Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Gabben on February 14, 2008, 06:37:34 PM
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If the N in your life is playing the victim role and fooling everyone because they are able to hide their covert aggression, remember N's are adept at disguise, then how do you defend youself?
I mean if everyone thinks that they, the scociopathic aggressor, is the good one and that the person who is being agressed against, who is angry in defense, is the bad one -- what do you do?
A. Just wait until the wolf trips themselves up?
B. Wait until others see under the wool eventually too?
C. any ideas?
What if this wolf was exceptionally adept at covert aggression that they had everyone fooled with their victim act while quietly and calmly they were targeting you? And, it was hurting you, however, others are giving the aggressor the sympathy and the aggressor is rubbing in your face, sadistically?
People are so easily fooled.
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Lise,
Honestly, I am hoping that maybe it's a trial so that we can learn how to function as though we're wearing a rubber suit... letting that rubbish bounce clean off?
And I keep trying to convince myself that paying someone no mind is not the same as avoidance (I hope)... Wow.
Think about that expression... "pay no mind" = allow no wasted useage of brain cells to be devoted to the taunter.
The covert N always outs herself in the end... always. She cannot maintain equilibrium when the object of her extreme envy simply goes on with life as normal, resting confidently in the assurance that God sees the inner heart and will judge.
Oh - a verse comes to mind... Everything which is hidden shall be revealed! How's that?
And all things which can be shaken, shall be shaken.
The thing is, when all our junk is shaken loose, there's only Jesus left inside...
and that is very good news, eh?
Hugs,
Carolyn
P.S. Is being angry really a defense?
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Oh - a verse comes to mind... Everything which is hidden shall be revealed! How's that?
And all things which can be shaken, shall be shaken.
The thing is, when all our junk is shaken loose, there's only Jesus left inside...
and that is very good news, eh?
P.S. Is being angry really a defense?
Hi Carolyn,
Good question, no, it is not. What I meant was that the aggressors actions that hurt the REAL victim which makes the REAL victim feel angry, in defense they stand up for themselves which serves to make the victim look like the aggressor, does that make sense?
I love that quote! Oh -- at this time in my life I just need lot's of reassurance of Christ's love and a lot of encouragement to just hold tight, persevere -- in the end it will all work out. You are doing just that for me Carolyn, giving me the support and encouragement I need to just hang in there quietly with prayer.
Hugs (((((((((((((((Carolyn)))))))))))))))
Lise
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Gabben - you have asked a very, very powerful question. I am here for just a moment and will post later but I was drawn by your topic. I personally have found it impossible to defend oneself. It is something of a tar baby. The more you fight the more stuck you get. The only way it to just ignore it and move on to the extent you can.
My experience is somewhat different from Certain Hope's. In my experience there is NO way to win. You just have to move on. It is never fair and never just.
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there is NO way to win. You just have to move on. It is never fair and never just.
Hi GS,
It is not so much about about winning as it is about stopping the hurt and wrong they are doing that when no one else is looking, they jab you.
But your are 100% correct in that I have to just persevere, turn the other cheeck and move on.
Thank you GS.
This is teaching me to practice being strong.
hugs ((((((((GS)))))))))
Lise
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Dear Lise,
I agree with GS. We can just keep ourselves safe from the N. Being strong is important for our own self respect and in any battle with them(strong BUT in control). If they see you "losing it", it is percieved as weakness .
I know that with my FIL, I was strong with him just one time and he never "bothered " me for 15 years ,after that one time.
In your case, you have to know who you are and that you are NOT defined by the N or any of the people that the N turns against you.
Love Ami
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Dear Lise,
I agree with GS. We can just keep ourselves safe from the N. Being strong is important for our own self respect and in any battle with them(strong BUT in control). If they see you "losing it", it is percieved as weakness .
I know that with my FIL, I was strong with him just one time and he never "bothered " me for 15 years ,after that one time.
In your case, you have to know who you are and that you are NOT defined by the N or any of the people that the N turns against you.
