Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Otus on May 05, 2005, 01:01:47 PM
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I'm writing this in the hope that I can direct a dear friend of mine to a site more suited to her problems.....can you help?
This girl was sexual abused as a young child by one of her mothers many boyfriends. Her mother was on the game (hooker) and when doing so, would leave her then two young daughters alone for days on end in what passed for a home (laughingly). The girls were aged 5 and 7 at the time when the younger one was continually abused! Whilst on their own, the now ex boyfriend would climb in through an open small window and carry out the abuse. She has now idea how many years before she was 4/5 this started, but it stopped when she was 6/7, she's now 39.
Their mother would regularly dissappear for days at a time, leaving the girls alone to fend for themselves. The mother was an alcoholic and would attack the girls....on one occassion with a hammer, frequently!
On returning from nursery one day, the girls were given some money, told that they were loved and then sent to the shops to buy sweets. On their return, there was no sign of mum and the house was shut and locked. They waited.....and waited.....and waited......then it was dark. Neighbours finally called social services and they were taken into care.
They both had scabies and went through a de-lousing treatment before being placed in a childrens home. Neither child had any idea of what the hell was going on! But this was one of many stays that they'd had in homes as a result of being abandoned by the mother. Days turned to weeks.....this time it was different. The authorities took a care order out and they were permanently taken into care!
Once again, their mother surfaced and tried to recover her kids, but it was too late! So she embarked on a campaign of visiting the children and telling them that they'd soon be home with her. She'd even tell them how she'd got new bedrooms for them and how many dolls she'd bought for them...etc. Weeks turned to months and there was no going home. The visits became less frequent. She married again.....a total of 4 times in the end. 8 more kids followed with this or that guy....and still she was pissing up and on the game whilst her two little girls were in care!!
Finally they moved from the home and into foster parents...out of the frying pan and into the fire! No one new that the younger girl had been continually and fully sexually abused......even she didn't tell anyone! The new foster home turned out to be a dumping ground for the authorities who couldn't place difficult children. The foster parents had turned it into a business and had 8 children living with them. The money was rolling for them, but the younger of the two girls started to experience the wrath of the foster mother. Maybe as a result of exhibiting effects of the sexual abuse or whatever, but the foster parents started to physically abuse her! This continued for 7 years before she ran away at 14.
Oh did I forget to mention, she also started to selfharm at this age! She'd take a blade to her arms and legs slicing just enough, but not too much! When they'd find her sleeping rough somewhere, they'd lock her up....pin down! Our lovely authorities!!
She used to sleep rough on building sites....all alone! How she managed to escape far more serious assaults is a amazing! A pattern developed of the authorities catching up with her, back in to care, then escaping again. This continued till she was 16....then she fell pregnant!
By 18 the had two children by the same guy. He was doing drugs, she wasn't. He'd tried to set fire to her in bed, beaten her variously! When carrying a third child, he dropped kicked her in her stomach. She lost the baby.....a deep mental scare for her to bare! He left having caused huge damage to her. A previous boyfriend, a childhood sweet heart, moved in and she was pregnant again. But this guy couldn't cope with the fact that she'd had two children by another guy and was beating her up! She awoke in hospital one morning with a broken jaw and face! He left!
Another miscarriage and one final baby with another guy who dumps her and she's on her own again. This time she decides it's best to keep it this way......well one can understand why! She brings the kids, 4 of them, up on her own! Never does any drugs, doesn't drink too much and buys everything through her own hard work! Never fails the children, not once! A model mother.....a very, very, very good woman!
She starts a job looking after the elderly. Loves it! Soon she's looking after several doing home help and their shopping. She gets close to some, too close! Over time, they die.....don't we all! Two that she's very close to die either in pain, or on their own and are found by her the following day! She is deeply, deeply traumatised by this!
He children are not longer children....they're growing up and leaving home. Her entire purpose.....her being as a person is beginning to collapse! She's always kept dolls houses in he adult years. Expensive ones complete with dolls. The master, butler, cook, wife and children.....the perfect house......the home she never had but always dreamt of! She no longer plays with the dolls, reality is biting.....and hard!
She cries over the deaths of her two elderly friends....her mother and father! They never had a clue what was going on for as you see, this little girl makes far deeper and hidden connections with people, far more than any realise! She's is more devastated by their deaths than their real families! Slowly, she's collapsing from within.......
She meets a guy over the net........now this ones different! You might expect that a girl with her background would be free and easy with her favours.......not so! With less than 6 or 7 sexual partners in her entire life, she's not exactly winning slapper of the year contests! She's a good woman, a descent woman.
She's had an affair with a guy for 12 years. Yes it's not good, but that's the way she wanted it because of what happened with the other men in her early life! Yes he lives with someone else and yes she knew this from the outset, but he's big and strong and if she ever needed a man to sort something or one out, he'd do it for her! But that's long over now.....over by 12months or more! He loved her, still does, but she doesn't have those feelings for him!
The new boyfriend......well he's posh.....or rather he talks as if he is. Older, she likes that, but not too old.....7 years difference. He's in business and flashes the cash! He takes her out for dinner....they stay in posh hotels.....she's smitten with him!
He's not long out of a marriage and a serious but painfull relationship. He too had a difficult childhood, a bullying and violent father, but nothing like her background!! He's a good listen.....and talker! He left one woman for another and promptly lost everything in the process! At the end of which, he even lost the mistress! He'd served her purpose and she no longer needed him. He was bitterly used, but that's life! It took him time to get over it all, but he's on the other side now, he's ready to date again!
He wants a relationship with a girl, but nothing heavy! No living with or 24/7. He wants to take a girl out, have fun, have sex....but nothing serious.....he can't cope with serious for fear of it all going wrong again! Nice and light....nice and simple.....dating, friendship, nothing else! He tells her this at the kick off. He listens to her problems......he's shocked to the core! As the weeks pass, his admiration for her grows! They spend time together....they talk a lot.....they get on well......and she feels safe with him!
Two months in to their 'light' relationship he makes a mistake...idiot! One night he tells her he loves her....big mistake! Two weeks later he's been talking to another girl over the net and goes around to hers one night. A few hours later and he's left having all but slept with her! He never sees her again.....but the damage is done!! Our damaged little girl.....our dreadfully hurt woman.....finds out! All hell breaks loose!!!! Just as she was beginning to relax.....just when what had happened to her as a child and those recent deaths was being replaced by the presence of newby.......the lid to pandoras box has been knocked open! The shit had hit the fan! Breakdown.......big time!!!!!
All of the what had happened over those many years now rises to the surface! Newby is back peddling like now tomorrow!!! Yes he's a 'player' but everything was supposed to be ok with her as she knew things weren't heavy between them.....just light! But then the f..king wan.er did say he loved her and she'd never met a guy like this before!! He understood her and she'd told him things she'd never said to another before! He'd replaced all of her pain......and the recent deaths of people close to her.....he was special.....he was such a f***ing idiot for not understanding what he was getting into! He'd really walked into things this time!!
She's beside herself and totally undone.....top to toe! He's trying to get away from her now.....but she needs someone, him, more than ever as the full emotion of those early years and beyond are exploding all over the place! Depression.....and then some!! A month or two later and she's diagnosed as 'Severly clinically depressed'! She can't work and has withdrawn to her bedroom.....her last castle! Frightened to go out....speak to even her children.....she either sits playing on her play station....listening to music.....or growling at people! Things get worse, much worse!
Unable to work, she's on the sick. 6 months elapse and her sick pay dries up! He's tried to end the relationship over and over......but she needs him more than ever! Everything that she's worked for is in jepeody! She's never had to rely on anyone before, but now she's desperate. He stands by her and comes through with the money as she's asked him to. He tries to contain the damage! On the one hand he's tip toeing away, spending less and less time with her but paying the bills!
He organises a counselor for her.....and covers the costs.....but 12 months later......and nothing has changed! Panic attacks, furore and fear of going out still abound! She's frightening herself even!
She spends most of her time ranting and raving at him! Everything he does is remorslessly questioned. He tells her that they're not in a relationship anymore.....but are good friends. He talks to her daily and texts back and forth continually. But at times she becomes totally overwhelming and has started to self-harm again! The ranting and raving becomes intense....so intense....he's withering under it all!!! He starts to shout back....the whole thing is a mess!!
She's threatening suicide by the day!! On anti depression tablets and diazzapan for over a year, nothing seems to work! The NHS wheels turn slowly. Nothing happens quickly....she's virtually on her own except for him! He family have all but backed away......he is backing further away under the strain of it all!
She goes to the police over her childhood sex abuse......they listen and pull the guy in for questioning. He's as guilty as sin.....and they know it.....but there's little they can do!! He's now old.....but as cunning as hell! He runs rings around the law......and knows he's going to get away with it!
She gets her childhood file from social services......what a terrible mess this poor girl has suffered from! It's a nightmare by anyones standing!!! She's close.....very close to the edge! Things have become soo bad......she's in danger....real danger of losing her life! He doesn't know what to do and is trying one thing after another to help! She sends pictures to him by phone of what she'd done to herself with a blade! He sends the cops in.....she kicks them out claiming he made it up......the picture and words attached don't lie.....she's slashed the hell out of the tops of her legs!! He's at his wits end!
She's a good person.......and he's a twat!! I am that twat......and one hell of a one! I knocked the lid off the box.....and I've got to get it back on! No one else wants to know....no one! I know that I can't continue like this for ever......I had not intention of being here in the first place! But she is a truly outstanding woman who's suffered sooooo much over the years....and survived.....until she met me.....wa*ker that I am! It's either into an institution she goes from here......or she starts to pull round after 18 months of it!
One way she could be helped is in finding similar groups such as this that could help her over the net. She has difficulty sleeping at nights and often has no one to talk to. Does anyone know of good sites like this but more geared to sexual abuse and depression than this one? I need to focus her attention towards something like this, hopefully UK based!
Thanks for reading it all.
Otus
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That was a very traumatic read - can't imagine how she feels.
Hope this helps.
http://www.self-injury-abuse-trauma-directory.info/Completed%20Files/Abuse-Links.htm
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Welcome Otus,
You're in way over your head here (as you know). You can't help her, and a sexual abuse support site isn't going to help her. She probably does need hospitalization (sorry). For yourself, please check out www.bpdcentral.com. You can get help for yourself there.
take care,
bunny
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This story was written about me, i am looking for help, not to be sectioned, and maybe otus hasnt told the full facts about what he done to me, it truly breaks my heart, to read what is written although mainly true, and i am desperate, there are no saints here, i was abused sexually verbally, and physically from 3 months old up until the not so distant past, i feel like i was put on this earth to be trampled on, i am a good person at heart, and have never set out to harm anyone deliberately, i have brought my kids up well, i have a nice home i work, up until this last year, and i cant cope for many reasons that otus has pointed out, and for many more, i am desperately lonely and isolated, and yes i do feel like doing away with it all, cos no matter how many tablets etc i take the pain wont go away, i just need to be listened to and understood, i dont live anymore i exsist, and i HATE myself for how i have become.
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That was a very traumatic read - can't imagine how she feels.
Hope this helps.
http://www.self-injury-abuse-trauma-directory.info/Completed%20Files/Abuse-Links.htm
Thankyou for this link i shall take a look
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Dear Denise,
Otus is overwhelmed. You need help. If you're cutting yourself and calling Otus to tell him, that is something that needs to be addressed. I'm glad you're going to check out that group on self-injury, I hope they will help you there.
bunny
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Denise
This is a nice board and you are welcome - try some of the other ones also. The problem with any childhood abuse is the lasting feelings of self-hatred heaped on top of the physical, emotional and sexual torture you have suffered.
I'd go and see the GP also if the tablets you are on aren't helping. Therapy worked for me but it was a 9 year slog but worth it.
Please take care of yourself because YOU MATTER.
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Dear Denise,
Otus is overwhelmed. You need help. If you're cutting yourself and calling Otus to tell him, that is something that needs to be addressed. I'm glad you're going to check out that group on self-injury, I hope they will help you there.
bunny
Right now i am devastasted about what he wrote, he has made himself look like a saint, and missed a lot of facts out about his role in this, and believe me it isnt all good, self harm is the only way to release my tension however sick and bad people think it may be
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Denise
This is a nice board and you are welcome - try some of the other ones also. The problem with any childhood abuse is the lasting feelings of self-hatred heaped on top of the physical, emotional and sexual torture you have suffered.
I'd go and see the GP also if the tablets you are on aren't helping. Therapy worked for me but it was a 9 year slog but worth it.
Please take care of yourself because YOU MATTER.
I am on tablets third lot of antidepressants, valium an sleepers, i see a phychiatrist, whom on my last visit 2 weeks ago when i told him how i felt said, "we will up the dose, now am on the highest dose of these particular 1s and come back in july"
I dont know who or what to turn to anymore, i feel like am in a nightmare, ive suffered for years, but always got through it, so why now, why does it feel like theres nothing left anymore
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Dear Denise,
Please hold on. You've been through hell, but please don't give up. You've survived for a reason, because you were meant to LIVE not just exist. Many of us here know how that feels like - existence/ subsistence sucks. You are strong for a reaon, and your time will come.
Strength to you,
2cents
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Right now i am devastasted about what he wrote, he has made himself look like a saint, and missed a lot of facts out about his role in this, and believe me it isnt all good, self harm is the only way to release my tension however sick and bad people think it may be
Denise,
There is a boundary issue because Otus wrote about you and you are also here reading it and posting. So there is a privacy issue, and an expectation that we will take sides. I don't think Otus sounded like a saint at all. It was somewhat of an intrusion to tell your story, unless you authorized him to do so. But I believe he's overwhelmed and frightened. I understand that you are cutting because that's how you manage feelings. Possibly he's telling your story to manage his feelings. Phoning him to tell him you're cutting is a problem and so I hope you will find others who will take that phone call, who are more qualified. Keep posting here and I hope you check out the self-injury site.
bunny
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Dear Denise:
You have truly endured horrors. :shock: I'm so sorry for all of the pain you have experienced and are still experiencing.
Cutting is not bad.....but it is very unhealthy. Please do go to those sites that might contain more information to help you get healthier in this area. You know it's not helping you to do it.
You are wondering why everything seems so overwhelming now? My guess is that you felt attached to and great trust for Otus. Have you ever felt that attached to or trusted any one else as much as that before?
If not, then this may be one of the biggest losses you have ever suffered and so it is understandable that you will have a great bit of grieving to do.
I'm sorry Denise, for that loss. :( :( :(
But cutting to relieve the tension.....rather than grieving.....feeling the feelings....getting them out....releasing them....will not make you any healthier. Cutting makes you unhealthier.
Have you ever spoken to a therapist about your traumas and feelings?
It is something that might really help you...at this point.
You don't have to relive all of the trauma you've experienced over and over. You can decide to focus on feeling well....finding joy....living in the now. And work on healing your pain in therapy.
It's not an easy thing to do but it is possible if you decide to do the work.
I hope things will get much better for you. You will have to take the first step for that to happen.
Otus: You're a good friend to Denise (I assume). It must be shocking to open an email and see pictures of your friend, all cut up and bloody. It is heart breaking to think about. Traumatic for you too, I bet. What do you think you need to do to protect yourself from this unhealthy behaviour of Denise's? Would it be possible for you to make it clear that if another pic like this arrives...you will not feel comfortable opening any further emails?
Part of the behaviour seems to be involving punishing you. That's my take. We all agree.....you're no saint, Otus. But....no one is obliged to encourage unhealthy behaviour of a friend, or be traumatized as punishment for past deeds. What do you think?
(((((Denise))))) (((((Otus)))))
My prayers are with you both.
GFN
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Replied by PM to Denise because she needs privacy now.
Meanwhile, my comment to Otus is that you did not know that what you were doing would do so much harm. Now you do know, I think the best thing you can do for Denise is to let her set the pace for the 'friendship' you have.
You have damaged the trust that you had between you, but clearly you are both still close and perhaps you can still be a support. I think Denise may well need that, as long as you can understand that she has to make the choices, and she has to decide what she needs. A major factor in trauma of any kind is loss of control; you need to give that control back to Denise as a gift, and you need to be trustworthy now, 100%. If you cannot do that, then tell her so, and tell her what you can commit to.
I would advise you to say to her that if she wants to talk to you, you are there for her, but that the choice is hers. She decides when and where. You decide for how long (because even the best listener in the world cannot listen forever at a time. Better a couple of hours a week than burning yourself out.) You are there to support and to listen.
Meanwhile, you have a right to set boundaries for yourself. If you cannot cope with certain kinds of messages, then say so in advance, so that you both understand the 'rules'.
I would advise not touching Denise unless she asks you to, and a friendly hug at the end of a visit (if she wants it) at absolute most. There is no question of anything other than friendship for Denise while she is in so much pain. I am sure you realise that. A very important part of your role as her friend is to show her how she can be safe with you.
This may seem a frightening, impossible situation, but there are ways out of the nightmare. Others have found the way, and with any luck at all we can help Denise to find her way too; she is no longer alone in this.
Last comment: God preserve us from Saints of any kind. What we need is people who care enough to do the wrong thing, for the right reasons.
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I thank you all for reading what I posted yesterday. Denise was aware of what I was doing, but not about the depth that I went into.
Denise is an exceptional woman to have survived and prospered as she has. When I first met her, I couldn't believe the pain and hurt a parent could inflict upon a child! As with the movie 'Angelas Ashes', this girls story goes way beyond its traumatic images! I've often said that someone should right a book about her life as it would leave few with a dry eye!
I'm a big boy....but a foolish one. I did something, which in turn, set off a cascade of effects which is still erupting today! I kicked the lid off the box, not her! Yes I had no idea about what was going to happen over what I did, but knock the lid off of box, I surely did! What was inside wasn't of my making, but neither was it hers!
Denise was OK before meeting me. She was like most girls of her age, just trundling along, living day to day, with a smile upon her face. But now she's not....and it is of my doing, my fault! Yes I struggle with the results of what I unleashed, but I can just about cope with the situation. She is a very good person.....a joy to know most days. There's really not a bad bone in her body and she cares for the elderly soooo well. She has a heart of gold.....but a leather whip for a tongue these days :lol: She's a far more worthy person than I.
The people who inflicted abuse after abuse upon the soul of a poor and defenseless child....are still walking around today without so much as a thought for what they did! Free to do so again as undoubtedly they probably have! Beyond the law and free of mind to hurt so deeply again! But she's in prison....a prison of her innocent mind for crimes she couldn't prevent! Every day and every night...the lids still off the box.
I deserve no pity for what I did, for I am a big boy and responsible for my actions. She's still a little girl who desperately needs and deserves any and every positive input you all could make.
This is very genuine situation and I appeal to your endevours. Please focus upon Denise, I'll take care of myself.
Thank you
David
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denise,
i dont know if you are still reading i just want to say how brave i think youve been. i wish there was something i could offer that was helpful but, just know i admire you. i hope you stay here and talk although i really hope you find other help too.
anna
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denise,
i dont know if you are still reading i just want to say how brave i think youve been. i wish there was something i could offer that was helpful but, just know i admire you. i hope you stay here and talk although i really hope you find other help too.
anna
Thankyou, Denise
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Dear Denise:
You have truly endured horrors. :shock: I'm so sorry for all of the pain you have experienced and are still experiencing.
Cutting is not bad.....but it is very unhealthy. Please do go to those sites that might contain more information to help you get healthier in this area. You know it's not helping you to do it.
You are wondering why everything seems so overwhelming now? My guess is that you felt attached to and great trust for Otus. Have you ever felt that attached to or trusted any one else as much as that before?
If not, then this may be one of the biggest losses you have ever suffered and so it is understandable that you will have a great bit of grieving to do.
I'm sorry Denise, for that loss. :( :( :(
But cutting to relieve the tension.....rather than grieving.....feeling the feelings....getting them out....releasing them....will not make you any healthier. Cutting makes you unhealthier.
Have you ever spoken to a therapist about your traumas and feelings?
It is something that might really help you...at this point.
You don't have to relive all of the trauma you've experienced over and over. You can decide to focus on feeling well....finding joy....living in the now. And work on healing your pain in therapy.
It's not an easy thing to do but it is possible if you decide to do the work.
I hope things will get much better for you. You will have to take the first step for that to happen.
Otus: You're a good friend to Denise (I assume). It must be shocking to open an email and see pictures of your friend, all cut up and bloody. It is heart breaking to think about. Traumatic for you too, I bet. What do you think you need to do to protect yourself from this unhealthy behaviour of Denise's? Would it be possible for you to make it clear that if another pic like this arrives...you will not feel comfortable opening any further emails?
Part of the behaviour seems to be involving punishing you. That's my take. We all agree.....you're no saint, Otus. But....no one is obliged to encourage unhealthy behaviour of a friend, or be traumatized as punishment for past deeds. What do you think?
(((((Denise))))) (((((Otus)))))
My prayers are with you both.
GFN
No i have never trusted or opened up to anyone before, not to the extent i did with David, he knows my life inside out, my behaviour is unhealthy i agree and wrong, but sometimes despair and desperation take over, i am trying to deal with a million different things at once, and i find it difficult to say the least.
Thankyou for taking the time to read
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denise,
i dont know if you are still reading i just want to say how brave i think youve been. i wish there was something i could offer that was helpful but, just know i admire you. i hope you stay here and talk although i really hope you find other help too.
anna
I am still reading, i find a lot of mixed feelings, and i find it difficult to read what people are saying, but its a reality, and ive got to face that sooner or later, am on a long hard journey,hopefully in time things will improve, but for now i live day to day, thanks anyway
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I'm writing this in the hope that I can direct a dear friend of mine to a site more suited to her problems.....can you help?
This girl was sexual abused as a young child by one of her mothers many boyfriends. Her mother was on the game (hooker) and when doing so, would leave her then two young daughters alone for days on end in what passed for a home (laughingly). The girls were aged 5 and 7 at the time when the younger one was continually abused! Whilst on their own, the now ex boyfriend would climb in through an open small window and carry out the abuse. She has now idea how many years before she was 4/5 this started, but it stopped when she was 6/7, she's now 39.
Their mother would regularly dissappear for days at a time, leaving the girls alone to fend for themselves. The mother was an alcoholic and would attack the girls....on one occassion with a hammer, frequently!
On returning from nursery one day, the girls were given some money, told that they were loved and then sent to the shops to buy sweets. On their return, there was no sign of mum and the house was shut and locked. They waited.....and waited.....and waited......then it was dark. Neighbours finally called social services and they were taken into care.
They both had scabies and went through a de-lousing treatment before being placed in a childrens home. Neither child had any idea of what the hell was going on! But this was one of many stays that they'd had in homes as a result of being abandoned by the mother. Days turned to weeks.....this time it was different. The authorities took a care order out and they were permanently taken into care!
Once again, their mother surfaced and tried to recover her kids, but it was too late! So she embarked on a campaign of visiting the children and telling them that they'd soon be home with her. She'd even tell them how she'd got new bedrooms for them and how many dolls she'd bought for them...etc. Weeks turned to months and there was no going home. The visits became less frequent. She married again.....a total of 4 times in the end. 8 more kids followed with this or that guy....and still she was pissing up and on the game whilst her two little girls were in care!!
Finally they moved from the home and into foster parents...out of the frying pan and into the fire! No one new that the younger girl had been continually and fully sexually abused......even she didn't tell anyone! The new foster home turned out to be a dumping ground for the authorities who couldn't place difficult children. The foster parents had turned it into a business and had 8 children living with them. The money was rolling for them, but the younger of the two girls started to experience the wrath of the foster mother. Maybe as a result of exhibiting effects of the sexual abuse or whatever, but the foster parents started to physically abuse her! This continued for 7 years before she ran away at 14.
Oh did I forget to mention, she also started to selfharm at this age! She'd take a blade to her arms and legs slicing just enough, but not too much! When they'd find her sleeping rough somewhere, they'd lock her up....pin down! Our lovely authorities!!
She used to sleep rough on building sites....all alone! How she managed to escape far more serious assaults is a amazing! A pattern developed of the authorities catching up with her, back in to care, then escaping again. This continued till she was 16....then she fell pregnant!
By 18 the had two children by the same guy. He was doing drugs, she wasn't. He'd tried to set fire to her in bed, beaten her variously! When carrying a third child, he dropped kicked her in her stomach. She lost the baby.....a deep mental scare for her to bare! He left having caused huge damage to her. A previous boyfriend, a childhood sweet heart, moved in and she was pregnant again. But this guy couldn't cope with the fact that she'd had two children by another guy and was beating her up! She awoke in hospital one morning with a broken jaw and face! He left!
Another miscarriage and one final baby with another guy who dumps her and she's on her own again. This time she decides it's best to keep it this way......well one can understand why! She brings the kids, 4 of them, up on her own! Never does any drugs, doesn't drink too much and buys everything through her own hard work! Never fails the children, not once! A model mother.....a very, very, very good woman!
She starts a job looking after the elderly. Loves it! Soon she's looking after several doing home help and their shopping. She gets close to some, too close! Over time, they die.....don't we all! Two that she's very close to die either in pain, or on their own and are found by her the following day! She is deeply, deeply traumatised by this!
He children are not longer children....they're growing up and leaving home. Her entire purpose.....her being as a person is beginning to collapse! She's always kept dolls houses in he adult years. Expensive ones complete with dolls. The master, butler, cook, wife and children.....the perfect house......the home she never had but always dreamt of! She no longer plays with the dolls, reality is biting.....and hard!
She cries over the deaths of her two elderly friends....her mother and father! They never had a clue what was going on for as you see, this little girl makes far deeper and hidden connections with people, far more than any realise! She's is more devastated by their deaths than their real families! Slowly, she's collapsing from within.......
