Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: teartracks on October 31, 2007, 11:49:29 PM
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Hi everyone,
It seems most dysfunctional families have a Golden Child. I personally believe that a parent who designates a Golden Child does so for selfish reasons and that it is abuse.
Any thoughts?
tt
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I firmly believe there is a "golden child" with N families. I have an older sister who is the firstborn and most definitely the "chosen child," my Nmom's golden child. In all ways, she has and continues to be treated differently.
I have also read a lot about NPD and how many maintain that the golden child is also abused. I admit I find this difficult to accept. It's not that I don't believe there is some abuse attached to this golden child, it's just that from my experience and level of abuse, I find it really hard to have any sympathy for the golden child. My sister has gotten all the attention, interest, time and "love" from my Nmom and co-dependent dad. She could become a serial killer and they would still place her on a pedestal. She has done really terrible things to my brother and I and others, yet she is forgiven anything. In fact, my Nmom will never, not once acknowledge that my Nsister has any faults, weaknesses or made any mistakes. As a result of all this special attention, my Nsister has led a successful and productive life. Thanks, in no small part, to my Nmom's efforts, she has excelled in her career. She has found a partner who has doted on her through their entire relationship as any co-dependent would. She has been successful in ensuring that my parents all but eliminate my brother and I from their lives so they can devote all their time to her. In my eyes, she has won. She has gotten everything she's wanted. And she's deeply hurt others in the process.
So I have a hard time seeing how this "golden child" is abused or been hurt by my Nmom as I have. She has gotten every break in the world, in large part to the attention and interest she has received by my parents along the way. Like I said, she has done terrible things yet suffered no consequences as a result.
Thus, I really don't see how it's fair to equate the "abuse" of the golden child to the others. Some would say the golden child experiences abuse because they are so closely tied to the Nparent(s). But it just seems to me they get their cake and eat it too.
Just an opinion....but I really find it hard to have any sympathy for the golden child, who by the way, is often N him/herself. From what I've read, the golden child is often the firstborn or at least the child who closely identifies with and mimics the behavior of the Nparent. Thus, they became Ns themselves. Not fun. But not easy to be sympathetic with either.
I'd be interested in hearing what others think.
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teartracks,
I'd say that the Golden Child DOES suffer abuse, but that it is a completely different KIND of abuse from the kind that the people who end up on here, trying to make sense of it all, suffer. I agree with Sunblue that 'we' suffer more. But the abuse that the Golden Children suffer is that they subsume their personalities so much to the N parent that they in turn become N's themselves, just to survive. Yes, sometimes they do have 'charmed' lives, but ultimately they become an N, whereas we don't. We can grow beyond what was done to us, and be (relatively!) normal. They can never be. And they often pass the curse of an N on to their own childern, which is a terribly abusive thing to have done to them - the normal, caring relationship that a parent should have for their children is taken from them by their own self-serving parent, for their own reasons. My younger sister is the Golden Child in my family (I have an older brother). I used to think she was 'lucky' to get everything - now I don't think so. Her life is completely enmeshed with my NMum's.
Janet
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I do think this is a form of abuse. My mother alternately ignored me and painted me as the golden child. When there was someone to impress, then I was so smart and talented and my accomplishments put up there for everyone to see. "Oh, my daughter went to college on an oboe scholarship, and there just aren't that many oboe players. The dean told me that female singers are dime a dozen, but oboe players are pretty rare." The funny thing about this comment was that playing the oboe was an act of defiance. My mother didn't want me to do it, and she resented having to rent an instrument for me.
Or on the subject of grades, she always glowed about what a good student I was, how smart I was, etc. Then to my face she would tell me I wasn't good enough, so I always felt like I had to do more. I never realized that all parents weren't like that until I started seeing the school psychologist my last year of school and he says, "Do you know how rare it is for a student to maintain a higher GPA in college than high school? Do you really think these expectations are normal?"
I was my mother's chosen one to go to for her problems. I got to listen to her complain about my dad's drinking, hunting, gun collecting. I listened to her rant and rave about him lying to her or looking at "dirty magazines." I hated it. I'd just sit and be silent because I didn't know what to say.
