Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: sally on December 01, 2003, 10:01:52 PM
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Has anybody left a narcissist behind for good? Your father, mother, husband, wife....?
I did it a few years ago and am still alive and feel pretty good, but sometimes I think I won't survive it.
Any experiences out there?
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I broke off an engagement to a narcissist a number of years ago. We were together for 2 or 3 years, living together most of that time. It was the hardest thing I'd ever done and it took me three years to completely get over him. I thought I was going to die without him. But time heals just about everything, and in light of what I now know about his NPD, I realize I came perilously close to a life of total hell. He recently got married and I thank God every day that she's his wife and not me.
If my N father weren't still married to my mother, I would never speak to him again either. I used to think it was terrible for family members not to forgive each other and reconcile. Now I've realized it's a healthy choice when the family member is too personality-disordered to be capable of a human relationship.
Good luck with whatever choices you make.
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Guest,
I dated my N for two years too. I used to wonder why I would get so stirred up about him for. I did not realise until I was away from him that the reason I was so confused most of the time with his actions is because they were so off the wall. Laughing one minte telling me how much he loved me, next minute I was a slut and he couldn't stand the sight of me. My head spun 24/7. They mess with your mind but I will say one thing, He may have crippled my thoughts for a while, but I would bet my last dollar if we would have married these men, our thoughts would be paralysed.
I almost felt if I would have left him I would have been letting him down as well as myself. I am not a quitter. I work hard at what I want in my life and damn it I wanted him. But it is what it is and I thank goodness that he was the type of N who walked away and with no contact That hurts like hell because it only proves to me that every word he said was a lie. We have been broke up for around 6 months now. I can finally see something good out of our relationship. I finally realise that I can love somebody more than I had ever dreamed. I actually think about what we could have had if he would have been, "Normal". He would have been the one. Instead I realise now that he is the one missing out. I gave it my all and for the life of me I can't understand why any of us had to experience this. Reading it out of a book and living it are as different as night and day.
You have been out of your relationship for 3 yrs? Great, 2 1/2 more years before I can have another genuine smile, until I dont have to turn my head so the people around me can't see my cry. I think if he would have given me the respect that I deserved and been a man and ended it in a different manner, I wouldnt be near this affected. I think their lack of feelings sends us scrambling for all of the answers. I have been asked out numerous times over the past 3 months. All I can say is I hope for my sake that I can believe another man. I might just be letting a hell of a guy go because of the emotional scars this man has left me with. An apology would have gone a loooong way. Nah, he decided to do a restraining order instead. How bizarre is that? I exposed him to a few of his friends and called his daughters school to make sure her safety was maintained. I told him he needed to be held accountable for his actions by somebody in his lifetime. He of course now says I am psychotic, well hells bells, N is enough to make anyone nuts.
Nuts, nah! I finally am now holding him accountable for his dirty deeds. I just can wait for my time in this mental prison to be finito. I will take your word that I only have 2 1/2 yrs left, guess thats better than a life sentence of hell.
I am very proud of those who can muster up the strength to leave once they have been in that situation for a long time. I only had two years and I was definately a weaker person because of it. I am slowly but surely working my way back up. Letting someone take your spirit away from you is actually worse then the broken rib I got. Words cut so deep, to bad they do not have the capability of ever knowing how bad they hurt us. Life goes on for them and we all realised we had to go on. It is the hardest thing I have ever done, but I know I will be looking back on this one day. Soon I hope, soon!
Jaded
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Thanks for your replies. Very interesting, very helpful. I'll spend some time thinking about them.
The narcissist I had to leave behind was my mother. A wicked, hard person. Verbally and emotionally abusive, of course. You could write the book on N about her. Well, actually she wrote her own book. All about herself. Her memoirs. About how wonderful she is. Nobody would publish it. She paid a fortune to have it printed. Nobody bought it. She couldn't stand the disappointment, so she went to bed. She's been in bed for 5 years now and has a staff of nurses and servants to give her attention. She became quietly enraged and made everyone miserable--as usual.
I'd put up with this same kind of hysterical and selfish behavior from her for 47 years. Tried like hell to make her happy. I had to quit. I moved out of town without telling her and started a new life.
