Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Cadbury on May 27, 2005, 07:19:28 AM
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Hello Everyone!
For those that didn't read the pregnancy post, I had a beautiful baby boy 9 days ago. I stayed strong and thought of mysef and didn't let my ex know about his son until after the event. He had wanted to be at the birth, but after worrying myself sick about it I suddenly realised that I WASN'T WITH HIM ANYMORE!! And so I could just leave him out. Sounds stupid, but I'm sure a lot of people on here have had the same thing.
Anyway, I let him see his son for half an hour the day after he was born. During that haf hour, he moaned incessantly about how he hadn't seen his son born. He then told me I had put on a lot of weight since he had last seen me and asked me if I thought he'd lost weight. I said no. (He was hurt by that). He didn't ask how our son was, how I was, how the birth had been. He looked at our beautiful boy and said "I can't believe he doesn't look more like me". Only an N! Then he started trying to discuss our relationship and was getting me more upset. I managed to hide this and luckily, guessing he would be like this, I had prearranged for the midwife to come in and do a "post-natal check" after half an hour so that he would have to leave. I then cried for hours. Seeing him hold my darling boy was the hardest thing. I had previously thought that I could cope with him having contact, but I don't know if I can.
After the birth, the pleurisy I had been suffering with got worse and I was readmitted to hospital to be checked out for a blood clot. I had an awful weekend in hospital and was let out on Monday. Luckily my son could stay with me so I didn't cry as much as I might have (hormones raging). I emailed my ex on the Monday night and just explained I'd been ill and asked him to let me have some recovery time before having to deal with the future. He emailed back and said ok. Wednesday he phoned my mother at work and asked to drop some things over to her. She was so shocked she didn't know what to say. He turned up and gave her the stuff. Didn't ask about me or the baby. Talked about himself and left. He had sent a bear for our son. The thing is it is a "Bear Factory" bear with his voice recorded in it. I heard it and cried.
I just don't know what to do. I don't want him to touch our son ever. I cannot cope with seeing him myself as it is too emotionally distressing. I don't think he is a fit father asI have witnessed him do things that are way over the top to his son from a previous relationship. I didn't know how others may have coped with this? I am leaning towards Social services and supervised contact but I know how hard he would then make my life. I have registred my son in my maiden name without my ex being present, which by UK law means he doesn't now have parental responsibility unless he goes to court for it. I am terrified of him finding this out as it will be something that will drive him mad - more the fact that the baby doesn't have his name than anything else.
I have lots of events of his mad behaviour written down and woitnessed where possible, so I think I may have enough amuntion to get supervised access only. The trouble is he may then get even more vicious. As soon as he sees a challenge he wants to win it, whether he cares about our son or not. So should I let him have access and let him lose interest of his own account? I have even contemplated telling him he's not the father! I am just so lost and crying most of the time. I wish he would leave me alone. If I had money I think I could pay him off, but I haven't so I don't have that option!
Sorry to ramble on, but I am so up in the air and just wanted opinions and ideas, or experiences etc to help me think through.
Thank you all so much!
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Dear Cadbury,
Ofcourse all of these worries are hard for you and will need to be considered.
Right now, you don't have to decide anything. Keep stalling and expressing your need for recovery time and keep recovering. You will feel much stronger soon and be in a better position to decide what next.
All of this can wait. The bear can go in a closet. Enjoy your little bundle of joy and take care of you first, for now.
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put the bear somewhere out of reach, stop worrying about your ex, and decide to take each day with your beautiful child as the priority right now.
Remember your ex's n-comments are because it's so painful to him not being the centre of attention; and nothing takes away that attention like a newborn baby. So unless you engage and he gets n-attention from the situation I'd expect him to get bored pretty quickly. And yes, you know he'll turn up from time to time and try to throw you off balance, but you'll feel stronger in a few weeks. You're vulnerable now and need to just be enjoying your family and resting.
Enlist support from your mum and folks who know what you've been through and don't let him get wind of 'I wish he would leave me alone', decide what you want to say ( eg I'm taking some time/ space to get a routine going ) and be like a matter-of-fact emotionless broken record. Don't try to see anything from his point of view, you can put his needs off, they're not your priority after all; prioritise taking care of yourself.
((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((())))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
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(((((Cadbury)))))
Oh, I am so sad for you. I remember just standing in my kitchen crying and crying for no apparent reason after my son was born. And you certainly have reasons!
Please have faith that the answers will come, and try not to put energy into figuring it all out right now. You have just gone through the most stressful and life changing thing a woman could possibly experience. Put off anything else....things have a way of working out well when we don't worry so much about them. Take action when and if you have to, and in the meantime, don't even care what your ex is thinking/doing.
Put the bear away, your child is too young to appreciate it, and it is upsetting to you, forget about it...(it was such an N present anyway...."oh, woah is me....I want him to hear MY voice"....coming from a stuffed bear????).
Focus on what you DO want, which you have in a sweet little bundle....and take any energy away from the N, for even now, you can see what he is.
My biggest mistakes were made when I felt sorry for "poor" exN. He was so very good at making others feel his pain, and then getting his way!!
So you know this. So let go of him, his pain, his needs. Your child deserves a mom who knows she deserves a good life, and whose goal is clear: to make a happy, emotionally healthy home for her and her child.
Relax. Have faith, things will be ok....breathe....focus on what you want, not what you don't. Good things will continue to happen.
Practical advice: Sleep when your baby does....and as close as possible to him. It's not a waste of time, it's essential.
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Hi Cadbury
I gave birth to my son as I was divorcing X N. He was not present at the birth as per my request. He did however have the nerve to show up at the hospital the day after. That was not a good day for me to say the least.
I agree with the others...don't worry about everything right at this moment. You have plenty of reasons/excuses to stall him and keep him at bay.
You have a newborn and newborns need to be with nurturing Mommy.....not psycho Daddy.
If he insists on seeing the baby maybe you could allow it (of course you would be there) but insist that you want another party present as well since you don't feel comfortable being around him.
Also, ditch the bear for now. My X N did the same exact thing but thankfully the bear didn't have his recorded voice. I put the bear away. My son didn't know any better anyway. BTW, I ended up throwing the bear in the garbage. It made me sick to look at it. My son is five now and noone has EVER asked for it or remembered it. I feel guilty about doing it but hey, if that's the worse thing I ever did to my kid then I think I can live with that.
You will find the strength to get through this time. Focus on your beautiful son and your lovely girls. Believe me if I could survive it you can too! God blessed you with a precious boy. With each passing day your head will clear and you will be able to deal with your X.
I hope I made you feel better.
You are in my thoughts and prayers.
Mia
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Thank you for all your replies, it does help to hear it from people who aren't family. I don't know why, it just seems more real or something.
Well, my son and I are settling down well. He feeds almost nonstop and doesn't really sleep that much at night, but the zombie look is in this year! (I wish!). He has spent every night in my bed and it is nice to have a decent man there for once! He doesn't steal the covers or snore, but does suffer from wind! Still, I can over look that!
My ex has not been in touch for almost a week, which is good. However, it isn't like him, so either he's planning something or he's found another source. Something else I try not to worry about. I tried to follow the advice about not thinking about him, but I find that hard. I just don't want him to ruin my son's life wit his manipulative ways.
I can't decide what will work best with his NPD. If I give him very little contact he may see that as a challenge and fight for more, whether or not he actually wants it. If I let him have a reasonable amount of contact, I have to live with the fact that he really isn't good for my son, but that may make him give up. If he finds someone else then he may lose interest anyway, or use her to fight me for custody. This is so hard, I stay awake when I should be sleeping thinking all the scenarios through. I try not to, I know I should rest more, but I just wish he would leave us alone.
Thanks again
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This is so hard, I stay awake when I should be sleeping thinking all the scenarios through
I hate to bring up the dreaded word: Lawyer. If you can get some advice now when your kiddo is so young, it may help sort out the scenarios. Forewarned is forearmed.
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The above but one post is me by the way, no idea why I was a guest as I'm logged n, but anyway!
Thanks Dogbit, I have been thinking about that. It's just the money side. Something like £120 for an hour + VAT. Still, worth it if I can find it I suppose. Will keep thinking. thanks all. Any opinions etc welcome!
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Hi Cadbury,
You are having a tough time! And sounds like you're being strong. I have 2 kids and I can say that if you take care of yourself, you are a much better parent. Not that I follow my own advice, but when I do, things go much better. Dont' try to compensate for your worthless husband by doing more.
Also, talk to your doctor about post-partum depression. All new moms are at risk but if your life is stressful you are even more at risk. Don't go along thinking you can handle everything or you will snap out of it, if it doesn't feel right. Make sure you have support.
Good luck.
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Hi Cadbury and congratulations!!! Try not to worry too much (easier said than done, I know...), and just concentrate on your lovely baby and on taking care of you both. Don't try to figure out how your ex will react to different strategies, but wait and see what he will do first? Maybe he won't be interested enough to do anything about custody? At least that way you'll have some time to yourself for now. Best of luck to you and take care! :D
((((((((Cadbury&son))))))))
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One thought Cadbury:
Are there any woman's shelters in your area? You have been abused. They will often have free or low cost counselling available.
I know it isn't maybe the same as some therapy but it might be a good support and a third eye?? Someone objective to talk with, who may know the system and some tricks to help you out?
Hope you and baby are enjoying eachother!
Take care of you both.
GFN
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Cadbury and Son:
Congratulations! I have been reading your threads off an on for about two months but never responded. So I plan to do that now! I am very happy about your new addition and what it will mean as your child gets older.
As far as the ex N and I do mean ex. This is where he is relegated as an ex. My experience with N's who like to "win or be right" at any cost is to just let it run its course. The more you protest or buck against it the more they are embolden to do more crap to just show that they can. He has the interest of a zero in your son. The interest is in the fight. His ego cannot stand the fact you are setting limits. If in fact you begin to require real "fatherhood" things out of him, believe me he will lose interest fast. The prime example is how he treats others and his other children. If it is not about him, then it has no importance.
Put the bear away or anything else that reminds you of him. When he comes over require him to take care of the child and busy yourself with other things while he is there. Responsiblity is the last thing he will want.
I know that is it is very traumatic for you to be around him and for him to touch the baby. I agree with this. However, the ultimate goal is to have him lose interest totally and leave you and the baby alone.
My ex N, I ignored, he got tired of the effort and went away. There of course was not a child involved so this puts a different take on things.
Also you are still post partum and the hormones are doing a number on you as well. Just know that we are here for you and pray for God's protection.
Much love
Patz
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Hi Cadbury
As one who has used the refuge system, you could go into one saying you feel unsafe and that you need to get away from n. They are quite good some of them being single seperate units. They offer masses of support and can tell you of a counsellor, but they are trained to offer support anyway and it is the getting somewhere safe that comes first. You could go to one in another part of the country if you want and have a contact in that area, or stay in your own and get provided with housing from the council. They do not put you in bad areas. In the meantime you could put your stuff into storage, but anyway if you leave anything they give you a grant to set up home again and in my area the council provide furnishing. That is if you want to get away from n totally. There is a lot of help for women leaving abusive relationships but you have to look for it. The first step could be to contact the local victim support.
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Hi Mati!
I was thinking about you and I am so glad to see you posting!!
What good advice you have put in that post to anyone who might be considering leaving an abusive situation! I didn't know that the shelters are called: refuges, in the UK. That is a nice name too. The idea of being sheltered or finding refuge from abuse.....just sounds good .... and safe and comfortable.
I think Cadbury is already living away from her abuser. I just wanted to let you know that I appreciate your post and hope others will see it and maybe it might help.
(((((((((Mati)))))))))
GFN
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Thanks for the encouragement GFN. Not sure whether they will still help if someone wants to 'disappear' if they are being pestered. The authorities are very keen to get women away from abusers at the moment.
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The authorities are very keen to get women away from abusers at the moment.
That's good to hear! Sure a big change from when I was a kid. Abuse wasn't even grounds for a divorce in this country until 1969/70 (can't remember which??). Not that long ago really.
Imagine going to a judge back and then asking for a divorce and being told that your husband bashing you half to death was not grounds for wanting to divorce him? What idiocy!!!
So...in that regard....things have greatly improved.
Praise to all women who fought for such change!!
And cheers to your success and to the good you have done to help others!!
And cheers to you Mati for reaching out too. You are a kind soul.
GFN
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Hello Everyone!
For those that didn't read the pregnancy post, I had a beautiful baby boy 9 days ago.
Congratulations on the arrival of Little Cadbury. I hope you are both doing really well, and enjoying one another. The early days are such a wonderful treasure, midnight feeds and all, so make the most of every moment!!
As for the rather grotesque bear, I think if that were in my house it would live in the loft. :lol:
(((((hugs for you both)))))))
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Thank you for all the replies. I am still pondering things. I think that what some of you have said about the challenge being a factor for him is right. My family want me to keep my son away from him, but I tried to explain that I felt this would cause my ex to fight for the sake of fighting.
I am thinking along the lines of a small amount of contact with me present at all times. I know that he is not that interested in my son as a person, more as a possession. He was quite annoyed that he didn't look more like him! He has a theory that new born babies all look like their fathers so that they know they are theirs. Exactly.
I have left the bear in its box for now. I should also mention that he dressed the bear and left all the price tags on the clothes. To me this is just him showing off - "look how much I spent on him". If he wanted the bear as a gift to his newborn son then he would surely have removed them as they are scratchy?
I don't know. I think I am going to find this hard to do. When he came to see us in hospital I was so close to being physically sick when he was holding him. Even though he paid little attention to our son and was more interested in berating me for not letting him be present at the birth. Still, I know what he is like and if I make it hard for him he will fight me just to do the whole power thing.
