Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: motheroffour on July 11, 2007, 09:17:51 AM
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Went to bed last night thinking of some many things I read yesterday from this board. This morning I woke feeling two major emotions. Anger and frustration about an experience I had 2 years ago. I hope it is ok to share that. Maybe some of you wiser ones can help me to process it to the letting go place.
Two years ago, I really hit bottom. My husband is addicted to pornography. I had been sexually abused by a man and a woman when I was a child. His addiction was re-traumatizing. He was in denial. I was just starting to come out of my denial and pushing him to get help or I would have to consider leaving. I had been part of this N family that was , as I have already explained, perfect. They don't yell at me. But they control, undermine, use my stuff against me, etc. But at the time, I really bought into all of it. I thought that I was the prob. Thought that I was the one that was causing all the problems just by being myself. I had just had a baby. It was a high risk pregnancy and I had been in bed for months. My husband resented me for getting sick and for getting pregnant. Tuned me out. Emotionally checked out. Blamed me for ruining his happiness. In an attempt to help him deal with the difficult circumstances, I agreed to move in with his parents until the baby came. My MIL jumped at the chance to serve. She jumped into my role as mother with my 3 kids. At the time, I did not understand N. I became so confused and unprepared for the shame and control that would come to me for being sick. I became very depressed. My husband thought I was so ugly....ghastly even....as a pregnant woman. My body would work. I couldn't walk and I had constant pain. Anyway, after the baby came I was so happy to get into my home. My MIL wouldn't let go. Was at the house before 6am. Being independent and wanting some privacy, I asked her for space. She ignored me for 7 days. That final day she came to the house, got impatient because i hadn't bought the right cleaner for my fridge and I blew. I said I couldn't take it. That I was sorry I didn't have the right cleaner. Could she please go. I need some space. Well, I am still paying the price for that one. (story for another day)
Long story short, I was stressed for a long time. One day, my husband told me that he had fantasied about me dying, so that when his brother passed (he has Cystic Fibrosis), that he could marry his wife. She is smart and pretty and young. Well, I hit the floor. Depression, self hatred, pain !
It was the final straw. On Thanksgiving morning (ironicallly it was the anniversary of our first date), I checked myself in a hospital. I still remember the intensity of pain on my children's faces as I left that morning. All I could think about was killing the pain inside me. And at the same time healing the pain with whatever means I could. So desperate. Didn't have any intension of suicide, but was really battling the thoughts. The ER told me that because i hadn't attempted anything that I could join their program and leave whenever I felt I was ready. They lied. They took me upstairs and locked all the doors. took my clothes, my bags, my jewelry--everything. Patted me down like I was enter juvy. I was so scared. Told them this wasn't what I thought it was. Told them I wanted to leave. Wouldn't let me. Called my husband for help. He felt bad but didn't act to help me. Alone in my very cold room, I prayed for help. A sweet feeling came to me. I was being told to have peace. To accept that I was there and to learn whatever I could. That He (God) would be with me when I got out. So, I changed my attitude. Gave it all my effort. Learned some great stuff. Found that "self" i had lost.
This morning when I woke, I felt so angry about this experience. Angry that I let so many things take me down. Angry that I didn't fight for myself. Angry that it happened. Angry at the hospital. Angry my husband didn't do more to help. Angry that I let myself get so low. Angry I lost myself. Angry I lost my self respect. Angry I thought about ending my life. Angry about my H's family system. ANGRY!!! that I was so alone and lost.
Well, anyway. I don't feel so angry anymore now that I have finished typing. I somehow feel better. Somehow I feel grateful.
PS. While I was in the hospital, my husband told his family about the sitation. They congratulated themselves on not being like me. Didn't understand it then. Grateful I do now.
Thanks for listening. --mof4
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((((((((Mo4)))))))))) Hugs to you.
What your husband said to you is so far beyond cruel and unusual... I have no words for it...
I'm just so glad that you've been able to express your righteous anger here.
Hope
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Ahhhhhhh! i'm so angry at them FOR YOU MO4!
Do not be angry at yourself.
You were confused because they wanted you confused.
Anyone would doubt the reality you were living.
I can identify with every aspect of your story and NOW YOU CAN SEE WHAT YOUR REALITY IS!
No more being mystified, though you'll tend to go in and out of it a bit, it takes some getting used to.
I do not like your husband. I do not trust him. I do not want you working on pleasing him and considering his needs in this relationship ANY MORE. Sexual addiction takes years of hard work to overcome and I don't see your husband doing any such thing.
You need to prioritize yourself and your children.