Love Ami
((((((((((((Ami))))))))))) -- thank you!!!
I'm hard on myself about my weakness. Your post just strengthened me! It was a blessing on my soul at this time.
Thank you so much GS, Carolyn, AMI -- I needed all of your love and encouragement...I'm getting stronger by the hour, I can feel it.
Lise
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((((((((Lise)))))))) I am so glad you're feeling stronger.
Everyone's posts here have helped me, too. And once again, Lise, I am so grateful that you're willing and able to bring these things out into the open, into the light and air, where they can lose their power to stir up fear and pain and anger.
Love,
Carolyn
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Dear Lise,
I am so happy that my experience helped you. I am seeing that we are responsible for OUR side of the street ,only. If someone hurts me,what they sow, they will reap. It is really "not" in my hands, even though I "feel" that it is,often. Ann helped me with this.
It is not my role to judge,just to give the person to God, and to ,of course,protect myself from abuse.
That person WILL reap what they saw, b/c it is a spiritual law.
Ann said that the human being was not designed to carry hatred, bitterness, or even to judge others. We will bring bad consequnces back on us, if we do.
This has freed me. I hope that it iis helpful to you, Lise. Love Ami
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Aha
This is where I posted my heart out when I told how th N had fooled everyone and I was left out of the whole picture.
No response/acknowledgment.
I was surprised at no response.................. then I guessed it was me?
Izzy
Yes, Izzy... I saw your post here last night, briefly... and then it was gone. I posted to you on another thread and mentioned it... and asked whether you were okay...
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Thank you Hope,
I didn't see the other thread!
xx
Izzy
You're welcome, Izzy... sorry I don't remember now which one. I didn't get a chance to read it thoroughly last night before it went *poof*. I can only process so much at once, with my already limited capacity... but wished there's been a chance to reply.
Glad you got rid of that bad tooth, Iz. Don't forget to rinse with warm saltwater to encourage healing :P
oxo
Carolyn
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Sorry, Izzy...if I left you hanging somewhere.
Hope you know I love you.
Hops
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This post hit close to home, as the N has reappeared and contacted my old friends. My first thought was to fight, but I knew I would lose, so I ignored him. He has now been found driving around my neighborhood (he lives about 75 miles away) so I know that he's loosing it. If I had responded immediately, he would have come off as the poor injured party. I know it's not over yet, but the NC seems to bring out a different side.
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Oh my goodness, ((( Alone )))
I can identify with your experience as my exNH travels still, some long distance to our last house, and sits in car outside the house, and goes into a venue and nonchalantly enquires as to whether I have visited the area. I know he is hoping that I will travel there and visit the area. Well he will just have to sit and hope in vain till his fog freezes.
My exNH believes that I belong to him -- period.
Leah x
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In my experience and by my observations N often try to destroy our standing with others and can be very successful at it. They seem to do it when we are most vulnerable. I had this happen to me at my very lowest. It is tragic that they are usually very successful. In my experience there is no winning i.e. no undoing the damage. If you try to appeal you case to the people the N has turned against you somehow the N always wins and you can get sucked in deeper and deeper into the mire. I am not suggesting that it is easy, I am only suggesting that the stock market metaphor applies here - cut your losses and get out. And don't worry about the timing - just go and leave the people who chose the N over you behind - no matter how painful. It is like being a refugee from your embattled homeland. Life will never be the same but you can opt for a new life in a foreign land or you can risk your life by staying in the war. Not great options.
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In my experience and by my observations N often try to destroy our standing with others and can be very successful at it. They seem to do it when we are most vulnerable. I had this happen to me at my very lowest. It is tragic that they are usually very successful. In my experience there is no winning i.e. no undoing the damage. If you try to appeal you case to the people the N has turned against you somehow the N always wins and you can get sucked in deeper and deeper into the mire. I am not suggesting that it is easy, I am only suggesting that the stock market metaphor applies here - cut your losses and get out. And don't worry about the timing - just go and leave the people who chose the N over you behind - no matter how painful. It is like being a refugee from your embattled homeland. Life will never be the same but you can opt for a new life in a foreign land or you can risk your life by staying in the war. Not great options.
