Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: phoenix on October 24, 2004, 03:18:20 PM
-
aka "Ramble".
Now I understand the pointlessness of interacting with Ramble thread. It all came together when Solace gaily sailed in, following CG’s Declaration of Independence.
We are dealing with emotional six year olds here.
Excerpts from: "Now We Are Six"
[Apologies to A. A. Milne.]
Narcissists have normal, even superior, intellectual development while remaining emotionally and morally immature. Dealing with them can give you the sense of trying to have a reasonable discussion with a very clever six-year-old -- this is an age when normal children are grandiose and exhibitionistic, when they are very resistant to taking the blame for their own misbehavior, when they understand what the rules are (e.g., that lying, cheating, and stealing are prohibited) but are still trying to wriggle out of accepting those rules for themselves.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Your typical Six-year-old is a paradoxical little person, and bipolarity is the name of the game. Whatever he does, he does the opposite just as readily. In fact, sometimes the choice of some certain object or course of action immediately triggers an overpowering need for its opposite."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The child is now the center of his own universe."
… delighted by any silly thing that calls attention to himself; may do silly, show-offy things to call attention to himself when he feels neglected or shut out
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And last but not least...
"Sixes love to dress up and pretend they are somebody else...."
http://www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/six.html
I thought I would start this thread just devoted to venting feelings about Ramble. That way we don't have to highjack other threads, and we are in a place removed from Ramble itself.
Anybody else? Post anonymous if you don't want to sign your name. Phoenix
-
Being relatively new here, I found the Ramble thread to be a negative detractor from the other conversations, questions, helps, & positive "safe" sharing that has occurred in other threads. I just quit reading it.
Your reference to Joanna Mashmun's site was good (halcyon.com). It was the first site I discovered on NPD, & still think it is one of the most clear & helpful resources around.
-
Whenever I do read it, it seems someone declares that they're leaving permanently due to ill-treatment, hurt feelings, and so on. But it never happens (the declaration is repeated rather regularly by the same people). It's always followed by an announcement that they've been convinced to stay...
Reading the ramble thread is a guilty pleasure sometimes. :oops:
-
Yeah, Solace, aka s, aka somebody has said she is leaving at least a half a dozen times. Lacks credibility at this point, not to mention that this person is still here regardless of the havoc she reeks on the other posters (with the exception of CG, Portia, et.al) who don't want to be force fed the "enlightenment" of her position on sexual predators. Ick.
Ah well. :roll:
-
Hope you don't mind Guest anv Liv if I copy your post from Parent Alientation Syndrome over to here.
Please be aware that Solace is the person formally known as "somebody" and "s".
Also be aware that Solace is CG/Portia.
You cannot read their posts and not know they are all the same person. Nobody else writes even close to that style, and the excessive use of emoticons. Nobody else is so patronizing in one moment, then belligerent the next.
I do find it amusing how each personality praises each other to the sky. They validate each other.
Well, I just know for a certainty that Solace, s and somebody are the same.I just wonder what continent that person is on really. First, it's "eh" from Canada and the next it's "G'day" from Australia. Sheesh.
Sorry, not trying to co opt the thread. I'll beat it now.
-
Post subject: How to be abusive 101
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How to be abusive, a step by step recipe:
1.If you need to feel better, find someone and demean them. This works great with those closest to you, since they have already been conditioned. It is equally effective if you are able to use a degrading situation against them, if the situation is such that you can lord it over that person. You may also be dismissive or insulting at will. If you can put them down while being clever and subtle, it is even better. It keeps them off balance. Push their buttons, you know exactly where they all are. You may even want to "act nice" while you do this. This is particularly effective if completely unprovoked and "out of nowhere." Remember, it's all about You getting what you need!
2. Deny that you did it. You may want to act self-righteous, act as if it is their fault. Tell them that they are too sensitive, or that that is just like them to feel that way. Be outraged that they would accuse you of such a thing after all that you have done for them. Tell them that there is no need for them to ruin your life. Point out how they lack credibility regularly. Puff up and try to make them feel bad for even questioning you. Pull rank. Play games. Whatever you need to do to keep control of the situation.
3. If this fails, use their own guilt against them. Fog the issue with their own fear of you that you instilled since the beginning. Make them question thier own judgement, (this will be easy because of all your prior work). Use their sense of obligation or family loyalty. Never, never underestimate the power of Guilt! You will find this to be very useful. You can make an adult question their own thoughts despite a lifetime of evidence to the contrary! It's unbelievable, really, but it works. Most of them have been so brainwashed they can't believe you would do this to them and thus they will allow you to keep doing it. How great is that?!
4. This is the most important step of all - Make them think that they are responsible for your actions! Take no responsibility whatsover. This is the key that makes the whole thing work! (Warning - If they really get this, and begin to believe in themselves, you are sunk)
5. Repeat at will - It will always make you feel better and give you what you need! Happy Abusing, and remember - It's all about YOU!!!
PS - The above will not work if they have figured out that you are in fact responsible for your own behaviors. If they begin to understand that you are deliberately using their own sense of fear, guilt, and obligation, they will begin to see the Truth and the above will not work any longer! Be Forewarned!!
-
aka "Ramble".
Now I understand the pointlessness of interacting with Ramble thread. It all came together when Solace gaily sailed in, following CG’s Declaration of Independence.
We are dealing with emotional six year olds here.
Excerpts from: "Now We Are Six"
[Apologies to A. A. Milne.]
Narcissists have normal, even superior, intellectual development while remaining emotionally and morally immature. Dealing with them can give you the sense of trying to have a reasonable discussion with a very clever six-year-old -- this is an age when normal children are grandiose and exhibitionistic, when they are very resistant to taking the blame for their own misbehavior, when they understand what the rules are (e.g., that lying, cheating, and stealing are prohibited) but are still trying to wriggle out of accepting those rules for themselves.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Your typical Six-year-old is a paradoxical little person, and bipolarity is the name of the game. Whatever he does, he does the opposite just as readily. In fact, sometimes the choice of some certain object or course of action immediately triggers an overpowering need for its opposite."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The child is now the center of his own universe."
… delighted by any silly thing that calls attention to himself; may do silly, show-offy things to call attention to himself when he feels neglected or shut out
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And last but not least...
"Sixes love to dress up and pretend they are somebody else...."
http://www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/six.html
I thought I would start this thread just devoted to venting feelings about Ramble. That way we don't have to highjack other threads, and we are in a place removed from Ramble itself.
Anybody else? Post anonymous if you don't want to sign your name. Phoenix
"Mirror mirror on the wall"
-
"Mirror mirror on the wall"
Ah, yes, I expected that. Thanks for coming through. Now we can move past that. Phoenix
-
Hope you don't mind Guest anv Liv if I copy your post from Parent Alientation Syndrome over to here.
Please be aware that Solace is the person formally known as "somebody" and "s".
Also be aware that Solace is CG/Portia.
You cannot read their posts and not know they are all the same person. Nobody else writes even close to that style, and the excessive use of emoticons. Nobody else is so patronizing in one moment, then belligerent the next.
I do find it amusing how each personality praises each other to the sky. They validate each other.
Well, I just know for a certainty that Solace, s and somebody are the same.I just wonder what continent that person is on really. First, it's "eh" from Canada and the next it's "G'day" from Australia. Sheesh.
Sorry, not trying to co opt the thread. I'll beat it now.
Good filler.
-
Yeah, Solace, aka s, aka somebody has said she is leaving at least a half a dozen times. Lacks credibility at this point,
Ah well. :roll:
Thanks for mentioning this. Good point to consider. Also can you remember how many times Phoenix has left?
-
Post subject: How to be abusive 101
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How to be abusive, a step by step recipe:
1.If you need to feel better, find someone and demean them. This works great with those closest to you, since they have already been conditioned. It is equally effective if you are able to use a degrading situation against them, if the situation is such that you can lord it over that person. You may also be dismissive or insulting at will. If you can put them down while being clever and subtle, it is even better. It keeps them off balance. Push their buttons, you know exactly where they all are. You may even want to "act nice" while you do this. This is particularly effective if completely unprovoked and "out of nowhere." Remember, it's all about You getting what you need!
2. Deny that you did it. You may want to act self-righteous, act as if it is their fault. Tell them that they are too sensitive, or that that is just like them to feel that way. Be outraged that they would accuse you of such a thing after all that you have done for them. Tell them that there is no need for them to ruin your life. Point out how they lack credibility regularly. Puff up and try to make them feel bad for even questioning you. Pull rank. Play games. Whatever you need to do to keep control of the situation.
3. If this fails, use their own guilt against them. Fog the issue with their own fear of you that you instilled since the beginning. Make them question thier own judgement, (this will be easy because of all your prior work). Use their sense of obligation or family loyalty. Never, never underestimate the power of Guilt! You will find this to be very useful. You can make an adult question their own thoughts despite a lifetime of evidence to the contrary! It's unbelievable, really, but it works. Most of them have been so brainwashed they can't believe you would do this to them and thus they will allow you to keep doing it. How great is that?!
4. This is the most important step of all - Make them think that they are responsible for your actions! Take no responsibility whatsover. This is the key that makes the whole thing work! (Warning - If they really get this, and begin to believe in themselves, you are sunk)
5. Repeat at will - It will always make you feel better and give you what you need! Happy Abusing, and remember - It's all about YOU!!!
PS - The above will not work if they have figured out that you are in fact responsible for your own behaviors. If they begin to understand that you are deliberately using their own sense of fear, guilt, and obligation, they will begin to see the Truth and the above will not work any longer! Be Forewarned!!
This is so good. Is it an excerpt of a larger article published on the internet somewhere or is it from a book? Could you provide more or the source or article?
-
This thread has no value IMHO. ha ha.
No value whatesoever.
Except to really upset me.
Annihilating me as a board member. :x :x :x
Thanks a lot Phoenix for your very unkind words about me.
I won't bother to identify myself. You know who I am. One person. You know that. I don't know exactly what I, as one person, one voice, have done to you. Except told you my real name. On PM. Remember the laugh about how people sometimes call you my name, when they miss-hear you? Yeah. I remember, maybe you don't.
Did I ignore you? Did you tell me about it? Nope. All in your head.
Did I ****make*** you invisible?
What utter and complete BOLLOCKS. Rubbish. Nonsense. Not in reality. Not my reality.
What's the matter? Did Ramble become too boring for you, that you had to start this tirade?
CG you know who this is too. I'm sick of this. I post as Guest to help, but not this time. Not this time. I'm really pissed off with this thread!
:roll: why why am I bothering to even post? :? Can anyone answer that question? :arrow:
-
Post subject: How to be abusive 101
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5. Repeat at will - It will always make you feel better and give you what you need! Happy Abusing Phoenix , and remember - It's all about YOU!!!
-
what's got into you, phoenix?
You sound like a small child who has been shut out of mummy's bedroom and is now on a vengeful path of destruction.
you invite people into a thread to post about other people
you invite people to post anonymously, to fear owning their own voice
you can't abide people in ramble owning and expressing their own voice
you preoccupy yourself iwth other people's identity - what's it to you?
you have been hurt on occasion - harsh words have been said. I see that. But this isn't the answer to hurt feelings. Express your anger and move on. Do not allow anger to fester. Do not preoccupy yourself with irrelevancies. You have your own tough world to deal with out there.
FIND THE REAL RELEVANCE TO YOU - what hurt does it remind you of? Work through it - work through it here with honesty. Don't hide behind revenge.
Are you asking people to gang up with you against ramble? You need to prove you are right? I sense tears behind your brave and angry front. I sense that you are sobbing with the hurt and the effort to remain as you are.
Here's an arm around your shoulders, phoenix.
I am sad that you removed all your posts. Was that anger, too? How sad that you removed the good and the helpful things you've written over time.
Nurture yourself phoenix - don't hurt yourself in hurting others. Other people don't always intend the hurt you experience from them.
-
This thread has no value IMHO. ha ha.
No value whatesoever.
Except to really upset me.
Annihilating me as a board member. :x :x :x
Thanks a lot Phoenix for your very unkind words about me.
I won't bother to identify myself. You know who I am. One person. You know that. I don't know exactly what I, as one person, one voice, have done to you. Except told you my real name. On PM. Remember the laugh about how people sometimes call you my name, when they miss-hear you? Yeah. I remember, maybe you don't.
Did I ignore you? Did you tell me about it? Nope. All in your head.
Did I ****make*** you invisible?
What utter and complete BOLLOCKS. Rubbish. Nonsense. Not in reality. Not my reality.
What's the matter? Did Ramble become too boring for you, that you had to start this tirade?
CG you know who this is too. I'm sick of this. I post as Guest to help, but not this time. Not this time. I'm really pissed off with this thread!
:roll: why why am I bothering to even post? :? Can anyone answer that question? :arrow:
?
Really? You took my words to you at Ramble as unkind? You could have made the effort of a reply. I wrote that to you with care. But if you can't see it any other way, I give up. It was me that wanted to keep things in private, but you have this out in the open policy...
Is that why CG came in on your behalf? To speak for you?
I have no intention of annihilating you as a board member. Or anyone.
What do you want from people? For others to roll over and take it whenever you and CG decide you have an itch for someone? No one can speak up?
This has been my point all along: you either retreat in sulky silence, or come out with the big guns blasting. How does anything ever get resolved this way?
I had an epiphany yesterday about Ramble. It was about this very thing. I saw the hook. It is this juvenile behavior- The rebelious "You can't tell me what to do". I realized that there is no talking things through.
I was done with it anyway, but now I feel truly done. Not done because I have said all I can, but because I see the pointlessness in it. How liberating this is...and really very obvious.
Maybe someday you will read my post to you in a different light.
-
What's the matter? Did Ramble become too boring for you, that you had to start this tirade?
I can't speak for Phoenix, but Ramble Cafe became rather insane for me. IMO of course. :D
CG/Solace/Portia, or whoever you are feeling like at this moment, go back to your own thread. :P
-
Yeah, Solace, aka s, aka somebody has said she is leaving at least a half a dozen times. Lacks credibility at this point,
Ah well. :roll:
Thanks for mentioning this. Good point to consider. Also can you remember how many times Phoenix has left?
I have left twice, not as a permanent situation. Both times due to outside influences. I stated that.
-
CG you know who this is too. I'm sick of this. I post as Guest to help, but not this time.
Yeah, we know who you are too. :wink: :wink: One of CG's other personalities. Hmmm....but which one? :D :D :D :D hahahahahahahahahahhahaha
-
What's the matter? Did Ramble become too boring for you, that you had to start this tirade?
I can't speak for Phoenix, but Ramble Cafe became rather insane for me. IMO of course. :D
CG/Solace/Portia, or whoever you are feeling like at this moment, go back to your own thread. :P
Sounds sort of like a typical Discounted Girl order :wink: ? Make me :D !
-
CG you know who this is too. I'm sick of this. I post as Guest to help, but not this time.
Yeah, we know who you are too. :wink: :wink: One of CG's other personalities. Hmmm....but which one? :D :D :D :D hahahahahahahahahahhahaha
Joining the abuse wagon is really good and easy and natural and fun for you, isn't it? Revenge, is fun to some people. remeber that test recently mentioned here. And it is oing to get you far :roll: . Don't bother listening to the person who you're quoting up there, or how they are feeling. It avoids you having to think! :wink:
-
what's got into you, phoenix?
You sound like a small child who has been shut out of mummy's bedroom and is now on a vengeful path of destruction.
you invite people into a thread to post about other people
you invite people to post anonymously, to fear owning their own voice
you can't abide people in ramble owning and expressing their own voice
you preoccupy yourself iwth other people's identity - what's it to you?
you have been hurt on occasion - harsh words have been said. I see that. But this isn't the answer to hurt feelings. Express your anger and move on. Do not allow anger to fester. Do not preoccupy yourself with irrelevancies. You have your own tough world to deal with out there.
FIND THE REAL RELEVANCE TO YOU - what hurt does it remind you of? Work through it - work through it here with honesty. Don't hide behind revenge.
Are you asking people to gang up with you against ramble? You need to prove you are right? I sense tears behind your brave and angry front. I sense that you are sobbing with the hurt and the effort to remain as you are.
Here's an arm around your shoulders, phoenix.
I am sad that you removed all your posts. Was that anger, too? How sad that you removed the good and the helpful things you've written over time.
Nurture yourself phoenix - don't hurt yourself in hurting others. Other people don't always intend the hurt you experience from them.
So kind and true and wonderfully said, whoever you.
-
This thread has no value IMHO. ha ha.
No value whatesoever.
Except to really upset me.
Annihilating me as a board member. :x :x :x
Thanks a lot Phoenix for your very unkind words about me.
I won't bother to identify myself. You know who I am. One person. You know that. I don't know exactly what I, as one person, one voice, have done to you. Except told you my real name. On PM. Remember the laugh about how people sometimes call you my name, when they miss-hear you? Yeah. I remember, maybe you don't.
Did I ignore you? Did you tell me about it? Nope. All in your head.
Did I ****make*** you invisible?
What utter and complete BOLLOCKS. Rubbish. Nonsense. Not in reality. Not my reality.
What's the matter? Did Ramble become too boring for you, that you had to start this tirade?
CG you know who this is too. I'm sick of this. I post as Guest to help, but not this time. Not this time. I'm really pissed off with this thread!
:roll: why why am I bothering to even post? :? Can anyone answer that question? :arrow:
?
Really? You took my words to you at Ramble as unkind? You could have made the effort of a reply. I wrote that to you with care. But if you can't see it any other way, I give up. It was me that wanted to keep things in private, but you have this out in the open policy...
Is that why CG came in on your behalf? To speak for you?
I have no intention of annihilating you as a board member. Or anyone.
What do you want from people? For others to roll over and take it whenever you and CG decide you have an itch for someone? No one can speak up?
This has been my point all along: you either retreat in sulky silence, or come out with the big guns blasting. How does anything ever get resolved this way?
I had an epiphany yesterday about Ramble. It was about this very thing. I saw the hook. It is this juvenile behavior- The rebelious "You can't tell me what to do". I realized that there is no talking things through.
I was done with it anyway, but now I feel truly done. Not done because I have said all I can, but because I see the pointlessness in it. How liberating this is...and really very obvious.
Maybe someday you will read my post to you in a different light.
You're showing that very nasty jealous side again Phoenix. :"Hell hath no fury like a Phoenix scorned "
You can try to rationalise it all you can Phoenix. Your motivation is plain and clear. Revenge! Phoenix, I hope that someday you will read your posts in a different light. Revenge, sweet revenge!
Portia hasn't been posting here for weeks, and you use something this negative to drawer her out and back to you. Why? Because she ignored you?
Hiding behind some higher altruistic motive doesn't wash with us here, Phoenix. We've heard it all before from our Nmothers, Nfathers, Nsisters and Nbosses. You've decided you crave and need P's attention. And you do crazy stuff like this when you don't get it. You claim to be P's friend and claim to care for her and yet post this stuff about her.
God save us all from the kind of friendship you express when you feel 'alienated' from someone you think you need. What you are doing to Portia is what many of us have had done to us by the N's who drove us here. We have experienced this same thing from people who claim to love and care for us too, but whose jealousies and control issues and needs have nearly destroyed us emotionally and mentally. It's frightening to see it happening here in such a real way. Can you see what you are doing Phoenix? Please stop and think.
(Portia), I'd try to just ignore this hun. This is Phoenix's own internal war with herself that is really raging here. It's really her problem. It's got nothing to do with you or your involvement in ramble really. It's Phoenix just projecting and re-expressing her jealousy and hatred of CG in a new and different way.
