Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: write on April 09, 2005, 01:14:08 AM
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I still feel uncomfortable that I was hurtful yesterday, but I know now that it was necessary FOR ME and that my happiness is as important as anyone elses.
Also that if these people had treated me with anything like kindness I would not have retaliated.
Maybe this is a good thing: I certainly don't intend to be ill-treated or abused by someone more than once again.
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Write, I am happy to hear from you tonight and that your post title is "starting over". You were not trying to be hurtful, but you were simply saying NO and setting your limits. This is progress. I am glad you are here.
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Write, I used to get myself all tied up in knots trying to make sure I was being nice enough to all the people who were hurting me. I knew they were hurting me but I felt that I somehow had to live up to my own standards. Then I was reading a book by Melody Beattie and I found the following quote:
"You cannot simultaneously set a boundary AND take care of the other person's feelings."
Thinking we can do this and are obligated to consider them - when they have no such obligation to us and we know it! - is is an N trap, to keep us docile and available for abuse. They train us well.
I think it's in Beyond Codependency.
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I felt that I somehow had to live up to my own standards.
I know that: I thought I should be like some kind of earth mother and be impossibly kind to everyone- and especially if someone is cruel or thoughtless.
The anxiety I have is tremendous now that I have decided not to be that person, I feel like I am somehow less of a person.
But I couldn't go on as I was, inviting people into my life who trample my emotions.
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Write,
You are in no way less than a person. You are standing up for yourself and showing yourself the respect that YOU DESERVE.
I think you have grown tremendously by doing this and in my eyes I see you as strong and courageous. You are indeed a better person for it.
So glad to see that you are keeping us updated.
((((Write))))
Mia
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write:
I am also of the "people pleaser" crowd. It caused me a great deal of anxiety to set limits and to say no. I came to realize that I was never as a child given any choices, that I always had to please no matter what. Anything else would have caused swift retribution for even a minor infraction. So I guess it followed that I also would do ANYTHING to avoid conflict and anger. Accepting someone elses anger is part of life. There is no way you are going to please everyone 100% of the time.
It still causes anxiety when I have to say no. So I relate. You cannot continue to give up "who you are" for the sake of pleasing someone else.
I also hooked up with N's that used that "people pleasing" to their supreme advantage. It is good that you are feeling anxiety. This is not because I want you to feel anxiety it is because you are headed in another direction which is scary and causes anxiety. To remain where you are even though it would require no progress, would mean giving up on yourself and your own desires. So in this respect your anxiety is good.
I am just glad you are still posting here. Please continue to come here because there is saftey and understanding. Many people have made tremendous progress just by posting here. There are many people here who care about you and want to see that progress in you.
So please use this sanctuary as a place where there is acceptance and love.
Keep on keeping on.
Patz
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a really strong capable person! If you saw me in my life you wouldn't recognise this victim in me.
I spent a little time with my father recently and every time he said a put-down I said the word put-down. Made for rather stilted conversation, but for once I came away not feeling bad!
I guess I'd made my mind up that the next insensitive or callous thing this man did I would end the relationship- but I wasn't expecting the beautiful love poem which arrived, which he casually told me after he'd written it for someone else! Yes, he deserved my response, though of course I have this ambivalence, wish I'd not said anything etc
Guess you all know what I mean.
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I spent a little time with my father recently and every time he said a put-down I said the word put-down. Made for rather stilted conversation, but for once I came away not feeling bad!
:lol:
I love that. You are really funny (and strong).
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is so important in keeping ourselves, isn't it.
And so often I've been praised for my wit, and thought ' tears of a clown'...
I'm getting through the morning, but not in the most positive way. I'm going to talk to the psychiatrist and therapist about drugs/ behavioural approaches to obsessive thoughts: they really do lead to a spiral.
But I'm also proud that this is a terrible illness to manage and I'm still here and not out of control. It doesn't feel like it but I know instinctively that it's a step forward.
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Hey, write --
you said something about rapid cycling on a different thread; be sure you remind your docs about anything else you may be taking, herbals included.
