Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: JustKathy on July 27, 2009, 06:37:15 PM
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Sorry for the length of this. I'm really a wreck.
I’ve reached a point where the stress from my NM and codependent father is starting to affect my health, so I have to decide if the time has come to go total NC. I went NC from my mother several years ago, but am now thinking that I may have to distance myself from my codependent father as well.
All of my life, my father has failed me, but I’ve refused to see it. He always sided with M, believed every lie about me, and hurt me over and over again. Every time he failed me I gave him a free pass, telling myself that he was under M’s control and couldn’t help himself. I wanted SO badly to believe that my dad loved me, but the reality is that he did some horrible things to me, including leaving me to starve in a roach infested apartment after I left home at 18. The whole time I was struggling to survive on minimum wage and food stamps, and taking the bus to work, he was giving my brother (the golden child) hundreds, if not thousands of dollars every week . . . a luxury apartment, brand new car, car insurance, college tuition, acting lessons, even private archery and figure skating lessons to support N mother’s dream of turning him into a celebrity.
My NM is terminally ill, and F has managed to convince himself that he will die shortly afterwards, with no one to take care of him (a “sympathetic death” is actually plausible, since for the last 50 years, his every move has been dictated by M).
Consequently, they have both started making burial arrangements and are dividing up assets. When my mother learned that she was terminally ill, she had the will redrawn to finally include me, not as an act of love, but as an act of retaliation against my brother’s N wife, who M hates even more than me. I’ve always known in my heart that my brother was sole heir, but finally hearing it come from their mouths drove it home, and REALLY hurt. Still, I managed to shrug it off, because I never wanted their money, and certainly never expected it. The will is meaningless to me, and in all honesty, I have serious doubts that it was changed anyway. I asked my sister (who has been named executor) if she has seen the new will, and she told me, “Mom wouldn’t give me a copy but she told me what was in it.” Nuff said there.
But the final cut came last weekend. There was only one thing that I had ever asked for, EVER. My father is an Emmy winner, and I had been asking him for years (decades) if he would leave me the Emmy. I was so proud of him for winning it, and having worked in the entertainment industry myself, it would have meant something for me to have it. I would have really truly treasured it. Well, my sister emailed me last weekend to tell me that he gave the Emmy to my brother and his N wife (same N wife that they didn’t want inheriting anything).
When I read her email, well, I don’t even remember what happened. I ran out of the room in tears, and the rest is a blur. My husband said that I ran into a wall and fell down. The next morning I had terrible aches and pains, and an injury to my hand. I’ve never had this happen before, where the stress was so severe that I just blacked out. Hubby had to stay home twice last week to take me to the doctor, one time for heart palpitations, the other for dizziness. In both cases, the doctor said I was probably on stress overload. My headaches have also become so severe that I’ve been in need of higher doses of pain meds, and am in danger of addiction if something doesn’t give.
I now feel that my health is at risk if I allow them to continue to get under my skin. This is harder than hard for me, because I love my father, and have spent 40 years trying to convince myself that he loved me, and that he only hurt me because he was brainwashed. But the decision to shut me out of the will, and to give his most treasured possession to my brother, those were HIS decisions. Sure, M may have influenced them, but he had at least 50% say in this. The decision to give the golden child his Emmy was definitely his alone.
Hubby is fed up with my family drama and wants to call my father and confront him – ask him why/how he could do this to me. I talked him out of it because I know my dad will just go into his Dustin Hoffman Rain Man routine and start yammering about buying underwear at Kmart. But the other side of me says that one of us needs to confront him so he knows how upset I am, so he’ll at least know the reason why his phone calls are no longer returned. I still love my dad, but how can I face him or talk to him, knowing all these years he had excluded me from his will? He has THREE children, not one, and to make his favorite child (his son), the sole heir is beyond cruel. It doesn’t matter if their estate is five dollars or five million – it’s wrong.
