Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board

Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Gaining Strength on January 06, 2007, 02:44:24 PM

Title: personal struggle
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 06, 2007, 02:44:24 PM

Something is bothering me and I am having a hard time putting it into words. 

I think it has something to do with my transition from a fearful, negative person into a positive, hopeful person.  I am so used to expecting bad things.  It definitely comes from growing up with a hypercritical FOO.  I am still astonished at how senstivie I am and filled with expectations of criticism.

I have seen real results as I move into expecting postivie things and yet I have this lingering doubt.  For the first time I am  truly bored with life and as usual am having a struggle to get my life on track.  But getting my life on track has everything to do with staying in the old way of processing my experiences.

For three days I have been trying to get something into words.  And finally I understand how significant the fear, the criticism, the negaivity in my life has been.  I realize that moving into something positive has been more difficult than I expected.  The subconscious power of old tapes is surprising to me.

I realize how important it is for me to write out my goals and put timelines beside them.  Until very recently that was worthless because I was so paralyzed that putting down a timeline would sort of guarantee that it wouldn't get done.  That experience set up another layer of fear.  But I have to remember that that part is past. 

Sorry to ramble but because you are here and someone will read this, I am able to ge it down in words and that actually changes things for me.  If you don't mind, I'm going to post some of the things that I want to change here.  I look forward to sharing with you all as I finally move forward in my life, one step at a time.  It is surprisingly scary. 0 Thanks - GS

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: isittoolate on January 06, 2007, 03:40:06 PM

Hugs to you GS.

I cannot say anything to help you in any way, but I identify with what you are saying. I have always tended to over analyze all these years wondering 'who' certain  people were and why they always appeared happier than I. Why did they emit this certain something/radiance/peace than I felt I was missing?

I feel the fear and have lived with the negativity of my family for so long (67 years now) that I have turned it into 'avoidant  personality disorder', to which the psychiatrist agreed. (If he is wrong, I certainly never intended to fool him.)

That is why my handle is 'isittoolate'.  I have always been sensitive and in fear of criticism. I am seeing how difficult it is to change my pattern of thinking after all these years. The best I can muster, so far, is to be more assertive and that is working for me.

It is very scary to try to move forward. I can see that, and at my age I wonder if I can do it? In the meantime I have put myself into the position of avoiding any fears of criticism by living alone, having no intimate friends and doing my work 'perfectly'. I just say to myself. "You were meant to be a loner" and I am more at peace than ever before. If  'seastorm' reads this she might understand why I grabbed the label of AvPD

I don't mean to hi-jack your new thread and Good On You for getting it started. It comes the closest of any I have read to how I 'think I feel'. I will follow with interest, and I always expect that I am 'talking with' people ever so much younger than I, who have their whole lives ahead of them. I am so glad you were able to put it into words, because I don't think I could have.

Keep on truckin'
Izzy

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Hopalong on January 06, 2007, 03:56:18 PM

Hi GS,
I admire you a lot! I think making a list of goals is wonderful. I think I'd have to use them as affirmations posted, rather than attach a timeline to them (sweaty brain at the thought of new deadlines in my life). But I do think that literally writing big print and posting pieces of paper up where I'm likely to accidentally ponder them (throne room come to mind, anyone?) is probably a very smart thing that I was very stupid not to take action about a long time ago. Thanks to JL (I think it was JL) for the amazing story of posting counter-messages to intentionally heal the pain from a specific incident.

JL...I'm on the wrong thread to answer you, but while I'm at it, I thought I'd mention the reaction I had at the time but didn't post. I don't think you have 43 years of incidents that you have to work so hard to heal in this way one at a time. I think it is a brilliant way to heal something. But if you do this with the most painful memories, say the top dozen or two...I think your psyche and mind will "get it" and because they're attached to your deep healing inner self, which is whole and happy...they will roll along with the process and begin spontaneously cooperating with your conscious healing work.

BRAVO for your inspiration with papering your hallway. Thank you for sharing the story.

Izzy, I'm 56 but feel older just now. Other times I've been 40-feeling-25, or whatever.  I am certain that in a few years, I will feel younger than I feel now. It IZZN'T.

Hops

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Dazed1 on January 06, 2007, 06:06:52 PM

Hi GS,

I think you are well on your way to making this transition due to the fact that you have clearly and succinctly described your problems and your goals.  So, pat yourself on your back and acknowledge to yourself that you have done a good job in identifying problems and goals.  By affirming your good work, you will hear your positive voice, as opposed to your negative one.  Yes, GS, you did a good job!!  Please affirm your good work.

