Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: jondo on March 26, 2005, 02:26:32 PM
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That first thread was getting pretty long.
I just received a call from my N mom's sister who is equally N however lacks the rage and aggression of my mother. Like my mom, this aunt has been seeking to understand her problems (58yrs), by going to psychic's. There has to be silver bullet to this problem that other people seem to have, with us - they think. None of my mom's children, including me, talk to her and live in fear of her half-way across the country. In that regard, she defends her position and makes sure we know how good everything is in her life via a promotional campaign through my aunt who promotes her cause.
Her report today was this:
"Your mother has seen the best psychic and he's told her that she carries no more karmic debt - that she has paid and is free".
Also that, all the psychic could see around her was the "glowing white light of truth and peace"
It's important to note here that she is a lifelong liar and denyer who has destroyed everybody around her. She has never admitted anything. Can you imagine, not having a relationship with any of your kids and still trying to "win" this debate?
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"The best psychic"! That's even better than someone's mother saying they went to "the best therapist in the country."
Well, with evidence like that I don't know how you could even argue. Clearly your mother is of godlike proportions.
I've mentioned this before, but I keep being reminded of one of my mom's most galling comments-- right after I told her about a lot of terrible things in my childhood, including many she knew about and some she didn't but should have guessed, and trying to get her in general to talk about the horror show that was my upbringing, she told me that she "was perfectly happy in [her] life." This is right after hearing about horrific things that happened to me on her watch. So I guess having children who feel utterly alienated doesn't figure into her happiness. Good to know.
And now we know that you can be terrible and have fantastic karma! Super.
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all the psychic could see around her was the "glowing white light of truth and peace" ...
... which was escaping from her into the ether, in the knowlege that she had no use whatever for it. :lol:
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The psychic story is a good one, now I am really convinced they only tell you what you want to hear.
I remember when I left my ex, he was in such disbelief that I would leave such a perfect man that he wanted an explanation why I decided to leave. I started rambling off issues and situations and the many awful things he did. Then just as I was getting warmed up, he interupted me and said, "Stop, I don't want to hear anymore about what I did to you, what about what YOU did to me." What he brought up about me, was lame and fabricated. Then I realized, what was the point of even discussing anything with him. He would never learn from his mistakes because HE didn't make any and refuses to hear about it.
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all the psychic could see around her was the "glowing white light of truth and peace" ...
... which was escaping from her into the ether, in the knowlege that she had no use whatever for it. :lol:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Here is one for the medical books. My H has no responsibilty for the horrible things he says to me, its the damaged brain cells, fault now.
Quote:
Remember when Gary Busey was in the motercycle accident & they said his personality changed after his brain injury ?
When I had my MRI there are numerous places where my brain cells are dead.
I guess from MS or no blood flow
But when I say
Water under the bridge
No hard feelings
I mean it
Those brain cells are gone
Literally gone
As in “numerous white brain matter 7mm posterior, inferior frontal lobe
Small vessel ischemia processes, multiple sclerosis"
So I really mean it
I loved this one, this only works when someone else lies not him.
My H said:
Quote:
I feel when you lie to someone
You have no respect for them
If you have no respect
You can't love 'em
OR
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A friend came to visit briefly yesterday, and brought an Easter egg for my daughter. She told me that her ex is going blind, and that it is probably a curse, because of the way he has treated her. Also, her youngest (4) is self harming (hitting himself hard around the face, banging his head on the ground or walls, calling himself names like evil and Satan :shock: etc), but only when she is around. He is fine with everyone else. She has considered counselling for him, but fears that the counsellor could do him a lot of harm. :shock:
No prizes for guessing she is N. Through and through.
Which made me realise how many of my closest 'friends' are Ns. Very scarey. Very sad about the child too. :(
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Then just as I was getting warmed up, he interupted me and said, "Stop, I don't want to hear anymore about what I did to you, what about what YOU did to me." What he brought up about me, was lame and fabricated. quote]
Hey, I think I just broke up with this guy last week! When I reminded him of his err of ways he diminished them with "I did so much for you! Of all the girls I dated I did the most for you!"
Then he brought up crap I did last year. One instance. I got pissed at him for leaving me for his ex last year, kicked him out of my house and chucked a soup can at his head and told him to get out.
(He wasn't hurt in any way). I guess he was traumatized. I wonder if he still eats Campbell's soup??