Sorry that this is turning into a long-winded vent. I’m just so unbelievably stressed that it’s reached a potential life-and-death situation for me. My doctor has warned me that if I don’t get the stress under control, that something “very bad” could happen.
My mother won’t be around much longer, and F will be left alone, and I feel badly about that. But I also don’t feel that I can face him again, and listen to his small talk, after he hurt me so badly. How can I stop feeling sorry for him and do what is right for ME?
Kathy
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Dear Kathy
I can relate so well.I wish I couldn't. I always "thought" my F loved me but I was kidding myself. When my H was breaking down my door and I asked my F for help,he said,"That's life."
My F does not care but NEXT to my M he was wonderful so I lied to myself so I could think I had one parent who cared.
I am so sorry for your situation. Maybe, when you ran in to the wall, the truth of your life hit you.
Sometimes, I can't believe what a horrible life I have had. I always had material things and advantages such as college etc but emotionally I was made to feel like I was crazy.I had no guidance in life other than an NM who delighted in shocking me and a F who would not lift a hand to protect me.(I did have a loving GM who saved what little but of sanity I have left) I went along with it all so I could have a family.
For me, I got so stressed that I could barely eat. I got really skinny.Maybe, I was giving up b/c I could see no way out. Maybe, I was calling out for help to my family to SEE that I needed love and caring.
You need to go NC,as I see it.
I think you know this down deep. I think your blacking out was your sign that you must.
Do you have a loving H ?
I started healing when I found s/one to love .
Can you share your real heart with your H ?
Ami
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Hi Ami,
I also had a loving Grandmother who was my rock. She knew that my M was abusing me, and always had my back. She lived in Canada, so I rarely saw her, but she wrote to me often, and would send me twenty dollar bills so I could buy food, She passed away about five years ago, and after she was gone, M’s abuse increased dramatically. From what I’ve read, this is common. When the N loses a parent, they no longer have an authority figure to keep them in check, so their behavior becomes worse.
As for my husband, he’s somewhat supportive. He has been quite controlling, forcing me to relocate from my home town, change jobs, etc., putting his own happiness before mine, always. But at least he is willing to talk these issues through with me, go to counseling with me, and try to help. A lesser person probably would have bailed by now. So while our marriage has been very strained, he does offer support with my family crap, and I know that’s asking a lot considering how bad it’s been.
I think you nailed it when you said your father looked good next to your mother. I can see that now. My father was a horrible parent, but compared to her, he was a king. Now it feels like someone has hit me over the head and made me see the truth, and it’s an awful truth, but if I keep giving him free passes, and keep making excuses for him, I’m only going to get hurt worse.
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Kathy, I am in the same position with my F. At least we are not alone even though it is small consolation. When my oldest son was 14 months, I called my M and told her I was being abused. She said "Don't think you are coming here."
Then, for my entire marriage ,My M AND F sided with my abusive H.
Honestly, Kathy, I don't feel that all this happened to me.
Inside, I am the loved child of a M and F and the beloved wife of a H. However, it never worked out that way except in fantasy which I could never give up. That is probably why my life became such a mess.
Anyway, my friend, for me I call on God, talk to him and trust that He loves me, will take me to Heaven when this is all over and the end will be much better than the beginning. Love and a Big Hug , Ami
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Dear Kathy
The hardest thing is seeing the truth but it is the only liberating thing. Have you ever been on the Alice Miller website? Her work is for abused children(now adults)
Her work(in a very small nutshell) is that if you can follow your true heart, you will find your truth and your feelings which you had to shut down to survive.
When you find your true heart, you will be healthy. She says you need help in an Enlightened Witness, some person who will allow you to be real .Many people want to shut us down b/c it makes THEM too uncomfortable.
Perhaps the hardest part of the whole thing is finding the Enlightened Witness.
The Board was that for me until I found a person. However, you have to be careful that people can get upset if THEY are reminded of their unhealed past and then it can get really crazy.
