Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Gabben on May 27, 2008, 05:55:26 PM
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Hi Everyone,
As I have been reading through some threads I found myself reflecting back to this article on Victim Anger which was very helpful for me in healing the wound from N fakesaint as well as the underlining wounds of my childhood that surfaced from her abuse.
Such as what it was like as a child to be rendered voiceless through silent shame and aggression, which was triggered by the covert aggression of Nfakesaint, as well as the need to speak out about how unfair the treatment was which was a parallel to my mom's abuse. The feelings I had as a child of hatred for my mom as well as that huge disappointing feeling that it was not fair have come up and out and are still coming. Nfake saint retraumatized me in a similar way as she covertly raped my heart and then rendered me silent with the smear campaign.
This article helped me to see that I had a deep layer of this victim anger stuff from a childhood of voicelessness and emotional neglect. The victim anger led me to self-destruct in many ways throughout my life in a silent unconscious fight for justice; if I could not get them then I would get me...it is and was really all about seeking relief, or satisfaction, in order to cope with the overwhelming pain and sense of helplessness of emotional abuse as a child.
My healing came when I made the conscious decision to no longer seek satisfaction; a giving up of self-hatred, a giving up of hurting me to get back at them; a giving up of self-justice and rather trusting God to render His justice in His time.
I hope this helps others here. It took me a while to digest this article but I kept at it; reading and reading until if finally sunk in and the tears came out.
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VICTIM ANGER by,
Raymond Lloyd Richmond, Ph.D.
According to the principles of geometry, an infinite
number of lines can be drawn through a single point,
To define any one particular line, however, two points
are needed.
The same sort of principle applies to psychology. The
experience of one trauma, for example, does not tell
you much about your unconscious, because any
explanation is as good as any other, If you are raped
once, or if you get in a car crash, no one has a right
to point at you and say, "You did this wrong," or "You
did that wrong." It's simply impossible to deduce
anything psychological from one event.
But if the trauma is repeated, then you have two
points to define a line that can be tracked back into
the past and projected into the future. This is the
time to sit up and take notice, because if you don't,
there will likely be a third time, And there may be
others again, until you start to look at your life and
ask yourself what is going on.
This concept of psychological repetition, however, has
nothing to do with naturally recurring cycles. If your
neighbor wakes you up early every morning when he
goes to work, for example, you might feel angry, but
this isn't victim anger.
Repetition refers to an unconscious process by which
you essentially lead yourself into trouble over and
over.
For some dark, unknown reason, you so despise yourself
that you continually put yourself at physical or
psychological risk, And the failure to accept that
this unconscious process has you trapped in its
clutches leads to victim anger.
As trauma after trauma batters you, you will begin to
say, "Why me? This isn't fair!" You will blame anyone
who gets in your way. You will feel like an innocent
victim being persecuted by the world, You might even
become a psychological "terrorist" whose unconscious
objective is to undermine the structure of any
authority perceived to be unjust and uncaring. But
because you can't look at your responsibility in what
is happening, you will develop a victim mentality,
believing that every painful event in your life is
"their" fault, and you will have fallen into victim
anger.
A careful distinction must be made here in
regard
to "naturally" repeated child abuse and repetition.
When a child is abused, it cannot be claimed that
the child has any responsibility for the abuse.
Violence is always the responsibility of the
perpetrator, and, when violence is repeated, the
perpetrator is at fault.This repeated abuse is
therefore not a result of the child's unconscious
desires.
But there is a psychodynamic process called
identification with the Aggressor in which the abused
child, in trying to make sense of something
essentially senseless, comes to believe that the abuse
must somehow be justified, and the child will
therefore unconsciously seek to befriend, and even
imitate, the abuser. With this dynamic in place, blame
and anger toward the abuser becomes turned
toward the self, thus beginning the repetition of an
unconscious, self-inflicted abuse.
In fact, scientific research has shown that adults
who were sexually abused as children tend to have
a high risk for sexual assault (e.g., rape) as adults.
Moreover, the research shows that adult sexual assault
victims who were also abused as children tend to have
even lower levels of mental health functioning than
those persons who were sexually abused as children but
not revictimized as adults.
So what's going on here? Well, the
psychological
process of developing an unconscious sense of victim
anger is largely a matter of misdirected blame:
Here's how it works in common-sense language:
1. As a result of abuse, the child experiences
painful fear and hatred of the abuser(s).
2. But because the child feels essentially
powerless to stop the abuse or to convince
anyone to help, the child begins to perceive
the whole world as "unfair."
3. The child blames the world for being un-
fair, and, at the same time, begins to blame
himself or herself for not being "good
enough" to put up a successful fight against
the world.
4. The child learns that blaming the world
does not provide any immediate gratifica-
tion, and that punishing the world is not an
easy task, but that blaming the self-and
punishing the self-can provide immediate
and controlled satisfaction.
5, Because this self-destructive behavior is
unconsciously directed against the world,
however, and not against the self, the child
cannot realize, let alone accept consciously,
that he or she is now causing most of his or
her own pain.
6, Therefore, the child grows into an adult
who harbors an aching bitterness against
the world for its unpunished abuses, and,
at the same time, at every disappointment
he or she will find some convenient, secret
means of self-sabotage-and will then feel
justified in saying, "Look what they did to
me! It's not fair!"
And what strange satisfaction maintains all this
self-destruction? Well, it's the satisfaction of
unconsciously hoping to show the world how wrong it
is. Like Hamlet holding a mirror up to his mother,
hoping that she will see in herself the responsibility
she played in the death of the king, the person
trapped in victim anger will hold
up his own destruction as "evidence" that, he hopes,
will condemn the world.
Thus you might hear someone saying, "So what if I get
cancer from smoking? Maybe it will serve them right.
Then they will see how much I had to suffer," And so
this unfortunate life will end, just like Hamlet,
cluttered with death and destruction.
Unlike a martyr, though, who lays down his or her life
out of pure love, this self-destruction has its deep
motivation in bitterness, hatred, and an obstinate
rejection of forgiveness.
When confronted by the victim anger of repetition,
therefore, your only hope is first to resolve the
repetition that traps you, You can't forgive"others if
the real problem is yourself: How can you accept the
ugly part of human nature if you can't see it in
yourself and if you can't accept your personal
responsibility for constantly placing yourself at
risk? If you don't recognize the repetition,
all the kings horses and all the king's men-and
all the anger management classes in the world-won't
save you from your own unconscious efforts to destroy
yourself as you remain locked in the dark identity of
being a victim.
