Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: whoami on December 29, 2006, 05:37:46 PM
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I really don't understand this. Why do N's feel the need to have a claim to fame? Is it that they don't really feel important underneath it all? Thing is, the ones I know are utterly CONVINCED that they are more important than other people. This isn't an "act" it's the way they really perceive things from my observation. To be special, or more important, or better, or some claim to fame, is really what they are wanting, but WHY? Is it to cover the fact that they were never special enough growing up? Or were they perhaps too special in mom or dad's eyes, and it went to their tiny little head?
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whoami
See RM's "something to ponder" thread regarding nism and daylilly's answer
Beautiful description and it takes a big heart to forgive when one has been hurt so much
moon
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whoami, I just want to say that X in my life was a minister's daughter who had to put on a perfect image to the world and the church, so that anything she talks about in her life, has to make her look like she knows important people and is connected to "big names" in some way. What I never did understand, was, when I'd be all impressed about her hooking up with famous singing groups, etc, her response was one of "oh it's nothin...it's just a bunch of guys that I'm driving to a concert." I never did understand why the false humility, yet the constant informing me that she was connected in some way to important people.
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Whoami
I believe it is because they feel so empty inside that they need their "fame" reflected from outside. We all like acknowledgement and praise but we are not dependant on others to know that we have done something worthwhile.
How about this. I made a lovely garden this year. If others admire it well and good, it is sharing it with them but I don't need them to tell me it is good. I can see. I did the work, the plants grew, I can stand back and admire it and acknowledge my part, natures part and rejoice in the joy of it.
XN has a high profile job but is constantly looking for other to see how good he is. Truth is that he is good at his job but he is hungry for others to acknowledge him all the time. He gets no satisfaction. Without an audience they are empty. it is why they are always looking for supply.
axa
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This thread brings to mind a question. Do all of you notice the N's in your life constantly asking you for approval? Do they say "how am I doing?" "Do you think the people liked it?" Is there a constant bid for attention, approval from others, from these people who claim to have it all together, yet deep inside feel terribly inadequate?
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Whoami,
My feeling is that n's need to be fed from the outside in, because they cannot feed themselves from the inside out. The inside is so damaged, that they cannot face it or access it, in order to heal it. No true healing can come from what is attained from the outside.
Most of us certainly appreciate being acknowledged for our accomplishments, being told we look good--especially when we've made an extra effort, or praised for a job well done. But, we don't live for it and die without it. We can gratify ourselves because the inside is whole and complete. If the inside is not healthy in those of us who are not n, we will want to and are able to seek help and actually make progress toward improving that situation.
N's cannot do that because they cannot dig to their core and heal the damage. They will just continue to feed from the outside in, trying to fill the bucket of their soul. But the bucket has a hole and the feed keeps leaking out and continues to need refilling. They cannot seal the hole. That would mean facing the pain which created it in the first place. Over time, they have learned that it is easier to ignore the inside and just keep feeding from the outside.
We can all be so grateful that we are not them.
Brigid
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True. If anything, famous people deeply appreciate being treated as ordinary people like the rest of us. (I have to confess, encountering someone with a combination of NPD and fame brings out the deviltry in me! :twisted: I can't resist having a little fun now and then.)
Bones
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I believe that is the only way my nmom can function. She NEEDS to be adored. She NEEDS to get awards. She NEEDS to be the center of attention. And she steps on anyone who gets in her way. And even if the spotlight is for her and someone else (me, in one case...............) She takes it all for herself.
Ex: We have always been partners in our business. But when we got an award, guess who went on stage? Guess who was featured in the slide show? ONLY her. Why? Because she made it clear to anyone who would listen that it was SHE who did it all. Funny thing is..................it wasn't her...................
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I am crosseyed with the obviousness of how I must relate to my mother to keep the peace.
I literally just feed her some flattery now and then just to keep her going.
It's like feeding some weird sort of alien chipmunk gasoline by eyedropper.
YAAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!