Your H does not sound like he is a true heart friend b/c he has too many of his own issues. Love Ami
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Thanks Ami. I will look up Alice Miller's site.
I agree that H is wrapped up in his own issues. I think he may have some abuse (or at least bad parenting) in his own past, but won't share it with me. He has always tried to paint a picture of a perfect childhood, with perfect parents, but I can tell by some of his behavior that he's not totally leveling with me. I don't think he's trying to intentionally deceive me, but maybe has too much pride to confide in me that his "perfect mother" maybe wasn't so perfect. Who knows, he may have some N in him himself. He's very selfish and controlling, though selfish is much different from self-absorbed (which is what true Ns are). But yeah, he's not 100% there for me.
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Kathy:
I just reminded myself today of something that might help you out with the stress.
I cared more about my FOO and how they felt...
than I cared about myself.
But they didn't return this level/type of caring and I just assumed it was my fault; something wrong with me and that I could change myself and finally earn that type of caring. I was wrong. They simply don't have the ability to do this type of caring about others....
and nothing you say, feel, or do - including trying to be what you think they want you be - can change that.
My stress levels decreased dramatically, when I stopped putting all my energy (obsessively) into trying to get my FOO to care about me and started spending all that energy and emotion on myself - and people who do care about me, like your husband cares about you. That said, it's a messy process and feels really strange/uncomfortable initially. Don't worry! There's no right/wrong way to go about it. Just keep at it and you'll find what works for you.
((((((((Kathy ))))))))))
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PS...
I almost forgot. They are counting on you caring more about them and if they care about you, than caring about yourself...
it is how they gain the control to make you miserable. It is, pure and simply, abuse. That word opened up a whole new way of looking at what happened to me... and was a giant boost to healing and getting better; stronger. The antidote word, was boundaries...
and I'll go out on a limb here and propose that all forms of self-sabotage are internalizations of the original/continued abuse situation blended up with with habits/beliefs about ourselves that somehow we deserve the abuse... that they wouldn't treat us like this, otherwise. That belief is based on the false premise that these people are "normal"... and can be expected to act like normal people... if only "I _______________________". Nope. Not reality; it's just a wish or a hope.
The lethal combination of blame/shame - believing we somehow deserve this - leads us to abuse ourselves (self-sabotage).... as punishment, a cry for help, revenge, resentment/anger that we can't express otherwise, and an attempt to control them back... to force them to be normal and care about us (denying the reality that this possible). One way that I manifested this, was in stress-related psychosomatic illnesses. It truly does start to go away, when you care about yourself FIRST.
Focus on YOU, healing and feeling better - not on them; who was right/wrong; and set a boundary of a time-limit on how much of your precious time/energy you'll spend on thinking/feeling things about them. Everyone has different tolerances... so what fits you... doesn't fit others. Some can spend forever sifting through the he said/she said and the horrible pain... some simply can't. There's no scale of what you "should" be able to handle... no ratings... no time limit on working it all through and letting it go.
NC as a concept has a whole continuum of amounts and boundaries... it's not just an all or nothing technique, or it doesn't have to be. There are lots of things you can do, to keep yourself from being triggered like you were. Someone posted a while back about "medium chill"... you should be able to search on that and find the posts. You still engage with the FOO... but in a detached fashion... tuning out certain things... refusing to discuss certain things. The important thing in NC... is that YOU decide what is best for you... what works for you. And Caller ID, is often a helpful tool.
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I cared more about my FOO and how they felt...
than I cared about myself.
Phoenix, thanks so much for your words of wisdom. I quoted the above because it's dead on. I've been doing this all my life . . . caring more about how THEY felt than about my own health or feelings. And why? That's the one thing that is SO hard to understand. After years and years of abuse, I still care what they think, I still worry about hurting a father who treated me like yesterday's trash. Maybe it's because society tells us that we are to love our parents, no matter what. I just don't know, but I have to break free of that mindset.
