Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Ami on November 17, 2007, 04:58:10 PM
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We are almost at the tail end of a party(PLEASE LEAVE---mental message).
There were two woman that I never really talked to . I started asking them about their lives etc and I had the kind of "insight" that I had at 14. Everyone is bearing hurt---not just me with an N mother.
It helped to be reminded that I can come out from the separate category of "screwed up person with an N mother' to
"person."
I see that my main problem in relationships is that I am pre programmed to give myself away. This makes relationships painful--not fun.
I guess the root of it is fear. I have to take the Scripture-----Perfect Love Casts out Fear. It means that if you get in your heart HOW much God loves you,you will not be afraid.
That is my next goal----Perfect Love Casts out Fear.
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Ami - I have been repeating such verses about fear for about year and it has been a tremendous help to me. I have made real progress. One that I particularly love is from 1 Timothy - I give you not a spirit of fear but of power, love and a sound mind.
I love this verse, especially this translation because I so love the three words: "power, love and a sound mind." Fear seems to take these away from me and I know that I am overcoming that fear. For me - one year of facing that fear that I have lived with for almost 50 years, is little tiime to overcome such a long standing, festering wound. I am just thankful to be on the other side of this battle.
I so encourage you to believe, to know that you can overcome that wretched fear, established so long ago. - your friend - GS
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Ami,
Nobody gets through life without being hurt profoundly, and nobody gets out alive.
The only question is, while we're here, will we be the kind who adds to the supply of hurt that is already here or the kind who tries to relieve the hurt of others?
mud
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That is my next goal----Perfect Love Casts out Fear.
Hi Ami,
I like this.
Something that helps me with fear is the thought that whenever I am in fear it is God's calling card for me to have faith and trust Him.
Lise
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Dear Mud,
This will sound like a really dumb question( and it is),but could you please elaborate about "everyone being hurt.' This sounds crazy BUT it IS how I think so I will say it-----What if s/one had a loving M and was affirmed ----how could they be THAT hurt in life?
Ami
ps---I feel silly even leaving this post here ---BUT it is a heartfelt question--Mud
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My daughter loves a man who will not be more than friends. Another guy likes her and she is afraid to like him because if the first guy realizes she likes someone else then he may confess his real feelings and she would choose him and hurt the second guy. That is it Am-everyone gets hurt. Good family or bad-Everyone gets hurt! No one is immune. But we with N mothers have a wound that is very hard to heal-worse than those with healthy families who in through normal hurts.
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Dear Kelly,
I am saying what you are saying.The wound with the N mother "seems" too deep to heal(in my mind). That was what i was asking Mud--if I am making any sense. Ami
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What if s/one had a loving M and was affirmed ----how could they be THAT hurt in life?
What if you had a child you loved more than your own life, and you had to watch her waste away and die at 15?
That happened to a member here.
What if you were raped as an adolescent and so abused at home that you dissociated?
That happened here.
What if you had so little money and opportunity that your electricity is turned off and you've seen cockroaches crawl over your baby's face?
That happened here.
What if you lost your sons, suddenly, in a terrible accident?
That happened here.
What if your beautiful strong body was broken in a heartbeat and you never walked freely again?
That happened here.
Have you ever read the amazing blog by Wandering Scribe, the British woman who lived in her car in a wooded lane?
This is a big realization for you Ami. The party. The women who have also had lives. And been hurt.
It's pretty exciting that you stopped feeling your wound is unique. I'm glad.
love
Hops
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Dear Hops.
When I even asked the question about my "wounding" being "worse" ,I knew that I was setting myself up for people saying,'Did you hear about this person........"
I am NOT saying that YOU said this. I am saying that the 'natural" response IS to say,'Have you heard about ......."
I asked the question from the unhealed emotions inside me---NOT the intellectual side of me that has been in the world experiencing life. I asked it b/c my " insides" wanted ( and needed) to know.
The last line in your post answered it for me.At my party, I got a "sense' that my wound was NOT unique. I was so "happy' that I could have jumped .
I have been so LOCKED in to my wound being "unique "and not able to be overcome. I was just "enmeshed" with this idea(if you can say it like that). I could not get a "gap" in my thinking where the 'truth" could come in.
