Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: bearwithme on April 14, 2010, 01:25:51 PM
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Without going into a novel description of what happened this past Sunday night, I just want to say that I sort have been LC and my NM came for a visit and was here for about 10 days so that she could see my daughter (her only granddaughter) and I allowed her to spend Easter with us etc. I'm her only daughter and my brother is NC.
Well, I snapped. I snapped the night before she left and threw her out of our house. I tossed her luggage out onto our front lawn and threw her clothes, phone and belongings out the front door and screamed at her to leave me and us along. I called her every name in the book. I was white with rage and anger. I nearly blacked out. She shoved me like she used to when I was a child whenever I tried to stick up for myself. I shoved her back this time. I physically turned her body around and pushed her out my door. Although she refused to leave until the next day, I left in my car leaving my husband and daughter in our bedroom. They heard everything and were shocked.
I have never felt that much anger. I lost it. I've never wanted to physically throw someone out my door like that. She was in my face demeaning me. She did not understand my anger and played the victim.
All my life I was the sweet, passive child. I was the pillar of strength for my mom. That was my job. I was the one bullied in school. I couldn't stick up for myself.
When I left in my car to calm down I realized that I felt good. I realized that there was a connection with my anger and the exact source of my anger. I got to finally be angry and express that anger at the source. I made a connection that opened up vessels in my brain which unclogged arteries where my anger is focused and where it should be expressed appropriately.
The next day my husband told me that my NM cornered him when I was on my "cooling off" drive down the street. She cornered him and said that she wasn't the bad guy and that I had problems. She told him that my therapy was a waste of money because this is what I'm showing everybody and what it's come to. NM told him that I deserved my childhood pain because I "was no angel." She told him that she raged on me because I deserved it. I could go on and on but I need to stop here.
I can't sleep or eat. I am now depressed. I went to a therapist yesterday on an emergency basis and he did help me keep it together.
I'm in crisis right now and I need to know if any of you have a quick remedy for depression or these feelings of guilt and shame (sort of) I just can't express my anger hangover right now and hoping that someone can understand me.
I'm thankful for this board.
Bear
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The only thing I can do is give you a standing ovation for standing up to your NM. Wow, I am really impressed and I wish I would finally have the guts to do what you did. Your NM had it coming for years and she deserves what you did. Try to stick to the positive feelings you had about this. What your mother said afterwards is to be expected from a freaking narcissist.
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I'm so sorry you are depressed because it did my heart a big load of good to hear what you did to her. If I had been there, I would have helped. I hope you are not sad about what you did, but instead for what might have been and now never will. Perhaps you are depressed because you have a crossed a point of no return? If you are lucky, she will get the message but based on what she said to your hubby -- she was in denial before you left the house. I'm still glad you did it and it made me smile! I hope you feel better soon! You're just doing your part to stamp out mean mommies everywhere!
Love, Biddy
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Honey I finally blew up at my Nmother one time and raged at her.
She was in her NINETIES.
I was so angry I threatened to leave her, ordered her to get on the phone and turn my brother back around (long story, but she'd set me up to be intimidated by him again because she wasn't getting the supreme amount of attention she was demanding from me at that moment)...and just plain blew my stack.
I told her it was a mistake to move in with her and "You're so manipulative!"
That may not sound as "shocking" as namecalling but for her lifetime, no one had ever yelled at her like that or spoken it so plainly.
I felt sick afterward. There was the relief of the truth, but I know exactly what you mean by an anger hangover.
I believe you must focus really hard on compassion for yourself, forgiving yourself, and undertanding that people can take being bullied, either physically or mentally, for only so long, before they blow.
You blew. If you were Mother Theresa you might not have.
Welcome to the club. Focus on forgiving yourself. You be be sorry you lost control, so you can forgive yourself for that too. If you want to write her a note that addresses that and that only, you can.
I apologized to my mother for my outburst (but not for my feelings). That was crucial. And we went on. (And she stabbed me in the back two years later with a new surprise will that's made my life very difficult.) But anyway, what happened happened...and I found I can live with it.
But you don't have to accept her view of you.
love,
Hops
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Lucky, Biddy, and Hoppy:
I so needed that feedback. This is so difficult. This is the most difficult thing I've ever had to deal with. The feelings of depression are unexpected as I was really at ease the last two days but somehow this morning, I felt like I woke up under an 800 pound boulder. I don't want to go back feeling sorry for her and feeling like I did something so bad and that she's right: that I'm a bad daughter. I don't want to be a daughter anymore, I want to be a mother and a wife and a friend.
I'm so down but I know what I did had been coming for 43 years. It took me by surprise and the adrenaline rush actually blinded me.