-
what's got into you, phoenix?
You sound like a small child who has been shut out of mummy's bedroom and is now on a vengeful path of destruction.
you invite people into a thread to post about other people
you invite people to post anonymously, to fear owning their own voice
you can't abide people in ramble owning and expressing their own voice
you preoccupy yourself iwth other people's identity - what's it to you?
you have been hurt on occasion - harsh words have been said. I see that. But this isn't the answer to hurt feelings. Express your anger and move on. Do not allow anger to fester. Do not preoccupy yourself with irrelevancies. You have your own tough world to deal with out there.
FIND THE REAL RELEVANCE TO YOU - what hurt does it remind you of? Work through it - work through it here with honesty. Don't hide behind revenge.
Are you asking people to gang up with you against ramble? You need to prove you are right? I sense tears behind your brave and angry front. I sense that you are sobbing with the hurt and the effort to remain as you are.
Here's an arm around your shoulders, phoenix.
I am sad that you removed all your posts. Was that anger, too? How sad that you removed the good and the helpful things you've written over time.
Nurture yourself phoenix - don't hurt yourself in hurting others. Other people don't always intend the hurt you experience from them.
I was feeling like this message is the wholest and the sanest and most reasonable voice in this thread so I'm bringing it top-side :D .
-
for phoenix
i always been your friend here and on your side but now I feels concerned by the way you have returned with such a stuck energy.i was surprised at all the hard rehashing of things as you've very suddenly appeared with and especially that you started this new thread.
i’m sad because I think its made thing worse when thing were probably at the point where they passed and you could have come back and started fresh if you wanted. i am one who has missed your messages.
i’m also sad because it seems like you are hurting.please consider that it is not your responsibility to change the attitude and behaviors of all others and also that there are some things we may not like that we just can’t control and its ok.others will have their own good or the painful karma and the life feedback from what they say or do and they get sorted out for themselves.
you needs to decide what is important and worthy of your time and energy and fight in life and what isn’t.you are very smart woman and you don’t and never did have anything to prove to no one.
drop what wastes and misuses your time and soul and focus on what make your heart happy and fulfilled and bring you to a positive life road.
please don't allow outside forces that are not important to your life emotionally control you. they are only important to the point they can show you to see how strong your defenses are around some feelings already inside you before all this things. but really in this forum atmosphere they are harmless and neutral objects.you give any meaning to them that is harmful to you.look behind and see why you do it and then blow the defense feelings away in your hands like feathers and walk proudly forward.
the good wishes to you
-
Hi Phoenix,
I don't read the Ramble thread. Period.
I don't always read all the threads posted, and don't always reply. I only reply to ones that resonate with me and/or if I have something of substance to say (maybe :wink: ).
That's it.
-
Can we stop this BS? There is no productive help going on here, unless it is productive to slander, talk behind others backs, hurt and make the rest of us wonder what the heck we are part of this board for if it means the same deragatory treatment we get form our own Ns?
There must be other message boards for this kind of behavior. If one wants to be this mean to others, say it directly to the person it is meant for. Stop taking room in the board for this stupid childish behavior, please.
-
I second this motion. I am a registered member and you could pm your six year old complaints directly to me, if you like, rather than disrupt this board further. Although, I'd much rather if you have something kind and helpful to offer and I'll do my best to treat you with the same and with respect, if you do pm me. I do not feel shame for offering a kind word to
a person who's children are being poisoned against her, especially since I know that feeling quite well. I do not feel shame for thanking CG, who has offered kindness to me more than once here and I do not feel shame for posting this:
"Post subject: How to be abusive 101
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How to be abusive, a step by step recipe:
1.If you need to feel better, find someone and demean them. This works great with those closest to you, since they have already been conditioned. It is equally effective if you are able to use a degrading situation against them, if the situation is such that you can lord it over that person. You may also be dismissive or insulting at will. If you can put them down while being clever and subtle, it is even better. It keeps them off balance. Push their buttons, you know exactly where they all are. You may even want to "act nice" while you do this. This is particularly effective if completely unprovoked and "out of nowhere." Remember, it's all about You getting what you need!
2. Deny that you did it. You may want to act self-righteous, act as if it is their fault. Tell them that they are too sensitive, or that that is just like them to feel that way. Be outraged that they would accuse you of such a thing after all that you have done for them. Tell them that there is no need for them to ruin your life. Point out how they lack credibility regularly. Puff up and try to make them feel bad for even questioning you. Pull rank. Play games. Whatever you need to do to keep control of the situation.
3. If this fails, use their own guilt against them. Fog the issue with their own fear of you that you instilled since the beginning. Make them question thier own judgement, (this will be easy because of all your prior work). Use their sense of obligation or family loyalty. Never, never underestimate the power of Guilt! You will find this to be very useful. You can make an adult question their own thoughts despite a lifetime of evidence to the contrary! It's unbelievable, really, but it works. Most of them have been so brainwashed they can't believe you would do this to them and thus they will allow you to keep doing it. How great is that?!
4. This is the most important step of all - Make them think that they are responsible for your actions! Take no responsibility whatsover. This is the key that makes the whole thing work! (Warning - If they really get this, and begin to believe in themselves, you are sunk)
5. Repeat at will - It will always make you feel better and give you what you need! Happy Abusing, and remember - It's all about YOU!!!
PS - The above will not work if they have figured out that you are in fact responsible for your own behaviors. If they begin to understand that you are deliberately using their own sense of fear, guilt, and obligation, they will begin to see the Truth and the above will not work any longer! Be Forewarned!! " because it speaks directly to this and other threads.
And then Guest wrote:
"This is so good. Is it an excerpt of a larger article published on the internet somewhere or is it from a book? Could you provide more or the source or article?"
Sorry Guest. I found this somewhere on this board and it really made an impact, so I copied it and saved it. I can't remember where I found it. Thankyou for noticing and sorry I can't give you more information.
S
-
wow -- who wrote that up there about me ??
Sounds sort of like a typical Discounted Girl order ? Make me !
You think that I would ever post as a Guest ?? You mean you think I order people around ?? If you would identify yourself I would like to talk about that. I'm not connecting on that one.
-
What a nice friendly welcoming title this thread had when I first saw the title. But what foul intent I feel it contains. Creating a specific targetted centre of negative energy and hatred within the board to direct at other board members. That's not very nice.
-
It's not very nice either when some people deliberately deceive the board to get their supply.
Some of us have been around here long enough to know this.
Phoenix, you have done the right thing. Good onya.
-
Jealousy and revenge are not my motives…I won’t address any posts regarding that. So if you care to, reread what was written and go from there. If you are really wanting the truth of my intentions you will have to let those ideas go. If you insist on it, it just shows that you don’t want to understand. You can say it in a hundred different languages colors type size, ect, but it won’t make it so.Those are not my motivations. Neither is hate.
Did I ignore you? Did you tell me about it? Nope. All in your head.
Did I ****make*** you invisible?
No you didn’t make me invisible, nor was that a complaint. Some people just aren’t in our radar, we don’t really see them. That is all. And I felt that with you. For me it was no big deal. Just telling you how I felt. I didn’t think you were unkind, either. CG is the one to suggest that one meant the other. That because I felt unseen, that I took it as you being unkind.
you invite people into a thread to post about other people
Yes I did just that- to do here what they were doing already elsewhere.
you invite people to post anonymously, to fear owning their own voice
They have a choice in that matter…perhaps posting anonymous gives them greater freedom to say what they feel. Voicelessness isn’t about identity - it is about speaking your mind.
you can't abide people in ramble owning and expressing their own voice
That was not the issue with me.
you preoccupy yourself iwth other people's identity - what's it to you?
I don’t.
Portia hasn't been posting here for weeks, and you use something this negative to drawer her out and back to you. Why? Because she ignored you?
Was that it? She was ignoring me? See, there is my innocence- I never thought she was ignoring me. I was waiting for her to reply, I was even concerned for her. Maybe she was on holiday. So now I see , she was stewing the whole time, instead of just talking to me about it.
for phoenix
i always been your friend here and on your side but now I feels concerned by the way you have returned with such a stuck energy.i was surprised at all the hard rehashing of things as you've very suddenly appeared with and especially that you started this new thread.
.
i’m sad because I think its made thing worse when thing were probably at the point where they passed and you could have come back and started fresh if you wanted. i am one who has missed your messages.
i’m also sad because it seems like you are hurting.please consider that it is not your responsibility to change the attitude and behaviors of all others and also that there are some things we may not like that we just can’t control and its ok.others will have their own good or the painful karma and the life feedback from what they say or do and they get sorted out for themselves.
you needs to decide what is important and worthy of your time and energy and fight in life and what isn’t.you are very smart woman and you don’t and never did have anything to prove to no one.
drop what wastes and misuses your time and soul and focus on what make your heart happy and fulfilled and bring you to a positive life road.
please don't allow outside forces that are not important to your life emotionally control you. they are only important to the point they can show you to see how strong your defenses are around some feelings already inside you before all this things. but really in this forum atmosphere they are harmless and neutral objects.you give any meaning to them that is harmful to you.look behind and see why you do it and then blow the defense feelings away in your hands like feathers and walk proudly forward.
the good wishes to you
No I am not hurting and I am not stuck. If anything I am unstuck. Sometimes you have to speak up and be bold about it- because things haven’t changed, and just going through this, I see just how much they haven’t. No, I had to say all this. And I can tell you are saying this with care; your words are not lost on me.
No there is more to it than is seen.
I would rather go out in flames here with everyone hating me than be here silent and watch this continue with out saying something. Even if no one else understands or approves.
I can’t not speak up. I can’t - too many other people have been hurt here. And the idea that it is not my business- well it is my business, because it eventually ends up on my doorstep... and has. In ways that aren't easily seen.
This has come from a deep pure part of me untethered by what I should, how I should.
Yes, I needed to say all this, and it feels good.
It is odd, looking at what I created. Boy what a mess, huh? Ugly, nasty mess. Maybe to see it from my viewpoint, outrageous as it is, it was necessary. Oh, it was for me. And I am done with it.
-
Well folks there you have it. Straight from the horses mouth. The final word, it appears. And it was the same predictable old well-worn unchanging response we've grown to expect and even 'D-I-S' love from Phoenix. :roll: zzzzzzzzzz
Onya Phoenix :D
-
Jealousy and revenge are not my motives…I won’t address any posts regarding that. So if you care to, reread what was written and go from there. If you are really wanting the truth of my intentions you will have to let those ideas go. If you insist on it, it just shows that you don’t want to understand. You can say it in a hundred different languages colors type size, ect, but it won’t make it so.Those are not my motivations. Neither is hate.
Did I ignore you? Did you tell me about it? Nope. All in your head.
Did I ****make*** you invisible?
No you didn’t make me invisible, nor was that a complaint. Some people just aren’t in our radar, we don’t really see them. That is all. And I felt that with you. For me it was no big deal. Just telling you how I felt. I didn’t think you were unkind, either. CG is the one to suggest that one meant the other. That because I felt unseen, that I took it as you being unkind.
you invite people into a thread to post about other people
Yes I did just that- to do here what they were doing already elsewhere.
you invite people to post anonymously, to fear owning their own voice
They have a choice in that matter…perhaps posting anonymous gives them greater freedom to say what they feel. Voicelessness isn’t about identity - it is about speaking your mind.
you can't abide people in ramble owning and expressing their own voice
That was not the issue with me.
you preoccupy yourself iwth other people's identity - what's it to you?
I don’t.
Portia hasn't been posting here for weeks, and you use something this negative to drawer her out and back to you. Why? Because she ignored you?
Was that it? She was ignoring me? See, there is my innocence- I never thought she was ignoring me. I was waiting for her to reply, I was even concerned for her. Maybe she was on holiday. So now I see , she was stewing the whole time, instead of just talking to me about it.
for phoenix
i always been your friend here and on your side but now I feels concerned by the way you have returned with such a stuck energy.i was surprised at all the hard rehashing of things as you've very suddenly appeared with and especially that you started this new thread.
.
i’m sad because I think its made thing worse when thing were probably at the point where they passed and you could have come back and started fresh if you wanted. i am one who has missed your messages.
i’m also sad because it seems like you are hurting.please consider that it is not your responsibility to change the attitude and behaviors of all others and also that there are some things we may not like that we just can’t control and its ok.others will have their own good or the painful karma and the life feedback from what they say or do and they get sorted out for themselves.
you needs to decide what is important and worthy of your time and energy and fight in life and what isn’t.you are very smart woman and you don’t and never did have anything to prove to no one.
drop what wastes and misuses your time and soul and focus on what make your heart happy and fulfilled and bring you to a positive life road.
please don't allow outside forces that are not important to your life emotionally control you. they are only important to the point they can show you to see how strong your defenses are around some feelings already inside you before all this things. but really in this forum atmosphere they are harmless and neutral objects.you give any meaning to them that is harmful to you.look behind and see why you do it and then blow the defense feelings away in your hands like feathers and walk proudly forward.
the good wishes to you
No I am not hurting and I am not stuck. If anything I am unstuck. Sometimes you have to speak up and be bold about it- because things haven’t changed, and just going through this, I see just how much they haven’t. No, I had to say all this. And I can tell you are saying this with care; your words are not lost on me.
No there is more to it than is seen.
I would rather go out in flames here with everyone hating me than be here silent and watch this continue with out saying something. Even if no one else understands or approves.
I can’t not speak up. I can’t - too many other people have been hurt here. And the idea that it is not my business- well it is my business, because it eventually ends up on my doorstep... and has. In ways that aren't easily seen.
This has come from a deep pure part of me untethered by what I should, how I should.
Yes, I needed to say all this, and it feels good.
It is odd, looking at what I created. Boy what a mess, huh? Ugly, nasty mess. Maybe to see it from my viewpoint, outrageous as it is, it was necessary. Oh, it was for me. And I am done with it.
We sure hope so :roll: maybe now we can all get back to our own issues :D .
-
Phoenix said - It is odd, looking at what I created. Boy what a mess, huh? Ugly, nasty mess. Maybe to see it from my viewpoint, outrageous as it is, it was necessary. Oh, it was for me. And I am done with it.[/quote][/u]
Sadly, yes, from your point of view, I guess all this ugliness was all necessary. It is all about you, after all.
-
So kind and true and wonderfully said, whoever you.
I was feeling like this message is the wholest and the sanest and most reasonable voice in this thread so I'm bringing it top-side .
Then may I share my voice again...
phoenix - you have denied everything but offered nothing in its place. You say 'come and talk about this topic' but offer nothing of your own other than denials.
What is the purpose of this thread? I do not understand. You brought someone else's nonsense post here - about CG/Portia/Solace being the same person - yet you also say that you are indifferent to other people's identities. I can't make sense of this.
Do you understand your own contradictions?
It seems that the only purpose is to disrupt Ramble, cause chaos and re-create your OWN Ramble thread.
In Ramble, people vented their feelings about their lives and occasionally about the board and specific people. I think they forgot sometimes that anyone else was around and reading!! But at least it was honest and open and outcasts were offered a safe haven. Now in the Romper Room, people are invited specifically to vent their feelings about individuals. Well, I guess when we find our voice, speak out our truth, our voice will also hurt others. It goes both ways, every which way.
But it doesn't have to be ugly and a mess. We can re-create something good out of chaos. Ramble and Romper can co-exist. They can share and intermingle. Ramble has had many 'reincarnations' as its purpose has changed for the participants. It has evolved. The Romper Room can evolve, too. In time we could salve hurt feelings, salvage the broken pieces. Will you allow that, will you help do that, phoenix? The mess is fixable. Would you like it to be fixed? Or do you need the chaos and the mess more?
In thoughtful consideration.
-
I don't really care if the ramble thread exists, I just don't understand WHY it does. If people want to vent about other board members or give refuge to people like SOLACE (s and somebody), then do it by email, pm or calling each other on the dang phone if you're that invested. This is a board to talk about voicelessness...not about pushing Solace's agenda, talking about men, pets, gossiping, et. al. I just don't see anything positive about that particular thread except it serves a need to a select few people that don't seem that interested in posting on too many other threads.
Dee
-
I would rather go out in flames here with everyone hating me than be here silent and watch this continue with out saying something. Even if no one else understands or approves.
I can’t not speak up. I can’t - too many other people have been hurt here. ...In ways that aren't easily seen.
No there is more to it than is seen.
Phoenix-- very often, you keep mentioning about ways that have not been seen by others and there being a lot more to things going on than others here realise.
Maybe you could tell us what these things are so we could understand all of this better. We could know what you know. I can actually assure you that everyone here will not hate you as wondered but it could help people to understand all the "mystery" around things better. You might even be surprised at the support you get.
You could come clean with everything going on behind the scenes that you are speaking of and then wipe your hands of it. If you just come to the board and do messages about things most have no idea about then I am concerned for you that people will only be confused and judge you wrongly. Some, like me, would instinctively trust that you know exactly what you are doing, but to others it can seem very strange.
Since you feel as strongly as you do about speaking up in the forum being the right path for you, wouldn't part of that be speaking the entire truth I wonder.
Also, if we as forum members need to be wary of something, I'd sure like to know.Though I do take my precautions in areas based on my own suspicions. Yes, some would not get the message and attack back but you'd reach some. I'd be listening. Besides, regarding attacking reactions, that cat has been out of the bag for a long time anyway so nothing new or lost.
Maybe you feel comfortable with things just as they are -- all of that is just food for thought.
Keep well my friend.
-
I joined this board a few weeks ago to gain support for dealing w/ the Ns in my life & to share stories (& maybe a little validation). It appears I ended up in the wrong place...
-
Hello All...
I am trying to sort through my own feelings about this and understand what everyone else is saying. I think I might agree with many folks here and forgive me if I am repeating something already said.
I have been having a difficult time understanding what actually bothers me about the Ramble thread. I think that if members want to chat with each other publicly it should be ok. The problem I have is when some members start to bully other people and receive support from their friends. It feels like certain members have more "power" than others. It creates a hostile atmosphere that may stop members and newcomers from feeling free to seek help here. It does recreate the situations that made people voiceless in the first place. That is why I choose to write as guest and maybe others feel that way too. There are so many people on this board who are kind and caring. Even the sometimes bullies can be very helpful, but the possibility of being attacked for expressing one's feelings/thoughts seems to just hang there.
This is an open forum and I think Dr. Grossman keeps it that way for a reason. Still, I think that we, as members, may want to consider, as part of our own healing journey, that we need to stop attacking one another. Personally, I would like to get to know most of the members more and hear from new people who want to share their stories. I wish everyone could feel safer to discuss their feelings here.
There has been so much speculation about who's who. I've spent too much time thinking about it myself. I've decided that if there are some people who are using more than one member name, oh well it's their energy that is being wasted. I don't see how it actually hurts me.
Anyways...thanks for listening.
-
Phoenix,
I forgot to say thank you for starting this thread. I agree that it is helpful to have a place to discuss this. Also, it does sound like you have more information than most of us. I would also be interested in anything you would like to share.
Thanks.
-
I joined this board a few weeks ago to gain support for dealing w/ the Ns in my life & to share stories (& maybe a little validation). It appears I ended up in the wrong place...
Sorry-- but haven't you seen the gazillion other threads in this forum?
There is much more helping and sharing going on by comparison.
You are in the right place. Don't read two threads and share away in all others!
