it!
(((((((((OR)))))))))) (((((((((((D)))))))))))
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Update:
My H just e-maile me a nasty note about the Visit to the grandparents.
I haven't asked my D if she told him but he tells me he doesn't want her to go. He's threating me with legal action, BLA,BLA, BLA.
He thinks if he can't see her no one should. They have rights to see her and just as good he is making a fuss so I'm sure to have their rights to see her in it's leagal place.
My BIL shows me a letter my H wrote him, he talks about how he's working with a christian radio station and they told him to write his brother a letter. What a joke the letter never says sorry only how everyone is against him for no good reason.
How I've split them apart and he is sorry. that I have done this.
Amazing. I still have nothing from any lawyer no name address or any date from them for me to be in CA on the 8th.
I do have my Aug 1st date that if he did have a lawyer looking on the court web site he would know about this Aug 1st .
I did get the papers in the mail and must send them to him 10days before the Aug 1st. I'm going to wait until the last minute to serve them.
I have been very busy with other things in my life and much more happy.
I went to see Joyce Myers here in Dallas, she signed my book and I got a picture with her. I was so excited to see her she has changed my life.
I would watch her in CA when ever I could and learned she was going to be at the Barnes and Noble this Friday. I stood in line with 200 or more and shook her husbands hand and got to tell her eye to eye how much she has done for me.
Because of her ministry I had found strength to change my attitudes to help me overcome some of my daily struggles.
She signed her new book Approval addictions. I'm reading it now.
My N husband would make comments everytime I would watch her on TV, how she only wants money, never would listen to her speak only put negative into what I was doing. There were a lot of men standing in line, Im glad some of them heard her message.
Were going to a pool party and Sunday after chruch my D goes to camp for 5 days.
Have a great day everyone ............OR
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Hey OR,
Good to hear from you. You sound great.
I know you're gonna kick his a**!
As a Christian I'm sure you'll kick it in a loving way, but kick it nonetheless. :wink: :D
mudpup
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Hey mudpuppy,
I just got back from the pool party, had a great time. It's fun to meet new faces.
Got home to find another e-mail with lots of anger, I just write "e-mail received" He says the most hurtful things pulling out all the stops to get me where he thinks it hurts. At first you want to respond back but a few seconds later I shut down and find no response is better.
I guess showing any response to the remarks will only give him what he wants. I know at some point communication is important but I can't get past the hurtful comments to even say he is hurting me.
D is going off to camp 2 hrs away to Oklahoma with Ed Youngs ministry.
She is torn about her Dad, she wants to believe he is like other Dads she has recently met. I think as time goes on she wants to believe now what her mind will accept. She wants her Dad to be normal and is having to compare others to her not so normal Dad.
I need to work on this for her. .............OR
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OR,
I'm sorry that the beat just goes on and on where the H is concerned, but at least he keeps burying himself deeper and deeper. I think its a good thing that you D is beginning to understand that he is not a "normal" dad. Hard for her, I'm sure, but she will be able to start developing the tools necessary to deal with him, or not, depending on what she eventually chooses to do.
You sound great, tho. :D Keep it up, kiddo, as you are a real inspiration to many women here. I'm so proud of you.
Blessings,
Brigid
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Bridgid Thank you so so much for keeping me inspired about myself
I have been restless all night about my D. She is on her way to camp for a week, Im going to miss her.
I wonder how she will present her dalimas with others. She may find others that have divorced parents willing to share.
Being divorced is bad enough but dealing with an N having major emotional issues and on Morphine makes the situation more difficult.
She is trying to find herself and wants so much to have her parents to be normal. I believe her letters from her dad may be full of N manipulations.
She is young and not sure what to believe.
I have told her a little bit about the medical reports but being an N has so many levels Im not sure how to present anymore than what will make her safe.
Today I want to find a way for her to understand herself but weave a positive refection about what she is dealing with at home.
I will find the words somehow to take a Negitive to a Positive.
About her family so she can be proud of who she is.
Im rambling .... OR
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OR,
I totally understand what you're saying about how our children choose to present their home situation to others. My children are older, but that doesn't necessarily mean its easier for them. It could even be more difficult and in our case everything came as such a shock, none of us had any prep time. I think my kids just don't talk about it, except to maybe one or two very close friends. Unfortunately, neither of them has a close friend who comes from a divorced family, so none of their friends can relate.
I hope your D can find a comfort level with someone to talk about her situation. You and I know how helpful that is to our healing, so it can only be true for them as well. Is she going with a friend to camp or on her own? I hope she has a wonderful experience and can just have fun and feel like a normal kid for a week. I would give anything to feel like a normal adult for a week. :shock:
God bless,
Brigid
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Brigid
She is going with a friend. This friend and her family have taken us under their wing. The dad is great and my D thinks he is cool. She is wanting to connect with the male gender vs the female. She likes boys and it's all she talks about.
When I was young I liked being around men vs women because women can be so caddy. I want her to keep up with female friends and not think men are going to always want to be FRIENDS.
It is such a delicate time, being 12. Im learning how divorce affects the young mind. I fear getting it right the first time is critical to her well being.
Got to go Brigid thanks for responding. OR
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Hey, OR. Good to see you're doing fine. I wouldn't put too much stock in your daughter's interest in boys as a side effect to having a nutjob for a dad. I remember distinctly that "boy crazy" stage. My own daughter is going through the same thing....and we certainly had different type dads and parent situations.
You're a smart mom, so noticing this, and knowing it is normal, (AND that you still need to keep on your toes) will add up to things being fine.
All teenagers need to feel this, and have a parent who will understand, provide guidance, without freaking out about it.
Remember, kids only need ONE good parent to really make it. That's you.
You and your daughter sound like resilient, healthy people. I'm sure life is going your way from now on.
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I wainted all day before I checked my e-mail
I just got this today from my H. my (BIL) is added in place of his name.
This sounds so threating to me, Im glad he is far away.
He continues with the blame for is condition to myself and his brother.
He's talking about a blood clot I guess. He doesn't drink so Im not sure
what the remark for his brother not to come to CA has to do with anything.
He's sent 3 letters to our D and a package on the way. She's gone to camp for now. I hope she is having a great time.
makes my P.E. travel to my brain
& cause a "lukoma" or something that sounds like it
a mini stoke
The neuro twisted my left foot
it seems the whole left part of my body is permanently effected
top of my head, ear, eyes arm leg & foot
He said "don't drink, you can't afford to lose any more brain cells"
So it would be best if BIL was considering coming with you on Aug 8th he should reconsider (I still have nothing for this date from any lawyer)
however it may take forever to not make the day BIL & my paths cross to be a life changing experience for him
At least my paralyzed left side will be a permanent reminder of the two of you
OR
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HUH? HUH? Could you just write that back? "HUH?"
It seems pretty evident that your ex is not mentally stable. If you are working with an attorney now, perhaps it's a good time to bundle up the nutty emails and get some sort of parenting plan in place that protects your daughter (supervised visitation...etc).
Jeez, OR, how you can deal with this guy is beyond me. At least my ex is somewhat sane....although I'm not sure that's better.
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Mum, I don't know what to think?
I belive the Meds have just sent him over the edge. I have already sent in the e-mails (a book of them) along with request for full custody.
I always go HUH ? scratch my head, What the hell is he saying.