I apologized to my mother for my outburst (but not for my feelings). That was crucial
The next morning I said my peace. I said that I didn't apologize for my anger but I owed my family an huge apology, my husband and daughter, and that they were THE ONLY ones who needed to be apologized to, not her.
I said some awful things to her and wished her ill will. I can't believe that sort of stuff came of me but it did. I scared my daughter and I am so sorry for that--the feeling is so horrible.
The next morning she stated that I "beat her" and that she has bruises and scars already. She said that I beat her up and that she was going to tell someone about it. I did "manhandle" her and was very firm in my grip holding her back and away, but I did not take a swing at her like she said. My only focus was to throw her things out of my house--symbolically like I was throwing her out of my life once and for all.
Do you think my depressed feelings are because I could have taken the highroad and said, "hey, that's just mom, that's just the way she is...I'll let it roll off my back because she's only got one more day of her visit left then she'll be gone." Or "I'm the bigger person here (not physically but mentally) so I will just not let it bother me." I could have been stronger and just told her to never come back and civilly explained my feelings. But I didn't. I feel I failed me family for witnessing something so horrific.
Baddaughter wrote:
Perhaps you are depressed because you have a crossed a point of no return?
This has made me think twice. Maybe the point of no return is that she is dead in my heart? Am I grieving the loss of a mother? To go back is to start over?
I'm so glad you are here. Thank you.
Bear
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Dear (((Bear)),
My heart truly goes out to you.
Ten days with your Nmother, bless your heart.
This isn't about me but I did BLOW UP at my N sister. Years, decades of built up abuse, nice shy little sister, perfect victim.....
It happened in our parents home, my dad was down stairs with my cousin working on putting a floor in. I forgot all about him, that he was there when I lost it.
I screamed at her, Pointing......Pointing my arm and finger at her. I told her "You are sick..You are sick...You are sick!!!!!!!!!!" "You need help!!!"
She looked at me and said, "Why didn't you ever tell me?" I was in shock from her reaction. Did she know deep inside she did need major help? I didn't reply.
Just left and Slammed the door.
The next day I was freaking out. I never spoke like that, I had lost it, I had enough, my body, my mind couldn't take her snarky, belittling remarks anymore.
I felt bad..(cough,,,silly me) .......then called her the next day to apologize, to save anything we had, which was nothing. Her daughter answered and she yelled for her that I was
on the phone. She said, "Tell her I'll call her back." I remember this like it was yesterday. She never called me back.
Well our Christmas party was that night at our parents home. We kept away from eachother, Then went ten years no/little contact. Only contact when it was about our
dying parents.
I wont continue with the story, it would be forever to explain.
Bear I just wanted to share how sad I felt afterwards. But as time went on and she behaved like an N. I knew what I did was not evil. I stood up to evilness, finally.
They drive you to the edge. I read the beginning and was thinking, you go girl, knowing the pain she has inflicted on you and continues to do so.
You are wonderful, your blessed with a beautiful family, embrace that...........don't let her rob you of years of the gifts and future you do have.
If someone were to tell you the exact same scene except it was a voiceless N friend on this board how would you feel towards them? I bet my bottom dollar you would have empathy, understanding of how and why they blew. Please be as kind to yourself as you would be to other N victims.
So sorry for rambaling.
Be kind and gentle to yourself. With warmth and understanding .........seasons xo
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You CAN feel bad about being explosive. For a little while. (Set a timer.)
That's perfectly okay. It's a built-in mechanism to keep us humans mostly behaving ourselves.
But even if you DO feel bad about the outer limits of your explosion, or feel the outer edges of it were a mistake, please don't make the mistake of thinking, I am the mistake.
That's the difference between normal healthy guilt:
I have made a mistake (YOUR definition, not anyone else's) and now I will do what I can (safely for yourself, so maybe with her aware or NOT, given she's an N) to amend it.
And TOXIC SHAME which says:
I am the mistake.
You are NOT a mistake or a "bad daughter". You are someone who just couldn't take it any more. Human.
So now you need your own kindness, most of all. Some healing time. This is okay. You deserve kindness. (Please repeat that to the Bear in the mirror, 10 times aloud. Every morning. I mean it.)
IF you want to address some failure to behave as your own good standards would normally have you behave, irrespective of who she is, you can do that. You can do it with a note to her or in meditation or completely by yourself. You have already begun that with your husband and child.