She meets a guy over the net........now this ones different! You might expect that a girl with her background would be free and easy with her favours.......not so! With less than 6 or 7 sexual partners in her entire life, she's not exactly winning slapper of the year contests! She's a good woman, a descent woman.
She's had an affair with a guy for 12 years. Yes it's not good, but that's the way she wanted it because of what happened with the other men in her early life! Yes he lives with someone else and yes she knew this from the outset, but he's big and strong and if she ever needed a man to sort something or one out, he'd do it for her! But that's long over now.....over by 12months or more! He loved her, still does, but she doesn't have those feelings for him!
The new boyfriend......well he's posh.....or rather he talks as if he is. Older, she likes that, but not too old.....7 years difference. He's in business and flashes the cash! He takes her out for dinner....they stay in posh hotels.....she's smitten with him!
He's not long out of a marriage and a serious but painfull relationship. He too had a difficult childhood, a bullying and violent father, but nothing like her background!! He's a good listen.....and talker! He left one woman for another and promptly lost everything in the process! At the end of which, he even lost the mistress! He'd served her purpose and she no longer needed him. He was bitterly used, but that's life! It took him time to get over it all, but he's on the other side now, he's ready to date again!
He wants a relationship with a girl, but nothing heavy! No living with or 24/7. He wants to take a girl out, have fun, have sex....but nothing serious.....he can't cope with serious for fear of it all going wrong again! Nice and light....nice and simple.....dating, friendship, nothing else! He tells her this at the kick off. He listens to her problems......he's shocked to the core! As the weeks pass, his admiration for her grows! They spend time together....they talk a lot.....they get on well......and she feels safe with him!
Two months in to their 'light' relationship he makes a mistake...idiot! One night he tells her he loves her....big mistake! Two weeks later he's been talking to another girl over the net and goes around to hers one night. A few hours later and he's left having all but slept with her! He never sees her again.....but the damage is done!! Our damaged little girl.....our dreadfully hurt woman.....finds out! All hell breaks loose!!!! Just as she was beginning to relax.....just when what had happened to her as a child and those recent deaths was being replaced by the presence of newby.......the lid to pandoras box has been knocked open! The shit had hit the fan! Breakdown.......big time!!!!!
All of the what had happened over those many years now rises to the surface! Newby is back peddling like now tomorrow!!! Yes he's a 'player' but everything was supposed to be ok with her as she knew things weren't heavy between them.....just light! But then the f..king wan.er did say he loved her and she'd never met a guy like this before!! He understood her and she'd told him things she'd never said to another before! He'd replaced all of her pain......and the recent deaths of people close to her.....he was special.....he was such a f***ing idiot for not understanding what he was getting into! He'd really walked into things this time!!
She's beside herself and totally undone.....top to toe! He's trying to get away from her now.....but she needs someone, him, more than ever as the full emotion of those early years and beyond are exploding all over the place! Depression.....and then some!! A month or two later and she's diagnosed as 'Severly clinically depressed'! She can't work and has withdrawn to her bedroom.....her last castle! Frightened to go out....speak to even her children.....she either sits playing on her play station....listening to music.....or growling at people! Things get worse, much worse!
Unable to work, she's on the sick. 6 months elapse and her sick pay dries up! He's tried to end the relationship over and over......but she needs him more than ever! Everything that she's worked for is in jepeody! She's never had to rely on anyone before, but now she's desperate. He stands by her and comes through with the money as she's asked him to. He tries to contain the damage! On the one hand he's tip toeing away, spending less and less time with her but paying the bills!
He organises a counselor for her.....and covers the costs.....but 12 months later......and nothing has changed! Panic attacks, furore and fear of going out still abound! She's frightening herself even!
She spends most of her time ranting and raving at him! Everything he does is remorslessly questioned. He tells her that they're not in a relationship anymore.....but are good friends. He talks to her daily and texts back and forth continually. But at times she becomes totally overwhelming and has started to self-harm again! The ranting and raving becomes intense....so intense....he's withering under it all!!! He starts to shout back....the whole thing is a mess!!
She's threatening suicide by the day!! On anti depression tablets and diazzapan for over a year, nothing seems to work! The NHS wheels turn slowly. Nothing happens quickly....she's virtually on her own except for him! He family have all but backed away......he is backing further away under the strain of it all!
She goes to the police over her childhood sex abuse......they listen and pull the guy in for questioning. He's as guilty as sin.....and they know it.....but there's little they can do!! He's now old.....but as cunning as hell! He runs rings around the law......and knows he's going to get away with it!
She gets her childhood file from social services......what a terrible mess this poor girl has suffered from! It's a nightmare by anyones standing!!! She's close.....very close to the edge! Things have become soo bad......she's in danger....real danger of losing her life! He doesn't know what to do and is trying one thing after another to help! She sends pictures to him by phone of what she'd done to herself with a blade! He sends the cops in.....she kicks them out claiming he made it up......the picture and words attached don't lie.....she's slashed the hell out of the tops of her legs!! He's at his wits end!
She's a good person.......and he's a twat!! I am that twat......and one hell of a one! I knocked the lid off the box.....and I've got to get it back on! No one else wants to know....no one! I know that I can't continue like this for ever......I had not intention of being here in the first place! But she is a truly outstanding woman who's suffered sooooo much over the years....and survived.....until she met me.....wa*ker that I am! It's either into an institution she goes from here......or she starts to pull round after 18 months of it!
One way she could be helped is in finding similar groups such as this that could help her over the net. She has difficulty sleeping at nights and often has no one to talk to. Does anyone know of good sites like this but more geared to sexual abuse and depression than this one? I need to focus her attention towards something like this, hopefully UK based!
Thanks for reading it all.
Otus
Can i just make 1 comment, i didnt have miscarriages, i had two beautiful babies, the 1st a baby girl weighing 41b12, at 35 wks gestation, she was never given the chance to breath life, she was stillborn, my other was a baby boy weighing 21b four an a half ounces, 29 wks gestation, premature labour due to a beating,he lived for 4 an a half hrs then died peacefully in my arms, Kirsty and Wesley, my babies, and now my angels forever xxxx
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Dear Denise:
No i have never trusted or opened up to anyone before, not to the extent i did with David, he knows my life inside out,
So then this is indeed a huge loss for you, this romantic relationship
that is over with him? You understand this and realize that you must grieve this loss?
my behaviour is unhealthy i agree and wrong,
Try not to think of it so much as wrong or bad because those terms often infiltrate your view of yourself/interfere with your self esteem....my behaviour is wrong, bad...therefore I am wrong, bad.
Nope. That's not it at all. You are not wrong or bad.
You have an unhealthy behaviour.
You are a good person, Denise and right now it seems you have decided that when you are in despair, when you feel desperate......this behaviour is acceptable. It isn't. It is unhealthy and dangerous.
You have to get this point across to yourself, consciously and unconsciously, in order to overcome your unhealthy behaviour, which is now....forming into a habit.
This idea, that this behaviour is a substitute for dealing with your feelings, will need to be corrected, by substituting more appropriate ideas, in order to help you stop this unhealthy behaviour, imo.
Tell yourself.....
"When I feel upset I will find healthy ways to release my feelings.
I will substitute these for cutting. I will overcome this unhealthy behaviour. I will do ............."
Write it out in huge letters and post it all over your house. Stand in the mirror, once an hour and repeat it out loud. Record it on a tape recorder and play it morning and night, as you relax your body in a chair, or some place comfortable. See yourself succeeding. See your beautiful healthy skin and yourself.....happy and free of this unhealthy behaviour. Imagine yourself free of this unhealthy behaviour. Visualize yourself letting go of it. Give it a form.....any nasty thing you choose.....eg. picture the behaviour as a black crow.....an watch it fly far, far away. Gone. Forever.
Find a therapist who will help you with this. A hypno-therapist if possible.
You must do the work to fix this. It is a dangerous, destructive, unhealthy behaviour. It is not a way of coping. It is a way of avoiding coping.
I'm not being kind to you Denise. I'm being real with you. Please believe that you can correct this. Only you can correct it. No doctor, no pill, no relationship, no friend, nobody but you can stop yourself from behaving in an unhealthy way. And it will take work but it is certainly something that can be corrected. And you can do it!
...but sometimes despair and desperation take over, ...
Every single person here has dealt with despair. I'm so very, very sorry for all you've been through. :( :( :? :shock: :x :( :( :( :(
I also see that you are no quitter. You're here seeking support and believe me, you will get it, if you stick around here.
But you must decide to correct this behaviour. No one else can do that for you. People will definately be here for you, to support your every effort, and cheer you on, and encourage you to correct this...and do all they can to help you through this. People here will sit with you, in your despair and listen and offer you cyber hugs and sympathy and empathize with your situation. They will try to comfort you and let you know that you are not alone.
So ......when you feel at your wits end......when you are full of despair and hurt and saddness and fury and all the emotions that emerge......
What else, besides cutting yourself with a blade, can you do, Denise?
Board memebers: Please help Denise with this......what else can she do?
I hope people will add to this list:
1. Come here and post. Read. Post 50 thousand times per hour (heehee) if you need to. Post. Read. Post. Post. Read. Read. Post.
2. Cry, scream, pound a pillow, draw pictures of your tormentors and jump up and down on them, rip them to shreds, write your feelings down, write, write, write, call a friend, scribble, hug a teddy bear, .....
3. Excercise.......go for a walk, rake the lawn, or volunteer to rake an elderly neighbour's lawn, ride a bike, go for a swim.......
4. Do something comforting for yourself...take a bubble bath....rent a funny movie, go to the library and look at books, research a topic, start a new hobbie, or work on an old one, call a friend, ...........
These may not be in the necessary order. Others will add to this list, I bet.
...i am trying to deal with a million different things at once
So stop dealing with everything at once. Decide that you don't have to do that. You don't. Deal with one thing at a time. You're not a robot. You're not expected to be the almighty problem solver of all eternity, capable of dealing with a million things at once. You are only human. Do you expect perfection in yourself? Is this another idea that needs to be banished?
...and i find it difficult to say the least.
Tell us one thing....one problem....that you need help with. Talk about it and see if others can help you work through it. Decide that you can work on it. You can decide anything you like. You can decide to stop dealing with everything at once, if you want to. You can decide to move forward and away from this state that you are in. You can decide to reach out here for more help, as often as needed.
Thankyou for taking the time to read
Denise, you are very, very welcome. Thankyou for realizing that it takes time to read and to respond. I will gladly read and write to you, whenever I can and so will a lot of people here.
Now..........Get rid of every knife in your possession. Bundle them up and get rid of them. Everything sharp, that could possibly be used to cut with....get it out of your home, out of your life. Take the first step toward stopping this unhealthy behaviour. Do it, (((((((((Denise)))))))). You can do it!!!
GFN
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Denise,
The horrors you have lived through are unimaginable and no child or adult should have had to indure that much pain.
In no way would I defend what Otus has done. He broke the trust you had developed in him and he must take responsibility for that. However, IMO you had SO much pain buried that needed to come out and be healed, that it was only a matter of time before something or someone would have caused that to happen.
My life looks like a fairy tale compared to yours, but I can, in a small way, relate to needing to heal that very deeply inflicted pain. I am having to go to that place in therapy now and it is very scary and uncomfortable. But if I have any hopes of truly being whole and happy and be able to make good decisions about relationships in the future, it must happen.
I hope that you can find a therapist with whom you can develop a trust so that you, too, can go deep inside to heal the many wounds that have been inflicted. You must be a very amazing woman to have been able to raise your children and do your job so competently and with such love. But now you need to focus on you. I pray that you will find the help you need.
God bless,
Brigid
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Hi,
I can't write much because I'm on some serious pain meds and am pretty out of it. But here's a great place for support and I got there often.
www.survivors-treehouse.net.
The site is slowly growing and the chat is wonderful. There's another site out there, but I've found it be be quite abusive itself and don't recommend it in any way. I chat almost daily at the treehouse. Sometimes no one is there, but if you just hang out, someone usually shows up. The more people we get going there, the more people to chat with. So spread the word.
Shwankey
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Shwankey[/quote]www.survivors-treehouse.net. THANKS
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Getting absolutely pie eyed drunk, can be fun! I wonder how many of us can remember trying to put one foot in front of the other having had ten to many? It's sooooooo simle really....but for all the effort in the world.....and no matter how hard we try.......it nearly always ends with us falling over and into a heap upon the floor! Fun I know, but I'm trying hard to aliken the situation Denise lives in today with the aforementioned.
No she's not pissed drunk....on booze or tablets. But as hard as she tries....and boy does she try.....Denise always manage to grab the wet end of the stick! She sees the paint on one end of the stick.....she does he level best not to grab that end.....but damn it, she always manages to get her hands covered in the paint.....no matter what, no matter how hard she tries not to!
I visited this site a number of years ago....and hung around for a time. I found it to be informative.....good....fair.....honest. Years later and thinking on about Denise, I thought it might be a good idea for her to talk with other perhaps troubled minds. So I told her that I was going to post about her on the net....I kind of got her agreement.....and then went ahead and wrote what I did earlier. That same evening.....I told her, in passing, that her story was up live and on the air right now! I could sense the whiff of panic over the phone as she started to ask: 'what, where, how....! So I told her....and she came here a calling!
This is all new stuff for her.....she hasn't got a clue about internet forums.....and not much more about computers at that :lol: ! Over the phone whilst talking to me, she started to read it......and promptly hit the roof! Not because I'd lied or anything.....just with the shear shock of it all being soooo very public now! For years she'd bottled it up inside.....and now the whole bloody world new! It took her a time to calm down and start to analyse what I'd written. The next day and she was pretty much happy with the entire piece....albeit not entirely.
It had taken Denise several attempts to get out of me where I'd posted her story. Mainly because I knew she'd hit the roof....because it was a first and she hates new things. She avoids going out...unless she has to...or if it's with someone she knows really well.....like me for instance. Anything new is not good and is always met by a huge panic attack across her face. Denise has a great scowling face......leaves no one in any doubt that she's pissed off :D ! But I pushed her into it.......in a vain hope I could get her to talk more to others in yet another attempt to get her to push her bounderaries!
You see, Denise is very much like the drunk I mentioned earlier. She knew what I was going to do.......but couldn't cope with it after I did it! Well it's her life I was writing about.....her secret! By the time she'd read to the end of the first paragraph, she'd already found something she didn't like. By the end of the entire piece......panic had set in! It took me a time to calm her down, but by then, she'd fired two corrections off in reply!
This might seem strange....easily so for someone not in Denise's shoes.
But then again Denise is learning to walk all over again! I don't wish to minimise people who can't walk.....but Denise is just like a crippled person.....only in the head! So on the surface there's nothing wrong.....not even a slured speach to suggest her damage.....but damage there is.....and by the bucket load! So having first posted my piece....and on behalf of someone else in the hope you could help me help her.....she stumbled into the world of help forums......and it looked as if we, Denise and I, were argueing! We weren't, I was just holding her hand as I helped her forward......you've got to give her a push sometimes.
Now she's busy posting to a number of the sites you've kindly directed her towards......the more the merrier. Yes I went about things the long way round......and yes this is all so very new for her.....but given time, she'll come out of her shell....and with people like you supporting her.
Denise has told me that someone wrote to her about: Otus, Denise and David being one and the same person. So I'd like to finally add this: Otus is the name of a submarine I served on in the Royal Navy many years ago. I used it as a name I could post by. Denise on the other hand, it knew to this.....and used her real name not understanding why she shouldn't :roll: . And as you now know.....my name is David and I'm a stunningly bald, fat, 45 year young, beast of a man......from Ireland.....originally......and I can't spell........but I can pass the loudest of farts possible! :P ......and Denise will verify this, much to her disgust 8) .
David
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and Denise will verify this, much to her disgust 8) .
David
I would personally prefer if you did not post anything else telling us personal details about Denise, Otus. Before you did not know that you were breaking confidences ... maybe. Now you do. To continue would be an unwarranted crossing of boundaries, imo.
Please feel free to talk about yourself, even about your relationship as you see it, but nothing further about her. Thank you.
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:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Hi David,
Okay, I remember you from when you posted before. Thanks for identifying yourself. This is what I'm hearing: you are overwhelmed, frightened, panicking, feel responsible, guilty, etc., and you acted out. You invaded Denise's privacy by posting your version of her story, with details that are very personal. I think your intention was to help her, but come on, this was so clearly wrong. Can we help you with your feelings and your story (not hers)? David, do you have a therapist?
bunny
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:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
(((((((safe hugs)))))))
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:cry: Today i feel sad and desperately lonely, i hate this world and i hate the person i have become, i can see no future, i have no hopes, am lost :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Hi Denise,
It sounds like you're feeling very upset about what happened on this board (among other things). I don't think anyone feels critical toward you. We can hold onto some hope for you, since it's hard for you right now.
bunny
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:(
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I'm glad the sad faces are only reduced to one. I'm taking that to mean that you will let us hold onto hope for you. Thanks!
bunny
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Its hard Bunny, so hard, i have felt like giving up on so many occasions, then i read other peoples stories :cry: there is so much pain going on i dont know how people cope, i know am not coping well, i suffer so in turn that means my kids suffer, not directly from me, i just shut myself away, am at the bottom of a big black hole and i need 1 huge ladder to climb back out, one day i hope to awaken from this nightmare and things be normal again, initially i wasnt happy about my life being put out for the world to see, but it is helping a little to know there are many others in the same boat, an most of all am not nuts,i just havent built up a lot of coping skills and i am learning although learning the hard way
Thanks, Denise
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Denise -
Buddhists say that sharing joy increases it, and sharing pain decreases it. your caring about the pain here comforts me, and i suspect a lot of other folks... thank you for that. i hope to god i can do something that will help you in turn.
thank you for that amazing poem you posted. Please post more, if and when you feel like it. they will be appreciated.
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Hi Denise,
Well, you're mainly hearing about the pain, and not as much about the good moments. But they're having some good moments. I know you're trying, keep it up.
bunny
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I just want to clarify a few things about David/Otus who wrote the story about me, hes made himself sound like a victim and a saint, he forgot to mention a few important details.
He didnt pay all my bills at all, i have wrked all my life and provided 4 myself, he gave me money to pay 4 a therapist plus a little extra, my therapy has now ended cos i cant afford to pay her fees.
He left his wife about 10 yrs ago 4 another woman, he divorced about 7 yrs ago, the relationship he was in went bad, she only cared for his wallet not him he split with her at least 3/4 yrs ago and they were apart more than they were together, so he became a player, going round sleeping with all kinds saying he was doing them a favour, then stupid me comes into the picture, he kinda 4got to tell me by this time he was living back with his ex wife, just as friends he says, 4 months into the relationship he has sex with another woman amongst other things, he used my pc 1 night and didnt log out so i got to read all the dirty disgusting details, then hes txting his ex probably trying to get back with her, so i let this go, a few months down the line hes at it again on the net looking 4 women, theres at least 3 i know about, it makes me sick, i had told him stuff i havent told any1 b4 i trusted him i believed he was genuine, but he abused me mentally, so in april last year it causes me to have a major breakdown, my whole life starts to unfold,i am in pieces now, things arent getting better, David pretends to b my friend when it suits him, ive lost everything my job my friends my family my confidence and my sanity, i cant go on like this, its a sad lonely world, with 1 rejection after another, ive had enough of it, David on a few occasions has said get your head together or sign yourself in hospital, hes even told me to take an overdose, am broken and i never see a way out of this, i feel emotionally worse by the day, my options left arent very good but life isnt good either
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I didnt know properly what a narcissist was, i most certainly do now :cry:
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((((((((Denise)))))))
I'm sooo glad to see you posting here and to hear that you have been reading. Like Stormy, I want to thank you for caring about the other people's pain here too. You are a kind soul to be thinking of others when you are feeling so low down sad. :(
Today i feel sad and desperately lonely, i hate this world and i hate the person i have become, i can see no future, i have no hopes, am lost
What really is amazing about days where I am feeling really sad and down on myself...is that it does seem so overwhelming. I keep thinking things like...."everything is rotten, things will never change, I can't take much more of this, etc...". Plus....plenty of negative thoughts about myself drift in and out of my mind. The more I allow myself to keep thinkig this way, the sadder and more depressed I feel.
Why can't we just be sad..get the feelings out.. and forget all the crappy thinking?
I have no idea. :? But...I do know that when I finally say to myself: "Ok, that's enough. You've cried enough for one day, do something else. No more thinking like this for now".....and stuff like that......I begin the journey out of despair and back to living life.
Another thing that has helped me when I was feeling lousy about myself was to make lists. Lists of what I would like to change about me. Lists of the stuff that is changable. Lists of ways to work on change. Lists of things I would like to do in my life. Lists of doable things. Lists of how to go about doing some things. I admit.....I do make a lot of lists. Sometimes it helps to try to organize my thoughts on paper. The lists don't solve problems/make any improvements but they help to clarify precisely what I can and cannot work on improving in my life, in my world, in the world. The rest.....I just have to accept.
So Denise, who ya gonna call??? (Ghostbusters...da da da da...ba ba ba ba)-- :D :D just being goofy Denise--- :D :D .
What do you think Denise? Have you ever made lists or tried to sort out exactly what, in your life, can and cannot be changed?
For instance: It's so hard when one feels lonely to think that there is any way to change that but...if we really think about it....there are lot's of ways. In your case....maybe you could call one of your kids to see what's going on in their life? Maybe you need a pet? Maybe it would help to volunteer some place and be around others, less fortunate, and others who are working to do something nice for them? Maybe you could join a group of some type....possibly meet a few new friends? Or take a course in something that interests you? Or start a group of your own on something you like, or just to share with others? Maybe helping out at a school or a church in your area might help? Or an animal shelter?
The thing is.....you aren't going to get any less lonely (and neither are any of the rest of us) by staying home alone, right? What do you think?
You might be pleasantly surprised how much better you feel....just by starting something new, especially.....something you enjoy. I know this does not erase your pain, or make up for your losses, which you must still grieve, but it would give you a break, inbetween, and something to look forward to. You will begin to feel better about yourself and your life, I bet!
I was sorry to hear that you can't afford to pay for therapy. That's a tough one Denise. But....not impossible, I think. Maybe you can call a woman's shelter, in your area, and see if there might be some one there to help. They often have low cost, or free councellors, willing to speak with you. Or possibly...the distress centre will know about what's available? Or maybe there is a pastor/reverand/priest/rabbi....you would ask for help? The mental health services, through hospitals...will often have support groups. There has to be a place where you can find some one to talk with about your feelings/troubles, Denise. You just have to find it.
These two issues......finding something meaningful to add to your life and some one to speak with in counselling/therapy.....might be just the two things that could start to give you hope about your life, and the world.
My advice is....don't allow yourself to think/say to yourself......I hate myself, my life, the world etc. Tell yourself to stop thinking those things. Instead......try to pin point exactly what you would like to change...figger out which stuff can be changed (and which stuff can't), and decide on things you can do to work on those changes that are possible. The rest, you will have to accept because if it can't be changed.....there is nothing else to do.
The old serenity prayer has much wisdom in it, imo.
Keeping you in my prayers, Denise.
GFN
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Denise,
Can David keep paying the therapist?
bunny
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So much trauma, you are in my thoughts
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I want to thank you all for your kind replys, its nice to know people understand.
Bunny, i dont know if David will keep paying for my therapy, after plenty of talking and tears last night he said he will, hopefully in june i should get a new therapist on the NHS which will be free, but i wont hold my breath as i thought i was getting one last month.
GFN, thankyou also for your reply, my concentration is not good at the moment, but when i have read properly what you wrote i will reply in full, thanks again
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You're welcome Denise:
I hope you will reread and reread and that your concentration will improve. Maybe just read a little at a time?
I'm glad you have found a way to continue therapy for now and glad to hear that you will be getting it covered (free), eventually. That will be a big relief, I'm sure. :D
You are in charge of what you do, Denise. Hope you will take charge and make healthy choices...from now on. You can do it!! 8)
GFN
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:cry: I am giving up finding any real help, ive been abandoned yet again, by friends and my doctor, if they cant help, noone can :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Hi Denise,
What is happening that you are spiralling downward. What did your doctor not do?
bunny
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I asked her to get me signed in somewhere for proper help, she said she would phone back she never, my head is totally messed up, and am not coping
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This is the wrong site for me to be on, ive posted stuff elsewhere with little response, am giving up now
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The purpose of the site is to talk and let your feelings out. It is early afternoon here, so give it sometime for people to respond. Don't give up, give more!
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Ive nothing to give anymore, sorry
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Denise,
There is one more thing you could try. Email Richard Grossman. I believe he will answer you. ragrossman@voicelessness.com. I understand that you are feeling that everything is destroyed and there is nothing left, but that isn't the case. It feels that way. But the reality is not that. Keep posting.
bunny
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Denise,
I know it is the middle of the night where you are, but I wanted you to know that people here do care and want you to get help. You need more than us. That is very apparent. But we want to provide support and caring. We can't heal you--only professionals can do that. But we will pray for you and send you cyber hugs and keep you in our thoughts.
Hang in there and hopefully you contacted Dr. Grossman.
((((((((Denise)))))))))))
Brigid
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Hang in there Denise.. go to the emergency room if you can't get help any other way and can't get through the night without it... things look different when the morning comes... don't give up now, there's all kinds of good that can come if you don't give up.
(((((((safe hugs)))))))
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Its afternoon now, i dont feel any better, i just cry and cry all day long, ive spent nearly all week in my bedroom, alone, no conversation, no nothing, ive run out of valium that keep me calmer and less anxious, my only release is to hurt myself,or take tablets to make me sleep, i cant go to the emergency room because i am agrophobic, i feel sick trapped alone an desperate, the only thing going through my head is if i take just a few more pills, it will be over the pain will go away, then i get put on a guilt trip how bad other people will feel.