I keep crying all the time, which I know could be down to barmy hormones. I found out that my ex has joined an online dating agency and has emailed a staggering 50 odd women in the 2 weeks since the baby was born. While I am relieved not to be with him, I find it so confusing. The fact that I have read articles that state that an N will drop you like a hot rock when they have a new source don't help now it has actually happened. It's as though all the hell I went through was for nothing. The confirmation that his emotions really are that shallow and that he caused me such anguish for nothing is crippling. I feel so worthless. I know I'm better off without him. It is truly what I wanted, but to have fought so hard against him, managed to get away, kept my own sanity by a thread and then just to be forgotten about, is really hard to come to terms with.
I suppose this is the same situation that a lot of you have had to come to terms with yourselves, and really I am not looking for answers, just expressing it all. Sorry this is so long, but I am feeling so crappy and worthless that I thought maybe getting it all out would help a little.
Thanks all. My son is beautiful, worth every second of the pain, so I should be grateful really.
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Just to torture myself, I answered him when he messaged me on yahoo just now. We just had a 20 minute conversation about ....him. Not his new born baby son that he has seen for 30 minutes of his life so far. Not how our beautiful, darling boy is coping with his gorgeous life so far, not one question about him. The closest he came was "Did A like his bear?". I didn't answer that one. He did tell me that on test the nation he came in the top 10%. Highly relevant when you have a dear little baby in the world don't you think? Oh and also that he has had a mental breakdown which is why he was such an arse to me. Oh God, I am crying so hard that my dear, darling, sweetheart of a boy must live his life with such an ignorant pig for a father.
For the non UK people, Test the nation is a tv quiz on general knowledge and the whole country can join in on digital tv or the internet etc. They give you the results at the end etc.
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Argh, what a situation!
My instinct is the same as Patz'-- the mundane aspects of childcare are going to drive this guy away like lightning.
If he wants to see his son, either bring the son to him (so you can leave when you want) or have him come over right when the baby needs to be changed and put down for a nap. Make sure to change the baby right there, inviting him to help. If the baby starts to cry, hand him to his father, or at least stand as close to him so that the loud cries are right in his ear. Maybe breastfeed right there in front of him. Burping would be a good thing to do, too.
I know you're not looking for advice, but it is very entertaining for me to imagine you manipulating him in this way, so I can't help but suggest it!
As for the bear, newborns aren't allowed to have soft fuzzy things (not even pillows and blankets) so there is your excuse right there.
I am having my own little one in October and am wishing you all the best! Congratulations on being a mother.
Oh, and ps your ex's comments that you had gained weight (!!!!) when he saw you in the hospital, and asking if he had lost weight were just classic.
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Cadbury:
This guy makes me barf! I know, I have been there. I was also dropped like a "hot rock" for another N supply. The problem is that YOU want him to SEE, YOU want him to feel...........projecting all the "normal" things that people feel when they have empathy. It is really hard when you realize that the only thing you are hearing and seeing is the echo of your own voice. The things you are trying to get him to "see and hear" are bouncing off the wall and coming back to you empty. I am very sorry that you were involved with this person. I hope he tires of fatherhood in a hurry and leaves you and the baby alone.
Much love
Patz
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Cadbury, since you first came here, how you’ve changed! How you’ve grown (and I don’t mean physically :wink: ). Have you looked at your first posts? How you were agonising over whether or not this man was as useless and selfish as you thought? Look at you now! So much healthier, together in your head, please give yourself a break. You’ve been on an emotional rollercoaster.
And you have your lovely baby boy. How worthwhile is he? So how full of value are you? A world full. :D You are everything to him (sorry any fathers reading, but you know it’s true, mums are top) – you are his complete world.
It’s okay to feel like you want to berate yourself for spending any time with the man you’ve left. It was just a mistake, we all make them.
Please don’t be scared or concerned about his legal rights and whether or not he’ll try to use them. I doubt very much that he will. Do you secretly want him to show an interest? Be honest with yourself. It’s best for both of you that he doesn’t. He’s bad news. If you don’t raise the subjects of your baby’s name, of parental rights etc – I bet those things won’t enter his mind. If they do, so what? They're nothing to do with him.
You don’t need any financial support from him do you? So you don’t need him at all. You can’t make him change into an interested father. Maybe you need to find someone else who would be an interested father, a man who would value you and your (three?) children for themselves and all joy they bring? All in good time.
Keep posting Cadbury, you need lots of support right now and by gum you're worth it :D
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Hi, Cadbury. Keep on focusing on your sweet baby boy (like he will give you any choice, right :lol: )
Don't stay stuck on the fear of what might happen (that is possibly bad). It's all "what if" anyway....so "what if" things go just the way you want?
Keep your focus there. What do you want ? (good thing to know). If right now it's all in your head.....then hey, think happy!!! It's all in how you think. You don't need this guy, and don't fall for it.....neither does your child (not a dad that selfish and destructive).
Another thought I heard today: "did you know there is no such thing as a mistake?"
YEAH! It's all just learning...just life.
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Thank you for all the support and encouragement.
I spoke to my health visitor yesterday and because I have registered the baby in my name without listing the father's details, he doesn't have parental responsibility. Until he gets that (has to go to court) then I am in charge of contact etc. I haven't told him this yet, but will leave it and see how he decides to play it. He doesn't even know that I have given the baby my maiden name. He assumes that the baby will have his surname. He will not be happy when he finds that out - dent to his ego and all that.
Hopefully things will get easier and I will stop crying soon!
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Hi again Cadbury
because I have registered the baby in my name without listing the father's details, he doesn't have parental responsibility.
I just want to say btw, well done for this decision. Was it difficult to make that decision? I think that was a great thing to do.
I hope you enjoy this weekend, maybe get out in the sun (fingers crossed for sun 8) ) with your lovely boy? Take lots of care of you too, best P
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Thank you for all the support and encouragement.
I spoke to my health visitor yesterday and because I have registered the baby in my name without listing the father's details, he doesn't have parental responsibility. Until he gets that (has to go to court) then I am in charge of contact etc. I haven't told him this yet, but will leave it and see how he decides to play it. He doesn't even know that I have given the baby my maiden name. He assumes that the baby will have his surname. He will not be happy when he finds that out - dent to his ego and all that.
Hopefully things will get easier and I will stop crying soon!
Cadbury, first of all, I'm delighted the little fella is doing well. I hope you are caring for yourself too, it's no mean feat having a tiny one and the other little kiddies to nurture.
Secondly, and I could be wrong, but I believe it will be very hard for him to get parental responsibility to include unsupervised visits given his history. Have you spoken to the Citizen's Advice? CAFCASS is the organisation dealing with law issues involving disputes with children, might be worth giving them a ring.
Kind regards
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Thanks again! I really get so much from coming on this board. I can't help but feel a little selfish in that I haven't responded to any other posts, but hopefully when I have recovered from all this I will be able to help others.
Portia - it wasn't so much hard to make the decision to leave him off the birth certificate as terrifying. He still doesn't know and I am so frightened of how he will react. It was scary enough when he found out I had given birth without letting him know. I am trying to tell myself that he can only hurt me and terrify me if I let him, so if I just let it all wash over me then maybe it won't be so bad.
Serena - I have been to Citizen's advice and they told me that I would need a solicitor to be properly advised of my legal situation. Either that or Social Services. I don't really want to involve Social services if I can help it as you hear so many stories of the overbearing way they can be. I think if I let him see our son and make it either too difficult or too easy for him to see us then he may lose interest. If he doesn't then I may have to reassess it all. I have looked at the Cafcass website and it is quite reassuring as if it did go to court I have enough information to prevent him having unsupervised visits.
Mum - thanks for your kind words. My son is a darling (as are my daughters) and I just want them all to be happy and safe. For me, I would like my ex to dissappear and find someone else to bother. Hopefully someone strong enough to see through him straight away.
Portia - again! It isn't that I want him to show an interest because I really would like him to lose interest all together. It's more that when I did contact him, I couldn't believe he WASN'T interested. I don't know if that makes sense, but I just cannot believe he didn't even have one question to ask about him. He just talked about himself the whole time. I don't need him financially and if he gave financial support it would be to gain control - "see, you NEED me" etc etc.
Patz - thank you for understanding! It is the misery of realising everything I went through with him was for nothing. I too, hope he tires of it all soon. I don't know if he's ready to relinquish control yet.
Vunil - I have been thinking the same kinds of things. turning up when the baby is desperate for a feed and then handing him over. My ex used to get offended when MY dauighters didn't want to cuddle him (aged 4 and 2) so if his own son were to cry when he saw him, he would very quickly lose all interest. As well as taking it personally! Good luck with your pregnancy and everything.
Anyone else who I haven't answered or responded to, sorry! I have taken all your commments and advice on board and I''m hjust hoping that I can get through all of this wih what is best for my family.
Thanks
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Anyone else who I haven't answered or responded to, sorry! I have taken all your commments and advice on board and I''m hjust hoping that I can get through all of this wih what is best for my family.
Thanks
How is the baby doing, Cadbury? Is he keeping you up nights? Tell us all the bits that we girlies like to hear; how he is feeding and sleeping and 'talking', and whether he is smiling yet. (I know the doctors will say it is too soon, but what do they know!! :lol: )
(((((Safe hugs))))))
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Hi October,
My son (I do love saying that) is a hungry baby. He feeds and feeds and then feeds some more. He has started having a sleep in the evenings for about 4 hours and then cat naps all night. as a result I have started going to bed at about 8 pm! The nice thing is that because we had so much time in hospital when I was readmitted, we have bonded really well together. He quiets at the sound of my voice, he settles whenever I hold him and that is just magical. At the risk of sounding petty and small minded, it is nice to know that whatever happens with my ex in the future, he will never have this bond and will never be able to relive these moments he is missing.
He was born with a mop of dark hair and now all his little new born blemishes are fading he is getting so gorgeous it's almost illegal! (Me, biased?!!).
I think he is starting to try out smiling. He is two and a half weeks old now and although Doctors say it's not until 6 weeks, I am sure both my daughters smiled around now - properly. It is different to the windy smiles!
My ex has not asked to see him yet, which is good. He says he is having a nervous breakdown. I would feel sorry for him, but while he is unable to communicate by computer or phone to me, he is perfectly able to join an online dating agency looking for a "serious relationship". So sympathy is limited. The good thing about his delusions and excuses is that I have quite a few yahoo conversations and emails where he states that he is mentally unstable! This will look good if he ever goes for any sort of custody! Bless him and his little narcissistic world!
Hope you are all okay. Still very appreciative of all the advice and feedback.
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Hi October,
My son (I do love saying that) is a hungry baby. He feeds and feeds and then feeds some more. He has started having a sleep in the evenings for about 4 hours and then cat naps all night. as a result I have started going to bed at about 8 pm! The nice thing is that because we had so much time in hospital when I was readmitted, we have bonded really well together. He quiets at the sound of my voice, he settles whenever I hold him and that is just magical. At the risk of sounding petty and small minded, it is nice to know that whatever happens with my ex in the future, he will never have this bond and will never be able to relive these moments he is missing.
He was born with a mop of dark hair and now all his little new born blemishes are fading he is getting so gorgeous it's almost illegal! (Me, biased?!!).
I think he is starting to try out smiling. He is two and a half weeks old now and although Doctors say it's not until 6 weeks, I am sure both my daughters smiled around now - properly. It is different to the windy smiles!
What a lovely description! And I am sure you are right about the smiling. With such a mother, why would he not be smiling?? :)
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Well, it has finally happened. My ex has asked to see his son. As an aside - is it usual for N's to be so distant towards their children? My ex always refers to our son as "our son" or "baby". He hardly ever uses his name. I get a text saying "when can I see our son" not "when can I see A" etc. "How is baby" "DOes aby need anything" etc etc. I just find it strange.
Anyway, I haven't yet replied. I had decided that if he asked I would go along with it, but now he actually has I am terrified again. I do think that if I make it hard he will just fight me for the sake of it, but at the same time I am worried about how I will cope with it. The only time he has seen him so far was when he was a day old and after he left I cried for hours. It just made me sick to see him holding my precious boy. Could this be because I have "demonised" my ex to an extent and perhaps lost some perspective? I am so worried about it all. I think if my ex sees any "weakness" in me he will use it to hurt me, just for fun.
I am thinking along the lines of my going over to me ex's house and staying for around half an hour. I know that my ex will take it personally if A cries when he holds him and hopefully because A is so attached to me that will happen. Not because I want my son to cry, but because it will help keep the distance between my ex and my son.
I was also thinking of getting a dictaphone or something to record the visit. That way if it is too much for me then I have something to show the relevant people what my ex is like. Does anyone have any other ideas? I am thinking of going over there tomorrow to get it over with. Then if it is too much I will have to think again.
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Sounds like a good idea to me, by going to his place you have control and can leave when you want to. The dictaphone also sounds like a good idea, although it might not be admissible in court, you can play it to health workers etc. I can only imagine how difficult this must be for you, but hang in there! Sending you good thoughts and keeping my fingers crossed.
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adbury, I am so sorry you are afraid again. I still get that way with my ex.
As a teacher, when we have a particularly scary or angry parent to deal with, we get another teacher, counselor, principal, etc, to sit in on the conference. That way, if we have a problem, there is a witness.
Is there any way you could bring a friend with you? That way, he is seeing the baby and you are not there to "see" him.....you are just allowing him time. PLEASE please bring someone with you....there is strength in numbers. You should not be alone.
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Cadbury, I think that as long as he doesn't harm your son, it is more about your reactions. Perhaps you could be very clear for yourself by listing all the things you can think of that he might do to actually harm your son. If he does any of the things on the list, you can terminate the visit immediately. If he doesn't take any actions or say things to harm your son, then your reaction may mean more about how you view him than his behavior at that moment. Either way, it might be a relief to list all the bad things you are afraid could happen to get them off your chest and prepare the best you can. Knowing your detailed limits and responses ahead of time might help reduce your fear and other strong reactions.
