Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Hopalong on June 02, 2007, 09:23:05 PM
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Hi all.
Another tough daughter moment, I could use some...oh, just compassion, I think.
I just keep banging into her controlling, rejecting declarations that leave me walking on eggshells and feeling so hurt.
This time, it's her demand that I leave town if she comes to see her grandmother because she doesn't like being with both of us at the same time. (I had told her I wanted to attend a church conference if I could, and she said she'd take care of her grandmother.)
A nice offer, and I thanked her. But then she kept insisting, register, make sure you're going, I may have friends visit, etc. And I started to feel she was ordering me out of my home. I haven't registered for the conference because I'm waiting to hear about a scholarship.
(Plus, I feel the pain of her stating that because we had a bad time at the beach last year, we can't vacation together again. It's like, she's decided it would be terrible so she won't allow any healing. Whenever I start to relax and feel happiness about us again, she lowers the boom.)
It has to stay negative and hurtful or she's not happy. And I am hurt and I just stuffed myself with food and I am so afraid of losing her forever (hence, the NC with mothers stories here strike a nerve)...and on the other hand, it's terribly painful to admit to myself that in some ways I don't like her--
At times---she's mean. And cold. And reminds me of her father. I think that scares me most, because on some level, I truly gave up on him, when he was mean for the last time. I just snapped and realized I could not stay married.
I DON'T WANT TO DIVORCE MY ONLY CHILD.
She refuses any therapy, just as her Dad did...so nothing I learn here, or in therapy, can be shared with her...she just turns away. Back to the violent movies and boxing matches with her new friends--her bleak little apartment.
I worry and grieve and have a hard time with this, that's all. There are things in her history that scared me to death, and decisions she made that haunt her (but we're not allowed to talk about).
I have to let go, I know that. I have to give her all the space she needs. It is just very very hard to act like I'm not affected when she orders me to do this or that, which amounts to disappearing.
She's my only child.
Hops
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This sucks.
:?
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((((((((((((((((((((Hops, tender heart, hurting heart))))))))))))))))))))))
tt
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Thank you Storm, and TT...
Hops
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Dear Hops,
I am so sorry for the pain that you are going through. I wish that I could give you a big hug and a cup
of tea.
It is hard to get a "feel" for what has transpired. It is hard to offer anything concrete because the details you provided don't give a window that would allow me to give any concrete suggestions.
I know from my relationships that are" difficult", the dynamics could be relatively easy to fix or hard depending on many factors. These factors would include the individual people, and the types of pains that led to the problems..
If you care to be more specific, I, for one., could comment. However, I can only send my heart to you in friendship and sadness for what you are experiencing . Love and a Big Hug Ami
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Dear ((((((((((((((((Hops)))))))))))))))))
Ringing a bell here!
Is the ???? that you cannot talk about something that gives her "power over"?
Even though my daughter has told me to stop living in the past, she has a couple of past issues that give her "power over" me.
I don't like to not like her either, but I haven't quite put her in an N-mode even though she had a good teacher in ex husband the N.
Love
Izzy
(hard to love yourself when a daughter turns against you---makes one think about being a total failure----but she has more genes than just her mother's.)
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Hi Ami,
Last summer, with no provocation other than being together, my D wound up screaming in my face that she hates me and hates her grandmother (I moved in with my mother after my D left for college, and my mother being an N, it was very difficult for my D to be shoved off center stage...my mother's demands that everything revolve around her meant that my D no longer got my F/T attention.) I felt pulled in two.
My D told me then that I'd chosen my mother over her. She's never forgiven me I think. All my appeals and apologies don't make a dent.
Hi Izzy,
It's not something that gives her "power over", it's something she feels guilt about. She shared it with me so it's an elephant in the room. But I'll leave it there.
I honestly don't know if she's an N or not, a clone of her Dad or not. I'm just isolated with my worries about it and don't know what to do. I think the answer is, I need to do nothing.
I need to just continue my life and be as fulfilled and happy as I can. And hope and pray we reconnect.
I panic when I think I can't make things better between us. But that's stupid.