When I had had a sense of self in my life,ONE big part was seeing that my wound was NOT unique. We used to go away for the summer to a small town outside of Boston. People lived close to each other and there was a sense of community.
I saw , then, that each person had a heartache . I did not see my M as the 'worse" heartache or one that could NOT be overcome.
I saw myself as "teflon" where she "rolled" off me. At some point, I abandoned myself( as you said in the other thread) and then I was in trouble that never ended until now..You go down fast when you have given yourself over to any outside force(in this case--my M)
So,Hops, I want to thank you for pointing out this HUGE concept about "wounding". It IS life changing to become "part of" the human race----not outside of it.I have only taken the first few steps on this new road,but I am very,very happy to be doing that. Thanks so very much Ami
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Dear Hops,
I have another very important question. I started "shifting" inside when I started understanding myself more and seeing myself more honestly.IOW,I started to see how I truly was---selfish,petty,self centered, etc,etc. I started seeing that level in me(Is it the N level,I wonder). However, when I could honestly look at myself, I was able to "give myself a pass" from perfection. I started being able to own the "bad" parts of me that my M had shamed. Maybe, they were human,not "bad"
I am not explaining myself very well. Once I started seeing my deep,unacceptable qualities ,I started seeing that everyone else was the same way ,too. So,I may as well own and love myself .Do you understand?
I can't explain myself any better,so I will leave it. Thanks so much, Hops Ami
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Have you ever read the amazing blog by Wandering Scribe, the British woman who lived in her car in a wooded lane?
Dear Hops,
Thanks for mentioning the above, as a British woman, this is of immense interest.
edit: ...I'm back ... my keyboard 'froze'!!
Grateful for the awareness of 'Wandering Scribe' blog.
"Thank You"
Love, Leah
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Am- It is true- you end up going full circle. I also had a sense of self but lost it at about 26. She had convinced me that that was my BAD self and if I would just live my life according to her will then everything would be just fine. What happened was I was lured into a trap like a sheep to the slaughter-and I went willingly because mother knows best. But Am-I am watching her spin out of control trying to keep her edge. I can see her pathology right before me and I feel my freedom!
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I really do understand, Ami.
It's like Nspots. Or Ncraters. In us.
When you take the step to see/feel something selfish or Nish or evilish move through you, you can go, oh there it is...I know where I learned that...mmm-hmmm, that's a Nspot all right. Igggh, yuck, okay, let's shake that off.
After a while the "iggggh" and "yuck" stop happening, as you accept your own spots, and instead when they move through you, you go more directly too a neutral: okay, let's shake that off, moving along, moving along...
It's like not getting IMPALED on self-loathing. Yay!
Hops
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Dear ((( Ami )))
You stood back and then you could see.
Such a difference in you as a result.
Pleasure to know your growth.
Love, Blessings & Hugs,
Leah
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Dear Hops,
I am going to describe more the shift that I had and I would like you to see if this is what you are saying(I think it is).
A guy broke a beer bottle in my kitchen. I knew that I SHOULD go help him clean it up but I didn't want to(selfish) and self centered) .Another person went and helped. IF the person hadn't come, I would have. However,my thinking was the important part to describe the shift. I could see that I was being totally selfish and self centered. However,I watched this feeling in me like observing a monkey in the zoo. I saw it and I felt it. Then I thought,it probably was human.i didn't go IN TO the "I am a terrible " person mode.
Then I had some other instances when I felt "bad" feelings but did exactly the same process.One guy was very sweet and nice. However,he was flirting with me and I had a feeling of revulsion. The old me would feel like I was a terrible person and "How could I be so judgemental?" The "new" me just felt the feeling , let it float away and just continued being kind and friendly .
Then,I had another instance. I was talking to a woman who had a terrible marriage break--up. As I was talking to her ,I started "judging" her. I just let the judgemental thoughts go and paid no attention to them. I just pulled my attention back to her and totally ignored whatever stupid thoughts came in to my head.
Is this what you are saying, Hops? I want to thank you for all the help you are giving me ,Hops. I am so very grateful for the wisdom that you are sharing with me. Love Ami
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Dear Leah,
Thank you for your warmth towards me and your kindness-----so very much . Ami
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Dear Ami,
As I have already shared with you, it was seeking God's wisdom that made the difference.
Wisdom and Discernment are the two precious gifts that I sought after.