I ask one thing, where are these people now? :cry: :cry:
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Denise,
Do not think of the people who have hurt you, think about those who love you. Think about your children and the hurt they would have if you left them. Can you call one of them for help? Your life is worth living and you can heal from this, but you must want to do that. Look into your soul and find the many reasons that a good person like you is needed and wanted. You have a story to tell and there are many damaged people out there who can learn and be helped by that. Turn your pain into power. Don't let the abusers win.
I'm praying for you Denise and I guarantee that many others here are as well. Please don't give up.
Brigid
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Denise,
I'm glad you were able to post here about how bad you're feeling and what you are afraid you'll do to get relief. Keep posting about your feelings of abandonment here. You're not as alone as you think. Do they have phone crisis lines in the UK where you can talk to someone at any hour?
bunny
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Hi Denise, sorry I haven't contributed to your thread before now. I'm in the UK too. About Bunny's suggestion, how about you call up the Samaritans? They're good, they listen, you can visit them if you wish I think. See: www.samaritans.org.uk
Please have a look and keep posting Denise, best wishes Portia
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The abusers are winning, every1, am reliving it every day, i must have lived in about 40 different homes when i was young, there was no love no hugs no1 to pick you up when you fall down, no birthday or christmas presents, i didnt exsist then and i dont now, there isnt even medical records before the age of 16, which is very strange.
I had a mother who left us days at a time, one time the nspcc came round we were alone, we got taken into care, but shortly sent back home, i was 2 yrs of age my sister 3, left to fend for ourselves, when betty (MOTHER) was there, was she loving us, nooooooooo, she was smashing dishes an hammers over my head, an then theres wilson, my sex abuser, knowing betty would be away days at a time he would climb through the window an get me, putting his thing in my mouth, peeing in my mouth and all over me, rubbing it in my face, inserting things in my front and back passage, the pain was unbelievable, and he may get away with it, it sickens me to death, i was a little girl.
Then we get the care system, we have the jones among the 40 homes, who physically mentaly and verbaly abused me, why i ask myself, the damage caused can never be put into words, then i grow up, and get the ex boyfriends, beating me to a pulp on a daily basis, breaking my jaw etc kicking a baby out of me, this is just a tiny bit of what i am trying to deal with, so i take tablets to sleep the time away, and when am desperate i slash myself to release the tension, i just want all the memories and feelings to go away, and when i say this is a tiny bit of it, i meant it, there was so much more, and why i ask myself, cos i was born, is my conclusion
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Ive tried phoning helplines, like the samaritans, i cant talk to strangers, i get to overwhelmed with emotion, ive got no1, three times ive slashed myself this week :oops: cos i just cant cope
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Hi Denise,
Your childhood sounds worse than anything I've heard in a long time. :cry: Somehow you made it through. None of these abusers managed to destroy you. There is life after childhood. I understand that you don't believe it now because of the anxiety. Just keep posting even if it's only to say you have no one. Are weekends generally bad for you?
bunny
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But they are destroying me now, and yes weekends are the worst, thats when am completely alone, i wonder if i was dead how long it would take any1 to realise, i am dead inside now and no1 has noticed, what do i do, where do i go?
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My question has just been answered for me, if i was dead it would take a while for anyone to notice, so why be here in the first place unnoticed unheard
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Denise: we are noticing you, we are loving you, we feel your pain, we care.
If we could we would be holding you. We are "strangers" too, but we are friends as well. There are other friends, others who care, who want to help. Please open to that. You are not invisible. You are not nothing. You are loveable and we want to help you see that. There are people where you are who will help you do this. Let them. It's ok.
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Denise,
I know it seems like forever to get an answer. It must seem very unfair and horrible. But you know, people remember that you're here even when they aren't posting.
bunny
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Denise,
I do not know you and have just returned from a week away at a family funeral (my aunt for whom I am named). Your story is so horrible that I do not know how to even respond to you. But I want to say that you have forgotten one very beautiful thing you were born with and no one, no abuse can ever take away. That is the music of your soul. You sing even if you do not know it. I can hear it in your posts to people on this board. Keep singing beautiful soul and you ARE going to get better. You will do this for your self and it will be a gift to all the rest of us who want to see you "weller". Hugs and good wishes, good karma, white light and every possible blessing God can bestow upon you. Much love. Guest4
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Hiya again Denise, Monday 11. am here in England, how are you today?
I know you said you can't talk to strangers, but talking to strangers here has been one of the most positive things I have ever done, if not THE most positive thing in my life.....(I need to think about that to see if that's true, it probably is)..
We're all strangers to each other, unless we talk. We talk and we find out that many people feel similar to us. I wanted to end my life once, I didn't because I thought "what's the point in doing it? No-one will care." Death isn't the answer, it's just nothing. Cutting is kind of okay in my book, as long as it doesn't end you up in Casualty (because the nurses and doctors in A&E are still very dismissive of self-inflicted injury, they don't understand it). Not cutting would be better, but if cutting lets out the pain a little, well, I understand. It's nothing to be embarrassed about, lots of us do it or have done it in the past.
You said you get too overwhelmed with emotion to talk to people, the Samaritans for example. What did you mean? That you can't physically talk? That's okay. They'll listen to you cry instead. You don't have to just talk. And if you wish, you can visit one of their offices if there's one close to you.
Letting safe people see your pain will most probably help you. And help you lots - but it does take time. Please think about this? And keep posting, we want to listen to you too. best, Portia
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PS. proper time check here...currently...11.26 am and it's darn cold for May. Bye for now, portia
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Hi Denise:
So sorry to hear that you are feeling so low down awful. :( :( It's not very nice for you and it probably seems like it can't or won't change, maybe??
Denise, what if you did contact the samaritans? What if you call them and explain that you need help but it's hard to talk to strangers? What's the worst thing that could happnen? They could hang up on you, maybe?? :shock: The probability of that happening is next to ziltch, I bet. :D
In the short time you've been here, talking to strangers......do you feel the warmth from the words of response to you? Do you believe people it..... here actually care? It's true!!!
For me, bothering to write a response to someone, taking the time to try to put my thoughts into words, trying to say something to encourage, trying to connect...with the person in some way....with you....all of that is done because I care. Believe it or not...and I'm a stranger (maybe stranger than some :roll: ) but I do care that you are suffering...feeling alone and lost... and I want to help. I don't like to know that you feel so hopeless and I want you to know that I will post to you as often as I can. I think there are other people here who feel the same. Some have already indicated it.
So, Denise....isn't that kind of cool? Even a little? You may not believe this.....but it is possible that if you stick around here, you will find yourself, at some time, writing something similar to what I have written above :shock: , or at the very least, feeling it, about some other stranger, who is suffering and feeling lost and alone....some time. It sounds like you have had a horrendous childhood and many tough experiences as an adult....but the thing is......there are other people here who have felt lost and alone and hopeless too and although they may not have had the same experiences as you, pain is pain, right? So people here will understand.
Denise, don't give up. You don't have to think about the memories so much and they can eventually be filed away and forgotten about. There are ways to train your mind to do this, to deal with the emotional trauma and there are people who can help you learn about all of that. But you have to reach out, just a little further. How about at least calling those samaritans? See if it might help? What's to lose?? :wink:
There is hope, Denise. There really is. :D Others have returned from the deep, dark, abbys. Life sucks sometimes. But so far.....you have survived, you have been very brave to post here at all, you have been honest about your feelings, you have let a bits out, you have communicated your desperation and you have reached out to others here. Those are all accomplishments!! Keep doing that!!
And for today......please do your very best to convince yourself that one phone call isn't the end of all life on earth. That one phone call could be a way to help yourself further. One phone call to the samaritans might ease some of your pain, Denise, and possibly be of even more help than that.
((((((((((((((((Denise))))))))))))))))))
I'd love to know more about your children......not stuff that would identify them.....but stuff about why you love them, what their qualities are, what they have brought to your life, so far, what their accomplishments are, etc.
If you feel like sharing??
GFN
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I just want to say thankyou to you all for your kind words, i still cant write much cos my brain isnt working properly yet, to many tears i think, but i will reply properly in time.
Today i am feeling a little better, theres been a few tears but it looks like i might finally be getting some real help to deal with all the different issues, and put things to rest, i am told i am in for a rocky road ahead while i exorcise all these bad things in my head, but at least help is on its way.
I wish i could treat you all to flowers and chocolates and hugs as a small thankyou, your kind words have helped, please dont abandon me just yet, cos hopefully you will all one day see the real me, the me that doesnt hurt anymore, am still at the bottom of the hole but maybe on the first rung back up the long ladder, thanks again everyone, its nice that complete strangers can be so caring xxxxx
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Denise,
I'm so glad the day is looking a little brighter for you today. You know that the vast amount of damage that has been done to you is going to take a lot of work and time to heal. If only there were a magic wand and fairy dust that could make it all go away and life would be beautiful again.
I would be honored to share those chocolates and hugs with you as you slowly climb that ladder. I'm so proud of you that you have made the choice to save yourself and find that healthy, loving, kind, wonderful person that has been buried under the rubble of abuse, pain and mistreatment inflicted by those who were on this earth to care for you.
I continue to hold you in my prayers, Denise.
((((((Denise)))))))))))
Brigid
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Hi Denise,
I'm glad you're feeling better and are getting real help. :-)
bunny
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Hi Denise, I want to give you flowers and chocolates and hugs and say a great big Thank You to you for letting us know how you are. It's good to know you're getting help. Very best wishes to you for today and tomorrow and all your tomorrows, may there be lots of them. And when you want to post here, we want to know about you too. Believe that! Take of your precious self, P
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Glad to hear you are doing better, Denise.
(((Denise)))
I hope that you keep posting.
Mia
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Hiya Denise:
Glad to hear the hope return to your voice......that you will find the you underneath the pain, that you will be getting help, and that things look a little better. Good for you!!! YOu are no quitter!! :D
Thankyou for wishing me chocolates and hugs! Those are two of my favorite things!!! I wish lot's and lot's of them back to you and not just today, but every day from now on.
I will keep you in my prayers too, Denise. Keep climbing that ladder! One rung at a time! I know it's hard work but you will eventually reach the top. Just keep on trying!! 8) 8) 8)
GFN
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Yesterday evening i had a visit from an emergency team, called race, who are set up for people who are in real danger of hurting themselves, after a long talk i felt a little better cos i thought i was finally going to get some proper help, cos my concentration is poor at the moment i couldnt take in everything that was being said, i woke at 3.40am this morning, my mind working over time, trying to process all that was said, i am still not really any the wiser, they are phoning me again tomorrow, so maybe i will take notes, i got up this morning thinking a little more positive about things, and now i am in pieces again, ive just been pushed off my ladder and left once again in a mess, thanks to my so called friend, so once again am locked in my room, once again theres plenty of tears, once again i feel isolated and alone, and why cos i asked for help with something i wasnt sure about, if my friend had contacted me last night and help explain,as he said he would, my journey maybe could have started today, i feel like i am fighting a losing battle, my brain is in overload, i dont have a therapist now, and i just cant concentrate, now am panicky and upset and dont know which way i am supposed to go :cry: :cry:
Denise
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So i will say, thankyou friend, you know i suffer with anxiety,and you know it was an important issue, you said you would help, i did not shout and scream at you as you said i did, i just wanted help, the day unfolds you lose your wallet and in a rounabout way you blame me, stop for a minute, rewind to yesterday and understand what i said instead of going at me, it was NOT my fault :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Denise
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Denise,
2 positive statements I see you have written that jump out at me:
so maybe i will take notes,
Excellent idea! Good for you! Race wants to help you and you are wise to think of writing stuff down because it is hard to concentrate right now.
Do that!! For sure!! It will help later...to have something to refer to and reinforce the information/ideas. It might help with concentrating too because writing sends the info to your brain in a different way than listening does. Ask them to speak slowly and explain that you are taking notes because of the difficulty you are having concentrating and understanding right now. They will understand.
it was NOT my fault
Ofcourse it wasn't Denise! Good for you for standing up for yourself! For not taking blame that does not belong to you and for coming here to get support because you need it!
Your friend let you down. :( :( :( That hurts. It is disappointing and not what you expected. I'm sorry this has happened.
Is there anyone else you can call on? I'm glad you have reached out here. You are not alone Denise. I am very proud of you for making that call to Race and being so brave. Good for you girl!! :D
GFN
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Hi Denise,
I understand that when Race came, you felt like someone was going to handle the situation and get you help so you wouldn't be alone with your feelings. Then Race told you something but you can't remember it or didn't comprehend it. Maybe you're afraid to phone Race and tell them that you were too panicked at the time to understand what was said, and ask them. But I think they'd be nice to you. We are thinking about you and not forgetting you.
bunny
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I wasnt actually given there number, they are contacted through my doctor, and they are only a short term thing, basically its for people who get that desperate they want to end it all, theres 1 number i was given and thats for putting in complaints about foster care and people abused in care, i am not ready to deal with that issue yet as it is so big, then its got ring EDT or ring CADT, I DONT EVEN REMEMBER WHAT THESE ARE ABBREVIATED FOR, i typed them in on here i think one is an emergency duty team, maybe thats race i am not sure, at the moment i need to deal with the child sex abuse, hopefully by the end of the month i will know what will be the outcome, if hes prosecuted or not, then i can move on to the next issue, i suppose writing things down will help, cos so many memories pop up unexpected and i think i must remember to report that 1 to.
Denise
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At the moment there is no1 else, so airing my anxietys and views on here are helping a little at least it gives me a little direction, thankyou everyone, i feel like i go on a bit, so sorry if it seems that way :oops:
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Hi again Denise:
Go on as long as you need to. There's no limit here to length or depth of need. It's ok.
Sorry no else is around to help. I have a suggestion..which you can take or leave, ofcourse.
How about reading the "Anything thread" from start to finish??
There are a few jokes, some nice poems, people sort of getting to know one another, opinions, stuff like that. It's a long one. It could be a sort of distraction for awhile for you.
You don't have to stay focussed on your problems right now. You could decide to take a little break and just read, a little at a time, right?
It would be ok to do that too, and give your emotions a break, and your mind, from having to worry about serious stuff.....all of the time.
Or if there is something else....a good book you have on hand? I know it's hard to concentrate...but maybe for just a few minutes at a time. It might help? I don't know for sure.
I'm glad you're posting and I hope you will keep on posting. That's a really good thing. And calling your doc and getting in touch with race was another great move!! How about giving yourself a little comfort? Just for awhile? To ease your concentration away from the trauma and onto something more comforting? What do you think?
(((((((((Denise))))))))))
I have to get off here now and go do stuff. I'm sure other people will post back to you too. You're doing ok Denise. You're still reaching out, instead of staying put. That's a good thing. Who cares how much your write? Write and write and post away!! Get your thoughts out and open. It helps make sense of things. And inbetween, maybe read a little bit of something that is off topic...??
GFN
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Hi Denise,
It's great if you can post here and air your anxieties. It may be difficult to feel that we are real people since you can't hear/see us but we know you're there.
bunny
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Hi Denise,
I'm so glad to see you continuing to reach out. That is brave of you. Is there anything creative that you can do to release some of your emotions. Can you draw, knit, sing, write, use clay--anything that allows your mind to flow in a more positive direction and keeps your hands busy. I found knitting to be very therapeutic when I was deeply depressed, and I journaled a lot of my pain.
What about your children? Are you connected to them right now? Does hearing their voices bring you pleasure or least a sense of peace?
Keep posting, as we care and are listening.
Brigid
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What about your children? Are you connected to them right now? Does hearing their voices bring you pleasure or least a sense of peace?
Would it sound terrible to say at the moment no we are not connected, me and my eldest daughter use to be really close, she moved out b4 christmas cos she couldnt cope, and i feel the bond we had has gone, i dont take my problems out on the kids they dont understand, but i know i have hurt them deeply as all they hear is me crying, and saying am going to end it all, ive messed their lives up 2, an i hate myself for it, and sometimes when they are in and chatting, it sounds soooooooooooo loud and i cant cope with it, so i take refuge to my room, this makes me sound terrible as a mum, but i never use to be like this, and in a way ive now damaged them :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Denise
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Denise,
Don't think that the bond with your daughter is gone. She knows that you love her and she knows that you are in pain. But she probably has a hard time understanding it right now. She is not mature enough, nor does she have enough life experiences to figure out how to deal with your pain and also make a life for herself. Maybe that's OK for now and something you just can't handle for the moment. It doesn't make you a bad mother, just a very damaged one that needs help. With time and maturity she will understand that, as will hopefully all your children and those relationships can be mended.
When you read about the evils of parents against their children on this board and you examine your own hell on earth as a child, you must take pride in the fact that you loved your kids and did the best you could for them with the very limited emotional tools you had. You did break the cycle of abuse and that is a wonderful thing.
Brigid
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Denise,
Your children will be okay if they are allowed to express their feelings about their mom's depression. If there is a therapist, or a father, or somewhere they can express their feelings, that leaves space for them to keep hoping for you, even when you can't hold onto hope. That's what kids are good at. They will hopefully be okay.
bunny
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Hey Denise:
Just popping in again on my way back out ('cause I've been thinking of you and hoping things are going a little better for you..even got a couple of prayers in there... :D ).
Would it sound terrible to say at the moment no we are not connected, me and my eldest daughter use to be really close, she moved out b4 christmas cos she couldnt cope, and i feel the bond we had has gone,
See what you said, Denise? "at the moment". For now, right? This lack of close connection isn't permanent, right? Absolutely you can improve your relationship with her...your connection together. And no, it doesn't sound terrible...it sounds like she has the strength to self-preserve herself....that's a good sign...that she takes steps to look our for herself. That's a good thing. You must have done something right to have a daughter who is this confident and assured, who moves out and onward, when she feels unable to cope. She is doing what feels right for her. That's ok, right?
IMO, the bond between you isn't gone. It's just stressed right now because of the way you are feeling. Once you feel better, which will happen in the future, you can work on strengthening that bond (and even now.....you could work on it a little....write little notes to her....tell her what you like about her....how much you love her.....miss her....respect her for looking after herself etc...and give them to her, if you feel it is the right time).
i know i have hurt them deeply
Look, Denise, there is no such thing as a perfect parent. We all make some mistakes and do some things wrong. It's impossible to do otherwise. If you were really physically ill and hospitalized, you would surely, not of your choice, be unable to nuture and care for your children during that time period. Right now...you are not feeling very well, correct? You are unavailable, in some ways, that you used to be available for them. Is this your choice? Your doing? Are you responsible for the trauma that is welling up and tormenting you? Please don't allow the guilt of all of that to get under your skin and lay there or take hold. That's no use and the guilt is deceiving you. I bet it's not your choice to feel this way. I bet you didn't ask for trauma, or for it to well up. I bet you'd rather be tormented by something easier to extinguish......like cockroaches or a leaky roof. Those can be sprayed away or patched up. This emotional stuff....it's not that easy to repair.
It is repairable.....but it takes longer and more care than just a spray of this or a patch of that.
The thing to do is take care of you...in what ever ways you can....which will help you to be a better mom, the best mom you can be. I know it's tempting to feel guilty and sorry, and you can express that to them, if you truly feel there are things that you should try to repair....but the damage..Denise.....is mostly your own suffering. They are living their lives, right? You are doing stuff to try to help yourself too. So that's good.
Whatever eases your suffering...in the healthiest possible way...is good for you and something you can try for.
so i take refuge to my room, this makes me sound terrible as a mum.
No it doesn't. I totally disagree with you. It makes you sound like a mum who is unable to stand a whole lot of stimuli at this time, because of anxiety and stress. It makes you sound like a person who is doing something to preserve your sanity....by leaving a room that feels too loud and intrusive. It makes you sound like a mum who cares about her children but who is feeling powerless to relate/interact appropriately...because of inner turmoil??? Possibly??? And it is a perfectly reasonable, healthy thing to do...retire to your room....if that feels better. It might help them....if you could just say that. Maybe you could try? "Sorry, I need a break from all the stimuli. It feels too much."
Keep trying Denise. Hold onto the idea that this is just the way things are: "at the moment".
This won't last forever. You can and will take more and more steps to feel better and better. It isn't going to happen over night. But it will happen.
Glad you're still posting. Good for you. :D Keep doing that!
GFN
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Bless you Denise. You are worthy and loved. Believe it. You are not alone, you are not foresaken.
"Love will not elude you. Love is simple."
Simple, Denise. Not complicated. You are loved. Don't look for it, don't try to find it. This takes no effort on your part. Just feel it. Know it.
(((((Denise))))))
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Today i was supposed to get a phone call from the race team, and hopefully they were going to explain what they were talking about the other day, but thanks to my so called friend, who had me in tears last night and again this morning, my phones are switched off, cos i cant cope, he still blames me for him losing his wallet, although i was miles away from him at the time, then cos i get frustrated i shout at him, and he says he cant understand why, i give up, am going nowhere yet again, the weekend approaches and my anxiety is building up, no phone call means no help, which also means will i survive the weekend, my son spends the weekend with his girlfriend, my daughter babysits and stays over, am alone, and this is when my mind works overtime, i get over anxious and overwhelmed with emotion, i hate it, i sit here tears in my eyes cos i know whats coming and i cant stop it :cry: :cry: :cry:
Denise
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Whatever happens my kids are my world,i am very proud of them, their good kids on the whole, and i love them always, i hope they stay safe always and will never experience the terrible feelings of loneliness and severe depression xxxx
Denise
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I don't understand what this race thing does, but it sounds pretty important to you. Why switch your phone off?
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Race are there for support, they will sort out a counsellor, they will be there if i feel like ending it all, they will put me in touch with support groups, for survivors of abuse selfharm, their someone to talk to and point me in the right directions, basically its an emergency unit, aimed at people like me when in desperation, my phones are off cos of the verbal i was getting this morning and yesterday, i cant take it, i was given an apology but with a but at the end, it doesnt matter what i say or do, i am in the wrong all the time :cry: , if someone wants to help and be your friend, shouldnt that be the case all the time, and not just when they are away from home and their ex partner, everything changes, so i get upset and shout with sheer frustration, so they attack me verbally, my answer to this is why be my part time friend, mr nice guy, and when back home mr nasty, am i wrong, is my way of thinking wrong?
I cant take it! :cry: :cry:
Denise
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To end it would be easier, rather than having to face these emotional challenges every day, ive lost me in all this, a year on and i still see no bright future, and it cant continue
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(((((Denise))))) hang in there, this will not last and things will change, next week will arrive and until then...you still have us! I know we're not the best thing but we are here and we will listen to you. Even if we don't post to you, we're still listening. Watch the 'viewed' count go up on your thread. It's still going up!
You still have your internet connection and all the amazing things there are on servers all around the world.
You can go anywhere in the world on the internet. Right now I guess we're on a server in America, amazing, these typed words bouncing back and forth across the skies, across the Atlantic (I guess?). Isn't that amazing? You still there Denise?...portia...
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Hi Denise,
Do you know the number for race?
Maybe you could switch your phone on to call them, and tell them what the situation is and have them explain things for you, then afterwards turn your phone back off.
Or maybe you could call them and set up a time for them to call you and only have your phone on at that time.
if someone wants to help and be your friend, shouldnt that be the case all the time.....am i wrong, is my way of thinking wrong?
No, of course you're not wrong. Your 'friend' is wrong. Your 'friend' has his own set of problems and he is putting them on you. You are right to stop him from doing that.
I have come to realize that a friend online who understands and cares is just as much a friend as someone we can touch and here. What matters is the caring not how close they are. There are a lot of people here who care for each other and for you.
I hope you will keep posting here, especially on the weekend, to talk to everyone here and let us know how you are doing and feeling. You are not alone. There are people here who will be your friend and love you. They have done it for me, so I know they will do it for you too.
I'll be your friend and I'll listen to anything you want to say.
If you can, please don't wait for race to contact you. Contact them.
mudpuppy
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To end it would be easier, rather than having to face these emotional challenges every day,
To end it would be a very selfish act, if we consider your children, who will be left...without any mother to love them.
Sorry to be blunt and clear about that...sometimes we need people to be straight with us....for our own good...and for the good of our loved ones.
I wouldn't waste my time if I didn't give a hoot but I do care Denise.
(((((((((Denise))))))))
So.....isn't the thing to do......as Mudpup has suggested....contact Race, since you are feeling these seriously hopeless feelings??? Call them today???
I understand that you feel really, really low and tired and distressed and that every day seems the same. I'm really sad for you and I even feel some of your pain, Denise. But you are the only one who can fix this.
None of that..emotionally challenging stuff is going to change, Denise, unless you DO something....to make it change.
So why not make the call again. Take a few more steps. Forget the friend who isn't helping you. Go to those who want to help you at Race.
Yes....you are doing great by posting here and I'm so glad you are doing that but you need more help than this. You deserve more help than this.
You deserve to feel better and you can and will feel better....but you have to seek help....make the call......join the groups......make new friends.....etc. Not all at once. Just...a little at a time.
And you will see........you will be smiling soon Denise :D !
GFN
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To end it would be easier, rather than having to face these emotional challenges every day, ive lost me in all this, a year on and i still see no bright future, and it cant continue
I can only speak for myself, but don't think I wasn't where you are for years on end.
I spent nine years in therapy and I still take Seroxat every day of my life.
Having said that, my life is full, happy, wonderful and I never, ever worry about things that drive other people crazy because to have come back from the depths of depression is the greatest gift you could imagine.
I think you are in the UK, if so, what medication are you on? Is your GP sympathetic? Have you had therapy? Have you approached your local Social Services? Have you thought about in-patient treatment (voluntarily)?
You are doing a great thing posting here and I, for one, have never heard such a tale so profoundly sad. Bear in mind, YOU were abused, your abusers attempted to 'steal your soul' - they didn't!!!!! It's obviously still in there and still fighting. They harmed you beyond recognition but you deserve to be the person you could have been before you were so violated.