I'm reading "Healthy Parenting" by Janet Woitizt right now. One the points that had me bobbing my head in agreement was, "Parentifying children isolates them from other children and makes them feel as though their peers are more immature." That pretty much sums up my young adulthood. I thought other kids my age were so immature, and on one hand I liked being my mother's confidant, but at the same time, I hated it.
I think GC's are just as abused as other children of N's. It's just a different form of abuse, and it ends up making the GC constantly search for approval and acceptance from parents who always ask for more. The sense of self gets sublimated until there is nothing left.
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But the abuse that the Golden Children suffer is that they subsume their personalities so much to the N parent that they in turn become N's themselves, just to survive.
So true, Janet
We can grow beyond what was done to us, and be (relatively!) normal.
I am glad you qualified the adjective of "normal" with "relatively." Personally, the majority of children of N's that I have encountered, were, as I've said before in other posts, either struggling with codependency issues or borderline personality disorders...or some other disorder that distorted their relationships.
tayana: "Do you know how rare it is for a student to maintain a higher GPA in college than high school? Do you really think these expectations are normal?"
Is that really true? I thought it was very common for people to maintain higher GPA's in college. I was terrible grade-wise in high school, compared to college. I didn't realize that is rare for people to do better in college.
They can never be. And they often pass the curse of an N on to their own childern, which is a terribly abusive thing to have done to them
yes and I often wonder about some of the children of N's that I've met. I ponder which of them will be the N and which of them will have other issues, and then, I PRAY for them to be spared, either by somehow coming to the end of themselves, or by someone sending them information about personality disorders and abuse, or something.
- the normal, caring relationship that a parent should have for their children is taken from them by their own self-serving parent, for their own reasons.
yes and the child often learns the behavior because it gets the n parent ATTENTION that is wanted.
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Is that really true? I thought it was very common for people to maintain higher GPA's in college. I was terrible grade-wise in high school, compared to college. I didn't realize that is rare for people to do better in college.
I only know what the school psychologist told me, that it was very rare for a student to maintain a higher GPA all through college than in high school. I guess they have to take into account that in college a lot of kids get their first taste of independence. Mom and Dad aren't there to make sure work gets done, etc. The psychologist explained that it's much more normal for grades to be lower with more difficult work and more responsibilities and freedoms.
My parents harped on my grades relentlessly in college. I remember I got a C in my astronomy class. I thought it would be a fun class, an alternative to biology and chemistry. It was the single most boring class I've ever taken. The professor was horrible. I used to read in class all the time because he just read the book to the class, and the book was more interesting than he was. Then he would test over things not in the book that were a brief mention in class. I remember my father saying, "A C? Why did you get a C?" He totally ignored the fact that I'd gotten A's in all of my other classes. He just didn't understand how hard the class was.
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I was my mother's chosen one to go to for her problems.
Likewise, that was my role.
"Parentifying children isolates them from other children and makes them feel as though their peers are more immature."
In my role as PARENT never had a childhood and matured by the age of thirteen to such an extent that it was briefly assumed at one point by a shopkeeper that my baby sister was mine! :shock: At the time I thought the lady was just 'silly'
Makes sense that my peers and I had very little in common as I was light years ahead of them.
Must be why I married so young - or was it a subconscious effort of escape?
Love to all,
Leah
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In my role as PARENT never had a childhood and matured by the age of thirteen to such an extent that it was briefly assumed at one point by a shopkeeper that my baby sister was mine! At the time I thought the lady was just 'silly'
I went someplace with my dad once, and one of the vendors thought I was his wife.
I was so far ahead of my peers at thirteen and fourteen that I thought all of their games silly. I remember in high school it was great fun to go out "cow tipping." I never went, but I thought it was the dumbest thing I'd ever heard of. Any of the other things my peers were doing fell into the same category. I think I finally had a taste of adolesence in college, but even then it was tempered with the level of maturity I'd attained.
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tayana,
What on earth is 'cow tipping'?? :shock:
Janet
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I think it's exactly what it sounds like. They would sneak out into fields at night and try to tip cows over while they slept. I thought it was pretty stupid, but other kids thought it was hilarious.
