Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Ami on April 20, 2008, 11:28:51 PM
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since the interaction
until I saw it in technicolor, here
I could not see her ,like I did this one, which was obvious.
THREE little jabs.
I'm sorry your tummy aches. but you will just have to get over it. Pepto bismal, Exlax, Castor Oil? whatever!
I am not even thinking about the ones who descended upon me and there was more than one. I certainly have never been that omportant to you.Ami.
I've notived little jabs ever since. No one else mentioned them and you stopped. Now you have started again.
If I am out ofg hand here, wrong, then please excuse me and so be it!
The interaction on the board was you and me, not the whole world Get over yourself!
I am now going in search of oll the other jabs and will post them when you run crying to the board and Dr. G.
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It was a PM, Ami, and I see you have run to the board.
Yep there were all these little jabs.....
Now Just leave me alone!
Izzy
My recent interaction showed my life, in microcosm.
Look at my recent interaction. WAS it MY fault? Case closed
I have been healing ,from board events
I really feel "new" after the interaction.
The recent interaction showed us that
I have been really hurting for 4 days
My stomach started hurting me with all that was going on, on the board.
If I am pricked, I will push back.
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You are so sick that it is not even funny.
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Be careful of your thoughts,
For thoughts become your words.
Be careful of your words,
For your words become your actions.
Be careful of your actions,
For your actions become your habits.
Be careful of your habits,
For your habits become your character.
Be careful of your character,
For your character becomes your destiny.
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Now Just leave me alone!
Izzy. Look at what you are doing and saying. You are telling Ami to leave you alone and yet it is you who have sent her this PM. That really does not make sense.
In Ami's posts, she is talking about herself. But you are taking umbrage to that.
It does not make sense to lash out at Ami and then tell her to leave you alone.
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Calm down GS, for Heaven's Sake!!
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I was sent this threatening e mail, out of the blue. When Izzy did her original " lashing out" on me, I spoke up and THEN asked her to stay on the board b/c the board was important to her life.
This unsolicited e mail is pure abuse. The original assult was pure abuse ,too, but I tried to be the bigger person. There is just SO much abuse one person can take and I have reached mine. I feel badly for Izzy,but does that mean someone needs to take this ? Ami
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I feel badly for Izzy,but does that mean someone needs to take this ?
No, you don't need to, imho, Ami.
My advice is simply to block PMs from Izzy.
That's the best thing.
Then any conflict or communication is open. You can also ask Izzy not to address you on the board.
There is a member who decided not to engage me at all after she repeatedly became angry at me, and though at first I felt hurt, I now think it was a wise solution. We just don't talk but we don't interfere with the flow of the board, either.
Hops
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Dear Hops,
It may look like I put this on the board to be self serving and "interfere" with the flow of the board,but,in fact THIS is what the board is all about. This is a better lesson of our problems with voiclessness than thousands of words(IMO)
This situation has it all, about voicelessness.
This situation can take s/one from voiceless to having voice,IF they can understand it. Ami
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Ami, I wasn't accusing you of interfering with the flow of the board...not at all.
It was just my thought about what resulted with me and another person.
I do think when things feel painful or aggressive or out of control, blocking PMs is an important first step. You could do that...
You can discuss anything you want on the board, unless it's at the point when disengaging from a certain person seems wise. Some personality clashes really aren't solvable, imo...some people are oil and water. (I used to never believe that, but I do.)
Just thoughts, compost anything...
Hops
PS--I think I'm suggesting this approach because I don't think you and Izzy will ever be friends, so why not set boundaries in place that keep you from hurting each other? Tolerance is necessary in a place like this and when somebody simply can't tolerate another or refrain from lashing out at them, in my view it's time for walls.
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Dear Hops,
You are missing my point, with all due respect.
I had a terrible loss. Izzy saw me as vulnerable and MY vulnerability caused her to attack me, for NO reason, other than her OWN sickness. THAT is HOW we GOT abused in the first place.
This is not a personality clash This is an abusive person thinking s/one is vulnerable and attacking. Period. Ami
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I see why you reject the language "personality clash". It seems to take away the point that you are making that you were minding your own business, posting about your struggles and reaction to an earlier conflict when you received the PM from Izzy attacking you.
A "personality clash" is a very passive term suggesting that something just happens, but you don't percieve this PM as passive but received it as an active pursuit. Is that close?
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Yes ,GS, a personality conflict is two people who rub each other the wrong way. Abuse is one person attacking another person as a WAY to manage their own emotions and BLAME it on the other person.
This is why we are voiceless. It is important to call things what they are b/c truth heals. Love Ami
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I was not online to witness the recent aforementioned 'interaction' - so in that regard, bearing in mind that postings have been deleted, I am in no position to make any fair and reasonable comment.
With regard to Ami's thread entitled "Lessons" and this thread "This is the E mail I got"
I simply don't see a personality clash, Izzy had not engaged with Ami on her thread "Lessons," and I have looked through the "Lessons" thread and can't see any ''jabs'
This is how I see the situation ...