When someone we know is doing well in life, she will come up with a labored anecdote about how they "felt so understood by her" that this "really gave them confidence"...and in some way tells tales about others in ways that always twist it around to be a result of her near-psychic intuition.
If we knew a president, Mom would explain how she was so sweet to that little boy or girl came to the library to return a book one day, that naturally this explains why they are now president.
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGLLLLEEE!
glub.
Hops
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well I think most people would find it interesting if they had a friend that became famous and you met them when say you all were in college....
A bit of interest .But when your life is based on "who" you know you are just not getting it.
This seems shallow ......... ego ego ego
so needy for approval.....
sad
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That is sad and, at the same time, I would think that the famous friend would not appreciate being exploited.
Bones
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Hi Bones
I believe if you had a famous friend and some one else exploited that knowelge ......
The friendship would not be effected at all .
If say the friendship was based on love not the fame but on true love.
Some one Else exploiting that would have no effect at all..........................
moon 8)
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Hi Bones
I believe if you had a famous friend and some one else exploited that knowelge ......
The friendship would not be effected at all .
If say the friendship was based on love not the fame but on true love.
Some one Else exploiting that would have no effect at all..........................
moon 8)
Hi, Moon.
If it's a third party, I can see why it would have no effect at all. At the same time, if an individual, for example, had the personal e-mail address of a celebrity and made a point of bragging about it, even sharing it, the celebrity would NOT be happy about being used and abused in that manner. For myself, I try to put myself in the famous person's shoes and ask myself how would I like to be treated? Then I try to apply the Golden Rule to that other person and to myself. It goes a long way.
Bones
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When I achieved something I always had a sense that XN felt it was HIS achievement or in some way it could not have happened withouth him. The truth is that what I managed to achieve it was dispite him! THis goes back to another thread around their inability to separate from others. As if everyone is an extention of them. That their presence guarantees success and they somehow facilitate the success of others.........crazy if you ask me, but then again so was almost everything else.
axa
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I have always been staggered at how my mother boasts about her accomplishments and so so so so seldom credits 50 years of devotion from my father or a decade from me.
I think it amazes me because she also mentions now and then that she never went home after age 18. She was too busy for her own mother's funeral.
But she's had her family spin around her (particularly me) for 50 years. And used to complain to me so constantly that I never gave her enough time.
I often wondered, LIVING with you isn't enough time? When your own mother never had your help?
Anyway, pointless...I just realized this wknd that I'm surfing a new wave of desire for this chapter to be over, and I can't wish that without wishing for her death...so it's a huge conundrum and inner balancing act, to keep my thoughts toward her patient and compassionate, but at the same time give myself a break because I do feel like a prisoner of her lifespan, and am chafing to have my own life again.
The good part is my new job does bring me interaction, and happiness, and creativity.
Hops
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Well, Hops, my mom is far from needing me to take care of her. I am doomed to be a part of her orbit for a very long time (unless she indeed gets Alzheirmer's - at which time I will be imprisoned by having to care for her.........) I am so excited about the possibility of getting this new job. And yet I am afraid. I am so used to the way things are and I am afraid of jumping out of the kettle and into the fire. But I assume the learning curve of a new job will be uncomfortable no matter what. I was listening to Joel Osteen last night (yeah, not out partying in the New Year!!) and he said that you have to be willing to walk away from abusive relationships......that God has a new plan for your life but you have to MOVE. He was talking about husband/wife relations but it was so appropriate to what we all go through. We need to have enough resolve within ourselves to be brave enough to walk away (even if it is only emotionally) from the orbit and adoration that we find ourselves sucked into by our needy, n people!! So, even if I don't get this new job (BUT I WILL!!!!) I still have the resolve to remove myself from my nmom (and my leachy aunt.....) Can't stand working with either of them. It will be so refreshing to be able to walk away and not look back. No getting irritated at how stupid they both can be. How delusional they both are. It has been a source of my frustration for so many years!! God bless them and I hope they do well. But I plan on doing well without being exposed to them on a daily basis. How knows? Maybe I will start liking them again!