And yes, caller ID is a very helpful tool, though I'm afraid I've been using it the wrong way. We know when it's my father calling (M refuses to call), and we always take the call because it's my father. Again, I have to ask myself why? I need to let my answering machine take some of the stress off of me.
I almost forgot. They are counting on you caring more about them and if they care about you, than caring about yourself...
This is also VERY true. When my M was diagnosed with cancer, F asked me to send her a card. I sent the card, but I did it for HIM, because I wanted to make him happy. He called me and told me how much M loved the card. In reality, she probably burned it. What he was telling me was that HE was happy I sent the card. I was given an order, and I followed it, and that's all he cared about. My feelings never entered into it.
Oh man, this is SO hard, and it shouldn't be. I was abused. Period. Yet it's still so hard. I'm just so grateful for the sage advice I've received from the people here. It's helped me more than you'll ever know, and I appreciate it very VERY much.
Kathy
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Dear Kathy
I think one of the hardest things is really facing that we WERE abused. Alice Miller talks about this as one of the main reasons we stay feeling like abused people(ie abusing ourselves just like our abusers did). We simply cannot face that we really were not loved.
I am in a daze about it alot. I can't believe it really happened to me.
I didn't think you could have material advantages and still be abused. I didn't think if it was "emotional" and not physical that it was "real" abuse.
I guess I made up excuses for my whole life so *I* would not have to be an abused person. I know I am still in denial. It sounds like you are going through a similar process.
Just my two cents, if your H cannot really be a safe place for your heart, be circumspect.
It takes a person who has really faced their OWN pain not to hurt you when yours comes out, in my experience. Love Ami
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I'm so sorry you're suffering, Kathy.
The pain of being harmed and betrayed......
by those who're supposed to protect you....
is understandably devastating (unfair, horrific, demoralizing, egregious, nonsensical wrong and impossible to understand.)
That the pain's so powerful, after all these years, speaks to your expectations, IMO.
The saying goes:
It's hope that kills us.
Your father can't do any better....
not when you were 18.....
and not now.
If he could, he would.
You deserve better and it's not your fault.
I'm glad you have the love and support of your husband..... he seems to have perspective on your FOO.
Mo2
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You deserve better and it's not your fault.
Thanks Mo. Wise words. No, it isn't my fault, but I have a box full of guilt ridden letters from M telling me that it WAS my fault. After 20 years of receiving letters like that, you can easily start to believe that you DID deserve it.
BUT, I was reading over some of those letters today. At the time I received them, I just sat and cried and cried, but years later, I can now look at them and see the textbook N mind at work. I think that it's helped me somewhat, to look at those letters from a more educated perspective, knowing what I know now about NPD that I didn't know then.
I think the main reason that I have been the target is that I was the oldest child. I was the first one to resist the control. My younger siblings saw what happened to me, and became little robots, probably because they didn't want to meet the same fate. But even though I was so badly abused, I have to say that I'm better off than them, because if I try, I can still break free of the torment and learn to move forward. I don't think that my codependent F, sister, and brother will ever be able to do that. My therapist always tells me to try to count my blessings, and maybe that's one of them. There is hope for me, because I'm a fighter. Maybe the rebellious side of me that made me their target in the first place can also set me free.
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Dear ((Kathy))
I had an insight in to your situation. Our F's are weak but NOT when it comes to hurting us. For example, he was strong NOT to give you the Emmy.
He can be strong when he is defending the N and hurting you.
I was thinking about it last night b/c my F is the same way.
I never held him responsible b/c he was too weak BUT he could hurt me in a strong way to protect the NM. So, it is a selective weakness.
My F always wanted to be a writer. After college,he went to Ca. and wrote some screenplays for a TV series. He was getting a start in that business when his M brought him back so he could go to medical school---her dream.
He always regreted not being a writer.
My point is that your F was a creative person and successful and still ended up the same wimp.