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Dear Lise
Thank you for this. It is so true and so sad that it IS true. I read it and it was distressing to me b/c I know I am doing it.Sometimes, this fight to overcome N conditioning seems too much, too big.
I am feeling that, at the moment,but hope it will change, soon.
Thanks for so many of your wonderful articles. Love Ami
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Dear Lise
Thank you for this. It is so true and so sad that it IS true. I read it and it was distressing to me b/c I know I am doing it.Sometimes, this fight to overcome N conditioning seems too much, too big.
I am feeling that, at the moment,but hope it will change, soon.
Thanks for so many of your wonderful articles. Love Ami
Ami,
That voice that you just shared was the voice of your inner child. As children our healing and coping felt "too big" as you say. It WAS too big which is why we wait...grief waits until we are in a place in life where we can handle it...subconsciously we know when we can heal. You would not even be reading this article and responding if you were not in a place of openness and healing.
Just know that voice you shared was the precious tender voice of your inner child because when you were a child it was "too big." But NOW you can handle it.
Lise
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this is a painful, painful article to read. I get it and it is speaking to me. I could write so much about my own life and my husband's life that I recognize in that article. I have made so much progress. I have finally moved out of the bitterness and moved through much of the resentment that has plagued me lifelong.
IOW, I have dealt well with the dark feelings that I projected outward onto others but I have not yet dealt with the dark feelings that I turned inward. Suddenly, as I write, it makes perfect sense that the "outward" would be healed first. And now I am in the midst of healing the "inward" and that is the most painful and the ugliest and the most difficult to deal with.
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You can't forgive"others if
the real problem is yourself: How can you accept the
ugly part of human nature if you can't see it in
yourself and if you can't accept your personal
responsibility for constantly placing yourself at
risk? If you don't recognize the repetition,
all the kings horses and all the king's men-and
all the anger management classes in the world-won't
save you from your own unconscious efforts to destroy
yourself as you remain locked in the dark identity of
being a victim.
This is difficult stuff, Lise... and absolutely true, in my experience.
In fact, I believe it's the dynamic behind every addiction, compulsion, neurosis, obsession, etc, etc... all of the faulty ways we may go about seeking to fill ourselves from a bitter well.
Thank you!
With love,
Carolyn
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I really need to start off my support group rounds here first. I always start the day of with some thought or issue and somebody here already seems to be all over it. "How can you accept the ugly part of human nature if you can't see it in yourself." I found this article painful also. I find it difficult to to deal with all this because in conquering all that outside pain all my attention has been turned inward and its a difficult place to explore.
Its a bit overwhelming, how do people deal with this?
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You can't forgive"others if
the real problem is yourself: How can you accept the
ugly part of human nature if you can't see it in
yourself and if you can't accept your personal
responsibility for constantly placing yourself at
risk? If you don't recognize the repetition,
all the kings horses and all the king's men-and
all the anger management classes in the world-won't
save you from your own unconscious efforts to destroy
yourself as you remain locked in the dark identity of
being a victim.
This is difficult stuff, Lise... and absolutely true, in my experience.
In fact, I believe it's the dynamic behind every addiction, compulsion, neurosis, obsession, etc, etc... all of the faulty ways we may go about seeking to fill ourselves from a bitter well.
Thank you!
With love,
Carolyn
Dear Carolyn,
It was so good to see your post, I was wondering were you were, I missed you.
Yes, this stuff was hard to swallow, as the truth really is.
What SS said was soothing:
IOW, I have dealt well with the dark feelings that I projected outward onto others but I have not yet dealt with the dark feelings that I turned inward.
Seeing the release of projection and taking ownership is more than half the battle. I know that I am no longer the victimizer that I was in my early twenties when I started to out grow my N traits due to the painful awareness and wake-up call a boss gave me.
Now I am the victim...screaming in pain and anger, but God is giving me a chance to be free from the victim role. I can see clearly to see that I choose the role, I choose the abusers that will mirror the pain that my mom gave me so that it gets triggered. I think that we are all trying to heal ourselves.
I think that life has to get worse before it gets better...But it will always get better as we work for it -- life and happiness is an inside job.
Lately, I have been working through my mom's invalidation, ouch, this stuff hurts, I can feel my inner child kicking and screaming. I have to remind myself to take the pain to the cross, let the tears flow and embrace the healing peace that follows until the next memory layer comes one day I will run out of painful memories, hopefully.
Hugs,
Lise
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I really need to start off my support group rounds here first. I always start the day of with some thought or issue and somebody here already seems to be all over it. "How can you accept the ugly part of human nature if you can't see it in yourself." I found this article painful also. I find it difficult to to deal with all this because in conquering all that outside pain all my attention has been turned inward and its a difficult place to explore.
Its a bit overwhelming, how do people deal with this?
Darren,
You are so correct, it is overwhelming and the best way I handle is to seek out support, safe support that I can share the ugly parts of self with, if you know what I mean? Not everyone understands and many will shame us right back into victimland if we open up about our ownership of our human failures. We all are so far from perfect -- what makes a good person good is that they can admit they are wrong and sometimes bad....that is it, at least in my opinion, what makes a good person good. Anyone who acts perfect all of the time wearies me.
Safe people and loving people to share with that can go deep is one way I cope. Also, my thinking used to get morbid when I would see the self-hatred or the behaviors that were Nish...yuck...I still see the N parts of me, but mostly from the perspective of my inner child...or at least my awareness that my anger IS my inner child who needs love and the best love I can give her is my attention by mourning her loss of love -- hope that makes sense.
Also, when our thinking is geared towards the outside it can take a great effort to turn our thinking inward to see the ugly, but it is never so black and white. We are all a mix of good, bad, ugly behaviors and beauty as well.....all of us and we have all walked many different paths.
I am my own worst enemy even when I have an enemy like Nsaint who would run me over with a car if she could, but only if I allowed it....well not anymore!
Lise
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I think that life has to get worse before it gets better...But it will always get better as we work for it -- life and happiness is an inside job.
Lately, I have been working through my mom's invalidation, ouch, this stuff hurts, I can feel my inner child kicking and screaming. I have to remind myself to take the pain to the cross, let the tears flow and embrace the healing peace that follows until the next memory layer comes one day I will run out of painful memories, hopefully.
