Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Frustrated on October 31, 2004, 11:16:05 AM
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The holiday's are quickly approaching and I was wondering how others deal with the dreaded Giving Gifts To The Narcissist?
Back in the day (the not too far distant day) before the blinders came off and I was still the well-trained highly obedient supplier, I would always ask my mother what to get my father for Christmas. And she would tell me something he had expressed really really wanting. So I would go out and buy this item, wrap it, and present it to him - and always without fail he would look at the item, frown, and ask "What the hell did you get me this for? What am I supposed to do with this? Did you keep the receipt? I don't want this." And my mother would be sitting there looking all smug and smirky.
The added bonus to these little get-togethers is that they've managed to drive everyone else off, so I'm the only one there besides them. Yeah for me.
Now, of course, I realize I was being set-up by my mother, but this doesn't excuse my father's jerky response. And I've received some crap gifts from them over the years, and if I had responded like that, WWIII would have started.
I think my favorite Christmas, though, I had just purchased my own home and my mother wanted to know what I wanted for Christmas. Since I was just getting started, I didn't have a lot of cookware, and I had a paticular brand/pattern that I liked. It was far too extravagent for me to purchase an entire set (or request someone else to purchase it for me) so I would buy a piece here and there as I could afford, and suggested my mother could do the same. I don't actually remember what she got me that year, but nothing related to cookware. However, and she couldn't resist showing me, my father had purchased her an entire set in the brand/pattern I liked, and she proudly displayed it to me. I just said oh thats nice! But I knew my mother, who couldn't care less about cooking or a particular cookware, neither needed nor wanted that set, and from what I can tell, probably hasn't used it that much to this day.
Nowadays, I refuse to exchange gifts with my parents. I won't buy them anything, and ask that they don't buy me anything (which is fine with them because they certainly aren't going to get me anything if I'm not going to get THEM anything)
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Did you ever say 'because mother told me that's what you really, really wanted and I wanted you to have something you really, really wanted'???
I suspect not cos we get caught up in the 'game' the N plays off of us.
That thing about your mother getting the very thing you wanted is so typically N. Gotta laugh really otherwise you'd go mad! They want to give you the gift but they're so empty they can't let it go.
I'm so well trained that I spend my life finding out what other people want then giving them that gift. And the gift could be psychological. You want love - here you are; you need someone to shove around : here you are; you need someone to hate : here you are; you need someone to project all your sicko stuff onto : here you are - I'll take all your bad stuff so you can feel like you're the most wonderful person on earth.
It's like a drug, but I'm giving it up - for Xmas and for ever.
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On occasion I actually would say "Hey, Mom said you wanted this" and she would pipe up with "Yeah, you said you did. Remember?" And he would always respond "I don't remember that." Since he would always say that whenever he had done or said something outrageous and his behavior/actions were pointed out to him, I assumed for years that he was the problem and my poor put-upon mother had to put up with this schlub. It was a long time before I realized they got themselves a sick game going on and she's a bigger participant than he is. She was setting him up to look bad in my eyes (and he played right into it with his obnoxious response, and I fell for it) just as she was setting me up to look stupid in his eyes.
I'm just glad I see all this now. And I do laugh sometimes because it just so absurd. Doesn't mean I don't still get sucked and in kick myself later, but its progress! Just eliminating the gift giving aspect has made the holidays much nicer for me, and I think, for them too. I don't think they much liked "having" to spend money on me and now they don't have to worry about that anymore.
Its hard to let go of that well-ingrained training, even after you've become aware of it. Its so frustrating! But it sounds you've got the right idea and you're on your way to giving it up for good!
I'm so well trained that I spend my life finding out what other people want then giving them that gift. And the gift could be psychological. You want love - here you are; you need someone to shove around : here you are; you need someone to hate : here you are; you need someone to project all your sicko stuff onto : here you are - I'll take all your bad stuff so you can feel like you're the most wonderful person on earth. It's like a drug, but I'm giving it up - for Xmas and for ever.
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Hi Frustrated,
Yep. Ns really take the joy out of gift giving. To them, it's just another opportunity to stick to someone. In your case, it sounds like "divide and conquer" for your mother. Your dad sounds angry at the whole situation, but helpless or uninterested in fixing anything.
You could ask your dad directly what he wants. Maybe. You've probably already tried that??? Or ask him what his latest interest is. Golfers and fishermen are easy to buy for, tons of stuff to be had.
Since you've lost the "what do you want" game, you can lose by trying out your own ideas. Just for variety. And if you get it right, watch your mother's eyes bug out.
Your mother sounds positively sick to buy something you wanted to just inspire jealousy in you. Ick. Phooey. My NSIL really ruined gift giving by asking precisely what we wanted and getting the cheapest item. I felt like we should just exchange twenty dollar bills for all the love and thought and generosity that went into it.
My advice is to be proactive and thoughtful. The way you'd want them to be. And expect nothing nice in return. Just lower your expectations and be the person you want to be.
Happy holidays. Seeker
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Interesting - I can't believe it but it never ever occurred to me to ask my father directly what he'd like for Christmas. I (and anyone who still cared at any given time) always went through my mother for everything related to my father. No one ever approached my father directly about anything. Its just interesting that it never occurred to me.
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Feels like I am reading every gift-giving occasion we have ever had. Then, after a few weeks, they give the gifts back to me, saying they don't like them, or don't need them. Slap slap slap.