Four years ago, I cut the neurotic ties. I've not seen her nor talked to her. It's been wonderful. But very frightening. I was used to spending 90% of all my energy dealing with her, so I have all kinds of time and energy to myself. Glad it's over, but I sure feel beat up and worn out. And sometimes very cruel and heartless.
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Read any of my posts and you will get my feedback on this.
WHY did I wait so long?
On hindsite, should have left that imbecilic brother of mine 25 years ago. He was just a waste of my time and energy. Obvious why he has zero friends...what a jerk!
And my mother, once I matured, I realized where she was coming from and it just caused me pain: everyone wants their mothers to love them, I would assume, so she was always such a disappointment to me. So, I left the situation for 21 years and am glad I did. God knows how messed up my child would have been had he been raised around her!
Leave and save yourself if that seems right for you. It was for me and I wish I had done it years and years ago.
How is it to leave? It's worth it! It brought me peace of mind. :D
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Hi Sally,
No, I've never left one behind. But I have really been thinking about it lately. I think you may be braver than I, and I envy those with the strength.. though each choice is probably equally as difficult. You may want to read some of my early posts, because the N in my life is my mother too and she lives in the same town. I'm 35, and still dealing with this crap. Things have improved, but there are setbacks, and this month was the biggest one in years.
See my new post "Free ticket to the theater, starring an N.."
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I left my N husband for good a year ago. For the first six months, I thought I'd die of the pain and hurt.It has been quite a process for me. to Now, I feel so much better. I am loosened from the false belief that he was good for me in any way. When I see him at all (we have kids together) I am shocked at how much of a crazy spin he puts on everything- even a brief converation. It is dizzying.
In my marriage, I took that as normal. I hung on to the belief that there was so much special about him during our marriage--and that someday it would fully emerge and all the bad stuff would go away. It doesn't, ever. I've starting to see him as the immature, selfish, damaging fool he really is. I've experienced more happiness from within myself in the past month then I did in 22 years of marriage, but it has taken a while. These N's ARE NOT SPECIAL, only especially sick. My N has talent, sure, but so do a lot of other people, so big deal. The years of walking on eggshells made me and my kids sick. But we are getting well. Thank goodness for boards like this. There's just no chance for happiness when we're with N's. We're not missing a thing--except emotional torture.
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I know what the slant of this thread is -- but, I am prompted to say that as a child of an NQueen and later years NDad -- I WAS THE ONE LEFT BEHIND !!!!
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I left an N husband, and 5 years later he's still stalking, although he's had a relationship since before our separation. Thank you, Star, for your story. It sounds so much like mine. It just gets better and better. The stalking is minimal compared to the mind games.
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Hello everyone,
Guest, I just had to reply to your observation.
I used to think it was terrible for family members not to forgive each other and reconcile. Now I've realized it's a healthy choice when the family member is too personality-disordered to be capable of a human relationship.
Thank you. I also felt this way. I couldn't understand families that couldn't "get along". This contributed to a lot of the pain I felt when I said "adios" to the exploitative members of my family. But I'm through it now (it does take a while!). But I feel so much better realizing that I'm still a "good person" and a healthier one for finally walking away. After working on it, I have been able to forgive this person and get past the anger and get on with my life, regardless of that person's feelings about me. I feel so much better about myself. And those new feelings are not tied to how that person feels about me. Bonus: it does lead to more free time to do the things that are important to oneself!
Best, Seeker
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Yes, I totally agree -- I have always thought it was quite shameful for in-family estrangements -- that it was for low class people and the Jerry Springer Show. Then, when the brick wall came down on my head and I finally washed my hands of my NQueenmother and all her evil ways, it has indeed freed up my time. Knowing that I won't ever have to hear that horrible voice hollering at me and accusing me and shocking me and expecting unbelievable things from me -- it is a true relief. However, it is still sad any way you want to look at it. I am sure she still tells her lies about me to any ear in the room, even if they don't believe it, she has been granted their respect (really bizarre). I am just glad I am done with her. I ask myself each day if I think I will ever feel guilty or when she dies feel like I made a mistake, and the answer is always NO. I had no choice but to cut with her -- she hates me, she always has and zeroed in all her weirdness mostly to me (she has others on whom she feeds, but I was her main source), so I had to protect myself and live my life. It's mine, not her's. Do I miss her? NOPE ... I am serious, I don't miss her at all. My past holds no fond memories of her -- never. Anyhow, if I die today I don't feel guilty. I ask the Lord about it too, and I never feel like I am holding a great burden or need to come clean. My Dad should have taken steps to get me away from her -- I will never understand why he chose to live with such a misery all those years. But, he is gone now, so, there ya go. Peace.
