Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: October on April 25, 2005, 06:55:11 PM
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Many of you will remember that my ex was in hospital. C and I visited yesterday and found him very sleepy, incoherent, rambling, unable to feed himself or take his medication, double incontinent, jaundiced, and reporting falls and hallucinations. You name it, really. We took him some sweets, and he couldn't find his mouth with his hand to eat them.
I today phoned and requested the hospital to carry out a brain scan to see whether his cancer has spread, causing him to have the seizures, blackouts, falls, incoherance and memory loss of recent weeks. I even spoke to his sister last night by phone and we seemed to have some meeting of minds, and she agreed with this strategy.
C and I planned to buy him some new slippers and pyjamas, and to take them on our next visit, in either a week or a fortnight.
Tonight I hear that he has discharged himself from hospital, with his parents co-operation, and that they have driven him back to his flat, where he lives on his own. Tomorrow I plan to inform the hospital that in my view he is not mentally competent to discharge himself, and to ask that they inform his GP of my opinion.
Speaking to his dad tonight, he said he doesn't think that ex has cancer at all, because he doesn't know anything about it. :shock: I described the facts as I know them in detail but he kept saying he didn't know anything about it. And I was telling him!!! He couldn't explain the seizures etc at all, but said 'perhaps it was drink'. After thirty years of denying the alcoholism, suddenly maybe that is the better option after all. :? And he said ex's N?mum burst into tears when she saw him wanting to go home, but said at the same time she had had enough, and would not have him in her house to look after, because she cannot cope any more. Nice parents.
I am now planning to take my daughter and buy her a ring and me some slippers, instead of anything for her dad. We are both left very emotionally battered and bruised, and feeling totally used. Again.
I dare not even begin to tell my family, because their anger would be incandescent, and all aimed at me.
Trying to repair the damage once again. Meanwhile, ex is dying and I appear to be the only person who can see it. And his parents have taken him home, perhaps to die, and left him there. His dad said they have spring cleaned his flat and he can't want for anything. They plan to visit him in a few days, and go with him to see his GP, perhaps next week. :evil:
Sorry to be overdramatic, but this is an unbelievable situation. No idea how to support my daughter through this. What a mess!!!
The whole world has gone mad. Or is it me? Or is it the whole world? Or are we all mad, in one shade of grey or another. Or perhaps life is just a huge practical joke, that one day we will laugh at, when we find out what the punch line is. It had better be good. :?
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God, October, I'm so sorry.
This does sound like alcoholic cirrhosis... not that I'm certain, but it does have a lot of the hallmarks. I'm so sorry. And the denial and the selfishness on the part of his family would be par for the course if it's alcoholism.
You did the right thing, and deciding to follow up with the GP is also the right thing. Unfortunately, your ex has the legal right to destroy himself... and his parents have the legal right to abet it... and I am so sorry for your daughter, and so sorry for you.
((((((((((October & Daughter))))))))))
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Oh My Gosh October, it is an unbelievable situation. It could be one of of a number of things. But you are right, he certainly shouldn't have been able to sign himself out. Is there any visiting nurses checking in on him? How long has he been this ill? Is it possible that if it is CA that he never told his parents?
God Bless You All,
N-Jaded
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just hugs october.
((((((((((october)))))))))
wishing safety for al of you. :(
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October:
I had a similar situation with my now deceased N husband. He had congestive heart failure. I remember going to the doctor with him and the doctor telling him the things he needed to do. When my H left the room, I just looked at his doctor and told him he probably was not going to do any of the things he suggested. He replied, "then he is on a downhill slope and he will die and early death." This is what happened because of my H denial.
Denial is a very hard thing to cut through when your ex is and N and the parents are Ns. There is nothing you can do about this. You see it happening before you and the best you can do is to prepare your daughter for the outcome. I am very sorry for this situation for you. I am just glad you and your daugther are not living in the midst of this situation right now.
My thoughts and prayers are with you and your daughter.
Patz
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October. This is a really horrible situation. I am so sorry for you and for your daughter. When my children were young, fortunately, we could rely on our spiritual beliefs to help us understand things like this that had no good answer. Basically, you do everything you can and then you let God take over. I am definitely not evangelicizing. It's just the only thing we could do. I had a very similar situation where my husband was very ill (abrupt alcohol withdrawal) and when I tried to get help for him through his doctor and get him into a hospital, he went into the worst rage I have ever seen in my life. That's when I really had to accept the fact that I could only do so much and then I had to be OK with walking away irregardless of the consequences. But your daughter is so young to understand all this. I'm thinking of you...Take care. Bittles
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Thanks all for your support. I really value it, and I am not worried if anyone talks of faith. That is part of who I am too.
Latest from this morning is that I spoke to a nurse friend last night, then phoned the hospital patient liaison service this morning. I told them that I wanted it documented that I believe ex is not able or fit to look after himself, and that in my view he is a danger to himself. The nurse there agreed that when he was discharged they did not think he was fit to leave, but that they had no choice but to let him go. I said that is fine, but if there is an inquest I want it known that I have made this call. :?
Then I rang the GP and asked for the practice manager, and told him pretty well the same. He said if I got ex's dad to ring this morning, he would make sure a GP went today for a home visit to assess ex. Then I rang exFIL, who was angry with me, said I was not entitled to ring anyone, and that they were closer to ex than I was. He said they had already rung the Surgery as well, and had been told to call back later. (Nobody told me to call back later!!!!!! :twisted: :twisted: )
So I got angry back, and swore at him, and said I don't give a **** who is closest, I just want what is best for ex, because he is dying.
:twisted: :twisted: Then FIL told me that I don't know the half of it, which I think is a nice bit of projection.
I rang the practice manager back, and meanwhile he had spoken to the GP, and said that she is aware of the situation, and has already been in touch with the hospital, and that she is on the case. I told him about FIL and said I am back not on speaking terms with the ex in laws once again, and we both laughed.
So now I feel well able to leave this situation alone. I have done everything I could, and I have no wish to get involved any more with any of it. I will try to ring his sister later to explain, but I doubt if she will even speak to me. Shame, really.
Daughter describes it as 'a wretched business,' which it is. And, as some of you have said, denial all over the place. :(
How many times have we heard at a funeral that there was nothing wrong with him, and it was a complete surprise, and if only we had known, perhaps we could have done something, and what a terrible thing. Of course, this can all be true. But sometimes it is not.
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October:
You have followed this situation to the bitter end. You have done every thing humanly possible and really it was done on behalf for your daughter. She will know that YOU did every thing you could to get her father the help he needed. The GP is aware, the hospital is aware, whether the FIL or sister in law likes it or not, they are aware. Denial is a very hard thing to cut through. Reality sucks. However not dealing in the here and now only prolongs their emotional agony.
Dealing with it as you are will eventually be the ultimate emotional protection for your daugther. You are teaching her through your actions that no matter what hand you are dealt, you have to come to gripes with the reality of it. I am truly sorry your ex N is living such a horrible life.
May God have Mercy on his Soul. When this is over, and it will be over, then it truly will be your and your daugther's turn.
I dealt with a now decease N husband who lived in denial. It took a while to get things back in order. My life is truly a different chapter and bears no resemblence to what went before. My prayers are truly with you at this time.