Please don't give up but please try every single resource available to you.
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hope you are there, ive just been thinking about you.
i dont think anyone here would judge you for any coping techniques youve used to get this far. youve come through a lot with the coping tecniques you have, even selfharm, and nothing youve done is wrong!
its brought you this far. i just know how awful it is to feel stuck with horrible feelings and im sorry your going through that. i hope you keep just coming here and saying whatever you want or need. dont feel judged please for anything.
just know im thinking of you and wishing you good things to get you through all these feelings.
please keep saying whatever you need. i wont judge you for ANYTHING! john lennon said - "whatever gets you through the night, its alright"
d'smom
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Hi Denise,
I hope you will turn your phone back on. Being contacted by Race is far more important than anything else. And we're here, keep posting.
bunny
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((((((Denise))))))) You are doing really well, please post again when you can. Meanwhile, take it slowly.
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will i survive the weekend, my son spends the weekend with his girlfriend, my daughter babysits and stays over, am alone, and this is when my mind works overtime, i get over anxious and overwhelmed with emotion, i hate it, i sit here tears in my eyes cos i know whats coming and i cant stop it :cry: :cry: :cry:
Denise
Is there any way you can change your focus on this a little, and see the weekend on your own as a gift? An oasis of peace and quiet in a week of noise and caring for other people? Your children may not be with you, but they are still in your heart, and you can put photographs of them next to your bed, and next to where you usually sit in the daytime, to help you remember them, whether they are there or not.
You may not be able to watch television. Is there a favourite film you like to see; one that you know well, and can enjoy? Can you plan a nice bubbly bath? Maybe go for a walk somewhere peaceful? Or you could explore the internet a bit more; take a round the world trip to all those places you wanted to see. Your choice. :)
Everyone deserves a holiday, so maybe this weekend can be a mini holiday for you, rather than something to fear.
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Portia, thankyou just for being there and reading and listening
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Mudpuppy,i dont know the number for the race team, as it was done through my doctor, i am waiting for her to ring me with some details how i can contact them.
I still feel very low, but i havent slept well all week, waking at 3.30/4.00 every night, so it doesnt help being tired.
Thanks for offering friendship
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GFN, its ok being blunt, you are entitled to your opinion, but if i could fix this that easily, i wouldnt be in this state in the first place.
I know what you are saying about joining groups etc but i am agrophobic, it makes me physically sick at the moment to go out and more so meeting new people, i am ashamed of how i have become :oops:
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Serena, am glad your life is sorted out now, as you say it takes time.
My meds r reboxetine highest dosage i can take, diazapam and zolpidem, ive been on the reboxetine a good few months now, and i actually think they are making me go backwards instead of forwards, so i think i will get them changed again.
My gp is ok, but if you live in the uk, you will know what the NHS is like, i need to see a psychologist this approximate waiting time is 18 months, ive got 5 to go, race are going to try and get it brought forward.
As 4 social services, i have been told to approach them but to complain not to ask for help, after being shoved in 40 different homes, would you want help from them?
Hospital frightens me to death, i was locked away as a child in various places, and thats how i see hospital, and what will it achieve anyway, they will just drug me up so i cant think about anything.
My abusers didnt steal my soul, they stole my innocent childhood, and now they have returned in my mind to steal my adulthood :cry: :cry:
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d'smom, thankyou to for thinking of me, and taking the time to let me know, i am grateful
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Hi Denise:
Hope you are still reading. Hope you are feeling a little better too. I am keeping you in my prayers.
Hiya October: Thankyou for your comments about what I said about ending it all to Denise. Maybe it does sound like I don't understand?
You wrote: That is applying a value judgement to an illness, and shows lack of understanding, imo.
I think you might be assuming that I have never been in a suicidal state and therefore I may have no empathy. That's ok October. We all assume incorrectly sometimes. It's easy enough to do. :D
The desire to kill oneself is not a choice,
I totally agree with you here. The desire is a symptom of illness that needs treatment. That's why it's important for Denise to seek help.
The act......however....of ending it all......is a choice. One that many of us have contemplated, or felt a great desire to perpetrate on ourselves. It's one thing to want something, to think about it, to desire it and another.....to do it.
But thankyou for bringing this up because I think it is important to establish the difference. Reason is something that influences choices.
In order to choose suicide, we must reason away all other choices, all other responsibilities, all other comforts and convince ourselves that there is a good enough reason to do it....to end it all. I believe Denise's children are a good enough reason...not to.
I like the comforts you suggested to Denise. Chocolate in bed!! :D Great idea!!!
I'm sorry that you're having a hard time right now October. Good for you for coming here and trying to help Denise! That is very considerate of you and generous. :D There you are again, giving and giving. (((((October)))))
GFN
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October, i thank you with all my heart, you must be experiencing bad things also, to know and understand exactly how i feel, i feel for your pain to :cry:
And thanks for defending me, i am not a selfish person, quite the opposite i am just having difficulty coping with all these bad feelings in my head and in my heart.
"Six more days hopefully and i find out if my sexual abuser will be prosecuted, do people really know how this feels, its like waiting for a bomb to go off, this is why i feel so overwhelmed worthless and like giving up, its making me worse not knowing the outcome, and theres a very big chance he will walk free, he knows what he done to me and i know and it sickens me everyday to think about it, this is just the first thing i have to sort out, so i say sorry to people who think it maybe selfish to have suicidal thought, but am sure if you were in my head right now you would feel the same" :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Sorry to put this on your posting october, its not meant for you or not meant to sound nasty, i just want people to understand how desperately hard things are at the moment.
Thanks again for your understanding, your an angel xx
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GFN, my children are a reason for not ending it, but i can give you a million other reasons to end it, i am in an extremely heightened state of depression sadness loneliness despair worthlessness emptyness, my heart aches with pain my eyes permanently filled with tears, my thoughts are bad, i agree, but even just for a day if this would all go away, it would help, maybe i would see a future, whereas now i see now, not tomorrow or next week, if you read my social services files, you would probably understand better what is going on right now :cry: :cry: :cry: i am not bad, i am just helpless in my self at the moment
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Denise,
I'm sorry things are so bad right now. I'm sure the anxiety of awaiting the results of the sexual abuser is overwhelming right now.
I am fortunate to have never been in a suicidal state, but when I was in the depths of my situational depression, I could, for the first time in my life, understand how someone could make that decision.
I hate the weekends too. I hope you take some of October's advice and find a way to enjoy the quiet and do something special for yourself. A bubble bath with nice music is a great indulgence and something we can't really enjoy when the kids are around.
I hope you can get through to Race and begin a plan for getting some help.
((((((((Denise))))))))))))
Brigid
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Good to hear you :) Denise. I’ll pinch something you said to GFN:
i am ashamed of how i have become
Where you are now is your situation and thinking and feeling right now. It isn’t YOU. Where you are is not all that is you: you are something separate underneath all this suffering. You are the you that was born a happy baby full of joy with life. I guess that didn’t last long and I’m so sorry. But you know what babies are like, they’re not bad or imperfect, they just are, they want to exist.
Somewhere in you is the same YOU that wants to live and experience life. It’s hidden away because of the intense cruelty you’ve suffered, for no reason other than being someone in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Please don’t be ashamed of your self, because your self is still pure. It’s the garbage piled on you that’s the problem: not you. I hope your abuser does get justice - but if not? It’s nothing to do with you: it’s an imperfect system. Will you be safe from him if he does walk free?
Hope you get that number soon and I sympathise about the NHS. It’s far from effective. Keep posting, we’re listening and thank you for your reply! Take care of your self (((Denise)))
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Hi again Denise:
I must have posted my post to you above, while you were busy posting also, so I didn't see some of yours until now.
Good to see you posting!
i am not bad,
Denise, good standing up for yourself!! I don't think you're bad and I doubt anyone else here does either. Have I ticked you off a little?
i am just helpless in my self at the moment
I don't think you're selfish, or bad, or any negative such thing. I think you are a good person who has been through h*ll and is still here to talk about it. You're no quitter!! You're still posting so that shows me that you are struggling to communicate and reach out. That's great!!
I have given you an idea that you could decide to use to help yourself. You could tell yourself that suicide would be a selfish act because your children would be left without a mother to love them. This might be the ticket to keep you here....and give you a reason to seek help. If you tell yourself this and decide to believe it.....it will help you.. to not choose ending it. You have said how much you love your children. I believe you Denise.
Our mind is a powerful device. It can be used to harm us. Our abusers know this and go to great lengths to convince us of nasty things, to instill us with negative feelings, to control us. Every minute that we allow their words, their faces, their nasty behaviours, their desire to fill us with fear and hate and especially self-hate...to occupy our minds.....is a minute they win space in our heads from us, another assault they get away with. I'm sure your abusers would be very glad to know you are feeling this way. :twisted: I bet they would rejoice if you were to end it all. :twisted: :twisted:
They would ultimately win....their horrible game of destruction. Don't let them win Denise!!!
There is one place you do have power, Denise. It is in your head. You can indeed decide to take away your abuser's power. Maybe it won't all happen today, and I know it won't be an easy task....but it is something to consider possible.....something to look forward to....a way to get back at them. Please don't give up and let those b#$%^&d's win. They've taken enough from you. :( :( :(
i am in an extremely heightened state of depression sadness loneliness despair worthlessness emptyness, my heart aches with pain my eyes permanently filled with tears, my thoughts are bad,...
I'm sorry that you are feeling so very lost and all this pain. The hospital seems similar to some horrors from your past. It might be possible to reject this idea. What if you imagine.....pretend.....on purpose.....that the hospital is a comfortable place, a place where there are people who want to help you, a place where you feel safe and cared for??
These are just thoughts, Denise. They won't hurt you. They are just ideas that you could substitute and concentrate on....for a little while.....to give yourself a break from all the pain. What would it hurt?
Maybe while having that bubble bath Brigid suggested?
Keep posting Denise. (((((((((Denise))))))))
GFN
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Serena, am glad your life is sorted out now, as you say it takes time.
My meds r reboxetine highest dosage i can take, diazapam and zolpidem, ive been on the reboxetine a good few months now, and i actually think they are making me go backwards instead of forwards, so i think i will get them changed again.
My gp is ok, but if you live in the uk, you will know what the NHS is like, i need to see a psychologist this approximate waiting time is 18 months, ive got 5 to go, race are going to try and get it brought forward.
As 4 social services, i have been told to approach them but to complain not to ask for help, after being shoved in 40 different homes, would you want help from them?
Hospital frightens me to death, i was locked away as a child in various places, and thats how i see hospital, and what will it achieve anyway, they will just drug me up so i cant think about anything.
My abusers didnt steal my soul, they stole my innocent childhood, and now they have returned in my mind to steal my adulthood :cry: :cry:
Hi Denise
I've had a look at the drugs you are on and a note of caution, don't take the diazepam and the zolpidem together. They are both sedatives. The Reboxeting is an NARI - a noradrenaline reuptake inhibitor. I would go back to the GP and have a word with him about how you feel on it. Discuss with him if you would be better with an SSRI - selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (or a combination of both).
Also, please don't assume my advice is professional and I would urge you to see your GP. When you are feeling better, I would approach Social Services and ask for ALL your files from your childhood which you can now get owing to the Freedom of Information Act.
Good luck :D
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I know the diazapam are to keep me calm, andd the zolpidem are to make me sleep, sometimes i take both together, still doesnt make me sleep, thanks for info on others, ive been on sertraline before an mitrazipine, thanks anyway
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I got my files from social services, this is what has caused half the problems, terrible reading, things i found out that i didnt know before, its really sad :cry:
Denise
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Hi Denise,
I think it's very risky to read your files without a therapist present and/or available by phone. I am sorry you are reading them and being traumatized. Isn't your therapist ethically obliged to talk to you or see you, even if you can't pay?
a concerned bunny
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Hi Denise,
I think it's very risky to read your files without a therapist present and/or available by phone. I am sorry you are reading them and being traumatized. Isn't your therapist ethically obliged to talk to you or see you, even if you can't pay?
a concerned bunny
I can't speak for Denise, but I live in England. It's almost impossible to get anything other than monthly visits to a psychiatrist, or a short course (6 weeks) of 'therapy'.......... They prefer the pharmaceutical option over here.
I was incredibly lucky to have a fantastic doctor who referred me to a psychoanalyst who took the occasional 'charity' case. I was with him for 9 years and he let me turn into the person I deserved to be.
Denise - from your posts, you are a warm, intelligent and emotionally aware person. Please try to nurture the child you were born as, the one that life sh*t upon from a great height. Your recovery will be sublime, it is no more than the life you should always have had. Your memories will always be with you but will recede in their horror. I sometimes think that the profound sorrow of abuse is not what happens at the time, but its' aftermath.
You are less wonderful and lovable just because adults treated your childhood like an emotional punchbag and a receptacle for abuse.
Kindest thoughts
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Sorry, posting earlier as 'guest' as I didn't sign in
From my last post:
You are less wonderful and lovable just because adults treated your childhood like an emotional punchbag and a receptacle for abuse.
Obviously I meant to say You are NO less..................... etc.
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Bunny, serena is right what she says, unless you pay, there is a huge waiting list, i am under a psychiatrist, for all the good it does, Serenas lucky if she got once a month, mines once every 3 months,i have found the NHS here is really bad for getting me help, its only now over a year down the line, and cos i threatened suicide things are moving, although still very slowly.
The only help i got when reading my files was, little tags attached to certain pieces of information, saying "sensitive", theres a lot of stuff they dont tell you, to do with Betty (mother) and other siblings cos its all data protected, so it still leaves a huge gap in your life.
And theres no medical records for me before the age of 16, or they have very conveniently disappeared, how can you live in so many places and have no medical history, if i go in hospital and they ask "does anyone suffer from this that or the other" i say i dont know, cos of the data protection we dont get family medical history.
Even down to the NSPCC, it clearly states they intervened on a few occasions, 1 time finding me and my sister abandoned, i was 2 she was 3, the NSPCC had the care orders placed on us when i was 6, and yet again there are no records, the social services on the whole messed up hugely in the 1970s its only now people are starting to sue them for compensation, cos there was that much abuse, neglect from their part etc that went on, it makes me wonder if maybe this is why so much information is missing :(
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Portia, you asked will i be safe,. these are questions i have also asked, at one time i was getting strange phone calls about 14 a day and night, i would answer they would hang up, number withheld all the time, it really freaked me out, it went on for weeks, then the police were going to put a trace on my phone and it stopped.
I am concerned either way if he walks free or is prosecuted, i wouldnt even know him now if i walked past him in the street, not knowing what he looks like does make me afraid, not just of him, but any of his associates, the police say he has a huge criminal record, hes been a hard man in his time, so yes i do find it worrying, not just 4 now but 4 the future to, cos he could just bide his time then come looking for me :(
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As I was slowly passing
an orphan's home one day,
I stopped for just a little while
to watch the children play.
Alone a girl was standing
and when I asked her why,
she turned with eyes that could not see
and she began to cry.
I'm nobody's child,
I'm nobody's child.
Just like the flowers
I'm growing wild.
I got no mummy's kisses
I got no daddy's smile.
Nobody wants me,
I'm nobody's child.
No mummy's arms to hold me
or sooth me when I cry,
'cos sometimes I feel so lonesome
I wish that I could die.
I'll walk the streets of heaven
where all blinds can see.
And just like for the other kids
it will be a home for me.
I'm nobody's child,
I'm nobody's child.
Just like the flowers
I'm growing wild.
I got no mummy's kisses
I got no daddy's smile.
Nobody wants me,
I'm nobody's child.
I have posted this elsewhere, its just a song i remember from childhood, that i wanted to share with people
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Brigid, thankyou, Race are actually coming to see me today just to give a little support :)
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Denise,
That's great news! Glad to see you are in an upbeat mood today.
((Denise))
Enjoy your day.
Mia
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Thanks Mia, enjoy your day also
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Denise,
So good to see a smiling face on your post. Also so good that Race is coming to see you. I will keep you in my prayers that something good happens from that. You deserve it so much.
Brigid
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Bunny, serena is right what she says, unless you pay, there is a huge waiting list, i am under a psychiatrist, for all the good it does, Serenas lucky if she got once a month, mines once every 3 months,i have found the NHS here is really bad for getting me help, its only now over a year down the line, and cos i threatened suicide things are moving, although still very slowly.
The only help i got when reading my files was, little tags attached to certain pieces of information, saying "sensitive", theres a lot of stuff they dont tell you, to do with Betty (mother) and other siblings cos its all data protected, so it still leaves a huge gap in your life.
And theres no medical records for me before the age of 16, or they have very conveniently disappeared, how can you live in so many places and have no medical history, if i go in hospital and they ask "does anyone suffer from this that or the other" i say i dont know, cos of the data protection we dont get family medical history.
Even down to the NSPCC, it clearly states they intervened on a few occasions, 1 time finding me and my sister abandoned, i was 2 she was 3, the NSPCC had the care orders placed on us when i was 6, and yet again there are no records, the social services on the whole messed up hugely in the 1970s its only now people are starting to sue them for compensation, cos there was that much abuse, neglect from their part etc that went on, it makes me wonder if maybe this is why so much information is missing :(
Denise, nice to see you more positive today and I'm glad Race are coming around. There is a lot of frustration with the interaction of the Freedom of Information Act and the Data Protection Act. I'm pretty sure a lot of social service dept. 'cleansed their files' prior to the FOI becoming law. I also think it's very sad that you weren't taken into care at age three and forcibly adopted to a family that would have loved you. That's what would happen today.....
Kind regards
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Thats part of what i dont understand, and dont have access to the information, there are 10 of us all together, various fathers, two sisters where adopted, 1 a year younger than me the other i think 3 yrs younger, i use to say "what did they do, put us all in a line, and the people choose which 1s they wanted".
We were all split as kids, me and my sis who have the same dad were brought up together, there were 5 to the stepdad (the abuser) 2 of which were adopted and three more to different dads, plus various, miscarriages, 1 cot death, 1 stillborn and i think even an abortion was in there, as we became adults we have kind of met other siblings, but cos they got different dads they dont class me and my sis, as their sisters, strange but true, i understand there was no bond as kids but you would think in growing up it would have brought us close, but its done the opposite, the 2 youngest sisters, we have just made contact with b4 christmas, havent seen them since they were babies, so we are starting to build a relationship up slowly, its a little difficult as they never got taken in to care properly, they were in and out all the time, and cos of this they still have contact with Betty (mother), whereas the only contact i want with her is when i know shes died, as bad as thats sounds, and thats just to make sure its her, shes an EVIL, WICKED, DERANGED, SICK IN THE HEAD WOMAN, and thats an understatement
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At first when my story was posted on this site i felt very negative about it all, but it does help to talk to people and everyone has been so supportive, i cant say am out the woods yet, still a long way to go, but thankyou everyone xxx :)
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Last 2 msges from me, i keep forgetting to sign in, sorry
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Good for you Denise. I doubt what you said about your "mother" (she doens't really deserve that wonderful word) an dher demise would surprise anyone here. Lots of us can relate!
Happy to see you are getting some in person help. Bless you.
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October, i thank you with all my heart, you must be experiencing bad things also, to know and understand exactly how i feel, i feel for your pain to :cry:
And thanks for defending me, i am not a selfish person, quite the opposite i am just having difficulty coping with all these bad feelings in my head and in my heart.
Denise, you are not selfish at all. You are a very loving person, and you are winning. It may not feel like it, but every single day that you carry on, however painful, you are winning a very important battle.
I had a friend who died from cancer last year, leaving a 21 year old daughter. Her family are allowed to remember her with respect and love, with no blame attached to her for dying, due to her illness. I would ask for the same respect for anyone who died from suicide. Another friend of mine lost a sister some years ago, and my friend still feels great anger towards her sister, which is a great shame. Understandable, because she feels abandoned, but nonetheless a shame.
Having said that, however, there is a big difference between wanting to take your life and actually doing it, as GFN says. I can understand and embrace you wanting to do it, and tell you that you are not alone, and that these feelings may feel powerful but they cannot hurt you unless you let them. However scarey it gets, you can survive it all. I know that you are strong, because no matter how much pain you are in, you can still recognise the goodness and love in other people. That, to me, shows that the love within you will protect you through the valley of the shadow. It is a gift, and it will help to keep you safe.
What you need are what is called 'protecting factors'. Your two most important are your children. After that, good friends, who can give you the gift of their time. One good friend is worth a thousand casual acquaintances, imo. After that, tactics. Ways of dealing with the ideation, and living through it.
If things get really bad, then delaying is a good tactic. Rather than fight the impulses, deflect them away from you. This reduces the desire, and allows you to do other things. Decide, ok, I'll do it. But first, I must tidy the house. All of it. (!!) And put my affairs in order. And make sure the children are safe, and not anywhere nearby. You can even set a date, if you like, as long as it is never, ever today. Next week. Next month. Make it as far away as you can, to give yourself time to find another reason to delay. And when that day comes, make sure that the house is tidy ... You get the idea?? This may sound like a cop out to other people, but if it works to keep you safe for another day, and another and another, and then suddenly a year has gone by, then why not?? :)
I would advise not dwelling on how, though. That is not a good path to go down. Put off doing that as much as you possibly can, and in the meantime, get rid of anything dangerous in the house. You know what there is that could be dangerous. Put it in the bin, or take it to the chemist. When you are strong, look after yourself for the times when you are less strong. Make it as difficult as you can.
Make rules. Never with the children around. Never leaving a mess for anyone else to clean up. Never where anyone other than yourself can be hurt as well. All of these can help to protect you. If you have enough rules, you will reduce the chances of anything bad happening. One excellent rule that I have is that I must not die alone. I deserve to have someone with me when I pass into eternity. Pretty tricky to achieve a plan for S with a benevolent bystander to hold my hand. :lol: 8) :lol:
Take care, and I hope the weekend is not being too difficult for you.
Where abouts in the UK are you? I am in Bedfordshire.
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I've had a look at the drugs you are on and a note of caution, don't take the diazepam and the zolpidem together. They are both sedatives. The Reboxeting is an NARI - a noradrenaline reuptake inhibitor. I would go back to the GP and have a word with him about how you feel on it. Discuss with him if you would be better with an SSRI - selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (or a combination of both).
Good luck :D
This is an excellent point. I took Reboxetine for a year or so, and found that it made me worse, and I (eventually) worked out that it was because it works on norepinephrine, which is one of the elements most affected by anyone suffering ptsd. When you have ptsd your levels of adrenaline and noradrenaline/norepinephrine are all over the place, and anything affecting them is best avoided, if possible.
Don't stop taking them just yet, Denise, but I agree you could try switching to an SSRI when you can, with your doctor's help.
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Hi october, you make so much sense in what you say, its funny, when you say about cleaning and getting affairs in order, i have actually done that, thought to myself tonight the night, made sure the house was immaculate, the kids woudnt be around, even made sure i was wearing nice clean fresh pjs (didnt want anyone finding me in old tatty 1s) sounds silly i know, but at the time it all makes sense to me.
This weekend hasnt been as bad as most, the race team where here yesterday 4 support, their going to speak to my doctor on monday about these tablets.
I think the reboxetine, have made me worse, when i was on the metrazapine although i was very tearful, i didnt have all these suicidal thoughts, i was agrophobic but began to get over it, and now its worse than ever, i sob uncontrollably, i cut myself, i think of suicide almost every day, i find i am more anxious irritable, even noise agitates me terribly, and it feels like am bubbling inside ready to explode, did you experience anything similar?
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October, i forgot to say am from the wirral, Merseyside :D
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Hi october, you make so much sense in what you say, its funny, when you say about cleaning and getting affairs in order, i have actually done that, thought to myself tonight the night, made sure the house was immaculate, the kids woudnt be around, even made sure i was wearing nice clean fresh pjs (didnt want anyone finding me in old tatty 1s) sounds silly i know, but at the time it all makes sense to me.
This weekend hasnt been as bad as most, the race team where here yesterday 4 support, their going to speak to my doctor on monday about these tablets.
It is possible that one kind of medication will make your symptoms worse, while another will calm them more. You really need to talk to a doctor, because I don't know enough to be able to give you the informed level of information you need.
The most recent meds I had were Cipralex or escitalopram, which is an SSRI. I was also prescribed a low dose of Risperdal, which prevents or inhibits flashbacks. The first time I took that was such a relief. I didn't realise before how busy my mind was, constantly. Like when you see a photo of a busy part of a city with no traffic on it. So calm and peaceful. That is what happened in my mind. It didn't stop me thinking, but it changed Monday rush hour into Sunday at dawn. :lol:
The symptoms you describe sound like those of hyperarousal, which is a state of extreme wariness, waiting for danger. The kind of feeling you get when confronted with a tiger out of its cage and looking for breakfast. Ptsd affects the body's ability to calm down from this state, and it tends to last and last, and sometimes build to really intense, unbearable levels. In that situation any kind of noise or stress or stimulus would be difficult to deal with.
Your comments about the PJs don't sound silly at all. You were doing the same as I have done over and over. Yes, but not now. Not this minute. Not until this and this and this are sorted. And by doing that you survived. Well done you!!!!!!! You are coping with SI in the only way it can be coped with, and you are finding help, which is really brilliant.
Do me a favour, Denise. When you get your new meds, give the old ones to your chemist, won't you? You know it makes sense. :wink: :lol:
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October, i forgot to say am from the wirral, Merseyside :D
Hmm. Bit of a long way. :lol: :lol: :lol:
I have a cousin lives in Wigan. Haven't been there for years and years. Nice part of the country, though. :)
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When you have ptsd your levels of adrenaline and noradrenaline/norepinephrine are all over the place, and anything affecting them is best avoided, if possible.
