Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: Izzy_*now* on July 14, 2010, 07:03:12 PM
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...from this oil spill in the Gulf.
The way this is going, it just history repeating itself...a fascist Obama, just like a fascist Hitler and a fascist Mussolini
..and Obama is vactioning in Maine?
http://theintelhub.com/2010/07/14/top-clinton-official-only-a-terror-attack-can-save-obama/ (http://theintelhub.com/2010/07/14/top-clinton-official-only-a-terror-attack-can-save-obama/)
Psychopaths
http://theintelhub.com/2010/07/12/psychopaths-in-the-gulf/ (http://theintelhub.com/2010/07/12/psychopaths-in-the-gulf/)
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Izzy,
I do not understand your post. You call our president a fascist. Yet Obama has also been called a socialist. What I understand is that these two philosophies are in conflict with each other.
And I believe that this post is not appropriate for this site. This is not designed for political comments. When I come to this site I expect to have support and offer support to people dealing with narcissism in their lives. If you have a comment regarding President Obama and narcissism then I feel that is appropriate here.
If I have misinterpreted your post, I apologize.
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Obama is a Narcissist! but he is also ruled by other Narcissists higher on the scale of the élite and, to all of them, the lives of the people in the Gulf States mean nothing with this attempt to kill off millions of people.
As President of the USA, he is vactioning in Maine, while all the Gulf States people are being urged to 'bug out', but to not get into a Government vehicle or will end up in a FEMA concentration camp!
I am concerned about the people on here who might be in that area, and just how aware they are, when lives are so filled with other things, on purpose, to keep people from seeing the real truth.
Narcissism on a grand scale!
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Hi Izzy,
Thank you for the concern. I live in Louisiana about 26 miles from the gulf. I wish we could blame one person for what the government hasn't done, but unfortunately our current problems are the result of decisions made by many people of every political persuasion. We see the negative effect of large corporations in every aspect of our lives. Big oil, big medical and pharmaceutical companies own too many of our representatives from the top to the bottom and they go on to staff key committees. Many of these companies do appear to be run by the most amoral and heartless of people. You may wish to check out the film "Money Medicine" on Amazon video on Demand. It is only $1.99 to view it. What it says about health care is true in other areas run by corporations.
This is horrible but I think it is a wake-up call. If we don't want to have government by narcissists for narcissists we need to send honest, ordinary people to the house and the senate rather than the choice of huge political organizations that owe far too much to corporate interests. Our state just got hit again today. A shipyard that employed 5000 people in New Orleans will close in two years. Nothing I have read suggests that the Gulf of Mexico will be a safe place to fish for at least a generation. What we need to do now is bring new manufacturing plants to our coast that can employ unskilled labor. Unfortunately our state has long courted Chemical and Oil companies to the exclusion of other industries. As the rigs and plants have become more automated we have been left with fewer and fewer jobs and all the pollution. We need to think outside the box now. I hope we will rise to the occasion.
S
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Oh Sealynx it must be absolutely devastating to be near.
I am so sorry for what trauma the whole region is feeling...
Please keep sharing your story of the Gulf.
You could start a thread just to tell us what you're living through or observing...
love,
Hops
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Thanks Hops,
For the first two months it felt like I was waking up in a funeral home every morning. There was a feeling in the air of death. Intuitively I think that is when the majority of the wildlife was struggling and dying. It is still going on but more of the higher animals have fled because food supplies on the lower end of the food chain have died off.
I really feel for the fishermen. Most engaged in two forms of business, selling to commercial houses and a cash only business selling from roadsides and to local markets. For some smaller boats the cash only business made up the majority of their sales. So when BP says show me proof of what you made, they can't and BP's lawyers know that. They have also shown they will play every legal game with people who have zero income at present.
The government is stepping in but if you agree to let them arbitrate you give up the right to sue for personal loss and agree to accept what they come up with. Many people don't realize it but claims from the EXXON disaster were settled 20 years after the spill and a federal judge reduced them to 20 cents on the dollar. Was that judges appointment affected by oil interests? I would think so. They certainly had plenty of time to set up their appeal.
In this case we are not dealing with a few coastal towns, we are dealing with the fishing and tourism industry of four states and the fact that even if they are paid for their current losses, there is literally nowhere to run for them. Florida at least has a lot of coastline, but if your Pensacola guest house is empty who will buy it so you can move to St. Augustine?? Fishing and working on oil rigs is the only game in town for many of these coastal communities. It is the main reason for living along a coast that is routinely destroyed by hurricanes. They've raised their houses to deal with high water, but how do you raise a new economy in a place too disaster prone for major commercial enterprises to set up shop and do it with a grade school or high school education?
BP's current checks (when they give them) are only paying part of the current loss to these people, and since they are always late the money is spent before it arrives. How do you plan for a new way of life with no disposable income? Should you continue to pay the note on your home when every one on the block will soon be vacant and there is no work? Do you abandon your life and try to find a job in another part of the state with virtually no resume? What do you do about a disaster so huge and unforeseen?
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An online radio statio I listen talks very openly about this and who's to blame, and it is far reaching, to Rothschilds, Rockefellers etc. (The Bilderburg Group, CFA etc.)
I wish we could blame one person for what the government hasn't done, but unfortunately our current problems are the result of decisions made by many people of every political persuasion.
and says the solution is to be like the Nuremburg Trials--take them all into account for this planned disaster, this crime against humanity.
I so dislike that the Queen, of Canada, who I used to respect as the Monarch, is at the top, near top, of this, as she owns BP. (She had Diana killed, it appears, from other things I've read.)
I may be in Canada but that oil can creep up the Mississippi to the Great Lakes and infect us from Ontario to the Atlantic, and will eventually cross the Ocean to Europe. This is one unholy disaster, brought on by the Narcissist's/Psychopaths who do not give a damn about the lives of what they called, the 'small people'.
Right now I am so safe in my little apartment, but I have to wonder how long that will last, and I don't have the abilty to escape.
The PTB have been digging underground living quarters, with their own water supply, electricity, food supply, everything, for a disaster such as this. The New Denver Airport's underground is HUGE...google if you don't know--- and the Queen has purchased property on a mountain in Colorado with underground facilities, as Britain is a low lying country, and might disappear as Florida is expected to.
This is really serious and I feel so helpless for everyone! Will anarchy break out?