Welcome :)
-
I have had two others over the course of my time here pm me about CG and what I call her method. Both asked me if they didn’t feel they were being singled out with her jabs in the dark. It is like the person who only shows that devil face for you, because they know you are onto them. I could see exactly what she was doing. CG is cunning and mean. I put nothing past her.
This is not my version of Ramble, neither is it for me to feel any who want to add here has the exact same viewpoint as I do. My dislike for S is wholly different than her husband issue, which is a point of real contention with others.
I don’t think CG and Portia are the same. But I think there are many posters that that come here and are fabrications - I will go so far as to say fabrications of parts of my life for one, and I can tell that these posters are going to scroll off never to be heard from again. I see things I can not defend, but when you see enough of them – it becomes apparent. It’s like a black hole, you can’t see it, but you know it exists by the galaxies being sucked in around it.
When one can not defend themselves, they a have a choice- be quiet, or go ahead and just say there is something wrong here, and I have no defense. Not one that won’t be picked apart by the gang. I am not giving them that. I know in my heart what I know.
Is this all about me? Yeah, in a sense I guess it will have to be if I stand alone on this issue. Is the implication that I am selfish, self centered? So be it. I am taking care of myself here.
My remark about everyone hating me was just to point out that I feel that strongly to risk that possibility. I know that others can’t fully grasp what I am saying, and I risk credibility – and wouldn’t the gang want to jump on that opportunity.
What I want from this exchange is for it to be clear how I feel about CG. CG plays games, insidious little games that maybe can only be seen if you are her target. Get caught up in her crosshairs and you will know what I mean.
Phoenix
-
While I'm still waiting for someone to answer me several posts back, I just have to say this: there is as much chance that Phoenix is an N as there is a light piercing that black hole she mentioned. She isn't scheming or trolling around to stir up trouble -- the girl is as out front as they come. I have seen her stand up politely and speak her peace and nobody listened. Now she has raised her voice, got your attention and now you are listening, but she wants you to "hear" her, which means you have to think about it and put yourself in her shoes. She has a different style, yes, and I think they call it "true grit." She doesn't make this stuff up, if she says it's true, that's enough for me. Maybe this has turned into a popularity contest and a runoff for the ALPHA ACON -- I hope not. Maybe that's what happens when a group of people virtually exchange with each other for so long. I was away from here for several months and the tone of the place definitely changed during that period. In any event, I don't think Phoenix has Ntraits, nor do any of the regular posters on this forum. There is so much genuine emotion and heartfelt support on this board -- there is no room for anything but honesty.
-
Well folks there you have it. Straight from the horses mouth. The final word, it appears. And it was the same predictable old well-worn unchanging response we've grown to expect and even 'D-I-S' love from Phoenix. zzzzzzzzzz
Onya Phoenix
Oh sorry, forgot to sign in ... that was me CG
-
i’m sad because I think its made thing worse when thing were probably at the point where they passed and you could have come back and started fresh if you wanted. i am one who has missed your messages.
I see it as things were just swept under the carpet. Ramble is like the family’s dirty little secret. Lets not confront the truth there and hope it dies down. It won’t as long as the key player still operates in her same mode.
I am not interested in hashing anything out with CG. She can just stay out of my way. And if I post a response in answer to anyone in any thread, she can stop her slimy scheme of coming up on my tail right after, with her own garrulous posting. And volubly patting others on the back, heaping praise, I know what she is doing. Wooing.
And why doesn’t Portia fight her own battles? Did she really think I would answer her through CG? Not a chance.
-
Well... from my stand point. Phoenix directed a post to Portia, and only Portia. CG, out of turn, gets all belligerent and into Phoenix's face.
Maybe CG shouldnt be answering posts directed at other members...that is unless she is really Portia also. That would explain her getting all irrate.
I see where CG, and perhaps Solace and P, is also posting as an anonymous guest.
If CG and company do not like this thread....then maybe they shouldn't read it. After all, I dont read threads I dont care for... Ramble especially, as it has an insane quality to it.
Phoenix, I really think you are wasting your time trying to get your point across to that person. It isnt worth the bother.
-
Phoenix, I really think you are wasting your time trying to get your point across to that person. It isnt worth the bother.
Yes, and this has been what I have come to realize, even as I started this thread. I just couldn't wrap my mind around the idea that on a board such as this, that someone may just not want to hear you, at the risk you might jolt them out of thier comfort zone. Phoenix
-
I'm the guest who first wrote about explaining.Thanx for taking the time for explaining all of that Phoenix.
I understand what you are saying and I completely believe you.
I see it as things were just swept under the carpet. Ramble is like the family’s dirty little secret. Lets not confront the truth there and hope it dies down. It won’t as long as the key player still operates in her same mode. I am not interested in hashing anything out with CG. She can just stay out of my way. And if I post a response in answer to anyone in any thread, she can stop her slimy scheme of coming up on my tail right after, with her own garrulous posting. And volubly patting others on the back, heaping praise, I know what she is doing. Wooing.
Why not just don't read ramble and now this thread too.It's not like sweeping it under the carpet hoping it will go away anymore at this point. At first I agree it might have been, but you tried hard and have now seen that you will always get nowhere with the ones involved. Nothing will ever be solved there and in fact your efforts stir more hostility unfortunately. So right now, leaving it behind and getting on with your own things is not sweeping it away and may be a good way to go for YOU.
But you have accomplished a lot in letting OTHERS know to be careful on the boards in general.
If you are ever harrassed when you are posting to other threads this is something Dr. Grossman should definitely take up. There is letting members work things out and then there is abusive bullying which is completely different and there should be zero tolerance for it.
You should be left alone when posting in other threads and that includes comments or quotes from those threads being taken into the ramble or Romper R. threads and picked apart. Should you post in those threads well, of course then it is fair game to for the others to reply what they will.
So anyway--i just hope you come back and leave it all behind now.
-
Why not just don't read ramble and now this thread too.It's not like sweeping it under the carpet hoping it will go away anymore at this point. At first I agree it might have been, but you tried hard and have now seen that you will always get nowhere with the ones involved. Nothing will ever be solved there and in fact your efforts stir more hostility unfortunately. So right now, leaving it behind and getting on with your own things is not sweeping it away and may be a good way to go for YOU.
Yes, I agree. Whole heartedly.
In answer ot my deleting all my past posts- I hated to do that. I wish I thought to do as Flower and save them. I would have put some of them back in. I removed them so my family couldn't get to them, which I feared to be a real possibility. I did the same on another board as well. A political board. Right now I want to protect my privacy from thier prying eyes.
Thanks, Phoenix
PS If CG or Portia want to engage me in conversation at this point, I won't answer. I will feel no obligation to respond. I had made my effort, already.
-
Hi ((((Phoenix)))!
First, in seeing a message with your name as origin, and then how many replies in such a short time, I couldn’t help but read and chime in.
I agree completely with Discounted Girl’s comments about you. In fact, it even seems silly to address it (to consider other than the obvious). Also, I am not saying anything about anyone else but only that I understand and know exactly what you are saying about your experience and feelings.
I hope, like another writer mentioned, that you will soon return to the forum outside of these two threads. I know there still may be a bit more for you to address in this one.
I also agree that if you (or anyone) were ever bullied on outside threads, it should be taken to Dr. Grossman, and dealt with. Nobody here should be allowed to be bullied.
I understand why you did what you did with posting on things. Regrettably, it doesn’t look like any middle ground will be reached.
It seems unfair but sometimes all we can do is look out for ourselves. Well, we can at least support others if we see they are victims of something, too. But sadly sometimes we can’t right what we see as injustices, and we move on. Some injustices are worth fighting to near death over, but others are not, and still others come nowhere near.
When I say “worth” I don’t mean value (it’s all valuable), I mean worth in terms of the probability of effecting change with reasonable others, along with the toll it can take on a person in trying.
You may have come to the end of the road regarding the issue, and I sure admire you for speaking your heart. I actually do think you might have helped make some changes, which may only become apparent down the line.
But I too hope that you will return to the board outside of the other stuff, and feel peaceful in being here.
Take care!
BT
-
So - it's OK to deal with bullying by being a bully.
It's OK to hurt people if they hurt you.
Hope you manage to grow up one day phoenix.
Hell, most of the world is still taking an eye for an eye.
You kill my folk and I'll kill yours.
Why should you be any different. It's still a narcissistic response. You don't have to be an N to be narcissistic. You just have to be very, very childish, struggling to fight the demons in your mind and projecting out onto the world outside.
So what if you've frightened and bullied the bogies away from the board. They're still there in your life.
Get rid of them from your mind and then you won't need to get rid of them from the board.
-
Once we find our voice, we should then learn to remember our manners when using it.
-
Once we find our voice, we should then learn to remember our manners when using it.
Amen, sister...
-
Hi Phoenix and everyone,
I still remember that beautiful dream you posted about, Phoenix. I am glad to see you back.
I felt like I changed how I was viewed by taking off my past posts back awhile ago. I want to say that part of the reason I took them off was that I felt my heart was on the board and not everyone that came to read or would read them in the future had a loving attitude. And after all the trouble in the past on this board, I can no longer respond to posts made by unidentified guests addressed to me specifically. I don't know enough about them to know where they are coming from. I am no longer sure of the sincerity of the unidentified poster. It's too bad because that guest feature was probably included to help those who were shy and voiceless express themselves. I have found other forums exclude guest posting and now I see why.
I've used the guest feature in the past. Now I don't like that I didn't have the courage to name myself. Part of getting our voice is not being afraid what others will think of us. What if we all posted as anonymous guests? What if no one took the risk of showing an established identity. It would be such a mess. We'd never straighten it out. Wouldn't that be fun?
Guest posting just doesn't seem like a good idea anymore on the other regular threads IMO (Not Ramble and Romper - hopefully they are outlets of expression for some of us somehow) after all the distrust from the trollishness suspicions awhile back. On the other threads, I see the word 'guest' and I wonder what someone is up to now. I rarely see anyone with their identity showing attacking openly, if ever. Phoenix I don't see you as attacking, it seems more like you're exposing something. But I don't know the details or CG so I can't take sides. I've had a mystery person act all supportive of me and then after time it seemed way over the top almost as if I were being mocked and I felt as if I had been had. But I recovered. All this hiding is too much like the N deception I experienced by Nmom. It's too bad, but the guest feature for me seems wrecked. IMO I see newcomers who name themselves being welcomed here often so I don't see this as an exclusive board. Afterall we are all anonymous with our user name anyway. Establishing an identity here actually seems pretty safe most of the time unless one is way too controversial.
Hi Portia - I enjoy your posts to me and really don't know completely what Ramble is about anyway, there is no way for me to catch up reading it from the beginning!
-
Hi Phoenix, hi Flower hello all other members on this thread.
Hey 4 pages and 53 replies Phoenix! I’m just popping in to say two things: one, I haven’t yet read all this thread; and two, I’ve only posted one post here – this one below. I was pretty annoyed at the time and just posted without thinking or sleeping on it (no, I haven’t learned my lesson on that one Phoenix).
I said this in the heat of the moment:
Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2004 5:30 pm Post subject:
This thread has no value IMHO. ha ha.
No value whatesoever.
Except to really upset me.
Annihilating me as a board member.
Thanks a lot Phoenix for your very unkind words about me.
I won't bother to identify myself. You know who I am. One person. You know that. I don't know exactly what I, as one person, one voice, have done to you. Except told you my real name. On PM. Remember the laugh about how people sometimes call you my name, when they miss-hear you? Yeah. I remember, maybe you don't.
Did I ignore you? Did you tell me about it? Nope. All in your head.
Did I ****make*** you invisible?
What utter and complete BOLLOCKS. Rubbish. Nonsense. Not in reality. Not my reality.
What's the matter? Did Ramble become too boring for you, that you had to start this tirade?
CG you know who this is too. I'm sick of this. I post as Guest to help, but not this time. Not this time. I'm really pissed off with this thread!
why why am I bothering to even post? Can anyone answer that question?
And I haven’t even revisited the start of this thread to see what I think now. I’ll have a read now and try to stick to your posts Phoenix, coz I have a vague impression that maybe that is what I’m supposed to do. Maybe not. Maybe I’m not required, wanted or welcome here but I’ll have a read anyway and in the meantime, I wanted to make my position clear: one post, as above, plus this one and the fact that I’m not here so often these days. So, yeah, hope this doesn’t upset any apple-carts, not my intention, just wanted to say that. Off to read, bye for now
-
Flower wrote: "I've had a mystery person act all supportive of me and then after time it seemed way over the top almost as if I were being mocked and I felt as if I had been had. But I recovered."
Dear Flower:
That mystery person was me and I meant every supportive word I said to you. I am so, so, so, sorry that I made you feel "mocked" and that is NOT what I was trying to do, or meant to do at all. I knew you were hurting and I wanted only to help you feel better and so I posted to you as a guest. I didn't post with my name because I needed to hide my identity in order to be heard. At least, that's how I felt at the time. I only wanted you to hear what I was saying, and never mind the source. Anything I posted using my name was being attacked.
If I am the only person who has posted using "guest" on this board, I will eat my right slipper and go barefoot in the park!! (Did anyone see that movie? "Barefoot in the Park"? I'm trying to lighten things up here a bit--that's all! :D ). And you, Flower, are truly one of the pure, true lights in this place. I hear your loving heart in your posts and your kindness to others and your gentle way is sooo obvious. I wanted only to let you know what a true Flower you are and help you to really believe that about yourself because it's sooo true!!
Then you complimented me and I reacted like I often react to compliments. I had a hard time accepting your compliments without being honest. I was trying to let you know who I am, by saying that not everyone would agree with your compliments, in case you wanted to stop there. Then I was away from my pc for a few days and when I came back, there was no more communication to me. So I didn't post there again. I felt very confused, as if I had missed something, but I didn't know what that was. I'm sorry Flower. I meant only to offer you good words and my true feelings and what I see in you that is so clearly real to me.
Flower, I wasn't a registered user or I might have pm'd you, I don't know. You have certainly opened my eyes about posting as a guest and that's why I posted to Meadow with my registered name. And I revealed who that name is, that Solace is Somebody, in ramble, right after that. I was next trying to decide how to do that in the thread to Meadow, after Bunny wrote that what I wrote was good, to let her know too--who--she was complimenting, when "Liv" made that revelation, with no kindness, for me.
I'm glad you did that Liv, thankyou. Although I would be much more glad if you had done so kindly. The fact that it was done while demeaning is sooo abuse-101ish but maybe you didn't think of that, Liv? I choose to believe what I have already stated and that is: that the abuse we have all endured..is the real villan. No hard feelings from me to you, Liv.
Flower, I might have pm'd this message to you but I've decided to skip being afraid of whatever negative may come of it and be honest, openly.
Discounted Girl wrote: "there is no room for anything but honesty."
I'm not discounting what you said DG and I agree, even if one is stupidly, blatently honest about themselves and their own stuff. It's so risky and it allows plenty for others to take advantage of, and "mock" and use against one, but honesty is still the best policy, isn't it? Hiding the truth is living a lie.
Maybe something positive will come of it.
S
-
All that this thread has accomplished that is directly good and helpful is in the above message.Good on ya solace!
-
Thankyou Guest. That is so nice of you to say.
I do disagree with you though in that there are other good things in this thread too. Lot's of good ideas and plenty of kind words by lot's of posters. Plenty of people here genuinely care about eachother and that is sooo good to see!!
Thankyou just the same for your words to me.
I really do appreciate it! :D
S
-
Hi Phoenix, I’ve read your posts, ignored the guests because I’m only talking to you here. I’ll answer your questions:
Really? You took my words to you at Ramble as unkind? You could have made the effort of a reply. I wrote that to you with care. But if you can't see it any other way, I give up. It was me that wanted to keep things in private, but you have this out in the open policy...
No, not your words in Ramble, this thread I took as unkind. You’re making an incorrect assumption there. I could have “made the effort of a reply” to your words on Ramble? Yeah I could have, but you said “Also, I don't need a reply”
so, so far, I’ve taken you at your word. I thought you meant what you said, you didn’t need a reply. Also, how long has it been since you posted at Ramble? I hadn’t decided never to reply to you. How long did it take you to reply to me on Ramble? Can’t remember but it was some time wasn’t it? How come you think I wasn’t going to reply? How come you have to start this thread? What was going on in your head? Hadn’t you noticed that I just wasn’t around on the Board? Maybe not, I don’t expect you to notice me. But you expect me to reply within your timeframe? I don’t understand.
Is that why CG came in on your behalf? To speak for you?
I have no idea. How could I? CG does whatever she wants to do. What has CG posted here? It isn’t clear to me.
I have no intention of annihilating you as a board member. Or anyone.
Fair enough. What I feel is what I feel. And this thread felt like a direct attack on Ramble. And Ramble has meant a lot to me. It’s helped me enormously. I was letting it go. And then you started this thread. I felt – I dunno – as if Ramble, all my thoughts, my words about my life, me feelings were nothing. Nothing. Just an annoyance to other members. And my internal world, as a deep introvert, is most of what I have. I have no real life friends whatsoever except my H. And he’s sick of hearing about my mother. Ha ha. Yeah Ramble has helped me hugely, through fights, through massive mistakes on my part and through friendship and words and empathy. I came to this board looking for answers about my mother. I got answers. Ramble helped me to look at myself. I owe Ramble and it’s posters and visitors. I’ve never had therapy and after Ramble, I doubt I ever will. I’m hugely sceptical of quick-fix therapy (pills, behavioural psychology etc) and do not have the money for long-term talking therapy. In fact, I’m running out of money full stop. I’ve been off work for over three years now and my funds are very low. I need to spend less time here and more time finding employment. I don’t have a car and if I bought one now, I’d need to work straight away. Unless I suddenly changed my outlook on life and lived off my partner, but I’m not about to do that. My financial independence is worth almost everything to me. Yeah, so Ramble, very important to me in my life. And by starting this thread you trash it. So yeah, I was annoyed. Perhaps you can’t understand why?
What do you want from people? For others to roll over and take it whenever you and CG decide you have an itch for someone? No one can speak up?
I don’t understand what this above is about Phoenix.
This has been my point all along: you either retreat in sulky silence, or come out with the big guns blasting. How does anything ever get resolved this way?
”Sulky silence?” Me? Nope not me. Your interpretation of something, I don’t know what. “Big guns blazing” well yeah, I’ve done some of that. With Somebody last I think. Coz I said ‘fuck’ didn’t I. Broke a rule. Amazed I’m still here. But I don’t retreat and I don’t sulk. Not my character. I’m surprised you think it is. But then, I guess we don’t know each other at all do we?
I had an epiphany yesterday about Ramble. It was about this very thing. I saw the hook. It is this juvenile behavior- The rebelious "You can't tell me what to do". I realized that there is no talking things through.
I really don’t know why you’re so obsessed – yes, obsessed – with Ramble. But juvenile behaviour? Phoenix – this is a board for crazy people like me. And you’re talking about behaviour? Is there some unwritten rule about ‘behaviour’ here? No. It’s your rule, your idea.
I was done with it anyway, but now I feel truly done. Not done because I have said all I can, but because I see the pointlessness in it. How liberating this is...and really very obvious.
Maybe someday you will read my post to you in a different light.
Which post? On Ramble? Does it mean so much to you then? Shall I go back and read it because to be honest, I don't remember much of it. Not sure I even understood it.