I too had a hypercritical FOO that would rain on my parade by often telling me not to get my hopes up and envisioning worst case scenarios (which is all fear based), so I relate to what you've said.  Like you, I was also raised in a fear based foo and I'm trying to undo the damage.

I have bought so many self help books and CDs, that it's embarrassing.  But, one thing that I have read over and over is that to get rid of the negative voice within, one must deprogram one's mind and substitute one's positive voice.  I have one book on tape that is essentially hypnosis and brain washs the listener into substituting the positive voice for the negative voice.  And, dang!  I think it's hard work, but worthwhile.

When I asked my T how to stop my negative thoughts, my T told me to consciously acknowledge my negative thinking by saying to myself "there's my old friend, negativity".  This helped me because I consciously became aware of my negative thoughts and then I made a conscious decision to look at a situation with both negative and positive thoughts.  Then, I realized that many situations are neither totally negative nor totally positive and that I can focus on either the negative or positive or both.  It's my choice.

So, every time I start to hear the negative voice, I consciously stop it and let the positive voice speak. Also, I try to see the positive in the things I do and then give myself a pat on the back for doing them.  And, when I hear my negative voice, I consciously acknowledge my negative voice and then I look for my positive voice and listen to it.

As I reread your post, I think one of the things you're saying is that transitioning from your old negative thinking to the new positive thinking is taking more time then you'd like and is harder than you thought.  I'm experiencing the same thing.  But, then, I remember that this transition is a process and it will take time and there will be slip ups and I think to myself "that's OK" because it's part of the process.  Then, I pat myself on the back for consciously acknowledging my thoughts.

I think writing down your goals is great, but if putting a due date on it is too much pressure, then, don't put dates down or give yourself more time.  The idea is not to do anything that feels self defeating or makes you feel pressured.  If putting dates down feels self defeating, then don't do it.  Maybe, in a few weeks, if you want to, you can add dates, or not.  It's your list and it's your choice, so do it the way that feels best to you.

Sorry this post is a bit rambling, but when I saw you were talking about the negative voice, it all poured out of me.

with love,
dazed

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: seastorm on January 06, 2007, 07:22:30 PM

Hi GS

I think setting goals is really important. They probably need to be small goals and reachable. There is a quote somewhere that says making a decision to do something starts all kinds of things happening in the universe that you could not have forseen. i think this is true.
A few year ago i made a poster and cut out pictures from a magazine of where I wanted to be in five years. The poster ended up in an out of the way place in the basement. Years later when i was moving I found it. I have bought a place in the country, had a permanent relationship and even the plan for garden and the landscaping by the river was identical.  I was pretty surprised by this.

Just keep going and make friends along the way. The fact that you are considering making goals sounds really positive. Reordering your thoughts to expect somethng positive is a big change. I think it really helps to be able to identify people who rain on your parade and crush out movement in a positive direction.

I hope to see your goals posted here where you can get a cheering squad.

Love,
Seastorm

Sea storm

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: axa on January 07, 2007, 04:56:19 AM

GS

It is such hard work.  I believe identifying goals certainly helps.  Are some of your goals fun?  I think it is important to have balance.  Changing is such difficult work but it does happen.  Ease up on any judgement.  I am looking forward to seeing your goals.  When I made my list I made it to focus myself.  I hope that I will achieve the goals but if I achieve just one, that is ok.  It is more than I have done in the past.

Waiting eagerly,

Axa

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: CB123 on January 07, 2007, 09:02:15 AM

GS,

It's hard to push your way past all the critical thoughts in your head.  Sometimes, it feels like there's a whole Greek chorus in the background! 

I think that the written goals are a good idea.  My experiment with the "ten things to do tomorrow" was very helpful and affirming--even though it took me three days to finish the list!  I guess the trick is to create a challenging list that will push you a bit, and then to be gentle with yourself if it takes longer than planned.  I hope you will post it--I think that will help it remain concrete to you as your work your way through it.

Maybe you could make a list and then go back through it and mark out anything that is only on the list because of the voices in your head?  They can intrude even there and your list could end up being a lot of "oughts" that don't even belong to you.  Maybe make a list, first, of the things that you think are important--a healthy relationship with your son, as you have mentioned before--and then a sub-list that helps you think through what would make up a healthy relationship.  Then small concrete things that would reinforce each thing on the sub-list.  You would end up with a lengthy-looking list, but perhaps it would feel more personal and do-able that way. 

I just thought through that while I was writing to you, but I think I'll try it myself.  I'm plagued by "oughts" these days and it might be a good antidote for me as well. 