It's being said that only because people have guns that this hasn't been worse, sooner. It's only these past 15 months of being laid up, that gave me to time to research all this, whereas most people have been going about their daily business and the real truths are not in the general Media. Even images from satellites have been doctored.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP4IykqSuRA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP4IykqSuRA)
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Hi Izzy,
I could add many more stories of insult and injury to what you have heard, but I try to restrict my news coverage to what I can truly do something about. It is possible that at some point in our history, only the rich will survive an ecological disaster in caves or remote islands, but their lives won't be a piece of cake either. Even an N needs peons to keep their world going round! Those talking heads on TV and in the press who spend their time writing and speaking only about what is wrong with people and don't address underlying issues that empower them are not doing me a service. Constant bad news weighs heavily on our health.
I could list a hundred terrible things I've learned about "what is wrong" though this disaster, but my greatest concern is not about the blatantly evil people, it is about the average person who will not renounce a way of living that gives power to these institutions. I have always lived modestly, bought fuel efficient vehicles and every year I try to teach a new group of students what critical thinking is and how to use it.
In spite of the admittedly awful job our government is doing with this oil spill and the protection it has afforded BP on many fronts, I am most concerned by my states lack of proactive economic incentives. We could be doing many things with the BP monies. Not the least of these would be creating inland fish hatcheries that use filtered gulf water to raise healthy new sea life. We can easily become so angry and focused on who is to blame that we forget the small things that can and should to be done to begin restoration efforts.
S
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Right Sealynx
--and I am googling about Canada all the time to see where we stand because in the end the entire world will be affected in some way.
Right now for me, it is who to trust, as we've had 2 Prime Ministers who have betrayed Canada, and the first was to allow a central banking system as the Fed is in the USA. On my Internet travels, I see many who have not even seen the light. I try to see what out current Prime minister is up to and nothing, but I keep googling
I can be selfish and think about my money, my home, my car---and I try to tell my daughter to watch out, but she doesn't want to discuss this, as she has been too busy with work, children and living life to pay attention to what is really happening. I worry more about her and my grandchildren in the long run, as they will live longer than I will.
This is still to me about Narcissists and we have not just one or two on a small scale but a huge number on a large scale who can plan these disasters....just as one N can plan a disaster for his spouse or family, and we all know how difficult it is to 'fight' his superiority and lack of empathy, who takes the money and runs---the person/world is in a bind!
It is said that just one person can make a difference, but I wouldn't know where to start and I have all the time in the world, just sitting here and wondering what any one person can do.
Just ridding the USA of its President won't even make a dent, as the higher ups who pull his strings will still be there.
Yet I cannot really conceive of the idea that this is the end of the world (as we know it, maybe) but the Illumiinati is not going to allow themselves to be killed-- they will have their 13 bloodlines to repopulate the world with their blueblood.
I read Aldous Huxley's Brave New World, written in 1932, and it spells out a scenario, that is apparently something he knew about what the future would be like, just about one step above where we are now, and babies were bred in jugs, for their positions as peons, even ones chosen to be 'idiots', but there were people from the Old World who were not affected.
but I am at a point that I cannot just turn a bliind eye! The FEMA camps scare me to death for the regular guy, as they who are incarcerated, and live, will be the slaves, I expect.
HAARP caused the 2004 tsunami, guided Hurricane Katrina into Louisiana, 2005, caused the Haitian earthquake--was that just last year or? (I lost some time after the accident) and now many more lives lost or to be lost from the poisons.... Georgia Guidestones orders to bring Earth to a population of ½ billion only.
When it comes to fear that I have had all my life, whether tucked away or right up front, I tell myself to not evacuate--just sit and take what comes.
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Izzy,
I certainly applaud you Canadians who are fighting the good fight now, when you first see your government becoming like ours! I have several friends in Canada and one in particular is very angry about many recent changes, especially the G20 stuff. Keep Canada Canadian! I may need to retire there one day!!.
P.S. I'll bring my own money!
S
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Darn it!--or worse if I could post !@#$%^&*&^%$#@!
http://www.canada.com/news/Drilling+underway+Canada+deepest+well/3013186/story.html (http://www.canada.com/news/Drilling+underway+Canada+deepest+well/3013186/story.html)
Chevron Canada (http://Canada) Limited has a 50 per cent stake in the venture. Other participants include Shell Canada Energy, ExxonMobil Canada Ltd. and Imperial Oil Resources Ventures Limited.
I just found this. We are drilling in the North Atlantic and it is to be deeper down than BP drilled.
That's one kilometer (3,280 feet) deeper than the well that was being drilled by the Deepwater Horizon rig before it ruptured, gushing an estimated 210,000 gallons of crude into the Gulf of Mexico each day.
I just hope that we haven't beed keeping bad company, somewhere, and get pulled in, but then we have never been consodered a super-power to be destroyed.
Our government began to change about 1970 and there they are attempting a deeper drill.
I so dislike change. I wanted the status quo some time ago. It's like, stop the world, I want to get off and catch my breath, mull around about things, alone and uninterrupted, then climb back on and be better prepared, but it goes to fast for me.
Come on ahead, as there is plenty of room in Northern Canada. We have a gorgeous country, but I have also seen breathtaking scenes in the USA. They're God's countries and the 'satanists' are trying to destroy everything....all for money greed, power, control.
IZ
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Remember the saying: "May you live in interesting times"?
Well, I think we are living in interesting times.
I think that if I allowed myself to feel anything in reaction to this oil spill, I would implode into a dark hole.
Everyday I'm looking for the smallest glimmers of light in my life. I don't look to the news for that.
Human beings interfere too much with too many things.
I heard recently that scientists are now genetically engineering fish to mature faster so they can turn a profit faster in the fish markets.
I wonder if some of these fish get into the wild what will that do to the ecosystem?
I lost my faith in humanity a long time ago.
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FINALLY! someone said what I've been too afraid to say out loud or online: "government by narcissists for narcissists".
But, one thing I do believe (pollyanna-ish, I know) is that while we live in "interesting times" for sure - and dangerous times as well - the pendulum of change and balance will swing back the other way....... eventually. And it is up to us "little people" to spread sanity and random acts of kindness... when the opportunity presents itself. That may seem like a pebble in the ocean... but that ripple does spread and grow into a decent size wave.
And from what I have seen - Mother Nature can take care of herself better than humans can imagine and she does, on a regular basis. We should be figuring out how to "live WITH" nature... and not think we know the right thing to protect, to artificially manage, or flat out know enough (scientifically or even morally) to be able to "know" what the right "balance of nature" is. The whole of that system is too complex, too chaotic, too large even... to comprehend with a human sensibility. The time-scale may not be convenient to humans - or the method could be life-threatening.... it is the role of humans to adapt and they do it well.