Patz
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(((((((October & C)))))))))
Patz said everything I was going to say, so I will just say that I am so sorry for what the two of you are having to deal with. You have demonstrated for your daughter what true compassion looks like. Bless you.
Brigid
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October,
I feel terrible for you and your daughter.
Sending my prayers and love for both of you. (((October and daughter)))
So sorry.
Mia
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((((((((((October & C))))))))))
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Dear October:
I'm going to tell you about my mother's death and what I learned from it. You can take or leave whatever you choose from it.
She was failing...mentally and physically...at a rapid pace. I could hear her struggling to breath when I spoke with her on the phone. I hung up.
I drove to her house and insisted that she go to hospital. I could see her skin was almost grey and her body was filling with fluid...edema. Her heart was overloaded and failing.
At the hospital, this is what the doctor said to her, after examining her:
"You have pronounced congestive heart failure. You've had several small heart attacks already and you will have another, major heart attack, within one week. I'd like to keep you here and run some tests, try some medications and see if we can help".
My mother refused to stay in hospital. Back at her home, I said:
"I can't stay here and watch you die. If you go back to the hospital, I'll stay with you every possible minute but I can't be here, waiting, until I must try resussitating you. Please, please, please blah blah blah..."
She refused. She lived one week.
I was angry and angry and angry and angry and angry. Did I mention I was angry???
I felt extreme guilt for leaving her to die without me. I was a coward for not staying and doing what I could to help her.
I was convinced that she might have lived had she listened to the doctor.
I was devistated with despair because I loved her so much and she lived a horrible life and died far too young and I would/do miss her immensely.
I was joyful that she was finally out of her misery and her suffering was over.
But after awhile.....I starting to think. It was her choice of where to die. She hated hospitals (who doesn't?) and she didn't want to die in one. Didn't she have the right to choose this?
And what did the doctor actually tell her? Try some medications. Do some tests. Try to help. You're going to have a major heart attack within a week. He was basically telling her she was going to die and there wasn't much he could do to prevent it.
He didn't say I can save you. He didn't say I think there's a good chance. He didn't even say....if I were you I'd stay here, it's your best bet. He said (in not so many words)--you're going to die and I can try to see if I can help.
Not much hope in that is there? It was her choice to let go of an unrealistic hope. It was her right to choose to let go of that. Not mine.
She died after visiting just about every friend she had. I couldn't believe the people at her funeral that came to me and said: "Your mother visited me last week. Just out of the blue. We had tea and laughed and I am so glad she came by". There were literally hundreds of people who came to the funeral home and the funeral (hot hundreds visited but just so many who loved her).
She chose to say good bye to her dearest friends. Wasn't that her right?
Rather than have people crying by her bedside?
I'm crying as I write this. It still hurts. I wanted the doctor to fix her. I wanted her to believe there was a chance. I wanted her to be in a safe place where she would be cared for. But those choices were not mine to make.
She didn't want to live hooked up to a bunch of machines. She didn't want to die hooked up to a bunch of machines.
These were her choices and as much as it hurts me to admit it....I'm glad she did what she wanted, at least in death.
October, I know how hard it is to watch someone slowly kill themselves with alchohol. I also know it is a choice.
And I know how hard it is to know someone will die without medical care.
And now I know this is a choice too.
For your child.....maybe he doesn't want her to sit by his hospital bed and see him like that? Maybe it's the one thing he wants to spare her? Deep down inside....he knows he's dying.
(((((((October and C))))))
GFN
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October,
You have done what so many of us have.
You have done everything you can, and sometimes it isn't enough.
Its a world where everyone has to live with the choices they make. Unfortunately the people around them have to live with those choices also. Sometimes we have to watch them suffer or even die from their choices. And we have to suffer and maybe have a little part of us die along with them.
But you have your little blessing and yourself to take care of.
Try and rest peacefully in the knowledge that you tried your best and in your faith that God is in His heaven.
(((((October and D)))))
mudpup
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Hi October,
What a stressful situation. It's really awful when one is faced with the bad decisions of others and can't do anything about it. You did the best you could and that's all you can do.
Take care,
bunny
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My prayers are truly with you at this time.
Patz
Thanks Patz. I really appreciate you being there.
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These were her choices and as much as it hurts me to admit it....I'm glad she did what she wanted, at least in death.
October, I know how hard it is to watch someone slowly kill themselves with alchohol. I also know it is a choice.
And I know how hard it is to know someone will die without medical care.
And now I know this is a choice too.
For your child.....maybe he doesn't want her to sit by his hospital bed and see him like that? Maybe it's the one thing he wants to spare her? Deep down inside....he knows he's dying.
(((((((October and C))))))
GFN
Thank you for sharing your story about your mother. She sounds like a very special lady indeed, and I am sure you should have no regrets at all. She knew how to live, and that is the important thing, after all.
Perhaps you are right about D, but I am not sure that he is capable of understanding that much. From what I saw on Sunday he is the same lost child he has always been. He told me he just wanted to be back to normal, and I said to him, I am not sure you are going to be able to do that.
Then afterwards in the car on the way home C and I talked about what normal is to her dad, and whether either of us would recognise that if we saw it.
My greatest fear for myself is of dying alone. Not the pain, but being alone. And because it is a fear for me, it is also something I would not wish on anyone else; I don't want him to die alone either.
I would be much happier if I thought that he were in a fit state to make the kind of choice you describe with your mother. A good friend of mine has a heart condition and I have spoken with her today - a kind of surrogate mum for me really - and she also will not ever go into hospital again. She has recently had several minor illnesses - if there are such things for her - and had an angina attack only last week, and stayed put in her flat, and intends to do that from now on. She has had two heart operations, and doesn't want any more. She goes for check ups at the hospital, and to her GP, but she doesn't want to be admitted again. In her case, I perfectly respect her wish. I asked her about dying alone, and she says she will not be alone; the angels will be with her.
I don't think D is in that state. He is confused, hallucinating, and forgets conversations of the morning by the evening. To me, it is neglect to leave him alone, and it hurts.
However, on the bright side, I underestimated his sister. She rang me, and says she can see both her parents position and mine. She promised to keep C and me informed of what happens, if anything. Her view is that the symptoms we are seeing in her brother are side effects of anti depressants. Nothing more. But at least we are talking, which is a step forward all round.
Meanwhile, I bought daughter a pretty little silver ring with three hearts on it; representing herself and her family; me and her dad. And I told her that her dad loves her.
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Hi October,
What a stressful situation. It's really awful when one is faced with the bad decisions of others and can't do anything about it. You did the best you could and that's all you can do.
Take care,
bunny
Thanks Bunny. I keep thinking maybe there is something else ...
What I need now I think is to switch off life for a while to recover a bit. I kind of need a side room, to hide in. :?
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Try and rest peacefully in the knowledge that you tried your best and in your faith that God is in His heaven.
(((((October and D)))))
mudpup
Thanks, Muddy. This one is hard for me. I am not very good at sitting back and doing nothing. Much better at finding something practical to do, and doing it. :?
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You have demonstrated for your daughter what true compassion looks like. Bless you.
Brigid
Thanks, Brigid. I really appreciate your comments.
(((((((hugs))))))))
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Sending my prayers and love for both of you.
So sorry.