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tayana,
Oh. It does sound stupid, but I thought there might be more to it, that I didn't understand.
Never mind how much N contact you've had, I think *anyone* in their right mind would think that's a childish thing to do!
Janet
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I know what cow-tipping is. At a church outdoor day that we had a while back at my former church, there was a pig-wrestling competition. YOu got to try and knock a huge greased pig onto its side.
Guess who actually accomplished this one! HEHE...I am your champion HOG tipper here :) believe it or not
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RM, that's so funny. Although in high school they were cow-tipping without a contest. At least you were doing it as part of a contest. :)
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I'm not sure what the answer is to TT's original question.
But I have one of my own.
Why is the Golden Child the Golden Child? Especially when the Golden Child is often the most screwed up one.
I'm sure there are different reasons in different family's especially depending on whether the parents are Ns.
But I wonder if sometimes the Golden Child is chosen not because he or she is seen as superior but precisely because he or she is perceived as defective or weak. Perhaps parents protect and idealize the screwballs out of some misguided parental over-protection not realizing or caring what effect it has on their other kids. If the other kids are "normal" and well adjusted perhaps they're seen as strong enough to fend for themselves and overcome parental favoritism while the Golden Child is placed on a pedastel precisely because the parents don't think he or she can make it on his or her own or out of some feeling of guilt that they are somehow responsible for the nuttiness.
mud
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The Golden Child~~~
~~~~~always makes me think of Scott Peterson, as he was called that in the media. After previous marriages, he was his parent's only child. His mother appeared to be an N.
He was not only and N, but a P, as he murdered his wife and unborn baby, while having another woman on the hook.
So my opinion is that the Golden Child is so accustomed to receiving whatever he/she wants, that the sense of entitlement carries on.
Since you will all know the story, just think about it~~~~
~~~and YES it was abusive of his mother to treat him as the GC. She raised a murderer.
Izzy
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sunblue, thanks for starting this thread. It has immediately got me thinking.
Is the Golden Child an abused child? To the extent that they seem to feel an incredible sense of self-entitlement and will, as a result, engage in all sorts of hideous behaviours, yes. And, in cases such as my aunt - the numero uno Golden Child - this sense of entitlement was passed on by her to my two cousins. The fly in her ointment has always seemed to be (based on solid evidence) my N mother, the 2nd daughter. What my mother did was to get pregnant 6 months before my aunt, having the first grandchild (me) in the family. This made my aunt livid and she abused me physically until I got bigger than her - and wisened to her ways -but she will always need to make an attempt to abuse me emotionally. The most recent example was when she asked me - upon my recent move back to the U.S. - if I needed any help. When I replied affirmatively and asked for her reply either way, I got no reply. Her children didn't reply to my change of address notification...nada/nothing.
I sense that the Golden Child engages in awful behaviour and can get away with it more easily than others in the family and that this behaviour gets passed on. For those of us who are/were not part of that Golden Child's perfection, we probably got relegated to the identified patient - this seems the way in many pathologies...Golden Child at one end and Identified Patient at the other. Interestingly, what my mother might have tried to do was get her status/right to exist through giving birth to me before my aunt could perfectly replay her Golden Child status. When that happened, my aunt truly felt usurped and turned into a scary person/abusER. I would not wish this scenario on anyone.
Interesting thread.
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I've always focused on the scapegoated child, never thought about the Golden one. I was both - the only girl, the smartest, did the best in school, minded well, etc. But as I got older and began falling apart, I was the scapegoat - "None of this would have happened if it hadn't been for you" ... yada yada yada. My brothers were doted on, never disciplined (not for REAL things anyway), and got their way 95% of the time. So I never felt like the golden one but my brothers both reported seeing me that way.
I can't wrap my mind around the Golden one being the abused one ... guess I'm dumb on this one. None of us had a sense of entitlement - we were slapped silly if we even acted that way.
The only way I can relate to this is thinking about the younger sister of a good friend. Kelly was the favorite, spoiled rotten, with a huge sense of entitlement, acted out outrageously, while her older sister (my friend) worked hard, was the quintissential "good girl". Kelly was never disciplined in any meaningful way and, now, she has no self-discipline and is a crack addict and alcoholic. Her parents are spending all the assets they had saved for retirement supporting her and expect her older sister to do the same. Yuk.