YOU get to decide how much guilt is enough. (Hint: 24 hours, tops.) And whether a note of amends for some of the action but NOT for the feelings, is or ever would be appropriate. SHE does not get to decide that. It would be about your relationship with yourself, any such thing. And may or may not be worth indicating to her. (I chose to, because my mother was very old and I was her caretaker. And it felt right to tell her I was sorry I yelled and blew up. She accepted it. Got even later, but that's another story. And when I was apologizing for that part of it? That was about ME having a good relationship with ME. I was addressing my own feelings about my own standards of behavior. It was not coerced.)
Big firm boundary. You are you and she is she and no matter what she thinks, you are you and whether you blew up and acted out feelings or not, you are still an adult woman with the right to evaluate and forgive yourself and make your own balance of actions, reflections, visible amends (or not--as you can be sure she won't receive them "cleanly"), LC or NC, etc. You have not lost those rights because you lost your cool.
Ten days? Jeez. You didn't murder her.
Model THAT self-reckoning and self-compassion for your child, not collapse. Share how hard it was to feel yourself so out of control, how you have learned how important it is to know you have a voice and that a child should be saying how she feels about things all the while you're growing up, and that your big huge blowup was an example of what happens when a child doesn't know they are allowed to have their own voice.
What a great lesson. It was very rough and hard but it is not disaster, life is still humming and learning's still happening.
See what I mean? Hope it helps but toss anything that doesn't.
love,
Hops
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Hops:
Toxic Shame? I never thought of it that way. You are right, I am NOT the mistake.
I do need time to heal. I don't know how long it will take and I don't see me having a relationship with her at this point in time. The thought of it turns me inside out.
The guilt and shame can be endless with an N and it's hard to undo 43 years of inflicted shame and guilt, the "if you show any emotion or pain whatsoever, then you are a bad, horrible, weak, selfish person." My explosion just superceded everything and blew open the doors to my closet of pain and out spilled 43 years of frustration and hurt and to no avail. The only thing I'm left with is her allegations that I "beat" her and that I have an anger problem that is causing her pain and suffering. In my opinion, she came between me and my husband and tried to pit him against me. DEAL BREAKER.
So be it.
Your experience with your sister is so much like mine. I'm sorry you had to go through that but you seem to have learned so much and carried on with your life without beating up on yourself. I hope I can do that, too.
Please don't be afraid to ramble. I learn from every story and and every heart that has a story to tell. Because we never got to tell out stories as children and we were ignored and treated as emotionless robots, out comes now the most colorful and educational of any life lesson we can conjure up. I need to hear it and hear it often.
Thank you friend for sharing.
I'm exhausted with depression and just want to sleep but my 2.5 year old does not understand that. I hope she doesn't hate me right now because I'm not myself and she picks up on that. I feel so bad about that.
Bear
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Oh Bear, I'm so sorry!!!! This is all too familiar to me.
I too have a toddler as you might remember from previous postings of mine. And I was the sweet child who helped my mom "keep it together". The last 3 visits my mom has flown out to see me, she left early because the visit turned sour at the end. Usually with me blowing up at her after her berate me, my life and things I care about.
You have every right to react the way you did. It's healthy, and the anger is pointed at the right person. This is your turf, and how dare her demolish you in front of your budding family. As hard as it is to recover from an outburst, know it's a healthy reaction to an impossible situation.
& and your mom trying to sway your husband in her direction when you left the house. My mom did this too.... desparate and sick!! A normal mother would have been upset for upsetting you.... and would have not dug herself deeper trying to triagulate your husband. A normal mother would have backed off and fell silent, and offered support when you cooled off.
Take care of you and your daughter & husband. If your mom is big enough to march into your home and berate you in front of your family, she can take care of herself This hits so close to me Bear..... I know, oh I know..... Just sick!
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Swimmer just said everything I was going to say to you!!!
You apologized to your own family (husband and daughter). That's all you need to do. And this just may be a teaching moment for your daughter. Though she is very young, she is not too young to learn that she is a valuable person who is allowed to express her anger and opinions, just as you have.
Logy
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& also Bear. That's great to apologize etc.... But remember your reaction is to a complicated situation. NM's often poke at us daughters to get a reaction out of us, it is carefully orchestrated. You did the best you could, and excused youself to your husband and daughter. I always pride myself on taking the high road, but life is messy. I think the high road is sticking up for your family, and you are part of that.
You seem to be a very loving mother.... Your mom is probably very jealous. I could go on and on Bear.
Oh yeah.... When I get "down" about this, I too think my 18 month old picks up on it. I get out of the house fast to a play ground and jump into her world. I let her lead me by the hand on an adventure with no limits (except safety of course). The other day she pulled the wagon 1 long block. Her sense of empowerment was energizing, and distracting.
I'm sure you have plenty of fun with your daughter:)). You deserve to be in her precious world, because you make it happen.