Dear Lise,
I think so, too. It's all an inside job... and the battle is for the mind. No sooner do I make a decision of will to work toward more positive, definite goals than all heck can break loose...
so I'm comin to expect that and not pay it any mind.
Mostly, I am so sorry that you have such memories of your mom's invalidation to recall ........
and yet I believe that you are fully capable of re-parenting yourself with love and tenderness and mercy, by God's grace. I believe the same about me... finally.
From my experience, neglectful parents teach kids how to neglect themselves. That can be manifest in many ways, by multiple symptoms, but it all comes from the same cause.
My own neglect of my emotional (and physical) self was very deeply engrained and broad-spectrumed... and even though those days are now passed, it's still not easy to tackle each day as a mature adult and not revert to old ways. That's a daily choice which I have to make. It's tough... but it's definitely time to be a big girl now... lol. A friend of mine always says, "It'll be alright!" (after singing the tune from the old "Pull Ups" tv ad) and my reply came to be: "Yeah, I know... cuz we got our big girl panties on."
:)
Thanks for what you said, Lise. I've missed you, too. Just determined to monitor my own time and energy and not get overly wrapped up in the computer/ this forum. Alot of life has passed by while I've sat typing, over the past few years. Enough of that! Balance has always been my biggest struggle. There've been lots of obsessive/ compulsive roots to weed out... lol. Feels like I finally have it under moderation, though... thank God!
((((((((((((Lise)))))))))))) I love you bunches, always. And I think that you'll wear out those painful memories before they wear you out. Some stuff simply has to run its course.
Carolyn
P.S. What you wrote to Darren about how your thinking used to go morbid...
whew, I know about that rut, too. It's another reason why I really need to always monitor what I put before my eyes and into my head... both from others and from myself! Heard a pastor say - give yourself 10 minutes per day to worry/sulk/be negative... and then that's it, cut yourself off from that line of thinking and deliberately change directions! Takes practice, but it really works!! Hugs.
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From my experience, neglectful parents teach kids how to neglect themselves. That can be manifest in many ways, by multiple symptoms, but it all comes from the same cause.
My own neglect of my emotional (and physical) self was very deeply engrained and broad-spectrumed...
Hi Carolyn,
I know you tend to lurk around sporadically as I do here these days but in case you read I just wanted to say hi and send you a hug.
What you wrote above has been very helpful for me in the past few weeks as I have been watching myself in the way I care for myself internally. What is so amazing is seeing the old tapes and stories run through my mind bringing me to a realization that those are just lies or untruths about reality; such as watching myself spend so much time alone in the past many months is an acting out of how I was ignored and invalidated as a child. When the untold painful story comes to light of my mind I no longer act it out anymore. Although, I really have needed my solitude for prayer and healing I have recently started to come out of my slumber isolation mode and spend more time with friends on the weekends.
Genuine healing is happening for me. Even this morning I found myself annoyed in thinking about Nfakesaint; I heard myself say "this is my life and my mental space, Nsaint - get out!" It was then that I realized that my mom took up so much mental space in my head because she wanted to. She had to be the center of attention and that meant that she had to takeover our lives, our attention thought space. Of course I had to give it to her for my survival I had to allow her to reside in my thoughts and that is exactly what I am doing with Nsaint -- it is a reacting out of the untold drama of what it was like to give my life to my mom to fully give her my thoughts and head space, I am self-neglecting myself by allowing Nsaint to rent free space in my head.
This morning I felt amazing relief through that insight. Lately, I have been feeling better than I have felt in months. I know for sure that I am really moving on.
Love and hugs (could not have done it with out you Carolyn)
Lise
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I really need to start off my support group rounds here first. I always start the day of with some thought or issue and somebody here already seems to be all over it. "How can you accept the ugly part of human nature if you can't see it in yourself." I found this article painful also. I find it difficult to to deal with all this because in conquering all that outside pain all my attention has been turned inward and its a difficult place to explore.
Its a bit overwhelming, how do people deal with this?
Darren,
You are so correct, it is overwhelming and the best way I handle is to seek out support, safe support that I can share the ugly parts of self with, if you know what I mean? Not everyone understands and many will shame us right back into victimland if we open up about our ownership of our human failures. We all are so far from perfect -- what makes a good person good is that they can admit they are wrong and sometimes bad....that is it, at least in my opinion, what makes a good person good. Anyone who acts perfect all of the time wearies me.
Safe people and loving people to share with that can go deep is one way I cope. Also, my thinking used to get morbid when I would see the self-hatred or the behaviors that were Nish...yuck...I still see the N parts of me, but mostly from the perspective of my inner child...or at least my awareness that my anger IS my inner child who needs love and the best love I can give her is my attention by mourning her loss of love -- hope that makes sense.
Also, when our thinking is geared towards the outside it can take a great effort to turn our thinking inward to see the ugly, but it is never so black and white. We are all a mix of good, bad, ugly behaviors and beauty as well.....all of us and we have all walked many different paths.
I am my own worst enemy even when I have an enemy like Nsaint who would run me over with a car if she could, but only if I allowed it....well not anymore!
Lise
This is very profound, Lise. Thank you. Love Ami
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((((((((((Lise))))))))) You are so very on-time... thank you so much for writing to me today!
I've been fumbling around in a bit of a rough patch here, but just hearing from you has already lifted me up so much. Oh, and your hug is gratefully received with a big smile!!
Ignored and invalidated as a child....
yes, in my bones - I understand that.
And I can see in my own life how such neglect can get translated into withdrawal - - a sort of self-imposed isolation - - in adulthood. Solitary confinement.
I'm wondering... do you think/feel that you are naturally a loner, Lise?
Always thought that I was, but anymore - I'm not so sure. It's just so hard to know what we might have been, "by nature", you know... once so many layers of other gunk's been heaped on. Maybe alot of what I've been imposing on myself (along the same lines) is also an acting-out of old rubbish. Sometimes I'm not sure whether I'm recharging my batteries or simply hiding out. The best I know to do is just try to remain aware of how I'm spending my time and attend to keeping things in moderation/balance.
Weekend outings with friends... sounds so healthy and wholesome, dear Lise, and I do hope that you're enjoying these times. You deserve to have some plain old-fashioned fun!! If you want to share, I'd love to hear more about how you're investing that time. Here, I tend to get so bogged down in family stuff and running around that there's not much left of me once that's accomplished. Not that it's bad... just seems to be readily using me up, lately. When stopping to smell the roses has to be added to the to-do-list, I know I'm running on fumes... lol.