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Sorry, that was me. :oops:
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Thank you for the advice. It is so good to get an outside perspective on things. I think my main worries are all involved with the mind games my ex may play. Both with me and my son. I know that my son is too young yet to be affected, but I can see it being something in the future. Mostly, it is a feeling I have that he is not going to be a good influence in our lives and wanting to protect my son from that. I suppose I should just stay distant and hope for the best instead of worrying about the what ifs all the time.
I just had a yahoo conversation with my ex, where I made the arrangements for tomorrow. He was so self absorbed and infuriating that I finally lost it with him. I said a lot of things that I have kept inside since we broke up. All the hurt and all the things he had done wrong. He only responded to the things that directly involved him. I am struggling to come to terms with how he is. He isn't like a normal human being. It is still something that is hard to accept - that he doesn't respond in the way a "normal" person does. I need to let this all go as it is starting to affect me too much.
I am even tempted more than I should be to tell him that the baby isn't his. If I wasn't terrified of how he would react, I would! Oh crap, I think I'll go and have a good cry and see if that helps!
Sorry for the rambling. And thank you for everyone who has helped.
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<I am even tempted more than I should be to tell him that the baby isn't his. If I wasn't terrified of how he would react, I would! Oh crap, I think I'll go and have a good cry and see if that helps! >
I know what you mean. But don't tell any outright lies. They could come back to haunt you. Would you like to hear your voice on tape in court telling an outright lie? And think of the feelings you might provoke in your ex!
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Dear Cadbury:
Good for you for getting some of that out! You needed that! And the world didn't collapse, even though you blew up!!
He isn't like a normal human being.
You got it. So don't worry so much about him, his reactions, his inhuman behaviour.
Whatever is best for you and baby is what matters, right?
He will need to know about the baby's name some time. Maybe, it would help to devulge this information with other people around to support you?
People who you trust and who he won't act out so easily infront of?
It doesn't have to happen today. There is lot's of time. Take care of you and your child first and foremos and for now.
I suppose I should just stay distant and hope for the best instead of worrying about the what ifs all the time.
This sounds like a good idea to me. What's the worst thing that could happen? What's the worst what if? Figger it out and then make a plan for it. Then.....forget it......because the chances are the worst possible thing that could happen....... probably won't.
It's hard to completely give up worrying. One thing I tell myself is....."worrying is a waste of time and energy".
It's true eh? What gets fixed by worrying? Notta thing! Planning and action are what work best, right?
So....plan. If this happens.....I'll do this or that.
If that happens......I'll do that or this.
Maybe even write it all down? See some worries that are a bit too extravagent? Have a written plan for the realistic things that are causing you the most upset/worry.
It's all fear. Worry is letting that fear take control.
Planning is walking past the fear.
And then there's hope. Please hold onto your hope that things will work out. You and your son will be fine! You can and will protect him! You are a great mom and you will make good decisions, as they need to be made!
((((((((Cadbury))))))))
GFN
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GFN: so nice to "hear" you're back:
I need to tatto this on my forehead:
"Worry is letting fear take control.
Planning is walking past the fear."
THANK YOU!!!
Cadbury: sending you strength to trust in your good mother instincts today. You'll do fine.
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Thank you! It is so true "Worrying is a waste of time". I met him in a Starbucks yesterday and it was not too bad. Of course we had to talk about my ex and then I had to hear a few more lies, but I found that by smiling and nodding and ignoring his worst comments I got through the visit okay. He seemed more interested in his son as a person than he has been before. I didn't arrange another visit as I thought it would be best to leave the ball in his court. I didn't tell him about the name or anything, so I am going to leave that until it is absolutely necessary.
All in all I feel okay about it. Thanks for all the eplies and advice and help etc
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Good for you, Cadbury. I think meeting someplace public and nuetral is sooo smart. Glad you got through it and he treated his son like a person.
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Well, I have been away from the boards for a week. Mostly trying to cathc up on sleep and think about the future. I met my ex yesterday in starbucks again so he could see his son. He is now trying to be more familiar with me and I am starting to feel uncomfortable again.
I don't think it's just me being paranoid or anything. As an example: He asked how our son was sleeping. I said, "not too well, he is a very hungry baby and is feeding a lot". He said "lucky boy" and stared at my breasts. I felt really uncomfortable with that. There are other little comments he makes that are starting to lead to more than I am happy with.
He does hold his son and makes a show of interest. However, it is all just words. All offers of help he could give, money he could give. He never just does it. My feeling is I shouldn't have to (and don't want to) ask him for money etc. If he really wants to help that much, there are plenty of ways he could do it off his own back without instructions from me.
I am starting to feel crap again about the whole situation. Today he emailed me and said he wants to see more of his son. I don't think I can cope with more than once a week at the moment.
I just feel so helpless. His only input to our son was in the physical act of creation. He left me soon after. (My fault - according to him now). He spent most of the pregnancy making my life hell and telling me he wanted nothing to do with me or the baby. Now the baby is here, he is coming over all concerned father and wanting a part of the life he nearly destroyed through stress.
Am I unreasonable to expect him to accept once a week contact with me present? I would rather he had NO contact, but this is the best I can manage for now. What do others think?
Thank you (yet again).
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he is a very hungry baby and is feeding a lot". He said "lucky boy" and stared at my breasts.
EEEWWWWW, Cadbury, what a sleazey, slimy, disgusting man.
I think once a week is absolute sainthood for you in scheduling your son's visits with the sperm doner.
I would also continue not to ask for money. He will see this as paying to see his child (that's how my ex sees it all). If he offers, say thank you, but do NOT attach that to visiting. Nasty things will start when you go there.
He is using the child to worm his way into an abusive stance with you again. That is what these people do. I still think you should look into some legality here...without his knowledge, so that you are forewarned and forearmed.
Don't feel guilty because you somehow are "keeping this man from his child". THAT is the biggest lie that these men use to gain access to the one thing that can hurt us the most....our precious children. Only they don't see them as that...they see them as an extension of thier "manliness" and one more thing to lord over us (our mothering).
Keep at it girl. You know your boy is better off without that man breathing poison down his little neck (or your cleavage!)
I admire your determination and patience. (((((Cadbury)))))
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Thank you mum! I sometimes get so lost in his world that I forget about REAL people and how they react to situations! I start thinking he is more normal than he is. At the moment, because he is not on the birth certificate, my ex has no rights to see our son until he goes to court. He doesn't know that however, and I am keeping it from him so that I can use it when I really need to. For example, he will be completely unable to stop us moving out of the country without it. So if he doesn't know he doesn't have it, I have more time and am in a better position. I hope that makes sense. Not that I want to move or anything (YET), but it is reassuring to know.
He is such an arse. He has so many excuses for his behaviour, for his life, everything. Everything is someone else's fault. Never his. He just drains me. I am thinking along the lines of telling him I can only cope with once weekly contact and leaving it to him. Even though I have said to him before that I find it hard to cope with seeing him, he thinks this is because I still have feelings for him, so he just preens when I say it. Still, I'd rather put up with his daft preening than having to see more of him. I'm just scared that he will start the fight when I say it. I think it will get nasty if he does. I will have to prove that he is unfit and all sorts of things. I can prove it, but I worry what he will do when I do. Not physically as such, but mentally. HE thinks he is above the law and that will be difficult.
Well, thanks for letting me ramble on. It helps me get perspective. When I'm through this, I hope that I will be able to help others as they have helped me.
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HE thinks he is above the law
Boy, does that sound familiar!!! My ex will agree on something legal, sign the court document and hours later he is challenging me to change it to accomodate his needs.....and when I don't his lawyer starts spitting!
I have decided my lawyer is my boundary. It costs me plenty, but the peace of mind is priceless... She gets to fight....I don't like to. She is not have any history with my ex, so she can see this for what it he is all about (control) and she deals with him accordingly.
I think keeping a tight lip is good, but maybe getting a little muscle behind you is worth the peace of mind....you said you can prove he's a moron....but maybe a legal aide place could tell you better what exactly you may need to do that.
Good luck...stay strong.
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that last post was me. Mum
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Hi Cadbury. This situation will continue to drain you unless you bring it to a conclusion. It’s up to you when, or if, you do that.
I would rather he had NO contact, but this is the best I can manage for now. What do others think?
Do you know your rights, inside out? Have you got all the information available?
If you would rather he had no contact, tell him. Or try something like “I don’t want you coming around here every week. Once a month would be too much for me. let's make it every two months.” See what he says. What’s the worse that could happen? A temper-tantrum, or a legal battle?
Would he go to court for access rights? He might not bother. He might not care that much.
You say you’re worried what he will do mentally if the fight happens. What do you mean? That he’ll shout and try to make you feel bad? If you write down the worse scenario (for yourself, or here), it might not appear so worrying. It might be something you can handle. It might even make you want to resolve this. What do you think?
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Hi, Portia. I'm not sure what the laws in the UK are. But I doubt they are hugely different than in the States regarding parental rights. Cadbury might very likely not find resolution with the guy....those of us who have kids with N's in the States certainly cannot. If you mean emotionally, though, it's a really tough battle, but possible.
Cadbury, I think Portia is right to encourage you to get more information, so you know what you are up against. You know HIM and what the deal is there....but the parental rights thing is something to find out about, legally.
Yes, he will throw a fit, I believe you. And you have every right to be wary of him. Just don't let it paralyze you. When I analyze my ex's tantrums, that's all they are. Unfortunately, he has money and a court system that supports the good ole boy mentality.....so his tantrums aren't always easy to blow off.
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Hiya Mum, I think the UK is probably behind the US, we are in many ways :? . Here Dads have to go to court for any access - they’re not entitled to it. See: http://www.fathers-4-justice.org/objectives/index.htm Quote: “Parents & Grandparents have no legal right to see their children & grandchildren in this country.”
Cadbury you weren’t married to him and he doesn’t demonstrate any obligation towards your child – financial or otherwise. His own behaviour with his own son could be used against him and the fact that you already have two children of your own could count in your favour.
The bloke is a manipulative loser. I wouldn’t want him within 50 feet of any of my children. The comment about breast-feeding and looking at your breasts was sickening. All he can think about is (excuse me) getting back into your knickers. That’s the extent of his personality, about 1 cm thick. Don’t you and your kids deserve better? (yes :D you do) Take care
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Hi guys,
Hiya Mum, I think the UK is probably behind the US, we are in many ways . Here Dads have to go to court for any access - they’re not entitled to it.
I'm not sure I'd call that being 'behind' us.
Cadbury seems to be the perfect example of why automatic access to the 'sperm donor' (or egg donor, as the case may be) is an asinine law. If these goons weren't so common, presumptive rights to access might be a better idea.
Nowadays if somebody doesn't come to court with a butcher knife dripping blood and a list with the judges name the next one to be crossed off, they get to ruin a kids life just because they dropped off a little of their, usually defective, DNA somewhere.
Hey, we're perfectly capable of messing up our own kids without having to get lunatics involved in the process, right? :P :shock: :oops:
Just kidding.
mud
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Hiya Cadbury:
I would rather he had NO contact, but this is the best I can manage for now. What do others think?
Honestly, I think I might seriously consider moving very, very far away, and on my way out the door, telling him I'm not sure WHO the father of my son is, while the chance exists.
That might be dishonest but necessary in order to spare my child the nasty influence of a father who will cause the child much worse pain, eventually.
The best of two evils maybe?
It's a tough call Cadbury. Only you will be able to decide if such drastic measures are required and whether the disruption in your life and your children's lives will be worth it.
(((((((((((Cadbury))))))))))
GFN
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Thanks for all the replies.
Portia - I had never thought of looking on the Fathers for Justice website. It was a good source of information. I felt bad that I was using their campaign the wrong way round, but then again my ex doesn't really count as a father so never mind.
Mudpuppy - thank you for seeing my point!
Mum - My ex scares me more in the sense of what he will try and do to me mentally. His tantrums are bad, and he has done enough of them publically enough for me to use them against him, but they don't scare me as much as the mind games.
I emailed him yesterday and told him that I was happy with the contact as it is. ie Once a week in a public place for an hour at the most. He was on yahoo this morning, trying to make me feel bad about it. I stuck to my guns, but tried to be as unconfrontational as possible, to avoid making him realise that this may end up as a legal battle.
GFN - I would love to do what you suggest, but I am a full time PhD student and my grant is what my family lives on so I don't have that option just yet. In another two years when I graduate then I have the options, so I'm hoping that will be soon enough.
I have agreed to meet him tomorrow so his other son can meet his baby brother for the first time, but I did then poiint out that he will have no further contact for another week. No midweek Starbucks for instance. I have looked into the rights issue a bit more, and he has none unless he goes to court, so I feel happier knowing that if this all gets too bad I can stop it. That helps, but I hope it doesn't come to that. I really hope he goes away and forgets about us all.
Thanks again, I will keep you all posted.
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In another two years when I graduate then I have the options, so I'm hoping that will be soon enough.
Not only that....but in another 2 years....maybe he'll be on to bigger and better things and won't be bothered/will forget about you and your son, as you hope.
Best wishes Cadbury! Keep doing what feels right.
GFN
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Cadbury
You are a star!!! I didn't realise you were doing a Phd along with bringing up your beautiful little family.
My advice would be to never go on msn with him and save his e-mails.
Fantastic weather, isn't it?????
Love to you all
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Hi Everyone,
Serena - beautiful weather, but getting too hot for me!!