Don't stop taking them just yet, Denise, but I agree you could try switching to an SSRI when you can, with your doctor's help.
Excellent points... also, don't forget cortisol. Hyperarousal - the 'fight or flight' response - literally floods you with it, and over time it can make significant changes in your body and brain chemistry.
The combination of an SSRI (fluoxetine) and olanzapine is now approved in the USA for treatment of bipolar depression. Other similar combinations such as October is describing - an SSRI plus risperidone - also would make good sense in theory. (And in October's case they made good sense in practice, too 8) )
Denise, if there is any chance at all that you are bipolar, you should avoid taking an antidepressant (SSRI, SNRI) by itself. It can trigger manic episodes extremely rapidly.
Do listen to October and don't stop any of your current meds abruptly now... there are discontinuation symptoms with some psych meds, and you need to wean off of them. Her advice is also excellent to enlist your chemist's help in sorting out the meds.
I'm sorry that mental health assistance is so sketchy where you are. A good chemist can be a tremendous help with managing your meds when the doctors just don't take the time to help you. And don't forget to mention and bring any herbals you are taking... the ones that work are essentially medicines, afer all, so they can interact with other medicines too.
Good luck Denise. Hang in there... you are worth it.
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Hi
I have just been reading the posts for a while and not posting because I have been going down this past week. still can't work out why, but things feel too much to cope with at the moment. It has not helped that I am in a relapse of my ME and have RSI in my right hand and my knee has been causing a lot of pain. So I have been stuck in more than usual and feeling really lonely. I still go to my divorced support group and counsellors, but I wish I had someone around I could turn to as most of my time I am alone. I know that things have got worse with the counselling, and facing things from my childhood. It was nothing as horrific as yours Denise and you give me hope and courage that, if you are still fighting, then I can too. I don't think you realise what an encouragement you can be to others. You are in a bad way yet you are reaching out and accepting help. I think that shows that you are one h*ll of a person and you will come through one day.
On saying to a potential suicide that they are being selfish.....because my son commited suicide, I learnt a bit about it. Just before a 'successful' suicide, a person goes into a sort of a trance and becomes obsessed with it. If they do not get brought out of the trance, then even if someone intervenes, they will still go on and do it when left alone. It usually takes some shock to get them out of this state because they are not in their right mind and become obsessed with various thoughts, a common one being that their family will be better off without them. This idea is always wrong, a family is always worse off if a member commits suicide and in fact relatives of suicides are at higher risk themselves.
I understand what October is saying about not adding to the guilt load that a p. suicide is already feeling, but when they get past a certain point, showing concern and kindness will not stop them, something stronger is needed and their thoughts need to be challenged.
I do wish there was more information available on how to talk to a person in this state, especially when you are not in a position to get help for them. I keep meaning to find more information so that I can provide it when needed as I consider it as valid as first aid as physical assistance.
Denise SUICIDE IS A PERMANENT SOLUTION TO A TEMPORARY PROBLEM
I know that what you are suffering seems as though it will never go away, but it can if you want it too. Something I realised this week was that I can learn how to have functional relationships and have a satisfying life even though I did not learn that still after 55 years.
It sounds to me that it could be your meds that are causing your feelings
and when you get them sorted you will feel much better. There is no need to feel helpless and useless if it is a chemical imbalance causing your despair. Just hang on. Try not to dwell on your past. Think about it later when you are in a stronger position. Just get by minute to minute for the moment. Do things that will cheer you up.
My daughter was a cutter until recently. She was admitted into hospital under Section 3, (frequentt occurance) and a nurse told her that her problem is that she is not accepting her mental illness. Since then she saw that it was true and has been able to stop cutting.
I am in Durham by the way.
Mati
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Mati
I was in therapy for nine years and some of it was painful, I wanted to quit.
My husband could see as an outsider how much of a roller-coaster it was and how my moods changed. Thankfully, I stuck it out and have a wonderfully fulfilling life now. So much so, that yesterday I wrote a four page update letter to my wonderful therapist.
Hope it goes the same for you. I am very, very sorry about your son, but when I was suicidal, I KNEW there was nobody alive who could have stopped me. I wish more people knew this and weren't left in a cloud of guilt.
Regards
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Re my comment that pain is the price we pay for love, a friend has suggested that maybe it is the other way round; love is our compensation for pain.
Or perhaps a bit of both. :)
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Hi Serena
And thanks. I am so pleased to hear that you stuck it out in therapy and have the benefits of it now in your life. That gives me hope. I wonder whether your thought that no-one could stop you when you were suicidal was just part of this trance condition where we become irrational and obsessed? Do you mind saying how you managed to get out of that state? Was it physical intervention? I don't think that it is possible for the people involved where there is an attempted or successful suicide to not bear a burden of guilt, well not easily anyway. Most of us empathise with distress and the feeling of not recognising it in someone close and them suiciding is excruciating. And next is recognisng it yet not being able to help them.
thanks October
Yes you are right and there is always pain with bereavement, but it is much more severe where the cause of death was suicide. And as I said, the relatives left behind have a much higher risk of suiciding themselves. The legacy really is terrible. I do not feel angry towards my son however for the pain he caused. The balance of his mind was disturbed and he was not fully aware of what he was doing, according to the information I have read to help relatives of suicides.
I do agree that different people need different approaches generally, but this information was obtained through research not conjecture. There are some people who are doing very valuable work through working for suicide prevention, and I am ashamed to say that I have not really taken as much notice as I should have, but I have decided to inform myself now.
Thanks so much for describing the dissociative state. I recognise it in myself at times when I have shut off and felt unable to reach out to get help. I do know that at those times I wanted help but had no idea how to get it. I don't know whether this describes the suicide trance though, as help and contact is always rejected and the main feature is obsessive thought.
It is wonderful that you use your own experience to reach out to help others, October. What a caring person you are.
Mati
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October
I am not just speaking from my own experience when I say that the death by suicide of a child is much harder to deal with then the other reasons for the death of a child like illness, disability or murder. These things are researched by the people who are working for suicide prevention. As I have said, the relatives left behind after a member of the family commits suicide is much more likely to do it themselves. This is not to diminish the suffering involved in the death of a child by another means. But the fact is that parents find it harder to come to terms with the fact that their child took their own life and frequently are unable to pull their lives together again. But I am not suggesting that one should convey these facts to a person considering suicide. But one should counter their unreasonable belief that their family will be better off without them, and doing this helps to break the 'spell' they are under. You seem to be saying that this is being judgemental. I do not understand this. The following site talks about the suicide 'trance' more
http://www.depressionet.com.au/articles/as.html
I think it is not so much that people blame the one who has commited suicide, as I said, I respect my son's decision that he could not bear his pain any longer, although studies show that young people are often motivated to suicide to teach others a lesson. I do think however that the intolerance is about those who have failed attempts which others interpret as a demand for attention. Unfortunately they are treat badly sometimes in hospitals.
I agree that if a person has made the decision over a long period of time and often because of long term pain or ill health, then they ARE in their right minds and after we have done all we can to show them that there is still hope, then of course we have to respect their decision. But most are not like that and depression is the most often reason or perhaps medication causing problems as denise has described and which I really hope she has sought help over today. Please let us know Denise.
Mati
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I dont really understand what all the different antidepressants are supposed to do, i have tried reading up, but cos my concentration is so bad at the moment i cant take it in, so far ive had nassa, snri and ssri, i found the ssri made me feel out of it, i took it in the mornings and wouldnt feel alert till probably 2 in the afternoon, the nassa, although it helped with my panic attacks, i found i was extremely emotional all the time, and the snri, the reboxetine that i am on now, imo are making me go nuts, although i was cutting myself i didnt feel suicidal, i have to wait for my doctor or psychatrist to prescribe new ones, whenever that will be, hopefully very soon, in the meantime as from yesterday ive stopped taking the reboxetine, i know i should wean myself off slowly, but i think its them thats making me feel even worse than i do, most of yesterday i took zolpidem an diazapam, basically to keep me asleep, i was very tearful and didnt want to wake up, 2day, my head feels very fuzzy, i am terribly hot and having bad palpatations, iam again feeling very tearful, but am hoping its just withdrawels from the meds, if by tomorrow i dont feel better physically i will start taking them again, i know you will all think am stupid to stop taking them, but i have diazapam to keep me calm, and i truly believe the meds were making things worse.
As for the bipolar disorder, i read a bit about it, and i do not have that my symptons are quite the opposite, cptsd i think is my problem
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Hi Denise,
I don't know anything about the medications you are taking, saying I hear you. I've also been through med withdrawal and it's not pretty.
bunny
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I must admit, i am feeling extremely down right now,, plenty of tears, very sickly and my head feels like its going to explode, and considering i slept most of yesterday, i feel very tired and aching, and very agitated and over anxious, i just dont know what to do for the best
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Frank sinartra "My way",and You'll never walk alone, remember that! :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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As for the bipolar disorder, i read a bit about it, and i do not have that my symptons are quite the opposite, cptsd i think is my problem
Denise, if you are doing as you describe, then your symptoms may intensify. You need to be aware that coming off an antidepressant very quickly will leave you very poorly for several days, if not weeks. Please be careful in doing this. I don't think it is sensible to stop completely - can you not just reduce the dose, perhaps by half, for a while? Doctors usually prescribe to me a very, very gradual withdrawal - one tablet less per week in one instance - so you need to be aware that it is not recommended at all to just stop taking them.
If you are determined to do this, then make sure that you look after yourself in the process. Do not expect too much - it is a very difficult thing to do. If you have to take the Reboxetine again, don't see it as a failure, whatever you do.
Perhaps you could try the link I sent you for the ptsd site. There is a meds section there, where you can ask others of their experiences, and get more advice than I can offer.
Please let us know how you are managing.
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Hi Serena
And thanks. I am so pleased to hear that you stuck it out in therapy and have the benefits of it now in your life. That gives me hope. I wonder whether your thought that no-one could stop you when you were suicidal was just part of this trance condition where we become irrational and obsessed? Do you mind saying how you managed to get out of that state? Was it physical intervention? I don't think that it is possible for the people involved where there is an attempted or successful suicide to not bear a burden of guilt, well not easily anyway. Most of us empathise with distress and the feeling of not recognising it in someone close and them suiciding is excruciating. And next is recognisng it yet not being able to help them.
thanks October
Yes you are right and there is always pain with bereavement, but it is much more severe where the cause of death was suicide. And as I said, the relatives left behind have a much higher risk of suiciding themselves. The legacy really is terrible. I do not feel angry towards my son however for the pain he caused. The balance of his mind was disturbed and he was not fully aware of what he was doing, according to the information I have read to help relatives of suicides.
I do agree that different people need different approaches generally, but this information was obtained through research not conjecture. There are some people who are doing very valuable work through working for suicide prevention, and I am ashamed to say that I have not really taken as much notice as I should have, but I have decided to inform myself now.
Thanks so much for describing the dissociative state. I recognise it in myself at times when I have shut off and felt unable to reach out to get help. I do know that at those times I wanted help but had no idea how to get it. I don't know whether this describes the suicide trance though, as help and contact is always rejected and the main feature is obsessive thought.
It is wonderful that you use your own experience to reach out to help others, October. What a caring person you are.
Mati
I never, ever felt like I was in a 'trance'. I believed it was a logical, clinical decision to end my unutterable pain. At the time, I would have liked to take pills/alcohol but had literally planned to drown in my swimsuit so my loved ones could believe this. I was waiting for the weather to warm up so it would seem belieavable. I could never have put them through knowing that I'd taken my own life....................
I lived by the sea then.
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October
I am not just speaking from my own experience when I say that the death by suicide of a child is much harder to deal with then the other reasons for the death of a child like illness, disability or murder. These things are researched by the people who are working for suicide prevention. As I have said, the relatives left behind after a member of the family commits suicide is much more likely to do it themselves. This is not to diminish the suffering involved in the death of a child by another means. But the fact is that parents find it harder to come to terms with the fact that their child took their own life and frequently are unable to pull their lives together again. But I am not suggesting that one should convey these facts to a person considering suicide. But one should counter their unreasonable belief that their family will be better off without them, and doing this helps to break the 'spell' they are under. You seem to be saying that this is being judgemental. I do not understand this. The following site talks about the suicide 'trance' more
http://www.depressionet.com.au/articles/as.html
I think it is not so much that people blame the one who has commited suicide, as I said, I respect my son's decision that he could not bear his pain any longer, although studies show that young people are often motivated to suicide to teach others a lesson. I do think however that the intolerance is about those who have failed attempts which others interpret as a demand for attention. Unfortunately they are treat badly sometimes in hospitals.
I agree that if a person has made the decision over a long period of time and often because of long term pain or ill health, then they ARE in their right minds and after we have done all we can to show them that there is still hope, then of course we have to respect their decision. But most are not like that and depression is the most often reason or perhaps medication causing problems as denise has described and which I really hope she has sought help over today. Please let us know Denise.
Mati
I'm so sorry about your son and if there's one thing you need to know, believe and hold onto, it is this: When I was suicidal, I was much, much loved by my husband, family and friends............... there wasn't one of them who could have stopped me AT THE TIME. When you are in the depths of depression, you fantasise about suicide only because it will end the terrible, terrible internal pain. You want to scream at the world to notice, but you can't and they won't. I spend several years in this place - a black pit, literally looking up at the light, but never having the strength to crawl out.
All I can say is that with the miracle of nine years of 'charitable' therapy, I returned to being the person I always should have been. I'm outgoing, kind, compassionate and the first to suggest a party after work or a surprise outing. My life has been transformed and I put it down to Mr DM who looked after me for 9 years. I could have been a casualty - thank God, I'm not, but I DO know how it feels.
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sorry, the two posts above are mine................
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:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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I am ending all this tonight i cant take no more pain or hurt, i am completely destoyed now as a person, i hate this world, and the hurt 1 person can cause another, i hope it was worth it David! :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Hi October
I can see that this has hit a nerve with you which explains why you are reading things into my words that I am not implying and why we are not communicating here. I am so sorry that it has been upsetting for you. Take care
Mati
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I am ending all this tonight i cant take no more pain or hurt, i am completely destoyed now as a person, i hate this world, and the hurt 1 person can cause another, i hope it was worth it David! :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
my god Denise you need to call somebody right now.
you must go back to weaning slowly off your meds and call someone right this minute. we want you here, please keep talking it out...... ((((((((Denise))))))))
quick withdrawal can be devastating emotionally. you need to talk with a doctor.
i'm glad your here Denise.
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Please call someone Denise or ask another person to do so for you. Ending it tonight is not a good idea. Please call someone, keep posting, and let us know what happens.
bunny
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Hi Denise,
Please go to your local emergency room, or call a suicide prevention hotline or RACE. We want you to live!
Best wishes,
Richard
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I am ending all this tonight i cant take no more pain or hurt, i am completely destoyed now as a person, i hate this world, and the hurt 1 person can cause another, i hope it was worth it David! :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Denise, just be yourself and don't let david hurt you.
I hope you don't mind me saying this but I think you should be sectioned?
For your own wellbeing.
Kindest
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I am ending all this tonight i cant take no more pain or hurt, i am completely destoyed now as a person, i hate this world, and the hurt 1 person can cause another, i hope it was worth it David! :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
We've all felt this way, love.
Let us know how you feel in the morning? Don't be embarassed to talk to us - we've all been in the same place????????????/
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Denice
Please tell us how you are.
Mati
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Last night David(otus) my so called friend and ex bf admitted to me he is still having sex with his ex wife and took her away for a dirty weekend, all this going on while he was still my boyfriend, i already knew he was sleeping round which started this problem in the first place, and on a number of occasions i have quizzed him over his ex and he has denied everything, yet again ive been hurt and i cant and will not take anymore, i do not need to be sectioned, David made me feel like i was nuts, he drove the situation right into the ground, i trusted him, i cared for him deeply and in return he has killed me, i am a shell of a person, last night i did take tablets, but then David turned it all round so he was the victim, he was sending me strange txt msges, phoning saying he had drunk a bottle of jack daniels amongst and took other things, then he would turn phone off, then 10 mins later he would phone back making howling noises, phone off again i tried to phone back numerous occasions it was still switched off so i sent a txt saying i would phone an ambulance still no reply, i txt his ex wife to say check on him, no reply back, so i phone an ambulance, ambulance comes an goes, he then txts saying "now you know how it feels", then after all these games he sends a msge saying he likes me, whose messing with whose head here.
15 tablets in all i took last night, if it wasnt for him it would have been more, and i wouldnt be here now suffering, he has damaged me so much as a person, i cant take the pain, i ask David 1 thing "what did i ever do to you" every way i look at it its abuse, he never cared for me just like the rest, i feel so emotionally sick inside it hurts so much, 1 more bad thing to add to the rest, i wish i was dead right now, theres nothing left for me no more, my life and my kids lives are messed up, and David, well he will be ok, hes got his ex wife the one he lied about so many times.
My life will be over soon noone will know when, but it will, i cant take it, i am so empty and damaged now its untrue, now he has caused a bigger problem he switches his phone off, but i know he will read this, you have taken away the last bit of hope i had you have added to destroying my life and my childrens, i hope it was worth it :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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He sits now an crys saying he cant take it turning it round once again like hes the victim, how can people be so mentaly cruel, I CANT CARRY ON, THE PAIN IS WAY TO INTENSE
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Denise, send me a PM, and we can talk offline.
You need not to post here any more, where David can read what you say.
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... you are reading things into my words that I am not implying and why we are not communicating here.
Communication may well not be happening. But it may not be my responsibility.
Why do you give the blame to me? Do you think I need that? :?
Anyway, I don't accept it. At most communication is 50:50. I speak: you listen. You speak: I listen. We do not have to agree at the end of it.
I, therefore, agree to differ from you, without ascribing blame.
I have deleted the posts I made in answer to your comments, because I don't think they are helpful to Denise.
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Hi October
I felt that you were not listening to me because I was stressing that I was not being judgemental towards the suicidal and the things I was saying were not my opinions but facts reported by suicide prevention agencies but you kept disagreeing with their findings even though you had not experienced the suicide of a child yourself (or at least you were not admitting it) so really you did not have the experience so your opinions could only be conjecture. But the main issue for me was that you were talking as though I was being judgemental, but maybe you were just saying that society is that way. if so I misunderstood you and I apologise. But I apologise anyway that our conversation was upsetting to you and you are offended with me.
I do not mind anyone disagreeing with me, but when they disagree with findings without providing some evidence then there is obvously something else going on in their minds. I am sorry that this has triggered you, I do not mean to cause anyone suffering or bring out something they are not ready to face.
Denice
Don't let the ba*t*rd* grind you down. David has his own problems and is toxic for you. You need to be with people who will give you unconditional positive regard so that you can recover from your past and you can do it.
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Denise,
David sounds very unstable. He cannot help you - he needs help himself. Please call someone professional. Have you tried to do that yet? I hope you will.
bunny
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I do not mind anyone disagreeing with me, but when they disagree with findings without providing some evidence then there is obvously something else going on in their minds.
This is highly offensive. This conversation is closed. Any further responses in this vein will be reported.
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I am sorry that you were offended October. Maybe i did not put it very well. I did not mean it in a judgemental way or anything like that. It was meant to be sympathetic. I was trying to say that your response showed me that you are having an issue in this area, and I am feeling sorry about that. I am having a really bad week myself and do not know what i have done to provoke this aggression from you. i have said i am sorry quite a few times but every time i speak it makes it worse and you become more offended. I don't know what else i can say to you now as you have refused the hand of friendship i have tried to offer you. I am very very uopset over this and it has brought me to tears.
Just to say thankyou to everyone for the support and advice but I think I had better stop posting on this site. Goodbye.
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Mati,
You don't have to stop posting to the site. A conversation about suicide is going to be very fraught with emotions and triggers. People get caught up in that and it's no one's fault. Maybe there can be a general consensus from now on, where we agree to table discussion on the reasons for it, and put the topic aside for now. How does that sound?
bunny
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Mati, I’ll repeat what bunny said: You don't have to stop posting to the site.
Denise, I hope you are still with us.
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Portia, i am still here, its been a bad few days, with the stuff i said about David and with the withdrawals fom the tablets, i have felt very sick today and light headed, i dont know if its the withdrawal that is causing it, but i must admit i dont feel like i am bubbling inside now like am going to explode, i do think these tablets where doing more harm than good, my gp has put me on a low dosage of stelazine she said they should help me feel calmer, i took the 1st 1 a couple of hours ago so i will see how i go on these, before my next appointment to see my shrink :roll:
Yesterday i also recieved a call from the police, telling me the crown prosecution have not decided yet whether my sex abuser will be prosecuted or not, it was supposed to be tomorrow i found out the outcome of it all, because of this and the wait i think its put me in a more anxious state, but now its been postponed till july, i dont know if thats a good or bad thing, so the wait continues, so i am a little sad about this.
I do feel calmer in myself although still very tearful, could be cos am overtired, or maybe cos them tablets were making me nuts, time will tell, i am not out of the woods yet, but heres hoping things may change even just a little, so at least 1 morning i can wake with a smile on my face rather than tears in my eyes, thanks for everyones support
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Can i also add, just incase anyone reads up on my meds, they are also used for treating people with schizophrenia, which i do not have, people that do suffer are put on a high dosage, mine is a low dosage for treatment of anxiety, thats all
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Denise, I glad that you are still here posting. I'm also glad that you feel different (slightly better?) and don't have the bubbling. Keep looking for things to help you feel better when you feel better and just hang on when you feel worse. Keep coming here for support and validation.
((((((((((Denise))))))))))
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Good to hear from you Denise :) . I’m glad the police are keeping you informed. Are you required to do anything regarding that case? I hope not. Is anyone else talking to you about what’s happening there? The Citizen’s Advice Bureaux or even the Samaritans might be able to give you general information about what happens in these cases. Knowing that might help you?
Hope you can get some good sleep and keep posting when you feel like it. Best wishes portia
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Portia, last summer i had to give a statement to the police, with all the graphic details included, it was very traumatizing as some things you remember and some you dont, questions like how mant times did it happen, was he dressed, undressed, what position was he or myself in, most i could only answer as i didnt remember, i was only 3/5, it also triggered a lot of flashbacks, things i had never even thought about before, 1 was me being abused i was on the top bunk of bunk beds, and yet the place i remember the main abuse taking place, i know we didnt have bunks, it wasnt till i rang my sister, and she said we did at a previous address, thats how i know i was at least 3 when the abuse started, it took two days to do the statement, it wasnt a nice experience, and now a year later i await the results
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Thanks longtire for thinking of me :)
As for cab or samaritans, i dont really want to talk to people about it as such, most will say awwwwwwwwwww, or he should be locked away for life, or maybe convince me he will be prosecuted, i know its a difficult one, 2 prove, historical abuse always is, although my records clearly state i was abused it doesnt say he is the abuser, so i need to prepare my mind mentally for whatever the outcome will be, and i think talking to people would probably end up convincing me he will be prosecuted, if you understand what i mean, cos my heads a bit fuzzy, i cant explain properly :?
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Dear Denise:
I'm so glad you are posting and also that you sound/seem a bit calmer...less upset?? I'm glad the "bubbling" feeling is gone too. Hopefully the new med will keep helping and to be rid of the other one will help too. You are one strong woman for being able to stop/withdraw from a med like that!
I'm still praying for you. I feel badly because my pc is now on the blink and I'm not sure when it will be up and running again (have to post from the library, which I'll be lucky to do once per week). Just wanted you to know that I'm still thinking of you and cheering for every day that you keep trying and hoping each day will get a little better and a little easier! You're my new heroine.
October: I hope you are ok and things are going better for you. Keeping you and C in my thoughts and prayers too.
Mati: I hope you are still around and posting. Also that things are going better for you too. You also, and your sons, in my thoughts and prayers.
(((((((((((((((all))))))))))))
GFN
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I see that October has removed all of the posts she has written that have been so upsetting to me. I did not come onto this board to be subjected to more abuse. I would have thought that the members here would be alert to this happening but it seems that a newcomer is not granted the same consideration as an established member. And so what has happened has been played down to seem as though it was just a case of two members triggering each other over a sensitive subject. In fact, I am the one who has had a son kill himself and so would have thought I would be granted at least a little consideration and back up when I was being subjected to the treatment I have had from October. I have been nothing but reasonable, polite, and considerate towards her and have not been offensive in the least yet October has seen it necessary to remove her posts. I have been deeply affected by this experience and the lack of recognition from others to what happened. I will not post again and open myself up to another experience like this as I do not consider it safe enough to do so here.
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Hi Denise :)
so i need to prepare my mind mentally for whatever the outcome will be, and i think talking to people would probably end up convincing me he will be prosecuted, if you understand what i mean
Yes I do understand what you mean and I can see how that would work, thanks for explaining. I just wish there’s more information you could get about the court process – the delay etc, but it sounds as though you have all the information you need. Sorry for making you explain. :oops: You have enough to deal with without explaining to me!
Glad to read you, hope you’re getting some of this sunnier weather today :)
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Mati
I was sorry to read your post. What you choose to do is up to you. I think it is safe here. If you think otherwise, so be it. :(
What do you mean by the lack of recognition from others to what happened? What did you want to happen - that people ‘took sides’? Would that be helpful? I don’t think so.
If we don’t have experiences, how can we learn anything? You say you have been deeply affected by this experience. If you’re still here, and I’m not talking to the ether :? , what do you mean? (Please, I don’t want to talk about October, I’d rather hear about you. How about a new thread?) best wishes whatever you do, P
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Mati,
Are you going to dismiss the whole board due to the writing of one person?
What about the others who have written differently?
There are many upset people here, do you expect perfection from them?
Mati, maybe move on from this subject, post to other threads?
October deletes her posts plenty of times. It has nothing to do with you.
