Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: lighter on May 28, 2007, 01:09:50 PM
-
How do N's respond to being well and truly dumped by Secondary N supply?
-
I don't understand what you mean by "being well?' I can't grasp the question. Amo
-
Hi Ami,
I think lighter is using the phrase "well and truly" as in 'completely' or 'thoroughly'.
mud
-
I went for the last one, but isnt that a bit insulting to rats? some rats can be quite sweet and cuddly compared to most N's even rats that live in the sewer and eat their own doo doo! :D
-
what are the textbook answers to the question? I think it depends on how severely his/her
problem really is??
Sweetgrass
-
I chose the "scared and living like rats" one, since:
#1 I've lived it.
#2 Several of the ones could have been chosen, in which the N treated the victim as a supply source, till a new one came along. As long as they have SOMEONE, they will simply
a.) rub the old supplier's nose in the fact that they never COULD have been as good as the new supplier is, and of course "it's best that we found this out now rather than continue on in a relationship that would have been a lie, right?"
b.) move on with the new supplier quite undaunted by the old person, and having "put that all in my past."
c.) just plain really don't give the old supplier another thought, maybe as long as they live, since this might just cause something N can't handle...GUILT and REFLECTION ON THEIR OWN BEHAVIOR TOWARD THE OLD SUPPLIER...yipes...can't have THAT now, can we?
-
I chose "several of the above but they'll be fine" because in my experience, it's true.
Most of the Ns I have known are just continuing to skate right along with the same behaviors and no reckoning.
That is a part of reality I have accepted now. That there is no guaranteed justice. Injustice is wrong but it is real.
Hops
-
Hoppies,
You are so right, and, it still amazes me to this day, how a person can wound another, think nothing of it, not give a second thought to how the other person must feel, where it left them at in their life, or maybe even reconciling with them at some point. I just don't conceive of such self-centeredness...and then, of course, seeing the one they deserted as the one who victimized THEM. UNREAL.
~L
-
How do N's respond to being well and truly dumped by their victims?
I agree with all of the following, but voted for ***
They don't care who provides the thrills, once IT is replaced the old source is forgotten completely 4 (21.1%) ***
Owning victims is nothing more than doing pushups, when one leaves another takes its place 0 (0%)
They aren't much affected by the comings and going of victims, as long as there are victims in the pipeline, life is good, the game is on 0 (0%)
Several of the above but they'll be fine 1 (5.3%)
Several of the above but they'll always be scared and living like rats 9 (47.4%)
The closest thing I've seen to a moment of self-examination was far from it. H described something to me about the fact that he did not cry at his first wife's funeral... He seemed to think that others thought that was odd... I am the replacement supply. If I died, I am certain that he would not shed a tear. If I dumped him, he would say that our differences were entirely due to my problems, and I think that he would actually believe it, to the extent that denial equals belief. He would focus only on replacing me, with someone who wouldn't "give him a hard time."
-
Reallyme,
What you said I so agree with! I am living it! My N-ex(soon to be) treats me like I stepped all over him. He goes to great lengths to be the victim.I guess I should stop trying to figure it out, because it takes up a lot of my brain time, and he really isn't the one I want to be thinkin' about!
Thanks for saying that, I feel better knowing others have felt the same.
McGirl
-
McGirl:
I'm amazed at how well they can present themselves as victim.
I'm tyring to figure out if they lie so well bc they actually believe the lies (pathological) or if they simply lie so well bc they don't have any guilt and it suits them?
At some point, I won't care or the lies will catch up. Hopefull, both.
<whew> Just so glad I don't have to figure it out. His problem, not mine.
-
I voted for As long as they are the victim they'll be fine, because that's my mom. Always the victim.
-
Hops,
That is a part of reality I have accepted now. That there is no guaranteed justice.
Just one of the hazards of being a universalist, I guess. :P
mud
-
Doesn't feel like a hazard, Mud...
I believe in fighting for justice for people in this life. That's what's noble about law, not that it works all the time. But its intent is noble.
I don't believe you can get justice for a personality disorder that has harmed you.
Not legal justice, anyway. It's why life is unfair. And why luck means a lot too.
The only personal, moral justice is apt to be forgiveness, as I understand it.
When I get there, and it's really released, I feel I've gained, rather than just gotten rid of.
(But anyone who has vengeance fantasies about an N, been there, done that, my sympathies!)
Hops
-
Sweetgrass,
Text book. Sometimes I wonder if there is such a thing for narcissism. But then, I've read and come to understand an awful lot about it either from walking through certain experiences or studying those of others.
How are you doing?
tt
-
Hi Hops,
I was just making a joke, admittedly a pretty lame one, about the difference between a universalist's and a Christian's view of justice, based on what each believes happens in the life to come.
I believe in an entirely just universe, wherein perfect justice is eventually meted out, albeit not on my preferred time scale.
mud
-
Well...mebbe Dust to Dust is in fact justice.
And we just don't know it.
How many UUs does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
None. You can't replace light bulbs with Unitarians. They complain too much when you try to screw them in.