Mia
Thanks Mia. (((((hugs)))))
I really value everyone's prayers. I am sure they will help, somehow. Many thanks to everyone. xxxxxx
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Hi October,
This one is hard for me. I am not very good at sitting back and doing nothing. Much better at finding something practical to do, and doing it.
I guess I was using my usual bumbling words again.
I meant rest peacefully in God in a spiritual and emotional sense.
You can rest like that while you're working in your garden or using a jack hammer. :wink: :D
mud
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I guess I was using my usual bumbling words again.
I meant rest peacefully in God in a spiritual and emotional sense.
You can rest like that while you're working in your garden or using a jack hammer. :wink: :D
mud
No, Rupert, hun, you were fine. I am not good at spiritual and emotional rest either; makes me all jittery. :lol: :lol:
However, the jack hammer sounds fun ...
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Hello again October:
I would be much happier if I thought that he were in a fit state to make the kind of choice .......I don't think D is in that state. He is confused, hallucinating, and forgets conversations of the morning by the evening. To me, it is neglect to leave him alone, and it hurts.
Are you sure this wasn't partly withdrawl??
He was in a lucid enough state to get up and leave the hospital and say that he just wants things to be "normal again". My mother was in and out of reality, near the end. The closer she got to death, the closer to reality...it seemed. I don't know him but my guess is that he is more aware than he is saying (even in his own denial....he knows his body is giving out). He is making his own choices.
You've done all you can, October, to make sure he isn't neglected. But he has always chosen to neglect himself (by his alcoholism) and those around him, right? So now, it's not really all that surprising that he will neglect himself in death.
That isn't up to you to fix. You can't be sure anyone but....the angels....will be there with him, even if he were in hospital (unless you intended to stay there 24 hours a day). He could still die alone there (so what if some nurse is down the hall and some sick stranger is in the bed beside him, really?)
I'm so glad to hear about your communications with your daughter. Your obligation to her is not taken lightly and her needs are first (above his). Good for you for being so open with her. I bet she'll treasure that ring with the 3 hearts in it. Did you get your slippys??
I hope so. :D My prayers are with you and C.
GFN
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I'm so glad to hear about your communications with your daughter. Your obligation to her is not taken lightly and her needs are first (above his). Good for you for being so open with her. I bet she'll treasure that ring with the 3 hearts in it. Did you get your slippys??
I hope so. :D
GFN
Not yet. But I am working on it. Takes me a while to buy anything like that. Very fussy. :lol:
You are right that she comes first. That is why ex had to go; she was 4, and it was a choice between him and her, and she won. And looking back on the 8 years since then, I dread to think what state she would have been in, had I not made him leave. His family think I abandoned him, but I think it was an act of love towards him to protect his daughter from those years. And myself, in a way.
Now sorting out information on local Alateen meetings - never bothered before, but it may help C now. Also, have printed out bereavement leaflet, written for young people. Helps to know what to expect, and to find phone numbers.
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Meanwhile, I bought daughter a pretty little silver ring with three hearts on it; representing herself and her family; me and her dad. And I told her that her dad loves her.
((((((((October)))))))) (((((((((October's Daughter)))))))))
If I were God, I'd let you into heaven on that one alone.
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Ditto what longtire said...October, you are an exceptional human being. Your daughter has a wonderful role model for how to do life. Your ex husband is (although he may never realize) a fortunate man, to have had a child with you.
bless you
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You know, October, you are giving C. the gift of honesty and courage, something children rarely get when facing the death of an adult. So often kids get pushed aside, ignored, or treated as though they are bad for wanting to know what is going on.
I wish I had known when my grandparents were dying, I would have done all I could to say my goodbyes to them. No, the adults thought it was better not to trouble me with that stuff. Boy were they wrong.
I'm glad you're doing these things for C.
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(((((((((((((((((October and C)))))))))))))))))))))))
2cents
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If I were God, I'd let you into heaven on that one alone.
Ah yes, but you don't see the very wicked side of me. :twisted: D rang last night to tell me that he had discharged himself from hospital, :? not remembering that I had already spoken to him two days earlier. However, he did seem a bit more lucid than before. Don't know whether that is good or bad, really. :oops:
I asked him when he is going to realise that there are other people in this world besides himself and what he wants, and start behaving like a grown man. I told him he has hurt his mother and his daughter, let alone anyone else, by what he has done, and that he is a fool to walk away from help like that. I told him that his memory is going, and he is seeing things and that something is wrong, that needs sorting out properly, not denying. I think he prefers not to know or think about that, or perhaps he can't. He said he was seeing things because he is tired, and that he didn't have enough sleep in hospital, and that was the only problem there. He sleeps nearly all the time, though. :?
Later he spoke to C to apologise (I insisted that he do that), and said that he loves her, and she said to him; 'Whatever!'. He wanted to hear the same back, but she can't do it, and I don't blame her.
He has seen his GP, which is something, and she is going to see him again next week. He said she did not like him having left the hospital. I bet she didn't. But at least I am absolved from having to visit now, I think. I am not about to reward this kind of thoughtless behaviour.
So, not any kind of saint, I am afraid. :? The man I married died long ago, if indeed he ever existed. Actually, he did, for a while, but there was a demon inside who took over. Sometimes I see a glimmer of the person I once knew and - liked - but not often. Mostly I see a wreck of a human being, and a terrible, wicked waste of a life. If D had done this to anyone else it would be murder, imo. As it is, it is long, drawn out self destruction, dragging everyone else down in the process.
So yesterday I made some gf cakes, which was very nice. I am trying to just get on with living, and with being a family of two. Not easy, but I am getting there. Today I did all the ironing. Later I will go shopping. :)
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You know, October, you are giving C. the gift of honesty and courage, something children rarely get when facing the death of an adult. So often kids get pushed aside, ignored, or treated as though they are bad for wanting to know what is going on.
I wish I had known when my grandparents were dying, I would have done all I could to say my goodbyes to them. No, the adults thought it was better not to trouble me with that stuff. Boy were they wrong.
I'm glad you're doing these things for C.
Thank you, Storm. My dad thinks I am telling C too much. He has said for a long time that she should not know the word 'alcoholic' and that all she should know if he dies, is that he was poorly. That is all.
I told C the truth right from the very start, as far as she was able to understand it, because I wanted her to know that it was not her fault, and not my fault. I suppose AA would want me to stress that it is an illness, and I have not done that. I said that daddy chooses his behaviour, and he chooses to drink, and cannot stop, the same as gran and grandad cannot stop smoking. She knows about addiction, but she also knows that there is nothing that I would not do for her sake, but that her dad was not able to stop drinking, even for her and me.
There was one episode, when C was a toddler, when she went into the kitchen and saw her dad hide a can of drink up his jumper. She said to me; 'Daddy has alcoholic up his jumper', and he denied it vehemently. He said there was nothing there, and that she had imagined it. I said, 'if C says there is alcohol up your jumper, then I believe her'. And I made him take it out and give it to me.
I took it from him, poured it down the sink, and then I spoke to C and told her; 'Daddy tells lies sometimes.'
Horrible, horrible, horrible thing to have to do to him. :cry: But I had to validate her reality. I would not have known the words then, but I had to tell her that what she said matters, and that I believed her. What would it have done to deny what she saw and say, 'no dear, daddy doesn't drink, he has promised us both, and daddy doesn't break his promises.'