Still searching for posts by you Phoenix…my God there are some vicious, vindictive Guest posts here…I’d love to see people post them as their member names. The cowards. Sneaky little bully behind your back kids at school. But I just love the Good Guests. The ones who post wise words and don’t need everyone to know it’s them. I love ‘em.
No you didn’t make me invisible, nor was that a complaint. Some people just aren’t in our radar, we don’t really see them. That is all. And I felt that with you. For me it was no big deal. Just telling you how I felt. I didn’t think you were unkind, either. CG is the one to suggest that one meant the other. That because I felt unseen, that I took it as you being unkind.
I’m confused. Was I unkind to you or not? I can’t tell, sorry.
Quote:
Portia hasn't been posting here for weeks, and you use something this negative to drawer her out and back to you. Why? Because she ignored you?
Was that it? She was ignoring me? See, there is my innocence- I never thought she was ignoring me. I was waiting for her to reply, I was even concerned for her. Maybe she was on holiday. So now I see , she was stewing the whole time, instead of just talking to me about it.
This is so dumb, I’m being talked about and I didn’t even know it ha ha! There are so many assumptions going on. That I can be drawn out. Nope, I just spotted this thread on Sunday and whooof! Posted my bit. Hey whoever posted the first part, can I tell you, I’ve been busy. So Phoenix: “she was stewing the whole time” – please do not take what someone else says about me as being the truth. Me, stewing? What? What the fuck is going on here? Can I speak for myself here? Jesus. Hey, can I repeat: I’VE BEEN BUSY. Not stewing (about what?) not hiding, not anything. Hey if anyone wants to talk about me, fine, but please don’t make up stories about what I’m doing. Stop assuming about me! Thanks.
I would rather go out in flames here with everyone hating me than be here silent and watch this continue with out saying something. Even if no one else understands or approves.
I can’t not speak up. I can’t - too many other people have been hurt here. And the idea that it is not my business- well it is my business, because it eventually ends up on my doorstep... and has. In ways that aren't easily seen.
This has come from a deep pure part of me untethered by what I should, how I should.
Yes, I needed to say all this, and it feels good.
It is odd, looking at what I created. Boy what a mess, huh? Ugly, nasty mess. Maybe to see it from my viewpoint, outrageous as it is, it was necessary. Oh, it was for me. And I am done with it.
Phoenix! Stop! What are you talking about? What is this all about? Phoenix this is ONLY A MESSAGE BOARD. No-one DIES here. No-one starves here. No-one gets blown up. It’s words on a server. And why are you talking about “too many other people have been hurt here” – have they told you so, in person, face-to-face? How can you speak on behalf of people you have never met? I’m not saying your intentions are wrong – I think your intentions are FANTASTIC but BUT, how can I put this…..they’re like mine were a while back. When the things with Jazz and Avery and Jacmac happened? When I took what happened here as life or death? It isn’t, please believe me.
Ah. May I say a quick thing to Dee Phoenix? DEE: if you don’t like something, don’t read it. What’s your story Dee? Who are you? What’s your problem Dee? Why are you here? Speak up for yourself before you start criticising others and telling them what you think they should do. Hell I did. I told my story before I started in on the big guns.
Wow Phoenix. I thought you said at some point elsewhere that you didn’t have a ‘thing’ with CG? Now you call her cunning and mean? I’m not defending her or anything else. Just noticing that she really really gets up your nose.
What is this “the gang” you’re talking about Phoenix? Phoenix. I’m in the UK, CG is in Oz. We don’t speak on the phone you know. This ‘gang’ doesn’t exist. See, I disagree with you about CG. But surely I’m allowed to? And just maybe if I do, if I think CG is okay, maybe one or two others think CG is not those things you say. Nothing is black and white Phoenix. We all ALL have good bits and bad bits. I happen to see the good in CG. And as much as you say this type of thing: “Get caught up in her crosshairs and you will know what I mean.”
I gotta say Phoenix, just who do you think you are, telling other people what to think? Where do get off here Phoenix? Am I allowed to have a mind of my own on this, or do we all have to listen to what you have decide is the truth? Don’t you feel that the truth doesn’t really exist? That everything – everything – is just our brain’s particular interpretation of what we experience? Can’t you see how dictatorial that sounds when you start telling other people how to think and behave? This is tough Phoenix but hell, what’s the point in me writing to you unless it somehow sinks in? How can I reach you Phoenix? How can I reach you? Why should I? Why should I care?
Because I bother you. And because I bother you, you bother me. I see parts of me in you and you in me. But it’s no big deal.
Ramble is like the family’s dirty little secret. Lets not confront the truth there and hope it dies down. It won’t as long as the key player still operates in her same mode.
Oh for Christ’s SAKE! Who? Who is the key player? Me? What’s this about? Is this in code or am I too THICK to understand this?
And why doesn’t Portia fight her own battles? Did she really think I would answer her through CG? Not a chance.
WHAT? Well here I am Phoenix! But am I fighting? Or am I just exasperated? Do I really care? You know, I’m not sure of the answer to that myself. But hey, no, this is all fantasy, about me talking through CG or whatever. I don’t get this. It’s nonsense. Blimey if I want to say something I’ll say it. Phoenix, you know me less than I thought you did. Now, do you want a reply to your other post – on ha ha Ramble – or will you keep to your original thought of not needing a reply? I’ll supply one, if you wish.
PS If CG or Portia want to engage me in conversation at this point, I won't answer. I will feel no obligation to respond. I had made my effort, already.
Ha ha. *sigh* Do you mean I’ve just read all this thread and written back to you for nothing? Whaddya mean "made your effort"? Effort to accomplish what exactly? What is this all about Phoenix? Heck you probably don't want to talk, so be it, whatever.
-
Okay Phoenix, this is what you posted to me. Is this what you're eaten up about, me not replying to this? It took you 13 days to reply to me! and you gave me less than a week? Come on!
Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:21 am
I posted this at Ramble, but changed my mind. The "guest" after me prompted me to move this, I don't want to continue with this issue publicly; which is probably why I held off writing you back in the first place. I want to move on from here. You can repost it if you want. Also, I don't need a reply:
Portia, Hello,
Quote:
Phoenix, hello. When I posted that question, I didn’t expect you to reply, I didn’t know you were reading here any more. But I had a tiny wonder if it was you (a 5% wonder perhaps). I saw your post last night and was so surprised and pleased – surprised that even if you were reading, that you would bother to reply, and pleased to hear that you are not making those posts.
Was I the only one you could attach a name to? Lol
Does it matter that I post them or not - if I feel supportive of those posts- because I understand the reasoning behind them? What might be more important is to not reacting, but to strain with all your senses to understand why they keep coming up. It isn’t just a bunch of mean people with a purposeless vendetta against you – or CG for that matter.
This reply has been in the making ever since your reply to me, October 5. My writing feels very stilted here, very cautious. It is like when in fear, your mouth goes dry. But here it is my emotions go dry, my words feel dry, because I fear I will not be understood. It is a thorny issue being honest with you Portia, because in the past - with me as well as others - you have two dominant ways of responding- Attack or going into hiding. And of course I understand it has to do with personal history. I am not saying this because I want an apology or an accounting of. Not at all. It is more that I am on the sideline, wanting to be a friend as much as that can mean on the board, but that may require saying something you don’t want to hear. I don’t want to be attacked, neither do I want to cause you pain. But you have said you understand, so let’s let it go at that. Ok? Ok.
Quote:
When we had that exchange here a while back, I was reacting without thinking – kind of ‘don’t tell me what to think, I’m not as stupid as you might imagine’. Of course you were getting a lifetime of trained response there. I wish I hadn’t said some of the things I said, but I learned a lot from that. About how I’d made these huge assumptions and let them crystallise in my head until I believed those assumptions to be true, without almost any doubt. I guess I’ve done that a lot throughout my life. It’s a very difficult bad habit for me to break – assuming things without thinking, do I really know that to be true, or can I get more facts before I make some decision …I do struggle with this, not just on the board. Like with my mother. I know very little about her. So, thank you for that exchange, it helped me. I only realised yesterday that I do thank you for that. I changed my mind on something else I wrote recently.
Can I say something about CG. This may be irrelevant to you, but I want to say it okay, for me? I don’t care if she is also PP. I don’t care if she is also a host of other posters, including those who aren’t (on the surface) kind. Because I believe that CG means me good and sometimes maybe that can include stretching my ideas of reality. Why not? I’m quite safe, here at home, reading a PC screen. I think I know CG well enough to think she won’t be hurt by what I’ve just said. I don’t know, I’m taking a risk. Maybe she’ll be flattered. I really don’t know! I just hope she’ll tell me if what I said bothers her. Risk taken. On the other hand, if some of the posters I can think of are separate people, expressing real opinions: well, we’re all different and at least we’re communicating. Yeah, some of it annoys me, course it does.
I would find it hard to find allegiance with someone who was well meaning to me, but ill willed towards others. In order to remain their friend, I would have to address it if they treated others in an ugly manner. I think that CG values you quite a bit, and is open to you. I also know that CG is working from her own issues.
My feelings about CG? I feel she is possessive and jealous of any threat of her friendship with you being violated. I feel much of her actions stem from that. That is just me as an outside observer watching this person in action. I write this with hesitation, because again, it is just me laying my thoughts out there, I don’t want to invite the wrath of god down on me for just pointing out what might well be considered. I can’t go into the details, and I don’t want to.
The issue of PP- want beat the dead horse some more?-is relevant to others here because it carries unresolved history of how this person related to others in the past- as well as the present. And for the posts to be removed right after VCG brought it up, and CG making a chess game out of it in regards to me- well, that just added fuel to the fire. So it doesn’t really matter who CG is/was, but it does matter how this person continues to operate in regard to other people. That is why you draw heat here.
Honestly, I can see the good as well as the pleasure your exchanges are for each other. . Often it has the appearance of two kittens playing. But then those other times…
Quote:
Yes, I know very little about you Phoenix. How could I know more? All that I think about you is based on your posts here and by the nature of the board, it’s never a whole person any of us see. Plus my interpretation of your posts at the time – and I might interpret them all very differently now, compared to months ago. Also I can’t look into your eyes, I can’t see your body language, and you can’t see mine. It’s a surreal place. I know very little about you - that’s why I’m glad you posted above, now at least I know what you’re not doing! I’m real. The washing machine is churning away, I’ve switched off Radio 4 and I’m writing this off-line, trying to remember your post. Just letting my thoughts about ‘you’ and my pictures of you come and go. My picture of you is dim - not like my picture of, for example, Wildflower (very strong image, complete with hair style and colour, probably way removed from the truth but it’s my picture and I like it). The poster ‘Phoenix’ is like a bird rising, I can’t get a clear image. Perhaps I wasn’t looking very hard, very attentively, maybe I couldn’t, at the time? Perhaps I wouldn’t allow myself.
Anyway, getting a bit weird there. You said about me not knowing you and yes, I don’t. I asked the question – is it you Phoenix? - not because I was sure it was you, but because I wondered. And rather than let that wonder grow into some stupid assumption, hey, I thought I’d ask. I didn’t expect a reply (didn’t know you read here) so I was really happy and grateful to see your post. Think I’d better stop now, although to be honest, I could talk to you more, try and find out something about you, but somehow I don’t think you want that ( actually, I have no idea about what you want!). All I have is a foggy image in my head that is Phoenix and I attach some meaning to that image. I wish I could write without thinking I sound so damn sure of stuff, it sounds – I dunno. I don’t want to be like those who made me what I am trying to change. It’s not easy. Thanks again for the reply. P
When I first came here Portia I was really entranced. Here was a whole (small) world of people with the potential to understand what no one else could. You were one of the strong prominent voices for me at that time. In time I found that even here there are wide differences in character. After a while I found that I was feeling invisible with you – you didn’t see me. That was ok with me, and still is. Emotionally, I think we are very different.
Ramble also carries with it a sense of exclusivity, no matter how you try to dispel that feeling. It isn’t a place outside of you. It is you. You think it will carry on without you and CG? It is your dialogue. How others relate to you and CG either as individuals or as a pair, colors their feelings about Ramble. To some it is open arms, to others there is a fire breathing dragon at the door, and others are going to shy at entering the castle.
I know I will remember other points later, or wish I said something more eloquently. I am pretty tired writing this but I felt I had to write it tonight. I have been pushing it aside.
I truly hope you take this in the nature it is intended- in good faith and from a caring individual.
Take care, Phoenix
PS. It was me that posted the link to John Gatto. I am glad you found him so valuable.
Thanks for that link Phoenix, it was interesting. As for the rest of your post above, I need to re-read it several times because I can't see much correlation between my original post to you, and what you say in reply. You see, my original post was FOR YOU but I think you didn't read it like that. So what can I do? Nothing. I'll shut up now.
-
Wonder how long it's going to be before Rodney King posts ...
-
Hi Discounted Girl. Just saw your post. Don’t understand your post though! Is it a joke that’s lost on these shores (or maybe just my brain)? Should I get it or not? Confused, P
-
...are you saying I'm like the LAPD beating Phoenix up? Or is it some reference to black and white? Or are you saying my posts are like a victim?.....don't understand, as you can probably tell...
-
no, I was just joking Portia, don't be gobsmacked :) In America (well at least in Texas) sometimes people say what Rodney King said during the riots that ensued following the LAPD investigations and trial/verdict fiasco -- he said "Can't we all just get along?" I was being a smart alec -- I do that sometimes -- and I am hanging around here still waiting on the guest from way up above to come back and 'splain.
-
Hey thanks for explaining DG! :) My paranoia just took a back seat. Thank you.
"Can't we all just get along?" love it. Jack Nicholson says it in 'Mars attack' just before the Martian chap slays him. Great film, very funny.
Anyway, Phoenix, I feel that's a bit of a belter post from me over the page. I dunno. Honesty and all that. I really don't want you to be hurt/upset/angry UNLESS it's the kind of stuff that does us good. Stuff that's had me hurt/upset/angry has done me a pile of good over these months. I said I'd shut up ....so I will here. P
-
Hi DG (and everyone):
I just won't forget how you posted, DG:
"Everybody loves Somebody sometime...." awhile back. It made me giggle and it seemed one of the first kind things anyone said to me. Did I read that right? I really think I did!!
And I remember posting good things to you too, as a guest, because you seemed to feel soooo unheard but I could hear so much from your words. Well I hear you again, DG, and I don't discount what you say. You make so many useful, valid points.
And I love your sence of humour girl after my own heart!!
I'm off to work but I'll look back here later. I hope I have not offended you DG because I sure don't mean to. Maybe my use of "ya'll" elsewhere offends you? I have been wondering about it. I truly love that expression and wish it was Canadian!! It's sooo warm and friendly! Reminds me of every bit of Southern Hospitality I've experienced in the States and there was so much of that, in those places I've visited. I mean absolutely no offense, truly. We could learn a lot up here from that one expression, if we bothered to count it. I count it and use it a lot. I embrace the goodness in it, DG. :D I mean no harm or offence with it and I just wanted to make my intentions clear (I think I used it when I was angry too, one time, but please, discount that time. Emotions cause me to say things the wrong way sometimes, especially negative feelings).
By the way, Portia, it was a good, kind thing of you to do-- to welcome outcasts there in ramble, and I don't know who they all are but it only makes me like and admire you more. You stick your kneck out to help sometimes, and that takes guts!
Thankyou again, for that. (((((P))))). Please don't "shut up". And you too (((((CG)))))--Thanks for that invite and your good words.
(((((((((((Phoenix))))))))), I hope you are feeling more like talking too.
I hold no grudge against you and I hope you will believe me. DG and P, I love it too!! "Can't we all just get along?" Can't we??
S
-
Sorry Somebody.....I don't feel kindly towards a woman who is still married to and living with the man who abused her daughter and pushing an agenda. Call me quirky. No matter what you do or say here, you will always be a disruptive force on this board and I think you know that. Faux kindness isn't working. I would have considered you kind if you had left when promised, when it was clear your agenda wasn't appreciated. That would have shown some real character. Apologising and getting lost would have been the real kindness. Actions and not faux kind words.
You just can't make people forget no matter what name you post under.
-
Hi Liv:
What do you think then? Do you think you know what I should do in my situation? I don't know you. I know I have not seen your name posted on this board before, except to LABEL me, as having an agenda, and to promote YOUR opinion, which seems to indicate that you dooo indeed know exactly what I should do and should not do in my life. You've called out MY STUFF and your opinion of Me. Will you be around to advise me in all of my other difficulties then, since you are sooooo sure about this?? Because I want to get along with you and I don't want to hurt your feelings but saying you don't FEEL kindly toward me is not MY stuff, it's yours. I feel kindly toward you Liv, even now.
And I do need help with other things but I bet you won't offer anything in those departments because for you.....it seems.....I am nothing but my marital situation. Guess what? You've made some real serious incorrect assumptions about my situation and I do not feel like straightening that out for you because I am not comfortable now talking about it here.
That's ok, isn't it?
Tell me this...please...if you don't feel kindly, then what exactly is it you feel??? Is that what you think needs to be voiced--continuously, whenever I post to any person here--your feelings about me (or other's with similar feelings)? Did my post to Meadow have anything, whatsoever to do with you??
YOUR FEELINGS ABOUT ME?? I like you Liv. I don't know you and I already like you because guess why? Because you seem honest and that's a good thing.
But--being honest about ourselves or to help others....is good.
Being honest to cause hurt, to insult, to abuse...is not good Liv.
Not good at all. I'm sorry to say this. No harm intended. You can easily ignor me or not bother to read my posts or what ---ever. But to stand in and scream out YOUR feelings about MY stuff is just not nice and I think you may not realize how much chaos that causes. Or maybe you do realize it and enjoy that idea?? How do I know??
It's not up to you to obliterate people from public bulletin boards, is it Liv? Are you in charge here or what?
Anyone who doesn't like me--that's ok. Don't like my stuff--that's ok too. Scream it out in an abusive manner--that's not ok and I just won't believe you think it is. I really do believe you are all good people and the abuse you have endured is your enemy--not me. I've endured too and I don't need more. So why is it ok for you to abuse me?
I learned something when I was a little girl that just won't leave my head. It rings and it rings and rings true, no matter what injustice I see in the world.
"Two wrongs do not make a right".
You have every right to your feelings Liv but you do not have the right to voice them in such a way as to cause harm to me, to disrupt the kind words I offer to anyone, no matter what you agree or disagree with about my life or how you feel about me. Do you understand that?
Do I have the right to scream out whatever nasty feelings I have about anyone, after they post something totally unrelated to me, and point out what I don't like about their lives or their stuff or my inaccurate assessment of it or my feelings about them????????????? Imagine if I had done THAT even once here????
Have I gone bazooka or what? I don't think so.
Please take heart Liv. You have not stood in my shoes.
Be thankful for that.
You don't have to try to, if you don't want to either.
I am not a disruptive force, Liv. Abusing is disruptive. Labelling is abusive. I have no "AGENDA" and I don't know who first said it but it's not true. It's Verbal abuse. Another wrong that will in absolutely no possible way--right whatever it is that you have decided is wrong with me or my life, nor will that wrong behaviour HELP anyone or improve anything.
I am free to come and leave here as I please as are you Liv. It's a free world, especially this cyber world. For now.
I would like it very much if you would stay and try your hardest to hear that what I am saying to you is not meant to hurt you but to help you see that your way or the high way is the wrong way. It's not up to you what I do in my life, is it? And you don't have to like it but you do not have the right to decide whether it is right or wrong for me or for my family. That's up to me, isn't it?