Well, to update, I met my ex and his son in Tesco cafe on saturday morning. It wasn't too bad, right up until he asked me if I'd registered the birth yet. I said yes. So he asked if he was on the birth certificate. I said I wasn't allowed to put his name on it as he wasn't present and we weren't married. (Which is true) He started getting nnoyed and saying how I'd deprived him of "almost everything you could have". He then asked what name I'd registered him in, so I told him "my name". He then said he could never forgive me for that. He started being very difficult. I started feeling shaky and sick. I first off tried to move on and talk about our baby, but he kept saying things like "Ican't believe you've done this to me. I can never forgive you". He was asing me why etc etc . In the end I got a little annoyed and told him that since I had been pregnant, and then gone through labour to deliver the baby and was doing everything for him, that I felt I deserved to call my son by my name. He was still going on and on. Then it struck me that he was just upset because he saw our son as a possession and wanted his name on that possession. He was taking it all as a personal insult to his manliness or something.
I got more annoyed and told him he had done nothing to deserve a part in our son's life and that if he wanted his contact to increase then he would have to work at regaining my trust and being a good parent. (Something I don't think he will ever do) He even woke the baby up just so he could cuddle him. When I said "oh don't wake him up" he got annoyed and said "well, I don't have much time with him". My darling little man rewarded his sperm donor by crying for the rest of the time.
The visit carried on (longest hour of my life) in much the same way. I felt worse and worse and was struggling to hold it all together. In the end he made one comment too many and so I said "you nearly caused me to lose this baby with the stress you put me under. You didn't care then, so why pretend now?" and walked out.
I knew he wouldn't be happy about that. Not only had I said what I had, but I had dared say it in a public place and then walk away from him. I walked so fast out of there as i was terrified he would come after me. Luckily, he didn't walk as fast as me and so I had managed to get the baby strapped in to my car and was just getting in the driver's seat before he found me. HE blamed me for my attitude "when is this anger going to stop". A few more stupid comments "what have I ever done to deserve this" and then I snapped at him that the problem he had was all about his big fat ego rather than our son and drove off. I haven't heard anything since, but I am now really scared of the way he makes me feel and I don't think I can cope with contact. If I do agree to meet him again then I will have to take someone with me or something.
However, I am getting to the point of letting him take me to court for any contact. I have enough of his mad emails and yahoo conversations to prove the point of why I am scared of him and doubt his ability as a father so if he does get any contact it would have to be supervised and minimal.
I feel so crap now. I have been trying to get over it and be strong, but I hate the way he can affect me and make me feel this bad.
The only upside is that the situation I had feared for so long has now happened so I can stop dreading it and start coping with it.
Sorry for the ramble, needed to get it off my chest.
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Cadbury,
So sorry that you are having to go through all of this crap with the sperm donor. It's not fair that you cannot just enjoy your beautiful little boy without all the additional stress.
I don't have any words of wisdom or good advice for you, but just wanted you to know that I hold you and your babies in my prayers. Also, congratulations on going for your PhD. You have alot on your plate and you are managing sooooo well. I do agree that you should take someone with you when (or if) you meet him in the future. The bigger the better (the person that is :wink: ).
Bless you,
Brigid
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Hiya Cadbury:
Hang in there! Hey! At least the dreaded is over re your son's name!
You do have a lot on your plate (wow....PhD and all!!! fantastic!!) and you are doing a good job of thinking things through being reasonable. What more could any person do?
I'm sorry about this:
I feel so crap now. I have been trying to get over it and be strong, but I hate the way he can affect me and make me feel this bad.
You are doing your best, which is all anyone could. Much of this is his own doing and you have made this clear. It's hard to be "strong" when you have hormones and responsibilities and people behaving like N's all dancing around wanting the main stage. You're doing a good job of staying focussed on what's most important. Too bad about his ego...poor boy. He'll live! :D
Be proud of being as strong as you are! For ignoring your fear and being honest and clear. For being more than reasonable! For thinking before you open your mouth!! For being a great mom! He hasn't effected those things, good things, about you! (Poor goof! :D )
GFN
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I checked my email and he had sent an email as if nothing at all had happened! Now, I just feel insane.
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Thank you for the replies by the way. I was just a little shocked by his "hey isn't life dandy?" email. Will update you all later, if he contacts me again. Thank you all.
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(((((((((Cadbury)))))))))
Confrontations are no fun. :( Your ex is really showing his N side here. Where a "normal" person would be asking what they could do to help, how they could show you that they care and are safe enough to have time with your precious son, all he could talk about was how "you did this to him." Yeechh! As long as he is stuck there, I don't think he will ever hear what you are saying.
I know from dealing with my BPD wife how hard it is to not let their behavior trigger us. Is there anything else you can do to help remain calm in the face of his ranting and raving and accusations? I am concerned that he will use your "anger problem" :x as an excuse to cause further problems for you. Maybe rememebring that we are all there with you in spirit will help? I hope you don't take this as criticism, I think that you are doing a great job of standing up to his behavior. I would just hate to see him use your (fully justified) anger against you by lying and claiming that it proves you are the one with the problem. I have had this problem with my wife. The more I detach from getting upset at her behavior and words the less she seems interested in provoking me or trying to blame me for her choices.
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Oh, Cadbury, I felt the stomach knots myself while reading your post about your visit with the ex. Owww. I have the same panic and fear in in dealing with my ex. I do believe that it will be better to face him and it (fear) down now, rather than later, because I believe it never really goes away, so you might as well get the 'battle" overwith, or at least learn how to do it, as in the case of my ex, his "possessions" (children) are indeed what he views as his arsenal and "purpose" at the same time.
I am so sorry that you are in this situation. You did the right thing, walking out. And you are completely right to have a (large...good idea, Brigid) friend with you next time.
Don't believe for a second, that your ex has forgotten anything. He is probably strategizing at this moment. I say this not to scare you......don't be scared any more. Just be prepared and thus powerful, and he won't be able to take you by surprise. Just do it. Much better than avoiding it.
He knows the score now. Yes, he views your child as a possession. It's hard to get beyond that, I know. But he will not change that view, he is incapable. Get armed.
My ex did indeed use my (very understandable and justifyable) anger to win his case against me. So use your anger toward him to get prepared and strong, but don't let it cloud your judgement into spewing it in court. Stay focused. The courts in the US anyway, don't care why people break up.....they want to hear that you care about your child. That's all. You know HE will be able to fake that......so your TRUE caring for this child needs to be your focus.
That man was abusive to you and you have every reason to believe he could be toward your son. He had nothing to do with you toward the end of the pregnancy, and has a bad track record, etc etc. Use that stuff. and please GET LEGAL HELP!!
I know you have a lot on your plate (egads, woman, a Phd and small children???? You are amazing)....but you ARE amazing, so this guy is small potatoes. You can do it!!!!!!!!
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Thank you all again. I am not really thinking straight right now as he has written me the longest email full of crap I have ever heard. Everything is my fault as usual. I have responded to it in as calm a manner as possible, but I don't know if I should have. I am now thinking that I should just let him take me to court and fight it out there.
Mum - your post was almost a prophecy!
I have tried to think about the future and how my son may feel about things, but it is difficult to think of how a relationship with his father may be for him. Maybe I will be enough of a balancing, loving, confidence building effect on him so that the crap from his father won't destroy him. Who knows? Maybe if all his contact were supervised and light hearted then he would stop all this crap. Then I think of my beautiful boy being destroyed by my ex and I can't bear it.
I am speaking to a solicitor tomorrow and hopefully that will help me work out what I CAN do and what I need to do for each case etc.
Well, I fel crap now and am going off to cry and get myself together.
Thanks all of you again. You help me so much.
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Hi Cadbury,
congratulations on your new baby. You sound like a wonderful mom. Everyone has given great advice here. I would just second that you should not express your anger to your ex. I know that is the hardest thing in the world to do.
1. Avoid voice to voice conversations. If you communicate, it should be in writing where you have a chance to read it over and consult someone else, if need be.
2. Do not read those emails he sends you. It is just imflaming you. Above all, do not respond.
3. If you communicate with him, make it all business. Only talk about logistics. If he accuses you, insults you, etc just ignore it. IGNORE IT. Do not respond. It's better if you don't even read it to begin with. What does he have to say that is valuable? I ask you. Let him be the one wondering why you are acting as if nothing happened.
4. Always have someone else as a witness. Take a friend with you every time you meet. Keep everything he communicates to you in a file. Keep all your responses too.
After those awful meetings with him, write down what happened, as you have done here, and keep it in a file. If your witness is willing to do so, have them make notes too.
5. Don't tell him that you are documenting. Never initiate contact with him. Respond only in writing.
I hope this helps.
Plucky Guest2
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Hello everyone.
Plucky - your post was excellent, thank you. I have been documenting everything without letting him know. It seems like I was right to do so as he has now said that he will be taking me to court. Not for contact you understand, but to get our son's surname changed. He says that this is nothing to do with ego, but to help him bond with his son?!
oh I feel absolutely crap
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Not for contact you understand, but to get our son's surname changed. He says that this is nothing to do with ego, but to help him bond with his son?!
THAT needs to be in the Narcissistic comment Hall of Fame!!!
((((Cadbury))))), sweetie, it's ok to cry.....I would too. But, as Gloria Steinam said:" just yell through the tears!" (or some such thing)
What an absolute moron that man is!!! What a selfish little baby. It may help to picture him as a tiny gnat, buzzing around trying to make a big noise over nothing. (that helps me with my ex....that and thinking of something rather unnatractive about him when naked!!!!) Anything to get me to laugh instead of boil over in tears (although there is plenty of time to do that as well).
I think you will feel better when you talk to a lawyer. You will not have to guess at things, you can have a solid plan of action. Sending you lots and lots and lots of motherly power!!!!!!
You can do this! You love your child. That's what this is all about: you love your baby MORE than you fear your ex....and that's why it will work out for you!
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Cadbury, that last one was me, Mum
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Hi Cadbury,
hang in there. Just a point of information here. If your ex is not on the birth certificate, how can he get you to change the baby's name? Could this be an empty threat? Just to upset you? He wouldn't do that, now would he?
Also, is there any financial responsibility he bears if he insists on being declared the baby's father? Your lawyer should know. Add it up over the baby's life until he's of adult age. Whop that number on your ex (actually no, have your lawyer do it) before he makes up his mind to try to force you to do anything.
Take the offence and be prepared to prove your ex dangerous or unstable before he even gets his ducks in line to try anything with you. Don't sit back and wait to see what he will do.
If he wants to get a blood test to determine the baby's parentage, find out what else can be determined from a blood test and scare him with that (old drug abuse or drinking, old venereal diseases, congenital diseases that his insurance company would like to know about, etc). Exaggerate if you have to. And you do have to.
Yes. I am telling you to fight dirty! You go girl!
This whole thing makes my blood boil. I guess it is sisterhood plus a baby at stake. Turn those crappy feelings into constructive anger! I will survive! I am woman hear me roar! Ok I'm shutting up now.
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Plucky 2: where were you when I started my court case? I could have used your shots in the arm. Cadbury, she is right. Go on the offense. For warned is fore armed.
Plucky, are you in the legal field? You sound pretty smart!
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Hi mum et al,
Plucky 2: where were you when I started my court case? I could have used your shots in the arm.
Well,I was out there wandering in the N induced wilderness. Before I found my way in to the warm hearth of this board. Sorry I wasn't there to warrior for you!
(At the risk of belaboring the point,) Cadbury, remember that if you first establish that he is unstable, everything he says about you afterwards will be viewed through that filter. Don't let him have first crack at making you the loony one.
Plucky, are you in the legal field? You sound pretty smart!
Oh mum, thank you! finally a compliment I can accept gracefully! No, but I was in business. That is how I got tougher. Running with all the other rats.
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Thank you both so much. As well as all the practical advice, the fact that you understand what I am going through is such a weight off my mind. No matter how much I try and explain things to family and friends, they really can't grasp the enormity of what I am trying to deal with. They think he is just an arse. Which he is, but they can't fully appreciate the levels of manipulation. It's like I feel validated in all my worries. Thank you.
Well, I don't know whether he is taking me to court or not. When I told him that I was feeling intimidated by his threats he said they weren't threats - he would be taking me to court. When I then told him that, in that case all further communication would have to wait until I had taken legal advice, he started to back down. I don't know if he is bluffing or what he is playing at, but I have now arranged to see a solicitor and will not be contacting him again until I have had legal advice.
One of the sentences he wrote regarding our son's surname was " this is a fatal wound you have dealt me". ?!!!!! What is he like! If I hadn't been so concerned that he would be using the conversation in any court battles I would have just replied with "so die then"!! However, I just responded with "Now you are talking absolute rubbish". Which was okay, but didn't feel as satisfying!
I am now carefully documenting all the emails and yahoo conversations and preparing a file on him, so that if we end up in court I will be totally prepared.
Well, I am exhausted so I will go for now. Thank you again everyone who has responded.
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Cadbury,
Keep your head up, don't give up on what you want for your little one.
I'm going this Saturday to the Paul Meiyer Clinic.
He is a graduate of Duke University and has written many books on the subject of the N and some major books on emotional disorders.
I also have a lawyers name from this clinic who helps in child custody cases that deal with spouses with emotional disorders.
Im marching in with the medical evaluation for a therapist to review and explain the abnormal findings for my H, including him being Narrsisstic.
I have many e-mails to show them, with the last on saying Im trying to Murder him, Im going to cause him to have a stroke, not letting him see our daughter.
Im going to get help from this clinic so my 12 yr old daughter has a clear understanding, when her dad writes her letters, that I don't read, what to look for and the best way to communicate with him.
My D has a friend with a step-dad. He's been with her since she was small. My D was wishing I had left my H long ago in the hopes I would have met someone better to have rasied her like her friend's step dad.
She feels a great loss about her dad, I want to help her the best way I know how.
I think Plunky is correct to attack him with your mother instincts to protect the baby from the unbalanced father. He will shrink away if you find a way to hit his poket book, insist on an mental evaluation and shed light with your e-mails.
I know you are worried, I have been away from my H for 4 mos now and getting stronger everday. I continue to pray for guidance and my H will heal from what ever makes him an N and all the other issues he has.