I feel for you. It's amazing the crap they dredge up about your mistakes, and what they do is "nothing". Always blamesless, and never wrong. And I'm the type of person who has no trouble admitting I'm wrong. Boy, we were a bad couple. He's always right, I'm always wrong.
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Heres another great quote from my H. I was asking him to stop with the lies to his family, who he never would let me talk to, now I know why.
Say anything to keep from talking about the truth about himself.
Horrible lies about me would keep the focus off his behavior.
don't know what your talking about
look yesterday is gone
I've never said anything i haven't believed is true
so i won't say I'm sorry for what i believe
you & i know the truth
when people have a difference of opinion
the judge says"somewhere in the middle is the truth
It's never one person is totally right
so lets just move forward
OR
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Heres another great quote from my H. I was asking him to stop with the lies to his family, who he never would let me talk to, now I know why.
Aha! This just struck me! My ex never wanted me to be talk to his sister, hang out "alone" with her, and was totally mad when she asked me to babysit once. It was almost like he was petrified we might talk about him when alone. And she's a very very open person and probably would have.
Hmmmm. And last week I spilled the beans about him to his SIL and now me and him are done for good. I made his fears come true I guess. I finally told on him and his behavior. And he's tellling them I'm a liar and made it all up. And they defend HIM. Just wait till he really hurts a girl some day physically. Then they'll know I didn't lie.
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Heres another great quote from my H. I was asking him to stop with the lies to his family, who he never would let me talk to, now I know why.
Aha! This just struck me! My ex never wanted me to be talk to his sister, hang out "alone" with her, and was totally mad when she asked me to babysit once. It was almost like he was petrified we might talk about him when alone. And she's a very very open person and probably would have.
Hmmmm. And last week I spilled the beans about him to his SIL and now me and him are done for good. I made his fears come true I guess. I finally told on him and his behavior. And he's tellling them I'm a liar and made it all up. And they defend HIM. Just wait till he really hurts a girl some day physically. Then they'll know I didn't lie.
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Geez, between my mom, bro and XH I've heard so many, it's hard to pick just one.... this does come to mind, from my mom, when she quit therapy:
" I am done with therapy becase everything about me has now been analysed and understood. Most people have some neurosis or minor problem but I am completely cured of everything, I am now perfect."\
After this proclamation, she went on to 6 more failed marriages but she told each guy that it was his fault since Dr X had told her that she is healthy in every way.
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All of these posts of ex's listing all the things they "did for you" upon being finally confronted about their N behavior really reminds me of my parents. It was a hilarious (in retrospect) exchange but I can't really make it short enough to be a quip. I can sort of quote from it, though. It went something like this:
Me: You put me in a situation in which I was sexually abused, often kicked me out of the house for no reason, tried to get me fired from a job, and took money from me when I was very young. Also, there was a little too much slapping for no reason. So, I'm angry with you about my childhood. Can we talk about it?
Them: But we did a lot for you! Let us list everything now in a 10-page e-mail (and never address any of the things you actually said).
It was pretty weird. I guess in their mind there is some sort of a balance sheet? And what do they think balances out the awful stuff they did? It's almost like a count-- one ride to school equals one slap across the face. Cancels it out. I mean.....? So weird. I don't get it.
Anyone have a clue what in the heck they are thinking when they say this stuff?
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I'm afraid to post this because it came from my husband and I don't want to think he's N - but it did happen a LONG time ago, and he's gotten a lot better:
We were arguing about something, I thought it was a reasonable debate, and all of a sudden he lashes out nastily against my last statement with:
"Well in MY world where the sky is blue and the grass is green...."
Wow, is that ever INVALIDATING!!
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my father after using my cycle to go to work on. it was stolen.
I said "but what about my bike"
"Well you weren't using it were you?" he replied.
or if he had drank any beers I had in the fridge. i repeatedly told him not too.
"I'll get you them back" he said with complete anger for me raising the subject.
I told my mother I was bankrupt.
"right, well I'll have to go off and worry about that now" she looked almost pleased she had something so good to worry about.
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I phoned my ex,feeling very low because I had spent the day arranging my father's funeral.
He said,'Yes,I'm fed up too, I've had a really busy day at work.'
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My MIL on hearing that my father had liver cancer.