However, the governmental issues are another story. Kinda hard to adapt when you are heard, only to be dismissed as not knowing right from wrong or acknowledged as smart enough to know what you want - or to know a lie when you hear it. I don't like groups of frightened people with guns. I don't want to live in a fortress (even though subconsciously, I've been working on just that). And I completely disagree with the government's premise that it needs to take more of everyone's income (thru taxes) to pay for an aggrandized version of what it believes government can do better than society at large. Capitalism & our form of democracy is far from perfect - it's just better than the alternatives and it's true that some large corporations become corrupted with powerful delusions... but not all.
But please don't let the talking heads with their "catastrophic" talk about worst-case scenarios push you away from being able to see what is still "right" with the world... people... society... and yes, even government & large corporations. It ain't ALL bad news... but they are paid to make you think and feel that it is.... and propaganda is designed to either scare the crap out of people, confuse them, or get them to "give up".
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I've had similar feelings for the past couple years, Izzy.
That things are going to get very upside down.
It made me feel better to prepare a bit for uncertain times.
I bought three 5 gallon buckets for storing 3 months supply of food, spices, batteries, medications, vitamins, tea, small bills, a water filtering system and baby wipes: / We had lots of jerkey, different dried "peas" (cause they take less time to cook than beans) and rice. Making sure you provide familiar comfort foods is very important also.
I stopped short of purchasing the little bucket toilet with a seat and waste waste disposal bags used on airplanes (one bag for number 1 and one for number 2) you can line your regular toilet with plastic bags then tie them off. I also researched, but didn't purchase, the tiny camping stove with a fan that burns anything (pinecones, twigs,etc.) which brings water to the boil very quickly. It was like $80.00 ACK: / About the size of a tin can, really. Stocking the other things, and researching how to survive a crisis, really brought down my anxiety levels though. Did you know you can prepare acorns many different ways and survive on them? The large ones are from white oaks and the smaller ones (more bitter) are from red oaks. Who knew? Since I live on the edge of a forest preserve, I found that interesting.
That said, I used the buckets as a pantry for a while, which is a good way to monitor what you use and replenish those items regularly. If you aren't going to rotate the dried peas and rice, you need to put them in the freezer for a week or so, to kill the buggies that might hatch. Alas, the buckets are pretty empty right now. My anxiety levels have leveled off.
Addressing some of these shelter in place issues might help you with your anxiety, Izz.
You can pull up information on the internet to figure out your needs.
::Picturing Izzy wheeling around 90 gallon jugs of water in her neat little apartment::
I'm sorry you're feeling so vulnerable Izzy, but you certainly have a right to those feelings and to deal with them.
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While we are discussing survival you might enjoy this local new media info on how seafood from the gulf is being "tested". If you can't smell the oil or dispersant it ain't there?? As much as the economy of my state depends on it, this is crazy. My guess is they are promoting the "everything is fine" to get BP off the hook.
http://www.wwltv.com/news/gulf-oil-spill/DHH-LA-Seafood-Passes-Sniff-Test-98550689.html
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I've had similar feelings for the past couple years, Izzy.
That things are going to get very upside down.
When you say that things are going to get very upside down Mo2, that resonates with me. This morning while I was walking down the sidewalk I was considering how human logic/minds, seem to have undergone a "a gravitational polar shift" of logic.
After reading this post yesterday about the oil spill, I had a dream last night about a baby dolphin I found out of water laying dehydrated under a table.
For some reason, intuitively speaking I don't feel bad about the overall outcome of the oil spill (not to be rude to the people who are living in the disaster area), but I sense that possibly this will be a so called "tipping point" that Americans so desperately need. It is such a visable dirty mess, maybe, unfortunately something really bad has to happen before people WAKE the F UP. Humanity as a whole needs to become disgusted enough with itself?
Some say that there will be a whole generation of cancers that result from this mess resulting from the carcinogens precipitating up and back out through the weather patterns....Who knows?
Some say the humans who can live through all of our own pollution will be the "new species of humans" with the right genetic traits to survive into the future....?
FAST PROFIT at any human or environmental cost is NAR-Behavior isn't it? Because there is no consideration for the consequences even to the greater community. Communities are suppose to be self-regulating. Are they not?
Have humans grown into such a large mass that they can not truly self-regulate?
I would imagine that in a tribal unit when the greater health or wellbeing of the whole community is jeopardized by one of the members that member loses social status within that community......??
BP, should lose respect, but it wont turn out that way because it's as if the large companies are the chiefs of the community.
Not only is the environment unhealthy, its unhealthy for the humans, it results from unhealthy community self regulating behaviors.
I have no idea. The other day I was in a cafe, a couple let their two little boys pee all over the floor in the restroom, the father walked in and saw what they had done. Then I used the restroom. The father didn't even bother to grab a paper towel and wipe the floor up where the two boys had managed to piss all across the floor of the whole restroom?? I mean not just a dribble but a water pistol shoot-out in the bathroom. The mentality???
People have just lost any type of social etiquette and self respect or respect for others. IT's the modern culture.
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Muffin Buster, your point about community is (I think) the key. What used to be known as the "common good" for neighborhoods, small towns, cities, states & the country as a whole has been wiped out in the tension between that basic concept and individualism - an "every man, woman & child for themselves" attitude. Where "I" matter more than "Us".
The same kind of balancing act or tension exists between individual boundaries and FOOs, too. Sometimes "Us" takes over and consumes or overrides an "I"... and vice versa.
What troubles me greatly, in observing our government in action, is precisely the same kinds of dysfunction that we discuss here on a more personal scale. It seems there must always be a scapegoat - someone to "blame" - and even after that entity has been tarred & feathered in the media and fined, the government denies any responsibility for their own blindness in oversight, no "we didn't even think of that possibility", or "OOOPS! We made a mistake and that [fill in the blank] decision|law|regulation or lack thereof obviously set up conditions for what happened later." No, "we're sorry" ... ever... from the government, for it's own participation, collaboration, or manipulation that contributed to a problem or exacerbated it.
Also troubling, is the expansion of the role government (in general) seems to be attributing to itself. As if, ordinary people and business owners are unable to take care of themselves and regulate themselves within commonly acceptable standards. (of course not - they need scapegoats!!) And while there are extensive arguments for that position... when you start asking "why can't these people take care of themselves"? You begin to see where the government's policies and this expansion of it's role (intrusion, to my way of thinking) into our own self-sufficiency is actually fostering a society that is dependent on a patriarchal government that isn't truly fit for the role it's aggrandizing attitude is attempting to impose on it's citizens.