D has never learned the difference between truth and fiction. If he wants it to be true, it becomes true. And his whole family is playing the same game, at present. My family has a version of this game all their own. No wonder I am so mixed up. :?
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(((((October))))) not wicked, no.
My dad thinks I am telling C too much.
Your Dad loves his denial though and he wants you in on the act. And C too. It's not what you tell, it's the intention.
Children like truth a whole lot more than adults do. I disagree with your Dad. So do you - good :D
Hope it stays dry for your shopping, take care, Portia
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Bless you October for not hiding your xh's alcoholism from C. I think an even worse legacy for children of alcoholics is the denial of the addiction. I think it causes a serious distortion of their reality and they cannot release the feelings of anger, instability, insecurity and fear that the behavior creates if the people living with it are not willing to acknowledge it.
I believe this is why my H is so messed up. His very high-functioning alcoholic father was allowed to hide the addiction from everyone outside the family, the children were never allowed to deal with their fear of it and he never took responsibility for it. Every child in that family has some sort of dysfunction that can be directly linked to the alcoholism. My MIL just enabled it and never put her children first.
My father was also an alcoholic, in addition to other members of my family. I think another important aspect of acknowledging the existence of this addiction to our children, is the potential of the inherited propensity to develop the addiction. I have made it clear to my son (my daughter is adopted so not the same issue) that he has this addiction on both sides of the family and he must always be very aware that it is in his genetic make-up. His broken family will just up the ante.
Don't ever question how you are handling this situation or question your goodness. You are taking care of the two people who matter most and the only ones over whom you have any control.
(((((((October & C))))))))
Brigid
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Hi all:
Not much time this morning October but I just wanted to say re:
His family think I abandoned him
By being too afraid to admit he has a problem, by denying, it is they who are truly abandoning him. They might think it's love to ignor bad behaviour and make excuses but it is selfish.....easier than being honest, makes them look good in his eyes (they think), gets them out of dealing with it, or trying to help and they don't have to protect anyone, because there isn't anything to protect anyone from.
Ofcourse your decision has protected you and your child from much more pain and your courage in acknowledging, facing, and explaining the truth to your child shows your goodness and bravery, October. I agree with the others....(as Portia put it..I think)......never wicked October.
Now sorting out information on local Alateen meetings - never bothered before, but it may help C now. Also, have printed out bereavement leaflet, written for young people. Helps to know what to expect, and to find phone numbers.
Good job October. Practical steps to help. How about Alanon for you? It might help. Think how it helps to be understood here. Imagine a room full of people doing that...who know your pain and caring and confusion. I hope you will consider going. It's support for you. Look after you too, October.
But I had to validate her reality. I would not have known the words then, but I had to tell her that what she said matters, and that I believed her.
You have such beautiful, natural and keen mothering instincts, October. She is so lucky. I mean it.
D has never learned the difference between truth and fiction. If he wants it to be true, it becomes true. And his whole family is playing the same game, at present. My family has a version of this game all their own. No wonder I am so mixed up.
It's so frustrating, isn't it. It's like seeing a ghost that every one else refuses to see or something. The denial is part of the disease. There are definately choices being made by all but those choices are being ruled by the disease. It's easier/less frightening than facing/admitting/dealing with the truth...that there is a disease and that choices can be made to deal with it.
It is confusing to look at people and wonder how the heck they can stare alcoholism in the face and just pretend it isn't there. I do think Alanon will help to uncomplicate some of this confusion for you October, if you want to go, that is. Take care of you either way.
((((((((October and C))))))))
GFN
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I do think Alanon will help to uncomplicate some of this confusion for you October, if you want to go, that is. Take care of you either way.
Thanks, GFN. I am rather wary of any kind of alcohol support group for myself, because of past events. When ex was still living in this town he was in alcohol rehab for 18 months here, and after that had close links with an alcohol centre in town. To start with the people there were friendly to both of us - well, all three if you include C. We used to go there to meet ex's friends and such, and he spent a lot of time there. He can be very charming. Can't they all? But then the person in charge left and someone else took over, who was a good friend to ex at the time. Sadly she bought the lies from him; the ones that said that I was a real bitch, and that he drank to get over that, and that if it were not for me, everything would be fine and dandy for him. He turned her into his mother figure, and she bought into it.
I rang one day, not realising that this agenda was in place, to ask whether they could provide supervised access for his visits to C, and was met with hostility, suspicion and hesitancy. I was in desperation because there was no buffer; he was coming to my house, and sometimes turning up drunk, and there was only me to close the door on him. :cry: The woman in charge refused to help, and not very politely. I know I can be oversensitive, but there was no mistake this time; she was suspicious of me, and protective of ex. She didn't believe that he was dangerous or a threat to either myself or C.
I learned to be very wary of anyone who had heard the 'poor me' story from ex. Which could be pretty well anyone involved with alcohol rehab in this town, including AA people.
I know this is daft, and that it is one of the first things you learn, that the drinker is responsible, and that he or she will try to shift this responsibility onto anyone else they can find, rather than deal with it themselves. But this woman, in charge of the project in town, somehow forgot, or didn't realise, or whatever, and I got hurt in the process. So I think I learned to have nothing to do with any of them; there is a poison in alcohol, far more than in the drink itself.
Better to be alone on your own than alone in a crowd. :)
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I think another important aspect of acknowledging the existence of this addiction to our children, is the potential of the inherited propensity to develop the addiction.
Brigid
Thanks Brigid. I really value your comments; alcoholism is a terrible thing for any family to have to deal with. I would be no good counselling the wives and husbands, I am afraid. I would say, get out of there straight away. Stop hoping for recovery. Get out. Then if recovery happens, maybe you can go back. But don't hold your breath.
However, on the other comment, about the children, I am concerned for this too. For many years I drank no alcohol at all. Nothing. But now I drink wine with meals maybe four or five times a year, and I usually add water to the wine, so that in two glasses I only drink one. And I let C have a glass the same; half wine, half water. Like the continental people do with their children. I hope that she learns from this that drinking is something you do with other people, socially, and as part of sharing good times and meals. I think she has seen enough of the effect on her dad not to want to go anywhere near the same path.
Ex used to decline a drink with me, if I offered say a glass of wine in the evening after work. He would wait until I had gone to bed, and then drink on his own. Very different pattern.
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Hi October:
the drinker is responsible, and that he or she will try to shift this responsibility onto anyone else they can find, rather than deal with it themselves. But this woman, in charge of the project in town, somehow forgot, or didn't realise, or whatever, and I got hurt in the process. So I think I learned to have nothing to do with any of them;
Is she that powerful? I wonder if she is thaaaaat capable? Or could she just be another N on a power trip/trying to look like she is an n-god?
Alanon is a support group for the friends and family members of alcoholics. It's for those who live with or care about their alcoholic friend/family member. The focus is on helping themselves stop enabling the behaviour and supporting eachother during the process. Also helping eachother cope with the effects of alcoholism/the alcoholic has had on their lives (I don't know if it is written that way anywhere but that's basically what I remember it being about).
It might be worth risking one meeting to see if it feels right? I don't know October. Even if you get some of their literature to read, it might help a little. They helped me change my life so I'm a big fan. I know it's hard to take that first step, especially if you're afraid this woman has poisoned everyone against you. Is there another town, not too far away, that you might consider going to for a meeting?