It's amazing he has his own web site where he writes music reviews.
He does not have the scatterd thoughts like he sends me. He writes about music from years ago and reflects back with a great memory and few typos.
I don't know what this BS is, he gives me all the time.
He is on the radio too, I have not listened to any of it but he sent an CD and I just heard his voice and couldn't bare to listen. I wanted to throw up.
Bazzar!!!!!!!!!! OR
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((((((((((OR)))))))))))
Keep going OR! Your life is moving, his is not. You are getting farther and farther away from him every day. Keep checking things out with us here and we will keep telling you that you are fine and he is the one who is sick. (As if you need us to tell you that.) Still, it is good to hear it from others once in a while.
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Hey, OR. So strange. I think you are doing the right thing. I always think you have done the right thing. And I don't think full custody is out of the question for you, either. It is really strange that he is coherent in other venues.
Sometimes, I can't believe my ex; what he does, what he says, how he treats the children (and me!!). But even though I am in the midst of legal garbage with him...I realize how much happier I am and how much closer to my goal I feel I get, when I can say: "Weird, pathetic loser".....and then let that scary energy go...and move on to thinking about my wonderful life instead. I can get really down and dark thinking about all the what if's and focusing on his actions or potential actions (what I don't want!) and I see that I can get really happy when I drop that catastrophizing and just realize how much nicer my life is ....simply because I am not married to him!!! That alone, makes me a happier person. so when I focus on what I do want, I think it brings that reality into perspective for me.
Naturally, we have to be smart, realize what we are up against, stay on our toes.....but we can do this AND be happier too.
Anyway, I think you are seeing that in your life. It's pretty clear that you are moving in a direction and picking up momentum that cannot be stopped, as Longtire pointed out.
Best to you, OR (my hero...still!!)
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Mum and Longtire
You both are so helpful in my life. I appreciate your time to help me in my struggles. I love this site and all the people here that want to help each other. Mum, you are always so positive and have been a bright light many times in my darkest days. Thank you soooo much.
I am doing good. Im so glad to be away from the nitemare I was in.
It is so much better to be free from my old life.
I feel great not walking on the eggshells around the house.
I see it now as manipulation to get his way. I don't believe he was in as much pain as he claimed. I know he was in alot of pain but maybe not as often as he wanted me to believe.
I on the other hand I see how I was manipulating too, trying to avoid the daily battles of trying to keep the peace for the family.
I'm not going to keep peace about alot more in my life.
Boundries are going up for my daughter so she knows how much I love her. I feel the 12 yr old about to see what she can get away with.
Summer is here and now she wants to stay home, not go stay the month
to see Grandpa.
We will be driving the 6hr drive in July together instead of her going by herself to visit.
Im going to be giving her some room to grow, allowing some trips to the malls with a few friends and a movie or two.
Anyone got some good teen punishments to share.
I got the no phone and computer down.
I need some Ideas.
Longtire, How have you been? I look for your writings to see whats going on with you. Your not using your old thread to update whats going on in your life. I have been away so maybe I missed some good news.
OR
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OR, I'll address your last point first. I am in such a different place these days that I haven't figured out what it is or how to talk about it. It is a good place :D, but maybe it has just been so long that I'm not sure how to handle it right now. Plus, I have been busy with work heating up and doing things around the house. No excuse. I'm glad I moved out when I did though, I've been so busy since. One of these days soon I'll start posting more again, but probably in a different vein seeing as how I'm literally in a different place now.
As far as teen discipline goes, I think every child is different, but here are somethings that helped with my daughter (16 now):
Consistency. Consistency. Consistency. You have to prove to her that you are more stubborn than she is. :twisted:
Setup the limits and rules clearly beforehand. You will probably hear "Well you didn't say I couldn't..." (technically do what I really did understand you wanted me not to do but I wanted to do so I did it anyway.) Ask her if she has any questions about where the boundaries are when you set them.
Always tell her you love her and are trying to teach her. Actually, this should probably be at the top of the list. :) Tell her WHY you are setting a limit in this area and what your concerns or fears are. Sometimes she may have valid information why that is not a problem. Most of the time she will think she has valid information why the boundary is not needed but you will not agree.
Stick to your guns and tell her the rules and that you love her over and over and over.... If they haven't already, hormones will kick your daughter's brain out of her hear for a couple of years. Don't worry, it does eventually come back. :) In our case, my 12YO daughter just could NOT understand why we had a problem with her hanging out with a couple of 15 YO boys with a friend of hers and trying to hide it from us. No matter how many times we explained, she didn't understand and thought we were being so unfair. She did finally realize when she was about 15 that it was actually not OK for 15YO to be hanging around with 12 year olds and that was so uncool.
Keep what works and change what doesn't. Mainly, just keep talking with her and let her know that you aren't just out to keep her from having fun, but that you want her to be safe while she has fun until she learns (from you) how to keep herself safe.
I'm not sure if any of this helps. You know your D better than anyone else, so I say trust your judgement. Just remember that over the next few years she will start to become more independent. The real trick then is to separate when to hold them back for safety and when it is just you being nervous and learning to sit with your own fear while you let her go somewhere new.
Sigh... I still have a lot of work to do to learn how to post short posts. :)
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Hi OR:
Good to see all the good stuff you are feeling and writing to us! Your life is so much better now and I'm so happy for you and proud of you!!
You are doing great job!
One thing I'm wondering:
Have you asked your daughter to show you the letters she's getting from dad? I mean.....it's ok to ask, right?
Also: do you see her response after reading them? Does she seem upset? Confused? Otherwise emotional?
You can be honest and tell her you're really curious about what her dad is writing to her and you would like to read the letters, if she is ok with it.
As long as you let her know it's ok if she doesn't feel comfortable with that, that she doesn't have to share what's in them.
Also, if you have noticed say....she seems...upset after reading....then you could mention that you noticed this and are concerned/care about her and would like to see if you could help by discussing the upsetting parts.
Just a thought.
As to teenage "punishments". I like to think of them as consequences. It's sometimes tricky but I try to make the consequence fit the action.
Have you heard of natural consequences? This is example....where the child refuses to bring an umbrella, when it's pouring rain and you want them to take it but they refuse. Rather than keep voicing your want....you let the natural consequence of getting soaking wet....be. It's tough to do sometimes....hard to watch them face the natural consequence of some of their actions....but I think it teaches them better than almost anything else.
Ofcourse......there are some things that are too dangerous to let the natural consequence occur (say.....they decide they're going out at 11 pm by themself, to just "hang out" with their friends...at 12 years old). In that case, you have to be prepared to be a dictator and firmly say: "No". Sometimes, substituting something fun.....offering to do something they enjoy with them, instead of what they want.......will be accepted.
I'm sure others will have some good ideas too.
Take care OR! Still praying for you and C!
GFN
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hey, OR. one of the best books I ever read on parenting teenagers is:
"Get Out of My Life!...but First Will you Drive me and Cheryl to the Mall?"
by a Dr. Wolf. He is funny (obviously) but drives home a lot of research and philosophy about teenagers home with his style.
I also aspire to the natural consequences style of parenting, but I reserve the right to change my style at any time!!!
I use "Love and Logic" in my classroom and those authors (name escapes me) have some great parenting books as well.