Is that kind of what you mean????
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Mud,
You've got a good point there. My NSister is definitely the most screwed up one. But I think my NMum selected her partly because my Nsister was the image of my NMum (physically and in her 'personality', such as it is!). I look more like my Dad. So, I think from the N point of view, they can replicate their more 'perfect self' in someone who at least superficially is the most like them. That suits their ego better. Even now, I refer to my Nsister as 'Clone', because she has no mind of her own. She's just like a cardboard cutout of her mother.
Janet
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Dawning,
First you said:
This made my aunt livid and she abused me physically until I got bigger than her - and wisened to her ways -but she will always need to make an attempt to abuse me emotionally.
...which depicts your aunt as a truly toxic person that most people would not want to associate with any more than needed.
Next you indicate:
The most recent example was when she asked me - upon my recent move back to the U.S. - if I needed any help. When I replied affirmatively and asked for her reply either way, I got no reply. Her children didn't reply to my change of address notification...nada/nothing.
Ok, here I go again, trying to figure out WHY YOU WOULD TELL THIS VICIOUS WOMAN OR HER CHILDREN THAT YOU WANTED HER HELP AND WHY IT WOULD BOTHER YOU THAT YOU DID NOT GET A REPLY.
I'm not sure YOU know what it is you really want from these abusive people. On one hand you state that they are bad and cruel and abusive, but then you indicate scenarios of where you were having some sort of polite exchange and even agreeing to having them help you?
Please, something's gotta get straightened out here in your perception, Dawning. You can't despise someone and then be upset or surprised. when they don't want to help you. I am not attacking you as a person, just really concerned about your hazy perception about abusers...that you think you don't want them around you yet get upset when they aren't reacting in the ways normal people that you are beloved by would. Not adding up at all.
Anyone else noticing a disturbing pattern in these situations, other than me?
Here is a pretend comparison of the pattern I'm seeing in you that I hope we are all able to help you also recognize and conquer eventually through your sharing with us on this group. Dr G, feel free to step in as well to help this dear lady too, please.
Dawning, it's like me saying "there is a bully next door who comes over every day and kicks me in the stomach. He is mean and nasty and he even dug up my garden last year that he saw me out there in the hot sun working so hard on.
The latest scenario was, This bully ask if I wanted her to babysit my daughter for me. I said "yes I did' but bully never even called me to find out WHEN I needed her help babysitting. I just can't believe that."
Are you able to understand what i'm trying to say, Dawning? Again, is it just me or are others on this list noticing Dawning's spinning her wheels in this rut repeatedly too? We care, Dawning. Many of us have been in your situation. Only hoping to help;
~Laura
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Towrite, I've been lots of roles. I was my mother's golden child, even though I didn't feel like that. She always told me that my brother was jealous because I'd had more opportunities than him. She also told me what a horrible disapointment he was.
I've been her scapegoat.
I've been the caretaker. I filled this role a lot when she was working, or when she was sick. It always made me feel so important to clean the house like I wanted it.
Mostly, I think I was just lost, because no one really cared about my sense of self. I identify more with the lost child role. I felt invisible a lot. I felt like I didn't matter. I felt as though I were a terrible person all the time.
I think golden children have a tendency to either become abusers or else they self destruct. I don't think their lives are really as golden as we think.
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Leah,
Maybe sister #2's life doesn't have to remain destroyed. Have you considered telling her about this board? invited her here where people will walk with her through things?
~Laura
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Sister No 2 was the Golden Child, and yes, she was very much abused. Shrine was made for GC with photographs every step of the way. No other photographs on display. Despite the fact that she was afforded every golden opportunity and supported through college - she has not managed a career. She lives in isolation, is fearful, and suffers from severe anxiety and depression. NM destroyed her life.