You'll snap out of this soon.... In the meantime, take tender care Bear. Best wishes for good sleep, you owe nothing.
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((((((((((((((((((((Bear)))))))))))))))))))))))
The above is a bear hug for Bear.
I was thinking when reading your post that I would never be able to take nm living in my house for 10 days . The cops or guys with straight jackets would have to be called for somebody.
Take care of yourself, Worn
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You are amazing!!
I was the good sweet child, too. I was bullied and never stood up for myself. I have young children. My mother said horrible things about me to my husband. And, YES YES YES I lost it the last time I was in my mother's company and she was abusing me verbally. I can only say that it absolutely was the point of no return, and I have not seen her since. My life is now my own, and I have never regretted the honesty that came out of me that day.
Your feelings were honest. I know in my case, it might have been the first time I was ever honest in expressing my feelings about my mother to my mother. Don't fear the truth, Bear. I am attempting each and every day to acknowledge the truth about my life and do all in my power to make sure the poison stops with me and does not creep into my young ones. Every day (hour) that I am successful, I can smile. And, I can love mysefl and forgive myself for not perfectly getting it right.
Be kind to you. Love the little Bear inside of you. She needs you now.
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Hi Bear,
Years ago I was diagnosed with bi-polar - up moods and down moods. Personally, I think it was just connected to dealing with my demented family - I'd be 'up' to cope with them (like a protective thing, racing round at a hundred miles an hour, always busy, drinking loads, working late and so on) and then I'd crash and get down - basically just worn out and needing to rest. I went NC and the mood problems went away.
I think maybe you blowing up at your mum like that was such a huge emotional surge that your body and mind just need some time now to rest and recover. At times like this I always turn to complementary therapies - homeopathy, acupuncture, flower remedies. I don't know if that's something you can try, but in any case just try to really look after yourself at the minute - walks, yoga, books, music, whatever suits you.
I think you have done exactly the right thing by standing up to her like that. I had a similar blow out with my mum a few years ago. She came to stay for my son's birthday, spent the evening telling me how lovely my ex-boyfriend's new girlfriend was (she knew I was in bits about him) and when that didn't get a reaction started talking about loads of old family stuff that she knew had upset me in the past. Eventually I told her to shut up and she said she was going to bed, which she did, leaving me crying in the kitchen. She got up the next morning and wouldn't speak to me, refused to eat breakfast or have a cup of tea - she wouldn't even drink a cup of water. I asked her if she was going to be like this all day at which point she just went back to the bedroom and started to pack. I lost it big time, screamed and shouted at her, slammed the door shut when she tried to leave and stood in front of it so she couldn't get out, I yelled and swore and really let rip. She just stood there. Eventually I opened the door and screamed at her to leave, then I chased her out onto the street shouting at her as she went. She told everyone she was forced to flee for her own safety, I turned on her for no reason and attacked her and she had to run for her life. I AM SO GLAD I DID IT!!!!!
For me, it was a turning point because it showed her that I wasn't this little kid she could push around and control anymore. I was big enough and strong enough to turn on her and if she pulled any more of her crap she'd get more of the same. I only saw her twice more after that before going NC.
Your mum deserved everything she got - it sounds like it was a long time coming. You don't have to be perfect for your daughter; this was out of character for you so as she gets older she'll understand how much your mum must have hurt you for you to be that angry with her. We've all got our limits and it sounds like you reached yours. Be kind to yourself and I hope you feel better soon xx
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Hi Bear,
I say, so what!
You were angry and rightfully so. Just because she is your mother does not give her the ticket to (mentally abuse you or yours). So you think you lost it? You showed her the door (with some choice words) and? So. Long time coming. Then even more bully of putting her hands and shoving you....Well bear honey...you shoved her out the door...don't let it hit you in the ass.
You didn't do anything wrong. You wanted her out. So would I. I probably would have done the same including leaving myself when it was that engaged (in moment) if she would not.
You did the right thing.
You cooled off. You were in control.
Your a pretty stand up person!!!
Please try not to be depressed over something you lost control or snapped over....I don't think you have.....
I think if your D was older she think your a pretty Stand Up Mom....herself.
Again....Bear.......So you let her have it.....
Long time coming....
Forgive yourself...you had the right to be angry, livid, and you controlled it...You left and coolded off.
We get angry. We are human.
The next day my husband told me that my NM cornered him when I was on my "cooling off" drive down the street. She cornered him and said that she wasn't the bad guy and that I had problems. She told him that my therapy was a waste of money because this is what I'm showing everybody and what it's come to. NM told him that I deserved my childhood pain because I "was no angel." She told him that she raged on me because I deserved it.