If you think about seeking a divorce attorney please do so without alerting anyone in the family, including your husband.
I have to go out of town now but there is a thread somewhere here started by "Changing" I wrote a list of things to think about if you're considering divorcing your pig. SOME ONE PLEASE list that here if you can find it.
(((((MO4)))))) So friggin po'd for you right now I could spit and I think I WILL!
You be ticked off. You deserve to BE ticked off and it's so unfair you can barely navigate for yourself while caring for 4 children and try to get clear headed on all this abusive crap you've been forced to live with. INSANITY!
Uh hem..... now.... I have to pack and get out of town. I know you'll get tons of great responses and I'll check back in when I land. Grrrrrrrr..... so mad at your husband. So mad at him!
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Dear MO4
You are fighting for your life, just as I am. You are not alone any more.Don't let anyone stop you. If a monkey wrench is thrown in your way-- find a way around it--but keep fighting.
You are fighting by facing the truth and telling the truth. That is your first way to fight(IMO)
For many people, the truth is frightening. That should not stop you - their being uncomfortable.. God promises us---"You shall know the truth and the truth will make you free. It IS doing that with me. God will also send you the people you need ------ to help you. He always has for me . I should stop worrying for all the times he has sent someone to pull me through.
I will be there to help you step by step. Just keep sharing. God is guiding you and speaking to you. He will lead you in the paths that you need to go.
I have seen so many truths since I took the promise "You shall know the truth and the truth will make you free ' and asked God to heal me with it.
Now, my medicine is "Perfect love casts out fear."I am going to take this to get rid of fears. I have so,so ,so many fears. I have all my life. God promises me away out. Today, I start to take it. Keep Sharing. Love and Big Hug Ami
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(((((((((((((((((((((((mof4))))))))))))))))))))))))))
No time to write now but thank you for sharing. I want to reread and write more later.
Love, Beth
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Mof4,
I'm so sorry that happened to you. You have every right to be angry. *I'M* angry for you, right now!
It will take time to sort it out, but feeling angry is the first stage, after acknowledging that it happened.
Your husband and his family are AWFUL to have not supported you through all that you went through.
Keep posting here - lots of really great people will be able to help you through this, even if it takes time (which it will).
Janet
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Kinda feel like I need to fill in here....for my husbands sake....
Keep in mind that this story took place more than two years ago. Since that time, I did leave my husband. Kicked him out, rather. He has since faced his addiction head on. He is a different person today. He is 9 mos clean. He is sweet to me now. He is dealing with the emotions that he could not for so long. He is doing the oh so difficult work. It is paying off. I am breathing easier. I trust his process. He trusts mine. We are not so enmeshed as we were. He is not so threatened if I have a bad day or my body doesn't want to work that day. He is patient and loving with the kids and so faithful in our church. It is a different landscape. One of healing. He has realized that his family is full of N's. He wonders if he has N tendencies. He is clearly a source for his mother. She lavishes praise on him and has raised him with by solving all of his problems and caretaking like crazy. The other night he finally showed signs of a little indignation about the circumstance. That is huge for him. Anger of any kind is so shameful to the family. He is not allowed to be anything but happy. He is really disturbed right now. Loving his family so much and then realizing that it wasn't what he thought it was. We are going to see our therapist tonight to calm the troubled waters.
Forgive me for not having moved past this experience. I must need to process it. This morning the anger was so strong! Out of the blue.
Thank you for giving me a forum where I can test the trust of the group with something so personal and unprocessed. Thank you for those words of outrage and of validation. I have such a need of that. Thank you for being willing to offer it to a stranger such as I.
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I also wanted to add that I think part of my struggle with laying this down is that what happened then keeps happening. It is a cronic pattern in my life. My needs unmet. My problems or even presence not worthy of attention, or too heavy for people with real problems who don't need therapy who are off doing less pathetic things. That seems crazy to me. Seems outrageous to me. I don't think I am that different that anyone else. My problems are mine. Guess I think our problems are custom made to stretch our weakness. I guess I am fine with some struggling. I have always believed in, "bearing one anothers burdan so that they be light." I think that perhaps I am learning that I can take care with myself now that I know that is not a shameful thing. And I am also learning that I don't need to do it all on my own. Like trying to climb Everest with no equipment, companions or experience.
I don't know......more thoughts flowing from my pain.....
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Hi Mo4
Overwhelming, what you've been through. I too was ready to deliver your husband a new pair of (cement) shoes. I'm glad there's progress. I'm glad you got all that written out, that is so valuable.
His mother is the one that should be locked up. I hope you have inviolable boundaries about her now. Do you? Does she have access to your life?