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Hi Sally, yes I left my N mom for good and many Ns far worse than the one I am struggling to leave now......
I did not have contact with my N mom for nearly 20 years. I cut it off entirely only after repeated attempts (about 8 years on and off) to get her to love me and to get her to be a "mom" to me. Then I just stopped all together (cold turkey after 8 years! :lol: ) and what a wonderful feeling I had finally! Freedom. I hadn't know what I was missing. If not for the foster care system I may not have ever left her. I was forced to leave. I still suffer for not having a family and yet I know now I would have suffered not having a family anyway had I stayed in contact and yet would have paid the price of striving for nothing. By leaving I learned that in reality I'd never had what I'd feared loosing.
I contacted her again a few months ago and was so glad I hadn't bothered for all those prior years. AND, I also learned a lot about myself and about her by seeing her again.
Interesting that although I barely lived with her at all after I was about 10 (foster homes etc. instead) I was reminded anew a few months ago when I saw her how much I'd ingested during that first decade when I was so impressionable. I knew I was/children are sponges yet seeing her again taught me more intimately and emotionally what I had understood generally and intellectually. It lit a fire under my arse to rid myself of the remnants. I also became much more clear about my husbands Nism and how I respond to him and how I learned to be responsive to some folks who act like self absorbed butt heads by being raised with her.
I also have more compassion for her than ever. Still, I do not desire to spend time with her other than on a few rare occasions and that is mostly for the purpose of trying to get information about my background and to perhaps (if and when it suits me only) toss some comfort her way for the things she did to right as a parent. I really have little to offer her anyway. I cannot feed her desire for image vs. reality even when she isn't at the moment presenting an insulting or defensive version of her falseness. She has people in her life to give her that. As seeker wisely noted in her post about forgiveness - it is not synonymous with reconciliation. I forgave my mother long ago. By that I mean I came to recognize emotionally as well as intellectually that she did do some things right as a parent and that she is just a human who under conditions only really experienced and knowable to herself became the damaged soul that she is. My guess is that had I lived every moment of her childhood I'd have turned out very similar to her. Our genetic make up as I understand it really only gives us very subtle differences in temperment. An identical twin's chance of getting schizophrenia is still much more a result of environment than by genetics alone. As for siblings - they each experience a different aspect of the same family so I don't count that as a fair comparison - to say they had the "same" childhood as she did. They are all messed up in their own way anyhow.
Sometimes I do feel guilt still- I haven't returned her last call for a month. And, I get through it with shear ease. I am able to respond to it, to myself, rather than react. I just say to myself " hmmm, interesting, that is guilt I am feeling". Without much thought I can instantly visualize what my life would be like if I let myself become beholding to her attempts at guilt. Had I never left I don't think I'd have had a real understanding of what I was missing and so would not have been as motivated to stay away and have boundaries now. The foster homes were mostly hell yet I learned to keep moving. I also have no trouble realizing that she let me grow up very alone and having to find other sources to look to and that she also has done without me for 20 years. When I was taken from home by social services due to a policeman discovering I was being locked in the backyard she said it was 99%my fault and 1% hers for being human. She would point up at the hospital windows when we went to a Dr. appt. and she was worried they'd notice my bruised and she would tell me that their were children in those rooms whose parents burned them with cigarettes and I was lucky that she didn't do that. I have not trouble recalling that if I dare utter one word about responsibility for the past her rage with uncoil like a striking snake. I can still hear the veiled hardness in her voice when I spoke with her this summer. When she visited a few months ago my having had melanoma was of no expressed concern to her only that we weren't going to the museum she had wanted to go to. She barely contained her anger and it rattled in her voice. Yet regarding my health there was not even a tinge of care.
Now I am working on leaving my N husband. I have left much worse Ns that him (before I knew about "Nism") and it always took me longer than I had hoped and yet I have learned so much each time and have graduated to lesser versions of N men over the years. I believe that seeing my mother again and finding this site and the support here and realizing there was this constant pattern in my relationships I now will never get up close and personal with an N type again. I really feel in a knowing way that is true. With each departure I learn more about how to avoid the road back. Meanwhile I still am struggling with getting out of my current situation.