... and God help you when N witnesses you make a mistake, an error in judgment... because when else are we more vulnerable? And there is shiny N, all loaded with ammo (some of which you actually have supplied yourself, for once) and ready to drill you full of holes.
When walking away is not an option - or not your preference, whatever - I opt for standing tall in a well known pattern of honesty and integrity, confessing to being a frail, fallible human being, and continuing to live life by God's grace, with no looking back.
Love,
Carolyn
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In my experience and by my observations N often try to destroy our standing with others and can be very successful at it. They seem to do it when we are most vulnerable. I had this happen to me at my very lowest. It is tragic that they are usually very successful. In my experience there is no winning i.e. no undoing the damage. If you try to appeal you case to the people the N has turned against you somehow the N always wins and you can get sucked in deeper and deeper into the mire. I am not suggesting that it is easy, I am only suggesting that the stock market metaphor applies here - cut your losses and get out. And don't worry about the timing - just go and leave the people who chose the N over you behind - no matter how painful. It is like being a refugee from your embattled homeland. Life will never be the same but you can opt for a new life in a foreign land or you can risk your life by staying in the war. Not great options.
Dear GS
I am copying down your words of wisdom, all of which, are precious affirming, validating, priceless pearls.
Leah x
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Aha
This is where I posted my heart out when I told how th N had fooled everyone and I was left out of the whole picture.
No response/acknowledgment.
I was surprised at no response.................. then I guessed it was me?
Izzy
Hi Izzy,
It was not you it was me. I read your post but I was too absorbed in my own pain at the time to really give it much consideration. Your post rented space in my mind and I was thinking to myself "I'll get to Izzy's post."
It was also hard for me to follow your story but I WAS interested. Will you post your story again for me, I'd like to read it?
Dear (((Izzy))) -- I'm sorry if you felt un-acknowledged --- that must have hurt. I wish to give you every bit if respect and consideration you truly deserve. Please forgive me.
(I'm glad you used your voice and spoke up :D)
Love.
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Hi Lise,
A turning point was when I stopped running. I didn't invite the N into my space, but when they showed up to step on my toes I was ready and had a new attitude - Bring it On.
When it's their issue, not yours, nothing really phases you anymore. They act like a jerk and I say to myself: oh, there's that jerk again. (yawn)
(this does not mean I don't get angry, frustrated, moody, etc - I just understand the reason why - and say So what)
bean
Hi Bean -- your post was helpful.
There is the issue of aggression. It is sort of like you are sitting in a car with your younger brother who is tormenting you, you ignore it because you know that he is doing it just to get a rise out of you and make you mad. But he won't stop, everytime mom is not looking he grabs your hair and pulls it all the while you are trying to read your book and trying to mind your own business. You keep ignoring him as he keeps pulling, spitting and tugging, all when know one is looking. Finally, out of pent up frustration, you yell "STOP IT!" Then your mom turns around to yell at you to lower your voice. You try to explain to her what bro is doing, she tells you that you are being reactive, making you feel ashamed. All the while little brother is in the back rolling on the floor laughing at you.
Bottom line this persons taunting is not going to kill me. I'll just wish them happiness and offer up the annoyance as suffering :wink:
Good to hear from you Bean.
Lise
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Bottom line this persons taunting is not going to kill me. I'll just wish them happiness and offer up the annoyance as suffering :wink:
:D ((((((Lise))))))) sounds like a plan to me!
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Hi Lise,
Just saw your post after a morning on the phone with my oldest sister N.
I told her about a bad dream I had, BIG MISTAKE! I am already paying the price. Gave her ammo.
Anyway she kept on harping about how others think of "US". That our sister Trish has brain washed everyone (extended family, female cousins mainly) that we are the bad sisters, mean, leave her out etc.
