Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board

Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Kelly as guest on June 24, 2006, 11:14:59 PM

Title: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Kelly as guest on June 24, 2006, 11:14:59 PM: Hello Everyone!! It has been so long since I have been here. Maybe I am getting better so I haven't had to log on and vent. But it is time again. I have been lying in bed crying and so/.........................some of you may remember that I have worked with my Nmom for 12 years. We had a major blow up about six years ago and it really helped..........even though she would diagnose me as unstable, etc. I realize that without the major blow up I would be dying of cancer or something major like that - my doctor said I NEEDED to get it out or it would literally eat me alive!!

Anyway, so our business which hasn't made a penny for ten years is finally making a profit. We hired a gal who is great at budgets and accounting and she has single handedly turned the business around. So at the first of the year we hired my aunt who had been fired from the job that she took over for my Nmom when she retired. When they let her go she came to us immediately and didn't even try for another job. We all had real high hopes for her!!1

Then out of the blue, she and my Nmom suddenly think our bookkeeper is too big for her britches. I, on the otherhand have told both of those women that we need to give credit where credit is due!! All of a sudden I realize that my aunt is basically worming her way into the family business and is coming and going as she pleases just like my mother and I do (we are co-owners.............) but if I start to put her in her place my Nmom defends her and progressively is more defensive towards the bookkeeper who has turned out business around. Well, I told my aunt that if she and my mom ran this gal out of her I hereby REFUSE to do the bookkeeping!!!! I am so furious I don't know what to do. I do not want anything to do with my mom and I don't want anything to do with my aunt!! But you have to understand that I always thought that my aunt was some poor abused girl who had to live under my mom's shadow (and she has) but now I realize she is almost as egotistical as my mom!!

I am beside myself with grief and anger!!

I found a new book from a Christian perspective and it is called "Enough About You, Let's Talk About Me!" by Les Carter. He doesn't shove the Christianity down your throat and I am going to give it to my bookkeeper to read!! I suggest it to all of you, too!!

Help!! Kelly (hey bunny and flower and all the rest of you that I haven't talked to in months!!)
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on June 24, 2006, 11:19:54 PM: Hi Kelly,
Just support...as you don't know me, but I'm here.

It sounds so good that you see so clearly.

I hope you can defend both the bookkeeper and your interest in the business successfully.

Almost sounds to me like it's time for an ultimatum to your mom, but only if you're ready for that.

Best of luck with this trying situation...I know others will chime in with more solid help.

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on June 24, 2006, 11:29:01 PM: I remembered my sign in!!! Thanks Hops for the immediate response!!!!! I just have always had a great relationship with my aunt!! We have kind of talked about my Nmom and all of her controlling ways. But the minute Aunt came into the office she started kissing my Nmom's butt and the bookkeeper as said to me that my aunt "knows who is buttering her bread!!" So the bookkeeper really kind of blew it because when my Nmom and me were on vacation and my aunt was there alone with the bookkeeper, the bookkeeper was rude to aunt. She should have never done that because she doesn't understand the whole dynamic going on in my family. I told her she didn't realize that she worked for a N and that my aunt is exibiting some of the very same behaviors!!! My aunt immediate went to my Nmom and "tattled" on the bookkeeper!! The bookkeeper and I have been making decisions for a very long time behind my mom's back - we know that without her we can run a better business. Now my aunt is getting in the way!!! I am just so scared and want to run again!! I cannot believe that I have to deal with more dramatics after we had such a major upheaval a few years ago - everything had settled down. My mom called me today and I just won't answer the phone - I just am so done with her and her "stuff!!"
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Portia on June 25, 2006, 10:51:52 AM: Hi Kelly and good to see you again!

Well from good, supportive Aunt to demon Aunt in one move eh? I’m so sorry. Seems she was only listening and supporting you for her own needs, maybe. Which is sad but: you’ve survived thus far and without you and the new book-keeper, where would the business be?

I could see an ultimatum – if the book-keeper goes, then so do I.

Who’d run the shop? What does Aunt contribute to this business? Could she manage without the two of you?

What a messy situation. What exactly are the positions here: is your Aunt in charge of you and the other woman? Does she have final says on things?

And how are you otherwise?
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: lightofheart on June 25, 2006, 10:59:29 AM: Hi Kelly,

I'm miles out of my depth here, no head for business/money, etc. Sound like this is more about family dynamics than business, though?

Might it be helpful if there was a good way to bring you Mom back around to the positive business aspect of things vs. the emotional? Hate to say it, especially if you've been close to your aunt, but I hear some possible divide and conquer stuff going on here?

For example, could you run a report of the business' in the red numbers before the bookkeeper came on and in the black numbers after? And gently remind Mom that it may be worth keeping those cold hard financial facts in mind during her dealings with the bookeeper?

Just a thought. Hope you're taking good care.

LoH
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on June 25, 2006, 02:04:10 PM: OK, I appreciate all the input. It's like this..................some of you might remember that my mother is loaded. We have run the business with smoke and mirrors for 10 years. We need cash flow, my mom puts the money into the business.

My aunt was hired to be on the management team. The bookkeeper and one other gal and my aunt are on the team. I am above them and my mom is above me. Mom is getting forgetful and forgets that we put bookkeeper in charge of the back room team. Now my aunt is in charge of Human Resources so both my mom and my aunt are saying how that means that aunt is in charge of ALL personnel. Well, she doesn't have a clue!! Plus she just started on January 1 and has already taken a week off and is taking another week off in July. So two weeks off in the first seven months.

People go to the bookkeeper because she is there all the time. Meanwhile my mom and aunt are off to some kind of training every month or so. My aunt hasn't "earned" the respect of the people but "demands" it because of her position.

So here is the dynamics in a nutshell. My family is always yelling about getting respect. My old grandma and her husband would throw fits because of the lack of respect the younger generation showed them. But they would have temper tantrums and no one would show them respect!! So now my aunt is doing the same thing.....................they owe her respect because of the position - not for what she does for the business. Bookkeeper, on the other hand, has earned it!!!!

So bookkeeper and I have had a conversation and we are both backing off. Bookkeeper says she'll just sit at her desk and do accounting and my aunt and mom can make all the decisions. I think I'll play the same game. I'll say things like "Aunt and Mom want to be in charge - let them!! Go see them with your problems!!" Funny thing is when they have questions they cannot answer they will come to me!! (and believe me, that's most of the questions......................) Both of them have come from a business where everyone below them were independent contractors.........they worked out of their homes. So now they know all the "theory" of running a business but don't have a clue about the nuts and bolts.

My mom will be able to see that I am disconnected. I am so done with her. I will just silently do my job. Not say a word at the meetings. Let them think they are running things................

But by the way, I really cannot stand my Nmom and my aunt is irritating me..................it's not that I hate her (yet) but I am just watching shaking my head realizing that she is just kissing my mom's butt to take over the business and have security and be able to come and go as she pleases!! It makes me sick. You wait, within a year my aunt will be making some serious money!! My mom will give her the raise not based on what she brings to the business but because she needs to take care of the poor little thing!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: adrift on June 25, 2006, 07:05:20 PM: FAmily and business, that's a tough combination. Sounds like your aunt is really worming her way in to the monetary security and is only looking out for herself. Not that it's any of my/our business, but I hope that for the future your mom has everything lined up in a will and that you know what that is so you'll know where you stand. Sounds like if the will isn't airtight, your aunt may become even more of a problem in the future.

My mom wasn't loaded, but my parents had a nice amount saved up and I kissed butt for many, many years in order to be able to inherit their $ when they passed. I am an only child, but if I had ever made them really mad, they probably would have done something else with their money. And it wasn't easy to keep my mouth shut for all those years, but I'm glad now that I did. And not only because of the money, also because I don't have too to many regrets lingering because of what I said and did. Course nothing I ever did was good enough for my dad, but that's almost besides the point.

I wish you luck. Keep on coming here to vent. :)

Adrift
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on June 26, 2006, 04:23:16 PM: Adrift: I am glad you said that. In the past people have told me that I need to cut ties with Nmom regardless of the money. Something inside of me just makes me endure all the BS because I know in the end I will inherit some money. Now, my brother is sure that my aunt is doing everything in her power to weasel her way into getting some of the "stuff." A cabin in the mountains is the highest prize that my aunt is positioning herself for. That is more important to everyone than the money is because it has been in the family for 65 years and we all have spent a good deal of our lives enjoying it every summer!! My mom bought it from grandparents so aunt grew up there, too. It is a very messy thing!!

As far as the business goes, it really isn't worth anything right now. It is a high volume business but is in debt up to our ears. So the only thing my aunt is positioning herself for is a nice paycheck since she has no retirement saved up. She actually said to me that when her husband's parents die, they will retire...........a bit like vultures. But then again, aren't I if I put up with the stuff in order to get money later??? Actually she probably looks at me and thinks I am a spoiled brat. I get a good paycheck and chose not to go in today because both teenagers were tied up and I got to stay home with my 11 year old. I wish I could do that everyday. My heart is at home, not at work.........................

So the comment about "nothing I ever did was good enough for my dad" YES!! That is exactly it. Nothing I can do will ever be enough. I'm telling you that "Enough About You, Let's Talk About Me" is such a good book. It identifies the behaviors in the first half and then helps you to deal with the Ns in the second half. It gave me great pleasure to give it to the bookkeeper to read!! She doesn't really have to stay and deal with Nmom but she might if she realizes that she'll never get a "atta girl" but she'll be paid well and be able to come and go as she pleases. (That was the best benefit we gave her - she comes in early....leaves early.......gets her 40 hours in but does it on her time sort a speak!!!)

I am realizing that my dad, my brother and myself are the only people my mom never defends......it's everyone else!! But that is another story and enough to get me going off the deep end!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: adrift on June 27, 2006, 09:56:49 PM: I don't think you're acting like a vulture. Usually parents leave the lion's share of their wealth to their children and for those of us with difficult parents, we just have to work harder jumping through the hoops to ensure we get that inheritance. There were many times I wanted to scream, tell my mom how crazy she was acting, etc.... but by the time I really got to the point to do that, I already had so many years invested that I didn't see the sense in "blowing it". Besides, nothing I could have said or done would have helped or changed my mom. The few times I kinda stood up to her, we didn't speak for a while and then later she acted like everything was fine. Her reality and my reality were very dissimilar and she didn't have the ability to see my reality, so I played the dutiful daughter to get what I felt was rightfully mine. Actually, I can feel sorry for her now, now that I know way more about her past than she ever wanted me or my dad to know (he never knew). I knew she had lots of skeletons because no one is as secretive and strange as she was unless they're hiding something. What I discovered blew me away, and I'm sure I haven't found out about it all, but the trail is cold and records were kept years ago like they are today. So now I can have peace and I got the money. Fighting with her wouldn't have helped anything. My choices were to either stay and struggle or walk far, far away. I stayed and struggled and now I'm glad I did.

I actually find comfort, now, in the fact that she died (long struggle with cancer) without knowing how I felt about her because now that I know her past, I know she would never have understood where I was coming from if I had confronted her and she would have died with even more worry and sadness on her mind. I've thought many times that God made me strong because my mom needed for me to be. She could never have handled any other kind of child, she just didn't have it in her to nurture. See, she had already lost three kids before me (one was put up for adoption when mom was young, one due to a miscarriage and another died due to hydrocephaly) and those situation combined with her childhood and things that happened before she met my dad, made her a nervous wreck and emotionally unstable and emotionally unavailable, not to mention downright mean on a regular basis.

As for my dad, well, in the Karpman triangle, he is the Persecutor and I was his Victim. I was never good enough. That has gnawed at me for so many years, (like maybe ALL MY LIFE) and I've finally been able to let it go. He was the last to die and he died letting me know he was disappointed in me, he even left that message on a cassette tape. What he actually said on the tape was, "When your in-laws are old and you go to their house, don't walk in and say 'Is there anything I can do?' ". Point being, that that was what I did at his house everyday after mom died and I wasn't very heartfelt in it, I really wasn't, but I had a lot of issues with my dad. He had a lot of issues with me too but we never discussed any of it, it just simmered a long. He left 4 cassettes with info about what to do with what, including his funeral which meant I had to listen to the first one the night of the day he died :x (that's almost like abuse from the grave ) and with information. Let me tell y'all, don't leave cassettes that your kids have to listen to immediately after your death, it's cruel.

Well, enough rambling. Hang in there Kelly. I know it's hard.

Adrift ( but close to land)
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: gratitude28 on June 27, 2006, 10:02:21 PM: Oh adrift,
I can't believe your father left you cassettes with instructions... Wow, what a control freak. Maybe it made him feel that he had some control over his death??????
You are doing so well and making so much progress in becoming healthy and understanding what is good and right.
Love, Beth
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on June 27, 2006, 11:03:41 PM: Well, I wouldn't put it past my mom to have directives for me and my family after she dies. I think my brother and I will get a good share of the inheritance but I also know mom doesn't trust us so she'll already divide out what she wants to give to our kids. She'll also give some to her siblings. I wouldn't put it past her to stick a knife in and turn it from the grave either. Kind of "Mommy Dearest" sort of stuff. But I guess I can probably control how much she sticks it to me by trying to be civil. And then if she does stick it to me, I may write a book or something!! 8)

But, the bad news is she is a control freak. And she will do anything to control the situation. Dead or alive. I cannot allow myself to kiss her butt but I can try to be civil.

The best thing I can try to do is make my own business successful. For these past twelve years I have truly endured a narcissistic, self absorbed, ego maniac. I have noticed some alzheimers type symptoms from her so it has been interesting watching this women who thrives on being the center of attention lose her edge. In June we went to a weekend business thing and they asked me to be on a panel. I knew she loved that kind of thing so I suggested she be a part of it. Well, she WAS nervous and sat me down and interviewed me on the topic at hand. She took extensive notes and then I watched her squirm during the panel discussion. It gave me some kind of perverse delight to watch her struggle. Then at the end of the panel several people came up to her and congratulated her on a job well done. Suddenly her posture grew about a foot and I swear a monster came out. She has been walking around work talking like she knows it all. Our bookkeeper told me I shouldn't do that again because it gives Nmom a false sense of her importance and how much she really knows!!! It backfired on me!!

So I appreciate what you are saying adrift. Again, so many people told me in a former discussion that the only way to be truly free is to get away and not look back. I believe the best way for me is to learn how to not reacte to her stupidity. The other day she asked me if everything was ok (it wasn't) but I told her in no uncertain terms that everything was just fine!!!!!!! And today she said something like "sometimes I just want to throw up my hands and run away..................." (this after I told her I was tired of being the one who had to do all the computer stuff..............) I didn't even blink an eye and then asked her another question as if she didn't say a sarcastic word to me!! Touche Kelly!! You did it!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: gratitude28 on June 27, 2006, 11:13:46 PM: Good job Kelley!
It sounds like you are getting control. I know what you mean... I would write my mother real letters about my news before. If I told her about something good, she made it out to be that I achieved something becasue someone "liked me." If I talked about something I didn't want to do, she would say how she always LOVED doing the exact same thing. If I had an issue with my husband, she flew off the handle and was sure I was going to leave him. So, now I write letters the way that was suggested to me here on the board... Dear Mom, The weather's nice. We are fine. How are you." That's it. And I am learning (slowly) to gloss over the ridiculous remarks she makes. I still get the urge to react, but I have been good about avoiding the subjects and I feel almost clinical towards her. Honestly, when I started figuring this all out, I desperately wanted to set her off, just for the Hell of it. I still haven't done that, and I am asking for the serenity not to need/want to do that when I see her. I still have lurking anger, in spite of working hard to focus on good.
Thanks for sharing your story. It really hit a chord with me and allowed to me to dig into some thoughts I have been having.
Beth
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on June 27, 2006, 11:45:46 PM: Dear Beth,

Before I began to deliberately underreact (or react the way you would to be polite to a person you don't have any interest in) and to adopt the everything's fine and oh my, there's weather outside where the weather is...attitude, I had rageful thoughts toward NMom that scalded me inside.