Your words and actions are seeming to say that you think it's your stuff. I'm sorry Liv. You are in charge of you, not me.
S
-
Sorry Somebody.....I don't feel kindly towards a woman who is still married to and living with the man who abused her daughter and pushing an agenda.
I wonder why any female would stay with a pedophile husband, especially one that has abused her very own daughter. Somebody-Solace even stated in an earlier post that she believed her daughter. What is this saying to a traumatized daughter when the mother won't even throw the sorry bastard out?
The excuse of "it was a one time mistake, he has changed", is a load of crap. Pedophiles never, ever lose their desire for children, no matter how much anyone would like to believe that. They carry those obscene desires until they die. They are predators. Protect your children.
-
errr...hi everyone....P posting at an unusual hour for me (8.45pm BST)...just popped in to say, ah, err..hey this is Phoenix's thread you know? Is it going to go the way of other threads and turn into a 'focus on S' thread? Just thoughts. It's a free board.
-
What good is this thread doing?
What a stupid idiotic waste of time this is. Time to sign off for a couple of weeks until those responding "tit for tat" get done expressing themselves.
-
I've been in bed with the flu since yesterday evening. I will respond to some of these posts later. :( Phoenix
-
Disruptive, insidious behaviour is not welcome here, because No Good Can Come From It.
"s" maybe you need to find another group which welcomes people with your pedophile/molester background. They might be able to interact with you in the way you are seeking. The majority of us here are on a different path.
We all have anger, but we need to be mature enough to know when to cool our jets and behave like responsible adults. We do not need to have our wounds scratched open here.
Signed, a member who wishes to remain hidden to avoid personal attacks for entertainment.
-
Sorry again S, I don't read your long soliloquys...not a good investment of time. yawn.
But I'm for giving Phoenix back the thread. Good point.
-
I'm sorry too Liv. I'm NOT the only person angry here.
That's a given.
Do as you choose.
Not my stuff.
S
-
Hi Phoenix, I know this is your thread, but since I was addressed here by Solace, I will respond here.
Hello Solace,
Registering shows you are establishing an identity, being open.
On this very Romper thread you said:
And you, Flower, are truly one of the pure, true lights in this place. I hear your loving heart in your posts and your kindness to others and your gentle way is sooo obvious. I wanted only to let you know what a true Flower you are and help you to really believe that about yourself because it's sooo true!!
You say you mean the things you say like this. Why do you give compliments like this when you have a hard time accepting them? That makes for an unequal exchange. Although these compliments appear very nice and caring, it is embarrassing to receive compliment after compliment such as this. People just can't swallow it. Just stopping at the first sentence would be a nice gesture. If it weren't for the fact that it singles me out as someone "special." (I'm flesh and blood like everyone else here, making mistakes like all the rest of us. ) But there are four more compliments after the first. I feel like I am being put up on a pedestal or mocked.
Two proverbs:
It is not good to eat much honey,
Nor is it glory to search out one's own glory.
A man who flatters his neighbor
Is spreading a net for his steps.
So please don't lavish the over the top praise on me. That is what my mom did to soften me up before she hammered me down. And also after making these lavish compliments when one can't receive compliments in return, a person looks insincere, like one is above others, not on others' level and manipulative.
P.S. You were the mystery poster. Thank you for your honesty about that and expressed regrets. I hope you see this response as constructive criticism. I hope your lavish compliments are a sincere attempt at being supportive, but I wonder about your comments (in areas besides your homelife) that keep offending others on this board.
-
yes flower, you're right.
I don't think she is mocking although it sounds like it.
I think she is trying to 'copy' the voices of others here on the forum, voices she thinks are acceptable. She's adopted several mannerisms of other people, especially from the Ramble thread.
I guess she feels it's safer to be someone else other than herself. Perhaps also she is hiding her real feelings, her anger, from herself as well as the board.
Very 'icky'. Very cloying. Time to find your own voice, Solace.
Time to work out what your parents did to you to make you marry the kind of man you did and stick with him through thick and thin.
What are your needs that you stay with him.
Feel your anger and your world may change. That takes true courage, but your world will change for the better.
-
Hi Flower:
I decided to wait a day before posting back to you because I was crying when I last posted yesterday to this board, so I knew I was in no state to respond further, plus I had other things to get done (crying not related to anything you said, by the way).
Thankyou for your considerate reply. I am sorry to have embarassed you. That was not my intention either. I am very sincere in my compliments to you and my desire to add something positive, but I have no way to prove that to you. I am sorry if I sound insincere and I'm trying hard to use the right words.
What I won't appologize for though, is your associating my words with your mother's. I won't bring any hammer down upon you, nor do I have any wish to cause you to feel as if I am doing that. We all associate things with other things sometimes, especially if they ring bells from the past and so I understand where you're coming from. Have done the same thing myself, so how can I possibly fault you?
As to responding to the negativity in the next guest's post, it's hard to ignor but I'm doing my best. I agree with Discounted Girl's idea to ignor nameless posters, at least, those who post nasty stuff. To me, the guest option is a good thing to offer positive comments, when one is wanting to get a point across without bringing whatever negativity is associated with our own identity into it. Also, to speak about things that are scarey to reveal about oneself or to begin to find a voice, when one is very timid. But if it causes the person posted to to feel as if they are associating with "a ghost", as you mentioned at one point Flower, then I see the point in identifying oneself.
But the hurtful, accusatory, false-story-making, button-pushing things that some no-names post is abusive. And I will speak out against abusive stuff until the day I die. I may not have any effect, but I will go to my grave knowing that I tried and I did not remain silent or numb to it.
I believe we will all meet our maker and be accountable then for any behaviour we did not take responsibility for already. I understand, that some people have a different opinion. Time will tell.
S
-
Sorry again. That was me, Solace. Forgot to log in.
I am an early bird this morning and must be off.
Hope you all truly have a good day.
S
-
Hi S. Tell me why I have this urge to shock you all the time? Odd. I do. I just noticed that. I don’t know why. Here’s a shock. I agree with some of the things in the guest post above. It’s not all negative, some of it is questioning. But I think the poster was trying to help. Okay, it’s one person’s interpretation of what you’ve said here. And some of it is very ‘directing’. But it’s some kind of gift. It’s not laid down as the ‘truth’. It’s an opinion (that’s all we have, maybe). But that ‘feel the anger’ line above. See, I agree. It doesn’t sound to me, listening to you, that all the anger is out. Honestly. But it’s not something we can know, and until/if it ever happens, let’s face it, it’s not something you can know either. Is that a double-bind? I feel that something is not ‘right’ but you don’t know it and I can’t tell you but believe me, something is not right, not finished. How could you process that? How could anyone? See how daft it is? But I think Guest meant you well in a very harsh way.
If you were crying because of what you wrote about your sister, I read it and I’ve started a reply, but I won’t get back to it until a weeks’ time as I’ll be away. Sorry. But you were crying? I’m sorry there too, for you crying. I wish I knew why you were. On a lighter note?-
I believe we will all meet our maker and be accountable then for any behaviour we did not take responsibility for already. I understand, that some people have a different opinion. Time will tell.
Another day, another time we’re going to talk about this one. Yeah! It’ll be good. P
PS. Phoenix, it’s still your thread, hope you’re getting better and don’t mind us taking up the thread with this stuff.
PPS. Sorry Flower, for barging in there.
-
Solace - You choose to experience objective feedback as negative and abusive.
That must threaten your very sense of being. That's a tough call. But it's something we all go through to reach the truth.
Perhaps your sister isn't so 'N' after all. Perhaps she too has been trying to give you objective feedback.
What she has done has hurt you to the core. It doesn't mean that she was wrong. Perhaps you really can't see what you need to see - the patterns of your past.
-
Hi Everyone:
Back to you P.
First, I didn't state something correctly. I was referring to a number of nasty guest posts, not just in this thread either, not indicating that the previous guest post was entirely negative. I wasn't clear there, sorry.
Next: "I think she is trying to 'copy' the voices of others here on the forum, voices she thinks are acceptable. She's adopted several mannerisms of other people, especially from the Ramble thread."
Let me reword this, for the sake of discussion only, I do not think this but let's pretend I was saying this to you:
"I think you are trying to 'copy' the voices of others here on the forum, voices you think are acceptable. You've adopted several mannerisms of other people, especially from whatever thread".
What am I really saying? Am I saying, in a polite way, that you are mirroring? That you have no identity? I'm not saying I can't see your individual mannerisms I'm saying you don't have any, aren't I?
Am I not saying that I know what you think?
Does this statement represent positive feedback to you? Can you prove or disprove this, even to yourself? Is it so general and non-definitive that it is confusing? Do you find it pushes any of your buttons? Is this an accusation written in opinion form? What feelings does this type of statement about you generate?
This statement is, at the very least, questionably negative, imo, in that it could cause a person confusion and insult and who knows what else? If so, that could cause real harm, depending on a number of variables.
Or this: ""s" maybe you need to find another group which welcomes people with your pedophile/molester background."
Who is the pedophile? I find it exceptionally interesting that this diagnosis has been made here. It is totally contrary to what the testing, the assessments, the evidence, the conclusions many so-called experts and doctors have made. It is not true and yet it is being stated, without basis of fact. Does this guest have the qualifications to make this diagnosis? It is a medical diagnosis. Has this person assessed, with the current tools available? Have they experience and knowledge to make such a diagnosis? Not only is it a diagnosis but it is a very damaging label. Putting damaging labels on others without having the qualification or facts to base them on..is abusive, imo.
I have done this myself, so I feel no anger toward this person. What I think is that such a thing is hurtful and wrong and I feel frustrated with it.
I have stated that my sister is an n and I have not stated such a diagnosis to her, to harm or upset her. I have since questioned my own statements on that. It's one of the positives I'm gleaned from being here. The fact is, I don't know that she is. She has many n behaviours and she may be one. I don't know and I have no right nor qualification to label her as such. My posts in regard to her, as time has passed, have left that damming statement out. I realized this awhile back and stopped calling her my n-sis. Just my sister.
My husband did not molest anyone. I did not molest anyone. Who is being referred to here, anyway? Me? My pedophile/molester background or my husband's? Ok, maybe a slip of words there. I can appreciate that and I'm being a bit picky about the statement but the fact is--my husband has been deemed NOT a pedophile. Has anyone asked me that? nope.
It's been assumed that he is one. Must I report this. I don't feel comfortable talking about it all and re-living it all but I am taking another risk and adding this bit of information because I really think it is extremely important.
Have I ever made incorrect assumptions before. Yep. We all do it sometimes. But some cause more harm than others. Some lead to much more hurt than others. This one has sent waves of stuff in all directions and this guest is not the first person to make this statement.
Portia, you have not shocked me at all. I may very well be reacting to feedback too sensitively but please do not assume that I am missing the intention or misperceiving all intention or taking every word to be negative. I am trying to work on me. I do sometimes feel like saying: "Work on you" to some, like to the misdiagnoser, but that is just another reaction. Probably anger, you're right. I do feel angry when I read such stuff, initially. Would you, if I labelled and misdiagnosed with such ease and that was then deemed truth?
I posted to you that my anger is toward my sister and I'm trying to voice how confusing that is for me. It's not my sister's feedback that angers me. It's her behaviour. I do empathize with her, maybe more than you might imagine, and this is also adding to the confusion. I want to release my anger but I feel guilt for even feeling it. How ridiculous is that???
I also said that I'm stuffing a lot of that anger about my sister and I am fully aware of it. I came here to try to help myself, in that regard because I know I need help with it and because I hope that with understanding more and more, I will be able to find some kind of peace.
My statement about my belief about meeting our maker. That is definately my opinion and I note it because because I think you, Portia, may have a different opinion and I am trying to point out that difference, to help others realize that we are not the same person posting under different names. I respect your opinion, whatever it is, and not just your's.
Third, how can anyone decide that I have taken all negative feedback as abusive? (next guest poster). Yes, that's your opinion. I'm not angry about that but I am pointing out that you have assumed I'm making a choice and that you are incorrect about that. I'm not taking all feedback as negative but I am in disagreement about some of the objectivity. No insult meant.
Anyway, this is Phoenix's thread and I hope you are feeling better Phoenix. The flu sucks. Takes a lot out of me, when I get it. Take your rest seriously and please take care of you too.
S
-
Did it again!! Forgot to log in. That was me,
S
-
how can anyone decide that I have taken all negative feedback as abusive?
You added the word 'all' so perhaps you are misreading and misperceiving more than you realise. That's not intended to add to your confusion - just an observation.
What am I really saying? Am I saying, in a polite way, that you are mirroring? That you have no identity? I'm not saying I can't see your individual mannerisms I'm saying you don't have any, aren't I?
Wow! Mirror, mirror on the wall. Projections projected. Can't keep up with the mirrors in the mirrors here. I think that's an accurate account of how you really feel or who you really are. Not sure which - but it's one of those two. You had to project it out in order to understand it. But you've got it. Well done!
Am I not saying that I know what you think?
Sorry - that was one step too far. Couldn't 'get' that one.
I also observe that you avoid the positives, the supportive comments. If you don't value them, you'll stop receiving them.
-
Hi Guest:
"You added the word 'all' so perhaps you are misreading and misperceiving more than you realise. That's not intended to add to your confusion - just an observation. "
Point taken. Thanks
"Wow! Mirror, mirror on the wall. Projections projected. Can't keep up with the mirrors in the mirrors here. I think that's an accurate account of how you really feel or who you really are. Not sure which - but it's one of those two. You had to project it out in order to understand it. But you've got it. Well done!"
I need more explanation here. Not sure what you mean?
"Am I not saying that I know what you think?"
If I use the words "you think", am I not assuming to know what you think?
"I also observe that you avoid the positives, the supportive comments. If you don't value them, you'll stop receiving them."
I have not commented on them. My post was very long winded. I hear you though, avoid may be not so correct as not comment on maybe?
S
-
Portia and all,
I am still feeling queasy, so that is going to put a damper on my ability to respond with the vitality in which I started out with. Maybe that is good, I don’t know; my mind feels wrapped in cotton and all I want to do is sleep.
I had put a lot of thought into how to reply, and it seemed that if I said a little, I’d have to say a lot. Or do I just let it all go? But I don’t think that it is fair to light a wildfire and walk away.
It is pretty amazing to see how this has blossomed into other threads.
I have been having a difficult time understanding what actually bothers me about the Ramble thread.
This is what I hoped others would address in regards to Ramble. What exactly is it that is bothersome? Not just to express your hate or scorn or fears, but to examine why? Maybe with defining just what it is that bothers us, we can offer awareness to the participants there.
For me, I no longer want to discuss it. I have grown past the need to, because for me, every effort I had made previously was rebuffed. I don’t trust that I can say what I feel and be heard. I have gotten what I need, not what I wanted. What I wanted was communication, what I got was freedom from caring anymore.
I joined this board a few weeks ago to gain support for dealing w/ the Ns in my life & to share stories (& maybe a little validation). It appears I ended up in the wrong place...
Although I feel I officially joined here January 28, 2004, I came across this site at it’s origination. I was probably one of the first five posters. It had a desperate quality to it then that I found extremely uncomfortable. Lonely, lost, suicidal, distressed, without any old timers established to offer any hope. When I came back to it, it had grown up, and now has a feel of having established itself. I found it inviting, and well structured, peopled with others who had already traveled the road I was on, a place I could come in from the cold. At it’s very worst and heated, it is still a much better site than it was
So what if you've frightened and bullied the bogies away from the board. They're still there in your life.
Get rid of them from your mind and then you won't need to get rid of them from the
board.
Well, the first thing that comes to mind is that this is a board designed to work things out on.
The other thing is that I think it in my right to address bullies when they are in my path. And there is that saying sometimes the only way to fight an n is to behave like an n – or nish behaviour. I have no problem with this, and won’t be shamed into thinking otherwise. If you want to let someone tread on you, that is your prerogative.
Good people have always attracted bullies- throughout history. It’s not all in there head.
But let me ask you this, if someone is beating up your neighbor, do you just look the other way, and say, well it’s not me, it’s not in my reality, they are attracting this because the it is their mindset?
What you are saying here is lame thinking, only intended to silence me, to have me doubt the right of my actions. It only serves you, in your effort to not hear what I am saying, so you can continue to pick at my argument, as if it doesn’t matter.
Flower- I've used the guest feature in the past. Now I don't like that I didn't have the courage to name myself. Part of getting our voice is not being afraid what others will think of us. What if we all posted as anonymous guests? What if no one took the risk of showing an established identity. It would be such a mess. We'd never straighten it out. Wouldn't that be fun?
I saw a commercial the other night. It was a group of ladies in an anger management class. There was music playing, and the ladies were sitting in their chairs in a peaceful circle. The lights flickered, went out, the music stopped, and you could hear the sounds of these women in a scuffle, in the dark. Then the lights came back on, and they were frozen in unconcealed astonishment, in various poses of their slugfest: entangled, hair pulling, grabbing, hitting, ect. It made me think of this very thing.
Guest- Hi Phoenix,
I don't read the Ramble thread. Period.
I don't always read all the threads posted, and don't always reply. I only reply to ones that resonate with me and/or if I have something of substance to say (maybe ).
That's it.
I don’t really “read’ Ramble, I just check in occasionally from curiosity. Or with a wary eye, checking it’s pulse. But I won’t from now on.
Thank you. That’s all I am asking. Those who post here freely, not feeling harassed, don’t realize that for me posting comes with a price. I feel I’m always looking over my shoulder. Not for the bogey man, necessarily, but for the little stinging bee that no one else notices. I just want others to be aware of how I am feeling. Why should I have to put up with that?
Blue Topaz-You may have come to the end of the road regarding the issue, and I sure admire you for speaking your heart. I actually do think you might have helped make some changes, which may only become apparent down the line.
It was taking it’s toll on me to not speak up. I started this thread not as a last ditch effort to be heard by Ramble, but to be heard by others, that this is what is going on with me, and I am thoroughly frustrated. I think we may all have come to the end of this road.
Portia, I started to reply to your post, but I am not going to, it can only spread the venom further on both parts.
Solace -You pm’d me, thanking me for once sticking up for you, and asking for me to now see you in a new light, to be your friend? Why did I stop being supportive of you? Did you ever figure that one out? You figure out what you do to continually annoy people here and change that, I will see you in a different light. But as it stands now, I don’t. Don’t waste your time trying with me, I am not interested.
Phoenix
-
To Solace
I also observe that you avoid the positives,
the supportive comments. If you don't value them, you'll stop receiving them.
I too observe you doing this at times Solace. Perhaps it's natural when feeling defensive. Tending to look actively for offences to take, and at the same time often not seeing too readily the postive sentiments within the same message. The things others may see. And more misunderstanding and conlict results. Perhaps its not resaonable to expect you or anybody
to be perfect in this area. I too believe I do precisely the same thing at times. Perhaps it may be helpful to keep this in mind.
Just a thought
-
Hi Phoenix:
I'm glad you're feeling well enough to post some. I appreciate the thought you put into it and many of the points. Since you mention the pm I sent to you, hope it's ok to post it here. I don't want to mix anything up, ok?
"From: Solace
To: phoenix
Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2004 5:14 pm
Subject: Just a note.
Hi Phoenix:
I have not forgotton that you supported me some, in the original thread I posted in. Thankyou, again. I did appreciate it. Now, in this romper room thread, you say you "dislike" me but it's not about my husband.