Let us know how you are doing.  We'll be your own private cheerleading squad!

CB

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 07, 2007, 09:35:57 AM

Wow - this is so exciting to read your replies, so many good suggestions.  After I posted yesterday, I made a chart with the catagories for my goals.  On review I want to add changing thoughs to positive.  The biggest trick is that what really gets me are those negative things going on below the surface.  The way I know they are there is by the "feeling" that is one of great discomfort, one that sends me wanting to hide.  If I try to express it then I can figure out that it is some dark dread left over from childhood.  I realize that this is the main one to focus on because it trumps everything else.  But here are three of the other catagories - Appearance (I really want to make an effort about how I look.  This goes to that latent feeling of shame and it keeps me from wanting to go out in public - more of that negative thinking.) Exercise (Not only do I want to do this for health but for mental health.  I really need to exercise to overcome depression, anxiety and to help battle that ADD crazy brain.  The negative "feeling" really fights this.  I don't walk because I don't want people to see me - there's a reason for everything.) Business I've had an idea in mind for a long time and I really want to get going on it.  My first timeline goal is to get my business plan written next week.  I have dilly dallied around putting too much before it.  Time to get going.  Thanks for the suggestions to not use timelines to beat myself up.  I will definitely focus on using it to motivate and help focus my activities.

Seastorm your story about your poster is fascinating.  It really emphasizes the value of setting pictures in our mind's eye.  After I posted my struggles with my son I realized that I needed to change my attitude towards him and his behavior and almost immediately I began making great strides.  Yesterday I had a woman come and help me with him and some housekeeping and as I talked to her I realized another attitudinal shift I could make with him and immediately had great results.  Those are examples of how working something out can really make a difference and that is what I find happens when I bring something to the board.  I struggle a little and receive marvelous responses to mull over.

I've said this before, this wonderful group of people function the way I imagine a good family and good friends should function and I am deeply thankful for you all and for finding this place.  I count finding this place as one of the good things that has happened to  me and I use it to remind myself tat things are getting better and better.

many thanks - gaining strength

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 08, 2007, 08:10:58 AM

Another note of thanks for your responses.  Yesterday after I read what you had written I found that I faced my day with a renewed strength and attitude.  There are some silent undercurrents in my life about inadequacies, belonging, rejection, fear of failure and such topics.  But yesterday, your encouragements helped me recognize and overcome them.   I find that if I recognize them and address them, substituting something positive then I can really make significant changes.  That is indeed my true goal.   

There is something magical for me about the help I receive here.  It really changes me and I am thankful.  I am going to carry your help forward today.  I actually got my exercise done yesterday.  I'm aiming for that again today.  -GS

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Peapod on January 10, 2007, 01:48:17 PM

Hey Strength,

Being proud of yourself and your actions every day will give you a peace of mind nothing else in the world could ever give you.
It sounds like you're incredibly strong and self aware - take pride in that, few people in this world really are.

P x

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Gaining Strength on January 11, 2007, 07:49:54 PM

Thank you peapod. And thanks again to CB, Axa, Storm, Hops, Dazed and Izzy.

Since I received your responses I have made great strides forward.  I have exercised 3 times this week.  Tomorow makes 4 - my initial weekly goal.  I have set 2 - 3 tasks a day and accomplished each one of them.  I am getting more and more done.  And best of all I have found that the number one goal is to change my attitude, to change my fear to eagerness. For example, I had a meeting today and had not noticed the mailing in time to call in my response.  I was feeling embarrassed and reluctant to go but I decided to imagine that the group would be glad I came rather than the regular feeling that they would think, "here she goes again.  Not doing things the way everyone else does."  The change really helped.  I am working to apply this to more and more in my life.

I already feel as though I have made a significant switch from dreading the shame of life to going out to meet life.  I am switching the internal message from thinking my changes are just getting to normal and deserve no internal accolades to giving myself credit for making significant changes in my life. 

I am pleased and excited about what the future may bring.  thanks for each of your encouragement.  It has made a real difference. -  your friend - Gaining Strength

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: pennyplant on January 11, 2007, 08:40:49 PM

GS, this is so good to hear.  You've come a long way in a short time.  Yippee!

Pennyplant  :D

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Hopalong on January 11, 2007, 10:41:45 PM

Wowsers, sistah!
GS, what a transformation is underway in you!

thanks for the inspiration.

Hugs,
Hops

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: isittoolate on January 11, 2007, 10:55:44 PM

Hiya GS

I was in on your thread from the first and now I have to say, for myself, lists etc. don’t work for me. Somehow it feels like pressure from somewhere I cannot acknowledge, so I reject my own list of dos and don’ts.