GFN
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Hmm... I probably should just keep my mouth shut, but part of the reason I'm on this board so much is that I've had soooo many really bad experiences with 12-Step groups.
I've had some good ones, too, but it seems to me to be so dependent on luck. There are Al-Anon and ACOA groups where I live now, and it turns out that there is one - just one! - extreme nar who goes to ALL of these meetings and yaps and yaps and yaps. Self, self, me, me, me, self, self. Group does nothing about it, so the nar sucks all the oxygen out of the air, and all the time out of the meeting. I went three times, confirmed the pattern, and haven't been back.
Another group I tried just about tore some poor man to shreds because he mentioned a book by John Bradshaw, and egad! it wasn't 'Conference Approved Literature'. Good lord. people were all over this poor b**tard, who had come there for healing and was trying to share something that helped him. I ran over to him as soon as the meeting ended - he lasted through it, somehow - and told him how sorry I was and that he should take this as evidence of an extremely unhealthy group, not evidence that he'd done or said anything the least bit wrong. I never went back to that one either. [This was a few years back. today, I would have stood up and gone over to him immediately and asked him to step out for coffee right then, and spared us both the idiocy of sitting through a meeting that had just shown itself to be useless for either of us. We live and learn.]
Finally, I just posted to write today about an alcoholic I nearly married who was sober - dry, rather - when courting me and dived off the wagon the minute we became engaged (I said soemthing to wiish awhile ago about fouling their own nest; this is what I was thinking of). He agreed to go to joint counseling, where he proceeded to lie to and flatter and suck up to the (male) therapist, who feel for it like a rock. Un-expletiving-believable, and nothing but sexist blind idiocy, as far as I could tell. Finally my by then ex fiance had a major alcoholic hissy fit in the office during a counseling session because I insisted on confronting him about something and having it admitted to and responsibility taken for it. Hard to cover that one up.
Plenty of people do plenty of damage in these places. October is wise to be wary. Healthy groups are out there for sure, I've known them, but you really have to watch and wait before you wade in.
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October is wise to be wary. Healthy groups are out there for sure, I've known them, but you really have to watch and wait before you wade in.
Thanks, Storm. ((((hugs))))
I am not against sharing with others, but as you say, I would be very wary. I don't go out much, and I don't have many friends in contact at present, but the ones I do have are those people who are not embroiled in dysfunctional lives, or if they are, their dysfunction is not the same as mine. :lol:
I am not sure it would be healthy for me to spend too much time with others in my own kind of position, whether ptsd or anything else. I would start to think the whole world lives as I do, and that is not true.
If I go to see a friend, I prefer to talk about their family, or about theology, or world politics, or poverty, or gardening. Anything 'normal'.
When I used to go to church, one of the lay people there was convinced that if only I met a 'friend' of hers, who had an abusive, alcoholic husband, it would help both her and me. I declined several times, because I did not feel strong enough to carry this friend, (I tend to listen and support, and I did not have any listening left. :oops: ) So I kept saying no, then one time I was at church and the lay reader rushed over to say this friend was present, and would I say hello. That time I had to be rather more assertive in saying no. :( But I did it. Then I ran.
It may be different for C, and for her sake I will try the alateen meetings with her. But I think the rest might not be for me. Or not yet, perhaps. If the leader of the major alcohol rehab project in this town, a very respected project, can blame me in this way, anyone can. And I am not going to let them get the chance. (This is a normal response of a ptsd sufferer; withdrawal/avoidance following traumatisation, to prevent further damage, possibly constituting retraumatisation. Enough of this is how you develop social phobia/agoraphobia.) :?
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Is she that powerful? I wonder if she is thaaaaat capable? Or could she just be another N on a power trip/trying to look like she is an n-god?
I know it's hard to take that first step, especially if you're afraid this woman has poisoned everyone against you. Is there another town, not too far away, that you might consider going to for a meeting?
GFN
I don't think this woman has poisoned anyone, she is not actively malicious towards me, as far as I know. But clearly there is a legacy from ex being here for so long. I might talk to people who know him, without realising it, and even hear about this man who had a b**ch of a wife, and how terribly she treated him. No point even beginning to go there, imo.
If I were strong enough on hearing this to laugh and say, well, I am sure she was a really nice person when those around her were sober, that would be fine. But part of me is very suggestible, and the first thing I do when I hear that someone thinks badly of me, is to think, maybe it is true. There is plenty of evidence that way, and how can I be so arrogant as to discount all of it? People in positions of power are not powerful per se, but they have power in that we listen to them, and consider their viewpoint, because we think, surely they cannot be so petty as to be biased, or so stupid to forget the rules, and fall for these stories. It takes me a long time to sort out that, actually, they are wrong. Just plain wrong. And it takes a lot of emotional energy on the way, which I do not have to spare. So I keep away. :oops:
Perhaps another town, yes. If I moved house I would probably try Alanon, just to see, I think. Or maybe at that point I would want to move on, and forget all of this. I would want to find my own life, rather than being haunted by my marriage, which ended several years ago.
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My brief experience with 12-step groups is that they tend to focus on "gee, it was awful but I survived without drinking, smoking, ingesting....whatever. They seem not to take the next logical step. Where do we go from here. Sort of narcissistic. They can always dwell on the superiority of having stopped drinking, smoking, ingesting whatever without taking the extra 13th step of how do we give back to those in need or those we have wronged. And I understand what you mean by people in power, a.k.a. people with a "title". We do tend to place more importance on their opinions. Not a safe road to travel. Ask Bill Clinton...(he was one of our more less-distinguished Presidents) who could contort the English (or US language :) ) to say anything he wanted. It does not disguise the fact that he was a jerk. OOOOOHHHHNOOOO...my soapbox is going too fast.....I'll quit for now except to say I think you have the situation described quite accurately. Anything you might hear of this person and whatever characterization he has dumped on his new friends of his history is only further support of why you are doing the right thing for you. He is supporting his program...you are supporting yourself.....no contest....sorry....this is seeming to be a ranting/raving on my part for which I will I will take responsibility :oops:
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Just a quick update to say that I am spending a lot of time gardening at present, due to wonderfully clement weather. Pulling weeds out of the lawn is very therapeutic at present, except that there are so many weeds I have to use grass seed afterwards!! - I seem to have remembered why I always used to do so much gardening before, when ex was still around. Finding or bringing order into the chaos, I think it is. But the advantage is that the garden is looking better every day. Just a bit at a time.
And the washing and ironing is up to date like never before. Stress does weird things to people!!!! :lol: :lol:
Otherwise, everything is quiet at present. I have bought some more winegums for C to send to her dad if she feels like writing to him, but otherwise I am keeping away from even thinking about him and his situation. No doubt there will be further difficult times ahead, but at least we are not living in them every day. :oops:
We seem to have got most of our balance back again now. Cs tummy is still painful - I think I forgot to say that it started hurting a lot last week, round about Wednesday, and she had to miss two days tutoring. But we are on course again for this week, starting tomorrow.
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I'm glad you're doing better October.
I'm sorry to hear about C's tummy, though. Does stress make it worse for her or was that just coincedence?