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: adrift on June 27, 2006, 11:53:52 PM: Quote from: gratitude28 on June 27, 2006, 10:02:21 PM
Oh adrift,
I can't believe your father left you cassettes with instructions... Wow, what a control freak. Maybe it made him feel that he had some control over his death??????
You are doing so well and making so much progress in becoming healthy and understanding what is good and right.
Love, Beth

Yes, he was a control freak. He left a few written instructions too, but also left it that in order for me to know all he wanted done, I had to listen to the tape.

One time he was having a really bad breathing spell (and probably some angina too, he'd already had 2 heart surgeries prior to this) and needed to go to the ER. The VA hospital was an hour away and that's where he wanted to go because it was free. He left his house on the way to the hospital (READ: He shouldn't have been driving himself) and I ran him down about a block or two away and he pulled over and I told him to move over and let me drive. He was really struggling to breath. He wouldn't do it!! He said for me to get in and ride with him!! I told him to MOVE OVER and let me drive him and again he refused and was getting really mad with me and the whole time was struggling to breath and I told him I would not ride with him, that it was not safe. In my mind I was deciding that my 3 kids and DH were more important obligations and that I wasn't going to chance dying while riding with him if he should pass out while driving. So I let him go on alone, although he gave me those "looks". I had to, I had other obligations that were higher than him and his ego. He made it to the ER, but when he walked in they grapped him and sent him back, took his oxygen saturation reading and it was 65!!! For those of you who don't know, a normal oxygen saturation is anywhere from 95-100. The nurses chewed his butt out for driving in like that and he never did it again. I think it scared him good.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: gratitude28 on June 28, 2006, 12:04:17 AM: adrift GOOD FOR YOU.

You know, I was so sick for such a long time, that I would allow myself to be in harm's way rather than risk "hurting someone's feelings." I won't even go into all the details here, but I can tell you it's one thing I work on with my kids... teaching them to respect themselves and not to ever put themselves in harm's way. No one is that important. Especially if doing something so horrible frivolous.

Love, Beth
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: adrift on June 28, 2006, 12:08:45 AM: Thanks, Beth.

Kelly, didn't mean to hijack your thread.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on June 28, 2006, 08:32:23 PM: No worries about highjacking!! I have always liked the way these threads twist and turn - except when people start fighting. But I have always said that when you read an email or a thread you NEVER know the intent or the tone of the statement. It is easy to read into other people's thoughts.

Anyway, one thing happened today which irked me so I kind of got my mom back. She had taken pictures while at my dad's family reunion in Jersey. I said something like "Oh, I hate having my picture taken!!" So the first picture I saw I liked the way I looked and I said, "Yea!! Finally a picture where I look good." She said, "Yeah, you look pretty good in that one!!" So I said "Pretty good? Pretty good!!?" Well then today she had come in from the hairdresser and one of the girls at work said, "Hey your hair looks great!!" And I said, "Yeah, it looks pretty good." touche!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: gratitude28 on June 28, 2006, 08:58:51 PM: Hey Kelly,
Funny you brought up the picture thing... my mother likes to take pictures of me at my worst. She thinks it is funny. She will "sneak" one if she can. After I had my thyroid out and gained a temporary 40 pounds, she kept trying to take pictures of me. I told her I wasn't feeling my best, but she did it anyways. And, like I have said here before, she will go back and pick out pictures when I am thin to show everyone on the websites and such. She doesn't take pictures to remember me... she does it to prove what I look like. I am just forcing myself to let people take pictures of me more regularly (I put myself in the position of cameraman to avoid it) because I know my kids will want to remember me... warts and all.
Love, Beth
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kelly as guest on June 29, 2006, 01:32:03 PM: Well, remember, the N has to be the best. My mom is much thinner than I am. I live in a chubby body because she has cursed me my whole life with words like "fat fat" and "dumplin".........she on the other hand has had three facelifts, a tummy tuck and I don't know what else...........I just kind of caught her at the others. I am trying desperately to get rid of those negative images in my mind so I can rise above all the shame and cursing!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on June 29, 2006, 07:44:38 PM: Why do some women want to destroy their daughters?
Is it just as bad between fathers and sons?

I guess it is...
:(

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Certain Hope on June 29, 2006, 08:23:33 PM: Seems like some women project every characteristic/ trait that they hate or fear about themselves onto their daughters and then set about wiping out the "enemy" :? Some don't rage or nitpick, they just apply the cold shoulder and isolate their victim. Either way, it's demoralizing and abusive.

Hope
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on June 30, 2006, 10:54:06 AM: Well we all know that is it very important that a narcissist have all the glory and all the spotlight. Then if you couple that with a horrible upbringing and the generational things that go on in families, you have a real monster!! My grandfather didn't have a nice thing to say about anyone. Now I watch my mother doing the exact same thing. Funny thing is that she was real high up in a Direct Sales company for years. When she walked into a room it was as if Princess Diana had arrived. She absolutely thrived on that. It was a perfect business for a N because she worked out of her home. No one really worked with her on a day-to-day basis so no one really got to know the "ugly" side of her. After she retired from that job my aunt took over for her. I don't know that my aunt got the same accolades that my mom did, but she was "in charge" and well thought of. So now they are both working in a business where their idiosyncracies are exposed for the employees to see on a day-to-day basis. Their real colors come out. My mom expects the same kind of adoration from the employees and doesn't get it, so she does the same thing to them as she does to me. She always points out the bad in their departments. NEVER even mentions the great things they are doing. When someone in our store is selected to teach a class at our international convention, or to serve on a board, and she isn't, suddenly they are on her hit list. I was selected to teach three classes at our convention and I know she hates that!!! Back to the story about me letting her be on the panel to kind of sabotage her and then some positive reinforcement and she's back riding high!!! Aunt thrives on Approval and so when the bookkeeper "corrects" her she tattles to my mommy. I cannot keep doing this!! It makes me crazy. It's like a self fullfilling prophecy. I am constantly put down by my Nmom - therefore my self esteem suffers and I continue to feed this fat and ugly body to somehow fit the mold that my Nmom has set for me!! I know it in my mind but for some reason I just can't seem to break free from the condemnation!!!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 02, 2006, 03:16:38 PM: Well, Jacmac: It goes like this. When I get my new business off the ground and am making as much as I do now, I am out of there. Problem for me is my job (even with my mom) is the lesser of two evils. I quit once because it was so intolerable. I went to another company and when I was in training I thought it was going to be a good fit. I got married right before I changed jobs. Well, the new job wanted me in by 9:30 am and I worked most days until 9:30 pm - couldn't even go home (two blocks) for dinner with my family. I worked every Saturday and Sunday. My job now is 9 am to 3 pm and I get paid a lot. So you see, when I put the two together my job with Nmom was a better fit for my family (maybe not for my psyche - but for my family.)

So now I have decided that the best defense is to totally back off. Like yesterday, my Nmom called at 5 pm and I didn't pick up. She didn't leave a message. I think she is getting "vibes" from me. I used to work with her every day. Went to church with her and out to eat after church - every week. We would eat dinner together. Well, anyway, we went on a vacation a couple of weeks ago and I told my dad I would not go if we didn't take two cars because I didn't want to be trapped in a car with the both of them (fighting and such.........) The trip would have been a disaster if I hadn't set that boundary. My new boundary is to totally sever my relationship with my Nmom outside of work except on rare occasions. I have pretty successfully severed the emmeshment with her(which my mom has used to control, etc...............) but time to grow up and live outside of her orbit. This saying to her "I do not think you are a very smart woman for alienating our bookkeeper - but rather than have a knock down dragged out fight with you, I choose to not talk with you at all!!!"
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 04, 2006, 02:33:26 PM: My children are all out of town for the holidays. Two are with their father and the other is with her boyfriend. I cannot tell you how sad I am. I guess I was really looking forward to the break and have just been vegging out while they have been gone. One of the management team at work resigned so the bookkeeper and I thought this would be a great time to rearrange the management team to get aunt out of the job she is doing and put her into a more administrative role (which she is better at!!) I suggested it to Nmom and of course, she defended aunt. Not that I have anything against aunt - just that she isn't working out the way we all anticipated!! So anyway, I miss my girls. I am going to a convention with both Nmom and aunt on Friday. A whole week with them!! I cannot do it!! My anxiety and sadness are overwhelming me. I can feel the frown on my face!! I mean............I cannot smile. I am not PMSing. I am just so sad right now. Maybe because I realize that I am living in the midst of hopelessness along with voicelessness!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: lightofheart on July 04, 2006, 04:40:47 PM: Hi Kelly,

Your work situation sounds like a stressful nightmare to bear. Painful, bad for your self-esteem, a matter of swallowing emotional sh*& daily. I can't imagine how exhausting this would feel. I hope the love and support of your other family is pulling you through.

I think Jac asked a really important question:

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I keep saying to myself, "But how much is your peace of mind worth?"
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Do you really think the money is worth what it's costing you? More than your self-esteem, and daily happiness?

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I cannot keep doing this!! It makes me crazy. It's like a self fullfilling prophecy. I am constantly put down by my Nmom - therefore my self esteem suffers and I continue to feed this fat and ugly body to somehow fit the mold that my Nmom has set for me!! I know it in my mind but for some reason I just can't seem to break free from the condemnation!!!!!!
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Twelve years of this? Personally, I couldn't last a week. It sounds like your Mom has tremendous power over how you see yourself, and you hold her responsible for your weight. I'm not sure how that will change, short of some distance between the two of you?

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I have pretty successfully severed the emmeshment with her(which my mom has used to control, etc...............) but time to grow up and live outside of her orbit.
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Do you really think this can happen while you're under her control daily at work? We all need to vent once in a while. iimho, venting means letting it out so it blows away. If every day at work requires 'venting' then you're not letting it out; you're stuck in a loop.

You've said you're scared, and beside yourself with grief and anger. What kind of a toll does it take to live with that? I don't mean to scare you, but I have concern for you, Kelly, and especially your kids. This kind of stress can have lifelong health repercussions.

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My anxiety and sadness are overwhelming me. I can feel the frown on my face!! I mean............I cannot smile. I am not PMSing. I am just so sad right now. Maybe because I realize that I am living in the midst of hopelessness along with voicelessness!
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Maybe this would be a good time to listen to yourself, what feels best in your heart and head for you. It sounds like a good part of your day is spent with people who encourage your voicelessness. What do you most want for Kelly, right now?

I'm not a parent, I don't know the pressure of trying to provide for children financially. But I can't imagine it would be good for them if you drive yourself into the ground waiting for an inheritance, in the end, that's contingent on your mother's whim.

imho, all we have is the present, today. For what it's worth, I'd wish you happy days and a peaceful heart now, with your children.

Good thoughts to you Kelly,
LoH

PS - if it helps to know where I'm coming from, I lost my inheritance/a trust fund from my GM by asking for a healther relationship with my N. father. At 32, I was diagnosed with a chronic illness largely brought on by work-related stress. I only regret the latter.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 06, 2006, 12:38:27 PM: All such good advice. But I cannot find a way out. I have tried and the alternatives have always been worse for my family than staying. But I have to say that it has been so hard to bear all these years that there is probably some physical thing brewing deep within my body due to all the stress I have been through my whole life!!

Part of me says I just want to move away. Start over. Be as far away from my Nmom as possible. But can I do that to my kids??? My Nmom is a better Gma than she ever was a mom.

And then I think that God cannot allow me to go through this indefinitely. He HAS to provide a way out for me!!! Sometimes I think it will take the death of my Nmom for me to finally be free from her condemnation, lack of approval, etc. Not that I want her to die but when she does I will probably have a big sigh of relief!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: lightofheart on July 06, 2006, 03:34:51 PM: Hi Kelly,

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And then I think that God cannot allow me to go through this indefinitely. He HAS to provide a way out for me!!!
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This is great to know, that you have God to talk to about it. Always keeps me from feeling alone, even on the worst day.

There's really no advice I meant to give, or could. Just wanted to express concern. You sound like you're living with a lot of pain.

Hope the good things keep pulling you through.

Best,
LoH
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 16, 2006, 06:26:41 PM: Hello All! Just got back from a convention with guess who? Nmom and aunt. Stayed a whole week with them. 24/7 Well, one thing I learned over the last week is that my self worth does NOT depend upon my Nmom. Yes, I have discovered that there is never a time on any day of my life that my Nmom gives me ANY words of encouragement. In fact, if I say anything (this is stupid - I just told her that she likes to wear blouses which cross over in the front - an argument insued................... we were shopping and I saw a blouse similar to many she already has ) she will disagree. Then I heard a speaker at the convention which just confirmed all I know to be true. If I ever want my Nmom to change, I will die waiting. SHE will never change and I have to just deal with her stubbornness....................the stupidity. I almost want to say I hate her but it is just because of the futility of knowing that she won't change and there is NOTHING I can do about it.

I went to a cabin yesterday and a friend of mine and his wife own it. Her father bought it for them. Just because he has money and is nice. My mom has money but she would never in a million years do something like that for me. Oh yeah, she gives when I ask. But she won't bless. I guess it fuels her need to feel important. Something about having people come to her in their times of need. Yes, mom the HERO!!!

So I am vowing to just do everything I can do to protect myself from her. And I have also decided that everytime she says ANYTHING that in the least makes me feel less than or inferior - I am going to catch her doing it at that moment and rebuke her right then and there!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on July 16, 2006, 06:59:33 PM: Hi Kelly...
I live with my NMom, and I was obsessed with her not being kind, maternal, generous...all that.
I exhausted myself wanting her to be other than what she is. It was an obsession. I thought more about her, was eaten up with anger, grief, hatred and frustration, over her...more than anything.
Then I accepted it. I drew boundaries so she couldn't toy with me any more (one big fight)...and ever since, it's a changed relationship. I even love her in a new way. (Oddly, it's coming back, too. She's not a competitive enemy any more. Sort of like a resigned old woman who belatedly recognizes me as another woman in the foxhole of life. Still an N, but she's letting her best side leak out too. Doesn't have the energy to try to suppress me anymore, and seems less interested. So, we cope together.)

I get my mothering from myself, my friends, my church, my affectionate dog, this board, my community.