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Denise,
I'm glad to see that you are still posting and getting medical intervention for your meds. I hope the new meds start making you feel better.
Mati,
I'm sorry that you have been upset by the discussion and eventual results. I would agree with Portia that for the rest of us to intervene on anyone's behalf would be unproductive and only create more upset. Whether I agree or disagree with what has been said by anyone is of no consequence as I am not directly involved.
Please go back and read the posts that were made to you by many of us on the other thread. I think there were many supportive comments regarding the loss of your son and our feelings about that have not changed. I hope you will reconsider your decision to leave this board (assuming you are still reading).
Brigid
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I think the answer to whether who's right or wrong lays within the context of the name of this board. 'Voicelessness' gives one the ability to be heard, right or wrong! Like minded people who have experienced traumatic events at some stage in their lives can now converse with people as group, who much more understand than most and will listen. In doing so, all of our knowledge, all of our understanding, can only grow collectively.
Being heard, being listened too, is only the start of the recovery process. Being able to debate comes much further down the road. People on here are at varying stages of recovery and that should be taken into consideration. Unfortunately, people who are new and who have very painfull recent experiences require far more understanding and have greater difficulty communicating their feelings. They are raw and have difficulty even discussing their issues. They are often in so much more emotional turmoil and as such, can be exceptionally sensitive and prone to insult were none was intended.
This is a process and one with which time, understanding and patiance will resolve. Injured souls need more time to rebuild strengths so that they can come in from the darkness and smile again. Too much light to soon, will only frighten them back into their darkness. It doesn't matter if they're right or wrong as long as they are heard.
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I think the answer to whether who's right or wrong lays within the context of the name of this board. 'Voicelessness' gives one the ability to be heard, right or wrong! Like minded people who have experienced traumatic events at some stage in their lives can now converse with people as group, who much more understand than most and will listen. In doing so, all of our knowledge, all of our understanding, can only grow collectively.
Being heard, being listened too, is only the start of the recovery process. Being able to debate comes much further down the road. People on here are at varying stages of recovery and that should be taken into consideration. Unfortunately, people who are new and who have very painfull recent experiences require far more understanding and have greater difficulty communicating their feelings. They are raw and have difficulty even discussing their issues. They are often in so much more emotional turmoil and as such, can be exceptionally sensitive and prone to insult were none was intended.
This is a process and one with which time, understanding and patiance will resolve. Injured souls need more time to rebuild strengths so that they can come in from the darkness and smile again. Too much light to soon, will only frighten them back into their darkness. It doesn't matter if they're right or wrong as long as they are heard.
Whoever wrote this is very smart! Thank you.
bunny
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Thanks Bunny
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Mati, i apologize deeply to you cos if it wasnt for me, writing about how i felt in the 1st place, none of this would have happened, in a way it was a cry for help in desperation, i didnt even consider the effect it may have on others, once again i am sorry :(
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Mati, i apologize deeply to you cos if it wasnt for me, writing about how i felt in the 1st place, none of this would have happened, in a way it was a cry for help in desperation, i didnt even consider the effect it may have on others, once again i am sorry :(
I think we should all stop worrying overly about it. I'm sure October / Mati will enjoy many happy posting times in the future.
Let's not forget, we are all here for the same reason and it's a calm, helpful and loving place.
We all need it....
Denise, I'm very glad you are doing better. Hope you are a Liverpool supporter!!!
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When i feel suicidal, i post on here, not good i realise, if and when i get past that state of anxiety and emotion, i can come back and read what i put in the 1st place, see if any of it makes sense to me, i still have very mixed emotions about it, do i die then others suffer or do i die and stop my suffering, as someone said maybe its like a suicidal trance, although i could not connect to the link to understand exactly what that meant.
I have felt pretty bad today and the last few days with a blinding headache and felt really sick, i dont know if its withdrawals off the other meds or what, plus i am having nightmares, very vivid very real, Bunny did you experience this, or has anyone?? :(
Sorry anyway if i have upset anyone.
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Denise what you did for Mati was much more than you think. Please do not see it as bad, as you have enabled Mati to talk further their problems. With it, Mati would have stayed in her darkness unable to even see the light. Talking thru your problems with strangers isn't easy, but that is what Voicelessness does for us all and we listen. Your have a platform and it helps us all so much. I realized a while back that even when we think our situation is bad, there is always someone worse off. It helped me to develop and made me input far beyond what I first thought.
Mati keep talking as we are listening. On Voicelessness Mati, bad becomes good and good just gets better.
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No, I do not expect perfection from everyone on this board and that comment was extremely unhelpful, considering I have not been given a voice yet to explain properly, why I feel as I do. In response and gratitude for the support I have received here, I will attempt to do so.
When October pulled someone up for mentioning something about the suffering of the ones left behind after a suicide (I am unable to back up what I say as October has removed all of the posts from herself on this subject), I talked about some of the research I have read about suicide, and mentioned that a suicide 'trance' which develops just before the act, needs to be broken by challenging the thoughts of the would be suicide, one of the most significant being that one's family will be better off without one. It was obvious to me that something had triggered October as she started to disagree with me as though it had been my opinions which I had mentioned. I spent a great deal of time trying to explain it was not as she had interpreted and that I was sorry that the subject had upset her. But I received a curt
"This is highly offensive. This conversation is closed. Any further responses in this vein will be reported."
If you read through my posts, I did nothing but apologise to her. I had not been triggered by the conversation, yet I was the one who had been through the trauma. I have no problem with the thought that October has had a raw nerve touched and I was truly sorry and did not want to cause her any suffering. I said nothing at all that could have offended her. But that would have been fine, and a lot more bearable if she had apologised before going off. But OK that is not causing me too much grief, though it has shaken me I must admit. I have never had anyone be so dismissive before after one of the few occasions where I have had to express sorrow that they have been upset by something I have said.
What has really upset me though is that the incident was treat as though it was just two people who have upset each other which is not the case. I understand the politics of forums and why a dispute is usually dealt with in this manner, where taking sides is not usually helpful IN THE EVENT OF A DISPUTE. But I stress that this was not a dispute, where two people are diagreeing, but is a case of where I was being accused of saying something I was not saying, and I was being as reasonable and as apologetic as I could to avoid anything bad developing. I was showing October as much understanding and tolerance as I possible and during this time, no-one contacted me by pm to give me any support of recognition to what was going on and how potentially upsetting it could have been for me who was discussing the death of my son.
The fact that the matter has been demoted to a case of a normal dispute, has been the thing that has shaken me as I have had a great deal of reality shifting from my abusive husband and I would have thought that this subject is one that those on this board would be very sensitive to, and something that would be avoided at all costs.
I do not expect anyone to respond to this. I know that October is valued here and has many friends whereas I am just a newcomer. I do not expect anyone to back me up. I just want to voice what has upset me.
I react very badly to anyone who tries to shift reality for me and tell me something had not taken place when it had. Well thankyou for letting me express myself.
I still do not feel safe enough to continue to post and will read for a while. I hope that I will be able to build up confidence to post agaIin but at the moment I do not know. I thank you again for the supoport I have had.
Denise
You have done nothing at all that has contributed to this.
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Serena, its an emotional roller coaster, my head hurts so much i dont know whether coming off the reboxetine is doing me good or not, plus today i should have found out the outcome of whats to happen to my sex abuser, but its been postponed, so today i am feeling sad and numb :cry:
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Mati, i to am a newcomer, i was so upset when i first read what had been posted about me, and some of the 1st comments i took personally and to heart, 1 was more or less saying i was nuts, it was horrible, i can only say i know how you feel in your frustrations to explain yourself, sometimes things are read the wrong way, i havent taken in all that was said between you and october as my concentration is not good, pm me if you want and maybe with you sharing things with me it might also help my very troubled self, a problem shared is a problem halved, or so they say, sorry ive not said much but my brain is working overtime with this terrible headache.
Take care always
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Mati,
I understand that you feel the interaction was downplayed and no one supported you when you've had an incredible tragedy. I'm really sorry that you felt so alone and attacked. I think suicide is such a loaded topic, it tends to paralyze people. I don't think anyone saw this as October=right and you=wrong. I didn't. Unfortunately because of the fragile nature of the thread's focus (Denise), things became very complex and brittle, and probably didn't support others who were triggered by the suicidal issue. I'm very sorry if you feel I dismissed you and considered you part of some trivial argument. I didn't. My goal was to de-escalate what I saw as an increasingly "going South" situation. I think you had every right to say what you said in your posts, and I thought it was pretty thoughtful. You weren't offensive. The only problem was that a person on the thread was considering suicide and I thought the discussion of suicidal ideation might trigger her. So I took some action. It may have been "control freakish" of me, and for that I apologize. You've done nothing wrong.
bunny
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Denise,
I'm sorry about the bad headaches, we're thinking of you.
bunny
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Mati,
I feel the need to say one more thing, then I'm going to leave this alone. I am only speaking for myself, obviously. In the context of the discussion you were having with October, I did not feel in any way qualified to comment on what either of you was saying, as I have no experience, no training, have done no reading or in any way could speak to the subject matter.
I do not know what triggers there may be for people who are suffering with serious depression, ptsd, or suicidal tendancies. The two of you have direct experience with that and obviously differing ideas about the causes and cures. I feel very helpless to offer support to either of you that has any real substance, and can really only offer a listening ear and a hug.
I know you feel you were treated unfairly and under normal circumstances, I would probably agree with you. However, this very delicate subject matter does not fall under "normal" IMO, and without knowing anyone's whole story, I could not say what is fair or unfair.
I pray that you can move on from this and once again find comfort and caring from the members of this board. You have every right to seek the help you need and I assure you that I support you in that quest.
Brigid
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I do not know what triggers there may be for people who are suffering with serious depression, ptsd, or suicidal tendancies
I shall tell you what my triggers are or a big part of them, especially now while am in this heightened state, a phone call "telling me i am lucky to have this person in my life" this is the same person who slept with the population behind my back and lied to me constantly, thankyou is all i can say to this person, for kicking me hard when i am down :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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And as with every ray of sunshine breaking thru, the clouds will one day, fade away!
Some of us live in darkness by choice and some because of others. Then there comes light and all of its many colors. We make the choice as to whether to move towards its many brilliant colors or stay in the dark. Others may have put us in darkness, but it is for us to choose the light.
Light is scary and new, dark is bad but farmiliar. What do we do, stay within the shadows for fear of better times? We know the dark has no answers, it has no life. Life is a one time gift, darkness is forever. The light at first will be a rushing shock and then soon a friend. Darkness has no friends, it has no life!
I welcome people from the darkness, for I was once one of you. I know your pain, I've felt its cold hand, but now I dance with the breeze about me and the sun upon my face. Life leads us to light, but sometimes, if not many, it takes us thru the shadows. This is life.
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Sunshine,
My ears started ringing at that time, and have not stopped-even after 20 years.
Thank you for sharing that. My ears have been ringing since I started taking Lexapro over 18 months ago. I thought it would go away when I stopped taking it over a year ago, but is still there and drives me crazy. I'm not happy to hear that you still have it after 20 years, but at least I know it is not just me.
Guest,
Life leads us to light, but sometimes, if not many, it takes us thru the shadows. This is life.
So beautifully said. Thank you.
Brigid
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The first meds i was given were zoloft or setraline, went straight from these onto others, all i remember is i could not function properly, i would take it early in the morning, and it wasnt till afternoon when my brain reattached to my body, horrible experience
Denise
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Light is scary and new, dark is bad but farmiliar. What do we do, stay within the shadows for fear of better times? We know the dark has no answers, it has no life. Life is a one time gift, darkness is forever. The light at first will be a rushing shock and then soon a friend. Darkness has no friends, it has no life!
How does 1 get from the darkness, as the weekend approaches, it gets darker an darker, and the anxiety is building up once again, how does it stop, if ever?I hate the weekend more than anything, its empty and lonely and i cant bear it! :cry:
Denise
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I am afraid to be alone, its the weekend coming and i cant cope with it, i dont want to exsist, bank holiday, 4 days on my own more or less, its not worth the pain, the sadness the despair the loneliness emptyness, my only companion being my pc, i get overwhelmed with fear and anxiety for myself, cos i feel in myself the time is near, i need to feel that sunshine again and smile them smiles and in this dark forsaken place its never going to happen, however hard i try, am like a fish in a bowl just going round an round.
Ive thought about suicide so much, just a few to many pills, go to bed listen to some gentle music, and its over, pain is taking over the guilt :(
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Sunshine, and what a lovely name that is, you are lucky i have no therapy havent for nearly 4 weeks now, its a lonely place
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I think a fear of being alone, the emptiness, desolation, comes from very, very early experience of parental neglect. A small baby doesn't have a sense of time like we do. A minute feels like an hour to them. People who were traumatized have a similar sense of time. An hour alone feels like forever. A day alone feels like an eternity. This is the memory of a baby who is afraid it literally will not survive. :cry:
How to deal with it: Keep reminding yourself that time is passing, and if you can, schedule every hour so that you feel there is some structure. Even if it's to watch a TV show, do the laundry, make a scrambled egg.
I don't know if this helps you but at one time it helped me.
bunny
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David you alone have just signed my death certificate, i will not be treated like a piece of dirt anymore, so now you can have sex with your EX WIFE as much as you want, you have destroyed me as a person, you and all the rest of the abusers, but over a time when i needed the most help you have done more damage, your sleeping round your constant lies and your pretence of being my friend, everything will be set in place, cos i CANNOT take this anymore, and will not, its over
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Denise,
It wasn't very nice what David did to you at all. Can you tell me what the latest thing is that happened?
LM
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It doesnt even matter no more, the damage and pain caused is far beyond repair, no1 will hurt me ever again :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Denise,
It matters to me. It matters to others. As you've said before you couldn't really go through with it because of your children. However the pain is still there ... it does help to talk. (((Denise)))
LM
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I have been made to feel guilty over my children, and the guilt will go with me, but my children will be far better off without having to see me suffer like this everyday.
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Denise,
I'm not trying to make you feel guilty about your children. I truly recall that you wrote that you wouldn't do it because of them. If I'm wrong about this I am very sorry.
I'm sure it is very hard to have your children see you suffer. I don't think though that they would be better off with you gone.
Will you please talk to me some. Tell me how life sucks and how unfair things can be. Tell me how angry you are, how mad you are at what people have done.
LM
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Sexually, physically, verbally mentally abused from the day i was born till the present day, that just about sums it up
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You live in England, don't you? I used to live in Florida, now I live in Belgium.
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Dear Denise, I can’t tell if you’re crying or shouting when you said these things:
i will not be treated like a piece of dirt anymore,
and I say Good for you Denise! You stand up and say out loud: “I don’t deserve any more of this crap”. You won’t take it anymore!! Good. It doesn’t mean you have to leave. It means you made a decision. You can be in control. You can decide not to take it. You’re allowed to say “this isn’t good enough”. It’s not your fault and you’re not bad for wanting something different!
you have done more damage, your sleeping round your constant lies and your pretence of being my friend
David’s a bit of a proverbial shit it seems to me. He thinks a lot of himself. He doesn’t deserve your friendship. I’m sure I could be wrong, but the effect he has on you Denise, it doesn’t seem good.
I’m with LM here Denise, I’d like to hear just how angry you are. You deserve to be angry. It’s okay to be angry. It’s okay to talk about it too. It can be scary, being angry, but please believe me, it does us good sometimes.
I don’t know. I might have it all wrong. Maybe you don’t feel angry?
I’m just chatting Denise, you don’t have to answer, just thoughts really. Hope you’ve got sun where you are, it’s very sunny here and almost too warm already (or maybe I’m having a hot flush, that’s a possibility I guess). Thinking of you
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I think David is one toxic guy, he seems to pretend to care but it seems that that is all it is, pretense. Yea he feels guilty for what he has done and I think he ought to. I'm angry at him. And if he is reading this I think he needs to stop messing with Denise's head. I think this is what has really got to you Denise, this pretense of caring ... and you were sucked into it. You have gone through a lot in life and this was just very, very cruel.
Portia, it's really hot here in Belgium now. Luckily our downstairs is really cool. That helps in the summer, however in the winter it's expensive to keep warm.
LM
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Hi LM, if you’re in Belgium, and I’m about 20 miles north of London, and Denise you’re in the Wirral? I wonder if I’m about half way between you two??
I failed my geography exam. So I could be very wrong about that! But it’s hot here. Probably cooler up thar Denise? I lived in Liverpool in the early 80s. Loved it. Wonderful city. Haven’t been there for many years. I was rather glad about the European cup football-thingy (though I just don’t do this football thing). Liverpool is different to every other English city and it’s difficult to explain...
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Thinking of you Denise and hoping your week end is going better than expected!
Do you ever rent funny movies? Do you have a favorite?
Mine is and remains: "Uncle Buck".
John Candy always makes me laugh....even by simply looking at his face, I end up in stitches. That guy and his facial expressions!!! :D Truly funny!
Just wondering if you've ever seen that movie?
GFN
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Friday, i called for helped from the race team, cos of a doctors did not relay the messages, i could have been dead now, i was in that bad a state, my sister ended up finding out what was going on, so raced up here, she lives an hour an a half away, in the meantime i took an overdose, i spent the day in hospital yesterday, having observations bloods done etc and waiting to see a physchiatrist, in the hope they would finally give me new medication, hrs went past still no doctor, in the end we left, 10.45 last night we got home, race have been on the phone today saying my meds will definately be sorted by tuesday, am back on emergency call, so lets just see now if i get help.
Today my mood is a little lighter, probably cos i am mentally exhausted, an overdose was wrong maybe, but i am still here, and hopefully they will understand the urgency and desperation of the whole situation, its not attention seeking, its so very serious and real, i am neither happy or sad, more so numb by the whole ordeal, but still here to tell the tale, there must be at least 1 guardian angel out there looking out for me :oops:
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GFN, i like comedy when i can concentrate, my favvy movies are the green mile, angelas ashes(cos of its reality to times gone by) and the phantom of the opera
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Hi Denise,
It's too bad you have to go to such dangerous lengths to get help. :cry: I feel very frustrated for you. The UK health care system seems so inadequate. I hope this time you will be taken care of properly.
bunny
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Friday, i called for helped from the race team, cos of a doctors did not relay the messages, i could have been dead now, i was in that bad a state, my sister ended up finding out what was going on, so raced up here, she lives an hour an a half away, in the meantime i took an overdose, i spent the day in hospital yesterday, having observations bloods done etc and waiting to see a physchiatrist, in the hope they would finally give me new medication, hrs went past still no doctor, in the end we left, 10.45 last night we got home, race have been on the phone today saying my meds will definately be sorted by tuesday, am back on emergency call, so lets just see now if i get help.
Today my mood is a little lighter, probably cos i am mentally exhausted, an overdose was wrong maybe, but i am still here, and hopefully they will understand the urgency and desperation of the whole situation, its not attention seeking, its so very serious and real, i am neither happy or sad, more so numb by the whole ordeal, but still here to tell the tale, there must be at least 1 guardian angel out there looking out for me :oops:
Denise
I'm delighted that you are still posting. I hope you don't mind me saying this but have you considered entering a psychiatric facility as a volunteer? I think it would help you greatly to become acclimatised to new medications?
Loving thoughts
S
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Hi Denise:
Maybe you could start planning for next week end.....now. Since week ends seem to be the hardest for you, wouldn't it be good to have a plan of stuff to do to help the week end be more enjoyable? The good thing about renting movies is that you can stop them and replay any part you wish to. This works well when concentration is a problem. And renting a funny movie might lift your spirits for a little while. What do you think?
I hope your meds get straightened around real quick. If you do what Serena says it might be the best thing. In patient might help you in many respects with different skills.
Glad you're feeling a bit lighter today.
I felt sad and angry when I read that you took an overdose and then when you wrote:
...an overdose was wrong maybe
Sounds like maybe you still think it's an ok thing to do maybe? I totally disagree. No maybe.
It's hard for me to allow myself to get emotionally involved with you because you might just discount and ignor my feelings and go ahead and overdose again because it's ok, maybe? Except actually I must already be doing some of that or I wouldn't feel sad or angry to know that you did intentionally overdose and just happened to survive.
I want to connect with you as a person and as a friend but I don't want to be treated as if that is nothing, of no value, not worth considering, not important. That's what it feels like my communications have been and I'm just letting you know that because I think it's better to express my feelings, rather than just keep them bottled up. Maybe if I share them, you will find some value in them too.
GFN
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GFN
With respect, I would not go this route. This is unsolicited advice and just my opinion.
bunny
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Hi Denise.
Your meds will be sorted by tuesday? That's tomorrow. Got my fingers crossed for you. I hope this gets done. It's so important. I hope some health people pull their fingers out! The NHS & mental health just don't fit in the same sentence. Grrrrrrrrr...
still here to tell the tale, there must be at least 1 guardian angel out there looking out for me
I reckon you've got a few angels rooting for you Denise. Please believe it! My best wishes and thoughts flying up the M1, M6 and M62 towards you (hope I've got that right). Hope you get some refreshing sleep. portia
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GFN
With respect, I would not go this route. This is unsolicited advice and just my opinion.
bunny
Thanks Bunny. You're probably quite right. I've been thinking about this all day.
GFN
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Denise
Keep us posted..... you are so much stronger than you realise. You are also an invaluable member of this board and we all care about you.
XXX
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I felt sad and angry when I read that you took an overdose and then when you wrote:
Quote:
...an overdose was wrong maybe
Sounds like maybe you still think it's an ok thing to do maybe? I totally disagree. No maybe.
It's hard for me to allow myself to get emotionally involved with you because you might just discount and ignor my feelings and go ahead and overdose again because it's ok, maybe? Except actually I must already be doing some of that or I wouldn't feel sad or angry to know that you did intentionally overdose and just happened to survive.
I want to connect with you as a person and as a friend but I don't want to be treated as if that is nothing, of no value, not worth considering, not important. That's what it feels like my communications have been and I'm just letting you know that because I think it's better to express my feelings, rather than just keep them bottled up. Maybe if I share them, you will find some value in them too.
GFN
GFN, you are entitled to say whatever you want, why be angry at me, when am in such an emotional state and i call for help, and get no reply, what do i do, maybe or maybe not, it was my decision, and still is my decision, and yes the overdose was very intentional, because sometimes things get to bad to cope with, so other people and their feelings dont come into the equation, sorry if this upsets you, but i also feel upset by what you said
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when in a suicidal state, one disconnects, and there is only one focus, and its not good
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Serena no disrespect.......I'm delighted that you are still posting. I hope you don't mind me saying this but have you considered entering a psychiatric facility as a volunteer? I think it would help you greatly to become acclimatised to new medications?
I will never in a million yrs go in a psychiatric unit as a volunteer or otherwise, do people not understand what its like 2 be locked away as a child, its caused a phobia, cos to me its just another institution, still no new meds got appointment 4 next week unless it gets cancelled, so i will see what happens then, but now the dreaded weekend approaches, i know, focus focus focus, on what exactly??
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Hiya Denise:
I'm glad to see you still posting here and saying what you think and feel.
GFN, you are entitled to say whatever you want,
Thankyou Denise. So are you. I'm glad you are! :D
why be angry at me,
Whoa Silver!!! I said I felt angry. That's my feeling and it's valid. You have feelings and yours are valid too. I'm not angry ....at....you. I felt angry and sad when I read what you did. I felt that way about your choice/decision.....to act....not about you. You are good and I like you a lot. That's why I felt sad and angry that your life might have been cut way too short. I want you to live. I want you to get the help you need and deserve. I felt sad and angry to think that might not happen.
when am in such an emotional state and i call for help, and get no reply, what do i do,
I understand what you're saying. The stupid system there sucks!! I want to go over there and throttle the whole bunch who are in charge and have the power to give you the services you need. I feel pretty angry about that too. That's nothing to do with you, that bout of anger, I mean.
maybe or maybe not, it was my decision, and still is my decision, and yes the overdose was very intentional,
I feel very sad and angry that you felt compelled to make a decision to overdose, intentionally, in order to get the services you need. I don't like the decision. I don't like any idea that says it's the only way. I don't like the system. I don't like a whole lot of stuff about it all! But I still really like you, Denise. I do.
because sometimes things get to bad to cope with, so other people and their feelings dont come into the equation, sorry if this upsets you,
I will be honest and say that it does upset me because I keep thinking about your children, who will be left to face life without a mother, who I bet love you very much, and who will really suffer, for a long time, if you kill yourself, and about your sister, who I bet cares very much about you too, and her pain, both/all of which I can only imagine the extent of that pain/suffering... because I'm not them... but I know how I felt....reading about your decision...and so....I won't discount all the people in the equation and only count you. I just won't.
but i also feel upset by what you said
I'm sorry Denise. I don't want to cause you more upset. I just want you to live. You have come so far, struggled with and through so much. You seem like a very nice person who has managed to get this far and I'm so proud of you for coming here and continuing that struggle.
when in a suicidal state, one disconnects, and there is only one focus, and its not good
My wish is to help you to focus elsewhere.....on those who love you and care about you.....and on those who want to be your friend/s..even here. My wish is to connect with you ...so you hear me....and I hear you...not just see me/you as some bits and bites on a screen...but as a real, breathing, feeling human being persons...and I really really feel for you, Denise. And also my wish is to remind you to focus on some of the small but very beautiful things in life, and to value your life....because it is a valuable possession that I don't want to see you waste. You said you have a million reasons not to live. I will quote a wise person from this board who said:
"There may be many reasons but there is no excuse".
I'm sure you have perfectly valid reasons for wanting to end this life but my opinion, my feeling, my plea to you is that you have no excuse. None.
To only focus on that thought and to not focus on those who care about you.