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Kell, I recently got a new assignment at work that takes me completely away from the very people who have been driving me bonkers and causing major stress for me and it does work in giving me a new perspective on all of them. I was getting too enmeshed there I think. For the next two or more months I will hardly see these people at all and will have new people and new duties and learning experiences to fill up my brain and heart with. Forever, there will be less and less room for these people. It feels better already even though the new assignment carries stresses of its own (I have had a tense neck and some form of headache every day for over a week now!) But I think I can manage that kind of stress over time. The other kind, these people who get under my skin and trigger me daily, that one I really needed distance on. And it's helping. I bet your new job will give that to you as well. The problems with Nmom and Naunt may fade or cease to be your problems anymore once you "escape"!
The "claim to fame" thing--
I wonder if it is a way of Ns re-enacting their own FOO issues. The N-types I know each had to contend with the early, traumatic loss of a parent. After which each of them became the saviour of the family. The girls had to become little moms, taking care of younger siblings and the home. Having adult responsibilities thrust upon them at age 10. The boy had to become the man of the house. At age ten.
I thought of this when remembering a story N-coworker told me once. His wife had been visiting, with their children, a relative who had a pool. She was chatting with the relative while the kids amused themselves by the pool, all by themselves. Sure enough, little daughter fell in. The older son immediately dove in and saved her from drowning. The little boy was ten when this happened. I said, so your son is a hero! N-coworker said in response, "Don't you think something like that warrents a phone call from my wife? She didn't even call me, she didn't even tell me first thing when I got there. She just sat there looking at me when I told her she should have called me right away." Not called him to help. Not worried that she hadn't been watching the kids around a pool and that such an accident even occurred. No, he was angry because she hadn't called right away to brag about their son being a hero and saving his sister's life.
N-co-worker had been the hero all his growing up years. Saw his father die in the living room at age ten and became the man of the house for his mom. That is the legacy his son now receives. A boy should always be a hero, an example for the younger siblings and responsible for them, and his heroism should be broadcast to all.
Heroism and claim to fame are learned early by some Ns. That is their FOO legacy that they must re-enact all the time. Heroism is seen as a positive on some level in our society. So, where is the motivation to have an awakening about how harmful this really is? Why change it? People have more negative FOO issues that they do not wish to change. Maybe if I had seen myself as a hero, I'd want to keep seeking that out too :shock: !
Pennyplant
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((Hops)) Wow, you give so much. Sending you much strength, health and much needed rest. seasons
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Hi CB,
You got it. Mom's too "special" to do daycare with other old folks. And what a shame. If she'd been going to senior programs a few times a week for the last decade, she'd have warm friendships (if such an Nish person can) that would be comforting in this last chapter. But as it is, she is very very lucky (as am I) that her morning companion is an absolute joy. This dear woman has humored and coaxed and befriended and tended her with great patience, humor and compassion, and I can't thank her enough. Without her, Mom's isolation would be complete. She spends mornings with her companion and naps much of the afternoon. I get her meal the minute I get home around 6:30 pm, then I put out her pills and retreat upstairs. So far, she can undress herself and get to bed, etc. I do not know what i'll do when she no longer can, because I really can't do that for her because of my back.
One day at a time.
What's more, now Mom is actually too weak to go out much. I took her for a ride tonight, she enjoyed that. (I was taking some papers to her gentleman friend, who's going blind...I'm going to help him get one of those video reading aid machines for people with low vision.)
Seasons, thanks for the hug. I don't do that much. And I'm not responsible in my own paperwork life!
That would be a NYRes except I don't make them (set myself up for guilt). But if I DID make them, it would be to make peace with the idea of taking care of myself. In the sense that tending to my paperwork regularly would be a stress REDUCER, instead of the phobic anxiety marathon I turn it into.
I notice that on a workday, I can get up very early at times and do some of it. I think the reason is that I know I'll be leaving the house and filling responsibilities that I enjoy at work...so I can put in a short spurt of "taking care of my business" at home. But when the weekend looms, I go limp. It's stupid.
love,
Hops