When you say the recurring theme is that your needs aren't met...do you think some of your anger is about you not meeting them?
In my situation, that's true for me.
love
Hops
PS--no more "hope it's okay" and "forgive me" about your posts, hon. You're doing great, just being Mo1.
(I mean, mother of yourself.)
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Hey hopalong,
Working on establishing boundaries with her. Really difficult situation right now. Good to see the N behavior and put a label on what I have been feeling for so long. Need my husband to catch up. Right now, I am ready to leave the state. Ready to start a new life away from these people who control us so much and call it love. Waiting patiently for answers.....
You know, I think that you are right about being angry at myself for not meeting my own needs. I always seem to express my needs but then act in whatever seems to be the best interests of the other person. Maybe I am afraid they won't stay with me if I meet my own needs. Dang the arrow always ends up pointing me back to the mirror. :)
ALL--
Thanks for the support. You know, most of the people, if not all of the people in my life think that my husband walks on water. He is great. He has come a long way. But he gets kudos for breathing in and out. It is crazy. Early on, i went to a church leader for help with his addiction. The man basically, in a round about way called me a liar because he thought I couldn't possibly be talking about the person he knew. Adds to the crazy making for me.
Anyway, think that I am finding more strength now. To meet my needs. Think it is why I came to this board. Baby steps, I guess.
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Dear MO4,
Maybe you should look back at the original situations in your family that set you up for not 'trusting yourself". Then you could be in the great shape that I am in--LOL Love Ami
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Ami,
You are funny. And all do respect to the humorous sentiment, I must say that I don't want to look back anymore. What happen then, happen then. It hurt. But it is over. My foo are not hurting me anymore. I have spent many years--most of my 20's and 30's working on those past things. It was like running through endless miles of canyons with blind turns and lots of dead ends. Now I don't want to be in the canyon. I want to climb out onto the plateau and look out over the great expanse.
Mof4
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Hi Mof4,
I love this quote ....................
a great way to feel
I want to climb out onto the plateau and look out over the great expanse.
Mof4
m
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Moffie,
I am sorry for the struggle that you are in. On the one hand you love your husband and see that he is trying. On the other hand the obstacles to this marriage seem huge. Mommie in law needs to be put in her place. Holly Cow. She is just unbelievable. Showing up at 6am and telling you about your fridge cleaning techniques?
You sound very saavy and smart and I have no doubt that you see what is going on. It is just too painful to accept. You need not do anything at all except have compassion for yourself and validate every feeling that you have. Don't doubt them. They are probably navigating you out of the crazy double bind. You have coped with such poison from your husband and mother in law. His saying he wished you were dead and shaming and humiliating you when you were pregnant are revolting to me and I am sure revolt any sane person on this site.
It is one thing to say let the past be in the past but one thing is very true. HISTORY REPEATS ITSELF. Start focusing on yourself and on nurturing yourself. You aren't any good to your family if you collapse from this abuse.Go where you feel valued and repected. I don't know where that is for you. Maybe a womans group or a church choir or a painting class.
Keep posting here. Red flags tell me that you are in a pretty impossible situation. For instance, your husband is in recovery from his addiction to porno. Is he attending an ongoing 12 step group or is he just making this change spontaneously through a self imposed regimen. Hmmmmmm.
This is probably not what you want to hear. But if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and swims like a duck, then it probably is a duck.
This is just my point of view and maybe it doesn't fit for you. For myself, I tried to hold my marriage together until I physically became ill and went into a serious depression. And they were not things I could just talk myself out of. Your instincts are very, very important. trust them.
Sea storm
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Thanks Sea
I think that the MO of any N- mother ,husband friend etc--- is to take away your trust in yourself. How could they twist you to their reality if you still had an internal compass? That was a very insightful and helpful response , Sea Love Ami
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Wow, seastorm,
How did you get that out of what I said? COOL! You hit the nail on the head. Feel kind of like I am two people -- one that sees the red flags and knows the injustice of it all and wants to walk away, and the other person that takes on the responsibility and tries so hard to make it better and tries for patience and hope for the future. Thanks for seeing it. Thanks for being direct. I must say that there is part of me that lives in confusion still. I see my husbands progress. Believe in the hope of humans changing themselves. If I didn't believe that, then I couldn't believe that I would ever be healed. But he doesn't do everything I want him to do either. But I refuse to micro-manage his recovery anymore.
Ami, love the compass comment. It is so how I feel. What do I trust? Using all of my strength to trust my instincts. Man, hardest thing these days to even know which voice is in my head. Thanks for saying that better than I could.