Ami
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There is hope for me, because I'm a fighter. Maybe the rebellious side of me that made me their target in the first place can also set me free.
I think you're absolutely right, Kathy.
I also think your husband, your chosen family, is one of your great blessings.
About the conflicted feelings you have for your father.....
can you write a letter to him, scream, be angry and let everything out on paper, read it then write it again?
Read, write it again?
Until you've refined it down to the most basic emotions and have clarity?
You don't have to send it.
But I think your heart needs to write it.
((Kathy))
Remember to keep your expectations in line with the reality.
Your father is broken.
You're not.
M02
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Kathy... one more adjustment on my "treatise" on caring (LOL!!)...
it will still be possible - maybe unavoidable - to care about them. It helps to think about the marker on the caring continuum sliding over to caring more about you - just a little, then a little more... and still caring about them... just not as much as you care about you.
Not all situations need complete NC, in other words. But that's for you to decide isn't it?
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Tacking onto Amber's post......
it was an amazing blessing for me to realize:
I could love people the way I needed to love them.....
instead of the way they wanted me to.
Give yourself permission to love your father the way you need to.
He's exactly where God wants him to be, you aren't responsible for caretaking his emotions.
You're job is taking care of yourself.
::nod::
Mo2
ps: Going NC.....
Withdrawing with love......
is one of many options.
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Thanks all. Many of you are right, that I may not be able to go total NC with my father, or will at least need to withdraw slowly. Total NC was necessary with NM, because she was the truly sick one who was beating on me relentlessly, so it had to be done. I have a lot of mixed feelings with my father. There is so much hurt and betrayal that we can never have a normal relationship, but at the same time, going total NC on a 79-year-old seems cruel (which I shouldn't even be considering, given the cruelty he's inflicted on me, but I seem to be the only family member who was born with a heart). I DO want to hear his explanation for cutting me from the will, and giving the Emmy to the golden child. There's no way he can talk his way out of it, but I'm still curious to hear his rationalization of it. If he comes right out with crap about the male heir being number one (which I know he believes), it will definitely influence my decision.
Ami, I really liked what you said about "selective weakness." I think you sure hit the nail on the head with that one. Yes, F could certainly be strong when it came to protecting NM and the golden child. If he were totally weak, he wouldn't have had a successful and high-paying career with a top network, AND won an Emmy, now would he? He definitely chose when to be weak, and when to be strong.
Kathy
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Yes, Kathy. It is so easy to give him a pass cuz he was "weak" but he could be VERY strong when he was protecting the NM. One day, I will tell you about what my F said to me when I got the repressed memory of my M molesting me.
I can't believe my life, sometimes! Ami
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My father called today. I let my husband answer the phone because I just couldn’t deal with it. Hubby also thought it best that HE be the one to confront F, since F is very old-school and very sexist, takes things more seriously when they come from a man.
Well, it went pretty much as expected. Hubby said it was the most frustrating phone call of his life. Every time he tried to bring up the subject of the will, F went into his “Rain Main” mode and started blabbering about buying peaches at the fruit market. H had to keep saying, “listen to me,” to try to get him to stop stammering, but F just kept talking nonsense and going full avoidance on the issue. After a whole lot of dancing around it, my father finally said that I was taken out of the will because I had hurt my NM, and that M had insisted, and that he “had no say in it.” He also said that there wasn’t much money left, so why did I care? H tried to explain that it wasn’t about the money, it was about my parents not loving me, which resulted in more blabbering.
We never did get much of an answer regarding the Emmy, other than “What’s the big deal, I gave it to my SON.”
The one thing hubby said over and over was that he couldn’t get past my father’s complete lack of empathy over having hurt me so badly. H told him that I was having heart palpitations, and F said, “Sorry she’s not feeling well, but, oh well.” Hubby got so frustrated going around in circles with him that he finally hung up on him. I’ve been dealing with F’s “bla bla bla bla I can’t hear you” routine for years, but this was the first time H had to deal with it, and he sat there afterwards, completely bewildered by the whole experience. He was REALLY upset/angry that my father had done these horrible, hurtful things to me, and had a total “who cares” attitude.