This is absolutely awesome, Lise:
Genuine healing is happening for me. Even this morning I found myself annoyed in thinking about Nfakesaint; I heard myself say "this is my life and my mental space, Nsaint - get out!"
Amen to that!
And I think I know exactly what you mean about your mom taking up so much mental space... your thoughts and attention, as a child. It's like being a sponge for someone else's crud and it's absolutely consuming. No boundaries... no filters... left bare and vulnerable for whatever flows downhill at us. Yet for most of my life, I thought that's how it was supposed to be! Really, I feel that we are trained to be used by such soul-snatchers from pre-verbal days, to such an extent that it's reflexive. This pattern takes over, by remote control, long before we have the mental processes to even be aware of it. After offering yourself up on the altar of other peoples' desires for a lifetime, giving that up leaves behind a seemingly very large & vacant space. I know that I've let alot of people (and stuff) try to fill that spot, Lise, and now they're all trying to get my attention and remind me of their past presence. It's not a pretty picture at all.
Recently my son had a nasty patch of poison oak on his skin, going quite deep. Although it's healing now, the one spot is still quite a pit (on his backside) and will likely leave behind a lifelong scar. The bad stuff is gone and there's no infection, but what is left behind... wow. And that's how my heart feels at times.... so the most gigantic challenge is in the daily choice- what's gonna fill that gap? Am I going to allow something or someone to swoop in and occupy that space? Or will I try to patch it up with my own idea of who I am/should be? Or God? Lately I've been desperately wanting to fill it myself... even though I know that going that direction only brings misery. And, of course, there's that awful nagging question which keeps returning at such times... "Aren't you further along than THIS, by now?!!??" Still trying to get that hissing voice to shut up. Along with you, I'm posting that "No Vacancy" sign... and if it falls over, we'll just hammer it a bit deeper into the ground next time, okay? *sigh* ..... lol. Did I mention how glad I am that you wrote? I feel better already. Thank you again for thinking of me and jogging me awake... and please know that you're in my prayers always.
With love,
Carolyn
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I ran across this today, an article I liked and can relate to.
Getting Out of the Victim Role
by Dianne Schwartz An excerpt from Whose Face Is in the Mirror?
The Story of One Woman's Journey from the Nightmare of Domestic Abuse fo True Healing
If you're used to being a victim, it can take time to recognize that love and respect go hand in hand.The doctor said he believed he had gotten all of the cancer. He expected my father to fully recover and live a long life. Dad was heavily drugged and was cracking stupid jokes. My sister and I asked if they had a drug to make him funnier.
Dutifully, I sent flowers to my father's hospital room. When I wasn't working, I tried to visit him, but only when my mother wasn't there. She was refusing to speak to me - an old pattern that no longer intimidated me.
Dad would try to make me look at his incision, knowing I would probably pass out at the sight of it. Things of that nature made me weak in the knees. I laughingly refused. But when he was no longer on painkillers, his nasty disposition returned. He was nice to my sister, but not to me. "It had always been this way, so I had grown accustomed to it. The only problem was, I no longer needed it or fed off it." Once again, though, I willingly let myself be put in the position of becoming a victim of sorts. As a result of my therapy, I could actually see it taking place, but not being 100 percent well yet, I allowed myself to enter into this familiar territory.
It started out as concern on my sister's part. She was in town to visit Dad during his stay in the hospital. She called me at the store one day and said, "I have to tell you that I'm worried. I just found out that Mom and Dad don't have any health insurance. If something major happened, they could be wiped out financially. Would you do me a favor? Could you try to talk to Dad and see if you can talk him into getting some kind of insurance?".
Now, as I look back on the situation, I should have told my sister that if she was so concerned, she should do it herself. But still the rescuer, I told her I would try.
The next time I visited him, I mentioned "my" concern. My father exploded. "The only reason you care is out of fear of losing your inheritance. Mind your own business."
I didn't want to be around his angry and demeaning remarks anymore. I guess since they had gotten all the cancer and he knew he wasn't going to die, he didn't care about his talk of forgiveness or getting along. It was to be the last time I saw him while he was hospitalized.
That evening I examined myself thoroughly. Why did I hang around and take his verbal abuse? Was I willing to do this the rest of my life? If I continued to have any kind of relationship with him, I could expect things to go as before. He was not going to change. Could I accept it? No. It hurt me too deeply and harmed my self-esteem. I had jumped into the situation at my sister's insistence because she was afraid to do it herself. I got the verbal abuse and she went home.
I decided to back away once again from my parents. It was the only way to survive. I didn't have the need to call and explain. That would only say I still wanted to argue or patch things up. I no longer wanted to offer explanations. I was simply removing myself from a bad situation. I had to.
I contacted a business broker and listed the store. The broker could talk to my father about the business, note, and so on.
I was owed money and intended to collect it. I still needed to survive, and I had put a lot of money into the store. I wanted to regain something for all of my hard work. I would no longer punish myself and allow others to walk all over me just to gain their approval.
I still prayed daily for God to show me my mission. I was learning that I still had areas of my life that needed changing.
Bob, my therapist, asked me, "Do you know how to stop being a victim?" Obviously, I still didn't know the answer to that question and gave him a blank look. "This is how you do it," he told me. "You stop being a victim!" In a nutshell, there was the answer to a lifelong problem. You make up your mind that you are tired of being in the victim mode, and you just stop doing it.
We don't have to be abused to be a victim. We might be the one who others contact to do their dirty work—the gophers, so to speak. They take on a project that requires a lot of footwork and know we will be willing to do it for them because we can't seem to say no.
Our fear of confrontation can also put us in the victim mode. Our friends can treat us rudely, canceling plans at the last moment in favor of something better that's come up, and they understand that we won't express anger. We will simply accept their actions without a word of complaint. We will be there for the next event, smiles and all.
We may still be connected to our parents because they hold the family purse strings, even when we are in our middle-age years. We bend and comply, as they not only tell us how to live our lives, but how to raise our children as well. They know we aren't going to argue or break free because we need their financial help. We've grown used to that extra financial bonus they sometimes throw our way, and we allow them to interfere because of it. We remain the victim.