I love my D so much and it pains me deeply, that she feels sadness about her life.
Best to get away from the N's as fast as you can
Take Care ......................OR
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Well, I am exhausted so I will go for now.
Sending you some powerful cyber energy in the form of good, strong, warm cyber hugs ((((((((((Cadbury)))))))))).
You're doing the right thing by consulting with a lawyer. He is "an arse" eh? But you are doing such a good job of stopping him in his tracks!
He's not controlling you anymore Cadbury!! You're standing up to him, a little at a time and that's a good thing! The more you do that, the better you will feel about not letting him make you crazy.
But it does take a lot of energy and so I will pray that you get lot's and lot's to sustain you through all this. Eat well! Pamper you some! Rest when you can!
How is your sweet son doing?
GFN
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Hello Everyone, thank you again for your replies and support etc.
Things have gotten quite bad recently in that my ex served me with court papers on Thursday (yesterday - seems like ages ago). Before he did so I had thought about trying to keep contact civil so that things weren't so difficult for us all. I wrote him and email to this effect on Wednesday, and asked him if e would like to meet me on Monday for contact. He didn't read this and set off on the whole court path. He then sent several messages to me saying that he had dee concerns regarding our son and my two daughters. He insinuated I was mad, my family was mad and controlling, and that he had witnessed all this! (?!!) He was very nasty and underhanded as he wrote it all as if he was merely concerned. Never mind the fact that it was all blatent lies! Then today he asked me if contact on Monday was still on! He genuinely wants a reply! He has twisted and lied about anything I have ever said, is hinting that he is going to go to court along the lines of my children being in some kind of danger and wants to know if I will be meeting him on Monday! I could scream!
Needless to say I have now got a solicitor and will not be responding at all, but God he is making me feel sick. Even after all his behaviour in the past, I never thought he'd be this nasty.
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Oh Cadbury! So sorry you are having to deal with all of this! Not nice stuff at all! :( :(
Glad you have a lawyer and good for you for not responding at all! That must be hard to do! I want to respond for you:
Dear Jerkoff:
Go blank yourself!
Love,
GFN
:D
I never thought he'd be this nasty.
Those who behave like this never cease to amaze me! It's shocking! :shock:
I can't fathom spewing such lies and acting so cruelly!
So sorry you have to experience this nasty stuff!
((((((Cadbury)))))
Sending you warm thoughts and strength to withstand this.
And keeping you and your family in my prayers too.
GFN
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Needless to say I have now got a solicitor and will not be responding at all, but God he is making me feel sick. Even after all his behaviour in the past, I never thought he'd be this nasty.
This is scary huh? Especially when you think that this is a person you were intimate enough with to have a baby!
The good thing is. you have no illusions any more. From now on, don't waver in your knowledge that he is sick, malignant, ruthless, distorted, and dangerous.
You seem to be on the right track and the only thing now is to maintain your strength and focus. Get support wherever you can. You have my complete support. Don't experiment and give him another chance. Close off to him and to anyone who will be carrying his message.
When he discovers that nastiness and threats are not working, he will again try charm and sweetness. Just look at that as a dishonest form of nastiness. Stay quiet to him and let your solicitor do all the talking. This is a good form of voicelessness!
Be strong.
Plucky
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(((((((Cadbury)))))))
Oh, boy, do I feel your pain. My ex is currently taking me to court, fighting me tooth and nail, and also sending me emails to show what an "involved" parent he is, and how we "work as a team" (all twisted and blatant lying and posturing for the courts). Then he has the audacity to call me this morning regarding a benign matter about our son and supplies for school as if what he says and does and how he says and does it has no carry over to anything else.
They just don't GET IT!!!! They are TRULY SICK and twisted.
What we need to remember is to keep on marching straight forward according to our beliefs, WHICH ARE NOT WRONG (no matter how they try to mess with it) and DO NOT let these guys sidetrack us, or question our own motives. That's all this legal crap is. Stuff to scare us, and knock us off center. Don't let him do it.
See it as a bunch of extranneous BS (which it is) and STAY FOCUSED on your and your children's happy life.
Get your lawyer to do the dirty work. Stay away from the direct conflict yourself when at all possible and use your lawyer for armour.
I am currently in a horrible scene with my ex the past few days (so sick I don't even want to explain) and I have been alternately crying and spitting mad, so I know how you feel. It helps to vent and then let it go...(which I seem to be practicing every five friggin seconds!).
He is still a mindless gnat, trapped by his own dysfunction. I will NOT go down the path of: "but other people believe him!" (which sometimes they do), but instead try to remember that I am NOT LYING and I don't have to "remember" my lies.....I can speak the truth with LOVING INTENTION for my children and toward myself, and I can disregard his garbage....and let the lawyer take the garbage out. (that's why they get the big bucks!!)
Remember that no matter what he does or says, YOU are the mother, YOU are doing what is right. Do NOT let him rock your boat!
Hang in there, sister: solidarity rocks. I'm with you!!!
love , MUM
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Hello Everyone,
Well, he has spent a few days writing me emails of lies (my family are controlling me, my family are abusing me, my children are at risk, etc etc). I have been so restrained and have not replied to any of them. Nearly bitten my lips off, but haven't responded! He phoned yesterday and I hung up. Yesterday I received this :
We really do need to talk, you want to trust but you don't see that you have broken the trust I had in you this is not a one way street. I don't want to argue but you are following your mothers advice which you know is flawed. I am not against you. I will not say or do anything until you can regain that trust. I will prove to you that we can talk because I am willing to stop the court case, remember you refused to let me or my family see him after I pleaded with you. Please talk.
This is him being reasonable and trying to appeal to me! I have not responded so I don't know what he may do next, but I am now getting angry that he still feels he is in the right all the time. I am now going t ofight to keep my precious son as far away from his destructive father as possible. I really feel for all you others that are going through the same kind of crap - I hope one day we will all be free from their lies and destruction.
The good news is that my son is thriving. He is putting on weight really well and getting to the unbearably cute chubby stage. He hasn't quite gotten the hang of the whole sleeping thing, but he has started proper big gummy smiles which are heart melting! My two daughters are also well and I'm not letting my ex's lies and crap spill over into our family life.
We can all do this. My prayers are with all of you also going through the crap. God bless and good wishes.
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Cadbury,
I'm so sorry for all the BS being thrown your way. But I am sooooo glad that your beautiful boy is thriving and smiling. I really miss those cuddly days (not the sleepless nights, however :? ) and would happily babysit if we didn't have that big body of water between us :D .
Stay strong, get as much rest as you can, whenever you can. Fight for that baby with all that you can muster. You are in my prayers.
Blessings,
Brigid
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Hiya Cadbury:
Very glad to hear that your son is growing and smiling and that your daughters are doing well too! It's a big change for them having a new baby brother. Glad to hear the good stuff!
As to the crap.........you sound like you are very determined to protect your son from it and like you are feeling a little stronger now.
Good for you for not responding to those emails!!
Good for you for your decision to fight this goose legally! (Johnimo says "goose" means bad person in Auzieland! I like it!"
Good for you for not letting your ex's junk spill into your family life!!
These are not easy things to do and you are doing them! Good for you!!
And you are also doing a good job of keeping a level head, which isn't easy either, I bet! How did it go with the lawyer? (sorry if you posted already and I missed it :oops: . I can look back if so).
Keep going Cadbury! You can do this! Sending you much energy.... to help you through this....and many prayers.
GFN
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Cadbury: I am glad to hear the power in your post. You are doing so well.
And your focus is strong....your children! This other BS is just stuff to distract you from that focus...and you are not letting it! Good for you.
You have three (is that right?) happy and healthy children and they are that way because of you!!!!! You are an awesome mother.
Your ex wanting to talk, "sincerely", reminds me of the beginnings of our legal matters (between me and the exN). He called me, after a settlement hearing (which of course, did not "settle" anything) to tell me he was "inspired" by what that judge said. This intrigued me, because that judged basically asked my ex what this vendetta of his against me was about, and why he couldn't just "do the right thing" and let me get on with my life?
So I let him keep talking. He said, "could we meet, just the two of us and talk about this?" So I said, "fine, but not alone, lets use a mediator." He balked...and said, "well, do you want to still move?" (the case was about my relocating with the children), and I said , "of course", and he said, "well, never mind then."
He hadn't heard a word that judge said! What he heard was "I should talk to Mum and convince her of how right I am and if I do it alone she will buckle under!!:"
My point is this. Don't believe one word he says....he is not being reasonable, he doesn't know how. He is a typical N with one agenda and only one. To punish you for not doing what he wants you to.
Hang in there, sweetie!! Ditto on the babysitting (actually my daughter is the great babysitterhere)....and the ocean issue......
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Thank you all again. I am not really thinking straight right now as he has written me the longest email full of crap I have ever heard. Everything is my fault as usual. I have responded to it in as calm a manner as possible, but I don't know if I should have. I am now thinking that I should just let him take me to court and fight it out there.
Mum - your post was almost a prophecy!
I have tried to think about the future and how my son may feel about things, but it is difficult to think of how a relationship with his father may be for him. Maybe I will be enough of a balancing, loving, confidence building effect on him so that the crap from his father won't destroy him. Who knows? Maybe if all his contact were supervised and light hearted then he would stop all this crap. Then I think of my beautiful boy being destroyed by my ex and I can't bear it.
I am speaking to a solicitor tomorrow and hopefully that will help me work out what I CAN do and what I need to do for each case etc.
Well, I fel crap now and am going off to cry and get myself together.
Thanks all of you again. You help me so much.
Cadbury, Honey
Bring as much 'evidence' as you can to the solicitor, I don't know if you are on legal aid or have been in touch with Cafcass (or used their website). I think with a good solicitor and barrister, you have good cause for denying your 'ex' custody and / or access to your little boy.
I know you've posted where you live before, does he live close by? Will he be a constant 'threat'? If so I would get in touch with KCC or Canterbury refuges and ask for a house move.
Once you take care of the legal stuff and if he is denied custody or visiting rights, I would leave where you are. It's a big county and a big country.
Don't feel guilty about denying your little fella 'his dad'.......... he has choices to make when he is older.
Kindest regards
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Cadbury, I have a book I'm reading "never be lied to again"
It takes apart what people say and how they say it. Its very intresting.
I found it helps to read between the lines.
When I read this it may be obvious to most, I see a Devide and Conquer.
1. WE- you know it will be his agenda you will be listening to, not a WE.
2. He questions your trust, maybe new informaiton has changed your trust THIS IS GOOD but he makes it sound like you owe him, not allowed to have a change in your thinking. (Brain Washing)
[quote]We really do need to talk, you want to trust but you don't see that you have broken the trust I had in you this is not a one way street.
Devide you from any support you may find, even if your mothers advice is flawed maybe in this case it's not.
I don't want to argue but you are following your mothers advice which you know is flawed.
I would wonder why he would think you can't trust him unless he knows you have GOOD reason not to trust him.
I am not against you. I will not say or do anything until you can regain that trust.
He wants to prove because it's a bluff, if you didn't want his family to see the baby, they would gang up on you and get in your face until you cave into their demands. I would stay away until you are stronger to face them.
If they don't understand the problems with him already then he should explain it to them.
I will prove to you that we can talk because I am willing to stop the court case, remember you refused to let me or my family see him after I pleaded with you. Please talk.
[/quote]
Keep strong and remember you can change your mind about your life.
You once belived he was wonderful then things changed.
You can be wrong sometimes in your life and you don't have to explain.
I don't know if any of this helps you, I will keep reading. OR
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Thanks again everyone, you are all so good for me. I so need this support at the moment.
OR - That was very insightful, thank you. It is what he does all the time. He says things like the thing about my mother as though it is afact that I know all about. In actual fact I am very close to my mother and she found it hilarious that he had said that about her.
Likewise with the contact. I had offered to go to see his parents and he had been very critical of the way I was going, the time I would spend etc. I had said I would spend an hour or so with them and he thought it should be more. I told him it was because it was an hours journey to get there and an hour to get back so it was at least 3 hours of effort, but he still kept almost attacking me. In the end I said that if he carried on like that I wouldn't go. He did and so I said okay, I won't go and I'll send your parents a letter saying why. He then tried to retract it all, but I had ended the conversation as it was starting to wear me down too much. When I'd calmed down I sent a yahoo message saying I would go to his parents as they didn't deserve to be punished for his behaviour. He didn't get the message and so while I was at his parents house, he filed the papers. Then he started with his lies (saying he felt the children were in danger from the controlling attitude of my family and worse) so I stopped talking to him altogether. Mostly for my own safety and sanity as his lies were threatening all kinds of things.
But, yes, I can see exactly his intention by reading through the lines and I totally agree with your opinion. Very interesting, thank you.
Serena - I saw the solicitor yesterday and because my grant cheque was paid in my bank account was too far in credit to automatically get legal aid, so I'm waiting to hear from them about that. I have brought all the evidence to the solicitor but it seems that it is a big fight to stop all contact. I am prepared to fight, but it is difficult to know what he will lie about to get his own way. The solicitor also said that I can apply to have him psychiatrically (sp?) assessed. The downside of that is that if the psychiatirst can find no threat then he would get unsupervised visits immediately. I know how well he lies so I am undecided about that. I have plenty of evidence to support him having very limited contact but apparently if he turns up to all his contact times and is well behaved it may move to unsupervised contact n the future. The thought just makes me feel sick. But I will fight as much as I can and hope that the right thing wins. Thank you for your kind words and support.
Mum - It is so true. He wants to talk, but he actually means "change your mind". That is why he is coming out with all the crap about my family 0 he cannot believe I have made decisions without him telling me what to do. He tries to portray me as weak and floundering, when I am not at all.
GFN - Thank you!
Brigid - and you!
