Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board

Voicelessness and Emotional Survival => Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board => Topic started by: sKePTiKal on January 01, 2020, 03:32:37 PM

Title: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 01, 2020, 03:32:37 PM: So, it seems like this is the year for second chances to "get it right" - whatever that is. That definition seems to be more of a moving target for me these days and that's just FINE. Really. I think I'm finally convinced that there simply isn't any one absolute "right state of being" for all times & places that endures for more than a NY moment.

Been using this past week to change some things up. Just enough that I can start to "see" from a different place. Buck has contributed to that too. He's had some Rambo moments lately; there is only so long you can treat a human being as an "asset", "resource", or property - and disposable - before that last boundary has been transgressed and in his terminology, one has to become "assertive". So, he got some things straightened out; got some straight answers that have gone a long way to explain (but not excuse) the medical nightmare he's been through the last 2 years. 7 major surgeries in 2 years, taking things out, putting them back - without ever completing the cycle.

I have to be a bit vague here, because this is leading up to him reporting for active duty again. Uh-huh. It seems he's one of the last alive with the knowledge needed to pass on to a new group of divers, so he'll be training for 3 weeks stateside. As soon as, that is, the recommended 6 weeks of antibiotics is done and he tests clear for the infection and he heals up enough from the last surgery to be able to enter a compression chamber. So someone pretty high up started pulling strings to be able to get him qualified for that training. Sigh. Yes, that's how this works.

Now, since it also contributes to getting him fully functional and healthy again I can't complain. I'll take my number and get in line. He's worth it. As he recovers, he's getting super sweet and romantic - and we're planning together. There is going to be a fair amount of unusual fun activities involved, not just being homebodies and living daily life. We seem to be catalyzing dormant aspects of each other and there is a depth, and breadth, to him that tweaks my curiosity and playful side. I seem to be opening his eyes to parts of himself he stuffed and swallowed, to be able to keep on going day after day. So we're both kind of dancing into the unknown, knowing each other to a depth that perhaps we wouldn't in the usual dating scenarios because we can talk, be emotionally vulnerable, and be there for each other with the usual life situations & struggles. Mr. Rambo really just wants to be allowed to be a big teddy bear and not be used and abused because he trusted someone. So, there's a need for absolute honesty between us. Lots of maybes, I don't know yet, or we'll figure it out together.

Now, the Hol story. The Hut is under roof. I can walk around inside and see just how efficient she was with space planning - but it's still going to feel small. Fortunately she'll have multiple outdoor spaces and the first floor. So far, they've worked fast and well. There was only one minor oops pouring the forms for the 2nd, main floor and except for some concrete on the ground, I can't see where it's going to cause any problems.

She is staying positive through the miscarriages. But there is a total lack of engagement/participation in the life of the farm from her sweetie. Like paying expenses, getting with the chore program - even directly asked, or contributing anything of value here. And he hasn't even gone to work in one of the busiest times of year in his career. Then, he simply drops trash wherever he is; or dishes and never cleans up after himself.

:mad: Sooner or later, she's going to realize she's already raising one child. And he's one that won't make eye contact or even speak directly to anyone BUT Hol... and he's pulling her into his orbit to the exclusion of her friends, me, etc. Buck and I have discussed this extensively. He is minding his boundary well, while being supportive of where I seem to be going as a way to deal with this. I will grant that he is feeding some emotional need she has right now. So confrontation isn't even on my list of choices about dealing with this. I will not support him to be a snuggly lump of non-communicative and self-absorbed comfort squeeze. Sorry. I have to draw a line at the old: you don't work, you don't eat demarcation. Hol cleans up after him, to mollify me, but oddly... won't acknowledge the problem or the extra work she's going to here. NOR, more importantly, how her other needs for social engagement are getting neglected because he might need her. "Codependence" is a fictitious concept to her. Her friend John and I have both tried to bring up the topic in general conversation. Denial is big right now.

I realize this is something that she has to do herself; make those decisions. And mom should mind her own business. But I see without doubt; that this is going to become another Bovie situation and end even more badly. So, I'm frustrated about not being able to point out the damned obvious and see what new excuse she makes for his behavior and treatment of the other people who are important to her. And ironically, she warned me to watch for red flags with Buck.... LOL.... as if that wasn't the first thing on my mind to address with him.

So, "doing" nothing right now, except waiting for an opportunity to discuss in non-personal terms the behaviors that are problematic and just let that sink in. She's smart enough to figure this out without being "told" this is what she is doing again. And also, spending a lot of time on me and my life. And she will go back to work this spring for a few months... so they won't even be here - either one of them. That might, all by itself, bring things into perspective for her.

Meanwhile........ the garden is already in planning stages. Seed inventory is done and I don't need much to get started. But I'll buy the basics fresh this year, to have extra in case something comes up that I don't get around to ordering next year. And I'm planning to teach Hol how to can. She's also never worked a garden so she doesn't know how much time/effort/work it takes, if you want more than a "sample sized" crop.

A full on metal shop is also being planned - for both Hol and Buck to work here. A garage for the Hut - so I don't have to share space with Steve in MY workshop. She'll vacate the studio with her sewing and quilts too. So I'm ready to do a bit of renovating here... remodeling the master suite to accommodate two of us... and eventually adding on to create a summer kitchen and extra work space in the office and replacing the roof. There aren't too many things on that list that have a deadline. And Buck needs to be involved too. And is already on some things.

We're still talking about timing for sneaking away to the beach. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 04, 2020, 09:02:31 AM: Took Hol to OB-GYN appt yesterday.

The Nurse Practitioner was good. Images indicate that Hol passed all the tissue, so all she's doing right now is blood tests for hormone levels to make sure her body has completed the miscarriage cycle. In 6 weeks, they'll test again until she's close enough to zero pregnancy hormones to start talking about what her options are, going forward. Her appt then will be with the MD. Hol is worried about getting too old to have viable eggs. When it may not be her at all, that is the problem. It very well could be her partner given some of his habits.

And I had to interject at one point, that she could very well get pregnant again and carry to term next time because this kind of medical knowledge/practice (while it's an extensively complex specialty) isn't an exact science. None of us can know for sure.

That appt and our studio session - where we got her to acknowledge her feelings and fears in a safe non-judgemental space - has cracked open her withdrawal from everyone and everything. We respected her need for that kind of time. for awhile. But that's not her natural state and unfortunately, she wasn't getting the external input she needed there. So we got her moving back in that direction and she's coming up for air now.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 05, 2020, 02:19:36 PM: Amber:

I have a couple observations here. One.... it's difficult to stay in our lane when our kids are bringing their SO's into our spaces while not honoring us, IMO.

Yesterday I asked youngest dd "what if" questions about her SO. I didn't judge, or expect her to DO anything. I just wanted her opinions, which she shared honestly with me. She also said she was hoping the what ifs I posed weren't true, but knew they absolutely COULD be the truth. This was comforting to me, and I think her to put it out there, and clear the air... come to an understanding, and bounce things off each other (while being super careful not to make her feel defensive about SO, to be sure.)

Second.... why does it have to feel like we're inviting conflict when we consider setting appropriate boundaries and requiring respectful treatment for ourselves IN OUR OWN SPACE?

I'm feeling more confident about asserting myself, requiring my boundaries be honored and not viewing these discussions as an invitation to conflict anymore.

I don't believe we should view them as conflict. I suspect other people have awareness around our aversions to conflict. I suspect we're manipulated to some extent, bc we've trained people into that behavior ourselves.

For me, this means I'm responsible for training them out of that behavior, sans drama. I know I have to get my head straight first, set boundaries, then calmly and consistently enforce them without allowing them to draw me into conflict.

I'm not sure what that would look like for you, Amber. Requiring Hol's sweetie clean up after himself, pull his weight financially and interact with you is reasonable, IMO. IF he stormed out, riled up Hol and acted like a victim.... that would be a combative reaction, IMO. Hol would likely be very reactive, but that doesn't mean you'd have to react back. It doesn't have to be a two-way conflict.

If Hol tries to escalate, you de-escalate while refusing to get drawn in, right? You're very sorry she feels the way she does, but you require a, b and c... rinse and repeat. Always go back to the issue, and don't allow Hol to engage you in negative conversations. It's perfectly acceptable to refuse to communicate with anyone who's raising their voice, name calling, or changing the subject before one topic is finished, IME.

I'm just spitballing here, thinking it through. Wondering why we have to put ourselves and our boundaries on backburners... at all.

If we don't put ourselves first now... when?

AND..... if we do it, we model for our girls how to do it.

::nodding::.

It might be uncomfortable. It might be new, and alien. It might feel wrong at first, but it's right and good and will soon feel that way if we just begin, IME.

I found my girls and I get along better when I set boundaries..... they look shocked at first, then immediately fall into the new routine if I just stay level, and calmly expect them to honor the boundaries.

Those boundaries help us communicate better... encourage respectful conduct from everyone, etc. Attitudes are adjusted. I just have to refuse to get sucked into the emotional drama the girls traditionally used to manipulate me into compliance. That's more difficult when I'm sick, tired or struggling with overwhelming other stuff.

About Buck asserting himself.....

YES. That man deserves better medical care, and it was his right to insist on it. It feels nice to know you're in a relationship with such a patient man, Amber.

I hope Hol continues to heal from her loss.

Feel free to dismiss anything that doesn't apply here: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 05, 2020, 10:06:52 PM: Ahhh, Lighter.
A lot of this applies to me.
Thank you.

Ooodles of love to all,
Two-fingered typing from Costa Rica.

Cannot WAIT to get back mid-Jan to unfettered
Internet not controlled by howler monkeys with
A hotspot control fixation!

(They sound like large primeval dogs coming
Toward you one slow, menacing step at a time.
They are right behind the pool and I saw two
In the trees mere fèet away! Astonishing.)

More later, full a wine at the mo'

Xxxooo
hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on January 06, 2020, 05:30:03 AM: I'm glad Buck is on the mend, Skep, but staggered that they are actually genuinely talking about making him do some more service. My mind is boggling. I did smile at the Rambo comment; I do love it when people kick arse ;)

I think you are right about there not being a permanent 'right' way of doing or being. Life needs to be flexible, I think, or we spend more energy trying to make a square peg fit a round hole. Right for now or good enough is perfectly okay, I think :)

I'm glad things are moving forward with the garden and the hut. It all sounds like the work is progressing okay and things are going well. I'm sorry Hol's sweetie isn't pulling his weight more. Perhaps you can drop a hint that he might end up underneath the next concrete floor if he doesn't pull his finger out :) Lol. On a serious note, yes, I think adult children are in some ways more difficult than small children. I am struggling with knowing when to put my mum hat on with son and when to let him do his own thing, and working out which are his issues and which are mine. It is difficult when you all live with or near each other. But you are a wise one; it will work its way through, one way or another xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 06, 2020, 08:40:38 AM: Lighter, interesting comments about boundaries and the heightened feeling of conflict and fear of emotional drama. And I believe this does apply in my case. I will chew on that awhile and see what else comes up.

But, her friend John is now insisting that I transgress Hol's boundaries in a HUGE way, and assert my ownership and control here and essentially destroy her relationship with this guy - for her own good. I flat out told him no and it isn't any of his business. I won't be triangulated.

I tried to explain to him, that sure - I could do that and destroy my relationship with her in the process. But it would be very much better if we simply gave her the space to decide for herself that the relationship isn't what she wants. She's 42. She isn't a child who doesn't have the ability to make her own choices - and suffer the consequences, if she chooses wrong. It's one thing to share the space here, and try to work out the process... but it's verboten in my value system to interfere with her relationship, EVEN (maybe ESPECIALLY) when I can see how it's not going to last or be a two-way relationship. He is very kind and sweet to her - even if he seems to expect to do nothing else. And that's what she is responding to. Is is genuine? Will he just up & leave when she starts expecting more participation from him? I don't know and it's not my outcome to fuss over or try to direct.

Man, things were a lot easier around here when I was a hermit. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 07, 2020, 01:15:50 PM: Amber:

It's curious that John would feel he's entitled to give you marching orders regarding your relationship with Hol, and her sweetie.

I'm guessing his anxiety got the better of him, and he just went off.

You seemed to handle it well.

Have you implemented any boundaries around your space and how you require it be kept?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 08, 2020, 09:01:09 AM: Yes. And so far it's working. On both men, and Hol. We do have about 6 inches of snow that means we are STUCK with each other, and therefore HAVE to get along. I made brownies & dinner for Hol's birthday (a day late, since she finally went out on a "date" with him for her birthday)... and it seems I was the only one eating; she did eat some of it and highly approved; did her happy dance.

Due to the explanation about Buck's duty status; the news has made me feel the full impact of what military wives have to deal with. The gov can change their mind at any moment, you know, and send him overseas due to a lack of trained experienced divers. Even at his age. That has a LOW probability of happening for real. I use probability to counter my "worst-case scenario" fears, and it's helpful for me.

But he's not yet well enough to even do training - neither one of those situations is warm & fuzzy for me - but he's easing my anxiety better than one would think, not actually being here. He's just had his pic line - where he administers the IV antibiotics, clog up and had to get that cleared; he was supposed to have sutures removed but the hospital had no one working qualified to do so that day (?????? WTF??? It's a HOSPITAL.) He took out the ones he could reach and his D got the ones on his back. And now his last medical device has been set improperly; too high overall, and not directed across his lower back, along with his legs. (That would be the nerve stimulator).

But otherwise, he's bouncing back and adjusting to the high dose antibiotics pretty well. He's been out walking trails, with and without carrying weight. Keeps him from going stir crazy.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 08, 2020, 10:08:49 PM: I'm not following about the last medical device... the stimulator. I thought all infection had to be cleared up before anything went back in?

And.... he's out walking trails! That's fantastic.

I have a question.... if and when B goes back into the service are you planning to go with him, at least some of the time? Or not?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on January 10, 2020, 03:25:35 AM: I'm glad Buck's able to get out walking, Skep, that is something at least, and I hope they can get all of this other stuff sorted soon (not him going away, I mean him getting better and hopefully someone seeing some sense and making sure he doesn't get sent away! I am really shaking my head here). I hope you and he get to spend some good quality time together soon xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 10, 2020, 09:58:09 AM: SIGH...

OK. Stimulator wasn't removed in the last surgery - just the pain pump and catheter to the spine. I'm less familiar with it too. There are 20 leads - wires - to paddles to send a very low voltage electrical charge to various muscles and nerves. Sort of an "artificial intelligence nervous system".

HOWEVER. (Lots of sighing)
The surgeon who did the last removal cut right through most of those 20 leads. As of the scan yesterday, only 4 out of 20 are functional. This explains the excessive low back pain he's had.

You know what the acronym SNAFU stands for and that it came from the military in WWII? Here we go...

The VA caseworker who approves payment for medical care denied his next round of antibiotic for the infection. Said he'd been on it 2 weeks already and she made a MEDICAL decision that he shouldn't continue the course - or he'd become resistant. NEVER read the doctor's orders for a 6 week course of the antibiotic BECAUSE it's already resistant.

His last blood count showed some reduction in white blood cells (infection) but not ENOUGH yet for the surgeon to take the chance of replacing the stimulator leads. At least this AB is proving effective. So far, there are no signs of infection around the stimulator. Because of the medical necessity of CONTINUOUS antibiotic treatment to kick the infection's butt B had 24 hrs to resolve this payment issue and get delivery of the next batch of AB this morning. He was calling DC - his senator and DoD - to get this all straightened out late afternoon yesterday. He actually did speak with the Senator and sent some paperwork to him. No idea what he may be able to do.

He had to inform DoD that he wouldn't be able to meet their deadline for activating him for training duty if the VA and the hospital didn't get their act together. Because he wouldn't be healthy enough to perform under the conditions required for the training. OH, and the VA caseworker also made a decision that they wouldn't approve the anasthetic for surgery for the leads because he'd already been under the influence of morphine too much in the last 2 months (because of the surgeries). So he'll only get a local anasthetic and have to bear up under the rest of the pain. Nice, huh?

FORTUNATELY, he has a very good T, who is the one prescribing what he can to help B with the pain management. That T now has all the documentation of the back & forth rigamarole and frustration that B has put up with. Because when B gets "assertive" he tends to scare the crap out of people who don't handle other people's anger very well and have no compassion because patients are just a presentation of symptoms or disease to them (so they can work day to day).

Then he discovered that there are data entry errors in his service record online. So very very little information that is supposed to be there, is there. Basically, name rank & serial number - and that number is off by one digit. COULD BE just a clerical error, typos do happen. But I do wonder about that and run various other explanations through my brain. It's also possible that this is why they keep denying payment for the care he needs.

All the man wants is to get healthy again and not have to deal with those docs/hospital AGAIN. He will agree to do the training - IF the Navy then lets him retire. Fully processed out. All legal, cut & dried, DONE. Then he can go on different insurance and choose his own docs. 26 years in the military; I think that's the least they could do.

It's normal for a person to get as upset at this kind of cluster**** as he does. The fact that he's still putting up with it and trying to fight his way through it demonstrates a lot more patience than I would have. He is attempting to get well to fulfill this last obligation but the "system" keeps trying to deny him that at the same time. The gov't might say some words thanking him for his service... but the way they've treated him, IMO, speaks more loudly to the fact of what they really believe about their "military assets".

I'm having to fight some "support fatigue" through all this. It's hard to find new ways to say, I'm sorry, I'm here, I'm not going anywhere, it's not your fault.... I've been doing this for years now but with better information than I had previously in the last 6 months or so. The total exhaustion in his voice is heartrending. But I have been able to find ways to make him laugh. That helps. My sense of humor is appropriately sick & twisted enough for a soldier. Go figure.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 10, 2020, 11:19:20 AM: Update: someone jiggled something enough in the system, that the AB was dropped off this morning. So moving in the right direction again. Getting the infection cleared up - enough for surgery and so it doesn't come back - would be such a big difference for him.

He likes the few "good days" he's had and would like some more. I concur.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 10, 2020, 12:02:45 PM: Yegods, what Buck has been going through...and vicariously, you too. I am so sorry. It's unfathomable. Any chance he would fare better at Walter Reed? May not be an option, I realize. They want their last piece of training from him but don't seem to care whether they excise the last piece of peace from him in order to get it. If I were a wounded soldier in such pain, poorly treated for so long...I'd begin to question my service. Damn.

About John. A boundary thing pops up in my mind as I imagine you deep in H-relationship analysis with him, a peer/friend of HERS. As with House Guest, before, I keep getting this feeling of you finding understanding and connection mostly from your child's peers, and though I understand why (you're on a mountain! tons of projects underway! they're the people who are there!) it tweaks some discomfort. It breaks down a natural generational boundary that is a protective one, imo.

Dunno why, but there it is. I guess it's because you are the older, life-wise adult in the building. Yet most of your 3D confidants are young, male, friends of Hols. The convos seem to be extremely psychologically intimate and analytical. In my head, it goes to enmeshment (encouraging that kind of intimate sharing with her peers) in a vicarious way. When it's with Hol, you and she get frontal, and you wind up emotionally abused by her, via the microscopic quasi-therapeutic joint analyses. When it's too much or too hard, there are her proxies right on site, and the analyses continue.

What I wish for you persistently is for you to find age-and-life peers of your own, in 3-D, somewhere nearby. And friendships that DON'T require so much intensive probing of toxic depths to enjoy them in good form. Trusting females your own age, building respect for them even if they're not as intellectual or confidently analytical as you are, circles around and builds your trust and confidence in yourself, in my experience. But that's me, here in my town, in very different circumstances.

Buck is your peer. But at this point Buck is still a LDR, long-distance relationship--and a lover, which is different though he also offers friendship. You also deserve support and the friendship of other whole adults of a similar age, at least within a decade. There's a qualitative difference, imo.

(And it's entirely obvious to me that I'm seizing on this worry because the micro-analysis has begun in my own relationship, and I need to warn MYSELF, as CB suggested, that a relationship that takes this much pro-active OR reactive verbal analysis may not be a healthy one. That one day I might look back and see how much the rescue-analyse habit cost or changed me.)

Projectionally and affectionately,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 11, 2020, 06:37:36 AM: Oh, I wholeheartedly agree with you Hops. I've had to - a couple times - walk into a conversation and announce that I'm just DONE with all the analysis and won't engage in it. Glad to talk about anything else anyone wants to talk about... or even human experience in GENERAL. Just none of the personal jousting.

My local friend has had her hands full caring for her mom, job location moving and full hormone workout to find out why her menopause is so debilitating. I haven't had space for another guest and just don't drive over the mountain much this time of year. The early dark makes me very sleepy at 6:30 pm. She still sees another friend from work that I've gotten along with. So we can do some things in the spring again.

The generational thing makes a lot of sense to me. I have at times pointed out that I'm at a completely different place in my life and then defend the "intentionality" of it... because apparently I'm not capable of knowing if I chose something or just let it happen and am now stuck. LOLOLOLOLOLOL. The projection levels are sad & funny at the same time. But I very seldom turn the tables and make it her turn. Why?

Because where else did she learn to confuse analysis with judgement? From people doing that to her. She is smart and self-aware. I can wait for her to see it... because this crap doesn't get under my skin as much as it used to. Somehow, gradually, in the background... I upgraded my strength of self to where I can endure this without TOO MUCH questioning my own sanity. And I refuse to engage in the power struggle version of "analysis"... where someone is "right" about the other person to the point that they're defined and can be nothing else. Bullshit.

I do have limits; and removing myself from the conversation/situation states my point about full-time naval gazing as well as words. When I am able to get through to her, I almost need a long-pondered, edited full statement... and be ready to deliver that to her - out of context to the rest of the blathering - and prepared to cut off any interruption or over-talking coming from her. As much as she is concerned about how she hasn't been "heard" - I'm never allowed to finish a thought or sentence before she's arguing her point, telling me I'm wrong, etc.

Yeah, I kinda recognize this description. At her age, I think I went through kinda the same thing. And therapy most definitely HELPED me get to the point I could help myself. She isn't ready to admit she needs help yet. But when the breakdown happens... Mom and her friends will be here to help her figure out next steps on her own. No one, including me, has TOLD her what to do since before she was 18.

Some of this is externalizing what she's experienced in past relationships; some of it is fears about the current one and the miscarriages; some of it is over-responsibility on HER PART - and being faced with the consequences of her own actions/decisions. She is probably stronger than I am, in that her "self" was innate and not something acquired through work. But she's also stuffed a lot of crazy ideas in her head; beliefs; and things that my place can give her the time to unpack, sort, purge and save a few things. It's good for her to do that while life isn't moving at her normal speed. That doesn't happen until late Feb; a new production is starting and she needs to be local to work.

And there are many many ways that Buck is who I retreat to for adult conversation and understanding. (Hol is 42; how is that not adult?? Generational things notwithstanding.) As much as I'm involved in what his experiences are... he is involved in mine. And I'm impressed. He knows how to listen; be supportive; and while he of course has his Mr. Fixit side... knows it's not up to him to fixit. He's really good at diffusing my anger & frustration.

So, one of the things that Hol has suggested actually makes sense. This place needs some purpose and direction; organization; there is a vacumn in the leadership role. We've all just been "being" out here. And there is only one person to whom that falls - the one who started all this, with a warm & fuzzy vague idea of something. And with time for Buck to join my flying circus getting closer, it's time for me to step into that role and start herding the cats into some kind of peaceful "order". Perhaps even overdue.

So, I'm working on something. To express & communicate what I see can happen; what I WANT to happen; what I DON'T WANT etc. The latest iteration of Mom's Rules, I guess. There are planned several moving parts to the farm; with different people interested in them and coordination, management & direction is one of my skills. It's important here now.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 12, 2020, 10:51:20 PM: I'm not sure what you mean by leadership, Amber.

YOu set out to find yourself, discover your passions and build a new life on the farm.

From here... maybe it's a matter of figuring out boundaries, putting them in place, and eforcing them rather than installing yourself as leader.

You raised your children. You're embarking on a new phase in your life. I just can't wrap my mind around taking on a leadership role on your farm over adults who should be able to lead themselves.

Perhaps it'll make more sense when I understand more about it.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 13, 2020, 10:05:40 AM: Organization, management, coordination - so that I'm not blindsided by the kids starting new projects without consulting me, or doing things that aren't particularly legal, general consideration and communication processes for all of us to follow...

that kind of leadership.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 14, 2020, 07:31:10 AM: Just a heads up that I might be on the quiet side for a bit.

I'm processing a bunch of things; including some realizations; and because so far, the winter has been mild - there is "doing" already too. So, until I get it all coherent... I'm digesting and won't say much until I can describe or explain and not lose you all.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 14, 2020, 10:36:35 AM: You didn't lose me, Amber. I think I'm experiencing similar frustrations with boundaries around adults and adult children in my life too. It would have been perfectly perfect to have boundaries perfectly in place all these years, but it's not the case.

There are so many layers of complicated feelings and history to sort through. We don't want to do harm or make people feeeeeel (insert deepest fears.)

It's not simple and I hope you find clarity and peace with decisions that come from an intuitive place. If we neeeed everything to make sense on every level, for everyone, maybe it's time to shed levels.

No decision, or boundary, will feel right for everyone, or make complete sense to everyone and that's OK. These are your boundaries. They only need to make sense to you and it's not up for debate.

::uncrossing eyes now::.

You'll do just fine, Amber.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 14, 2020, 12:11:07 PM: (((((Amber)))) --

It may sound goofy but one of the ways I ask myself, how much stress is Amber feeling right now...is to ask myself: How abstract is she being?

If we follow, we follow, but if we don't, we're still here for you.

Personally, I'd rather hear you ramble than not hear you, hon.

Big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 18, 2020, 08:44:50 AM: Snow on the ground already here this morning; hot dark coffee in my coffee hole. I've started hanging out in my "nest" in the mornings - journaling, researching some stuff. It's a chance to chat with Buck as we wake up and sort out our day. The little routines that people create in their relationship. That kind of thing is INCREDIBLY comforting to me.

Well, my "leadership plan" is going by the name "charter" now. When I started writing things down, I wound up with a list of 10 or so "virtues" or philosophical principles that are the foundation of developing a working relationship between us and my vision for developing the farm to sustain US and be self-sustaining. There is some redundancy in that list, so it'll be condensed and refined. I just had to start putting my feelings into words. As I moved on into structure and logistics, even MORE feelings started showing up. My discomfort revolves around people not understanding - or just innately knowing - what is required in a group living situation. And the privacy issues which are inescapable. Separate dwellings will relieve an awful lot of that automatically. But what remains, is the fact of my ownership & responsibility -- and I need to make it absolutely clear what I refuse to be responsible for; for what is THEIR responsibility.

All wrapped up in that, is also my boundaries for where particularly Holly's input isn't asked for, welcomed, required or appreciated. If she was truly practicing empathy as claimed, she would accept what I've explained about the work I've done and the "level" I'm at; instead of constantly expressing the message that there is something "wrong", that I need to address; that in HER opinion isn't satisfactory - nevermind it suits me just fine. She is not accepting that I can intentionally CHOOSE to live a quiet, slow life and not seek a lot of external inputs from the world at large. For her, I understand that's form of misery that fuels her frustrations. For me, I find it liberating. Why can't it just BE that we're different?

Her perceptions are a tad distorted and disordered and it is offensive to me, that she doesn't take my word for how comfortable I am with the work I've done years ago and where I am now. I catch her projecting a lot. Sometimes I just let it go and note it to myself. Sometimes, I'm able to gently point it out -- without pushing her hostile defense button. She will be going back to work (as things stand right now) in March and will live in Baltimore again those months. If the pilot episode is picked up, there could be 5 years worth of work. Hopefully, she'll take Steve and the dogs with her because he is a major part of my discomfort. VERY seldom speaks directly to me; VERY seldom makes eye contact even. And doesn't exactly consult me on things he wants to do. He operates in a universe of 1; even where Holly is concerned. But she's taking the co-dependent position and assuming she's responsible and she dare not express her fears, concerns, needs or else risk the ending of the relationship. <insert mom frownie face>

The Hut will be getting finished while she's working on this production; she'll be beside herself with trusting the contractor & me to make the decisions she would make... and has already had one panic attack regarding her windows and sliding doors. She is already chewing on the decision of turning it down. But I know for a fact that having a structured life, with challenges to her creativity and problem-solving skills, along with the accessible external stimulus that exists in a city would be a huge benefit to her right now. Balancing the time she has to naval-gaze and redesign all the people around her here.

So - she's feeling pressure and yet having a hard time deciding what she's really going to choose to do right now. Several of her good friends are working on this same production and being in those relationships on a daily, working basis would provide some perspective for her. She is craving that. As a counterpoint to what exists here - wide open space, peace & quiet to hear your own thoughts, and a continuity of energy through all the seasons and life cycles. Out here, one has to create one's OWN structure and routines and self-motivate. One also has to be thinking one season ahead to tasks, maintenance, etc. Things still unexpectedly break and need a quick reaction to deal with it -- but most of the planning, organization, and management is always future oriented. MOST of the tasks are the same, season to season... so those can be listed/communicated easily.

But I'm adamant that the "farm" isn't ever going to be a commercial ag place during my lifetime. Not even small time. What we produce will be for us - and if we choose to share we will. I am willing to include individual's commercial enterprises however. Bringing in dollars, for themselves. I'm covering all the expenses around here so far - but that is going change over time, too. I want people to explore and refine their skills, and learn new ones. There's Hol's sewing; Steve's mushrooms & herbal tinctures; Buck's metal work... my various mediums.

So, when I joke about starting my own country... there is a nugget of seriousness in it. Independence is one of those virtues on the original list... and I need to sort out how individual independence can co-exist with group goals/directions and how that necessarily limits my authority/responsibility. After all - it's Hol's future home too. She also has a vested interest here.

So it's ALL boundary work, but in the form of an agreement for how we'll all be able to be happy doing what we want to do here and work well together.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 18, 2020, 01:21:48 PM: You've been busy, Amber. What an amazing synopsis of your process.

The word "charter" seems very right to me too. This is a communal living space.... a compound..... for yourself, Buck, Hol and their SOs and children. The plan will have ongoing chapters and that's OK.

I'm curious what the bunk rook looks like at this point. Will Buck's dd have her own space.... perhaps a bedroom IN the bunk area? She'll be at college for a while, so plenty of time to think this through. Having her in your living space, during visits, might be the best thing for your relationship, or the worst thing. B will lead on that one. I hope you and his dd get along very well.

I can't wait to hear more about the self sustaining pieces of the plan. Very exciting!

I wonder if internships could be established for students on your farm. They could work, bring new ideas and gain experience. You could mentor and have a process in place for keeping up with the work when you travel, etc. I love the idea of choice and options in this area.

Lastly.... the idea of creating artist's space.... everyone with their own area..... sounds amazing to me. I vibe more with your idea of happiness..... I don't need a lot of outside stimulation. I like peace and quiet. I like being able to hear myself think, which is difficult when there are many voices with strong opinions.

You'll remind Hol to walk her own path and you'll walk yours. No drama. No need to feel resentful while holding stated boundaries with compassion.

Hol will learn how to do that for herself, which is a gift.

Even if it feels like crisis and chaos in our chests.... it's not that, IME.

I'm trying to see the truth in these upheavals. The crisis is just a messenger with information something isn''t working any more. We need to make a change. For some of us change is harder or easier, depending on our history.

Some of us experience change with more fear. Those who've been fighting and scratching out survival for themselves will have a harder time learning to adjust, bc change has always been challenge and struggle without a winner. We can remember we have the option to create and hold space while others adjust and test it for themselves.

Hold till we see the whites of their eyes then continue to hold (without flinching, if possible.)

I see planning and writing a charter helps you make sense of your world. It looks like you're defending quiet safe space for your still small voice to inform and direct the process. Brava, Amber. Really: )

Thanks for that update.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 18, 2020, 03:42:55 PM: Happy to vote for you to run the country, Amber, had I citizenship there!

Here's what worries me:
Quote
I'm covering all the expenses around here so far - but that is going change over time, too. I want people to explore and refine their skills, and learn new ones. There's Hol's sewing; Steve's mushrooms & herbal tinctures; Buck's metal work... my various mediums.

Here's the thing. You're supporting a little clan that includes an entitled D who rails at you, challenges your sense of self and disrespects your autonomy, plus her bf who is surly, uncommunicative, and at least passively disrespectful to you.

And you WANT to be the leader. You WANT to direct people in psychological growth and even in what skills/interests they should develop.

I just don't think they really want to be led. And probably don't have much interest in contributing money, either. Doesn't matter who's right. Nobody wants to be directed by their parents these days, as wise and far-seeing as those parents might be. So they are, perhaps not evilly but naturally, working your system and dream for their own benefits, in both passive-aggressive and at time aggressive-aggressive ways. I'm not seeing how this gets better, even with the Hut done.

Sure, there'll be some relief with the building separating y'all. And more perhaps (or perhaps new conflicts and competitions) when Buck arrives. It's as complicated as it appears, maybe moreso. What evidence is there that entitled Hol and Steve will accept B with welcome and grace?

I see it all as a recipe for breaking apart. Or living in a miserable siege state where nobody listens to you because: 1) articulating things brilliantly already, for many months, hasn't stopped the disrespect, 2) being kind and tolerant and an in-house analyst hasn't stopped the disrespect, and 3) you're getting older which in this culture unfortunately rarely confers respect. That they aren't respecting you now doesn't bode well for them suddenly beginning to as your powers naturally diminish.

I'm sorry to be so blunt and hope I'm wrong. Shakers of salt are required because I have experienced complete family breakdown.

My way-more-modest fantasy for you would be: Hol, here's a cottage for you to retreat to when you want to get away from the city. Don't bring your friends. I live here, or I and Buck live here and it is OUR home.

I think all the signs and portents of a functioning compound with you as leader not working out are there. Your D and her coterie are with you but also using you. And I believe, oh so sorry for the bluntness, that no charter or manifesto or written anything will change it as long as the money-house-etc are already given and the seed has been planted. All this will be yours. (Ugly but natural thought from struggling next generation: Will be? I want it now. I want to assert myself and control my own destiny -- quite apart from Amber's plans/dreams for me -- now.)

I've seen such brutality over inheritance EXPECTATIONS, not just in my own family. For Hol, it's been explicit. This will all be yours. And imo, she's claiming way too much too early.

It's the gift and curse of money, I expect. And of the power that has to distort relationships that should be clean, clear and respectful.

Here's my question: Before you get in deeper and deeper and deeper, do you ever have moments where you ask yourself -- do I really want to continue with this president-of-a-family-compound dream?

You've got all our support if the answer's Yes. Of course.
I'm just wondering if some part of you might sometimes think: No.

Buck's no spring chicken either. With grateful and cooperative kids to help, it could be all rosy. But as I see it, they're neither grateful nor cooperative.

Please do correct what's wrong in this as I'm equally positive I'm not seeing the full context and am missing things.

Hope you'll forgive my bluntness. It's just concern for you.

love
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 18, 2020, 05:46:02 PM: Yes Hops, I well am aware of those pitfalls. And perhaps "leader" is the wrong word - although I do plan to assert my druthers - permit negotiation, suggestion and compromise - and point out (you don't like it, you know where the highway is). I see it more as a coordinator position... and less me telling people: this is the way it's going to be and more... here are ways for all of us to do what we need/want without stepping all over everyone else's toes.

I'm really hoping to put a stop to the extended stay houseguests; despite how helpful John has been in practical (and peacemaking) ways. He's currently peripetetic; here for a few days to a week at a time then gone for days in a row or weeks, too. He is self-sufficient and generous with his time and cooking. He's an EASY houseguest, but it's still an issue for other reasons.

No artist's retreats or interns here Lighter; despite previous ideas to that effect. I'm hoping to keep things to just the 4 of us as "permanent" residents - with visitors in/out. Buck D will become one of those visitors sometimes. I will have two guest rooms; bunk room was changed to accommodate a couple with two twin beds. But since we didn't have the big Holly birthday bash, we haven't had 8-10 people come stay for the weekend.

It could be that Hol really does decide to only use the Hut as a vacation home. I've had to face the facts of what kind of a relationship we have in daily practice vs what we actually feel for each other - and while I love her dearly, we don't have a good relationship because of her badgering me and her insecurities. Perhaps she'll work through this and she CAN be very good company when she's not targeting me, John, former boyfriends, her sister... as obstacles she needs to reform and recreate. If she leaves, nothing changes about the estate (yes, that IS one of her worries but SHE is more a threat to her status than anyone else). I was doing OK, by myself. And I can do OK by myself AGAIN.

Yes, I'm glad Buck will be around - but he is from the old school of behavior & manners and one doesn't treat one's parents that way. Even though his family background is as dysfunctional as mine. Yes that will cause friction. I'm already aware. Which is why I'd really like them to move to the Hut before he arrives - and it does seem that his "earliest date" isn't going happen. So, still looking for a chance to runaway with him somewhere comfortable and romantic - at least the way we see romance. Somewhere outdoors. Or where the outdoors is the "main feature". Still keeping the island in mind Lighter. I need to get a passport again.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 19, 2020, 08:46:25 AM: Couple realizations this morning.

I've been dabbling again with astrology & tarot; mostly astrology. This year and especially this month, there is a planetary combination that hasn't happened since The Reformation and Martin Luthor. And because of Holly's and my signs... where we were once united, very strong & indomitable together... we've been in an opposing position for a little over a year now. Helps me to see that this isn't some permanent change that's occurred; it too shall pass.

And in my perusal of related but non-specific items I ran across this INTERESTING article about "Control Dramas" and people's style of them. Today's astrologers combine quite a bit of psychology and energy work, into their readings so that is the influence on the content. The influence of the Saturn - Pluto conjunction in Capricorn is interpreted to inflame those kinds of control dramas. It's from the old Celestine Prophecies. (Yeah, I'm kinda retracing my steps over a few things here and there.) But stripped of all the astrological mumbo-jumbo... these four styles DO exist; I've experienced them... and it helped me see a bit of what of what is driving my normally pragmatic, can-do daughter, a tad too far over the edge.

https://askastrology.com/control-dramas/
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 21, 2020, 10:00:03 AM: Even co-ordinator is the wrong word. I think I'm going with TEACHER. But what I'm offering as subject matter is not, you must be/do/think x, y, z... it's teaching a process for doing that one's self. Understanding what works, functionally. NOT ideally. And why. It does require me explaining what works for me, and doesn't; and why. And expecting that to be accepted and not challenged to change...

and why no one can tell another person: you need to change THIS WAY.

I imagine - ha - that this will get presented pretty smoothly, if I'm allowed to be the teacher in front of the room. But when we get to the exercise and participation part of it, it might all just go to hell. We'll see. I have herded cats before and have that experience to fall back on. Those cats didn't quite feel so entitled to challenge/criticize me directly... without addressing the content itself.

Meanwhile, at a deeper level I've had a cascade of insights into what's going on - non-verbally - with Holly. Could be wrong, I know that and accept it. But for me, it clears up a lot of the confusion I was experiencing about her behavior.

Sigh. Can't dilly-dally much longer. Need to start the outline. And then meditate, go into the void, and reassess it before scheduling the meeting.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 25, 2020, 06:52:39 AM: Sheesh. Not just double-bind, but multiple bindings... changing with the breeze: go in this direction - why'd you do that? - this idea seems oddly too "formal" - why can't we just talk and be casual? (Because it's not acknowledged, heard & acted upon, that's why) - why don't we have a simple agreement? ('Coz it's not a simple situation)

Throw into the mix, that Hol has a childhood memory percolating up (from time w/Dad) that's been giving her nightmares. And it burst forth a couple nights ago; her way of making something conscious and starting to deal with it involves spewing it out among people she trusts. So, nothing overt - just icky, as far as she's concerned. But there is a question in her mind, where her sister was during that episode. Other men, around. Right now, the people she trusts are me & John. She is also clearly engaging in a co-dependent relationship - all the classic symptoms are showing - with Steve.

I think I'm neglecting Buck a little bit, just trying to not get so dizzy I'm throwing up. He did post a funny meme that's appropos... "One of the chains on my mood swing broke; RUN". Between Hol's hormone storms (she just got first period after miscarrying), the tension around here because my way of dealing with a group of people isn't "evolved" enough for the enlightened youngens... (rules? we don't need no stinkin' rules...) I'm not sure if I'm coming or going lately. Makes no nevermind, that while I'm validating her choices - she doesn't want to allow me mine.

And it all rolls into that co-dependency situation. One of her dreams specifically had Steve saying exactly one of the very hurtful things Bovie had said about her - and me, for that matter. Trying to control Hol. And she's going out of her way to "protect him", cover for him, be an intermediary - or "ambassador" - trying to smooth things over... so HE doesn't have to be responsible or engage or face the music about why the only "conversation" he can have with people around him is limited to short phrases or one word answers.

I had a chance to actually talk to - be heard by - Hol while she was relating her memories and feelings. We dredged up some ancient family history and compared notes, filling in gaps of knowledge for each other to get a better picture of what was going on. In the process, I was able to get a couple openings into the Steve subject going. Did she tell S any of this? (no, I didn't want to upset him; I need to protect him) Well, don't you think you want to be able to discuss and share things like this in a true, intimate relationship? Isn't that kind of what "relationship" is?

Between her inflated ego (to cover her self-doubts) and the denial of co-dependence - I straight up mentioned the basics of it the other day... and her rising anxiety level due to multiple very important things coming up: trial date, and likely jail time for DUI; consultation with OB-GYN on testing to try to figure out if she can get pregnant; moving back to B'more for a couple months to work on this series pilot production; and the Holly Hut going into the finishing stages... oh, and irrational fears about Buck - that she simply can't take my trust in him, at face value, until she develops her own.

I only have a couple weeks to have this family meeting before all this next round of change happens. The timing is massively important. Because if the kids come back from B'more and this isn't settled... it's just going to be more of the same crap. She has said she'll consider finding a T to deal with Dad memories AFTER the film project is done. LOL... she said she felt like she'd be wasting T's time, to actually tell the whole story it was so long... and I had to remind her how eloquent, erudite, and yes, sometimes verbose she's become since being a silent 3 yr old with massive temper tantrums. I've had to remind her how formidable she and I are together when we're not opposing each other. And how stupidly stubborn we both are when we DO face off.

So, I don't exactly KNOW anything for sure right now. Not even sure that "ownership" of property gives me the right to set out some basic expectations for participation in work; and personal tidiness habits, etc.

But then, Hol shocked me by saying she was concerned that I didn't seem interested in HAVING a relationship with Steve. Hey, he's HER sweetie - not mine. I don't even have to LIKE him. It seems funny (odd) to me, to expect us to want to have a relationship. I'm going to settle for a "working relationship" - because I'm pretty sure he's using Hol and reinforcing her co-dependent patterns. And hope that the signs I see of him being a "love 'em & leave 'em" become apparent so Hol can decide if she's going to put with that or not.

Yeah, I'm walking a real fine line here.

Next week, Hol & I will go to art show opening for Matthew -- former house guest, and a pony farm birthday party for 7 yr old Harper -- Hol's personality double. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 25, 2020, 11:20:39 AM: CB:

I'm so grateful you're here. I needed to hear and wanted to say so many things in your post.

Much of it resonated for me.

Well said.
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 25, 2020, 07:51:10 PM: Amen, and me too.

Obviously mine is a crap example, but if I WERE in an active relationship with an adult daughter with whom I couldn't relate in serenity...I'd work most on releasing her to her independence and own choices and consequences, and stop seeing myself as being in charge of shrinking or analyzing her or steering her this way or that.

It's a weird thing, to step back from enmeshment. But it's so right, in the life cycle.

It's really good news that a T is on Hol's horizon, imo. And of course it won't be only about her Dad...it is natural that her private therapy experience will be about you too. And that's okay. It's good for her to do her own work of individuating from not just bad memories of him, but from current toxic patterns with you. And it's sacred that you not ask her about it, or try to relitigate anything she reports learning. (I'd even suggest gently but clearly shutting down such conversations by expressing respect for a boundary of privacy around therapy that you both need to respect.) That wouldn't be fair to you OR her. This is one great way she can begin to draw her own boundaries and learn how to back off, which will relieve you both, I hope. (In a way you need to do the exact same thing...you both need the same boundary understandings.)

Meanwhile, if you re-enter your own life and your own dreams that don't involve over-custody of a grown 40-y/o adult person, no matter how much you love her or assign yourself unfitting responsibility for her....you will be happier. I believe so anyway.

Sending hope that you become truly able to release her to the universe, which will make space for new love and involvement (hello, B!) into your own adult life.

Big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 26, 2020, 07:28:06 AM: The reason Hol is here, isn't because I wanted to have a close relationship with her. I fully expected she would be away much of the year - working on various film projects. It's because a long-term relationship ended about the same as her work dried up... and she had no where to go and nothing to do with herself, until a new production got started.

From there, before there was a boyfriend too, she talked about needing a headquarters; her own place that no matter what was going on in her life, she could "fall back to". That was how we arrived at the idea of the Hut. She didn't want to buy something in the city; didn't want to live in the city anymore.

I've known she can be difficult for a long time. (And she comes by that honestly; our "issues" are pretty close - and we are slowly working through those.) She's even been with a T before. This last couple days, we've been able to actually talk to - and hear each other. Even if the subject matter is difficult. It's OK; I kept my hand busy in the studio. And she's now in the middle of a quilt. One of those conversations with some long silences in between as we pulled back into our own thoughts for a bit, before re-engaging.

As much as is on her plate presently, the only feasible option is to wait on T, till after the pilot is shot. And you BETCHA it's going to be nice to be alone for a couple months.

As far as the enmeshment goes, Hops - I've been trying to mind those boundaries. But that is apparently contrary to what she wants; what she's asking for. And therein lies the problem. Because I'm resisting engaging in that kind of activity - she's imagining all kinds of evil intent/judgement on my part about her, gets angry with me, and feels free to verbally/emotionally attack me. And I'm well aware that this limits my ability to get her to recognize the co-dependent patterns she's desirous of right now. Steve on the other hand - is validating and encouraging it.

Sigh. And I don't think he's a BAD person. He's impossible for anyone except Hol to interact with - because he is simply silent. For whatever reason - he doesn't feel obliged to even talk about what he's planning to do on any given day; sometimes not even with Holly. He doesn't even respond to direct questions from John; or me... except with one word or short phrases. It seems calculated to make people go away and leave him alone. As in, he can't be bothered to make conversation because the person isn't at all important in his world.

However - he is Holly's choice, so what I can do/say - or expect of him without running afoul of her protective instincts? Right? Every small, ordinary thing I ask is met with an outsized defensive attack. And yet - other people, the other "house guests" simply automatically know to help out around here. They are considerate of my space, me, and my needs. He doesn't even tidy up after himself in the kitchen; just gets up and leaves trash, food mess, dishes where ever. Drags dishes out into the woods and walks away forgetting about them. ???? WTF IS that? I don't even know; but one doesn't do that with other people's things in MY world.

Therefore the "charter". How we can treat each other to avoid conflict and misunderstanding and hurt feelings. A process for planning that allows for freedom of choices - but doesn't tweak my feelings of being steamrolled by people who don't care. SIGH... and I'm not sure I'm talented enough with words to do this in a way that doesn't sound like an edict from "management". LOL.

If I can get Steve to understand that he has to include me in his world - because he's living at my place; and even the Hut is still legally mine until I'm dust - so that I know what to expect in the way of projects in their space... then I have a basis that I know about him. Right now - after a year here - he is a completely unknown entity to me. And if Hol was honest, he is still an enigma to her too.

But she's willing to go to extreme lengths of tolerance, suspension of her needs, to keep this relationship. I know better than to even suggest there is a problem with this. But I KNOW there is a problem with this.

CB, getting my passport renewed is on the list. Buck and I have daydreamed about going some places he's been before.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 26, 2020, 08:04:45 AM: I am so sorry, Amber.
It truly makes me sad to see your dreams of retreat under siege.

I think Hol could return to her independent life and continue T and growing up and visiting the mountain sometimes with notice; meanwhile you could have a great Air B&B with the hut.

It was such an optimistic dream and a lovely one, but she doesn't seem mature enough to help it happen. And inconsiderate hangers-on....selfish entourage. Damn.

It does sound as though Steve does not want a relationship with you. One can't compel compatibility. But you sure as heck shouldn't have to play Mommy to these adults. Dirty dishes? Are you kidding? Ugh. Yet "laying down the law" is probably the only thing you CAN do. They're not going to suddenly embrace family/compound meetings or be inspired by charters if they already behave this way now.

"When people show you who they are, believe them."

As to dishes etc...I worry that "rules" are made to be broken by entitled younguns. I don't know how that attitude goes away without somebody saying No and meaning it.

You are doing the very best you can; I worry about the cost to you of all this stress.

Huge hugs,
Hops

PS Just heard a great quote from a T about relationships: "Honor the wish; accept the reality."
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on January 26, 2020, 11:07:27 AM: Skep, I just wanted to add my very general thoughts to this very difficult and complex situation. To me, the idea of moving into my mum's house, getting her to build me a place to live, having her allow me to move in my boyfriend, mentally unwell friend and dog and then castigating her for expecting people to be conversational and wash their own dishes up, is just mind blowing. They're not teenagers finding their way in the world, they're all middle aged people who need a kick up the bum, quite frankly. I feel really sad to read that you're worrying about how to word a 'charter' of behaviour and expectation. It's your place - if you want everyone to leap to attention every four minutes and do a cartwheel then you've got every right to insist that they do that or go somewhere else. It doesn't need to be reasonable - it's your home (and your dime they're all living on) and none of them are treating you very well, in my opinion. I do agree with Hops - if Holly's desperate to have a relationship and a baby with this monosyllabic layabout then she can - somewhere else (and I do find myself wondering how long that relationship would last if it were just the two of them, with no mum to absorb Holly's emotional needs that are quite clearly not being met by him).

I don't think you need a charter - I think you need some gloves off, straight talking about manners, decency, responsibilities and rent, without any worry about whose feelings might be hurt. I don't mean to sound harsh but from an outsiders point of view it reads like they're all taking advantage of your incredibly generous and giving nature and somehow managing to convince you you need to deal with all of them. They can all deal with themselves - somewhere else, if need be. I hope you can draw a line though a lot of this soon, and sorry again if this is too harsh or blunt, I don't mean it to be xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 26, 2020, 05:08:50 PM: Amber:

I feel a great deal of compassion for Holly.

From here, it feels like she's been pushing your buttons and boundaries hard, hoping you'll rally and stand your ground. I think she'll be relieved once you do.
Our children want us to have the answers, even as they resist them, IME.

The facts might feel threatening to Holly, for a bit, but they're necessary for her to make big girl decisions going forward, IME. Facts and truth will empower her. Blurring boundaries doesn't serve her journey, or anyone involved, IME.

It's going to be OK. You're a kind, consistent mother. Focus on what's yours and things will fall in place.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 27, 2020, 07:15:25 AM: Lighter - yes; you've hit the nail on the head. I have been suffering for months - precisely because I didn't ever forecast I'd have to stand up for myself in my own home, against my own - very empathic, and sensitive D. It's not as awful as some of y'all are thinking.

I get breaks - that I enforce. Sometimes Hol needs one too. But it's an ongoing situation that I need to address and SOON. Before her jail sentence (if any) and the temporary move to B'more. John is here and engaged in some of the situations - so I have his observations/feedback too. Mixed in with his concerns for her, of course.

My guess that this was a PTSD thing, has more validity. We spent two days talking through a lot of her memories. Mostly her talking - me filling in blanks or providing more details. She's on a mission, I think, to remember something her brain doesn't want to remember. It's a factor in her righteous anger. Confusion means, that sometimes she directs it at me; a little guilt as well.

3 days in a row now, with no major blowups or meltdowns. Of course, she's still got raging hormones from the miscarriage (and feelings to deal with)... and she started her first period right after the last ugly episode, when she was trying to nix the idea of the charter meeting - that she'd suggested not that many days before.

After my notes, after the first attempt at an outline, I rewrote it. There are only 3 main points (for now) - separated by Q&A/Discussion points. I want this to be absolutely CLEAR, unmistakeable, and things are phrased in such a way that I am looking for their input and ideas, to come to a basic agreement.

Buck has been my rock. It's been easy to explain all this to him; yeah - he has his own opinion and is OFFERING, should I ask, to "fix it". But staying behind the boundary. No challenges there. Commisseration, yes - he has an 18 yr old daughter feeling her oats. LOL. Holly's fears about him, are irrational. She even admits it. But I think I know where that fear comes from. For now, my lips are sealed.

Buck has so many kids - children, grandchildren, fosters, and god-children that he takes responsibility for - I know he's got great "Dad" instincts. I think eventually, she'll come to value that... as long as those boundaries glow in the dark and can be seen from outer space.

It IS going to be OK; all right. Because that's my role around here; it's in my job description.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 27, 2020, 07:51:25 AM: CB - yes, you know. I think it's a generational thing. The kids are way more used to friends or themselves "couch surfing" for a time, or permanently; and group living. I've NEVER lived with a group. Longest we had family stay with us at the beach was 10 days - and they were off sightseeing, going to the ocean all day many days.

I grew up expected to respect other people's things; to ask - not just assume; please & thank you... and I can't conceive of ever behaving like this -- even the times I've stayed with my (still) limited contact Mom.

And of course - Holly grew up with same social "rules"; some even stricter and more detailed. So, yes - I have an idea where she's getting the new attitude from. I'm presuming; but I'm also not buying the reasons/explanations/excuses for it anymore, either. BS.

Hops, there is NO WAY I want people traipsing in/out of my property on a regular basis; I am pretty sure now I'd be a terrible hostess. I just want to be a hermit - so I don't have to deal with the kind of crap I'm dealing with on a weekly basis - in my own house, because I offered her a refuge... and she brought home a stray pet.

She and I have had conversations about this for a year or more already. I really don't mind even large groups of her friends for a weekend. They're all intelligent, respectful, helpful and fun people - unlike this "pet" of hers. I objected - and warned her I would pull the plug on the first house guest, and DID. John, just showed up sans invitation to "help". I've talked to him about "white knight" syndrome. LOL. But that is the difference:

John does odd jobs around here - Steve has done none. John cooks food that is appetizing to all of us - instead of just himself. He attempts to mediate & witness during some of Hol's and my more heated interactions. While he is Hol's friend and right now devoted to helping HER, he's developed a fair amount of respect for my situation too. He and I even work together around here fairly comfortably.

And John goes into town to entertain himself, use a gym, meet friends - and offers to take Hol with him, but she will not leave Steve when he's here. (I believe the plan is for him to go along with her for the pilot filming. I already stated in no uncertain terms that he couldn't stay while she was gone that long.)

Steve may have ulterior motives for being this way; he may not. It may be a combination of reasons why he isn't going to interact with me - I have tried to initiate conversations with HIM, and I need a stopwatch to time how long they are. He never approaches me. I've even used the gimmick of speaking to the dogs... and that seldom works. But it's IMPOSSIBLE for me to tolerate - especiallly when he isn't contributing financially or with work. (This time of year, it's not hard work; just piddling inside projects; creative work.)