Not a black and while all or nothing answer and yet I hope this helps illustrate some of what leaving (and even leaving again for good) can be about.
Take Care.
Accappella - signing in as guest because I don't want my N-traited husband reading my posts, he found out about this site...arrg.
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Sally:
I left my Nfamily behind, except for my aunt(Nmom's sister). After struggling for years, cutting them off periodically, and then going back for more of the same, I finally reached my limit one day. The way I look at it is that I wouldn't tolerate that kind of behavior from a stranger, so why tolerate it from a family member? :wink:
My cousin committed suicide several years ago, and that was the final straw for me. Do you know what the Ns in the family had to say about that? "She had a lot of problems!" Well, I guess so! She ran away from home in the first grade!!! It never occured any of them that THEY were the problem. :roll:
I am 49, and it has taken me this long to get where I am in this situation. I can honestly tell you that I am happier than I've ever been in my entire life. I am remarried to a wonderful man with a beautiful family. They can't even fathom belonging to a family like mine. I never miss any of the Ns that I left behind and don't feel the slightest bit guilty. I don't wish anything bad on them, only pity for being so screwed up.
"Misery loves company" is the phrase that comes to mind when thinking about my Nfamily. They are all miserable. They are backstabbing, manipulative liars. They talk about each other and everyone else behind their backs. I'm sorry that their lives are so miserable, but that's no reason to let them keep ruining mine.
I hope you find the courage you need to keep up what you feel you must do. Only YOU know what's best for you. My heart goes out to you. Good luck!
Hugs,
Cathi
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Guest,
I almost felt if I would have left him I would have been letting him down as well as myself. I am not a quitter. I work hard at what I want in my life and damn it I wanted him. But it is what it is and I thank goodness that he was the type of N who walked away and with no contact.
I actually think about what we could have had if he would have been, "Normal". He would have been the one. Instead I realise now that he is the one missing out. I gave it my all...
until I dont have to turn my head so the people around me can't see me cry.
Jaded
These words you write are straight out of my experience & heart as well. If my xN had have been "normal", he is the first man ever, that I would have considered marrying!! (and I am over 35-but younger than 40 :wink: )
I'm definitely getting better after 4 months, thankfully, but I'm still quite upset at times, and there are also so many times when I just can't believe all of this has happened. Am I in a Twilight Zone episode? Sometimes I still hold out hope that I'm going to wake up in bed, in a cold sweat, and that it will all have been a bad dream. Nothing that a nice glass of water wouldn't cure! :(
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it's been over a year now since I stopped taking my father's calls, and I can no longer hear his voice in my head.
I forgive him, but I still don't want him in my life.
The rest of the family don't understand this, or how calm and happy I am.
But I finally relaised its up to me, its not about them and its my life.
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sally,
I think leaving a mother is the hardest. No matter how awful she is and no matter how sick, there is something about one's mother that is different from any other relationship. For various reasons this relationship is quite persistent and it's very, very hard to cut off a mother. However, if your mother is seriously impaired, and extremely destructive (she sounds like she is), you simply need to survive. That probably required doing what you did. Kudos to you.
bunny
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delete
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Left NM more than a year ago. I still have nightmares. I'm still looking over my shoulder. This is horrible, but it's so true, I'll say it. I don't think I'll rest until she's six feet under. But I haven't gone back!
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I am in a lot of pain after being stung by the Nar once again, and trying to go through the grief of our final separation, as I know I must. I feel so terribly disillusioned. But, I guess that's their whole game isn't it? The illusion.
Thanks for being here. It hurts so much.
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:oops:
You are all probably going to think I am a sell-out. And I feel like I am. Anyway, Hello, everyone, ... I am new to this forum.
The problem is this: First of all, I didn't know anything about N until about 2-3 days ago, when I got a book out of the public library called **Trapped in the Mirror.** It's for families of N's trying to find themselves and heal themselves. It's written by the daugher of an N, who is also a therapist.
I'd read some of Vaknin's stuff but it didn't quite "sit" with what I needed; but this book did.