So here' my classroom "rules" as an example:(thanks to Love and Logic...although it's probably not exactly what they say)
"I will treat you with respect so that you know how to treat me.
Feel free to do anything you want in my classroom as long as it doesn't cause a problem for yourself or anyone else.
If you cause a problem, I will ask you to fix it.
If you can't fix it, or choose not to, I will do something.
What I do, depends on the special circumstances and the special people involved."
I swear, after 22 years of teaching and many classroom rules posters, this is the most honest and straighforward of all.
And it applies in the home as well.
It leaves the children empowered, but not feeling so unstructured as to feel unsafe. I will still be there to help them when they can't figure things out. But for the most part, a simple, "your talking when I present this information is making it hard for me to teach and others to learn. Please take care of the problem". I don't have many "discipline" problems in my classroom.
Nor do I with my kids (although.....more so, as you would guess).
My own kids push me.
Generally, I my teenage boy will ignore and ignore (and grumble when they finally do what I ask) and my teenage girl will argue and argue and argue until Ihave forgotten my point in the first place.
Sometimes I remember this, sometimes I forget (and they help me remember!!!). I believe it's pretty typical behavoir, actually. Reading books helps me to feel this "normalcy" and not worry too much.
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MuM, Longtire and GFN,
I will reread all the wonderful thoughts to help me with my D.
I found a clinic specializing in N's and other emotional problems like Manic or Bi- polar.
Next Saturday at 9am I'm bringing my H's medical evaluation with me.
I will have them review the report to help my D and I understand what is the best way to move forward with the divorce.
I was given a lawyer's name who deals with all of the above and child custody too. This is a lawyer from this clinic but now has his own practice.
The receptionist said to call him he may give some free advise.
I was told my assigned T has a focus with children and they have many other T's to help me to deal with the many struggles regarding the physical and mental problems with my H.
Tonight my D and her friend have a babbysitting job for the Aunt/Uncle.
This will be a Friday nite thing for them to make some money on the side.
Well she left all her letters from her Dad on the floor by her bed so I read them. He is telling her we have to be in CA on the 8th for custody.
I told her we were not going to CA and able to call by phone.
She was worried she would miss the first day of school.
He said some other things but nothing worth talking about here.
Today I mentioned I made this appointment to disscuss the medical report from a specialist how we need guidance from a 3rd party.
This Clinic is on the radio , I have listen to them and heard them last night talkin about Bi Polar and medications that can help.
It's the Paul Meyers clinic. They have offices all over the country the main office where Im going is here in Tx 30 min away.
The Receptionist asked me what kind of abnormal findings were mentioned in the report. I didn't have the report with me but when I told her a self-absorbed N, she said he may not see he has a problem.
She agreed we should come in so they can help with the understanding and guidance with child custody. Paul Meyers has a book out called
"Crazy Makers". available at Barnes and Nobel.
I was so gald she told me he knows alot about N's and wrote a book on the subject.
Im feeling less stressed about him and the e-mail he just sent me.
He's letting me know his lawyer has a report comming from TX that was kinda funny, wanted to know if I filed a life insurrance policy on him.
When I moved here to TX my Medical had to be setup with another carrier
I simply transferred over what I already had. It's only accidental cheep stuff. I will let him wonder.
He is also telling me that his brother and I are trying to Murder him because we know about all his medcical problems.
the Blood clot has moved to his brain causing a stroke and we have caused this stress, it's all our fault. BLA BLA.
Now this must be true because I have taken out a life insurrance policy on him trying to kill him. WOW I wonder if Dr Myer will use us as a case study for the Crazy Makers II.
Thanks for reading................OR
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OR: I am happy for you. Things are opening up....moving along.....
picking up speed...straight for the life you wanted. It is encouraging to hear your story. I get a little overwhelmed sometimes and forget that it is very possible to win in life. After being "beaten" for so long, I sometimes forget "you can't lose em all". And once again, OR, you are my hero.
Bless you...sending you more and more and more momentum toward your happiness that you so rightly deserve!!!
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Received this email today, this is a new one were now talking Murder.
I have replaced the names.
He tells me his lawyer had a funny report about life insurance come up. I would guess when I moved here to TX, My company transfered my DATA from CA over to the TX carrier. He knows about it but has forgotten, its a cheep policy to cover incase you get hurt at work the whole family is on it for 3 dollars a month.
Right or wrong I view the actions of the two of you as attempted murder using D The only way you guys can hurt me
BIL, medical knowledge & your ability to be cruel.
feel like a man who has someone holding a life insurance policy on them & someone is trying to collect.
So with BIL medical knowledge his domineering personality combines with a hatred of me.
I am in fear for my life
I am not threatning I am afraid for my life
BIL being a DR knows the truth & any judge will agree
I don't write often to him. I write only received e-mail.
This time I told him he needs to get emotional help and if he wanted to get help I would send him a name of a clinic but beyond that to calm down no one is trying to hurt him and to understand our D is going no where with him having his many emotional problems
He reminds me how his MS is affecting him, I used this to show how without some peace of mind about his condition I would not move on my position.
Today my D went to the mall with her friend, she had fun and followed all the given rules. Yeah! Were here now having girl time with her friend watching movies and eating pizza.
Have a great Fathers Day ...........OR
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I just got some very sad news, my nephew commited suicide on Fathers day. My BIL has two children from his first marriage. His oldest son was 38 or so, on drugs.
He was on his way here to Dallas, when he got lost some how comming from LA. He called about 5 days ago telling his dad he was in Illinois.
My BIL said he sounded parinod, they found his body washed up in the river with his car nearby.
My D is very sad, she called her Dad, he just emailed me a nasty note,
telling me to get out of TX leave his family alone. His nephew died because of a bad marriage, and I would also kill him if I didn't give him back his family.
He was upset that his brother would call me about the news. He telles me my D wants to be with him now and he his telling his lawyer.
I don't want to upset my D about what her dad tells me, I know she is sad and would want her dad in her time of pain.
I'm feeling sad too, I was there when my nephew was 12 and his parents divorced. He became wealthy with the conception of YAHOO.
His mother is a physcologist and father a Medical Pathologist.
He had non stop money to spend on his habit.
He was in pain, I wish somehow he could have gotten some help.
His 5 yr marriage had just broke up. His ex-wife called yesterday to tell of the news. I had just e-mailed my BIL asking about his son, he called me to tell me the bad news.
Talk later .................OR
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Dear OR:
I've been so glad to hear how things were going so well for you and now I'm sorry to hear about the loss of your nephew, especially the tragic circumstances. That is so awful to picture and so sad to think about.
And your dopey soon to be ex trying to shovel his shame on you makes it all worse, I bet.
(((((OR))))).
Keep plugging along OR. Hopefully the new T will have some good suggestions, especially for your D.
Don't accept your H's nasty gifts! He's now threatening you with suicide. If he does that, it will be his choice and you have no bearing on it. He could choose to seek help for himself and work on himself. He chooses to blame you for his losses.
You're doing a great job of taking care of your D and you! Keep going OR!
GEN
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GEN
Ya know how sometimes you have a bad hair day?
Well....I'm having a bad hairy finger day (type-extravaganza!)!! :roll:
That was me. :D
GFN
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GFN, Im so sad about all of this. Im already fighting off depression about my Divorce, and now my H is insulting me about the death of his nephew.