That is pretty revealing......She just let him know......Your No Kid Now.....and you took the bull by the horns (as and adult) and she went back to the same crap she used since childhood with you.......
It didn't work.
I'm showing everybody and what it's come to.
So she says....
Yes you are Bear....I'm seeing it.
The board is seeing it.
A strong woman who stood up for herself. You showed her the door and guided her through it.
And she see's it.
She is just using tactic.... and desperate that it didn't work...
Good for you Bear.......
It's ok Bear.
It will pass....cut yourself a break....
((((Bear)))
love
Deb
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Hi Bear,
I say, so what!
You were angry and rightfully so. Just because she is your mother does not give her the ticket to (mentally abuse you or yours). So you think you lost it? You showed her the door (with some choice words) and? So. Long time coming. Then even more bully of putting her hands and shoving you....Well bear honey...you shoved her out the door...don't let it hit you in the ass.
You didn't do anything wrong. You wanted her out. So would I. I probably would have done the same including leaving myself when it was that engaged (in moment) if she would not.
You did the right thing.
You cooled off. You were in control.
Your a pretty stand up person!!!
Please try not to be depressed over something you lost control or snapped over....I don't think you have.....
I think if your D was older she think your a pretty Stand Up Mom....herself.
Again....Bear.......So you let her have it.....
Long time coming....
Forgive yourself...you had the right to be angry, livid, and you controlled it...You left and coolded off.
We get angry. We are human.
I like your "matter of fact" attitude here. I think it's smart of you to think that way and I need to apply this a bit more. Yeah, so what? I'm human for pete's sake! Well, I was never treated like a human as a child with my own feelings so that's where it comes from. If I showed any emotion, especially anger, then I was a selfish, mean, awful, self-centered daughter. I also never learned to forgive myself, only learned to forgive NM. I learned very well how to punish myself for mistakes because she let me know that I was too stupid or too slow to "figure things out on [my] own."
Twoapenny wrote:
I asked her if she was going to be like this all day at which point she just went back to the bedroom and started to pack. I lost it big time, screamed and shouted at her, slammed the door shut when she tried to leave and stood in front of it so she couldn't get out, I yelled and swore and really let rip. She just stood there. Eventually I opened the door and screamed at her to leave, then I chased her out onto the street shouting at her as she went. She told everyone she was forced to flee for her own safety, I turned on her for no reason and attacked her and she had to run for her life. I AM SO GLAD I DID IT!!!!!
Ahhh, I stood up and cheered when I read this!! It is so relieving to know that I'm not the only one who's "lost it." I'm happy you did this too! I love the part where you chased her out onto the street! Wow...that is so like a movie and so honest! I'm just beside myself knowing you did this and you survived and are happy and healthy and moving on so gracefully, etc. Thank you sooooo much for sharing that. I love it!
Butterfly:
Your feelings were honest. I know in my case, it might have been the first time I was ever honest in expressing my feelings about my mother to my mother. Don't fear the truth, Bear. I am attempting each and every day to acknowledge the truth about my life and do all in my power to make sure the poison stops with me and does not creep into my young ones. Every day (hour) that I am successful, I can smile. And, I can love myself and forgive myself for not perfectly getting it right.
You made me cry :( but in a joyful way. I need to smile after each hour I'm away from that crazy monster, yes, I am successful now, too and need to express love for myself as I was only taught how to love NM and never learned to love myself and it's a hard thing to learn after all these years.
The cops or guys with straight jackets would have to be called for somebody.
Worn: that is too funny! Great and true!!
Swimmer: the image of your daughter pulling the wagon for a block is just so profound to me and my eyes welled up. You are much like me and I often jump in the car with my daughter when I feel "tight" and take her to go see the ducks and birds, something in nature always pulls me back to earth.
Logy: thank you for the reminder about apologizing to MY family. My NM is not my family anymore and she doesn't deserve an apology.
Thank you all for being here for me and having the guts to tell your "lost it" stories. It takes a lot of bravery and honesty to share those moments where most feel they may be judged by their actions of thought of as the one with the problem...and we know that is not the case with an N.
Bear
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I just wanted to say that I'm doing much better today than yesterday, thank you.
Out of nowhere, I walked into a Catholic church this morning to be close to God. (Mind you, I practice no religion and I don't go to church) but I wanted to prove that I could be close to God, too. My NM shouted that she is the ONLY one who has God in her life and that she is the ONLY one who is close to God and that she is the ONLY one that is forgiven by God and that she is the ONLY one who knows how God works and that she is the ONLY one who can claim God has taken over her life. She reads the Bible constantly and goes to countless Bible study classes and seminars. She gives all her money to her church and church friends when my brother is claiming BK and I struggle to find a job.