Good luck with the weeds. I can't even look at my lawn without a grimace. It would be easier to turn it under and start over. :roll: :P
(((((O&C)))))
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I'm glad you're doing better October.
I'm sorry to hear about C's tummy, though. Does stress make it worse for her or was that just coincedence?
Good luck with the weeds. I can't even look at my lawn without a grimace. It would be easier to turn it under and start over. :roll: :P
(((((O&C)))))
Yes, stress makes her tummy hurt a lot more. That is mostly why we had to give up on school for a while. I have since found out about something called Leaky Gut syndrome, which links intestinal disorders with anxiety, due to something or other leaking through the intestinal wall and affecting the mind. She should eventually get more resilient, as she recovers. :)
The lawn is bad, as you say. Most years I just let it get on with being whatever it is. Dandelions and daisies. But this week I have turned into a weird gardening obsessive. :lol: :lol: :lol: Could be worse. Pathological gardening. :lol: 8) :lol:
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Hi everyone:
Hiya October:
Perhaps another town, yes. If I moved house I would probably try Alanon, just to see, I think. Or maybe at that point I would want to move on, and forget all of this. I would want to find my own life, rather than being haunted by my marriage, which ended several years ago.
Wouldn't that be great!!! Maybe that will happen soon? Maybe you'll be joining art classes and ladies coffee groups and stuff..just for you!!
That's what I hope for you October, some special you-time, just for you, to help you have a little fun and enjoy/build a life of your own. Some day your daughter may leave and I hope by then you will have a whole lot of stuff you do for you, because it will make everything a little easier.
Pathological gardening. :lol: 8) :lol:
Too funny!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
Hope you like gardening. I do. Last year I built 9 gardens and grew a lot of stuff from seed. Many perenials. This year I am glad to say, I see many of them coming back up!! (Except the massive hail today may injure some....I don't know :? ). I find gardening very therapeautic. :D
Glad your daughter is doing better and recovering. :D
GFN
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October,
I'm glad to hear that things are improving for you and C. Sorry about her tummy troubles, but hopefully that is looking up also.
I know what you mean about the yard and garden. I finally got the front yard mowed last week (I think the neighbors are glad too) and will get the back yard done this week when the temps warm up.
Gardening is very therapeudic and seeing the new growth in the spring does give you feelings of hope.
Blessings,
Brigid
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Hi October,
Sorry I just noticed I didn't sign my post up top about my crummy lawn. :oops:
Gives me a chance to give you another hug though. 8)
(((O&C)))
mudpup
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She should eventually get more resilient, as she recovers
She will! I did! Sometimes your body speaks when your voice cannot. Of course, in someone so young, it is confusing but it can be a powerful ally in the future. I'm responding since the same thing happened to me when quite young as a natural reaction to living with stress. Also, hives! OMG....there's hives and then there's contact hives....It's quite embarrassing to have these red splotches on you. But it's all your body's way of saying HELLO! something's going on here. I'm not a doctor and do not dispense medical opinions...just I picked up on this. On to gardening....Bittles
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Pathological gardening. :lol: 8) :lol:
Too funny!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
GFN
You not seen this one in DSM IV? :lol: :lol: :lol: Its right alongside pathological reading of the complete works of Charles Dickens. You start at the first book, keep going until you get to the last one and then start again. Go on, ask me anything about CD, anything at all. Lost count of the number of times ... Takes about four months in total. :shock:
And when I get bored with that (which frankly doesn't take long) I read through all the other books on my shelves, and then go back to CD again.
However, very worried today. Actually tidying the spare room. This is getting serious!!!!! 8)
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Hiya October:
Is your house going to be one of those places where you can eat off the floor? :D :shock: :D
Come to think of it, I have a pathological-sewing problem, sometimes. Just don't look at the floor then because the bits of fabric and little balls of thread will blind you! :shock:
However, very worried today.
Want to talk about it, if all that cleaning doesn't help? If not, maybe another bubble bath is in order??
(((((((October)))))))
GFN
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Hiya October:
Is your house going to be one of those places where you can eat off the floor? :D :shock: :D
It might head that way if I get some more bleach. Ran out after cleaning the bathrooms and kitchen. :lol: :lol:
Come to think of it, I have a pathological-sewing problem, sometimes. Just don't look at the floor then because the bits of fabric and little balls of thread will blind you! :shock:
:lol: I used to have that one too, when C was small. She had new dresses every other week. Beats taking to drink or drugs, though. :lol:
I was only kidding about the spare room really. Bit like when you get round to tidying the garage, or putting stuff in the loft that has been lying around for months and months. Fortunately I have not quite got there yet. Amost, but not quite. However I only did half the spare room then went to lie down. Ran out of energy, and into depression. Pretty normal. After reaction stuff. It will pass. :)
Thanks for caring. (((((((GFN)))))))
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Hi All,
Do any of you have a pathological urge for wallpaper removal? :? If so, I could really use you about now. I am scraping the paper off my daughter's bedroom walls and I have never encountered paper this stubborn before. My neck and shoulders are killing me and I'm only about 1/5th of the way.
Just thought I'd ask. :wink:
Brigid
PS If you don't want to do wallpaper, you are always welcome to clean. :!:
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Hey Brigid,
I'm there with you in spirit.
Does that help any? :? Didn't think so.
Sorry I can't drop by and help. Really. No kidding. Scout's honor. :roll:
mud
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Mud,
I'm there with you in spirit.
Yea, that's what they all say. :roll: You'll be sorry when my shoulders are so sore that I can't type anymore. :(
All kidding aside, it would be lovely to have the company. :D
Brig
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:oops: :oops: :oops:
Brigid... have you tried using a steamer? The kind you use to get creases out of clothes when you travel? Sometimes they help.
The oopsie faces are because I'm sure you started with that... but figured I'd rather mention it and feel silly, than not mention it and feel unhelpful.
The other thing that really works for me when trying to remove stubbornly adhesive things is the following, which I typically sing to a tune I think Mozart wrote:
Let GO, you b*****d!
Let GO, you b*****d!
Let GO!
Let GO!
You b*****d, let GO!
(repeat)
Chorus: Oh, damanblast it just let GO!
Oh, Damanblast it just let GO!
Oh, D & B it just let GO!
Let go..... let GO!
(back to the verse)
You can get a good rhythm going with it and pull the paper off in time to it. I wish I could remember the title of the piece this goes to, it's pretty funny if you get the right tune.
Good luck!!!
PS come to think of it, this wouldn't be a bad lullaby for N exes, either.
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Hi ((((((((((Brigid))))))))))
I didn't have a steamer when I did it, so I just sprayed the paper with hot water from a squirt bottle and let it sit awhile. The paper scraped off quite easily after that. It was only one layer though. I'm no expert so I quit now. :oops: :D :oops: :oops:
GFN
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Hey Brigid,
I'm with Stormy on this one... p'raps singing said lullaby TO hideous b*****d of choice? :twisted:
Much love and positive vibes,
((()))
2cents
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You are all so sweet to offer your suggestions.
I've have tried the steamer route in past wallpaper removal experiences and I'm am not a fan. A real pain in the a$$ if you ask me.
I am currently using a solution that claims to be "the best available wallpaper remover." That is a lot of BS unless this paper is attached with superglue.