Where do you get your mothering? If you aren't being loved...WHERE CAN YOU GO TO BEGIN THE PROCESS OF FINDING SOME NURTURING FOR YOURSELF? (Serious question.)

One of the biggest steps I took, years ago, was going to women's support groups. There, I found the love and support of women. That did so much to help me begin healing my losses (over not having felt loved by the primary woman, my mother). Then I started six of them, and passing on the nurturing became as joyful as getting it had been.

I think it's really important for you to try on this thought: IT IS DOABLE. TO BECOME HAPPY IN SPITE OF EVERYTHING THAT HAS GONE BEFORE. It happens all the time, to people in even greater pain and misery than you and me. It does happen, because it is doable. You are up to it more than you give yourself credit for.

I truly believe that just being brave enough to try on that thought, day after day, insisting that you say it to yourself...might be all you need to get started in a new direction.

Hope you keep posting, you are not alone.

((((Kelly)))))

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 16, 2006, 09:10:50 PM: Thanks, Hops!! For the hug AND encouragement. I picked up a book in my library called "Love Hunger." A book about eating disorders, etc. which talks about how we eat to fill the void from the lack of love and encouragement. As I was reading through it it brought tears to my eyes. It talked about getting into a support group (specifically Overeaters Anonymous.......) but also talked about finding a women friend to "mother" you. It's hard to find someone like that. I have a best friend who is about 8 or 9 years older than I. I wonder if she could kind of mother me. I hate to lose that give and take thing we've got going. Probably would like to find some lady at least 20 years older who could understand my pain. I am at a loss because most of those ladies are probably my mom's friends and I have concluded that to my mom and aunt, it is what appears to be the truth that is important to them - not the truth. I find myself exposing them in public - like when someone said my mom looks more like my sister than mother and I said something like - "See goes to great lengths to look that young!!"" (Exposing the plastic surgery - the THIRD facelift!!) Well, I have decided tomorrow to tell my mother that I am going to mirror her behavior back to her. When she has an idea that I do not agree with I am going to say "That's insane!!" Or some other invalidating thing. B ut what I am going to do it TELL her I am going to do it. I am going to say, "Mother, I am going to purpose to respond to you the way you respond to me." "And, when you invalidate me or make me feel stupid - no matter who is standing there - I am going to say - "Did you mean to invalidate me by saying XYZ?"
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on July 16, 2006, 10:48:22 PM: Hey Kelly,
It just sounds enmeshed. You're spending your precious energy and brain-time plotting your next strategy on the battlefield. It consumes you and you have a precious life.

Amazingly, there is more to it that your deep battle with your mother. If you think of the snappiest comebacks, etc....it's momentary. But...if you start working through your issues and your pain in therapy and in support groups, or whatever setting works for you--you begin to change your life, not just your dialogue.

You can do this. You can heal and begin to release the obsession with her. And then, she won't have the power you are now giving her.

As to finding good women mentors...again, women's support groups exist in most communities. You really need to get OUT, I think.

Keep at it! BTW, the book sounds GREAT and so is your thinking about OA...bravo, bravo! This is the sort of direction that saves and transforms people. First steps as simple as these get the healing engine going.

You can do it.

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 17, 2006, 10:25:02 PM: Yes, it has always been enmeshed. I have come so far. You wouldn't believe the power my mother had over me for most of my life. I couldn't make a deciion without her approval. It took me blowing up - I mean REALLY losing it to break that kind of control. The fact that I am with her almost 24/7 is what gets to me.

I am doing my Arbonne business and it is coming right along. I need to hit it hard to finally make enough money to walk away. Does anyone know of a job that gives you lots of flexibility AND you make a lot of money? I just need to be able to be a good mom and have enough money to not work with my mom. My husband wishes he made enough that I could stay home!!! Sometimes I think I am doing so well with Arbonne but have had problems getting people to "get it" and try to make their lives better. When they get it, it helps me. So until I get some people who are serious about making some major dollars than I am stuck with mom!

God help me!! And believe me, I have praying that He will help me. I still cannot believe that a loving God would allow me to have such poor self esteem and not help me to rise above!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on July 17, 2006, 10:39:57 PM: Substitute teaching? (Done by 3:00...)
Ummmm...babysitting?
A lot of people are frantic for good childcare...

Hope someone else will have some good ideas for you.
You have business skillls...maybe you could do freelance bookkeeping for small businesses?

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hops on July 18, 2006, 08:58:11 AM: Hi Kelly,
There's a lot about Arbonne on the net...good and bad. I have a friend who's tried it for a few years now. I'll email her and ask how it's going.
To me it smacks of a company that relies on creating an artificial family with evangelical-style training to get reps to sell people a lot of stuff to put on their faces...
bottom line is, the bottom line isn't for the psyched-up Avon ladies (so to speak).

Have you considered other approaches besides that kind of marketing?
How about an EBay business? People can do fantastically well by buying interesting things at rummage sales and reselling them...some make a LOT. And all you need is a digital camera, a white sheet, and the book EBay for Dummies.

Just a thought...
Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 18, 2006, 06:13:29 PM: Great ideas!! Sometimes I think network marketing works for some but not all.............
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on July 20, 2006, 05:42:12 PM: Well, my mom and I had a conversation today and she said she is going to back off (yeah, right!!) I applied to be a traveling trainer for a retail training organization. If they only travel one or two days a week, I think it would be a good job. As long as I make enough money and am not away from my family for a long time.............................I just wish I could have my cake and eat it too!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on July 21, 2006, 12:13:16 AM: Good for you, Kelly!!!

How about just taking it one week at a time?

You're earning your cake, and you'll probably find you like it better even if it's less fancy.

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kelly as guest on July 21, 2006, 10:32:18 AM: Thanks!! I took the day off so I can regroup!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on August 03, 2006, 07:15:42 PM: I thought I would just add to this post............................my aunt went on vacation so I sat my mom down and told her everything I did not like about her and my aunt at work. At first I was apprehensive and I told her so because I said when I am concerned about something she says "Pshaw........" Now isn't "Pshaw" a totally invalidating thing? When you say "Pshaw" to someone doesn't that mean - that is wrong - that is bogus - that is stupid? So anyway I had my conversation and told her I either wanted her to leave or I would leave................so a few days go by and I get an email from her that says "we are going to have to learn to work with each other as long as we are partners and I do not want you to insult me by saying I invalidate you........." I guess I could have endured the email if she hadn't used the word "insult." I insulted her??? She's the one who said "Pshaw" to me..............and it made me mad and I told her it did and she says I insulted her by saying she invalidated me??????
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on August 03, 2006, 11:04:05 PM: Kelly,
A thought to try?.

Your mother does not have the power to invalidate you, unless you give it to her.

She can say Pshaw and you can say:

Pshaw means you are dismissing what I have said, so I will talk to you another time.

(And walk away...). Repeat. With calm. Under-reacting. Calm. You're taking yourself out of something disrespectful. (Just be sure you are courteous while you do it, so you are modeling respect.)

Every single time she says it.

Not all, but it's amazing...some parents can actually learn to change at least some habits.

But what matters more is you learning to not take it in...when she says something insensitive and doesn't appreciate you. If YOU become loving to yourself, do the work of learning how (it IS a real feeling, not an idea)...she can Pshaw until her lips chap and it won't harm you.

What can you change? Your reactions. That is freedom.

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on August 04, 2006, 08:57:34 AM: Whoa, Hops!! THAT was good. I get it. I can confront her invalidation rationally. Love you for saying this. It was like a lightbulb moment. Still her invalidation will hurt a bit...................it's an ugly wound.................taking years to heal. BUT, I like it. My ex husband read a book called "The Art of Verbal Warfare....." or something like that and he was a master at throwing stuff back in my face in a calm manner. It infuriated me. I can only imagine that this will do the same to my mom!

Thanks!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: jordanspeeps on August 08, 2006, 06:59:00 PM: Hi Kelly

Tiffany here. I was just reading your post in Dr. G's thread and you mentioned how things were currently, "us vs. them" right now with you, your mom, your aunt, and your bookkeeper. I tend to be an anxiety-driven worrier about things like this, as I have been in your shoes, in business with my Nmother, that is. I'm trying not to do it [worry] so much anymore and I don't mean to upset you unduly, but my question is: Where do you see things going in the near and not-so-near future with the business? You mentioned the "smoke and mirrors" aspect to it; do you think this will present itself as a problem, eventually?

Has your mother or aunt ever violated your trust or been proven to have a lack of integrity? Business is tough and often we lose sight of what is ethical or for what we are accountable. I would hate for you to bear the brunt of a bitter business battle either between you and your mom or worse, the two of you and some higher authority, like your creditors, unjustly. I'm just curious to know where your head is with the subject. For some reason, I find your story to be on my mind, it's probably because of the similarities, and I think I want to see all turn out well for you. I hope you keep posting.

Take care
Tiff
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on August 08, 2006, 07:57:20 PM: Tiff: Well, I was surprised to see this thread up on the top again....I thought it was a dead horse. Here's the scoop:

My mom is a super-ego..............she was very successful in a career.................made tons of money. My aunt was her assistant. When my mom retired from that company they gave my aunt a piece of my mom's pie and she was in that position for about 15 years. Well, she had been feeling the pressure for the last few years, not cutting the mustard, etc. So she was let go.

She didn't even try to get another job......she came right to us and asked us for a job (red flag................easy way out..........) Wanted to be on the management team.

Well, my mom has always had enough money to put into the business when we were short of cash (it's retail.....) Our sales were great but we just didn't know how to manage a business.

So mom backs off and me and two other ladies ran it last year. It finally made a profit....first time in 12 years. Bookkeeper was very important in that. So we hire my aunt and my mom steps back in and starts acting like a big shot. She walks around saying things like "I can do whatever I want (spend money) I own the store!" Meanwhile aunt is a slacker and the bookkeeper says "she knows who is buttering her bread!!" (meaning her sister - the big shot.....) Bookkeeper resents aunt and lets her know it with jabs, etc. I finally said to bookkeeper - you know, stop pressuring her because she runs right to my mom and whines and mom comes down on bookkeeper. So it has become "us vs them." I even told my aunt today that since she has been there my mom has been posturing to impress her or something. I seriously think my aunt takes this poor me (victim) stance and my mom would put the business in jeopardy to protect her helpless (connving) sister......

Sick!! So I am on a roll in my other business and I just keep praying for patience while I build it because it will give me great satisfaction to go in (with bookkeeper) and say, "OK, girls, run it! Bye!!"
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: jordanspeeps on August 08, 2006, 08:17:58 PM: kelly,

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Sick!! So I am on a roll in my other business and I just keep praying for patience while I build it because it will give me great satisfaction to go in (with bookkeeper) and say, "OK, girls, run it! Bye!!

Well, the best of blessings on this new endeavor. Won't you have such pride and joy to know that your future is not so tied up with your mother's and aunt's. Who knows what will become of them and the business. The way they relate to one another sounds like my mother and one of her sisters who've been in secret competition with one another since they were children. It's odd the way they pretend they don't even care what the other is doing, but somehow they always seem to be "up under" each other. It's like they carry on this charade that they really love each other and my grandmother, but when I'm alone with my mother, all she does is complain about her sister and how she doesn't really do things "right." Sometimes, I think she was raising, or shall I say "grooming" me to be 'better' than my aunt, who used college education, beauty pageants, and creative writing to one-up my mother throughout life. My mother was the nurse, businesswoman, entrepreneur, with a husband and four children and they spent a lifetime competing but in an opposite kind of way. Although my mother never complimented me on good grades or winning pageants or essay contests, she never failed to share a proud moment with her sister, who would often scoff in ignorance.

It seems like your mother and aunt chose to stay close to one another and have taken on roles in order to relate to one another. You can guarantee, they'll be at one another's throats or more subtly, holding secret rage and resentment to one another sometime in the future if not already. I do feel for you, kelly, and it's sad that their childhood drama is playing out to your detriment. But it doesn't have to be a complete wash-out. You'll do well with this endeavor, especially if you are patient, as you mentioned. 40 is the new 30 they say, so you practically have your whole life in front of you, girl! :D

Best to you
Tiff
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on August 08, 2006, 08:48:28 PM: Yeah, I've even heard that 50 is the new 30s.....my gma is 91 and I am 46 so I really do have the second half of my life left.

Well, my aunt is not motivated like my mom.......she likes to ride on my mom's coat tails so she can get some of the inheritance when my mom is gone. Aunt talks poorly about mom but sucks up to mom. Mom has this insatiable desire to protect everyone from ME. I have the desire to protect everyone from HER. But this is the first time that she has worked in a place where people have figured her out and her fascade has been exposed. But she doesn't care - afterall, they are the little people. They mean nothing to her!!! I mean nothing to her. She is only concerned about herself - and now, to protect poor abused aunt. Aunt has worked for use for 7 months. She has taken three weeks of vacation and scheduled them right behind conventions (that she had no business going to but mom wanted to strut her stuff in front of aunt, so aunt had to be there to see how important mom was.............) She's supposed to be in charge of people but she conveniently hides in the back room or takes weeks and weeks off. Funny how she is getting more vacation than the next one..........oh well, I could go on and on and on........
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on August 21, 2006, 06:51:30 PM: Hello everyone!! Rather than start a new thread, since I experienced some trauma today I thought I would vent.........

I told my mom I had a boat load of work to do so to please not pile all of her work on me..........................so a little while longer she asked if I could come into her office and go over some things.................so we went through all the little details that she thinks are so important............we get so much junk mail...............mostly I toss it. She looks at everything and thinks she needs to act on it. So she was asking me about an important decision for our business and I told her, if we keep the bookkeeper than we can go with the less expensive solution because the bookkeeper will keep us in line. If we lose the bookkeeper we have to stay with the more expensive solution because they hold our hands more and we will need that without bookkeeper.

Well, that opened a can of worms. The fight began. I told her, "Did you call me in here to start a fight?" And she said no. Then she started throwing accusations at me, etc. I told her I could talk to any employee I want because I am the GM!! She is the CLASSIC "the emperor has no clothes" or "there is a pink elephant in the room" person. (I think Jac started a thread like that!!) I call it like I see it. She invalidates what I say and blames me. It's funny. I blame her for everything. She blames me for everything. It is a vicious circle. We go round and round and round. Good news is I don't back down. I told her I thought her behavior was arrogant and prideful (and it IS!!!!!) She said something like, "I don't make any money at this job so I reserve the right to make any decision I want for the business." I told her that that statement was arrogant and prideful because if she makes poor decisions for the business than it doesn't matter if she makes much money or not - they are bad business decisions.

So anyway as one person on this board told me "Give it up, give it up, give it up - to God (sorry for those agnostics - but He is the only person I know to give it up to - no comment on all that on this thread.....maybe I'll hop over there and put my two cents in....)
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on August 21, 2006, 07:49:25 PM: No apologies needed for this agnostic!
I'm glad you have a strength and source to give it up to, Kelly.

I am sorry that you and your Mom are in this horrid dance.
It must drain you beyond belief.

Hope you can get some self-nurturing in, and a little escape from it all..