We allow a man whom we work with to make sexually degrading remarks to us because we are fearful of rocking the corporate ladder. He has learned, through repeated efforts, that we are going to smile and treat his words as a joke. We will even change jobs to escape him, rather than face him head-on.
Our children become tyrants who rule our homes with their aggressive behavior and rebellion. We fear what might happen if we put our foot down and restrict their actions. We hold our breath, just waiting for the day when they are raised and out of the house.
We haven't learned that love and respect go hand-in-hand. When we remain the victim, or in the victim mode, we haven't set any boundaries for ourselves. We have no clear-cut or defined lines drawn in the sand that tell others we are not willing to allow them to tread on our self-respect. We may complain about the actions or words of others, but we do nothing to change them.
Sometimes, we will use game playing to get a response from those who don't treat us fairly. We grow silent, waiting for them to respond and ask what is wrong. We detach for a short period of time, waiting for the apology. We feel sorry for ourselves and cry, hoping they will feel bad when they see our tears. We write long letters, which are never delivered, explaining how we feel, the pain they have caused, and the results of their offenses. We never have a face-to-face confrontation, setting our boundaries in concrete. We believe these offenders are mind readers. How will they know and understand if we don't tell them?
When we've set our boundaries, we have to be careful not to use them as a ploy to get even. This only opens the door for more pain. If there is a person in our lives who continually hurts us, it's acceptable to simply walk away. If our explanation is only going to cause arguments and strife, we don't walk down that pathway again. We find a new path. We may have grown accustomed to arguing with certain people, and this is just another reason to do it. If we know we're right, we don't offer previous offenses to explain our case. We use our legs and feet to walk away.
This is about changing. Change is something we are very fearful of. Why else would we remain with an abuser? Our victimization is deeply rooted. It is also a part of us that we have grown familiar with. But it isn't comfortable, and eventually we will understand that familiarity and comfort can be two very different things.
I was familiar with my father's verbal abuse-so familiar that it made me feel strange during those brief periods when he was actually nice. It was a side of him that was rarely seen by me, and I didn't know how to deal with it. If he had always been kind and soft-spoken, his rages would have frightened me. But it was the raging I had grown familiar with, so the periodic affability was not comfortable.
We have to examine when the familiar is no longer comfortable or not something we want in our lives. We need to look at the value of it and what it brings to us. Is it something that reaffirms our belief that we are undeserving of kindness or respect? Is it something that keeps us in the victim role? Is it something that keeps us from having to make a change? Does the familiarity harm our spirit?
I'm very comfortable with my current husband, David. We have a set pattern when he comes home from work. We talk about the day's events, his job, my writing, our children, and other things that may have taken place that day. If it's summer, we sit on our front patio, have a cocktail, and watch our horses grazing in the front pasture. I'm also very comfortable with it. All of these patterns make me happy and content. If he came home angry and verbally abusive every single day, I would be familiar with it, but not comfortable. Do you see the difference?
We literally teach others how to treat us. We do this by accepting and conforming to their actions and behavior. Now they're familiar with our reactions. They've learned how far we will be pushed, what trigger words to use, and which buttons to push—all because we haven't demonstrated that it isn't acceptable.
Actually, defending ourselves can be somewhat intimidating at first. We may be tempted to back down and seek others approval, after telling them we aren't going to tolerate their behavior anymore. We detest the feeling of not getting their acceptance, but after we've done it the first time and refuse to back down on our commitment to change our victimization, we begin to sense a feeling of power. We discover that this new way of living really works! Then, our self-respect begins to turn to self-love. Along with these new emotions, we regain our power. It is something we will not ever lose again.
All of these new feelings will start to bring about change—and we learn that change can be good.
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Thank you Darren for this empowering article.
Lise
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Hi Lise,
A very powerful moment, you tossing her (Nsaint) OUT, and at the same time, owning your responsibility for having allowed her to squat there.
BRAVO!!
Hops
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Carolyn, hon,
You know I'm thick about faith.
(So I can ask you the dumb questions.)
Or will I try to patch it up with my own idea of who I am/should be? Or God? Lately I've been desperately wanting to fill it myself... even though I know that going that direction only brings misery.
Didn't God give you yourself? All the wonder and depth and capability and imagination and responsiveness and intelligence and talent that are you? Wouldn't s/he be delighted to see you jump up and down with excitement for the gifts you've been given, and start celebrating those gifts by enjoying them? Including the great freedom you've been given to make these choices?
densely, but with love,
Hops
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Dear Hops,
Thank you for the post!
Just to let you know I bought a copy of Roberta Flack and Donny Hathaway's CD with "Come, Ye Disconsolate" on it. I listened to it last night, I was much moved - thank you for that tip!
Lise
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Carolyn,
I have read your post, I am working on a response to you, I'll post it tomorrow.
Love,
Lise
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Lise,
I am truly delighted to have shared that song with you.
Thank you for getting it.
That is a very important song to me.
hugs
Hops
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Thanks, Lise! I will watch for it... eagerly. Feels like I'm waking up from a long nap over here.
Love you!
Hops... you are the sweetest agnostic I know and you're welcome to ask me anything, at any time.
Yes, God is delighted when I jump up and down for joy... and He's been supremely patient with me through all of my many detours through the muck of my own faulty decisions and choices. In fact, I do believe that He values my freedom of choice even more than I have, in the past, because He knows that without it, all I'd have is a dead religion, full of rite and rote. The thing is... I've pretty much exhausted my own notions of what it might take to make me fulfilled.
Multiple marriages, multiple children, multiple jobs, multiple hobbies, and multiple addictions - and that's just the tip of the iceberg.
What's left?
In many ways, I'm alot like Peter, as recorded in this bit, from the Gospel of John:
Then Jesus turned to the Twelve and asked, "Are you going to leave, too?"
Simon Peter replied, "Lord, to whom would we go? You alone have the words of eternal life."
See... it's not that I'm afraid God will get mad at me or punish me if I try to get happiness out of attempts to fulfill myself.
It's that I've been down that dead-end road enough to have finally learned - there is no true joy apart from Him.
Doesn't mean I don't get tempted, though... and lately has been an especially heavy challenge.
So... I do ask myself, what's left? And in my heart, I know the answer is: nothing but the best, if I will only stand.
Love and hugs,
Carolyn
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Ummm, can you take him along for the ride?
Doing things that make you happy?