Leah, I identify with this so much. My NM tried to make me the GC, and oh she was so proud of me until I got pregnant with M. It's really hard to stay on that pedastal, and you spend a lot of time trying to live up to unrealistic expectations. It causes horrible anxiety. I've suffered from anxiety all my life. I used to get physically ill from the anxiety, and my mother never did a thing about it. She'd just tell me I was "too excited." I had horrible anxieties about taking tests, concerts, etc. More than I should have had. I don't mean a little nervousness, but truly bone wrenching fear. It's even worse now. Right now I'm tied in knots because I'm afraid my NM will have called my son at daycare again. Or she'll have gone there to pick him up.
At some point, I realized that my NM only loved me as a trophy prize, and then I really resented what she was doing. That was sometime in college I think, but I"m not sure.
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Leah,
Maybe sister #2's life doesn't have to remain destroyed. Have you considered telling her about this board? invited her here where people will walk with her through things?
~Laura
Laura,
Managed to find Sister No 2 who was petrified of NM ever finding out her location. Sister No 2 sent an email telling me that she would only have contact with me when NM is dead. Then she sent a second email telling me that I was 'blocked' on her email system. She did say that she had been reading loads of stuff on the internet and that in her opinion ......... "NM had Psychopathic tendancies"
Who knows, she may be reading this ........ if you are my dear sister ...... " I Love You So Much " xxxxxxx
Leah
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Right now I'm tied in knots because I'm afraid my NM will have called my son at daycare again.
Tayana,
There should be some kind of protective restraining order - for the well being of the child.
Think I read that you have given strict instructions to the daycare place. Understand how and why you would feel that that's not enough to give you complete peace of mind.
Ordinary folk with ordinary lives who have no knowledge of Nism cannot be expected to fully comprehend what N's and suchlike do and how they work.
All you can do is to reinforce your strict instructions with the daycare place.
Not an easy task I know.
Thinking of you with genuine empathy.
Leah
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The Golden Child~~~
~~~~~always makes me think of Scott Peterson, as he was called that in the media. After previous marriages, he was his parent's only child. His mother appeared to be an N.
He was not only and N, but a P, as he murdered his wife and unborn baby, while having another woman on the hook.
So my opinion is that the Golden Child is so accustomed to receiving whatever he/she wants, that the sense of entitlement carries on.
Since you will all know the story, just think about it~~~~
~~~and YES it was abusive of his mother to treat him as the GC. She raised a murderer.
Izzy
Dear Izzy,
Did read about the Scott Peterson case briefly on the internet. However, was not aware that his mother raised him as the GC.
Regarding my Sister No 2 - Golden Child ....... I am aware of her behaviour in recent years as that of being manipulative to others, and worryingly scheming and cunning too.
Such a young life - not having a true quality of life.
That is, unless her life has changed this year.
Love,
Leah
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I'm curious about something, Leah...how about the case where a child was parentified, was not seen as the Golden Child, until she became an adult.
In the case I'm referring to, this adult became very controlling of people, exuded an air of superiority, yet deep inside was one of the most depressed individuals I ever met in my life. This person had a real fear of getting close with people because they didn't want to have to reject them if they found them to be unlikeable.
This was my story, of course...the person found ME to be unlikeable, and therefore was put in a position they feared more than death...a position of having to tell me we didn't "click."
I honestly think I understand where this person stood back then, more than I ever did before. This person's main thrust in life seemed to be earning the favor of the parent. First this person watched a sibling be the GC, but then later on as an adult this person become the GC. When I came along and the parent befriended me, this person became insecure, jealous and immediately had to find a way to get me out of the picture.
Does any of this sound even remotely familiar to you, Leah? If so, it would help me immensely to hear any of your input.
~Laura
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I'm curious about something, Leah...how about the case where a child was parentified, was not seen as the Golden Child, until she became an adult.
In the case I'm referring to, this adult became very controlling of people, exuded an air of superiority, yet deep inside was one of the most depressed individuals I ever met in my life. This person had a real fear of getting close with people because they didn't want to have to reject them if they found them to be unlikeable.
This was my story, of course...the person found ME to be unlikeable, and therefore was put in a position they feared more than death...a position of having to tell me we didn't "click."