The point being, if he chooses to be this way and make no effort - well, shit. There are consequences. And these are it. I'm suspicious of his intentions toward my D long term and don't feel terribly KIND, as a result. But she's a big girl and makes her own choices TOO. And will suffer any consequences of them... but they're not going to be punishments or anything I initiate. She makes her bed; she can lie in it too.

But, if he thinks that's enough to get away with disrespecting my buildings, tools, and property - and kitchen counter - he has another think coming. It doesn't buy him a free ride either.

Buck described him as a tick. Once he's used up his "host" - he'll move on. It seems OBVIOUS to all of us, but it's not possible to talk to Hol about concerns. She makes excuses for him and defends him and takes on the things HE should be doing herself.

SIGH. Y'all know what that is and how it ends up
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 27, 2020, 02:50:33 PM: Amber:

I'm following your thread, taking notes and making connections for myself.

I have much work to do.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 28, 2020, 10:14:39 AM: I am taking a little "Buck Break" this morning. This is his first day back to work, and we've been downright silly and bawdy this morning. A mini-brain vacation.

Charter is done, printed, now all I have to do - with help - is find the right time/place to sit & talk it over.

I'm knocking off a lot of things like this off the list today. Lots of energy acquired in playing; who knew? LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 30, 2020, 09:01:43 AM: Short road trip today. Taking the sewing machine to nearest repair shop for this (now obsolete) model and possibly looking at replacement(s).

All by my big old lonesome. Going to be traipsing across paths I frequented years & years ago.

And Buck has his last appt today to check white blood count re: infection levels today. Depending on the results, this could set up another road trip for me, spontaneous like.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on January 30, 2020, 11:11:53 AM: Good luck with the meeting.

I'm praying for everything to go right for Buck.

Enjoy your busy day getti,b things done.

You sound good.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 30, 2020, 03:43:42 PM: Sending loads of repairing vibes for Buck, sewing machine, Hol, and last but not one bit least...you.

((((Amber))))

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on January 31, 2020, 01:11:58 PM: Oh, I found a new favorite place, when I got to the quilt shop. A mennonite family owns it, and I was met by the daughters (and maybe a friend or two) I stood in the entrance just taking in the space, the amazing machines, the absolutely PERFECT quilts and breathing in the smell of fabric and thread. The girls just OOZED cheer and bubbly goodwill... and I felt at home, immediately.

The father only needed a little time to look at his notes on this problem, with the out of date machine and I'd barely looked at a couple of potential replacements when it was fixed. He didn't charge me for that; I just needed the touchscreen recalibrated. Then we chatted a bit about manufacturer and the touchscreen issues. I bought a new machine that doesn't HAVE a touchscreen, just mechanical buttons to set stitches and adjustments. It's still in the box. It's my "backup" machine now. I'll keep abusing the old one until the touchscreen goes out again. I've made a note of how to override the menu and get to the screen I need to recalibrate it again. The owner said, it WILL happen again, and again, until eventually it completely fails.

The rest of the day didn't go so well. Buck asked if I wanted him to sugarcoat the news or tell me straight up - while I was stuck in a 5 mile long backup on the highway. Yes, his white blood count is still elevated; but the infection is only in his bloodstream and in layers of fat just under the skin. There isn't any contagion risk from him, unless he's cut and bleeding. Which, he promptly told me I would back away and let him handle it. I said OK, but know that I can glove up pretty quick. He called later, and said - I would also need a mask & gown. Easily acquired. Sometimes injuries happen where you can't reach it yourself.

The implications of this, is that left perennially untreated, eventually the infection will turn septic and kill him. Except he's going to have brand-new doctors up here and perhaps a completely different treatment protocol and level of care. He called to ask me if I still wanted to proceed with the relationship, knowing all this.

He's sensitive to how long I grieved Michael, which is appreciated. But Buck is a different person, in a different situation... and even I'm different now. Our relationship is also different and more transparent, no games or competition, lots more playing... without denying the reality that we're both over 60.

I did take a moment before I told him, I was still "all in". Ask the feelings one more time, if I could handle another loss. But it was just a moment. In order to LIVE, it's necessary to accept that loss can happen at any age or time. And we plan to dance a LOT before then. How could I pass that up? Out of some weird idea of trying to keep myself safe?

Nahhhhhh. I did that too much when I was lots younger. Time to roll the dice some more.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on January 31, 2020, 09:07:09 PM: Transcendent.
Beautiful.

What love.

I am so moved by your choice, Amber.

If you ever need a hospital gown, you'll turn it into your ball gown.

Lucky Buck, and lucky you, to be a woman who chooses love over certainty.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 01, 2020, 08:55:26 AM: Ya know Hops, when "writing" a really good story, or reading one, we really look forward to that denouement or sometimes "happy ending".

I figure I'm "writing" my life story but by living it - not telling the story - these days. And I'm thinking about writing this chapter(s) as the The Years of Living Dangerously. LOLOL. Freedom to jump off the cliff; trusting my wings; freedom to soar...

As compared to the 60 some years, that I was so focused on staying "safe" and "being careful" and being anxious about the future... and tortured by the past. And oh so concerned about being judged/criticized/what "other people" think. Nope, I'm over that. And that goes double for Holly, btw. LOL.

SO: it looks like I might be making a longer road trip to spend some time away from this 3 ring circus and just spending a couple more days with Buck. Soon. Like this month.

He's got to get back into shape to be able to carry his gear, to do the training. (Unless that's not a requirement for a trainer.) It's 187 lbs he says. :insert eyes bugging out at that weight: He figures the training will happen this summer. A month or so before he can come here. We keep checking things off the to-do list, to make this possible. And also checking-in after each one... to see if this is still what we want to do.

It is.
-------------------

Holly's at the stage of deciding where outlets are going, lighting, etc in the Hut. Windows and sliding doors should be arriving in a couple weeks; decks are the next thing up - which makes installing that glass wall on the field side of the house, MUCH safer and easier. She finally found a kitchen sink that'll do for now; still needs to pick out/order a woodstove and masterbath toilet (picked up 2 others at one of the rehab/reuse places - along with bathroom sinks). She still needs a tub for guest room. And meet with the concrete guys who might build her concrete soaking tub in the master.

We are now counting days to her court date; and finding out what her jail sentence might be. And she starts work on the pilot for this series in a month.

I dunno what exactly happened or how... but ever since our last squabble over the Farm Charter meeting, all that crap has died out and is gone. I suspect John made some headway with her. Last time the 3 of us hung out, it was like they were talking in their own language and I wasn't much included. So she picked at the scab of memory about some abuse stuff from her Dad... and we talked 2 days about that in a quiet, calm manner mostly. So now, we can actually have conversations that don't automatically become arguments. She's no longer ranting out a spiel of things... and when she starts into a semi-chronological blow by blow, all the gorey details including psych analysis... I am able to stop her and ask for the executive summary instead without being accused of who knows what occurs to her.

She's even starting to talk about things with Steve differently. I'm no longer anxious about the final version Charter to discuss at the first meeting. Que sera, sera.

Weird. So I don't know what changed. Just accepting that it has and rolling with it.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on February 01, 2020, 10:59:06 AM: Amber:

It sounds like you're happy with your sewing machine decisions. Well done.

It sounds like you're happily resolved to whatever comes next with B. He was so sweet to revisit your commitment to full time connection... willing to give you a gentle out, sans guilt.

He strikes me as an amazingly brave spirit. I've only met 1 like him.

You guys are well suited, IMO; )

I'm glad the anxiety around the charter dropped away. Doesn't matter why, you're right.

Hol moving through her stuff is good too.

I'm sending prayers and healing pink light for everyone who needs it.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 03, 2020, 10:02:37 AM: Thanks hon. He is a remarkable person - not the life-story stuff, the stories that old guys always tell on themselves (over & over & over... LOL) but how he approaches life in the day to day. The stuff that REALLY matters to him; and the plethora of stuff that DOESN'T.

We're hitting the point - even at a distance - where we're going through things together. That's pretty special all by itself. His D will hear by the 14th if she's accepted at the college she really wants. It's a smaller school, with a more classic art program. I think she'll do well there. He won't have to worry AS much about her in that environment. He's very much been a part of this whole Farm Charter debate and contention. But all from the place where he understands he's part of it too. He will need to participate. And why its necessary for us, as a family group.

The past 2 days, John's been putting in long hours on the rotohammer, helping me demo the surround for the electric fireplace in the master. The room is a freakin' dusty disaster right now. But we've been making good progress on it and while I can feel the "need to clean" ramping up; even overcoming physical exhaustion... I'm really wanting to push on and finish, so that I can clean ONCE and it stays clean. I need to call Hol's contractor and see if he wants to take on a reasonably small bathroom remodel that shouldn't take long and he'll have plumbers & electricians here anyway. The wall where the fireplace WAS, is my job. I think I'm putting up cement board and then filling in with dry stacked stone veneer (lightest color I can find) for behind the headboard. More mess - LOL. Then, new carpet... and bathroom tile... and then I can start making it a space for two instead of just me (which of course, I've been putting up with the things that bothered me or were unused/inconvenient for years now).

John and I work well together. He needed something physical to do and I was a little frustrated by my own procrastination - and lack of strength, to tell the truth - to do battle with the stubborn mortar, heavy hammers, and cobbled together blocks. Depending on what he decides to do with his future path, I could see him becoming a more permanent fixture around here. There are some personal issues of his own to work out; and he tends to trample boundaries more than he has a right to... but he's also working on that, and I am better aware of it, too. I don't think staying here is in his plans though. I think he has other things calling him, that he's working toward.

Que sera, sera. He's the right man right now and he is gratified by being able to contribute. So it works out.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on February 04, 2020, 10:13:11 AM: Glad Hol's friend John is a positive contributor for now, Amber.

Really glad it's beginning to sound as though actual plans are in the works for you and Buck!

Thinking of you as all these currents go in all their directions and hopefully soon settle into a beautiful body of peace, still waters, and calm depths.

Big hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 04, 2020, 11:49:32 AM: There is work to be done Hops. Since it seems we're having a mild-ish winter, I'm taking advantage of the "early season" schedule for contractor's tradesmen. Getting the bathroom remodeled, I think. Contractor will come look at it tomorrow or Thurs. Whichever day is full on rainy.

The end of this month and beginning of March are going to be totally insane, due to Hol's life stuff. But it also means I should have a couple months completely to myself - with probably some weekend visits from the kids. John's been talking about a trip to Vegas so he'll be gone awhile too.

And it sounds like work begins again on the fireplace demo. This day 3 for us working together on it.

Off and running now.

-------------------- ETA-------------

Shortly after I posted, he called to run the "idea" he had last night past me. He saw me post about the Ham Antenna I'm planning to put up. Wants to know if it would be OK, to come visit and stay a week - while he helps me. About mid-March - which is when Hol & Steve will temporarily be in Baltimore while she's working.

Guess who's over the moon?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on February 04, 2020, 10:18:09 PM: YEAH!

Great timing, Mr. B!

So happy for you, Amber.
Soon he'll be near enough to put your arms around.

YAY. HUGE YAYS.

Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on February 05, 2020, 07:46:48 AM: Oh, thank God.

I'm so glad you're over the moon about B's potential visit and not in need of some downtime.

I'm a bit over the moon too...picturing you and Buck installing a...
:: checking what Amber wrote.... ham radio.... antenna? Tower?::.

YES!
Ham Antenna.
::NOD::
That's it!
::imagining something very tall, very heavy requiring equipment and math::.

I can picture you two happily tackling that project together.... it just feels so right!
You've been so patient.
You've waited so long.

I hope the visit is everything you want it to be, ((Amber.))

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on February 07, 2020, 12:47:31 PM: Hey, Amber,

I was really interested in what you posted on CB's thread, thought I'd reply over here as it might turn into a rambling hijack (my major).

I like the idea that the search for "purpose" can become another "should." Well worth pondering, imo. Amazing how trendiness creeps into our most private/sacred spaces.

It's funny how we remember things (or in my case, often can't...). I don't remember ever advising you to seek your "purpose" but I could have. I'm sure I yammered on a lot about you finding yourSELF.

I normally tend to be leery of the word "purpose" in the context of searches for meaning or illumination or insight or some form of faith (or whatever) because it reminds me of Christian code-talk (from the book The Purpose-Driven Life) and that makes me uneasy. Not that people shouldn't do that or see their lives that way, if this structure works for them. I'm just allergic to special spiritual sauces.

I hope I haven't been pouring that on people. Ain't qualified.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 08, 2020, 10:17:29 AM: No worries, Hops.

It was back when I was flailing a lot after Mike died; and trying out words to try to talk about things I felt; realized; pondered. And it wasn't made as a "prescription"- it was just feedback about what you heard me talking about. One of many I got in those days!! But I heard it and pondered it; and what I told CB is what I came to for myself out of that process.

Holly is grappling with this now; and I think in her case - she's taking on some "purpose" that really doesn't belong to her; that she imagines "someone has to do". I just can't tell her that. LOL. Better to let her discover it on her own.

Things are about to be absolutely crazy here. Monday, the contractor demos my master bath. Have to let flooring place know how much tile to order; new vanity is ordered. I think by the time they move the plumbing & electric - the tile will be in. Vanity could take longer. Might even be done by the time Buck comes to visit.

We're trying to decide hardwood or carpet for the bedroom. Carpet is fast AND easy. But as far as hardwood being cold in the morning on warm toes... they DO make large rugs. I think I'm leaning to the carpet. Thick soft squishy carpet. LOL. There's some pilates, yoga & tai chi I NEED to start doing again. It helps to have a soft floor to do that on (maybe not the tai chi). That room is going to have the most floor space (except for the studio).

Holly Hut almost melted down last week - coz the windows came in and weren't the sliding style she wanted. Only ONE was; the rest are double hung. But they are VERY nice windows... and in the end, she accepted them, because of more air flow through her bigger windows (sliders would've had a fixed center pane in the triple width) and because it would've delayed work a whole month - plus cost me more money. It was a close call and I started talking her off the warpath the night before she woke the contractor up the next morning. LOL.

Reason I'm getting the master bath done so quick is it's supposed to rain all next week and the Hut still doesn't have power or heat. Hol is going to be tasked with putting the solar panels on the rack - and I guess perhaps John will help her - since S doesn't seem to want to work on the house where he's planning on living. (?? Eventually, Hol is going to take him to task for that. My lips are sealed.) Not sure they can work in the mud either. But there isn't much time now, till her court date and the probably of a week & a half; could be MORE/LESS; of jail time. Then the day she's released she has to be packed up to move to B'more for work. And she won't be around for 2 months, minimum.

So, whirlwind Amber is in motion and not slowing down. YET.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on February 08, 2020, 12:23:30 PM: Hi, Amber!

Just wanted to mention you could put heated tile in your master bath and bedroom. If it's on one control it might be as cheap to do both rooms as one?
Maybe? It's been many years since I looked into that, so there's likely tons of new info and products. I really enjoyed a heated bathroom floor when i had one.

You sound great. Get stuff done: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 08, 2020, 01:54:14 PM: Yeah, no... on the heated floors. Master is right over the furnace - and it's the warmest place in the house (coolest in a/c weather). The worry about cold floors belongs to Buck - but I understand it having lived in some old houses over the years. I'll probably have to turn the heat down for him, when he visits. LOL.

When it dawned on me that February was going to be this busy - I just dove right in and started herding all my "little kiddies" in the same direction. Might as well get a head start on spring stuff (or what normally waits to spring) and then, when it's suffocatingly hot in August - I'll be ahead of the game. No long winter nap for me this year. And working on that bathing suit body - moving LOTS of heavy stuff around right now. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on February 08, 2020, 03:35:58 PM: Well I invite you to make house slippers available for B, in whatever style you think complements him best, then not worry about the floors. Your master sounds like it's perfectly placed for maximum comfort at minimum trouble.

Do you think your kicking it into gear and herding cats in ONE direction had something to do with the cats calming down?

My kids do better when I'm busy, engaged and moving very fast just to keep up with what's on my plate.

Oldest seeks me out, talks about funny things, is very animated and engaged... wants to snuggle.... just a complete difference in the girls when I'm in a good busy space.

Thoughts?

Lighter

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on February 08, 2020, 10:01:48 PM: Carpet thought. I personally loathe laminate because of the poisonous (and odorless) VOCs that release for the life of it...and I love genuine hardwood.

I'd go for lovely rugs with deep wool or felt pads beneath. Reason is that carpet is just about THE biggest source of allergens in the home, and sucks up soooooo much yuck from indoor life that it simply can't be eliminated by any vacuum ever invented.

It does feel good though!

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 09, 2020, 09:17:58 AM: Yeah Hops, I ran through pros & cons of both hardwoods and carpet out loud to Buck - and still haven't heard back. We both have seasonal allergies to the greater/lesser extent; and I'm particularly sensitive to dust. So, I'm thinking I'm leaning to hardwoods. The other thing, is that Buck is always going to a small residual amount of this infection in his bloodstream - even as knocked down as it is.

And he tends to hurt himself resulting in bleeding a good bit. He's absolutely OCD fearful of accepting any help for fear of contaminating someone. I understand, of course. But he really is overdoing it. So hard, non-porous surfaces seem like a good idea.
---------------------------

I dunno Lighter, about the herding cats question. I do know for sure, that John has effectively helped the situation. From what I gather, from his explanation of this journey he's on, since I don't know him well... is that it's a "Johnny Appleseed" kind of thing. He is still going new places; places to feed his artistic creativity - museums, new restaurants, etc (he last worked as a chef) and eventually, in the near future will need to settle in somewhere into whatever his new "thing" is going to be. He'd communicated with Hol after the arrest - hopped in his van and was here 3 days later from the west coast. He was THAT concerned about her state of mind; and what all she was living through at the time.

His intention is to be as objective as possible and HELP in any way he can - and is allowed to. So, John and I have spent some long nights talking, comparing notes - he needed to see that Holly in her 20s has become this new Holly in her 40s and accept it. We accomplished that. Then there were the boundary issues: Hol's re: Steve, Mine, Hers & mine vs John's ideas... etc. All that has been comfortably and successfully navigated now. His mind is more at ease; she's not transferring her anger at other people onto me as much; I'm giving myself a bit of distance from all the drama before I say a thing; so not just instinctively reacting. And I'm making small, and gentle approaches to Steve (because according to Hol, I scare the bejesus out of him and he's sooooooooooo sensitive.) That pleases her.

John has also spent all night some nights talking to Hol. Giving her, his perceptions and understanding of what he sees around here. (Yes, he's done some therapy too.) And because of their long friendship, and maturation of themselves over the years, she's a bit more open to his presentation of topics/issues than from me. Whatever works, right?

So, all in all, it's been truly helpful to have him here. He was someone patient enough to hear me, as I slowly get the words out about my feelings... and not talking over me. He's validated, confirmed, & challenged some things. We don't have the emotional connection that Hol & I do; and the attendent complications. He's that and more with Hol. I think his venture has been successful. Add in that he truly loves to work - and has skills & tools - and his way of working is close to mine... (Hol's isn't)... and I've been able to give him a home base for him to enable this journey he's on - for himself. So, many of my little projects are completed. Because he's now comfortable that everything is going to be OK, with Hol he can focus more on himself and another friend who is around this coast, searching too. He's watched me go into action (after I sorted out the confusion of the gaslighting & transference crap she still isn't completely aware of) in my interactions with her....

and is comfortable with my understanding of what's been going on & why. No, it wasn't any of his business. But he does truly care about Hol as a human being; and this is a lifelong friendship for the two of them. He doesn't have any romantic fantasies about her... per se. And I've been able to give him some insight into what I know for a fact, about her, and her relationships - and how she's evolving through the classic co-dependent stuff.

Building the house has been a god-send for her. Stepping into the "boss" role. Making choices, compromises, working with so many people - when winter is usually a solitude time here. I think John showed up just in time to become enough of a distraction - without causing more real issues - to make it possible to avoid a really ugly and undesirable situation. Instead, everyone is working through it. Part of that - was getting her to accept that no one here was a threat to her or wanted to impose any judgements on her choices. In fact, we were trying hard to help her stop judging herself so cruelly.

I have a real, strong sense of "disaster averted" over these months; and it's mostly thanks to John. The physical work we've been doing together has been good for me, to shift out of "long winter's nap" mode and take advantage of the mild weather... to be in prime position come spring and planting season. Without an overwhelming "to-do list". I still have a couple things to take care of to be ready. But that's just "stuff".

LOL... he even mentioned the other day, that he wasn't looking for any "mom stuff" from me. So through our discussions - his/my past traumas, for instance - I have gotten to know him and I have been able to at least, convey my genuine appreciation for his help around here and validate the things that aren't so visible that he's tried to do.

He's also got Hol's superhuman critical thinking brain wheels churning again too. I wasn't able to get her unstuck. Now we just leave her be to do her awesome thing... and can trust that she'll make wise decisions, as she is wont to do, once she stops beating herself up. LOL.

I can see everyone's going to go away into their own lives for awhile, which is what I hoped would happen. And then we'll gravitate back into the group again at some time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 09, 2020, 09:51:57 PM: He's contagious if he bleeds - AND the person trying to tend him isn't gloved AND has some kind of cut or scrape. Bloodstream to bloodstream, in other words. Just getting his blood on intact skin, isn't a sure contamination. (I been doing my homework.) But even a hangnail could be considered an opening in skin.

Most of his complication derives from the fact that he's deathly allergic to the best antibiotic for clearing his infection. Lets say I did "catch" his infection. As far as I know, I can take vancomyacin without any side effects. (I'm not terribly worried about this anyway; he's so concerned that he could infect someone else - well, that's why he's OCD about it.)

He shouldn't have any issues at training, being in full diving gear - and he won't be actually diving. The training happens in a special pressure/compression chamber. Think astronauts training for weightlessness - only this simulates the pressure of being deep in the water. He can't say what he'll be teaching; and I know better than to ask.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 13, 2020, 11:40:44 AM: Sigh - February's mantra is: NO REST FOR THE WEARY. LOL.

I was ready to go to bed last night at 7:30. But even as tired as I was (because I stayed up late the night before trying to carve out some "me time") I ended up around the pub table in the studio. Steve left for work that evening, John took off for the gym and R&R in town... so it was just Hol & me. We haven't had that luxury for awhile.

We had a really GOOD talk. First one in awhile. She's identifying signs of being pregnant again - but clearly isn't letting herself even think about it as "real" yet; because the issue has been staying pregnant. She consults with the OB-GYN next Tues. She is working through some things with Steve; with her friend John; with me - and with herself. All while managing all this OTHER stuff - LOL.

I'm feeling a lot better; more solid and confident and HOPEFUL about things coming together and going forward together here. But I'm also having a hard time with the activity level going on around me -- even when I'm not involved and don't have to devote any brain space to it. So I took advantage of a late night with no one around... just to "put it all down and do something kinda fun"... and now I don't have the luxury of resting back up again. I've got to keep moving, get this & that done - so we're not behind an 8 ball and waiting because I didn't hold up my end of things. Trying to get past the worst of the "disruption" and parade of vehicles & people around here by May. And ALSO get all my garden prep underway - which requires some shopping. LOL.

Nurseries aren't open here yet - I haven't been able to get into town over the mountain to pick up seed starting soil. But I have seeds; I have mushroom compost... still need pots & trays. There's some stuff I can start now, because they take so long to germinate. Mostly herbs; the woody stemmed varieties.

I think part of what is causing mental sensory overwhelm, is coz Hol has to tell me all the details of every single decision she's making/made on the Hut, while I'm making decisions on my projects... and then another person will chime in... or Buck will text with a question... LOL. It just like working again. 'Cept it's working for US, and what we will have at completion won't need any "attention" at this intensity for a long long time.

That said, I'm really glad the contractors only work 4 days a week. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 20, 2020, 09:58:28 AM: So, Buck trimmed his beard last night. It had gotten VERY long; ZZ Top long. And he's gone from teddy-bear cute (but also looking kinda homeless) to tall, dark, handsome & somewhat mysterious... (I think he has to get used to seeing the shorter look too.) Kinda reminds me of Sean Connery in the Raiders of the Lost Ark movie... or Harrison Ford, I think it was... in Red October. Phones being what they are these days, I have before/after pics.

Farm projects are moving along pretty good; tomorrow is Hol's court date and then I need to step in as project manager on the Hut for however long she gets sentenced. (Fingers crossed.)

She isn't pregnant; OB has prescribed a simple med that will encourage egg production since she's older; and the chances of a natural pregnancy with healthy egg goes up too. It's also the least problematic solution with the life situation she's faced with for the next couple months. Today is all about keeping Hol from overthinking tomorrow's DUI sentencing.

All the stuff for my bathroom makeover is ordered; now we wait - and those carpenters are working on the Hut anyway. Plumbers, electricians, and a guy making a custom concrete soaking tub for 2 - who has already butted heads with the Gen Contractor. Hol just looked at the foreman and mouthed: I'm outta here... LOL. She's learning. Danny can be just as protective of her as Buck can be of me. I think Danny wants to hire her after this house/pilot movie production is done. I don't think she'd work for him. LOL.

Both of the carpenters working on my bathroom, worked on the window/door replacement for me a couple years ago. One guy chatters incessantly and the other quietly goes about his job, until he needs direction. That's Mike; I was telling Mike about Buck - the reason for the bathroom timeline getting moved up... and the next call I got from the Gen Contractor, he was razzing me about "falling in love again". I could almost see him grinning over the phone. LOL. I've heard all kinds of terrible things about him being difficult to work with - and yeah, I've butted heads with him too. But I understand this kind of "old school" guy mentality... and know the difference from when it's well-intentioned and when it's not. I told him it was true that guys gossip more than women. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 23, 2020, 08:23:33 AM: So, going to court, with Hol... since she can't legally drive in that state... the second time, gave me a chance to watch my reaction. It was a lot more intense than Hol's.

Things I noticed coming up:

powerlessness
voicelessness
shame
absolute terror

Now, given I've never fallen afoul of the laws or remember any court time, except for my divorces and some jury duty... and Hol's first DUI, never even been in a court room... I'm real curious about the reaction, because it seemed as if it were triggered trauma memories. As if I'd lived some horrific experience before.

That my conscious mind doesn't remember - but my emotional/body mind still has memories of.

We all kind of breathed a sigh of relief and have quieted down, rested from the anxiety of uncertainty, and separated into our own spaces. John cooked yesterday. Not sure what Steve is doing... but Hol is adamant that he will be the one picking her up from jail in 10 days - or else. Because he hasn't been there for her in any of this process. And it's kinda hard to ignore that John drove all the way here from Portland, OR to support her, be with her, without holding any romantic (so he claims) expectations. I think he IS trying to set an example for her - of what she should expect in the way of reciprocity from her SOs, however.

Small panic attack, Thursday. A phone call; number I didn't recognize - was the company I'd ordered the bath vanity from. Their supplier is backordered on sink tops until MAY - unless I wanted a vessel sink. (I don't like these.) He tried to talk me into a longer vanity, too... but given the bathroom is only 50 inches wide, wall to wall, I NEEDED the 48" wide one. I retreated to vacated studio space... and started looking online. Found what I wanted locally. It'll be here next week. Guess my tile will get picked up next Friday.

There is a whole list of things I need to step in, temporarily, and be in charge of on the Hut too. And try to get my taxes pulled together and shipped off to CPA.

Hol gets out of jail the 3rd; and I guess I need to ask her if she's backing out of this job to shoot the pilot or not; Friend Debbie is coming for the weekend the 5th - and the house is a disaster. Buck will be here after that.

It's mud season. And so far, everyone but Hol & John remember to take their boots off before traipsing through the house. SHE should remember it's one of the house rules. Irritates me no end and she doesn't clean up after the dogs when they shake mud off either.

Even Buck's gone quiet - his D spent the weekend with his ex (or so she says; she had previously planned to go to Myrtle Beach with a problematic group of HS friends; and he's not sure if she's pulling a fast one or not). But it's not lost on him, that in 5 months, she'll be gone and he won't know what she's up to on a daily basis. I guess even Dads go through empty nest syndrome. LOL. I've been giving him his space and vice versa. We both have a lot of stuff in our heads to deal with right now.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on February 23, 2020, 12:54:13 PM: Whew, glad that's behind you, Amber.

Luckily, you don't need to be vigilant about or involved in or analyzing or talking to John about whether:

Hol's partner stuff: whether she asserts herself and gives Steve an ultimatum/clear consequences or not.

Hol's friend stuff: whether John asserts himself and manages his own expectations or not.

You are freeeeeeeee, to enjoy your own beautiful new bathroom and beautiful new man.

Gotta run, lugging gallons of tea and juice and cider to homeless kitchen. Due...aaackk!

Later,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on February 29, 2020, 01:24:37 AM: I hope Hol emerges relatively unscathed from her time away, Skep. I think that feeling powerless as a mum is very powerful and can bring up all sorts of reactions linked to past events. I'd imagine sitting in court and knowing there's nothing you can do might evoke that. I'm glad at least it's done and hopefully things will settle better once she's home again.

I am laughing at Buck's beard and about the stories I hear about people offering to buy food and drink for people they think are homeless, but who are actually just a bit hairy :) Lol, there was one here recently about a lovely lady who stepped in to pay for a man's food because she thought he was homeless - he was actually a very hungover builder who'd stopped for emergency junk food on the way to work. All his mates were in the van laughing themselves silly :) I like stories like that xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 29, 2020, 05:18:40 AM: I'm kinda feeling like there is a big storm approaching on my horizon. From some direction. that hasn't made itself known just yet.

Up way before the dawn, because this is visiting day; about halfway through Hol's sentence... and John and I are going to visit. Once again, the BF "conveniently" has work scheduled so as to not be there for her. He has consistently let her down throughout this whole self-created ordeal of hers... and why was she drinking that night to blow off steam? Frustration about BF.

She is seriously co-dependent here; and ENABLING him to take advantage of her.

Now, going to go read more on CB's thoughts. (Good timing for that thread.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on February 29, 2020, 06:45:31 AM: ((((((((Amber)))))).

I can't imagine what it's like to deal with a kid who's locked up; to visit and feel the shock of the environment, her loss of freedom. How is she taking it? Are the conditions okay?

I can imagine how stressful it is to see her making poor choices, whether with alcohol or BF, and not want desperately to undo them. That one, I know too well.

I hope her time back at work and away from the mountain brings a change that is good for you both--and mostly, for you and the chance to build your relationship with Buck.

But I am concerned he won't be able to be your Outlander man now, with just scruff. The show just popped up on HULU and I'm wondering if I dare get hooked?

When does Buck arrive? I hope it is just a wonderful, deepening, happy and peaceful time together. You two have gone through a LOT to get together.

big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on February 29, 2020, 01:04:21 PM: Amber:

Maybe something is brewing. Trust your instinct, but beware old patterns. Sometimes the other shoe isn't going to fall, though we're expecting it to.

Hopefully Hol has what she needs.... and if she doesn't...it's only 10 days of institutionally inflicted lack of sleep/privacy/nutritional food.

She'll likely be living in her amygdala when she gets out. I hope she finds a way to calm her nervous system so it doesn't get stuck and more difficult to shift.

And when is Master Buck scheduled to arrive?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on February 29, 2020, 04:35:55 PM: Actually, a lot of the pinched stress lines in her face are gone. Because she has nothing to do but think about what has transpired up till now - AND the examples he is showing her, about who he is - for her. And who he's NOT.

I find myself infuriated FOR her; on her behalf a lot. I'm gonna stop that. She's the one that needs to be angry; not me. I am frustrated by her continually excusing the behavior based on extremely limited information from him. He is simply NOT THERE for her and I woulda thrown this one back some time ago.

She is also way too passive about all this - and yet it still erupts in projection onto others; primarily John & me... because we're "safe". We ain't goin' anywhere; won't abandon her. But I think we're not going to put up with that anymore.

So: as far as what I "can do"; is simply encourage her to seek therapy - in a couple of weeks. (She already turned down the job; because BF "needs her". I can point out when she's engaging in "needing to be needed" and enabling the behavior that's a problem. I can encourage to actively pursue her own friends and life activities.

He is not going to change; it's too easy for him - with all the enabling and her caretaking and "gatekeeping" anyone else from confronting him. Until she deals with it.

Buck is getting jerked around by the hospital again. And he simply will NOT expose me to his infection. I asked him point blank if this would interrupt or delay our plans. And he disappointed me. By trying to keep me safe from what he's dealing with. SIGH. But, he will be here as soon as he can.

Amber is kinda going to a whole new place. She probably won't be described as "nice" by too many people. LOL. Fortunately, Buck respects that. He told me this week (while I was trying to settle an oncoming panic attack) that I was stronger than anyone he's met before. That wasn't military. LOL.... it helped, in a strange way, coz I realized the panic was because I was trying to take care of everyone else around me - and not taking care of myself. Desperately needing someone to focus on ME, you know? But I can do that.

I think I understand the origin of Hol's codependence. But my lips are sealed for now - unless she brings it up and asks. I think she & I have talked about it previously. But she needs a good, compatible T, to walk her into a new path. I'm not sure what worked for me - will help her. And I don't know what else to suggest. We have some important differences, despite the things we have in common. All that has to wait till she regains her feet and finds out what ELSE might be a consequence of this DUI. John has committed to staying a few days after she's back - but then - he's making other plans so she has more space to step into her life and start working it. He and I have talked about that, and I think it's for the best - for everyone, including him.

It has been a tremendous help to have another mind around here to bounce things off of - for ME. John's been very helpful in many ways. Yeah, there were some boundary issues - and we could talk about them and sort them out comfortably. That's a breath of fresh air around here. And helped me out of the confusing clouds of phog and gaslighting... and find my own place to stand, and step up from.

Wasn't what he had in mind - but it's still helping. LOL. I'll be trying to help him along on his way to the next phase, out of gratitude. (He has had a good effect on Hol, too - but that was an ugly confrontation that I wasn't involved in.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on February 29, 2020, 09:52:12 PM: Amber:

I'm confused about Hol giving up the job, Buck putting off the visit and John, in general.... I missed anything about a blow up with Hol.

It's concerning. You've been concerned. Seems reasonable to me.

Hol's bf's not being there for Hol..... Holy Cow. Esp as she's trying to get pregnant with his baby. Maybe Hol will feel this lack of support and project herself into the future, raising a child, with someone who doesn't show up. Why doesn't she feel she deserves better, Amber? Why is she working so hard to make her relationship into something it's not? So much denial, and defensiveness and picking up slack for someone who seems unable to connect or carry his share.

I'd be fighting anxiety back too, Amber. Good on you for recognizing lack of self care and worry about other people's stuff needed attention and correction.

::sending Buck healing light and faith you can take care of yourself in this::.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 01, 2020, 07:21:44 AM: Lighter - I'm gonna admit I'm kinda confused too. Especially the Holly situation. I HOPED we had talked things out; she had gone away to ponder and show the kind of solid good judgement she's known for...

it IS possible that the 9 yrs in an abusive relationship has impacted her self-worth more than I realized (or she would admit). But all I can do is gently make note of the possibility - and then turn over "doing something about it" to HER. But there are multiple things to worry about. She would've been working with a lot of friends she's known awhile on this production... and instead chose more isolation here. (Which is totally out of character for her; I'm the hermit - she's more a social butterfly.)

Buck will know Monday; or at least know MORE about when he'll be able to come up. They'll probably do another blood test to ascertain infection level. He is feeling better; the meingitis has cleared; he hasn't "crashed" in the afternoon/evening with a fever for a week.

Tonight's another Outlander episode... and Monday I have plumbers and contractors again, before they move on to other jobs (Hut's plumbing/electrical is just waiting on some solar parts). I am very very very tired. So, shrinking down into my space for a bit.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 06, 2020, 08:14:32 AM: More hospital organizational confusion for Buck. More poor communication. Within this cobbled together system with the VA... one of his docs was supposed to be the "primary". There are 3 depts he's been a patient of: the neurosurgeon, Pain Management, and Infectious Disease. The surgeon WAS his primary and last week, released him. Neither of the other two will claim him...

and now the hospital's NEW procedure (unannounced change) is that only the primary doc can prescribe Rx - including painkillers.

Buck hasn't been taking ANY beside over the counter NSAIDS; and his BP shot up dangerously high -- due to pain. His cardiologist is apparently in another system. And he will prescribe enough to keep B's BP somewhat closer to normal. It's been some years ago now, that he had to have stents. And he's learning to drop it with intentional relaxation.

Buck doesn't want to have a thing more to do with that hospital anymore. They won't treat the infection, the recurring meningitis except to exacerbate it or do a thing for his chronic pain. He'll wait till he comes here - after his training this summer - and find new docs.

But the new wrinkle is that he is a 3rd tier contact for Coronavirus (and he's stocking limes for it - LOL). His D is going to prom with 3 other girls... and the poor man has been taking the group shopping. Last weekend was shoes. One of the girls in the group has a relative that had contact with someone who contracted the virus on the other side of the country. Despite age & previous health conditions... there is a good probability that he will NOT come down with it. STILL...

the man is a magnet for stuff happening to him. He must've been very bad in a past life to have karma like this. LOL.

I've had an extremely taxing week - emotionally. My friend Debbie is here for the weekend. And I'm really really hoping the contractors don't show up today... I want to have a slow morning or 3 and let my OWN tension and BP and anxiety go and relax too.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on March 06, 2020, 11:25:37 AM: I cannot fathom how profound your and Buck's frustration is over his inadequate treatment, Amber. It is excruciating to even read about, and knowing you love the man....words fail.

I am so very sorry.
This is taxing you at the deepest levels.
Much less poor Buck. Dammit.

So glad you have a friend's company right now.
I hope you soak in the support and care.

You deserve it. Lots more of it. Lots more often.

(((((((((Amber))))))))))

Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on March 06, 2020, 02:35:54 PM: Amber:

Sometimes I think I'm reading old posts, bc there are so many medical snafoos in your postings.

I'm shocked B is so robust and active with everything going on. I'm afraid he's going to go and go until he's worn himself beyond repair, bc he's so tough but I really don't know.

Those patients who wail and carry on dramatically might get more attention, IMO. Maybe those hiring attorney advocates? Not sure about that, but I'm shocked more doctors don't end up threatened into right actions by super deserving vets who know they're being harmed and shafted by the system AND the docs in particular.

I don't know. I do understand the frustration, justice denied in abusive systems and feeling at the mercy of.

Rest. It's snowing here... high winds... feels brrrr freezing cold right now, but in 40s. How is weather for you?

Stay warm and enjoy visit with friend.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on March 08, 2020, 12:01:31 PM: Amber, this is a reply to your latest post on CB's Thoughts thread about men and women and power, since I thought I was helping hijack that one off topic....just being anal. Librarian gene. And, maybe all this stuff about me is likely a hijack too!
Last para below is my actual answer to your question.
----------------
NOPE.

I remember when my D was grinding at me, crunching me like an old soup bone, the hardest...she kind of peaked in her desperation to control when she told me I wasn't allowed to think about certain things. Or want something. Or remember something. She didn't realize what she was expressing but it was about control. She was actually beginning to become emotionally abusive then, and it went downhill from there.

At one point when I mentioned an insightful bit of wisdom about our struggle I'd gotten from a minister, she railed that I was not allowed to mention her name, ever, anywhere, with anyone. I know she was battling for control as her own world was melting down. And fighting a feeling of shame as her mental illness escalated. But I told her in that moment that she could not set restrictions on my freedom to speak, about whatever I needed to. I know that was very hard for her. It was hard for me too, that there were privacy issues to negotiate. I wanted to create a safe space for her, but not one in which she could continue to focus pure hatred and rage on me. The bald truth was, if I couldn't carry my heartbreak to a few trusted friends (including here), not to mention a T, I wouldn't have survived. She was in a way trying to isolate me then.

When someone tries to control how you process or share or articulate...or demands you share what they want you to at their command, I believe then boundaries are pudding and, having lost their own self of self, they're trying to absorb yours to gain strength. (A theory out of the blue, but I'm owning it.) It's unconscious I think, and not always malicious. But it
Sure
Ain't
Healthy.

I'm so sorry you're dealing with this, (((((Amber)))).

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 08, 2020, 12:50:05 PM: PUDDING, those boundaries are. Yes indeed.

In this case, the difference is that her need to control isn't about me - she's "rehearsing" in a way - for the person she NEEDS to talk to directly, get answers from that help her relax and feel secure enough that the relationship won't end as a result.

I have made tangible, visible steps that she asked me to take - in the interest of lowering the tension levels around here. And over the years, I've made significant progress being able to share my space. With lots of different kinds of people, in fact. (That progress is dismissed, when we're locked into one of her analysis trips.)

I have zippo expectation or realistic hope that I can teach her SO, by example. So my focus is on her. If she sees me not resorting to co-dependent strategies, perhaps the lightbulb will come on. That does presuppose she can accurately separate what she FEELS she's doing, versus how that is manifested in the caretaking she indulges in without discernment. There are other parts to this story I haven't shared... mostly because we are making some progress there and I'm gently nudging that progress on. And again trying to model the behaviors that will help her in the long run.

Under all the external stuff - is the horrible self-shaming fear she has that she won't be able to have a child. I'm pretty sure she has some work to do, before becoming a mom. This is one reason the transgressions of SO are so overlooked and excused by her. LOL... but I'm still trusting that things are going to work out, in the actual nitty-gritty of hard work, and 3rd party (ie, not ME) therapy. Obviously, every single time we go through a repeat of this behavior... I back off some more, and point out who owns what - who's responsible for what - and we take care of our own stuff. I don't get to tell her who to choose for SO. At all. Any way shape or form. Not my business.

That is the only way to manage this kind of shared living space, that I can see being useful after the ground rules of communication & cooperation and basic values are shared in common.

It will help a LOT if she can learn to mind her business, and not mine. I said it to her a little differently. Think I said, we each need to mind our own business - and NOT each other's. Sounds like planting a flag on a boundary to me.

LOL.

Mind you - this is a NOT constant reality between us. It only erupts under very specific circumstances, and knowing what I know now about that... I can be responsible for not letting ALL those circumstances come together into the "perfect storm". It is decidedly NOT useful to either of us.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 11, 2020, 08:10:53 AM: So... because of this virus going around, the hospital has pushed back Buck's next appt - for the infection. His cardiologist is attempting to get both Infectious Disease and Pain Management to do their jobs for him - because it's the infection & pain pushing his BP up. (Oddly, it comes under control - to normal - with physical activity and mental relaxation IF he can work at that.)

Which means our week together is getting delayed - AGAIN - by forces outside his control. But by June - it will have been a whole year since he was here last. And he needs to be cleared medically, to do this training for the Navy over the summer. So it's looking more likely I won't see him, till after his D goes to college.

I have some pretty big sad feelings about this. Not blaming him; just disappointed. I told him; he took it pretty well - all things considered.

I really don't like going through getting my hopes up & then disappointed again. Thinking I might step back a little and shift where I'm looking at things from.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on March 11, 2020, 08:43:50 AM: Oh, Skep. Can you not go up to him? Or is that not an option with all the health issues and so on? xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 11, 2020, 09:21:02 AM: It's not an option, for other reasons, dear.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on March 11, 2020, 03:06:31 PM: Is it the crazy ex wife?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on March 11, 2020, 04:19:51 PM: I'm really sorry, (((((Amber))))).

I hope you'll keep posting as you process this.

Big big hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on March 11, 2020, 04:32:25 PM: Who can expect B to be up to a physical challenge when the VA hamstringed him through subpar/incompetent/non-existent care for very serious infections AND pain AND the stress that drives his BP up to unhealthy levels.... while they continue leaving him in pain and creating stress FOR HIM?

I can't imagine B would be ready for duty.... ANY duty..... he can't even have a week's visit with his SO.

OK... THIS is what's bugging me.

The VA is treating him like they're waiting for him to go ahead and die.
NOT like they're trying to get him up and running for duty as a highly sought after asset in the field.

((Amber)) I'm sorry this is so dissapointing. I'm dissapointed for you too.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 12, 2020, 09:03:02 AM: That's exactly how they're treating him Lighter. My head's exploded so many times from frustation at the sheer willful stupidity of it all... that I'm kinda numb.

Only thing I can think to suggest is for his commander to put pressure on these depts. Usually when the military officers "request"... people hop to.

And the other thing that's crossed my mind (god forgive me) is that I still don't know the whole story.
----------------------

It appears from announcements last night that the virus is picking up speed and getting the usual "lets throw money at it" solution from FedGov. I hope the virus is bribe-able. /sarc

Just to muddy the waters a little more, on what know/don't know about this virus...

one of the girls B took prom shopping a couple weekends ago - is now down with the virus, in hospital, with ARDS. She is 18. That contradicts all the official messages about younger people and mild cases, since she was a healthy girl. In another week, he and his D, will have finished up the 14 day (minimum) waiting period for incubation.

I have to go over the mtn today for banking. It'll be the last time I'll do so for a month. Everyone is adjusting their understanding of "basic expectations of normal life" around here - including the kids. Usually Steve works large events - concerts, conventions, etc. Those have been cancelled for the most part. She has other friends in the cities that will be magnets for community spread. So far, she's limiting travel - but not completely. She can't; she has classes to take (state mandated as part of her sentence) over the mtn.

I am not adjusting much to my routines - and will continue going out - but am very carefully watching what's going on and paying attention. With an eye toward being able to hibernate, at the drop of a hat.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 14, 2020, 03:59:29 PM: Tell ya what - work seems to keep me away from seeing the 100th iteration of the same information online - and letting it get under my skin.

Painting and staining wood in bathroom, so that they can come in, Monday and finish up by the end of next week (Thursday for them). So far the contractors haven't stopped working 'coz of CV19. So far no (reported) cases in my state - I think we're the last of the 50. No idea how long that'll last. Our K-12 schools are closed as a precaution, but otherwise life is normal around here. Maybe fewer tourists - who usually start making expeditions this time of year.

This is about my "normal" for the start of spring/end of winter... so, nothing is all that different for me.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on March 14, 2020, 04:09:41 PM: Amber:

Two questions:

1. What color are you staining wood in the bathroom and...

2. If you don't know B's entire truth, what is your intuition telling you that truth might be? This is a rhetorical question, of course.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on March 14, 2020, 09:37:11 PM: Quote
the other thing that's crossed my mind (god forgive me) is that I still don't know the whole story

Forgive yourself, please, Amber. Given all the drama, darkness and heroic obstacles laced through B's exotic backstory, it would be irrational not to have any thread of doubt. Romance is what it is. And rationality is too. Don't feel guilty for having questions and needing evidence or looking before leaping too far. And for perhaps not entirely upending your life before you do feel that full confidence.

Love is the best. It's a healing purpose and a savior and sometimes a magician (or a trickster) and none of us manage it perfectly. But if love is also honest, true and transparent, it will not become enmeshment or obsession, and it will still be there after the examining and testing of passion is done. When love is mature, it winds up wise. And if it can't mature, but stays adolescent (we all start there...that's what lust and loneliness are about!), then WE get to wind up wise anyway.

(You can tell I never learned anything the easy way....)

I so hope it works out for you and B, but if it doesn't or can't, I know you'll be all right. Bloody but unbowed.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 15, 2020, 09:13:02 AM: 'morning...

Lighter, the pine is going to get a stain of red oak on top of it; that will darken it a notch and cut the yellow a little; but I've upgraded the lighting in there and the floor and shower are now lighter (haha) - as well we dropped the ceiling to the bottom of the exposed beams in the area over the shower and opposite on the vanity side. Those are already primed with Killz as is the drywall behind the where the vanity goes. Paint color is "Bit o' sugar" - a shade of white, that has the palest pinkish; warmish tones I could find in the swatches. This picks up some of the tones in the stone tile in the shower.

I'll figure out a way to get pics to y'all. Everything will make more sense if you can SEE it.

Hops, my dear, thank you.

I think what my worries all boil down to, is that once again - my belief & faith in how institutions work has been shattered again. This time it's healthcare and the military/gov at a deeper level, than I already knew it was messed up. Along with: there are likely perfectly legitimate reasons why he isn't going to share every blessed detail with me about himself.

Those would be intensely personal and emotional. Just like I have things that even NOW after all these years - are hard for me to say and talk about. And the fact is - knowing such things isn't required for me to trust him; I don't have any "right" either, to know those things -- unless they're offered. Anymore than Holly has any right to pry into my deeper feelings about anything I don't offer to talk about.

In fact, as I sit here writing this - it occurs to me that this "modern" "virtue" of oversharing everything contributes to all kinds of dysfunctional interpersonal expectations and interactions. The problem I see with this - is that emotions & feelings are constantly in flux - changing - so a truth told to one, on a Tuesday can absolutely be false by Saturday. EEEEEEK.... there would be no constants, no continuity, no predictability in relationships if people actually did practice that (or could with any duration). It would be like not having ANY higher brain function or control over behavior EVER - and IIRC - that's a serious PD.

Enmeshment, codependence, abuse... are all nurtured in that kind of environment. Thanks, but no thanks. I'll just stay out here on my mountain and be an anachronism and dinosaur.

My doubts about B showed up when I was physically, mentally and emotionally exhausted. And concerned about things I was seeing about this virus situation. Oddly, Hol's concern too was even more upsetting than reassuring - as in, if she's noticing/worrying about it too... maybe I should be more scared & careful. I was just that tired.

One of the things I love about Buck, is that I can ask him a direct question and get a direct answer. No evasiveness; no judgement; no power-struggle game playing - not even making fun of me. His arrows strike true. So I asked him, if he wasn't talking to me - 'coz he was busy & more quiet that day than usual. I mentioned I felt that I just wasn't thinking "right"... and he told me that I should never think he wouldn't talk to me... and that I should try to sleep; he'd stand watch for me. (So, telling me to put away my hypervigilance and stand down and rest.) It worked; I dropped right off to sleep and slept 10 hours. I needed that protection to stop myself/my brain, and just rest...

He knows I don't need him, to do what I do and have done. He's told me he knows I am strong and believes in my abilities. He knows even strong women need a strong man to lean on and rely on in those times they just need to take care of themselves -- but aren't seeing it themselves coz they're too damn tired... he's needed me the same way, more than once and it doesn't diminish either one of us to admit that and to take care of each other, as needed. The rest of the time we're partners or playmates - like some self-perpetuating fun & creativity chemical reaction; and there is a great deal of intimacy in that.

I don't need to DO much FOR Buck. To take care of him. The man is self-sufficient, skilled, and highly intelligent. And way more civilized & nurturing than the stereotype of a grizzled,scarred old vet would lead one to believe. That's WAAAYYYYY out of my previous experience of men, in general. And go figure - he puts as much into "working on the relationship" as I do, too.

It just all seems way too good to be true. I'm not doing the starry-eyed, nothing can be difficult about this falling head over heels and not being practical thing. But it DOES come up periodically - and when it does - I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop instead of simply enjoying the feeling. Told him last night he makes me smile ear to ear - just coz of how happy he looked in a picture he sent me. He told me that brings him joy.

It doesn't get more direct than that and I'm SOOOOOO not used to this.

There is one youtube tarot reader I really like; she does "intuitive readings" - going deeper below the surface - and she does longer readings, even when they're just general - for one sun sign. This last one, the very last card was Blessings - count your blessings - gratitude. Maybe that will calm my nervousness and worry about how I can know if all this is really really really true, cross your heart & hope to die true. And whether this is what I really really feel for him, too - not just being lonely & needy.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on March 15, 2020, 09:38:37 AM: Skep, I think Buck sounds like an absolute diamond. Yes, I agree with the not 'oversharing' thing. From what you've written on here, Buck seems to me to be a decent enough man that he would tell you anything he felt you needed to know. He just comes across as that sort of person - that he'd tell you if it might affect you. But other than that - I know I've got stuff from years ago that I wouldn't bring up with a prospective partner now. We all do things at times in our lives to survive - experiences we go through make us react in certain ways, and there are ways I coped when I was younger that I wouldn't use to cope now. People change, as you say, sometimes even in the space of a few days.

I can also only say that after fifteen years of dealing with the public sector here on behalf of my son I honestly feel that it's the most corrupt and malefic institution going. And it's very destabilising when you discover that systems you believe are in place for our benefit might not be. So I can understand very well how you must both be feeling with all this endless faffing about over his health. Terrible situation. I am keeping all things crossed for the two of you to spend time together eventually and just have a nice time, being together and enjoying each other. xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on March 27, 2020, 01:06:42 AM: How are you doing, Amber?

Is your bathroom moving along?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on March 27, 2020, 08:23:10 AM: Well I'll defend lonely and needy any day of the week, honestly. I gave a lay sermon once called "Only the Lonely" about "needy" being a modern epithet. We DO need each other; we're supposed to. Lonely and needy are not shameful, they're human feelings in many human realities, and if you feel either from time to time that's just part of you being you. If those feelings got so huge they broke relationships, disabled you from functioning or meant you were no longer responsible, they'd be pathological. Sure doesn't sound like Amber to me.

Hell, you've been a recent widow on a mountain with a troubled, demanding adult child and her retinue and your only present friend was a married handyperson who's now a wounded logger. What would most humans feel in that situation? You deserve to feel whatever you feel and meet your natural need to be loved and cared for in whatever ways feel healthy and right to you. Ninety percent right.

It's the reciprocity that makes it beautiful. That you can express need or loneliness to him, and vice versa. Our culture sneers at vulnerability, which is the one thing that if shared two ways, forges something strong.

It's possible to heroize and romanticize someone from a distance. It's also possible to reach a near-breaking point about not having real time together to test and build on what is there. And exhausting.

In addition to everything else you have on your enormous plate on the mountain, you have a space beside you that you yearn to have filled. And you deserve companionship and love in the real. You also are stronger than you know and you can make decisions as you need to, about time tolerance, distance or any other part of it.

I'm so rooting for you. And B. In any combination that is healing and happy for you.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 27, 2020, 01:33:17 PM: Having a pretty hard week, actually. The bathroom is almost done; it's functional at the moment but I still have painting to do. One wall is very dark (it's the exterior log wall; had water stains... so the dark camoflauged them really well. Opposite was all new pine siding, so I bought that tone down into a warm, oak. Floor tile is a warm gray; long plank-style which goes very well with the natural limestone in the shower.

I'm really going to need more storage in there and organization, but that'll come. I just haven't had a moment to think about it. For the time being, all I'm getting done doing is simply calming everyone down and trying to find ways to keep them occupied. We don't really feel all cooped up together here - not with several buildings to be doing things in - so not everyone is in one place together all the time.

Lots of good talks; supporting each other... some tensions and upsets, but that's to be expected. Sickness - of some sort (no one knows since people can't get tests) starting to hit people we're actually acquainted with or friends. Buck's oldest D in London has tested positive and she's hospitalized due having lupus. He is beside himself with worry; getting awake at 3 am to try to get her on the phone. My oldest, Amy, is sick - but can't get a test anywhere, despite being EMS for medical transport. Most of her patients are elderly/infirm so she was torn between going to work to get them to medical care... or staying home, taking care of herself and not infecting anyone with what she has. Mike's D Autumn, works ICU, ER & trauma... but has two school age kids at home. I need to check in with her and see how they're doing in all this.