If I could move to America I would! I haven't even been there, but I've always wanted to! I cannot say how much all this means to me. People who understand and support me when we've never met is so special. When this is over I hope I can be there for some of you too!
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(((Cadbury)))
I hope that you can get at minimum the supervised visits.
I know all your worries all to well.
I will keep you and your baby in my prayers.
Mia
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Thank you Mia!
Just watching news at lunchtime and there's a story of a young man (19) who killed his parents last July. He was due to start medical school and everything, promising future the works. Went mad, killed his parents in a frenzy and then went on holiday and spent £30,000 on their credit cards. The Crown court today accepted his plea of manslaughter on the grounds of diminished responsibility as he has NARCISSISTIC PERSONALITY DISORDER!! I am actually quite scared now. How could I ever prove it? He will lie to trick anyone, so a Psychiatrist will never get a diagnosis. Oh well. I will pray that this turns out okay.
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Cadbury,
Keep the faith. I know my children's therapist has already seen through X N. I never thought she would but it happened and in a very short time.
Mia
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Hiya Cadbury:
Hopefully the lawyer will help you get what is needed to protect your child. I would keep insisting that this is my priority based on my ex's very inconsistent emails (he changes his angle, tone per email, showing his sudden mood swings, somewhat paranoid thinking and manipulative tendancies.....not good for giving me stable trust that he will parent with compassion, consistency or responsibility). I would be pointing out that no contact will be best for the child. This person uses children to get to their mothers and when that doesn't work, discards the child, as has been proven by his behaviour toward his other child (children?--sorry I can't remember).
You don't have to let him visit your son at all, for now, if you choose not to. Does his tone cause you to feel threatened at all? Document this well, if so and be sure to tell the attorney.
diminished responsibility as he has NARCISSISTIC PERSONALITY DISORDER!!
Note the time, channel, date of this news broadcast. Again, report to lawyer. If you do decide to ask for a psychiatric assessment....this shows that NPD's have deminished responsibility.....according to the courts....so how can they be trusted to visit children and not cause harm...even under supervision???? Doesn't one have to be fully responsible when caring for young children? Might be of use??? I don't know.
I'm rooting for you too, Cadbury. And still praying.
GFN
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Thanks again GFN and everyone. I will keep you all posted as to how it goes. Hopefully I will be able to protect my baby from him.
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hello everyone,
one handed typing as my beautiful baby son is curled up under my arm fast asleep! Apologies for mistakes in advance!
Well, it was court yesterday and although it was only a district judge I was terrified. My ex was a bit of a twit (including being really rude to the cafcass officers) but the judge decided that he should have one hours contact per week at a contact centre for now with a review in 2 months. It is very hard, but I am going to try and make it as amicable as possible for the sake of my son. My ex even said comments about my abilities as a mother which i nearly bit my arm off to ignore. The name is still an issue and he has threatened to sue me for custody too so we'll have to see how it goes.
I am glad the first step is over, but wish it could all be so much easier. Feel a bit down about it, but still .... the media at the moment has ensured that any man with functioning testicles gets to call himself a father, so I guess I'll have to live with it.
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Cadbury,
I sorry for the stress Mr. Sperm Donor is applying, but at least your boy is protected for now. With any luck he will get bored with the process and just go away.
Please send that baby over for a visit so I can cuddle him for awhile. :D
Hugs and blessings,
Brigid
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Hi Brigid,
Tahnk you - I hope he does get bored and go away, but he is all about winning and I think he wants to fight just for the sake of it. He doesn't have his son's best interests at heart, only his own ego. That makes things hard.
Still, my son is doing well and if you could see his super fat little cheeks you would be on a plane for a cuddle straight away!! If only he would sleep ...... !
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Hi Cadbury:
... he is all about winning and I think he wants to fight just for the sake of it.
It's frustrating isn't it? Well, at least he hasn't really won a thing here......has actually lost a bit.
Prior to court.....when he was behaving fairly reasonably....he was getting to visit his son AND YOU, in a comfy coffee shop, nice and convenient... but now....he will be in a centre where he will be observed by strangers, no YOU there to work on. He may put on a show but my bet is those who watch learn to see through people like him. So, in a way....he is now on test ground and he has lost freedom, some comfort/convenience and the chance to win the supply he was really after.
Congratulations Cadbury!! It might not seem like much and maybe it isn't but he wasn't awarded unsupervised visitation for days at a time so really.....this is worth celebrating some.
I adore babies and if I lived near I would be over there taking my turn at cuddling. Keep your chin up Cadbury, you're doing a great job! You have a calm, firm attitude, which is fantastic!!
:D Sela/GFN
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Thank you Sela and everyone. Just a little update ...
My solicitor has been trying to arrange the contact centre. She has contacted the contact centre (?!) and found out when they are open, she has gotten a list of times that suit me and written to my ex's solicitors to ask for the times that would suit my ex. It has been over a week since court and about 5 days since my ex was asked for times - he has still not provided any. This could be because we have been told that it will cost £55 an hour at the centre, or because he is only interested in our son's name and not anything else. I don't know.
I am in contact with my ex's ex girlfriend. Sounds strange and he has no idea about this, but she is a nice person and knows exactly what he is like. She is in contact to him and lets him tell her everything he is thinking and she then tells me. If he finds out he will go mad, but I don't think he will. Anyway, apparently I am schizophrenic and autistic. I am also violent and he has seen my father sexually abusing me. Apparently, everyone who knows me, knows this about me. I also cannot live without him and cannot manage on my own. etc etc etc. While I cannot use any of this explicitly - it does help to know what mad little thoughts are going through his head!
At court he even told my solicitor that I was getting married and would be getting my new husband to adopt our son and then give him my new husband's name. My solicitor came rushing over to me as, obviously, if I am engaged to be married it is something the court has to know about when making decisions about my son. She asked me about it and I had to tell her ..... I am single! I don't even have any male friends at the moment, let alone a boyfriend!! He is really getting scary. He believes all his own lies. I seriously think he could pass a lie detector test as he does not see himself as lying. I don't understand it at all.
Stilll, trying to keep upbeat - you are right Sela, he is going mad at the idea of a contact centre. Plus, I now don't have to deal with him personally so his contact with me cannot damage me at all.
Hope you are all okay. I don't get much time, but I try to check in every couple of days or so.
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Hi Cadbury! Sorry to hear that you are having such problems with mr Sperm Donor, but you seem to be holding up very well. :) It's ebcouraging to hear that he hasnt been in contact about the contact centre yet, I hope that he will keep it up so that the court will see how little interest he has in his son. To cheer you up I can tell you that after my parents divorced my mother took back her maiden name and managed to change my sister's and mine too! This was in the seventies and even though she had been married and we all had had my father's name! True, this was not in the UK and she did have to go all the way to uor version of the supreme court to do it, but she did. On the other hand, she is an N, but I strongly suspect that my fater is too, just don't know him well enough to be sure! :shock: :? Anyway, I read through the court papers the other day (my mother was away, so I had a snoop), and it is fascinating to see the crap that was flying.... But I agree with you, it is just about power, my father never cared about me (not that my mother did either), and it was all just about them, had nothing to do with us kids.
Anyhow, the reason she finally won was because the court found it made more sense for us to have the same name as the caregiver (!!!???) we were living with, makes practical matters easier (someone from my sister's school had called and hung up, thinking they had the wrong number), makes it easier for the children, not having to explain to friends why they don't have the same name as the parent they live with (don't know if this argument will hold up today, but worth a shot), plus the fact that our father had been absent for quite a while when they got divorced (he was actually living in the US when the divorce came through). Hope these strategies help. Also, do your other children have your last name? That could help, you saying you want them to have the same name as their sibling (or if they don't, saying that three different last names in one household would just be too much). The contact with your ex's ex sounds great, could she testify? Or maybe that would make you seem as if you gang up on him.
Your son sounds wonderful, and I'm so envious that you have him out in the real world now, I have to wait another two and a half months or so... Playing with a little foot through my stomach wall is great, but I can't wait to actually meet this little person! Take care and good luck!
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Hi sleepyhead
I hope you are resting well while you wait for your little one to arrive. You really cannot get enough rest in preparation. I didn't listen when people told me to rest as I was so excited I just kept dashing around! So please listen and go and pamper yourself!
The last thing I really heard my ex say in court was that he disputed the interim residence order in my favour as he didn't think the children would be safe with me. All false, just him making waves for no apparent reason. He must know that that was an awful thing to say, plus all the allegations he keeps throwing out. We still haven't heard about when he is free for the contact centre, but last night he suddenly IM'd me on yahoo to ask how Alex was and to say he was going away for a week. I didn't reply, but I just get so frustrated that he seems to see his actios as something entirely seperate from himself. Like I should still be civil and like him etc when he is doing everything he can to destroy my life.
Well, I suppose it is just a question of waiting to see what madness he will come out with next. I so wish I had never met him.
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Hi Cadbury:
Do wonders ever cease? Gee.....it's amazing how much these people think they can just brush under the carpet eh?
Stilll, trying to keep upbeat - you are right Sela, he is going mad at the idea of a contact centre. Plus, I now don't have to deal with him personally so his contact with me cannot damage me at all.
Good for you girl!! Keep up that beat!! 8)
Maybe he'll meet princess right on his trip and decide to stay in happyland forever! :shock: :roll: :mrgreen:
With any luck, he will be very late, lax, certainly continue to be uneager to attend the contact centre and that will look bad on him.
And I hope the comment about him not thinking "the children would be safe" with you does too!!!
What a goof!! :roll:
Hi Sleepyhead!
Good to see you posting!! Hope everything is going well for you! The next couple of months will go by quick. And then you'll have your own bouncing bundle of joy!!!! :D :D :D
Sela/GFN
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Ok, this isn't very nice, but nice schmice I am pregnant and on bedrest!
Is there some way to get him to say to someone official all of the nonsense he tells you and his ex? It would really help if they could see better what he is like. I just wonder if there is a way to push him so that he'll reveal himself more.
I don't totally understand the law in your case, but why does he have any rights at all? I don't get it. I guess in the states he would have some sort of visitation rights, but he would also have to pay child support. That would be annoying-- having to deal with him. Usually deadbeat dads don't come around because they don't want to be found to be asked for money. So it works out. But the name-- I am a little confused by that.
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Hi Vunil!
How are you? When is your baby due? I hope you are both keeping well!
The name thing is all about his ego. He wants "his" child to have "his" name. I nhis own words "A child without its fathers name is a child that is unloved and unwanted". That is the kind of thing he comes out with! It is all about ownership and control with him. The only really good thing about his NPD is that he cannot see it and so he isn't curbing his behaviour in court.
As an example. I was adopted by my step-father when I was 7. I was given my new fathers name and am now 28. So for 21 years I have been known by that name. In court, my ex said to the judge "the name _____ has no biological link to the child. It is not his mothers real name". The judge looked at me and raised an eyebrow. I explained how it was my adoptive name and the judge looked at my ex as if he was a total fruitcake and said " I think we can accept that there is a biological link with this name to the child, since it is his mothers name. That gives it the biological link". My ex said to the judge "Well, I disagree". To a judge.
When we go back to court, because the name is the most important thing to my ex, he will start saying more and more screwy things to try and get it changed. He has said a few already. Because he is so sure of his own importance, he cannot see that others don't agree and can see right through him. That is about the only good thing to come out of NPD - their total inability to see that they may be wrong about anything!
Sela - I am so hoping he will meet someone on his trip! It would be enough to get him to leave me alone while he "love bombed" her to get her to be his new supply. However, that's kind of a bad thing to wish as it means I'm then hoping for someone else to have to put up with him! He phoned yesterday and I hung up. I think he will get more and more desperate as he realises I really have cut him off from me.
I hope all the pregnancies are going well. Another couple of months and I'll have friends in the land of sleep deprivation!! It's nice here, if a little blurry!
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V- Hope your getting lots of rest, when are you due?????
I am pregnant and on bedrest!
Cadbury
The name thing is all about his ego
My STB- EX-N-H, is so caught-up on the name thing too.
After 28 yrs he wants me to change my name back to my madien name.
I think he is can't understand more than his own ego here too.
Our child would have his name, my name would be different causing confusion.
I would then have to make the effort to change everything in my current name like DL, medical information, etc, just a pain in the butt. He keeps asking me to change my name back, I ignore him, I DON"T have to make him HAPPY anymore so he can just keep asking I have too many other things to worry about.
I think where there is confusion about the name, if your dear sweet child is going to be with you , but you have his name when your not married then it will cause questions.
I have to go to work ..............take care..............OR
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I'm doing great-- rest seems to be really doing the trick-- thanks for asking! It is probably good for me to get used to not doing 10000 things in a day, too, although I'm still settling into that. Thank heavens for the internet.
One thing can be said for these N folks. They are entertaining as all heck. I really think you should write a memoir or short story or something, Cadbury. The thought of him instructing a judge is just too funny. I know it is less funny to you since you have to deal with him, but the way you write it suggests you can at least get some sarcastic pleasure out of it :) Why don't you get a big bright label with his full name on it, with the words "this baby is the spawn of" before the name and the next time you see him make a big deal of putting the label on the child. Promise that the child will wear this label at all times. Promise to have all clothing embroidered with your ex's name and to emblazon the name on the front of your house.
It's funny names are coming up, because one of the really fun things for my mom (and, I suspect, my sister) to do during my pregnancy is to disagree with my choice of names. Mind you, it does not appear to matter what name I pick, it is always wrong. It's very nice that they know the exact right names other people should be named. Perhaps we could give them sovereignty over all people, and they could assign names accordingly.
Anyway, congrats Cadbury! I am jealous that you are at that stage now where you aren't pregnant and you know everything went well with the birth. And you get to see the little face :)
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Vuil - I am sure everything will be fine with your birth and your beautiful little baby. (Apart from the pain, but then you would never believe how bad that can be!).