I honestly think I understand where this person stood back then, more than I ever did before. This person's main thrust in life seemed to be earning the favor of the parent. First this person watched a sibling be the GC, but then later on as an adult this person become the GC. When I came along and the parent befriended me, this person became insecure, jealous and immediately had to find a way to get me out of the picture.
Does any of this sound even remotely familiar to you, Leah? If so, it would help me immensely to hear any of your input.
~Laura
Dear Laura,
Sorry, no, does not sound familiar to me at all.
Bearing in mind each family dynamic, or should I say dysfunctional set-up, most likely will be different. As is mine to yours.
Can only refer to my family.
But I have thought regarding my younger sister, sister no 2, that she was left behind, as we all three of us had left home, and NM cut off contact.
Which meant that my Sister No 2 GC would then have become Parentified - which would explain the change shift in her behaviour.
Especially as Sister No 2 later on took control of NM !!!
Just coming back to me crystal clear and some most important :idea: are shining bright.
But back to your situation Laura, I can only guess at the root cause being Envy.
Sorry.
Leah
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tt,
This is a very good question. Yes, I do think they are abused. And, in a lot of ways, I think it is a lot harder for them to realize how to live their lives happily. Going just by what I have seen with my sister, I don't feel there has been any advantage to her - except financially and in that, in some senses she has had a bit better esteem than I had - though not by much. And she is still a very confused person. We have gotten very close - mostly because she has reached out so much. I honestly felt like letting it go for a long time - our relationship, I mean. She maintains more ties and more responsibilities to my parents because of her "status." I wouldn't trade places with her for the world. She is in a marriage that is far from making her happy, but is in denial and doesn't want to admit her husband is a jerk.v She really is a kind and loving person, but has faced no demons and seems to ignore anything unpleasant in her life. I wish I could make her happy. But she won't see until she wants to. She had bulimia and other issues and still has a terrible time with food. She doesn't seem to see how all of the bad things are related in her life. Once I tried to talk to her, but the lines were quickly closed.
So, tt, judging by my experience - yes they are abused and, sadly, I think they have little chance of realizing it and getting help. And I wonder how they cannot see that something is wrong?
Love, Beth
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Hi everyone,
In my family, the GC designation rotated depending on who was 'in' or who was 'out'. I'm talking about when we were pre-adolescent and afterwards. My brother seemed to occupy the position more often and longer than me and my sister. But then males were/are highly favored too, so I don't know what percentage of the favoritism rested on gender. Do you suppose that GC is simply one of the nuances of triangulation or is it something different?
Thanks tribe for good reading :)
tt
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It's interesting to hear different scenarios about the "golden child" in families. I always thought it had something to do with birth order but I see here that the child selected to be the "golden child" could be chosen for a variety of reasons. But there also seem to be some key similarities, one of which is that the chosen child can essentially get away with murder (both figuratively and literally, in Scott Peterson's case). They also seem to share a very strong sense of entitlement, just like their Nparent.
For me, the child who is oh most definitely NOT the chosen child, it is important to understand the reason WHY one child is selected as the golden child over another. In my family's case, the chosen child is my older sister. SHe is the firstborn and had my Nmom's complete and undividied attention for more than five years before another child came along (me). Added to this, we lived with my Nmom's parents at the time and I believe my maternal grandmother was also N, who subsequently showed the firstborn child with love and attention. No wonder my Nsister wanted nothing to do with me when I came along. So she came to possess a ridiculous sense of entitlement as well as undivided attention from both my parents. This devotion to her never wavers iin spite of the despicable things she did. It's a vicious circle. My Nsister ultimately excelled due to my Nmother's direct assistance in her life as well as attention and "love", albeit narcissistic love. In turn, my Nmom closely identifed with her. Easy to identify with the person who reaps the rewards of all the attention they are given while the other children are left alone, struggling with everything by themselves and amid enormous emotional abuse and neglect.
Do I have any empathy for the golden child? Sorry to say I don't. I just can't excuse all the deliberate, painful, damaging things she does to people, not to mention the way they destroy their own families and siblings. Do I believe they were ultimately affected by the Nparent. Yes, they were, perhaps due to no fault of their own. But like the Nparent, I believe they are capable of understanding the difference between right and wrong. They just don't care whether other people are hurt or not. THey are too selfish and self-centered.