People I haven't spoken with in years are popping up to chat, make jokes, and just generally commisserate over what we're all doing - and worrying about comes after this. My shop is still open; and we've had to print letters of "passage" for all the employees stating we're a critical infrastructure manufacturer. Without us working, repairs or expansions couldn't be made to energy companies that are keeping the lights & heat & tv/internet on for everyone.

So, lots of trying to support people having their reactions/emotions about this situation. Soon there will be plenty of work to do for everyone as we get into spring.

Today, I'm not going to do anything except try another variation on my ham/bean soup. Hol just got back from the store for some extras we've gone through. I see Steve found another dozen goose eggs - they're so big that's like having 2 dozen around. Then, I'm going into my sanctuary and hiding out till I doze off. Shouldn't have stayed up so late by myself... it's too easy to fall back into the grieving state right now.

There is a strong possibility that from henceforth, everything is going to change in this country and probably most places around the world too. The US simply can't afford to print that much money; it will devalue the currency to the point that a loaf of bread or can of soup will cost $10. After making myself face the real possibility that the shop (my source of income) would be shut down - and that the requirements of the shutdown would force employees to move on to other jobs... and put us out of business... (as other places shutdown that impacts our sales)...

I'm pulling out all my great depression knowledge that I gained from grandma and my step-dad... putting it to use, and teaching Hol.

Buck is doing what he can for me, from his distance - his infection isn't being treated at all, under the circumstances and that hospital has basically told him to go away. He has gotten his BP down - all by mind over matter and exercise - and right now, even with the lack of sleep - he looks good. Better probably than I do. LOL. But I know this is temporary and it's OK for me to have a day off... and just take care of me.

TOO many things I am not able to do anything about and I have to just let that go and do what I can do.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on March 27, 2020, 02:04:16 PM: I'm sorry, Skep, it's really hard not knowing what's coming - it feels like you either have to do nothing to prepare or try to prepare for all eventualities. Neither one is a good option, and I'm sorry you've got people you know coming down with symptoms. You are right about having to let go of what you can't control but it's difficult to do. I feel that we've done as much as we can (myself and son) and now we're just hunkering down waiting for it all to be over. Which I hope will be sooner than later. I hope you get a chance to rest and nap a bit and I'm glad Buck's looking good :) xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on March 27, 2020, 05:20:40 PM: ((((Amber)))))

I hope you'll pause to consider whether you really ARE or HAVE TO be the engine that drives everyone else's survival. You don't. You're just one engine. A mighty one but not the only one. Everyone has an opportunity to step up now, in their different ways.

I am so sorry to hear that your company may be under serious pressure. That's talking load on shoulders huge worry, I'm sure. I don't grasp the details but know you don't take it lightly. I hope there's a solution that keeps it open, even if limping along, in a way that saves jobs if that's possible. What a heavy heavy responsibility.

Given that, I hope you won't feel you're suddenly teaching everyone, personally responsible for passing along Depression-era wisdom anyone who wants to learn can find on the Internet, etc.

You are NOT alone and must take care of yourself.

I'm so sorry about B's daughter's risk, and your own D's risk, and more. Please keep us in the loop. It's all unfathomable, until it's not.

Huge hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on March 27, 2020, 06:37:55 PM: Two days after I talked with her, my D is feeling better. Probably going back to work next week.

Still no word from Buck's D - he just called a little bit ago. It doesn't matter we only talk about normal married people stuff - what he's been doing today, what I'm making for dinner - it just helps to hear his voice. I did think to ask him about the Navy today. Turns out he's "qualified" for the training - so now it's only a matter of assembling the students (assuming they aren't sick) and getting it all scheduled.

This was a really good day for his BP. Staying way down in his normal range.

Buck's OTHER D, has a prom buddy (which is still postponed) that has recovered from Covid. She's still in isolation though; most of her symptoms have cleared. And she has her cellphone back now... LOL. Makes it easier for her to stay in contact with her all-important-at that age friends.

Hol's friend who thought she was ill, is now convinced it is her annual allergies making her miserable. I know I'm suffering through that with trees starting to bud out. An ER doc on another forum, says about 83% of the patients he sees with Covid symptoms are mild and they recover within a week, two weeks at the most. They aren't even testing people unless they meet 4 out of 5 criteria. Obviously, the numbers were seeing updated daily are only based on tests, so the virus is pretty widespread. A couple days ago, there were only 39 cases in my state; now there are 76.

We are limiting our exposure and staying at home as much as we can - but we DO still go out & about some. Week 2 so far.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 01, 2020, 06:09:03 PM: Buck absolutely knows I want "just us" time - because between my zoo here and his Ds - we're like "instant Brady Bunch". Being family oriented, I suppose it's natural - but I'm really most interested in the dynamics between the two of us... by ourselves. There have been hints, clues, teases on both sides... and I understand he's shy, self-deprecating... kind of for the same reasons I can be that way sometimes too. Out here - it is possible, even under stay at home orders - for us find a place to go and just be us for awhile.

I know I can ask for privacy for a specific amount of time from everyone here, too. And we're not going to need total seclusion... just time by ourselves, to ourselves. There's plenty of hiking, fishing, places to go and see... and the kids already spend a day every so often hiking.

I've been reading that colleges are a bit panic'd about whether they'll even be able to open next fall - that will definitely change his D's plans if her school is one of those. Buck's appts are in limbo, due to the virus. His shop is closed. The D in London - he found out through back channels is NOT on a ventilator; she is in guarded condition because of the meds she takes for Lupus. There should be another update this afternoon -- he's told me more about the "back story" with her too. It's been 8 days since he first spoke with her. The Navy thing is still on, for this summer. He will want to sell his house and end all connections in his state before coming here. And so far, not even the virus has thrown up anything major in the way of obstacles.

So, I'm just waiting for him to tell me when. He knows if finances are an issue I'll help. But I also know he's sensitive about that - so following his lead there.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 01, 2020, 10:07:46 PM: Asking vaguely....how far away is Buck?
NO chance of him coming for a week's visit, or does the house sale etc. have to happen even before that can take place? (Much less all the medical stabilizing, I know.)

Just so would love to hear that you and he are at last cozied up (ahem--it's YOUR house so you guys should have it all to yourselves for your first week or so, imn-ho...)

Damn, you're patient. I'm so eager for you two to find the path open.
I hope you don't have to wait until fall. But I grok that if you have to, you'll manage it.

Big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 02, 2020, 08:19:07 AM: Well, until the Holly Hut is completed, to a functional point - she & Steve ARE in the house. Along with both dogs. Absolutely nothing to be done about that right now. Work is definitely progressing there and hopefully, she'll make a decision on flooring so it shouldn't be MUCH longer.

Buck is probably a 12-14 hr drive away - unless he brings the bike. He promised a week; but then that fell through. He is still talking about this... and WANTS to make it happen. So, fingers crossed, between us we can figure something out. "Soon".... LOL. I'm starting to hate that word.

Both of his ex's have done some serious injury to him. I didn't exactly get off scot-free in my relationships either. So in one way - this long-distance relationship has been perfect, in it's pacing and nurturing of an emotional and mental space that is "us". I think it's been there a lot longer than a year - back to when I was nursing Mike. So, we started as friends... and that's always a good starting point, IMO. I'm not really into the "Prince Charming" myth. If I can't have a deep, totally honest and trustful connection with someone... all the charm & suave in the world won't make it work.

We both want companionship; mirroring - of that deep friendship kind; and a true, equal "partner". Someone who has our back, can work well side by side, to pull together in the same yoke - not in different directions. He wants the woods & peace and quiet... but knows we can't be all things to each other. We both worked through accepting we might be alone all the way to the end of our lives. And when the incendiary spark went off between us, it surprised both of us.

It could just be a "question mark" inquiry of each other based on a long-denied need on each of our parts that we recognize in the other. That happens. And it's why I've insisted on "no strings, no harm no foul" terms so we can REMAIN friends, without regrets. Leaves us both with agency; equally. I ain't gonna do all the work in a relationship again. And he's tired of betrayals and wants to maintain his personal independence; his own space. And while we can each be just fine on our own... there's no denying life is more pleasant and our capabilities exponentially increase being together.

I appreciate his story and what/how he chose to move through it. I've always admired that kind of male energy. But he is also able to be open about the emotional side of things. He knows what I've been through too; how much I loved Mike - despite his idiosyncrasies that drove me crazy. He knows I didn't run - or even tried to compensate for how much I was giving, by trying to "get back" somewhere else. This is the kind of level of knowing each other, that couples don't hit for a few years, in most cases. That's why I kid him about we're doing it all backwards. LOL.

I think what I'm most impressed with, tho is his understanding and practice of maintaining boundaries. I might learn more about this from him. And for an old man, he is dang fit and HOT... even with the ongoing health issues. (you guys seem to have this idea sometimes, he's an invalid... and perhaps that's due to my description of his issues; they have been serious and acute... but even during hospital stays, his strength of personality & will power him through any pain/weakness in his body) LOLOL, I find have to "protect" his reputation by not letting on how funny, erudite, and absolutely sweet he is... coz he's such a "guy's guy".

I mean, it was 20 years ago he was blown up; told he wasn't going to walk again, after the corpsman said he wasn't dying on the chopper... and for 20 years he''s done more, better, than guys younger than him. Including walking.

:insert googly-eyed drooling old lady:

Guys like that never looked twice at me. I'm not going to miss a chance to slide into home plate with this one. But he already knows I'm not gonna become something I'm not, to "keep him". Just the way it has to be. And he expects the same back.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 02, 2020, 03:40:44 PM: That is such a beautiful, elegant portrait of both the man you love and the way you are loving each other, Amber. What a drink of water to read. Lovely.

When you say he wants space/place of his own (I'm getting all bourgeois here), does that mean you and B have no interest in living together at some point? Or does it mean a separate building project on the mountain so B has a man cave?

You might not know the answer yet. And it might be a rather premature question.

You just seem to glow when you talk about the essence of Buck. Like just being in relationship with him, however parallel and independent, is giving you renewed life force.

It sure sounds like he's worth the wait. I hope his "needing space" doesn't reflect problems making commitments. I hope he will commit to you fully and there won't be obstacle after obstacle.

One big thing is when two older lovers are each financially independent and secure, if not financially equally well off. It would make it a lot easier to maintain autonomy and feed healthy interdependence.

I so hope you get a chance to fulfill this dream.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 02, 2020, 04:12:31 PM: Thanks Hops. Maybe it will brighten someone's day today - seems like a lot more of that is needed right now.

By "space" I mean more autonomy, than physical space. But we ARE talking about another shop specifically for metal work. He'll end up teaching Hol a few things there - since she welds already. My guy is used to being deployed for a year or more at a time. Often not able to say WHERE he is, as a consequence. And while he's hoping to retire once and for all from that - he's been on his own for 20 years. I would be NUTZ to expect the same kind of constant contact Mike seemed to want/need - when I was asking him to please give me "space" because I just felt "hampered, stifled, just want to go-do on my own..." So I can appreciated B is going to be more oriented that way too. I call it "divide & conquer" tactics - we'll get more done that way that if we're both working together. At least sometimes. It's a flexible fluid thing.

No way, no how he has commitment issues. Of that I'm sure.

There are income differences - but he's remarkably self-sufficient and multi-talented. I'm not so dependent that I can't let him do what he needs to do for himself. Probably more independent than what he may know from the past, actually. But that doesn't mean I don't know the meaning of loyalty & commitment. It's born of respect for him and love for what we're like together. I rather suspect I'm gonna get my socks knocked off by how much fun this is gonna be. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 05, 2020, 05:19:09 PM: Amber:

I'm glad B got an update about his dd living abroad. That would be so scary to not be able to reach her, find her, figure out what's going on with her, IME.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 06, 2020, 10:06:44 AM: Yes, it was scary - and he reacts to those things with a superhero cape on. (I've told him after he moves here, I'm ritually burning the cape. LOL)

About to head out for parts even more rural than here - and pick up my plow.

Friend asked about a rumor that WV was stopping people at the borders and not letting them in. LOL. Maybe they are; I've been suggesting it for years. LOL. Guess I'll delay my monthly trip over the mountain for another couple weeks.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 06, 2020, 10:54:32 AM: Yes to delaying trips anywhere, shopping anywhere, as much as humanly possible.
Been reading that rural areas will be among the hardest hit, proportionally, because of less medical resources. Fingers crossed.

How long was it for B since his last real relationship?

I know it was one big difference between M and me...me adapting to anyone in my life, expecting regular attention, much less coming into the space of my home. After 20 years alone (including Nmom time in that) these were trying adjustments for me, despite the parallel positive feelings. He had been alone for six months when we met. But now it feels better. Much more relaxed around him, as he's behaving less invasively. Knock wood.

I'm sure you and B in all that gorgeous mountain space and with your independent spirits, will adapt more easily. Just want you two to get the chance!

Still don't grasp how a medically-unstable "old man" can be "called up" but B must have highly specialized expertise that's just not available elsewhere. It is just all very mysterious. That's the only bit that worries me a little. But I'm projecting from my own experience with special mysterious unusual unprovable tales from my ex², inappropriately. Doesn't sound like that is happening with B's military status. And you clearly trust him.

I love the idea of him welding away and you farming away, and both of you connecting freely when you want to. Sounds amazing.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 06, 2020, 12:37:23 PM: Lord, I just want to read about Amber and B sharing meals, burning capes and sharing space... generally.

Simply.

Finally.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 07, 2020, 11:39:28 AM: Amen, Lighter!!

Hops, it's very much like the beach & ocean... we pull back into ourselves... and then return to us... sometimes there's an event that affects the timing of it, sometimes it's just like breathing of the earth. He's been alone 18 years; 4 for me... depending on how I count. Sometimes I count it 6 years, because of how Mike withdrew from me.

It's common for military guys to not be able to talk about what they're doing or where. A good part of the "scandal" surrounding Ollie North, was he broke that code. In addition to revealing what the US was up to with the whole Iran-Contra mess. As for not being medically retired already, his records being screwed up - apparently lost - that's also a common thing. He did find out that his active CO, is the one who pulled his records. In his case, it's his hands on skill and particular knowledge set that was a scarce commodity. So someone somewhere in the course of things, decided to hold onto his records - just in case. He is the last one left with this knowledge that is anywhere physically close to being able to "train the trainers". As it turns out - yes, they DO want to preserve that knowledge & skill. And pass it on.

There is NO ulterior motive or game-playing involved in this, that I can find. I'm just as able to see red flags as you are even if fewer things are on my "serious problem" list. There are things I'm keeping an eye on. The disparity in finances is one of them - both his sensitivity to "making his own way" and my ability to solve roadblocks by writing a check.

For this particular national crisis to hit - at this time - its stressing my patience. Whether it's true or not, or just plain fear... my need to have him here, even if just for a visit just went off the chart in the past week. I was able to put it in simple language - strip out the crazy emotional janglies associated with it - and just let him know. I am perfectly capable of doing what needs done around here... or I would be, if I wasn't spending all my time required to pay attention to the stress, upset, disillusionment, and existential angst of the younger set around me.

This week, I'm taking issue with that "requirement" part. Remember all the comic strips with some guru on top of a mountain or in a cave... and a seeker, asking "what's the meaning of life"? Yeah, I feel as though my daily existence is a constant IV-drip of trying to teach that to these adult "kids". They are trying to work it out amongst themselves, too... and I'm being more selective about when I participate. But I'm starting to resent it. It's kinda like what GS talked about years ago - about obligation; one that was simply expected and not negotiated or agreed to.

So, I'm giving myself enough time/space to let all the psyco-babble die down out of my head... look at MY requirements... and then I'm going to present my case for changing a few things up, for the duration of this lockdown. WV isn't ALL that locked down. Commonsense measures are being taken all around, but the main one, is that we simply don't go out gallivanting around much. We're homebodies. And someday soon, this lockdown is going to be over. While I don't expect things to go back to "normal" - the way it was before, 100% - there's a D, that I know NEEDS to go back to work, of one sort or another. Same with her pathetic excuse for a boyfriend who isn't really meeting her needs. She also has more requirements of her, due to her DUI. We're not entirely sure how much is OPTIONAL, and how much is mandated... and nothing is really functioning in Va. So - in limbo mode for the time being. Her friend John, while willingly and pleasantly helpful, also a has a life of his own to start moving forward on.

IF Hol & Steve choose to stay together, then I have a very specific list of do's & don'ts which I expect to be maintained religiously. It's a matter of respect - for our tools, our work on projects, and each other. If that can't happen... then I'm tempted to kick them all out. LOL. Even with the Hut nearing move-in ready completion. (I so sincerely HOPE.)

The reason for all that - is because I was hoping to have my OWN life; separate and apart from being "mom" or the "matriarch" who is making all this possible. And it doesn't involve nurturing the neuroses of these GenX cynics, who are still not really get that life doesn't ever really CHANGE. It's just changes it's appearances. What was true a thousand years ago is STILL true today. Despite theories of "evolution"... the human condition and human frailties and human creativity & capability are STILL the same.

I don't where they got the idea that an "ideal world" could be made possible... but they sure don't want to hear anything that I KNOW is reality and just accept that. It has to become a cause, a movement, to change things. Just doesn't happen at any level that is perceptible to people.

I'm also getting more than a little tired of the canard, that online friends aren't really your friends. Witness our little group here. I really HOPE Hol in particular, is required to do 6 months of therapy with this woman T that confronted all her hostility right from GO. Hol can't stand her. I think that's absolutely a really good thing to being working through some of Hol's deep issues and is what she needs. Hol NEEDS to be more actively engaged in her OWN life -- and keep her nose out of other people's lives -- since she doesn't appear motivated to change any of the things in her own, to create more balance for herself.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on April 07, 2020, 12:39:33 PM: Well, Skep, I am glad to read that you're not willing to carry on endlessly being mum to all the other grown ups there. I'm very much looking forward to reading about you and Buck having fun, whether it's going away together, getting on with your own projects on the farm or just hanging out - without stress, drama or other people's problems going on around you :) I'm looking forward to reading that update. And amazed that the army is crap enough to not secure the knowledge they need way before personnel are of retirement age! Surely someone could have got him to do some training tapes years ago? It baffles me - but we see similar madness here so I can say I'm not entirely surprised. Wishing you both well xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 07, 2020, 05:03:41 PM: Maybe it was my "mom reflex" - that initiated the expectation that I would be on call 24/7 for such things. The expectation that I could solve self-created problems. Dunno.

But I'm very conscious of resisting that expectation and even some days resenting it. It seems short-sighted and unfair to me. But I've been in a mood of being able to chew nails the past couple days. And it turns out that's kind of a recognition of my own needs. And even vision for this arrangement.

This doesn't seem healthy for anyone. And that's really bugging me.

So, I guess I'm just going to manage my own time/energy given to this crap better. And withdraw into my own space - and do what's on my agenda. Others can participate as they want - or not. While they're sorting their own flies from pepper. I'm over it. Been over it. For some time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 07, 2020, 07:05:19 PM: ((((((Amber))))))))

I'm so sorry. I completely get how you're feeling and how oppressive it must be.
I think when one sees oneself as a matriarch, a source of wisdom and learning for young adults (and some not so young), it's very hard to find your own children rejecting it, being immature and selfish, entitled, whatever. It sure wasn't your original idea in trying to pass along what you've learned, for their benefit.

Maybe the Matriarch of the Mountain is REALLY going to retire now. And just pursue projects and plans because they're fulfilling. I say, tough love time. Toss the little buggers out so they can start growing up. Couldn't agree more about Hol and T, but of course she'll assert her own choices in that regard too, regardless of impact on you.

CB, I really felt this is extremely wise:
Quote
I could never have given them what they have forged for themselves in the past decade. I remember a saying that when a child is born, so is a mother. I think when a child grows up, so does a mother!

Amber, remember that your value is NOT exclusively in your capacity to be strong, to lead, to sit under the banyan tree dispensing advice or wisdom. You are valuable without a shred of wisdom. You are valuable as a friend, a partner, a good soul, a creator.

Matriarchs have one thing in common: They're all exhausted and resentful. And nobody thanks them.

Big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 08, 2020, 09:24:57 AM: Yes, Hops. I would absolutely pursue my plans & projects IF:

my tools were put back - or not "lost" - because someone else used them and isn't considerate enough
my studio wasn't completely filled with other people's materials
my kitchen wasn't cluttered with the kinds of things I don't cook with (and they don't either apparently; they graze all day long)

And I am denied control over my own stuff - "because" this or that justification or excuse

I have my "cave" - the master; to hide out in. The work in progress has made the door to the back deck available to me now, so I've also created a small sitting area there too.

It will HELP, when the Hut is completed enough for them to move into. AND they buy their own tools. :P We estimate maybe another month. And when I'm finally able to talk to her again, I'm going to impress upon her the need for both of them to go back to work... as soon as that restarts.

The lack of consideration and the absurd expectation that I have all the answers to why their self-created lives suck... and what to do about that... as if I don't have my own life is enough of a burr under my saddle right now to make me BLUNT, TO THE DIRECT PERSONAL PAINFUL POINT, and keep me on the edge of being swept away by all the pent up anger over the behaviors I was directly told would change, or wouldn't continue being a problem for me.

I've suggested that she start packing this last month. :D

Rather than just drift around having her attitude... and proclaiming how "unevolved" or "unfair" I am.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 08, 2020, 12:11:58 PM: Amber:

I was struck with several thoughts while reading your post.

1. ALL the clutter and crap the kids have in your home should BE IN THEIR SPACE or in the barn or the shed to whatever spaces aren't YOUR LIVING AREA.

This is YOUR home, not their dumping ground, grazing ground, complaining ground, blaming ground. Why do they feel it's those things?

2. IS this YOUR problem? Really?

Your post reminded me SO much of the first conversation I had with my T about my problem... codependence.

It was MY problem, not the people I was frustrated with.

Hell, just tell them what needs doing. Packing... yup. Pack it all up. Move it to the space of your choosing and let it be so. Now. No time for yammering, complaining, dwelling on YOUR life and choices.

The last thing coming up for me is the feeling you have about the kids expecting you to have all the answers for them WHEN obviously they aren't open to much, if anything, you have to say about.

Whatever dynamic is going on here isn't working for you, or them IMO.

Whatever you want to create, before B arrives is up to you. It's your home, your property, your rules or the kids can go where they may create their own rules, which is how growing up works, IME. No upset or bother..... go in good faith, with best wishes, you believe in Hol and know she'll figure it out, bc she's competent and capable enough to do so.

Make a list. Make a copy or two. Give Hol a list, put one on the fridge, and one in your safe space. Require they check boxes off daily.

If they complain, refer them BACK to the list and stay focused on your own business.

They have their business.

You have yours.

THAT ONE LITTLE THING made all the difference for me in the world.... frustration evaporated, I was lighthearted toward the folks I was so !UPSET!! with and MY stuff was easier to focus and work on without all that codependent chatter in my head and body.

Just say'in...... this might be easier to solve than you think.

Take what makes sense and ignore the rest.

I know you'll figure it out, bc...

you're competent and capable; )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 08, 2020, 04:47:11 PM: Amber, I have a serious fear about freeloaders staying so comfortably in the new house you optimistically paid for that never mind your opinion about their need to work. Much less return your tools, respect your kitchen, or show you grace.

Have to ask it: What happens if they just won't go? Next steps?

Worry worry,

Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 12, 2020, 10:14:21 AM: OK... y'all have such different takes on the situation...
first of all - none of this is as HUGE-amous as you're leaping to. I'm irritated, annoyed, not sure how to address the situation in practical terms -- without making Hol feel totally unwelcome. And she HAS been dealing with a lot of swirling emotional crap... so on a hair-trigger. I'm venting. Bitching - because there are few avenues that I can see to actually DO something productive for her.

I asked for quiet; relenting on the 24/7 group therapy activity... and got it. We've spent several days (when we're together and not doing our own things) just sitting and staring at each other... everything that CAN be said, has been said... and now it's simply a matter of people deciding to "do". The quiet gave me a chance to "hear myself think" - something my Dad used to require and ask for a lot.

That gave me a chance to let another faint echo of Mike stuff to come up for a mini-anniversary... talk to Buck about it openly... and get open, understanding, and supportive feedback from him. He is easy for me to talk to. Yeah, I was still feeling a little guilty about Buck... and I absolutely don't want to proceed with that remnant tagging along. Nothing he could do about it, either. I just had to deal with it -- and required the silence and space to do so; got it. Moving onwards....

John rode shotgun with me to pick up the plow. Yesterday we worked out most of the bugs in the process and I made a few passes. Ground's still too wet; I'll do more damage plowing now than if I wait for it to dry out. Except the weather has other plans... freezing overnight temps and more rain this coming week. It IS April. And it IS early. So on to plan B... for staying busy, getting things done, and preparing for the exodus.

Hol and Steve will probably be able to move into the Hut mid-May. Contractors will still be finishing up -- and there's a garage that needs to be started too. That will finally let me clean up MY garage. Photographer came out yesterday to get progress pics. John and I have lots of time to talk one on one... and he has been making a lot of plans, picking directions for what he wants to do next, etc. Still grappling with residual FOO trauma of his own... but instead of acting out about it, he and I can talk... and it's been useful for both of us. As soon as travel restrictions lift, I think he'll be taking off for other parts of the country.

The Hol problem, is that clearly this relationship isn't cutting the mustard for her. If she wants to engage with him... it is ALWAYS ONLY what he wants to do and he doesn't even make excuses anymore - just says I don't want to do that. He seems to be almost a wilfull slob. He will leave trash within one step of the trashcan, without completing the process. Hol & I are always (and there are no exceptions) going behind him and cleaning up his messes. Where I lose it is when he borrows my tools - and then leaves them whereever to be exposed to weather and forgotten. I need a tool and spend an hour looking only to not find it. It's not ignorance - or he couldn't perform his job. And that doesn't leave many benign explanations to choose from.

Yesterday, I heard her upstairs venting out loud... about what a laundry basket was for and why all those clothes were left right outside the basket. She'd mentioned this before... and of course, they don't have a lot of space in the guest room. She's constantly returning dishes, and bringing down trash that he takes up to "be alone"... because he can't even eat a meal with the rest of us much less participate. He has no practical skills, domestically. None. Zippo. Hol did get to (sometimes) put his dishes in the sink - but his idea of washing dishes is to pass them under cold water from the faucet & put them in the drainer.

I KNOW HOW NIT-PICKY THIS SOUNDS. But it's 24/7!!!! I woke up at 4:30 am and went to investigate a noise (fortunately unarmed)... and he was setting up the 12 ft ladder to retrieve cactus plants from the ledge. Of course, I couldn't go back to sleep then. And he truly WAS trying to be as quiet as possible - but it seemed perfectly appropriate to him (he has no set routine) that since he was awake he'd do something useful... and those plants needed to be repotted.

And I know I'm not being unreasonable. But Hol continues to defend and protect him from behaving like a grown adult man. And I know what a mess this relationship is; that it's far from what she thought it would be - and actually wants; and she can't admit she picked a lemon and throw him back into the dating pool (some question if he ever left it) and try her luck again. This is the part that has me picking my words very very carefully around her. It is NOT like her... and yet there is a pattern... where she'll completely sacrifice her wants, needs, expectations... for any little amount of affection. It seems the smaller the amount of affection, and the more she has to work for it -- the more committed she is to work at it.

And yet -- it is not possible to have an open conversation with her about just these plain observations and my concern for her -- without invoking her Mama Tiger. She seems to be becoming more cognizant of the inequity she's experiencing... but then throw in the added pressure of wanting to conceive. I'm also well aware of my boundaries here, people. No way we could do this with as few tears & casualties as there've been... without me pointing out boundaries and policing them. It's been NECESSARY to take that stance at times.

Her substance abuse counselor may not be the BEST therapist in the world... but Hol absolutely needs to be seeing some impartial 3rd party for insight, guidance, and repairing her self-respect. But we just can't do that from within our relationship -- without totally risking that relationship. Of course - all that kind of thing is in limbo due to the excessive shutdowns.

But the Times they are a-changin'.

Can't... won't... say more than that now. But don't worry about me -- I'm fine. Truly. I want to "help" her... but that is a thankless job, she would resent it, I'd hurt myself in the process and I thought I'd retired from the mom job? But due to circumstances beyond everyone's control... John & I are ALL she's got. (John has some psych nursing background.)

So we're making do. Proceeding carefully, gently and slowly... and letting her say what she wants/needs. For now.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 13, 2020, 12:43:24 PM: Amber:

No advice from me today..... maybe oil down the tools left in the rain. My Grandfather used to clean and oil his tools, particularly shovels, after each use. Where I come from, there are rules to borrowing someone's tools. Returning them in better shape is number one. Returning them goes without saying.

I'm conflicted about your latest post. I don't know if everyone here is overreacting or not. I have the sense your nose is on multiple pebbles, but I honestly don't know. I'm getting a better feel for when my nose is on and when it's off.

Thanks for the update. I was wondering how you're doing.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 13, 2020, 02:26:03 PM: (((((Amber)))))

I hear you that you feel folks might over-react.
I think I react to recognizing a very consistent pattern over time. It can always be analyzed or explained away but it does sound to me that Holly's problems become yours and don't improve, and that Steve is a parasite she is unwilling to stop hosting because of her own psychological problems. And lastly, I do believe that there is no Mama, anywhere, who can be in charge of fixing them. (I KNOW you know this rationally, but perhaps it's possible that reflexively, it's a different matter?)

You know how DRASTIC my experience with an adult child's mental/psychological issues has been, so I'm sure that impacts my tone of urgency for you. But I'll try to step it back a bit. I want you to be comfortable venting here as often and as much as you can!

Probably my own codependency is behind that, so it's helpful for me to think about.

Hugs and hopes,
Hops

PS And I'm sorry this was so blunt as to sound uncaring. I care about you, ((((((Miz Amber))))). And I know I can over-read or misread. Please forgive if I have. I'll stop trying to fix it so much. Hugs.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 14, 2020, 09:51:34 AM: Lighter - I will if I can find them. They went out into the woods, never to return.
Hops - no worries - I was mostly noticing that each of us responds from what our own fears/experiences are and yeah, I'm still doing that too.

Big argument last night. She was in studio; he was here - and he was screaming at her over the phone. All she wanted to have a conversation about their relationship. So he accused her of attacking him; gaslighting him; manipulation him. I fled the house for the studio, because I've lived through that kind of yelling once; a long time ago... and I couldn't stop shaking. She came up to talk to him face to face and he left.

So I spent some later hours with her, validating the fact that she isn't a bad person for having feelings and wanting to discuss her wants, needs, & dreams with him. He is always running away from her - and not engaging. That reads to me like he doesn't want a relationship at all - just a mommy to clean up after him and a hookup. John helped too; mostly by listening and quietly caring.

I drew bright boundaries for her - that whatever she ultimately decides I'll back her up 100% but that this is all her: all her decision, her show, her life. Except for her, and how she kicks herself, it's none of my business. Yeah - she has the classic - "it's all my fault", "I'm the one who's wrong" syndrome. As much as possible I'm trying to break that spell. She deserves someone who will step up and be there for her, engage with whatever she's doing, and not make himself the constant receiver of her attentions and ministrations.

This has been building; slowly dawning on her. A total repeat of the Bovie equation. Just in a different flavor.

And no, I can't get involved even though it's my house - it's her relationship.

I have no idea this morning, how this is going to turn out. And all I want is for it to be decided - however it suits her. I will say even the air seemed fresher around here after he left.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 14, 2020, 10:17:02 AM: Back...and she's up. I guess we'll see what happens. He's not back yet.

The fears that were triggered last night are still jangling around a little. But I'm going to focus on doing something pretty soon... and not let my imagination get carried away. John is puttering around in the kitchen, turning last night's roast into beef noodle soup. There is plenty I can do around here inside (still) since it's cold and yucky outside.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 14, 2020, 12:03:00 PM: Meh...

I'm minding my own business and taking care of some loose ends from the bathroom remodel. But it's time for lunch... and I'm needing to babble.

With the Hut nearing completion, and impending move down there... where she will end up as a glorified house/farm servant so he can space out in the woods (never mind how she thought he was gonna be a dad) and then, neither of them working due to the virus...

I think it brought CLEAR - that when she needed help, support or just companionship - she came to either John or me. Because S is just "absent" - even when physically present. Unless of course, he's trying to feed her some line to get her to be content playing mommy to him. We went to visit her in jail; S refused - because he didn't want to go into a jail. Like she did???? How much can he care about her, if he couldn't bother himself to do something like that for her?

But I know how far she's pretzled herself - in a transactional way to get his affection. And I pointed out, that her definition of a relationship - and what she wants from one - is far different than his. He slowly & gradually built a life that suited him - without giving a good god damn whether it was what she wanted. It's not lost on her - that even directly asking S to do something for her - he won't... but John & I were there, taking care of business and letting her talk, listening, feeding back... without demanding she do all the work herself.

So, I worry that the instinct to bend, give him another chance (after a year??) and basically deprive herself through the choice of "the bird in the hand" versus trying to find what she wants - REALLY - might again take the upper hand. This isn't the first time he's left when she's asked him to pay attention to her. But last night, he didn't come back home. Said he'd be here in the morning - he needed a "break". "Break" my patootie; his ex-girlfriend is staying out at his farm. Sheesh - he doesn't even put his trash in the can. He's not here. I guarantee you she's trying to talk to him over the phone. And still not getting anywhere.

So, my plan is to do some piddly, fussy, attention to detail kind of stuff today and at least stay centered enough - that when I'm called on for support again I might actually be of some use. Buck is right there, backing me up. Which is lovely. Sweet man.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 14, 2020, 05:20:35 PM: Quote
I worry that the instinct to bend, give him another chance (after a year??) and basically deprive herself through the choice of "the bird in the hand" versus trying to find what she wants - REALLY - might again take the upper hand.

Very rational worry, imo. I am so sorry.

It is absolute agony to watch an adult child you love make destructive choices. YOU can see it, feel it, red flags waving, coming at her like a slow tsunami of misery.

But sometimes the MORE a parent or parent figure tries to stop the train bearing down on their adult child, the more stubbornly they cling to the track and talk about how pretty the oncoming light is....how far they (think they) can see.... It's heartbreaking sometimes.

I understand now everything you dislike about him, and why you agonize over her weakness in enabling his mistreatment and/or neglect of her. The anecdote about him not being willing to visit her in jail says so much about his issues. (That she was in jail in the first place says a different thing about her issues.)

It is not about HER and it's not about WE, with him. It's all about HIM. I'm really sorry.

I don't know if this is true or right, but as long as she is living on your land with you, is it remotely possible, even a little, that being where you are (given her emotional dependence on you) will delay her in maturing and healing (through her own therapy, not group therapy with you) enough to get rid of S? Whether it's through epiphany soon, or a divorce miserable years down the pike?

Is it possible that despite the security you offer, she cannot mature and heal until she truly is facing the future without the cushion of you and the mountain?

Not intentionally cruel....just blunt. (Sometimes I try to pick dandelions with a crowbar.)

big hugs and comfort,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 15, 2020, 09:42:24 AM: Hops - she's been independent since she was 15. Responsible, hard-working... intelligent, including emotionally intelligent... until she began to struggle with relationships with men. So, at 40 - when job ended along with relationship - I offered an easy place for her to land & regroup, and then life itself began to alter that plan. Again.

Originally, she would be working in the city 5-6 months of the year on productions. Supporting herself, and quite well. While the farm and Hut, were simply going to be her own fallback "headquarters" -- and down the road, her own property close to mom, when that time does arrive. This may still happen. IF, and possibly when, all these shutdowns are lifted.

I am really not "doing" all that much with her. And the great sorting of her issues is up to her - and sometimes her friends. But I periodically get called on, to voice my observations and opinions, but I am used to - given how long she's been independent - leaving her to it. I've kept my lines with her - flashing neon. Her friend John may have given me an insight. We'd discussed this before... but I was still skeptical. Yeah, I have my own crap to deal with watching her go through this. (Please let the shutdown end so she can go complete the therapy she's assigned as part of her sentence... )

Yesterday, instead of continuing on in the vein she'd been in the night before - the night of the loud argument - she did a 180 and everything was "fine". Leaving me totally confused about what I KNOW for a FACT was expressed as being her feelings on the matter just the night before. I of all people know that two opposites can be true, just not to the same degree or importance. This was Jekyll/Hyde stuff.

But John has known her during times she didn't live with me, and has observed that this is a pattern with her. Exhausting chance after chance for her partner to step up and be there for her... all while enduring lonliness within the relationship, or abuse, or/and mounting frustration & resentment & pure righteous anger. I think that finally sunk in with me. It's like a point of pride that she is tough enough to endure this, come out intact (she thinks), and can out tough the guy involved. This guy isn't going to do anything more than take advantage of that, as long as it's convenient for him - and still won't give her what she is asking for. Anymore than the last one did in 9 years.

The night before she was proclaiming that she could do better than this guy. Sigh. And perhaps she is simply struggling over deciding what she really WANTS (ideally), and the reality - which is - what is she willing to live with?

I'm merely trying to understand what is going on here. And not interfere... but that's damn hard when I don't even know where the mines are placed in the minefield - AND I'm denied being able to maintain even basic rules for all those living in my house... because she defends him, excuses him, and unlike her, I don't have an issue deciding what I want. (we ARE very different, despite some of our strong similarilities)

So, while I think her friend John is getting antsy to get on the road of his own life... while he's here, the two of them have been talking and sorting that stuff out - completely without my presence or participation. He is just as eager to power up the lightbulb that will reveal to her, how much of this she is doing to herself. And he knows, "right words, at right time", or gradual incremental repetition... are both valid ways to offer a safe space for someone to see and understand this about themselves. She helped him get through some of his own trauma/issues.

Think I'm going to have a conversation with the contractor. He might be able to give a better idea of how long this work is going to take. And it would be helpful if these shutdowns were lifted... although I'm having a difficult time defining for myself how things would be more "normal" or "better". For me, living as I do, it's not that much different.
I do know it would be a good thing if her GF M can come out for a break from her life for a few days. It would help clear Hol's thinking a lot to have another female around.

In the Hut: I know the stucco walls are getting started; the power system is functional; siding is almost done; and she just ordered the flooring. Once the flooring is done, sinks & toilets & appliances can go in... and her furniture and collection of fabric. Then the garage needs to be built. I don't think the contractor remembers that.

-----------

Ground's still too wet to plow. And I have snow on the porch this morning. Most of it on the ground has melted. Lots of seed started and they're starting to germinate.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 15, 2020, 06:26:27 PM: Amber:

As I'm giving advice to one of my dd's regarding a boy, I want to give you advice to NOT give your dd advice about boys.

::uncrossing super hypocritical eyes::.

The truth is, part of my emotional response is what my girls went through in early childhood, bc of me and my relationship with their father.

I can't change that now. I can model taking care of my own business and let the girls know I trust them to handle theirs.

I can't control or moderate their feelings, actions or words.... no matter how hard I want to, feel I have to, feel responsible.... I just can't. Sometimes I really get that, Amber. Other times, I get mixed up, and turns around... confused about it, what I can and can't do.... what is my business and what is theirs.

Figuring out what is mine and what is theirs helps simplify the answer to questions I ask myself for clarity.....
Is there anything I can be doing in this moment?

That really brings me back to my center. It's helpful.

You can't tell Hol her plan to have a baby with a chucklehead on your property isn't a good plan. What you CAN do is tell her you trust her to make decisions she can live with, bc she's the one who'll be living with them. You don't have to live with her decisions. She does. She should be making here own decisions for that reason. I'd say that to her flat out, and I'd say it with zero emotion. Eeeek. Sorry. Just giving you my POV right now. Not telling you what you must do, of course. I guess I'm trying to say..... as long as Hol feels you're involved.... the decisions are somewhat about YOU..... and she's not really focusing on what's hers, which is S, and what her life would be like if she had a baby with him. That's something she'll see more clearly if you've stepped OUT of it, completely, IME. The full weight of being on her own, and being responsible for her decisions will then carry the full weight, IME. You won't give her the mistaken impression this is YOUR business and you'll be there to solve and carry the problems with her.

You can set boundaries around S touching your tools, or not. How he lives in your space IS your business.

You can require S hunt all the lost tools, help you care for them and return them where he won't be allowed to touch them again. Hol can't FIX that one. She can't cover it up. She can will you to keep your mouth shut, and allow things to get worse.... or not.

From where I sit.... that seems perfectly logical to me around the tools, particularly bc Hol and S are living under your roof right now.

There have to be limits you set for your life.
Not for theirs.
For yours and Buck's. Modeling that for Hol is a good thing, IME.

I have a habit of looking down the road and Hol sharing a baby with chucklehead wouldn't simplify any of the problems you guys struggle with now, IME. It would make matters more complicated, more unsteady and more difficult to process and deal with.

Choices.

Heck, S might decide he's not happy living with an empowered woman's boundaries fully in place, with consequences swiftly delivered, sans discussion. It's my hope all our daughters will learn how to do this for themselves, and to feel entitled to set and hold those boundaries.

I had an epiphany last week.... I've done my children a disservice by cushioning their path and shielding them as I have...... and you know what? I know I was doing the best I could at that time. I'm OK with it, and I forgive myself.

I know better now, and I'll try to do better now, bc of that awareness.

All I can do is model taking care of my own business. Give them their business to deal with and wish them well...... let them know I trust them to handle it and I will tell you..... I have a belly full of this, close up, right now, btw.

It comes down to figuring out what is mine, putting my blanket statements in place, then repeating them as needed so as not to get dragged into things that are muddled and not mine. OH SO SIMPLE once I SEE what's mine.

So as not to let the young people feel they have a say in my business, how I feel and what my boundaries are or how I'll enforce them, bc that's exactly what I'm doing right now.

Taking control back. Feeling entitled and obligated to do so.

::nodding::.

Yes, there's some discomfort, but I can't control that. I don't want to control it, truth be told. It's growth and growth is painful, IME.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 16, 2020, 12:17:29 AM: ((((((((LIghter))))))))).

Well timed my dear. Well timed.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 17, 2020, 10:22:55 AM: I am feeling drawn to a new space. As in being-space. It's a familiar feeling; it's where I am right before I change directions, start a new creative endeavor, and make huge systemic changes. "Powered by the great void"....

Hopefully, there isn't a LOT of rain in the future forecast so I can get the plowing done. It is cold; 34 this morning. But warming up again. I need to be busy in this longer spring. I've ordered LOTS of canning jars. Lids seem to be non-existent, even at Lehman Hardware right now. But if I just buy bands, I have re-usable lids. I'm going to need that outdoor kitchen setup, somewhere out of the wind... which presents a little bit of an issue. Not unsolvalbe, just needs some thought.

Siding is almost done on the hut; they're getting ready to finish the walls inside... and she's ordered flooring. By chance, she has gotten several orders for leather shoulder pouches (purse substitute that leaves your hands free) she makes, so she's got a little momentum to that Etsy shop she talked about. She's also making masks for her step-sister, the nurse. The creative income is a good thing; she could be completely moved into the hut before production is allowed to start up again in the city... the way things look, at the moment. Months, in other words, before that happens.

John has been talking a lot about the beach; but I know he is making other plans too. He may be moving on in the near future. Doesn't appear he has any reason to return to Portland.

Buck gained a pass to travel last week, when he did some diving for the Sheriff. That's let him finish the scrapping he's doing out of his shops; and take care of business. He's also getting his strength back. The less he's involved with that medical system, the better his health is getting. Go figure.

I'm still wary & not kindly disposed to the BF of Hol's. And I've made it clear that she can't just unilaterally give him permission for doing things... without clearing it with me first. I've got a few extra tasks for them, that are simply waiting on the weather to get better. I'm wary of her moods & frustrations too.

So, there is a new set of coping plans developed that will help me a lot. It's from that major shift mentioned above. Some change is external - and out of our control. Some change can be initiated from within - and manifested externally. Change is my specialty. :insert evil grin:
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 17, 2020, 11:30:52 PM: Amber:

What do you mean by "wary"?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 18, 2020, 10:39:06 AM: He doesn't interact with ANYONE Lighter. Not me, not even a good morning - much less: is there anything you want me to do today? He avoids John completely too.

And because half the peeps he ordered (baby ducks & guinea keets) arrived dead - he didn't want to interact with Hol either.

It's weird. No thank you, when I buy the non-usual things he prefers to eat or one of us cooks/cleans up after his 3 yr old messes.

When I asked Hol about it, she said he said (which is the only way I'm getting information about him)... that he doesn't want to be in my way around here. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This isn't being considerate; it's some elaborate means of getting what he wants - WITHOUT having to reciprocate.

And he's begun yelling at her. It sounds pathetically stupid - but I'm going to the studio and making a sign to post in the kitchen that says I'm the only one allowed to yell in this house. Because, here's the deal: I can ask directlly to stop doing that... and I get more response from a concrete wall. Or he leaves; runs away. Which is one of the things Hol is complaining about, btw. I have pointed out that it's not likely to get better when they move into the hut.

Here's the thing: it's HER relationship to deal with. But it's MY house. And there are certain things that I need from people in my house.

SO.... I'm very wary of him. I don't dare cross the boundary of throwing him out myself.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 18, 2020, 10:56:12 AM: Amber:

You wrote you're wary of Hol's moods and frustrations too.

How does that show up for you?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 19, 2020, 11:14:44 AM: Happy Sunday. Weather's turning nicer here, so will be getting outside again, more.

Yesterday, in about 8 hours, I had the studio to myself. Cranked up my favorite Beethoven Sonata and vented all my anger & frustration & said what I am not allowed to say out loud in words... onto a 24x40 canvas. First time in 32 years. Canvas is covered with the underpainting. Now the real work begins. I was THAT angry.

Angry - and wary - of how Hol vents her anger. She is most fond of projecting her passive co-dependence onto me in the form of an accusation (either in relationship with her or Buck) and transferring the (in)actions of her partner onto one of us as well. I am familiar with the technique - LOL. Basically externalizing everything she can't/won't deal with herself - that is her sole responsibility to do, mind you - onto someone else so she can either a) solve the dilemma and reach a decision or B) not have to feel the feelings as being herself. She has no idea what my relationship with Buck entails - I set a big flashing, neon, electrically charged boundary around that and most of the information surrounding it - with her. Precisely, because of this way of coping she's using.

She doesn't do this all the time. You can actually see the flip of the switch, when she goes there while holding forth on whatever topic she's proclaiming about. John and I - without her around - have pretty much dissected it. He is much more able to maintain objectivity and point out the inconsistencies... or logical progressions... in her thought process to her than I am; in the moment during conversation. Still - he's also stood in for the object of her dissatisfaction and anger - while she practices and works out just what she's trying to say, decide or do. Kid is terribly intelligent cognitively; but she has ALWAYS experiencing massively intense emotional reactions... and not known how to handle them.

As a mom, I would just grab her and hold her in a hug until the intensity calmed down. I didn't have anything else in my toolkit. But as an adult - she doesn't always permit this solution. She IS seeking that solution... and is flailing. But her thought process is reaaaaaalll close to solving this puzzle for her, her way - a way that will stand her in good stead, instead of impact the people around her because she ejects that energy. I think it's pretty important that she find her the solution/resolution herself - and we can talk about it later. More and more, I am able to quietly state some observations to her... and they're taken on board, while she ponders. So, I know she's working it out. It's not a pretty process; she's mud-wrestling herself. We not trying to influence what decision she comes to... just to get to a decision and then deal with the consequences herself.

Happily, John seems to have resolved some of his issues - at least made progress up the spiral of healing from FOO trauma. Not that we've spoken about them directly. I don't know his story. But he did tell me recently that he has stopped blaming himself, and unloaded an awful lot of toxic shame (that didn't belong to him in the first place). He's been doing a deep dive into the complex PTSD literature. He has a smorgasbord of future plan directions he may go in... once things open up a bit more again. His inner motivation is to go and be, where he is helpful and useful. I think he's helped Holly come up from a bit of a mental fairy tale and start to deal with the reality of it, instead. He's definitely helped me understand the dynamics of what's going on here - and listened to my concerns about it, validated quite a few of my ideas/observations... which has helped push me somewhere new. Letting Holly deal with Holly - MOST of the time - and giving me the space/chance to think/and move on with my own plans... without her trying to tell me to do things HER way.

So that canvas has been on the easel in the studio for about 4 years. It was entirely blank for a year; then a playful friend of Hol's made a game out of doodling on it in charcoal; that stayed about another year. Last year, I gesso'd over the charcoal... and Hol had brought in an old painting I'd done of a barn in '79. Looked at that old painting and saw lots of things, with a better educated eye, that I would've done differently now. And things that I instinctively - without training - knew would work. So was the born the idea of repainting that subject - but making a very different painting. This one is more symbolist/surreal than the stock, traditional, "barnscape" painting.

No; there are no sketches; no studies. The idea itself took a flyer off a cliff in an unexpected direction... a couple nights ago. Yesterday, I just walked up to the canvas, opened the turp & medium and picked up a few brushes and went at it. For hours. It only appears to be a spontaneous act to people around me... because all the work up to this point has been visualization inside my own head. For years. All it needed was the right amount of emotional energy to fuel it. To get that energy across I have to paint things that are not in my repertoire - the ocean; atmosphere; another mirage... so technically a challenge; and it simply can't be accomplished successfully by "thinking" alone - it requires that emotional energy to fuse into the paint... so it can jump out of the image.

It's already titled too: Fire & Water.

So, I'm having a "very pleased with myself" day today. It's warming up outside; sun is out. I have onions, garlic, peas, spinach, fancy lettuce & radishes in the ground. The raspberries look great this year. And just as soon as I can tell the ground is dry enough to work up, I'm going back to plow. Have 6 dz each quart/pint jars on their way... but no one seems to have lids in stock. Good thing I bought a gross of the reusables a couple years back.

Officially, WV has a stay at home order. But it was written in such a way - that life can go on anyway. Cases/deaths are creeping up here still... but extremely slowly. So there's no legitimate concern about our healthcare being overrun. I'm seeing lots of questions about the reliability of the tests these days... so I have no idea what to believe. Local resources are stretched pretty thin still... but over the mountain all is stocked full-up. I believe the "worst" is over -- and even if there is a rebound of cases later, it will be much smaller than that first wave.

So: I am officially bored of the virus, the news & politics about it, and the silly shutdowns. You quarantine SICK PEOPLE, not healthy ones. Somehow that got lost in the panic.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 19, 2020, 11:23:54 AM: So thrilling to hear you're painting, Amber!
Massively so.

I found myself thinking TURNER! as you described it.
How wonderful, to find some familiar boundaries dissolving as you paint.
That's one place where boundaries dropping can be a wonderful thing, eh?

Yay yay yay.

I am jealous of your sturdy muscled self that can go do with gardening what you are.
Sounds just fantastically satisfying.

I feel differently than you do about public health policy but we are darn good here about letting differences be.

I do wish you didn't get projected on. You don't deserve it and there comes a point when it's no longer interesting for you, just harmful.

Big hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 20, 2020, 06:49:13 AM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on April 18, 2020, 10:39:06 AM
He doesn't interact with ANYONE Lighter. Not me, not even a good morning - much less: is there anything you want me to do today? He avoids John completely too. You can't change the bf's behavior. You can put boundaries in place around your space, your tools, your expectations for housework, IMO.

I'd interact with him directly, cutting Hol out, and let him know he's responsible for his own messes or he can find a place with a maid to deal with it. THIS space doesn't come with maid service as of today, but I'm in a mood, and I see it just that way. When Hol has a problem with it... and she will... I'd invite her to move into her own place if she plans to allow her bf to pig up the house one more day. She can take all her furniture and personal items with her when she goes, and I'd say it in a very firm but pleasant tone..... no discussion. Just the way it is. I wish I'd done more of that when the boy was here with us. Now I wonder why the heck I didn't, bc it seems so simple now.

And because half the peeps he ordered (baby ducks & guinea keets) arrived dead - he didn't want to interact with Hol either.That's heartbreaking. Sorry that happened to those babies.

It's weird. No thank you, when I buy the non-usual things he prefers to eat or one of us cooks/cleans up after his 3 yr old messes. I'm shocked he has 2 maids cleaning up after his adult self. I'm shocked you're buying his preferred foods, honestly.

When I asked Hol about it, she said he said (which is the only way I'm getting information about him)... that he doesn't want to be in my way around here. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This isn't being considerate; it's some elaborate means of getting what he wants - WITHOUT having to reciprocate.Whatever it is... it doesn't sound sustainable. He's avoiding you, I understand that.
He's avoiding John. I understand that too. HE KNOWS he's not carrying his own weight but has no intention of changing, IMO. I'd want him out of my space under these circumstances. No judgment, just..... no. He's not your ward. He's not your bf. He's certainly not your child. Why does Hol feel you'll put up with his over the top really bad houseguest behavior?
She's willing to put up with it. Fine. She has her own space and I know it's not finished BUT IT IS HERS. She shouldn't have asked you to put it with this big child boy. I wish you hadn't allowed her to, but what's done is done.

What to do today about it? What CAN you do today, if anything?

If he's training you, and Hol... .how do you see that working out when Buck arrives?

And he's begun yelling at her. And THIS is as good as that's every going to get, IME.
It's a downhill slide from there, IME. It sounds pathetically stupid - but I'm going to the studio and making a sign to post in the kitchen that says I'm the only one allowed to yell in this house. I'm thinking MR. Avoidance won't pick up on it or admit if he did. It would, again, be time for him to move on, where that is. Because, here's the deal: I can ask directlly to stop doing that... and I get more response from a concrete wall. Or he leaves; runs away. Which is one of the things Hol is complaining about, btw. I have pointed out that it's not likely to get better when they move into the hut. All I could control is where the chucklehead doesn't yell at my dd and I'd feel perfectly within my right to insist he do it outside my space,
bc it's not cool, I would never condone it and, considering how I feel about these things and where they typically go.... I'd send him OUT of my space right after he did it so he KNEW, and Hol knew and John knew and the dogs and cats knew.... it's not cool, won't be tolerated, and that's the best things would get with me around while that happened.... things are likely to escalate with me, as well.

My T would want me to allow dd to come to her own conclusions about what she'll put up with and demand from men. FINE. What I won't do is allow it to happen under my roof, where it affects me. I get to feel OK in my space. I get to say who's IN my space. I get to make calm statements, skip explanations, and get my needs met... take care of myself... take care of my business.... make sure other's people's business is on their plate.

In fact, the yelling might not be OK on my property... anywhere. There have to be limits. Hol can fall out of love with MR. NOT THERE FOR HER anywhere. It doesn't have to be under your roof, or on your farm, IMO.