I think the best suggestion is yours Stormy. A lot of cursing, swearing and pretending I am removing my H's body parts rather than wallpaper. :twisted:
Love to you all :D
Brigid
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I think the best suggestion is yours Stormy. A lot of cursing, swearing and pretending I am removing my H's body parts rather than wallpaper. :twisted:
Love to you all :D
Brigid
Wish I could come and help - I think a bit of wallpaper removal might be fun!!!!!!! All I have done in the past is to use lots of water, and if there is a plasticy type layer on top, take that off first before soaking, because the water won't go through it. Maybe a wire brush to break the surface first, if it is too hard to remove, to let the water through. Then lots of hard work. I love how nice wallpaper looks, but I can't understand people who put one layer on top of another. Weird!!
I am toying with the idea of redecorating my bathroom. The rest of the house (inside, that is) is fine, but the bathroom is looking a bit sad. Hmm. Maybe next week. :lol:
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October,
I did use a wallpaper scoring tool before applying the solution so it would soak in better. I used to own a VERY old house (built in 1847) and they had applied layers of wallpaper on top of one another. (I removed 7 layers in the dining room and some that had been painted over in between) so I have LOTS of experience.
This house has tons of wallpaper in it and most of it is OK, but my daughter's room is an ugly gold plaid which is not pleasing to a 16-year-old. I promised we would change it right after we moved in, but I just haven't had the energy to deal with it. I don't now either, but I feel badly that I have not kept my promise and she has never been able to decorate the room the way she wants.
I'm enjoying my coffee now and avoiding getting started again. :x I wish you were close by too. :(
Brigid
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Hi October! Since I'm catching up here, I'm going back to the original topic. Such a horrible situation for you and C! :cry: I was impressed by the way you dealt with it though! :) 8) I have a slight touch of what you've got (don't like leaving the house on my own, once I'm out I'm usually o.k. though, but not so ten years ago, when I was with xN, going to Tesco felt like climbing Mount Everest), so I can imagine what guts it took for you to call the hospital and xH's GP. Anger and feeling that this is something that you have to do help though, don't you find? Oh, and I think you are being a wonderful mother to C, handling the situation beautifully, I wish I had had a mother like you. When you told how you validated C when she saw her dad put alcohol up his jumper really moved me. Take care and hope you get to get out today (good thing you have a garden to go out into), it looks like it's getting to be a ´nice day, at leats here up north.
Oh, wallpaper! When we took down the awful mirror squares in our hallway back home, we found that the previous tenant had been to lazy to wallpaper behind it, so there was a big square of flowered wallpaper behind it! Good thing we had already bought a big mirror to go there!
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Oh, and I think you are being a wonderful mother to C, handling the situation beautifully, I wish I had had a mother like you. When you told how you validated C when she saw her dad put alcohol up his jumper really moved me.
Oh, wallpaper! When we took down the awful mirror squares in our hallway back home, we found that the previous tenant had been to lazy to wallpaper behind it, so there was a big square of flowered wallpaper behind it! Good thing we had already bought a big mirror to go there!
Thanks, SH (((((hugs))))). I wish I had had a mother like me too. :lol: :lol: Or any kind of a mother, come to that ... :?
When I wallpapered my kitchen I took all the cupboards down off the walls to paper behind them. Years and years ago. What a daft thing to do!! Mind you, it would have been just as hard to paper round them, to be honest. :lol: Can you imagine papering around all the furniture, and never being able to move it again!!!!! :lol: :lol:
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I'm enjoying my coffee now and avoiding getting started again. :x I wish you were close by too. :(
Brigid
Yesterday and today I have had cafe au lait made with diluted evaporated milk, and a very small amount of coffee (can't drink it full strength.) Lovely!!!! :)
Feeling much better today. Depression of a couple of days ago seems to have been connected to tummy bug/anxious tummy symptoms, which were horrible yesterday, but have now gone. All now well again. :lol:
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October,
Feeling much better today.
Good news, for sure. :D :D
I'm here again, drinking my half decaf coffee with a lot of flavored creamer and sugar (I hate the taste of black coffee :x ) once again avoiding the wallpaper removal.
I can only imagine how the next owners of your home will feel if they take down those cabinets in the future and find the wallpaper. Oh well, it won't be your problem. :shock:
So glad you're feeling better.
((((((October))))))) (wish I could do it in person)
Brigid
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Hey Brigid,
If you've still got any of that tenderloin left I'll come on over and help you with the wallpaper. :wink: :lol:
October,
I'm also available to pull weeds in exchange for, oh lets say, a lemon cake with a lemon custard center and whipped cream type frosting. Make it big, its a transatlantic fight. :P
mud
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Muddy,
If you've still got any of that tenderloin left I'll come on over and help you with the wallpaper
For you, my dear, if you bring those strong arms and put them to work, I'll make you a whole one just for yourself. :D :D I'll even throw in asparagus with Hollandaise and a lovely dessert of your choosing--unless, of course, we can convince October to make a lovely lemon cake and come join us. :wink:
Brigid
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I'm also available to pull weeds in exchange for, oh lets say, a lemon cake with a lemon custard center and whipped cream type frosting. Make it big, its a transatlantic fight. :P
mud
Funny you should say that. I made a gf madeira cake yesterday, then put strawberry jam in the middle, icing on top, and sugar sprinkles on top of that. And there it is, sitting in my kitchen saying sweetly "Eat me! Eat me!" (As all cakes do, of course.)
Now for the dilemma. My friend the mad Rector has a May Fair tomorrow, and I promised him some cakes (Also made fairy cakes, each one also saying "Eat me", but in smaller voices) for his cake stall. I said I would make gluten free cakes in case there are any gluten intolerant/coeliac people there, because for such a person to find cakes which are safe for them to eat would be really nice.
However, how do I get them there and when? Do I take them today, when he is setting up the youth group for tonight, and will barely have time to say hello and goodbye and ta for the cakes, or do I go tomorrow, and actually visit the May Fair, and all those crowds of people. Which is C's preferred way, because she would actually like to be there, but I am not sure. Part of me thinks I would not be wanted, but I can't think of a single logical reason why that would be true. Tried ringing mad Rector yesterday, but he was not there, or not answering the phone at any rate.
Maybe I should just go down and make some tea and eat all the cake myself. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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October,
do I go tomorrow, and actually visit the May Fair, and all those crowds of people. Which is C's preferred way, because she would actually like to be there, but I am not sure. Part of me thinks I would not be wanted, but I can't think of a single logical reason why that would be true.
I know this is not an easy situation for you, but for C's sake maybe you could give it a try. There isn't a single reason why you would not be wanted and I'm sure those delicious cakes will make a big hit.
I cannot at all relate to your discomfort of being in crowds--well maybe big crowds I can, but I tend to thrive in social situations as long as I know some people. So I don't have suggestions for finding that strength, but perhaps if it is important to C that would be an incentive for you to give it a test.
I'll be thinking of you as you work through the dilemma.
Blessings,
Brigid
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Hi All:
Wish I loved near too and I'd come over too to help with the wall paper removal and cake eating!!! :D
Hey October:
I wonder if it might help to sort of really think about/visualize the scene at the fair, ahead of time, in a really positive light??