In my family, I not only suffered the typical abuse of a Nparent and co-dependent parent, but also an Nsister as well. Put together, it's a lethal combination. It is scary to watch just how closely my Nmom and Nsister identify with each other. They are clearly totally dependent on each other. For all my Nsister's evil, evil ways, she would never cross my Nmom, never criticize her, never question her position as Queen of the Throne. She would privately because she is the grand manipulator. But they feed off each other. In so doing, they deliberately eliminate the rest of their family from their lives (with the exception of the co-dependent husband/father). My only very small consolation is that I know somewhere, deep, deep, deep down, my Nsister is not happy. In my family's case, while she has both my parent's complete and total dedication and attention, she also has completely and forever lost the possibility of any relationship with her siblings and niece. It is the consequences of her actions, actions which of course she would never take responsibility for. But her sphere of those who she can be the center of attention for has diminished.
One last thought. I once went to a reader who commented on my family's narcissistic dynamics. She noted, among other things, that it is when my parents (particularly my Nmom) eventually passes that my Nsister will have the most trouble. She will not be able to cope since she is completely dependent on her for her own narcissistic supply. While she controls everything now, when it is time to care for a weakened Nmom or deal with her passing, she will not be able to cope. She'll leave it to others to handle. How very narcisstic of her..but I think ultimately it will be true someday.
Ultimately, narcissists just have to be right. THey have to control. ANd Nparents choose a golden child to control. In the end, they end up being equally controlled by the Nchild they created, in my opinion at least.
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I relate more to the other stories where the `Golden Child' was kind of an imaginery identity, that my mother pushed upon some of us at certain times in our lives, followed by scapegoating and punishing us when we could no longer live up to those unrealistic expectations.
Most of my 5 siblings have developed a lot of independence from our mother as adults, but the ones who are still deeply enmeshed and dependent on her still strive to fullfill the role Golden Child (although they only ever partially attain that goal). I feel sorry for them, because I remember the fear that drives them on, and the agony & stress of trying to be perfect.
I still have that `desire' in my psyche, but I try to use it to motivate me, rather than dictate all my behaviour and feelings. I used to spiral down into terrible shame cycles as a teen and young adult, whenever I `failed' (as my mother defined failure). I would want to die, or feel like I was dying; it was so horrible.
I think the biggest problem for my siblings and I is that we grew up feeling that if we weren't `Golden'. then we would be punished and abused like the scapegoat (whoever my mother had chosen at that moment). There was no in between. So even our times of success were shadowed by intense fear of not being able to sustain it 24/7. Instead of seeing `success' as a nice experience, we felt that our wellbeing depended upon it.
X Bella
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But back to your situation Laura, I can only guess at the root cause being Envy.
BINGO, Leah...in fact, this was even admitted to some people by this person
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I have been thinking about this thread, and one of the things my NMum said to me when I was in my mid-twenties (and openly questioning her abuse of me by then).
She said ' I had you so that you would stay with me forever.'
I found that really chilling. I thought people had children so that they could bring them up to be capable, valuable, happy, adult members of society in their own right, separate from their parents. But no, apparently.
I don't know if my NMum had ALWAYS thought like this, but it certainly seemed as if, in her eyes, anyway, we had pre-destined roles, and we HAD to fulfil those, or fail.
Perhaps she had decided *I* would be the Golden Child, but I had refused that role, so she transferred it to my sister, who was less 'rebellious'?
Janet
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Ultimately, narcissists just have to be right. THey have to control. ANd Nparents choose a golden child to control. In the end, they end up being equally controlled by the Nchild they created, in my opinion at least.
Dear Sunblue,
All of what you have written is quite remarkable in so much as it has a bearing with my FOO situation.
I have highlighted your statement that Nparents choose a GC to control - in the end, the end up being controlled by the Nchild they created ....
...... because that actually happened with my Sister No 2 as GC and my NM.
The tables turned and GC controlled and manipulated NM. Many many :idea: shone on my dreadful FOO scenario and my summation is this:
NM slipped up in her choice of Sister No 2 as replacement GC (after Brother left home to join armed forces) NM underestimated her.