Here's the thing: it's HER relationship to deal with. But it's MY house. And there are certain things that I need from people in my house. You've needed those things for a while.
You've been thwarted. I don't understand how that's still happening EXCEPT you're worried about your relationship with Hol. In the long run, Hol might balk and rage and complain and whine but she'll see you modeling how to calmly deal with unacceptable behavior, which is more important than those two manipulating you into allowing this to go, IME. Of course, I could be completely wrong, and am willing to consider that.

SO.... I'm very wary of him. I don't dare cross the boundary of throwing him out myself.
You... don't dare cross the boundary. After all the boundaries those two have shoved down your throat and made you eat. After the situation turned toxic... you're still purchasing groceries and allowing this chucklehead man to roam your house at all hours, scream at Hol, pig up your HOME, take and lose your tools, refuse to interact EVEN TO DISCUSS HOUSE RULES AND the standards you've set, his failure to comply and what consequences are involved... then follow through with the consequences.

Maybe that's the discussion...
setting consequences for failure to honor boundaries then follow through without hesitation or worry about what Hol will do, say, scream, bc it's not her home. It seems like I'm reading about a property you and Hol own together.... as though she's a partner you have to put up with, bc you have no power to make requests and expect they'll be honored.

Requests. You're way beyond making requests, and I'm not talking about anger here. It's about making calm statements, not getting dragged into arguments or explaining your actions BECAUSE ALL THE ADULTS in the rook have been asked nicely, suggested to, asked clearly, been snapped at and still they ignore you.

Hol asks too much, IMO.

You shouldn't have to help her pretend the man isn't pigging up the space. Isn't expecting the maids to handle his mess. Neither of you are his maid. Better he learn that before Hol has a child with him... before Buck lands... before you lose your mind.

I'd say it right to the man....
"Time for you to go now... yup yup yup.... now. It's the Hut or wherever else you feel is appropriate but it's now and it's all your stuff too. Lets go... out."

I'd repeat that and only that.... maybe remind whoever gets in your face they were warned, consequences were laid out, those consequences were real and it's time to go... out the door...
now.... all his stuff.... if Hol is too upset to remain in your home, she should take all her things and go with the chucklehead. It's time. He has to go.

Rinse and repeat till the problem is OUT of your space and knows he can't touch any of your tools vehicles, daughter without the next set of consequences falling on his head.

Is that too strong? I don't feel it is right now, but you're more than capable of handling this, Amber and I trust you will.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 20, 2020, 08:47:21 AM: Yes, Lighter. I am the sole owner of the farm. The legal puzzle involves titling it in the name of the trust - through which it become Hol's. The lawyer and I had an extremely short, blunt and to the point conversation about my idea of adding her to the title... that dissuaded me from it. And I know, now - he was right. Based on several things, not just this current untenable situation. That is a conversation I will have with her later.

Hops, the act of painting is powerful; expressive in no uncertain - or diplomatic, politically correct - terms. Primal scream type of thing. Even when I'm noodling over a tiny microscopic segment or element of it. Everything about it is from the essential "me" - no reference; no discernable influence from other artist's work; it's a specific magic spell intended to manifest something directly into reality. Dang near a "command" - so it shall be.

The other action I'm engaged in at the moment, is getting the garden area plowed up. At least, today - I'm going to try to give it another shot before rain arrives. It's a delicate dance of timing - to find just the right moment when the soil is dry enough to work up, but still damp enough. The whole point being to turn over the top layers, to gradually work it smaller and smoother for a seed bed - without detroying the tilth, the texture of the soil. It's big tools for a very fine result - sorta like using a stand mixer to get a merangue or bread dough mixed just the right amount, without over mixing. After the first couple years, I won't need the big implements - a broadfork will do just fine. But I'm breaking sod this year; gently terracing - with a lot of paying attention to the dirt, the moisture in it, the amount of rocks - thinking about designing it as much permaculture as I can. Obviously, most garden produce is annuals... but the "good dirt" is scarce around these hills and I need to make the most of my space.

I'm taking an intentional break from the whole Holly & BF situation. When I start to beat my head on the same brick wall of stalemate - or waiting on the responsible parties to step up and act on their responsibilities - I'm too close to the problem, too immersed in it, driving myself crazy to no effect... and even losing "me". So I have the painting and garden to focus on instead... and it's time to get busy on part of the master bedroom makeover. Where John & I removed the fireplace, I want to lay up a decorative stone wall - the background for the bed headboard. I've decided the french door has to go - it needs to be a slider - to maximize the footprint in this room; and I'm likely to add a screened/roofed small sitting porch off of it too. (That will happen when I replace the roof.)

Once the stone wall is done, then I'm putting hardwood down instead of the carpet. I need to call contractor and see if we can get the last piece of trim - on the wall OUTSIDE the bathroom done. And I'm going to reorganize the closet to provide some long hanging space for me, and more shelves for Buck.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 20, 2020, 01:18:40 PM: Amber:

After filling the house with chicken salad, egg salad and poached shredded chicken for easy recipes....
I realized something about my situation.

I feel completely solid in my decision. DD is nothing but relieved I handled it. She didn't ONCE try to dissuade me from my course. IF she came to me with concerns.... and she did.... it was a back and forth between the boy manipulating her with whining, cold shoulders, and insistence she couldn't possibly love him IFshe ALLOWED her mother to send him home.

Ummmm..... I should have done it sooner is how I felt and I feel more strongly about it with every passing moment.

DD didn't have the reaction I thought she would, particularly bc I'd extended so much freedom, ZERO control, done the clean up way too often, argued with them about doing chores, and then I STOPPED arguing and he had to go.

It feels like DD lost control and was grateful to have me step up and show her how to handle whiney trauma bonded men... .zero drama..... all business.... a little tinge of regret and dd TOLD the boy ALL the reasons why he was gone.

He whined.... NOTHING is EVER his FAULT, kwim?

Fine. I l already knew that one.

Whining it was bc of her and her fault upset dd very much, and she came to me with her distress. It never changed my demeanor... I was always dead set, completely committed to my course and KNEW KNEW KNEW it was the right course for me.

I never ever made it about dd..... it was the boy and MY interaction, feeling in MY home and you know what? I already posted about this, but it bares repeating.....

the house felt amazing when he was gone. For all of us. We laughed and joined together and watched a favorite movie and we felt safe and warm and sheltered and......

I don't have a word for lifting and escaping the emotional whiney yolke of a man's insistence WE, me, dd, any woman is the reason he's not completely happy, and/or is the reason he's about to be miserable.... read that as about to deal with the consequences of his own actions.

DD needed to see how it's done. Even as her eyes bugged out when I kept repeating exactly what I'd started with, despite the boy's apparent emotional......

what?

Emotional.......

ESCALATION.

And dd expected it bc I'd mentioned it and that I wasn't dissuaded by it in any way and hop, ed she could SEE it for what it was too, but eh......
this wasn't about her. It was about me, my space and my comfort within it.

The boy is acting normal again, btw. He wants to visit again and so the cycle begins.

I told her about that too, not that I needed to teach the lesson, just saying it bc it;s not going to impact my course of action bc I don't feel the same discomfort she does. That's OK. I don't need to change that for her. SHE can step into that, stay in it, seek it out.....
I'm not doing that, nor will I ever do it and now now now dd believes it and is talking about breaking up with the boy without me mentioning it, suggesting it, or telling she should do anything.

I'm not telling her what she needs to do, think or feel. That's on her.

I think know that.... knowing I'm not going to intervene or care about that for her.... makes if feel more real, more weighty, more what it is.... and she can't hide from it, bc I'm not helping her sustain denial an inch.

THIS is what it looks like when a woman stands up to a man she cares about. THIS is what it can look like if you want to control your world, what you'll put up with, and how you'll live.

DD is calm. Working on cleaning and editing her bedroom with happiness and gusto. We work together often, but only when she asks. It's HER room and I help. Suggest things when asked. Other than that...... and bugging her to wake up and not sleep the day away...... she's making her own decisions and growing up a good deal.

When I thought I had to teach her a bunch of lessons.....
it was all jumbled up and scary.

When I went back to what was mine, and what was hers....
it got so much easier.

I can tell when I'm sitting in my truth, bc it feels solid, good and right.... no doubt. Not an inch.

That's an amazing way to go through a day, Amber.

Amazing.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 20, 2020, 02:08:31 PM: Whoo.

Boundaries on fleek!
(I am positive that as a geriatric, I am using that term correctly....not.)

Great stuff, Lighter.

Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: CB123 on April 20, 2020, 06:22:22 PM: Good explanation, Lighter...I recognize the feeling you describe, of knowing that you know that it was the right decision, because it feels right in a deep way. I've felt that way before, I hate that it has often taken me a long time to get to it. But, yes, the feeling of lightness and freedom and almost exuberance is very real.

So glad you were able to communicate that so well to your daughter. Not easy to do, but what a thrill when you do.

CB
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 21, 2020, 09:48:16 AM: I'm quickly getting to the same place Lighter.
Yesterday, just was the last straw for me.

Nothing, however, is going to happen until I reassemble myself and reweld all the seams that blew apart.

I know that's cryptic; but the drama just isn't worth repeating - it's THAT stupid and unnecessary. Which is one of the things that poured gasoline on my anger.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 26, 2020, 07:45:38 PM: Psssst, Amber.

Are you doing OK?

I don't want to give away your position if you're in escape and evasion mode.

Let us know when you can.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 27, 2020, 10:31:27 AM: I'm OK; still VERRY angry.

There's not much I can do if she wants to let some guy use her; take advantage of her. But when I'm supposed to do the same simply because I asked her to stay until she had other plans... it's just not happening and now SHE is part of the problem that is making me angry. And honestly, "lockdown" being lifted wouldn't make a damn bit of difference unless she can/does go back to work.

Fortunately, we can be angry and yell at each other - sleep on it - and go on the next day. But this time, I'm not forgetting/forgiving what she is making me suffer - because she won't admit it to herself. Irresistible force and immovable object time.

And it's just not worth going through the he said/she said/I said crap. I know she KNOWS what I have an issue with. And our boundary is where "my house" ends... and her relationship is supposed to be. She makes grand statements about taking care of everyone... but doesn't hear me when I point out, I don't see her taking care of me. I'll handle my upset; but the source of the issue REMAINS until she deals with it. This 38 yr old boy-child can't/won't/doesn't know how to take care of himself, much less others and I'll be damned if I'm going to train him for her. I really think it's not what he wants anyway.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 27, 2020, 12:05:06 PM: I'm so sorry, ((((((((Amber))))))))))).

It's like being hostage to your own love.
You love your child, but you can still be hostage.

You love your mountain.
You loved your family-compound dreams.

You didn't anticipate it all turning into a trap.

Hold on. The faster she/they are out of your house, the better.

And speaking of which, with walls and a roof, they can move into
the Hut before it's finished. If you're at wits' end, you can decide that.

I hope.

Big hugs and comfort,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 27, 2020, 04:49:17 PM: Well, she kinda needs her appliances & a bathroom... while everything else gets finished up. And that requires the stucco to be on the walls and the flooring down. So, maybe in 3 weeks a month.

But I guess on the plus side - my anger and need to separate from the crap going on here IS fueling a lot of energy for the painting. Which is storm clouds, an angry sea and a barn sinking in the waves. Heh. There will also be fog... and rain... and it's totally a challenge for me to render those atmospheric effects well in paint and not lose the intensity of the image and it's symbolism.

Bless Buck - he's my safe harbor even in the storms. And we are still playing when I'm not completely in a state.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 27, 2020, 06:15:43 PM: Creativity. The painting.

And love. Mr. B.

I'm so glad you have these powerful, powerful forces in you, beside you.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 28, 2020, 09:56:47 AM: The one thing I'm NOT is victimized, Hops.

Tired, out of patience, frustrated, angry, fed up, and stressed out - beyond anything in recent memory. Still trying to stay busy at useful things on the farm. I keep reading about potential food shortages and am noticing a great deal of price inflation. So my focus is on food production. Fortunately I have some local, grass-fed, organic farmers who are decades ahead of me, near here. Even through the summer, I will be canning meat, keeping the freezer topped off (and maybe buying another one) and am looking at freeze-dryers. I have a dehydrator already - and so far, not pleased with the results.

But it seems the absolute best thing I can do is social distance myself from the drama-purveyors in my household for DAYS at a time, to allow me an opportunity to deal with my own emotions - and not smoosh those up into a blend of theirs, and my own frustrations. So far, no one is complaining about that.

I mean, I could go so far as to call the Sheriff and forcibly remove the offending BF from here. She could still see him at the primitive accommodations at his farm. Still have her relationship. I did seriously consider this. It's within my property rights - and I have an ace up my sleeve there. If he ever HITS her - I'll play that card so fast they won't even know what happened. And of course - between doing nothing and minding my own business, and that level of protecting myself and property - there are lots and lots of options. Creativity has it's uses... And Buck's experience does too.

LOL... who woulda figured my big tough guy would ask permission to bring his roses, hydrangeas & hibiscus - along with his rock collection (lots of fossils) when he comes? This is gonna be so much fun. First dancing, now flowers... I guess the old saying is true:

"It's better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener in a war".
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on April 28, 2020, 02:04:26 PM: I love that old saying! Must look up the source.

I could never perceive you as a victim, Amber.
That said, I think you're in a hostagey situation with Hol and S.
S is the surface target and deserves it, but she hasn't been mature
or responsible herself.

I'm just unhappy for you, because you've worked so hard and had
such grand happy compound dreams for the mountain.

But B. arriving, plants in tow? That sounds like a good man planning to LIVE with you!

Is that it? For real? Either way, I love that he's bringing the flowers....

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on April 28, 2020, 03:28:08 PM: Yeah, he's bringing plants - I'd better see if I can get another load of topsoil, LOL. I checked the webpage of the college his D is going to start at, in the fall. Classes start Aug 24, so I imagine he'll be moving her about a week before then. I KNOW Hol will be moved out by then, into the Hut.

She's been keeping busy, with a way to make money outside of film production. (No telling when that will start back up.) She makes leather pouches to wear as a shoulder harness, instead of carrying a purse. That leaves your hands free to manage a toddler, dogs, groceries, etc. Sent a set as a "smile" to a coffee shop owner - who wore them around and got a couple people interested in getting their own. They're only good for the essential stuff - a couple cards, cash, phone - not the gramma sized, all purpose emergency kit some of us struggle with. And they're CUTE, too. She's also experimenting with other kinds of bags - made a very simple, pretty one for Harper, the 7 yr old artsy niece (it's pink suede and she embroidered it too). Her assembly/design time is down to about two hours for pouches now... and she usually prices them around a couple hundred dollars. They're sturdy and secure those loose bits we need when you don't really have pockets; don't want to carry a purse... so I think she can do pretty well.

It's important to her - and to me - that I don't add any more pressure on her to deal with this BF, than the unavoidable expressions of my emotions that will erupt from time to time. So I have basically re-invoked the force field around me... shifted my personal schedule enough that I can avoid coming into direct contact with either one of them... and am constructing myself a cardboard box (imaginary) of just the things I want in "my world" fulltime... and shouldn't be impacting mine this way - when her goal was to "help mom around the farm". I can fully accept that perhaps for her - nor me - was it ever intended to be a full-time thing. I know for a fact, that in her own way, she's doing the work to sort this out for herself. And I'm standing back as much as I can.

There's a big difference being ready to let her go - and live her own life, with her own rules & habits - and me rejecting her outright. That's a subtlety that's lost in an argument, usually. Two fierce Amazons going at it, very few holds barred? LOLOL. Not completely rational. Nor really communicating anymore. We both recognize that.

What I lack, is the "my age companionship" with common experiential background to pass what is physically undemanding "down time". Buck is definitely going to help there. But so will being able to get to see my friend from over the mountain. These guys are definitely dealing with the "OMG, my life is half over... " panic and all the looming mortality issues that come with it. And still haven't reconciled the idea that grief is a natural part of life, as is death, yet. And that living in abject fear of that -- steals what life one does have.

I'm just a couple turns down the road past all that. And it's tiresome (and pedantically tedious) how much time & effort is being put into that around here. Sheesh. Maybe I'll shop online for dancing shoes again. Still haven't found anything that screams "buy me" yet.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on April 28, 2020, 05:09:34 PM: I look forward to reading posts about Buck planting cherished plants, and arranging fossils among the Amber things. It's a sweet thought.

I have to say... I really like the idea of sending the bf back to his own farm. I didn't realize he had a place of his own. That seems like a no brainer solution to all your problems, IMO. I believe I'd release him and Hol back to his farm with love.

Sometimes it feels like Hol is so focused on you she can't SEE this boy... manchild clearly.

::crossing fingers for Buck's safe arrival at the farm::

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 05, 2020, 08:41:39 AM: Nice... allergy season and a polar vortex in May... on top of everything else. If you keep up with the news, one is risking overwhelming oneself with bad news.

Hol's gf came for the weekend. Lots of hikes & walking around... she set up a hammock and tent and camped... and she and I connected on the topic of grief and losing a spouse - even tho, for her, he was just her Partner. But honestly, every time I revisit those feelings - it gets all tangled up with guilt that prevents me being happy about Buck.

If the weather doesn't break here soon, we're going to run out of projects. I'm working on the big garden, primarily, this year. The big bed has been plowed from each direction; then I added 3 smaller ones; narrower - same length - 90 degrees to the slope of the hill to maximize rain distribution in August. It won't always be this wet here. Right now rain is still too frequent to get to some sections without splashing and wishing I had an outboard motor.

Hol is working on another knitted blanket as a wedding present for the other co-worker on her team. They had a baby last year - and she was just diagnosed with stage 3 cancer. That news hit all 3 of us women damned hard emotionally. We are still hanging out at the farm most of the time. Trying to stay out of each others heads & spaces... saw the contractor last week; he thinks 3-4 weeks to finish the hut is realistic.

I've been adding to my seed stash; talking with M - the master gardener who's working side landscaping jobs right now - about different planting areas. We're both trying to identify some interesting native plants here.

Sat up straight in bed last night from the worst nightmare I've had in a very long time. Might be about my feelings about Buck - or just EVERYTHING going on. I'm not pushing to remember the details of it. He did say that as soon as the rental place opens up, he's going to try to get a truck reservation and head this way - bringing one of his major tools with him. They're currently cleaning vehicles, and told him to call back Friday. For some reason, that freaks me out. Total cold feet reaction. And it has nothing to do with him; or even how I feel about him.

Might just be going from the planning stage to reality; and a 100 anxious what-if scenarios in my head about "how it will be"... that may/may not manifest. After all, the man DOES have a high level of agency... as do most of the people around here. AND he's very kind and wise. But doesn't take his role as a protector lightly. So no idea how that's going to work.

And some of it is my own insecurities; the past emotional life I've lived... and letting all that go. Not forgetting, just doing something new instead.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 05, 2020, 01:11:05 PM: Amber:

It's difficult to calm down after a shot of adrenaline like you've been experiencing. The nightmare. The realization B will truly be there soon.... no more waiting. And I believe you've waited so long you've habituated to the waiting. Maybe not.

The young, engaged new mother..... with stage 3 cancer..... that's a terrible shock too, IME. You KNOW what she's in for... bc you've walked your MIL and darling M through. You've had young children. I've had to picture my children growing up without me...... it's a devastating shot of chemicals capable of driving one into the floor, IME.

At risk of sounding trite....
breathe, Amber. Breathe.

You know how.

Get yourself out of that anxious hole and into the light. Nose off the pebbles. Widen your gaze. See the entire field.

When B arrives he'll have his stance. All you can do is tweak your stance, on everything worrying you, before he arrives.

You have time.

And you're not in charge of making everyone get along all the time. That's crazy pressure. You can't control that situation, no matter how many lists you make or thought you give to it.

Only the part you play. The information you relay to the people around you. The boundaries you set. The consequences you follow through with. The attitude you have when you deliver this information with compassion. Release expectations if you can as a lot of the anxiety likely comes when you're worrying about the future.
Worrying about what certain fearful outcomes mean for you.... you have certain expectations. Your ego needs things to go certain ways, but your ego can't control anything but what you do in this moment.

Tomorrow never comes. It's always right now that we're living. Think about what it is you're resisting..... what is it you can't accept?

It's OK... even when it's not OK.

Everything will be all right, Amber.

I suspect you'll see all the crazy joy around you if you can just get your nose off those pesky pebbles. Not embrace them, or call them right and good.

Just accept them, as they are, bc you can't change them. You can only change your response, ability to respond, and what you focus on... how you focus. Zero judgment. Huge self-compassion.

Remind yourself.... what can you do IN THIS MOMENT? Is there anything? Do it, then put the story on the shelf and get your head back to where your feet are.

You, as well as anyone on this board, knows how some dreaded things can lead to uplifting, unexpected things. We don't know what the future holds.

The dread robs us, so lean into it, without expectation....

oh.....

you know how it goes.

I'm excited for Buck's arrival!

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 05, 2020, 02:17:21 PM: What she said.
All of it.

Bravo, Lighter.
Big hugs, Amber.

Hops in Pebbles
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 07, 2020, 09:54:20 AM: Yes... excitement! still no confirmation on dates yet, so I'm not getting TOO wound up - but he is able to "be here" for me without actually being here. I can almost viscerally FEEL that things are moving to new deeper levels. And while I have some questions, and the instinct to want to manage/organize everything ahead of time, there is something truly fun and energizing about just surfing this, too. Yes...!!!!!! he found & sent me the picture of him in a kilt. I'd sent him a pic of me from the same era - back when big hair perms were a thing, and mine was really long. There are very few pics of me; and damn few proving what color my hair WAS... before going platinum.

LOTS of crap happening at the farm right now. Stucco on the walls at the hut is coming up next; it'll be 2 weeks before her flooring comes in; work outside has commenced - but it might snow this weekend here and the temps are going back to winter again. Now, I have a leak somewhere between well & house. And I have to go over the mtn today... and.... and.... I'm only going to be able to be in one place at a time.

And for today - I'm just gonna close the file on a bunch of things in my head. It can all go in the "archive folder"... and sit there till I'm not so silly giddy happy and brainless (in a good way).
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 07, 2020, 10:58:33 AM: Quote
silly giddy happy and brainless (in a good way)

I volunteer to be all those things for you vicariously, (((((Amber))))).

I can feel the joy and hope.

So happy he's coming and hope it goes well.

(Hope you'll disabuse him of his "protector role" as though you'd be standing back while he fights your very own dragon....the quiet knight, who supports you privately as your own strength rebuilds, might be more beneficial. I'll bet he can play that too.)

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 07, 2020, 01:33:32 PM: Most of my life deep planning ended up flying by the seat of my pants wishing I'd not wasted so much time and worry planning. Much of that time was spent what iffing in every direction.

There comes a point where we have to do what we can, with the available details, then put the subject down until further details emerge, ime.

I'm glad to read a happy busy update, Amber.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 08, 2020, 06:47:55 AM: Well, crap keeps breaking around here. And that's a perfect scenario for someone who needs to keep busy at fixin' things. At least, that's what I'm thinking. LOL. Yes, he's always going to have that protector instinct. It's who he is. But we started off with him saying I was the CO, and he's the Git R Done guy. As far as that stuff goes. He's pretty dang good at boundaries; I'm sure that's starting to rub off on me a little. But mostly, I'm thinking he's got the ability to say out loud the simple truths of life and not worry a smidge whether anyone takes issue with it or not. He doesn't cause me much concern that way. But everyone else who is here right now might not be so comfortable with that.

And that points to the fact, that for all intents and purposes, I am still voiceless - where it concerns my wants/needs and when that might "inconvenience" or upset or offend someone else. And that remains an issue with boundaries for me. With the current crew of people here (hopefully out of my space in the VERY near future). Not with B. Not at all. And the reason for that, is that we have the same values and common shared life experiences - they're different in setting and lived realities - but the essence of them are the same. I think that matters a great deal long-term. We have a frame of reference for understanding each other so communication is MUCH easier; less fraught. At least, the way things stand at the moment. I fully understand that may change when we're actually sharing space together. I rather expect it change in ways I don't imagine or foresee.

But the power-dynamic between us is of being on the same team. Working together; pulling together in the same direction. I saw that immediately - but he's the one who keeps reminding me when I fall back into old habits from the past experiences. I can tell he's done a lot of inner work; he's steady and not living in a reactive state (unlike some people around here). Once I let the sense of being grounded that he's giving soak in, then I stand down from the hyypervigilent state and relax too. That's been a missing ingredient for me.

It helps that he's so creative too. Well-versed in taking an idea, and making it a real thing. Not in a controlling way; more of an experimental playful way. See where it goes. But he's all matter of fact, too. Despite having a secret, romantic side to him... LOL. He has his insecurities and self-image stuff that he's still working on too. His adventures with relationships and women haven't turned out all that well for him, when all is said and done. Just takin' his hurts, let them heal, and move on... lesson learned. And we can talk about that... along with my past. It's refreshing; and it's intense emotionally. But we're both practical people... so the basics of daily life how-tos, while we do things differently... are still, pretty much the same thing.

Yesterday, my head was buzzing from all the energy & intensity of how freeing it is to start getting ready for a brand-new journey. Not even driving calmed that down; I went over the mountain & back on auto-pilot. By evening, I was totally wiped out and exhausted of all ability to ponder or what-if or even put together verb-object sentences... LOL. But I felt lighter than I have in a LONG time; the weight is lifting. Not imagining or expecting or planning... still in waiting mode... confidently. For as long as I need to.

The timing is right too; I'm letting the past go - into the dry pages of history while working on becoming "just Amber"; the whole enchilada of my "self"... instead of the image to project to the world... and I suppose the recent barrage I've been under from my hatchling about all kinds of things from the past - to the point of returning to old coping mechanisms which just aren't compatible with my current chronological state - has been part of that inventory process. Assessing the good, bad, impractical and downright irritating things - or ones which threatened me into defensiveness in the first place.

I am still the sum result of all those experiences. But now I can choose to do and be the things I intuit are the one's most authentically "me" -- whether they're socially acceptable or NOT. And not give two flying f's what ANYONE including the hatchling, thinks about it.

I think I'm gonna rock purple polka-dots.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 08, 2020, 10:16:52 AM: ..............
..............
..............
..............

Dang. These are supposed to be DOTS, not cubes!

Amber, your energy is way up, and it's just a big contrast with
how it's been for months lately. So glad you have B to look forward
to, and a stronger sense brewing of self-love and self-respect.

I hope you can pre-analyse less and just be open to knowing that
you are an adult, this is your home, he is your most welcome guest
and companion, and the entitled babies need to get out of the building.

When does B arrive?

Big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 08, 2020, 04:23:10 PM: Hmmm. I like the cubes better than round dots!

Still no word from Buck yet. More virus hoops to jump through today with HS graduation traditions. Not sure his patience is going to hold up. I'm creating a scale gauge for "how bored is Buck?" LOLOL.

I've managed to offload a lot of the stuff holding me down in the past week of pulling back into my "nest", stuff that was dragging me back through stuff I ALREADY had settled. (Including the youngen' stuff).

So... yes, it's better now. Bouncy back babe... the roly-poly boddhisatva...
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 09, 2020, 08:30:34 AM: Well, the rental companies aren't cleared for out of state rentals until after the 15th. (:P coronoavirus)

Then to get a truck big enough for what he's bringing there isn't anything available until the 26th. So he made a reservation for 5 days rental after that. Under the circumstances, that's the soonest it can happen - bigger pickup trucks aren't that common in the rentals; and not many available with a hitch to tow a trailer either.

After June 10 - he does the Navy thing. And will be retired after that.

His D's graduation has been pushed back to the 3rd week in July. And so far, nothing definite on her college situation yet. Which is actually kinda normal; schools get ready starting right after spring finals and graduation for fall. The virus situation has messed up the admissions processes - so there is a lot of flexibility in how it's being handled. She doesn't have to worry; good student and talented.

Then, he'll be here - and not going anywhere.

:D :D :D

and more purple dots!!!
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 09, 2020, 09:30:22 AM: So around June 1, then with you until around the 10th, and gone for a good while for Navy thing? Then D's graduation in July?

Sounds like a kind of nice progression from here a while, gone a while, then back...which might make it easier to transition into FT living together, I'm thinking.

Can be transition shock to go to all at once all the time. (I'm petrified of it anyway.)

Oh this sounds really good, Amber.

Fingers toes and all hairs crossed!

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 09, 2020, 03:28:10 PM: I'll know for sure on the 16th the actual dates. He'll be here most of a week. Anywhere between May 26 - June 10th.

Everything else to do, was on his original year-long plan... just as described; except for all the covid impacts on normal stuff. Obviously, I'm beside myself with anticipatory excitement... but I've already warned him too. Asked him what is the first thing you're gonna do when you get out of the truck? Smart man, said I'm going to hold you as long as you want me to. I'm gonna cry, I just know it... LOL.

June 14th is when he was here last year. I'm pretty sure he's going to ask, as a formality, if I'm still OK with him moving here. But he doesn't have to; he already knows it's a yes. I don't think I've ever been more absolutely sure about any relationship before. I wasn't sure I was going to be able to hang in there for the duration of him, finishing his obligations in that part of his life. I'm not the most patient person. And I was sure some flag or another was going to pop up. That just happens; and may still. But it feels like the time has flown by - and regardless of what's going on with him or me... we're talking to each other throughout the day; developing that mundane life routine. Waking up; morning coffee time... together... off on our day; touch base at various points during it for no important reason usually... and then in the evenings, signing off with a goodnight ritual. He likes to have fun. And I like to have fun with him.

He's 100% up to speed on things here at the farm. I know just about all that's going on with him. He's been diving for the Sheriff - various things. I know when he & his D get into spats; latest one was she pestered him to get her X amount of kitten food... except there were no kittens anywhere around. When he walked into her room, she and a friend from down the road were trying to feed baby possums. All he said was: Them ain't kittens. And he got put on the list from that point on. LOL. Poor Dad.

Last night, I observed we seemed to have moved on to parenting together. He said it's just in our natures. And maybe it's part of the attraction, too, I think. He's raised so many kids; still works with veterans fresh out of the service to help them adjust and teach them marketable skills. That'd be guys in their 30s - kids to us. Family is important to him. There will be some travel too for us in the future. Dancing lessons... tango... LOL.

His VA T is beside himself with curiosity about why he's so happy and carefree. LOL. B still hasn't told him. LOL.... I'm kinda enjoying that I'm his big secret. I didn't think I would, but I am kinda a privacy freak - for as open I am about sharing with y'all and others.

Hol has convinced herself - and she's trying to convince me - that this lovely vision I have is all going to come crashing down; that I'm not able to discern anything for real & true about him. :shakes head: Strikes me that she's a bit green over my happiness. I just tell her she's entitled to her opinion and let it go. I want her to go and deal with her life - and try to find her own brand of happiness instead of worrying about mine. LOL. That was the deal, originally.

She and I will get along much better when we spend less time together. This is known. LOL. That, and a patient therapist would go a LONG way toward her having better relationships. She kinda reminds me of me, before those years with my T. All I can do is remind her of the idea from time to time. It would be good if she got a better understanding of what co-dependency is. I'm almost certain she's confusing trusting someone, with reciprocal dependency, and thinking that all of those things are variously co-dependence. When you're strong enough to stand alone - but recognize that you're stronger with a trusted partner by your side - that's NOT co-dependency. She kinda thinks it is. And of course, she knows everything so can't even listen to my understanding.

That's a giant tell, I think.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 15, 2020, 04:49:07 PM: Been a pretty good week here. Hol was moving some of their plants to the Hut today. :)

Last day before I hear from Buck when he's coming up. So since the sun is warm and it's not TOO hot... I'm trying to get some of the pale out of my skin. Been a few years since I've done that. And just generally floofing about not doing anything serious at all. Just a day to chill out and let the dust of the past months settle. I can go back to my crazy work tasks tomorrow. Ain't goin' anywhere.

Not really looking back at anything I've been through in the past. Pfffttt! What's it matter now? When I have a whole new adventure I'm looking forward to - that's as cozy and caring and fun as I could've imagined for myself? It's all because of who B is... and what that evokes from me. We know who we are; have been able to be honest & vulnerable to each other about that; that's amazingly helpful for getting a sense of "we'll figure things out as we go" instead of pre-planning. And I'm looking forward to it - because I haven't done this kind of life before.

And while that might seem out of character... just leaping off the cliff without even calculating the risks, as I usually do... I can do it 'coz B says: "I got you babe. You'll be OK." Who knew that would be so attractive to me, after such a struggle to be independent and strong in myself???? That's not going to change, ya know. I don't have to give that up to enjoy knowing someone is right next to me; someone who really has my back. All he wants is someone to appreciate the manly stuff he's all about... and let him do what he does. That is perfectly fine by me. It's grounding for me.

So... we'll see. There is a small possibility we decide this isn't going to work for us. For whatever reason. But so far, I have no reason to believe that's the case. We'll part friends if one of us decides "no". But I really don't see that happening. Chances are slim and none. So, I'm trying really hard to not get my hopes up he'll be here next week. LOL. And wondering in amazement at my luck... it's just too crazy good to be believed. It's a good time be alive. And having been through everything up till now.

We'll see what tomorrow brings.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 15, 2020, 05:22:10 PM: If there's any single thing that tells me B is good for you, ((((Amber)))), it's this:

Quote
And just generally floofing about not doing anything serious at all.

I cannot believe my eyes.

Hadda go read it again.

Woo HOOOOOOO for you, for both of you!

Hang in, breathe, and trust the present.
I am so happy for you.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 15, 2020, 06:12:15 PM: Hugs, Hops... I'm in a good mood these days. But today was special - just settin' & bein" & waiting to hear from him. In his time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 16, 2020, 01:57:08 PM: Amber:

I love the way you're focusing on your bliss. Allowing Hol to keep ownership of her stuff.... is the way it should be.

I'm sorry her she has a worry, worry, in your face, hand wringing style of intimacy. All you can do is model something better, and share information when she's open to it. It seems that's what you've been doing, so..... onward and upward!

I'm so excited for you!!!!!

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 19, 2020, 02:01:35 PM: Finally got dates for Buck's visit - 6/11 to 6/16.
R E L I E F

Yeah, it's a little further away than I wanted. (Like from March) But I no longer have the worry that it wasn't important enough for him to nail down dates. And chances are good that Hol & Steve will be moving into the Hut then. Hol and I have both been bundles of anxiety today. For totally different reasons - just shared the energy quality & level between us.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 19, 2020, 02:16:53 PM: YAY! So happy Amber!

If Hol and Steve can't go sleep on camping mats in a roofed and floored and plumbed hut so YOU and B can have your whole damn house to your sweet selves, let me know.

I'll send them a gift certificate to a nearby B & B.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 19, 2020, 05:21:36 PM: LOLOL. We hope it's plumbed by then. But they are campers. :D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 20, 2020, 08:33:21 AM: Camping....
Staying at the BF's farm.

You should have your house all to yourself when B arrives, Amber.

I cant wipe the smile off my face thinking about B's arrival!

Dance lessons!!!!!!!

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 20, 2020, 01:01:39 PM: What I'm feeling is.... unusual for me.

The kids will surely accomodate; Steve has his own issues with us all living together & privacy. Told Hol I understood & sympathized completely with that. Hence, the Hut solution. They're both sensitive to our need - B's & mine - to just be us and try this on for size in more ways than one. Mom went out of her way, many times & ways, to give them that kind of space, too.

I actually feel... calm. Surrounded by a gentle, restful peace. Normally, I'd be in overdrive and trying to get everything done all at once. But not now. It's as if in some emotional logic sort of way... I'm feeling the reverse of the process of grieving and letting go I experienced these years after Mike passing.

I can observe it without feeling it; feel it without thinking about it in my usual anxious, analytical way.

Different. For me.

I don't have to do the heavy-lifting to make this relationship a "thing". It just is - because B is right there for me; all the time. Even if we're just blowing tele-kisses to each other because we happened to be daydreaming & thinking of each other. He's very much more romantic than Mike was - even at the beginning of the relationship. Mike was more obsessive than romantic. I'm sure B's got some insecurities, but whatever they are - he seems to manage them better than a lot of people do (looking at myself here, primarily). And I don't get away with making a joke or role-playing any kind of submissive 2nd fiddle crap with him; he's quick to come back with - we're EQUALS in this; you make your own decisions.

There is some division of labor being self-selected though. What I do with the house - when I ask for input from him, it's given - with the caveat that ultimately it's my decision. Everything mechanical is his speciality. And there are projects we're already planning to do together. He's looking forward to having his hands in the dirt too. And there are things we're planning to teach each other... He cooks & rather well.

I don't scare him one single bit. LOL. And he sure can't be intimidated by many people, much less me. His aesthetic, creative abilities, design sense is nice and strong too. He makes lots of things because he can't stand not being productive - perhaps that's one of his weaknesses. But I know he CAN just sit patiently for hours and watch the light, the wind in the trees, the stars.

This is way more like gravitational pull than whirlwind. I'm liking it so far. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 21, 2020, 10:00:59 AM: Now, today - I feel like I'm bundled in cotton fluff... unable to move at normal speed and not really motivated to either. Just wanting to give in to fluff... slip into the twilight zone...

but there ARE things to do. And the kids have been running errands and picking up things while I'm in this state of suspended animation. It's definitely NOT sensory deprivation however. Lots & lots & lots of information and observations moving through the head and body. When the kids do things for me, I feel kinda deprived of the pressure to get up and do them myself. I kinda need that momentum. But they're trying to make more distance between me and the virus... and I appreciate that.

I'm going to try to finish up the last bit of legal work to insure Hol's future today; pay bills. Maybe visit the grocery store. Just for a change of scenery.

I started watching Downton Abbey... it's restful in strange ways. To watch. Clearly, it wasn't that peaceful to live in those times. As if it is - any time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 22, 2020, 12:32:28 AM: Quote
I actually feel... calm. Surrounded by a gentle, restful peace. Normally, I'd be in overdrive and trying to get everything done all at once. But not now. It's as if in some emotional logic sort of way... I'm feeling the reverse of the process of grieving and letting go I experienced these years after Mike passing.

This was just beautiful to read, Amber! You know, you've been in overdrive for SO LONG. After Mike died you plunged forward almost immediately and had so much unearthing, planning, searching, purchasing, planning more, hosting, coping, carving out your new life on the mountain. Maybe I'm wrong but I barely recall you stopping to take a breath.

Maybe one of the gifts from B is he's holding space for you to just BREATHE, and be Amber. Your wonderful happy woman self.

I'm sure you'll pull yourself out of the cotton wool enough to oh, dunno, clean a toilet or something. My guess is B wouldn't care if your house looks lived in, comfy but not pristine...like a home.

Both of you have earned that week and I bet you're going to love it. One suggestion (can't resist of course) -- tryyyyyy not to overthink or pretzel your brain into too much "emotional planning." It's safe to just enjoy, stay in the present moments with yourself and with him.

So tickled for you, girl.

Big happy hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 22, 2020, 11:24:51 AM: So, lots of daydreaming...

but I'm trying really hard not to set expectations about anything - not even thinking about food yet. It will be more fun to decide those things together. Still, I think, absorbing the feeling that it's really happening and the time is finally here. After the months & months of second-guessing myself - Hol questioning HIS intentions and motivations and honesty - and the hours & hours of late night conversations about this, that & all the other things in our lives.

Last night he was asking if I had a certain kind of shop tool. So he said he'd bring his... then we'd have one. Very next message was: you don't mind me using "we" do you?

LOLOLOLOLOLOL. He assumes nothing; checks to make sure I don't have an issue about something. It's so different & refreshing to me. I'm not used to that.

Add to that, the kids moving to the Hut... and the shift in our dynamic around here... and there's a lot to get used to that's going to be "new". Not all of it will be easy; or comfortable... but I'm pretty sure we'll figure it out. And that's PLENTY to take on all at one time, ya know? As far as I'm concerned anyway. And it leaves plenty of time to just live days at a time, doing the normal stuff... thinking of fun stuff to do... of which there is again PLENTY since both of us are easily entertained and seldom bored - even on those days when nothing much is getting done.

That ability to "just be" does not compute to the younger set. They're into self-improvement, setting goals & achievements, conquering or changing the world. I had my shot at that back in the 70s; Buck too. Differently, of course. I got all caught up in Ralph Nader's environmental movement - and we did clean up a lot of trash dumps. Which is why I'm so offended about Steve's drop something where ever he is... mentality... and keep on going. I can't stand that mentality; it's the height of hypocrisy for someone who claims to be in touch with nature. It's the opposite of stewardship and it's a hard rule of mine. He will learn and abide by it - or incur my wrath. One doesn't just leave a trail of ugliness through nature... :shakes head: I won't have it here. There are no justifiable excuses.

There's still a lot of "conditional magical thinking" going on there, with Hol. But ya know - it's her problem to deal with. I can color inside the lines... LOL. And I have a feeling that there is going to be some "example setting" around here after Buck finalizes his move. Something to work toward. We've kind of reinvented "commitment" - and written our own definitions to include a huge amount of personal space & freedom. But still keeping that strong "together" element. I think that's going to be challenging at times, but I also think it's going to work OK, because of who we are. He has a lot of family; kids he's raised and cousins. He isn't capable of just walking away from them; just not his nature - which is the dependable wise father figure. He already knows I'm seeing him having some really good influence around here and accepts that role without thinking much about it. It's what he does.

So... I really am just sitting here watching it rain half smiling to myself, not worrying about a damn thing, and thoroughly letting my mind just drift...

Garden tools for more hands to work up the garden soil are here. More herb plants too. I got 3 lavender grossos - which grow into mounds about 6-8 ft across. Medicinal yarrow; more garden sage (which is antibacterial; antiseptic used in the WW when the nurses ran out of penicillin). So, LOTS to plant this year again. More dirt to relocate... and I'll probably need to order some more, too. But the weather needs to warm up and be sunnier... I'm probably a month to six weeks behind because it's just been too cold.

Fortunately Hol's solar system is charging even in this overcast; they're looking into adding more battery storage.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 22, 2020, 12:39:02 PM: That's an exciting update, Amber.

Plans for the garden. Plans for adding more batteries, bc solar panels doing such a great job. Plans for Hol being in Hut very soon. Plans for handling her anxiety.

Most impressive is your serenity around so many moving parts and people.

Good choice; )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 22, 2020, 04:50:45 PM: Serenity? Maybe it is - but it wasn't intentional. Just what I'm feeling these days. More peaceful.

Maybe discernment helped; I'm seeing more clearly what other people own (or should be) and isn't mine. Conflicts are bound to crop up from time to time. For the most part - Hol and I are able to sort those non-aggressively. Not entirely sure all that caused this last batch to be so intense... but part of it, was confusion on my part - misunderstanding what was/wasn't personal to me - and being encouraged to "do something" about what is none of my business. It wasn't well-received when I clearly stated that had to be hard boundary for me... but then, they can like or lump it. :shrug:

Holly doesn't need to be parented to feel cared about and secure. Not at 42. LOL. I was more successful at parenting than that! LOL.

Finding this connection with Buck has helped too. I have a partner in crime again... and his viewpoints are usually helpful to me, sorting out the messy stuff... not gospel from on high, mind you... but gives me a few different ways to think about things - just like you amazons do. Coming at things as we tend to do, from our own experiences and views, is incredibly important when I'm thinking through knotty, murky situations. Even if it seems to not apply (when I look harder - I do see how it could, often times).

Buck is just happy to be around. The turn around I've seen in him, from being totally withdrawn and not wanting to burden people with what he was going through... to playfully engaging with our mutual forum friends and being pure joy coming in to my space... it's like we both are able to awaken life in each other again. Kinda cool... and different, in my experience, for sure.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 22, 2020, 08:01:14 PM: Awww... that sounds so promising for you and B, ((Amber.))

I think it's time for you to play.

And dance.

::nodding::.

Good for you setting a hard boundary. How did that feel? Was the situation new, or was it an issue you've faced before?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 23, 2020, 10:40:49 AM: Friend John was pleading with me to step in and interfere with Hol's relationship. That was a hard no. I had told him that before, but for some reason - probably some of his own trauma-related issues - he's been in some emotional-mental crisis this week. Up till now, he's been pretty steady and stable. I became aware of some triangulations he's attempted between Hol & me before too. Neither one of us women are letting him get away with that... and it must be frustrating.

With the states - most of them - opening back up again, me thinks it's just about time to write "The End" on this chapter of his "adventure" and journey... and move on to a change of scenery. This time, it's Hol's job - she just wanted to know that I was backing her up. All the whys & wherefores of why he's here in the first place gravitate around Hol and it would take forever to go through that story. Suffice it to say, there is a little bit "white knight" syndrome - and he perceived that Hol needed some help (she doesn't) and that he could be helpful here - which he has on some projects with me. But now we've knocked a bunch of those off the list... the planting is all me, and I don't want help with that. Unless it's Hol, learning the subtleties. Meanwhile, he's added a burden to Hol and if she's spending time with John - she's not with Steve. And life in the country is very slow... we have to make our own "fun" and "entertainment" here... we don't have anywhere to go & be entertained.

Anyway, this has been part of an ongoing discussion between Hol & me since she's been here - about some limits on inviting people here. Yes, reasonable sized special occasion parties are cool; and her good friends are welcome to visit. I like most of them. I like John - when his issues aren't out of control and beyond our talents to help. But in this state - he's not pleasant; and this situation as it stands isn't doing him any good. So it's her turn to deliver the ultimatum and move him on. And he wasn't invited; she DIDN'T ask him to come. He just arrived. Wanting to "help".

We had a very very good talk last night. Yes, she does have some issues in her relationship she's working on with Steve. But she's perfectly capable of handling that all by herself. That's why she's my "second in command" around here.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 24, 2020, 08:54:43 AM: John did take off; and we're all resting and just floofing about in the predictable peace. I'm refusing to worry about him, because I gave him every gentle opportunity for him to say what was agitating him and was able to be very patient that day; strong in myself. Some days, I can't. And I take things way too personally then. But apparently, he wasn't able to verbalize it.

Downton Abbey is the perfect ambiance for this quieter space I'm in as a distraction.

Buck is quiet too... but when I gave him a countdown of the days till he's here, he came back with hours, minutes & seconds too - "but, no one's counting, right?" LOLOLOLOL. I think his patience is finally fraying too. It seems we can go days with minimal communication or interaction... and then there is a flurry of intensity of it. That works OK for me; helps me get stuff done in a weird way.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 24, 2020, 02:38:10 PM: I hope it was some internal stress sending John around the bend and not something between Hol and S John knows about, heard, saw, or HOl talked about.

In any case, it's up to Hol to figure this out and solve it for herself.

I'm glad everyone's enjoying some relief. J needed to go before B arrives anyway.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 24, 2020, 02:46:00 PM: Amber, I'm super glad you are very clear that it's YOUR decision who comes to the mountain, not Hol's. Sorry about that but that's the deal and she can take it or leave it to live there.

J sounds like the second emotionally unbalanced young man who's coasted into your space on Hol's coattails, and she doesn't seem healthy enough right now to choose the healthier friends over the exciting ones. Or the colorfully-toxic or interestingly-damaged ones. I can so relate to that...when I was younger I found NON-damaged people boring.

Not no more!

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 24, 2020, 02:51:09 PM: Amber:

Will Hol have to run her guest lists by you when she's in the Holly Hut?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 24, 2020, 09:14:05 PM: Delicate topic Lighter. She will, probably do so - even when they're temporary guests just so I'm not surprised. The John situation wasn't one she invited or requested. And since she's taking the lead - and he is HER friend - it's her job to clarify. As far as I know, she's still not heard from him. So he's off doing his thing elsewhere for the time being. Hopefully, sorting his head out.

I worked on my herb garden today.... all by myself... doing my "thing"... sigh... I'm tired, a little sore, but it feels so good. I have boulders that will provide wind and temp protection for my prize lavender grossos. I wanted to play with rocks too... but stayed on task instead. The dirt's better than I thought it would be. I have pleurisy root and centaury plant coming up from seed too now... so the medicinals appear to like it here.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 25, 2020, 09:11:21 AM: OK, she had some communication with John and shared it.

He is moving forward or onward - but does have to drop off some of Hol's house stuff and pick up the rest of his next weekend. She plans to write him a long letter about her feelings and make it clear how his episodes impact other people - and how when he NOT having an episode that he's very welcome to crash here or work on his van... that he didn't exactly burn his bridges here. But explain that neither she or I are qualified to help him through those more difficult times.

He's not exactly someone who's at-risk; he is pretty skilled in a lot of areas and can pick up work quickly; smart; but his FOO trauma keeps coming up front & center for him - and a series of issues around it too - and I've even given him the nuts & bolts of the process (the toolkit) of my T hoping it would encourage him to seek out more for himself. But even during that conversation - he expressed his confusion and disbelief that he HAD a self to be able to sort out what was him - and what his experiences were. That's not something I can tackle or help with. The other thing I've noticed - and it's true for both him & Hol - is that they misunderstand the definitions/descriptions of some emotional/psych characteristics. Especially terms that have hit the the popular parlance.

So, I was the assertive and pedantic professor doing the emotional heavy-lifting of trying to teach in this situation, while making it abundantly clear that a) I didn't know what trauma he'd been through and b) mine was mine; it doesn't translate well to someone else's - despite the ability to see similarities in effect & affect. Hol is a decent assistant - but still too often gets engaged on a personal level. But I think she was the first to realize that J was headed in a direction beyond just people comparing notes and supporting each other through to the other side.

Only thing about his plan that worries me - and Hol will address this - is his plans to volunteer for crisis/disaster response. I very much sense that he is seeking to resolve his internal crisis by addressing external ones - or other people's - real or imagined. We know it's avoidance and resistance - but haven't been able to communicate that despite expressing it. You can lead a horse to water...

----------

Planting in my rocks yesterday was good for me. I'm still not ready to go back to the big garden yet - but I HAVE to get moving because my seedlings are coming on to transplant size. I bought enough tools for both Hol & Steve to help... since they'll be fed from the garden, they need to help it be successful. I wear out pretty quickly in the sun - it's not even the heat so much, just the effects of the sun. Yesterday was heavy overcast (like today), cool - and it even sprinkled while I was working.

So I'm going into the kitchen today to cook. It's back at it tomorrow.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 25, 2020, 09:44:29 AM: (((Amber)))

Do you feel able to release John entirely to his own learning path, whatever it is?

I remember how wrapped up you became in the previous mentally-ill friend of Hol's who became your housemate and destroyed your serenity before he was hospitalized. John is a different person from that one, did I follow that right?

When you refer to Hol as your "assistant" (in being a therapist to John), what does that signal about your self image or role with these young people in your orbit?

Do you have any feeling of recognition about John's self-image role as rescuer?

You may worry about them; I'm worrying about YOU.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 25, 2020, 03:16:09 PM: Two different people, Hops.

I meant that situationally, Hol backs me up. MOST of the time, it wasn't required during John's stay. Like I said, he's generally pleasant, stable & steadily helpful. I wasn't always engaged in their interactions, either - not feeling that I'm essential or always needed for them to sort either their friendship issues or personal issues out.

Nope, I don't feel obligated to rescue anyone. That's why over the course of the year taking issue with her boyfriend - I decided to step out completely and just have my feelings and opinions about it and keep it to myself - but not even discuss it, unless she asks for input. I really do think she is independently capable of even seeing how she can sometimes self-sabotage - because of her own "rescuer" syndrome. It wouldn't be something new if she learns the hard way. I've been decidedly ineffective at showing her another way. And that's not all my fault.

No worries Hops. She invited HGuest #1 - and even after he seemed to improve - it turned out she decided to distance herself from him, for personal reasons. HGuest #2 invited himself - and while she was interested in "catching up" after 20 years it turned out to be something other than she expected too. I haven't exactly busted her chops over this - that's counterproductive to solutions. I just expressed my discomfort to her - and let her make up her own mind.

She lives here. Soon to have her own household here. I'm fully aware she's a more social person than I am - and has grown up mostly past living the "wild & crazy life". She has some local, long-time friends. And many of her friends will turn out to be overnight or weekend guests since they're not exactly local. My rule is against someone setting up housekeeping here. End of restriction. She needs to live her own style of life. She knows who I DON'T like; as well as those I've found interesting on my own accord... and since they range in ages, some are more my age. Her late boss for one. Given the extra privacy that we'll soon have I'm pretty sure it'll work out - she doesn't want me to be uncomfortable or to feel like she's added to my responsibilities or restricted my use of the farm as a property owner... or her mom.

So, since I've offloaded being responsible for those "under my roof"... somewhat - there's still compassion for people's struggles if I like them - I think that's also contributed to my current "peace & contentment". And even the boyfriend is starting to relax and realize I'm not going to BBQ him and serve him for dinner... LOL. He's starting to settle in more and open up. That'll contribute to going on forward, easier. Even if it doesn't work out for them.

She let me know he was terrified of me (explaining the above). I think he's never really known women like us. Independent and strong - and still capable of all the traditional roles - without being pushovers. Hol & I have a lot in common - but the differences that do exist are strong, too. I think it's helped him relax, that we're not shy about talking about that kind of thing around him.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 25, 2020, 10:28:22 PM: Amber:

If S is afraid of you.... why oh why is he leaving your tools in the woods?

I also want to know, you don't have to tell me, why he decided it was a good idea to order livestock through the mail. Were you consulted? IS there housing and a plan to care and feed livestock?

I guess I don't understand whether or not a plan for big projects has been hammered out yet.

I don't think you should control who Hol brings into her home, BTW. The rules of engagement, if they're in place, should cut down on upset and surprises.

The mama in me wants to restrict Hol's guests to those who support her sobriety journey, but that's not realistic. Hol has to do that on her own, just as she has to deal with the consequences of future mistakes, should they happen.

Have you and Hol talked about consequences should Hol fall off the wagon with another DUI?

Not my business. Just wondering, bc the mama in me does.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 26, 2020, 12:21:39 AM: That sounds like a fair hut-life boundary to me, Amber.
Sure, visit H but no "setting up housekeeping."
And she is an adult, and nobody would want to live where they can't have friends visit.

That's good, so glad you've set that reasonable boundary.
Hope it holds and hope her friends turn out to me mostly adults too!

Good luck with all of it. It must be a huuuuuge relief that they're moving out of your house soon.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 26, 2020, 09:07:13 AM: Yes it's a relief. We've done some imagining how it will be - whether we'll still hang out in the studio together, front porch sit... whether I'll visit down at the hut, etc. Just feeling out individual and joint expectations and daydreams. S actually helps with her controlling her drinking. Until he triggers her anger, that is. LOL. Same things that bother me, DO bother her - but she's trying hard not to admit that. LOLOL.

S is an enigma to me. I can't for the life of me suss him out - and the only things that are even close to coherent are pretty negative. But for now, it's pure bias on my part. It's not possible to discuss any of that with him. As to the birds - yes, we already have mature geese; lost some chickens; the fence went up to try to contain them (mostly successful) and we've added guinea keets now. He mostly cares for them and has been improving their shelter. Hol hopes to have her own pond - and then the birds will move. I will kinda miss seeing the geese playing on the pond.