Ami created her thread "Lessons" and simply posted what she was working through, with her voice, her personal life experience(s).
Izzy decided to create, write, and post the PM to Ami -- for reasons known only to Izzy, and that is the sole responsibility of Izzy, who is personally accountable for her own thoughts, words, and actions.
As we all are, as individual persons with a free will and choice.
Ami received and read the PM from Izzy and decided to 'voice' her own thoughts, and feelings, with words, by creating a thread posting, this one. Which is her basic human right to do, and of course, she is personally accountable for doing so.
Personally, I have not blocked anyone in the land of PM. Why? Because, I prefer to encourage people to BE personally responsible and accountable for their own thoughts, words, and actions. Rather than, enabling and/or caretaking.
Personally, here on the board, I have had several hurtful, painful, and upsetting experiences, of which, after all, is part of life, and living a life, equipped -- not coddled.
Leah x
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Ami..........My father abused me when i was young and vulnerable....at his mercy. The only reason he did this was to fend off his own feelings of vulnerability/hurt as mine triggered the unconcious pain he experienced as a child while at the mercy of his parents. No doubt he felt powerful/justified for a moment but it was repeated over and over because he never was honest enough to face his own pain and understand what he was doing. I became the symbolic scapegoat until i found my voice and put a stop to this. It wasn't pretty but it worked.........James
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For what it's worth, I agree with you, Ami, that the initial interaction was an attack. And that this PM is more of the same. To the extent that exploring it and your response helps you, I say go for it. It IS a lesson in voicelessness and overcoming that. But I can see Hops' side too, about hitting the delete button, blocking, whatever. Let me explain this way: in my profession (which happens to be book publishing, though the term also relates to TV and film) there's something called "opportunity cost." OC is defined as the opportunities lost by focusing editorial/marketing/publicity dollars on a specific project. It sounds bass-akwards, but if we publish book A, it means not publishing book B, which may have done better, been more beneficial. Beneficial, in book publishing, means money. Here, beneficial means something much more important: your mental health and well-being. We all have limited stores of energy and time. You can choose to engage A, or you can choose to engage B, or C, or D. IF IT WERE ME (and I KNOW it's not), I'd send all future messages of this nature straight to the trash unread, just as I would a manuscript that has no potential for positive result (no, no, I don't really trash them, that's metaphorical). For me, it comes down to: do I really have this kind of time, or should I spend it elsewhere? That's not negating the hurt you feel, it's moving beyond what you cannot control (incoming manuscripts!) to what you can (sorry we can't work together, better luck elsewhere).
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Leah and Hops,
Yes I have to agree with you. I have just recently went through an experience in (real life) with a conflict between friends.
They both voiced to me.
Lesson learned was from being on this board. I choose not to engage. It was not my conflict. I simply shut the conversation down. This was my boundary and I enforced it. I don't know who was right or who was wrong but it was not up to me to fix it. There were hurts and pain and anger on both sides. They are both my friends and I could not hear one talk about the other to me with me. This felt like a betrayal on my end to engage in conversation with them about them. It would be a conflict of interest. I liked both parties. I am on a personal level with both.
I did learn that if something is uncomfortable or abusive to you that shutting down the conversation has nothing to do with shutting down your voice or feelings. It's just enforcing that strong boundary and choosing not to engage.
And your right Leah, such is life, always challenges and lessons to be learned. Sometimes very painful.
Love
Deb
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Ami,
Your initial post that struck me was the one about your friend hearing your husband talking with Scott about suicide before the sad occurrence. My point was that no one stepped in and dealt with Scott’s talking suicide. If it didn’t mean what I took it for, then an explanation would have saved a lot of typing.
(I had a woman come to me, saying she was going to kill herself. I telephoned 9-1-1, after discussing it with her and an ambulance came for her, took her to the psych ward. Her medications, doled out by the son and daughter-in-law, who professed to hate her, were adjusted and she became well again. She left them and went back to her friends in Europe. She escaped her tormentors, and lived)
That is what I meant by saying he could have been saved. However the situation spun out of control and it ended, becoming, to you, the upset from the board interaction.
I have so little to post about these days that I was thinking of leaving the board anyway. I was being of no assistance to those still in Contact with the N., because my belief is to stop contact and heal. Perhaps it is because you continue contact with your mother that it I find it irritating that you still complain about her. This interaction gave me a good reason to leave without just dropping off the map, a la changing.
I was asked to stay, although I thank those who asked, I still had little to say, but then received fewer responses. Hopalong is the only one who had interceded for you, while out of place in that episode, and still posted to me. The others stopped, so I knew they had nothing more to say to me. One of your fans, gjazz doesn't even know me and has chosen to ignore me.
I still read posts, not just yours, but yours were the only ones that kept referring to the interaction on the board. I knew they were little digs and jabs, but they finally stopped. I felt you had finally put it behind.