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Certain Hope on August 21, 2006, 10:46:11 PM: (((((((Kelly))))))) Sounds like someone has to stop the blaming and it's not likely to be your mom. That's the sort of adult choice that only a mature grown-up can make 8) Be cool, Kelly... and Amen to giving it to God... He's the only One who can sort this stuff out.

Love,
Hope
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on August 22, 2006, 08:35:10 PM: Well, nmom said, "Maybe we should sell the business......" so I got on the phone and called a man I know would be interested in buying. If I can do enough homework, I may be able to get out of there, sell the business and get a little money - maybe to pay off my house or cars and then? I thought I might wait tables somewhere................I honestly don't care what I do as long as I am able to generate enough cash until my other business gets going..................I can taste the relief in my head!! Maybe that advise to give it up is starting to work!!!!! Thanks, Mud!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Certain Hope on August 22, 2006, 08:51:12 PM: Yeee haaaa.... Kelly :D The sweet, sweet taste of freedom from the whims of N ! You know, I'd drive a clunker (and did for awhile, not to mention carrying and paying off all the mutual credit debt on my own) just to be out from under that burden.
Praying with assurance for the very best outcome for you!

Love,
Hope
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on August 22, 2006, 09:57:49 PM: Hope!! Well, I'm not counting my chickens before they are hatched - that would just be too frustrating because if my nmom thinks for a minute SHE is not in control of the situation, she'll balk.....................so it will probably take a lot of back door tactics to make anything happen...........but I know this man will pay more than the business is worth because he is convinced that our name and our mailing list make us incredibly valuable............and it is more valuable than starting a new store................and he knows it...so we will see. If it is God's will, then it will happen because even God is more powerful than my nmom!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Certain Hope on August 22, 2006, 11:32:04 PM: Oh, I understand that, Kelly...just hoping that you can get free of your end of the business and then it won't matter how many times she might change her mind... you'll be busy doing you own thing! You know, there are so many different options with debt consolidation, reducing overhead, living more simply... it's worth giving up alot if the stress of that N-relationship goes out the window with the rest of the stuff. You can count on your needs being provided for, always.

Love,
Hope
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on August 22, 2006, 11:52:38 PM: WOW.

Kelly!

You just blasted your way out of a thick hard ostrich eggshell!
The rest is details.

I am feel excited for you. I wish you a steady balance and a SECRET inner glow as you tiptoe through the minefield to your FREEEEEEEEEDOMMMMMMMMM on the other side! You just tripped the one wire that turns on a laser that lights a SAFE PATH for you! A few brambles and bruises will not matter, you've got your eyes on the prize!

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on November 01, 2006, 05:52:57 PM: I went and searched for this thread.............I had some trauma today so I thought I would continue on.........................earlier I started (and it ended rather quickly) a thread about Alzheimers. I believe my mom is experiencing the first signs of Alzheimers. EX: a friend of ours died a month ago and another friend came into our business last week and I told him I was sorry about the passing of our friend. My nmom asked what happened to the man? Well, I told her she was the one who told me he died and that other friend agreed and said they had had some correspondence via email regarding his death...................so that was the first time that something as BIG as a death slipped her mind. So I sent her an email asking her to go get tested for Alzheimers because I feel like she is becoming more and more forgetful. She came into my office and basically had to hold herself back from verbally attacking me. Reason is, she is convinced I am trying to convince her that she has A. We got into an argument about the bookkeeper again and I asked her if she came into my office to fight? Last week she seemed geniunely concerned about my kids and was all about me backing off from work and being with them. Today it was, "how are you going to support yourself?" Last week it was, "we could still pay you even if you are not here." And today it is, "we can't sell the business....what would you do?" She is truly a person who speaks out of both sides of her mouth. I NEVER know if I can trust where she is going with ANY topic. She changes her mind (or forgets) daily and then blames me for whatever!!

So me and the bookkeeper are tight. And she is suspicious of our relationship and thinks we are plotting against her. Does anyone know about Alzheimer's?? How about Alzheimers and how it makes narcissism all the worse. I am so afraid that rather than my life getting easier, it will get exceedingly more difficult as her Alzheirmer's progresses. Are Alzheimers patients suspicious??
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on November 01, 2006, 06:09:16 PM: Gosh, Kelly. I don't know.
It might be partly that she's having age-related dementia, but I read recently that some experts thinnk that all early memory loss is related to the processes of Alzheimer's. (In which case, me too.)

I think this checklist may help you:
http://www.alz.org/AboutAD/Warning.asp

I wonder if her intense reaction might also have been upset at hearing that suggestion in an email? It might have been scary.

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on November 01, 2006, 07:04:41 PM: Well, she seems to think that I am trying to CONVINCE her that she has A. She thinks that it is my purpose in life to undermine her and make her look bad. She's a bit paranoid and I have told her so. She hates that. In fact, she hates a lot!! My aunt says she uses the word hate all the time. Thanks for the link......I'm going to go there now!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 10, 2007, 07:46:41 PM: Hey Guys: I know I keep bringing back this thread when a confrontation happens between my nmom and me because it is just a continuation of the same fight and I have to vent.........

So, you may know I am holding my breath about a new job which is my ticket to freedom. Please God - PLEASE!! Anyway, so my nmom has this vendetta against the computer - it is too slow and she hates it. She hates that our sales have gone down at our store. She hates this person. She hates that person. She blames the bookkeeper because the sales have gone down. I said to her that the sales are down because the price of gas is up.....we are at war......the economy is suffering.....it has nothing to do with the bookkeeper. So in a rage, I went into the bookkeepers office and totally unloaded on her. I told her what my nmom had said and she was furious. She told me if I get this job she is walking right behind me. And she is not training anyone without charging a consulting fee. It is insane. My nmom is so delusional that she actually thinks she and my aunt can run the business. No way. Without me, maybe.....but without the bookkeeper? No way!! The word hate keeps popping in my mind and I have to pray to God that that bitterness will go away. I feel bad because I know if me and the bookkeeper leave nmom is in a world of hurt. Oh yeah, I don't think I said that nmom is totally backpeddling on the selling of the business. Par for the course. She's signed up to attend an industry convention in a couple weeks. Didn't invite me.........not that I want to go........
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: isittoolate on January 10, 2007, 08:36:21 PM: Hiya kell

First of all, what we all hear, we must look after ourselves first.

I started on page one here and realized I was out of date, so hopped forward to see why you posted.

You and your mother are still co-owners? Can she buy you out? The both of you must get away from one another!!! You know the N rule...No Contact!

Mom can advertise for other help if you and the bboookkkeeeppeerr leave! I do bookkeeping and I know if I were hit by a mack truck tomorrow, this non for profit organization would be WILD. I do their website too. So I know what you mean.

If N mom is left on her own, she might just understand that she has to sell!

Whatever hell you are feeling is what you have to avoid to live a comfortable life. N mom causes all your stress?

(I have an UZI here!) <tee hee>

You have to do what you have tp do. before you go insame, like............me?

xxoo
Izzy

(http://www.slrkelowna.ca/computerg.gif)
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kelly as guest on January 11, 2007, 09:35:49 PM: "co" is not the correct term......yes, we are co-owners but SHE has to be in charge. She took over when she had to put money into the business (she has money - I don't....) Suddenly it was "her" business and she took all the glory etc. Now, the business sales have gone down and she doesn't take the responsibility for the decline - only for the glory. So now it is everyone elses fault....

The bookkeeper and I work really well together and we talk all the time. That is what made the bookkeeper suspect. It really is my fault because nmom doesn't like or trust me. She has to be in control. Will she buy me out? No. She has to be in control. So it is my turn to be in control of MY life and when I get this new job it will give me pleasure to allow her to run the show. And the bookkeeper is so sick of nmom and aunt that she will walk and they won't know what hit them/.......stupid people!!

Yes, I am PMSing and yes I am pissed!!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on January 12, 2007, 09:49:41 PM: Please help me. Need input or just moral support!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: isittoolate on January 12, 2007, 10:21:58 PM: Hi kell

I still stick with what I said before, and maybe I can add that you have to get out and cut you losses, before you go nuts. You turn on your mother to save yourself.

Even though I am in a position that my daughter turned on me, I see that, in your case, it ought to happen!

Do you agree? or do you think you ought to be loyal to your mother, no matter what?
xxoo
Izzy

(http://www.copwt.ca/images/avoid/WhiteRose.jpg)
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on January 12, 2007, 11:25:45 PM: (((((((((((((Kell)))))))))))))))))

Hang on, hon.
It's coming to a head now that you're closer to a transition, that's all...

You're going to be okay (and so is she), and you will find peace again.

hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 13, 2007, 09:58:45 AM: Hop and Izzy: You are probably the only two people who can stand my rantings!! You guys........a couple of years ago I was at my wits end with nmom and applied for a job. I went through three interviews and they gave it to someone else. So I have gone through three interviews with this one, too. Now I am scared. I wonder if I put out these vibes in the last interviews to sabotage my chances. OR, maybe I am going to get it and he hasn't contacted me yet. Whatever it is......I just want this so badly. I keep praying for God's will but how could he let me get my hopes up and then not get it? Or maybe I am just obsessing. Plus I am PMSing so I think that makes my obsessing all the worse........it's just that if they offer the job to someone else I will literally feel like I was up for parole and then they denied it. It is that bad. I feel like I am in jail. Have you ever seen the Count of Monte Cristo? That's how I feel. I think it will be like when he finally escapes from prison. Jumps off the cliff with handcuffs on! Then he makes his escape and finds treasure and his life is his own!! At the end he kills his foes. I don't even want to kill them - I just want to be away from their captivity. But who knows. Maybe the war will start when I leave. Please. Please. Please. I can't stand the waiting. Then I think God is punishing me for telling the bookkeeper what nmom said. Could it be? Should have a kept my mouth shut? Or is that all a part of the dysfunctional family rules. Don't tell. But does that apply in business????
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 13, 2007, 12:25:17 PM: Hi Kell,

Just wanted to say that I don't think you are ranting and I like your posts. I just don't have enough time or energy to always post responses.

I'd like to post responses to everyone, but, as mentioned, don't have the time and energy to do so.

You're processing events over and over in your mind, questioning and second guessing yourself. I used to drive myself CRAZY doing this and I try to tell myself to stop obsessing because it doen't help me.

I read some where that this type of obsessing is a symptom of being raised in a dysfunctional family.

How about this: Own what you did. Maybe some of it was right and some was wrong, but it's done and over. Now, look to the future and next time you're in a situation, be mindful and conscious of your words and actions.

As for the job, if it happens, great. If not, you will find something else. Just know in your gut that you WILL find something else. You are smart and resourceful. Put your thinking cap on, look at your options, speak to a career counselor. You have options and choices. Write down your options and choices.

I don't want to rain on your parade, but if this job doesn't pan out, what's your next step? Maybe by writing down a plan, you will feel less pressured and anxious.

love,
dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: isittoolate on January 13, 2007, 03:51:42 PM: hi again kell,

When people rant, they just might say something that will help me, so I read.

I obsess as well and it can be so difficult to dismiss that thought from my head
...from Dazed" I read some where that this type of obsessing is a symptom of being raised in a dysfunctional family.

If somethingis forthcoming, I imagine all scenarios so that I can be prepared. I have actual conversations with myself, that even include "No. Erase that. Keep away from that topic".

Job interviews can be scary, but if you are applying for a job, that requires the talents you already have, then it is so much easier to put yourself 'over the top". As scary as I found them, I knew I could always "sell myself" when it came to anything regarding accounting, bookkeeping, payroll, and with no degrees, just on-the-job training for them. Each company has its own way and I was always prepared to say that I was a quick learner for these differences.

One job was doing plant payroll for a company. I was well paid. I had an inside track on the gossip and heard that this company was just a "write-off" for Loblaws. and then I heard that it was closing down in a few months, so I went job hunting again. Another payroll job opened up in that town and I applied, and for the same amont as what I'd been receiviing. I think this horrified them, but I learned later that I replaced the gal who was earning $30.00 a week less than I asked for and was given that when hired, she told me she had said that if they wanted someone good they would have to pay for it.

However i was matched with the top paid gal there--I know because of the payroll records. This "top gal" hated my guts for the longest time but eventually she came to me and told me that I was worth every penny and we became friends.

People are very strange!

Good Luck on your search
Izzy
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 14, 2007, 03:36:03 PM: Izzy, Dazed, Hops and CB..................thanks!! I will be a week since i talked with the RVP tomorrow. The District Manager told me they were going to make a decision in the next week.......that was last week. I have been looking at the phone. Checking both voice mails (even though there is no indication of a message.....) Checking my email. All in hopes of finding a message. I just have to get this job. I know I will be so good. I am afraid some other person is going to swoop in and take my job!! Yes, I am obSESSING!! Thank you for understanding. I have been praying that God would give me some kind of peace. Just need peace!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on January 14, 2007, 04:51:39 PM: Hi Kelly,

How can you talk to yourself, right now in this present moment, to find some balance and calm?

If you haven't ever read the little book Man's Search for Meaning by Victor Frankl, now's the time!

Fingers crossed for you, and also confidence that you can handle reality.
Whatever comes, I know you will learn and keep growing and your life WILL move ahead in good directions...

You may step back or leap ahead but your direction is ALREADY forward, no matter what the news is this week. (Don't set yourself up for terrible disappointment...just try to be ready for delight if the news is good and ordinary disappointment if it's not.) Does that make sense?

Will be thinking of you...
hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 15, 2007, 12:40:59 PM: Ok, so I got gutsy and called the new store. I asked for the District Manager and they said he wasn't in today. I asked her if she knew if they filled the position and she said, "I'm not sure.........." She told me the assistant manager would email the District Manager and took my phone number and my name. The assistant manager is supposed to either call him or email him and tell him to call me!! So at the risk of seeming desperate, I did that. I figured when he calls I would say, "The RVP suggested I go into the store and see if I thought it was a good fit for me as well as you so I was justing following through to see if you want me to come in........." Then all he can say is yes or no, I am sorry, we offered the posiition to someone else.......I WANT IT SO BADLY - BUT THE WAITING IS THE HARDEST PART!!! I Have prayed that if it is not God's will that it wouldn't be so if I don't get the job, I will just have to thank God for saving me from something that is not what I want or need in my life. But the DM and I had so much in common and I even ran into him at my store. It all pointed to them selecting me. So I have to stop obsessing about this and just let what is to be - BE!! And stop trying to wrap my arms around the whole thing! I have no control over this. I just have to sit back and wait. I know the other job that I was second in line for.......they just didn't call......didn't write......nothing. So eventually I emailed them and they said "We have offered that position to someone else." But I felt like they owed it to me to let me know that I was not the person they decided on. The biggest obtacle I have faced is that people don't think I can work for someone else after being an owner for so many years. People are skeptical of my commitment!! But I will give them commitment. I will do a great job. I will be wonderful!! Now they just have to ask me and I will say yes!!! They do not realize that working FOR someone is so much better than working WITH a Narcissistic Parent!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 17, 2007, 07:05:15 PM: hEY Thanks CB: I really appreciate someone checking in. Well, you know I called and left a message on Monday and still nothing. So needless to say I am frustrated. Doing the pacing back and forth routine and looking at both my phone and cell phone to see if I have a message. Also checking my email all the time. I just have given it up. Basically I was mopping the floor and quoting positive scripture. My doc says I give off negative energy and I need to counter it with positive words, positive thoughts, etc. So I said, "OK, God, if I don't get this job then I have to believe that you are protecting me or preparing me for something so much better!!" I have to believe that or I will just get depressed and mad......