Traditionally, the role of government is rather limited: national security, interstate commerce, etc. And it was the Community as a self-sufficient living breathing entity that regulated, prescribed, nurtured, and supported itself with the resources available to it. I think there needs to be revival of terminally-ill concept of community... a "get to know your neighbor" campaign... a lending a helping hand movement (without expectation of glory or recompense)... a "we're all in this together" grassroots movement to take care of each other, and by so doing - mutually prosper.
OK, that's it. All I have to say on this subject... y'all can have the soapbox back now.
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After reading this thread I think I'll grow a long scraggly beard and start walking around with one of those "The End is Near!" signs.
Personally I'm neither a socialist nor a fascist; I'm a Neumanist:
(http://www.1440wallstreet.com/images/alfred_e_neuman.jpg)
mud
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PR,
I was reading something the other day and I can't even tell you where at this point. Probably some article from the NY Times. It made a good point. It said that our greatest mathematical minds used to create things, now many of these geniuses are creating financial instruments on Wall Street. They are the ones coming up with brilliant strategies like betting on the failure of their own instruments to make money regardless of what happens.
These geniuses are the reason we need regulations. We are no longer dealing with what the "common man" or the "average person" can understand. Most people aren't even able to tell you the exact terms of their cell phone contract (try to get a hard copy-they won't give you one!!). How many ordinary people whose only "loan education" came from a banking officer, agreed to impossible terms they could not possibly adhere to and lost their homes? Life has become much too complex to navigate without intelligent oversight by a neutral agency. We can't all be experts on finance, pesticides, the lead content of children's toys, and whether a drug is safe. We can no longer trust corporations to do this for us. They have a team of lawyers ready to cover their tracks even when caught red handed.
We have come to a point where we can't trust corporations to treat us fairly and even when government regulations exist big corporations circumvent them by having their people appointed to make only regulations that favor them. They even intimidate those on a local level who would try to protect us. Look at the doctors who have come forward complaining that lAVANDIA was harming their patients? Letters were sent to their hospitals telling them to stop these physicians from speaking out against the harm they were seeing. I now wonder if my own father's heart condition was not caused by this drug!
The recent supreme court decision stating that corporations have the same rights as people is especially frightening. How many of us can afford our own lobbyists to make deals in Washington? The problem is that people do not have the same rights or access to knowledge and consultants that corporations have. We need to have someone in our corner who can truly provide the kind of advice that leads to informed consent. That means an independent advisory board that can see through the spin, control the self-serving legal agreements and afford us some protection to freely live our lives. Unfortunately there is no money to be made in doing this and corporations have the money to out gun individuals who speak out as they did with the physicians. We need honest government made up of common people with uncommon dedication and we can expect that should they run, they will be subjected to smear campaigns of every sort by those who want to "maintain" control of our regulatory bodies.
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I appreciate everyone's response on this thread. You are saying what I have going around in my mind, but don't have the ability to put to paper. I live in my thoughts, more or less.
With one Narcisssit, he can put such a spin on an issue, that it make you feel nuts, and stupid, and can seem beyond you.
With the highly educated, yes... they have such insight into everything, it seems, and it is beyond us. They really know how to be evil crooks and cover their butts.
In both cases it is about power and control.
I've thought, perhaps would say, if there are family members who fight, or neighbours who fight, it just gets bigger so that countries fight (war) but after all my research online, I see that there just has to be CONTROL, of everyone by the CORPORATIONS, which are inter-owned by all the billionaires in the world (The Illuminati) and it appears they have no empathy, so they have no problem killing millions of people at a time. I can only go by what I read, see on videos, and hear on internet radio, but who to really belive. I just believe that so many past events were staged--my suspicions arose with JFK's assissination. Since all possibilties for the reasoning of that, and the people involved have been released, I began to take more notice, and I wonder how we will fare, what we can do.
Can the USA start another revolution?
It disturbs me to hear that all the young Americans are overseas fighting the war(s) while Russian and German? soldiers are present in Canada and the USA, at the ready for killing us, as Americans might find difficult to do.
Is Florida really going to disappear into the ocean? That is horrendous!!!! Perhaaps G-d meant for that oil to remain there undisturbed!
Then I hear that oil runs under the earth as far as California and it, as well, can drop into the earth---Google 'sinkholes'. It's awful. Unbelievable until one sees a picture.
So I think of the N I was with, the N my daughter married and the end result is.... we are all equal when it comes to the threat that is hanging over our heads! There is no way these individual Ns can be superior to/exempted from ... what is happening!
Being that I live alone, I must depend upon the kindness of strangers, or in this case, a validation on a forum of strangers that there are others who feel the threat/the evil that exists.
Thank You
Izzy
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This is a Youtube link, to part 1, that helps me settle down because of the calmness with which these men discuss the situation. There are 12 parts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJWLbgsOfLE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJWLbgsOfLE)
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LOL mud!! If we couldn't laugh, we'd all go insane!
I really don't think the situation is nearly as dire as the propaganda makes it sound. The problem is, though: believing in the propaganda. Who said: "T'ain't necessarily so"? I want to shake his/her hand and buy him/her a beverage.
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After reading this thread I think I'll grow a long scraggly beard and start walking around with one of those "The End is Near!" signs.
Personally I'm neither a socialist nor a fascist; I'm a Neumanist:
(http://www.1440wallstreet.com/images/alfred_e_neuman.jpg)
mud
YES, Mud!
We were missing the scraggly sign carrying bearded guy; )
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Sealynx,
Your comment about why we need regulations "These geniuses are the reason we need regulations."
We do need the regulations to control corporations. But then we also criticize the politicians who work for more regulations.
Seems like the goal of government and corporations is to make us all so crazy and confused. This whole thing reminds me of my N family and their toxic behavior. The corporation has their culture and they groom their employees. The political parties have their rants and indoctrinate their followers with slogans.
Maybe I'm looking through those rose-colored glasses. I believe in the human spirit and strength. It's all a circle. The circle of life. As it has been with my own life. Surging forward, feeling strength. Meeting an obstacle, being pushed back, feeling bad. Overcoming it, feeling good. Surging forward, feeling strength. Meeting an obstacle..................and on and on. And on.