So, I sat down in this church and looked up at this giant wooden cross with a carving of Jesus on it. The sides of the church were floor-to-celing, stained-glass windows of all the Saints and the nativity scene with a baby Jesus. A painting of the last supper and a lit candle in the front and a white cloth laid over a table with what looked like a big Bible on a stand. The church was completely empty and silent with only the creaking of the heavy-beamed ceiling, which was lit up from the sunlight that shined through the giant stained-glass windows. I was alone, but was I.
I sat there for a while and then smirked and said quite sarcastically aloud, "See, I can be close to you, too." I'm glad no one heard me (except for God, that is).
Bear
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Nice to hear today is better Bear:) It warms my heart to hear how you enjoy ducks and birds with your daughter. I bet she just adores you!! A daughter IS a gift.
Thx for sharing Bear, great to hear about your journey. Your strength is inspiring!
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Bear,
BRAVO!!!
I think your tirade on the lawn was wonderful! So some luggage got tossed around, mom heard her behavior adequately defined with a few four letter words, and your family got to see that you are human and can only be pushed so far. Nobody died. We all have a breaking point. We all needed permission to break as children but we never could because we couldn't walk away, drive around the block or get an apartment.
When I was a child I let people walk all over me and to this day my mother ridicules my behavior. Why did I do that? Because I knew how sick I felt whenever she flew into a rage and I knew if I tried to stand up to anyone she would either do the same thing to them (and my battle an excuse for her rage) or do it to me. It was a double bind situation. Either other kids abused me because I was a wimp, my mother abused them and they took it out me later, or she abused me. I had to keep all the rage inside. I've been tempted to throw my mother out with her luggage a few times, but the luggage is mine and I don't want to break it. I got it for graduation and my parents promptly took it and went to Europe. They were too cheap to buy their own.
S
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Sealynx:
I had to keep all the rage inside. I've been tempted to throw my mother out with her luggage a few times, but the luggage is mine and I don't want to break it. I got it for graduation and my parents promptly took it and went to Europe. They were too cheap to buy their own.
Hey, you could always replace your luggage! I'll (and I gather donations from the board) help you with that if need be! $$$$ :D :D :D
Bear.
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LOL...Thanks Bear. Actually Blue is no longer my favorite color. I'll let you know when they hit the lawn :lol:
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I've got word that NM has spread the word to all relatives and other people that "I'm sick" and that "I need help." That I "have anger problems, etc." She is relentless. She is on the God bandwagon and won't stop.
I am so tired. I need sleep and help. This angers me and I'm depressed at the same time. I'm a lot better than before but I want to be better.
Bear
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All I can say is GO BEAR! Wow. What courage and strength to put her in her place. She deserved it, giving all what she did to you. When we stand up to NM, it can make us feel lousy b/c they trained us to be this way..like we're the bad one.
I hope you recover..Wait..You WILL recover. Moms like that are like people who hit us with a dangerous object, and it just takes awhile for us to get back up and running.
She can bs all she want calling you sick and that you need help. We know it's not true.
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thank you NAS. Each hour that passes I try to smile a little more. Although, the depressed/sad feelings are still there and they flow in and out of me quite often. I wonder about that and will take it up with my therapist tomorrow. He is very excited for me to get started on a new road of "recovery" and to organize this mess which I have allowed into my very private life.
You have all been just wonderful on this thread. I can't believe how much support I received and how I have my own cheering section. Hee hee, it feels really good!! :lol: :lol: :lol: 8) 8) 8) I will hang on to this for a long time.
Does anyone here still feel sorry for their NM'S? Does anyone still feel depressed or sad about the "bad" times, i.e., confrontations with their N or full-blown fights with their N?
Is anyone here embarrassed by their actions in any of the flare-ups with their N? Just curious...
Bear
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Feel bad for my actions?? There is always a feeling I'm bad overall. But specifically.... I'm a little embarassed and regretful I didn't speak up more. I just found it was exhausting and distracting to stick up for myself, so I let too much roll off my back. My mother was always ashamed she had a daughter that spoke up, so I learned to gracefully be assertive with most people. I really let my mother have it at certain turning points of my life though.
Anyways.... I NEVER regret my reactions to my mother. She buys all this stuff I'll never need to cover her vile nature. I see a blowout as a maintenance of truth and dignity rather than a blowout. Christianity gives me the strength to know that the truth is the moral standing I can take to find joy.
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Yes, I did regret it. Still do.
But I forgave myself. So it is a regret I accept and I am not disabled by it. What I mean is, I am sorry but I am not ashamed. The difference is "right regret" (for me) and self-loathing (embarrassment = shame).