I can't believe him, or yes I can, but it boils my blood. I sent him a response back that I DON'T HAVE TO MAKE HIM HAPPY,
I don't have to move out of texas because his brother lives here.
He is making blame that an unhappy marriage made his nephew walk in the water and drown. That his wife made him do this. How I was doing the same to him.
I told him if he had not been so selfish he could have been a bigger part of his life and given him guidance on something he could relate to, a bad marriage.
I read his web site to his buds and he makes a remark how he wished he had been a better uncle.
He is telling me horrible things , It's too much for me to even believe.
I want to cry, how uncaring he is. We are all upset I best not reply back to him.
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OR: I am sorry about your nephew. What a blow for your family.
Your crazy soon to be EX is just that, a real nutjob.
It has helped me not respond to my ex when my blood is boiling, as you said. And believe me, it boils plenty often.
Because you are most likely using his crazy, emotional computer rantings in a potential court case, I urge you to NOT respond emotionally on email. ALL email will be used in a case, not just from one side. If you have a lawyer, send everything through him or her. Ask yourself if you could possibly LET IT GO, as in NO response needed, legally (or ask your attorney) and if the answer is: hmmm, this doesn't really deserve a response....or it's not a question, etc...than let it go....and buy a punching bag!!!
If you want to add something else, make sure you sound emotionally neutral if you can. It is really hard for me, because he deliberately insists on my responses after a while and they have to do with my children (if it were just me, I could care less....but you know that feeling!)
I write a lot of responses, but don't send the first draft, as it is usually very reactive. And then what I do send goes through my lawyer.
He is once again, trying to dump his pain onto you. Don't take it, let it slide right by. Hang in there, OR!! You are doing great.
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Thanks Mum, Im numb by it all. I did reply back to my H ,said He was way out of line. that's it.
I know my BIL has a big heart made out of flesh. I understand my H is off the deep end with a cold hard heart.
I just can't believe when people are in sorrow how can someone be so full of hate.
Im tired and didn't sleep much, will write more later.
Thanks Mum, ........... OR
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OR,
So sorry that you are having to deal with this now after working so hard to get to a good place. Your soon-to-be ex is really pushing your buttons now, but you need to be strong and smart and not react or respond. Keep your eye on the big prize of being free of him and don't compromise your position.
I'm very sorry about your nephew. Children of very happy intact families commit suicide, too. Generally it is due to very deep depression that would have been there regardless of their family situation. He was a grown man with many problems, but that doesn't make it any less painful. Do not let this distract you. It has nothing to do with you or your situation. Try to deal with the grief apart from your own situation. Easier said than done, I'm sure, but don't think for one minute that anything he is saying makes any sense.
I continue to hold you and your daughter in my prayers.
Blessings,
Brigid
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Hi OR,
Don't let your ex get you down by piling on to your nephews tragedy.
My brother has accused me of spitting on my fathers grave (he didn't quite explain how I did this) and being responsible for my mother's heart disease and even preemptively accused me of killing her if I didn't stop fighting for a fair share of my property and just accept his lopsided offer.
Your husband is just latching onto something that he knows effects you and is trying to use it to his advantage.
My advice is don't even respond to the ape. Sounds like he is either calculatingly sadistic and cold blooded or headed to an institution shortly.
mud
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Hi OR
Sorry I haven't gotten back to you until now. I'll pass on and adlib to the advice given me, by other board members, which really, applies to any of us who have to have dealings with these.........insects.
We have to try to think of them as insects.
Tiny, little, nothings, really, that bite and make little spots on us itchy, but who's bite is generally ignorable.
That's what he's doing. He's trying to make you itch! He's trying to make you think he's some big injured bird when really, he's just a lousy, irritating insect!
Ignor his stupid words, OR. They mean nothing. They're just meant to cause an itch. There's no real value or truth to them.
And see if you can try, as I'm trying to do too, and probably others are trying to or will at some point try....to mentally squash him, or at least, ignor his buzzing!!!
So..........don't even read his silly emails while you are grieving the loss of your nephew. They can be saved and read later, when you're feeling stronger.
((((((((((((((OR)))))))))))))))))
So sorry for your loss. You are not responsible for other people's actions, OR. You didn't cause anyone to do anything. They choose what to do and justify their behaviour to themselves. Like your insect H is doing.
GFN
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Mum, GFN, Mud, Brigid,
Thank you all for your warm words to me.
I'm going thru waves of emotion but ok.
GFN, this has been a suggestion in the past I do believe I will take the advise this time, my emotional tank is just too full to take anymore.
don't even read his silly emails while you are grieving the loss of your nephew
I will try this idea. I know he is miles away, and I can look at him as a small insect to minimize my stess as much as possible.
We have to try to think of them as insects.
Brigid, I have compromised enough in my life, I stand firm in my goals.
I have come along way to get here, with more support than I ever imagined in my life. I do believe my H has huge problems that he must own. I have come along way to let go of the unlovable.
Pushing me away with hate, wanting to draw me near with a faulse kindness, over and over.
don't compromise your position.
Mud, This kind of comment hits me deep. I wonder why? It would be showing a lack of respect to your parents, if it's not important maybe it means little. Someone dies you only have the respect left to give them,
holding them dear in your heart, then some BUTT head makes your special thoughts poisioned with a act of hate. Pisses me off.
My brother has accused me of spitting on my fathers grave (he didn't quite explain how I did this) and being responsible for my mother's heart disease and even preemptively accused me of killing her if I didn't stop fighting for a fair share of my property and just accept his lopsided offer.
MuM, I have been good about not responding, I don't know if my H saved what I did send him, I have asked him to share with me his medical reports how I don't feel safe leaving our D with him until I have peace of mind. Sometimes I draft a letter then delete it. That helps me too.
I will have some answers Saturday when I speak with a T regarding my H's medical report. I expect they will give some guidance on how my D should respond to him.
I write a lot of responses, but don't send the first draft
I wil be better in a short while, I have not yet got all the details from my BIL. I know he his so sad, I hear it in his voice, so heart breaking.
Thank you all so much .........OR
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I wil be better in a short while.
You're still my heroine OR!!!
(((((OR)))))
GFN
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Just updating on the past few days.
1. Nephew's car was not found, he liked to gamble and may have been in Illinois on a boat. I guess he had gobs of cash in his wallet. He did die from drowning. My BIL just left for the airport, to Balboa Island where the kids lived after the divorce. My Nephew was sparated from his wife who lives in SF. She went to claim the body and belongings. He has been cremated and the ashes will be divided with the sister and mom.
My BIL is going thru so much and called my H to tell him to be in New Port on Sunday. My H is such an A#$%hole, he told him he is angry and would not be there, he didn't want to ruin things too.
This is not about my H, being an N he shows how only his feelings matter.
My BIL was pist that my H could not get beyond his own feelings.
It would have been nice if my H could be a man instead of a 5 yr old.
Amazing !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! even in a death how they just can't get beyond themselfs.
Along with a nasty note to me he wants to make sure I change my
Married name back to my madein name. Tells me to move out of Texas leave his family alone and HE WILL QUICKLY GET MARRIED TO RESOLVE THIS PROBLEM? That was today.
Im not clear how being married again will change much with me. I would be happy incase I have to pay him spousal support or something money wise.
It would a great thing because he would leave me alone. How wonderful that would be.