Maybe modern man just wants things too easy. Or maybe having things too easy has made us restless.
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Logy,
Most of the things we don't understand are not part of the circle of life. When the banks supposedly went under (only to take our billions and pay bonuses!) the birds still sang, food still grew and water still flowed. The problem is that we have a culture that bears no resemblance to nature. If you think about it, unless a person has money they can't even run off into the forest and live like an American Indian. They'd be arrested as a vagrant and fined for hunting and fishing without a license!!
Most people also don't understand how marketing and PR work though the gulf oil spill has given some valuable lessons. I've heard more die hard Dems and Reps saying they now don't believe either side has the answer. To me that is good news. Both sides appealed to emotion rather than providing real solutions and as things stand they always oppose each other rather than trying to find the best solution. It is like asking Toyota to say Nissan makes a good car.
Politicians also pick simple emotional issues to campaign on rather than talking about the hard stuff. Real health care reform would be too much of a threat to corporate medicine and big insurance. Real financial reform would be too much of a threat to Wall Street firms. So they do simple things that in the end don't do much but sound good to the average person. Amazon has a really good Video on Demand right now called Money Medicine. It costs $1.99 to watch and talks about some very interesting topics in medicine that most folks have never thought about and no politician will be discussing any time soon.
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the birds still sang, food still grew and water still flowed. The problem is that we have a culture that bears no resemblance to nature. If you think about it, unless a person has money they can't even run off into the forest and live like an American Indian. They'd be arrested as a vagrant and fined for hunting and fishing without a license!!
Americans boast about the ideal of Freedom though despite the above statement. People seem to hang on to the word freedom, but I don't even know what the greater philosophy behind "American Freedom" is. I'm not a history buff. I think it would be a good thing for an author to write about, the evolution of so called American Freedom.
Humans have domesticated themselves just like live stock are domesticated. Feral humans would be threatening to the social structure. A person can't even dance weird without drawing attention and ridicule, there is no stepping out of line.
I've been reading about two different families who both moved from the big city and into rural areas to start farming and they MUST have other sources of income to live a rural life. They are not really making a living off of the land, instead they have hobby-farms. It is quite expensive for them to "live close to the land", playing at being "self sufficient". It seems to be a privilege to play at living a simple, "humble" life.
Modern life seems to be a web of entanglement of contrived complications that only can be escaped with the aid of money, private airplanes and lawyers. Modern life is a game for the wealthy from my perspective, but that is how humanity has always been. A game, played and won by the wealthy, the soldiers, the worker-bees, the peasants, the scapegoats, the grunts, the laborers are not pulling the strings.
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Seems like the goal of government and corporations is to make us all so crazy and confused.
Yes, I think it is to their benefit to have a public that is disoriented, unfocused, distracted.
What is quite ironic to me is that these people who are top-level employees at these companies that exploit the natural resources are also the people who own multiple houses nestled in expensive excluded communities in the most beautiful pristine areas, they do own yachts that they take through beautiful oceans and they own sail boats. They simply don't sail through the gulf oil-spill, they go somewhere else. They ruin the environment and make people sick but they can afford to travel to wonderful places where THEY can breath fresh air and drink clean water. They have the best doctors that money can afford. They send their children to the best schools that money can afford. They get all their money from exploitation. They go on expensive fishing trips, they pay to have helicopters drop them into remote wilderness areas and they can pay for all of this with the money they make on oil.
They don't have to live mired in their own mess day after day. They don't get their hands dirty do they, I mean are they down there themselves cleaning up the oil of course they are not. They are clean, on a golf course.
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“Religion begat prosperity and the daughter devoured the mother.”
Cotton Mather
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My guess is that most people who romanticise the natural life without all of the modern complications usually haven't lived it.
It was however the common lot of man back when David Hobbes noted that the majority of men lived lives that were "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish and short".
It might be helpful to note that while many people in modern economies say that living primitively is superior, almost none actually make a bona fide attempt, but many millions of people living without what we take for granted are willing to risk life and limb crossing oceans and deserts to escape the Hobbesian world they were born in.
mud
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When I think of backing away from the evil side of capitalism I don't think of the ideal of the "Marlboro Man" and his family setting off to a farm. Part of the problem I see with American Society is this ideal of rugged individualism that never did work. It suggests that if you can't make is alone you are doggie doo.
I think more in terms of gradual alliances being formed at a less costly and more productive level of employee owned companies. For instance I saw something on a "taxi cab" collective. A group of drivers got together who each owned their own cab. They formed a company and as time past included a mechanic and a dispatcher and split the profits equally. As the group got larger they could add their own gas pump and have fleet insurance. The idea is that they don't go to the level where they start paying people to sit home and share in their profit by buying stock. That is what makes most companies come to value money over people.
Overtime they may contract to buy food from a group of people who like to farm so they don't have to buy the pesticide and hormone laden food produced by Conagra. This is the exact opposite of the American Dream of Great Gatsby fame.
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SIGH... ain't it awful?
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The idea is that they don't go to the level where they start paying people to sit home and share in their profit by buying stock.
Unfortunately for the taxi drivers a small employee owned company is not capable of producing taxi cabs. Or the earth movers and pavers which build the roads the taxis drive on. Or of filling the office buildings with employees for the cab drivers to drive around.
There's a reason there are public corporations; it's the only way to get big enough to do those things which require more capital than a few cab drivers banding together. And shareholders don't just sit back and soak up profits. If they invest poorly they sit back and absorb losses. Either way they are providing liquidity to provide products and services that otherwise couldn't be provided.
Big companies that make things like transportation and drugs and fuel are easy to blame for all sorts of ills until our kid cuts his femoral artery playing American Indian in the woods and we need a Sikorsky helicopter full of Exxon-Mobil JP4 jet fuel taking the kid to an HMO where he's pumped full of Big Pharma antibiotics to prevent an infection from killing him.
I don't think there is some ideal middle ground where we get the benefits of modernity without the costs.
mud
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I don't think there is some ideal middle ground where we get the benefits of modernity without the costs.
Sure there is! It's called Scandinavia.
:)
Hops
PS--I wanna go back to Sweden. But not in winter!
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Sure there is! It's called Scandinavia.
You mean the home of tiny companies like Volvo and Saab which produce not only autos and fume belching semis but warplanes? Or Ikea which reportedly makes its furniture from wood? Or Valmet and others which produce forest gobbling machines which log the wood for Ikea? Or Husqvarna which makes the smelly smoking two stroke chainsaws to cut down the forsts?