"Oh, when you come over for the funeral I'll arrange a family reunion!!"
My XNH on seeing my newly pierced ears with earrings.
"You didn't ask me."
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All of these posts of ex's listing all the things they "did for you" upon being finally confronted about their N behavior really reminds me of my parents.....
I guess in their mind there is some sort of a balance sheet? And what do they think balances out the awful stuff they did? It's almost like a count-- one ride to school equals one slap across the face. Cancels it out. I mean.....? So weird. I don't get it.
Anyone have a clue what in the heck they are thinking when they say this stuff?
Vunil, that is the BIGGEST mystery to me. My parents attempted to minimize any of the abuse they inflicted upon me by either trotting-out their parental "score card"(if I were to take their behavior as gospel, I guess I should assume that paying for a child's braces means that you have the right to treat the child however the hell you see fit) or I would get the "you don't appreciate how good you have it, because when I was a kid, MY parents...(insert really horrific stories of abuse here)."
I guess that in their mind a certain moral relativism exists re: how they parented me(their abuse of me was not nearly the scope and severity of the abuse that they suffered as children, so they must be doing OK...or actually, because they did not inflict upon me the exact same cruel behaviors that their folks inflicted upon them, my parents don't have to contemplate that maybe they were abusive toward me?)
What I really love is my mother's modus operandi. When confronted with the possibility that she is not quite the uber-Mom that she wants to think that she is, not only does she brandish the parental score card("I changed your dirty diapers/cleaned-up your vomit," etc.), she goes one step further and launches into her soliloquy of "Here is Everything that You Ever Did Wrong Over the Course of Your Lifetime." Now, we're not talking about felonious or destructive behavior, as I was too afraid of my folks to ever get out of line---it is more along the lines of stupid stuff that I said or did as a KID, or instances where I didn't behave exactly as she had wanted me to(like not having danced a jig after being ordered to ride my bike to the store in a monsoon to buy milk for her because she didn't drive)...
That is her favorite line of defense---she trots-out all kinds of dumb crap that I did as a youngster, because it happened in the past and it can't be changed. But, excuse me, I was seven years old! I was behaving like a kid, because I WAS one! Do any of you have parents who placed unrealistic expectations of conduct upon you while growing up(i.e., you were only seven yet they expected you to possess the thought processes and self-possession of a fully mature adult)?
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or if he had drank any beers I had in the fridge. i repeatedly told him not too.
"I'll get you them back" he said with complete anger for me raising the subject.
This reminded me of a 'conversation' with my mum. She had been on a long car journey with my young daughter, and had not been able to wait for a cigarette, so had smoked in the car. When my daughter then opened a window for fresh air, my mum told her off, because it was cold outside, and made her shut the window. Mum had her window open, but as anyone would know, that just blew the smoke into the car. :evil: :evil:
So, lots to 'discuss' there. I spoke to mum about it, and, not allowing my anger to show, only said, 'I understand you smoked a cigarette in the car with C?'
Her reply was to say, in a very angry, very victimised tone, 'It only happened once' (which is not true; C said she did it several times on the journey). Then I said that was not the point, so she changed to saying; 'Well, it will never happen again!!!!!' Then she closed down completely. Nothing more to say. And she truly looked like a martyr. Sorry? Not a bit of it. Only sorry to be caught.
No admission of fault. No validation of our point of view. Just her assuming a victim status and enjoying it. However, having learned to take whatever is going, I said, 'Good, I am glad to hear that.' And let it drop.
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Do any of you have parents who placed unrealistic expectations of conduct upon you while growing up(i.e., you were only seven yet they expected you to possess the thought processes and self-possession of a fully mature adult)?
Yes. All the time. We were never told that anything didn't matter, because we were too young. Everything we did wrong mattered. :oops:
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(Do any of you have parents who placed unrealistic expectations of conduct upon you while growing up)
I think this is how most N parents raise their children. We never had a childhood - period. We were expected to be adults at birth - they didn't have the history therefore ability to nuture children. We were taught nothing and then critisizes for what we didn't know. That is the basis for felling "useless" and "stupid" that alot of us suffer from even as adults. The frustration remains in adulthood for us because we want/need them to acknowledge their fault in this rather than take the position in our current lives that "something was wrong with us" That is the source of my anger anyway. I just can't continue to live their lies.