We've gotten as far as agreeing on a process for planning, approving, etc various projects... and I will also have a land lease agreement in place that will protect both of us - and spell out the basic rules. It helps actually, that Steve is privacy-minded pretty much like me and is already comfortable with the lack of external "entertainment" out in the boonies. He is still abnormally quiet - but he DOES seem comfortable enough talking to me one on one casually. And after the tool-upset... he's learning.

Part of that issue - Hol grew up on the first homestead; she KNOWS how many rules were in place to insure that we preserved tools, didn't make extra work, and took care of our investments - whether stuff we bought or grew or built. S grew up in Chicago - and simply doesn't have those habits yet. We didn't have a lot of money, so it was IMPORTANT to take care of tools, because you may have to do without if you didn't have the money - or availability - to get more. Putting things back was critical when more than one person was working - so time wasn't wasted looking for things.

S never learned things like that before. So, while my mind is boggled that someone who claims an affinity for stewardship... feels it's fine to litter, and not take care of tools which let you care for your plantings and animals... it's less the "not caring" variety than just sheer ignorance of the requirements of this lifestyle.

I'm scary to him, because I can and DO, express anger in it's pure form - emotionally & verbally. I'm very seldom physically angry... but when I am it's contained inside my skin with no outward actions. And I s'pose that might look like a manifestation of Kali. LOLOL. The dangerous goddess. Lightning in the eyes... stormclouds on the brow... every molecule vibrating at nuclear meltdown frequency... angry. Oh, and I'm LOUD. I'm sure I was heard all the way down the hollow and maybe over the ridge.

Took me an hour to get my blood pressure back to normal the last time; it's been YEARS since I've been that angry. I even scared Hol. (Takes a LOT to scare her; she was a Baltimore bartender.)

That shovel re-appeared out in the barn last time I looked; John found the knife I keep out there.

I guess that's why Hol comes by her "force of nature" description honestly.

For all I grew up with Mennonite environments and pacifist behaviors... there is no denying the Celtic/Viking genes running loose in me too. Can & will fight, as needed. I reconciled those two opposites, for the most part but it took over 50 years. And it's still a work in progress. So, that equation looks like - "can and will, but don't like or want to".

Life doesn't give a crap what illusions I might expect from it, upon reaching the arbitrarily-declared "retirement" age... it's going to keep challenging me whether I try to create a place to hide from it or not. No matter how many bits & pieces I've already mastered. And since I don't get to choose who will be Hol's partner... I have to adjust, with as much grace as I can muster - or just be myself. LOL. Sometimes, I just gotta be me... and take the consequences.

Fortunately, this is one thing Buck already knows about me and he understands it, too.

OK - enough lollygagging! I'm wasting daylight... and now starts the countdown of to-do list before Buck arrives. (So I'm not rushing around or working sunup to sundown...)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 26, 2020, 04:07:33 PM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on May 26, 2020, 09:07:13 AM
Yes it's a relief. We've done some imagining how it will be - whether we'll still hang out in the studio together, front porch sit... whether I'll visit down at the hut, etc. Just feeling out individual and joint expectations and daydreams. S actually helps with her controlling her drinking. Until he triggers her anger, that is. LOL. Same things that bother me, DO bother her - but she's trying hard not to admit that. LOLOL.

S is an enigma to me. I can't for the life of me suss him out - and the only things that are even close to coherent are pretty negative. But for now, it's pure bias on my part. It's not possible to discuss any of that with him. As to the birds - yes, we already have mature geese; lost some chickens; the fence went up to try to contain them (mostly successful) and we've added guinea keets now. He mostly cares for them and has been improving their shelter. Hol hopes to have her own pond - and then the birds will move. I will kinda miss seeing the geese playing on the pond. That sounds so peaceful, Amber. I'd miss the too.

We've gotten as far as agreeing on a process for planning, approving, etc various projects... and I will also have a land lease agreement in place that will protect both of us - and spell out the basic rules. It helps actually, that Steve is privacy-minded pretty much like me and is already comfortable with the lack of external "entertainment" out in the boonies. He is still abnormally quiet - but he DOES seem comfortable enough talking to me one on one casually. And after the tool-upset... he's learning. Ahhh, he can learn! That's huge. Also, I'm glad you can BE with him comfortably now. I'm not able to do that with dd's bf right now and we;re going to have a chata about it tomorrow.

Part of that issue - Hol grew up on the first homestead; she KNOWS how many rules were in place to insure that we preserved tools, didn't make extra work, and took care of our investments - whether stuff we bought or grew or built. S grew up in Chicago - and simply doesn't have those habits yet. We didn't have a lot of money, so it was IMPORTANT to take care of tools, because you may have to do without if you didn't have the money - or availability - to get more. Putting things back was critical when more than one person was working - so time wasn't wasted looking for things.

S never learned things like that before. So, while my mind is boggled that someone who claims an affinity for stewardship... feels it's fine to litter, and not take care of tools which let you care for your plantings and animals... it's less the "not caring" variety than just sheer ignorance of the requirements of this lifestyle. Well, has he stopped littering and scattering tools to the wind?

I'm scary to him, because I can and DO, express anger in it's pure form - emotionally & verbally. I'm very seldom physically angry... but when I am it's contained inside my skin with no outward actions. And I s'pose that might look like a manifestation of Kali. LOLOL. The dangerous goddess. Lightning in the eyes... stormclouds on the brow... every molecule vibrating at nuclear meltdown frequency... angry. Oh, and I'm LOUD. I'm sure I was heard all the way down the hollow and maybe over the ridge. I'm glad you can express yourself, Amber. I'm having a come to Jesus chat with myself about how to handle this discussion with the bf. I think I'm scary to him... well. I know I am. I don't want things to be weird, if he's going to spend time here. I want to have an understanding, like you seem to have with S now. I'll take responsibility for not being more proactive and getting things straight up front. He can speak to me respectfully, without finger pointing and whining, and we'll iron thngs out.

Took me an hour to get my blood pressure back to normal the last time; it's been YEARS since I've been that angry. I even scared Hol. (Takes a LOT to scare her; she was a Baltimore bartender.) I didn't realize you'd had a "discussion" like that over the tools, but I'm glad you provided clarity. It had to be done. There have to be limits.

That shovel re-appeared out in the barn last time I looked; John found the knife I keep out there.

I guess that's why Hol comes by her "force of nature" description honestly. Yup.

For all I grew up with Mennonite environments and pacifist behaviors... there is no denying the Celtic/Viking genes running loose in me too. Can & will fight, as needed. I reconciled those two opposites, for the most part but it took over 50 years. And it's still a work in progress. So, that equation looks like - "can and will, but don't like or want to". I understand.

Life doesn't give a crap what illusions I might expect from it, upon reaching the arbitrarily-declared "retirement" age... it's going to keep challenging me whether I try to create a place to hide from it or not. No matter how many bits & pieces I've already mastered. And since I don't get to choose who will be Hol's partner... I have to adjust, with as much grace as I can muster - or just be myself. LOL. Sometimes, I just gotta be me... and take the consequences. Everyone takes the consequences: )

Fortunately, this is one thing Buck already knows about me and he understands it, too. I'm hoping he'll be the storm cloud to your lightening bolt... on your side, rarely aimed at each other, but capable of holding your own, both of you, if it comes to that on occasion. Couples who disagree are more likely to make it long term, bc they iron things out, rather than pretend things are OK.

OK - enough lollygagging! I'm wasting daylight... and now starts the countdown of to-do list before Buck arrives. (So I'm not rushing around or working sunup to sundown...) I just fertilized the garden, then the rain started so it's break time. Good luck getting everything the way you want it for B's arrival. And.... remember... if it's not OK... it's OK. NOthing has to be perfect. Making time to focus on him and being present is the important thing. THINGS can wait. I'm so excited for you!!! Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 26, 2020, 06:45:37 PM: Oh... I can only do so much in the sun anymore. I is pooped.

As for getting everything "just so" - as I look at what I wish I could just task some fairies with... I realize I plain old need help; intelligent help. He'll see it too, if I don't get to it. And we're at the point, that we need to walk and talk about what each of us visualizes. (The beauty of a fellow creative... for a partner.) **

The important thing on the list, is feeding him. Being an energizer bunny - the man needs to replenish calories in a serious way. He can't graze or eat small meals like we do. There is some cleaning I want to do too. Pollen season is about over here... so things outside & in will "feel better" if I get that moved away from the house or washed off. And he truly just wants to spend time WITH me, not doing things FOR me - even though there are some things like that on the list. I need to get him acquainted with the city "over the mountain" too.

That relaxing into being together - I first noticed within the first few hours he was here. He was working on my jeep... I was fixing lunch... a hearty spread to hold everyone till dinner. And it just "felt right"... I was smiling to myself as I worked in the kitchen. Then, he sat where I normally sit - me on his left - and he ate without being at all self-conscious. Told me later, that was something that usually makes him uncomfortable - but he was surprised that he wasn't.

I just truly LIKE who he is. No need to change a thing. As far as I know - and I'm not really expecting that to change.

But of course, little by little, all those little self-talk topics and insecurities are creeping in. Maybe I'm not pretty enough or slim enough... that crap. This poor guy has more bullet hole scars and surgical scars than should be humanly possible... and he was afraid I'd be squeamish about them, even AFTER I told him "chicks dig scars". He still has so much shrapnel in him, he sets off metal detectors. LOLOL. And yet he doesn't have the ego-attitude so prevalent in some former military guys. He's simple, plain-speaking, honest and kind as the day is long. And working and being busy is how he stays moving and sane.

I still have 2 weeks to go... and we're both so silly excited it's getting rediculous. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 27, 2020, 09:36:05 AM: Forgot to go into the bit I **'d.

Buck is extremely creative. He has a lot of interests and is a lot better read than I expected him to be. (He enlisted at 17.) And he's skilled with a lot of different materials and tools. He does some really nice work in leather; he makes knives too - repurposing leaf springs, etc from old vehicles. Wood, is hardly a challenge; he also works masonry & stone. There will be a forge here in the near future.

His imagination is about as wild and irrepressible as mine; backed up with a natural curiosity for new things we might not have encountered previously.

He spent some years of his youth with his grandfather on NC's Cherokee reservation. He's actually 50% Catawba, which was a tribe I didn't know much about - but it's one of the larger east coast tribes. And he spent some time with the Sioux; it was a buffalo hunt IIRC. Rites of passage and all that tradition - which I am familiar with. I learned a lot of Ohio/Indiana Indian history in grade school and in high school got even more involved with that interest; read a lot of contemporary things about that time. I refreshed that again, moving here - because there was a lot of intermingling of tribes in this part of the mountains in colonial times.

I'm pretty sure the Portuguese DNA is due to a pirate in the family tree. :D

And then, there's the "Black Irish" - which he's informed me was a polite euphemism for Romany. Celtic version. All of which is prevalent in my make up, as well - on my Dad's side, despite the name itself being Norweigan. or Viking, as I like to think of it. LOL. Dad's mom was a Scot, so more opportunity for those Vikings to connect.

And yeah, I know I'm babbling over like a teenager.... LOLOLOL. It's a luxury I can indulge in, given we've already tackled a lot of the practical stuff already.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 27, 2020, 12:56:13 PM: Babble away, Amber. It put a big on my face today; )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on May 27, 2020, 01:01:04 PM: Makes me happy to hear your happiness, Amber!
Anticipation is delicious and of course it'll be different than
the fantasies, better in unexpected ways and odd in moments too.
That's all right, all good. It'll just be whatever it is and you both are ready,
it seems to me. Open and grateful and warm in your hearts. Oh HOORAY.

I love the DNA game, and may have said this already. But I was so excited
to hear a family rumor when I was young that my gfather on one side was
buried in a Cherokee cemetery -- he had great cheekbones, and I have, well,
cheekbones. I entertained myself for ages with my perhaps-part-Native fantasies,
so romantic.

Then I took an intensive course in college called "Images of the Native American in
Western Literature" which just showed how much romanticizing or "savaging" views
were overlayed on complex, infinitely varied tribes. Got involved in AIM to the
point of subscribing to its newspaper and was utterly wrenched when it all sank in.

I'm as morally revolted on what our country has done to them forever as I am about the suffering children still in cages or separated from their parents at our border.

But DNA was still interesting. I am the whitest white woman anybody's ever heard of. All U.K. except for 3% Norwegian. So much for exotic cheekbones.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 27, 2020, 03:24:37 PM: I got as far as reading Vine DeLoria's book, and reading about AIM. Leonard Peltier. When my Dad was doing the geneology, he did find a Cherokee connection no one had known about previously. Still don't consider it a strong influence; or myself, a member of a tribe -- more a romantic idealistic connection.

But when you consider my first shoes were fur-lined moccasins from a lake reservation in N. Minnesota - and I spent time around there - there are mental associations for me, with their spirituality & way of life. I took to the deep woods like a little Indian, in fact. LOL... scared the girl scout leaders half to death, but I already knew more about surviving in the woods - and not getting lost - than they did by the time I was 12. My grandpa (the German one) had picked up a lot of Indian lore... along with Emerson & Thoreau... and of course, he and Gramma procured those moccasins on one of their trips to Minnesota. Took me back, WAY up north, after the Twiggy days... where we fished & walked the woods together. And he helped me start healing.

I've spent time at 4 Corners and in those reservations; and also have been to the Redbud. Hiked Chaco Canyon and cliimbed Mesa Verde's cliff face (overcoming my fear - which was HUGE; still is).

So, I'm your basic American mutt. The Amish/mennonite lifestyle was mostly what I learned. On that side, I'm only the 4th gen American. The woodscraft just seemed to be there - along with an affinity for horses & natural riding ability. The stuff from my Dad's side (who've like been here longer, some of them) probably contributes to how much I moved around - seeking - and my sense of accepting adventure. And some odd, undeveloped extra-sensory garbage that floats in/out of my life on it's own timetable. I sometimes "see"; more often just "know".

Buck and I hadn't been together 12 hrs. when I had that strong sense of recognizing him; along with a heavy duty deja vu; and while I don't know know all his "old guy stories" yet... on that deep connection level, I know him. We just haven't started that part of our relationship yet, to know how accurate it is. But so far, I've anticipated him correctly.

I keep reminding myself - this is the visit where we finally decide yes/no - what we're doing 3 months from now. And to keep my feet on the ground and my nose off the pebbles, as Lighter says. And to not let my giddyness and fantasies get away from me - or take me somewhere I don't really want to go. So, TRYING to stay grounded. Hol agreed to give us plenty of alone time - much depends on where they are finishing up the hut as to whether they'll sleep there or not. There IS a large comfy tent located down in the field in front of the hut.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on May 27, 2020, 10:38:06 PM: Amber:

Hol and S can sleep in the hut even if there's no electric or water hooked up. I'm pretty sure it's dried in. It's dried in, right? Better than a tent, if they don't want to sleep in an actual tent. They can have a little fire in the fireplace while sort'a rough'in it OR sleep at S's farm. SO many choices, yay.

I'd nail down the fact they're aren't going to BE in your house, even if they aren't thrilled with the comforts the Hut can provide when B arrives.

This is like a honeymoon.

It's a JELLYMOON! There;s no room for guests inside the Jellymoon abode, IMO.
None. At all. Nada. Nicht. Just.... nuthin available.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on May 28, 2020, 11:24:34 AM: Well Lighter - they LIKE camping - so the tent IS an option for them. But they will need to shower, etc & eat.

The REALITY is that they are going to be living on the property going forward. So we all have to get to know each other and adjust to another person in the mix as far as group dynamics. And B has daughters too who may visit at some point - oldest is Hol's age. B needs to see for himself the situation too.

I have my master suite at one end of the house; H&S are in the bedroom upstairs over the kitchen/dining. Other end of the house. When they're inside - they hang out there except for meals. They don't even sit in the living room - they watch tv upstairs. Doors close; volume of tv or music provides another layer of privacy.

Hol spends a fair amount of time in the studio sewing on projects. S in his mushroom "lab" making tinctures -- and there are 150 acres of space here; they're both out in it quite a bit - either working or hiking. Once they get moved into the hut - we will need to communicate that we are headed their way... so we don't surprise them... LOL. It will go both ways. By road, the hut is about a mile+ away. But I can see the roof off the back deck -- down at the bottom of the cliff, through the trees. The kids have started to cut a trail, directly up the cliff... but haven't done any more on that yet. Hol says she can climb it in about 5 minutes. And there may be times that's a good thing.

It's been hard for both of them, living in my house. Easier for Hol, of course. I have "given way" to allow them to function together without also including me... as much as I felt like it and was able. I'm sure consideration for a few days will be given. Yeah, there were some weird things at weird times that boggled my mind... like at 4:30 am. And when they worked - they'd often get in in the wee hours too. Just a reality of the commute/working hours - like if Hol had to be on set for a night shoot. We HAVE made this work - not perfectly, all the time - just well enough that the resentment trap has been avoided.

She is already working on the logistics to move again. Things are THAT close to being finished down there. So the 11th/12th will be cutting it really close to the possibility they could camp in the hut... we just don't know yet. OBVIOUSLY, it's what they WANT to do too. We've been working toward this since October. As well as all the other things around here. It's the perfect compromise - of her being here - but we don't have to live with each other. LOL.

And it's HERS. That makes a huge impact too.

B, nor I, will be too terribly shy about shooing them away. LOL. But etiquette and the long term situation does require some interaction - so as to avoid misunderstandings. He has a strong parent mindset... and that will go a long way toward easing some of the awkwardness and change. And as I've said - he's damn good with boundaries. I'm not fussing over this; it'll work out fine.

I'm kinda moving into another mental mode right now. It's probably adjustment to this becoming REAL. And not just "cyber". But, I'm not entirely sure yet. Still doing a lot of just sitting with feelings... talking back & forth about some details... deciding what has/doesn't have to be worked on. Just absorbing. But I've been doing that awhile now... and it might be time to do something else soon.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 02, 2020, 07:15:30 AM: Raining and cool here this morning. Got the potatos in finally, yesterday. I'm going to have punt on the garden - and go back to the plow. I can change the blade from turning spades to chisel plow... and perhaps that'll speed up the process of pulling the sod & rocks. Even with the broadfork, I'm only able to dig a couple feet at one time before I need a shade & water break.

Seedlings just aren't looking that strong. Especially the broccoli; time to order grow lights I guess. Sigh. I knew it was going to be a challenge this year. They're in good starting soil; 4 in deep pots; they SHOULD be developing stronger stems by now (2 mos + since germination). They've even had fish fertilizer.

9 more days till Buck arrives. He's recruited a buddy to camp at his place to watch over his D for the duration of the trip. Reason being - the violence in Charleston, is starting to spill out into the surrounding counties. Speaking of D - she's registered now for college and tomorrow goes through a bit of an online orientation for August. So that's still on schedule, too.

With the rain, my work shifts indoors again. Time to clean house more thoroughly, figure out menus, and do the shopping. Might go into town Friday; my GF Deb says TGIF has outdoor seating, but I dunno how I'm going to eat with a mask (required there). Looks like rain most of the week.

I wish my magic 8 ball was working; I keep trying to see what things are going to look like in a few years -- and then I see the most likely probabilities -- and wish i hadn't asked. :(
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 02, 2020, 01:03:04 PM: Nine days! But who's counting???
I am so happy for you Amber.

And this made me feel a lot better about how things
might feel for you going forward:
By road, the hut is about a mile+ away.

For some reason I'd pictured the hut as uphill and not that
far from your own home. Hmmm. Sounds as though privacy
and independence will be comfortable and not hard to maintain
for all of you. I like the idea of H and S both engaged in craft industry.
Hope it takes off for them.

As to B's visit, my guess is the man will be doing a Real Move
your way not long after the visit. At least I hope it goes that way!

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 02, 2020, 02:24:36 PM: Well, he was invited some years ago now, Hops. And once he saw how I was situated here... it became the "plan". This was even before sparks flew. Apparently, I chose "wisely" in this location. LOLOL.

Part of that, was I just plain LIKED him, from what I saw. Nothing to date has changed that. Not even the extensive military background - which DOES merit more discussion between us. Part of it was his "never give up" - even in the face of his injuries. And part of that, was my realization that despite my ability to LEARN how to do things - there are simply things that come naturally for a guy who's spent his life working with machinery and using his hands. And he likes to stay busy - that can be arranged. And he's still - even with his difficulties - physically way stronger than I am. It comes in handy around here.

Funny story. On his trip here last year, I took him on a ride to the "back 40" to show him how much land there was; the site of the Holly Hut (he's followed the progress in pics). At one point, there was a tree - not a big one - across the road. He hopped out to move it... and promptly fell on his ass. This old lady went to give him a hand up and grab the other end of the tree... and then it was my turn. LOLOL. It was one of those moments that just felt apropos. Seemed to indicate: We'll stumble along together, figuring out our limits and working together to figure things out. Yes, the tree got moved finally.

Mission: Aegean Stable Clean Up has begun today.

Pollen - is everywhere outside. But the trees are mostly done creating it now, so it's time to wash down the porch stuff. Windows are filthy. Furniture has a layer of pollen & grime. Last step will be to haul the hose up here with my special "washing wand" that will remove all the dog/cat hair, mulched wood chips - thanks Knuckles - etc from the cracks between the wall boards. (Decks need a SERIOUS overhaul in the next year or two; safety issues as well as basic aesthetics/functionality. Some day - it'll be screened in.

Inside isn't so bad; I've piecemealed a lot of the work, so it's not everything all at one time.

No contractors yet this week; no floor/bathroom tile till later in the week... so the kids'll have to rough it. But I DO want them to spend time w/Buck too. Holly is being over-protective of me (it's natural; not overbearing) and I think he can put her at ease. We're all going to be here, going forward, ya know?

The Hut location was important to both of us; me because I'm concerned about the overall development of the property. Her, because she DIDN'T want to be able see my house - LOL. They're down almost to the bottom field, all the glass faces the western ridge - which is the back access into the property via a power company gate. But she is literally 5 mins away.

And I'm starting to think too much again. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 02, 2020, 03:03:44 PM: Remind me, Amber. Did H and B meet during his last visit?

Of course you want everyone to spend time together and get along. That goes without saying, but you might have to assert boundaries around H's protectiveness and how she expresses it, IME. Proactive is better than reactive in this situation, IME.

I loved the tree/falling on your arses story. Having a sense of humor goes a looooong long way, IME.

I reminded Hops.... I'm reminding you.

Go forward with a happy curious heart. Don't worry about what comes up, bc you WILL HANDLE IT. Whatever it is.

You can always change your mind. You can always do something different if things aren't working out the way you hoped they would.

You aren't trapped in any decision once you've made it. Switching directions is part of life.

Lighter

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 02, 2020, 06:11:27 PM: Yep, 90% of how the vibes will go and what your loved ones will think of each other and how/whether/when they'll form their own connections or not is totally out of your control, ((((Amber)))). So you might as well release it to the universe before it even gets started.

ALL WILL BE WELL. Observe AND release.

And it was nice to re-read my favorite of Lighter's Awesome Advice. One May Change One's Mind At Any Point. Opens things right up and reduces anxiety.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 03, 2020, 10:14:09 AM: Well - I'm not worried about Hol. She may be a tad surprised at seeing a side of me, she's not really known about before when Buck is around... LOL... but she's pretty solid MOST of the time. We both have some strange moods drop down on us - and tend to gravitate to each other to sort them out or pass the time till they pass. But she's wholly unfamiliar with military culture - and has some attitudes about it, that aren't well-informed. So Buck will eventually open up to her about some of that. She has the protectiveness gene, already. Yes, there was conversation between the three of us - and just the two and them - on the last visit Lighter. In fact, Buck passed on some useful wisdom to her then... which I'm sure is going to come up again, now that she's pondered it a good bit.

A lot of his demeanor is like my Ex#2 - who was a good teacher for her about life things. Not quite a father, 'coz he had his own issues with that role; but he did step up on occasion. She revered him for a long time, before she knew the inner workings of my relationship with him.

It will be, what it will be - and of course, I'm a master peacemaker (so far, anyway)... with the only exceptions being when something rattles me beyond comfort.

Pretty sure there isn't going to be any need to fuss over changing my mind. The more I know, the more comfortable I get - and not passive, mind you. B seems to make it OK and even be a catalyst for - helping me feel comfortable being REALLY ME. Not just fulfilling a role; not just managing situations; not just being what people expect of me. So much so, I've already begun to play with it... see what it's like... and enjoy it. It's like he enables me to fully step into my life.... but I couldn't say that he DOES or SAYS anything to make that so. He just has an acceptance that invites me to that party.

He told me this week, he absolutely adores an independent strong woman. That was a counter to my previous experiences with being found "difficult" by other men. And he's not looking for someone to take care of him; he's got that taken care of. He doesn't need someone 24/7 within arm's reach to feel secure or not "lonely". He's not possessive and seems to have a handle on jealousy, too. So he's secure in himself. Without being dominating or controlling. And damn, he's a lot of fun... even in just little ways at a distance right now, he can make me laugh out loud - at myself, at life, at irony. I can't remember the last time I giggled like this.

Something woke up in him, too - when his scars didn't phase me. And he didn't scare me. We've already talked through the "what ifs" on his medical stuff; even been in close contact his last couple surgeries and the complexities of his situation getting treatment. And what the future of that looks like. And he knows I'd rather focus on the living we can do, versus the probability of the future loss. That's one of the things Hol worried about. But I learned lifetimes of stuff about myself in the process of going through all that with Mike. So, I'm not scared of that either.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 03, 2020, 11:11:49 AM: Amber:

Hol and B have already met and talked one on one. That's great!

I bet things settle down at once. If they don't, you'll handle it.

All will be well, no matter what.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 03, 2020, 01:47:36 PM: Quote
He just has an acceptance that invites me to that party.

No wonder you love B.

There's no bigger gift.

Oh my days, land sakes, and other inexplicable geriatric exclamations...

Happy!

Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 08, 2020, 09:15:47 AM: I think I'm a legitimate weirdo now. I got into a really unexpected headspace this past week. Most of the projects around here are at a good stopping point. Hut's still not done; contractors weren't here at all last week. So, there hasn't been a LOT, I've had to do to prepare for this visit. I just really wasn't feeling a thing about B's visit this week. And for the life of me, I couldn't figure out why - I was just not having any feelings about it one way or another.

Then, I had a weird dream about the trauma timeframe - involving a fire that needed put out - and of course the news has just been full of heartwarming stories -- not. A bit of anxiety, I guess.

Hol & I had a decent talk regarding same. And I spent some time journalling the thoughts... that weren't even verbal yet, so don't exactly manifest for me - as "feelings" until they do have words. But pencil & paper seems to open that door... So what came up, that got me to cool my jets on happy anticipation of this visit, was the spector of past relationships -- where I lost a certain amount of freedom; autonomy; due to being IN the relationship. The essence of that co-dependence cycle, in other words. Which, after some close examination, may have been a pattern-expectation I imposed on myself from the get-go and then set up the expectation in those partners... and that fueled the later resentment.

I was re-examining that idea I've had that just on this side of the line before co-dependence, being in a relationship involves that give & take, taking turns, sharing, and a bit of change & compromise from both partners. I'm no longer willing to sacrifice my own freedom & autonomy for love or anything else relationships have to offer. Surprise! LOL. B's been single and on his own for a lot longer than I have. It's been 5 years now for me. We will have that conversation. But face to face. I don't think it's an issue - but details are always helpful.

Hol is definitely learning. She suggested that from the start I pay attention to and determine where my boundaries are on that issue. As well as what I may require from B, in that area too. Sort of the practical nuts & bolts of the relationship - a game plan, or agreement open to negotiation/revision - that we haven't really discussed per se. There have been signals given, for sure. It's easy to misread those in cyber communication.

More than that, I kinda have to watch for my reflex - to make myself "needed". I can sacrifice myself on the altar of making myself so indispensible that I end up throwing myself under the bus. When B suggested we take ballroom dance lessons, I warned him - first thing I'll have to do is overcome my tendency to lead - LOL. Fortunately, boundaries are something he is very clear about and gently reminds me, too. I do think, I'm mostly responsible for creating those kinds of relationship patterns. And it's too tempting for partners to not take advantage of that - or at least the ones in my scrapbook collection. From all I know, so far, Buck just doesn't have that tendency.

I've been super-clear with myself about not having any expectations AT ALL from the chemistry, the way we work together, or whatever. I just want to be paying attention - for both of our sakes - to what the experience of actually being together feels like. Which might also be a reason for my whole mental/emotional shutdown - it's like locking up my imagination so it can't cause problems. LOL. Impertinent child that it is. Energetic, too.

So, that's lifted a little. Letting in a little more excitement and fun. Feeling more worthy about the wish I have, that he "come correct" and I get myself put together more coherently, and just accept that THIS IS DIFFERENT than what I've experienced in the past; he is different; I am different. It's something NEW and I have to just surf this too. I can trust myself and my discernment & judgement of my own feelings. It's kinda telling that I usually feel I can trust him more than myself, you know?

I notice, too -- that I'm not even making any menu choices ahead of time. Just waiting for him to be here to participate in those decisions. This so unlike my normal routine - it's actually jarring. Just who the hell IS this Amber???? LOLOL... the one thing that hasn't gone away is the excruciating self-consciousness of being old; how I look; or my tendency to just jump off cliffs........ wheeeeeeeeeee......

He shortened his beard again. And now looks a lot like Sean Connery to me... since I feel, now, like I'm jumping into very deep water... he'd better teach me to dive properly. LOLOL.

Hol is OK with mom just "checking out" over this visit, since we had our talk about things. I think she understands how huge this is for me. And she knows to check in with me, periodically, to see if I'm OK. But for the most part she has her own stuff going on and will be giving us a LOT of space. She'd better - she's the one who was pushing me to explore something like this, in the first place.

All her tile & flooring is here; the odd finishing touches like wall sconces and ceiling fans are here. She has all the bathroom fixtures and appliances... so we're getting worried about where the contractors are. She's already made curtains (for now, functional - not the final design choice) for all her big windows. Impatient doesn't even come close to describing how much she wants to be able to move out from here - and move in there.

Baking cookies for Buck today, before it gets too warm again. I'm waiting on electrician to take care of some little things around here - so B doesn't feel like he has to (which he's not likely to thank me for; Mr. Busy-Bee) - and I have some regular housework stuff to do downstairs today. I need to stay busy before I go drifting off into daydream land again.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 08, 2020, 10:24:31 AM: (((((Amber)))))

my whole mental/emotional shutdown - it's like locking up my imagination so it can't cause problems. (http://my whole mental/emotional shutdown - it's like locking up my imagination so it can't cause problems.)

I think the shutdown is truly protective. Deep within, your wise mind recognizes that you are over-thinking all of this to the point of freezing paralysis OR anxiety overload, or both. You have analysed this LDR microscopically and run infinite experiments: conditions good, but what if this, and if that that, to a huge degree.

You are intensely analysing/fantasizing/projecting what living with Buck might/will/could/might/perhaps would be like, and....

It hasn't happened yet. You're like a reverse Outlander, living in future time.

I'm cheering you on to do all you can (or not do) to let the future control and speculation go and actually tryyyyyyyyy to be present to what IS. What unfolds. What does not unfold. What goes smoothly. What doesn't. Expect all of that WHAT IS to turn out to be what it turns out to be, and release the rest. Open your hands in moments of quiet, turn palms up, and literally release the frantic pondering. It doesn't give you control like farm projects can, that's an illusion. It just gives you fantasy. This is a human project. Those need some fantasy and some planning, but mostly presence to what is real and what actually is happening. There'll be time for post-mortems and reflections. But too much PRE-analysis, or fantasy-based scenario-building, can backfire. (I know because I majored in it.)

What I know for sure is that however it goes, you will be able to live with it and be grateful you took the risk. With, without, for now, forever, not at all, always and forever, for a time, for now, any of those.

You will love and laugh and you will grow and learn. For always. What you won't do is out-plan life.

Hope you get some mellow relaxation and do trust that inner wisdom and give your racing mind permission to use a lower gear. Please, do that for yourself. You deserve inner peace -- anticipation is great but over-detailed imaginings can turn on you and exhaust your spirit before anything has a chance to grow naturally. Your relationship, despite the hours of electronic and phone connection, is a seedling. The thing about weeding or tending a seedling too vigorously, is risk of root damage. You want roots? Stop sticking your mighty brain-trowel in there quite so hard. Let it grow. Let the rain and sun contribute their share. They're free.

Are you codependent poison? Find out. Will all compatibilities on the farm work out? Find out. Will you be calm and content around B? Find out. Will his arrival upset some carefully controlled plans and vibes, or improve what is? Find out.

Just...find out when you find out. By being present. You won't miss anything, promise! (You're incapable of missing much, dear.) And whatever you find out, you will be able to deal with, celebrate, assimilate, let go of, hold fast to, whatever is right you will know when you know it. And only after it happens, not before.

Big hugs and happy thoughts for you when B arrives!

Cookies!

hugs
Hops

PS -- You absolutely are a legitimate, and legitimately LOVEABLE, weirdo. (Takes one to know one....). [Insert heart icon here, mine vanished.]
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on June 08, 2020, 11:10:49 AM: Skep, in the nicest possible way, I'm hoping you're having such a good time over the next few days that we don't hear from you :) You know what I mean :) I hope the two of you really enjoy the time together. You've both waited a long time for this; you deserve a bit of fun xx xx xx

PS Sean Connery? I understand the swooning ;) Lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 08, 2020, 11:31:21 AM: Noooooo....I want updates!!!

Well, okay. But ONLY a couple days.
(And if you need to post, you post, hemme?)

hugs
:)
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 08, 2020, 01:46:31 PM: LOLOL...B knows about youse guys. He kinda thinks it's cute we've all hung together so long. (He's suffered a lot of real life betrayals.) I'll see what I can do about updates; just can't promise for sure. :D

Huh... that's just it, Hops - there wasn't any anxiety or analyzing or anything going on mentally. I'm as sure as I can be, without spending more time with him, that this is going to be fine - and fun; all around. NORMALLY, though, I would be doing just that; plus running around frantically trying to make things "just so". It just isn't happening. So, I was kind of looking around thinking... what I do now? To pass the time? And there just wasn't anything glaring, that said get up & do this NOW.

So, maybe it was just peace & contentedness. I dunno. I feel pretty dang safe - despite understanding that big change is in the process of happening. (Over the next few more months) Hol & Steve will be in the hut by then - and that's a HUGE project/PITA off my list. It's not just their "stuff"... but we have different ways of doing things and while we've all been uncomfortable in the process -- we've gotten through it pretty well. No permanent damage.

And Buck will be here with HIS stuff. LOLOLOLOL. But then, we'll be merging, organizing (hopefully last iteration of that), and deciding stuff together -- even though he's leaving the interior design stuff completely up to me - even when I do consult him -- there are just naturally going to be things we both collaborate on.

But its precisely the LACK of overthinking this, that was bugging me. It did make space for me to let whatever was "itchy" come to the surface - acknowledge it - and quickly, realize that I've already done the work necessary for me to not have to worry about it now. I don't consider myself all that cool, calm & collected - or patient. But here it is. So, maybe I'll just accept that this is a kind of "new me"...

that whatever lessons I've learned in the past; things I've dealt with - including this awkward living with Hol & Steve and the various houseguest situations - it's OK, now... to let the perception of risk, and the fear of it (due to my own susceptibility as PERCEIVED by me -- go. I moved on. Permanently.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 08, 2020, 01:52:54 PM: From here, Amber, it looks a little like you're living more in the moment, worrying less about the future, which means you've perhaps accepted you can't control things or people around you, and can relax into that without the usual distractions.

Now, I might be reading into that, or wholly wrong, but it feels right.

When I read about you not fussing and making everything perfect for B's arrival... I experience an inner sigh I can't explain.... it's so calming and happy: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 08, 2020, 02:30:31 PM: FanTAStic.

I must've been exhorting Old Amber, when New Amber already has released all that over-thinking (my minor, btw)....

Bravo, you.

And three steps behind the beat, me.

Hoorays and hallelus...

HAVE FUN!

hugs and happiness, much much--
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 08, 2020, 06:28:49 PM: ::lighting imaginary candles on Amber's outdoor kitchen patio::.

I look forward to hearing all about lovely meals cooked, shared and enjoyed.

If you don't already have an outdoor shower, I recommend putting that on the list: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 09, 2020, 09:24:12 AM: Lighter - yes; you're NOT reading into it. At first, when I noticed it, I immediately thought - what the hell is wrong with me? This isn't who I am.

But it wasn't shakable. It persisted no matter what I tried. So the only way I can understand and move forward with this, is that I "am" more than I was letting myself be under that limited set of definitions. So.... okay, then. It's an adventure.

And I "think" - that possibly - during the months of navel-gazing and analysis conversations I've been in with Hol and her friend John accomplished a few things that I was only minimally aware of. For me, anyway.

I got to say out loud, about how I see things now; how I see myself now; and talk about the past - as if it were a book I read, that affected me deeply. It is NOW, someone else's story. I am not that person anymore... after the years of solitude and getting to know my self a lot better. And the fact that I can SAY those things out loud now, and express my strong opinions about certain experiences I've lived through is also a new thing.

That "time out" was absolutely necessary for me. A turning point in my life. And while I still have the old reflexes pop up from time to time - gotta love neural pathways, right? - it seems I'm embracing all the other stuff I didn't explore or discover. My tastes have changed... along with a lot of other things. Perhaps they've just been refined; forged in the fire one more time. I know now, that having time completely alone is something I need from time to time and it's not scary... or dangerous... and I can trust myself to take care of myself.

A little bit of that, is due to Buck and how we are together. He is most definitely different from ALL my other relationships. And so far, that appears to be a good thing for me. From a couple things he's said, it seems like it's a good thing for him too - and he's also been affected in a similar way. He isn't pushing any of the codependence buttons - which feels strange, but hey - I'll get used to it. LOL. In some weird alchemy... he makes me feel more self-confident and free. Which is odd, since we're on the verge of an exclusive and intimate change to our relationship.

So maybe this going slow and the kind of bassackwards kinds of things we've opened up about to each other works for us. Time will tell.

I have some things I want to do today... none of them major. But it's the kind "nesting" thing that generates even more comfort and gratitude. The kids are probably going swimming today... so I'll get some quiet time again... to ponder and reflect.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 09, 2020, 11:52:21 AM: Amber:

WHen B arrives....I encourage you to take things slowly.....
meaning....
give yourself space between feeling and acting. With B. The kids. Yourself.

You're surfing real good now, but when he arrives..... slow down. Savor.

Take time to BE in a feeling and consider it..... resist doing doing doing... out of habit, for whatever reason. Go slow. Be so very gentle with yourself. Simply BE... and pay attention to the feelings..... notice them and notice if urges to DO DO DO come up... then let them go by.

There's plenty time to put together more lists and there will always be problems to solve.

In the first weeks of B's arrival...... just notice your inner world. How you're feeling.

Resist noticing what you didn't get done. How you can solve A, B and C.... proactively. Screw it. That's the next phase. Resist over-functioning in favor of being present.... is what I'm trying to say.

This first phase... IME.... is to plan a meal ahead..... a load of laundry ahead..... coffee on the patio in the morning.... and to notice how you feel, where you feel it and to HONOR it, above all.

That's all I have to say about that; )

Very excited for you!

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 09, 2020, 01:23:12 PM: I'm going to be paying attention to that regardless, Lighter. Yeah- I can (have done) that for days on end. It will, however, drive Buck to the edge of madness.

He is the "energizer bunny" as a matter of survival. The more he works, the better he feels. I've already mentioned that I have some other plans for him than work - and got resistance. There may be some ego involved in that; but he really can't be inactive without paying for it physically. So, we'll dance on that topic... LOL. He does negotiate fairly and understands his limits - along with what he needs to do for himself.

There are many things of this nature we still need to work out between us. So, I'm hoping to mix it up. Praying for rain won't help either; unless it's a storm - he'll still be out in it working until he can't. But we DO have kind of a daily routine down already, so yeah; surfing...

I'm well aware I'm not going to be able tell him what to do. LOL. And he knows the same about me. We'll figure out a happy balance I'm sure. Even if it's a tad fiery and combustible... we can always go to the river and cool off. Neither one of us is afraid of that... but neither one of us prefers that; it takes too much energy. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 09, 2020, 05:53:32 PM: I think there's a difference between DOING stuff and DOING DOING DOING stuff to fill the space and redirect attention and keep you from focusing on your inner world, kwim?

You guys will figure it out. I'm picturing mindful projects you and B work on together. At a very slow pace. With each other in mind. Lots of banter and smiles and kind touch.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 10, 2020, 08:05:45 AM: Today is the day B's D graduates. The date/place moved a couple times due to the virus. This is one of his big milestones on the to-do list for this year. That just leaves two more things - complete his training commitment to the Navy and sell his house. He'll settle up with Ex... and then he's free to do whatever he wants to do. And then he'll move her to college and himself here.

It was with relief that I saw 4 contractor vehicles head down to the hut this morning. We're past the timeline contractor thought they'd be done. I'm glad he's busy... but, they haven't done much the last 2 weeks. Instead of Holly giving contractor a piece of her mind... I was thinking about calling, since I'm footing the bill here. She's planning a solstice campout and is hoping to at least have one functioning bathroom down there. Everyone invited is experienced at primitive camping - one is an Appalachian Trail thru hiker. So all will be well. LOLOL... middle aged "kids"...

I'm still in my calm cloud; tomorrow I'll meet him "over the mtn" and he can follow me home. The road sign is covered with tree branches out at the highway; the drive is 7-8 hrs and he'll be driving into the sun... and it IS easy to miss. There isn't a lot planned for tomorrow... first thing he wants is a shower and change clothes... then coffee... and I'll have a meatloaf in the oven and then we can talk on the back deck, go to the studio... whatever.

He's promised to help me get an antenna situated and up and grounded. There are some minor implement issues we could address... some field trips if we feel like it... or we can just hang out. (I'm leaning toward that one.) No actual plan, in other words. But it's only a few days... and I think both of us just want to be together and not be running around "doing" so much.

So, still in my calm place but aware of a building energetic excitement that - for now - I'm still trying to contain. :D When it goes - the lid will come off and fly for some distance. LOLOLOL. Early 4th of July. We're calling this energy - irresistable force meets immovable object. Tee-hee...
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 10, 2020, 10:01:18 PM: ::grinning ear to ear:

Here we go!

Light
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 11, 2020, 08:45:50 AM: There have been so many unexpected obstacles come up that prevented him from traveling each time - since March - that I just couldn't let myself get excited about something that might not happen again, this time. I do protect myself... probably still more than I really need to...

... so I asked him last night if I could be excited now... LOL... he's picking up the rental in 10 minutes. I woke up at 1 am and started giving him more information about routes. Up again at 6:30 am and still sorting out routes.

I'm drinking too much coffee and having a slow morning. Hol took off to get her car inspected. There are only a couple things on today's list... it seems to be a pretty fine day; mixed sun & clouds; a nice gentle breeze - possibility of strong storms, but I was disappointed last night's forecasted one didn't show up; Freddy's having a nap next to me in the "nest".

I feel....... alive; like 220 volts running through me. Smiling; still relaxed & calm; everything is just fine and will be perfectly OK in about 9 hours. And I'm not the one "making it so" - I'm not the only person who knows how to do that. Knuckles seems to know about the energy shift in me; he's been zero'd in on me for the past 2 days... making a special smiling dog effort to give ME attention for a change.

And it looks like B is happy with the rental he's getting. It has a hemi. LOLOL.... guys.

Neither one of us can wipe the grin off our faces. LOLOLOLOL. I thank the fates for smiling on us.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 11, 2020, 09:04:01 AM: Step

awaaaaaaaaaay

from the coffee!

Oh hon, not sure how you're going to control that team
of wild oxen you have in your brain right now but maybe
plowing [see what I did there? LOL] through this day is
all you can do....

It's still going to end in beauty. Sunset, storm, mist, fog,
no matter what...night and peace and comfort will come.

Sending peace to ground the joy
and happiness and fun and relaxed
company and just the marvel of it all....

I'm so glad for you. Gonna hoist a glass to you two
as my own evening comes on.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 11, 2020, 03:08:06 PM: Well, it'll be later on Hops - 10-ish or so - since it took him awhile to load the truck. Didn't get on the road till about an hour ago.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 12, 2020, 06:52:39 AM: Annnnndddd.... he's not here yet. Forgot his night driving glasses and had to pull off till daybreak. ETA: about 10 am.
Pffffffftt... plans! What plans?

Surfing......
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 12, 2020, 03:27:20 PM: Tell me he's there and he's a real boy.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 13, 2020, 09:21:09 AM: Oh he's HERE. Hol & S went to have a late dinner with friends - so we had the place all to ourselves last night.

And yes, he's totally a real boy... and real man. And I am NOT allowed to wait hand & foot on him... LOL... he'll get up and get stuff for himself; take care of himself. We are learning the small idiosyncrasies now.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 13, 2020, 10:41:28 AM: :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Evidently a lot of chins here, but you know
what I mean.

I can't stand being waited on either, unless I'm ill.
Just makes me uncomfortable. Independence, as long
as I can manage it.

Have fun, ((((((Amber)))).
The present is your present.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 14, 2020, 04:20:08 PM: YES! He's arrived safely.... and he's real: )

I'm glad you don't want to be waited on.... he doesn't want to be waited on. I'm thinking this is the beginning of a great 3D friendship.

The journey continues: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 15, 2020, 05:25:33 PM: Very very real. And instead of him needing help with stuff - I'm finding I need to get out of the way. LOL.

I'm still trying to find his "off" switch. Last night, he had to send to me to bed - coz it was late, I was falling asleep keeping him company - which he also doesn't really need - and a couple hours later, I went to tell him to quit. LOL.

Talk? Non-stop...

He did say he's slept more in the last couple nights than he has in the last 3 years. He's happy just sitting on the porch after supper and yakking up a storm. (I did remember M, Hops... it's not as bad, coz he just tells his stories and THEN, comes out with something important to tell me.)

I'm adjusting and adapting. Haven't seen alot of the kids either.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 15, 2020, 05:57:59 PM: It sounds overall wonderful, ((((Amber))))), so far.

I wonder if it'll be easier adaptation if you tell yourself you are not involved in his decision about when to go to bed?

Just a thought.

I bet his nonstop talking isn't like M's...maybe just the pent-up gladness of having someone in his life who enjoys hearing him? But who knows. You'll find out if it's too much or just a quirk. You'll find out. Time will show you.

BIIIIG hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 15, 2020, 06:48:19 PM: Amber:

What has B so busy, late at night? What's he doing?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 17, 2020, 05:46:54 PM: He has adopted certain projects, that he can't stop doing until he hits a certain point. I do understand that mindset. Thanks to rain, he's already planning to stay an extra day.

There's a bit of drama at home for him, waiting. And he's forthright about needing an extra day before walking into it. Can't say I blame him, either.

Even though he tells long-winded stories... they're helpful to me, for filling in gaps about what I know about him. I was surprised to learn how many years he lived in Scotland, Wales & England - but it also explains an awful lot. He notices my states, before I do - coming on, he'll tell me to take a time out, or go to sleep. It's his protective mindset; I find it to be refreshing and compassionate; empathetic. Kindness is one of his traits.

Yes, in the course of working together, we've had our little tiffs - I don't understand something he says/needs... and he takes the time to explain it. Or I'll try to jump in and "manage" via reflex without thinking - and get that shut down pretty quick. Like I said, he's better at boundaries than I am.

But that doesn't preclude vulnerability and openness. There is a great deal more than close affection that exists between us... even while we're navigating each other's daily routines.

I iz pretty darn happy with all this. (Yes, I had a day of emotional whiplash - aka guilt - hit me. We navigated it together.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 17, 2020, 09:48:29 PM: I am sooooooooooo glad to hear
"pretty darn happy."

Oh, YESSSS.

(Poo on guilt. You are a good human.)

And now there's two of you.

big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 17, 2020, 11:32:29 PM: No advice, Amber.

I have hope and trust you two are practicing self-care, and care for each other in relationship.

This is so exciting.

It's finally happening.

Assuming the drama has to do with his ex-wife and final exit from that situation and business.

This too shall pass.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 18, 2020, 04:00:50 PM: The hard part is going to be saying goodbye tomorrow. He's already planning to come back before the Navy schedules his training gig. I already know it's going to be OK. He'll be here again in 6-8 weeks permanently.

I didn't need to worry about him & Holly. His fatherly persuasion isn't uncomfortable for her; and they have some things in common that make for interesting conversations. He isn't going to take the liberty to lecture her - and I think that was reassuring to her. S is still not engaging with any of us; and I'm not even bothering to inquire why. I think we're all getting to the point where we don't really have much use for tolerating him much longer - and that includes Hol.

Hol already said last night that she'd give me 3-4 days to process - then we'll touch base. I have completely lost track of time & days. Fantasies are all shot to hell; the reality is much better - so who needs fantasy? He holds my hand in the stores. There is still going to be adjustment on both parts. He's making the effort to figure out where I have things in the kitchen; washes up after himself. He takes on things without my creating any kind of "honey do list". He just sees something that needs doing and does it.

He's so very sweet. For all he's a big bad military guy. I told him the other night as we sat out back, listened to music and stared at the stars... that you don't realize how lonely you've been until you're not lonely anymore. He doesn't presume; always asks. And this is the easiest "coming together" that I think I've ever experienced. I haven't had to explain myself once.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on June 18, 2020, 04:14:43 PM: It makes me so happy to read this, Skep. I'm so glad you've had such a good time together and that he can get down again fairly soon xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 18, 2020, 05:43:21 PM: (((((Amber)))))
If you had a third eye, you'd see a big wide smile on my face.

I am so happy to hear this.

He's coming permanently.
You had that epiphany about loneliness.
He holds your hand in stores.
He cleans up after himself.

And that's just a few highlights, I'm sure.

So very heartily glad for you! For you both.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 19, 2020, 08:44:54 AM: Oh... the third eye is getting stronger Hops. Along with heart chakra... ;)

So, now I know what his daily rhythms are like. Someone see if they can locate a case of geritol for me, to be able to even keep up with this man. For all the major health concerns, he's the "Little Engine that Could". He was able to sleep here; nothing hurt; he did slow down for long talks...

and we learned a lot about each other - those things that don't convey well in words. And my worries about those little things, maybe not so little sometimes, were put paid to. He insisted on making his own coffee, learning the controls on washer & dryer, rinsing all his dishes before putting them in the sink. (We'd already covered the silverware up or down; toilet paper direction long time ago.... LOLOL.) He is OCD, too - or at least, has learned all the little habits that insure you take care of what you have for the life of the tool. He is the furthest thing from reckless or careless. And he is good at riding herd on the cat, dogs, Hol... and me... without being overbearing or presumptuous.

I've heard the story about both Ex's... and he listened to mine. I've heard the war stories, too. He listened about my N-boss. Hol has told him a good bit about our trials with her sister. We have made the grand tour of the place... I took him to Winchester to shop for some parts for the antenna project, which was the excuse for him making the trip. Got him acquainted with the major roads, the shopping area, medical center. I can turn him loose around here and he can find things. He figures we've been talking to each other online for about 10 years.

There is pretty strong telepathy between us. We know what the other is thinking or feeling... MOST of the time. But, instead of just assuming he's right... he always checks in. It's SOOOO easy to just talk & tell him, whatever... even the things that might bug me. And over the years, apart, we've both managed to learn benign ways of coping with things like that. We work well together; and "divide & conquer" methods work pretty good between us. There's no hint of "let me do that for you" and I'm good asking for him help - but I usually try it first and then call in the cavalry.

So when I drove into town to guide him back home, there most definitely was jumping up and down hugs & kisses. Right in the 7-11 parking lot. But I was driving the rubicon... and promptly got into "show off" mode and lost him in the curves. Later he told me, he wasn't used to cresting the little hills (or big ones) anymore... because being coastal - everything's pretty flat where he lives.

His drama at home, was with his D's little dog. Puppy got sick, and she called the Ex to drive her to the vet (still not driving much as kids are wont to do, these days). Vet gave the dog meds for the infection, that the dog was allergic to and dog died an hour after getting home. Then, there was interference from the Ex. So he was angry. And it was because D had had the dog since she was little and he knew her heart was broken. And he wasn't there for her. And that was the trigger for him to re-feel his own losses. He accepted my tentative comforting gestures and let me in. And except for the fact that the drama continued on throughout a couple days... he got all that managed right quick. He pointed out, that he hadn't had anyone who could just be there for him... and with him... without telling him what, how, to "do"... and didn't judge him, for his instinctual reactions. I can relate to that crap.

We've got pieces of a plan, for the future. But I did tell him that apart from those few pieces, and the maintenance on the buildings I know I have to do... I'm waiting until he's here to make any other decisions. Because he sees things I don't and has some very good ideas. And experience! He told me, that if he had it to do over again, he probably wouldn't have enlisted and just been a farmer. Both things require a high level of energy and dedicated work ethic. Attention to detail and the sympathetic intuition to be able to read situations.

Buck is wise; Buck is good. He's sweet, kind (almost to a fault), funny - a very dry sense of humor, almost as warped as mine; he has exquisite manners for one who has lived as rough as he has at times but doesn't get all snooty with it. Pulls my chair out for me at the table. Adaptable and flexible to situations. We fit together like a lock & key... and it's not something titillating - it's just like coming home, where it's "casual" and you can put your feet up.

Absolutely NO flags or causes for concern. And even Steve's dog - who barks at anyone who isn't part of the "pack" - got used to Buck after a week. We're both pretty simple people - when you strip the life circumstances and details away. And he is the most shyly romantic partner I've danced with so far... he just wants to be accepted for who he is and so do I. Everything else is just small potatoes.

He's seen me get overwhelmed by too much info, too fast. Takes it stride, patient, slows down for me. He's so gentle, but so strong. This isn't fantasy stuff anymore. And doesn't taste like "too good to be true". We're both a little awkward about being a "couple" and figuring all that stuff out... but it's drama-free and only took a week to feel "easy". I did find myself wanting to stick to him like glue... but when I needed a time out I could just take it. He'd track me down in a little bit and sit with me, to hear what was up. And I was able to just turn him loose, give him directions to a tool or whatever, too after a couple of days.

And the funniest thing going through my head, is how he ever was able to talk to anyone in the UK, with his mountains of NC accent & drawl... LOLOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 19, 2020, 11:46:12 AM: Oh man, I love me a good drawwwwwwwl.

It just sounds like a lovely time, Amber. I'm so happy for you.
And YOU are so happy you included the name of your nearby city...gonggggg. Wanna edit that out?

It was wonderful reading all those moments and moods and how good it all felt to you. I could feel your relaxation and peace coming off the "page."

There might be times ahead when it's not-easy or has some bumps for you to edge over. But you can handle it and you will. Honeymoon behavior or not, he sounds like a very dear and endearing man, with a lot of the fine qualities that are most important to you. And a whole lot of natural charm, as opposed to the posing kind.

Bravo to A and B! What a treat it would be to sit down for a brew with you two.