Okay, after some 40 years of making excuses for this man, it has to stop. Maybe I’ll change my mind years from now (if he’s still around), but right now I’m just done with this entire effed-up dysfunctional family.
Not only am I done with F, but I NEVER want to see my worthless brother again, the golden child who grew up to be a selfish piece of crap. He treats his sisters like garbage, looks down his nose at us, while holding out his hands expecting gifts.
I don’t know how to feel about my sister. She’s never done anything to hurt me, but she’s SO brainwashed by my mother that I can’t say anything to her without her reporting back to them. I can’t trust her at all. Example of how codependent she is (and how controlling M is). My NM, in another effort at control, does not want her house sold when she dies, because she can’t stand the thought of Mexicans or Blacks or some “undesirables” living in her house. So according to this new will they’ve had drawn, S gets the house, but is required to live in it, and sell her own house. S is totally cool with this because “Mom wants me to.” Unreal. (And for the record, both homes are of equal value, so there's no monetary gain for her).
I’m just devastated right now. Been crying all day and my head is pounding. Like Ami said in an earlier post about her own dad, I always made excuses for him and held onto this fantasy that ONE of my parents loved me. It’s not easy finally getting punched in the gut at age 49 and realizing that I was wrong. It more than hurts. I feel like I’ve been hit by a truck. :cry:
Kathy
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Dear (((Kathy)))
I had the EXACT same thing---- same underlying themes.
My F coldly threw me under the bus--no feeling!
I told you about my H breaking down the door 3 times and my F said. "That's life."
After I realized my M molested me, my F said,"Let's look up the word"molest" in the Dictionary.
I asked my F WHY he did not protect me from my abusive H. He said,"Nobody protected me."
Your relationship with your F before was unreal. That was a big reason you had so many emotional and physical problems. Emotional health is proportional to facing truth. Keep seeking your gut level truth. Don't let ANYONE take it from you, NOT a therapist or anyone else. If it doesn't ring true for you---anything---reject it.
You are smart and insightful. You are not too damaged to trust yourself. You are like a baby horse, wobbly.
Keep sharing. I understand ,for sure! Love Ami
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Kathy.....I have read a book.....Toxic Emotions (I think that is the title.....) I also went to a doctor who is into bioidentical hormones, etc. She told me it was important that I blew up because to hold the stress in would probably give me cancer. Well, guess what? Got the cancer. All this stress is NOT good for your body...
I am on the other side of the extreme emotions regarding my NM. My dad always sided with my mom although I believe he loves me......just cannot stand up to NM.
Oh, to get out from under that power. I wish I had done it years before I did. Maybe I would not have the cancer....
My advise is to try to live life without them and their stress. It sucks.....o, boy does it suck!!!
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((((((((((((Kathy))))))))))))))))
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I'm going to look up that book Kelly. Thanks for the recommendation.
I'm glad to hear that your doctor told you that letting stress out was better than holding it in. Good advice from a good doctor. I have generalized anxiety disorder, and I've found that if my stress peaks, and I finally blow up, the anxiety disorder actually improves. I had a psychiatrist once who kept telling me that wasn't true, that it was all in my mind, but I DO feel better when I blow up. It must help to release hormones or Serotonin, or something that helps you feel better.
My doctor HAS warned me that too much stress could lead to cancer, or possibly Lupus (apparently people with anxiety disorders are vulnerable to Lupus). So I HAVE to get this stress out of my body, which probably means going NC with all of them. I’ve had a migraine since last night and am throwing up from the medicine. I’ve spent my whole life trying to win their love, and they’re going to end up killing me. I HAVE to put them behind me and break free.