Sister No 2 was not as complacent as she had thought. NM had had plans for GC to stay close in alliegence. BUT, what NM failed to discern was that the whole time NM was actively engaged in her abusive scheme of things ... my baby Sister No 2 had been quietly 'watching and learning' in her safety zone.
Missed that completely and yet it is so obvious.
Leah
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Dear Janet,
Perhaps she had decided *I* would be the Golden Child, but I had refused that role, so she transferred it to my sister, who was less 'rebellious'?
Yes, think you have hit the nail on the head!
Leah
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Janet,
Actually, X's mother was a very sweet, kind lady. The problem was, by her own admission, she was not able to be there in X's life or her sibling's when they were in their teens (same mistake I made emotionally with my now N daughter). X raised herself and her sibling for the most part, and so, never really got to know what being a "child" was about. X learned that it was her job to have all the answers, fix things and people, and that she was NOBODY if she could not fulfil this role.
Janet: I don't know if my NMum had ALWAYS thought like this, but it certainly seemed as if, in her eyes, anyway, we had pre-destined roles, and we HAD to fulfil those, or fail.
Perhaps she had decided *I* would be the Golden Child, but I had refused that role, so she transferred it to my sister, who was less 'rebellious'?
My guess is that, yes, your Nmum had always thought to have you so you could be with her forever. How do I guess this? Cause children who grow up in dysfunctional families, tend to want someone "to love forever." I WAS THIS CHILD AND THAT WAS MY FANTASY. It was why I got pregnant at 18 by a boyfriend whom I dreamed would wisk me off and marry me and I'd live "happily ever after" with this blissful little baby that loved me and lived with me forever in the palace of my mind.
Now, hopefully, normal-minded people will WAKE UP and realize that this was JUST A FANTASY, like I had to. Apparently, your own Nmum did not have a ability to separate fantasy from truth at the time and still doesn't.
In the case with X in my life, there was one daughter who did not fulfill the role of mirror. X had nothing but complaints about how she wouldn't do "fun" things with her, etc. So, X found another "daughter" to bring into the situation, a girl she picked "off the street" so to speak, that she could basically turn into her cupie doll, dress up, re-form, etc and later, when the girl tried to individuate, X threw up the usual "after ALL WE DID FOR YOU! WE MADE YOU WHO YOU ARE" thingy at her. The girl decided she didn't want to be part of X's fantasy anymore, partly because of how she was being treated behind closed doors, although X would never admit to that to me or anyone else.
After X's pseudo-child left, guess who was NEXT in line to play the role..................yours truly, and, sad or maybe glad to say, I FAILED MISERABLY AT IT! I couldn't second-guess what X wanted, like pseudo-d did, I couldn't be thankful enough to X and her spouse, like pseudo was, I couldn't read X's mind or do what pseudo used to do apparently without flaw...therefore, DEVALUE, DISCARD, REPLACE! and out the door I went with a "consolation prize' of a sort.
That's how it works. It's insane, but it's what they do, because it's all they know to do.
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My guess is that, yes, your Nmum had always thought to have you so you could be with her forever. How do I guess this? Cause children who grow up in dysfunctional families, tend to want someone "to love forever." I WAS THIS CHILD AND THAT WAS MY FANTASY. It was why I got pregnant at 18 by a boyfriend whom I dreamed would wisk me off and marry me and I'd live "happily ever after" with this blissful little baby that loved me and lived with me forever in the palace of my mind.
I had this fantasy. When I got pregnant with M, I was hoping that his father would swoop in and save me. For about two years after M was born, I kept hoping he would change his mind and come save me. I never wanted M to love me forever. I was too caught up in not wanting him to have the same experience I had, but I definitely wanted someone to come in and rescue me. I wanted to feel loved and respected, and it's taken a long time for me to learn that I have to learn to love and respect myself before someone else can love me.
My mother never said she wanted me to stay with her forever, but she and my dad often made inferences that they wanted me to take care of them. They'd say things like, "Are you going to make enough money to take care of me?" I think that's the problem with me moving away from them. I'm not there to take care of them anymore, and by moving, I've taken the stance that I'm not going to play anymore.