Phoenix, I am a separate person, who has not ever been to a public board before (I'm not Portia or CG--but I began reading the ramble thread because there were so many posts to it--it seemed like it must be important. I do like Portia and CG, and that's ok, isn't it?).
I have suffered real traumas and I came here to speak about what was bothering me, what I have not been able to speak of, and to learn about n'ism and it's effects.
I don't understand how you can make such a statement when you don't even know me (about disliking me)?? I don't mean to cause you any hurt or any harm but your words seem so unfair to me.
Haven't you noticed anything good about me at all? Are you absolutely certain that I am some evil troll n-monster who has some mad agenda?
I'm not, Phoenix. I know I'm not but I don't know what to say that will help you believe me.
I am sorry if CG has treated you badly. She treated me badly at first too but later she was kind to me. I don't know anyone here well-enough to judge them as conniving but I know what it's like to live with people who behave that way. It's not very nice, especially if you trust them. I'm sorry if I have said stuff that has upset you Phoenix. I have never wanted to do that and I am trying really hard to just be honest. I really can't stand lies and liars. I have always said I can take anything...but it better be the truth (and God help me, I have faced plenty).
Phoenix, I'm hoping you will change your mind about me. It doesn't matter if you don't feel like pm'ing back to me, that's ok. I just wish I could help you see that the labels that have been placed on me, by some here are not right or true or fair and that I have been really hurt in my life too.
S"
Phoenix: " Why did I stop being supportive of you? Did you ever figure that one out?"
To be honest, I can't remember if I did or not.
Phoenix: "You figure out what you do to continually annoy people here and change that, I will see you in a different light. "
Well, that's something to look forward to but I might need help with it, I admit.
"But as it stands now, I don’t. Don’t waste your time trying with me, I am not interested. "
I don't think I'm wasting my time and I can only hope that your interest will change. I do hear the boundary being set and I can respect it.
I do hope you feel much better soon and no hard feelings Phoenix.
S
-
Hi Guest:
Sorry I bumped my post in there and missed yours until now.
Absolutely. I agree. Defensive to the limit at times.
Some days worse than others, depending on which diagnosis I read or how strong I am feeling or lot's of stuff.
I take no offense and I do appreciate you saying you do it too. We all do don't we??
Thanks Guest
S
-
I saw a commercial the other night. It was a group of ladies in an anger management class. There was music playing, and the ladies were sitting in their chairs in a peaceful circle. The lights flickered, went out, the music stopped, and you could hear the sounds of these women in a scuffle, in the dark. Then the lights came back on, and they were frozen in unconcealed astonishment, in various poses of their slugfest: entangled, hair pulling, grabbing, hitting, ect. It made me think of this very thing.
Hi Phoenix, glad you are feeling a bit better. I remember that commercial too. I hope you feel better soon and hope you come and post on lots of threads with your valuable input. I really am glad to see you back on the board. :)
Hi Solace,
I hope you are feeling better.
I do hear the boundary being set and I can respect it.
I hope you will respect Phoenix's boundary. If you stop the excessive compliments towards me that will be a solid action. I don't like flattery and a lot of compliments is flattery. The board is full of words so the only "actions" we can really see is discretion in the use of words. I look forward to seeing your growth in this area which will help your credibility here.
Hi Portia,
PPS. Sorry Flower, for barging in there.
I like to read your posts and don't feel you are barging a bit. :)
-
Solace said to Phoenix
I am sorry if CG has treated you badly. She treated me badly at first too but later she was kind to me. I don't know anyone here well-enough to judge them as conniving but I know what it's like to live with people who behave that way. It's not very nice, especially if you trust them. I'm sorry if I have said stuff that has upset you Phoenix. I have never wanted to do that and I am trying really hard to just be honest. I really can't stand lies and liars. I have always said I can take anything...but it better be the truth (and God help me, I have faced plenty).
Solace, may I discuss this pm of yours with the board and you?
Solace, you generously suggested to Phoenix via your pm to her that perhaps CG had treated Phoenix badly like she treated you badly. And expressing your understanding of her feelings if that were the case.
We all have read the many many times that Phoenix constantly states that her main problem is how CG treats other board members, whose names Phoenix doesn't mention. That it's been a great concern to her that it's not obvious to so many others. Phoenix mentions often how she can see CG's evil at work on the board in background, and how others have even pm'd her about it.
CG's evil and manipulation is something that she feels is overlooked and is hard to notice or isn't observed by the rest of us on the board, and how some people who are special to her have been blinsided by CG's charm.
That's what I observe that Phoenix is trying to do. Phoenix is trying to bring a healthy awareness to board about CG's slimey scheming mean manipulative ways, that Phoenix is concerned that no-ones else seems to see.
Phoenix has wanted CG to be recognised by the board as a damaging harmful influence and has been willing to stick her neck out and be ridiculed for doing it. Does that sound right so far?
So an idea came to me by Solace sharing her pm to Phoenix.
Why doesn't everybody who CG has hurt speak up for themselves like Solace just did? Instead of leaving it all up to Phoenix to do.
Why should this burden of exposing CG for who she really is rest solely on Phoenix's shoulders?
What if Phoenix is wrong about CG? We don't know that yet, do we?
Where are the all the members who Phoenix talks about, all the real examples of where CG has hurt and manipulatd people? Surely all this isn't just about Phoenix being offended for how CG hurt you Solace! :D
There must be other examples that people would care to share here, to get resolution and reach a verdict.
Perhaps it might be timely for those who have been hurt by CG in the past to share these incidences with us here and now. Perhaps it may be good to understand the situations and understand what we're talking about here instead of assuming, like you could have Solace in your message to Phoenix. Instead, you used the word 'if' instead of 'because' which meant you weren't assuming and imposing.
To see and read the evidence of the offences and manipulation and slime and scheming from CG. To perhaps even analyse them, instead of us all simply having to take Phoenix's word for it, which places an enormous burden and responsibility on Phoenix's shoulders.
And even though I am quite fond of Phoenix, her readings of her feelings without evidence is insufficient evidence for me. Also, unlike Discounted Girl's ( 8) who I'm also fond of) sentiment where she said something like "If Phoeinx says it, it must be so! It's good enough for me." Well, that doesn't sit well with me either. I would never want to hand over that level of thinking and control to anyone else DG :D . Not even Phoenix. I would like to see some real information from the offended parties.
Or perhaps, is it even possible, that there are more misunderstandings here than meets the eye? How can we ever know if the exact incidences aren't presented? People take offence at little things from others all the time.
A member is being judged here as someone who is quite terribly evil. That is a very serious and possibly damaging label to impose on someone and I don't think should be done lightly.
I think there have been many very serious accusations leveled at CG by Phoenix that now they need to be supported with hard evidence by others, and not feelings alone, if they are to be taken seriously.
So how about some hard evidence from as many serious and known members as possible to help out here.
If all of those who Phoenix believes have been hurt by CG would step up to the board themselves with their names and speak out and tell their stories of how and what CG did, perhaps even by calling up CG's actual posts up where she did it to them, this could be resolved intelligently.
This would also take a lot of pressure off Phoenix and give CG something serious to think about, wouldn't it? And it could assist matters here generally. The people who Phoenix is trying to look after appear to be hiding behind the 'guest' option leaving it aup to Phoenix to take the heat on their behalf. Where is their courage? Where is their truth? Is Phoenix
a bleeding-heart who is being manipulated herself to fight other people's battles. Battles which they don't have the courage to fight themselves.
And perhaps if the victims themelves came forward with their own hurts and grievances regarding CG true healing could take place here instead of the constant and escalating bickering over CG. I would like to finally see a conclusion to this constant on-going situation, and see a fair and just resolution.
Thomas.
-
Thank you Thomas for your refreshing reasonable post. :)
-
Thomas,
First off, it sounds as if you are benignly attempting to discredit me.
If you cared to go back into past posts, you can see for yourself the abuse CG has heaped upon others.
I am here to represent my own self, that I am tired of it. I will call the police if a burglar is seen entering the house next door. A burglar is a burglar. I am not just protecting my nieghbors interest alone, I am also working on behalf that said burglar doesn't enter in my house next.
Some of those harrassed are no longer here. I feel it within my rights not necessarily to speak on their behalf, but to cite them as examples. Even those that decided in the end to be friends with CG.
Phoenix
-
Some of those harrassed are no longer here. I feel it within my rights not necessarily to speak on their behalf, but to cite them as examples. Even those that decided in the end to be friends with CG.
Phoenix
I know I certainly have no desire at all to discredit you Phoenix. I am supporting you, whether you can recognise that or not.
What I am doing is attempting to assist the board and you in particular.
I am simply using my developed T skills confirmed from the Myer Briggs to add an alternative approach to the situation, and what I believe is an already abundance of the many F skills and talents here.
Please include those who you feel have left as a result of CG.
Why would you not provide those specific identities for the benefit of the board, especially as you say they aren't here to do it themselves?
Who you are talking about could actually get the ball rolling on this and even assist others to come forward with their stories of hurt.
Thomas
-
I am simply using my developed T skills confirmed from the Myer Briggs to add an alternative approach to the situation, and what I believe is an already abundance of the many F skills and talents here.
Are you for real? :shock:
-
Hello everyone:
Flower, I will do my best, ok? And I am feeling better, thankyou for bothering to hope.
Thomas, I like your idea and thanks for your kind words about me.
S
-
Thomas,
First off, it sounds as if you are benignly attempting to discredit me.
If you cared to go back into past posts, you can see for yourself the abuse CG has heaped upon others.
I am here to represent my own self, that I am tired of it. I will call the police if a burglar is seen entering the house next door. A burglar is a burglar. I am not just protecting my nieghbors interest alone, I am also working on behalf that said burglar doesn't enter in my house next.
Some of those harrassed are no longer here. I feel it within my rights not necessarily to speak on their behalf, but to cite them as examples. Even those that decided in the end to be friends with CG.Phoenix
In the end of what? This slip of the tongue speaks volumes to me about your pain Phoenix. Yes, I can see what is eating at you Phoenix and I can see what you're doing.
Jacmac's leaving and the closed threads really affected you badly didn't they. That's what you are refering to up there, isn't it?
And then to add insult to your injury Portia and R went on and became acquainted with and then friends with NG who then became CG.
That is what is bothering you so much, and that is why you seem to many to be obsessed and analyse every CG word looking for her demon to expose.
Phoenix, do you feel hurt and angry that Jacmac left and CG stayed?
Or is it more anger that Rosencrantz and Portia went on and became friends with and later accepted CG? Where is the anger here in you? What does it connect with in your real life?
Do you blame CG for all of that conflict back then? Do you not remember anybody else being involved? Not Jacmac herself? I remember Jacmac wouldn't apologise to another member here. Remember J called someone's husband NPD and that member rightfully corrected her.
That alone caused an uproar. So many demanding an apology from J to th hurt one. So much division, so many nasty things said by so many, when actually it had nothing to do with anybody else but Jacmac and the other member.
Not everybody else and all the other guests who were involved at the time who were trying to force Jacmac to apologise. I bring up that history to you to present to you that many many people were involved in the conflicts which led to Jacmac leaving.
And you blame just 1 person, CG, for it all don't you?
I can see what you're doing now Phoenix and why. I understand.
You're replicating that totally horrendous time 6 months ago almost identically here, but instead of it being Jacmac who is the focus, it's CG who's the centre of all the nasty innuendo. And who keeps making her this focus? You.
Are you intending to keep on and on at CG to try to tip her over the edge with your words and guest words till she goes over the edge and maybe begins posting crazy stuff in large blue and bold like Jacmac did?
Do you feel that the wrong person stayed? Do you feel you won't rest till CG goes too? Do you feel there is such an injustice here, that CG doesn't belong here, that your friend J should still be here instead?
All this from 6 months ago. WOW!
Phoenix, Jacmac could still be here and posting under a new identity. :D You never know. Maybe you should get out and meet more new people here.
I sense a real guilt in you Phoenix. A very sad deep guilt. A guilt that you didn't say enough as Phoenix with your identity up and out in the open to protect Jacmac. That you feel you failed or didn't do enough for Jacmac. And you feel responsible now, so responsible that you're going to follow CG and ensure she's constantly under watch.
I can understand how you must be so angered and resentful by reading Portia and others defending CG now and previously. And they seem to be doing a very good fine of it too. That must bring about feelings of hostility and even failure in you. That is all so dreadfully sad for you Phoenix if that's what's going on in you. I think it's time to move on my friend, and focus on your real life. Too many of these ideas of any injustice to Jacmac are purely supposition.
Completely Amazed
-
I am simply using my developed T skills confirmed from the Myer Briggs to add an alternative approach to the situation, and what I believe is an already abundance of the many F skills and talents here.
Are you for real? :shock:
Yes of course I am, and so are you? Now let's sort out the real problems here. We could begin with you moving from your 'naughty child' poster mode to your 'adult' poster mode, and you might like to consider how to begin doing this.
Here's how. Stop playing your silly dysfunctional little board games. We're talking about real problems here on the board. Get with it or get out of the way.
Thomas
-
I find it funny how some people here claim to be sooo supporting, yet are subtly insulting at the same time. It is like drawing ya in with one supporting hand, and whacking ya upside the head with the other. :shock:
Anybody ever notice that?
-
Solace said to Phoenix
I am sorry if CG has treated you badly. She treated me badly at first too but later she was kind to me. I don't know anyone here well-enough to judge them as conniving but I know what it's like to live with people who behave that way. It's not very nice, especially if you trust them. I'm sorry if I have said stuff that has upset you Phoenix. I have never wanted to do that and I am trying really hard to just be honest. I really can't stand lies and liars. I have always said I can take anything...but it better be the truth (and God help me, I have faced plenty).
Solace, may I discuss this pm of yours with the board and you?
Solace, you generously suggested to Phoenix via your pm to her that perhaps CG had treated Phoenix badly like she treated you badly. And expressing your understanding of her feelings if that were the case.
We all have read the many many times that Phoenix constantly states that her main problem is how CG treats other board members, whose names Phoenix doesn't mention. That it's been a great concern to her that it's not obvious to so many others. Phoenix mentions often how she can see CG's evil at work on the board in background, and how others have even pm'd her about it.
CG's evil and manipulation is something that she feels is overlooked and is hard to notice or isn't observed by the rest of us on the board, and how some people who are special to her have been blinsided by CG's charm.
That's what I observe that Phoenix is trying to do. Phoenix is trying to bring a healthy awareness to board about CG's slimey scheming mean manipulative ways, that Phoenix is concerned that no-ones else seems to see.
Phoenix has wanted CG to be recognised by the board as a damaging harmful influence and has been willing to stick her neck out and be ridiculed for doing it. Does that sound right so far?
So an idea came to me by Solace sharing her pm to Phoenix.
Why doesn't everybody who CG has hurt speak up for themselves like Solace just did? Instead of leaving it all up to Phoenix to do.
Why should this burden of exposing CG for who she really is rest solely on Phoenix's shoulders?
What if Phoenix is wrong about CG? We don't know that yet, do we?
Where are the all the members who Phoenix talks about, all the real examples of where CG has hurt and manipulatd people? Surely all this isn't just about Phoenix being offended for how CG hurt you Solace! :D
There must be other examples that people would care to share here, to get resolution and reach a verdict.
Perhaps it might be timely for those who have been hurt by CG in the past to share these incidences with us here and now. Perhaps it may be good to understand the situations and understand what we're talking about here instead of assuming, like you could have Solace in your message to Phoenix. Instead, you used the word 'if' instead of 'because' which meant you weren't assuming and imposing.
To see and read the evidence of the offences and manipulation and slime and scheming from CG. To perhaps even analyse them, instead of us all simply having to take Phoenix's word for it, which places an enormous burden and responsibility on Phoenix's shoulders.
And even though I am quite fond of Phoenix, her readings of her feelings without evidence is insufficient evidence for me. Also, unlike Discounted Girl's ( 8) who I'm also fond of) sentiment where she said something like "If Phoeinx says it, it must be so! It's good enough for me." Well, that doesn't sit well with me either. I would never want to hand over that level of thinking and control to anyone else DG :D . Not even Phoenix. I would like to see some real information from the offended parties.
Or perhaps, is it even possible, that there are more misunderstandings here than meets the eye? How can we ever know if the exact incidences aren't presented? People take offence at little things from others all the time.
A member is being judged here as someone who is quite terribly evil. That is a very serious and possibly damaging label to impose on someone and I don't think should be done lightly.
I think there have been many very serious accusations leveled at CG by Phoenix that now they need to be supported with hard evidence by others, and not feelings alone, if they are to be taken seriously.
So how about some hard evidence from as many serious and known members as possible to help out here.
If all of those who Phoenix believes have been hurt by CG would step up to the board themselves with their names and speak out and tell their stories of how and what CG did, perhaps even by calling up CG's actual posts up where she did it to them, this could be resolved intelligently.
This would also take a lot of pressure off Phoenix and give CG something serious to think about, wouldn't it? And it could assist matters here generally. The people who Phoenix is trying to look after appear to be hiding behind the 'guest' option leaving it aup to Phoenix to take the heat on their behalf. Where is their courage? Where is their truth? Is Phoenix
a bleeding-heart who is being manipulated herself to fight other people's battles. Battles which they don't have the courage to fight themselves.
And perhaps if the victims themelves came forward with their own hurts and grievances regarding CG true healing could take place here instead of the constant and escalating bickering over CG. I would like to finally see a conclusion to this constant on-going situation, and see a fair and just resolution.
Thomas.
-
Completely Amazed
Ditto dude- right back atcha.
Stop playing your own roles {albeit very poorly} of armchair psychologist and tryant know-it-all :evil:
Phoenix doesn't need to be bleeping pyschoanalysed by the likes of you.
How dare you!
Analysis of Thomas:
I think you reacted to my message so strongly because of your deep seated childhood memories of being mocked by your father. You think he thought you were stupid, never listened to you, and you never felt you amounted to much in his eyes. And then there was that time at the baseball game......
Annoying to have someone pick you apart like that--isn't it!!!!
Take a hike with the psycho-babble. Stop talking about Myers-Briggs and good to school for 6 or 7 years, get a ph.d and come back to the board and try again.
-
Hey Thomas. Can you repost that last one again? I didnt catch it the first two times.
:P
-
Oh my "Amazed", I am laughing my ass off...to attribute such thoughts of revenge by me. Not my way. No way. But it sure puts you in a heat. I came back some time ago and made no inroads then towards revenge, now did I? Did I? No , I did not. You got the wrong call. You understand nothing about me. Phoenix
-
Thomas, not everyone concerned has been directly attacked by CG- but enough have seen her in action to give me credibility. I dont expect others to come forth, on my behalf, for that reason.
I don't care if someone follows up with a post saying see , she made it all up, there isn't anyone else, so she is making excuses. I really can't defend myself against that, don't intend to. And I don't feel the least bit bad about this. I know my concious, I know my motives. The only resolve I see is in just having done what I have done here. I am going to go forward and make my place here on the board where I feel called to and expect CG to stay away from me. And I will stay completely out of Ramble.
Phoenix
-
Completely Amazed
Ditto dude- right back atcha.
Stop playing your own roles {albeit very poorly} of armchair psychologist and tryant know-it-all :evil:
Phoenix doesn't need to be bleeping pyschoanalysed by the likes of you.
How dare you!
Analysis of Thomas:
I think you reacted to my message so strongly because of your deep seated childhood memories of being mocked by your father.
You think he thought you were stupid, never listened to you, and you never felt you amounted to much in his eyes. And then there was that time at the baseball game......