Speaking of old witches, today is Halloween. Happy Halloween to you all, and if you go outside tonight, look up at the moon, you may see my Nmom sailing past it on her broom stick. Twisted Evil
Thanks for the smile. The same thought flashed through my mind today. Maybe we'll see the NM's flying past on to never-to-return-again land. :twisted:
Oh, bad thought :evil:
but true thought :oops: cuz I'm down for the count, trying to pull out all the knives that she has used to stab me in the back the last few days. It still surprises me that I don't see them coming. My NM is a clever, deviant, Manipulating, lying back-stabber. I can barely get up on one knee, let alone stand, yet. All the energy it takes to cope has made me weak, and furthermore, I am really resenting all the energy, time and well-being that I am losing from this precious life of mine because of her and her sick sick mind. I'm going to watch the sky tonite....will be looking for the old bitches, er witches flying past. THAT would be a Gift (re: the title of your thread!).
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Speaking of old witches, today is Halloween. Happy Halloween to you all, and if you go outside tonight, look up at the moon, you may see my Nmom sailing past it on her broom stick. :twisted:
Thanks for the smile. The same thought flashed through my mind today. Maybe we'll see the NM's flying past on to never-to-return-again land.
Oh, bad thought :twisted:
:lol: :lol: :lol: I just had this image of ALL of our NMoms flying around the moon - fighting for space and crashing into each other. :lol: :lol: :lol: Thanks for that image, Moonflower and OnlyMe! :D
Happy Halloween!!
Wildflower
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Hi Everyone:
My sister officially announced that she "did not wish to be involved" with me, yet the first Christmas after that, she sent some really unusually lovely gifts to me, by having my children deliver them.
Once the hubbub was all over and January set in, I wrote her a note asking her to please dispense with gift giving to me and that I intended to do the same, except ofcourse that this did not include the children. I would continue to send gifts to my sister's children and that I did not wish to interfere in her gift giving to my children.
She used to buy my kids fairly nice gifts but that Christmas and from then on, the gifts became shockingly (for my children) less than lovely (even before I sent the note). My kids still visit her and look forward to seeing their cousins (who are much younger, still small kids) and afterward they tell me things like:
"Auntie says she doesn't know why you keep sending (my nefews) gifts. She said that (blank-gift) was (blank derogatory adjective). She says they'll (the boys) never know who you are anyway".
I don't show a negative reaction when my children relay these messages but inside, I feel the anger rising. I want to say: "Tell Auntie to go....." but instead I usually answer something logical like: "The boys will grow up some day". Also, I talk with them about their feelings when such statements are made to them by their aunt.
The whole gift giving thing cause me anxiety and frustration.
Thanks for this topic.
S
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always went through my mother for everything related to my father. No one ever approached my father directly about anything. Its just interesting that it never occurred to me.
Hi frustrated - that's what they do - perhaps you didn't realise but nmothers have to have everyone communicate via them - they are the hub of all communication so they control it all. If you all tried to communicate with each other or have a personal and individual relationship with each other, it would set the nmom off on one of those raging tantrums.
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Just discovered this site, and it may save my liver. I've been caring for my NMom (I'm a newbie enough to still hear a voice in my head saying "But she's not THAT BAD, of course") who just had heart valve replacement surgery. Medication is also distilling her charming personality. While she's been taking Sotilol, This-a-tol and That-a-tol, I've been nipping the Damitol: the bottle of bourbon, 'coz that way I won't really commit matricide. For Halloween -- a holiday I usually adore -- she insisted on telling us to invite the kids inside to view her chest scar. And did it, while giving them a running commentary on how the surgery didn't hurt, what they did, etc.
Three more days until I take the plane bacl to my real life and adulthood...
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Hi Everyone:
My sister officially announced that she "did not wish to be involved" with me, yet the first Christmas after that, she sent some really unusually lovely gifts to me, by having my children deliver them.
Once the hubbub was all over and January set in, I wrote her a note asking her to please dispense with gift giving to me and that I intended to do the same, except ofcourse that this did not include the children. I would continue to send gifts to my sister's children and that I did not wish to interfere in her gift giving to my children.
She used to buy my kids fairly nice gifts but that Christmas and from then on, the gifts became shockingly (for my children) less than lovely (even before I sent the note). My kids still visit her and look forward to seeing their cousins (who are much younger, still small kids) and afterward they tell me things like:
"Auntie says she doesn't know why you keep sending (my nefews) gifts. She said that (blank-gift) was (blank derogatory adjective). She says they'll (the boys) never know who you are anyway".
I don't show a negative reaction when my children relay these messages but inside, I feel the anger rising. I want to say: "Tell Auntie to go....." but instead I usually answer something logical like: "The boys will grow up some day". Also, I talk with them about their feelings when such statements are made to them by their aunt.
The whole gift giving thing cause me anxiety and frustration.
Thanks for this topic.
S
Somebody, I am far more worried about the *gift* of a sexaul preditor who you gave your kids for a father, than any gift you deam *inappropriate* from there Auntie. I'm not buying it. The rest of the board can if they want. Get with your real problem - and Sis isn't it.
L.
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It's really weird the way that solace doesn't see how her actions create the re-actions in her life. As if the world out there exists and is so unkind. "Poor innocent little me". NOT!
The story just doesn't hang together.
Deja vu!
It's like throwing down a banana peel, slipping on it then blaming the world for not picking it up!!! YOU create the very situations you are complaining about.
You reject your sister's gifts, tell her she can send your kids gifts (gee, how good of you) then expect her to be gracious about it. Meanwhile your kids suffer believing their aunt doesn't love THEM!
Sadly, in all this time, you've learnt nothing.
Read up about personality disorders then get some treatment and stop hurting people and driving them nuts.
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Well my mom has always sent crappy gifts but I just thought that was because she didn't have much money. And that's okay, I just give the stuff to Goodwill. It would be nice if she got me just one nice thing, but her mode is to get many crappy gifts so it looks bountiful. Unfortunately, I get sweaters off the sale rack sometimes with holes or that are not even close to my size. And some fragrance or lotion when I don't use them because of allergies. These are just indicators that she doesn't know me at all.