A&B. I like that. My new mental shorthand for the two of you. Not to be confused with just Amber when it's all about you, which life has to be too sometimes.

I don't think you'll drown in this. I think you'll float, and swim in any direction you like, still always free, but just feeling at home and supported and loved.

You so deserve this gift, this time. It just doesn't get much better than feeling loved and having someone to love.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 19, 2020, 04:44:47 PM: HA! A&B....

Naw; even knowing that bit of information (city), unless you're a high-falutin' computer hacker or part of the gov't... you still can't find me. And neither one of them, has any reason to go looking for me.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 20, 2020, 01:00:05 PM: What I got out of your posts, Amber.....

B is ready to get to the business of being who he is, without pointing his toes, and for you to get there too.

Sounds like you just might both get there at the same time. Maybe you've already arrived.

Just astonishing update, Amber and better still bc I didn't worry at all about anything I would normally worry about, whatever those things were.

::sigh::.

I've moved into relaxed and vibrantly happy for you two; )

SO sorry to hear about Hol's ribs. She's had a pretty rough year. How is S doing with this situation?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 20, 2020, 03:48:25 PM: I'm so terribly sorry to hear about Hol's fall and painful injuries.
Is there clarity about how it happened?

Yikes. Broken ribs takes quite a lot of impact.
It must be very painful.

Poor her, and poor you too. Just when you were relaxing into A&B world.

Keep us posted....

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 21, 2020, 08:52:11 PM: There are steps down from the studio... and Hol built 4 steps UP to the driveway in the hill. It was raining... she had cowboy boots on - slick soles - and the toe of her boot slipped and she went down on the same rock that I've fallen into 3-4 times. Buck was just reaching out for her when she went down and scraped his elbow in the process too. (He's fine.)

S had a bit of a snit - so to add insult to injury, he was mad that she stayed so long talking with us; claims she lied to him; and took 24 hrs to re-evaluate if they had a future. Yes, he's that immature, self-centered, and insecure. They have since made up again - over my confusion & objection about how she was taking it last night; she was very angry and could clearly see some parallels to the previous relationship. All I can really do is just shake my head at her.

Local hospital insisted she go over the mountain to the big med center - where Mike's D has been working. (Soon to become the head of the trauma dept too!) So, we didn't have long to wait - 3-4 people came to introduce themselves - including the resident on that shift and the current trauma surgeon. Being a veteran of ERs and hospitals - I packed a bag in 5 mins. We weren't sure she wouldn't be admitted - and did in fact, turn down a 24 hr stay for observation. CT eliminated the concern that she might need surgery. But all told I think we waited 4 hrs. total for the CT and results.

If she stays on top of her pain medication, she's able to get around OK but she's making every effort to move slowly and intentionally; she has lots of tai chi walking experience. She's been sleeping OK - but still hasn't started using the breathing tube. I'll have to remind her tomorrow. She'll call Monday for a followup with the trauma doc. We both liked him a lot.

I'm missing B a lot already. It won't be long before he's back though. My phone has been constantly busy starting a couple hours after he left. :D It's an understatement that he's very attentive. But we still separate to get stuff done, and then come back together again. All the little things I worried about - didn't matter once he was here.

It's just so easy and natural to be with him.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 21, 2020, 11:53:54 PM: Quote
All the little things I worried about - didn't matter once he was here.

It's just so easy and natural to be with him.

What a wonderful thing to read.

I'm so glad, Amber.

Glad too that Hol's going to be okay. Miserable experience.
And when an SO goes all self-absorbed when their SO is in PAIN....arrrggghhh.

Lucky for you it's her job to sort S out. But jeez.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 22, 2020, 08:13:19 AM: When I redesign the deck... guess I'd better go on and change the steps too. But that won't be for awhile.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 23, 2020, 04:38:27 PM: Should a railing be installed... until you can get to the change in steps? Is there a railing or some way to put one in?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 24, 2020, 10:20:54 AM: I thought about that Lighter. But the driveway surface is on top of solid rock; I suppose it could be drilled for bolts. I've been wanting to cover and change those stairs anyway... I just need to think about it a bit. It COULD go on the other side of the building - where there isn't a subsequent grade to reach driveway level. It's a little longer walk, but it's safer. Especially in the dark, rain & snow.

I haven't made any final plans about what I'm doing to that building yet; but the decks are getting in pretty bad shape and that involves the location/style of the steps too. The deck is ALSO quite large which is contributing to the instability - and we just don't need that much deck on that building. It is blistering hot in the afternoons on that side of both buildings.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 26, 2020, 09:32:52 AM: Relevant to major derailment on the co-dependence thread:

The week before Buck arrived - I noticed a change in myself. I had completely cut off feeling my feelings. Just pulled the plug. It wasn't intentional and I only became aware of it after the drawbridge and portcullis were completely locked and manned with archers. Mind you - I was still HAVING feelings - but I had separated as far as a person can and still be human. I could still experience feelings - in the middle of my head center, in the midst of imagination and fantasy & fiction. Where it was without risk and perfectly "safe"... and a lot less "real".

And then while he was here... the feelings didn't ever overwhelm me; except maybe saying "au revoir". That was more intense, because I'd woken up and he wasn't on the deck out back; he'd already packed the truck; he wasn't in the kitchen or bathroom... I'd gotten coffee and went back to bed to wake up a little more... wondering if he'd really left. And then I noticed his change of clothes on the bed and I continued looking until I found him on the porch talking to Hol. That kinda freaked me out; I knew he needed to get an early start and I was afraid I'd slept so long I'd missed the leave taking. Plus Hol had texted me and that woke me up, saying she thought her ribs were broken.

So this vulcan mindset has persisted this week too. Letting all the big emotions settle; resting; not "thinking" or analyzing - just letting them be. I sure couldn't put many words to describing the feelings. Not without seeing myself through a lens of judgement - critical judgement - all those "shoulds" and "should NOTS" about making decisions based on feelings. Everything is proceeding as per normal - including silly fun & playful communication with B. Then, last night, I realized my eyes were leaking a bit again... and the fortress started crumbling. And words started to be available again.

I guess I was just absolutely terrified of going through hurt or disappointment again. Being bereft again. And that was MOSTLY expectations about myself more than him. He was sweet & kind, and funny as all get out - except for that one "real life" moment where HE was the vulnerable one; completely exposed and afraid of rejection...or criticism... and waiting to be told what he "should feel, do, be". And angry. To fall into the pattern of the past experiences that is the library of both our selves. And we aren't doing that. To the best of our ability. This is a very new framework.

But, I really didn't need to be afraid. He presumes nothing; always asks. He is not aggressive - despite being a strong personality. And for all his busy-ness and needing physical activity; of the productive work sort... he could just sit and feel, too. And then we shared "war stories" of the past. He's sensitive and intuitive - so I think he picked up how much intensity I had locked down. After all - he cares for a lot of feral cats - LOL. He's kind and patient when he picks up on those feelings.

And no, he would rather I NOT become dependent on him, even emotionally - he likes that I'm independent and strong (most of the time). He has to keep reminding me - equals. (Yeah, past conditioning; I tend toward thinking it's expected; and therefore it's become a reflex.) I don't have to "take care of" him; that would suffocate him - and if I NEED him, he will take care of me, but it's not a condition for the existence of the relationship. He is gobsmacked that I know how and can, take care of him when he needs it. Especially, because of the strong expressions of anger he has. LOLOLOL. Holly throws things; the bigger the better. You don't want to see what she does when THAT doesn't satisfy her anger. It's almost time for me to remind her about therapy again.

Buck has gone through at least 20 years of therapy. He has himself pretty well figured out by now. His list of "needs" or "requirements" are quite simple. I can't even begin to list mine. First, I have to spend some time sorting out my fear of this kind of happiness... even daring to FEEL it seems taboo; like I'm tempting fate. If it was someone else who felt that way - boy, do I have a pep talk, mommy lecture ready to deliver. But I almost feel sorry for myself for being so damn neurotic about this.

There was absolutely nothing "off"; no flags; he's authentic and genuine - and like most people just wants to be accepted for who he is. Emotions are tough for him to talk about too - but he DOES, in the most simple straightforward way. More so than I can, when I get all twisted up into one of these absurd mazes.

So, I'm not terribly surprised y'all misread what I was trying to say. It happens when I'm in that cold, emotionless space - but still feeling the pressure of the intensity I'm trying to keep a lid on. Throw the most difficult set of circumstances or complex, awful emotions at me... and I'm in my comfort zone. Throw sunshine, peace, love and happiness at me - and I bolt. Go figure.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 26, 2020, 10:42:18 AM: Quote
I was just absolutely terrified of going through hurt or disappointment again. Being bereft again.

(((((((((((Amber)))))))))))))

I understand this. It's the actual vulnerability.
I see it as very powerful that you have admitted the fear,
let it come up...because owning a feeling releases the feeling.

You're both human and both love and need each other.
Living in an independent way doesn't have a hidden rule that
you can't also feel needy. That's another word for lonely, imo.
And lonely is normal when one is on a mountain after a couple
years of intense family drama, and the beautiful new human
in your life is there for a week, igniting all the dreams, and
then he has to go away again.

You can FEEL abandoned even when you know you're not.
You're only human and you've been going through a whole lot.

I hope Buck is coming back soon and the plan continues.
I hope your connection and the hope you feel keep on growing.

hugs and comfort,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 26, 2020, 10:51:53 AM: Amber:

I don't think it's fair for large men to be judged violent and dangerous when they express anger... particularly when what's underneath is fear for what they consider vulnerable people they're responsible for. Particularly when there's no threat or fear of violence. Sometimes anger is the appropriate response, IMO.

At the same time, you're not a psych ward nurse, even if you're as competent and willing to deal with angry outbursts from adults in your life on a regular basis. The reactive nature of B's outburst, and I suppose Hol's.... that's something else, IMO.

Are you training them? Are they training you? Rhetorical questions, but we do train people how we want to be treated. It's something to reflect on, IMO.

B felt terrible when he lost control and let his fear come out sideways.... he lost his ability to reason and SEE you. That's cause for concern, even if there was never any chance for violence. Feeling bad about that seems appropriate, bc B typically receives a less than enthusiastic response from the women in his life.. maybe all people, when he reacts with anger in situations where it's not appropriate?

I doubt he wants to lose contact with his senses, and you, in that way, in any case, as a theme in this relationship is what I'm trying to say. It seems unlikely to produce any positive outcome, and more likely to produce negative outcomes, IME.

Just bc you CAN deal with all that anger... doesn't mean you should, I guess? Maybe?

Maybe everyone benefits if you aren't so masterful at being so strong, brave and competent at handling other people's sideways upside down emotions. Maybe everyone benefits if you're less competent and comfortable?

Not saying you should judge, or condemn them, or yourself.

I'm saying... maybe it's time for you to seek out and cultivate more peace and serenity, simply bc you can. Because you deserve it. You can leave the battlefield. You've earned the right to leave it, IMO.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 26, 2020, 11:23:41 AM: Thanks Hops. That hit the spot. :blushing:

Lighter, we all have our personal struggles. I reacted with giving him space for his anger first, then simple comfort without words. I'm not anywhere knowledgeable enough to do more than that with Buck. With Hol, I have stepped back even some more - and I seldom address her or try to "manage" her in her tantrums unless I know it's really that she's asking for physical contact, and then she gets a giant hug. We always go back and address things AFTER the fact, when she's calm... and has had a chance to do her own work about that particular moment.

I doubt this is going to be a "theme" in our relationship. Anger is just a fact of life; and some people reach for that emotion first, instead of others. Because my meltdowns are so rare these days, it may be a long long time before he sees one. Like once in a decade rare. And that one, was because I let things get past the point of making myself explicitly clear; strongly. Instead of addressing it sooner - and suffering the repercussions/accusations of "judging" or being controlling or just OCD - because I have rules about taking care of things instead of just trashing them because they are material things. That belief/attitude does not compute for me. For me, that consideration for tools is part & parcel of caring about people... and it's a symbol of not caring about anyone but yourself in a moment. Which IS a theme around here; Hol has been working on a couple very painful experiences involving that, herself.

And that particular thing - makes me VERY angry. LOL.

Buck is able to work through his moments on his own with me around but not engaging verbally; but I'm not going to retreat or cower or abandon him to it. I can be there for him, without "doing" his work... and I'm still mindful of my own boundaries, should he exceed them. And I don't fear expressing that to him, at all. I've had quite a bit of practice with Hol, practicing this same strategy. And it's EFFECTIVE. It de-escalates the emotion down to a level where the rest of the brain engages again.

Eh. Change makes for interesting challenges, doesn't it?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 26, 2020, 11:27:07 AM: Massive agreement with everything Lighter says here:

Quote
I doubt he wants to lose contact with his senses, and you, in that way, in any case, as a theme in this relationship is what I'm trying to say. It seems unlikely to produce any positive outcome, and more likely to produce negative outcomes, IME.

Just bc you CAN deal with all that anger... doesn't mean you should, I guess? Maybe?

Maybe everyone benefits if you aren't so masterful at being so strong, brave and competent at handling other people's sideways upside down emotions. Maybe everyone benefits if you're less competent and comfortable?

Not saying you should judge, or condemn them, or yourself.

I had a recent blowup myself that I'll mention on Relationship.

Anger may not be a "bad" emotion, but being around it semi-regularly when someone hasn't learned to manage it themselves, is toxic.

Amber, I would really really like for you to be in a relationship where you are not the coach or the therapist. Just yourself. Just a good, smart, creative woman who'd like to enjoy and share life in peace.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 27, 2020, 12:05:38 PM: Quote
Amber, I would really really like for you to be in a relationship where you are not the coach or the therapist. Just yourself. Just a good, smart, creative woman who'd like to enjoy and share life in peace.

It may SOUND like I'm doing this a lot more, than I am Hops - because I'm processing when I write here. IRL, I'm not doing so much of it.

I'll reiterate again - with Hol, I've stepped back even further (the move into the Hut is close) and I'm not at all interested in being in that role with Buck. And I doubt he'd let me.

So within the space of a month or two... there is going to be massive change here; and there is still a lot of work to be done. Rome wasn't built in a day - so I'm looking at "time to completion" and knocking those things off the list. Because I have to keep making progress because there are other projects/phases of development I want to get to - and in some cases stand in for Hol, given her injury. Which is healing up pretty well. She stopped the painkillers coz she was having dreams that were too bizarre & intense (and one which was definitely generated by her subconscious - that spelled out plain as day a pattern I've seen in her).

I'm still kinda concerned about that switch that turns off my emotions just to avoid fear of - I dunno, vulnerability? But that doesn't make rational sense because one of the great things about how Buck and I get along - is I can just tell him things like that and he understands. It doesn't become an issue between us. He doesn't try to "fix it" or tell me what I should do/be instead. I think perhaps, that I was so conscious of this visit providing the rest of the information he and I both needed to decide if we were going to say, thanks but no thanks... or decide to proceed... that I over-compensated on the observation side of things. Somewhat.

Because I did spend much of my time just feeling; more than perhaps I wanted to even. When he's here - this farm isn't so much a project as it is "home"; he's HOME for me. And that's what I've been craving; being able to rest in that.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 27, 2020, 12:39:38 PM: Amber:

I do think your processing here gives a sense you're doing more with regard to coaching or whatever, for Hol and B and the strays at the farm.

I get it now. Thanks for explaining that.

As for the anxiety..... with the time it took B to get his ducks lined up.... I understand any feelings of doubt that would crop up, and threaten to come true, God forbid.

You've been through a lot. You've overcome a lot. You didn't want this to be that.

Turns out it's not, but I think it's perfectly normal to be wary and aware, which you tend to be over smaller things, so.... ya. You did it a bit with B, a bit. So what?
You're not going to change altogether. You're still you, and just relaxing into trusting B IS what you believe he is.

I think being pragmatic and aware is logical and wise. This isn't your first rodeo, why would you ever BE that person again..... blindly in love, blindly trusting. You aren't, nor should you be.

You're surfing real good, right now, Amber.

I'm dancing circles in the moss for you: )

Lighter.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 27, 2020, 07:53:42 PM: Thanks Lighter. I suppose it's more natural for a widow to feel deeply the risk involved in a deep, intense, intimate new relationship. And to fear that risk. Regardless of age. (Just a WAG off the top of my head.) I know when I was younger it didn't even register on my awareness at all. I worried about OTHER things.

And while choosing partners - when I was younger - when I really didn't know myself well - I tended to pick more stable responsible men. But as I aged - I also changed and learned more about myself. And often I found them lacking in one way or another then. It happens; it's a real thing. Even Hol has noticed it in her relationships.

Active fatherhood seems to be (from my anecdotal study of men) what causes them to grow and mature. The ones that are less involved seem to get stuck somewhere and they never become interested in new things, being different or seeking wisdom. And many can't - or don't want to - change right along with their women. It's just an observation that MAY be generally true. I certainly don't have enough data or experience.

About my fear - I know Buck has his own similar. But our pact is to be happy and dance until we can't! That may have come out of my mouth while he was still in the hospital for a surgery and feeling very precarious about rejection - due to his physical limitations & multiple surgery scars being the reason the Ex gave for moving on 18 years ago. I'm creative; and I know how to make do, in a lot of situations - make lemonade outta lemons. And he is so simply very warm, open and kind - I can tell him anything. We had talked about my sitting with the decision to take this risk again, some time ago. How I felt about it. What I wanted to do. He knows my scars are on the inside. I've told him a lot about it, but I still haven't told him the whole story. I've heard about the horrors of his war combat experiences and the accident where he wasn't supposed to have survived, much less walk again... and be as active as he is.

So we almost HAVE to be completely honest with each other going into this; open and vulnerable; and trusting. Neither of us would be happy with anything less or have the patience for anything else. It's a tall order. But he's undersold himself - both his strength and understanding of things in this realm; the emotional side of things. That's so dang rare in men his age - no matter their level of success or accomplishments - he's like a unicorn.

So I'm stuck on him like glue - LOLOL. And vice versa. He can't believe my first baby shoes were fur lined moccasins from Lake Mille Lac. That I can handle a canoe. Can shoot and am no longer freaked out by guns. That I study alternative medicine, and still read obsessively. He can't believe I don't faint at the sight of blood or get grossed out by his scars. We have protocols for managing his infection - which isn't gone; but also isn't very active now. His blood and spinal fluid are where it's concentrated. I've been into first aid since I was a kid; picked up the basics of home care during Mike's last days from his daughter Autumn - a flight/trauma nurse who's about to become our big regional medical center's head of Trauma Dept. (I'm so proud of her! She's not even 40 yet!) Hol can suture (part of her tattoo and cosmetic tattooing training). And I know she can sew better by hand than this last surgeon.

When I'm upset, scared, angry or freaked out... B lets me talk it out. He is comforting without trying to fix it. I do the same for him. So that seems appropriate to me - and isn't close to coaching or crossing a boundary about managing those things. We can be in each other's space during that kind of intense emotional storm and be strong for each other. (oh... more unicorn qualities... you know how many men I've sent running in terror??? It's so disappointing.)

I think that the perfection in all this - so far - how easily we fit together, find our strides and rhythms, divide and conquer work together - feels almost too good to be true. But there have been those projects when I've had to say - I don't know what that tool or thing looks like or how to do something. And he quickly falls into teaching mode; in a way I can understand... and progress continues. We've just winged it and it's worked just fine.

So I think I'm just going to trust how good this is; be grateful for it; and stop questioning it.

He wants to completely close a chapter in his life - and start a new one. That's exactly why I came here, too. And I've spent time alone healing. Then Hol showed up - one of my favorite people despite how difficult she is sometimes - and brought her entourage to visit. She challenges me intellectually and challenges my defense mechanism habits. Because she cares. So I've learned some new people skills. Having people spend extended amounts of time in my space has been a CHALLENGE to say the least, but there is a balance now between the times it's cozy and peaceful and easy and those more difficult times. Now I can enjoy larger groups of people around and not retreat to wallflower, people-watching status. I really LIKE a lot of her friends and can go one on one with them openly. She has gotten a lot more selective over the years and has some really talented, creative and caring folks in her network.

So I think with the amount of space and privacy we have around here - the hut is a mile away by road and not visible from the house - and now with Buck in the picture... I'm seeing a plan come together in a really good way. Doesn't mean we won't have disagreements or clashes... but I know Hol and I can sit down and hash it all out and find a compromise or solution. One that respects everyone's wishes/needs.

So while there is much yet to do - including some time away traveling for A & B - I've managed to put the basics together of my dream for this place. Hol is happy - because she finally has a home that is HERS. I'm happy because there's enough of us here to work together to produce what we can for self-sufficiency. Even Steve - he's the duck, goose, chicken, guinea keet master. And he's constantly tramping through the woods - finding/identifying mushrooms and medicinal herbs. He's found a patch of ginseng here, which he is nurturing. So there are ways he DOES fit in here... and the rest is none of my business unless she brings it up. Buck's woodsman skills go back to before he enlisted at 17. And he didn't stop learning/practicing. He did a traditional buffalo hunt - loincloth and all - from horseback with a spear. LOL. It was a challenging ride. To say the least. ;)

And he cleans up enough to take ballroom dancing lessons. Or look dashing in a kilt.

I have absolutely NO BUSINESS raining on my own parade with a bunch of "what ifs" that may or may not even come up... and I need to just surrender to being happy about all this and grateful that love has come back around again. And surf everything else.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 27, 2020, 08:52:09 PM: Well, that's just about the best argument I've hears for dropping the past and future so you can focus on the hear and now.

It sounds like an amazing here and now, Amber.

::nodding::.

A unicorn, wearing a kilt, taking ballroom dance lessons AND can hunt buffalo in nothing but a loincloth.

Yup yup yup.

I don't think anyone should ask for more.

You embrace and dance and squeeze all the happy you can out of this ride, Amber.

I wish you the best possible outcome... I wish that for all of us.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 28, 2020, 09:16:08 AM: Thanks Lighter. I guess you're right. I'm finding it's not possible to create a rational, reasonable expectation of predictability for the future these days. I've tried. I've looked & looked for anything beyond human nature that was stable and not being impacted by entropy or change that could be counted on remaining recognizable 5 years from now. Heck 5 months from now. Hol told me a couple days ago she thinks the next 2 years are going to be all about huge, very fast change; and not positive change. It was a cautionary statement.

And the past - is gone - as is said. I'm not who I was yesterday, even if I cling to certain ego-persona-attachments. Both Buck and I have a couple of books worth of past experiences. Good and bad. But neither of us wants to do any of that again. But we have wisdom, lessons and skills from the past that will be useful going forward while we're learning the flip side of those things.

So, my understanding of the present moment is that it's a door of chance opportunity, that opens to a path, that leads many different kinds of places - depending on what each of us is carrying. If we carry the past - we can't help recognizing those patterns - and perhaps taking the bait to learn another lesson about that one kind of thing. Sometimes karma influences choices here.

And sometimes that door & path is a leap of faith - into fulfillment of the heart's hopes and dreams. Most of the time, people don't really know what their hopes and dreams are; or don't have words for them. I'm not entirely sure I have a good idea of my own... so this is the kind of the ultimate "release the outcome" response to the universe. Maintaining love, trusting that it's all going to be OK, acceptance that "bad" or difficult things are always existent in life... and staying on the path.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on June 28, 2020, 11:53:21 AM: Amber:

I'm saying that tomorrow never comes. It's always now, this very moment. That's all we ever get.... that's what's real. That's where we live, bc that's all we every experience in reality. NOW.

Hol can share her fears and thoughts with you, but that's what they are. She doesn't know what will happen. It's quite a bold statement to make, IMO. No one knows.

Everyone can plan for their future, do what they can to deal with good and bad scenarios, but what if we can't put those stories down, and turn back to living in the actual moment, the ONLY moment we'll ever have to live in?

Worrying, thinking, planning and trying to see into the fugure is a coping strategy. It fills us with anxiety and we dump chemicals and have racing mind syndrome, and we plan and plan and go round and round and.....
and live in our limbic systems, then wonder why we're feeling anxious, and fearful and that's a choice to live that way.

Doing what we can, then putting ALLLLL the stories on the shelf, so we CAN be present in the moment we're living... where are feet are...... engaged and awake for what's happening to us NOW.... that's a choice too.

Neither are wrong or bad. They're just choices.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on June 28, 2020, 01:26:18 PM: Amen to everything.
What a great discussion.

I felt badly for the buffalo.
But I still like B!
(And A&B...)

I fear a Great Depression
which I think is coming.
But agree with Lighter that
fear of tomorrow poisons today,
being present.

Thank you both for all this thinking.
And presentness.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on June 28, 2020, 05:45:01 PM: Well, yes Lighter. I've been schooled in that kind of present moment thinking. BUT...

unfortunately, I MUST glean the lessons from the past, such as they are and even when they might not directly apply to the present...

AND at least gather enough information (if any is to be had) to plan for the future - as I have a business to care for, the employees livelihoods, and my (growing) family to support. They all need a careful, wise hand... and much of our income depends on me making forward-looking decisions. I simply can't ignore it in the realm of business, income, or needs of the farm for sustainability and simply "trust" that the universe will provide. I'm a bit frazzled over the LACK of information available with which to make an informed decision in this area these days. And my retained experts aren't any help at all either; they are throwing up their hands and stating "who knows??"

I still wear a lot of different hats; and I'm still where the buck (oooo freud strikes again!) stops.

My work next week is already determined; and I'm not thrilled about spending time with all those numbers again. BUT... I'm the person that's supposed to do it.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 01, 2020, 07:33:54 AM: Procrastinating, avoiding, resisting the spreadsheet and research work... still. Hol had a followup appt for her ribs and got to see her xrays. Only one rib is actually broken; the other 3 are cracked, but maybe not all the way through. Healing is estimated at 6-12 weeks since she's really healthy and in good shape and relatively young.

She stopped taking the painkillers early. They were letting her subconscious sneak through and provide what I thought were USEFUL images/feelings - but were also terrifying nightmares. That was the extent of my comment - because if that situation had come up so powerfully for her, she isn't going to be able to ignore it for long. She'll have to work through it. And I have my own take on it - and need to ponder it somemore without critique. Just in case she asks.

Buck is waiting to hear what dates/where he's to report for this training. It should last 7-10 days and there will be total radio silence between us for the duration. And his D is waiting on college information too. Which will be the next thing. Sell the house & move.

And of course, he had to cut his hair. His D did a great job, IMO. It was well past his shoulders, giving him that dark brooding Viking look, even if he is more compact than that. And now, it's as short as it can be without shaving his head. Gives his visage the same look, but older, as the kilt picture. His hair was much darker then, too. But I didn't fall for his hair or lack of it...

and the radio silence timeframe isn't going to be too difficult. We have a strong open channel of telepathy between us. May not get a lot of details out of it, but I know when he's asleep or totally occupied... and when he's thinking about me. And vice versa. :shrug: maybe just a fantasy too... but it's a comforting one.

I'm looking forward to a long winter of thinking about and designing a shared space... and maybe some trips, here and there - though I don't know how far afield we're going to get yet.

The forecast is for abominably hot temps here the next 3 weeks. I MIGHT be able to get the rest of my medicinals in, but we're currently going through the annual emergence of "no-see-ums" too... and Hol & I both are fresh meat for those bugs. Much more unpleasant than mosquitos or black flies. So it's the perfect opportunity to do my financial stuff, right? LOLOLOL. Finish the master bedroom reno, too... but oh so UNmotivated.

Looks like 2-3 weeks till Hol moves into the hut. Hardwood & tile are going down. Hickory hardwood in the dining room and master bedroom; tile everywhere else on that floor - a dark charcoal porcelain; the walls are a light creamy stucco - "not" white - LOLOL. Downstairs, same walls, floor will be polished concrete and the woodstove will be located there, which should keep the worst of the "wood dirt" contained. I might order her a set of tools like mine and an ash bucket. (I know she didn't think about that yet.)

She's started making curtains for that wall of glass... hee hee; sun makes it really hot in there in the afternoons. I'm really proud of her; designing it herself - it grew a little when she thought she was pregnant - but it's elegant, simple, quirky (she is the color/pattern master for combinations) and very much did what was needed to move things along for the contractor without being one of "those" clients where nothing's ever right. She had to compromise on some things. And she still needs the plumber/electrician back to finish up... but it's very very close now.

This kind of description just doesn't do it justice, though. Maybe while I'm spending so much time on the 'puter I'll see what I can find for image services these days. Then, it's just a link to post here. I can even PW protect the pics.

Her aesthetic is even more ecclectic than mine is. Lots of rustic - she got unfinished lath to put up on one accent wall; think old barn wood but smaller strips. There is mid-century and minimalist modern too. And then her collection of the quirkiest art & stuff you could imagine. She's thinking about getting away from this place for awhile too, when the house is done.

Still absolutely no word about work for either one of them; and both are looking at the alternatives for income. One big advantage for her, is that except for propane and the "land lease agreement", and perhaps insurance costs (we haven't talked about that yet) there are no regular expenses after the contractors leave to live there.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 01, 2020, 11:02:30 AM: Wow, the Hut sounds like a dream, Amber. How beautiful.
I have lived online in sustainable modern houses for ages, and just
love the feeling of so much light, and simple surroundings, and art....
sounds incredible.

I'm glad you have a plan for Buck's NC absence, and that he has
one in place for moving. I'm just soooooo pleased for you.

I keep thinking "what Amber does is work on the mountain" and forget
all about the fact that you still have a family business you are involved in.
How often do you have meetings/discussions with the folks on the ground?
Are y'all Zooming a lot? Is it pandemic-proof for employees? On site?

I can't imagine how many plates are spinning in your head, on sticks.

And no-see-ums, ugh.

Hope you enjoy this hiatus and kind of suspended time. I think you
will and hope nothing spoils your peace. Glad Holly is healing too. That must've been wrenching, that fall and pain.

Meanwhile, taking really good care of yourself despite spreadsheets sounds
like a wonderful idea. You deserve it. Health, happiness and peace of mind.

Big hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 03, 2020, 09:35:41 AM: Forgot I hadn't responded here. I seem to have two speeds these days - idle, and 90 mph. But the idle phase, is when I'm doing a ton of head work. It just looks like I'm being a slug. LOLOL.

I'm careful not to mess around with the daily affairs at the shop, so I check in once a month or every two weeks depending on what's going on. The employees have been there 10-20-30 years for the most part and they know what to do. My guy in charge and the bookkeeper have been there close to 30 years. Thanks to strange economic investments nationally and internationally - we've been kinda treading water for the last 5 years thinking/hoping that things would "wake up" and starting building/making again. It hasn't happened.

And now, Covid and shutdowns, transportation delays, and item availability and social distancing requirements are impacting the companies who generally buy our stuff. Catepillar's sales are down 20% so far this year -- and I'm sure their production is slower than that because they built up dealer inventory at the end of last year.

We're "essential" - and the employees wouldn't have been able to make it on unemployment anyway - so we kept going. For their sake. No one's been sick, thankfully. The bookkeeper is in her 80s now; she's been working at night for even more distance. We're small... so we can have more flexibility like that. If we had to, we could separate people in the shop even more by running multiple shifts... with shipping working to get product out the next morning.

There is just a strong sense of fear and uncertainty running through all levels of society right now and it's impacting businesses and the economies around the world. With 50 states having 50 different ways of addressing the virus - and all kinds of variables in their production/sales environments - it's generating some additional chaos; supply issues; and the whole process is starting to look very very shaky.

It's just like the toilet paper shortage - Kimberley Clark, et all - have two kinds of production facilities, each specializing in either home or commercial products. When the run on home TP hit - there wasn't any way for the commercial facilities to retool (think big money and time; and if you want quality - it either takes more time or more money) and then put it all back, IF the situation was temporary and short-lived.

Welcome to one of my worlds. LOLOL.

That's actually been hard for me to get across to Hol. It's not like I have a job, with set hours and things to do every day. I'm spending time doing the research, gathering information/data, and trying to create a strategy that will let us adapt to whatever conditions we might have to face... always keeping the best interests of the employees and long-term sustainability of the business as the most important criteria. She is having trouble grasping that or seeing the things I actually DO. Because I'm usually parked in front of a screen doing research, reading government economic reports... networking with some contacts who are well-placed to assess the same kinds of things.

---------

Hol can actually move some of her kitchen stuff this weekend; the tile along the single galley wall is done. Well - not her personally. John had to stop in to pick up some mail, so the guys will move it and Hol will drive using my trailer. Her kitchen counter is really just a long narrow table affair she had custom made by friends she knows in the city; it's gorgeous. She'll use open shelving for everything else. Hickory hardwood is done too; the rest of the tile would be done, except somehow the grout she ordered is the wrong color. No idea how that happened. Lots of tile left over from both of our projects and I think the colors will even work together.

The woodstove will be downstairs backing up to the wall supporting the stairs, so she's thinking about using the extra tile under the stove (floor's concrete anyway) and up the wall behind the stove.

Rick will be back, with his backhoe to dress up the driveways with the shale he's already dug -- clearing out the space where Buck's metal shop is going to be. Which I have to size/get a ballpark number and try to get ordered asap.
---------------

Hol's healing up pretty good. Doc told her 6-12 weeks, and because of how fit/young she is (42 is young?) that she'll probably heal in the shorter amount of time. She is walking to the hut & back every day; doing some packing to stage for the move; and cooking. A little sewing, but her stool isn't stable enough to spend much time on it and she hasn't tried to get my chair (which I know will work at that table) yet. She's not in the mood. Speaking of mood - that seems to be stabilizing these days. (Fingers behind back; crossed)
-----------------

Buck is busy too. He's trying not to slow down - even though heat indexes there are through the roof - to keep to his timeline goal of late August/early Sept. for his move. Navy hasn't contacted him yet with specifics, so next week. He did say often he only got 5 hours notice before being expected to be ready to deploy... so this is SOP.

This couple of months feels like the home stretch to me. He and I have said all that needs saying for now. So we're mostly "doing" the stuff that makes it happen. I tend - sometimes he does too - to drift into/out of highly emotional states. I know it's a more of a shock to him, because he's just now phasing out of a long time of it not being safe for him to feel. Too much pain. I just feel a little goofy; slightly embarrassed that even at my age someone could rock my world like this.

Fortunately, we're both very practical and our needs are aligned on the goal of turning the farm into a sustainable system, so there is never going to be a time when there isn't "something to do", if we need something to do. Our skills/knowledge compliment each other to make that happen.

And I think he's going to find that he can have a social life again here. Rick's already invited him to hunt rattlesnakes... LOLOL. That is right up Buck's alley. Rick's wife is nice too. Ronnie, his brother, is getting around alot better and those two can compare notes on spinal injuries. As long as Ronnie minds his manners. Even Rick tries to rein him in.

It's been difficult to cope with this heat wave. My poor plants are pretty much compost. I MIGHT be able to save the medicinal herbs by getting them in the ground - the bigger ones anyway. Grow lights are a necessity; not an option anymore... and covered growing space, too. Hol is going with a walapini; I'll probably go high tunnel. Only thing I got in the ground before it got hot was potatos & half the herbs; and they're doing well.

Honestly, having fewer hats would be nice some days. I find myself spinning around looking for the next thing that needs to be addressed RIGHT NOW... and never getting caught up, much less a little ahead. Still have one more legal thing to deal with - but the business stuff comes first.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on July 03, 2020, 12:24:47 PM: Hi, Amber:

The only comment I have is.....
Hol spoke her piece. She doesn't understand what you do, regarding research, business, looking down the road planning directions and moves for farm and businesses.... investments.... future.

That's OK. You can hear her. Validate her feelings... opinions.... lack of knowledge and perhaps put that to bed.

I don't see anything to be gained from her sharing that over and over and over again. In fact, I'd be tempted to give her little jobs so SHE can do some research, collect information and make sense of it for the business, farm, sustainability and welfare of the employees.

If watching you do it doesn't clue her in....
perhaps doing.....
will.

You can add her efforts to your research and use it to form, tweak and run down ideas, bc....
90% research
10% execution

I know you want Hol to go back into her chosen career field, so I'm not suggesting you give her a job. I'm suggesting you give her missions to SHOW her what it is you're doing, and educate her so she stops making assumptions about what you're doing, or NOT doing.

My father would have called it getting out there and getting your nose bloody. Tearing off a chunk of raw meat with your teeth. Just.... getting the jobs done, no matter what it takes. This ongoing research is necessary and part of your reality.

If Hol needs to understand it, so she can turn back to her stuff, her business, her own plate....
perhaps show her.

Or not.

I'm just so excited about your plans and Buck and Hol's hut coming together. I can't tell you how satisfying it was to read about the counter top, the flooring, open shelves, and tile.... wood burning stove down below, where cold air drops.... just bananas happy for you all!

::Huge happy smile for A, B and family::

Light
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 03, 2020, 01:51:28 PM: Re. being idle:
I tell myself when I'm idle (TR: when I'm breathing) that I'm doing heavy mental work. More of the time than I like to admit, I'm simply idle. Which is why even a big back yard on a small scale feels like Amber's mountain to me.

Got to admit I don't envy you all that complexity, or simply, I'm incapable of it. But it is awesome, mind-boggling to read about. GOOD on you. What a leader you are, and how well you're working to safeguard a group of people's jobs. Bravo.

Wild and likely way-off guess: Does H hassle you about your business work because you process a lot of it aloud with her, or in her vicinity? If that's so, she might have trouble not being anxious about whatever worry/concern you're voicing? (And we all know things don't go well when there're not granite boundaries with Hol...)

I'm vacariously REALLY happy for you, Amber. And for Buck. A&B. What a chapter!

hugs
Hops

PS -- I wanna live in the Hut, if H ever moves out. I'm entirely useless, however.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 03, 2020, 05:06:36 PM: If you can sit on the deck/porch and watch - then, there's an important part of the purpose of the Hut, Hops. Watch the light; the creek rise; the birds, etc...

Yeah... I like the idea of giving her something to research. She HAS the ability/talent for that. Her conclusions aren't exactly "too far out there" either. And big YES, to granite boundaries.

She doesn't seem too anxious about this current deep dive, 'coz I haven't said a whole lot about what I'm finding... and she doesn't really feel enough ownership to make suggestions - yet. I've just started and am in the middle; then my printer decided to go walkabout from the network. (Saving that for later; it's REALLY cool downstairs.) But what HAS stopped is the prattle about me not being up to handling things. That's a good thing.

There have been some discussion on "Acceptance" -- and pondering & more discussion on what that means and how it acts as an energy in one's life. So some of her acting out, is balancing now. I just need to stick around and keep an eye on her through the full moon/eclipse; that energy has already been building and it's hard to tell right now which turn it'll take.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on July 03, 2020, 06:09:26 PM: Fair enought, Amber.

Light
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 04, 2020, 10:44:55 AM: Long night of communication under a full moon (if you follow the 3 days of full theory)...

this is the Buck moon. Look it up... LOL. He is THERE, I am here - and yet we can be so together the only thing we can't do is touch each other with hands; touching other ways instead. Argument can be made that's even more important.

He told me in depth how he feels about me. Why this is such an intense relationship - even though I've known him for years now. Explained a little about this telepathic connection, as much as he understands of it. I might indulge in some research about that today. Find something that's not quite so fairy-tale-ish or woo.

And finally, finally the toxins started leaking away from my eyes... from happiness this time. Not loss; not yearning; or frustration... SOME thing; was encapsulating me; holding me back still - and he's freed me from that simply with how he feels about me. I can learn a different way to be alone - this time, knowing he's with me in that private, invisible space. Even when he has to go away. I feel so much lighter and free-er. I've been "claimed"... LOL. After I claimed him last year... after mere hours of being in his presence... which isn't at all like the cautious, guarded, calculated me... so he's had to work through the "what is this??" too.

Last year, in the July full moon - was his last horrible surgery. When I wasn't sure I'd ever see him again. Well, I did. And my "observer" was a busy little thing, this time, let me tell you. Constantly monitoring how I felt around him, doing different things. How comfortable I was - any sign of hesitancy on his part - the subconscious tells we all have about our patterns of being/behaving - what the ebb & flow between us was like. I've done this "first days of being with a new man" a few times; not my first rodeo.

The very first day - he was asking directions to dishes in the cupboards - saying, he needed to know where I keep things. To take care of himself. He let me cook; thankfully he's not a picky eater - as long as it isn't a burnt offering... LOL. I think he knows where my tools are better than I do now. He washed his own coffee cup...

After giving him the tour of the city over the mountain; main thoroughfares from which he could find his way around; he watched how drained I was after the hours there. He picked up on what the reason for that is... and told me it was OK for me rest; he could work on whichever project that was that day. He even overwhelmed me by assuming I knew a lot more about the antenna project than I did and slowed down enough for me to keep up. And immediatelly shifted gears into that slower gear; didn't wait for me to say something -- he SAW it. So I didn't have my usual frazzled brain-short.

I couldn't stand not to be in the same room with him. LOL. You know how you can send pictures, etc from phone to phone? It was like that. Being around him, I was feeling and getting stronger... calmer... free-er of the accumulation of "head stuff" and it was so easy to be in that feeling-space with him; comfortable and nutritious! Nurturing. And it felt... quiet.

It totally doesn't feel possessive or controlling. It's almost as if he showing me who I am; how he sees me and feels about me... and this is, believe or not, new information for me. I can say with certainty I'm never been in relationship with any guy who was so spontaneously, emotionally, giving. And it's so incredibly simple and uncomplicated. He doesn't tell me; he shows me by how he is with me. He knows I can take care of myself.

Hol, he and I were trying to figure out how long we've known each other. How long we've been slowly gravitating toward each other. He thinks it's been at least 7-8 years; and I think he's right. Mike's mom died in 2010. And that was my first encounter with no-see-ums; and he was the source of the cold, black tea bags tip to take the itch down when I asked online. He was my FRIEND first; I was stilll married. And we could've easily stayed that way. And still be close.

And when Mike died, he was there when I needed him -- but kept his distance and maintained boundaries; and didn't press mine. It was only after I was here 2-3 years and most definitely bit off more than I could chew on the work/maintenance side of things that he rode to my rescue. LOL. He stood up out of the truck and I flew in for a hug... and then took a good look. Not at all what I expected or visualized. But I did like what I saw. And then I was flabbergasted by that feeling of giving from him... and he just ignored all my attempts to scare him off, too. LOL. And didn't think I was totally crazy or that I live in drama-central. (Even tho I think I do, sometimes.)

This summer I met him at a 7-11 over the mountain. He was tired after the long uphill drive so the plan was I'd make sure he wouldn't miss my road. It's gotten a lot harder to find. I pulled in and parked the rubicon, jumped out and got wrapped up in a hug that neither one of us let go of... and then I lost him on the curves going home. LOL. Had to pull off and wait for him a couple times. He's not used to driving hills anymore. And I haven't felt so alive and confident - I was showing off a little.

Last night... we both realized we've been looking for each other for a long, long time. Our "missing piece". And things are shifting up a level in the commitment arena. But except for knowing neither one of us is going anywhere and we don't want anyone else... I don't know that we need any of the other bits of commitment. We'll see; there's all the healthcare stuff... but Hol is POA for me.

We'll talk about all that later. But the plan for him to move in is still ON, and can't happen soon enough to suit me. The level of trust I have with him is such I think all that other stuff will resolve pretty easily, once he's here. The next couple months is going to be:

"The Adventures of A&B - The Beginning" -- even though we've known each other so long.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 04, 2020, 11:12:34 AM: The love story of A&B is very beautiful.
So happy to be reading it!!!!

My two favorite bits:

Quote
the toxins started leaking away from my eyes... from happiness this time. Not loss; not yearning; or frustration...

HAPPY TEARS. What a healing thing to happen. I can feel your relief.

Quote
I can say with certainty I'm never been in relationship with any guy who was so spontaneously, emotionally, giving. And it's so incredibly simple and uncomplicated. He doesn't tell me; he shows me by how he is with me. He knows I can take care of myself.

Absolutely wonderful. Simple. Straightforward. Real.

Oh YAY. So very happy for you both!

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 11, 2020, 11:31:15 PM: Buck got his orders. Report the 24th. Take covid test on 17th and again when he arrives. And radio silence for 7-10 days. So worst case, back August 3rd. Then they need to process his retirement. Somehow I'm imagining a few glitches in that process.... despite the fact that this year he needs to sign up for social security. Breathing.

I haven't said much, coz with the heat wave, I've had to find things to do inside. And that involved a lot of head work. Which hasn't exactly been comforting. But I have options. And I cleared a lot of old tangled cobwebs too. Breathing.

Hol's healing up well and got back to mowing today; she and I solved a repair issue on the mower today. Her head is in a peaceful place. She has friends coming to camp at the Hut site to help her move next weekend. She THINKS it'll be time. I hope so... contractor is already 6 weeks past when he thought they'd be done.

Lots of change going on. Quickly. I'm rolling with it. Some days easier than others. But one thing I've recently learned is that making sure I'm totally safe and guarded and never taking any risks.... isn't exactly "living".

And I'm choosing living. No matter what ELSE pops up on my radar.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 12, 2020, 12:04:55 PM: I'm so awed by you, Amber.
But this risk you're taking DOES sound as though it's grounded in a lot of layers of compatibility, deep and honest communication, and mutual desire.

August THIRD is very near! I am thrilled for you, and for B, and for A&B.

You are bold but conscious, in love and reasonable.

You have found your Outlander, my girl.

This is just beautiful and encouraging and uplifting to think about.

So very happy for you. You've been steady and true to yourself.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 12, 2020, 12:35:46 PM: I believe so, Hops.

I know it's unleashed a flood of crap left over in my head & heart, from years & years of putting up & shutting up & letting other people tell me who to be, how to act and what I'm supposed to want. As it comes up... it flows away. There's still a decontamination process to go through. But I'm no stranger to cleaning up toxic muck.

It'll help me discern present from old experiences in my feelings. I KNOW I'm not experiencing those things with B.
And that's just unusual enough to catalyze this "further processing" I'm going through. At this rate, I'll be done with it before he gets back. Another short busy month after that - then, he and I can figure out everything else together, in peace & privacy.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 13, 2020, 10:49:54 AM: This is the point of most friction/stress in a time of big change. Getting started, getting finished... letting go one set of conditions and getting familiar with the new one. I'm a tad depressed - maybe just a little sad, and definitely lethargic. It feels a lot like just after Mike died... and I only did what I had to do, to live every day but was nowhere near dealing with his accounts or estate. As much as I've wanted my house all to myself again - and the space back - I'm going to miss Hol's presence here. It's been almost 2 years now.

We're already talking about how often we need to get together and just empty our heads, brainstorm ideas, or resolve issues. Some of that is "as needed"; but because her partner isn't exactly communicative with her - when she needs to verbalize stuff in her head she relies on me to listen and feedback.

So on the plus side of the Hol living here experience... we are even closer than we were, in that we've cleared up a lot of old misunderstandings, done some historical deep dives into our shared past experiences, and both of our "buttons" are less reactive than they used to be. We have found the standalone principles that we absolutely agree on and are committed to, despite varying political inferences (I wanted to write interferences... sigh.)

But her need to be always busy and physically active has completelly disrupted what I had going - and was working on - in the area of self-motivation. I'm going to have see if I can remember what that consisted of again; and since I'm doing an extremely deep self-reflection/introspection right now - coz both Hol & I indirectly have changed each other (this feels much clearer and cleaner than it was before; even though it was pretty good then too) - and we're starting to both adjust to new space boundaries, with the move coming up - it's a great time for me to take stock of the things that have changed about me.

A lot of my hostess hangups are gone; all of her friends are quite accomplished and self-sufficient and accustomed to pitching in when they're visiting. I am particularly fond of her widowed friend M. We clicked right away and it might be because she lost her mom a few years prior to me meeting her. She's very giving and insightful and strong so we've shared a few things we have in common about loss.

Because of the two big dogs, Mr. Freddy-Big Purr-Cat and Steve/Hol in and out all the time... I've had to completely re-orient the priority of keeping the house clean. I'm aware of it; I care; but we still have bigger things to give our time to. When she's completely moved; then I'll spend the days required to do a deep clean.

I've learned to be a lot more open and less apologetic about talking about my feelings; expressing some difficult topics too... and navigating those conversations more neutrally.

I once again appreciate the restorative value to total silence - LOLOL. B likes it too. I've acquired some new music - again - from Hol's eclectic playlists. And I've gotten comfortable with just letting go - and Hol will often just jump in and make dinner, or brunch... taking over that role for a day or two.

I'm really really missing B's energy; just his presence - it's like instant relaxation magic for me. I've become aware of just how much tension I'm holding when he's not here, because of the sedative effect of his presence. It's steady calm and quiet; unperturbable - as opposed to my nervous/anxious zip-zip bouncing around. He gave me a large quartz crystal... I've been holding it in alternate hands when I'm resting; taking a break... whatever. It helps; almost feels like it's absorbing that energy and leaving me still. But then - my imaginative side has been super-charged lately.

Before this navel-gazing turns into procrastination (or any more procrastination) and being lazy... I need to address my post-it note of to-do items for today. Much as I'm enjoying just hanging out in this whole realm of "feelings"... the other stuff is necessary too... and time's a-wastin'.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on July 13, 2020, 12:08:17 PM: It sounds as though you've reached a clearish space after a lot of turbulence, Skep. I'm really pleased for you. I had no idea H had been there two years; it's seemed from this end just a few months? My sense of time is obviously lost when I'm reading posts lol. I'm glad you and she have had a good emotional sort out and got to a good place together.

I'm kind of seeing Buck as this big, calming, soothing blanket and I'm really glad he's been (and is) such a calming and positive presence in your life. I hope things get to a point where you can spend more time together soon xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 13, 2020, 01:36:09 PM: It won't be long now, till he's here Tupp! :D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 14, 2020, 08:44:08 AM: Something A&B had for each other, before we started seeing there was even a possibility of more than that between us - was actual respect for each other. It sounds like an old-fashioned concept... but it's not role-dependent. And I'm thinking it's the foundation of real unconditional love for each other.

He respected my attempts to do things way outside my experiential comfort zone and ability to fearlessly take on big projects and responsibilities (traditionally male areas of expertise) and still cover the nurturing side of "women's work". I respected his skills in those areas (not all guys are actually good at those things)- but more than that, his very active solo father-protector side was respect-worthy; the emotions that motivate him to take honorable actions. His very real "above & beyond" CARING about people and even critters was something he wasn't shy about expressing. And that's rare, I think. More rare than it should be.

After all - here's this steely-eyed combat hardened warrior who's seen things he won't describe in detail... and he can still be the most thoughtful, caring, gentle being.

I'm beginning to think, this is the first foundation that has to exist - and be demonstrated without resentments - in a relationship. Old-fashioned or not. Without respect, is reciprocal love real?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 14, 2020, 11:37:59 AM: What an incredibly positive thing this is, Amber:

Quote
I've learned to be a lot more open and less apologetic about talking about my feelings; expressing some difficult topics too... and navigating those conversations more neutrally.

And a quote that made my knees fold (such a gift from the universe!):

Quote
his presence - it's like instant relaxation magic for me

May you absorb much of that calming focus and energy from B so that never, ever will you be without it. I know you are working to learn to give it to yourself, so you become your own source of peace.

But to have a B like that appear in your life, in this stage of life...what a gift.

I'm over the moon for you two.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 15, 2020, 03:39:45 PM: I'm still doing a deep introspection through these next weeks, I think. I find Hol isn't a good person to talk this processing through with. She can't be objective enough. And she does tend to view what I'm saying through her own lens of emotions & experiences she's currently sorting out. I'm not second-guessing here or looking for something to fix; just trying to better understand this connection.

There isn't anything resembling a "red flag" anywhere in the total picture. But that doesn't necessarily mean that this is the absolute right thing for either of us. I sense he's kind of doing the same - since he's in quarantine till he gets on a plane. We're only touching base twice a day right now - coz it can be painful knowing we will have no contact for 10 days - LOL.

I sense that we're both sensitive to not wanting to disappoint each other. But we aren't betraying ourselves for connection either. Communication has been open, honest - for the moment we're in, even sometimes vulnerable. It's difficult for each of us to talk about the deep feelings - except to point at them, say "oh look, there they are"... we're gun-shy of those feelings, each of us. He's experienced deep rejection; I've watched relationships fall completely apart due to lack of nurturing - and the loss of a spouse, which completely up-ended my life. Those things make a person wary, not to the point of distrust... but hesitant; tentative; feeling things out. We both long for that deep connection again, is the sense I get.

I think it's likely that there are emotions we don't want to admit to ourselves; perhaps the depth of them instead. So there's been some tap-dancing around the topic of "just what do you want"; maybe more so on my part. I tend to be more "so what are you offering?" This connection took both of us by surprise - in it's suddenness, intensity, playfulness, comfort & ease, "too good to be true" flavor of it. But we've hung in there over a year, at distance - and that's made communication essential. We both are starting to know the "don't go there right now" signs in each other. And the other thing, looming over all of this is timing. We're delaying doing or saying certain things right now, due to circumstances. It's just not time yet.

Him, till the old commitments are done; fulfilled; and he's finally free to move on... me till Hol has moved into the Hut. For all she's a very perceptive little sprite - she MISperceives and superimposes her own twist on things that really are what they appear to be at face value. For us, anyway. Things may very well be different in her world; but then she tends to think that what's she's experienced is the ONLY thing that exists in reality. (She's at least aware that she wishes for things she hasn't yet experienced.)

So, we still aren't yet at the point we can actually create a "relationship"; that foundational structure of living daily life. We're both impatient for it to be time for that; LOL. Because everything we have already established and know, feels like "more please". This hasn't been an easy year for either of us. LOTS of work - inner & outer - going on. What Tupp said about being "independent within relationship" is something we intuitively knew was our "style" - he's gone so far as to tell me it's one of the things he most appreciates about me. That I'm not a dependent sort; that I think for myself and will challenge his assumptions - even long-held beliefs and I don't need him to validate my mine (even though it's rewarding when he does). I can very well manage on my own without him - as I've made clear on some occasions. I tell him, it's so wonderful to know that when I can't be strong anymore - he will. But being independent doesn't diminish the strength or depth of the connection. It's "added value" not something at the expense of the connection.

No, I'm not processing all of this to create a plan of organization and management for "how it should go". LOLOL. That would last about 5 minutes with him. A LOT more spontaneous than I am. But that's changing. And I'm trusting it; relaxed with it. We're both changing - not to please the other, or in response to signals or requests - we just have that effect on each other. That effect is causing us to tap into parts of ourselves that have been on hold, for the right time and place... or was hidden because others didn't understand or accept it. It's like we're both "sleeping beauty" and being awakened to ourselves as "whole beings" instead of somehow "lacking" or incomplete.

He's not my type; at all. At least, as he presents himself. And honestly, at this point, I think that's a GOOD thing. It's not that I've never known anyone like him; I have. But I never would've considered him "relationship material"; maybe a fling. I thought initially that's all this was. And when things got real between us, I had to rethink that first impression. I know I took him quite by surprise on several levels. He had no expectations of the sort when he first came to rescue me from my car problems. I didn't EITHER; I surprised myself. I am way too reserved & self-possessed to throw caution to the wind like that. Except this time, I recognized something in him I'd almost given up hope of ever coming across in life. When Hops says I've found my Outlander, that covers it.