Annoying to have someone pick you apart like that--isn't it!!!!
Take a hike with the psycho-babble. Stop talking about Myers-Briggs and good to school for 6 or 7 years, get a ph.d and come back to the board and try again.
Your messages are sadly telling. We are touching some old and still open wounds here, aren't we? You just gave much away about yourself then.
The same story we've heard over and over so many times from you. And about your father. You probably hid somewhere and wanted to poke your tongue at him too.
I will dare to speak up here. Why do you feel to silence and riducule my right.
I look at you Phoenix. You dare to speak up. I respect that.
-
Thomas, not everyone concerned has been directly attacked by CG- but enough have seen her in action to give me credibility. I dont expect others to come forth, on my behalf, for that reason.
I don't care if someone follows up with a post saying see , she made it all up, there isn't anyone else, so she is making excuses. I really can't defend myself against that, don't intend to. And I don't feel the least bit bad about this. I know my concious, I know my motives. The only resolve I see is in just having done what I have done here. I am going to go forward and make my place here on the board where I feel called to and expect CG to stay away from me. And I will stay completely out of Ramble.
Phoenix
This position you have taken has been to date, very one-sided Phoenix.
You've made very many accusations and had much to say about CG being evil and slimey adn manipulative. Which on some days has brought the board to a standstil. Now you say you won't or can't support it with any hard information.
We're waiting. We haven't heard from any of CG's victims yet. We haven't heard anything from CG herself yet.
And now that they have been called on to step forward and speak up, you want to close the door on all of this.
Now, who are all of these new group of people you are mentioning Phoenix? These people who CG hasn't hurt directly, but who have seen CG hurt others too.
Would this new group of members who Phoenix is talking about like to step forward, name names, times and places on the board, and provide at least some hard evidence of actual incidences about CG, for us all to take a solid look at?
Phoenix, at the moment I find myself struggling. I am resisting beginning to feel like I've beenhad.
Thomas
-
As per guests request
Solace said to Phoenix I am sorry if CG has treated you badly. She treated me badly at first too but later she was kind to me. I don't know anyone here well-enough to judge them as conniving but I know what it's like to live with people who behave that way. It's not very nice, especially if you trust them. I'm sorry if I have said stuff that has upset you Phoenix. I have never wanted to do that and I am trying really hard to just be honest. I really can't stand lies and liars. I have always said I can take anything...but it better be the truth (and God help me, I have faced plenty).
Solace, may I discuss this pm of yours with the board and you?
Solace, you generously suggested to Phoenix via your pm to her that perhaps CG had treated Phoenix badly like she treated you badly. And expressing your understanding of her feelings if that were the case.
We all have read the many many times that Phoenix constantly states that her main problem is how CG treats other board members, whose names Phoenix doesn't mention. That it's been a great concern to her that it's not obvious to so many others. Phoenix mentions often how she can see CG's evil at work on the board in background, and how others have even pm'd her about it.
CG's evil and manipulation is something that she feels is overlooked and is hard to notice or isn't observed by the rest of us on the board, and how some people who are special to her have been blinsided by CG's charm.
That's what I observe that Phoenix is trying to do. Phoenix is trying to bring a healthy awareness to board about CG's slimey scheming mean manipulative ways, that Phoenix is concerned that no-ones else seems to see.
Phoenix has wanted CG to be recognised by the board as a damaging harmful influence and has been willing to stick her neck out and be ridiculed for doing it. Does that sound right so far?
So an idea came to me by Solace sharing her pm to Phoenix.
Why doesn't everybody who CG has hurt speak up for themselves like Solace just did? Instead of leaving it all up to Phoenix to do.
Why should this burden of exposing CG for who she really is rest solely on Phoenix's shoulders?
What if Phoenix is wrong about CG? We don't know that yet, do we?
Where are the all the members who Phoenix talks about, all the real examples of where CG has hurt and manipulatd people? Surely all this isn't just about Phoenix being offended for how CG hurt you Solace! :D
There must be other examples that people would care to share here, to get resolution and reach a verdict.
Perhaps it might be timely for those who have been hurt by CG in the past to share these incidences with us here and now. Perhaps it may be good to understand the situations and understand what we're talking about here instead of assuming, like you could have Solace in your message to Phoenix. Instead, you used the word 'if' instead of 'because' which meant you weren't assuming and imposing.
To see and read the evidence of the offences and manipulation and slime and scheming from CG. To perhaps even analyse them, instead of us all simply having to take Phoenix's word for it, which places an enormous burden and responsibility on Phoenix's shoulders.
And even though I am quite fond of Phoenix, her readings of her feelings without evidence is insufficient evidence for me. Also, unlike Discounted Girl's ( 8) who I'm also fond of) sentiment where she said something like "If Phoeinx says it, it must be so! It's good enough for me." Well, that doesn't sit well with me either. I would never want to hand over that level of thinking and control to anyone else DG :D . Not even Phoenix. I would like to see some real information from the offended parties.
Or perhaps, is it even possible, that there are more misunderstandings here than meets the eye? How can we ever know if the exact incidences aren't presented? People take offence at little things from others all the time.
A member is being judged here as someone who is quite terribly evil. That is a very serious and possibly damaging label to impose on someone and I don't think should be done lightly.
I think there have been many very serious accusations leveled at CG by Phoenix that now they need to be supported with hard evidence by others, and not feelings alone, if they are to be taken seriously.
So how about some hard evidence from as many serious and known members as possible to help out here.
If all of those who Phoenix believes have been hurt by CG would step up to the board themselves with their names and speak out and tell their stories of how and what CG did, perhaps even by calling up CG's actual posts up where she did it to them, this could be resolved intelligently.
This would also take a lot of pressure off Phoenix and give CG something serious to think about, wouldn't it? And it could assist matters here generally. The people who Phoenix is trying to look after appear to be hiding behind the 'guest' option leaving it aup to Phoenix to take the heat on their behalf. Where is their courage? Where is their truth? Is Phoenix
a bleeding-heart who is being manipulated herself to fight other people's battles. Battles which they don't have the courage to fight themselves.
And perhaps if the victims themelves came forward with their own hurts and grievances regarding CG true healing could take place here instead of the constant and escalating bickering over CG. I would like to finally see a conclusion to this constant on-going situation, and see a fair and just resolution.
Thomas.
-
Thomas, not everyone concerned has been directly attacked by CG- but enough have seen her in action to give me credibility. I dont expect others to come forth, on my behalf, for that reason.
I don't care if someone follows up with a post saying see , she made it all up, there isn't anyone else, so she is making excuses. I really can't defend myself against that, don't intend to. And I don't feel the least bit bad about this. I know my concious, I know my motives. The only resolve I see is in just having done what I have done here. I am going to go forward and make my place here on the board where I feel called to and expect CG to stay away from me. And I will stay completely out of Ramble.
Phoenix
This position you have taken has been to date, very one-sided Phoenix.
You've made very many accusations and had much to say about CG being evil and slimey and manipulative. These constant accusations have many times brought the board to a standstill. I believe many would be open to believing this if it could be supported with hard evidence. Now you say you won't or can't support it with any hard information.
We're waiting. We haven't heard from any of CG's victims yet. We haven't heard anything from CG herself yet.
Now that they have been called on to step forward and speak up, it appears you wish to close the door on all of this.
Who are this new group of people you are mentioning Phoenix? These people who CG hasn't hurt directly, but who have seen CG hurt others too.
Would this new group of members who Phoenix is talking about like to step forward, name names, times and places on the board, and provide at least some hard evidence of actual incidences about CG, for us all to take a solid look at?
Phoenix, at the moment I find myself struggling. I am still with you, yet find I'm resisting beginning to feel like I've been had.
Thomas
-
Then feel had Thomas. I am not out to change your mind.
My point in the first place was to talk to Portia over at Ramble. Then I gave up, I saw it as pointless. And seeing that there were others voicing their feelings over at Ramble, I started this thread for them to talk here. And some have. If they choose not to be open, then I can't drag them out. Phoenix.
-
Also Thomas, other's not attacked but seeing things for how they could be for themselves don't want to come forth because they don't want to be the next target. Phoenix
-
Hey "Thomas" - Even you aren't posting as your online name. Phoenix
-
Also Thomas, other's not attacked but seeing things for how they could be for themselves don't want to come forth because they don't want to be the next target. Phoenix
Thankyou Phoenix.
I understand that. That is exactly my point. :!: That is why I believe they must come forward, and now, while it's being discussed in detail. And because you are here, and because you started this thread to bring about change. If it is all true, as you say it is, then they, this scared group are actually doing this board harm by hiding their truths and only secretly communicating their fears with you.
They are responsible for allowing this evil CG to remain on this board and are hiding behind you. Happily observing you fighting their fight, and doing nothing to assist you to bring about the needed cleansing.
If they , this scared group who feel they'll be targeted next, don't want to stand up for themselves now, and for healthy change, then they really can't complain in the future about CG, can they? And all of this will have been futile.
To the foolish, frightened, timid group hiding behind Phoenix and her loyalty and courage. Speak up. Identify yourselves and tell your stories of how CG targeted you.
And then stick together once you do. CG won't be able to get at you then. Vote with your names. You should get behind Phoenix, visibly, to rid this board of CG if she frightens you that much. You should present your evidence and bring CG to full account for how you have seen her hurt yourself or others. Instead, you are hiding and playing 'guests' and enjoying observing Phoenix doing all your 'registered member' fighting for you. That is useless. The board will be behind you if you speak up, I'm sure.
Thomas
-
oh, for crying out loud... could someone please have the balls to put an end to this ***ing nonsense & the abusive volleys & just stop this damn thread!!! I see people who are already wounded N-survivors being whacked right & left. Just STOP IT!
-
There's a difference, phoenix, between seeing someone 'as if' they are some bad person from your past and deciding that they ARE a bad person.
There's a difference between 'wondering' if someone is being harmful and declaring evil intent which undermines friendship and trust between other people.
To my mind, undermining trust between others is evil in itself but then, I know that I think that cos my Nmother had a policy of undermining my friendships because she wanted all of me for herself for ever. So I'm inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt that you've not got the same intentions as my mother.
I, too, would like to understand what's really gone on here - but all the time, phoenix, you say either you've said it before or you won't say it. Please don't condemn people when you don't know them at all.
There is a lot of spiteful troublemaking on this board, phoenix, that makes it difficult to make sense of things. Whenever there's a sense of reaching some sensible place, someone just needs to stir it up again and undermine trust and send people scattering for the safety of their caves. Sad for them and sad for all of us.
But also remember that everybody is both good and bad, mean and kind, confused and rational. You can't pick on one piece of behaviour and colour the person as a whole with it. People are complex, interesting and very rarely evil. It's only our incapacity to handle their behaviour that makes them evil at all.
R
-
Agreed. I see classic school yard Bullies visinting a board where they know there are weak ones. It takes a really demented Bully to pick on those who are known to be weak. Bullies, shape up or ship out. This is not the Bully Board.
-
The problem is that we can't get rid of the bullies from our lives.
Bullies are frightened people. There are lots of frightened people around and lots of bullies.
It's up to us to find ways of handling the bullies - reaching out and understanding their fear perhaps. Whacking them back, perhaps. :lol:
There must be lots of ways to do it - perhaps each situation requires us to be inventive and creative. Perhaps it's a simple as ignoring them, finding the people who make us feel good, giving up our sense of righteous indignation (how 'dare' they do that to me) and forgiving (but NOT lying down for them - oh no - the forgiveness just allows us to move on and leave THEM behind).
But, ultimately, do we know who the bullies are? The bullies turn us into bullies. So where does it start? Who's the real bully? If you look at it closely, it's very very fuzzy ground.
My mother is a terrible bully - but only when I let her pull my strings. And I only let her pull my strings when I'm not aware of what she's doing. But she's got me so well wound up that I jump before she pulls the strings. And fight her before she's even got round to setting me up. And then I find myself doing that in 'real life', too.
So checking out where reality lies is our first task and then finding what pulls our strings without us even realising it...???
R
-
R -
you have some valid points, but this is not the Board to work out those issues with bullies. We have come here for the other issues as the title says. Stirring up anger and frustration in us is not the purpose of this Board. Anger with confrontation belong elsewhere. Defending ourselves constantly is not healthy growht. Good Bye Bullies. - you are not welcome here.
-
Hi Everyone:R -
R: A lot of what you wrote makes so much sence to me. But I also think Guest makes it even clearer for me.
"Defending ourselves constantly is not healthy growht. Good Bye Bullies. - you are not welcome here."
S
-
There must be lots of ways to do it - perhaps each situation requires us to be inventive and creative. Perhaps it's a simple as ignoring them, finding the people who make us feel good, giving up our sense of righteous indignation (how 'dare' they do that to me) and forgiving (but NOT lying down for them - oh no - the forgiveness just allows us to move on and leave THEM behind).
But, ultimately, do we know who the bullies are? The bullies turn us into bullies. So where does it start? Who's the real bully? If you look at it closely, it's very very fuzzy ground.
R, I just wanted to come in and say this is very well put. Very good point about the cyclical part of bullying. :idea: It's so good to read you again :D (no pressure though :wink: ((R)) ).
They are responsible for allowing this evil CG to remain on this board and are hiding behind you. Happily observing you fighting their fight, and doing nothing to assist you to bring about the needed cleansing.
If they , this scared group who feel they'll be targeted next, don't want to stand up for themselves now, and for healthy change, then they really can't complain in the future about CG, can they? And all of this will have been futile.
To the foolish, frightened, timid group hiding behind Phoenix and her loyalty and courage. Speak up. Identify yourselves and tell your stories of how CG targeted you.
Thomas, can you step back and read this again? Is there another way you could ask people to support Pheonix that would not involve insulting them and, well, threatening them? I think you have an incredibly valid point about supporting arguments with facts, and I agree that much of what has been said so far has been expressed in ambiguous emotional ways. I also think that by getting to the facts, clarity may be achieved - and therefore resolution.
But if Pheonix drops it and no one speaks up about CG in support of her, that doesn't necessarily mean the topic has to be closed and those who didn't speak up failed. Maybe it just means that people don't feel comfortable now. Maybe it just means that there may not be resolution for this now. Maybe everyone needs a break and some space. Maybe it'll never come up again, but if it does, maybe we'll all be in a better place to be able to talk about it without being harsh with each other. Can you let it go for a little while? It doesn't have to be forever, and it doesn't mean anyone is giving up or that all of this will have been futile. It just means that perhaps this is as far as we can go right now.
this is not the Board to work out those issues with bullies. We have come here for the other issues as the title says. Stirring up anger and frustration in us is not the purpose of this Board. Anger with confrontation belong elsewhere.
I completely agree with this, Guest. But can I add that I also think that given our backgrounds there's a lot of unintentional button pushing here? I do think this is a good place for talking about and discovering our buttons as well as finding healthier ways of handling ourselves when they are pushed. And maybe in doing so (talking, not insulting and lashing out, but talking), some of us who are unintentionally pushing buttons can discover this about themselves, learn to stop, and move on to healthier relationships in their lives out in the real world.
Wildflower
-
This is the ideal place to work out these issues - finding our VOICE and not letting others take it away. This is just a micricosm of real life. Each and every one of us bring our real lives onto this board. Haven't you worked that out yet?
And you missed my point - how do you define the bullies when the bullies are those who have been bullied. Read some other threads and you'll see just how honest some people are being about coping iwth the Ns in their life. It turns us all into bullies.
For example, I don't know who you are talking about when you refer to bullies - in the situation of CG and phoenix, it could be either, depending on your point of view or where you came into the argument. Or it could be the other nameless guests. Who defines the bullies and the bullied?
In fact, guest, I will take you to task and say that I experience your post as bullying to me!!! The way you expressed your different opinion was not supportive or friendly and it affected me.
R
-
Thomas is now the one keeping the pot stirred, and the thread going when it might have died out already. It would be better for everyone if he privately contacts Phoenix if he wishes to play analyst.
Not everyone wants to see this continuing, even the ones who have been on the receiving end of CG/Portia's nice-nasty tongue. Posting incidences would drag this mess out forever. I see no good reason in everyone prolonging this. How is this healthy for anyone?
I chose a long time ago not to even visit Ramble. Maybe it is time for a few other people to make that same decision. You just can't change people, so you have to ignore the ones that annoy you. It is easy to ignore people here....just don't read their posts. And those who keep stirring the pot of discontent... just stop. That being said, I won't be visiting negative threads again. There is no value. If I want some negativity, I will go visit the N in my life.
-
Hello phoenix - I was about to post this when I noticed that guest had already leapt in to disagree disagreeably with my previous post - so I stopped a while to post back. I was still in a quiet, agreeable mood when I wrote the following. :-) Sorry I let myself be sidetracked. ;-)
Hi phoenix - I've been reading more of your old posts and I see what you tried to explain to Portia and CG's reply and I wonder how two such rational posts could have escalated to here. You expressed concern and wanted to help.
But then I noticed one guest making a number of mean posts immediately afterwards. Neither CG nor phoenix. From past experience I'd say that's one person - I used to call that person Tweedledum and Tweedledee - always one mean post followed by a supporting confirming post. Very JPN!! ;-) What spite, what resentment, what meanness. Now that's bullying - but no doubt there's an inner pain, a reason why. Tis just a pity they don't come out and deal with their issues properly on the board One day they might find the courage instead of poisoning relationships between other people.
'They' have been around a long time, being mean and disrupting and expressing lots of venom, hiding behind anonymity.
Oh well, everybody needs to release a little venom every now and then. Perhaps they should post as 'we just need to be spiteful and spread a little dissent cos we feel so powerless to get any attention any other way' and then we'd know. But then I suppose we'd just ignore them. And I'm just wondering if that's what upset the applecart so much.
I'd say to them that there ARE better ways of getting attention and receiving support. Trouble is, you have to take your courage in both hands. And that's what's so darn difficult sometimes.
Anyway, phoenix - you know who I am and I hope that you are doing OK.
R
-
I take back what I said about this being a research project for a psych dissertation -- I think it's a developing sitcom pilot -- call it "Cyber Mob Rule." While I was joking before, I am quite certain now that if Rodney King knew how to get on the internet, he would be here with us.
While I find you a Doubting Thomas, I am going to respond to your first post. Yes, I said that if Phoenix says she was being picked on, then I believe her. What difference does it make what I think anyhow? As far as I can tell, she never comes in here hiding behind a guest name or a penned guest name or any other form of camo. She has the kahoonas to sign her name and speak her peace. She zeroes in on her point and is not wishy-washy. What good is your opinion if you are afraid someone will know it is your's? That is what I meant. Instead of seeing her as the leader of a witch hunt, I see her as reaching the end of her rope and needing to expose wrongdoings she feels were directed at her. That's how I feel about the NQueenmother, if I could pay for it, I would have the terror she wreaked on me broadcast to the whole world. I don't have anything against CG -- I don't even know anything about her, she never signed in until recently -- I am only talking about Phoenix and if she wants to talk about things that happened to her, I don't see anything wrong with it. It's her choice -- don't read it if it offends you. She says she tried other ways, and this apparently is very important to her.
There are a whole lot of postings flying back and forth here (and not just recently) that are from the same person -- that's my opinion and I'm stickin' with it. Some of those we said goodbye to in the past have only changed the color of their ink and switched masks. I find that creepy -- life is too short for deceit. It's more than catty little girl school yard play -- it's twisted.