His wisdom will continue to guide you, as you surrender to Him.
Love & Blessings,
Leah
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I have to add s/thing. A picture is popping in my head of my M berating herself for every "normal" feeling and desire. I remember that she could never be "selfish" without horrible guilt. She could never feel "judgemental" without beating herself up. She could not feel
normal" human "falings" such as pettiness,jealousy, selfishness without taking an "ax" to herself. I am seeing this in my "mind's eye".
Also, my M has to DO everything perfectly. I remember how horrible it was for her to train a dog. She could never admit failure or defeat. .
My M's sister can accept her foibles. She can talk about her various weaknesses(fear of dogs is one). She can joke about them. She said that she almost had a heart attck when a friends bull dog jumped in her lap. She can talk about her selfishness. She was telling me a story about her D when my Aunt let her D do a task that my Aunt should have and how my Aunt felt guilty. However, she could admit selfishness, poor judgement, weakness etc---all in her story. Then I was telling her about Maria. She said,"Ami, dear,of course, she would have jealousy. That is just normal.
My Aunt can own the whole spectrum of her emotions as "just human". She can laugh at them.It surprises me every time that I talk to her. This is what I want. This is what I call "normal" and this is what my goal is. Does anyone understand ? Ami
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Yes, Ami,
That's what being 'Authentic' is all about, being 'True to Yourself' ....
warts an all :)
Love, Leah
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Yeah,Leah
It feels good to accept the warts. It feels even better to laugh at them.( Maybe, this is at the root of humor ) Love Ami
((((((((((((((Leah))))))))))))
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Dear Hops,
I am going to ask you a very "dumb" question. It is my "emotions" asking it--not my intellect. This is it----- Can we accept all the feelings and thoughts that we have without feeling "bad" and self condemning? Can we just let the bad, selfish, hostile, self centered, rude, petty, jealous, self centered etc feelings and thoughts ---just "go by" . Thanks Hops ---so much Ami
PS---my favorite author---Stephen King has characters which think "horrible " thoughts that I would feel very "condemned "by. However, these thoughts must be human or King would not resonate with so many people ---right?
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Hi Ami,
I think you've got BINGO today, for sure!
Yes and yes. I really do believe we have to have compassion for ourselves as much as we proclaim it as a rule, to have it for others.
Observing and noticing or even sometimes getting swept up in our own darkness is real. It is. So that is where loving ourselves is most difficult and most helpful.
We know the difference between celebrating and fixating on our capacity for hatred, judgment, hurting people--and seeing it in ourselves and simultaneously letting it go and flowing right past toxic shame.
Shame for what? Being a human being? Displaying some of the natural effects of what we've learned or lived through?
Unless we want to shame every person we meet, why shame ourselves?
It just is kindness. After a while, imo, it just feels illogical and odd not to be as kind to ourselves as we are in our kindest moments toward others. We are them. They are us. We are all one human community.
Might as well start with whoever's handiest, right? That would be ourselves...
love
Hops
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Ami,
I think what you are referring to is how can you accept your "shadow side", that part of human nature which contains the dark, negative, yucky parts.
The pyschiatrist, Carl Jung, wrote extensively about "The Shadow". A book I liked which explains why feeling our Shadow Side is natural and human is called Meeting the Shadow by Connie Zweig. Here's the amazon link: www.amazon.com/Meeting-Shadow-New-Consciousness-Reader/dp/087477618X/ref=sr_1_5/104-9786183-7310347?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1195412455&sr=1-5.
In the customer reviews of this book, someone wrote a review which I think you could relate to. This person wrote:
"Jung was once quoted as saying "I would rather be whole than to be good." I did not understand this statement until I read this book. Now that I have begun my own "shadow work," the picture is becoming clearer, and clearer"
Maybe working on accepting your "shadow side" could help you feel more whole, more accepting of yourself, both your good parts and the not-so-good parts. As humans, we all have a shadow side and once we embrace our shadow side, we can feel more whole. When we hate our shadow side or try to repress or ignore it, then our shadow side bites us in the a$$. We can't run away from our shadow and our shadow is valuable because it teaches us many things about ourselves.
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Dear Observer,
THAT IS IT EXACTLY.I am going to get that book, today. You have some wisdom, Observer.I hope that you stay around.. Love Ami