Weekends are the most vulnerable time. I have things in my own life I need to take care of, that I just neglect. At work during the week, I'm happy. I'm competent and creative and appreciated.
Things like this hurt, and maybe they should not: I mentioned that I was starting a side business. My D has not asked me one thing about it, ever. She has no interest. I mentioned that I went here or there or did this or that. My D never says one word about anything in my life. Never asks.
When she does call for comfort she just starts talking about being frustrated in her job, and I am sympathetic and supportive, and then we role play ways she can deal with her bosses, etc. But she only talks about herself. She'll ask me how her Gma is occasionally, but never asks how I am.
I think she loves me, in some way. I just go through times when I feel very unsure of who she's becoming. That's what this is about.
Sorry all. Must be unpleasant to read such an insecurity fit.
thanks for listening.
Hops
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My D never says one word about anything in my life. Never asks.
..... but never asks how I am.
It's the same here and with our last encounters, I was being put down for just about everything I wrote--spelling errors, misquotes, wrong years, wrong memories--yet I wasn't always wrong. I never corrected her, as there would have been more back and forth about nothing.
I have stepped back and am curious what Therapist will say!
When I emailed D about that, there was no response and hasn't been
((((((((xx)))))))))))))))))))))
Izzy
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Hops,
Oh hops, (((hugs))) my heart is breaking for you. I wish there is something I could say more. I wish there were something I could do more to comfort you. It hurts, ouch!
Love
Deb
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Hops and Iz,
There's no heartache quite like that of a mother for her child. I'm so very sorry that both of you are enduring that kind of pain. I just don't know what to say except, try to step back a little, cut them as much slack as you must for the time being, and allow that sliver of light through the door to represent hope for a more satisfying future with your girls.
tt
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Hops,
I'm so sorry. There are no possible words of advice that could help. You only need someone to sit with you and be sympathetic--I volunteer!
People change. I believe she will change. In the meantime, you need to take care of yourself. If you do that, I don't think you will feel as badly.
You will be in my thoughts this weekend, Hops. You know you are special to all of us here--that doesnt make up for what you are going through with your daughter, but it may soothe you to know it.
Love
CB
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You and I both need to take a hold of agreement number 2 and stop taking so much personally (I think that's what you might be doing. I sure recognize this in my own relationships).
Maybe it is true that most of what your daughter says and does has nothing to do with you and everything to do with her?
I guess all you can do is accept her the way she is and I agree, people change, so she might some time. It's ok to hope!
But how much time do you want to worry yourself and suffer pain over this thing that you have no control over? (her words and actions)
You don't have to divorce her but rather your reactions to what she says and does (easier said than done, I know, but it is possible to do).
It's almost like dealing with an alcoholic in that when you stop responding to their drunken slurs by leaving the room or house; when you quit cleaning up their messes and begin taking care of yourself; when you stop feeling upset with them and work on feeling good about you; when you stop trying to help them to see the errors of their ways and start making your own way better, living your own life and enjoying it>>>>>
>>>>they are suddenly left to deal with themselves and their own choices.
Something to think about anyway.
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Thank you for this question, Anon:
how much time do you want to worry yourself and suffer pain over this thing that you have no control over?
It is crazy-making and I need to stop it.
You're also completely correct that I was taking it personally.
Hops
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Well, it's just all about D isn't it?
You chose her grandmother over her. No thought of Grandmother's needs, nor yours. Only her own.
Never asks about how you are or what's going on with you. Not even when you throw her a big ole soft ball with the side business discussion, something about which she could easily feign interest (I call this "weak affirmation" when N's do it), if she cared to appear to have a half-way normal level of concern about her own mother. Nope.
Sounds to me like she got used to your taking care of her when she was a child, and she expects you to continue in that role forever. Maybe she needs a wake-up call. Your mother may need you more than D does now. At some point, normally, people grow up and the roles reverse. Child cares for parent.
Maybe you can explain to her that your mother cared for you as a child, and now that you're a grown woman, and your mother is aging, you feel good about taking care of her. You are returning the favor. Hint. Hint. This is what people are supposed to do. Correct form requires it and shouldering one's responsibilities with grace makes us feel good.