There's so much important stuff legitimates have posted here, it would take years to absorb it all and it is invaluable. Thank you, thank you very much. I hope all the bad guys have left the building :wink:
-
{{{{Wildflower}}}} Tender thoughts.
Just read your post. I've seen some of your other recent posts, too. High five to you. Lovely thoughts, lovely posts. Really centred, thoughtful, courageous.
We're all moving on, aren't we.
I dare to expose myself; dare to be visibly vulnerable. Thought you'd never see that, eh??? Carapace? Never heard of it. LOL (Doesn't mean I'm a walkover, tho!! :wink: )
R
-
Sorry Somebody.....I don't feel kindly towards a woman who is still married to and living with the man who abused her daughter and pushing an agenda.
I wonder why any female would stay with a pedophile husband, especially one that has abused her very own daughter. Somebody-Solace even stated in an earlier post that she believed her daughter. What is this saying to a traumatized daughter when the mother won't even throw the sorry bastard out?
The excuse of "it was a one time mistake, he has changed", is a load of crap. Pedophiles never, ever lose their desire for children, no matter how much anyone would like to believe that. They carry those obscene desires until they die. They are predators. Protect your children.
She also said she felt she needed to stay to "control him" so he wouldn't do it again to other children. As if that is possble.
-
Hello Guest:
I'm wondering why you're feeling the need to bring this up?
I said that my husband has a better chance of not re-offending with me monitoring him. The more people monitoring him, the better, don't you think? He told what he did to a lot of people and they too will, I'm sure, keep an eye on open too.
Ultimately, he controls his own behaviour, just like the rest of us. Ultimately he did control his own behaviour. I've stated on this board this point that we are the ones responsible and in control of our own behaviour but maybe you didn't read that? That's ok.
Do you have an agenda? That's accusatory almost or is it? Maybe you have a need to hurt me? Do you? Because it feels like that to me but maybe I'm missing how you are just trying to help, somehow. By talking about me, rather than to me though, it doesn't appear that way. Maybe you'll decide to see that, maybe not. I hope you do.
S
-
Hello Guest:
I'm wondering why you're feeling the need to bring this up?
I said that my husband has a better chance of not re-offending with me monitoring him. The more people monitoring him, the better, don't you think? He told what he did to a lot of people and they too will, I'm sure, keep an eye on open too.
Ultimately, he controls his own behaviour, just like the rest of us. Ultimately he did control his own behaviour. I've stated on this board this point that we are the ones responsible and in control of our own behaviour but maybe you didn't read that? That's ok.
Do you have an agenda? That's accusatory almost or is it? Maybe you have a need to hurt me? Do you? Because it feels like that to me but maybe I'm missing how you are just trying to help, somehow. By talking about me, rather than to me though, it doesn't appear that way. Maybe you'll decide to see that, maybe not. I hope you do.
S
You have posted here a glaring contradiction, I wonder that you don't see it.
-
Here's what I see Guest:
People have expressed the desire for all of this circular stuff to stop, including me.
If you do wish to respectfully discuss something with me, then please, pm me and we'll talk.
There's no need to go through and rehash my story or my words or anything to upset the good people or harm me here any further, is there?
And your bringing this up here is harming me and may very well be upsetting other people.
So please understand that I will not be responding to any more of your stuff or mine, on this thread.
And please, if you wish to discuss my stuff with me, then pm me and I'll be glad to try my best to understand and be honest, if I feel comfortable doing that.
I truly do hope you hear me because I'm trying so hard to hear you but all I hear is what seems like a desire to demean and that is getting no one anywhere.
But, at least you are addressing me rather than about me, which I see as something very positive and I thank you for that. Now please, leave this thread be and pm your concerns to me personally.
Thankyou
S
-
Here's what I see Guest:
People have expressed the desire for all of this circular stuff to stop, including me.
If you do wish to respectfully discuss something with me, then please, pm me and we'll talk.
There's no need to go through and rehash my story or my words or anything to upset the good people or harm me here any further, is there?
And your bringing this up here is harming me and may very well be upsetting other people.
So please understand that I will not be responding to any more of your stuff or mine, on this thread.
And please, if you wish to discuss my stuff with me, then pm me and I'll be glad to try my best to understand and be honest, if I feel comfortable doing that.
I truly do hope you hear me because I'm trying so hard to hear you but all I hear is what seems like a desire to demean and that is getting no one anywhere.
But, at least you are addressing me rather than about me, which I see as something very positive and I thank you for that. Now please, leave this thread be and pm your concerns to me personally.
Thankyou
S
More word salad and telling people what to do.
-
S, I have noticed that sometimes you are nice, and sometimes you are not so nice. You keep flipping back and forth. What are you looking for, here, I ask, trying to help you find some peace, here and in the other part of your liife back in the real world?
A member posing as a guest, for obvious reasons.
-
She also said she felt she needed to stay to "control him" so he wouldn't do it again to other children.
You cannot control someone's thoughts and desires.
Solace,
Ultimately, he controls his own behaviour, just like the rest of us. Ultimately he did control his own behaviour
You are right, everyone has to be accountable for their own behavior. Speaking in generalities, once a pedophile loses that control, crosses the line and abuses, he will find it easier to pass those boundries next time. That is why often times we find that when a pedophile is apprehended, there are multiple victims. The older the offender, the list of victims becomes longer.
Solace, you have a heavy burden to bear. It is very hard to police someone 24/7. With a vigilant wife at his side, a pedophile may be less likely to offend, as there may be less opportunity. Too many wives turn a blind eye. I'm glad you are not. However, they are a wily breed, often plotting and planning their next conquest to great end. Be aware of that, and don't get complacent after a while.
I do have one piece of advice for you, which I hope will take, or maybe already have. Don't let your H be on the internet. If he is, put some spyware on it.
I did not write this to hurt you in any way, as I think you have been hurt enough.
-
Why the hell are you picking on Solace now??? They are very mean words - spiteful words that are quoted and used. You are trying to pick a fight. Solace won't fight you - are you trying to push her til she will?? She prides herself, I suspect, on not responding to people picking on her. What good are you doing?
She said her husband is not a paedophile and that he did not molest anybody. You and I know nothing of the situation other than what she has posted - you pick and choose which of her words you believe - see a one-sided situation, don't allow for confusion.
Accept her words. Don't use mean words as weapons. It's obvious you are trying to hurt her. Shame on you.
Ah - did things start to calm down in this thread? Were kind words spoken? Is that the problem?
Stir, stir - hubble, bubble, toil and trouble!!!
-
Why the hell are you picking on Solace now??? They are very mean words - spiteful words that are quoted and used. You are trying to pick a fight. Solace won't fight you - are you trying to push her til she will?? She prides herself, I suspect, on not responding to people picking on her. What good are you doing?
She said her husband is not a paedophile and that he did not molest anybody. You and I know nothing of the situation other than what she has posted - you pick and choose which of her words you believe - see a one-sided situation, don't allow for confusion.
Accept her words. Don't use mean words as weapons. It's obvious you are trying to hurt her. Shame on you.
Ah - did things start to calm down in this thread? Were kind words spoken? Is that the problem?
Stir, stir - hubble, bubble, toil and trouble!!!
Sometimes the truth hurts.
-
Some think she should be on a board that will help her get help for the positon she is in, the mother of children, while also enabling her sick husband, and keeping him in the house with her and her children. This is not that board. Think of it as enccouragement to find a board where she belongs. She clearly needs help, but not the help we can provide for her, here. Want us to help her find one, Other Guest? Think of this as positive input. Some of us have been molested, and it is hard to be sympathetic, here. Another board might be the answer. She would be welcomed with open arms and that is what she needs.
S, when you read this, please give it some thought. You need to be on a site where you are among other wives who are married to molesters. Some of us grew up in families like yours, and look where it got us - a lifetime of pain, pain that could have been prevented. How can we feel comfortable with you here in the group? Think of your children. Take them away from him. Stop the cycle. Find a support group for woment like you, and they will help you, where we cannot.
-
This board has always had two main users -
i) children of parents who are narcissistic
ii) women (and men!) who have partners who are narcissistic
Supposing sudddenly the people with narcissistic partners outnumber the people with narcissistic parents.
At that point do they get to 'out' the latter for pressing their parental guilt buttons and/or for whinging all the time about how hard done by they've been by their parents???
Pots, kettles and all that.
The voiceless aren't just those who are silent, the voiceless are also those who haven't found their true voice. And it's the N way to find a voice at the expense of others.
Having said that, I hold no candle for the way Solace is communicating here.
-
Guest wrote:
"Why the hell are you picking on Solace now??? They are very mean words - spiteful words that are quoted and used. You are trying to pick a fight. Solace won't fight you - are you trying to push her til she will?? She prides herself, I suspect, on not responding to people picking on her. What good are you doing?
She said her husband is not a paedophile and that he did not molest anybody. You and I know nothing of the situation other than what she has posted - you pick and choose which of her words you believe - see a one-sided situation, don't allow for confusion.
Accept her words. Don't use mean words as weapons. It's obvious you are trying to hurt her. Shame on you.
Ah - did things start to calm down in this thread? Were kind words spoken? Is that the problem? "
Thankyou for your support. I'm starting to believe what is said that someone will always protect you here, even me. I see some other kind words in others posts too and I see misinformation being repeated. There are some things I've written that may have been missed in other posts.
My children don't live with me. One is an adult. I was appart from my husband for years and I never stopped nurturing my children. My kids and I have close relationships and our family is healing. My daughter says quite opposite things to the things you seem to think she must feel but I don't want to minimize your feelings. It does feel to me like some are picking and choosing what to believe or allowing imagination or their own experience to get into my situation and somehow become real. It's hard for you too, if you haven't read everything I've posted and I understand that. You don't have all the information and I keep adding bits but they must either be missed or omitted or not believed. I don't feel comfortable talking about it but it seems necessary. It takes all of my courage to speak here because I feel battered sometimes. There are no groups for the women you speak of.
To some who've had experience with molestation--your experience is different than what happened in my family. I know you have suffered but please don't make me suffer any more because of what you might be associating with me.
If I think about robbing a bank and I offer to rob a bank, does that make me a bank robber? If I stop myself from robbing the bank and then later admit that I thought about robbing the bank and offered to rob a bank, does that make me a bank robber? If I'm truly interested in making sure that I never, ever, rob a bank, then I stand up and say that I thought about robbing a bank, I offered to rob a bank, I stopped myself from robbing the bank, and now I admit that I did those things. I've never thought of robbing a bank since then and I'm not thinking of robbing any banks and it's been terribly hard to admit that I did what I did and I want you to know this so that you can talk about it with me and remind me about that time I thought about robbing the bank and I can feel comfortable talking about it with you and if I ever think of robbing a bank again, then I will feel safe enough to tell you and you can help me get help so I won't ever offer to rob a bank. I haven't even considered robbing a bank since then but punish me good so I won't forget that time and that punishment will be another deterrent. As a matter of fact, punish me as if I robbed a bank and used a gun and kidnapped a teller and stole a whole lot of money. Punish me and punish me punish me, over and over because I deserve it because I thought about robbing a bank and I offered to rob a bank. Punish me but don't punish my wife or her children because everything is all my fault. Everybody else's reaction is my fault and everybody else's behaviour is my fault and every thing that is wrong with everything is all my fault. I won't ever offer to rob a bank again, I know it. I knew it was wrong and I still know it and will punish myself for it forever and I want to somehow make up for everything that's happened and everyone I've hurt. I will take all responsibility for everything and I will talk to you about this because I never intend to think about robbing banks again but I want to be sure I have a safe place to talk about robbing banks in case that thought ever pops into my mind again. I know I'm not a bank robber and the tests and assessors say I'm not a bank robber but I did think about robbing a bank and offer to rob a bank and I won't ever deny that or let my responsibility to myself and those around me go to the wayside.
S
-
Offering to do something sexual to a child is not the same thing as thinking about robbing a bank.
-
If there's no difference between thinking about something and 'doing' something then an awful lot of guest poster on this forum must be dead by now!!!
:wink:
-
If there's no difference between thinking about something and 'doing' something then an awful lot of guest poster on this forum must be dead by now!!!
:wink:
Rapid response : 10/10 Accuracy 10/10 :wink:
-
You can think about robbing a bank, and even tell others about it. But, if you do not follow through, you have not committed a single crime.
Once you offer or ask for sex from a minor, you have broken the law. Why do you think they set up these internet stings? Once the guy shows up for sex, he is immediately arrested. He is filed on and has to register as a sex offender. Just because he didn't get a chance to follow through does not mean he is innocent.
[/quote]
-
If there's no difference between thinking about something and 'doing' something then an awful lot of guest poster on this forum must be dead by now!!!
:wink:
Rapid response : 10/10 Accuracy 10/10 :wink:
An offer to another person (in this situation, specifically, a child), is an overt act.
It is not the same thing as "thinking" about doing something, and thinking about robbing a bank is no where near the same thing as thinking about doing something sexual to a child and then taking the overt step to "offer" that sexual service to the child.
-
You can think about robbing a bank, and even tell others about it. But, if you do not follow through, you have not committed a single crime.
Once you offer or ask for sex from a minor, you have broken the law. Why do you think they set up these internet stings? Once the guy shows up for sex, he is immediately arrested. He is filed on and has to register as a sex offender. Just because he didn't get a chance to follow through does not mean he is innocent.
[/quote]
Exactly. One is an overt act, a crime, the other is not.
-
My husband committed a crime is correct.
He is not a pedophile is also correct (according to what I've been told, seen documented etc by those who know and test and try to help correct the problem). His behaviour since is the biggest indicator.
Robbing a bank is definately entirely a different crime. I'm trying to help you see that he did also rob a bank. He robbed my bank. My emotional bank. And that my sister robbed my bank too. And there is only sooo much money in it. I'm also asking if you want to rob my bank too???? I don't believe you do. Nor do I want to rob yours.
I want to deal with me. With my bank. I need your help. Not in correcting what he did to rob it because he is doing his best about that and I feel alright about the way things are going. But to help me sort out and somehow live with the robbery my sister committed. And she did do that. It's my feeling. I am not a criminal. I am not the abuser. I am a victim of the first crime and part of the correction, and I want to help myself correct the second one because the person who did that is not taking responsibility for her behaviour. It may never happen.
No insult to anyone. No harm to anyone meant. Does having n traits make one an n? Does living with an n make one an n? Or do those things have an effect that can be dealt with and improved? That's why I'm here. I need help and information. I need support. I need kind words to help me deal with the hurt that's bothering me. I don't need to relive the hurts I've been through. Or redeal with those. I'm trying hard to just be honest and to be considerate. I do care about you. All of you. All of you have had hurts too and need support and information too, right?
I better not spend any more time on here.
S
-
Thomas is now the one keeping the pot stirred, and the thread going when it might have died out already. It would be
better for everyone if he privately contacts Phoenix if he wishes to play analyst.
Yep! I couldn't agree more! He's all excited about what he calls his exceptional "T" skills on a Myers-Briggs test score. So, now he's Mr. armchair "expert" {nooooot!!!}. The boy needs to sit his butt in university for a few years and keep quiet with the analysing {say whatever else you want} until finals are done and the degree is on the wall.
Thomas writes:
I will dare to speak up here. Why do you feel to silence and riducule my right.
I'm not telling you not to write-- I'd never do that. Just to quit the annoying know-it-all analysing and superhero syndrome.
And as far as ridcule... well... how to put it delicately.... Like out of the mouth of a babe standing over a broken ming vase-- "It was already like that when I got here"!
Thomas writes:What I am doing is attempting to assist the board and you in particular.
Well now, you see, that's kind of what I mean.
You appointed yourself to come in and save the world using your magical powers and smarts above all others here? Some kindly advice would be to stick to your day job because things are looking a quite a mess and instead of saving, you just got dragged into it all! Just yet another voice of turmoil. :(
And I know you were depending on them T skills to shine through but you pegged me more than just a little wrong, too. You have no idea who you're talking with.
Ah-the shame of it--you had such high aspirations. But I learned something here after all. I think I know what T skills stand for now! Thanks! :wink:
-
Quote:
Thomas is now the one keeping the pot stirred, and the thread going when it might have died out already. It would be
better for everyone if he privately contacts Phoenix if he wishes to play analyst.
Yep! I couldn't agree more! He's all excited about what he calls his exceptional "T" skills on a Myers-Briggs test score. So, now he's Mr. armchair "expert" {nooooot!!!}. The boy needs to sit his butt in university for a few years and keep quiet with the analysing {say whatever else you want} until finals are done and the degree is on the wall.
Quote:
Thomas writes:
I will dare to speak up here. Why do you feel to silence and riducule my right.
I'm not telling you not to write-- I'd never do that. Just to quit the annoying know-it-all analysing and superhero syndrome.
And as far as ridcule... well... how to put it delicately.... Like out of the mouth of a babe standing over a broken ming vase-- "It was already like that when I got here"!
Quote:
Thomas writes:What I am doing is attempting to assist the board and you in particular.
Well now, you see, that's kind of what I mean.
You appointed yourself to come in and save the world using your magical powers and smarts above all others here? Some kindly advice would be to stick to your day job because things are looking a quite a mess and instead of saving, you just got dragged into it all! Just yet another voice of turmoil.
And I know you were depending on them T skills to shine through but you pegged me more than just a little wrong, too. You have no idea who you're talking with.
Ah-the shame of it--you had such high aspirations. But I learned something here after all. I think I know what T skills stand for now! Thanks!
LMAO :lol: Well put Guest.
-
Quote:
Thomas is now the one keeping the pot stirred, and the thread going when it might have died out already. It would be
better for everyone if he privately contacts Phoenix if he wishes to play analyst.
Yep! I couldn't agree more! He's all excited about what he calls his exceptional "T" skills on a Myers-Briggs test score. So, now he's Mr. armchair "expert" {nooooot!!!}. The boy needs to sit his butt in university for a few years and keep quiet with the analysing {say whatever else you want} until finals are done and the degree is on the wall.
Quote:
Thomas writes:
I will dare to speak up here. Why do you feel to silence and riducule my right.
I'm not telling you not to write-- I'd never do that. Just to quit the annoying know-it-all analysing and superhero syndrome.
And as far as ridcule... well... how to put it delicately.... Like out of the mouth of a babe standing over a broken ming vase-- "It was already like that when I got here"!
Quote:
Thomas writes:What I am doing is attempting to assist the board and you in particular.
Well now, you see, that's kind of what I mean.
You appointed yourself to come in and save the world using your magical powers and smarts above all others here? Some kindly advice would be to stick to your day job because things are looking a quite a mess and instead of saving, you just got dragged into it all! Just yet another voice of turmoil.
And I know you were depending on them T skills to shine through but you pegged me more than just a little wrong, too. You have no idea who you're talking with.
Ah-the shame of it--you had such high aspirations. But I learned something here after all. I think I know what T skills stand for now! Thanks!
LMAO :lol: Well put Guest.
:wink: tweedledee and tweeledum. Are you at it again?
-
This is from over at "Phoenix Stays", a post by Blue Topaz. I am going to use her words, as they express best where I am at.
BT- Personally, I'd probably stop responding (no matter what was written about me) when I'd felt I'd said all I'd had to on all levels about the situation and my feelings, and any other messages I did would be repetitive...I think it becomes purely reactive & defensive at the repetitive point, which I know would be tapping into my inner "stuff" and wearing on me. .
If I haven't replied to you, I read your every word. Well except for T's 3X repetion. Once was plenty.
Thank you, all. Phoenix