I am not sure my N is like the rest of yours in that no one says mean things outright. No one says I hate you or you are stupid. But the message is woven in the "nice-ness" and "whipcream" of their fantansy world. I am I making sense. It is very confusing. I can't always see it. Try to figure it out. Feels like a tar-baby. Guess that is why everyone says to run like hell!. The other day I was talking to a trusted Aunt that knows some of what I struggle with. She asked me why I struggled with my MIL. Told her one minor incident. Nothing about N-ism or anything like. She kind of naively told me that perhaps it was me emotional problems that were causing me to see her that way. She couldn't see that my MIL had any flaws. (She is married to my MIL's husband). Hopeless! Blame, albeit innocent blame, is back on me.
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Dear MO4
Family members ,sometimes, want to make things O.K.. In doing so, they "push back' our emotions. Unfortunately----- the saying is "Peace at any price and the price is you"
I think that it is worse when people are "sweet" rather than raging lunatics-
Have you ever heard the saying,"Shirley Temple with a shiv.?"
Anyway, you need to honor yourself if you want to be healthy. I learned the hard way. I wanted to believe that my mother was "wonderful" and my husband was ,too. My body knew differently.
I guess that most woman would like this ,but I could not eat. I got so thin . I had to face all this pain or I might have died.
This is just my path. I found God. What I went through is "nothing" to find God. I have to remember that.
God speaks to me and leads me. It really is "stupid" that I don't just relax and trust Him. Love Ami
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Hi Mo4,
I understand why you're tired of diggiing into the past. Or at least the far past.
I sympathize with this feeling too--abandonment is what being on your own feels like when you don't yet quite believe that you are stronger than you know. (That can change, you know?)
Maybe I am afraid they won't stay with me if I meet my own needs.
I know you're afraid. It's good to identify that. You can really keep looking at this question. You've got it named very simply, here, and maybe contemplating this could be really helpful to you.
I know sometimes the ancient past feels dry of insight, but two years ago doesn't feel very far back to me...
Just 24 months ago, the man who is supposed to love and nurture you, who turned over his loyalty to pornography and stays enmeshed with parents who harm his wife, told you he'd wished your death?
What need does he meet? And how well?
A life in which you love yourself, not as a bitter anguished battle, but simply? As a person who's supposed to be here, are you supposed to eke out an existence without loyal affection?
Or are you supposed to feel serenity and peace inside, because you're caring for the gift of your life?
love
Hops
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Wow, you at the heart of the matter, aren't you, Hops. I probably sound crazy to stay in a marriage with such a history. I have thought the same thing about myself. Asked myself similar questions. Asked God so many times whether I should stay with him. Exhausted myself with all the factors involved. Finally I decided I would not do it for one more day. Asked him to leave. Found enough self love to do at least that. Since then, I have spent many months wrestling with the multitude of questions that rack my brain constantly. Prayed countless times for an answers about divorcing or not. The answer I did get was to wait and go on with my life. So, I am waiting and going on with the rest of my life waiting on the wisdom and timing and almighty hand of the Lord. I do know this: my husband has and is repenting. He is changing. Father in Heaven is changing him too. Water to wine kind of stuff here. I know that his addiction and his family system have captured him. But I also know who he really is. And that knowledge, however flimsy to an observer, is keeping me in the game for now. I now know when it is his "addiction" that is doing the talking. We don't live in that same environment now. Or I wouldn't have stayed. I have asked myself so many times why it seems like such a battle to be loved by a loyal partner. All I can say is that I haven't had that -- true. But God has this thing. I see Him moving the mountains that stand in our way. "Is anything too hard for the Lord?" I hold on to that right now. While we both work together with God and our therapists and the support of each other to be the people we really want to be.
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CB
Right now I think that I am hoping for the best. I have to hope right now. If something reveals to me that I need to make a different choice, I am trusting that I will be able to handle it. I am trusting that it will be ok. Whatever way it turns out. I am strong now, than I was before. I will be ok. And if I am not, I have you guys, right??? :P
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Kinda feel like I need to fill in here....for my husbands sake....
He has since faced his addiction head on. He is a different person today. He is 9 mos clean. He is sweet to me now. He is dealing with the emotions that he could not for so long. He is doing the oh so difficult work. It is paying off. I am breathing easier. I trust his process. He trusts mine.
Ummmmm....::releasing choke hold on MOF's husband::
::stepping away from the man::
Ahhhh....he's still breathin.......
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Lighter
I missed you. Love Ami
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I missed you guys too, Ami.
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Lighter,
You are very funny. You make me smile. Thanks for wanting to strangle my husband. That support is so needed.