(In addition to worship, I mean.)
xo
Hops
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lol... why does this feel like looking for a loophole? :D
But yes, I think so, Hops. Trouble is, much of the stuff I've thought would make me happy has bombed out in a very big way. Honestly and sincerely... I have no reason to trust my own judgment, based on my own track record; there's simply no denying that!
I mean, what feels comfy- cozy to me and seems to give me some sense of security may be nothing more than an old and very destructive habit/thinking rut/whatever.
On the other hand....
washing dishes can make me happy when my heart is in it, for the glory of God.
Hops, I'm miserable when my attitude goes into the pits, and that happens primarily when I allow my thoughts to settle on myself. It's like... letting some feelings out of the bottle for examination can be risky, but I've done just that, rather than letting them simmer and stew. Sometimes it's hard to cork them back up again.
I will try to be more clear another time, with less rambly babble.
Bunches of love,
Carolyn
P.S. Sorry for the sidetrack, Lise. Thank you for sharing your space!
xox
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I'm wondering... do you think/feel that you are naturally a loner, Lise?
Not really -- my psychiatrist told me once that I am gregarious in nature and people oriented which is very true. However, just like you said this last round of "self imposed" isolation is due to the trauma I have endured over the last year as well as a reenactment of my childhood neglect at the hands of my mom.
Weekend outings with friends... sounds so healthy and wholesome, dear Lise, and I do hope that you're enjoying these times. You deserve to have some plain old-fashioned fun!! If you want to share, I'd love to hear more about how you're investing that time. Here, I tend to get so bogged down in family stuff and running around that there's not much left of me once that's accomplished. Not that it's bad... just seems to be readily using me up, lately. When stopping to smell the roses has to be added to the to-do-list, I know I'm running on fumes... lol.
My weekend outings have been simple and with a woman I trust. She is my AA sponsor. She is not deeply Christian but she lives an integrable spiritual life. We went this past weekend to get a massage and then to have dinner. In the next few weeks I'll be having friends come to visit me. There is much to do here, live music, museums, cafe's etc. so I am really looking forward to it. Also, my condo is right on the beach so I tend to spend a lot of time walking down the beach on weekends, the air and waves sooth me as well as watching all of the dogs play in the water is fun.
That taking the time to stop and smell the roses is important, but recall, I am single and don't have children, therefore, I have more time then my married friends who are mothers. I have to remind them of this from time to time as they tend to think I am some sort of amazing self-disciplined woman and the reality is I just don't have any kids, plan and simple.
It's like being a sponge for someone else's crud and it's absolutely consuming. No boundaries... no filters... left bare and vulnerable for whatever flows downhill at us. Yet for most of my life, I thought that's how it was supposed to be!
This rings so true for me lately has I have been reflecting on the ways I grew up, the messages, the tapes etc.. There was so much that I just absorbed as a child that I did not have to. Lately, I have been in a period of cleansing out these old tapes and garbage, really looking at the anger, fear and the hatred I absorbed and how it warped my thinking and created self-defeating patterns. It seems that the moment I can stare this stuff head on is the moment I start to out grow my old patterns as well as I start to grow emotionally.
Recently my son had a nasty patch of poison oak on his skin, going quite deep. Although it's healing now, the one spot is still quite a pit (on his backside) and will likely leave behind a lifelong scar.
Oh :cry: -- your poor son, I'll pray for him.
The bad stuff is gone and there's no infection, but what is left behind... wow. And that's how my heart feels at times.... so the most gigantic challenge is in the daily choice- what's gonna fill that gap?
Carolyn -- the grace of God can feel that gap. When we spend time in prayer thinking about others or offering up warm intentions for people in this world who are suffering as well as the grace that we get from God in simple living and seeking truth fills our holes from when we did not get the love we needed.
"Aren't you further along than THIS, by now?!!??" Still trying to get that hissing voice to shut up. Along with you, I'm posting that "No Vacancy" sign... and if it falls over, we'll just hammer it a bit deeper into the ground next time, okay? *sigh* ..... lol. Did I mention how glad I am that you wrote? I feel better already. Thank you again for thinking of me and jogging me awake... and please know that you're in my prayers always.
I hear your pain - me too. It is as if I made the thread about letting go of hatred and anger a couple of weeks ago, and yes indeed I have made the conscious choice to no longer chew on the anger but to prayer through it as well as to try to unite my thoughts with Christ's thoughts in the way that He would view Nsaint and the those that have hurt me.
Last night I was reflecting on my abortions. I realized that for the past 9 months of my drama with nsaint that I have been a hypocrite. That I have cursed her in my anger and hatred, yes, I have wanted forgiveness and peace as well as I have refused to allow myself any vengeful thoughts, although the hatred was still there. Nsaint wanted me dead, at least socially, but I killed my two children who am I not to forgive someone.
Yes, what Nsaint did was wrong and she could hurt another person, but I still have to cultivate love in my heart for her despite the past. It does not mean that I have to reach out to her or to pity her but instead I can love her the way my children in heaven have loved me.
Always here for you Carolyn.
Lise
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Dear Lise,
In case you are still around and reading, I just wanted to thank you - so much! - for writing again. I am absolutely savoring it and will reply in due time.
When you wrote yesterday to say that you were working on a response, that made me so happy... just to have that to look forward to. To which to look forward? LOL - o well, who needs perfect grammar :lol: Anyhow, just thought I'd follow suit and let you know that I'm pondering as I savor.
After being generally out of touch for some time, it's extra encouraging to be able to manage a more regular communication here... especially with you.
For now, what instantly registered with me is what you've written about hatred for N-saint...
oh, how I know that deep hatred. Just recently, it sprung up so suddenly in me, and with such force... completely out of proportion to all circumstances... to the point that blaming hormones (or the lack thereof) simply didn't do it justice :? I didn't let it fly, but - wow, it was a powerful nastiness... and reading your post here this evening, I realized - this is a supernatural hatred. And there's nothing heavenly about it.
So - - you've helped me to recognize that it's certainly time to beef up the armor and cultivate that love you mentioned, especially for those who are unlovely.
Will write again - tomorrow at the latest.
With gratitude and love and hugs,
Carolyn
P.S. And thank you so much for your prayers for my son. He is much better, but a bit troubled by the depth of those scars. Made quite an impression on him in more ways than one. (((()))))
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Dear Carolyn,
I wanted to say that the hatred is sometimes our inner child who never got a chance to fully experience her hatred; that inner child in us was "just" a child, meaning that we cannot expect children to be so naturally unhateful as it is their emotional state to react with hatred, especially in the face of ugly abuse.