Present for you, Mud: http://stoney.sb.org/uujokes.html
:D Hops
-
i agree that there is no justice if you have been betrayed by a narcissist. That is the centre of the hurricane of surviving a relationship with one. OnCe the penny drops that the N has no conscience, remorse, accountability, responsibility etc.
What is replacing justice for me is knowledge. This only goes so far. However, from what I have read they are on the spectrum of disorders which include being psychopathic, anti social, sociopathic and brain disordered. TheIr brains are wired differently. I wish that I had known this information long ago. As it was, it was a miracle I came upon it. My sister casually mentioned narcissism and I looked it up. So I have been able to make sense of what happened and gain some insight. This is not exactly healing me and I still have the searing grief feeling and wake up scared and don't trust people. But I have a well developed system of knowledge to help order the cruelty and casual disregard. It definitly helps.
It also helps to think of ex in terms that are invented by James.
Sea storm
-
Did anyone ever watch SIX FEET UNDER regularly?
There was a scene in the 5th season where the gay brother is driving the van. He just picked up a woman's body.
On the side of the road he sees a cute boy signaling for help. He stops. The boys gives a story about running out of gas, his grandma is waiting for him, could he get a ride and some gas?
You see a satisfied smirk of attraction wrapped in helpfulness as the brother lets the guy into the van and agrees to help out.
The guy turns out to be a psycho and beats him and makes him do drugs and they have sex and then the brother ends up covered in gasoline expecting a match to fall. It doesn't.
Later when he goes to visit the perp in jail, the guy is whining about how his victim is the only person he can count on. He really depends on his visits blah blah blah. The brother looks repulsed and says..., "I hate you." Cute physcho boy blathers on obliviouse, just trying to work his game bc the game IS HIM.
If you saw it you know how sick nad awful his going back and forth between sweetness and "my daddy died when I was 8" and being a murderous violent attacker with no remorse. It reminds me of how I feel around N.
-
OK... at this point.... my N has been truly dumped.
He can fight and extend the death of our relationship but... he can't stop it.
He doesn't have any real friends of his own he's so toxic everyone he's ever dealt with knows what a liability he is.
He continues to reach out to my friends and family for support but they're dwindling as they realize the extent of his disorder and my resolve to divorce him.
He continues to take other women and I think that if my friends and family left him to his own devices he'd go through several levels of self destruction that would hurt him, if I survived them physically.
What happens next? Do they finally get it and leave us alone when it's clear we're leaving?
Do they go manic active and DO things that make it look like they're over us?
Do they get quiet and just fade away?
Do they fabricate evidence in every direction designed to make us look bad and make them look victimies?
Do they go down in a fiery ball of crazy behavior if they can't find good enough secondary N supply?
Do they go after the naughty secondary supply if it won't comply?
I know lies are coming. I know he'll do anything to save a buck but..... where does it end and when does it end. DOES IT END?
-
It ends when you snip the last thread of either dependency or the thought of rescue.
Hops
-
It ends when you snip the last thread of either dependency or the thought of rescue.
Hops
And it's just that simple..... like alchemy or something lighter than air. The difference between praying and going through the motions..... snipping the threads.
So timely, Hops. Thanks for this post.
-
(((((Lighter)))))
-
Light,
I agree with hops. All those thing you wrote your way ahead of the game. See you know there next move only your not playing.
Yes it will end now.
Deb
-
Deb.....
I'll just take your and hop's word on this.
I'm still unsure how bad the devistation and fallout will be.... so many threats.... so hard for N's to lose.
If he'd just find someone else to bother.... and leave us alone... or keel over from natural causes.
Duoh! Did I say that out loud? Again?
I'm really ready for this to be over!!!!!
-
Light,
That is the biggest thing when it's a done deal (with us) you just don't know what their last trick will be (if any) but we do know most likely what they will pull. As much as they get to know us (we get to know them) He will surely USE from knowing you and how you tick your weakness. Think about yours. What would work to his advantage to make you react to how he wants you to. This will be your biggest power here (knowing your own weakness) and turning it around. Block that hit.
Keep your smarts and you have plenty. Always be one step ahead in your thinking.
My biggest thing that worked for me was I showed no reaction. I wanted to pull my hair out from restraining my action/emotions but I kept control. Shocked the hell out of my H.
There is nothing that he can throw your way any curve ball that you cannot handle. You are done.
Most criminals keep the same motives. I think of them in this sense. They commit crimes against human emotions.
What do you think he would use, Fear, guilt, jealous, humiliate?
Pick out the ones he already tried and try to figure the last he will use and just be ready. Prepare your self so it won't be so hard. You will already have an idea whats coming.
These were the last of my H's tactics. The others he already had done.
I kind of had an idea already that this would be the last attempts of control so it backfired on him. I did not react because I already expected that it was a possibility and dealt with it before it even happened.
Do they go manic active and DO things that make it look like they're over us?
Do they get quiet and just fade away?
The 2nd and last was the best, quiet and faded away.
I really hope that yours will just be quiet and fade away too or an earthquake will happen only where he is standing swallow him up and send him straight back to hell.
Oh! did I say that out loud too!
Deb