Went to the T today, talked to her about what was going on and getting help for my D. When my D walked in the office she was glaring at me.
She wasn't mad but was not sure what to expect.
I told her we were comming here to speak with a T regarding the communicaiton with her dad. I think she thought it was a legal decision she was making.
When we were sigining out we bought 2 books 1 called Crazy Makers that Dr. Meiyers wrote, the other She bought written by Katie Meiyers his daugher.
She did appear happier and even hugged me. She wants to go back once a week to speak with the T. I asked why she thought 1 time a week VS 1 time a month or everday? She said as things happen she could remember better if she went weekly.
She did not tell me what her T talked about.
I know the T said she would go over a few things, Trusting me,
Safety issue, understanding about her dad how his emotional problems are concering and she also needs someone to help her through this divorce.
We leave for Kansas on the 29th to see my Dad will be back on the 5th.
Looking forward to seeing him and my twin brother too.
My Dad tells me I should be reading her letters from my H.
He said she should not be having this privacy because he could be telling her to meet him somewhere.
I told him he could e-mail her and she could easily call him anytime. I know she would not want me to read her mail. My Dad said too bad for her I should read them.
The last email after I said I would not open them anymore,
he tells me she wrote him that I had listen to his phone conversation when he called the fist week. I told her I was listening but that was the only time.
She has called him 1 or maybe 2 times that I know of that was to talk about his nephews death. I don't know of anything else but she has been writing him and he tells me he is using her letters in court.
It doesn't matter he will get an eye full in a few weeks when I send out the OSC with all of his wacko e-mails.
Thanks for reading .............OR
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It doesn't matter he will get an eye full in a few weeks when I send out the OSC with all of his wacko e-mails.
There you go, OR!! That's the way to keep thinking!!!! YEAH!!
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Update,
The sevice was Sunday for my Nephew. I was told my H would not come
because of his anger towards his brother about helping me.
I wrote him, told him to go to the service be an man not act like a 5 yr old.
I wrote more but this was part of what I said.
He did go, and wrote me back.
Nothing in reply to being N, only for his nephew he would not say the negitive things he says to me. (don't believe it for one minute).
I felt better to tell him he needs HELP, I say very little because of the Divorce.
This is all coming out in a few weeks with the OSC, so for now I guess he thinks Im just giving my opinion that he is an N. His reply to me makes no mention about being an N.
He did say he felt like his family cared about him and felt he was loved.
He changes with the wind, I know he will need extensive help.
This is not the first time I have told him he is an N, I mentioned 1 time shortly after we moved here.
I think it odd he would not say "NO IM NOT an N," or maybe he likes being an N and it's no big deal to him????????
I wrote this to my H.
You are a text book case, the way you react and the things you say and do are all ready written down.
You have a problem called self absorb Narrssistic behavior. You can be helped with lots of therapy. Problem you CANT see it in yourself. it's too painful. YOU must press through this take a step of faith, GOOO! to the service.
Don't talk about yourself or your problems but about Steve.
Don't cry and make a scene that you have this sorrow, you just need to be calm and listen to the pains of others learn from people who have emotions that are real.
You have lost your emotions somehow and not expected to be emotional, just try and feel, not to mask what you think, you should be.
My H did say some other wako stuff, this is what I said to him.
trying to keep in mind what I have to say is more important than the Wako stuff he comes up with.
I responded back only with how "great it was he felt he was loved by his family."
Thanks for reading. Im reading a book called Crazy Makers, it gives advise to tell these N people they are N's.
The thearapy is extensive with more than 1 T, to do the job on a daily treatment plan, lasting for a very long time depending on the degree.
I wonder if you go from one degree to another but would always be an N never able to be healed.
Thanks for reading. OR
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I printed out all 283 pages of this thread, reading and amazed at where Im at today.
I wanted to tell everyone that helped me on my way to Dallas, thank you so much.
As time was getting close to that tramatic day I could feel the fears and how much your support got me through.After I left the house with our D and all the prayers that followed me during my journey here.
My story brought tears to my eyes, maybe someday I will share it with others.
I was reviewing what took place so I can answer questions if asked.
I'm sure the Judge only wants to know how we're going to deal with custody and not so much why we want to divorce. It helped to go back and get in touch with the pain, I'm still sorta numb about it all but I feel more angry about things and will work through this in time.
I have been having difficulty talking with our D about her Dad.
I found e-mailing her from my work so she can read it without shutting me down has helped.
I try and say what needs to be said in love but just the same some truths had to be said.
This has helped and I feel she is breaking down her walls to let me in a little.
After I mailed the court papers My STBEX, he has not given me any BS. he has been very quiet.
(other than to tell me another lie how his lawyer e-mailed to remind him of court on 8/1, when it was my SIL who mailed him all 32 pages to the house)
I checked the court web site today and if any one knows what" CASE TRACKED TO CP17 FOR HRG8/1"
means let me know.
I don't see where my H has responded to my OSC filing, maybe the Case hearing is being prepared for Monday the 1st.
Im going to call the court house in the AM and ask if he has not responded and if he is no show what happens.
My H now knows he has been caught in lies, will be view with emotional problems and admitted he had money but made the court pay for his divorce filing fees. A letter from his brother about how he wanted to leave us, telling me to leave with our D, the Gun remark, him talking about how sick he is with MS, how I left him to die and all the other crazy e-mails.
I am truely getting upset inside about everything, as I was reading thru this thread where I mentioned about a legal aid telling me I could leave with our D if NO court papers were filed.
Please know I need some good thoughts about what's about to take place. I will be with my SIL at 8:30 on the 1st. I have been able to hold it together but once the judge makes a decision I may find myself upset or just so happy this part is over.
I wrote the phone number on the court papers for my H to call in for the telephone appearance, but I wonder if the leagal aid that helped him file his divorce papers for FREE, will read the papers and see he lied about his income.
He may not wish to file the response and maybe won't show up!
Thanks for reading ...........OR
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I called the court today, found the H did not pickup the court papers for the OSC.
He has not filed the response but may plan to show up anyway.
The court clerk said the judge has the option to deny him a response without the papers filed.
I faxed the court the proff of service papers and the confirmaiton from the post office the papers have not been picked up. It works out for me, H will not have any Idea about the 32 pages of all his lies the judge will have read by time the hearing starts. Im able to call by phone, H doesn't know that because he never picked up the papers. Im sure he is thinking Im flying into CA on Monday with our D. He will be all ready to find he may not be having the kind of day he planned on.
I also learned he has no divorce lawyer,like he said. He has the SSI lawyer who helped him file his papers.
She is a WC/SSI lawyer.
I also learned I have to file more papers for the divorce to be finalized. I have a lawyer here in TX that Im talking to about this, on Monday.
Talk later, ..............OR
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(((((((OR))))))) It will all be ok. Keep focused on how far you have come....how happy you and your daughter can be. All will be well. Sending lots of love and strength.
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Hey Mum, Thank you so much for the good wishes. I'm looking at you and your story, all the BS your EX
puts you thru over and over. I know if my H had the money he would never let up.
I get worried sometimes how the family courts work and the horror stories I have read.
My D asked me the other day if I remembered the dream she interpeted about the beast.
(she doesn't know you thought it was of me)
She remembers it and talks about the beast and how the woman had others that loved her and to have faith to let go, others would be there to catch me. In time I will let her know it was me running away from the terror.