I was sorry because (and this is easier for me because her form of N was so suppressed into "virtue" that, for example, she never struck me, verbally abused me...she just...drove me crazy with her lack of empathy, her invasiveness, her lecturing and hectoring me until I thought I'd lose my mind, her apparent empathy void, her inability to get outside her own script for even one moment for me, except a couple times--which memories I hoard like gems of healing)...
I was sorry because she was a very old human being. And she was a child, and she had been damaged in a toxic family. And she passed on a legacy she knew nothing about. She still didn't deserve cruelty.
To her, my blowing up and raging was cruel. She was 95. I SCARED her by yelling and storming. She had no defense to this. She was in her 90s. I believe one doesn't emotionally abuse the very old, even in the name of sticking up for oneself. And it must have been an experience of horror for her.
I do not feel good about scaring a person so old who had done her best for me. No matter who she was.
But I do and I mean this truly, also I truly do forgive myself. I understand how I'd been pushed past my limit when she threatened me with the arrival of my brother that night...how manipulative and wrong it was for her to do that. I was furious and rightly so. And I was terrified, because he was a monster to me.
It was a lifetime of fury and fear. Still, my anger wasn't purely righteous. In that moment it was, but my motives with her were not always perfectly Florence Nightingale. I am responsible.
But as I found forgiveness and compassion for her, helpless in her wheelchair and frailty at the hard hard end of her life 14 months after a stroke...I have found it for myself too.
It was when the blaming stopped. I think it can only stop when one is safe, when one has support and love in one's life, and community, and compassion for yourself. Then you can see an N is probably a damaged child, and feel sorrow for them. But in many cases, still, you may need NC forever. And just work through that forgiveness cycle alone if that's what you find you want to do.
It doesn't require subjecting yourself to harm. Ever.
And sometimes it isn't time to forgive the N yet. And sometimes probably never, I'm no judge of when that shift takes place. We all have a right to our own path.
We have to forgive ourselves. I just know it. Otherwise, life is a waste. And I guess if I believe in forgiveness as a principle, I believe it's probably good for it to go beyond myself. I haven't forgiven my brother yet. Dunno when that will happen. But I'm not regretting that. I'm in the position I need to be until he is completely out of my life.
We weren't strong enough to fight back all along the way, our instincts were overpowered by many forces (the Ns and the culture and more). And sometimes, people just freaking snap. I did.
So...the healing first had to be forgiveness of myself. With her, it just came about because I took care of her. I saw her body. I watched her lose her health, a breast at 95, eventually her mind, her ability to walk, her personal dignity, and then, her life. So...after witnessing it, I couldn't stay mad. I'm generally not wired to.
Then my attention turned to healing myself. I had already begun...and forgiveness of myself, compassion for myself, was the part I was missing. I've learned it. Many many many people and processes helped.
There's enough love in the universe for all of that to happen.
I'm sorry you're hurting, Bear. I understand why. You will heal, hon. Be on your own side. Be kind to the Bear in the mirror. You didn't mean to lose control. You had been hurt too much for too long and it all came out at once.
love,
Hops
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I'm a little embarassed and regretful I didn't speak up more. I just found it was exhausting and distracting to stick up for myself, so I let too much roll off my back.
Me too. I wished I had the tools to do this earlier in life. To assert myself against the bully in our house. I just feel so late in doing this. Well, so be it. It had to come at a time when I was mature enough to do it I guess. Thanks Swimmer. You have great input for me and we share so many similar experiences.
We have to forgive ourselves. I just know it. Otherwise, life is a waste. And I guess if I believe in forgiveness as a principle, I believe it's probably good for it to go beyond myself. I haven't forgiven my brother yet. Dunno when that will happen. But I'm not regretting that. I'm in the position I need to be until he is completely out of my life.
We weren't strong enough to fight back all along the way, our instincts were overpowered by many forces (the Ns and the culture and more). And sometimes, people just freaking snap. I did.
So...the healing first had to be forgiveness of myself. With her, it just came about because I took care of her. I saw her body. I watched her lose her health, a breast at 95, eventually her mind, her ability to walk, her personal dignity, and then, her life. So...after witnessing it, I couldn't stay mad. I'm generally not wired to.
Then my attention turned to healing myself. I had already begun...and forgiveness of myself, compassion for myself, was the part I was missing. I've learned it. Many many many people and processes helped.
There's enough love in the universe for all of that to happen.
Your journey to heal seems so right for you and it happened the way that it did for you to pay attention to yourself, this I see, how you forgave yourself yet have regrets that don't immobilize who you are. Wow. I appreciate you wisdom and hope that I can forgive myself and heal.