She is mad that our sister hasn't called her in 5 weeks. She wants her and I DON"T. She wont listen, or hear me.
She said we were blacklisted by many.
I again don't care, and I also believe middle sister has won, as far as playing the victim.
Just liked you described, pushes and taunts you and then you speak up, maybe loudly and you look like the bully, troublemaker etc.
I once confided with one of my cousins. I poured my hear out. At the time didn't know what was my sisters problem, Narcissistic.
She never wanted to cross the line and be on any side. But I so much wanted to hear, that must of been very painful, sorry to hear that happened. More of a gentle silence I got.
I'm sure her communication with my sisters were only the show time faces, and couldn't grasp such ugliness. I understood in my heart, I thought........
Yet once this year after spending a weekend with my sister at a wedding out of state, I did not attend.
She sends me an email. One sentence.
"YOUR SISTER IS AWESOME!"
I felt so betrayed knowing I shared such deep pain with her. Why did she have to tell me that? She could of told plenty of people if she wanted to share how great my sister is. When she knows my heart cannot share that with her.
Again, my sister played herself up at this wedding, everyone falling all over her stories of herself, always saintly.
It still is painful to think about.
It is still painful that my oldest sister wants us to be a PAIR. When she herself is extremely narcissistic. I don't want to be with people that don't see me.
I know I need to escape from one last sister, but it is very hard.
Thank you (Lise) I understand and feel your words. seasons
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((((((((((((((Seasons))))))))))))))) Reading your post I felt so much disappointment and hurt for you.... you so much deserve to be seen and valued and cherished for who you are!
But some peoples' vision only goes so shallow... I guess they see what they want to see, because that's easiest for them - and it doesn't take alot of time out of their busy schedules and away from tending themselves.
You are cherished, dear Seasons.. and highly valued.
Love,
Carolyn
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Thank you Carolyn, that was so very kind of you. Feeling kinda weak today, your voice brought me comfort and truth.
I guess they see what they want to see, because that's easiest for them
A wonderful reminder when you are feeling a bit low.
Much love and peace to you always. seasons
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I felt so betrayed knowing I shared such deep pain with her. Why did she have to tell me that? She could of told plenty of people if she wanted to share how great my sister is. When she knows my heart cannot share that with her.
Again, my sister played herself up at this wedding, everyone falling all over her stories of herself, always saintly.
Dear Seasons,
I've been thinking about you lately.
The pain of betrayal is for me the worst, it just really hurts. I'm glad that you took the time to write this out and tell us about your pain.
The elusive pain of manipulation and other people's denial is so very hurtful and leaves us feeling helpless, if you know what I mean and I know you do.
"I don't want to be with people that don't see me."
Oh boy do I know this-- ouch. Others on this thread have said some good things here about this that have helped strengthen me and see the reality that I can't change the situation but this stuff can be overcome. And, as much as I want to change them or the situation, I have to change me and my attitudes towards the N's (good information)
However, I do not know about you but my little inner girl is throwing a tantrum right about now...she kicking and screaming "no" they change, not me!!!! All the while my adult is saying OK - I hear your pain.
Some days are better than others, if you know what mean? (((((((((((((((((((SEASONS)))))))))))))))))
Lise
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And, as much as I want to change them or the situation, I have to change me and my attitudes towards the N's (good information)
I agree their is a wealth of help on your thread. I am eager to learn and take the truth in. Very N broken down today. Tomorrow will be better.
However, I do not know about you but my little inner girl is throwing a tantrum right about now...she kicking and screaming "no" they change, not me!!!! All the while my adult is saying OK - I hear your pain.
(((Lise))) yes, I understand. seasons
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(((((((((((((Seasons)))))))))
You are in a really hard situation. I have been thinking lately that as "insecure" as I have gotten ,having an NM, I STILL am so glad that I am not an N.
It is better to be on the other end(little voice-LV) than an N.I know that you are hurting badly,Seasons, but YOU have empathy and heart.It IS better. Being an N is a wasteland.