I will keep a good attitude about what ever happens , I will not let the crazy beast make me bitter about my life.
Thanks Mum, You are so good at sending good energy to others, no matter what difficult matters you are going through yourself. Take Care ...............OR
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Hi OR:
Been following your thread and I just want to say that you are still one of the best inspirations around!! Your attitude is just the best!! Keep going OR!!!
I will be going on holiday....leaving Monday night...and I may not have much pc time for the next couple of days, if any. I will be thinking of you and praying for you that Monday goes well for you and if I can possibly pop in here to read I will.
God Bless you OR!! I have a good feeling about Monday for you!!
:D Sela
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Sela,
Have a great time on vacation. Where you going ?
Im on one myself until the 8th, praying it's not used to pack my stuff up to move back to CA.
Thanks for the good wishes, you too have been a pilar of strength for me. I'm feeling the pressure and want to cry sometimes. After I printed the over 200 pages of this thread and sat to read it, I was reminded how much others do care. When some members of your own family could care less about you.
I have had posters here show more compassion and understanding than I have ever felt.
My two of 3 sisters and mother have not ever contacted me about the move here to TX or the divorce.
We have had a strained relationship from many years so no surprize. So I have appreciated the warm thoughts from you and others too.
Sometimes I try not to be too needy but I have empty holes in my heart and want to heal them some how.
So thank you again Sela, have a wonderful vacation..................OR
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Dear OR:
Compared to the size of your heart, picture those holes as very small, and very sure to heal! Poo on your sisters and mother! They are nothing! They have no clue! Let them live the way they choose and you live your way! I like your way a whole lot better!
Courageous!
Determined!
Full of hope and faith!
Honest!
Open!
Giving and sharing!
Reaching for help when needed!
Not ashamed of being human!
I could go on but I won't. Not that I don't want to. Just that I don't want to embarrass you, only to encourage you to keep going!
You won't be moving to CA!!! No need to! No judge in his/her right mind will order you to!
I will post to the "anything" thead about my trip. I'm very excited!
Enjoy your holiday too OR! Let go of your fears for a little while and just relax! Revive your strength! You have it! You are still my heroine!!!
((((((OR))))))
:D Sela
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Hi OR,
Its been a while since I really replied to you. I always remember you and say prayers for you and your daughter and for others here. When I'm feeling like this is all too much to handle I remember you taking that huge step of making the move to Dallas and I feel encouraged. I am making final financial preparations before I tell my wife that I want a divorce. I follow your example and plan for the things I can plan for and trust for the rest. I know it hasn't been easy for you. But if you've looked back at those old posts, I'm sure you can see the wonderful changes in yourself as well.
This place and the people here are very important members of my chosen family. I rely on my chosen family, here and elsewhere, to help me through difficult things. I am fortunate to have good contact with my parents without NPD or other major issues. They can't really understand where I am with all this, but they do support me. After reading about many people's situations here, I am very grateful for that. I will still pursue better relationship with my parents and other family, but doubt that it will be as important to me as my chosen family. I'm glad to see that you are going back over some of these things from the past and are able to see them with new wisdom and awareness.
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Sela,
Compared to the size of your heart, picture those holes as very small, and very sure to heal! Poo on your sisters and mother! They are nothing! They have no clue! Let them live the way they choose and you live your way! I like your way a whole lot better!
Thanks for this thought about the big heart, I feel better about those holes being small and more managable. I know everything has it's time maybe some day they will have a clue but for now it is POO! on them. They are all some type of (N's) anyway.
I guess sometimes when you feel empty about these people in your life you still wish you knew what it was like to have a mother that cared.
Your mind reaches as a child for a mother's understanding.
I'm not a child and I tell myself "who needs the mind games". Then Im not so sad about the way it JUST IS!
Long
I follow your example and plan for the things I can plan for and trust for the rest
Your right! I have done all I could do and TRUST is what I will do now! Thanks for the reminder, you can get caught up in the worries, the laws, what my H and his verbal attacks on at me.
Sometimes life can take an unexpected turn to live out another plan than what you think your plan should be. I want to believe so much the way things happened to get me here, can't be the wrong place for me to be.
This place and the people here are very important members of my chosen family. I rely on my chosen family, here and elsewhere, to help me through difficult things.
You are right! a chosen family can be rewarding. I do think having positive role modles to replace the empty places in our heart is what can heal us. God adopted all of us as his children and will put people in our lives to mend the broken relationships. I can't do anything about how others choose to ambutate me from their lives but I can grow a more fruitful relationship with those that want to be part of my life.
Thanks for the warm thoughts ................OR
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I'm staying in tx not going anywhere for now. H could not make me come back today, no mention about
plans to make me move.........HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oct. 4th will be another hearing. The judge knows Im in TX, no problem...........what a relief!!!!!!
This is what took place....... H- is in the court room, I'm on the phone the judge ask why my H had not filed the response papers
He tells the Judge he was not served..........I chime in "YES he was, he did not respond and a copy of the Post office notice of service had been faxed. to the court"
......Paused, Judge locates the notice
It was noted that H did not respond and the Notice WAS SERVED!.....HA!!!!!!!!!
Next was the SSI money for support, judge says to me so you are now receiving this money?
NOOOOOOOOOOOO! H put a hold on the money then SSI released the money , I received 2 mos and NOW I have to pay back this money BECAUSE H, was collecting WC while he received SSI. Now I get nothing
Pause......... Judge tells H to account for the money he is getting and how HE WOULD RESPOND to me within 10 days and would also need to respond within 20 days of the OCT date with papers for mediation.
I must file an appointment for Mediation to work out custody I don't know if I understood the OSC process I thought the judge would rule on something today and mediation would also be part of todays processs.
I understand now I have to make an appointment first with the mediation and the judge part, takes place another time. The Judge first mentioned Oct 17th, then the clerk confirmed the 4th. so maybe the mediation is the 4th and court with the judge is the 17th.
I know the judge got my 32 pages, I don't know how much of it he read, he did see the SSI papers so he must have looked to some degree, only the SSI was discussed, he said he was sorry he could not help me more, he did make MY DAY letting me know H, would comply with rules and respond like he should.
I will be calling legal aid on how much mediation can help the the evaluation papers and the other evidence.
I have been here in TX long enough now to seek council here and see about having this all transfered.
will be working on it this week
sorry to ramble Im so excited !!!!!!!!!!!!!OR
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OR!!!! I wish I were there to hug you and jump up and down and all that crazy/happy stuff.
Everything that happened today is GOOD GOOD GOOD. An OSC, or Order to Show Cause is always preliminary....so the judge doesn't rule on anything big, just accepts that yes, we do need a trial/hearing/other thing (mediation) before a ruling. (my understanding after so many OSCs).
So, keep on top of the dates (your ex won't!!!!) and the longer you are in Texas, the harder it will be for him to get you and your daughter back there (if he would even try).
I don't drink, but if I did: I'd raise my glass to you!!! Or maybe I will go eat ice cream all by myself to celebrate.
You are still my hero, OR. This just proves it!!!
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Great news OR. :D :D I'm very happy for you. I continue to keep you and your daughter in my prayers.
Hugs,
Brigid
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I slept so much better!!!!!!!!! I went to the Doctors for my 1 yr physical, I'm in great physical condition.