Then I had a conversation with my nmom on the phone yesterday and I really felt like I got the upper hand. She said something derogatory about the bookkeeper and I didn't even comment. I just went on to the next topic. Then she said, "I really want for you and I to communicate more. I didn't even know you weren't coming in on Friday, Monday and Tuesday until I got into work." And I said, "Yes, I told the bookkeeper as I was leaving on Thursday to tell you all on Friday morning." Mom said, "Yes, that is how I heard it." And I said, "Isn't that great?" With a smiley happy voice. I know it bugged her. I have decided that my response to her is going to be somewhat like a dumb blonde. You know.........pretend like I didn't get the jab she was throwing at me and come back with some nonsequiter that will totally throw her off. My conversation yesterday worked twice. I had so much satisfaction after the conversation!!

So, yes, I want the job = BADLY. But at this point I am started to think he has offered it to someone else. I thought I might get a Dear Jane letter in the mail. But my husband said, "Maybe they haven't decided yet. Maybe he had a hard time getting together with the other two people that needed to be interviewed. Maybe he had an emergency in some other market......so we'll see. Thanks...
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 19, 2007, 07:58:06 PM: NO WORD!! I APPLIED AGAIN. IT IS STILL LISTED ON CAREERBUILDER.COM SO I REAPPLIED!!!! YIKES!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: CB123 on January 20, 2007, 05:20:46 PM: Kell,

Good for you! Keep trying.

CB
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Stormchild on January 20, 2007, 07:15:10 PM: Ouch Kell. Good luck - sorry I missed seeing this earlier. Will be praying for you... and well done, handling your mother so well!!! :cool:
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on January 20, 2007, 11:10:51 PM: Thanks guys. I was beginning to think I was all alone in this trauma! Then I got home tonight and my h was so drunk he fell through the shower door. Why cant anything go right for me?
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Carhut on January 20, 2007, 11:33:27 PM: Why is it that a presentation, description and analysis of such an impacting and overarching disorder must be cased in such disappointing prose? Is the Doctor in? Dr. Grossman, I am afraid you have more drops than King Rex of ChiTown. Get it write sir. Then and only then will we who would rather the title sire be inclined to, "Sir". Thank the good Lord for the "Patriot" act. For those inclined to Suck, we salute You! ( A strained attempt at humor).
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 20, 2007, 11:46:09 PM: Hi Kelly,

I don't know what the prior post is about, but, yikes, sorry to hear about H!! Did he hurt himself? Does H have a serious drinking problem?

Hey, you're not alone in this. We are all rooting for you.

Ach, Kelly, when it rains it pours.

Hang in there, Hon,

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 21, 2007, 09:42:33 AM: Dear Kell,
I haven't been reading your post in a while so I am a little behind. This line REALLY caught my eye:
Why cant anything go right for me?

The tone of it really concerns me for you but I can't fully explain why. But clearly some of what comes through is that you have given your power away.

As I went back and began reading your posts about your application for this new job I see part of what is blocking your progress. You are living in enormous fear. I am so glad that you listened to your doctor about your negative trap and I am so glad that you have considered doing something about it but while you may think you are being positive you are actually still acting out of fear.

I recently I came across a saying that really helps me. WHERE ATTENTION GOES, ENERGY FLOWS. I feel certain that you are unaware of how much fear you have about not getting the job. You sound as though you are hoping to get it but really afraid you won't. And that fear is stronger than the hope. I really reccommend that you begin reading some books on positive thinking. It takes a complete committment. Try this or some variation of this sentence, "I choose to believe the job I need is at hand."

It sounds so crazy that saying that can make a difference but it goes down to a cellular level. Izzy posted the link to a lecture by a medical school professor who explains how our thoughts effect our outcomes. The way we think about ourselves and out environments actually shapes our reality. I'm rooting for you Kell.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Stormchild on January 21, 2007, 10:12:43 AM: Kell, this is what abusers do.

They sabotage you... your mother's efforts to start fights at the store, your husband's EXPENSIVE and DANGEROUS destruction of a part of your house.

And they teach you to sabotage yourself, by believing that there is nothing you can do about it...

Things will go right for you, they will. But... you will need to protect yourself from the people who want to make things go wrong for you.

And I know, it is so hard to do that when those people are your parents or you have married them.

Are you going to Al-Anon? Please think about going if you aren't... and I'm sorry that I didn't remember, if you are. Active and non-recovering alcoholics can be very abusive, very N. Not all of them, but many of them. Some are medicating pain - in a self destructive way - and do not lash out at others. But many of them can be very abusive.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 21, 2007, 11:27:27 AM: I echo what Storm says. And even if they don't rail at you - living with someone who gets so drunk that they fall through a shower door is in itself abuse. It is a passive abuse but abuse none-the-less. Think about it this way. Does his falling through the shower door instill a fear in you - that he will do it again, that he will or someone willl blame you or expect you to clean up and repair. Does it effect your life adversely? I agree with Storm that Al-anon is a very good place. If you don't like one particular group try another until the fit is right. I met some very good friends at Al-anon years ago. Maybe I should go again - it really is a good place to meet friends. - GS
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 21, 2007, 11:42:01 AM: Hey Everyone! Well, I don't know why I was the beneficiary of carhuts first post..............probably because I was whining a bit. But after rereading it several times, I don't know if he was dissing me or Dr. Grossman!!

I know, I know.........................it's just that this District Manager basically told me I was at the top of his list so I assumed I was a shoe in for the job. I must have made a bad impression on the Regional girl because everything came to a screeching halt after I talked to her. And I said in an earlier post that I had another promising job opportunity a couple years back and I got to the third interview and they selected someone else. I can't help but think that somehow I put off negative "don't hire me" vibes towards the end. Start with a bang and end up fizzling out.....................don't know....................but after the doc told me about my huge negative energy!! But I truly have been praying and confessing positive words but I cannot help to obsess about WHY he hasn't called me.

And my h? I was involved in a series of posts about alcoholism and narcissism. Several people suggested I go to Al-anon and I went to 4 meetings. Then my h starts to do better and I think "well, maybe it is not so bad............." But last night when I came home from a day trip for a competition my daughter was in he was literally falling down drunk. He looked at me through crossed eyes and was totally incoherent. He went into the garage and I heard a big bang......he came in and had fallen down. I told him to go to bed so he went upstairs, another big bang and I ran up to find him in the shower. Luckily the doors gave way so he didn't break them.....they just went off the track. So what did I do? I called my nmom and told her all about him falling through the shower, etc. She said something like "I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were dealing with this at home................" It was almost like she somehow understood me for a moment. Her way to deal with it is to get him into treatment and stay with him through thick and thin. My way is to set some boundaries and truly decide if he doesn't change to divorce him. And then I think maybe God knew that I would have to deal with this stupid alcoholism and the timing wouldn't be right to go away for 10 days at a time for training (three sets of 10 days - out of town.....)

So I see a light at the end of the tunnel and then BANG the other shoe drops. I mean, people on this post will tell you that I was making so much progress. My resolve to get away from nmom was huge and people could see me climbing out of my life traps. And then the perfect job disappears - poof - and my h is not only a drunk but has started conversing wtih my kids while totally smashed. For years he hid it from them and now they know because I outed him a couple months ago. I told him he was outed so now he comes in and rambles on and on in front of them,,,,,(he's their step dad and they don't like him to begin with so the fact that he is a total drunk just makes them look at me and wonder when I am going to get rid of him........) But part of me says, I need his income...............stupid, I know. So if I leave him there is selling the house in a slow market and having to stay working with nmom because I couldn't change jobs during all that and you know, it just seems a little cruel and overwhelming right now!!! Whine away, Kelly!!!

Thanks to all except you know who for listening and giving me input. I need it. But I wish I could just turn back the hands of time to two weeks ago and do better at that third interview!! And you know, maybe I am still in the running and I am just being a doomsday kinda person!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Stormchild on January 21, 2007, 12:23:09 PM: or maybe that regional girl is an N too, or strongly N-ish, and doesn't want you around because your competence threatens her?????

this could be a blessing in disguise.

(Al-anon, al-anon, al-anon)
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on January 21, 2007, 01:06:11 PM: Who Knows? She had a heavy New York accent and she had a stronger personality than I (which is hard to do) And she could have said I dont like her. I am having a conversation with h today. He is extremely huggy today~must feel guilty for being so stupid last night.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 21, 2007, 01:41:52 PM: errrrrkkkkk! Screeeeeech!! Put the brakes on there Kell.

Here is where that negativity eeks out unnoticed from your unconscious. (I know this because I am working diligently to uncover my own and to overcome it. It takes time and persistance.) Well, I don't know why I was the beneficiary of carhuts first post..............probably because I was whining a bit. That nutcase has NOTHING to do with YOU. Those are the words of a nutcase. That person's writings have nothing to do with you, your whining nor Dr. Grossman. It is just about that person's problems.

The job you interview you never heard back from 3 years ago had less to do about you than you think. It is very sad and unkind that people hiring do not let people who don't get the job know that they didn't. But I had that experience over and over years ago and finally learned by talking to many people that that is a common practise. Hard to believe isn't it!!! It is soooo RUDE and so unkind. How can humans who once were interviewing treat peole like that? I don't know. But it is not about you! Likewise, whatever is going on with this current business is more about them than about you.

Getting a new job is really a numbers game. There is a very young man who wrote a book about "How to become a Realionnaire" who developed his business practises as a child in the ghetto. He decided that any sales would require 100 calls. So when he got turned down 10, 11, 12 times he just saw that as the ones he had to go through to get to the right one. I think that is a fabulous way to look at the job seeking process. You have been through at least one of the NOs you have to go through to get to your YES. Don't give up. Start applying more and more. You will learn from the process. Do you really want to work for a business that cares so little about the way they treat potential employees? If they treat you like this now, how will they treat you when you work for them? Keep looking and take the attitude that the right place will be lucky to have YOU. Remember you are interviewing THEM am much as they are interviewing you.

Keep at this postive thinking practise. I have been working on it for several years and am making great progress. But it is a matter of undoing a lifetime of bad programming. Be patient and persistent. You have both of those characteristics. I have seen them demonstrated in your posts. My thoughts and encourgement are with you. - Gaining STrength
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 21, 2007, 03:07:27 PM: Hey GS: Is that eeerrrkkkkk directed at my huggy drunken , remorseful h or at my internalizing my dumb luck (therefore speaking out loud the reason for them not hiring me......yes, I understand that negative words become negative affirmations if you will. Self fulfilling prophecies. Stating the truth unknowingly. I have been walking around saying "That job is mine!!" "I am the perfect candidate for that job." But the lack of basic communication frustrates me. Don't want me? Fine, than tell me so. Don't just forget I exist.........especially after you told me I was at the top of your list. I remember once I was totally in love with a guy. We were with each other every single day for three months. So one day I went over to his house (he lived with some buddies and we were all friends..................) He just didn't show up. I left at midnight. It was before cell phones. Well, a day or two went by and someone finally told me, "Kell, he is seeing someone else." What? Aren't you suppose to end it with one person before you start it with another? Aren't you suppose to write the candidates that you didn't choose and thank them for making it so far in the interview process? I know I applied at a restaurant once and had a phone interview. It went well. Then I never heard from them again. So I applied again. Then about six months later they had another positing so I applied like this...................."I went into your restaurant and there was a 16 year old person behind the counter who clearly didn't know what he was doing. The manager was outside sweaping and the line kept getting longer.................so I went up to the manager and told him he needed to get inside and help the boy. That will NEVER happen if you hire me." Well THAT time I got a Dear Jane letter that said, "We don't think you are a good fit for our organization." I had to laugh at that one!! I am getting pretty gutsy in my old age and people probably don't like that!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 21, 2007, 03:29:05 PM: Oh, and the thing about my drunken husband abusing me with his drunkenness? I agree. Sometimes when he drinks he starts the verbal abuse.....blah blah blah. Never hit me and if he did I would be out of there ............But this constant disappointment. This weekend drunk thing. This doesn't have to have much of an excuse to get drunk thing. Every weekend. Week in. Week out. That is like chinese water torture. It's like a bad dream that I cannot wake up from. Same with my nmom. 13 year of working with a self-absorbed, arrogant, temper tantrum throwing, bull in a china closet type women who will not throw me a crumb. That's it. That's why my whole life I have looked at nicer homes than I live in now. I have this dream that if I move into a new home - I will be happy. I have done that so many times and it is always the same. And the doc said to me................"No matter where you go - there you are!!" So I think I'll sign out and finish reading the Battlefield of the Mind by Joyce Meyer. I've got a battle going and I need to be victorious!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 21, 2007, 03:45:58 PM: Stormy,

Wow, you are blowing my mind! You are so good. Would you be my T? :lol:

Kell,
For me, I think Stormy really hit it: Your job rejections are not necessarily about YOU. Your interviewer may be an N, may feel threatened by you. I have been through this job maze too and I felt like many employers feel threatened by competent employees.

Stormy is also right re: it's a numbers game and the more you play, the better you get and then you will (think positively) find a really good job.

And Stormy, the thing about living in FEAR: For me, that has been my whole life, even now, while I'm trying to heal.

"WHERE ATTENTION GOES, ENERGY FLOWS". Thank you, Stormy. This is my new MANTRA!!!!

Kell, you are going through hard times, especially re: your question about whether to leave H due to money. So, although I do not have great wisdom myself, I think you should take about 20 minutes per day and mediatate, sit quietly and gather your thoughts and decide WHAT YOU WANT and how to get it.

Think about all the things going on in your life: positive thinking, the job, living in fear, H, Nmom, money and try to figure out what you want and don't want.

Love to you, kell,

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 21, 2007, 04:02:38 PM: [Thank you Stormy and Dazed. Living in fear of everything always being the same. Living in fear that there is no good escape strategy. Negativism by living trying to save myself from drowning. It's almost like being held under and right before you die, you pop up for a breath. But it doesn't end. Almost like those horror movies where the good guy thinks they have FINALLY gotten away from the bad guy and he is around the next corner - with a knife!! Or Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction when we think she is drowned and she jumps out of the bath with one final attempt to win!! And to stab her foe.