She gets me teddy bears every year even though I've asked her not to anymore. I guess she's decided I'm the teddy bear daughter and there's no talking her out of it. But at least some child can get it at Goodwill now, so there's an upside. I don't get disappointed anymore. I'm waaaay past that by now. I even get a giggle from it.
I used to get her really nice stuff, but I decided a year ago to just get her a couple of nice but not too extravagant things. I don't bust my budget like I used to. In fact I made the realization one January as I ordered a really nice necklace for her that I should send it back when it arrived. And I did. That was a defining moment for me and it felt good to send that necklace back and get my money back. That I didn't have to try to please Nmom anymore, that it simply did no good.
So the upside is that I save alot more money at Holidays and Birthdays and Mother's day (didn't even send a card this year). And I miss her less and less because I never really had anything much there to begin with.
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For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
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For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also I doubt your intentions here.
B
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*****hooray*****
for saying so clearly what others here have been thinking and trying to say.
THANK YOU!
I feel a peace here, at last.
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*****hooray*****
for saying so clearly what others here have been thinking and trying to say.
THANK YOU!
I feel a peace here, at last.
Me too **** :D **** I want to move those words up for others to read.
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For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also I doubt your intentions here.
B
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I think we should repost this at least 10 times a day. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I'm glad people are finally speaking up a bit more. And thanks to those who have tried in the past and been taken to task for being too mean or direct. Thanks to everyone who loves their kids and wouldn't let a sex offender anywhere near them. I'm beginning to have faith in this place again after this.
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California has a proposition to impose a "one strike" rule against sex offenders of children, specifically those who molest or harm children under age 14 and/or who are ten years younger than the offender. It's attached to the three strikes modification proposition...
In other words, some of us folks feel sexual abuse of children is NEVER excusable and should be more harshly dealt with for the irreparable damage done to innocents.
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For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also I doubt your intentions here.
B
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Hey guys and girls,
I am seeing the guest function being put to very good use here. Sometimes a mask lets us tell the truth (and of course sometimes.....well you know the rest). Won't go there for now. :wink:
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For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
I was one of those two - I'm sorry - it took me such a long time to understand. I still find it difficult to say 'go away'. But I think B might be right about doubting S's intentions.
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Thinking out loud:
Maybe the Guests are right and I'm the crazy one? Maybe it was wrong of me to ask my sister to only communicate in writing with me and wrong of me to want to have a way to hear her words and help her stop denying that she said this or that? Maybe when she rejected me publicly, I should have gone to her and begged for mercy and told her that it was the right thing to do--to reject me publicly instead of to my face, or at least in writing to me. Maybe I should have told her what she wanted to hear, just to keep peace, for my children's sake? Maybe I should've made excuses for the junky gifts she sent them and maybe I should have found a way to devalue the beautiful ones she sent me, after her public rejection? Maybe I should have somehow, found a way to make my kids think she was being nice or extra kind, in some reasonable way, maybe? Maybe she has a right to take whatever actions she likes against me, no matter how she looks to my kids, no matter that they express how her behaviour hurts them? I'm not there when she makes nasty statements about me but my kids are and they tell her they don't want to hear it and that it hurts them but she doesn't listen. Maybe I should take responsibility for the way her words hurt them? I try to help them understand, sometimes, how their aunt might be feeling but maybe that's not enough? I even make excuses for her, but I'm doing less of that now. Maybe I should take alll responsibility for everyone's behaviour like my husband did? After all, I'm the criminal who started the whole process, right? Maybe I'm ultimately responsible for everything everyone says and does? Maybe I have 14 different disorders and I'm the one whose marbles have finally cracked? Maybe all of the doctors here on this board know better? Maybe the labels that have been assigned to me, that are derogatory, hurtful and damaging are not abusive? Maybe it's ok to label people and send them packing if we choose not to empathize with them? Do any of you agree?
Maybe some people here just won't accept my words because of whatever happened to them that they just won't choose to keep from blending with what happened in my family? Maybe they think the fact that 7 years went by after that, without my husband ever behaving in such a way again, with him controlling his own thoughts and behaviour, with him trying to make up for it all, before his behaviour was brought to light, is no indication of the future? Maybe they think they know more than the experts? Wait, I haven't given that info yet. Maybe it's hard for them to accept such an idea and maybe they just don't realize that's it's NOT impossible to accept? Maybe they don't see their CHOICE that they are making to continuously insist that IIIII am a liar, IIIII am a sick one? Maybe they don't know that over 96% of molestations are perpetrated by people with no previous offenses? Maybe they refuse to believe that my husband served his sentence and more and is still paying?
Speaking to you:
Maybe it's ok to prey on me? To follow my posts with abusive insults and bullying?
I'm causing chaos and pain here? No. Maybe you've decided that I'm causing chaos and pain here. Maybe you've made up your mind that no matter what I say--it's a lie, that I'm out to hurt you and that I'm any number of labels. I'm a daily reminder of what happened to you? No, maybe you've decided that I'm a daily reminder of what happened to you. There are any number of daily reminders of what happened to you, in the world, on this board (by other people's experiences), in your head. I haven't got a thing to do with what happened to you but maybe you've decided that I do. I create the situations I complain about? Aren't you doing that? Aren't you trying your best to make me out to be what you've decided I am and trying to chaotically convince the rest of the board of your "truth" and incite chaotic response? In any possible manner? Sadly, I've learnt nothing? How the heck do you know what I've learnt? I should stop hurting people and driving them nuts? Shake your head. What are you talking about? Can you hear yourself? How many labels have I put on you? How many times have I tried to indicate that you are a liar? How many times have I rejected you, not your advice or opinion, but you? How many abusive names have I called you? How many times have I followed one of your posts with a demeaning comment? None. I may not have diagreed with you, and that's ok, isn't it? But I haven't done those other things and you're saying IIIII'm the one hurting and driving you nuts? That's in your head. Not my stuff.