Allowing myself to feel the hatred I experienced as a child, letting it bubble to the surface, giving my hatred a voice by simply getting it out and saying "I hate her!!" was freeing and helped me to move past that stuborn stuff in my heart as it was mainly just my inner child who, as I said, never got to have her hate filled voice because her anger was shamed.
"Expect To Experience Anger"
It's not wrong to be angry. Paul says, "Be angry, and yet do not sin. . . ." (Eph. 4:26). It's not a sin to be angry, otherwise God would have sinned by becoming angry. But anger can become sinful, if we don't handle it properly and control it.
http://www.biblestudyguide.org/articles/be-angry-and-do-not-sin.htm
With love,
Lise
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I'm poking my nose into a deep dialogue, forgive me guys.
But I noticed Carolyn, that you mentioned peace in washing dishes.
And you Lise, mentioned living simply.
I have seen people who are at peace, centered in themselves and their tasks, no big separation between their identity and their action.
I just liked thinking about that as I read your posts.
I am missing that balance right now.
Good reminder.
(As you were...) :)
Hops
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Dear Carolyn,
I wanted to say that the hatred is sometimes our inner child who never got a chance to fully experience her hatred; that inner child in us was "just" a child, meaning that we cannot expect children to be so naturally unhateful as it is their emotional state to react with hatred, especially in the face of ugly abuse.
Allowing myself to feel the hatred I experienced as a child, letting it bubble to the surface, giving my hatred a voice by simply getting it out and saying "I hate her!!" was freeing and helped me to move past that stuborn stuff in my heart as it was mainly just my inner child who, as I said, never got to have her hate filled voice because her anger was shamed.
"Expect To Experience Anger"
It's not wrong to be angry. Paul says, "Be angry, and yet do not sin. . . ." (Eph. 4:26). It's not a sin to be angry, otherwise God would have sinned by becoming angry. But anger can become sinful, if we don't handle it properly and control it.
http://www.biblestudyguide.org/articles/be-angry-and-do-not-sin.htm
With love,
Lise
Thank you, Lise! I just read through the Bible study and was especially surprised to notice - for the very first time - that Mark 3:5 reference
about Jesus looking around at them with anger.
I never saw that part before!
The Lord was grieved... at the hardness of their heart... and that struck me immediately, as well -
the fact that feeling anger and being grieved go so intimately together.
Just shows that maybe the big problems come into play when we disconnect our anger from the grievance at hand.
He had a legitimate grievance against them, for their unbelief and hard heart... yet Jesus didn't let that sway Him. He simply carried on with His work and restored that man's hand, not stopping to pitch a fit or setting His priorities askew.
This is just the revelation I needed this morning! Gonna sit and chew on it today, expectantly, and see what else comes to light.
And I understand what you've said about the inner child who never got to fully experience her hatred.
I notice you say "experience" - - - not "express". Wow, there's another revelation.
You've made me realize that I don't remember ever really feeling that sort of anger as a child. Only fear. Lots and lots of fear.
Maybe the anger got so instantly transformed to shame that it went totally unrecognized and morphed instantly into terror? I don't know... but I was scared spitless most of the time and one of the fears that stands out above all is that something would happen to my mother and I would not be able to survive that. She was so thoroughly "over" me.
I didn't receive the sort of abuse that you and many others received. In our home, it was more about control and domination.
Most I can recall is one time feeling extremely mad when I came home at age 12 or so and found that my mother had completely rearranged my bedroom. That felt like a severe violation and I was very angry, but no memories as a younger child of anger.
Ahh, sorry, I'm babbling. It just really shocked me to read you say that it's a child's natural state to react with hatred. That would explain alot though... why the horrible fear of conflict and why the old choice seemed to be, at least for me, between anger and fear.
Lots to think on. Back again later about your other post and I hope you'll have a wonderful day!
Love,
Carolyn
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Dear Lise,
First off, just want to say that I really appreciate this opportunity to get to know you a bit better! Thank you for taking the time to visit with me here and especially to share some more about yourself... and of yourself. This was a hard post for me to sort and write, and if it'd been to anyone else but you, I may have avoided it altogether... but it's definitely time for me to skip the part where I take two steps back after moving forward a bit. So... here goes.
Although I may be more introverted by nature, I do enjoy being with others, as well... at least for limited periods of time. Afterward, though, I do sense a strong pull to retreat and regroup... within the quiet of my own thoughts. Sometimes I'm not sure whether that's good or bad, but it does seem to be a fact of life for me.
Isolation is another story, though. There were years of that, for various reasons, mainly as I focused on my (non-)relationship with a husband who wouldn't tolerate any disruption to his kingdom. Besides that, 7 years into our marriage, we had to confront him into confessing that he was sexually inappropriate with my oldest daughter. That was just the beginning of another 8 year nightmare through which all the court proceedings and counseling didn't succeed in making him safe to be around children. More isolation... and stigma. And then there was N-ex and an ongoing downward spiral. When that ended in 2003, there was not much left of me. But that is in the past, thank God. Moving right along...
Your simple weekend outings seem lovely, to me. A massage and then dinner... wow, what a treat! Best part, I think, is having someone you trust with whom to share that time and your AA sponsor sounds like a very special individual. Makes me wish that I'd reached out for help in that way. Haven't had a drink in nearly 3 years, but it was a "cold turkey" decision with me... another of my "loner" steps, held together by paper clips, duct tape, and prayer. Still feels pretty fragile at times... and maybe it always will. But spending time outdoors, with our pets... like you said, watching all of the dogs play in the water - well, that restores and strengthens me (although, the more I think on it, just may have to explore outlets for massage therapy in this podunk town - :D)
You wrote:
This rings so true for me lately has I have been reflecting on the ways I grew up, the messages, the tapes etc.. There was so much that I just absorbed as a child that I did not have to. Lately, I have been in a period of cleansing out these old tapes and garbage, really looking at the anger, fear and the hatred I absorbed and how it warped my thinking and created self-defeating patterns. It seems that the moment I can stare this stuff head on is the moment I start to out grow my old patterns as well as I start to grow emotionally.