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PQC!
I stopped copying parts of your message to quote, and gave up because it was all of it.
We have the exact same mother. For instance, when told that I thought it was a little odd for them to have taken my money in my childhood, she said (and I quote) "well, we *had* to charge you for your behavior! It was the only way to teach you!"
I remember this throughout my childhood. I would be looking for my shoes or coat or whatever and they would tell me that they didn't know where they were and I'd be panicked I'd miss the schoolbus and at the last minute they would reveal that they had taken my clothes and I would have to pay (x amount-- magically what I happened to have from my allowance or babysitting) to get them back. This was from age 6 on.
And your mention of braces cracked me up. My mother mentions having paid for our braces with great regularity (even though it was 30 years ago). She seems to still be thinking about what else she could have done with that money...
Man. It's good to remember this stuff, and also painful. Because I have to really recognize how lost they are.
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oops I left out of the previous post that my "sin" was leaving my coat/shoes/whatever somewhere they didn't belong. I often put my shoes under the TV, which I guess is the same as murdering someone. A six year old should never do something so terrible!
Talk about unrealistic expectations...
Now I leave my shoes all over the damn house 8)
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Do any of you have parents who placed unrealistic expectations of conduct upon you while growing up(i.e., you were only seven yet they expected you to possess the thought processes and self-possession of a fully mature adult)?
Oh, yes, all the time. And be scorned and ridiculed and told off, if I couldn't do it. The funny thing is though... Now she is completely the opposite! Now that I am grown up, she expects me to be completely helpless and treats me like a little kid instead! What is going on in her head? Does she think I am like Merlin and was born old and become younger every year? :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Do any of you have parents who placed unrealistic expectations of conduct upon you while growing up(i.e., you were only seven yet they expected you to possess the thought processes and self-possession of a fully mature adult)?
Oh, yes, all the time. And be scorned and ridiculed and told off, if I couldn't do it. The funny thing is though... Now she is completely the opposite! Now that I am grown up, she expects me to be completely helpless and treats me like a little kid instead! What is going on in her head? Does she think I am like Merlin and was born old and become younger every year? :roll: :roll: :roll:
No, dear, it's about control. The way to control you is to always impose totally unrealistic expectations. When you're a child, you will be expected to act like an adult. When you're an adult, you will be treated as though you are a child. This always allows the N to maintain a posture of superiority.
They are jerks, by God, but at least once you have the playbook, they all seem to follow it. You just have to make sure you're reading the right chapter for their particular pathology...
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They are jerks, by God, but at least once you have the playbook, they all seem to follow it. You just have to make sure you're reading the right chapter for their particular pathology...
It does help me a lot to have a label, books to read, other people's (very similar!) experiences to read. In a way that feels lucky.
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One of the many not so endearing things my second (ex) husband would do was to put one of my children's backpacks (or any belongings) in the other child's room if he found it in a place he didn't like. The kids would be late for school, performances, rehearsals, frantically looking for things and he wouldn't fess up. this is even after I had put things in the aleged 'wrong' place (like by the door, to save time.
The kids would go looking, never think to look in the other's room, and upon final discovery, the sadistic moron would grin and say: "see, they'll never do that again!"
Think again pal, you'll never do that again....(I divorced him).
My children's father, another enormous N, has soo many examples of these unrealistic and ridiculous expectations of his children, that they will both be able to write books, hopefully citing thier mother's saving them by divorcing the cruel idiot.
I am appalled to say the least, at the abuse so many of you endured at the hands of those who were entrusted to be your "protectors" and those who were supposed to love you "most of all". But I am amazed and in admiration of your ability to get beyond this trouble and carve happiness out of this life instead.
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I am not sure if this will sound bad to other people or not, but twice when I was growing up I went away from home - once to camp and once to University - and returned home to find that my bedroom had completely changed, without my knowing it would happen.
The first time there was a set of new furniture, which I was supposed to be delighted with, and I think I was in part, but I also felt very confused, and that part was not allowed to show. That was 'ungrateful.'
The second time my dad was working on an extension to the house, and knocked down a wall in my room. In the process water got in and ruined my wardrobe (which nobody bothered to move first), and many of my books. Again, there was no chance - and no words - to complain or say, why did this happen in this way? I was expected to smile and be grateful.