Giving and receiving love is what makes life worth s/thing. Other that that, what really is there ,in life, of value. That is what it seems to me, anyway.
I know that ALL the things I did to try to be happy(buying things, education, marriage, activities etc) left me empty. I think that you need God's love first, as a foundation , and then give and recieve human love.
You always give ME a lot of love,Seasons . Ami
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Ok Here we go again!
N and I moved to a new city where we knew no one, 2000 miles away from family and friends.
At the campground we met a couple, rather ritzy in hindsight, who helped us out when the truck had to go in for new brakes. We spent the day at their place, had lunch and played trionimoes with their mentally challenged daughter. Then husband-half drove us back to the truck when it was ready. Very kind people. When N took the trip back for our cars and furniture, wife-half came and took me grocery shopping, then we had lunch..
N returned and I suggested going to see these people or having them over, when we were settled and he kept shrugging me off. I ran into them at Xmas time that year and they were very cool. I believe I said something about N, but not knowing he was an N, it might have been that he was an alcoholic and couldn’t spend time with anyone who didn’t drink---I really forget! (I just know he felt they were too ‘clean living’ for him.)
The neighbors on either side--a 6’ fence on the property lines. N could stand there an talk to them but I couldn’t. I never got to know them and I was shunned if I called out a “Hi!” When one couple had a baby we gave them a gift (N took it over) The thank was just to him.
I began to believe he was telling tall tales about me, like I was his maiden Aunt who was helping out with the business/books and wasn’t right in the head from a car accident--only G_d knows.
One of his customers, an elderly lady, bought a computer and wanted instructions. She told me this much later, after I had left him. He said he knew an instructor and she happened to live in the same house. She never knew we were a couple.
He buddied up with the guy across the street and later I learned he had a wife in a wheelchair. I never saw her outside. I went there once to retrieve a key to our house and a remote for the alarm system and she wouldn’t even talk to me.
It hindsight this is extremely insulting
Izzy
Iz, I don't know what to say... that is really bizarre. I cannot even guess what he was thinking at the time, or what his reasoning was...
but surely these folks' reactions had nothing to do with you. There's just no tellin... except I bet the woman whose husband he buddied up with (the one in the wheelchair who wouldn't talk to you) was thoroughly disgusted with him and - what? Somehow blamed you?
Who knows! He surely did a number on you, though... that old isolation technique which cuts you off from anyone who might be supportive.
((((((Izzy))))))
Carolyn
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Izzy beside fence:
Hi! I'm over here and I can't see you, but I'd like to say hello! Come on around the fence, would you???
You know, Izz, this reminds me of what happened at work the other day. When I burst out a couple sobs at my desk, I know the 2 coworkers in the other room heard it. My boss made a beeline in there, and I'm sure he put his Nspin on it. No doubt subtly putting me down while sounding "concerned".
I've been wondering whether I should ask one of them what he said, but figure it's more politic not to. If they're wired to recognize an N, they'll eventually figure it out themselves. If they're not, then as we've all experienced, it may be a waste of time or make me look bad, if I bring it up.
I think the best thing is for me to keep my head up and treat everyone courteously and just let it go.
Izz, I have a feeling that you would be very good at voodoo. Shall we do a voodoo Ndoll? Hmm, what could we do with him.
Sit him upside down in a chair with scotch tape over his mouth and let him know exactly what we think of him.
Prop him up on the sidewalk with a sandwich board that says, WONDERFUL WOMAN INDOORS. NARCISSIST JERK HERE.
heh heh
Hops
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lol... (((((((((((Hops))))))))))) ((((((((((((((Izzy))))))))))) you two made me giggle... thanks!
And Hops... ugh. I have a similar scenario with a co-worker who last known remark about me to other co-workers was to tell them that I get "over-anxious". Patronizing is her middle name. Now when they come to tell me what she's said, I just shake my head and say, I don't even wanna know. They're all wise to her.