My words may be shocking and maybe too blunt and I'm sorry for that. I'm not the most tactful person alive but I have a big heart Denise and I really want you to feel cared about because people do care.
I'm glad you're here still and I'm glad you're still posting and I hope you will continue. Are you thinking about making any plans for the weekend?
Is there a library near your place? Do you like the library?
I love books. When I have been in a severe state of traumatization and could not focus on reading for even 5 minutes at a time, I went to the library and found books with the most gorgeous pictures in them. It was much easier to look at a lovely picture and imagine the peacefulness there and admire the beauty than it was to try to look at words and make sense of them. That helped me. Maybe it might help you??
(((((((Denise)))))))
GFN
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I will never in a million yrs go in a psychiatric unit as a volunteer or otherwise, do people not understand what its like 2 be locked away as a child, its caused a phobia, cos to me its just another institution, still no new meds got appointment 4 next week unless it gets cancelled, so i will see what happens then, but now the dreaded weekend approaches, i know, focus focus focus, on what exactly??
Denise - im sooooooo happy to see you are still here.!!!!..... and that you have an app. I just want you to know that ive thought about you every single day since youve been here....... i know youre in a really bad space and i just wish there was something i could do to help.
sooo... here comes the weekend...... focus focus focus..... what can we focus on.
what -does- give you joy? it can be something verrrrrrrrrrry tiny. lets make a plan, for these weekends...
what if ANYTHING do you like or enjoy or feel good about. ?? it doesnt matter how small. lets figure out something to focus on. if that doesnt sound good, its just an idea, we can do a different one.
there are certain days of the week that are worse for me, i do a lot of stuff on those days to help get through. so maybe we can talk it out.
take care im really thinking about you.
anna
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I will never in a million yrs go in a psychiatric unit as a volunteer or otherwise, do people not understand what its like 2 be locked away as a child
oh i had meant to tell you i was locked up for a year @ 16..... definitely a horrible experience. they locked me up cause i ran away from home. just wanted to let you know i do understand that.
i wish the 'helpers' were more helpful somtimes...... because if i thought they would actually be helpful, i would also suggest a more structured environment right now...... but, its hard to be sure which are going to be actually healthy. the way the dr's are treating you... im not sure i would be too trusting of a hospital either...... either way still thinking of you.
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Hi Denise and everyone,
just wanted to post a message of support. I don't have any great ideas but just small ones. They are the ones that have helped me in the past. If they are not of any use, then just ignore them and hear my underlying care and support for you.
I don't know why the weekends are so bad for you. Is it that everyone goes away? or your routine is different or is it that bad memories are triggered?
I tend to give myself small gifts when I am down, like watching something on telly or taking a walk around the block and seeing a dog, if you like dogs. Washing my hair. Or reading something fun. This will be the only thing I have to accomplish that day, and if I do it, I am a success and I can make it to the next day. I try to do distracting things, so I won't have to work full time on my thoughts. Nobody should have to work 24 hours a day.
Try to make sure you are eating enough, and good stuff. This can help your mental state, being hungry or full of junk cannot help you.
I would also think about, not the big people who might suffer if I were gone, but the 'little' people. I remember many times hearing that something bad happened to an acquaintance, an accident or sudden death, and it felt bad. Not life changing bad, but I thought, if that happens to lots of people who know me or know of me, it is a big impact on the world. And then I would try to think about all those people - people I saw at the grocery store, people who I knew in school, my neighbors, my distant cousins, and that would occupy me for a while.
David sounds like a person who might have some good qualities and was good for a while, but you have handed over your Self to him and it is time to take yourself back. Like my friend said once, "I thought about killing myself. And then I thought, let him kill himself! I didn't do anything wrong!" So ask yourself, have you done anything wrong?
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Hi Denise
I'm sorry you don't trust medical professionals although I fully understand why.
This is probably the most vacuous advice you will ever get on this forum, start watching Big Brother............. if you have E4, you will be so cheered up.
It will reinforce to you how normal, decent and compassionate you are when you get a look at this bunch of losers.
Thinking of you
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Hi Denise
I hate weekends and holidays as they are the times that happy families get togther and my dream has always to be part of a normal family, not a fantasy one just a normal one where people love each other. I just tell myself that it will happen for me one day if I keep on the path of recovery and that I need this time alone for just a bit longer and one day I will not have this pain. They are still hard though so I feel for you.
love Mati
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This is probably the most vacuous advice you will ever get on this forum, start watching Big Brother............. if you have E4, you will be so cheered up.
It will reinforce to you how normal, decent and compassionate you are when you get a look at this bunch of losers.
Serena, when I feel low, I switch on the TV and soon feel better. Usually because I get so frustrated with the incredible TOSH on it! Your advice is spot-on :D
Denise, it's on channel 4 too, so all you need is a basic telly. Try tuning in :) best P
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I will never in a million yrs go in a psychiatric unit as a volunteer or otherwise, do people not understand what its like 2 be locked away as a child, its caused a phobia, cos to me its just another institution, still no new meds got appointment 4 next week unless it gets cancelled, so i will see what happens then, but now the dreaded weekend approaches, i know, focus focus focus, on what exactly??
Hiya D
It is very very normal for people with cptsd to avoid psychiatric units at almost any cost. Trauma almost always results from a catastrophic loss of control, whether of ones soul, body or spirit. In endeavouring to minimise the effects of trauma, we learn to restore control in whatever way we can, and dread the loss of it again.
I am absolutely with you. I have told my t that I cannot, simply cannot, explain to her or a psychiatrist how bad my thoughts become at times, because if I did, they would have no option but to offer admission to me, for my own protection. I cannot be explicit, because I know that such admission would be devastating to me. I need to be in control. I need to have a normal life; a child to care for, washing and ironing to do, shopping to plan, bills to pay. However unwell I am, it is those things that form a framework around which to live, and to build whatever kind of existence is possible for me.
You are doing really well, Denise, imo. Every day that you learn how to survive and how to cope will make it that bit easier to cope tomorrow.
I am glad you have an appointment next week - I hope it goes well for you. Meanwhile, as others say, maybe plan for the weekend with a TV guide; choose what you are going to watch all the time. Maybe get in a tub of popcorn, some icecream, crisps and tonic water or similar. Pretend you are at an exclusive screening at a posh cinema and veg in front of the telly for a while, or watch your fav videos or whatever. And there is always bubble bath pampering time when you get bored with the telly.
Well done for making it this far. :) It does get easier, but it takes time.
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You said you have a million reasons not to live. I will quote a wise person from this board who said:
"There may be many reasons but there is no excuse".
I'm sure you have perfectly valid reasons for wanting to end this life but my opinion, my feeling, my plea to you is that you have no excuse. None.
To only focus on that thought and to not focus on those who care about you.
My words may be shocking and maybe too blunt and I'm sorry for that. I'm not the most tactful person alive but I have a big heart Denise and I really want you to feel cared about because people do care.
I know you care a lot, GFN. Perhaps you are one of the most caring people on this thread, in terms of the impact it is having on you, and the cost of it on yourself. I don't know why it is so triggering to you, but it seems to be very much so.
I don't want to get again into the same conversation as we had before, because I think we said everything that needed to be said at the time, and that is fine.
But from my own, personal point of view, coming to this thread to help Denise, and knowing that it will not be easy for me to do that, or for her to read what is said here - this kind of comment - the 'no excuse' comment - weighs on me like a great weight around my shoulders. It feels like a millstone. It feels as if I am struggling not to drown and you have put a millstone around my neck. I am sorry for the strong, even violent, imagery, but I am trying to express my feelings, and I don't want you to feel that in turn as a condemnation of you, because I appreciate how much you care.
My own benchmark, as I have said before, is to use the same terminology for people who have suicidal ideation as for any other potentially terminal illness. I would not say that someone with cancer has no excuse for contemplating leaving her children, so I would also not say it for someone with SI. I know you disagree, but perhaps you can consider what might be helpful for Denise, and where she asks you to refrain from such comments, perhaps you could do that, and maybe start a general discussion somewhere else on the ethics of suicide, which is not the same thing as the struggle against SI.
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I feel very sad and angry that you felt compelled to make a decision to overdose, intentionally, in order to get the services you need. I don't like the decision. I don't like any idea that says it's the only way. I don't like the system. I don't like a whole lot of stuff about it all! But I still really like you, Denise. I do.
GFN
This bit (and a lot of the rest) I agree with 100%.
The problem with the NHS is that it is second to none in terms of dealing with acute illness of one kind or another, but not so strong in dealing with chronic conditions. Mental health is right at the bottom of the heap, with inadequate provision at every level.
Sometimes all that is left is to tell people like myself and Denise that if we have a problem, to go to A&E and ask for the duty psychiatrist, and then I suppose, hope for the best. As you know, I have been three weeks without my psychologist, with the advice to ring the Samaritans if I have problems in the meantime. I have not done so. It would take a great deal of courage - more than I have - to walk into A&E, and then wait four or five hours for someone to come and then explain the problem to them. You would need a fair amount of emotional stability to achieve that. Chances are, all you would get would be a letter to take to your GP. :?
I think I have said before that in my area there is no provision whatever for third level (long term) support for mental health conditions, other than eating disorders. You have crisis care, for overdoses, and acute care for those who need admission. You have short term counselling (maximum 12 weeks). But there is nothing else, unless you pay and go privately. But even then, you can waste your money, as I did, and end up with an incorrect diagnosis. Other parts of the country differ, depending on how the health authorities spend their money.
As far as I know I am the only person in my county receiving long term therapy for ptsd, and that is from a psychologist specialising in eating disorders, because that is the only kind available. :? And it took me 6 or 7 years to find that, with a lot of internet searching and determination. I just refused to give up, and kept trying one avenue after another after another. Without my daughter, I am sure I would not have kept going so long.
I think there is, indeed, excuse for those in the UK who cannot find a way through to the help they need, and who do not make it through. All the books I read, all the internet self assessments I have read, all say 'you need to seek immediate professional help'. This is much easier said than done, in my experience.
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Hiya October:
this kind of comment - the 'no excuse' comment - weighs on me like a great weight around my shoulders. It feels like a millstone. It feels as if I am struggling not to drown and you have put a millstone around my neck. I am sorry for the strong, even violent, imagery, but I am trying to express my feelings, and I don't want you to feel that in turn as a condemnation of you, because I appreciate how much you care.
Thankyou for acknowledging that I do care. I appreciate that. The "no excuse" stuff is meant to hold back not drag down. But......with the picture/imagery you've now painted, the suggestion of that pic......it may/might now be the one gathered/accepted/inclined toward. So....I know you mean well, and I believe you care very much but it feels frustrating to me to have my words interpreted for Denise by you.
My own benchmark, as I have said before, is to use the same terminology for people who have suicidal ideation as for any other potentially terminal illness.
That seems very reasonable and it works for you.
perhaps you can consider what might be helpful for Denise.
What? October, do you really think you a) know what I consider and b) that I have not considered this? Sorry October. No offense but I don't accept assumptions well.
where she asks you to refrain from such comments, perhaps you could do that,
But you're the one asking right? You would like me to refrain from saying stuff that is different than what you think/feel/believe right?
perhaps you could do that, and maybe start a general discussion somewhere else on the ethics of suicide?
Honestly, October, I think there is no discussion. I'm sticking with my belief because it just seems wrong to discard it. I voiced it and my feelings. Denise hasn't responded yet but now.....gee......I wonder if the stone around the kneck idea/maybe I might consider!!!!!!Denise.....refrain from "such comment" stuff will have a positive impact????
I think there is, indeed, excuse for those in the UK who cannot find a way through to the help they need, and who do not make it through.
Sounds like you're encouraging Denise to go ahead and end it all?
Sorry October. Maybe I'm reading this wrong. Reacting badly??? There is an excuse for what? What are you saying exactly?
Denise: I mean to throw you a life line......not a mill stone.
I consider encouraging you to live...not to find or look for excuses not to.....to be best for you/your children/your loved ones.
I'm reminding you to remember them too and be kind to you...look for something, anything to help you focus on another idea besides killing yourself.
I'm very sorry if I have come across otherwise.
GFN
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PS:
(((((((Denise)))))) (((((((October)))))
GFN
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I'm going to be a buddinsky, so my apologies in advance.
I think that suicide is a very interesting topic, and there are many books written on it. Too bad I haven't read them. However I think that when someone is kind of fragile, unstable, and this group is one of their hopes for staying grounded, maybe we can abstain from talking about suicide. I think when someone is talking about ending their own life, it's very stressful on everyone. Talking about suicide eases the stress but then it causes its own stress. Basically I think what helps is letting each other know we aren't alone and we're here for each other.
Stepping off the soapbox, carry on.
bunny
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P.S. I don't mean to censor anyone, I'm just thinking about a pragmatic situation here. I think suicide is legitimate issue but it's also emotionally volatile.
thanks
bunny
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GFN, i did not take an overdose to get attention, i took it to end my life, the pain the misery i just wanted it to stop, as i said when in a suicidal state others dont matter, in the past the guilts kicked in so its stopped me, so instead i selfharm, last week was different.
You think to end 1s life for whatever reasons is no excuse, sometimes are brains and thoughts go beyond being rational and reasonable, so that gives an excuse.
I know you probably mean well, i need to read a few times to take things in, and i probably dont and cant explain my thought properly anyway, so right now theres no point in trying, sorry and thanks at the same time
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Thanks d'smom, serena and portia, for your ideas, i need a brain to function 1st :oops:
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Guest 2, David pretends to be a friend and suckers people in with his mr nice guy attitude, but i know the other side of him.
He wanted to know my life all the ins and outs good and bad, and then used this knowledge to abuse me mentally, hes stripped me of every bit of self confidence selfworth selfesteem, do not be fooled by what he has written, he is as much to blame, relationship ends, agree on frienship, friends dont treat each other the way he does, i am writing this cos you could be him that left the msge in the 1st place, i have nvery little trust or faith in people these days. sorry if am wrong
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Mati, i know exactly what you mean by a normal family, it brings tears to my eyes, thats all i ever wanted, maybe in my next life i will be blessed :cry: :cry:
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i probably dont and cant explain my thought properly anyway, so right now theres no point in trying, sorry and thanks at the same time
You know what Denise? Don't worry about it. I just want you to know that I'm glad you're still here and I'm hoping and praying that things will get better for you. The main thing is trying to focus on something that helps you....feels good to you in a nice way. That's what matters most.
For you to get through this coming weekend the best way possible.
For you to feel even a little bit better....even for a few minutes at a time.
Think some good thoughts...just a few.
Look at something you like....pictures, nature, tv.
Do you have a teddy bear to cuddle?
I'm away now for the week end and will be thinking of you and sending you warm wishes!!
((((((Denise))))))
GFN
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Bunny, am sorry if u find this thread stressful, but my life is stressful, and to read and reply and hear others, helps a little, no1 has to read this thread its their choice :(
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One last msge for October, Mati and myself, lets help each other if we can get through these dreaded weekends, ive had plenty of tears today, and you 2 probably have to, tmoro might be better or maybe not, lets just look 4 a rainbow and know at the other end is 1 of us.
(((((((((safe hugs 2 both of you and every1 else 4 giving support))))))))
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Thanks GFN XX
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Denise,
I don't hold you responsible for any stress on others. I was talking about something else. We will take care of ourselves. Keep posting.
bunny
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David imo, you are :twisted: from what i have read :!:
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Guest 2, David pretends to be a friend and suckers people in with his mr nice guy attitude, but i know the other side of him.
...i am writing this cos you could be him that left the msge in the 1st place, i have nvery little trust or faith in people these days. sorry if am wrong
_________________
Denise
Hi Denise,
I can't prove it but I am SO not David! I only said a mildly positive thing about him, because there must have been something good enough to fool you at the beginning, because no person on earth is all bad, even if you have seen a very bad part of them, and so that you might not get the impression that you ought to blame yourself for trusting him or for getting into this mess.
But my main point was that he is holding an important key to your wellbeing, because he has the ability to upset and disappoint you still. In your shoes I would try to disengage from him. It does not seem like anything good is coming from it.
Also, when this is over and you are well and so much stronger because of it, yes, that is way down the road, but won't it be nice not to have your past in the closet hanging over your head (sorry about the bad writing)? And his bad deeds will have been the catalyst to free you. And no matter who or how or what started the process, it was going to be a long and hard one.
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David charmed his way into my life, took me to nice places we done nice things, but all the while he was living a huge lie, decieving me, cheating on me,lying from when i met him to the present day, i am emotionally tortured, after all the bad he knew that went on in my life, why add to it, maybe at the beginning he didnt quite grasp it, but as time passed, he did, i had a serious breakdown, he supported me financially, but still continued to lie to me, its easy to say disengage, but when some1 brings your whole bad past to the surface then dumps on you its hard, David would not care if i was alive or dead, he will just move on to the next bed partner, cos thats what women are to him, a sexual release, nothing more, he does upset and disappoint me, cos he makes promises that are broken frequently, the last 14 months of my life i havent exsisted, my life is in shreds, while DAVID, BETTY(MOTHER), JACK WILSON, THE JONES, THE SOCIAL SERVICES, etc get on with their lives not giving me a second thought, and the damage they have caused.
Why should i be the 1 to suffer i done nothing wrong, ive never caused harm to a single person in my life, i go to sleep crying i wake crying, i cry throughout the day, is this what lifes about, and the best bit of all is no1 will admit to doing me harm, i am to blame for being born, for trusting for caring, i hate myself everyday and i hate the bad thoughts in my head, WHEN DOES IT STOP, AND WHY ME, OVER AND OVER AGAIN?? :cry:
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Ive had little sleep over the past few weeks, i am tired, drained emotionally, its the weekend and i hate it, my ability to want to carry on this exsistence is wearing thin.
Just now and then to have some1 physically hold you, sooth you, help take the hurt away would help, but am alone and feeling so very low right now :cry:
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(((((((((Denise)))))))))
A big board hug for you from me, i can't be with you sorry :( , but if I was, I'd be hugging you. (((((((((Denise))))))))) that's a warmer hug :) portia
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Thinking of you Denise. Just letting you know that and t-y-p-i-n-g it out (two fingers only, can you type? I wish i could). Hope you're finding it not too tough. Keep posting and talking if you want to, we'll listen. (((Denise)))
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Denise: thinking of you and hoping you are well.
When you can think about things, perhaps this will occur to you, as it did to Ekhart Tolle ("The Power of NOW"):
(I lent the book, so I will put it down the way I remember it)
Ekhart Tolle was tortured, miserable, barely able to keep on living. He felt life had no meaning for him, other than pain.
He had a moment, one night, where he said: "I cannot live with myself any longer!"
And it hit him: he had said: I.............cannot live with.........MYSELF.
As if he were actually two different entities. There was "I" and there was
"myself".
"I" was pure, unharmed, and without pain. "Myself" then, he thought, must be his accumulated pain from experience and this life.....his life experience...
Perhaps you will think on this.
You are not your life experience. Right NOW, YOU are pure, lovable and loving. Yesterday was now, but no longer is. The future is not NOW either, and when it becomes now, it will instantly become past. Right at this moment, (not ten minutes from now, not next weekend, not 20 years ago, or even 2 minutes ago) YOU are fine....you are loved. Focus on this, and maybe, in your pain, you can step into this very moment of NOW and you will see what Ekhart Tolle was able to see.
The REAL you is NOT what happened to you, what you think about, what tortures you still. That is your life experience self. Perhaps looking at things this way may help you detach from this pain, and find your true essence again. YOU are love.
Bless you, Denise.
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One last msge for October, Mati and myself, lets help each other if we can get through these dreaded weekends, ive had plenty of tears today, and you 2 probably have to, tmoro might be better or maybe not, lets just look 4 a rainbow and know at the other end is 1 of us.
(((((((((safe hugs 2 both of you and every1 else 4 giving support))))))))
Denise
The tears are difficult, but every single one is healing. You may not see that yet, and I am sorry if I sound arrogant, but I honestly believe that. A friend once told me of a culture (Sorry, I forget where - India somewhere perhaps??) where they regard tears as precious, and save them in a jar. I have never been able to see my own like that, but I am sure they are healing. (He said this one day as I was crying, and it made me smile to think that something we regard as nothing, or something to be ashamed of, could be treasures to more enlightened people from other cultures.)
I am really proud of how well you are doing, Denise, and your ability to keep going and going. You are doing so well. Your children may never know how strong you have had to be for them, or what a wonderful, wonderful mother you have been, but I can see it and one day you will too.
One day at a time, remember. That is all that counts, and all that matters.
Sending you love.
xxxxxxx
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Sounds like you're encouraging Denise to go ahead and end it all?
GFN
I can understand that from the point of view you have expressed (as far as I am able to understand it, which may not be fully) it will look to you as if I am encouraging Denise to go ahead. I can assure you that this is not the case. Neither was I trying to interpret Denise's feelings. I purposedly spoke only of my own.
The difference as I see it (and this is all subjective to me) is that I am willing to hold Denise's hand all the way, while you are willing to hold her hand only up to the point where she makes what you regard as a 'wrong' decision. You interpret this as me condoning a certain behaviour. I interpret it as not letting go, ever, whatever she chooses to do. Whether you like it or not, she is free to make that choice, just as you or I or anyone else is. I refuse to let go of Denise, and I will not give up on her, whatever she does. But no, I do not want her to give up. Absolutely 100% not. I want her to live, and to be a mother to her children for many many years to come. I want her to see her grandchildren. I find it bizarre that you could get a different message from what I have written.
I am offering Denise the closest I can to the kind of unconditional love we all need from someone, somewhere, and that love will carry on, whether she manages to win or not. But all the indications I have seen are that she can win through. I have seen nothing to make me afraid for her ultimate survival, as long as she keeps posting here, and elsewhere, and keeps communicating with us all.
But I do think that you care, and I am touched by how much. I wish I could feel half as much as you clearly do. :? (I have emotional numbing, just for good measure. Mostly I feel nothing. Doesn't mean I don't care, but it is not connected, if that makes any sense at all. Probably not. :( )
I hope this helps. :oops:
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Mati, i know exactly what you mean by a normal family, it brings tears to my eyes, thats all i ever wanted, maybe in my next life i will be blessed :cry: :cry:
Maybe you could redefine 'family' Denise. To me, my family is me and my daughter. That is the bit that counts. And we are as normal as it is possible for me to achieve.
The extended family is completely mad, and considering how mad, my own little bit is little short of a miracle. :lol:
You and your children. Nobody else. Are you not already blessed? :)
Maybe you could try doing what I do sometimes when I am low. I think that my daughter would be better off without me, and then I try to think who she would actually be better off with. My mother? :evil: My brothers? :evil: Her dad?? :evil: You can go through as many people as you like; chances are you will find the same answer as I do. Imperfect as I am, broken as I am in parts, I am still the best mother for her. I am sure you will think the same about yourself and your children. You are a very loving, very giving person. You cannot be replaced. And, as a mother, you cannot be bettered. :)
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Hi Denise:
How are ya this day? Hope you made it through the week end. Also, hope you will post soon to let us know how you are doing?
Hey October: I don't know yet what I am willing and not willling to do, and I'm not sure how you know this?
....and all the way, while you are willing to hold her hand only up to the point....
Do you see why this type of statement might not sit well?
I have emotional numbing, just for good measure. Mostly I feel nothing. Doesn't mean I don't care, but it is not connected, if that makes any sense at all. Probably not.
Does this mean you care with your head instead of you heart? That your thoughts of caring aren't connected with feelings of caring? I'm trying to understand, October. I have the feeling that you do care, very much, so at least it might help to know that you give that clear impression. :D
No worries anyhow (((((October))))). Hope today is a good one for you!
GFN
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Can i just say, october has been very helpful and caring towards me on the board and with pms, and yet it seems people are twisting round what she says, why is this, or am i reading things the wrong way again?? :?
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Is my reaction wrong, when i say that people that look at porn sites make me feel sick, i put it all in the pervert catergory, i put it in my sexual abuser catergory, i have just asked a question "what do you get out of it" the reply was" i like it," i said it makes me sick cos it reminds me of my abuser, and it upsets me greatly, i understand child and adult porn is different, but 4 some1 2 know of my bad experiences and then tell me the site they go on(ADULT PORN) and say they like it, just makes me ill, AM I WRONG TO FEEL THIS WAY?
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Denise. No, your reaction is not wrong. You do not have to justify your opinion to these people, or anyone. Your reasoning is valid, and so are you. I believe many, many people will agree with what you say, but perhaps not the people you are around.
I did not have the horrible experiences you did and I think pornography is bad. It objectifies people and is a major contibutor to the pain this planet experiences. Whenever we see fellow humans as objects and not human this will happen. This belief of mine is one of the reasons I do not have friends who would use pornography, or if they did, they would not share that fact with me (as we would not remain close).
I have noticed from your posts, that you seem to be surrounded by people who do not share your level of thinking and spirit. Is there any way to extricate yourself from your social situation? This may be a contributing factor in your pain.
Good to see you here this morning, Denise!!
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Hi Denise, very good to read you.
Can i just say, october has been very helpful and caring towards me on the board and with pms, and yet it seems people are twisting round what she says, why is this, or am i reading things the wrong way again??
Does it bother you Denise? I think October is helpful and caring towards you. I think the same of GFN, but she talks to you in a different way. I think October and GFN are talking to each other because they disagree on something. But that’s between them, it’s not about you, I feel.
They both still help and care about you, whatever they say to each other. It’s okay for them to talk to each other, it won’t hurt you, and they’ll both still care about you, I imagine. Does that help you? Let us know if it does bother you, okay?
About porn, I agree with Mum: I think pornography is bad. It objectifies people and is a major contibutor to the pain this planet experiences.