Now that I understand more about boundaries I can see why this was unsettling. At the time it just made me very unhappy, with no words to explain why.
Forgot to say, my Nmum calls these things 'surprises'. She loves surprises, because to her they are a power game. I hate surprises. :lol:
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Wow, Mum, isn't that weird? Your husband and my parents did the exact same thing. Except I think my parents are especially fancy to have thrown a monetary twist into it, don't you? They got to be sadistic AND be paid for it.
I am glad you sent that guy packing.
And, October, you poor thing. Not only being violated like that but then being asked to smile and like it. Man.
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mum, your ExH behavior reminds me of my wife's. When I left something anywhere in the house without her prior "permission." She would move it somewhere else in the house without asking or even telling me where. Then she was angry because my stuff was somewhere where it "didn't belong," because she moved it there. If there was ever reasoning about where she decided put things, I never figured it out. Things might end up in the garage or the kitchen or the closet, who knew? Every attempt on my part to find a compromise solution where I could act like I lived in the house failed. I used to think it was just about claiming the house as her sole domain. Now, I see the control and the manipulation, because I had to go to her to find what I was looking for and ask her to tell me what she did with it. Yeeuucchh!
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What a sorry excuse for humans/parents these people are,huh?
October, you brought up a funny memory for me: one day I came home from high school, and my mother was so excited. She had bought me a new dresser and it was already in my room. I had a crappy one before, so she thought I would be so pleased. I wasn't. But my mom was not a mean N or anything, and I didn't tell her how I felt completely, because she was crestfallen at my lackluster reaction. After 10 minutes of processing how I felt, though, I was thrilled and told her so.
But now, as a parent and educator, I know exactly why I felt the way I did. Kids want a voice. In anything that affects them, they want a say. Even if it's to also get excited about a new thing, or even if it's to argue and dialogue about something that affects them. We all just want to be heard.
If my mom had said, I found a great new dresser for you, what do you think? I would have had such a different reaction, because I was involved or heard. JEEEESH, and I had a pretty "normal" (whatever that it) parent situation.
I like to surprise my own children with things, but they are comfortable enough with me to say, "thanks, mom, but I'd rather have something else" and then we change it (or sometimes, they just want to say that, and change thier minds and love it). It's all about being heard.
My kids have NO say at all at thier dad's house, none. I predict they will have a say about seeing him at all as adults, though.
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I am not sure if this will sound bad to other people or not, but twice when I was growing up I went away from home - once to camp and once to University - and returned home to find that my bedroom had completely changed, without my knowing it would happen.
Oh, yes October, it sounds bad and it sounds familiar. My mother actually asked me if I wanted her to repaint my dresser, and I said no. (I wasn't living at home but my dresser was there, since I lived abroad) A few months later she asked my sister if she thought it was a good idea to paint it as a "surprise" to me, and my sister said no. Guess what my mother did?
I also remember being maybe ten and hiding under the stairs crying because my mother was throwing my bed out. She had bought my sister a new one, and I was getting my sister's. She ignored my crying and pleading that I wanted to keep my bed (there was nothing wrong with it), she just kept telling me that my sister's bed was "much better" (i.e., it had cost more money).
mum, you are so right that it is about being voiceless, I think it is also about controlling and at the same time looking good. "I am so nice and do this for you, and you don't even appreciate it." Makes them feel good since they can play the martyr. I remember my mother actually LAUGHING at my tears at times like this, as if my feelings were completely ridiculous and incomprehensible. :x :x :x
Sorry for venting, this just brought up so much stuff from deep down.
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My Nmom had a field day with this stuff. She'd promise me something in private, then make a big display of giving that same thing to my Nsibling - and not me - and making sure I did NOT get one of whatever it was - in front of others (so I'd look like a whiny brat if I protested). She especially loved to do this in front of Edad, who would then lecture ME about MY attitude, totally ignoring my assertion that Nmom had promised me the item in question. Nine times out of ten, my Nsib hadn't even asked for it, but since Nmom really enjoyed doing this to me, Nsib participated with gusto.
When I learned to stop asking for things, Nmom escalated to throwing my stuff out while I was out of the house. While I was in college, living on campus, my Nsib sold a bunch of my records (music, vinyl, pre-CD) to get money for drugs, but left the sleeves so it wouldn't be detected. My uselesss parents expected me to just put up with this.... and never once compelled Nbrat to replace anything of mine that Nbrat damaged or destroyed. We were poor, I made maybe $100.00 a month doing janitorial work on weekends, there was no way I could afford to replace what the brat had stolen. My parents couldn't have cared less.