Thanks to all of you for your continue support. It means so much to me, to come here and have other people tell me they get it. Just knowing that I'm not alone has done wonders for my outlook. You guys are the BEST.
Kathy
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It is actually called Deadly Emotions by Don Colbert....
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Dear Kathy
The hard part is what you are doing,now--coming out of denial. It hurts SO badly b/c we went in to denial as a survival mechanism. Perhaps, we would have died of a broken heart as children ,without denial.
I think we could have.
Now, the original ,suppressed pain comes back when we face the truth. It is pain combined with hopelessness, helplessness, despair, fear, abandonment, betrayal etc.
Try to get support , as much as you can--here and in 3D if you can.
Get people who understand. if anyone dismisses you, such as your therapist seemed to, they are not healthy for you, IME. You need to be validated right now.
You need understanding, not people who will try to shut you down b/c THEY can't handle emotions. This is many,many people.
I think I am getting better although don't feel so great today. Change is really hard. I think I am getting more confidence and self esteem but that is hard too b/c it brings guilt and fear of my M's reprisal with it.
Keep sharing((( Kathy))). I think you are great! XXOO Ami
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Hi Kathy,
I posted a long response to you today but got timed out...frustrating!
Boiled down, what I was saying was a series of things, the main one being that I think partly it's cultural sexism that many men breathe in unaware all their lives, to the point that although some father are really, really there for their daughters, so many times daughters sublty and gradually learn that they are second-class citizens in a family, and meanwhile, some fathers are just poleaxed with awe that they have a SON, and it's not even very conscious or intentional, it's just this whole man-son thing, even when it doesn't make sense or when the son's not all that deserving...
And it is about sexism as much as it's about the individual.
And it's very sad, and a huge waste for your father...all that intelligence and accomplishment, and he deosn't know how to value having a daughter.
I am terribly sorry. But maybe it could help a little to see it as not completely, entirely, totally personal...somewhere along the lines of his own upbringing and acculturation, your father learned that a son is a Huge Deal and a daughter is less.
It's a terribly painful thing for you, but I have a sense that maybe your father is totally clueless about why or how he keeps wronging you, he just knows you're terribly upset, and he has about zero ideas as to what to do about it, and whatever he does do doesn't work, so he's kind of thrown up his hands.
And he goes into his loony loop out of helplessness, more than cruelty.
I dunno, for sure, of course. Just a conjecture.
I hope it could ease a little of your pain a little bit to see him from a faraway perspective, as a man who was taught things, and who incorporated sexist values without even seeing that...and who doesn't really know why his daughter's unhappy, but never makes the connection.... (Because meanwhile, he can related to The Glory of Son so the diversion/satisfaction is right there-- cue organs....)
Hops
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That's some pretty good insight, Hops. My father was born in South Africa and lived there until he was about 20, so I've always felt that there was something in his cultural upbringing that told him the male heir was the ONLY thing that mattered. My brother actually came along later in life. They had me first, my sister 18 months later, then nine years later, the male child was born - an unexpected gift. My father was always wonderful to his two daughters until the day the MALE came out of the womb. Suddenly, S and I stopped receiving toys and ice cream cones, and 99.9% of the attention went to the child with the preferred anatomy.
F does spend a lot of time doing things with my sister, but S is as co-dependent as he is, so he doesn't have that confusion that he has with me about "issues" with my NM. Still, he knows that there have been problems with M, and he has always believed her, no matter how insane her stories were. And even if he did favor the male child (either consciously or subconsciously), that's no excuse for not flipping me a twenty dollar bill when I was homeless. Hubby said that F totally didn't get why I would feel hurt about being shut out of the will. It very well may be cultural upbringing, but it's really hard to understand anyone having three children, and thinking it's okay to throw one of them under the bus because his wife told him to.