Love,
Carolyn
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I completely agree with the former posts that say that you can't win. I have been fighting this battle since I was a kid (and didn't even know what the fight was about) and always lost.
If you are a believer, then don't get in the way of God's justice. Forgive and let Him carry out it.
But if you want to try something, I can say one thing you CAN’T do. NEVER, NEVER, NEVER tell the whole truth about the narcissist.
Nobody will believe you. That by itself is a defense for the narcissist. It is too much craziness. You wouldn't believe it if you weren't there.
I had a narcissistic/borderline girlfriend. She was my best friend during college. EVERYBODY who knew her (including myself) would tell you how religious, funny, considerate, honest, lovely etc she was. When we began our relationship I thought I had won the lottery. During the following months, between her attempts (?) of suicide, I would try to conciliate two images in my brain: the one of the angelic and beautiful classmate and the devil I had met. BTW, she always accused me of being aggressive (in the middle of her affairs, lies etc).
If I couldn't believe who she was behind the facade, who would?
I remember when I read “A child called it”. There was a moment when I threw the book away and said “Impossible! Nobody would do it!”. Immediately I understood why so many people weren't capable of connecting with my experiences and tried to minimize my feelings.
If you want to try to break the facade, the inverted picture of victim/aggressor, you may try a very simple step.
You say only a simple (but powerful) truth (a fact, never an opinion, judgment etc) a time. And you state that calmly, never making any accusation.
In the same way the N planted seeds of lies and doubts in the minds of everyone, you are going to try to plant a seed of truth.
If you have to stick to a single truth, do it. No matter how long it takes.
A friend of mine always joked that I must be the crazy one, not my girlfriends. If I were in her place I would have thought that as well. One day, I sat down and said, “Well, you say I'm the crazy one, let me tell just one, among hundreds of things that I hear, and this one is far from the worst. What would you think if your husband, after you helped him all day long to buy gifts and other things, when you arrived home, told you “I am just going to have a quick one with the neighbor, bye”, with a smile in his lips? And after that, if you complained, you had to hear that “you don’t have a sense of humor”? And if you still desperately complained, you were told to go away, because “it was impossible to talk to you like that”? What would you feel?”
That changed everything. But she wasn’t under the spell of the narcissist, so you better be more careful yet and more subtle.
But remember, you aren't going to change the narcissist. All you may achieve is to crack his facade. Nothing more.
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Izzy,
Felt so sad when I read your post.........it reminded me of my own feelings of isolation........ we could never invite anyone back to our house because (a) he did not like people coming to the house and (b) he could be so rude or alternatively nice, depending on how useful the people were, that it just wasn't worth it.
As far as defending yourself when the N has fooled everyone IMO say nothing............ people tend not to hear, or else hear what they want to hear, they will continue to play the Ngames until they run out of steam and any reaction is fuel to the fire. People will believe what they want to believe. I also wonder about the motivation of those who "report"back. What good does it do anyone, we cannot control what another says and hearing back stories just does ones head in IMO.......breathing a sigh of relief to be far away from the dreaded N.
axa
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As far as defending yourself when the N has fooled everyone IMO say nothing............ people tend not to hear, or else hear what they want to hear, they will continue to play the Ngames until they run out of steam and any reaction is fuel to the fire. People will believe what they want to believe. I also wonder about the motivation of those who "report"back. What good does it do anyone, we cannot control what another says and hearing back stories just does ones head in IMO.......breathing a sigh of relief to be far away from the dreaded N.
axa
Well... I don't know whether they ever run out of steam, exactly... but maybe they'll find someone else to play with. That's what I've seen here... a sort of taking of turns, like back in grade school, "who will I target today?!" Basically, it's anyone who's dared to contradict her.
With N, her target is whomever she's most envious of at the moment - or - has caught the mighty powerful one in action and unmasked her.