It all sounds pretty N to me. Sorry to say this. Maybe she just learned it from her dad. If so, perhaps she could change over time. Her relationships with her peer group may require her to look inward, eventually, if she can.
Regarding her desire for you to vacate your home while she's there, I think you might want to just play it cool. You can tell her that your decision about the conference depends upon what you hear about the scholarship. Tell her that you'll keep her apprised. Don't let her get to you. You know she wants you to react to her. That's her game. Your negative reaction satisfies her. She has a really bad habit going there. As her mother, I think that the best thing you can do for her, and for yourself, is to step back, respond slowly, focus on the current situation, and keep it really impersonal. If D starts with the personal stuff, just don't respond. Don't let her suck you in.
Just my opinion. Hope you can find a good way to deal with this.
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Sorry you're going through this (((Hops)))
All you can do is treat her the way you want her to treat you.
I don't like the thought of her speaking to you with disrespect. I don't like to think of her hurting you over and over again and you standing there, taking it on the chin and asking for more. This may not be the way it is but, I don't want it to be the case.
I will say this, doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting a different outcome, is the definition of insanity.
What can you do differently that protects you and perhaps leads to her behaving differently in your relationship?
I can't tell if she's being hurtful to you as a cry for help or if she's comfortable with this relationship bc that's what she's learned.
Sorry again (((Hops)))
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Thank you, Confounded, a lot of wisdom there.
I don't think I'll glue the label on her now...that won't help me either.
But stepping back, not taking everything personally, that will.
And not being vulnerable to the hooks, I will work hard on that.
Right now, I think superficial friendliness w/o vulnerability is wise.
Lighter, Hi, and thank you too.
I think I need to breathe and be busy, remember that weekends
are a vulnerable time, and I need to fill them with happy work,
instead of retreating to my room to oversleep and overintrospect...
that sort of opens me up to panicking and clutching.
If I quit that, things will be better, I'm sure of it.
I need to remember I am a strong and capable 57-y/o woman
who has learned some stuff the hard way, but worthwhile stuff.
Self respect. That's what's required for her to treat me respectfully.
thanks, all, doing better today...and I'm going to think of other things.
love
Hops
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I'm glad you're feeling better Hops.
I'm taking the morning easy. I've cried and felt deeply sorry for myself and now it's time to get dressed and do something positive.
I'm thinking a regular visit to the gym, starting this afternoon, is a good idea. It's something I know I need to add back into my self care routine.
Of course, now I'm worrying about conversations with people who'll want to speak to me at the gym, and there's always some extrovert who does, lol. I get a little anxiety attack when thinking about what I'll say to them. I don't want to talk about my life right now. I just want to work out and be left alone without being judged hostile or unbalanced, lol.
Bleck on having to field any questions about me now. How in the heck do I find introspection and peace in a crowded room?
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Headphones, hon.
Good for you for going to the gym, Lighter!
Hops
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Hops,
Been thinking about you. You really have a lot of weight on your shoulders right now. You must be exhausted.
You have taken over care taker of your mom and worrying about your daughter. Then you have to get up to go to work and do that job too.
I think you really need to take that beach vacation. Don't burn your self out, hon.
Sit back take a deep breath and try to turn off to some of the things even if for an hour.
I'm sorry you are having such a heavy heart right now.
Just wanted you to know thinking of you.
Love
Deb
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((((Hops))))
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Must be unpleasant to read such an insecurity fit.
no, but insecurity is interesting because that's how I would deal with it- by choking down my insecurity and being pushed out of the house leaving daughter with her grandma time and go to the conference.
Take back my feelings on it because it's not going to happen how I'd like....but what feels right to happen etc.
One of the lessons I am learning about ongoing things with my ex is- he is usually IN THE WRONG, because of the way he goes about things, but not always necessarily WRONG.
Would you enjoy the conference and a break from your mum? Then go.
(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
Much love to you
~W
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How'ya doing today Hops?