I expect the pressure is from my parents, now dead, but I was always ordered around, and did as I was told, and now I cannot even stand to order myself around! Wow, 67 years of this and I feel like a fool for having been controlled by my parents and siblings for so long. Controlled even by my paternal grandmother and maybe even from their graves. Booga Booga!

I am receiving great advice on this Board and am feeling perky! I am getting, from strangers, the kind if responses I would have liked from family, but the family was so dysfunctional!!

I am glad to live 2000 miles away from them, and try to build a life that is somewhere close to ‘natural’. Being 67, I am not looking for a man. I am looking for ‘peace’ and perhaps some semblance of good communication with my daughter, now 42.

I used to know my grandson, until age 4½. But he is 20 now, and my granddaughter, until age 2, who is now 17. A 3rd was born after I was dismissed from the N’s property. He is now 14. I know NOTHING about him.

I believe for me that I, and only I can identify what is FOR me—as the words are thrown out here, I can tell.

Like CB was saying, I hope that everyone here is glad to see me!!

Lemme post my d and gd.

I force myself to not miss them. These are when both were/are 17. Imagine trying to force yourself to forget you have a daughter and 3 grandchildren. Maybe I have an internal struggle that's killing me--look at these faces.!!

Love Izzy

(http://www.copwt.ca/anita.jpg)      (http://www.copwt.ca/Maggie.jpg)

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: pennyplant on January 12, 2007, 06:11:20 AM

Oh my, what beautiful young women!  They just glow.  Izzy, I don't think you can make yourself not miss them.  This is a big missing piece.  I don't  know what the answer is.  But it's pretty big not to have them in your life.

I'm reminded of someone I know who was given up for adoption at age one or so.  She loved her adoptive parents but never gave up wondering about her biological parents.  She was adopted in the 30s when unmarried mothers were a complete scandal.  During her career days she had access to the adoption records of our county.  So she looked and found the name of her biological mother.  She tracked her down and made many attempts to have a meeting with her.  She had so many questions.  Such a yearning to find her and know her.  But her mother, who is still living today, in her 90s probably by now, cannot make herself have a face to face meeting with her daughter.  Shame probably.  About things she had little control over, no doubt.  This "rejection" tormented my friend no end.  But she finally came to terms with it.  It really wasn't a rejection.  The one thing she has promised herself is that if her mother dies first, she will go to that funeral and no one will stop her!

Another thing she learned is that over the years, her mother had followed her life and knew about her and the family she went on to have.  There had been a somewhat invisible connection the whole time.  It still broke my friend's heart that the face to face meeting is to be denied her.  But she did come to terms with it eventually.

My point here is that each person brings their own experience to each situation.  Some of these experiences are next to impossible for the person to overcome for some reason.  Real sticking points that effect everything in their lives.  I have no idea why you have this disconnect with your daughter.  You can only bring your real self into it.  She only has her real self to bring to it.  And her whole history of experience.  And your history of experience is yours alone.

This is just my opinion from out here in the ether.  But I think you should allow yourself to miss your daughter and her family.  Within reason.   Self-blame should be only a small part of it.  She brings her own self into this.  That is hers to deal with and live with.

Thanks for telling us about you.

Pennyplant

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: axa on January 12, 2007, 02:00:14 PM

One of my personal goals this week was to colour my hair.  Don't like the grey bits and cannot afford to go to the hairdresser at the moment too expensive.  Well, I choose ash blonde to compliment my skin tone and quelle suprise..... it turned out dark brown!!!! WHO IS THAT LADY IN THE MIRROR..... MADE ME LAUGH OUT LOUD.  Think I'll save and get it done professionally next time.


love to all

axa the new brunette!!!!

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: isittoolate on January 12, 2007, 09:48:36 PM

Hi pennyyplant

(from where did this handle come?)

I wrote and wrote and lost it and I will likely not be able replicate it, but I will try! I thought I was doing well.
How odd that you were the only redhead and I was the only not redhead. Maybe we were switched at birth? But you aren’t 67!! OMG there is another place I lost it….not here!

What a sad story about the 90 year old mother who won’t see her daughter.

The disconnect, I believe, and won’t know until my daughter admits something, follows.
When she met the guy, an N, she was 19 and he was 30. I believe N because she changed and spoke to me in disrespectful terms, as did he. I was so confused that I didn’t see he had her under his control.  (I didn’t know about N-ism then and I thought my daughter was following Princess Di and her New love Prince Charles, somewhat older and rich.)