I wondered if I had high blood pressure or something, but Im doing great!!!!!
I feel the pressure releasing, but need to keep up on making sure N-H does what the Judge told him to do.
Just knowing our D will start school on Monday, without the worries to move back to CA is soooooooo sweet.
Im waiting for N-H to do something because he is NOT having his way!
No time to worry about making him happy! I'm going to focus on D and myself for a little bit.
I was thinking how my H and his health issues were all we ever had to look forward to.
Not thinking about him is a hard habit to break. I feel free, right now!
My D received a letter from him, he tells her how I stole her away and how Ill he is, not able to
be under stress like I was putting him thru. Telling her not to ever lie, that your word is all you have.
I think we're having some PROJECTION !!!!!!!
Yesterday before we went to call the court house she tells me how she believes her dad is Bipolar.
She said she knows a kid that is bipolar and her dad reminds her of him.
I have not mentioned her dad was Bipolar only N, she never wants to discuss much about her dad, so I was surprized she wanted me to know she belived this about him. He may be bipolar not sure.
Thanks mum and Bridgid for the good thoughts, Im feeling so much better about life today!!!!!!
OR
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Well it did not take long for the N-H to spit back some anger
He just e-mailed our D, tells her "he would not move here to TX, if I did not distance myself from his brother and their family"
I do have a life, I would like to continue to have our D have cousins here to visit thats important. I will someday have another boyfriend and move past what is here, but he can't see that.
My SIL and I went to school together so he hates that. I realize EX's need to do this with each other I have no problem, just he is a punk to think he can be such a dictator.
I'm not ready to reply back to him, he is so good at isolation.
He can just keep wishing, I'm not going to make him happy with a reply.
If he moves here that would ruin my day, so he can sit in CA angry about me being here in TX, tooo bad!
He's a big A#$%$^&.
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Update
H- is upset and letting his brother know how he is not happy. :(
It appears my N-H never picked up my certified letter and 32 papers, but the judge was happy to let him know about some of the evidence against him. The BIG lie, I left N-H to die while he was recovering from surgery, other illness, abused him to tears and kidnapped our D.
I have the police report and to back-up H's statement he wanted to shoot me, leave US, is an email from his brother explaining he would have no part of my H leaving us in the cold confirming how he wanted to leave us.
The judge must have let my H copy the courts 32 papers for him to read, and announced how his brother explained in an e-mail what was going on. All I know is BIL wrote me to say my H is mad and going on about the letter the court had how he thought his brother supplied the letter directly to the judge.
I was imagining the judge never read all the pages, only set up the next appointment for our october 4th mediation.
I feel like with H so upset it could only mean he now has to face the lies and the judge knows his brother thinks he was doing the wrong thing to his family. I wish I could have been a fly on the wall in the court room that day. I guess it was ment to be H, never picked up the 32 pages from the Post Office.
Some how the judge giving the documents to my H has a much sweeter ring to it.
I wonder how he will respond about that medical evaluation on his mental abnormalities.
Now he must account for the money too, I know he hates having to account to anyone for his actions.
His brother is glad he will have to account to the judge and knows his brother hates authority.
I explained to him how the judge was pist at my H for the lie about not being served.
How the judge told my H, he will comply with the rules of the court and respond when requiried.
Thanks for reading ........... OR
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Yay OR!
I'm so glad the judge isn't an N, and is reading the papers, and isn't fooled by your H.
I wonder if your H's narcissism worked against him. If he thought he was too good to make the effort to pick up those papers, and could just lie his way through.
Oops, didn't work this time, did it?
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All of you, thank you sooooooooo much, My heart is sssssssssooooooooooooo Happy!
I know it's not over and much more to be done, but for now all the past e-mails from H telling me how I was in trouble for kidnapping, he can't say it to me anymore so HA!
thanks again,OR
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OR: My therapist was explaining to me (yesterday) how the biggest fear an N has is being exposed. Now this makes total sense....and I am SOOOOO happy too, that this is what is happening. That the judge is not fooled/impressed one bit is Fantastic!!
This good thing brings me such hope for myself as well!!
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Update.............Another lost battle for the N, Judge is standing with the recommendations until Jan. 16th
Because their was no agreement made until ex comes back with all his medical and phys reports the Judge wants on the 16th another meeting with D and the mediator again.
Ex was in the court room, his voice gave me chills.......I had the report faxed to me so I knew what to expect.
Ex got the report when he entered the court room. The judge was telling him about the upcoming dates and explaining how and what would affect him.....H was reading the report and did not listen as the judge was speaking to him.......Judge got pist and had to repeat what was said. H must have been stund about his lies not working for him.........
thanks for reading OR
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Hi OR:
My pc is on the blink and so I can only post occasionally from the library (haven't time to read back in this thread too far) but I am very, very happy to hear things are going the way they are...with the judge seemingly not fooled by your ex and by your ex acting like a dope infront of the judge. I hope this keeps up and will eventually put your jerk ex in his place!!!
Still keeping you and your d in my prayers!! Be strong OR!! You're doing great!!
:D Sela
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Sela, bummer your PC is down.
Thanks for the encouragement, I think I posted more details on another thread and wanted to update this one so it would have it on record for myself. I was in a hurry and didn't write what I should be so happy about.
to fininsh up a little more page 8 of the 9 page doc. said the recommendations would be I would have
full legal and physical custody.........
The mediator had told me she could not review the recent packett because it did not have a stamp from the court for proff of service to my H. I told her the last one I sent was left unclaimed for 2weeks and sent back to me. She did end up reading it and was able to verify the many lies. She talked to me first then D, then H.
He told so many lies made some most hurtful ones.
What a relief this was, all the hard work putting togeter reports and emails, even pictures of our D. the orginal OSC was about 32 pages, this one was 15 or so.
The judge for some reason kept this not giving it to the mediator. I put together a version for the mediator with all of the above. One of the reports was from a lawyer who teaches the courts judges and mediators how to look out the N's they lie and project etc.
I higlighted but kept everything in context so if she had never read his report which included all types of PD's she may learn what he teaches.
I sent e-mails from H, who tells all his chat room buds how we were making plans to move and he noted my move to our TX Corp. headquarters.
H must now provide a mental eval, and all meds and doc reports to the court for review.
He will not have more than supervised visit until Jan. and only after family court reviews the reports.
I have to go OR
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Hiya OR:
He will not have more than supervised visit until Jan. and only after family court reviews the reports.
Yay!!! This is a step in the right direction. So glad to hear it!
Keep trudging along!
(not sure what "other thread" to read but glad to read this!!!).
:D Sela
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Great News !!
Jan 31st was my court day for a mandatory settlement conference.
Child custody remains the same I keep full legal and physical custody until EX can provide medical reports to prove he is done with surgery and his medications.
The judge was willing to grant the divorce, so I'm FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thursday the court faxed me the mediation report from Jan 13th. I read all comments from EX, D and the mediators recommendations.
1. Mediator recommended Ex get individual therapy but the final report had this deleted.
There were other recommendations deleted like EX and D have T together with him by phone.
I was to screen all communication from EX, to D the final cut was reduced from a full page to half page.
The important thing is I have full custody I can stay in TX and Ex must have a full review with family services before any part changes. He would be able to have supervised visits.