If I had empathy? You have no idea how much empathy I have, yet it seems you've decided exactly and factually, in your head, that I don't have any? I'm causing you pain? Maybe the realization that your abuse of me is wrong-- is causing you pain-- but that's not such a bad thing, is it? Is it?????? Other than that, your pain is your pain and I have nothing to do with it. It seems you've decided that I do. I'd like to help you feel better. I might actually be able to share something of value with you and you with me, but it seems you have decided that that won't happen and what my intentions are. It also appears that you have decided that you know what I want and what I am out to accomplish. That's in your head. Maybe you don't think I have a right to speak here? That's in your head too because I deserve the same basic human rights as you, regardless of whether or not you wish to accept that idea or not. It looks like you have somehow decided that I am less than human and therefore don't deserve those basic rights. That's in your head. I am human and I am just a person who is in pain too. I am not responsible for what's happened to you and you are not responsible for what's happened to me. But you are responsible for your own words. Conflicts get resolved, though, when people take responsibility for their behaviour. I don't need your appologies, you do. I think you may need to forgive yourself first. For making mistakes. We all make mistakes. We all make judgements that are incorrect. I understand and I can easily empathize with your difficulty in admitting that, to yourself. I am a constant reminder of the mistakes you've made in regard to me. That's the real issue, isn't it?
And I see "I'm sorry. It took me such a long time to understand". Is that some kind of appology? Sorry for what? Sorry that I'm still here pointing out your bullying? Sorry that you called me a hurtful name or 10? Sorry that you must state what's in your head about my intentions? Sorry that you've labelled me with a medical diagnosis, a damaging label that others have accepted? Understand what? Are you really sorry for anything? I don't understand. And I already forgive you because I know you are a good person who has been badly hurt. Do you hear me? I'm not angry with you. I believe in you.
You do not know the many n behaviours of my sister, and the n speak she has showered on me, for years and years, long before ANY husband or children of mine were on the scene. Maybe you think you're trying to help me see things through my sister's eyes? I'm already trying too hard to see things through my sister's eyes and that's why I feel guilty for feeling angry with her behaviour. That's the way I see it. Maybe I'm wrong?
Maybe, you have only considered ONE of my children. You don't realize that my other child was devestated by the loss of her step-dad. Went beserk. Practically insane, when I threw him out, and for a long time after. She still suffers. She swears he has never done anything to hurt her. She was broken by the loss and is still very pained by it. I believe her. Do you?
Do you really think you have all of the facts? Do you really think your judgements are fair? Do you really think it's ok to decide what's best for EVERYONE in my family? Do you really think I should divorce my husband for YOU? How ridiculous is that???? Isn't that ridiculous?
Come on, be real. Be real to you. No need to beat yourself up. No need to feel guilty. That won't help you. Maybe it would be better to take your own steps to correct your own thinking? That will help you, won't it?
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I think we should repost this at least 10 times a day. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I'm glad people are finally speaking up a bit more. And thanks to those who have tried in the past and been taken to task for being too mean or direct. Thanks to everyone who loves their kids and wouldn't let a sex offender anywhere near them. I'm beginning to have faith in this place again after this.
I can't understand a woman wanting to stay with a man had such thoughts in his head that he would make a sexual offer to a child. The child did not take up the offer, but did not feel comfortable telling her mother about it and kept it a secret for years and only brought it out into the open (and not to her mother) when it feared its younger sister would be victimized the same way. If this man had truly felt he had done wrong, he would have confessed the minute he had transgressed, not when he was confronted years later. What was the offer? It must have been pretty bad for this chlid to be so afraid for her sister that she broke her silence to protect her.
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Thinking out loud:
Maybe the Guests are right and I'm the crazy one? Maybe it was wrong of me to ask my sister to only communicate in writing with me and wrong of me to want to have a way to hear her words and help her stop denying that she said this or that? Maybe when she rejected me publicly, I should have gone to her and begged for mercy and told her that it was the right thing to do--to reject me publicly instead of to my face, or at least in writing to me. Maybe I should have told her what she wanted to hear, just to keep peace, for my children's sake? Maybe I should've made excuses for the junky gifts she sent them and maybe I should have found a way to devalue the beautiful ones she sent me, after her public rejection? Maybe I should have somehow, found a way to make my kids think she was being nice or extra kind, in some reasonable way, maybe? Maybe she has a right to take whatever actions she likes against me, no matter how she looks to my kids, no matter that they express how her behaviour hurts them? I'm not there when she makes nasty statements about me but my kids are and they tell her they don't want to hear it and that it hurts them but she doesn't listen. Maybe I should take responsibility for the way her words hurt them? I try to help them understand, sometimes, how their aunt might be feeling but maybe that's not enough? I even make excuses for her, but I'm doing less of that now. Maybe I should take alll responsibility for everyone's behaviour like my husband did? After all, I'm the criminal who started the whole process, right? Maybe I'm ultimately responsible for everything everyone says and does? Maybe I have 14 different disorders and I'm the one whose marbles have finally cracked? Maybe all of the doctors here on this board know better? Maybe the labels that have been assigned to me, that are derogatory, hurtful and damaging are not abusive? Maybe it's ok to label people and send them packing if we choose not to empathize with them? Do any of you agree?
Maybe some people here just won't accept my words because of whatever happened to them that they just won't choose to keep from blending with what happened in my family? Maybe they think the fact that 7 years went by after that, without my husband ever behaving in such a way again, with him controlling his own thoughts and behaviour, with him trying to make up for it all, before his behaviour was brought to light, is no indication of the future? Maybe they think they know more than the experts? Wait, I haven't given that info yet. Maybe it's hard for them to accept such an idea and maybe they just don't realize that's it's NOT impossible to accept? Maybe they don't see their CHOICE that they are making to continuously insist that IIIII am a liar, IIIII am a sick one? Maybe they don't know that over 96% of molestations are perpetrated by people with no previous offenses? Maybe they refuse to believe that my husband served his sentence and more and is still paying?