Anyway, my parents, especially my dad, was determined never to let me "get away" from him. I was essentially forcibly prevented from growing up, from learning any life skills to take care of myself; I was kept helpless in a way. In addition to this, I was emotionally, verbally, and physically abused by him, and (sound familiar?) not protected by my cool, and emotionally neglectful mother. There was terrible turmoil in my family of 2 parents and 3 siblings. I am the oldest, brother is next and then my younger sister.
I tried moving thousands of miles away from Mother and Daddy, but they would move, too, to live nearby.
My parents grew up with money; then their families lost money in the Great Depression. When they grew up, they got professional jobs (Daddy was a corporation attorney, Mother a public school teacher) and when they had put me through college (the other two didn't finish college) they began to pile up money.
I had always had mood disorders, and of course this made me dependent on Daddy's money. He controlled the money.
I tried and tried to support myself, but had many nervous breakdowns, but was never hospitalized because my (3) husbands were all crazy, too, and between my crazy family and theirs, I guess nobody wanted the various dirty linens exposed, so I was kept out of hospital? Who really knows.
I mostly worked; I had a lot of different sorts of jobs, but my main ones were teaching and office work. I was good at both, but terrified when I was at work. I usually had conflict with one or more people at work, and got along very well with everyone else. The main problem was that I did not have the stamina to do the work. I have always tired easily. Even in high school, I went to a doctor about exhaustion. He did not know what was wrong. This seems to be a familial problem. My brother has it,although he is a home builder with his own hands. He has to work for himself because he can't work for anyone else. He did work for the Feds for about 15 years and he says it "about killed him." I finally ended up working for myself for 19 years, and it was much better, but I was not able to support myself because I could only work 3 days a week in student-contact (i.e. paid hours). The rest of the time I was either resting or planning. When I got my third divorce, I went back to work and got fired, fired, fired because by then I was no longer young and cute, and could not keep up with the work pace.
In the earlier years, I DID try to get counseling, but in those days family counseling was not the "thing" and it was always "fix the broken person", you see. And throughout my life, nothing helped, either. I tried EVERYTHING except leaving my family.
Meanwhile, now I am 62; Mother is 86; Daddy died about 4 years ago at 86.
Daddy's will left all to Mother, and I think there were provisions for us 3 "kids," too. But Mother is not a generous person. Daddy was very generous to us.
Daddy loved me -- the most of all the kids. Even though Daddy was very cruel to me, he also loved me and I don't know about his feelings, but I had a very strong love-hate relationship with him. Not sexual. My hate relationship was stronger than my love.
Had my family not had money, I think I would have left them all a long time ago. But I needed help monetarily, because I could not support myself, and I did not know what to do.
Now, I again/still want to leave them all behind. I loathe my sister in law. My sister has always been ambivalent towards me and last Saturday I realized she is an N. She was very sweet and good to me when we were children; but I was very mean to her then. She was terrified of me and my Dad. We were the tyrants then. She was the "sweet one," and I was the "strong one," and I retained me sense of self, of my own identity. She has told me that she never knew, still does not know, who she is. That she had subverted herself and hidden behind sweetness in order to avoid the terrors and physical abuse that I endured. We are both sure that she was not aware that she was doing this, when she was young, of course. My sister has been getting more and more difficult in the last 8-10 years, and she does not take care of herself. She is under constant stress. When she DOES take care of herself, she and I get along well. But now, as most of the time, she is under such stress that her judgment is off, and as such I cannot trust her.
Mother is some sort of N, too. Daddy was some sort of N. My brother is not an N. But he is a mystery man and there is a lot of secrecy in our family. Last Saturday my sister insulted me so badly it was a great shock; she also insulted my sweet, caring, loving Significant Other, who has never known anything like such a family as I have! So I have not spoken to my sister since then (today is Tuesday, and she has tried to contact me, but I have ignored it.)
I admire the many people here who have managed to cut themselves off from their families of origin, or from certain members of their families.
Last month, my sister and I also had a row. That time it was over a very SIMPLE matter in my mother's will, which involved only me. But my sister acted like it also involved her and my brother. I was outraged. I then called my mother and told her I wanted out of her will and to hell with her and her money and I was tired of cow-towing to her and Daddy and their money all these years and forget it all.