Vicious, evil, inexcusable. And you can well imagine the slanderous outrage when I finally reached the limit of my tolerance, and much too late, wrote Nmom and Nsib off.
I then discovered that they'd been slandering me for decades! I'd done things for Nmom that Nbrat never would have done in a million years, such as replacing her refrigerator when the old one broke down the same day that her father died, and she didn't have enough money to both attend his funeral and replace the appliance. As you can imagine, nobody was ever told about any of the things I did for her. She either said nothing, took credit for the things herself, or claimed that Nbrat had done them instead of me.
Grrrrrrrrr :evil: :evil: :evil:
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That last post reminded me of my books and dolls. While I was at University my mum gave all my childhood books and dolls to one of my young cousins, without me knowing about it. I only found out one day on a visit to her house, when I found my books on her bookshelf. :?
Another thing that happened to me much later in life relates to my daughter. This is quite a difficult one. I may have mentioned it before, so apologies for repetition. When my marriage was in the process of falling to pieces, and life was very difficult for me, my daughter was still quite small, and it was coming up to her birthday. Mum showed me a picture in a catalogue of a seesaw for the garden. I asked her not to buy it, and explained that you need two children for a seesaw, and that seeing it would remind me of the children I had never had, because my marriage was in pieces. There would never be a sibling for my daughter, even though both she and I would love there to be one.
I suggested a train set instead, and my mum did her usual silent response to dissent, which means that she is not going to disagree, but she is never in a million years going to give in.
On the day of the birthday there was a family party, and a big box turned up in the garden, and my daughter was taken to open it. I was also asked to go, but refused, because I knew what was in that box. I refused to even look at it. Mum said my daughter could keep it at her house, if I wanted, but I said no. She also said she could play with her friends and cousins on it, but that is not the point. An only child cannot enjoy a seesaw like a child with siblings. Is this too difficult to understand??
I said that if it belonged to her, then it would stay at our house. But I have always hated that seesaw as a symbol of my mum's utter lack of regard for me and my feelings, and determination to do what the hell she likes, no matter who she tramples in the process.
Sorry. Ranting myself now. :oops: :oops: :oops:
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October, I can't believe that seasaw story. I could just picture myself marching over to my mother and saying TAKE THAT THING BACK RIGHT NOW!. I am sure I wouldn't have the nerve to do it, but boy did that story make me want to yell at someone :evil:
This is weird-- almost all of the stories remind me of my grandmother's treatment of my mother. She was all the time giving away her stuff. She did it to me once, actually, when I was a teenager and I left a pair of pants in the dryer at her place and two days later (before I realized they were missing) she gave them to a charity that sent them to China! Evidently this kind of thing went on in my mom's childhood all of the time.
So I guess my mother comes by her N tendencies naturally... It's amazing the legacy these nutjobs leave.
I wish my mom would process what all of that did to her. I wish it so much I might start a thread about it...
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October, I can't believe that seasaw story. I could just picture myself marching over to my mother and saying TAKE THAT THING BACK RIGHT NOW!. I am sure I wouldn't have the nerve to do it, but boy did that story make me want to yell at someone :evil:
That is what Ns do. Even third hand, like this, they can stir up emotions in us. :oops: :oops: Sorry, Vunil, I was not trying to make you feel bad about this. But thank you for understanding. There are tears somewhere wanting to fall over this kind of thing. :cry:
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my ex, when I was having a dissoaciated panic attack and could hardly walk " well I would thank you for heelping me move my bed, but you didn't"
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Had to share this one.
My daughter told me last night that during her last visit with Dad he told her that he was going to be super rich from an invention he made. (I can remember the "invention talk" dating back 10 years). He goes on to tell her that he will be putting the $$ in a trust for her and her brother. My daughter asked if she could buy a shore house with the $$. He told her yes but made her promise that ONLY her and her brother would use it. He said, no Mommy, no StepDad no Grandma, no Uncles, no Aunts, etc.
My daughter told me this is why i hate Dad. He is so mean. I became very alarmed when she said, "I wish he were dead".