Or do you mean Norway which reaps gigantic profits from vast North Sea oil exploitation?
Or Iceland which managed to produce a financial catastrophe of their own, considerably worse per capita than anything the US has seen?
Between all of them they have a bit more than half the population of California so I question whether their per capita pollution or other modern problems are less than anywhere else. And they fairly uniformly have rather high rates of suicide and alcoholism so not too sure if they've hit the sweet spot. And considering the growing cultural clashes now occurring with their rapidly expanding Muslim populations I doubt it's going to be getting any sweeter any time soon.
mud
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Hops and Mud,
This was an eye=opener! And right on topic too....Scandinavia has its struggles just like we all do. Just funny what theirs look like!
CB
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/21/world/europe/21iht-LETTER.html?_r=1
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And I believe that this post is not appropriate for this site. This is not designed for political comments. When I come to this site I expect to have support and offer support to people dealing with narcissism in their lives.
I agree Logy. I didn't come here to see our president compared to a Nazi who sent 17 million Jews to their death. I'm outta here for now. I've felt comfortable on this board for many years. That just changed.
Kathy
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My interest in this is a question about why the "common guy" is not able or willing to mobilize his energy towards his own best interests?
In my mind, personally, it is not a question for me about which politician is the better politician, but rather something along the lines of: within this current culture and social structure, how does a person maintain their sense of integrity and humanness in a world that appears to be degrading the higher aspects of what it even means to be human (something more then fearful, fighting animals).
I think that listening to the news can make a person feel crazy sometimes because of all the chaos. It is reminiscent of the feeling of being around Narcissists. Many people can start to feel overwhelmed by what is in the news/current events. Aside from talking about it or voting, many individuals really can't or don't make a difference so people have frustration and a helplessness of witnessing it.
The news and television are a one-way portal, we can not stick our hands into the television and fix it, and despite reducing, reusing and recycling and volunteering...one's actions don't yield much rewards...in reality.
Personally, I have volunteered, I have worked for non-profits, I have worked for big corps., I havent driven a vehicle in over a decade, I don't feel that anything I have done has made one iota of a difference.
Some of these conspiracy theories are very compelling, I don't believe everything I hear, yet at the same time I know enough about life to understand that corrupt things are happening.
Like you Izzy, I can not build an underground shelter to crawl into. Hopefully "armageddon" will not happen in your life time.
Go drink a beer. :)
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Hi Just Kathy,
"...a fascist Obama, just like a fascist Hitler and a fascist Mussolini."
Only one person’s opinion/voice and not shared by me. Actually, many Israelis (but not American Jews who were supporters in the last election) consider Obama to be too far to the left (hardly a fascist), and fiddling while Israel is about to burn—you may want to look at this blog:
http://jgcaesarea.blogspot.com/
Since we’ve talked about the narcissism of leaders and corporate executives, I think the topic is OK. I hope you stick around!
Best,
Richard
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I am Jewish so I can say this. I hate to see fellow Jews on Obama's side. The night Obama won, I could not sleep all night cuz I knew we--Americans and Jews --were in Trouble.
Ami
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And I believe that this post is not appropriate for this site. This is not designed for political comments. When I come to this site I expect to have support and offer support to people dealing with narcissism in their lives.
I agree Logy. I didn't come here to see our president compared to a Nazi who sent 17 million Jews to their death. I'm outta here for now. I've felt comfortable on this board for many years. That just changed.
Kathy
to each his own...
I have already said my piece, in essence, (who's) whose life is in danger from the actions of the Narcissists running a large Corporation and perhaps lying to us while putting our lives in danger.... while they have underground cities to run to in case of total destruction above ground.
Whose life is in danger from living with just one Narcissist who lies to you and you go crazy or become paranoid, sometime with good reason, that he might kill you, and still lie enough to get away with it?
If one cannot see the comparison in the bigger picture from just one's life then maybe one had better check on one's own understanding of other people's lives!
When I learned of Narcissism in my life, I learned how to deal with it.... and now I see it on such a large scale I wonder what will happen to all of us who have fought do hard to put our lives together, when the World is loaded with liars and Narcissists, big corporations, central banks, and don't give a hoot for the rest of us. It's their down dirty values, willing to kill anyone and everyone who gets in theirselfish, money-gribbing psychopathic ways.
I told my daughter I was going to get a gun, a cross, a bible and------ a life, I hoped!
Pray to Yahweh and Jesus, I saw on one site. I really don't know what to believe now, but I expect that there is Someone, Somewhere Who will see us through this mess.
I say one thing: I don't think I was put through 2 heavy duty accidents to still live, and then find out about the Ns in my life to survive them, just to get enslaved by a cabal of half human, half alien beings!
Thank you Dr. G.
Izzy
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Considering how similar threads have melted down in the past I'm amazed and encouraged, despite the large variety of opinions here, at how calm and respectful the discussion and reaction has been even with some pretty provocative statements.
Hope nobody leaves over it.
I don't think Obama is a fascist by any stretch of the imagination.
And I won't argue Doc G's implication that fascism is of the right rather than the left, but will only note that I disagree and I think history demonstrates otherwise.
mud
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...........lying to us while putting our lives in danger.... while they have underground cities to run to in case of total destruction above ground.....
Izzy, I have listened to radio-talk-programs that discuss this exact thing. I have felt disgust over this in the past.
One of the companies that I worked for had issues with bomb-scares. I didn't understand why for a long time, but eventually I understood that there were customers who were treated so unfairly that the company would get targeted. Even irate customers don't have an effect on the core beliefs of these people though.
Each time there was an article in the news that was related to the company, the company would scramble on emergency mode to respond with their own statement that they wanted the customers read. People are influenced by what is in print in magazines or in the news but the sources of the printed material and news are human generated by people who have their own agendas. The people who are part of the game just laugh knowingly.
I personally do agree with some of what I hear on these radio shows, I know some of these less then mainstream concepts to be true. There is a tremendous effort and energy that goes into keeping certain things (and people) quiet and covered up.
I'm glad there are people who will explore the unknown.
I also hear some things on these radio shows that almost give me nightmares. I hear about sasquaches, chupacabras, vampires, aliens, and various types of monsters and after hearing that I don't want to turn the light off when I go to sleep at night just like a kid, I think to myself "what if an alien-vampire-chupacabra-politician is flying outside my window peering in at me while I'm falling asleep waiting to suck my brains out?"