But I decided against it, and a few days later called her back and apologized for being rude. She said she didn't think I had been rude. Can you even imaging her saying that??????????????
We are talking about $350,000 in inheritance, for each of us 3 siblings. My mother is 86 years old. But she could live to be 100. Her grandfather lived to the age of 98.
I live on $592.00 per month Social Security Disability. And I think of suicide a lot. But this is a habit since age 10. When my medications are working better, I don't do this. And I have never had a suicide attempt, so please don't worry. I'm just upset now, and the funding cutbacks have me really worried about my mental health services, which keep getting less and less. Oh -- I am the beneficiary of a smaller "special needs trust" (for disabled people) which is from a house I sold, plus $10,000 Daddy gave to each of us. It totals $25,000 and is supposed to last the rest of my life.
Any comments people think would be helpful would be most welcome. I am really angry at my family, and most of all, angry at myself for putting up with them for so many years.
Flo
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jarmac,
If it is any consolation to you, I have been where you are -- all alone. Except my N family which we won't mention (see above post.)
Then I had this wonderful therapist who helped me focus on finding a best friend. We have now been best friends for about 3 years. We knew each other for several years before that. Also, he helped me focus on my interests and build a group around my music. I built up a weekly jam session.
From there, I decided to find a different apartment building to live in, because my other building was so isolated and isolating. I didn't know any of my neighbors.
My new building is very social. We have a community room. I'm friends with several people who live on my same floor. It is a multicultural building and I love having friends of many races, cultures, and countries of origin, and accents.
Also, I have met a man of a different culture from mine and we are in love and have given each other commitment rings. He treats me like a queen, and I love his family and they love me.
All this is the result of about 7 years of intensive therapy, medication, and 15 years of spiritual work. Maybe it would not take everyone as long as it has me, though.
And not everyone would want all the things I wanted and want in my life. My life is very full, too full sometimes. And I still have depressions, ups and downs, and my life is far from easy. But I am not lonely anymore, and I used to be. It sounds like you are not lonely, though. But I just wanted to mention what the turns my life has taken have been, in case you were interested. Please do not think I am trying to impose. :)
Flo
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Oh, Jac, it is so nice to hear from you. I feel like now I have my first friend here. How nice! I am glad you did not think of my post as an imposition -- and that you actually thought of it as an inspiration.
Well, let me tellya -- keep on keepin' on.
Do you have any memories of good times -- or any "spiritual," inspirational, or mystical sense, or intuition when you were a child that life was really meant to be beautiful? Well, I did. That is, I had those feelings a lot. And I have memories of them, and always have.
If you have memories of these things, that will help you. If you don't have memories, maybe you can work on cultivating them. Because I believe all small children have them, to some degree at least. Let me know, k? And if you can't remember, maybe you'd like me to TRY to help you tweak your memory.
So anyway, my intrinsic spiritual sense or whatever it was/is has kept me afloat, through all of this. All this craziness and abuse that I grew up with; all these terrible moodswings and rages and depressions, and so much failure in many areas of my life, and things that don't make sense. I go through times of suicidal thinking, but still, that "will to find out what the beauty of life is really all about" -- to see God in some way? -- somehow brings me around.
That's how I keep on keepin' on. In fact, I have fulfilled just about every life goal I have ever had. Some of them have had to be modified!!! But one I had about given up on, was to ever have a love relationship like the one I have with J.... -- because since it takes two to have a fulfilling relationship, how could I possibly control THAT???? It just seemed like I was doomed to keep picking the wrong guys. But so far, so good with J...
One of the really wonderful things that helps me with J... is that he is a widower. He was happily married for 31 beautiful years. I had always been so sure I would NEVER be interested in dating a widower. I figured that at our age, any widower would have had a "perfect little wifey" who was at his beck and call, and was simpering and overly feminine! And that such a man would be scared to death of me and learn to hate me, even if he were to be fascinated by me, and attracted to me AT FIRST (as men often are). But it turns out that J...'s wife was a very strong -- even bossy -- woman! So he and I get along fine!! He is so virile -- he is not "pu**y -whipped" believe you me! He's like a bull -- like a ram and he could compete with any 25 year old in many ways. If you get what I mean...... So anyway, the fact that he'd had a successful marriage for 31 years, and that his wife and I are at least somewhat similar, gives me a lot of strength. Plus, his life has not been at all easy. His childhood was very hard, he was divorced once after a short marriage and one child, and has overcome many hardships. So he is anything but a spoiled person. He has great personal strength and courage, and is a very successful person in his own very positive ways.