So that is how I feel when I think I have a job. It's a good job. The money is good. The hours are good. The environment is good. This one will work. I can do this. I can escape the never ending nightmare and move on. I can feel good about myself. Believe me, I have applied for so many other jobs. But none of them feel like this one. This one has ME written all over it. I haven't found another job where I could actually see myself, feel myself, imagine myself being there day in and day out......it feels like a step up. It doesn't have the feeling of "out of the frying pan, into the fire." That happened to me once. I DID get another job and it ended being horrible. Like being in jail. Go in at 9:45 am and not allowed to leave until 9:45 pm. I told them I had wrapped my mind around the every Saturday and Sunday and some nights.....but I never anticipated working bell to bell with children at home!! So I quit and went back to nmom. But I know if I leave again, it's for good. So I had myself imagined at this new store. I was in charge. I ran the show. It was mine. The District Manager and I hit it off on both a personal and professional level. I knew I had the job. I knew it!!!!! I knew it!!! And that is why I am disappointed if I don't get it. And I am not saying I am not getting it - I still think they might be too busy. But part of me thinks if I got a message from someone to call them.......................and I wasn't going to hire them..................then wouldn't you call them?? I left a message with the Assistant Manager at my store to have the DM call me. Now the Assistant might not have given him the message but I emailed him twice through careerbuilder.com. And I guess there is a chance he didn't get those emails...............but!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He also said they were going to make an offer next week and that was two weeks ago.......................so fear? Yes. Fear of being trapped in this life. Fear of being trapped in this chubby body. Fear of being trapped with a drunk husband. Kell the "drunk magnet." Oh, I mean, Kell the positive, wonderful opportunity and man magnet!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: CB123 on January 21, 2007, 04:15:00 PM: ed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 21, 2007, 04:18:58 PM: "Yes. Fear of being trapped in this life. Fear of being trapped in this chubby body. Fear of being trapped with a drunk husband. Kell the "drunk magnet." Oh, I mean, Kell the positive, wonderful opportunity and man magnet!"

Kell,

I feel for you, I really do. But, how can you change you're life? I know you're trying to change it, but maybe you have to change the method you're using to change your life.

Like, the sarcasm you used in the last 2 sentences. I know you're angry and frustrated, but the sarcasm shows the opposite of positive thinking. The sarcasm hurts you more than it hurts anyone else. The sarcasm is inverted anger. Please ackowledge the anger so that it's not inverted.

Maybe, just sit with your feelings, feel your negative, sad, hopeless feelings and anger, acknowledge them and then, commit to yourself that you want to change. You have many of the tools to do this. You just need to make the committment.

Kell, I'm sorry if I'm being too hard on you, but I believe you can grow and feel happier. I have faith in you.

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Stormchild on January 21, 2007, 04:22:24 PM: Hi Dazed -

thanks :oops: - but most of the good stuff here came from you, and the stuff about fear and attention and having enough patience to wait for the numbers to work in your favor - came from GS :oops:

- I am tickled pink at the compliments, but want to be sure credit is given where it is due. I'm just keeping the ball in the air, here, with the odd thought now and then. You folks are making the amazing stuff happen!

Kell - have you ever heard of the Book of Kells? I'm going to try and link to it. It is ancient and breathtakingly beautiful...

here's a nice one: http://celtdigital.org/CeltArtKells.htm

and here's the official site... http://www.bookofkells.ie/

See what beauty you were named for!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 21, 2007, 05:53:13 PM: Stormy,

You're right! "the stuff about fear and attention and having enough patience to wait for the numbers to work in your favor - came from GS "

I'm so sorry GS. When I respond to a post, sometimes I loose track of who said what and believe it or not, I'm a bit dyslexic (ie: get confused) with the Sts of Storm & Strength.

So sorry, GS :(. But, GS is my VERY GOOD FRIEND and I hope GS knows how much I really & truly care for her :D.

Lordy, GS, your wisdom over whelms me. Not that I think you're incapable of wisdom, but rather, I wonder if you, GS, know how deep your wisdom is? Your wisdom is very deep and solid and I feel it and am learning from it. Will you be my shrink? I think you already are!!

I loved everything you said about giving power away, living in fear and, of course my VERY FAVORITE and new mantra: WHERE ATTENTION GOES, ENERGY FLOWS.

I have repeated this mantra to myself several times today and the more I ponder it, the more I see how true it is. I started thinking of which things in my life I want to give my attention and now, my energy is flowing to those things. I'm truly amazed how simple this is and how it really does work. It's like an easy little trick which has a huge payoff. I love it. So, thank you again, GS, for CHANGING my life for the better.

I must say, I've spent a good deal of time posting this weekend and I have gained such insight and wisdom from it. I feel empowered and have clearer vision. It's unbelievable. I'm loving it and am so GRATEFUL for it.

Kell, I wish my overflowing cup will spill onto you.

Love to you all,
dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Stormchild on January 21, 2007, 06:38:07 PM: :-) :cool:
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 21, 2007, 07:24:54 PM: Hey: So I went downstairs and picked up my book and started reading and what did she say? Don't grumble and complain. God wants to see if you can be patient WITH a good attitude. Guess I blew that one, God!!!

Then I went upstairs and took a nap. I think I may be a little depressed. Thank God the doc put me on Lexapro or I might be off the deep end. I just needed to sleep. I want so much for change to occur for me ALL the time. I do so well and then things don't pan out or the raging drunkard rears his ugly head and I can't help but get a little pessimistic.

I want to walk through a door and see sunshine and walk down the yellow brick road.................I do. I want for everything to go from black and white to vivid color!! Thanks for the link to the Book of Kells. Very nice.........that's the kind of color I want!!

So I leave my life in God's hands and hope that he will do His best in my life!! I know that will happen!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 21, 2007, 07:48:11 PM: Oh boy! Turn off the computer for a couple of hours and so much happens!!

Kell - keep reading that Joyce Meyers. She'g got great stuff. Pick one or two things to work on and be patient and persistent.
Hate to pick on you but really Kell, "Guess I blew that one, God!!!" Give yourself a break. You aren't expected to have this all correct just because you read the book. If we all had this down pat Joyce wouldn't need to write the book. She is giving you something to process and to learn and to apply to your life. It takes time. It is not instantaneous. We are all begging you to be kinder to yourself. Someone showed me another of her books just last night that is about the power of words. Her main theme is to not criticize yourself. According to Joyce, God does not will you to criticize and condemn yourself. It works against his plan for you. Your mother does enough of that. Don't join forces with her.

Dazed - I am always getting confused about who says what on which thread. I was just thrilled that you liked what I posted. I don't need credit. I love that ATTENTION one too. I am really focusing on that.

We're cheering for you Kell. Keep at it. You are headed in the right direction. When you take the next step towards being your own best friend you will have made a significant achievement. You will get out of this nightmare. If you move you will still be there but take the you who is kind, nurturing and supportive to Kell and leave the one who keeps criticizing Kell at the last house.

your friend - really - Gaining Strength
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on January 21, 2007, 09:14:48 PM: BE NICE TO MYSELF! Crazy concept. You mean it is not me who causes them to not hire me? Could it be there was a more qualified candidate? I am good and I know it! Thanks!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 22, 2007, 12:59:34 PM: Could be that they didn't want a competent candidate or could be that they wanted the boss' son's best friend or could be they wanted ........ None of which had to do with you and your excellent qualifications. Employers can be as N as family members. You didn't cause your mother to be an N and your abilities don't cause to her to completely missout on the best possible employee and daughter she could have.

All of the things that are right about you need to fit into the right recepticle. You do not want them to fit into N recepticles anymore. Hold faith that you will be drawn to the perfect fit in good time (meaning in a bearable timeframe before you lose your mind.)

Keep reading Joyce Meyers and applying her principles to your life. - Gaining Strength
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: towrite on January 22, 2007, 06:01:04 PM: Quote from: Kelly as guest on June 24, 2006, 11:14:59 PM
Hello Everyone!! It has been so long since I have been here. Maybe I am getting better so I haven't had to log on and vent. But it is time again. I have been lying in bed crying and so/.........................some of you may remember that I have worked with my Nmom for 12 years. We had a major blow up about six years ago and it really helped..........even though she would diagnose me as unstable, etc. I realize that without the major blow up I would be dying of cancer or something major like that - my doctor said I NEEDED to get it out or it would literally eat me alive!!

Anyway, so our business which hasn't made a penny for ten years is finally making a profit. We hired a gal who is great at budgets and accounting and she has single handedly turned the business around. So at the first of the year we hired my aunt who had been fired from the job that she took over for my Nmom when she retired. When they let her go she came to us immediately and didn't even try for another job. We all had real high hopes for her!!1

Then out of the blue, she and my Nmom suddenly think our bookkeeper is too big for her britches. I, on the otherhand have told both of those women that we need to give credit where credit is due!! All of a sudden I realize that my aunt is basically worming her way into the family business and is coming and going as she pleases just like my mother and I do (we are co-owners.............) but if I start to put her in her place my Nmom defends her and progressively is more defensive towards the bookkeeper who has turned out business around. Well, I told my aunt that if she and my mom ran this gal out of her I hereby REFUSE to do the bookkeeping!!!! I am so furious I don't know what to do. I do not want anything to do with my mom and I don't want anything to do with my aunt!! But you have to understand that I always thought that my aunt was some poor abused girl who had to live under my mom's shadow (and she has) but now I realize she is almost as egotistical as my mom!!

I am beside myself with grief and anger!!

I found a new book from a Christian perspective and it is called "Enough About You, Let's Talk About Me!" by Les Carter. He doesn't shove the Christianity down your throat and I am going to give it to my bookkeeper to read!! I suggest it to all of you, too!!

Help!! Kelly (hey bunny and flower and all the rest of you that I haven't talked to in months!!)

Kelly - do you have anything in writing showing you and your nmom are equal owners of the business? If things are beginning to turn around in the business due to this new bookkeeper, you need more control! Maybe it's time for you to see an attorney and brainstorm about buying your nmom out. You are on a short road to burnout.

Best, towrite
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 22, 2007, 06:25:12 PM: Oh, no, we WERE equal partners and somehow when we were short on cash flow, nmom put money into the business and made it stock. After thousands were put in the business, I had about 7 percent and she 93%.....I don't know how she legally did it......................and I can't afford to fight against all her wealth. I live paycheck to paycheck and she is loaded.................but thanks for the thought!!

Well, I decided to be kinder to myself. I have been making an effort to always look put together and a bit more "glam" than I had before (that is something the RVP said they wanted in a manager...............) and I have to admit that I haven't really cared how I look for a long time. Now I am starting to count points. I figure I can better myself regardless of where I am. It only makes me more marketable in the future.

And I got contacted by another company I applied for......................so you see, even though I wanted the other job, I am still applying!!!!

I am trying!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 22, 2007, 06:57:04 PM: Excellent, Kell!!! :D

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 22, 2007, 07:10:05 PM: Thanks!! I just want to be better!! Thank you all for your moral support this weekend. I was spent. My h says he will "probably" go to AA!! We'll see. My nmom said she was mad at him for presenting himself as a nondrinker (we met online) only to start back being a drunk on our honeymoon!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 22, 2007, 07:33:21 PM: Kell,

I'm glad you're feeling better.

Between your Nmom, H and the job situation, you probably feel like a huge boulder of sh*t is chasing you and ready to run you over. I can only image.

But, the way out is to work on you. So, keep reading that book, posting here and try to love yourself, even though it's really hard to do.

love,
dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on January 22, 2007, 07:48:37 PM: ((((((((((((((((((((((((Kell))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 22, 2007, 09:06:11 PM: YOU GUYS ROCK!! HOW COULD HAVE I GOTTEN THROUGH THE LAST COUPLE WEEKS WITHOUT PEOPLE POINTING OUT MY NEGATIVE WORDS!! I OWE YOU ALL A LOT!! :D
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 23, 2007, 08:44:09 PM: OK, back to the original topic of this post...................the backing off of my nmom at work. The finally making a profit. The hiring of my aunt and the reappearance of my nmom at work............................one year with my aunt.........................one year with my mom back..........................didn't make a profit - AGAIN!!! What does that say to you? The presence of my mom makes us not make a profit because she has no regard for budgets or anything else.

I think I have applied for no less than six jobs in the last two days!!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 24, 2007, 11:15:12 AM: I think I have applied for no less than six jobs in the last two days!!!!!

Way to go girl!! Don't forget - the interview is YOUR opportunity to interview THEM to make sure it is a good fit. Interviewing them has another advantage, it moves you out of the begging, proving mode. When you try to prove your qualifications it often is received by, "Methinks she doth protest too much." So remember - you re trying to find out if they are a good match for you.

Good luck - GS
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on January 24, 2007, 08:28:18 PM: Got a phone call today from another company. Phone tag. But I really wanted that other job. It still surprises me after he told me I was at the top of my list! Well a friend of mine had a dream that my daughter and I were running the store without mom. She has a gift so I am hoping it is some kind of a prophecy and that will happen.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Stormchild on January 24, 2007, 08:37:18 PM: Go for it, Kell.

That company is going to be the loser, not you. They didn't know a good person when she was looking them right in the face. Or, they DID, and they didn't WANT a good person.

Either way, you are better off without them. Praying for you.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 24, 2007, 10:15:49 PM: She has a gift so I am hoping it is some kind of a prophecy and that will happen.

Hold on to that but don't stop interviewing. That process of searching will be a learning one. - GS
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 25, 2007, 02:08:48 AM: Kell,

Good things are starting to happen. Yaye!!

Keepa goin'!!

Dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 25, 2007, 10:40:51 AM: Thanks to all! So last night I was laying in the dark and kind of obsessing about not getting that job. I was thinking about calling and point blank asking (in a nice way) why they didn't call me........anyway then I was talking to my husband and was telling him about my frustration and as I was rehashing what they wanted me to do IF I got hired - and that was going out of town for 10 days straight, then home for 4, then to another town for 10 straight days and then home for 4 and then out of town for another 10 straight days and then I was done with training................so in actuality - gone 30 days.........when I heard myself say it out loud I realized that would have been a real hardship on my family (especially for my youngest) and I was actually glad I didn't have to do that..................it was a relief. Then I also realized that the bottom line was the feeling of rejection. That hurt. But since this all happened, I started counting points again and for the last 4 days I have done a good job. I have been thinking about taking care of ME!! Trying to eat healthy. Trying to BE better.

So I have a phone interview with the other company today at 2:30. We'll see if anything becomes of that!! But it is ok and I will be ok!!! Thanks!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 25, 2007, 11:23:58 AM: We'll see if anything becomes of that!! But it is ok and I will be ok!!! Thanks!!
Way to go Kelly!!! What an unbelieveable shift you have made!!! That is so significant. Congratulatoins.

Then I also realized that the bottom line was the feeling of rejection. That hurt.
I am learning that identifying the source of the emotionally charged experience is the root of healing and you got to it. I encourage you to dig a little further and identify why rejection is so painful and generates a strong avoidance tendency. Getting to the root of today's pain helps get to the root of our deepest pain. I really admire you for working hard and looking deeply into this.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on January 25, 2007, 02:57:46 PM: All right, whoever you are, what did you do with the old Kelly?????

:D

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 25, 2007, 03:58:39 PM: "who are you and what have you done with Kelly.......?" I love that quote!!!