He must be feeling insecure about something b/c I notice that is when he'll start with his grandiose ideas.
Mia
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My daughter told me this is why i hate Dad. He is so mean. I became very alarmed when she said, "I wish he were dead".
Mia
My daughter says this sometimes, and it is a difficult one to deal with. I usually support the feelings, by saying, I can understand why you might feel that way. And then I make sure she understands that wishing it doesn't make it happen. Sometimes kids blame themselves if they wish someone dead and then they die. I tell my daughter this, and say that feelings are important to us, but they don't make bad things happen.
((((Mia))))
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Hello Stormchild Guesting
I can relate to you buying the fridge. I paid off a lounge suite for my parents, then later on my own bedroom suite , and then later on a china cabinet full of stuff....came home one day and the lot was sold by N mother.
Zeene
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Hi Zeene
I'm so sorry you had to go through that too. I'm sorry any of us had to go through it. How they take and take, and demand and demand, and never ever thank or give.
(((((Zeene)))))
It sounds as though you are getting free, though, at last, and I am very glad for you.
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I'm sorry if I haven't read all the posts on this thread before posting mine. I feel like I'm jumping in abruptly, but the title of the thread is appropriate for my post.
Well, today, my mother said a very narcissistic comment to me. What she said makes me wonder if I will cry at her funeral :roll:
She wanted me to go with her to the bank tomorrow to have some paperwork signed. I told her I can't go with her b/c I have to attend a class tomorrow all day. Her snide remark to me was, "I have seven kids, and yet I have to depend on outsiders to do things for me." Her words were full of selfishness. Mind you, just five minutes before she made her comment, I went out in the rain to buy her medicine, and just that afternoon my brother took her to the hospital for four hours for a surgical procedure. Yet, she doesn't see the goodness in her own kids nor does she truly value us. What a shame. What a damn shame. I was so angry and full of hurt. The worst part is that she will never understand or unconditionally value or appreciate her own kids. I don't want anything from her except her sense of pride for me. I know that won't ever happen. :x Well, life just goes on.
Butterfly
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Dear Butterfly,
I'm sorry about your mother's comment;it truly does sound selfish and self-pitying. And you are right, these people seem unable to see all the things that other people do for them out of kindness. There is no awareness, no acknowledgment and no gratitude. I'm sorry Butterfly.
Sincerely,
Lara.
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Thanks so much (((Lara))) :!: :!: :!:
It means a whole lot to me.
Butterfly
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I wonder if your mother will keep saying things like this if they stop working? It just seems so obviously manipulative-- like she expected you to not go to your class because of her comment.
I agree-- it's pretty narcissistic! Like what you are doing is not even worth noticing or respecting.
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Yeah, it hurts deeply to realize since you were young that your mother's parenting ideology is that she believes her kids are suppose to revolve around her needs and wants, and not the other way around. I guess that is the essence of an N, isn't it?
Unfortunately, she will not change her core beliefs of a parent-child dynamics. She cannot see it any other way. I've tried to reason with her and tried to help her understand how I felt about it, but it didn't hold water with her.
:cry: :cry: :cry:
Butterfly
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Butterfly,
I'm so sorry to hear about your situation with your mother. If there's any consolation, perhaps the cycle of N can end with her.
Take care.
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OK, here's a REAL doozie.
Someone.... I...... WORK...... with.....
emailed several colleagues the link to a news story about someone who was recently arrested and charged with offering material assistance to potential terrorists.
the title of this person's email was something along the lines of "Gee, Look How I Affected This Person".
and the text, besides the link, was something like "I was this guy's TA once. Look what an unfortunate influence I had on him."
I've changed the words a lot, but the meaning is as close as I can get to what was sent. Obviously it was intended as a joke... ugh.
Ye Gods. And. Little. Fishes.
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When my H broke both of his legs in a work related accident we ended up living in our bus in the middle of its conversion into a motorhome. We had married 3 months before and he was the sole bread winner. I had to stay at home to take care of him because he needed 24 hour care. He also had a son living with us. The cost for child care and a nurse would have more than taxed any money I made. My choice was to stay at home.
I told my mother about my situation. Her reply, "You made your bed. Now sleep in it!" She was livid.
I later confronted her. She lied to me saying she never would say something like that to me in that kind of situation. Conclusion, I must be the liar.