Jac, are you a man or a woman? I am a woman, and I think I already said that.
So, keep on keepin' on, kid, whatever age you are -- a young kid or an older kid!! And by the way -- J.... has only told me one lie! He lied to me for months about his age. He had been lying to everyone about his age!! He told me he was 63. I am 61, so this was PERFECT, as far as I was concerned. But he "got caught" in the first speaker-phone conversation we had with his sister, and we got to talking about families,and age, and stuff.....he started stammering and stuff...well, uh, duh.....I'mmmm.....73 years old. I lied to you because I loved you so much I really wanted to have you and was afraid you would not go out with me if I told you my true age."
His sister said, "Why, J...., that is ridiculous! Of COURSE she would have gone out with you!" And I said, "Welllll, I don't know....maybe I would not have!! I think it is SO COOL that he lied to me!! What a sweet thing to do!!!"
Women HATE men who go with younger women, I think....but....hey....it sure is a lot of fun being the young belle!!!!! (((simpering))) He treats me like "una princessa" and "una rrregnya" (a princess and a queen, in Spanish -- did I say he's NY Rican?) I put the y in regna because I didn't put the ~ tilde in there. Hmmmm ñ oh, THERE it is. Alt+0241 on the number pad. Too small to read, though.
And one other thing, Jac and all, you say "Myfamily was so toxic." Well, mine was, too. And the really weird thing is, my sister and I tried for years and years (as adults) to figure out WHAT IT WAS that was wrong at home. It was like we "could never put our finger on anything specific." Not until I started reading **Trapped in the Mirror,** and all you great folks here's stories, that things began to fall into place as to what, exactly was wrong at home.
Flo :roll:
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I am the daughter of an emotionally and physically abusive mother; I have spent the majority of my life living as geographically far away from her as possible and because of this I have been able to attain a good amount of mental health. The problem is that she, several years ago, inherited her mother's fortune and money is a terrible weapon for a narcissist to wield. I made my choice years ago (left to pursue my own life and health, she never forgave me as my purpose supposedly was to exist as a moon orbiting her earth) knowing the money would be a future issue. I am considering 'letting go' for good in light of a recent conversation with her where she once again reverted to disloyal and cruel discourse. I can let go of any claim I may have to the money although it is hard as I am 52 and am tired from having struggled in that abusive home and struggled to raise my two daughters after my N husband made clear that he loved them but wanted no financial responsiblity for them. I can't sell out now for the money any more than I ever could and my mother is furious to discover this. I always loved my mother despite the heartache but if I release her I have decided for my own peace of mind that it will be done with compassion and a regard for her fragility rather than with anger. If i nail her and give her a painful reflection back I am afraid we will be stuck together for all time in an angry dance in time and I would like to be done with her forever and want never to see her again, either in heaven or in the next lifetime. Thanks for checking this posting out.
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Surf, thanks for your post -- it rang a bell for me, loud & true. Survival is the reason for stopping the abuse. Money dangling as a temptation is always a biggee -- my NQueenmother is a master at that one. While it would be nice to have lots of money and not have to worry so much about finances, I have made it thus far figuring it out on my own and I guess I can go the rest of the way. I see no reason to sell my soul now. After a dream I had last night and after reading your post (even though you may not have meant the same thing) I now realize that this sense of "why can't I forgive her?" is not what that feeling is. It's not about forgiveness, she just simply will not stop the abuse and I just closed the door on it so that she can't come in and hurt me. All she had to do was stop abusing me, but she wouldn't. I provided marvelous meals for her insatiable appetite. It has taken so incredibly long to figure things out, I vacillate between fury at myself for trying so hard for so long and wasting those precious years to feeling relief that it's over. As far as seeing her in heaven, I don't know. My heart tells me that heaven will be eternal and complete peace, a non-stop smile and sense of contentment and the warmth of unconditional and powerful love -- so there is the answer.
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:) Thank you, surf, and Discounted Girl, for your posts after mine. I am also coping my post about the inheritance issue over on surf's new thread about inheritance matters.
Flo