Ex walked in with 2 canes and a ace wrapped elbow from his recent surgery.
I think the poor sympathy trick only backfired on him.
He went on with his lies about me kidnapping D and how I left because I was having an affair, the report said I leave D alone while I go to the bars and drink.
The mediator asked D she said mom leaves at 6 30 am calls her at 7am and picks her up everyday at 3 30 and we are home together the rest of the evening.
The judge tells ex this is a no fault divorce and he would be admonished in court if he believed he would say these things in court. ( Stamped that out cold) He also reminded him HE was the one who filed this divorce not me. My ex last words were he was going to get married right away ! What a stupid thing to say.
I was able to be calm and say " This is all about money" ex said NO, I then showed the judge the recent tax information showing the SSI, he received in Ds name. He then admitted how he received over $10.000
in a lump sum along with her SSI of over 5,000.
The judge told me to contact the child support agency here in TX and report the tax information to SSI.
I was able to prove ex a liar, my D proved he was a liar and he proved himself a liar.
The judge said a final judgment packet would be filed, I told him I had the forms already but he told me very quietly to put the forms away .
His words to my ex, he was to come back the next day, stand in line, get the judgment packet and send me the copies.
The judges words to me, put the packett away, nothing more for me to do, this was over get on the plane and don't look back!!!!!
AS I got on the plane at lift off I felt I could leave all the pain from my 28 years with ex, my relationship with my mother and sisters there in CA.
I did have a nice visit with long time friends who I stayed with the 1 day I was there and had a nice dinner with another friend.
I stopped by to drop off a toy for our dog, (she was outside) and to say good-bye, this was very sad.
Said good-bye to some neighbors. While I was there ex walked around the corner to come talk to them.
Funny he didn't have his 2 canes... I got in my car and never looked back..
I felt so tired when I got home.
I forgot, ex's mother died last week the will was read, mom left her money to a a judge who is the wife of the executor of her will. the grand kids will receive money for college.
ex does not know about the will, his brother is contesting the will so it could be a few years before they see any of the money. I was almost glad because ex, called D before I made it back to TX he was fighting the court judgment. I'm sure he was thinking his mother left him money and may want to use it to fight me.
His brother will not let him know about the will until ex says he is sorry. His brother wrote him to tell him he needs mental help and needs to apologies to everyone.
The war has been won for now, will be intresting to see how ex will choose to communicate with D.
D tells me "Mom we now have two single women in the house " she was not upset.
Her dad said he wants her to visit him but I am keeping her from him.
I told her he can see her with supervised visits any time. Reading the mediators report Ex was very upset about the supervised visit and told the mediator he wanted another mediator to review the case. The Judge ignored the request and said the judgement was final.
I don't believe he will fight the judgement, just the same Im glad he is 1,500 miles away...
OR
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Congratulations OR!!!
You give me something to shoot for.
God bless you and your daughter.
mudpup
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CONGRATULATIONS OR!!!!
Fatastic news!! I knew he'd fry his own bacon!!
You are so brave! You fought and won!!
Ditto what Muddy said:
God bless you and your daughter!!
((((((((((((((big large happy hug))))))))))))))))
:D :D :D Sela
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OR,
You are really an amazing woman. when you were in midst of all this, and posting his emails etc, I was really afraid of what he could do, what he would do. I am really proud of how you have handled this, and the lengths to which you have gone to protect your daughter.
Kudos to our very own tigress!!!
Love, Marta
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OR,
Congratulations and many blessings for the courts having done the right thing for a change. I wish you and your daughter all the best as you begin this next phase of your life. I know you will find the happiness and peace you so richly deserve.
Hugs,
Brigid
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Thank you all so much for the support and encouragement for the past year.
The divorce came 1year to the day when EX said he would soot me then himself if I moved to TX.
I remember because the next day was my fathers B-Day. I had told my father about the remark and how worried I was ready to say I had enough and would make every effort to leave the relationship and get out safe.
This time when I called my dad I gave him the great news. He was very happy for all of us and said the news was a great B-Day gift.
BIL wrote ex telling him to get some mental help, how his mind was sick and he is still waiting for an applogy before he will tell him about his mothers Will. He has written 4 e-mails but no response from ex.
I'm having drama with D's friend, she is staying with us for I don't know how long, the G-parents who have raised her for the past 5 years are finding a 13yo is not always fun.
The girl is given $200 to spend at the mall and lives is a very nice house. G-parents (step-G-father) trying to hold some boundaries I guess, the little girl was mad and called him names and cried becasue she didn't want to go with them and wanted to do something with her friends instead.
They were so mad they said she was going to be given up to foster care.
She is with us for now, tonight we by chance went shopping for food and the G-MA was in the parking lot.
We said hello and she asked her G-Daughter how she was doing. The G-D said I love you G-ma, and G-ma said I love you too. G-D felt bad not understanding why they would ever say they would give her away to foster care. I hope this is only a temp situation and after everyone cools down they can move her back home.
Drama, I was not ready for this but we are fine and my D loves having her here.
Thanks for reading OR
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OR, I am so happy for you. Has it been a year?
As you may recall, I have a 13 year old also, and drama is the name of the game ANYWAY....so what you (and I) are going through (have gone through) is not easy on our girls. Your resolve to make the right choices for your daughter are inspiring and compelling. Thank you for sharing this wonderful news.
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Know what I hear, OR?
In the middle of all you've been going through you are still the kind of person who has compassion for an out of control kid and her pushed too far grandma.
Bless you for that...
and KUDOS on your brave swim to freedom!
You MADE it across the Rio Grande.
Awesome.
Hopalong
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hey, OR, I sent you a PM, but I think I managed to lose it....let me know.
Mum
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OR, I am overjoyed to hear that your bravery, hard work, and search for peace have gotten you this! Don't ever think that this "just happened to you." You had the vision and you made it happen despite a lot of setbacks and fear. You found a way. Congratulations! Hearing your experience is so inspiring to me.
:D :lol: :) :mrgreen: :!:
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Many, many congratulations OR! This is fantastic news... I am so pleased for yo uand your daughter! :D :D :D :D :D
Well done :)
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thank you all so much....I can't believe I made it across the river. I want to jump for joy, sing some happy songs and look forward to becoming a new person like I have never known. WOW !!!!!!!!!!
(Mum) I will respond in a short time.
Today we're making a decision to have this little girl stay here until after school is out for the next 12 weeks.
As we are talking about what she has been going through D, is telling her how other than the recent deal about the e-mail invasion, how we get along so well. We don't walk around with wounded feelings.
We say what needs to be said then it's forgotten, never stay mad for long.
She spoke of her father and his over reactions about everything. Her friend's Gpa reminded D of her father, it's been the first time I have heard her speak about some of her thoughts about him. She wanted her friend to know we could so relate to the verbal abuse and over reactions. They talked about how D, said she was not shocked and knew just how she felt she knew her story all to well.
We are all trying to heal and we would want her to feel safe with us . Her friend so far has been a healing for D,like a little sister its so sweet.
Today Ex wrote a letter to D, telling her when she is 18 she can be with him, he gives her the exact date and time. He also reminds me I can not sensor her mail, that the final judgement has the recommendation removed. (I did not show her the letter). I now have full leagal custody and at this time we are both in need of healing not more salt in our wounds.
Its late, up early in the AM
Will respond more later OR