I dunno. I think a lot of it IS cultural, and that he genuinely is confused about it, but at the same time, the hurt runs so deep that I can no longer stop it from affecting my health. I just ordered the book that Kelly recommended, and am looking forward to reading that. I think that will help me a lot, to understand the stress/wellness connection better, and hopefully start feeling better physically. Maybe I'll be able to see things differently if/when I can be fit and healthy again. Right now I'm such a mess. Between the anxiety disorder, chronic migraines, and now new stress-related symptoms, I have to find a way to heal myself, and I really think that I have to put the entire family behind me until I get to that point.
Ami summed it up really well about this being the hardest part - coming out of denial, and learning to survive in sort of a new life. My N mother won't be around much longer, and the entire family dynamic will change when she's gone. For better or worse, I don't know. But things ARE going to change, for sure.
Kathy
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it's really hard to understand anyone having three children, and thinking it's okay to throw one of them under the bus because his wife told him to.
No kidding. Would have been mighty nice to have had a father strong enough to say NO to his Nwife, and really stand up for you.
I understand the hurt. It's devastating...and primal.
You will heal. You will get stronger and eventually be able to sit with "it is what it is" without being sick.
I applaud your decision to get away from them and take care of yourself now. You don't deserve to suffer this way.
Hops
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Kathy..... it would be nice if your relationship with your sister could be about something other than your parents and brother.
If you can't find other things between you..... maybe she has to go the way of the others?
About your choice to step back and away from your FOO......
probably for the best.
(((Kathy)))
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Dear Kathy
My F was born here and is still the same. For me, it was important not to give him excuses b/c that is what I WANTED to do. I wanted some explanation that would make it warmer than he threw me under the bus.However, THAT is what I had been doing all these years ,trying to find some explanation,and getting re-abused over and over.
Alice Miller talks about the child giving his life so not to face the truth of the parents. I did that. I almost died rather than face that my parents really didn't care about me i.e didn't love me.
Facing it is horrible BUT is the path to true freedom.
God has sent me angels in the form of people who love me . I have a few people in my life who God seems to have touched their heart for me. They seem to love me in a way that I don't understand but I am healing with it.
I bet that can(or has) happened for you.
XOO Ami
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Kathy..... it would be nice if your relationship with your sister could be about something other than your parents and brother.
It would be nice, but I don't see it happening anytime soon. She never writes or calls for any other reason than to tell me family news. She is SO dependent on my parents, that she's emotionally at the level of a fifth grader and simply cannot function on her own. She depends on them for everything. She has never dated or had a relationship. When she wants to go to Disneyland, the movies, whatever, she takes my father.
A few years ago she met a guy at a concert and they went on a date. My parents picked on her relentlessly over it. My father called me and was joking about it, and said, "Your Mom and I can't stop laughing that your poor sister finally got some guy to take her on a date." I couldn't believe that he could say something so horrid about his own daughter. I guess I should have seen that as an early sign. Consequently, I'd be surprised if S ever goes on another date.
I honestly don't know how she'll be able to function when they're gone. I'll be the only person she has left at that point, so maybe then the relationship will change.
Ami, I think this cultural attitude of men placing sons on pedestals is an international thing. While it’s certainly worse in less developed countries, American men still have that “thing” about having a SON. Every guy I know is named after his father, or has the father's name as a middle name. My husband never got special treatment for being male, but is still named after his father. Many people on this board have said that the golden child in their family was male, and that may be based in the N's belief that a male child is capable of getting a better job, making more money, etc., so best to take care of THAT child. My NM said several times that "her boy" would grow up to be a doctor or lawyer, make lots of money, and take care of her.
It’s certainly not an excuse for bad behavior, but it probably does influence some of it. Sadly, we still have a country where women are paid less, and are just generally undervalued. I think that future generations may place a greater value on daughters, but people in our parent’s generation, not so much. They grew up in a time when a son might grow up to be president, but never a daughter, so you put all of your hopes on that son. One day that will change, I hope.
Kathy
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Your poor sister, Kathy: (
Mo2