Luckily I can see the amusing side of his mad behaviour or I think I'd go mad myself!
OR - I cannot believe your ex is being like that! It's as if they see their name as something of ownership. It's like it is an honour to carry their name. So for my ex he wants our son to have his name as the ultimate honour and my name obviously wouldn't be good enough for that! Your ex obviously feels you are no longer worthy of having his name. It's his, how dare you!!
My ex has finally got in touch with the solicitors to say he can manage a Thursday or Friday for contact. I don't know why as he does nothing, but probably his way of making himself sound busy and important. I have raised the fact that part of his conviction means he cannot work with children under the age of 16, so I queried whether he would be allowed around the children in a contact centre. I think that will send him mad, but it is a genuine question.
He gets back from his summer school on Friday, so I'll see what happens then.
Vunil - call your baby whatever you like! I am sure you will have picked out a beautiful name so ignore everyone else. I think that they just like the argument to make you feel bad. Once the baby is here and you have chosen the name, I'll bet they never mention it again! :lol:
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Oh Cadbury!
...while he "love bombed" her to get her to be his new supply...
You gave me my morning giggle with this one! How accurate!!! Another one of those too true and pathetically funny ones!! (sorry....that's the evil in me coming out this morning.. :evil:). I can just picture it! He drops a bomb and she's swoons and falls, overcome with "luuuuv" feelings for him! He smiles, a sneaky, little N-smile, knowing he now has her hooked, and he can now play with his new toy, to his "heart's content"!! Sad, sick and sickly funny!
....part of his conviction means he cannot work with children under the age of 16,...
Sorry if I missed this....what conviction? (if you feel ok answering, that is). And he's saying the children might not be "safe" around you? Sounds like you have a fact here to show that it's the other way around. Don't give in on this one Cadbury!!! You bet it's a genuine question and deserves a serious answer!!!!
The thought of him instructing a judge is just too funny.
I agree with Vunil. Hopefully, the judge didn't find it the least bit funny!! :D
Hi OR! Yes....how dare you carry his name!!! I was told that once the divorce went through, I could use whatever name I chose (return to my maiden name or whatever). I wonder if the law is the same where you are? What a dilly he is eh? His name! He probably has some great ancestor, who did something important to earn that name, and who is rolling over in his grave, at this point, knowing your ex has misused that name and is taking credit for it...trying to own it....and recking it!!
Vunil......some people find the pain of childbirth isn't all that bad. I'm serious! They do their breathing and focussing and all that and it helps alot!!
...one of the really fun things for my mom (and, I suspect, my sister) to do during my pregnancy is to disagree with my choice of names.
What ever name you have picked, Vunil, I bet it's beautiful!! Feel like sharing so we can support your choice?? (if not.....no worries.....surprise us later!! :D).
Keep resting! You're sounding like you are doing very well! Hope this is so and it keeps on that way!!
:D Sela
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OR,
Just thought I'd relate a funny story my attorney shared with me regarding changing your name. A client of his was being divorced by an a$$hole jerk who came from a local, wealthy prominent family with a very recognizable name. He really wanted his wife to change her name once they were divorced so she would no longer be associated with him (and he had a new honey that would be the new Mrs. a$$hole). She agreed she would for the price of $50,000. He agreed, paid her the money and she changed her name--for one year--then changed it back to his last name as he had neglected to attach any kind of time limit to it. I thought that was hysterically funny and I'm sure just pushed her x right off the edge.
I don't think any court can force you to change your name as part of the divorce. If your child has that name, you are entitled to have it as well. I even know a woman here who not only changed her name back to her maiden name, but her two teenage daughters did as well because they were all so angry at their father's cheating on their mother and marrying the new girlfriend.
Good luck.
Brigid
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Brigid:
She agreed she would for the price of $50,000. He agreed, paid her the money and she changed her name--for one year--then changed it back to his last name as he had neglected to attach any kind of time limit to
I like this story, HA! these N's think they are so smart, they get to their goal and forget much beyond that.
Sela:
His name! He probably has some great ancestor, who did something important to earn that name, and who is rolling over in his grave, at this point, knowing your ex has misused that name and is taking credit for it...trying to own it....and recking it!!
I know he thinks HIS name is special, but not for any great thing HE did. Your right his living relatives are looking at him like he's recking their name with his big N behavior, and the dead ones are surely rolling in the graves.
Chadbury: When do the N's ever get happy! You want something, they don't want you to have it.
My H tried to tell our 12 yr old D she was not his child, but now wants custody. I think he would be willing to discard us both, have us both change our names.
Then I think he wants to have control so he would want our D to keep his name, just have me change mine, leaving our D to feel disconnected from me.
I need to look at this name thing closer maybe use it to my advantage somehow.
It's like it is an honour to carry their name.
no longer worthy of having his name. It's his, how dare you!!
V - Mind you, it does not appear to matter what name I pick, it is always wrong
Others that think they will name the child for you will not be there everyday to call the childs name.
The mother has to like the name so LOVE will be heard from the child.
If your family does not like the name you choose then it will be a silly story from them, how they wanted to choose the name they liked.
OR
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Well, I picked the name Pumpkin Patch. Just kidding. For anonymity reasons I guess I won't give the name but it is a very common name, not at all weird. But I've already given her the nickname "bear" so I'll probably call her that a lot. Maybe I'll tell my family that is her official name! Bear! That would be pretty fun.
Speaking of names, my mother has decided that everyone who doesn't change their name to their husband's name upon marriage is evil. This is a problem since neither of the married women in the family changed their names. So, she just pretends they did. She says , "well, X is really Mrs. Y, no matter what her other name is. Officially, she is Mrs. Y." When told that, no, the woman's legal name is the same name she always had, she says "well, but really she is Mrs. Y. Since she is married to Y. So that is her name, at least according to tradition." It's pretty funny. Tradition trumps anything that an individual might want or believe. At least if she herself likes the tradition, of course.
Names! They should be their own thread. It is not surprising it's a major N issue, since we can picture the landowner naming all of his serfs after himself and the king giving all of his sons his same name. Since they think everyone is an extension of themselves anyway, why wouldn't they want to control everyone else's name? How infuriating that they can't, they must think.
Cadbury, what is going on with you and the weirdo? And how is your beautiful baby?
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This name stuff is so typically N! My ex won't even consider a double barrelled surname, because it has to be all his!!
Thanks so much for all your replies - it's like some kind of reassurance that it's not just me!! Sorry if I don't respond to everything right now, but my beautiful baby is not a sleeper (bless his little heart) and I am so sleep deprived I can't really see straight!
Vunil - my ex has finally gotten back to us about contact and I'm waiting for my solicitor to arrange it. He has a conviction for child abduction of his other son so I did raise a query about whetehr he is allowed in the contact centre on the grounds of his conviction. I cannot remember what I have already posted so please forgive repitition! I think that has to be ironed out before it can all go ahead.
He keeps sending me text messages asking about our son and slipping some other comment in at the same time. I am doing a fantastic job so far of just responding in a very plain "A is fine. He does not sleep. He eats a lot" and nothing more. As far as I can work out, he is a bit miffed that I have managed this for so long, but really if his son is his only interest then that should be fine. I still spend many happy hours imaging winning enough money to buy him out of my life!! I wish!
Hope everyone is well and doing happy things. I am okay, just desperately missing sleep and typing on here without bouncing a baby on my knee!!
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Hope you win the lottery. :)
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Mia - so do I!
On my worst days I try to decide between money to pay him off and allow me to adopt our son (so he cannot contact us until our son is 18) and paying a hit man...... I'm only half joking! :lol:
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The hit man would work out better....also half joking :P
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Cadbury,
Give those sweet cheeks a kiss for me (the baby's, not yours). :D I vote for the hit man too. Sending you prayers for strength and a good night's sleep.
Hugs,
Brigid
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I am okay, just desperately missing sleep and typing on here without bouncing a baby on my knee!!
How old is baby now; can you start on baby rice to help with sleeping through the night or is it too soon? My daughter was a very hungry baby, and it took a long time to settle her through the night. 10 years I think it was. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Thank you everyone!
*A* is 11 weeks old now and although the health visitor recommend 6 months before weaning, he is going to be weaned in 5 weeks. He is so big I don't think he would last that long. My two daughters were weaned at that age (it's a recent change) and they were fine, so the end (I hope) is in sight. He feeds every two hours day and night at the moment and I am shattered so I have to wean him soon, or collapse of exhaustion!
He has beautiful little fat cheeks and I kiss them daily!!
My ex was on yahoo yesterday and being abusive as usual. I have made a decision to answer anything about *A* and ignore everything else. After almost an hour of him abusing my family and explaining why what he does is justified, (sat on my hands to ignore all that!), he then asked about *A*. I have copied this and it is so classic, I had to laugh:
M:-How much does he weigh now, is he crawling, can he grasp toys, do you play my voice for him in his bear?
M:- what does he look like
M:- have you sebnt some photos to my sister
M:- can he sit up
M:- are you feeding him anything solid yet
M:- bit early for that sorry
M:- does he look like me
me :-no
M:- no to what
me:- no solids yet, doesn't look like you. Yes, sent photos to your sister.
M:- he doesn't look like me?
me:-no, not that I can see
M:- perhaps you have forgotten what I look like
me:- No, he just doesn't look like you. He looks like Sarah, alomst exactly
M:-That's not reassuring,
Oh how his ego must have hurt!! *A* doesn't look like me either, but I am not worried!
We are still waiting for the date of contact so I will update when I can. I haven't been around this board much as I am so exhausted, so I apologise for not being any help to anyone, I will be better soon! Take care everyone.
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He is online now and wants to talk. No matter how much I tell myself that it is pointless trying to talk to him - the urge to try and tell him what I am feeling is intense. I still think I could get him to empathise. I have to learn it is useless. I will feel so crap if I do, yet... there he is writing crap and I am finding it harder to ignore.....
AHHHHH I hate the way he still affects me with his s**t. Help me resist!!
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BUTTON..............PUSH THE BUTTON................HE IS PUSHHHHHHHHHHHHING THE BUTTONS.
DON'T RESPOND........WRITE SOMETHING BUT DELETE IT AND TALK A WALK GET AWAY FOR AWHILE.
there he is writing crap and I am finding it harder to ignore
He will write what he wants and making you jump at what he is saying shows the control he wants.
He will lie and laugh all the way how he knows it will upset you...........laugh at him, sit back and watch what happens when you ignore him.
I just read some letters my H sent our D, telling her crap how Im keeping her from writing him, taking the stamps so she can't mail the letters........how dumb....the stamps are already on the envelopes he sent.
He made up a song how Im abusing him and he has no self-esteam because of me, LA LA LA
telling her lies then saying to her to write him back about coming to live with him in CA.
I making copies of the letters to show the court how he tells her negative stuff.
You can copy this crap he is writing and show it to the mediators.
Stay strong and the pain to communicate with him will pass..............OR
OR
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I love how firm you are-- "no he doesn't look like you"--!
I hope you did resist chatting with him. I think you know what to expect from him by now.
Poor guy. He will never know the true joy of parenthood the way you know it. It will always be about him.
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Cadbury, I must tell you this tale.
I too, thought if I just told my ex:
how bad I felt, how what he was doing to prevent me from having a life was hurting me, how horrible I thought he was for doing this, how he knew damn well that the kids would be fine if they moved with me, etc etc etc.
that some how this would alleviate my pain, or maybe even cause him to change his mind..(after all, maybe he WAS a nice guy).
So I took the opportunity of a mediation session to do just that. It started out okay, as he seemed to be listening, etc (puts on the good show for the mediator). But the strange thing was, that once I started, there was no stopping me. The pent up rage just came flying out, faster and faster, until I was out of control with anger. The mediator asked him to step out of the room and asked me if I was in therapy....for anger! She had NO idea what abuse I had taken from this man, and it didn't matter.....she told me that if any of that rage had spilled out in court...well NO WONDER I lost my case!
Let me tell you, I was thrown into the bowels of hell in my mind after that incident. It was what pushed me into the final depths of my pain, and I am thankful for it, now. At the time, I wanted to die, as it drove home how utterly heartless this man is, and how commited he was to hurting me and taking pleasure in it. And I had opened up completely and let him know how very well he was doing that job.
I am certain he laughed all the way home and he and his wife had a few drinks celebrating my pain. No doubt about it.
But the bottom line is this: HE didn't deserve my rage, my feelings, as he had NO pity, empathy, remorse, etc.
So I caution you, save the rage for a therapist, good friend, etc.....and don't bother sharing it with him. He won't do with it what a real man would (care).
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Well, all your advice was excellent. I listened to every word and then he pushed one button too many and I responded. I told him I did not believe a word he was saying about anything. This sent him mad, after all - his word is law! He then messaged me a few days later and, after some rambling that obviously blamed me for what was about to follow, he told me that he had contacted social services about his concerns. His concerns are that my family will abuse my children as they abused me. Perfectly valid concerns, except ... my parents never abused me. Really that's the only thing stopping him being a naturally concerned parent. After all, what's a little truth to a Narcissist?
Well, yesterday, social services and a police officer came to my house to question me about his allegations. I had to defend my father from being a child abuser. He even told them about sexual fantasies I (allegedly) had that all (apparently) go to show how abused I must have been. He really seems to be escalating. He has just messaged me on yahoo and I have told him I will only respond to questions he may have about our son. He still couldn't keep to that, so I have now told him that he will have to write me an email if he has any questions and I will answer when I can.
Apparently he has been to see his solicitor about mediation. I haven't heard anything about that yet, so I'm waiting for it. My problem is: I am genuinely now too frightened to be the same room as him. I shake when I see him post a message. I know I can refuse to go to mediation, but then I will look like I am the unreasonable one. How do I deal with this? Do I put myself through a really frightening experience, just to look good in court? Do I explain that I find him too frightening and intimidating to speak to?