Ok, so here's a new turn of events. I just got off the phone with the recruiter for this other company. The interview just didn't go well. So after I got off the phone I thought, "What the heck!!~ I am going to call the Regional Vice President of the company I want to work for and ask her point blank if they offered the position to someone else." So I called her and told her I had not heard from the District Manager and so I assumed they had offered the position to someone else.......and with her thick New York accent she said, "NO! Not to my knowledge.....we have been in meetings all last week and this week the DM is on vacation so give me your number and I'll have my assistant call him and we'll get back with you!!" Can you believe it? All this time I have been obsessing and like someone said, they were just living their lives not giving me a second thought!! Gee Whiz!! I think I might STILL be in the running!! Yea!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on January 25, 2007, 09:29:16 PM: Guess what? I just talked to the district manager and I just need to convince the region lady that I can be glam enough. I was stressing for nothing!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on January 25, 2007, 11:19:18 PM: Woo-hoo! This you can fix, Kell!

Time to take yourself to a nice store, find a nice saleswoman, and ask her to dress you from head to toe.

Umm, forget the toe. I do not believe in heels or pointy toes, they're for goats, not feet.

Hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 26, 2007, 06:24:17 PM: Hi kell,

What a rollercoaster ride!!

Just when you decided that you don't want the job, then you find out you're still in the running!

So many ups and downs.

"I was stressing for nothing!" Kell, I have done this so many times. When ever I have stressed for nothing, first I suppress the urge to kick myself and then I try to learn the lesson:
Stop creating scenerios in my mind that may have no basis in reality.

I think that sometimes, when we feel overwhelmed or anxious and we try to problem solve, our thoughts start running wild and we think up worse case possibilities, when in reality, we do not know all the facts.

Good luck with the makeover, I want to hear all about it.

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 26, 2007, 07:54:05 PM: You know? I believe it. Since I had heard nothing in two weeks I was obsessing about it. You all knew I was. My husband knew I was (who by the way ISN"T drinking right now...................................... :lol:) Anyway, I have heard the old adage - no news is good news. But I just could feel, hear, taste, and everything else - this job. I was obsessively going through the motions trying to take the sting out of the rejection but my heart was with THIS job. You can not believe how much guts it took me to pick up the phone knowing full well that she was going to break my heart.......but that would have been some closure and it would have helped me stop obsessing. I think that is growth. When I was younger I would have never had the guts to pick up that phone and call!! So from that point of view it is great!! But when she said NO, they hadn't filled the position and I heard from him a couple hours later!! That was great. And he made it seem like the job was mine!!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 26, 2007, 08:36:30 PM: Kell,

"You can not believe how much guts it took me to pick up the phone knowing full well that she was going to break my heart.......but that would have been some closure and it would have helped me stop obsessing. " Yes, I can, because I'm the same way! I really understand.

Good to hear about your hubby.

"And he made it seem like the job was mine!!!!!" I really, really, really hope you get this job, but, if, for whatever reason, it does not come through, please do not punish yourself. I truly wish you blue birds, but if you are disappointed, please don't put yourself on the down loop of the rollercoaster.

love,
dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 26, 2007, 09:09:58 PM: I know. If after all this I don't get the job, then it will be really hard to not be VERY disappointed. But he basically told me he has to come up with a couple more people for the RVP to interview but gave me a heads up on what I should focus on. Plus he is going to make sure she goes to my store so she can see where I came from. Also, my mom actually went and met with the guy who is interested in buying our business. She came up with a promotion packet with some catalogs we send out and an outline of what she sees in our business......I have to admit she did a good job. Now we will see if he can read the numbers and if he thinks the business is worth what she wants even though it never makes a profit (except the year my nmom stepped away - the year BEFORE we hired my aunt....) Anyway, I had to thank God for the timing because if they would have offered me the job BEFORE she had her ducks in a row and BEFORE she was ready to present the business to this man, she may have balked and the timing just might not have been right. As it is, if they offer me the job and I take it, I can go in and say, "Well, you are selling the business so I had to go out and take care of myself." They are a little concerned that I will feel trapped in a job where I cannot come and go as I please but I told him that working with my nmom is more of a trap than working in a corporation where I am THE boss at the store. Yes, corporate to set policies, etc. District Managers to make sure I am doing a good job. But no nmom to scrutinize everything I do and to make sure I feel terrible about myself as well. No idea I have is a good idea in nmom's view. I know I will do such a good job with this company that they will constantly tell me so. It will be like a breath of fresh air to work for someone who validates me, hears me and let's me do what I know how to do!! So I am so relieved and I feel so stupid for how obsessive compulsive I was acting. And I know you all know how it is because we as victims of Ns or people who have been raised in dysfunctional families do things like that!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on January 26, 2007, 10:20:28 PM: Kell,

If you don't get the job, it's OK to feel disappointed. Yes, feel your feelings. But, please do not punish yourself for feeling disappointed.

Good news about the potential buyer and the timing.

I think you are not only looking forward to this particular job, but the idea of leaving your mom's company and working out in the world. I bet you are really good at what you do because you have such passion for your work.

"I feel so stupid for how obsessive compulsive I was acting". Oh kell! It's OK to feel that you unnecessarily stressed yourself out. But, try not to berate yourself for being stupid.

Forgive yourself, understand yourself, be gentle with yourself and try to love yourself. Think of yourself as a good and loving friend. If this friend made a mistake by unnecessarily stressing herself out, you wouldn't berate her, call her stupid and make her feel like cr*p, would you? No, you would have compassion for her and still love and accept her despite her faults. Treat yourself like you would this friend.

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on January 27, 2007, 09:55:04 AM: Dazed: This is something that I am going to work on. I use the work idiot and stupid way too much. I said to a friend of mine - you idiot!! (joking) and he said, "Mr. Idiot to you!!"

You know? After my phone interview with the Regional Vice President (who was talking about fashion, etc.............) I have started to try to pull my looks together. I am making sure I always have lipstick on and that my hose don't have runs in them. I am counting points so I can slowly lose weight (I say slowly because at 47 it comes off so much slower than when I was in my 20s.....) I went out and bought a Coach purse I had been eyeing. I want to look good.

I think this is because I know if I get this job, I will feel so good about myself (and even if I don't......) I have that light at the end of the tunnel feeling. I just know that even if I have to work harder and longer, I will feel good about my accomplishments and that will translate into a newer, better Kell!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 03, 2007, 09:08:49 AM: Just needing a little moral support. Well, it was 9 days since I talked with the DM........he said they were going to set up interviews in person with the RVP. I cannot believe how long this company is waiting to fill this position. I originally interviewed for this right after Thanksgiving. Meanwhile this store is being run by the Assistant Manager who will clearly take ownership. If I get the position I may have some trouble establishing that I am the manager. Anyway, I keep thinking that this is all in God's timing and that for some reason they are taking their own sweet time to offer this position. Then after offering the position it is 30 days of training. If they had given me the position right after the first of the year I could have my training done and be at the store.......oh well. I am trying not to obsess! Any thoughts??
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: CB123 on February 03, 2007, 09:12:14 AM: Kell,

Maybe this job isnt as good as it looks? Maybe you will find out that it is a big headache and you are glad you went elsewhere?

It's starting to sound less ideal. What do you think?

CB
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 03, 2007, 09:58:31 AM: Well, one would think with all this delay that maybe the company (or the DM) is less communicative than they (he) should be. I am still holding out that this is the perfect job for me. The mere thought of working there excites me. It is doing something that I dreamed of doing since I was a teenager........it's funny, I applied at a store that sold what this store sells years ago....................all I could say to the interviewer is that I love _______!!! Now almost 30 years later I have the chance to be the manager of a mega store!!! I don't know. I mean, they could be so busy and I am just one in a million things they have to take care of.....

Also, I left my nmom once before for another job and I was in the management program.......that meant I came in as a sales person and started learning the ropes to be a manager. Well, at this job, I am the manager. I walk in and I am in charge. I love that. No nmom. No cut throat sales people trying to steal your customers. I've decided that even though I was in sales for many years, I like retail management much better. Sales is a vicious trade!!

So not trying to over spiritualize it, but I am thinking that maybe God is working out the timing so that it will be better all around. My nmom gave a prospective buyer an information packet. Now when I leave it can be "rationalized" by saying..............hey, you are selling, I need to take care of myself and family. Had I left BEFORE she gave the packet to the man, she would have freaked out and told me I was bailing.

For whatever reason, I still think this is a great job. The DM and I hit it off. We just have to convince the RVP that I will be a good fit for the position.........I was praying that the RVP would finally say, "If the DM likes her, then I trust him and we can hire her sight unseen!!"
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on February 03, 2007, 12:05:43 PM: Hi Kell,
I feel for you, dear. It is so hard waiting.
Two thoughts, hope they're helpful:

--Wherever you wind up in a new job (and you WILL!)...I think it'd be good not to discuss your NMom or your feelings about her except in a brief way at the beginning if it's needed to explain

--Can you spend some time right now continuing to search and actively put in applications for OTHER jobs, even though this is the one you want most? I think if you do that, you'll be helping yourself feel better and more positive. Even multiple ones. Just doing it with a calmer optimism that says: I don't know which one of these will work out but I know eventually one is going to, so I'm just going to present my best working self to each one as I work on it.

((((Kell))))

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: towrite on February 03, 2007, 12:47:27 PM: I don't know you but wanted to offer my support. You've got a sticky situation there. It sounds to me like it would give you some peace of mind to (1) set your priorities - and stick with them (decide what your bottom line is), (2) set your boundaries - see the website posted recently about boundaries, and (3) accept that your grief is normal. Keep your chin up. My mother is the same in a lot of ways - she even threatened to cut me off in her will if I ever did "anything" to embarrass her. But I don't think she's as mean as yours.

towrite.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on February 03, 2007, 03:56:27 PM: Well I already know what money I will accept at new job ifI am hired. I have applied at at least ten other places but this place still feels the best. My Mom is so self absorbed that she makes decisions for our business that are clearly made by a 70 Year old and our primary customer is 30 Something! We cannot argue with her because She owns the store so we all are frustrated but me the most! bookkeeper is close behind!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 04, 2007, 10:27:48 PM: Well, I expect to hear something tomorrow? Don't you think so?? I mean it has totally been 11 days tomorrow since I talked to him. Why oh why would he say they were going to make an offer soon - as in next week - and that was like six weeks ago??? Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. I actually went into the store and bought something. Walked around. Checked out the employees. Walked around and saw where I think I could help the place.

I told my husband I am starting to get discouraged in a way. Not obsessing like I was before but thinking - WHAT IS TAKING SO LONG???

Then I have to remind myself of the absolutely crazy making day in and day out interactions with my nmom and my aunt. And somehow I think maybe God is teaching me even MORE patience. I prayed for patience and it seems that everything in my life is a series of infuriating "make-me-wait" scenarios. I have been praying for and strategizing my exit for years. Almost from the time we bought the place I made two false starts. The first one they loved me and offered me the job but it was $15,000 per year less and I was living paycheck to paycheck. The second one I made the jump and the hours were bell to bell - 9 am to 9 pm and I don't know about you but that is totally unacceptable.

Sorry about the ramble!!!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on February 05, 2007, 07:11:23 PM: Keeping you in my prayers Kell. I like Hops' suggestions. Keep interviewing. That will keep you involved with what is out there. You will be gaining good information about competitors and learning something about how to treat your underlings. Plus it will keep your mind off the BIG ONE. - GS
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on February 05, 2007, 08:00:15 PM: I WILL SURELY GO MAD! Today I saw my job re posted on career builder! I know he said he wanted the RVP to meet me so he needed to get some people besides me to interview. Gee!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on February 05, 2007, 09:12:24 PM: Oh (((((((((((((((((((Kell)))))))))))))))))))!!

This waiting sucks. But, remember the rollercoaster ride about 10 days ago? Please don't get back on the rollercoaster.

Nonetheless, it seems like this company likes to play games and I am not digging that. As CB said, maybe this isn't such a great company. I just do not like the games they play.

Also, in the overall, life lesson, spiritual aspect of this experience, perhaps you are undergoing this as a means to teach patience? Reminds me of the Southpark episode on Wii2. I also have a big prob with patience, so it's a lesson I must learn.

I bet you're probably tired of hearing it, but keep on interviewing.

love,
dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on February 06, 2007, 05:35:30 PM: Oh patience is not my virtue. Well I texted him yesterday and he texted me back and said he would call me today with info. We will see what kind of info!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on February 06, 2007, 05:46:20 PM: Hang in there Kell - GS
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Leah on February 06, 2007, 05:49:37 PM: You are in my thoughts and prayers Kell

Leah xx
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 06, 2007, 05:59:12 PM: THIS IS DRIVING ME CRAZY!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on February 06, 2007, 07:04:21 PM: I just talked to the DM and he told me that they are reconfiguring the districts and the glam RVP is no longer my manager so I will be meeting with a couple of new guys for this district. He thinks this is good news for me and that is why all the delays because of all the shuffling around of districts and regions.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: pennyplant on February 06, 2007, 07:28:22 PM: Sounds like good news to me! So, perhaps you will wind up with a better situation due to the delay. Very cool.

Pennyplant
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 06, 2007, 07:40:43 PM: You know, I talked in an earlier post about how I prayed for patience. Well, I am NOT a patient person and so it is like I am forced into being patient by having to wait. So when he called me he told me that the whole company is being moved about and they were redrawing the lines in the regions and districts. The bad news is if I am hired he won't be my district manager and I have hit it off with him. But then a real strange twist of events happened........remember how I told you all that I walked out of the back room and there he was in my store? Well, he asked me if maybe he could buy my store. His family lives in my town but he lives in Missouri. He and his wife would love to buy the store and move back to their home town. Well, we are wanting to sell so I just have to look up into the heavens and wonder if God is working in a mysterious way and He is putting all this together in a real and cool way. Don't know but I am going to sign off and go have a conversation with God!! I know He is in control and if I would just stop trying to work everything out FOR Him and just sit back and watch Him work, maybe I wouldn't always be so freaked out.....
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: pennyplant on February 06, 2007, 07:50:11 PM: That would be pretty amazing, Kell :D. I sure hope it works out.

PP
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on February 06, 2007, 09:13:24 PM: Kell,

It's all just simply AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good luck with eveything

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on February 07, 2007, 11:16:03 AM: Kell - what an amazing story. I look forward to hearing what happens next. It is a good reminder about having faith and patience. You continue to be in my prayers. - your friend - Gaining Strength
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Leah on February 07, 2007, 11:40:42 AM: Quote
You know, I talked in an earlier post about how I prayed for patience.

Oh Kell,

I remember when I was a baby christian, a lovely lady said to me, 'don't pray for patience like I did' and proceeded to tell me how she had been tested .......... till she had patience!!

The lovely lady was a real example of a mature christian, and a sweet 'mother' to me.

Quote
It is a good reminder about having faith and patience.

Gaining Strength said it all.

Hard to go through, but, you will be rewarded I am sure.

In my thoughts and prayers.

Leah x
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kelly as guest on February 07, 2007, 11:56:23 AM: It IS weird, isn't it? But the problem is my NMOM. If I go to her and tell her the series of events, she won't think it is anything because it didn't happen to HER. And she will feel betrayed because I am out looking for jobs even though I know she SAID she is trying to sell the place. I have given it up to God and asking that HE work out all the details!! She will put the brakes on quickly!! Such an N!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on February 07, 2007, 12:32:54 PM: Kell...maybe DON'T tell your Nmom about it? Just let the events play out as they will?
Neither keep it a secret nor push it forward, but if he comes to meet her, let them meet...?