What I mean is....see yourself there, smiling, watching C and yourself enjoying the fair activities, maybe sharing a special treat together, feeling comfortable, and safe, seeing all the people smiling and enjoying themselves and not interested in you (because they're too busy having fun), hear the sounds of the laughter, see the end of the day when you both leave happy and bit tired, imagine arriving home and knowing that this will be a lovely memory for both of you...etc.????
Also....if your friend is involved in running the fair and has a cake stall to attend to, he may not have much time to visit with you there. If you do decide to go (and I'll be cheering you all the way!!!), maybe don't expect to have much of a chat with him there and then you won't feel ignored or disappointed. If he's busy, it isn't the best time right?
Hoping for a nice sunny warm day for you regardless!
GFN
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Also....if your friend is involved in running the fair and has a cake stall to attend to, he may not have much time to visit with you there. If you do decide to go (and I'll be cheering you all the way!!!), maybe don't expect to have much of a chat with him there and then you won't feel ignored or disappointed. If he's busy, it isn't the best time right?
Hoping for a nice sunny warm day for you regardless!
GFN
That is the problem. I hate to go anywhere where I will be in the way or not wanted (no prizes for guessing where that comes from), so I would rather not go at all. However, C wants to go, and I have rung Rector now, and he said, 'why not come down?', so I am going. He says I can always escape to the Rectory if I need to. (You can tell he knows me well!!) So I have the cakes all ready to take, and we will go tomorrow afternoon, and help afterwards with some of the work towards Sunday.
There may not be time for much talking, but sometimes that is not too important. As long as I am not invisible. That is what destroys me. :oops:
If I can hide behind the counter and serve tea, and be there for C to show the things she has won/bought/whatever, then that will be fine for me. I am good at that kind of thing. I can hide behind being the tea lady. :lol:
So, if anyone wants a cup of tea and a cake, please come along. :lol: :lol:
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Cheers!!! October, I'm glad you're going. C will appreciate it!!
It's good that your friend knows you so well and has offered an escape, if you need it. I hope you won't. I think you will be just fine as the tea lady!!
So, if anyone wants a cup of tea and a cake, please come along. :D :D
Sure wish I could!! There might not be a lot of talking between us either but it would be nice just to smile and shake hands, maybe a hug.
((((October))))
Have a cup of tea for me and a bite of cake too!! I'm sure you'll make the best of the day and enjoy seeing C's enthusiasm!! :D :D
GFN
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Hi October,
I wish I could be there too.
Might be more talking with me than GFN, though.
My dad used to be able to talk for hours to perfect strangers. The older I get the more I get like that too.
And you're no stranger so you wouldn't have to worry about being invisible with me around. You'd probably try to find some place to get away from me. :P :roll: :wink:
Hope you keep positive and have a good day. You deserve one, well several. Well a bunch actually. 8)
mudpup
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October,
Really glad you're going, for both of you! :D Hope you enjoy your day tomorrow!
2cents
(btw those cakes sound mighty tempting! :wink: )
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October,
So glad you have decided to go to the May fair (or is it one word?). You will make a fantastic tea lady and knowing how you Brits are about your tea, I don't think you will be ignored. :D
I'm sure the big smiles on C's face will take away any doubts you have about being there. My children's smiles always take away my unhappiness.
Have a wonderful day. :) :)
Brigid
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October, I'm really glad you're going to the fair; C will enjoy it so, and I hope you will enjoy it just as much.
Sounds as though the Mad Rector is a minister in the truest and best sense of the word.
hugs,
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October,
Sometimes we have the most fun at places where we had to *force* ourselves to go. I know I have experienced this. I hope tomorrow will be one of those days for you.
May God shine his light on you and your daughter.
Mia
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Hi October
I hope you have a good day. I would come along but I am in the cold NE. I bet that's too far.
Mati
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Hiya. Went. Survived. Came home. :lol:
There was this other woman serving teas with me. Strange woman, bit serious. You know the kind? Worried about getting the right money. :?
So, it was either her at the tea bar, or else yours truly, giving cakes away to all the kiddies, because what is life about if not being allowed a free cake at a May Fair when you only have a few pennies in your hand??
I dare say I cost them maybe a fiver by that, in total, but since I took more cakes than that, I think it is quits really.
One stupid man complained about there being gluten free cakes, and said in his day they didn't have gluten free, and what did people do then? So I replied 'They died'. Didn't shut him up, though. Stupid man, with my daughter listening to him complain about fat free this and sugar free that.
:?
On the whole it was ok. I couldn't go round the stalls much, because it felt too vulnerable and visible, but I did a bit, with C, for her sake. Not sure it teaches her how to be normal, though. :?
Then we went back to the Rectory, and had Chinese, and then I helped with the service sheets for today, until about 9.30, when we left to come home as Rector was starting to prepare the Sunday School stuff. Would have stayed longer, but he was concerned that I would be too tired. He does care, really. :) However, he was much more tired than I was, I think. We were trying to look after one another, which is a nice thing to realise.
Got a letter from the LEA yesterday with a pack of lies, which the home tutor is going to sort out for me, because she says she is not happy with it. :? Meanwhile, got another letter from t, about not being available over the bank holiday, and about what happened with X. She says she can't let me have more access to her (ie phone number/whatever for emergencies) because that would set up unreasonable expectations of her. She says to ring either the psychiatric unit where I have a psychiatrist (and where there is not a duty nurse available, or anyone else, as far as I know), or the Samaritans. Nice of her to write, but not sure how I feel about this kind of rationalisation.
I need something. I say so. It is not available because it is not available. Therefore it is my fault for expecting too much. Try the Samaritans.
Sounds weird to me. Sounds not therapeutic.
Need to think about this. I think she does not understand trauma enough.
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Whoa Nelly!
What does your t think people do? Schedule their crises for her convenience? :roll:
Samaritans my elbow. BUNNY! We need you here!!!!
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Glad the fair went so well. Good on you about the teacakes... sorry to hear about the oik. On the other hand, it was good for C to see that. You can explain to her what happens when people with phenylketonuria (PKU) eat chocolate, now, and you have a REALLY vivid example. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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What an absolute delight your Rector must be! I envy you, but in the nicest possible way. :D :D
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Whoa Nelly!
What does your t think people do? Schedule their crises for her convenience? :roll:
Samaritans my elbow. BUNNY! We need you here!!!!
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What an absolute delight your Rector must be! I envy you, but in the nicest possible way. :D :D
Well, he can be a git sometimes, :) but mostly he is good fun, and my main emotional support a lot of the time. When he is not too busy. But I try to give as much as I take, because he hasn't got many people giving back.
On the other point, I emailed (via Admin secretary at meeting place) and cancelled the t session for tomorrow. I have said that I need time to think. I have also emailed Women's Aid to ask for local contacts who understand emotional abuse, because it is still happening, to me and C, in spite of the divorce and x moving away.
I think I need a t who is a trauma specialist. My current t specialises in eating disorders, which I do not have. She was all that could be offered. There is nobody else locally, and nobody wants to pay for me to go to London for the help I need from the people who could actually provide it. She is very good, and very knowledgeable, but she does not understand enough about trauma or retraumatisation, which is what I have had recently, and had to deal with alone, which then adds another layer on top. And on it goes. And months of my life go by ...
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Well done October. I'll put prayers on that...