I know we have enough of the basics in common to be compatible being together... and we're both brave enough and creative enough to figure out all the other stuff when nothing else is keeping us apart. We've both been tested too; on the level of commitment to each other; showing up for each other and being there through hard stuff.

I couldn't have dreamed this up if I tried; my imagination ain't THAT good... LOL. But then, that whole intuitive side of me has had a very long nap and he's woken her up now... and she woke up into a whole different world than she was used to. Still getting my bearings, I think. I'm thankful he actually understands that side of me; recognizes her, too. Accepts her. Oddly enough, I find it's strengthening my trust in all the pragmatic, intellectual, practical side of me, too.

Go figure.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 15, 2020, 11:11:20 PM: Awww, ((((Amber)))).

Quote
This hasn't been an easy year for either of us.

Lawd KNOWS it hasn't been!
And you feel a little wobbly, because even something wonderful that represents big change, or could, is scary.

You are so normal. Ha. Didn't expect that, didya?

I'm just feeling a whole lot of tenderness toward you both, and hope it's because I'm reflecting the vibes that are floating east from your mountain. (No idea where B is...underwater?)

You'd be weird if you had no fear at all, especially as the reality-choices come closer. I have complete faith you will be okay, whatever and however you decide things.

I am not confident that Hol-involved, Hol-hearing-the-layers, Hol-being-your-closest-confidante (because who else is handy on a mountain near not much, with no Amazon group yet for you in town?). This beloved chile matters, but she's also run you through this year, over and over, because of her own stuff.

So I feel protective of your privacy, and confident in your capacity, and hopeful you'll let the good in and keep the toxic out.

Ohhhh, Jamie..... LOL.

Big hugs, reassuring ones -- you are going to be OKAY. It doesn't have to be explicated or justified or understood-right-now-in-full to its toenails. A&B have a real thing going on. A lot of the good stuff will be UNEXPECTED. And you'll figure out how to navigate it.

A perverse thing to say, but I think at this point in life, sometimes happiness can have moments where the brain thinks: wait, can happiness be hard? Sure it can. Temporarily. It's messy to mix romance and LTRs into the actual daily mud. It's a process, not a produce. And even in the messiness, it's...well, that's up to you to fill in and decide about.

However it goes, be-all or be-now, you're still you. Don't lose that wonderful woman in the mix.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 16, 2020, 10:10:06 AM: LTRs? Whatzit? (For a techie, I've become somewhat of a dinosaur...)

I'm glad you understand why I have to put those words somewhere besides my head Hops; I was definitely afraid maybe you wouldn't see it that way. I'm actively journaling; I'm commenting on some tarot card reader's videos (which is totally against my cyber security religion); talking to B as much as I can during the day without making both of us nutz... he's on quarantine after Covid test Monday; his D left to wait out his time away with friends yesterday; he leaves next Friday and will get tested again when he arrives where ever he's gotta be.

My friend Debbie has gone into hibernation, since I had to say no to her queries last couple times, about coming here for a weekend mental health break. She's got a lot of drama going on - between her job being shutdown, caring for her elderly mom, drama with her brother.... and I had drama going on here too. It's OK, we'll reconnect again and pick up where we left off and get caught up again.

I felt affinity for the woman Sheriff's deputy who was here with a partner looking for a missing kid yesterday. I think she recognized me from when I put in my application for CCW permit. Years ago now. I still didn't catch her name, but I recognized her too. They checked w/all my neighbors too, since we're the closest east - from the development where the kid lived and it's pretty much wide open woods... with our homestead outbuildings and such. Don't know if he was a runaway or what... but no sign of him here. Makes me think he met a pre-arranged ride. He's 14. No search & rescue kind of thing - just inquiries if we'd seen/heard anything. A month ago, it was neighbors looking for a pair of blind beagles that ran off and got lost; both Hol and I did hear them. There isn't a lot of what you'd call opportunities for a social life out here.

I've met Rick's wife Missy; I like her and we plan to invite both of them out for cookout when a lot of the work on the hut is done. I've met his Mom when she came out with Ronnie (Rick's brother) to hunt morels. Ronnie's wife wants nothing to do with his hunting friends. So we're on Ronnie's list of "get out for awhile" destinations. He's driving and starting to walk again.

I'm making a gentle but firm effort to separate from Hol these days; she is literally a couple weeks from moving into the Hut - and it'd be next week, if the contractor wasn't spread so thin right now. She's LOOKING for things to complain about, she's getting that frustrated. To be fair, contractor said they'd be done a couple weeks ago. The "downstream" effects of Covid on the supply chain has affected things like lumber availability. And shipping delays... and... weird stuff in shipping. She'd ordered a pedestal sink for the master bath; a week or two late - she got the base but no basin. Called the company; yesterday UPS brought the basin - someone put it in a box without any padding or even bubble wrap and it was porcelain confetti... she didn't accept it. It'll be another 3 weeks before they can get her another one.

But mentally/emotionally - I'm trying to create the new arrangement for her. In that, we each live our own lives here and don't have to share every last detail or thought in our heads with each other. 'Sides, we're going to miss little moments like when I got up for a bowl of ice cream with both caramel & chocolate sauce last night... and she was in the kitchen... and got that approving "oh YEAAAAAHH" look on her face... followed by giggles from both of us.

----------
I think the A&B experience is waking up the sleeping beauty emotional/intuitive me from it's almost lifelong slumber. And I find that disorienting and a little scary because the world has definitely changed since the days she had to go to sleep. That's part of what's new, scary, exhilarating... and yet familiar at the same time.

In the Time of Twiggy - EVERYTHING about me was emotional and intuitive - and it was more than overwhelming; it disabled me from functioning. And so, the "taboo" about accepting that side of myself as valid, real, and important was created. It wasn't balanced; but it was necessary at the time - because the age I was at, was crucial to acquiring the skills to be a functioning, autonomous, adult. Has it affected my relationships? Ya, you betcha.

Back then, I needed my intellectual, practical, pragmatic side of my brain to survive and escape - and sort out - what living with my Mom was like; what home was like for me. And the easiest way to amplify that at my age then, was to push all the emotional side over "there" - and work hard to contain it's effect on me in favor of being a logical, rational being instead.

What's happening NOW, is that I feel safe - where I am, with the people around me, with myself - even that taboo side - and it's finally time to balance it, and step into the full power/caring of Amber. While I'm missing Buck every minute of the day... this time before he's really here is my chance to get this process established for myself. Integrating; fusing it or forging it into whatever that becomes. That's partly the effect B's had on me - not something he did or asked for or required - but the organic change of the chemistry between us. And it's partly finally just TIME for me to do this. The same thing is happening to him, but I haven't asked yet if he's noticed it. I have seen it though. He's engaging with people on our shared forum, on a daily basis... sharing his knowledge, his caring, and he's hilariously funny and entertaining. He's going one on one with the guys there, too... the ones who contacted him during the last hospital stay; who share the same interests. There's even a new one that's joined the crew who has more of a psych background that I connect with, too.

Hol has begun stepping up into her role/responsibility in her own way around here, the past couple years. And I'm keeping her in the loop on the business stuff too. So she KNOWS what/why about things that go on before it's her turn - if I can save it, that is. I start dealing with that today, too. Just discussions at this point... with lots of finger-crossing and sacrifices to the gods of commerce about the future. Which looks rather bleak, in all reality. But tough times can be survived... and that's my touchstone and goal here. I'm a firm believer in trying to work WITH conditions instead of against them and that requires the kind of intuition and far-seeing that I know this forsaken side of myself is quite good at.

And I'm going to start building the rock wall in the bedroom today too. And getting the master bedroom reno completed. Don't know how much I'm going to hang out with Hol's group of campers this weekend... but she DID order overnight delivery of crab cakes from her favorite place in B'more to cook over the fire in cast iron... LOLOL. One of them has my name on it. :D I know most of this group; there's only a couple that are new to me - but that I've learned about from Hol's stories and experiences with them.

She knows what my rules are about inviting people here. She is abiding by them. (This has been planned for a month; she asked permission too.) Interestingly - Steve is my ally more on this subject that one would've expected. But on the other hand - of COURSE she wants to invite her friends out to stay; she IS a social creature and likes organizing adventures - like river tubing & hikes & picnics - for them. But it's mostly her close-in circle of people that she needs in her life - as much as she depends on them, too. I can't deny her that... but our situation is good for everyone having the space and privacy needed... and they even have an indoor toilet now (set temporarily) at the Hut!! LOLOLOL. We're not talking wild partiers here; Hol might be the wildest of the bunch... but even she's calmed down quite a bit since being out here. Again, Steve is an ally in that too. Despite the things that I think are huge negatives about him, I can be objective and appreciate when our interests coincide.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 18, 2020, 08:44:45 AM: AHHHHHhhhhh....

splendidly quiet & leisurely evening, after the fixin's for their cookout were gathered and a brief bit of fireworks from the camp site down below. I did notice this morning that someone trekked up here in the middle of the night for her usual midnight snack... there is evidence of a bowl of choolate ice cream having been consumed after B & I finally stopped talking & closed our eyes. Which was LATE.

LOL - I think it was Hops mentioned texting. A mutual friend had told me a year or so ago, that B hated to text; to just call him instead. You can't prove it by me. LOL. There are so many texts back & forth between us on any given day - if it's been more than 4 hours since he's heard from me - he'll ask if I'm OK. LOLOL. I never used to carry the cell anywhere... now I'm shopping for shorts & pants that have a pocket the right size for my phone. Hol begged me to keep the phone with me - in case something happened. And I just never remembered. LOLOL. I think she's getting over thinking of me as decrepit - but it's taken a whole "campaign". With B, it's just a way to be together - across the states. To share our day - just as if we were physically in the same location.

Some fairly complex and sensitive emotional stuff has been worked out via text; on both sides. I think in SOME ways it's improved and facilitated communication between us. A way to sustain connection - without intruding much into whatever we're involved in, in meat space. Like an email - a message will just sit there until one can direct attention to it. There is a kinda of Pavlovian "answer the ringing phone" reflex too; but it's easily managed.

And mostly, our back & forth chats are the normal daily routine stuff people talk about in the mornings - what's your day look like? what do you want to do today? need a hand? and then in the evenings... it's more personal and funny and fun and sweet. The daily rituals... establishing how much space there is within the relationship for each of us to do our things - him, in the process of getting ready to move; me playing number cruncher to arrive at a path for helping the business to survive through this covid economic disaster without having to lay anyone off - but also not paying them for time when there is nothing to do at work, either. I'm just doing my homework and throwing brainstorm spaghetti ideas at the wall for now. It's probably going to require more than one "remedy". At least recently, that's what it's been like.

I can't possibly describe what a relief it is, that he doesn't expect me to be visually right where he is all the time. Or wanting/needing me to go out & run errands with him. I can go do what I want to do with my day. See other people; spend special time with Hol doing something...

and yet, when he was here for a week - only a week! - I couldn't tear myself away from just watching him, if there wasn't any need for me to help. I kept reaching out to touch him - YES; he's really real and he's really here!

And I completely lost my phone several times. But then, the other person I'm tethered to - Hol - was irately calling me, asking if I'd seen her txt message... LOLOLOL. It's become like Star Trek's communicators or two-way radios for us, even when she's home and in different buildings or in various parts of the property.

So much for old-time primitive living, huh?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 18, 2020, 10:11:36 AM: I'm happy y'all text happily, Ms A!
Sounds like it's been a wonderful way to stay connected and in the present with B as this whole thing grew.

Dif'rent strokes make sense...I'm so wedded to my laptop it sometimes goes to the bathroom with me! But you couldn't pay me enough to text a lot. It's just small keys, fiddly feeling, and I'm so wedded to a traditional keyboard that I don't like it. And the compulsive checking that I already do online would get worse if I had a second source of it.

I'm grateful I have a cell for travel though, or being out and about. And to confirm time/location/meetups (back in the day when I did all that stuff).

I love summer. I'm still not active enough but I just love the light and the greenery.

hugs
Hops
BTW, "LTR" was a typo....I meant "LDR" for long-distance relationship. Ooops.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 18, 2020, 02:03:30 PM: It is that, CB.

I worked in tech for 10 years; on call, 24-7 - even in blizzards; responsible for software and servers and campus wide upgrade planning. Oh, and training too. LOL. When I quit, I intentionally dumped a lot of that crap out of my head - deleted it and rewrote those sections of my internal hard drive (brain). The only aspect I kinda miss of it was working with databases and web applications. Sometimes, anyway.

Except for topic-specific discussion forums, I no longer have any social media accounts. I've do have an instagram account just to see my kids' pictures. Hol is a pretty good photog even with a phone. And her silly sick twisted sense of humor comes through a lot of times. Never filled out a profile; never uploaded anything and rarely will I comment.

Its actually a time-consuming and tedious process to get yourself removed from all that stuff. The texting is for me, more like a chatroom (which can move faster than I type) or instant messaging.... so it kinda provides that space for person to person interaction and connection. We only occasionally have issues with understanding a message - and that's usually coz of acronym usage or topic shift into something one of us is completely clueless about. And we're pretty good at conveying "tone" or the emotional undercurrent too.

Oddly, I can't stand the video message/conference software. LOLOL. I used to do some training with the earlier versions of that technology and a group of consultants was i in, also got together for meetings on certain projects that way. (People were distributed throughout the US and Europe.) For a personal conversation it just seems to be too.... something for me to feel comfortable.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 21, 2020, 10:21:43 AM: Well, tensions are running kinda high with the contractor about finishing up the Hut. Honestly, 2-3 guys would be done and out of the way of plumbers & electricians in a week if they were just here the 4 days a week they work. Hol thinks she's been too nice about it... but contractor is over-extended for the crew he has and while he says he's trying to keep everyone happy -- Hol & I both know a) that's impossible and b) it will easier if you just wrap up what's close to "done" first... then you can distribute people over fewer jobs. Really and truly, 4 days of solid work, and appliance could go in and she move stuff in. There are STILL things to finish up outside... but she just wants to be in HER house.

She had friends come to camp down at the hut over the weekend and I was basically on my own up in my house... and loving it. I just had a full-on stop and with the abominable heat & humidity we've got... I needed it. Seems the heat just drains every ounce of motivation, energy & even caring out of me. I'm much more lively in -25 and blowing snow. LOLOL.

Buck leaves Friday for this training obligation - and as usual, a whole bunch of other life things dropped on him all at once while he was mentally preparing and going over all the safety protocols (it's been decades since he's done anything like this). So, I got a phone call late at night. Sent him a message this morning about how stressful the ending of a cycle, moving, sending a kid out of the nest, and basically starting your life all over again can be. I should know. LOLOLOL. How many times have I juggled that many things all at once? Then, I reminded him - all that is easier with a partner, even if all you need is moral support and a willing, caring ear.

He's calmer this morning, and still not quite balanced - but he's getting there. He has a new primary care doc, that he's paying out of pocket for, and this one seems to be quite good. He told B there are 4-5 OTHER antibiotics that should've been tried and for 2 weeks longer on each course, to completely clear the infection he got from the hospital. Hospital staff told him it would lay dormant and flare up again & again. New doc said: not so. So, keeping my fingers crossed. That hospital is also responsible for the recurrent meningitis problem, too. Started with faulty surgeries, escalated to faulty med devices... it's all finally a lot clearer in my mind what happened and what kind of lack of accountability there is at that place. As it stands, he still has to have one more outpatient surgery to relocate the paddles of the stimulator on his vertebra -- the surgeon put them in the wrong place. (And I hesitate to think they will get it right THIS time either.)

I can't decide if society has reached the point of over-complexity that total entropy is setting in... or what. But I started noticing years & years ago... that it seemed caring about doing a good job on a LOT of things just didn't seem to be a priority anymore with a lot of people.

Oh, and there is some real disturbing news out in my tiny little chunk of the world. Last weekend, some deputies showed up to ask if we'd seen a 14 yr old boy who'd gone missing... or noticed anything odd around here. Hol had already seen flyers posted at the stores listing him as "endangered" - but not why. The family is from Connecticut, so that might be why... unfamiliar environment for the kid (just moved here in march) or there was something else going on... and this week the search is over. They found remains that look to be him, in a shallow grave near his home. It's just over my west ridge... and down the hollow to the SW. STILL too close for comfort. A couple of older teens are suspects; one was already arrested for burglery.

And I think I saw those two teens, 2 weeks before. B & I had run to the convenience store and I was waiting in the truck for him. Kids walked out minding their own business and started heading up the road on that side of the ridge. But I got an instant totally creeped out by evil feeling from them. So much so that even with the windows down in the truck I felt I needed to lock the damn doors. Now - this doesn't happen to me much. Even when I'm in Baltimore, downtown, and at night time. I'm careful; yes. But this hit like a huge wave of "evil" to me... and all I figured it was, at the time, was just me being tired and letting my imagination run away with me. I told B about it and he said he picked up something similar from them. I don't ever pick up feelings like that when I'm out & about. I think my spidey sense kicked in.

But I haven't called the sheriff... coz it's not exactly helpful for them. That poor kid. I don't yet know what all the story is about him, but when the deputy said they were checking all the wooded areas around here... didn't even know what he was wearing... well, I could easily suppose he was hungry and scared if he was running away from an immediate threat. Or that he got a ride from a friend to get back to an estranged parent maybe?? I never would've expected him to be killed. I'm sure once more details are public - the story will be even more sad. Hol and I just let it all sink in yesterday... but we're going to have a talk soon about security and change a few things around here.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: CB123 on July 21, 2020, 11:08:36 AM: Such a sad story, Amber.

I'll bet that the investigation could use your info, actually. If you can reconstruct when you saw them, investigators could go back and look at the security tapes in the store. It may identify and locate them at a point in the timeline that would be helpful.

CB
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 21, 2020, 11:29:11 AM: Maybe. I was so affected I couldn't even give a decent description of them; just general stuff. They've already arrested one for burglary and have another suspect in mind. My spidey sense isn't going to be proof of anything nor is a couple kids - who probably live here (one is a relative of the poor kid) - buying drinks & snacks at the store.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on July 21, 2020, 02:28:25 PM: Oh, Skep, that poor boy, what a horrible thing to have happened. It does really hit home when it's that close - we all read about it in the papers but when it's literally on your doorstep it really brings everything home. And to think other kids can do it. That chills me. Sorry to read it. And agree completely with people not doing a good job - it's very hard to get anything done well here. A lot of people seem to focus on doing as little as they can get away with. I had a guy give me a quote to wash the windows last October and he said he'd be in touch the following week to sort out a time to do it. He called last week! Mad people. I am sorry about the boy, that's awful news xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 21, 2020, 03:11:24 PM: I'm with CB on this, Amber.
Your minor detail via spidey sense may actually contribute something useful to the timeline. Even if it doesn't, you will have the understanding that you offered and stepped up, fwiw. Imo, that'd be better to live with than the possibility your unknown bit could have helped. They follow up a lot of vague and obscure tips to get to the real stuff, routinely.

I'm so sorry this came so near.
And terribly sorry for the murdered boy.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 21, 2020, 11:18:56 PM: I'm really perturbed.

I know people do bad things all the time. Even to this extent. But it was the feeling of true, pure evil that has undone me. I touched it. I know what it was. This is my terror-dream.

And I know I'm standing watch over my small flock tonight. HOPING it's totally unnecessary. Hoping the evil spent itself and will be captured in time. It makes me so sad. I can't even begin to find words. That family hoped they'd find refuge. And it IS a refuge. Where did the evil come from?

This place is so pure and peaceful and nurturing. Healing. The energy here is strong. How could evil find a way into this?? I just have to adjust my thinking and realize that of course evil would see this as a target. And I refuse to let it.

I won't have it. I just won't.

Just like I don't allow ghosts in my house. I don't allow that kind of evil around me. Lots of other things can irritate me, but nothing scares the shit out of me like pure evil. For the sake of evil. I simply will NOT allow it to exist near me. Maybe, I'm a total fool for thinking I can take it on. Maybe there's enough hobbit in me, to overcome it. Simply by not giving up or giving in. It's just NOT RIGHT. And if all I can do is put up a force field to ward it off... I will do that. It's not just me now. Hol's energy is there too. And even Steve's. Buck's too.

I want to find that family and bring them them some caring. If they're still here. I'd understand if they ran. None of this makes sense in my world. Yeah, I'm traumatized by this. That isn't at all my experience of this place. And I don't get what would make other teens - or even other adults - think this was a good place to do such things. Totally diifferent energy here. As if any place was a good place to do such things. DUH Amber. There are bad people who give evil a place to flourish.

I dunno. It's partly that visceral experience of feeling pure evil... out of the blue... for no discernable reason that freaked me out and then later, what came to be reality. And the pure tragedy of that reality. In juxtaposition with what I know about the energy of this place. It's protected; this place is. Not by me. I just don't understand yet. But even when I do, I have a feeling I'm still gonna be sad about this. I don't know the family. I'm that much of a hermit. But it doesn't mean I don't care.

This didn't need to happen. It's the true meaning of senseless.

Part of me is just devastated. Why did I ever think I could I teach? How is it that some people are so beyond hearing? Caring? How exactly did this happen? What is WRONG with people these days?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 22, 2020, 07:40:19 AM: No place is a good place to do such things.

Your farm's beauty and peace are not destroyed.
You do not have to evoke magical powers to fight evil.
It consumes itself, ultimately.

Evil isn't a presence, it is an absence of good and peace.
A pitiable glitch, an emptiness, an abandonment of life.

Your good and your peace already outweigh a visit from evil.
It is already undone. Beauty and creativity and goodwill win.

You are surrounded by life and by beauty.

Don't despair, Amber. As ugly as this was, it was not a message
for you or yours. It was not personal to you, the location was a random
and passing event, like a gust of wind.

Don't let it take your peace. You generate your own peace.

Hugs and comfort,
Hops

PS--Your loving attention to each other--and talking about it, all you need to for as long as you need to--will help you and everyone there, heal from the feeling of horror.

If his grave was actually on your property, perhaps you could plant a lovely tree in his name?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 23, 2020, 05:50:20 AM: Thanks ladies... I lost my other post last evening; storms have been rolling thru, with serious lightning and the cell tower was down. Along with the needed rain, my sinuses let loose and I fought a headache all day yesterday.

I've known for years - with my brain - that yes, even out here things like this happen from time to time. And all the events took place out of sight on the other side of the ridge from us. There is a small development over there and Ronnie warned me that there is the occasional problem from that direction shortly after I moved in. Nothing happened right within the boundary of my property. The grave wasn't dug this side of the ridge, I can tell you that. My side of the ridge is impossibly steep. We can drive ATV/UTVs up a winding path that been opened up over YEARS and that's about it; it's even a strenuous hike. But the land is basically open to surrounding tracts of land and my chunk is "blessed" with boulders and rocks. LOL. Giant earth granola.

The feeling that settled on me - was exactly that violation CB. Way back when, I was home when I was attacked. And the feeling of evil - of meeting it face to face - was strong then, too. Overwhelming. I do experience things intensely (I tend to think all people do, despite their best efforts not to). Of course, now I know better what to do with those feelings. So I was able to express it the other night... get it out where I could "see" it. And that was enough to finally sleep. Mostly I was just mourning for this young man... regardless of details that may still be revealed about what was really going on... there was a burglery involved I believe... and we are able to defend our property with lethal force in WV legally .... and dealing with my refusal to accept evil around me. Two completely different things for me. Grief is such a familiar old friend for me... I don't resist it anymore. I don't like the feeling of internal pressure that builds up, trying to avoid feeling it.

The sense of evil... MIGHT have a connection to that; but this was more an energy unconnected to the real events that I felt was walking unrestricted around here. In my weird collection of education/knowledge about things like this... light and dark forces are ALL around us all the time. We can choose to tune in our preference, most of the time - until enough force acumulates... or complacency sets in... or obliviousness... or distraction... and then sometimes the dark forces see a chance to push out into the reality a bit more of itself. Tiny influences. Y'all know the yin/yang symbol... at some place in that image... there are two tiny places where there is just a speck of black or white pigment before it changes to it's opposite: that's what I'm talking about here. White has an essence to it and variety within it... just as black does. Neither is inherently "good" or "bad", as referenced to morality...

B had quoted to me, the old "evil lies in the heart of all men" lines... and that's when I realized I mean something ELSE by "evil" than most people do. Now I guess I'll try to figure out how to describe it. LOL.

But first, protection rituals. Yep.... cleansing and protection.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 23, 2020, 10:30:01 AM: I have similar thoughts about the accused rapist next door. He has new charges, from an outlying county. Which I find completely believable, but fingers crossed.

I have used bright powerful energy ever since I moved in. When he tried to get friendly, I would stiffen up into an upright snotty lady persona instantly, and decline my head courteously, and walk on indoors with a regal don't-fuck-with-me posture. (My inner thought is just a steel boundary, a loud kind of "absolutely NOT, I am not going to be pals with you").

He's never bothered me since. He isn't on his property often, thank heaven, although his miserable wife is at times. They have other places. But my hope is that one of these days he'll be put on trial and go away for a nice loooooong time. Bad vibes, but also coward vibes.

Being good friends with two other neighbors feels protective, and I sense he won't aggress where he lives.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on July 23, 2020, 06:29:52 PM: Amber:

I was so sad to read about the death of the boy in your area. There's no explaining that kind of horror, IME.

I've experienced the presence of an evil person or people. I can't say what that is, exactly, either. It felt like molevolent energy... super focused energy. Looking for a place to land and become more of what it was. It was looking to exert itself on others, to be seen and felt. To impact others.

Maybe those people don't feel they exist unless they're exerting force on a more vulberable person. I have no idea. I'm not built that way. I catch myself trying to picture the people, causes and conditions leading to this..... state in a human being. It's always a mistake.

There must be levels of evil. Of energy always looking to inflict trauma, and energies finding opportunities and seizing them, when they otherwise might not be so focused exclusively on doing harm.

I don't believe any child is born with a malevolent spirit/energy/a will to do harm. I supposed there are children in the world who's stories and parents would give me pause, but I have to believe there's something acting on them... something creates that change in them. That's what I believe today.

I absolutely believe in our innate sense of identifying predators and prey. Of BEING one of the other, as well.

My youngest dd had a friend over the other night. DD's older cousin said this friend gave off "kindnappable" vibes. Niece just zeroed in on what is a likely truth, quickly.

There's evil we can talk to, and evil that's coming at us, bc it's come at many people before us, and will go on attacking those who come after... until caught or stopped.

Assuming the best in everyone is..... something that's not normal, iME. It's something that's trained into people, mostly women, IME. I think some parents do it to their children bc it makes their lives easier... things like...."You don't hate that dress..... you don't like those pants... you don't dislike playing with Jenny, etc." I know there are parents who DO intend to harm their children. I think many just don't know better.

To ignore one's instincts is counter intuitive. To train someone to ignore their instincts... is..... can be many different things.

I hope we all, on this board, choose to honor ourselves and our instincts above all else.

I'll be curious how your ideas around evil develop, Amber.

Hops: I'm so glad you have pooch there. She's not just a great companion. She's a willing early warning system. Dogs are born protectors of their territory and pack members, IME.
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 23, 2020, 08:42:50 PM: Lighter - a super-focused malevolent energy - is REAL close to what I felt. But it looks to corrupt and INFLUENCE other's actions... against prey. Including those of us who can recognize it; we ourselves can be vulnerable.

How it passed by me (even while freaking me completely out) I'll never know. Maybe I still have protection against that, that I haven't recognized yet.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 23, 2020, 11:03:54 PM: It's odd to me that I described using "bright, powerful energy" because the truth is I'm completely lost in y'all's discussion of dark forces and evil and all that.

Seems inconsistent (me). I'm not much of a believer in elaborate energy ideas. But I did describe using that. I think what I felt was something like that...but I was also using class signals, class intimidation. Maybe that's an off-putting energy. I sure knew I was drawing on something protective, insulative. And I know intuition is real, and I believe in the possibility of good things happening.

But I have no belief in magic or special connections with energy fields, or shamanism, or Tarot or astrology, so I'm kind of in the weeds on this one.

I think (for me only) they veer too close to religions, and I find nature awesome enough. I don't feel comfortable about the "supernatural" realms, neither the "good ones/gods" which harm so many psychologically due to a lot of religious teachings (particularly females) nor the "bad ones/devils" which harm even more. I do not believe in a force of evil. Yet I still hold on to vestiges of my childhood faith. Until a few years ago, I held a trace belief in the power of prayer.

Very confusing. I have strong mystical tendencies at times, but as usual, I'm so deeply allergic to definitions of what all that is, that I stick with mystery.

I do recognize there is an emptiness or amorality in some people that show a void, an absence of good, an inability to be moved by empathy. Maybe it's the same thing as what people mean by evil; I'm just flopping around semantically.

My main thoughts about the killer teenagers were more psychologically oriented -- as in, isolated youth with little to draw on, in a bleak rural culture which used to offer or demand vital activities and meaningful, sustaining roles for many of them has been replaced by vacuous media and an extremely dark and dangerous internet....so many are losing their way.

Nothing justifies what they did. But I think the culture has lost old touchstones of community that held youth close and nurtured them. And media and internet and brutal political corruption and neglect have dug pits in a lot of vulnerable kids, to be filled by the handiest cultural trash, which is now flows in a torrent into their minds.

I don't think we should go backward. But we have to find a way to care about our kids, in every zip code, with superb public education for ALL of them, and books and thinking instead of screens and playing...and mentors and extended families of support even if those are made of volunteers. Kids are getting SO lost today.

Some of them are wired wrong and born dangerous, but I think most are born innocent and vulnerable to neglect, to poisoning, to toxic masculinity, to violent culture, to horror, to loneliness so profound it numbs them...and mayhem calls.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 24, 2020, 08:29:20 AM: Most of my life, I've stayed within those definitions for human nature too Hops. That's why I spent so many years learning as much as I could about those different ways to "explaining life/world to yourself". There is ENOUGH there, contradictory and otherwise, to study for a lifetime.

Chi, as in Chi Gong or Tai Chi, is energy. The chakras are energy. I've always seen emotions as a form of energy.

It made absolute sense to me that you said "bright, powerful energy" Hops; I know the taste of that one, too. That is exactly the energy in the last form of the 103 movements - a "ward off" position/movement. Mayhap we've tripped over a new sometimes topic here for insights & discussion. The number of symbols - across faiths & the arts - that represent that energy standing against "evil"... is HUGE.

IF, it's accepted that light and dark always co-exist within the realm of life and human experience... then, those odd passing INTENSE sensations of Bright energy or pure evil... that manifest in reality... would indicate a serious imbalance. And of course, we can pretty much see the evidence of that in current events. Even Mother Nature feels menopausal these days. Reiki purports to help balance energy flow in individuals; is there a Reiki for the world? Life? LOTS of things are available at an individual level.

At the collective consciousness level, it seems there is an absence and gross misunderstanding of what balance truly is... some days it even seems it's a willful denial and active resistance to the idea that balance is a good thing. IE, there are cracks in the collective's being and awareness that allows evil to disperse and spread more quickly. Unless there is enough bright, powerful energy to banish the evil back into the shadows under the rock from under which it crawled out at that opportunity.

Transformation processes are alternately chaotic, terrifying, stressful, frustrating, absurdly comical and ultimately provide a satisfying sense of accomplishment or a relief in coming out the other side more whole and intact. (Hopefully)

This is starting to really ramble again. But I'm focused on finding a recommendation on "what to do" (if anything) on a few different levels about this particular kind of time-specific experience in life that exists right now. As far as inner practices and possibilities to counter some of the effects. What I'm talking about in "current events" is really just beginning. And while the practical "what to do" aspects are widely covered and shared lots of places... the inner work is just left to flounder and flail... and find respite in things there seem to "magically" be no shortage of.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 25, 2020, 09:12:42 AM: B was "wheels up" finally around 7 pm. We don't say goodbye... sailors have lots of superstititions & I can't; it's too emotional... usually au revoir. But this one was tough for both of us. Even with as much space as we allow we other during the day... he's definitely kept me mentally/emotionally "busy". His pickup time changed 3 times. He remembered more things he should've packed around 5. His brain works a LOT like mine. Kinda OCD... but still knowing how/when to put that on pause. And he's "radio silent" for the duration - no way to communicate - because of his location. He thinks he'll be back to his phone Friday or Saturday next week.

I've framed it all as - He has to go to work for a week. And because of the nature of the work - he can't have any distractions. So it's OK. It's not the same as being deployed into a battle zone. He is stateside, kinda; and is simply doing training for a class. And yes, what he is teaching is very potentially dangerous. But if anyone knows what he's doing and is GOOD at it, it's Buck. In fact - this has generated some extra communication that makes clear the significance of each other has gotten deeper and more committed; more vulnerable and transparent; more clearly defined.

I got a PM from him, yesterday - with txt'd instructions not to open it till he was wheels up. LOLOL. He'd left me a sweet romantic message about his feelings for me. Which of course, I can't respond to it until next week. LOLOLOL. We're both pretty good at "delayed gratification" - but we're both experiencing some major impatience too. I did send him a typical "good night" text anyway last night - just in case he was in a hotel and had his phone. Habits....

This is a BFD for him. He enlisted in '72.... injured in '94... but was never processed out of the service. So it's been a huge part of his life. And since the other guys who knew the same stuff are already beyond being able to pass on what he knows... he's IT. He can't exactly tell me what it is that is so important to the Navy that they'd bring back a 64 yr old, medically disabled member for one more training mission... that comes with the territory. My curiosity is unruly. LOLOL. So I've told him to have fun; enjoy himself - but not TOO much. It has to be incredibly validating to be this important to the higher-ups that they actually singled him out - and hid him away even in records - to be able to deploy him at just the right time. And instead of just a handful of 20-30 somethings in his class, there's almost 3x as many supplied as "alternates" in case he washes out some of the first choice candidates. He even got to keep his rank for this trip. (I kinda think he might even get a bump up for this unusual "service" - which will boost his retirement benefits. But I'm not going to hold my breath, either.)

So, my plan for the upcoming week is to keep myself occupied with crossing things off the to-do list. The heat should break early next week and until then, I can stay busy in the house & studio with some of the things I usually procrastinate about. Some self-care stuff too. Finishing the master bedroom.

One of the things he pointed out to me in his message is that the separate paths we've been on the past 50 years... is what brought us together now; the things we've been through, processed, survived - helps us appreciate what the other is. Who the other is. He's my zombie apocalypse partner... LOLOLOL. Which is kinda funny (and kinda NOT) because it seems my important relationship's "other" has always suited the particular phase of life I was in - and what I needed from a partner at that time. I might actually think about how weird that is today... when I head out to the studio to finish up that project. But he's right; I wouldn't have been able to SEE him or appreciate him when I was younger; less experienced; less familiar with my own self. He's done the same walk too.

And I'm just FINE for this week... even if I don't like it. I can't possibly imagine how difficult it is for military wives to manage with 6 month, 1 year and 2 year deployments. How does a relationship survive that much separation? After a year of a distance relationship, I know the only reason the relationship still exists is because of the constant communication that's been possible for us. And he KNOWS what it takes to maintain his side of it. He works at it.

So yeah - my pragmatic side is kinda taking a back seat to the emotional stuff going on. There's always some mix of the two... different points on the continuum between the two points of totally one thing or the other. But the emotional side is definitely more pronounced right now. And I haven't spent that much time "there" since those first months after Mike died. This is JUST as intense; but it's different feelings. And some of them are even new. I need better WORDS for this. Besides just feeling amazingly alive; more myself - because of who he is and being able to trust him at a level that's not been possible previously.

Seriously. I should start writing romance novels... LOLOLOLOL. Unlikely Partners could be a theme.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 25, 2020, 11:44:22 AM: I imagine you're going through a kind of texting-withdrawal right now, Amber. Sorry not sorry your sweetie is on his way to get this training assignment over with. And maybe in unexpected ways you'll find that NOT texting all day actually does something good for you as a separate human being. It may even make the connection deeper but less dependent at the same time.

Re. B. With his age and his injury, I'm imagining this assignment is taking place on dry land? As in, leading instruction in a tent/hangar/building, etc. Even for swashbuckling military heroes and action types, I'd find it hard to believe they would send someone in his physical condition to actually dive, etc. And even for such physical-hero types, there is a lot of material they must learn in their training in what's essentially a "classroom" setting (outdoors or indoors). Hope that's the case. Safe as houses. Just busy. And unable to communicate because security.

Makes sense to me anyway!

So happy for you that you have him in your heart. I hope you actually enjoy this week being Amber-on-her-own, because that's a source of strength and insight too.

You being you, you'll make the most of it and come away with good stuff.

Hang in there--remember if a tree in the forest goes off on a military teaching assignment for a week so it can't text you, it's still a real tree.

Man, I'm deep.

hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 25, 2020, 12:11:30 PM: LOLOLOL. Oh, I don't have any problems with text withdrawal. Hol texts me from upstairs a lot. LOLOLOLOL.
Yeah, I know I'm quite all right just being me for awhile. It's a common thing between us that one or the other will ask for some parts of a day to go do our thing... where we don't really want the interruption.

And yes, he's diving. It's essential to the instruction. He's BEEN diving all along, since his injury - just not at those depths. And yes, I miss him like crazy. Even after a year of practice being alone (albeit with that steady stream of communication) while in a relationship.

I have some "secret plans" to give me a goal (or three) to accomplish before he gets back. It's not so much dependency on him, as it is being lazy and procrastinating on things I want to do - for me - and he's a handy distraction. LOLOL. And I have become way too proficient at coming up with ways to waste a whole 'nother day waiting for Covid to subside (not that it's bad here)... and x, y, z reasons to allow one day to just roll into another, without end. When he's here - he's making me focus on getting things done. LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 25, 2020, 12:51:04 PM: Man, I'm glad nobody's around to notice the ways I can avoid such productivity.
Eerrrgggghhh.

Well, I'm going to assume faith in him and the gubmint that if he physically is too unwell to dive, they won't let him dive. Hope so anyhow.

You sound good. A&B sound GREAT.

I advocate laziness in mega heat. Unfortunately, I advocate laziness generally.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 26, 2020, 08:37:38 PM: Yeah Hops. Thanks for the advice to focus on me this week. I have a tendency to rub salt in my wounds - and I'm missing B a LOT. I've already told him it's not fair of him to basically tell me how he feels about me at the deepest levels... and then go away with no communication for a week. :P We've kinda been headed in that direction since he was here last anyway. And I dove in a little deeper than was wise on my feelings - given how intense my feelings for him have become.

I am fortunate in that Hol & Steve are around and I do have someone to talk to... and there's stuff going on all the time, coz even tho she's taking it easy on her ribs - she absolutely can't sit still. LOL. Just like B. Her new tactic to hurry the contractor along finishing up the Hut is brilliant. She's started setting up her dining room today. And is choosing the next room for the next day they don't show up to work. LOLOLOLOL. Plumber called today a couple times, coordinating what needs to happen in her kitchen & bathrooms. He'll be here next week. Contractor has another coat of stucco to spray on the walls & ceiling downstairs... and then it's just small things and the electrician again. So she can move things in.

There's probably going to be a space of time, where I'm alone at the house again before B moves. I have some things I want to accomplish before he gets here - if possible. The biggest ones are for me. But the heat should start to moderate end of next week... and then I can get back to outside things again. And it'll soon be hunting season - Hol and I were talking about splitting the rest of the woodpile from what was cut to change the drive. And I can STILL work in the garden... even if it's too late to plant. I still have some herbs to get planted too. It's going to be easier to focus on stuff like that by myself.

We're already starting to talk about Yule season too. I've kinda been moving away from traditional "Christmas" and toward Yule the last few years. And it's a much longer timeframe. And I've just been warned that if things don't improve in the city soon - there will be a hell of a Halloween party at the Hut.

Back to my feelings... which I'm glad to be distracted from for any amount of time...

I've noticed something that I've been working on today. I trust this guy a lot; deeply. And even though he's not my normal type - the connection we have is incredibly strong. We have a LOT in common, too. I'm totally in love with him... and as it turns out, he with me. We know that over time things change. But this feeling doesn't have to. So I should feel totally happy right? Yeah..... maybe not. In some ways, it's so intense; "Too good to be true" and I'm so used to him "being there" - that this week's separation really turned dark on me. Almost a replay of losing Michael... but not quite. And it persisted even after I woke up this morning... so I simply DECIDED...

I'm not going to do that. It's OK, he had to go away for work for a week. I'm truly FINE. He hasn't been here that much yet. The intense feelings aren't "bad"; aren't negative at all... he'll be back soon. And I'm right here waiting on him.

I found it strange that my mind tried to turn the feelings into something negative; painful. And that it was so easy to decide not to do that. Who knew it was that easy? It's never been that easy before. The more I work with feelings, the easier it seems to get - to not be at their "mercy". Tortured by them.

Maybe - referencing G's comments & article on the Anything thread - I had a long-held belief that I couldn't protect myself from being run over by own feelings? And perhaps the belief simply isn't true NOW. We used to believe in Santa Claus, after all....

B has this effect on me - that I feel MORE my SELF and more ALIVE than before. Like in some alchemical way - our chemistry is such that we're both waking up from a long long dream. (Weird metaphor; but it's the only one I have that comes close.) He is so extroverted and having fun with our friends online now, versus only barely posting gloomy, I'm still surviving news about what's going on with him. He's so much brighter, energetic, and shines like the sun... and I'm feeling quite comfortable in my own skin - old & wrinkled as it is - and stronger of purpose and trusting of my ability to "do" what needs doing... even without him around. (Yeah, the man has skills and will be incredibly useful here.) Feeling bad because he's completing his past obligations & not available to me... just doesn't make a damn bit o' sense to me. Yeah, I miss him. I miss him when he's blowing up my phone and interrupting what I'm doing, too.

It's just what IS. And I'd be a silly goose to feel guilty about being so fortunate that I found love again or afraid of being so happy - as if neither of us deserved it. THAT'S neurotic. Pure & simple. And I don't have to do it. Apparently.

Hahahahahahahaha...
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 29, 2020, 11:14:39 AM: <Rambling Blather Warning>

It's a good thing I figured out I could essentially "flip a switch" and not try to make myself miserable about B being beyond where we can communicate. Because this feeling (feelings?) is/are incredibly intense. I've been trying to figure out ways to manage that and still go about my day without being totally distracted & preoccupied. This is more intense than even when I first recognized the connection between us - when Hol said I was just like a lovestruck 14 yr old. LOLOLOL.

Go figure: I've got a lot more practice and experience managing negative emotions - but I've never been this so blissfully happy. It feels STRANGE. And he's not even communicating with me; not for a few more days yet. This is all coming from ME. And ironically, for most of my life, I believed that happy was a transitory state. Fleeting moments that one shouldn't attach oneself to - because they'd be gone in the space of hours or at most - a day. It's not imaginary or fantasy-based... I'll be doing something mundane like taking the trash out - and start giggling to myself, just because I feel so happy. Not even thinking about him. It's not conditional - ie, it's not a reaction to communication from him or his presence. There isn't any interaction whatsoever between us this week - altho I did dream about him a couple nights ago.

I can't even analyze it much; only so far as concluding that the feelings I've experienced previously when I thought I was "in love"... were apparitions of emotional programming/conditioning: this is how people are supposed to feel, act, think, etc. There were a lot transactional conditions in all 3 of my marriages; unspoken negotiations of I'll give you X, and in return, I'll receive Y and "put up with" Z. After the years A&B have talked - we've never even had one "relationship" conversation. We do talk about feelings; and how we feel with each other. We did address the practical aspects of our individual habits & quirks & how we like to do things.

We're both so ferociously independent that "needs" seem to not exist as separate things; we just WANT to be together because it feels happy to be together. The other's happiness is more important - and that's a two-way connection. We don't HAVE TO BE together, to still have the relationship we do. All the other stuff just kind of falls into place naturally with us. Even now - while I'm adjusting to this unfamiliar "frequency" of happy - I'm not making plans, checklists of expectations to be met, or a post-it of things we have to discuss.

I guess this "me".... is Amber too. She was there all this time under the layers & layers of muck, pain, defenses, risk averseness, starting overs, practical matters.... and all it took was for someone to look and see her hiding under all that. All that "other stuff" is still useful; a good experiential toolkit; it doesn't need to be purged or forgotten... as long as it doesn't get in the way or thinks it's not important anymore and tries to get attention by acting out.

Better late than never, I guess.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on July 29, 2020, 11:27:26 AM: WOWSERS, Amber. I think this is some huge leaping. You are beginning to resemble a kangaroo.

Quote
this week's separation really turned dark on me. Almost a replay of losing Michael...

That is so stark and so clear. I'm glad you saw it. That the lover's temporary absence could feel almost (not quite) like DEATH, in the loss it triggered. You know this reaction is "too big" but you identified it honestly and full on, and that's why you could immediately, rationally, challenge the proportion. Good for you, girl.

Quote
...it persisted even after I woke up this morning... so I simply DECIDED...

I'm not going to do that. It's OK, he had to go away for work for a week. I'm truly FINE.

Yes, you are! Doesn't mean it's FUN to be missing him, but it isn't DANGEROUS.

It sounds as though you really had an epiphany about your own self and your own reactions, and it sounds like the kind that will keep on rippling good things, healing and hopeful realizations...on into the future.

I say seriously, congratulations. Whether it was decision or reason or a sudden moment where your mind was ready to click into balance between emotion and reason and health and vulnerability...all or some combo, you let this good change happen. You didn't block it or fear it or sabotage it.

That's awesome!

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on July 29, 2020, 12:44:39 PM: Amber:

Hear! Hear!

Here's to noticing emotions aren't real. They have no power. They're not good or bad, they just are, and one doesn't have to grab on or follow them down a rabbit hole.

One may choose where attention is focused.

I look forward to you and B focusing on every happy amazing thing in your lives, shared and individually, without projecting into the future or worrying about the past.

Just.....

BE A&B.
And A.
And B.

And seek your joy.

Right here, and now, WOOF.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: CB123 on July 29, 2020, 03:15:10 PM: I remember this so well, Amber. A naturally occurring hormone drug! I think its designed to make the commitment plunge absolutely imperative! Enjoy it--but you AREN'T going to get anything done, so give that up!

CB
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: cats paw on July 29, 2020, 04:05:14 PM: Well said by CB. I was going to say something very similar after reading your last couple of posts!

It's so wonderful to know those kinds of feelings have no age limit.

Cat
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 29, 2020, 04:27:45 PM: Hops I do think it's a combo of things - and TIMING, really - that it just clicked for me. Boo on the not getting anything done, though... LOL. But I really can't. I'm in some strange state of suspended animation... waiting for Hol to be able to start moving (a couple more days; early next week) and Buck to get back to his regularly scheduled "timeline" for moving here.

I did get preps ready to build my wall of rock, though, yesterday.

Lighter... I sense that I'm flowing more WITH things these days, instead of trying to impose how I think things should go. And since that whole intuitive side of me has woken up... I'm definitely noticing things more often and in different ways than before.

Kitty - After Mike died (2015) it was a few years before I even thought about "looking" again. Tried the online dating stuff - and it just isn't my scene. And I'd known B for years before he came up last year to rescue my jeeps from my studied neglect... LOL. I moved in that time too; back "home" but in the mountains across the state line. So I knew I liked him as a friend; he'd been actively supporting me on some of those worst nights early on, during the freshest loss. But the sparks were undeniable and he was too much a gentleman and too shy to make the first move. LOLOL. I think I mighta scared myself a little in that process. ("What were you THINKING Amber?! Have you lost your mind??! You're not ready for this!!!!) Oh my***. But as it turns out we've had a chance to let the friendship deepen and shift... and yes, it's truly something I'm grateful for -- to find this kind of love again.

Seriously, I might consider writing a romance novel this winter. LOL. I just can't write dialogue worth a crap. Maybe I'll try Cormac McCarthy's style - no punctuation on the dialogue. There's an ulterior motive to this idea, since there's an open question of whether perhaps we were together in a past life (if you believe such things are possibe; I'm not sure). Would give me a chance to let imagination & intuition create setting... and maybe I'd get clues.

*** Once upon a time, back in ye olden times of beads & rock & roll & incense, I was most definitely an "empowered" young woman. That changed over the decades; mellowed; I'm seeing my feminity in new ways too. (Without giving up any independence, mind you).
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on July 31, 2020, 10:03:38 AM: And Buck is home. :D :D :D :D :D

Everything went well. And now, for the catching up phase....

I'll be back; just don't know how long this is going to take. :D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on July 31, 2020, 10:08:15 AM: That's great news, Skep, enjoy :) Look forward to reading the next update :) xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 03, 2020, 08:46:41 AM: There are some parallel plots going on in the farm story right now. Different streams of activity... like different wet weather streams in a downpour - which we might get this week. Not the trop storm so much - but what the storm is going to run into; a weather feature coming out of the upper midwest/great lakes.

Hol has been working at the Hut; removing the wrong color of grout in her master bath shower so it can be regrouted. Heat gun and utility knife work - miserable but not physically difficult. She's just about done. Plumber has been busy connecting kitchen sink & bathroom stuff. Electrician worked Sat, too. This week looks to include moving her appliances down so the gas ones can be hooked up. Interior doors going up; trim getting finished; painting the few odds & ends left. Then, she's headed to B'more to help one of co-workers move. His wife has been going through chemo - and they are moving her and the little one first, as a virus precaution. Then the assembled crew - mostly people from the production crews - will dive in on the bigger stuff. The tv series that was postponed by the virus has been cancelled, so it's a good thing all those people have side jobs. Hol wasn't sure she was going to go back to work. The next weekend - my house will get emptied of her stuff.

Over the weekend, she invited out a friend & his wife that she hasn't seen in a long time. They live out of the city - but jumped at a chance to go somewhere for a change of scenery. He builds garden structures - ike greenhouses, solar systems, etc. And have a homesteader mentality. He and I hit it off and talked late into the darkness; I'm covered in mosquito bites... but we were trading his ideas & my long decades of being interested in this life. Years & years ago, I remember being on the first homestead - and telling Hol I could see her becoming the cliché farmwife with chickens, dogs & cats, & kids running around the yard. I smile to myself, seeing her make that transition - her way of course.

B had a very productive week on his training mission. One student reminded him, of him at that age. He spent a little more time with him - just as he did, with the guy who'd trained him. It was his first - and last - deep dive (100 ft or more) since his injury. And he got closure on that whole part of his life. Some of the diving gear got an appropriate "burial at sea". 17 to 65 is a pretty big chunk of someone's life. He called me a couple times over the weekend. Once when the dog, Seth (Hol's friend) & I got stung by yellow jackets.... LOL. I didn't see the nest when we walked around the deck. No major problems; B was just being protective. That can feel really new & strange to me; but I LIKE it. Sometimes I do remind him, I can take care of myself, though.

I didn't get TOO stuck in overthinking all these new feelings and the "knock you on your butt" intensity of them. I asked for, and got, the reassurance that I wasn't imagining how he feels about me. We are doing the trade, I described in the SHAME thread... so that our individual puzzle pieces of self are coming together to form a new picture. I had to transfer the one text he sent me, to my journal. So I flipped back, to the beginning marker - about my first weekend at the little cabin back in spring '16. Before I bought the farm. It was 6 months after Mike died.

The comparison is interesting. What happened as a result of that experience for me, was beginning a journey back into the whole world of Pre-Twiggy emotional intensity. All the stuff I had to "put away" to get all of my cognitive synapses firing in functional order after the trauma. Hops mentioned shame... I was shamed for how emotional I was as a result of all that trauma. I was expected - it was demanded of me - that I pull up my boots and keep on truckin' somehow. As if what had happened was just a minor insult. Those feelings were the full panorama of emotion, in living color. And it was ALL shutdown, in an attempt to keep my anger under wraps... because that emotion and it's intensity wasn't "comfortable" for other people around me. (Nevermind, it was a direct cry for HELP.) Funny I did meet other people in those early days who completely understood it... and started to help me figure it out. But the people I counted on the most just made things worse. Neighborhood people, teachers, my step-dad... they all helped...

and countless boyfriends and 3 husbands. LOL. I mentioned my stubborn persistence, in the other thread. LOLOL. I never stopped LOOKING for someone who could understand and accept that part of me. It would appear that B was on the same quest... and needed what I can give him too. A whole nother B is waking up too, in this process of working to be together. And communicating that between us... just blew the overthinking, doubts, and uncertainty right outta the water (why do I think I'm going to use that analogy a lot more??? LOLOL). This is real & it's for all the marbles this time. It's "what you see is what you get"... simple. Happy is now a new flavor in both our lives - and we're not clinging to any one particular moment of it... instead we're creating ways to manifest that as often as we can.

I feel kinda like I'm designing myself a new life role... and I think I know where I got the idea from; but of course, it needs to be tailored to me. And Buck.

And I'm going to weave a new balance between left-brain competence and right-brain emotion & processing. It's already starting... and some of it, I'm not even directing. That's OK too.

I just love it when a plan works out. LOLOLOLOLOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 03, 2020, 01:57:40 PM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on August 03, 2020, 08:46:41 AM
There are some parallel plots going on in the farm story right now. Different streams of activity... like different wet weather streams in a downpour - which we might get this week. Not the trop storm so much - but what the storm is going to run into; a weather feature coming out of the upper midwest/great lakes. Thunder storm just rolled over us, Amber. I do love the rain.

Hol has been working at the Hut; removing the wrong color of grout in her master bath shower so it can be regrouted. Heat gun and utility knife work - miserable but not physically difficult. She's just about done. Plumber has been busy connecting kitchen sink & bathroom stuff. Electrician worked Sat, too. This week looks to include moving her appliances down so the gas ones can be hooked up. Interior doors going up; trim getting finished; painting the few odds & ends left. Then, she's headed to B'more to help one of co-workers move. His wife has been going through chemo - and they are moving her and the little one first, as a virus precaution. Then the assembled crew - mostly people from the production crews - will dive in on the bigger stuff. The tv series that was postponed by the virus has been cancelled, so it's a good thing all those people have side jobs. Hol wasn't sure she was going to go back to work. The next weekend - my house will get emptied of her stuff.
You so often hit all the high points, IMO, and leave me feeling I have the big picture... and need nothing else from your posts to feel informed and caught up: )

Over the weekend, she invited out a friend & his wife that she hasn't seen in a long time. They live out of the city - but jumped at a chance to go somewhere for a change of scenery. He builds garden structures - ike greenhouses, solar systems, etc. And have a homesteader mentality. He and I hit it off and talked late into the darkness; I'm covered in mosquito bites... but we were trading his ideas & my long decades of being interested in this life. Years & years ago, I remember being on the first homestead - and telling Hol I could see her becoming the cliché farmwife with chickens, dogs & cats, & kids running around the yard. I smile to myself, seeing her make that transition - her way of course.
That warms my heart. How kind of Hol to lend that hand. I hope she stays safe.I hope being around a little one doesn't jerk her emotions around too hard for wanting her own. Is she still talking about having a baby?