I have a rapid cycling friend, a dear kind creative person, who had to switch GP doctors after moving, and the new doc prescribed a fluoroquinoline antibiotic to her for something. TOTALLY messed my friend up - she's OK now, but one single dose caused a major brain fog and it took awhile to go away.
So do make sure they're reminded of whatever you're taking, and ask about interactions on anything new they give you?
Sorry about nannying you. When you're in the thick of it, these things can fall through the cracks, afterwards you'll say, oh yeah, of course. And docs don't exactly invite you to sit down and take your time with them....
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Write,
But I'm also proud that this is a terrible illness to manage and I'm still here and not out of control. It doesn't feel like it but I know instinctively that it's a step forward.
You are so right!! :) Be very proud of surviving yet another day and taking those baby steps forward. Good luck with the doc today. I hope he can find some ways to help you feel better.
Brigid
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I'm getting through the morning, but not in the most positive way. I'm going to talk to the psychiatrist and therapist about drugs/ behavioural approaches to obsessive thoughts: they really do lead to a spiral.
I am prone to that, too, and I thought for awhile I might have some form of OCD. But it turned out to be caused by anxiety, caused by funny seratonin imbalance (and lack of sleep caused by it). Probably the imbalance is caused by a number of things, too, for instance a really weird childhood! who knows-- now that it's fixed I don't care the reason.
At any rate, I know exactly what you mean, with the spirals and the fog.
My experience, and yours may not be the same, is that the *same day* that I started taking the meds prescribed me, I felt a little bit of sky opening up, the fog going away. Two days after I started taking them I actually had the sensation of the sun coming out in my head, burning all of the sludgy stuff away and really helping me stay clear. It was amazing. And it helped me start to deal with the real stuff that I had avoided thinking about (e.g., crazy childhood, including abuse). So it helped healing in about 10 ways.
It took me years to go to the doctor because I thought a successful professional fabulously perfect person like me should be able to get by without medicine. Now I am pretty mad at myself for not going years ago.
Just one person's story! But I hope it is your story, too :)
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do you take Vunil?
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Write,
I agree with Vunil that meds can make a huge difference. I finally went to a psychiatrist for evaluation (on recommendation from my T) after losing 12 pounds (I didn't need to lose any to begin with), being totally unable to get food down (I existed on 2 cans of Ensure a day for 2 weeks before getting to the doctor), and barely able to function. I had been put on Wellbrutrin by my Ob/Gyn just to deal with the anxiety of marriage counselling, etc. Turns out I was allergic to it and having all kinds of awful side effects. Once I saw the Psych, she switched me to a different anti-anxiety med (Lexapro) and also put me on an anti-psychotic to bring back my appetite. It was a miracle drug and literally overnight I could start eating again and feeling so much stronger and more alert. I was only on the anti-psychotic for a few months and have been off everything for a year, but when you are in the thick of it, they can really make a difference.
Good luck.
Brigid
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I spent a little time with my father recently and every time he said a put-down I said the word put-down. Made for rather stilted conversation, but for once I came away not feeling bad!
:lol: :lol: :lol: write, I can't wait until I have your presence of mind. I would love to be clear enough while these things are going on to recognize and speak what they are!
Take care of yourself with baby steps every day. Take care of yourself even when you are not yet in a place to do it "the right way," according to your judgement. Taking care of yourself in awareness is always the right thing.
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do you take Vunil?
I think we're missing a what :)
Paxil. But there are a million solutions. It really depends on your situation. For me, it definitely was the answer. And I take a super-low dose and it still magically puts everything in order. As angry as we can all get at terrible medical people, I would like to give whoever invented paxil a hug!
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I told the psychiatrist I don't want to put anything unhealthy in my body...she said 'but you just said you drank half a bottle of vodka last night!' which was true.
But I understand that it's hard to allow strangers who don't fully understand to prescribe for us.
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But I understand that it's hard to allow strangers who don't fully understand to prescribe for us.
You'd be surprised-- she probably really does understand, and could potentially help. When I went in, finally, my doctor read me a list of symptoms, I said "I have that!", he nodded and gave me a prescription. As he was leaving, I said "But there is such a stigma against doing this! I am not sure I can." He said "Look, I spend about a third of my time prescribing these drugs or talking to people about them. They are a lifesaver, they are commonplace now, and if you hate them you can just stop taking them later. And no one but me has to know you take them." He is a nice man...