Speaking to you:
Maybe it's ok to prey on me? To follow my posts with abusive insults and bullying?
I'm causing chaos and pain here? No. Maybe you've decided that I'm causing chaos and pain here. Maybe you've made up your mind that no matter what I say--it's a lie, that I'm out to hurt you and that I'm any number of labels. I'm a daily reminder of what happened to you? No, maybe you've decided that I'm a daily reminder of what happened to you. There are any number of daily reminders of what happened to you, in the world, on this board (by other people's experiences), in your head. I haven't got a thing to do with what happened to you but maybe you've decided that I do. I create the situations I complain about? Aren't you doing that? Aren't you trying your best to make me out to be what you've decided I am and trying to chaotically convince the rest of the board of your "truth" and incite chaotic response? In any possible manner? Sadly, I've learnt nothing? How the heck do you know what I've learnt? I should stop hurting people and driving them nuts? Shake your head. What are you talking about? Can you hear yourself? How many labels have I put on you? How many times have I tried to indicate that you are a liar? How many times have I rejected you, not your advice or opinion, but you? How many abusive names have I called you? How many times have I followed one of your posts with a demeaning comment? None. I may not have diagreed with you, and that's ok, isn't it? But I haven't done those other things and you're saying IIIII'm the one hurting and driving you nuts? That's in your head. Not my stuff.
If I had empathy? You have no idea how much empathy I have, yet it seems you've decided exactly and factually, in your head, that I don't have any? I'm causing you pain? Maybe the realization that your abuse of me is wrong-- is causing you pain-- but that's not such a bad thing, is it? Is it?????? Other than that, your pain is your pain and I have nothing to do with it. It seems you've decided that I do. I'd like to help you feel better. I might actually be able to share something of value with you and you with me, but it seems you have decided that that won't happen and what my intentions are. It also appears that you have decided that you know what I want and what I am out to accomplish. That's in your head. Maybe you don't think I have a right to speak here? That's in your head too because I deserve the same basic human rights as you, regardless of whether or not you wish to accept that idea or not. It looks like you have somehow decided that I am less than human and therefore don't deserve those basic rights. That's in your head. I am human and I am just a person who is in pain too. I am not responsible for what's happened to you and you are not responsible for what's happened to me. But you are responsible for your own words. Conflicts get resolved, though, when people take responsibility for their behaviour. I don't need your appologies, you do. I think you may need to forgive yourself first. For making mistakes. We all make mistakes. We all make judgements that are incorrect. I understand and I can easily empathize with your difficulty in admitting that, to yourself. I am a constant reminder of the mistakes you've made in regard to me. That's the real issue, isn't it?
And I see "I'm sorry. It took me such a long time to understand". Is that some kind of appology? Sorry for what? Sorry that I'm still here pointing out your bullying? Sorry that you called me a hurtful name or 10? Sorry that you must state what's in your head about my intentions? Sorry that you've labelled me with a medical diagnosis, a damaging label that others have accepted? Understand what? Are you really sorry for anything? I don't understand. And I already forgive you because I know you are a good person who has been badly hurt. Do you hear me? I'm not angry with you. I believe in you.
You do not know the many n behaviours of my sister, and the n speak she has showered on me, for years and years, long before ANY husband or children of mine were on the scene. Maybe you think you're trying to help me see things through my sister's eyes? I'm already trying too hard to see things through my sister's eyes and that's why I feel guilty for feeling angry with her behaviour. That's the way I see it. Maybe I'm wrong?
Maybe, you have only considered ONE of my children. You don't realize that my other child was devestated by the loss of her step-dad. Went beserk. Practically insane, when I threw him out, and for a long time after. She still suffers. She swears he has never done anything to hurt her. She was broken by the loss and is still very pained by it. I believe her. Do you?
Do you really think you have all of the facts? Do you really think your judgements are fair? Do you really think it's ok to decide what's best for EVERYONE in my family? Do you really think I should divorce my husband for YOU? How ridiculous is that???? Isn't that ridiculous?
Come on, be real. Be real to you. No need to beat yourself up. No need to feel guilty. That won't help you. Maybe it would be better to take your own steps to correct your own thinking? That will help you, won't it?
You are living with a man who made a sexual offer to your child. Most people will never understand that, no matter how many words you use to try to explain it. You are the one who is going to have to live with your decision, you can't force others to accept it.
You don't belong here.
Period.
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Many men have such thoughts. They just don't admit it. Maybe you are not aware of that?
Now you want the exact details. Again, you do not have to respect MY boundaries, right?
Keep writing the story and you'll come up with some real smashers, but that won'd make them facts.
Go for it. It seems you do not hear or believe my words or want to know any truth at all. Fiction is much more entertaining, maybe?
S
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Many men have such thoughts. They just don't admit it. Maybe you are not aware of that?
Now you want the exact details. Again, you do not have to respect MY boundaries, right?
Keep writing the story and you'll come up with some real smashers, but that won'd make them facts.
Go for it. It seems you do not hear or believe my words or want to know any truth at all. Fiction is much more entertaining, maybe?
S
They may have the thoughts, but they don't act on them. That is the difference, your gem of a husband did. To a child, your daughter.
I remember what you wrote, I don't need to embellish.
You don't belong here.
Period.
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In that particular post, you did not embellish. But all the other embellishing stuff must now be excused? It's justifyable, is it? You seem to have decided who belongs where? That's in your head. Oh well, whatever.