I am so excited. Sounds like things are opening for you in many ways.

(SO good that you got an explanation for the long delay in hearing about the job. Makes sense, and makes it easier to bide.)

You hang in there, you're doing GREAT.

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 07, 2007, 02:21:18 PM: I almost went in there today and told my mom about me applying for jobs and I just decided to leave well enough alone and see if they offer me the job. Then if the man who wants to buy it backs out I can mention this other guy. Problem is he wouldn't pay what my nmom wants because the business doesn't make money. Not that it couldn't make money but my nmom is so full of herself that she refuses to even look at a budget.......the only year we made a profit was the year she backed off.

So it really is up to God. And I am starting to PMS so I don't need to talk to nmom while under the influence of raging hormones!! It might get ugly!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 07, 2007, 05:49:31 PM: Well, I emailed my nmom and told her in light of our therapy visit which ended in an impasse and because she is negotiating the sale of our business, I am looking for jobs. I told her I have interviewed with three different companies (which I have) but still haven't found the perfect job. So at least she knows I am looking. So if and when I get the job I have been holding my breath on (and holding, and holding, and holding) she won't be completely broadsided. This may also make her a little more serious about finding a buyer. If she knows I am serious about leaving, she may realize she cannot do it without me and this will force the issue. Or if it doesn't, then maybe she can get some things done without me there pulling in an opposite direction. Regardless, not working with her is going to be an amazing reprieve!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on February 09, 2007, 06:59:07 PM: Well, it has been a couple of days since I sent the email to my nmom. She asked if we could talk in her office. We went in and the frustration began!!! I told her it only seemed prudent in light of our therapy which confirmed we were at an impasse, and the fact that we are going to sell, that I get another job. Then she proceeded to tell me that she thought that I was going to continue therapy to help me learn to work with her. She told me she couldn't back off at work unless I did, A, B, C, D, and E...and I said NO!! You are setting me up for failure. In essence saying if I meet your criteria, THEN you will back off. Well I will NEVER meet her criteria so she will never back off. I told her I cannot continue to work with her and if I find something I will leave. Well, this obvious lack of control bothered her. So I said, "If you are truly trying to sell the business, then this should only make sense to you." Well, I know she is going through the motions. She has no interest in selling. She is just trying to appease me. Then I told her if I had my way we would make the bookkeeper the general manager...............and you should have seen the grimace on her face!!! I called her on the grimace and she said (through her gritted teeth) that there was no way the bookkeeper would ever be GM because she is only a bookkeeper (wrong!!) So I just sighed and said, I am looking for jobs and when a good one comes, I am out of here. She complained about not having meetings, etc. I told her I was meetinged out!! I was so sick of sitting around talking about the problems at work. Now, I just need the DM to call me and tell me when the new DM and RVP are coming through town. I know this waiting is killing me but I really am giving it up. I wonder if my nmom might throw in the towel (doubt it) somehow. She seemed a little worried about me leaving. I told her if we wanted to salvage any part of our relationship, I needed to NOT work with her. I cannot tell you how many times I have told her this. I feel like I am banging my head against a brick wall when I have any interchanges with her!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on February 09, 2007, 07:11:43 PM: I feel like I am banging my head against a brick wall when I have any interchanges with her!!!

That's because you are.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 09, 2007, 07:36:01 PM: Right oh!! If you xrayed my head you would see many concussions......................not dead yet............but my goal is to stop it!! Yikes. She does not get it!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on February 09, 2007, 10:36:38 PM: Your poor head.

((((Kell))))

She really doesn't (and probably can't) get it.

Things will be much better for you when you see her not as an employer...

hoping for the news you need,

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 12, 2007, 07:36:29 PM: Well, I texted the DM who said the new DM and RVP would be visiting all their stores and they wanted to meet me. He said probably sometime this week. But boy, oh, boy - the Assistant Manager who has been running the show for over 3 months probably won't give up control easily. Can't they see that not filling the position for this long is a set up no matter how you look at it? The store is running under the direction of the Assistant and I am supposed to go in there and take over? Not that I am afraid of that because I am very diplomatic......

But after all this if I don't get it I will be disappointed. Although, maybe my nmom heard me (not likely) and will back off 100%!!

Then my aunt said something very telling today. She said my nmom makes up work so she looks busy. And I said, "You have been here a year and already know more than my mom......." She said about practical things yes. Well, my nmom knows some of the catch phrases and some of the theory..........but she doesn't get it. My aunt said she thinks my nmom is fearful of being found out that she doesn't know so she makes any excuse to point out other people's faults...............so we all remember she is in charge.

I'd like to think that this is all a part of God's ultimate plan.............................LEARNING PATIENCE HERE, GOD!!! PRETTY MUCH GOT IT WRAPPED!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on February 12, 2007, 07:41:42 PM: Kell - She does not get it!

Do you get it yet? You are so close!!! Stop beating your head against the wall!!!!

{This is pot (GS) calling the kettle (Kell) black. OR It takes one to know one - from head banger (GS)}
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 12, 2007, 08:13:22 PM: Yes, Kettle, I get it!!! :shock: But I do have my setbacks. Like I said this weekend, I started to back peddle. Then I read some of your posts and I realized SHE DOES NOT GET IT!! AND SHE WILL NEVER GET IT!! AND IF I KEEP TRYING TO CONVINCE HER OF THE WAY IS SEE IT, I WILL JUST BE BRAINDEAD FROM ALL THE HEADBANGING!! aND IT IS NOT EVEN ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!

But I truly expect my mom to do something. One time after my divorce, I was making $24,000 per year at our business. This was not enough to get by so my mom would supplement the income but wanted to know what every penny was for. So I went to Real Estate school and told her I needed to make more money and I refused to continue to have to tell her what every penny was for......................she doubled my salary and said it was because my XNH and I used to make that much and since the business was bought to support my family, she might as well pay me double!!!!

So we will see!! But I do not want her to do something like this to manipulate me into staying!! I'll let you all know and you can knock me into my senses!!! More head banging cannot hurt at this point in my life!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 12, 2007, 08:16:26 PM: I mean, "Yes Pot!!!" Love, Kettle
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on February 13, 2007, 08:11:48 AM: I do soooo hope you get that job. The $ dangling is so unbearably powerful and controlling - especially by a parent. - Pot
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on February 13, 2007, 09:26:30 AM: I know. But is the other company going to ever offer me that job? I have another interview with a new company on Thursday.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: axa on February 13, 2007, 09:33:33 AM: Kell,

Reading your post remeinded me of all the time I wasted trying to get XN to HEAR what I was saying. Deeply regret all that wasted time.

Ok, here goes. Since you and I know she is not going to hear you why are you bothering to tell her?

She cannot manipulate you with money unless you allow it.

Seems to me, no more than myself, you hooked into the N games and manipulation and they are going to continue until you step outside the playing field. I know how difficult it is to be around your NMOM and set boundaries but I think you need bullet proof glass boundaries, so that you can see the games but stay safe.

axa
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kell as guest on February 13, 2007, 09:56:08 AM: Problem is she is my mom and my goal is to set boundaries and still have an ok personal relationship with her. But if I am nice to her she forgets there is a problem. I choose not to fight all the time so I can live in peace. It takes a confrontation for her to remember there is a problem. This whole thing is taking so long that I feel I am spinning my wheels. It also allows mom to come up with tactics to manipulate me . She is a master of guilt and shame and she uses my youngest daughter
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on February 13, 2007, 12:44:21 PM: Kell, that's wonderful that you have another interview.

EXACTLY what to do when you're in limbo.

Your determination and focus on changing this situation ARE going to result in a new job.

I am positive.
Said the Oracle.

hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on February 13, 2007, 01:39:53 PM: Hi Kell,

I posted about a book I'm reading: The Wizard of Oz & Other Narcissists by Eleanor D. Payson.

I think this book could really help you keep your boundaries, while still having a relationship with your Mom.

Kell, I consider myself your friend and as your friend, I ask you to please get this book and read it. I think it will help you so much to manage your relationship with your mom.

Love,
dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 13, 2007, 01:49:21 PM: Wow!! Is there an excerpt on the web??? I am going to Google it. I have told my mom on numerous occasions that I would rather have a good relationship with her then hurting it forever by staying in the job. Isn't it amazing that this women would rather risk my hating her than to let me go without a fight??? I also told her that I didn't want to resent my aunt as well.......I have always had a great relationship with my aunt until she went to work for us. Now I just get irritated by her. I was thinking about asking my mom what in the world did her parents do to them? Why, oh, why would they act the way they do? But as a N she cannot see that she has problems. That is why she said "I thought you were going to continue therapy so you could get over this thing with working with me.........." Stupid. So now I just need to be the great person I am when I talk with these managers and not let my impatience show through. I am afraid I will say something like "Do you really think it is smart to not fill this position for so long???????" Idiots!! I won't................but that is how I feel right now. I have never been through a three month process before!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 13, 2007, 02:21:59 PM: OK, I just went to Amazon and ordered two books - Trapped In the Mirror AND Wizard of Oz and Other Narcissists........I am looking forward to reading them both. Problem is I kind of get off on reading things that prove to myself that my mom is an N. And that is stupid because I already know she is an N. But sometimes I backslide and get back in old ruts. I, too, forget about the conflicts when we are getting along. But I won't. She either leaves or I leave. So I will read these books to make sure I am resolved to get out - then GET OUT!!!

I truly think in the long run she will get over it. It is just the fear of trying to run the place without me (who knows it all............)
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 13, 2007, 03:45:45 PM: So today was a mental health day. Kids didn't have school due to inclement weather. Thanks for all the posts and all the support......I feel I have made some real progress on a Tuesday afternoon!!!!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kel on February 13, 2007, 10:35:42 PM: So my mom just called and said the potential buyer wants to invest money in the business but we run it. She said she would back off and I could run it but he would have a say. I do not think I can trust her. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Hopalong on February 13, 2007, 10:46:54 PM: My thought is stick to your personal plan of getting out, Kell.

Unless it's all spelled out legally and you're SURE she'll back off.

Has she ever offered to before, or is this new?

Hops
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Dazed1 on February 14, 2007, 12:39:32 AM: Kell,

I agree with Hops.

How will you personally benefit by this new investor? Will you make a bigger salary? Will you be guaranteed a salary and if so, for how long?

Actually, things could be worse with an outside investor because then you'd have to answer to N mom, plus the investor.

I don't see how this investor benefits you.

Any possibility of you buying your mother out on a long term installment basis? ie: over 10 years, you will pay her (using cash generated by the store's profits) X amount of money every year?

An out right sale of the store could cause your mom to pay sizable capital gains on the lump sum profit of the sale (assuming there's a profit on the sale), whereas an installment sale could save her tax because she'd pay the tax in installments.

Can you convince your mom to retire to Arizona, florida (where ever) and have her sell you the store? She probably won't go for this idea, because she never wants to retire, right?

Just thinking.

dazed
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kel on February 14, 2007, 06:21:09 PM: Well I went into work and read the guys proposal and I didnt read it the way my mom presented it. I am starting to get irritated at the company where I want to work! It is getting ridiculous! So I am having a hard time praying because I cannot tell what God is doing though all this and I definitely dont want to make a wrong move.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 14, 2007, 10:22:29 PM: My mom said if he came in as a partner she could back off. Thanks for your warnings, girls. I feel the same way. The risk is too high to take her at her word and continue on with such enmeshment and anger. I also think my health will get so much better without all the stress.

But I feel jerked around by the other company. So jerked in fact that if I don't get the job, I am going to express to them my dismay over what I really consider their lack of professionalism..........................and for their lack of concern for the welfare of the store.......
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 15, 2007, 02:42:47 PM: I just got off the phone with another company. I really wowed her. I figured I didn't have anything to lose and I am not desperate. In fact, SHE called me. I posted my resume and she saw it. So I didn't feel like I was going after them. So I did a great job and I knew she loved me. Then she called back and basically told me I could count on about $13,000 per year less than I am making now. Plus this morning I was watching Joyce Meyer and she basically said "sometimes you need to change just so you can grow..." Which confirmed that I really need to leave my job even if it looks like it might be better..................and go with my dream job - IF they offer it to me and at this point I am beginning to doubt it. Once my friend told me - go where the peace is, Kelly, go where the peace is.....so I am waiting for that peace that transcends all understanding...........................I'll go there.
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: pennyplant on February 15, 2007, 02:56:31 PM: You never know. It will be less pay at first. But anything could happen down the line. A foot in the door. That's all you need. Follow your heart and the good things just may follow you!!

Pennyplant
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 16, 2007, 04:26:20 PM: Ok, so after I post this I am on my way for the 4th interview with my favorite company. Not the new DM or RVP but the store manager from another store. Gee Whiz, I started with a store manager, went to the DM, phone interviewed with the RVP, they redrew the lines and I feel like I am back to square one. In with some others who are interviewing for the position. Meanwhile, the DM is REALLY interested in buying my store and when I told him how much my mom wants for it, he freaked a bit. But I told him she is not ready to walk away without a profit.....

So we will see. Either this girl likes me or not!!!!

A lot is riding on this. If I leave my mom will be more apt to sell. The DM should have hired me when he had the chance!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: pennyplant on February 16, 2007, 04:50:18 PM: Hee hee, Kelly, it gets more interesting by the minute!! When they finally hire you, maybe you should just take over. You have more common sense than they do it seems!!!

PP
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Overcomer on February 16, 2007, 08:15:40 PM: Well, PP.....it IS interesting. So I went to the interview and this woman liked me, too. I asked her why they haven't hired me and it pointed right back to the RVP from New York that wanted someone who read fashion magazines and was glam!! Well, now that she is out of the picture both this woman today and the DM both want me and are going to highly endorse me to the new RVP. So I don't think I'll go after the second interview with this other company that called me (or maybe I will - just to keep all avenues open.....)

And I plan on talking to the man who is in negotiation to buy our store. I really want to give him all the information and to tell him about the DM who feels led to buy our store. He was talking about how he needed to do this..................it's weird, I want his job and he wants my job. He doesn't realize how hard it is to run your own b usiness but boy he has years of retail experience!! He could make it successful!!!

So I should know within a week or so!!
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: Gaining Strength on February 17, 2007, 06:18:12 PM: Keep your foot in the door. As long as people want you keep your foot in the door, even if the money isn't right. It is good experience to keep the interview process going.

I am glad things are humming along and hope the deal gets closed on the job you want so much.

Isn't it interesting how lucky you are a decision wasn't made earlier since the NY woman wanted someone "glam". PATIENCE Kell, PATIENCE. - your friend - GS
Title: Re: It's been a long while since I've been here - trauma so I'm back
Post by: kel on February 17, 2007, 09:00:32 PM: THANKS G. I am still amazed at the timing of the whole thing. The gal from yesterday said she has one more interview with someone who has rescheduled 3 Times. I hope I get it. I think I will. I also hope the dm Will buy my store. I told him how much my mom wants for it but I feel he it is Gods will He will make it happen no matter how far fetched it seems.