Yes, exactly. Same here... and I've been thinking lately that maybe by the time I'm 50, I'll have reached the age of majority. Seriously. Seem to be finally outgrowing the mid-teen years (emotionally) - at last! And I think - wow, at age12 1/2, my son is experiencing some periodic growing pains in his legs and back. It can get really uncomfortable for him... and I can relate, because the emotional growing pains are no picnic either. Along with that, there's the irony of physical twinges and aches which have nothing to do with youth, but just the opposite. lol... life surely does come around full circle!!
And you wrote:
Carolyn -- the grace of God can feel that gap. When we spend time in prayer thinking about others or offering up warm intentions for people in this world who are suffering as well as the grace that we get from God in simple living and seeking truth fills our holes from when we did not get the love we needed.
I know you're right, Lise.
Thank you. God help me remember.
This is what's kept me going through so many rough times, but I just really needed to hear it again. Simple living - by grace, through faith. More than anything, I want to say, with all assurance, that the old anger and hate will never disturb that simplicity again. Just seems like each time I get to thinking it's licked and done for, there it is again.
Day by day, that's all we can face, I guess.
And finally, I hear you about the need to cultivate love in your heart, even toward N-saint. Reflecting on your abortions in the light of the absolute forgiveness which you've received... well, it's a beautiful view, dear Lise, and I thank you most for sharing that. I see it as another example of God taking what the devil meant for evil and working it out for good... changing hearts and lives, just as He has worked through you to change me. Without a doubt, I know that our heavenly Father holds our precious ones in His tender hands... yours and mine. With a humble heart, the grieving and mourning and receiving of forgiveness do complete the picture... as with everything else, only by His grace.
I love you, Lise. Thanks for always being there... and for causing me to want to be here, too.
Carolyn
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Dear Carolyn,
I have just finished reading your post, I wanted to let you that I am very tenderly touched by your words and openness as well as your risk to open yourself up to me. It warms my heart -- you have no idea what a God given blessing you are to me.
For this evening I will take your words home with me, reflecting and praying to see what our Beloved Christ wants for me to write back to you, no doubt it will be from my heart.
Just wanted to validate your post.
I love you too.
Lise
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(((((Lise))))) thank you so much.
I have just been sitting here thinking of how...
in all of my life, so few people have ever treated me with such sweet consideration and appreciation and respect...
and of those, well... in most cases... the price to be paid was far too high.
Words fail me.
Just want to say that you are a rare human being and I'm so very thankful to have encountered you here.
I feel alot less alone these days.
Love,
Carolyn
P.S. I read your new posts about healing and instantly recognized the truth in all its brilliance. Will try to post to them tomorrow, because I think they're very valid and... important... and necessary!
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Dear Lise,
First off, just want to say that I really appreciate this opportunity to get to know you a bit better! Thank you for taking the time to visit with me here and especially to share some more about yourself... and of yourself.
Likewise!
Although I may be more introverted by nature, I do enjoy being with others, as well... at least for limited periods of time. Afterward, though, I do sense a strong pull to retreat and regroup... within the quiet of my own thoughts. Sometimes I'm not sure whether that's good or bad, but it does seem to be a fact of life for me.
This I can relate to. There is nothing wrong with this either, it is actually healthy, IMO, that we retreat into solitude from time to time. That is how I have spent most of this last year, healing, crying, hurting reflecting and gaining insights through my solitutde. The next year just may be a year of more soclializing and that is OK...it is all OK as long as I know my motives which is sounds like your solitude is healthy in recogizing that part of yourself that is introverted and respecting that part of yourself. We had parents who rarely took the time to notice these things about us or who never really tired to understand our individual unique natures, they would have or could have mistaken that natural introvertedness for something negative.
Isolation is another story, though. There were years of that, for various reasons, mainly as I focused on my (non-)relationship with a husband who wouldn't tolerate any disruption to his kingdom. Besides that, 7 years into our marriage, we had to confront him into confessing that he was sexually inappropriate with my oldest daughter. That was just the beginning of another 8 year nightmare through which all the court proceedings and counseling didn't succeed in making him safe to be around children. More isolation... and stigma. And then there was N-ex and an ongoing downward spiral. When that ended in 2003, there was not much left of me. But that is in the past, thank God. Moving right along...
Thank you for sharing this with me no doubt the experience was traumatic and there is still a pain there, but it sounds like you have healed and moved on with more wisdom.
But spending time outdoors, with our pets... like you said, watching all of the dogs play in the water - well, that restores and strengthens me
This for me is the bread and butter of enjoying life...our culture dictates that we have to do and spend so much in order to find happiness, but the real joy is in the simple things; our pets can be the best stuff of life!
You wrote:
This is what's kept me going through so many rough times, but I just really needed to hear it again.
I need to hear it too again and again and work for it and keep striving for it all the time; the grace of God is the real life transforming stuff, but we can only recieve it if our hearts are ready and open.
Hugs to you on this Friday!
Lise
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Dear Lise,
Lately it seems there has just been so much to wake up to!
About respecting ourselves... the only way I ever knew to do that was via achievement - - and that, often by trying to do things in the most difficult way possible and by trying to fix everyone else's dilemmas by giving too much, too often, and too freely.
As this learned perfectionism gave way to practicality and I could no longer deny the impossibility of maintaining such stringent standards, what was left behind was a deep sense of relief - - and shame. Those two battled it out within me for ages and nearly tore me to shreds. I wasn't even so ashamed at not being able to do it all and do it well. I was ashamed at feeling relieved!
Also lately, each time I'd read you post about the work you have been doing in "healing, crying, hurting, reflecting and gaining insights" - I felt like someone had taken my hand and reassured me, "It's okay. You can step away from the fury and just sort through this stuff at your own pace. You're not negligent, or lazy, or hateful, or avoidant... you're just learning how to be."
I couldn't express all of that then, but the relief was palpable.
Only now can I verbalize it and that's because your motives have always touched my heart and my spirit in such a way as to dislodge both from old ruts.
Can you just feel yourself stretching emotionally and spiritually? I can. It's a new sort of limberness and flexibility. It's not a forceful thing at all, but just a lessening of that old sense of fragility.
You said that we can only receive the grace of God when our hearts are ready and open... and I agree. But it can sure be exhausting getting to that point, which is why I now so deeply appreciate the need for fellowship along the way. When two walk together and one falls, the other can help him up... amen. Isolation stops up that flow of grace, I see that now. As does refusing to extend grace to others, whether I feel like it or not. So many lessons and so far to go, but never alone again :)
Love and hugs,
Carolyn