S
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In that particular post, you did not embellish. But all the other embellishing stuff must now be excused? It's justifyable, is it? You seem to have decided who belongs where? That's in your head. Oh well, whatever.
S
I've never embellished, I've only repeated what you have posted in the past. Your core words, despite the fact that you try to cover them with thousands and thousands of blatherings and ditherings, come back to haunt you on this board. They will not be forgotten.
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I don't know who you are or what words you mean--another general accusation, is it?
I do think I know this--it looks like you may have decided that you are the epiphany of knowing who is and who is not equal or worthy, repentant or humble--and that is not a good thing to decide or take responsibility for. Whether you have dealings with me or not. That type of thinking will cause more harm than good but you may not ever realize that. I have no ill will toward you.
S
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"They will not be forgotten."
A threat.
S
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"They will not be forgotten."
A threat.
S
A promise. Made in the name of those who have been sexually abused.
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Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:34 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Solace wrote:
"They will not be forgotten."
A threat.
S
A promise. Made in the name of those who have been sexually abused
Even those who go on to purpetrate themselves?
S
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Sorry about that. Don't know how "Solace wrote" got in there.
That is not correct.
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I don't know who you are or what words you mean--another general accusation, is it?
I do think I know this--it looks like you may have decided that you are the epiphany of knowing who is and who is not equal or worthy, repentant or humble--and that is not a good thing to decide or take responsibility for. Whether you have dealings with me or not. That type of thinking will cause more harm than good but you may not ever realize that. I have no ill will toward you.
S
Blah, blah blah, signifying nothing. More blah blah blah.
Just decided to say what so many have been afraid to say, tired of all the pussy footing around. Period.
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No problem. As long as you can sleep at night. I must be off.
S
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Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:34 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Solace wrote:
"They will not be forgotten."
A threat.
S
A promise. Made in the name of those who have been sexually abused
Even those who go on to purpetrate themselves?
S
That is not a word. You make no sense.
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No problem. As long as you can sleep at night. I must be off.
S
I have no problem sleeping at night, I'm not in bed with a man who made a sexual offer to my child.
Yes, I agree, you are off.
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I like your quick witt. And I'm not complimenting you, I'm expressing my feeling of what I like.
"I'm not in bed with a man who made a sexual offer to my child. "
You're right, you're not. And that could never happen to anyone else, just me? I am off---- my rocker, right? You're sure, it seems. Looks like you've made up your mind about that.
Good day to you, anyway. No hard feelings from me but you, still appear to be out to label. Why is that?
S
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I like your quick witt. And I'm not complimenting you, I'm expressing my feeling of what I like.
"I'm not in bed with a man who made a sexual offer to my child. "
You're right, you're not. And that could never happen to anyone else, just me? I am off---- my rocker, right? You're sure, it seems. Looks like you've made up your mind about that.
Good day to you, anyway. No hard feelings from me but you, still appear to be out to label. Why is that?
S
I have no ulterior motives. If it makes you feel better to think that, go ahead.
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bump
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Things that don't work:
(1) engaging with "that person" in dialogue.
(2) arguing with her
(3) reasoning with her
(4) attacking her
(5) telling her anything at all.
She always puts "hooks" into her posts so that people will be provoked to reply. It's that simple.
bunny
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Amen! Ya'll shut the hell up. Jesus, Mary and Joseph. Ignore the crap and get to what is really important.
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Things that don't work:
(1) engaging with "that person" in dialogue.
(2) arguing with her
(3) reasoning with her
(4) attacking her
(5) telling her anything at all.
She always puts "hooks" into her posts so that people will be provoked to reply. It's that simple.
bunny
Her hooks are obvious, but I believe they serve another intention other than provoking just a reply.
This issue will not go away, no matter how much she wants it to, no matter how much verbal diarreah she uses to cover things up. Many people on this board are tired of pretending the emperor has no clothes, it needed to just be said, she does not belong here.
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Never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. :P
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Never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. :P
That reminds me of another saying. Never try to dress up a pig. It makes you look like an idiot and annoys the pig. :)
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bump
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bump
Just so you know, that wasn't me.
:wink:
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Had the same effect though.
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What does bump mean?
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Bump is an act to move your post up and out of view. Even a silly word like bump holds more intelligence than you or anything you have to say, but it would take too long to prove it to this board, so its very easier to casually bump your post out of the way. :D
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Actually bump is just to bump the thread to the top because maybe it has something of importance to say or remember to the person who bumped it up there. It's not a bad thing.
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For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also S, I doubt your intentions here.
B
Bump :D
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...
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No prob, Moonflower, you beautiful ray of moonlight!
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...
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Had the same effect though.
Oh, sure did.
:D
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You're wlecome. Ask any darn thing your heart desires. It doesn't cost a thing!
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Actually bump is just to bump the thread to the top because maybe it has something of importance to say or remember to the person who bumped it up there. It's not a bad thing.
Exactly. It's to keep a thread with something the bumpee thinks is important at the top of the thread list.
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Bump...
and the best part of this is that 's' isn't playing with us anymore :P
Let's do whatever works.
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Here, here!!!!!
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Hey, good message B. I like your very precise and factual information.
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For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also S, I doubt your intentions here.
B
Bump :D
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bumpedy bump bump
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A young woman went to her mother and told her about her life and how
things were so hard for her. She did not know how she was going to make it and wanted to give up. She was tired of fighting and struggling. It seemed as one problem was solved, a new one arose.
Her mother took her to the kitchen. She filled three pots with water and
placed each on a high fire. Soon the pots came to boil. In the first she placed carrots, in the second she placed eggs, and in the last she placed ground coffee beans. She let them sit and boil, without saying a word.