I didn’t used to think this harshly about pornography, but I do now. I used to think adult porn wasn’t really hurting anyone, but it does. It hurts those who take part in it and it hurts those who buy it. It treats people as objects, sex as a commodity, to be bought and sold. Adult pornography probably leads directly to child porn. So I think you’re right to feel the way do.
Why do people like porn? Because they’re too lazy or too screwed up mentally to have a real, adult relationship I guess. If you don’t like it Denise, I guess you’re more adult and more thoughtful than those people. That is, you have a good brain. Yes you do :) take care Denise
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As I am still a tad gunshy from a recent altercation here, I'll only say what I can from my own direct experience. No comments are directed at anyone in particular.
I think we are all different and need different things at different times.
When I was severely depressed, I do not believe a sympathetic shoulder would have done me much good. I had one and it didn't help.
I believe in my case I needed someone to gently slap my face and get me out of my rut of focusing on my present pain, rather than my loved ones and the hope of a better future.
I think for some people gently holding their hand all the way is the right thing to do.
But for others, I believe holding their hand with a good hard tug and a maybe somewhat uncomfortable squeeze right up to the very brink, to try and wake them up, is what is needed.
Now, I don't know which way is called for in this case or whether either is. But I do know it is possible to care for someone just as much and to be trying your best for that person's welfare just as much by either approach.
Thats my perspective anyway. I hope it helps a little.
mudpup
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Denise,
You aren't wrong to dislike and be appalled by porn. It might be really important for you only to be with men who don't look at porn. If a man looks at porn, probably that is a sign that he's unsafe for you. It won't help to ask him not to look at it -- he is addicted and can't stop. It's not about you. These are problems/addictions that he had before meeting you.
bunny
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Is my reaction wrong, when i say that people that look at porn sites make me feel sick, i put it all in the pervert catergory, i put it in my sexual abuser catergory, i have just asked a question "what do you get out of it" the reply was" i like it," i said it makes me sick cos it reminds me of my abuser, and it upsets me greatly, i understand child and adult porn is different, but 4 some1 2 know of my bad experiences and then tell me the site they go on(ADULT PORN) and say they like it, just makes me ill, AM I WRONG TO FEEL THIS WAY?
Denise, you are entitled to your reaction and choices in this area as in every area of your life. They are a part of you. You don't have to explain your position, justify it by having been abused, or explain it. It isn't about being right or being wrong. You feel and believe the way you do and that tells us (and you) about you. Nobody (who is healthy) can argue with that, even though they may hold completely different views.
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Hi Denise:
Very glad to see you posting! Good for you! You made it through the week end! Way to go!
I'm with you re. the porn thing. I think it's degrading to women. Just because something is legal doesn't always make it right, imo. I don't blame you one bit for feeling ill about it and I agree with all who say you will probably be better off with a person that doesn't like it either.
Also: Do you think October and I are upset with eachother? I don't think we are. We agree on one thing, that's for sure, and that is that we both like you and care about you Denise. :D :D :D
October: I hope you're ok too. :D
GFN
PS: Thanks P and Mud
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Also: Do you think October and I are upset with eachother? I don't think we are. We agree on one thing, that's for sure, and that is that we both like you and care about you Denise. :D :D :D
Quite right. And maybe an important part of friendship is to be able to disagree and still stay friends. If we didn't care we would have stopped bothering to try to communicate ages ago, imo.
GFN is one of the people I really value on this board. There are lots of others too. :lol:
Not reading the rest of the thread, other than this page tonight. Not easy to revisit some posts (mine, that is. If I go back, they will end up deleted.) Apologies to anyone missed out, and (((((hugs)))) to Denise.
Don't worry about the peripheral stuff, Denise. You are doing really well, imo. I am really impressed with how well you are tackling each problem as it happens, and winning through bit by bit. :lol:
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Now, I don't know which way is called for in this case or whether either is. But I do know it is possible to care for someone just as much and to be trying your best for that person's welfare just as much by either approach.
Thats my perspective anyway. I hope it helps a little.
mudpup
I admit you may be right. I also admit that I cannot see the other side of the picture, and that I am aware that this does not necessarily mean I am right either. But having been slapped round the face, mostly but not always metaphorically, too many times in my life, what I would need - what I do need - is total absolute acceptance. Anything else would drive me away.
It is only acceptance which would keep me connected. Speaking to Denise in this way seems to resonate with her, so that is why I keep doing it. If I thought it was not helping I would not carry on here, particularly in the face of alternative points of view. I am not usually resilient enough to stand my ground in this way. :oops: :oops:
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Does this mean you care with your head instead of you heart? That your thoughts of caring aren't connected with feelings of caring? I'm trying to understand, October. I have the feeling that you do care, very much, so at least it might help to know that you give that clear impression. :D
GFN
Thanks, yes it does help. I care with my heart and my head, but the connection between the two is broken. So although I know intellectually that I love, I cannot feel it emotionally. The only emotional connections that get through are strong pain and anger. None of the rest. I know that I love my daughter, but I can only feel it if she has hurt herself, when I feel the (emotional) pain. I can't feel love. :(
Probably impossible to imagine unless you have ever experienced it. Not very nice. But it makes me (feel) a bit robotic/inhuman sometimes.
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Hi October,
It is only acceptance which would keep me connected. Speaking to Denise in this way seems to resonate with her, so that is why I keep doing it.
Good for you, October.
I am not usually resilient enough to stand my ground in this way.
Doubly good for you, October.
So although I know intellectually that I love, I cannot feel it emotionally.
We feel it emotionally from you. I don't know if that helps you but it definitely helps us.
GFN is one of the people I really value on this board.
This sentiment represents why, despite its warts, this place is so unique.
Yous guys are makin me all teary eyed.
mud
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Hi everyone, i hope u r all well, am glad october and gfn are friends i thought i had caused conflict between them (((((hugs to both)))))
I have to say my weekend wasnt bad at all, David took me out to a couple of carboot sales, i was ok till we went to eat then i had a huge panic attack after 5/10 mins things calmed down, although it did make me feel sick, i got a new computer dask for a tenner cos it had a crack in it, not huge, but great bargain, amn David bought me a game, i must admit i felt bit rough by the time i got in, an a bit niggley, tired i suppose, but on the whole the weekend was the best in a looooooooooooooong time.
Ive not been in therapy for a month now, no antidepressants for 2 weeks, although i still use the diazapam,but havent took them 4 a few days, 2day i didnt feel good, head down the loo as soon as i woke up feeling sick bad tummy cramps and just sickly all day, dunno if its withdrawal off diazapam, then this subject of porn came up(can i just say this isnt all the people i know that look at it) i found it a shock at 1st that this person was looking, then amid conversation he actually clicked on the sight an told me what the women was wearing etc, i said it made me sick, gave the reasons why, but once again i am the bad one, people r entitled to do as they please but dont have 2 rub 1s nose in it, its really upset me today, i said u look cos u like it, then i said it makes me think of my abuser, did he abuse me cos he liked it, i tried to explain but its all been twisted round and now am the bad guy, now the weekend has been spoilt cos there will be a bad atmosphere all week, ive cried, was really upset, and was told to stop whinging, i cant win, in the end i had to take diazapam an other things to calm down cos i got myself in such a state, i go the hozzy wednesday, new meds lets hope they make me sane again, i was told off 4 putting the bit about the porn on here but no names were mentioned so what does it matter.
Just maybe sit back and think how u would feel if u had been sexually abused in such a disgusting way and try to understand were i am coming from :cry: :cry:
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Hi again all:
If we didn't care we would have stopped bothering to try to communicate ages ago, imo.
So true, October. Thankyou for saying this.
GFN is one of the people I really value on this board.
:oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: Thankyou and I have to say I value you very much too, regardless of whatever heart-mind connections seem missing to you, October. They don't seem missing to me (about you) and you don't seem the least bit like a robot, or unfeeling, or apathetic. If anything, you seem quite caring and keen on picking up on feelings. That's the way you come across and that's a lovely thing about you.
I am not usually resilient enough to stand my ground in this way.
Then that's a positive outcome from our discussions......good practice and good job, October!! I meant it!! :D
I cannot feel it emotionally.
May I suggest that this is something you believe....that you believe you cannot....and that it may not be forever?? Maybe it could be said:
Right now, you are not fully aware of your feelings of love but are hoping to get more in tune with those feelings soon? I'm sure this will happen for you October, it will just take a bit of time.....and before you know it.....you'll be bursting with those loving feelings!!
This is totally off topic but that just reminded me of once, when I went to a "therapist"......(very loose term there)..... who rediculed me when I mentioned my faith in God and said to me:
"You're just like the Buddists. I mean. The Buddists are all ok and everything but they just say: 'Let's all sit around and love eachother' and while they're all sitting around and loving eachother, nothing gets done".
What a jerk!! Guess what I said back to him?
"Just because you can't see it or feel it, doesn't mean it isn't getting done."
Guess what I felt like saying? "How the heck would you know? I bet you don't even love your dog!!! " :evil:
October, you're waaaaaaaaaaaaaay ahead of that person, believe me. You empathize...which shows you perceive with love.....which you may not realize as a clear feeling...since it's not something so easily defined maybe?
Back to you Denise. :D
GFN
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If you are with a man who is looking at porn in front of you, and describing it to you, he is being INCREDIBLY RUDE. You don't have to explain why you don't like it. You don't have to tell him you were abused so you don't like it. He shouldn't be doing it. All I can say is, he has a really big problem.
bunny
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He wasnt looking at it in front of me, he was talking on the phone, then as i am saying i dont like it and why he clicks on the site and then starts telling me what its about, after numerous words today about it ive been called everything under the sun, so i shout back in anger and get called more 4 it, am in a no win situation, how can something b so good 1 day and so bad the next, i really do think i am going mad, i must be, if some1 cannot understand the simple facts y i dont like porn or like the details of it cos it gives me bad feelings then obviously there is something wrong with me, but to keep saying "well i like it" repulses me, i clicked on the site just to look it sickened me, young girls bout 16/18 dressed in school uniform, showing everything off, do u not understand were i am coming from, did my sex abuser say "i like it" when i was a little girl, these r the thought in my head.
I cant believe how different a person can be, some1 that said they hated porn it done nothing for them and then 2day they say they like it, my head is so messed up, i dont know what is right or wrong anymore, whats good or bad, i know am bad ive been told so many times, and y cos i dont explain myself properly, i did say earlier there was a difference in child and adult porn, but in my head its all as bad and gives me deep rooted bad feelings, i wish i could explain better, once again the tears r flowing and i feel sick inside, just about every single week in months something has happened to knock me back in the dark hole, i cant get out, if i try am pushed back in.
Does anyone else question themselves as i do, is it me, or is it them thats causing this?? :cry:
Denise
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He wasnt looking at it in front of me, he was talking on the phone, then as i am saying i dont like it and why he clicks on the site and then starts telling me what its about
That is the same as looking at it in front of you. It's totally ill-mannered, insensitive, and he did it on purpose. But I already believe that he has very serious emotional problems.
how can something b so good 1 day and so bad the next
Because when things go well, some people feel vulnerable because they're getting too close for comfort. They pick a fight to create enough distance where they feel safe again.
bunny
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Hi Girl
Ok, the first thing to accept is that what has happened in your life did happen. Yes, it was awful and yes, you have no one to turn to.
The next thing to do is accept that these issues are embedded in your memory. They are a part of you and make you what you are today.
You may not like what you think you are, but that doesn't mean that you are worth any less than anyone else on this planet.
It would be great to see you start thinking that the only way from here is up. How far up and how quickly you get there is under your control. That is the secret to improving your self esteem.
Once your self esteem improves then you will start seeing the dregs of life for what they are. Those dregs caused these issues, not you. Their guilt is on their conscience, not yours. You are a decent person, you know you are. You wouldn't be here otherwise.
If you want advice then the best I can give you is to start believing this one last time that there is a life, there is happiness, and that you are going to get it. Don't let anyone stand in your way. They can't win, they won't win. You are going to win this time. Push the crap back at those people who give it to you, ignore those who seek to get in your way. It's your life, not theirs and they can screw up their lives, not yours.
You really can do it. One step forward is all it takes, and that one step IS a step forward. You have a wealth of experience of what can go wrong. more than most. You know what to look for, you know how to spot the bad guys. Make use of those skills and take a pride in them.
The next time someone tries to mess things up just think 'no way, I am in control now and it just isn't going to happen'.
We are all with you. You have friends here. You can chat to us anytime you like.
Rob G
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Thank you RobG for a masterful post. I know you weren't talking to me but I heard you.
Guest2
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If anybody I knew, liked or loved pulled this stunt on me (particularly if I'd been abused to the degree you have been), I would end the friendship / relationship then and there.
It sounds to me like it is severe emotional abuse and the person is enjoying toying with you.
Good luck at the hospital and with the therapist. Once you are on the mend, you will realise that you need to surround yourself with loving, positive people and give anyone else a wide berth.
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Does anyone else question themselves as i do, is it me, or is it them thats causing this??
I have to agree with Bunny, David sounds like a very messed up individual. I believe your feeling like you are at times "going mad" is coming from having contact with him. I now live in Belgium, where the weather is lousy but the health care system I have found to be very good. There was a time when I felt like I was "going crazy" and I had a few appointments with a psychiatrist. Now I knew in my mind that I was not crazy, but others tried to make me out like I was the crazy one. I had the same question as you, is it me or is it them? I questioned myself over and over. It sounds like David is trying to make you out to be the crazy one, but from what information the two of you have expressed here it seems that you were managing pretty well despite your past until you and David hooked up. If you are around a person that is really messed up it can cause you to feel messed up in the head yourself.
Do you really feel like it is beneficial for you to continue to have contact with him? It seems like contact with him is like being on a roller coaster. There are the highs and the lows. Are the highs really worth the lows? Personally I had to decide for myself that the costs outweighed the benefits in a few of my relationships and I had to sever ties. Yes there were benefits that I lost, but in the end it was much better for me and allowed me to have a more stable life. These are just things for you to consider.
LM
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Hi Denise,
I know you said weekends are bad for you. I'm just checking in to see how you are doing. I haven't seen you post in a couple days. Big hugs from out here in anti-N-land!
Guest2
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Hi everyone, just letting u all know the latest, last weekend i went out with David,(hes not all bad, he can b good at times, although very naughty other times) just as friends went to rhyl 4 the day lunch out, all in all it wasnt a bad weekend.
I must say 1 thing sice i have stopped taking those reboxetine tablets i feel a lot better in myself,i was very sickly and had terrible cramps and headaches, i just put it down to withdrawal, i went to c my psychiatrist the other day, hes a bit of an idiot, imo, i asked about these suicidal feelings agrophobia etc and said i thought it was the tablets that were making me worse, his answer was, the manufacturers will disagree although they have had patients that have been through the exact same thing with the same feelings, he has prescribed new 1s which i havent got yet, citrolpram i think they r called, i havent had any 4 nearly 3 weeks now so maybe i wont bother or maybe just try the low dosage 4 now, i still feel like i cant venture out on my own but maybe in time, its just 1 step at a time, still no therapist though i am on the high priority list he says.
I had a bit of bad news this week as a lady i look after and have done 4 yrs, died, i was very sad as she has been suffering the last few months, although i was and am very upset about it, i have dealt with it a lot better than i have in the past when people close to me have died, at least she isnt suffering now, am just sorry i didnt get chance to say goodbye :cry:
Anyway 4 now i am feeling positive, but i know from seeing my old therapist, i can go up and down, lets hope up lasts a bit longer.
David is giving me some money again which is nice, i dont have debts and theres always food in but never money left 4 anything else, so its nice 2 b able to buy some bits and pieces and not have 2 worry :) after all retail therapy is the best kind, i say as i smile to myself.
I hope everyone is well, thanku 4 the msges off the new peopleand old 1s, it means a lot 2 me knowing people care.
Mati and October i hope u r well as i have not heard from u 2 in a while
(((((((((hugs 4 everyone)))))))))
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I always 4get to sign in :? reply on previous page
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Hi Denise:
Glad to hear things are going better for you!
Wonderful news!! :D
GFN
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Thanks GFN :)
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Hi again Denise:
You're very welcome!
And I forgot to say......have a great week end!!
Keeping you in my thoughts and prayers!!
((((Denise))))
GFN
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Mati and October i hope u r well as i have not heard from u 2 in a while
Hiya D, glad things are a bit more stable for you; that is really good news.
I am sorry you lost your friend, but I don't think it is too late to say goodbye to her; choose your own time and place for this, and say whatever you need to, whether in words or in a letter.
Good luck with the weekend.
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Last night i went out with my eldest daughter 4 a drink, the 1st time in a long time, i felt sick all day thinking about it, but pushed myself, of course it was 2 much all at once, i did not enjoy it 1 little bit i felt very anxious, although it was nice having a good chat with my daughter, everything else i hated, we came home she stayed over, i went to bed and just cried, i was awake till 5 this morning, i feel very down again, and ive cried all day, i obviously still do need medication to lift my mood.
And i want to say thanks 2 my friend whose was very attentive all week, but as soon as the weekend came, i get shut off and ignored, i am sick of people being false, a few of my friends said they would come out with me this weekend, no1 did, so now i am going to shut myself off from people again, if u cant b genuine and sincere, dont bother to pretend, cos its just putting me back down. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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although it was nice having a good chat with my daughter, everything else i hated,
Hiya D. I agree, it is likely that you need medication at present to help you a little. However, I don't agree that going out with your daughter was quite as bad as you feel. You paid a very high price for going out, I can see, but you still did it. That is a real achievement. You say it was nice having a chat with her; surely that is worth a great deal? And it will get easier next time. So well done you!!!!! Honestly, I mean it, you have made a real step forward in achieving this.
Friends can't always be there when we need them to be. That is true of my life as well as yours. It is really difficult when you are a giving person, to find that at the moment of need everyone seems to run for the hills, at a point where you are sure you would have stuck around. But maybe we wouldn't have stuck around either, if we are honest. I couldn't say that I have always put other people before myself, or considered what they need with quite the degree of interest I have in my own life. It is a shame, but that is life. But your daughter was there for you, and she stayed over with you. With a daughter like that, who needs to worry about friends; you can see them another time. But she sounds like a real treasure. :) (((hugs)))
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I think maybe i still need the medication i am supposed to b starting a new 1 this week, my daughters not always about although shes a good girl, shes got a new boyfriend so spends most of her spare time with him, even my best friend said she would come out 4 a couple of hours and she never, i feel really let down. And i have been told, if i start taking the antidepressants again, the extra money i have been offered will stop, its either pills 2 keep me sane or money to help with the extras, but there again if i lose it again i wont need the money will i?! Although my mood has been lighter this week, i am still down inside, but ive tried hard 2 keep smiling, i think as the week has gone on the anxiety has built up an up, and now i need a release.amazing how i few little things like ignorance and pretense can change everything back round, i am sick of it and sick of people saying 1 thing and doing another :cry: :cry:
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Ive never asked any of my friends 4 anything b4, and when i do ask 4 1 little thing i get a kick in the teeth, ive been told am only a phonecall away i b there 4 u, i was even asked if i wanted a meal 2nite, that fleeting thought was soon 4gotton, theres my wkend and myself messed up yet again.
Am not looking 4 pity i just feel really let down, but who cares its only Denise after all she will cope :(
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Ive never asked any of my friends 4 anything b4, and when i do ask 4 1 little thing i get a kick in the teeth, ive been told am only a phonecall away i b there 4 u, i was even asked if i wanted a meal 2nite, that fleeting thought was soon 4gotton, theres my wkend and myself messed up yet again.
Am not looking 4 pity i just feel really let down, but who cares its only Denise after all she will cope :(
Plenty of us care about you, Denise. But friends can't always be there when we need them to be. I am sorry, but we have to take what they are able to give, and be grateful, rather than always notice what is not there. A friend forgetting to turn up for a couple of hours with you is not the same thing as a kick in the teeth, though. It might feel like it, but it is not. Friends forget; we all forget sometimes.
Same with your daughter. It is absolutely right that she should have a life of her own, and a boyfriend and her own interests. Given that, she is a wonderful daughter to have spent so much time with you over the weekend. But it is not enough, is it?
The only person that can be there, 100% of the time, for you, is you. I am sorry, and this is really hard to get to grips with, I know, but you cannot rely on other people to keep you going. It has to come from the inside, and that is such a difficult thing to do. I am not sure I even know how to do it myself, but I am sure this is the only thing that will work, in the end. Then we can take visits from friends and relations as a wonderful, welcome, bonus rather than straws to clutch at in despair.
Thinking of you, Denise.
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but who cares its only Denise after all she will cope
Denise has to care, Denise. That's all that really matters. Please don't feel distressed by this, instead it is the one thing that keeps us whole. Denise matters. YOU matter. You decide for yourself to be happy or unhappy. It's not up to them, whether they are around or not. Please don't give them your power any more.
October is right, Denise. Happiness comes from the inside. Many people are lonely, even when surrounded by people all the time. If people are in your life only to keep you from being with yourself.....well, there's the core of it, huh? (((((((Denise))))))))
I sometimes get upset if someone I need to talk to isn't available for me. Usually after a while I realize I am alone because it just worked out that way, and I better be there for myself. Others, not even the ones who love us best, can take care of us in this way. It is something we must learn alone. To be comfortable with ourselves.
How is the path toward therapy going, Denise?
Are you drinking alcohol when you go out? I have found alcohol to be a real pain....it kept me from reality, even in moderation, because even when I'm not drinking, if the people I am around are even a little drunk, letting them decide if I will be happy or not isn't a really good idea. Well, letting others decide our mood never is, but I have found that putting stock in anything someone drunk has to say is not a great idea.
Please take this with love....I would not coddle you with messages without true feeling, because I believe you are a capable person, able to heal. You are not your life situation. YOU are capable.
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How are ya doing Denise?
Are you still reading?
GFN
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I found out the other day,the crown prosecution has decided not to prosecute my sex abuser, on the grounds of, cos it was so many years ago, he would not be able to give an alibi for himself, plus my medical records before the age of 16 have vanished, so basically it wouldnt be a fair trial, i am absolutely sick and gutted, he has got away with it, although it clearly states on my file i was sexually abused it doesnt name him as the abuser, if people had took notice of what i said when i was young and questioned all my sexual activities that were wrote about when i was 5, we wouldnt be here now, and he would have been punished, its a disgrace on the part of the law and social services cos they let me down big time.
The fact i said he use 2 climb through the window, and i remember clearly and he has admitted it but saying he only done it once, and yet he went on to say betty(mother) use to leave us alone days at a time, how would he know unless he was there regularly, so what he says is the same as some of the facts written in my statement, and yet walks away probably smiling, the justice system is totally messed up, it should have gone 2 court and let a jury hear both sides of the story, and let them decide.
I was a little girl sexually abused on many occasions in many dirty disgusting ways, AND HES GOT AWAY WITH IT!!! :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Denise,
I'm very sorry that the justice system is not doing its job. It will be little of consolation, but I believe that they would not have prosecuted him here in the States either, because the statute of limitations (the amount of time where charges can be brought) would have run out. Murder is one of the few (or maybe the only) thing which does not have a time limit.
Would his being put in jail miraculously have made you healthy? Probably not. You would have gotten some satisfaction knowing that he had gotten his life diminished, but it would not have fixed you. Hopefully you know that he will face judgment and pay the price of his evil ways eventually, but probably not in this lifetime.
Now you need to put this behind you and find the way to truly fix Denise and make her whole. I know that I am saying this as a person who has not endured the pain and suffering that you have, but I really don't see any other options for you. You know you can't continue to live the way you have been and ever hope to find peace and happiness. I want that so much for you, Denise, as I'm sure many others here do, your children do and your friends and other family as well.
I pray that you can start to work on you and find a way to take those tiny, little steps day-by-day to lead yourself out of the dark and into the light. Only you can do that. Friends and family can support you, but you are the one who must do the work. I wish you much hope and faith.
((((((((Denise)))))))))))
God bless,
Brigid
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Hi Denise
My abuser got away with it too because he died :cry: I wish that I had spoken out sooner. Too late now. But I do believe that justice is done despite the legal system as I believe that the higher power/God will not allow crimes against children to go unpunished. My abuser got Alzheimers so maybe that was punishment. It is so unfair if they get away with it but it is true that it does not affect our recovery and personal growth. They never did develop into whole healthy people else they would have come to us to express their sorrow and say sorry. They will die as sad sick people but we can make the decision to be whole and have all of the things in life that have been denied to us. Why let them win is what I say. I hope that you can see there is hope for you too Denise.
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Dear Denise:
I'm sorry that your abuser got away with abusing you. My abusers did/are still too. It sucks. I know it's not the same type of abuse but pain is pain, isn't it? It's maddening too, isn't it, that people get away with behaving the way they do, sometimes eh?
I'm with Mati in that I don't think they will get away with it forever. Maybe in this life. Maybe.
Anyway......it's a loss because you said you were hoping he would have to face justice and so I'm sure that hurts and adds to your sadness and feelings of being abused......now by the "system".
I hope you will get those feelings out and grieve the loss. You don't need any more pain to keep/carry inside.
October and Mum gave you some profound advice, I think, and others have echoed their suggestion that:
Denise needs to care about Denise and that Denise matters.
I hope you are doing little things for you, that help you feel a little better, inbetween feeling all the rest of the junk. I hope you are hugging Denise and caring for Denise and believing that Denise does matter!
((((((((Denise))))))))
GFN
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Hi, everyone, sorry ive not been posting, i needed to get my head around what has gone on, for now i have completely stopped with the antidepressants, and i actually feel better for it, things arent perfect, but they are getting there slowly, i want to thank u all 4 your support, it helped hugely :).
I hope everyone is doing ok, i will have to read and catch up, hugs 4 you all
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Denise, I am very glad that you are feeling somewhat better and that you are back posting! :) Keep taking care of yourself.