Out of kindness to myself sometimes I just have to turn it off. I think part of what makes those types of radio shows so exciting is the creepy factor. Sometimes those radio shows intersperse real scientists with other people who are more like hobbyists or more science-fictiony.
I can't think of anything scarier then a Narcissistic Alien government. :shock:
Well, actually I guess there are worse things then a Narcissistic Alien government.
Wealthy Japanese people purchase the body organs from executed Chinese prisoners. To me, that is about as amoral as it gets, one of the worst examples of benefiting from others misfortune. It's pretty intense. I think the world is an ugly place sometimes when I'm not watching the beautiful sunrise over the water.
Maybe this is why Narcissistic people have children--it's for the organs.
I'm sort of kidding, but I think my mother actually believes I might donate an organ to her if she needed one. I think that is why she sometimes pretends to be nice to me, it's because she wants to rip my beating heart out of my chest right at the moment she is about to have a heart attack. HAAAA! I've had an an epiphany.
I ask myself: Why even pretend to be sane anymore.
If anyone out there actually believes in morality or the goodness of humans then watch the PBS documentary on the history of lobotomies that were performed on populations who had the least power: people in mental institutions, elderly & children.
It's not as if there are just a few messed up people in this world, it seems that every person is capable of allowing bad things to happen if not being a participant or an instigator.
Nurses helped with unnecessary lobotomies that seemed to be more like a weird circus stage performance. The doctor hammered icepicks into peoples eye sockets and somehow he convinced his colleagues that it was a legitimate way to heal people.
Being a human being is disgusting, I want to be a tree rooted somewhere far, far away from humans.
I wish I could CHOOSE, have a CHOICE about not being connected to a narcissist in some way, in this spiderweb network of life, but I think it is impossible, every big company and every government and even every little town's community council is going to have a sneering narcissist sitting at the front of the table where decisions are being made about the world that I have to live in since, unfortunately I am human instead of alien.
I hear people saying the phrase a lot lately about "you always have the choice".. It's not true. I didn't have a CHOICE as a kid to get away from my Narcisistic mother. A regular-joe-blow person can't get away from the power of billionaires either!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
AHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Laugh uncontrolably
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Marshall McLuhan would have a field day, with our current popular media. Especially the "news" channels. Like the Weather Channel hosts, who turn a normal summer thunderstorm into a "SEEK SHELTER" warning - I've noticed that the underlying emotion of the sound of everyone's "voices" on these programs are making even sleep-inducing country commissioners meetings sound like the end is near... No one calmly reports plain facts anymore... No one can discuss issues without picking a side first to join and then, through their persuasive argument or through connecting with a fear or belief of the viewer, reinforce it. Just listen to the sound of their voices and emotional message contained in the inflection - without listening to the words. You'll hear it:
urgency
alert!!
catastrophe
seek shelter now
the end is near
All this intensity only serves to keep a person glued to the set or video or radio and dampening the mental challenge of thinking it through, processing the impact of the information in the overall scheme of things... and making the person's pulse race and all of us adrenalin addicts. Keeping a person glued to the set is the real purpose of this vocal technique, you know. So you are also exposed to the advertising. The very same people who are relaying all this "news" depend on the very corporate sponsors they are progandizing against. Politically, every politician utilizes propaganda as a tool to gain support for whatever bill or viewpoint or inquisition they currently believe in. Politics has come to equal popularity, too much.
Progaganda isn't the same as truth, facts or reality. It always has an emotional component to it. Subtle, but still there. It's work to not let it scare the hell out of me - but then, it's my well-being and peace of mind they're trying to upset.
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If one cannot see the comparison in the bigger picture from just one's life then maybe one had better check on one's own understanding of other people's lives!
Since you quoted me above this statement, I have to assume that this is directed at me. If it was meant to hurt me, you succeeded.
I came here yesterday to do what I have done for years, seek advice and guidance concerning a serious problem with my N mother. Instead, I found something that I felt belonged on a Fox News message board, that made me feel uncomfortable. I stated that I was uncomfortable, and you're saying what? That I'm ignorant?
I will come back later and properly thank those who have given me so much help, support, and friendship over the years, but I can't do that now.
For what it's worth, the reason I am uncomfortable with this thread is because two months ago, I was assaulted by two grown men outside of a grocery store here in Arizona. Why? Because I still have an Obama campaign sticker on my car. I still see Bush/Cheney stickers on cars, and have a opinion about that, but would never wish bodily harm on anyone because they exercised their freedom of speech, or their right to support the candidate of their choice. This has not been a good time for my husband and I, with the assault, in combination with other issues going on in Arizona. We have placed our house up for sale and plan on moving back to California. (And no, I did not speak of the incident here, because I felt this was not an appropriate forum to discuss political hatred and violence).
So go ahead, get your bible and your gun, and maybe you too can attack a little 105 lb. woman in a parking lot, if it helps you feel better.
I need someone to help me feel better. This used to be where I came for that. Now I just feel lost.
Thanks Izzy. Thanks a lot.
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Dear Kathy,
I am so sorry to have hurt you. I never meant to and was introducing my thoughts on our 'lives in our own little world' in comparison to our 'lives as part of nearly 7 billion people here on Earth', controlled by Narcissists/Psychopaths. I am SO sorry!!!
I just lost my first long post to you, right after spell check so won't run that, and wonder if I can remember it all. Yes I did quote you, without applying your name.
I have been sitting at home since the car struck me in March, 2009 and have just been in bed and my wheelchair (41 years now for the 'chair and where do I run to? Nowhere!)
When I left the N, 2002, the only available aprtment for me was just 1½ blocks away from him and I was safe. I still am in that respect......
...but all these almost 16 months of recuperating, after the car struck me, I have doone nothing but lie in bed and sit in my 'chair--at the computer and I began to research conspiracy theories, from JFK forward until I found answers enough to know they WERE conspiracies. We are in the midst of another conspiracy and that is the whole of earth's population under the control of Narcissistic Psychopaths who have no qualms about killing innocent people to have their own way, conquer countries, for their minerals, oil and diamonds and reduce the population to just 500,000,000 (on Georgia Guidestones)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojyBTAuv8Uc&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojyBTAuv8Uc&feature=related)
while they, The Illuminati have underground housing to save theselves; THAT is Narcissism to the Nth degree.
New Denver Airport is in this list
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Bases.html (http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Bases.html)
and the Queen, being close to the top of the freemason conspirators has purchased property in Colorado, above ground and underground.