In about twenty minutes she turned off the burners. She fished the carrots
out and placed them in a bowl. She pulled the eggs out and placed them in a bowl. Then she ladled the coffee out and placed it in a bowl.
Turning to her daughter, she asked, "Tell me, what do you see?"
"Carrots, eggs, and coffee," she replied.
Her mother brought her closer and asked her to feel the carrots. She did
and noted that they were soft. The mother then asked the daughter to take an egg and break it. After pulling off the shell, she observed the hard-boiled egg. Finally, the mother asked the daughter to sip the coffee. The daughter smiled, as she tasted its rich aroma. The daughter then asked, "What does it mean, mother?"
Her mother explained that each of these objects had faced the same
adversity, boiling water, and each reacted differently.
The carrot went in strong, hard, and unrelenting. However, after being
subjected to the boiling water, it softened and became weak.
The egg had been fragile. Its thin outer shell had protected its liquid
interior, but after sitting through the boiling water, its inside became
hardened.
The ground coffee beans were unique, however. After they were in the
boiling water, they had changed the water.
Which are you?" she asked her daughter. "When adversity knocks on your
door, how do you respond? Are you a carrot, an egg, or a coffee bean?"
Think of this: Which are you?
Are you the carrot that seems strong, but with pain and adversity do you wilt and become soft and lose your strength?
Are you the egg that starts with a malleable heart, but changes with the
heat? Did you have a fluid spirit, but after a death, a breakup, a financial
hardship or some other trial, have you become hardened and stiff? Does your shell look the same, but on the inside are you bitter and tough with a stiff spirit and hardened heart?
Or are you like the coffee bean? The bean actually changes the hot water, the very circumstance that brings the pain. When the water gets hot, it
releases the fragrance and flavor. If you are like the bean, when things
are at their worst, you get better and change the situation around you.
When the hour is the darkest and trials are their greatest, do you elevate
yourself to another level? How do you handle adversity?
Are you a carrot, an egg, or a coffee bean?
Thankyou to all the coffee beans on this board.
S
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Interesting,
Coffee is stimulating and not very nourishing. Fitting.
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Interesting,
Coffee is stimulating and not very nourishing. Fitting.
It makes people jumpy and nervous too.
Caffien is also addictive.
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Anonymous wrote:
For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also S, I doubt your intentions here.
B
Bump
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Well, I've tried being kind, as I did by asking my sister to write rather than phone me. That isn't working here, just as it didn't work with her either, and so I blocked her phone number (ofcourse, blocking the phone number only worked when she called from her home, so she kept calling from cell phones and other places, to rant after I that). Finally, I just said: "write it down and mail it" and I hung up, each time. That's when she decided to publicly reject me, but --bet you guessed it--the phone calls continued for quite awhile after that. She didn't want to be "involved" but she kept calling to what again?
As much as I dislike being blunt and tactless, my marshal art training really did teach necessity.
"I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S."
This idea may be what is causing you to behave like a preditor.
You are preying on me. You are putting yourself on the same level as any preditor and showing the same lack of respect.
Go work on you.
S
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Anonymous wrote:
For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also S, I doubt your intentions here.
B
Bump
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What if we stopped replying to 's' and all her attempts to stir up controversy? Maybe, if we didn't supply feedback she might go to a site where she is among others like her, and feel more at home there.
If we remain silent to her and to any guest who sounds like her, maybe we can get back to the point of helping each other.
So, this is not a reply to 's'. Rather, it is an attempt to ignore her, and encourage others to do likewise.
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Like I said before: you know s is an n, I know that, but by the sheer fact that she is still here where she's obviously not wanted (stubbornly just like my n is always where she's not wanted) indicates a severe disconnect in cognitive thought......N. She can not be reasoned with because she is unreasonable and N. I base my presumption of N not because she chooses a convicted sex offender of her daughter, but because of all her other behavior and attitudes. We give her more fuel for her insatiable fire by responding to her in any way.
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Anonymous wrote:
For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N. I do not respond or address her in any way. I think many others don't as well. It is useless. If S had empathy and good intent, she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone.
Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n.
Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought.
Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime.
Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made. The offer was a gravely serious illegal act.
I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children. I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder.
Please take heart in this statement.
S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children. How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here causes? Also, how can we expect her to put others first here when she couldn't do that for her own children?
Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S. You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues. I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem. Also S, I doubt your intentions here.
B
Bump
Back to top
Guest
Posted: Wed Nov 03,
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"For the two posters who addressed S: you know S is an N. I know S is an N. S doesn't know S is an N."
Thankyou doctor for your diagnosis.
" I do not respond or address her in any way."
But that's what you're doing, isn't it? Or are you trying to taunt a response?
" If S had empathy and good intent,"
There you go again with all these wonderful assumptions, insights, false deductions of yours. From your head.
.." she would know she causes pain and chaos here and be gone."
You seem to want to force others to believe this, it appears.
Control.
Control by blaming the pain and chaos on S.
S is the one who keeps this place chaotic.
Everything was just dandy before S got here.
There was no pain here either.
S is responsible for it all.
S is keeping this place chaotic.
S is to blame.
And.......Control...... by directing S to be gone.
A bit of a control issue, eh?
"Possibly many n's wouldn't even tolerate a child sex offender to remain in their home. My SIL wouldn't and I think she's an n."
Awww...I see. I give you information about my family situation and you use it against me. Is your behaviour n-ish or what? Never mind. I know the answer to that. So then you're not really sure about your diagnosis then? I might not be an n? Retracting your diagnosis or trying to look like you're being fair? I wonder which?