Then I posted a note about the now very pleasant understanding with my DD and I know you must have read my post, or at least seen the thread, because the little digs and jabs appeared again. You are the instigator this time, as I sent you a Private Message to spell it out and if I were wrong about this, to then please excuse me.
In your desire to further cause me to be isolated on this board, you made it public. I note someone pointed out about your being talkative and at that point you had an average of quite a number of posts per day--I see now it is 18?
Check your posts and you will see how many people have caused your stomach pains, and now it is my fault. If the little nigs and jabs continue, then look at your own thoughts.
(Hopalong: You have begun very few threads recently and I have responded to you; in particular your being blue thread. I think of you as a very special person, deserving of more than you are receiving. So your remark about my not talking to you is erroneous.)
My post about my DD mentioned that with much patience, persistence and hurt we have finally met in the middle of the road, to continue on together. I have a deep respect for her, but just saying it, does not make it so. It must be shown. It's the same with Love and with Friendship. The good ones in our lives stick with us through thick and thin...and some people just serve as a bad example.
Respectfully
Izzy
My thanks to Hops and her wisdom, as well as Leah and Deb. They have the knowledge that this is just you and me, not all their personalities mixed in the melée
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Hey Izz,
I wasn't referring to you not talking to me. (Another person.)
I don't think we've ever been estranged.
Sorry if my piping into this hasn't been helpful.
I know you got triggered. But I will stay out of it now.
Sometimes more voices add oxygen to fire.
Thanks for the kind words.
Back atya.
xo
Hops
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Well Iz-i am sad you do not mention me as friend and supporter. I love you and I love Am. Each of us is in a different place in our recovery-and we have different dynamics. Am and I have horrible N moms and no one knows pict these emotional vampires have taken from us. We think we are doing ok and then something triggers us. I understand having my body hurt. This death of her child had to be the worst and when someone is mourning they deserve some time to process and be irrational if neede
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Thank you for clearing that up, Hops,
I appreciate it. Sad to say that anyone else speaking up is not helpful to me. If Ami could respond in a adult and calm manner, no one else is needed.
Love ya
Izzy
and Overcomer
My sincere apologies for neglecting to mention you. You were not on this thread and I forgot, with the posts I have deleted, but could have run through the names, then remembered. I am sorry about your having an N mother. I remember this from my very beginning.... and the business. You are trying so hard to break free and I applaud you for that. We each break free in our own way.
I am amazed at the parallels in my DD's life and mine!
Love and Good Luck
Izzy
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Oh Iz,
I am sorry if you feel, felt that I was avoiding you. I really am not. I have been reading and posting and having anxiety attacks looking up health issues in between. My mind is all over the place sometimes.
Talk about a lesson learned. I learned not to look up anything on the net because you will surely go from nothing to 4 days left to live.
Love
Deb
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Interesting, bean--I can only respond for myself, and I have no desire to control anyone. Nor do I delude myself into thinking I can. I see these boards as a place to go to bounce ideas and experiences off other people. This is why I post, when I do, and I assume people take what good they can from it, if anything, and ignore the rest.
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No worries, bean. Hugs back to you! (Do you know I just realized what those parentheses are for??) I'm a slow one! LOL.
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Ami -- Just wanted to say that I hear your pain over this situation -- I'm sorry this happening to you. When are hurting and want someone to defend us, which is only natural and human, advice can come across as feeling belittling and "fixing it" rather than allowing you to feel the pain and have your feelings acknowledged with compassion.
The fact is that you have been unfairly attacked and it hurts -- you do not deserve it.
Love,
Lise
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Izzy,
You have targeted me for abuse b/c of YOUR own issues. I am SORRY for your issues, but I am not your pin cushion. I don't want to engage with you in any form.
Ami
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Dear Bean,
I will not accept Izzy's abuse any more. That is what this thread is about for me.
Love Ami
PS When I am attacked out of the blue and people who care for me try to help, it is NOT unwanted intereference. It is LOVE.
To the people who are saying "Let Izzy and me work it out. This is making the abuser and the one abused EQUAL.
IMO, The abuser ,Izzy ,is the abuser. Period. If you saw s/one beaten up on the street would you feel sympathy for the bully? I know this is saying it "straight",but I want to say it straight ,FINALLY.
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Thanks Bean
You got it. Love Ami
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Dear Bean All I want now is NO interaction in ANY form or WAY with Izzy. I cared when she attacked me the FIRST time that she would be at a loss if she left the board.
I don't care what she does or where she goes as long as she stays away from me. Ami
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((((((( Ami ))))))))
My heart truly goes out to you, a mother, still grieving, should not have to endure this, not at all, and most especially, not here.
As always, you are in my prayers.
Making ones own personal boundary clearly known, is always the best thing to do, for ones own personal emotional well being.
One can only ever be responsible and accountable for oneself.
Take care of you,
Love, Leah
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My heart goes out to you too. I know we know what is like to have our mom rob us of all precious-I do NOT know what it is like to lose a child to death-I hope to never find out and I will always be here to support you through the most awful thing anyone will ever go through.