I am sorry you were assaulted. Obama has been losing in popularity for some time, as people are waking up and realizing all his lies. He is a puppet who's strings are being pulled by the Illumintati, and he dances to their tune and says what they want. He was groomed for President for 30 years. People are becoming very angry, and if you think, we are just as helpless there, as we were at times with the N in our lives.
That was the point of my introducing this thread.... Narcissicm on a grand scale, and whose life was in danger from the oil in the gulf-- another setup?, like 9-11? I am Canadian, but I don't know what would happen if nobody voted for anyone in an election.
Just wait until THEY pull their "invasion from outer space"... that's the scuttlebutt, for all of us to be begging for help and doing what they say!
If you think I am making this up, just google anything and find what the Internet says, as the media is controlled, TV, radio and newspapers. Rupert Murdoch. None of this is released to the press.
Again, I am sorry, and hope you understand what I meant by checking on others' lives, as a whole, you included.
Regards
Izzy
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In regards to my last post, I am concerned for my daughter and grandchildren if all this comes about without an uprising from the people. I asked her permission to send her documentation on how "history is all a lie" and she said it was OK, but to not expect a 'debate' on it.
I also mentioned parts to my sister and some scared her so much, that I stopped.
I sent a link to my brother (we are 5 siblings, 68-75 years of age with children and grandchildren) and he never replied---a first for him.
Maybe they all think I have lost my mind, but I am the only one I know who has 24 hours a day on my hands to have delved into this, while others are busy living their lives and perhaps only watch the 6:00 pm news and that's it.
The decadency that has now pervaded the music and movie industry is phenomenal (all owned by the Illuminati) and does anyone know about "HAARP" in Alaska, that can create tsunamis, 2004, hurricanes (Katrina), 2005, and earthquakes (Haiti), 2008-9?-- and emits other signals as well.
I mentioned some time ago, that I had compartmentalized my feelings. I don't feel scared. I tell this as fact that I have uncovered, be it right or wrong, checked and double-checked. From trauma-based physical abuse, I must have 'put it all away' and at 71 I am not about to go retrieving all that pain. When my sister said I scared her, I knew I didn't have the feelings that she has, but i understand about hurting people and I certainly never mean any harm. Where does all the truth lie? an oxymoron? Truth Lie?
So whatever has happened to me since, I have accepted as undoable, and change my live accordingly, while people think I am so strong and mallable!
I wonder if I get a do-over from G-d?
Izzy
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Wow!!! This subject gets more heated by the day. As long as we are posting links, I have one that I hope will provide some education. I am still researching. Let's all look to education as opposed to political ideologies.
http://ifamericansknew.org/history/origin.html
I still believe in the spirit of humanity.
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And Phoenix, I do agree with your comment.
But, one thing I do believe (pollyanna-ish, I know) is that while we live in "interesting times" for sure - and dangerous times as well - the pendulum of change and balance will swing back the other way....... eventually. And it is up to us "little people" to spread sanity and random acts of kindness... when the opportunity presents itself. That may seem like a pebble in the ocean... but that ripple does spread and grow into a decent size wave.
The Illuminati, the Masons, Aliens seeking to control Earth, End-Time predictions. I believe these are Narcissist groups, seeking to instill fear, just as the microcosim of our individual narcissists have. If everyone is afraid enough, they will look to anyone to save them. Even the narcissist.
These ARE interesting times. How many other "interesting" times have there been in the evolution of man? As I mentioned in my comment about the circle of life, it does swing back. Each pebble creates a path.
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I wish I could CHOOSE, have a CHOICE about not being connected to a narcissist in some way, in this spiderweb network of life, but I think it is impossible, every big company and every government and even every little town's community council is going to have a sneering narcissist sitting at the front of the table where decisions are being made about the world that I have to live in since, unfortunately I am human instead of alien.
LAST POST on this topic, from me... until the discussion moves into more than just inflaming fear and creating more "monsters" under the bed and engaging everyone's reptilian brain. I'm not running to buy more ammo or building seige fences.
I choose to not live like that, Muffin Buster. I choose to not grant the rampant-running N-monsters the power to create a hell that I don't want to live in. I quoted you above, because what you've said is - in my experience - true. And it's also true, that some of them have political power, gobs of money, and make the rules that affect the daily lives of many people (and these Ns are of all political and religious persuasions). And I know that it's true, that their power is an illusion. It's an illusion because the only power they really have is to make one afraid. Even that power isn't as great as they think it is! Some of us aren't afraid to say:
WHAT new clothes, Emperor? You're stark nekkid!! And then laugh.
Back when I was also afraid my mom would steal my organs and afraid that, that fear made me insane... I was drawn to information and stories and pictures of Holocaust victims. My nightmares included these stories and images. Even when my stomach was turning in fear and disgust at what some humans were capable of - and the reasons why - I kept reading and learning. I ran across these stories again after therapy, when I was researching PTSD. And I found what I was unconsciously looking for, finally.
No one has the power to tell me what to think; to feel is right or wrong. No one can tell me what to choose for myself. Yes, every choice has consequences... and some choices are only "bad" and "even worse". But if I choose to live free to say - "that is WRONG" - I still can. And no one has to agree with me. And I believe that it's the people who can see N in the world and say "that is wrong" who have the real power - not the people spinning the "end-of-the-world-as-we-know-it" stories or the people at the head of institutions, appointed to committees, or elected by people looking for the "lesser evil".
The sun still shines and comes up every morning - and the birds still sing. Someday in the next week, it might rain and cool off. Meanwhile, there's sweet tea, ice, people I like - and people I don't, and it's just FINE with me that some bozos think they control the world or know what's best for the rest of us or think they can hide (from??) the consequences of their own decisions and actions. I know that's not the way it works. There IS justice in the world - even if it's not always public knowledge or posted on the internet.
When the asteroid finally gets close enough to disrupt the gravity on earth - someone will be N-ishly oblivious to his or her job of monitoring space and sounding the alarm and summoning the cavalry until it's too late. And all the Ns will be sucked off the earth by the asteroid because they're so full of hot air. It's just as real a possibility, to me. And there are a lot more "alternate endings" I can think of... and they're all just as possible... and I think I'm going to go try to think up a whole bunch more.
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LAST POST on this topic, from me... until the discussion moves into more than just inflaming fear and creating more "monsters" under the bed and engaging everyone's reptilian brain.
Last post for me too.
I'll just say I never knew there was such an array of (what's the word I'm looking for.....'interesting'.....yeah that's the ticket) interesting perspectives here.
mud