However, along with his manner, the fact he arrived in a 10-yr old truck, had to buy new shoes to meet me….I was wary, but not aware. When, in a few months they announced they would be married the next June, I was distraught. She would have finished only one year of University and I had seen him only once., maybe twice.

There was something ‘defensive in her attitude” but I couldn’t get her to talk. When I suggested she wait, as if it were real love it would last, she barked at me, that she” loved him, was marrying him and if I didn’t like it I could stay away from the wedding”. (1984)

I was being dominated by him through her and it hurt me very much. I didn’t know what to do!

They married and she lived in isolation and poverty and had 2 children. I was always there for the children, one until he was 4½ and the girl until her 2nd birthday. Lordy how I loved them, and that was the day he told me I was no longer welcome on his property. May 11,1991. Happy Mother’s Day !!

I feel that she cannot admit to me that I was right in the first place, and she left him in 1994, divorced in 1996, while he owed me $55,000.00, all loaned for the sake of my daughter and grandchildren.

Then I sued him for the money. It’s all repaid now, but first child, grandson, now 20 lives with Dad and is as much an N as his father. How disappointing.  I asked daughter once how she would feel if one of her children turned against her and she said it would never happen. It did! Daughter has the other 2. I never knew the youngest as he was born after I was cut out! 14 now.

The reason I have the pic of the 17 year old is that there was a wedding and a sister took a picture and sent to me. I knew my daughter worked part time and went to university part time. It took her 5 years and she is now a mid-wife, owns her own home and I guess all is well, but I don’t hear much via email.  Have no idea about the g’kids let alone her.

I feel I just have to dismiss them from my life as this disconnect cannot be rectified. Not from my point of view

Love
Izzy

(http://www.copwt.ca/shiningcross.gif)

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: isittoolate on January 12, 2007, 10:02:35 PM

My dearest GS
(http://www.slrkelowna.ca/rose.gif)(http://www.slrkelowna.ca/rose.gif)(http://www.slrkelowna.ca/rose.gif)

I h-jacked your thread again and I am truly sorry.

To quote you: And finally I understand how significant the fear, the criticism, the negaivity in my life has been.  I realize that moving into something positive has been more difficult than I expected.  The subconscious power of old tapes is surprising to me.
that statement was/is a big help to me as i feel the same. I am searching for the negatives and many thoughts and words are reminding more than what I "held on to"--negatively. There are so few--if any--positives.

I feel as though I must relive 67 years to get it all straight! and I have a post to answer about my eyebrows!!!! How petty of me!!

Love
Izzy

(http://www.copwt.ca/images/avoid/FrayofSun.gif) Please pardon the language. It came from the Internet

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: pennyplant on January 12, 2007, 11:10:16 PM

What terrible damage the Ns can do.  I would say he destroyed your family.  I am glad your daughter got away from him eventually.  But she did lose her son to him.  I guess this is one of those situations that has to be let alone.  Such a shame, though.

Pennyplant (is what I used to call Silver Dollar Plant, Money Plant, Lunaria.  When we moved into our house, it came with several English type gardens.  In one of them, the Money Plants grew all over the place.  They just seed themselves every year.  I like how they transform throughout the spring, summer, and fall.  Purple flowers, then the petals drop off and the pods grow.  Purplish green and small at first.  Then green and the size of coins.  Then they dry up and look kind of brown and dusty.  Then the reward of whiteness in the late fall.  Transformation is sort of my theme in life.  So, it fits to call myself Pennyplant.)

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: Hopalong on January 12, 2007, 11:31:09 PM

Izzy,
I apologize for my fantasy letter to your daughter.
Please forgive me.
I can't imagine how painful this has been for you.
(Well, I think I was projecting, too, because I had a short-term estrangement with my D that half killed me. Aha. So that's where that letter came from...)

I am truly sorry. One day, I wouldn't be surprised if a grandchild doesn't seek you out.
And how happy she would be to discover a grandmother with such humor and life!

In the meantime, you're not wasted.

Your brightness and presence are lifting me.

Hops

Title: Re: personal struggle
Post by: isittoolate on January 13, 2007, 04:27:24 PM

hi Hopalong,

You are forgiven.

I read this before (your post) and couldn't connect it to anything, then finally was on the thread where your letter was.

It is a great letter, but at this point it is not what would help her and me.

Not too much exciting happens in my life but I do want to start sending her emails that have nothing to do with N-ism, the split, whatever, nothing negative, just positive.

I do enough crazy things, I just might make her laugh again, as she did as a young girl.

love and hugs
Izzy