This one at work is a real trip. I go out of my way to not point out her errors, but sometimes one will come to light because of the ignorant bystanders (how can they be innocent?!... they've worked with her far longer than I have). As the newest member of the clan, I get punished, somehow, some way, for N's foibles... and she loves to refer to me as "sweeeeeetie" (high, hissing voice) while doing it. This woman is only a few years older than me and has no reason to talk down to me so. Now the youngest of our little group has left (N's personal punching bag) and so I expect she'll try to get me to step in as replacement punching bag for all her frustrations. No way.
Carolyn
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If one more person tells me how "cute" or "amazing" my NM is, I think I may slap them. She has every one fooled, every single person in the community thinks she is "wonderful"; if there is ever the smallest hint that she might not be wonderful, I have heard too many people say, "Oh, no, it must be a mistake. She's just not like that. I know her too well and she'd never do that."
Gr-r-r-r-r
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(((((((((((((towrite))))))))))))) I know it feels like salt in an open wound.
I keep trying to practice forgiveness, but it's sure not easy. This stuff keeps coming back like a boomerang.
Sorry it's so hard.
Carolyn
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ToWrite,
Even one of my closest friends, when she sees me stumbling around exhausted, always stops and with deep concern, says How IS your mother? Now I know that's a kind inquiry and she is a kind woman.
But there have been times I've longed to say, "Just once, will you ask about the caregiver? How I'm holding up?" (I don't.)
Have to say that in 3-D life I actually have one friend who also has an Nmother (hers makes mine look like Ghandi)...and she DOES get it. Every permutation of it. It's been just amazing.
love
Hops
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Thanks Hops & Carolyn - it would be easier to forgive her if she hadn't refused to help me financially.
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Ok Here we go again!
N and I moved to a new city where we knew no one, 2000 miles away from family and friends.
At the campground we met a couple, rather ritzy in hindsight, who helped us out when the truck had to go in for new brakes. We spent the day at their place, had lunch and played trionimoes with their mentally challenged daughter. Then husband-half drove us back to the truck when it was ready. Very kind people. When N took the trip back for our cars and furniture, wife-half came and took me grocery shopping, then we had lunch..
N returned and I suggested going to see these people or having them over, when we were settled and he kept shrugging me off. I ran into them at Xmas time that year and they were very cool. I believe I said something about N, but not knowing he was an N, it might have been that he was an alcoholic and couldn’t spend time with anyone who didn’t drink---I really forget! (I just know he felt they were too ‘clean living’ for him.)
The neighbors on either side--a 6’ fence on the property lines. N could stand there an talk to them but I couldn’t. I never got to know them and I was shunned if I called out a “Hi!” When one couple had a baby we gave them a gift (N took it over) The thank was just to him.
I began to believe he was telling tall tales about me, like I was his maiden Aunt who was helping out with the business/books and wasn’t right in the head from a car accident--only G_d knows.
One of his customers, an elderly lady, bought a computer and wanted instructions. She told me this much later, after I had left him. He said he knew an instructor and she happened to live in the same house. She never knew we were a couple.
He buddied up with the guy across the street and later I learned he had a wife in a wheelchair. I never saw her outside. I went there once to retrieve a key to our house and a remote for the alarm system and she wouldn’t even talk to me.
It hindsight this is extremely insulting
Izzy
Hi Izzy,
Sorry but I still can't follow this post :( Well.
One of his customers, an elderly lady, bought a computer and wanted instructions. She told me this much later, after I had left him. He said he knew an instructor and she happened to live in the same house. She never knew we were a couple.
One thing came to mind is that you were given confirmation of his slander at least by one person. Your gut feelings were right. Recently, I spoke with a woman at my Parrish who told me that when we are being slandered, because of the lack of evidence, God will confirm our gut feelings for us by sending at least one person to confirm the slander. God does not leave us feeling crazy and second guessing ourselves.
Your feelings and experience of this is exactly the N dilemma or drama. The N's first have to fool everyone, form of control and power, then they have to slander, more control and power all of which comes from their fears.
Wonder what his fears were? He obviously did not have a core.
The pain of slander is anguish...it creates a sense of helplessness in the victim - very painful.
Lise