I just want everything to be over and for it to all go away so fast but I know that this is a process and a journey to a happier place.
thank you for helping me.
Bear
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Dear Beawithme,
Ten days with your mother sounds like an eternity. You must have felt very strong to attempt that. This shows a lot of goodwill on your part, given the history.
Your mom wanted to make you WRONG. There was no way to please her. Mine had a way of pressing every button I had and poking me with the psychic equivalents of red hot pokers and then she would be aghast when I went ballistic. Come to think of it if you look back and imagine her face and demeanor, she had a faint smile on her lips and an implacable look overall. That is the dance these crazy moms do. Get you going and then say in a little girl voice," I didnt do anythiing and why is she being such a big meany and bullying me and yelling and screaming and tearing out her hair? This is such a racket.
You described how she then went on to slander you and tell people you are insane, unstable and to even threaten you with god knows what because you put your hands on her. She put you through the blender. Thoroughly. And to top it off, she is your mother so you crossed no man's land with her and ended up feeling about three years old and a really bad girl.
Your mom deserves a flogging or something.
One good thing about it is that you can just imagine what you felt like as a little kid with no resources, experience, education or maturity to deal with this kind of person. This is what she did then. She can still get you there. And she has no conscience or insight about it.
I really feel sorry for you. You dont deserve this. No need to apologize. None. Finally you felt the fires of hell well up in you and you acted out. It was time to say ," Back off Buster!!!!!!" and you did. You must be a lot healthier now if you can stand up for yourself, even if you did go a bit opera.
Seems to me that you stood up for yourself and that is great. You got to see the movie as an adult. You explain it clearly and rationally. You take responsibility for your part. I hope you give that little girl in you a lot of love and validate her for surviving around such a mother.
Sea storm
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Seastorm wrote:
if you look back and imagine her face and demeanor, she had a faint smile on her lips and an implacable look overall
You got it! Whoa. I am so not alone in this world. Thank God. Yes, the smirk. The smile. My husband was ultimately disturbed by this as when I left and she was in his face, he said, "Bear, I was a bit nervous for the first time because I sensed that she got enjoyment out of what had just happened."
Seastorm, thank you for your input and cheering me on. I realize now what you and everybody has said that 10 days is too long. I just want to be "healthy" and happy like everyone talks about here and that long of a time with NM is just unreasonable. What was I thinking? I wanted her to stay so that my and my husband could go out a few times at our leisure. NOT WORTH IT!! (sorry hubby:(
Bear.
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Thanks for sharing your experience. It helped me see it again and remember not to forget why I stayed away. I could never stand it without turning into raging volcano. It made me hate myself to be like that, and if you asked me what exactly she was doing I could not explain it very coherently, if at all. Hearing you explain it let me see it again through adult eyes. To be objective, detached.
This is one unhealthy puppy you have for a mother. I really hope you are coming down from the oozie attack. You are not a bad person. You offered her a welcome into your home. If my daughter invited me for ten days I would be tapdancing with happiness and on my very best behaviour so that I could enhance her life, her family and our relationship. If I ended up creating complete havoc I sure would not feel good about it and blame her. It just isn't rational.
I really send blessings to you. It hurts not to get your mom's blessing. But she is incapable of it.
Love,
Sea storm
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Bear,
I'm not sure this will help but being too much of a klutz and nerd to ever be allowed near a pompom, the closest I ever got to cheerleading was to stand on a float once in a h.s. parade with a little felt skirt with VIVE LA FRANCE written in big letters across my ass...
So in the same spirit,
VIVE LA BEAR!
The important part being vive....which is all that this is about, all of it.
You and vive.
All the things that stem from that-
vi-tal
viv-acious
viv-ify
live...vive...
You deserve your vive!
(This includes people with feelings, flailings, failings and fears. You still deserve your vive.)
hugs
Hops
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Hops, your simply the best!! :P
You know just what to say.
Had to laugh out loud about the felt skirt thing. Still chuckling about it now.....
I'm hangin' in there. My therapist is working hard on me to calm down and BREATHE....BREATHE....BREATHE
Bear ((((((hugs))))))))))
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Hi Bear,
I keep sitting down to write to you and find there are so many similarities in our situations that I find I've written an essay about myself and not got round to what I want to say to you!! So I will keep it short and sweet, but basically, I have been where you are now, there is a glorious, shining light at the end of that very long tunnel you are looking at and I wish you were right here so I could give you a big hug and tell you you're brilliant and I'm really proud of you. I'm not suprised your T is excited, I think you have broken through something major here and that this is really the start of you getting your life back for you and your family (I mean your hubby and child when I say that!).
Go, Bear!!!!!!!!!
Hugs,
Twoapenny