"Any offer or plot or scheme to kill harm rob or sexually offend anybody particularly a child is a jailable crime in my country and S's too. People are being jailed over this very thing happening on the internet. Any adult caught making any offer of sex to a child over the internet nowdays is liable to be caught by undercover net police and get a jail sentence. Why? Because an offer is an act, not a thought. "
Very good. You understand english. I gave you the information to begin with. I said my husband committed a crime. But it seems, you must reinforce this information on a daily basis. As if I hadn't told you about it to begin with. As if YOU are the great exposer of truth. And people might be buying that you have such gooooooood at heart. Or they may not?
"Also, an offer forms the essential basis of any contract under common law. You can have no acceptance without first having an offer on which to accept it.
Which is precisely why S's husbands offer was a serious jailable offence. If I offer to kill someone I will be arrested and tried. It need not even have been accepted by the other party I make the proposition too. I have presented and given my full consent of the contract to be accepted by the other party. That is all I need to have done to have committed a crime. "
Yes, all that blither blather, as some guest put it, to say the same thing I told you to begin with. Or was that you're term-blither blather? Who here uses that blither blather term, I wonder? My husband committed a crime, which I stated in my post to the board. Where's the news????
"Thankfully, S's child wisely declined the offer which never should have been made."
Yessirree! And thankfully, S taught her child to decline such offers, so there you go. But...who wants to consider that? Not you it seems. No way. This fact is being omitted. In order to create the picture you want to create, perhaps????
" The offer was a gravely serious illegal act."
Yes, yes, yes. I told you about it to begin with. But keep repeating it, over and over, if you must. As if you are speaking to the hard of hearing or less than intelligent people. Keep pretending to be bringing forth important facts. What a lovely job you're doing of repeating the information that I posted to this board to begin with. Thankyou, thankyou, thankyou very much. Control.
"I am saddened for those members here who experienced sexual abuse as children."
If you were, you might stop bringing this subject up every day and posting this same message to this thread and keeping it at the top of the board at the top of so many people's day and trying to control...........control.....yes I said......control......what's on top!! Make sure YOUR message is seen!!! Bury all else, as quick as possible!!! Shovel any other ideas that ARE NOT IN SINK WITH YOURS deeper and deeper in this thread!! Control problem, maybe?
" I am saddened that you see S's presence still here on a daily basis as a reminder."
I don't think you're sad (my opinion, my deduction, my assumption). I think there is another, more serious, underlying feeling driving you to behave LIKE A PREDITOR.
Rage-possibly?
"Please take heart in this statement."
Please don't be fooled by this person's continued attempts to control the board, cause chaos and influence you're thinking. I won't be posting to this thread again.
Let this control person, who's preying on my words, and your serenity play whatever games are necessary. But please, don't be fooled!
"S couldn't see well enough to do the right thing by her own children."
Where are you getting off saying this? What an outrageous, ridiculous, unfair, unkind, cruel, untrue, abusive thing to say. What rubbish!!
" How can we expect her to see what harm her selfishness in staying here.."
Now that's what I find halarious!! Who's bringing this to the top of the board and calling who what over and over for what purpose? Insanely halarious to say that ANYONE is selfish for wanting to come to a public board, to find information, to help themselves or get support. What ISSSSS this person trying to make you believe??
" in staying here causes?"
In staying where? Not in this thread, after this. That's a given. By saying this...you are behaving like bully, abusive and..... Controlling. A real lack of concern for anyone. I'd say. Trying to bully people away from a public board issss a control issue, no matter which way it is looked at. Doing so by your methods is cruel.
Has someone been really cruel to you? I really wonder. I wish for you to get the help you need in dealing with that in a more productive, positive manner, if that happened to you. I do feel sad to think that the circle of abuse continues through your behaviour.
" Also, how can we expect her to put others first here"
Yes, I see you doing soooo much of that yourself!! Come on. Get real.
This idea that my posting here is so terribly selfish suggests mixed up thinking.
If there is anyone here who falls for this, so be it.
".. when she couldn't do that for her own children?"
More assumptions. More lies. More bullying. More preying. Not true. Don't believe this person. They are truly trying to cause you to believe stuff that just is not fact.
"Also, I don't accept you have a right to a presence here S."
This idea may be what is causing you to behave the way you are--controlling.
You are preying on me. You are showing a great lack of respect.
" You could and should find a more appropriate forum for your real issues."
So could you but I am not directing you to do that. That's up to you. Your choice. I am however, pointing out your ridiculous behaviour for all to decide upon and that is all. After this...I'm not playing any more.
Go work on you.
" I don't believe your sister is your 'real' problem."
Don't believe it then. I'm not asking you to believe anything. I'm telling you what I think and I'm trying to work on me. Your behaviour indicates an entirely different objective. Control this thread. Control what people see. Control what's on top. Control who stays and who goes. Control by pretending to help. Control by blaming the chaos on me while continuing to chaotically repost your controlling messages over and over. Control by inserting your inaccurate beliefs about me and my situation and pretend to be doing so for someone else's benefit. Control by posing your mixed up ideas as fact. Yep, a control problem, I'd say. Just my opinion though.
" Also S, I doubt your intentions here."
Same response. Doubt what you want. I'm not interested in your beliefs. It's wrong to try to convince others that you know my intentions. You don't. Better to work on you and stop preying on me. Better to face the facts, that you may not be seen in the light you are trying to project. Especially if you continue behaving this way. You are not in charge and you do not speak for all people. You don't know the facts of my situation and the facts you do know, you are using AGAINST me. You are not trying to help anyone, even yourself. It looks like you are trying very hard to silence.
Silence.
Go ahead, keep reposting and reposting and reposting your message. If you must.
But it is not healthy for you or anyone else.
Oh and other Guest: " this is not a reply to 's'. Rather, it is an attempt to ignore her, and encourage others to do likewise."
That's very kind of you. I'd like to be ignored by you, I think. That would be very good for me. Why NOT encourage others to behave-- nicely-- though, rather than with your type of kindness? Never mind. What a silly idea, eh?
S