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Itex:
That was so mean!! I'm so sorry for the hurt that must have caused you. How sad and maddening!
And then....ofcourse....to lie later and say it was never said.
Typical N behaviour.
You managed on your own so good for you! I bet it wasn't easy but if she had of come to "help", I bet she would have just agrivated the situation and made things worse.
I guess in that sense, you can be glad she didn't.
Still doesn't erase the pain of her words though. So sorry for that Itex. :(
Sela
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Hi guys and gals! Man, I bet this thread will generate some doozies!! I have a few- from my ex n partner and my N mother. My father had a heart attack at home and collapsed on the basement floor. He weakly called my mother- who was nattering on about things he " hadn't done" and had no idea what happened. She must have stopped to take a breath! and heard my dad weakly calling out. He told her he was having a heart attack. she promptly got very annoyed- this was cutting into her day and plans of course!. Instead of calling ambulance, she phoned family GP and had a long pleasant social chat with the receptionist whom she knew for years. When finally asked why she was calling, she said" Oh for God's sake, K. thinks he's having a heart attack and that's just great considering my bridge group starts in 20 minutes". The receptionist couldn't get her to hang up so she ended up calling 911. When ambulance arrived, mom wouldn't answer the door because she didn't have her make up on!!!Miraculously, my father survived!! Another example- my ex N partner used to regualrly call my shrink everytime I confronted- oops (" accused" him wrongly...of course!!) about his lies. He'd leave messages for my shrink saying" I'm really worried about Moira...she's not well. she's psychotic and delusional..she's always accusing me of things I'm clearly not doing and even when I " prove" to her she's wrong, she lies...she's not sleeping and has lost alot of weight...I think she's punishing me for her perception I'm screwing up...she needs to be in hospital"...Hilarious!!! He also recently- kicked him out a month ago- left me a message calling me a lying cruel bitch and in the next breath, all Mr Nice Guy...he was telling me " he really loved me...I'M not angry because of YOUR behaviour.. and by the way, I just won 2 free tickets to Sarah McLaughlin, so I'll be by at 7 to pick you up". Sorry for being long winded- one final example from my N sister and her N daughter. When my dad died, I went home for funeral. During the wake, my N neice sailed in, grabbed my hand to inspect my engagement ring, commented on how "small the stone is", and said she had no intention of staying for the service " because I don't do funerals and besides I haven't had a weekend alone with my boyfriend in months so we're off to the cottage...oh, do you think I can live in Gramps' house now that he's dead and have his car?". Of course her N mother thought all this was perfectly reasonable and started telling people why her daughter couldn't possibly come to service and it wasn't until everyone looked at her like she was an alien and gave her shit that she stopped telling people. She didn't have a clue of course why people would react with disgust to this, she merely learned not to tell anyone else. She said to me several times she was totally baffled why these people weren't " understanding and respectful about her poor daughter's wishes and her need to see her boyfriend...poor kids"!!! I look forward to others' comments and stories- there's always black humour galore in these stories- for those of us who have N experience. When I first was old enough to start sharing some of my N family's stories with " normal" people, I was shocked to learn that the rest of the world didn't operate that way and for the longest time I was confused at people's shocked reactions.
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My ex H N wrote a letter to our 12 yr old and a song he said was about us.
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My ex H N wrote a letter to our 12 yr old and a song he said was about us.
I think he is out of line to send her this note.
" I know I'm being used It's ok cause I like the abuse, I know she's playing with me
thats ok cause I got no selfesteam.
The letter tells her he would have stayed with me forever to be with her but
I left him when he could have died from the recovery of his surgery.
I see he is going to biofeed back, I wonder if the doctors are making him get off the Morphine.
OR
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I told my mother about my situation. Her reply, "You made your bed. Now sleep in it!" She was livid.
I later confronted her. She lied to me saying she never would say something like that to me in that kind of situation. Conclusion, I must be the liar.
My mother also convieniently forgets irrational and damaging things she's said. She also loves to accuse other people of rewriting history. My belief in my own perception of reality as a child was often questioned or attacked. And the kicker is, her mother was a violent and sexually abusive N, so if I dared contradict my nmom, she would accuse me of either being deluded, or (the ultimate) actually accusing her of being like her mother to hurt her.
It's nice to be old enough to make up my own mind about my memories and perceptions. :)