It just doesn't seem to end. He will be able to hurt me for ever, all because I couldn't bear the thought of an abortion. If I had I would never have to suffer him again, but then I wouldn't have my darling, beautiful precious little boy. I don't mean anything by these thoughts really, just kind of getting them out.
Thank you everyone.
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Cadbury. I only have a moment, on my way to work
I know the shaking you feel when you read his e-mails, Im glad you told him he's a liar.
I'm sorry about the police asking about your family abuse.
My husband is planning to tell lies about me too. I am able to call in by phone, if somehow you can find out if this is an option with the courts it may help.
I was thinking about you, wondered how you were.
Talk later OR
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Thanks OR for responding.
I hadn't thought about phone contact. As long as I don't have to speak directly to him, that may help. Thank you, I will look into it ...
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Hi Cadbury:
So far, you have done a wonderful job of standing up to this dork. You have resisted whatever urges you have had to try to reason/explain/express to him, most of the time. This recent button pushing session is just a bump in the road to success. I bet you have learned more about how useless it is to try to communicate with him and so it will stick in your mind for next time, and hopefully help you resist his button pushing attempt.
Try to think of yourself as getting mentally stronger and stronger. I know the sleep deprivation has a huge impact on it all. Did that too and it's tough. But that doesn't mean you are weak, just mostly tired. You can be strong in your mind and stubborn about staying that way.
If you must face this ding dong in court/mediation/whatever......maybe it would help to have a plan?
Things like:
What you will do with your eyes
What you will say with your posture
Where you will place yourself in the room
Who you will bring with you for support
What you will say (what information you want presented)
How you will respond to his insane lies
What you will do for yourself, to help soothe you, afterward
Just some ideas in case it becomes necessary. ((((((((((Cadbury)))))))))
Sela
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Thanks Sela - that is such a good idea. When the police woman read out some of the things he'd said I was so shocked I couldn't say anything, so to be prepared with something to say to his lies would be good Even if it's just a standard line of some sort.
He just messaged me to ask for a photo of *A*. Do I send one? I haven't answered yet. I know he's doing it to see if he has any power left, but do I then look petty? I don't want him to have one, but that stems from not wanting him anywhere near my precious baby...
I think I am getting stronger, I just need to be more prepared for his madness.
Well thanks everyone... I'm getting there.
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Hi Cadbury:
That's what I find the hardest too....the shockingness of the lies. They floor me and I feel totally at a loss of what to say in situations like that. I'm stunned! Tongue-tied! Feel like a complete idiot afterward too!
It does help me to try to plan ahead, if I must have contact with such people. I have to psych myself up, have a reserve of responses and be prepared to exit, if necessary.
In the case of insane accusations about your parenting abilities or personal life...you might respond simply......"untrue, more manipulation", or "Not at all true. I can easily prove otherwise." or "Where are you getting your facts?" or "where do you come up with this baloney?" or "Oh come on, have you gone off your medications again???" (just kidding with that last one.... :D..but you get the point I bet?).
In other words be calm, try not to let the shock rule, ignor the fear, speak as if you are certain of yourself and your postitionl. You know it isn't true. You know he's a lunatic rattling off insane accusations. Shake it all off as if you are quite sure he is a nutbar. Don't let him rock your boat (plan on releasing all of that later, in a safe place, preferably with a friend/support person).
Re the picture....honestly....you have no obligation whatsoever to provide him with a single thing he requests. This jerk is recking your life, fighting you in a court of law, making up and telling authorities lies about you, acting like a complete dope and then has the idaucity to request stuff from you???????
Personally, I would not respond at all or, if I felt I must....I might say something like: "Unfortunately, I'm not prepared to do that".
It's not being petty to refuse to do favours for those who give nothing back (in his case....take, take, take.....and twist twist twist). That would be allowing him to use you. You have boundaries right? Let him cross and he'll keep going.
That's just what I think. You might decide I'm the dopey one!! :D :D
:D Sela
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Hi Cadbury,
you can rethink your relationship with this guy a million ways and berate yourself for every choice, but each choice made differently would result in your not having your darling baby, so you just have to assume that all your choices were fine up to this point, or at least as fine as they could be under the circumstances, and let all that Monday morning quarterbacking go. For good.
Then you can focus on your current issues, which should be more than enough to keep you busy! I would consult your solicitor before anything you do. Everything has the potential to be trotted out in a court case. For example, whether you give him a picture or not.
Also, I know you are busy and tired and everything and you just don't need this right now. But try to keep him on the defensive by making a case that he is crazy before he starts against you and you have to defend yourself. Make sure people know about the worst things he does, and why can't you go running to the police complaining about him before he has a chance to complain first about you?
Keep in mind that he is not the first to lie to the police. They are used to having people lie to them and do not, if they are worth their salt, believe him just because he said it. In the end you will prevail, but only if you work at it. That is unfair and a complete bummer, but, that's how it is.
I once had a crazy uber-N roomate call the police on me. When they got there, I just acted my reasonable self and she was hysterical. Of course they went away shaking their heads. You will win. But don't stop fighting. We are here for you. This whole thing is not your fault, but you have to deal with it, and it doesn't seem fair, but you know what? You'll get through it, you'll learn a lot, you'll be able to teach your son a lot that you didn't learn, and it will make you a better, stronger person.
an optimistic
Plucky
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Hi Cadbury,
Being in the middle of a court case myself here's a little advice.
Don't worry so much about looking like the 'goodguy'. People will understand, when they see his provocations, that you are merely trying to protect yourself.
I have consistently taken the high road in court while my brother has not. But taking the high road does not include bending over backwards to the extent of disappearing up your own backside. :shock: :P :shock:
It means being polite and reasonable but having a spine of iron when it comes to protecting yourself and your little one.
If he wanted a picture of his son he could have acted like a father. :x
Maybe you could send him a picture of a baboon and tell him you've been wrong all along, there is a resemblance to him after all. :D :P
mudpup
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Maybe you could send him a picture of a baboon and tell him you've been wrong all along, there is a resemblance to him after all.
mudpup
They say laughter is the best medicine. So after reading this, I can safely skip my vitamin and my doctor appointment! Thank you mudpup!
Plucky
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I haven't got much time at the moment, but I just had to say that the baboon thing was so funny! I am so tempted!!!
Thanks all, I'll be back later to read all your responses again....
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Hi Cadbury. Sorry you're having to go through all this. :( You are not alone in the shaking and being stunned speechless by the lies. I feel the same way about my wife. When I know that I'm going to see her to exchange mail, I feel phsyically sick and grumpy until it is over with. And that is even with nothing particuarly bad happening, just that "air of superiority" that I can't stand anymore. It's not fair, but we will be here for you. Keep up the good work.
And I second mud's suggestion to send the baboon picture. A much needed laugh for me also. :D
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Thank you all so much for your replies, you all help so much!
Well, I haven't sent a picture and he hasn't asked again. The last YIM conversation we had upset me so much that I did ask him to keep all communication to email. I said if he had any questions about *A* then I would answer them by email. He hasn't asked so he obviously isn't interested. I mean *A* is now nearly 15 weeks old. My ex hasn't seen him since he was 4 weeks old and that was only brief. Wouldn't you think he would have a million questions? If I leave *A* for an hour I have questions! #
It is all about power and control to him. He said in the last YIM conversation that I should think about what I want from him money wise and then ask him. I haven't asked because a) I really don't want anything from him, I would rather struggle on than ask him for money and b) he WANTS me to ask so that he has that power. Any man worth anything would just DO all these oh-so-helpful things he offers than keep talking about them. He is just talk and nothing more.
I have now been contacted by a mediator. In the UK in order to get legal aid, we have to try mediation first. I have told them that I cannot be in the same room as my ex as I am terrified of him. They were okay about it, but a little reticent as mediation works better when the two of you are face to face. I have thought long and hard about it and I just am too frightened to be in the same room as him. I don't know if others have had this happen (and I may start another post on this), but since I have been "free" of him in a physical sense, all the mental torture I suffered during the relationship has become worse, somehow. It's like I will suddenly remember something that happened and reel in shock over the awfulness of it. Whilst I was in the relationship, because bad things happened all the time, it was like they became normal. It is only now that life is truly normal again that I can actually see how bad some of the things were. I am so not ready to face him. Apparently I won't have to, but I am worried about the pressure.
I will keep you all posted. I am trying a new sleeping routine with *A* and I am shattered but hoping that things can only get better!
Take care ...
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Well, sleeping routine is getting better, *A* is now sleeping a little bit better than he was, so I am getting slightly more human!
My ex has just emailed me and it is like he is on another planet. The things he has done are so awful and then he writes an email as if nothing has happened. I would like to throttle him with my bare hands, but instead I have come on here to vent it all out! He has thanked me for agreeing to mediation, for a wonderful N quote we have :
"I am full of admiration for your noble deed of accepting to try mediation,..."
does anyone in the whole world speak like that? !! He is such a ......... fill in what you will! The whole tone of his email is grovelling and contrite, and it is purely that I know him so well that I can see straight through it. I think that is why I am angry, because I know it is just another of his games and other people probably won't see that. Well, all my friends and family will because they know him too, but arghhhhhhhhhh God it makes me so annoyed.
Well, it is just another chapter in a whole book of crap so here we go again....
Oh, he also says that he can deal with all the delays in seeing *A* as he doesn't want pressure to add to my strain etc and he has a whole life time to make it up. The very words "a whole lifetime" have made me sick to my stomach. I wish he would just go away.....
Thank you for letting me vent!
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Cadbury,
let him think he has a whole lifetime. That way he won't be hurried. And since we know he is not really interested in your little angel, maybe he will wait so long before really trying to have contact that the baby will grow up and be old enough to see through him.
He just said that to irk you. Maybe he has slacked off because you are not providing the supply. So please continue not providing the supply. Just come up here and rant to us. We understand.
Plucky
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Thank you Plucky! When I think how far I have come since first finding this board last October/November I feel good. I was a total wreck, now I just get annoyed with his games. Well, occasionally I bawl my eyes out, but I think that's a good thing!
I think he will eventually pipe down, especially if I keep distant (as you said). I just wish it would happen NOW!!!
Thanks again... ranted out ...
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Cadbury,
I found this web site about child custody and found some good advise there. There are some things about infants and the scheduling for visits as they get older.
http://forum.freeadvice.com/archive/index.php/f-37-p-9.html
Also, I found an expert who will mediate with the mediators about NPD. He will speak for you about what you should expect from the difficult dad. Im planning on paying him to give guidance to the mediators so I don't have to explain why I worry about what he may be willing to do to be hurtful or maybe even take her away because he wants to cause me hurt and pain.
And yes my H talks like this to me. I remember he was a big jerk told our D how she was not his, but he would always be her father.
like he deserved a gold metal for all his superior efforts, out of his good will, he would go ahead and be a responsible father.
I have to go but see if you can review some of the infomation about what others have done to get through the visitations.
I think you have to set up an Id, there are hundreds of stories. ............OR
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Thank you Plucky! When I think how far I have come since first finding this board last October/November I feel good. I was a total wreck, now I just get annoyed with his games. Well, occasionally I bawl my eyes out, but I think that's a good thing!
I think he will eventually pipe down, especially if I keep distant (as you said). I just wish it would happen NOW!!!
Thanks again... ranted out ...
I used to wish my ex would fall off the face of the earth. And the "Nobility" and "Martyrdom" of the Nex's is so far from the realities of their behavior...makes me want to puke. Of course they never get it.
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OR - I checked out that site and did a lot of reading. My only concern is that it wasn't a UK site and I think the laws may be slightly different. Mostly because we have a political group called "Father's for Justice" who are campaigning for Father's rights and they are kind of influencing the way access etc is being done at the moment. The weird thing is, until I met my ex I agreed with everything they said - I had absolutely no idea that there could exist people whose children would be better off never knowing them. This means that courts are being very favourable to fathers at the moment.
I want to say I am not against father's rights AT ALL. Just IDIOT father's rights! And idiot mother's rights for that matter!
Amethyst - they are so supercillious it makes me sick! They don't just have to have the last word, but also the best word and the most up-their-own-arse-word.
I hate the way my ex writes things that make him appear so reasonable, when he is anything but. He has destroyed my family, my mother is a nervous wreck from all his accusations and then he expects everyone to forgive him and act as though nothing has happened. When I had my ill-advised rant at him, he was honestly astonished that my family would think any bad of him. At least, by his own procrastination, he is putting off seeing my gorgeous boy all the time. I just wish I could protect him forever.
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Cadbury,
I believe the fathers rights group are here too. My H reads through this stuff and has let me know how he has this and that right and he plans on using them.
I found a 3rd party expert to voice the concerns dealing with NPD to the mediator. There is a strong need to educate the courts about NPD and other PD's. Yes a difficult parent and N or some other type has rights but when the children are not safe their rights should not be the same.
When you are talking about a normal person, that's different but Mental Illness, drugs, depression etc. that needs to be considered.
Most court systems only know the laws, we read more and more about deaths because of people who have mental problems.I worry every day because I must let my daughter have some contact with her dad because that's his right.
I feel if a 3rd party can teach us all how the courts should direct the judge and mediators in some precautions I will feel alot better. I know Im expected to follow all the rules and the courts will be able to see I will be the one they can trust. I believe they want to deal with people they can trust for the intrest of the child. Let the father show how he won't behave and go back to court and file until you get his rights taken away.
My D wants to visit her friends in CA not so much her dad but wants to be able to fly to CA and visit.
She THINKS she wants to try and see her Dad who she admits I need to be concerned about with his emotional problems while on many meds. She tells me he said: he only acted out of line becasue it was me who caused him to act this way. Im feeling unsure what to do in some ways I feel like she is being manipulating to get her way and the safety issue is not as big of a concern for her as it is for me.
I have to go ....................OR