Do you feel that antidepressants are unhealthy? Where does that condemnation come from? Your unconscious seems to want to be mean to you about every little thing! It seems very picky. It wants you to stand up for yourself, then gets mad if you do. Wants you to get help, then tells you it is not healthy to do so. Mean unconscious! Maybe you should take the decision making away from him!
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write:
I can relate to the obessessive thoughts. You just go over and over things in your mind. My thoughts on what the N did made the temples on the side of my head hurt, I was obessessing so much. Looking back I probably should have had medication to help me through.
The psychiatrist is right you know..........no need to suffer when you can have Paxil or whatever to help you over the hump. This does not mean you are weak or anything else. It is somewhat like wearing glasses. You are prescribed glasses to see.......the same is true of medication. It will help with the fog of things and help you to "see" better and make good decisions. Just my 2c. Patz
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do you take Vunil?
I think we're missing a what :)
Paxil. But there are a million solutions. It really depends on your situation.
hey write! so very glad you are hanging in there.....
want to say, paxil helped me -very- very much as well. i took it for 4 years. also took remeron for two years after that.
had refused ad's for years due to fear of doctors and feeling i should be able to 'handle it myself'.... but the first day i took paxil i also felt as though something opened up in my mind for the first time really ever. it really really really helped.
after a few years i weaned off it veeeerrrry slowly - if you are sensitive its good to discontinue gradually. now i dont take any. went very well. i am totally a convert. it did get rid of 'obsessive/intrusive thoughts' which i do have when im anxious.
certain ad's didnt react well with me though, i tried maybe 5 or 6 before finding one that was right for me... so its important to monitor your reactions, and if one isnt working for you, -tell- your doctor and ask to try a different one... there are lots of them and they are all different.
so glad you are hanging in there -
d's mom
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Couldn't do the Paxil thing. The stomache upset I felt on it wasn't worth it for me. I started rock climbing instead. But whatever works (endorphines, whatever) don't even bother with the real or imagined "judgement" about it. Taking care of yourself is the bottom line.
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mum,
stomach problems was why i eventually switched from paxil to remeron.
i will say, that i had a boyfriend when i started paxil and we had a very happy physical relationship, paxil has sexual side effects that make it impossible to feel very much sexually...... but i felt so much better taking it, that i didnt even care and actually let this guy break up with me beucase i was so happy just to feel better..... thats how worth it it was.....
now that im balanced again without meds, i can manage any depression with exercise and other non-med techniques. but i needed the medicine then, and im really really glad i stuck with it..
anna
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((((Write))))
I admire your courage in calling your father on the carpet---I wish that I were as brave! : )
Re: medication, I have never taken anything stronger than Valium(I tried it once for performance anxiety, and it didn't do jack), but I took-up running and race-walking fourteen years ago(when I was at my absolute lowest point), and for me, nothing clears my head better than an hour or two outside in the elements, alone(it's my "thinking time"). I'm out there year 'round(and the place where I live is known for cold, harsh winters). I also study yoga and meditation, both of which have been very effective at calming and clearing my head when I'm going through a difficult time(like recently!).
I know that your situation right now is more pressing in nature, and I am so happy that you are consulting a professional. I guess that I was just offering other ideas for relieving some of the unfavorable physiological side-effects that accompany this kind of upset(sometimes the Nperson you're really angry with isn't there to give a piece of your mind to, and although anger is productive, you don't want to be sitting home alone seething---believe me, I have had the stomachaches, asthma flare-ups and heart palpitations to back that up!) in addition to whatever you and your doctor decide.
Keep on keeping on. : )
PQC
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to cope with this second n relationship than my marriage: I really thought I'd been more cautious and it's shocked me to pick someone who's even more abusive.
Plus all the signs were there, I just chose to ignore them...
So no more relationships for me until I work out this pattern.
Yes, it was good calling my father on his behaviour!
I felt a bit mean to burst his bubble, but it's the first time I've spent any time with him and not left feeling belittled and diminuished.