B had a very productive week on his training mission. One student reminded him, of him at that age. He spent a little more time with him - just as he did, with the guy who'd trained him. It was his first - and last - deep dive (100 ft or more) since his injury. And he got closure on that whole part of his life. Some of the diving gear got an appropriate "burial at sea". 17 to 65 is a pretty big chunk of someone's life. He called me a couple times over the weekend. Once when the dog, Seth (Hol's friend) & I got stung by yellow jackets.... LOL. I didn't see the nest when we walked around the deck. No major problems; B was just being protective. That can feel really new & strange to me; but I LIKE it. Sometimes I do remind him, I can take care of myself, though.
I so get that being able to take care of yourself, but also having a place where care and concern are welcome. It's a delicate balance, IME. I don't know why it sometimes brings up reactivity, but it does. Well, I DO know, but it has nothing to do with your stuff, thank God.

I didn't get TOO stuck in overthinking all these new feelings and the "knock you on your butt" intensity of them. I asked for, and got, the reassurance that I wasn't imagining how he feels about me. We are doing the trade, I described in the SHAME thread... so that our individual puzzle pieces of self are coming together to form a new picture. I had to transfer the one text he sent me, to my journal. So I flipped back, to the beginning marker - about my first weekend at the little cabin back in spring '16. Before I bought the farm. It was 6 months after Mike died.

The comparison is interesting. What happened as a result of that experience for me, was beginning a journey back into the whole world of Pre-Twiggy emotional intensity. All the stuff I had to "put away" to get all of my cognitive synapses firing in functional order after the trauma. Hops mentioned shame... I was shamed for how emotional I was as a result of all that trauma. I was expected - it was demanded of me - that I pull up my boots and keep on truckin' somehow. As if what had happened was just a minor insult. Those feelings were the full panorama of emotion, in living color. I think I get that too. The stoicism.... the need to get through and not feel weakened or weak or vulnerable or allowed to have normal human emotions while there's so much to be done. Does that make sense to you? And it was ALL shutdown, in an attempt to keep my anger under wraps... because that emotion and it's intensity wasn't "comfortable" for other people around me. (Nevermind, it was a direct cry for HELP.)Familiar too. Funny I did meet other people in those early days who completely understood it... and started to help me figure it out. But the people I counted on the most just made things worse. Neighborhood people, teachers, my step-dad... they all helped...

and countless boyfriends and 3 husbands. LOL. I mentioned my stubborn persistence, in the other thread. LOLOL. I never stopped LOOKING for someone who could understand and accept that part of me. It would appear that B was on the same quest... and needed what I can give him too. A whole nother B is waking up too, in this process of working to be together. And communicating that between us... just blew the overthinking, doubts, and uncertainty right outta the water (why do I think I'm going to use that analogy a lot more??? LOLOL). This is real & it's for all the marbles this time. It's "what you see is what you get"... simple. Happy is now a new flavor in both our lives - and we're not clinging to any one particular moment of it... instead we're creating ways to manifest that as often as we can. IME, it's a rare and cherished thing to be loved, even when speaking a less than popular truth. It's a rare thing to be with people who respect your views, even though they don't agree, or don't get what they want in the moment. It feels like a good marker in relationship. Does this person treat me with respect and kindness, even when receiving sometimes painful information? Can they hear it? Can they process and discuss it, and accept it, without trying to change it?

I feel kinda like I'm designing myself a new life role... and I think I know where I got the idea from; but of course, it needs to be tailored to me. And Buck. Yup.

And I'm going to weave a new balance between left-brain competence and right-brain emotion & processing. It's already starting... and some of it, I'm not even directing. That's OK too.

I just love it when a plan works out. LOLOLOLOLOL.

The difficulties and challenges will lead to more strength and understanding, IME. Sometimes disagreement and discomfort are messengers....
something has to change.

Nothing has to be broken. A tweak is just a tweak and all relationships are navigated and morphing, as a matter of healthy course, IME. You're surin'real good, ((Amber.))

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 03, 2020, 03:04:45 PM: Hol still enjoys other people's little ones immensely. Yes, I think she'd still like to be pregnant and carry to term. She is more than wary about miscarrying again - which is understandable. But she tried some fertility Rx's (stuff for age; at 42 she has some peri-menopausal symptoms - that was about the age I started that mess too) and has since forsaken them. Like most things that affect our basic hormonal balance - she didn't like the effects and she also wasn't pregnant. She's not going to pursue things like that any further.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 03, 2020, 03:42:51 PM: Welcome home, Buck!!!!!

I'm very happy for you both, Amber.

And especially glad for you that you see the over-thinking for the impediment it is, and are working not to get stuck there. Bravo. Not easy to undo long habits but nothing like falling in love to upend a lot of autopilot stuff.

It sounds to me as though you both have such positive impacts on each other, overall. And what a relief that B is now aiming for a safe, secure military retirement (if I remember the bureaucratic weirdness right).

Hol moving out? Oh that glorious day. No disrespect to her and I hope she'll be very self-sufficient and healthy in her own nest, which you have beyond-generously made possible.

Heading to Baltimore as the pandemic surges again? Dunno about THAT....

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 03, 2020, 04:41:08 PM: It's beyond interesting - and explanation - to my usual over-analyzed degree Hops. The over-thinking was a response to emotional fear (this is too good to be true). And yet - all the intuitive/emotional side of me kept saying: he means what he says; you aren't imagining this or wishing it into being in your mind; it's not a fantasy/delusion... based on old dependency issues.

The way out was simply asking if he meant what I thought he said; and getting that answer.

It's funny, Hol moving out and into the hut. She's not far from the house; and I'm sure I'm going to see her frequently and just hang out or work together. And she's a professional texter. LOLOL. IF she gets a signal down there. TBD for the moment. For both of us, it's another "new" experience. We're both happy that we've made sharing a house work for so long with only a couple major blowups (we each have our own records) along the way. I've got a little more legal stuff to do - a land lease agreement - until she inherits the whole kit & kaboodle. I will probably make some provision for B... but it's way too soon to think about that right now and he might have his own druthers on that topic.

For right now -- the future is still the future, and until all the major "planners" are here... we're simply going to finish what's been started and get ready for winter. That starts in August, on the farm, ya know. She and I haven't even had one of our usual daydreaming, what-if pow-wows for a while. And unless she decides to travel this winter - situationally dependent of course - I think we're all going to be hunkered down and cozy for the winter.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 03, 2020, 04:48:04 PM: Amber:

Have you decided what provisions, if any, you'll make for grandsons and other dd?

You know I don't expect you to answer that if you aren't comfortable doing so.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 04, 2020, 08:03:04 AM: All that legal stuff got wrapped up last year. Only have one more business "action item" to take care of and the land lease for the Hut... and I'm done. It's just insurance. Yes, everyone is accounted for in those documents. I got QUITE the education into complexity of legal issues and combined - not necessarily friendly - families when my Dad died...

As it stands - B was already in the picture a LITTLE, when I organized all of that and the lawyer explained some options that made sense in case things got more committed. B already knows all this. It was one of our first "serious" discussions. If I had inherited before I married Mike - I have a feeling I would've seen some things about him sooner. Like his addiction to flashy, egoistic, status symbol stuff. Even without direct confrontations, it still became an issue. I think we did OK with it - but then, he didn't see things the same way I did and pressed his influence on me. To keep him "happy" - even tho there simply isn't enough material things in the world to create "happy".

Wills & estates are always updated when there is a substantial change in someone's life. Beneficiaries on certain bank accounts even. This is the second time I went through the trust process and all that. POAs. It's because what I set up in NC, wasn't going to fly in WV - the bank was the trustee and they aren't even licensed in this state. Things would've been even more complex. There are even more things that can happen... should I choose to go that route... to solidify Hol's situation some.

I didn't know I was going to inherit anything. I had to scramble to learn about all this stuff; I'd just gone through my first mortgage process a few years before that. In two years, I basically self-didacted into an MBA level understanding. But I also found that the people who were in charge of helping settle my Dad's estate welcomed questions when you listened to the answers. I picked their brains pretty thoroughly. Granted, I'm unconventional (these days) in my beliefs and understanding. My business background was VERY old-fashioned and based on the simplest principles. But I've also brought some compassion into the picture too. Some different ideas about how to correct the greed and exploitation that's rampant - especially in big business - and make that work for everyone. After all - I was the one exploited the times I worked within the "system". I knew what needed to be different. I really think that's made our business stronger and able to make it through these rough times. And more & worse, I fear, is on the way... so I need to put on my thinking cap/mystic visionary cape and dig for some more ideas to add to the mix.

And I'm doing all this with Hol watching, absorbing, objecting, proposing, and asking her questions... so the transition when it comes, SHOULD be easier for her. She should be able to just focus on making the decisions - without having to do all the research into what the decision actually consists of, where the traps are, and how to look forward to consequences that don't show up for years.... as well as thinking fast on your feet, when the unexpected stuff shows up. As it always does.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 04, 2020, 08:48:56 AM: Oh lord, I'm so glad I'm not responsible for a huge complex of decision making and enterprise running the way you are, Amber. But reading all that reminds me that I've been making my 1100 square foot house and small personal goals into MOUNTAINS while you're actually carving out a complex and sustaining world on one.

I'm awed.

You also remind me that I need to update my will, etc. I actually added M to my health care POA and want to update that pronto.

I just have the law firm as my executor. Wish I had an individual I could trust with all that to help out D one day, but I don't. I had put in some restrictions for her because of her illness (one symptom is impulsive spending) but feel as though I should take another look at those. I want to ease her future, not make it harder.

And sorry for the hijack--I wanted to say how much I admire all you accomplish. It's mind boggling to me. Because you DO internal growing and working with just as much intensity as all the earth-moving, house-building stuff. It's astonishing.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 04, 2020, 01:34:17 PM: Yikes, Hops. Change that M POA over healthcare issues pronto. I can't imagine the threads of unhappiness if you had to endure M making decisions for you in a health scare.

You'd be all.... "I know he's my POA, BUT...." then you'd get drowsy and M would continue on.

Then you'd wake up and be all.... "I thought I told you M's NOT my....." then you get drowsy again and wake up to M.

Nope nopity nope nope NOPE.

Uh uh.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 04, 2020, 02:08:32 PM: LOL!
You are sooo right, Lighter.

I'll shove it on top of the paperwork to-do pile.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 04, 2020, 04:02:10 PM: It's OK Hops. I hijacked my own thread as a reminder to everyone who hasn't dealt with things.

Yeah, all my creative projects tend to be over-sized. LOL. I like to work BIG. Guess that's one reason Buck was so attractive... we'll see what happens when he's done dealing with all his past. BIG stuff to process. Except for being tired, he's doing pretty good with it all. He said he never felt right with what happened after the injury - he could've been medically retired then - and this training mission let him close out that part of his life on his own terms. Not everyone gets to do that. So it's likely a bigger deal than he's letting on right now. But he's no longer moving into a future with a nothing in it. My crazy projects and plans were a big part of the attraction for him. He can remain useful and needed; along with the personal stuff. It was a big attraction to me too...

I NEED to have the "impossible" to work my way toward. Little by little. So I don't feel "old". Right now, I have an impossibly energetic Hol who can SMELL how close the time is to move into the hut. She's jumping out of her skin to do something to further the progress. Therefore my rock wall is well underway today. LOLOLOL. Door knobs were delivered today; switchplates last week - we're down to that level of detail now.

She just can't contain her excitement.... it's definitely entertaining.... LOLOLOLOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 05, 2020, 12:29:56 PM: Amber:

I'd like to suggest Hol considering a final edit BEFORE moving all her stuff into the hut.

What we say NO to is more important that what we say YES to, IME.

Maybe scheduling a GOODWILL pick up would help her find her perspective and make good use of all that energy.

Not sure.

Just say'in. She might be glad she did.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 05, 2020, 03:06:30 PM: New problem; need to talk things through.

Hol & Steve have gotten it in their heads to not like Buck. A lot of it is due to his background; that's scary to them. And they are working hard to associate bad things that have happened - coincidentally, in fact - to associate them with him and blame him for them. To the point that even quiet Steve joined in the discussion - which was sort of a presentation of an ultimatum to me, without using those words - that I've allowed myself to indulge in wishful fantasies about how things will be and who he is, in reality. As in, mom's doing something really irresponsible that is going to impact us and our ability to create our own life here. I kept hearing "he makes us really uncomfortable", "you don't really know who he is" (as if they do haviing a lot less engagement with him - and that's all been recent), and "once he's here - regardless of how you feel then - it's going to be much more difficult to change your mind about this relationship".

SIGH. I'm truly hoping this is their "ace card"... and it can all be chalked up to they think their experience of the world and less positive sides of it, is more informed than mine and that once they DO get to know him better, they'll see what is persona vs the real person as well as I do. I heard their concerns, understand them - as well as their motivations - and I don't dismiss it. It's still real to them, even if I have a completely different perspective.

As I start sorting things out, I'll provide more details. This is going to take some days to get clear in my own head - but there are some actions I can take in the meantime for good or ill, that might work into the mix as I try to find a way to reassure them, let them know they can't "demand" anything of me (which is what some of the "conversation" amounted to), and entails taking a risk with what Buck and I have, to this point. I'm completely not OK, with the implication that I'm naive, easily manipulated, and perhaps not acting in my own best interests. I know where that goes legally. (Which is about as airtight, as it can be, protectively for me.)

The hut can't be done soon enough. (A good bit of this has been generated in Hol's "I need to create a problem to solve so I'm taken seriously", script of behavior. Because she is denying something that I can see with my own two eyes - but she won't accept is true and then deal with it - in HERSELF.) Yeah, gaslighting to a degree.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 05, 2020, 04:05:22 PM: Oh, Amber.
I'm so very sorry.

There's a sense of horror in adult children beginning to have opinions about your financial/legal whatever wellbeing waaaaaaaaaay before it's time to step in and "take over." I personally experienced that horror with a different adult child with different issues, but I did in my case have to face that I had gradually become a "resource" in her mind. Once the financial advantages closed, so did her heart.

I'm not saying Hol doesn't love you. Of course she does. But I AM saying that a youngish and not very stable adult with a drinking problem and jail time under her belt is WAAAAAAAY out of her lane trying to control or dominate or "manage" you.

FWIW, I continue to be concerned at times about the detailed intensity of what you share with her, and the degree to which you expose your innards and intimate thought processes for her listening and evaluation, because (imo) even though you want her to be a best friend, she's not able to be. She just doesn't have the maturity yet, and when your yearning for that closeness overwhelms your capacity to look at oversharing with her objectively, I fear that enmeshment results that could really harm you as you (and Buck) get older.

I don't know why they don't like Buck. Maybe it's his image or his militariness or his demeanor or his politics or his whatever. But they don't have to like Buck. They should be, but likely can't be forced to be, civil and mature and polite and restrained and SOCIALLY DISTANT and calm around him (and you, for that matter). They should bury their noses in their own business and keep them there.

And if there is ANY maneuvering around inheritance, honey, I'd write Hol out of the will/trust immediately, provide her a new copy, and lovingly explain that the only way she gets back IN is if she treats your adult-woman boundaries with absolute respect from this moment forward. And mean it. But you'd have to behave as though you embrace those boundaries yourself, and also sacrifice some intimacy with her (read: codependence). Are you able? It's time!

On your end, I think my biggest hope for you is that you stop analysing and inviting and opening up like an oyster -- YOUR life, for her examination. She's just not equipped to understand all that maturely. And you need to be okay without her understanding or "we-ness" or approval.

I am definitely jaundiced by my own enmeshed experience of trying to make my D into a best friend. She could not be, and it took a long time in therapy before I realized that unwittingly, I was trying to maneuver her into that role. I HAD TO finally accept an emotional separation even before she left....that she would and never could be my intimate pal. That here adult self was not the fulfillment of my mothering dreams, and that this is part of the ticket price when you have a child. Happy or sad, you release the outcome. That this is meet. And right. And natural. And how it should be when they have grown into their own. We HAVE to let go.

(All of my reaction here could be SOOOOO off base because of my different experience with a different adult child, and please do forgive me for the 90% of it that's likely unfitting to you, your experience with Hol and Steve and their hangers-on, etc. I count on you to TOSS what's useless!)

But in the event that some wee part is....are they worried that B might have more presence and influence than they do? Heck yeah, if he's your partner or husband or mate, he will. Because you and he are the grownups. And you OWN the place. (Sorry, don't care what age they are, but with drinking and driving and refusing to return tools or just grow up, they don't get the co-grownup title yet. I hope they soon will!) And that question (what is the deep reason behind your resistance to Buck, my dears?) should never be asked out loud, of course. You do not need to get into their heads. You should avoid the insides of their heads, and they yours!

Oh so hoping I didn't make it worse for you. I could have my head in the dark and stinky place.

Big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 05, 2020, 06:00:12 PM: Hops - will do on your recommendation. I haven't spilled guts yet. But essentially, Hol's line in the sand is me or B. She is setting that up - again. I've had husbands pull this crap. And they got their effort shot down. No, I don't overshare or discuss intimate details. I mind my boundaries with her... and so she's resorted to this. And has backup in Steve.

CB - you read my mind. I'm going to do precisely as you've said and relax for a bit. I know exactly what I can do, in this situation - and it's a range of things. But for now... I don't have to do a thing. I heard them out. Said their comfort & safety is important to me. Even addressed some of the more esoteric things that came up.

But I won't lie about it. I feel cornered - forced into a decision not out of need, but someone else's comfort (why am I responsible for that again?) and the claws won't exactly retract just yet. I know I need to wait for clarity.

I have explained to B what position I'm in - and why. And proposed that another trip with a planned activity where they can actually interact with him and get to know him better MIGHT help. It might not. He might not want to try. They are biased and prejudiced in this instance (without evidence to justify it) and couching the ultimatum in "concern for me". There are so many things wrong with that I don't know which piece I want to attempt to pick up first without getting my hands all icky. B and I don't even have a definite timing for him to actually move and be here, anyway - talk about putting the cart before the horse. His D won't go off to college until Septermber-ish... and he still has to sel his house.

And I'm back to figuring out how to pick a turd while keeping my hands clean. Wow.

So I wait for inspiration, clarity, getting my nose off the pebbles... and I contain my self.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 05, 2020, 06:24:54 PM: Amber:

I went back and re read your OP.... I didn't see an actual threat. What do you feel Hol and Steve's ultimatum WOULD BE, if they made one? That they'd leave? Try to have you committed? M arrested? Go no contact with you until you cleared your head of this fantastical silliness, that is your life? My, God. What nerve, in any case, making threats of any sort.

I fall somewhere between Hops and CB's responses, btw.

I'd feel a burning necessity to calmly pee a definitive line around what's MINE to worry about, and what's Hol's to worry about. I'd ignore S's involvement, I think. This is between you and Hol, IMO.

Steve has as much say in your relationship with Hol as B does. B matters. He matters to you. S matters. He matters to Hol. You have boundaries around these relationships, as long as no one is getting injured, IME. It's hands off each other's relationships. Seems pretty obvious to me, but not to Hol. Not right now.

For what it's worth, it's looking like Hol and S about to overstep a very serious boundary, IME. I'd go so far as to use the term "interpersonal terrorism" IF they do make ultimatums. For me, that's very serious behavior. That's something requiring swift response, and very pointed sharing of information HOL and S need to make big boy and girl decisions going forward. They aren't children. They should know they can't tantrum their way into gaining your compliance, IME.

THis is what I don't get.....

Hol KNOWS you pretty well. What makes her believe this kind of ultimatum, if that's what it is, would gain your compliance?

What makes Hol believe she's the one with all YOUR answers, when she's got plenty to tend to on her own plate?

WHY does S believe he has any say in your relationship with B....
at ALL? Ever. In any way?

To me, that smacks of Hol and S sitting around, catastrophizing about WHAT IFs, and I get that. I've done it. I've lived in that head space FOR YEARS.

If S and Hol sit around, whipping each other into frenzies over your relationship with B and perhaps how scary B would be to deal with IF he were to become unstable..... controlling..... DANGEROUS..... violent in ways they absolutely wouldn't be able to handle..... that's honestly a pretty scary scenario to think about. I can imagine Hol and S are both living in their limbic systems a lot anyway, with COVID and Hol's loss of control in other areas of her life... work....the court.... her issues with fertility...... unhelpful coping strategies she'd do well to explore and tend to, herself.

Knowing you, Amber.....
in what world does Hol believe she has a right to leverage you into complying with her demands... and I'm not sure what exactly she's demanding, or what might happen if you fail to comply... again... you sense this is the direction they're taking. I wonder if that's true, or if they're just being what they feel is VERY FRANK about their feelings of what's true.

As you said, they're entitled to have their feelings.

You're entitled to have yours about Hol and S. Feelings aren't right or wrong, they just are.

There have to be boundaries, thought, for both you and Hol.

The men are partners, not mother and daughter. This is between you and Hol, IME. Hol needs and requires a very vivid picture of how things work, where she ends and you begin and what's hers to tend to and yours to tend to, IME. In some ways, I think she'll be calmed and reassured, like a child, when you set and hold healthy boundaries for yourself. You'll be modeling how to do it FOR HER, as well. It's ALL good. No need to freak out or get upset. Every need to be calm consistent mom, showing Hol how the world works.... helping her through it, but not enabling in any way or pussy footing around the information she needs to make sense of her world.

It's OK to speak up.

It's not OK to use interpersonal terrorism to force another adult to comply, or else.

Respectful behavior should go both ways. Anything else shouldn't be tolerated,
IME.

Nipping this kind of think IN THE BUD seems proactive and uber helpful, IME.

I know you're super capable of figuring out what boundaries you want in place, and what consequences would be appropriate, so I have no suggestions about that.

I know you'll handle this as well as it can be handled, Amber.

I think B will help you stay grounded, and able to be responsive, which is what Hol needs right now, IME.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 05, 2020, 07:32:56 PM: Remember, Amber.

You can't control Hol or how she'll respond. Things get exponentially complicated when we try to plan around controlling other people's reactions, IME. It can't be done, in any case, so why not dismiss it and get on with what we CAN do?

Control is yourself. Things look a whole lot simpler when we remember what's ours to worry about, and what's not, IME.

Take care of your business.... prioritize self care. Enjoy this long awaited time with B without adult kids kicking rocks and eating bologna samiches in your space. On your land. Hol isn't there to save you from yourself. She shouldn't be allowed for a moment to feel that's her job or you require her to do that for you. It's simply on or OFF the table, IMO.

I hope you pay attention to any feelings around NEEEDING everyone to get along and BE OK.

That's not your job. That's not a job any one person should have to be responsible for. Everyone is responsible for themselves and their actions. I'm guessing B will be straightforward and super easy to understand. That may be part of what bothers Hol and S, btw. They likely have the idea he can't be terrorized or manipulated into doing ANYTHING. He likely doesn't put up with bologna of any sort, particularly when disrespected and pushed. That they're trying with you might mean they have the idea they CAN get traction with threatening you. Maybe you DO care too much. Feel you should control how things go. Control how things work out or don't. Feel responsible?

If Hol and S can't be civil and respectful on THE farm.... maybe they'd do well to move into S's farm for a while.... maybe 6 months, to be reviewed sooner or later? To reveiw their stance and feelings in the manner. Hol doesn't have to subject herself to the stress that is being around you and B. She isn't your keeper. She doesn't have to play that very stressful role of controlling another adult, Lord... what a nightmare. She can go elsewhere, and perhaps should, rid herself of that chore that never belonged to her in the first place.

If things continue to go well with B, perhaps Hol considers giving up the Holly Hut in favor of her name on a bank account instead, or whatever is fair. IF she really can't get along and look to her own life.

Life is too short to waste your last 15 or so years being emotionally jerked around and bullied by an adult child, If that's how HOl wants to spend the next 15 years, you can't control her. She just might have to find someone else to hold the other end of that rope, bc you might just drop your end. That's OK too. Right?

YOU'VE earned your joy, Amber. What must Hol be suffering to attempt to stand in the way of your
happiness? I do believe she's suffering, btw. I just don't have the answers and no one, but Hol, can.

That's HER job.

That's not your job.

Trust she'll figure it out for herself, then turn back to what's on your plate.

Honestly, I don't know why B and S are involved in any of these discussion when this is really about Hol and you and your relationship.

Hol either has the power and control over you and your relationships, and choices, or she doesn't. For some reason, she believes she has it.

IMO, this isn't about B at all. It's about Hol's insecurities and inability to regulate her emotions.

Her anxiety ramps up, and she doesn't have the skills to manage it, perhaps.

I imagine a very nice Sikh T would help you and Hol move swiftly through these matters if you were lucky enough to find one, and open to it.

A neutral third party might get Hol's attention where you haven't been able to.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 06, 2020, 10:46:58 AM: OK - the emotional dust & gaslighting glitter is settling now. Thank y'all for those GREAT ideas, the feedback and advice and support. But I gotta tell ya - now that I've had a chance to think, sleep (thank you bourbon), and touch base with Buck and John the REAL PICTURE is now coming clearer to me. The situation is different than it first appeared. The gaslighting cloud around all I talked about yesterday was like thick wet fog.

John got it in 1 when I texted him. He asked if she was REALLY uncomfortable with Buck or if it was only safer to get mad at him; blame him. He and I had detected this pattern of hers, while John was still here on a daily basis. There's no denying it's real; instead of confronting S and making a decision about their relationship -- she offloads on someone else. It's been John, me, and from time to time, Buck. The night before, she'd been up talking to me about she kinda wished she could move into the hut 3 weeks before S did -- because he didn't seem emotionally invested in the fact they were about to get their own house -- and was physically unavailable to assist with moving things when they had to be staged for installation. She was visibly angry. Kinda hard to miss with her - no mindreading or enmeshment or oversharing necessary. (A predominant pattern; he does only what he feels like doing - never collaborating or participating in joint projects or even social situations - but she has to drop everything when he's isolated himself so much he's lonely and needs her attention. He's not available or "doesn't feel like it" when she needs him.)

So Buck was the scapegoat in this "presentation of concern" which actually boils down to S, egging her on to confront me about how uncomfortable HE feels having a person come live here that despite the opportunities available, he assidously avoided having contact with or getting to know. They wouldn't even eat dinner with us when I cooked. I'm pretty sure S isn't ballsy enough to try to tell me what to do - in my own house - because he wants to insure HIS comfort. So he put her up to it. Which explains how nervous she appeared to me. SHE knows better than to try to tell me what I can/can't do. And wild guess, is that she realizes her relationship isn't going anywhere she wants it to go. She's made herself his spokesperson - because he will not speak, except rarely, to anyone but her in a candid or authentic fashion.

Lots of transference - insisting I have no proof that anything Buck's told me about himself is true (and how pray tell shall I find out? Hmmm. 3 background checks turned up nothing and my radar hasn't pinged either to make me DIStrust him) is the substitute for the fact that S has been here the same amount of time and she knows even LESS about S. In fact, her whole performance would've made a lot more sense if she were talking about S rather than Buck... hence my swirling cognitive dissonance cloud.

So S put Hol in the middle; making her risk her relationship with me (I stayed calm and logical because this isn't the first time these "concerns" have been brought forth. It's just the first time S deigned to grace us with his presence while she was speaking FOR him.) And if it's not this excuse - it'll be something else. And the way she left things with me, that afternoon, was that I would try to brainstorm a way to reassure them, that it is important to me that they aren't uncomfortable or feel unsafe here... and that seemed to satisfy HER, but not him. She even said - you'll probably just do what you want to do anyway. Well YEAH. I own everything including the hut - and as of this moment - there is NO land lease agreement. She hasn't gotten the occupancy permit yet (it's close; maybe next week).

So I've bought myself some time to let all this calm down in my head/feeings - and get very very clear about my next steps. B is hoping to return for a visit next month; at which time there will a mandatory attendance dinner, at the very least. S can either speak directly to B about his fear or not. I don't really give a shit. Meanwhile, Hol and I are going to have a very straightforward heart to heart talk - again - about the hierarchy of things around here; what she's knows already about her relationship - and what has to happen for her to feel it's a two-way relationship. Or not. I've consistently told her when she's brought up the issue before that it's entirely up to her but I'll back her up any way I need to. This is ALMOST the exact same scenario that she put herself through with Bovie; the last relationship. But she's already said she isn't going to waste 9 more years of her life - or put herself through the "trying to be good enough" to be treated as an equal partner - again.

Hops - I hear you about oversharing, mindreading, and enmeshment. And while Hol and I ARE really close, I've kept a lot of B & my's relationship to myself. She doesn't need to know, as long as she knows I'm happy - and she truly does want me to be happy. I haven't pried into her relationship w/S; but the patterns are obvious and out in the open. And she isn't shy at all, at openly talking through how she feels about it when he's not around. And then the mask goes back on... because she wants his attention/affection. As if she's not attractive and lovable enough, and has to settle for this which is right in front of her. No matter how frequently he makes her feel angry with him or frustrated or alone within the relationship. Some time back - maybe last year - in the heat of some of her loud protestations (I can't call them arguments per se) she made threats about leaving. I checked in with myself -- and realized that while I would be a little sad I'd be just fine if she took off. And that was before B and I decided to go ahead with him moving here. We've lived apart for 20 years and the relationship has still accommodated the distance. In fact, the original plan was the Hut would be where she lived when she wasn't working on location somewhere around the country. For months at a time. So it wasn't based on her being here 365/24/7.

Current affairs in the world have definitely impacted the reality of the situation. And I know it's way more attractive to spend time alone in the woods with a companion and bedwarmer... but she is very aware of the lack of participation, financial contribution, and additional work of this particular choice. I said in front of S - you can't go around expecting people to change so much that they stop being themselves. Her eyes got a little wide; her mouth stayed shut. The topic was B -- but even I know how convey a truth without pointing direcctly at the one I'm referencing. She got it. And as long as the gaslighting backs off a little, she'll figure it out. It's not the first time I've brought that up and it goes back a ways - her pretzeling her around S and mommying him while she isn't getting equal in return; and trying to make him be something he just ISN'T. No amount of conversation, explanation of feelings, etc is going to change who he is.

So I'm still in "do nothing right now" phase. Just needed to talk this out, coz I know it looked COMPLETELY different yesterday to me -- and that's what I expressed and you all reacted to. Instead of me having the heart to heart about the CLASSIC signs of his behavior in this relationship with her, I believe I'm going to suggest that she find someone else - a T - to see. I think she needs to own for herself, once and for all, what a healthy relationship consists of and then create her own version of what she wants. I'll be more than happy to support that - even if I'm not fond of the guy, but if he makes her consistently unhappy, in the same way over & over - and I have suspicions of even more ulterior motives... I think I can be a little upfront with HER about MY concerns. We have always been able to tell each other things we didn't want to hear. And that's not been damaged by yesterday's little kabuki theater performance.

My plan is go over the mountain today for some errands and have alone time in the car. There is a huge contingent of vehicles and contractors here today. And I think I hear another one coming down the drive (I'm out back on my private deck).

Oh. And when I explained to B what was going on his response was - what do you want me to do? I'll do whatever you want, when you want it. I just want you babe; not your money nothing else - I'll live in a tarpaper shack, as long as you'll be with me. He's said I've helped him feel joy again; access those parts of himself that a soldier doesn't have the luxury to feel or be. And he really doesn't want to be the reason for causing me any of this current stinking uproar. And it doesn't even have to be an uproar.

It can be simple, cut & dried. They've appealed to me to consider their concerns. I've said I'll think on it. I will make a decision and they can either live with it here - or elsewhere. Completely up to them. And if he doesn't want to -- then she has a decision to make. Her hut will still be here. And she can do her dance with him and make up her mind - while leaving us in peace. It doesn't have to be fraught with a lot of hard feelings either. I put in 5 years of supporting her emotionally while she decided what to do with Bovie... and in the end, she forced HIM to make the decision. I'm not doing that again and I've already told her so. And I'd be tickled pink if she did this somewhere else and it didn't involve me on a daily basis.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 06, 2020, 11:21:54 AM: Well that makes sense out of a very odd conversation with Hol and S. I don't have time to comment, but am familiar with that kind of tactic. IME it speaks to red flags flying all around, very toxic, chaos manufacture behaviors increasing, not getting better. I'm talking about S here. Not Hol.

Thanks for the update, Amber.
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 06, 2020, 11:33:02 AM: OH... when I asked what would satisfy their concerns... it was made clear that they have no idea; it was "we don't want B here at all". Which went over like a lead balloon. Neither of them has the standing to ask me for that.

And she just now sought me out to tell me that she was acting as S's spokesperson, because of his anxieties. Which he doesn't feel safe enough to voice even after seeing how calm and non-confrontational I heard them out. I told her I figured that out. She's knows what IS around here... and she knows how many allowances I've made to accomodate S's behaviors etc for the sake of her trying to create a relationship with him.

For him to ask me to forsake what Buck & I have been planning for years, takes some chutzpah now, let me tell ya. Especially when you're not materially, financially, or emotionally investing in a relationship or where you live.

She knows where all this leads, for her, as well as I see it. I offered to take her with me over the mountain today but she's going to piddle around painting a dresser I'm giving her, for a nightstand in the hut bedroom. She is also doing deep thinking about this too. We'll convene in the studio - our usual discussion/planning/sorting things out place - later. It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, she's really thinking.

The driving will help clear my head, and I have to have a special saw to cut down my stone for the wall. I'd go look to see if there's one in my garage - but Mr Pigpen's mess makes it impossible to find ANYTHING in there. She said it just wasn't worth trying to look. Because everything has been moved around so many times it's not where we last saw it. Including tools from Mike's toolboxes which were carefully labeled & organized... and now strewn & piled everywhere - including outside where they've rusted.

:mad: still, too, etc. I don't think S realizes how afraid he should be if BOTH of us are mad at him at the same time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 06, 2020, 11:34:22 AM: S'OK lighter - this needs to sit a little for everyone. And I have to get moving to get done what I intend to, need to do today.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 06, 2020, 12:57:22 PM: ((((Amber))))

You're thinking so hard I can smell the brainsmoke coming over the mountains.

One thing went pink-ping:

Quote
....Hol and I are going to have a very straightforward heart to heart talk - again - about ... what she's knows already about her relationship - and what has to happen for her to feel it's a two-way relationship. Or not.

The hierarchical stuff yes of course YAY. But this...my first thought about the above was, No no no nooooo. Don't have the mother telling the daughter they are going to discuss the daughter's relationship again. What she knows, what has to happen, etc. Because i-m-n-h-o (sorry) this IS a risk of over-involvement. She's 40! One of those places where at some point, the relationship needs to be LESS close. For Hol to grow up, think for herself without so much parental input or quasi-therpist parental input (cf., "transference" etc), and (soon, Lord) make wiser more self-loving decisions. Your eagerness to analyse and instruct and direct is an honest aptitude well earned, but I think in terms of this nuclear relationship, I think undermines her maturation.

THEN, you promptly solved what I was worrying about:

I believe I'm going to suggest that she find someone else - a T - to see. I think she needs to own for herself, once and for all, what a healthy relationship consists of and then create her own version of what she wants.

Yes, oh YES.

So good to read this today. Gotta run, two teenaged boys coming to weed. Aaack!

Hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 06, 2020, 03:11:37 PM: I'm with CB on the tools, except....
S would have to stop touching them altogether, always and forever. Locking the shed, and not allowing him to pig it up, move or destroy another thing is what I feel he's earned. I'm not mad he got into M's tools, but I am sure there's a consequence waiting to be delivered without racor or any emotion, other than regret and sadness it's come to this.

S was warned, and pleaded with, I assume, from Hol's end. Maybe yours too, Amber.

It doesn't really matter if Hol is upset by S being upset, bc he WILL send her to you with complaints and more threats, no doubt.

When I was dealing with this sort of sabotage from youngest dd's bf...... dd was coming to me too. As messenger, as peace maker, as the person who felt she could control everything and everyone and I think she honestly believed she had that power.

Over the months she learned SHE DID NOT have that power, and I'll cut right to the chase before blathering on about details....
DD went from mortified, wide eyed horror over discussion boundaries with the boy, putting them in place and following through with consequences
to
being
a
stone
cold
Amazon
Warrior
Princess
delivering
consequences
without having to think about it....
she just DID and it was MAGNIFICENT to behold.

She'd stopped coming to me and trying to resolve issues FOR ME or for the little man and I hand't really noticed when.

I mean..... I'm still in awe of her poise and power and calm.

I'm going to stop talking about before I jinx it.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 07, 2020, 12:06:46 PM: Hol and I DID have the heart to heart last night. And she brought up the relationship via the "presentation" of a couple days ago. S's insecurities are such that he really can't even talk to people - although I believe it's a style of manipulation. Putting Hol in the middle - the spokesperson - and responsible for making things OK for him. She knows this; knows that the position she's put in isn't fair. But continues to tolerate it, for the sake of affection from him - which she doesn't always get. I learned a couple more things about him that only make my opinion of him lower.

What I noticed about him early on, was that he has made a tragedy (losing his mom) from almost 20 years ago, into the excuse for his anti-social (yep; that's what it is) behavior. And there is an excuse for EVERYTHING he doesn't want to do or participate in. Couple that with a very extreme sense of entitlement. Lack of normal communication with people he LIVES with... including Hol. Its not just "I can't talk about my feelings" but the normal bits & bobs of his life, as he lived it. Normal people conversation.

He doesn't want to contribute any time, money, or energy on tasks around here - and only does so when Hol insists. He's only recently begun to remove the full kitchen trash bags and take them to the garage for instance. He wipes his hands on counters; leaves wrappers and dishes where ever he just finished... and if he's walking the woods and finishes a drink - just drops the can or bottle where ever he is. This habit infuriates both of us. Hol has said to him: why are these clothes on the floor right NEXT to the laundry basket and not IN the basket? Entitlement to the point of he expects to be taken care of as if he was an infant.

At least in her previous relationship, there was communication and interaction and socializing -- even if it was dysfunctional, many times, as he used to dismiss and deny her actual feelings as being "not correct".

She is not a novice or deluded about relationships - healthy and otherwise. And she did see a T for awhile, trying to decide if she was going to leave that former relationship or keep putting up with that treatment. She's no stranger to the kinds of manipulative mind games that can be played between two people.

S has already said that if B moves here, he isn't going to feel safe enough to stay, himself. That's just fabulously FINE to me. And Hol is addressing - and has been - this reality in the relationship for at least half of the time they've been together. She is ever the optimist, that people will grow and change... and she's attached to having someone... in that position of affection. And she will put up with this arrangement - until she doesn't. Yes she gets angry with him, expresses with finesse and detail what her wants & needs are... and there will be some small gesture before he goes back to doing just what he wants to do, when he wants to do... and everyone else can dance around that - until he decides he "needs" her attention again.

Finding out that he is rather wealthy - and COULD contribute to the expenses around here, buy his expensive food preferences (there are always two different meals prepared because he won't eat what everyone else eats - again with the excuses) - really irritates me. I asked Hol - has he ever bought you a present? Even just something small? Nope. So entitled in the extreme - and not at all cognizant of other people's feelings about that. Or he just doesn't care. Which sometimes, seems to be more the case.

None of this behavior is going to change when they move into the Hut; in fact I expect it to get even worse.

But, I'm OK right now. And of course Hol wants to start moving stuff from her storage unit - and he requires a nap - so I got recruited and need to take of myself some today.

I can't throw him out - no matter how much I want to, because it's Hol's job to deal with his behavior and the relationship. If he chooses to leave because of B... there is nothing I can do about that. She doesn't have the same level of fear over him. Just the garden-variety worry over her mom getting in a new relationship - and because she only became aware of him after we'd been friends for a LONG time; years - her perception is that this is happening too fast. (Parenting the mom; we talked a little about that last night too)

So, she and I are on the same page. She thinks this is just a passing anxiety... and that thiings will be fine with them. I didn't argue that at all
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 07, 2020, 04:40:37 PM: And so... Hol isn't REEEEAAAALLLY demanding you dump B and change your life's plan, bc S is scared and she's so dependent on him she's willing to risk her relationship and home keep him (read that as SHUT him up, or keep the peace.
I had a hard time believing Hol would make a serious demand to dump B. Honestly.... that would be nuts, knowing you.

It looks like she was making a show of support and doing what she could to bring about the outcome S is demanding, and that's just sad, IMO.

I'm afraid his nutsy rocksy koo koo behaviors are more seriously disordered than I want to admit.

Here's one suggestion I have for when Hol and S move into the Hut.....
stop paying for every expense that belongs to the both of them. Let them pay for their own groceries, even if you continue paying all overhead... utilities, etc, bc you want to, or promised to, or don't want to deal with that conversation.

Hol will see the real him more clearly and quickly if you aren't carrying ALL of S's weight, all the time, for reasons I can't quite discern, but understand, bc I have kids too.

I don't know how S will argue Hol has to provide the home, all the living expenses AND 100% of grocery money too, when he's 50percent or more of that expense.

It's one thing she might see as reasonable to ask him to pay, 100perfent, on his own, but only if you aren't making it easy for her avoid any conversation around expenses and fairness.

As much pressure as they're under now, bc of the big bad B, that pressure will get much heavier if S has to consider pulling a tiny fraction of his weight, yet refuses. Hol has her limits.

About everyone having their say..... S won't stand up to B and voice his concerns out loud to HIM. He can't even do it with you. He set up Hol to do it for him, then stood behind her and talked through her legs like a little child.

My best guess is S will continue to work on S, basically torment her, refuse to give her affection or a moment's peace until she forces YOU to comply, which, again....
is so unrealistic, I question S' emotional stability... and Hol's to allow it.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 07, 2020, 07:02:41 PM: Yeah, as she started to confess things the whole picture changed. They won't have much to pay in utilities, since the hut is solar powered. However, there IS a learning curve involved in it... and Hol is the only one motivated to learn it. She HAS serious concerns about the relationship - but refuses to deal with it - while she's in my house. She has indicated that the hut will be a different story, but time will tell. I think part of that is wishful thinking; I see her resentments bubble up & over; and he doesn't even manage to provide her with actual companionship - because he won't engage with her on planning or projects - just leaves everything up to her.

His actions - being taken care of, almost every need - and EXPECTING that, leads me to the conclusion that everything is about him, in his reality. He doesn't give a crap about me, for sure. And it's truly questionable if he really cares about Hol or not. Since he's well off, then the golddigger aspect doesn't play. But why doesn't he feel responsible for carrying his own weight? Only thing I can think of is a stunted need to be mommied and entitlement. And she falls for that, since she is still dealing with her own "need to be needed" - and rescue.

The boy - he's not a man - has some serious issues and escapes from dealing with them. And I believe her when she says she's not going to waste another almost decade of her life, doing all the work in a relationship. I can't repeat what B thinks about him. He did say, that if S came to him, he'd answer any questions he might have and if he had a problem with B - that she should bring them directly to him instead of playing these games.

What I'm currently thinking... is that I'm going to detach from all this. She is beginning to move in - and it's like pulling teeth to get him to help. It doesn't take a mindreader to see her disappointment over all that. I "think" there is a strong possibility that he's getting ready to bail on her. But it's HER relationship. And they are physically healthy grown adults. Plenty of opportunities to work around here and take care of yourselves. I fulfilled my promise - building the hut. I still own it. Everything else is on them. I am just exhausted from the constant drama of all this. Since there ARE boundaries and I know she can take care of herself... but she expected an actual partner - not a dependent she had to cater to his every mood/whim. I am also going to maintain some control over land use, too. It's going to be tricky legally... but I believe there is a way.

In some ways, this is actually good for her to go through... with my feedback and observations and how I think about things. I would NOT be doing what she is doing... but I'm not her. I don't push her, just give her my perspective and she can do with that as she will... but she is NOT happy and she knows it.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 07, 2020, 08:43:50 PM: I locked all my tools up from my renter on the island. I strongly suggest you consider taking control of your tools back. Perhaps let S sign them out, one at a time, IF he returns and respects them if you gets to use them at all. It sounds like he has his own tools, or ability to purchase them if he wants to mistreat tools.

It's sad if it comes to that, but thems the consequences for failure to respectfully use and return tools in good condition, IMO.

You aren't punishing him. You aren't trying to create problems with Hol. You're taking care of yourself and your property.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 08, 2020, 01:52:37 AM: ((((Amber))))

I don't know from the legal stuff.

What's a land lease about? Is it necessary for the hut for some reason?

Just wondering why the whole kit and kaboodle can't just remain all yours, period, until you go to that great building project in the sky. But maybe it is, and I just don't know what I'm talking about.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 08, 2020, 06:29:50 AM: Lighter, if I could, I would lock things up. Logistical reasons; practical reasons; why that's not possible. But that, IMO, is the least of the issues here. This is more of a - you don't bite the hand that feeds you lesson for S... and no work-y, no eat-y. I've gotten several spontaneous genuine "thank you" hugs from Hol - but never once have those words left his mouth... like he's a "little prince" and just expects everything to flow to him from everyone.

Yes Hops, I still own everything; I will pay the additional taxes on the hut - and it's my house too, until I ride off into the sunset. The land lease lets them rent use of X amount of land and gives them a legal basis to residence in the hut, without it being a rental situation or creating an additional income (and taxable income) situation for me.

It's an understatement to say I don't like this aspect of him. And given that the rest of the time, he simply lurks around here like a ghost (except for working on HIS stuff) I truly don't know much else about him. But often our children hook up with people we don't like. I don't have to like him... but one thing you simply do NOT do, is make a personal demand from one's benefactor (his checkbook balance aside) in an attempt to protect your male ego territorial rights. Especially, when you don't step up into that role of protector, provider and equal partner. I can see where B would threaten him that way. But then, most people would try to talk through those kinds of things and get to know - or at least SPEAK to a new person that's coming into your home, or at least where you're living, if you were concerned, right?

B isn't a physically big guy. Divers are necessarily smaller to get into awkward places working on ships & subs. He also doesn't project a dominating, controlling or "bad person" menacing energy around him - in public or private. He's capable, yes. So this is all S's insecurities, and I haven't seen enough redeeming qualities to consider him a permanent "feature" here. Not with how close he is to ex-girlfriends. One of which, seems to have the same entitlement attitude he does. She was dropping broad hints to Hol during the last visit (oh, yes... I'm so intolerent & rigid, right? /read: sarcasm) about designing/building her own house out here. EXCUSE ME???? I don't think so.

It's not like I had much of a choice about S moving in here. Hol presented it to me; was dead set on it; and it would've definitely risked our relationship for me to say no. And I've been bringing my wishes & concerns to her about his behavior ever since. That has covered the continuum, of me asking her to ask him - since he doesn't talk to me or acknowledge me when I talk to him - to modify his habits/behavior... to my nuclear melt-down over the tools when I was trying to work.

She is definitely squarely in the middle here. And I know the same things that irritate me are going to irritate her when they don't change. I know that he doesn't have clue one what the word commitment means. But it's like if she brought home a stray dog that had problematic behaviors that weren't able to be changed or commandable - and has the clear & obvious traits of turning on you. (And yes, that fact about not being able to change people when they tell you who they are, came out my mouth during the group meeting in front of him.) I am going out of my way to not make her misery any bigger than it is, and to remain non-confrontational or force her into any decisions. But I'm not letting her try to polish this turd and pretend she's happy when she's not. She brings up issues often, before I utter a word. And since I express emotions with my whole body - she clearly knows when I'm upset or angry.

Until she makes the decision on her own, that this isn't what she wants to live with... I feel like my hands are tied. But then, I've also been running through a couple hard & fast "no's" that might be forthcoming after I've calmed down a little. As far as I'm concerned - if B's presence here, without any overt actions on his part - is so upsetting to S that he must leave - I don't really care. And if Hol is fool enough to chase after him, I won't try to stop her. This guy is a player, a taker, and he doesn't WANT to fit in and participate and shoulder the work here. And he doesn't care anywhere in his psyche want anyone else wants.

Not something I want around here. Period. My concern is Hol; and getting her the therapy she needs to stop repeating this pattern. Her anxiety levels are off the charts; and so is her energy to "do". She is positively excited about moving into the hut and his resigned, OK, I'll help you do that - if we can do this tomorrow - and no, I require a nap or food, or a walk right now instead - is truly grating on her. When she wants to be heard & her feelings/thoughts/ideas validated she seeks me out... because he really only sees her as the object that provides for his needs/wants and just isn't there for her - or gets angry at her for disturbing him.

I know what happens when resentments build up over a long time of trying to resolve a problem that only gets pushed off the table because it's not "convenient" at this very moment.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 08, 2020, 04:45:15 PM: Oh, that makes sense. (Land lease and tax planning.) Got it.

Is Hol aware that she can go online and find nearby Ts who work online and some who specialize in abusive relationships, etc? If she is, is there a need for you to find a T for her or can she find her own?

Do you think discussing S with B a lot, and/or H & S's feelings of threat about B, will make it easier or more difficult for B to anticipate his life with you on the mountain? Just wondering if holding back most of that might be healthier for you two starting out together IRL, so he doesn't get drawn into drama that's not his? Or feel something toxic will be going on out of the gate?

I know you can't wait for this new chapter to begin, and I hope it is all the wonderful you're hoping for. Can't see why it wouldn't be, if S & H are not allowed to hijack it.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 08, 2020, 06:38:04 PM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on August 08, 2020, 06:29:50 AM
Lighter, if I could, I would lock things up. Logistical reasons; practical reasons; why that's not possible. But that, IMO, is the least of the issues here. This is more of a - you don't bite the hand that feeds you lesson for S... and no work-y, no eat-y. I've gotten several spontaneous genuine "thank you" hugs from Hol - but never once have those words left his mouth... like he's a "little prince" and just expects everything to flow to him from everyone.

Yes Hops, I still own everything; I will pay the additional taxes on the hut - and it's my house too, until I ride off into the sunset. The land lease lets them rent use of X amount of land and gives them a legal basis to residence in the hut, without it being a rental situation or creating an additional income (and taxable income) situation for me.

It's an understatement to say I don't like this aspect of him. And given that the rest of the time, he simply lurks around here like a ghost (except for working on HIS stuff) I truly don't know much else about him. But often our children hook up with people we don't like. I don't have to like him... but one thing you simply do NOT do, is make a personal demand from one's benefactor (his checkbook balance aside) in an attempt to protect your male ego territorial rights. Especially, when you don't step up into that role of protector, provider and equal partner. I can see where B would threaten him that way. But then, most people would try to talk through those kinds of things and get to know - or at least SPEAK to a new person that's coming into your home, or at least where you're living, if you were concerned, right?

B isn't a physically big guy. Divers are necessarily smaller to get into awkward places working on ships & subs. He also doesn't project a dominating, controlling or "bad person" menacing energy around him - in public or private. He's capable, yes. So this is all S's insecurities, and I haven't seen enough redeeming qualities to consider him a permanent "feature" here. Not with how close he is to ex-girlfriends. One of which, seems to have the same entitlement attitude he does. She was dropping broad hints to Hol during the last visit (oh, yes... I'm so intolerent & rigid, right? /read: sarcasm) about designing/building her own house out here. EXCUSE ME???? I don't think so.

It's not like I had much of a choice about S moving in here. Hol presented it to me; was dead set on it; and it would've definitely risked our relationship for me to say no. And I've been bringing my wishes & concerns to her about his behavior ever since. That has covered the continuum, of me asking her to ask him - since he doesn't talk to me or acknowledge me when I talk to him - to modify his habits/behavior... to my nuclear melt-down over the tools when I was trying to work.

She is definitely squarely in the middle here. And I know the same things that irritate me are going to irritate her when they don't change. I know that he doesn't have clue one what the word commitment means. But it's like if she brought home a stray dog that had problematic behaviors that weren't able to be changed or commandable - and has the clear & obvious traits of turning on you. (And yes, that fact about not being able to change people when they tell you who they are, came out my mouth during the group meeting in front of him.) I am going out of my way to not make her misery any bigger than it is, and to remain non-confrontational or force her into any decisions. But I'm not letting her try to polish this turd and pretend she's happy when she's not. She brings up issues often, before I utter a word. And since I express emotions with my whole body - she clearly knows when I'm upset or angry.

Until she makes the decision on her own, that this isn't what she wants to live with... I feel like my hands are tied. But then, I've also been running through a couple hard & fast "no's" that might be forthcoming after I've calmed down a little. As far as I'm concerned - if B's presence here, without any overt actions on his part - is so upsetting to S that he must leave - I don't really care. And if Hol is fool enough to chase after him, I won't try to stop her. This guy is a player, a taker, and he doesn't WANT to fit in and participate and shoulder the work here. And he doesn't care anywhere in his psyche want anyone else wants.

Not something I want around here. Period. My concern is Hol; and getting her the therapy she needs to stop repeating this pattern. Her anxiety levels are off the charts; and so is her energy to "do". She is positively excited about moving into the hut and his resigned, OK, I'll help you do that - if we can do this tomorrow - and no, I require a nap or food, or a walk right now instead - is truly grating on her. When she wants to be heard & her feelings/thoughts/ideas validated she seeks me out... because he really only sees her as the object that provides for his needs/wants and just isn't there for her - or gets angry at her for disturbing him.

I know what happens when resentments build up over a long time of trying to resolve a problem that only gets pushed off the table because it's not "convenient" at this very moment.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 08, 2020, 06:57:03 PM: Dunno Hops. I get to hear all his drama, so he might as well hear about mine. And it feels more honest & full disclosure-ish to let him know what exists here. So he can decide if he can let me deal with it, or get involved at my request (and within limits) or if he'd rather avoid it at all costs. He knows I'm handling it OK for now; and he doesn't need to ride to my rescue. I am confident he wouldn't do that unless I specifically asked him.

Yeah, we have that level of honesty & vulnerability between us now. He's not without courage emotionally - even as much as he's been hurt previously. He won't add problems to the situation either. Hol is MOSTLY OK with him, and right now that's the only other person that counts. And she doesn't figure that largely in the picture. If I can let her relationship BE - despite what I see, I know she will let mine be too.

Neither of us is a stranger to toxic; it's a PITA BECAUSE we have so much experience with it - but that's ALL it is, despite my freak out the other day.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 08, 2020, 07:14:32 PM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on August 08, 2020, 06:29:50 AM
Lighter, if I could, I would lock things up. Logistical reasons; practical reasons; why that's not possible. But that, IMO, is the least of the issues here. This is more of a - you don't bite the hand that feeds you lesson for S... and no work-y, no eat-y. Oh, Amber. There's a difference between us.... when my stomach "clicks" as my father used to say... that's IT. That man would be told the tools are OFF LIMITS to him and why. I did that with my "renter" on the island..... I took the keys. I told him WHY I took the keys. I was sorry I had to remove his access to the tools, bc I'm sure it impacted his life in a very striking way. It didn't matter. He never would have been respectful of the tools, no matter how I asked.

You might not be able to lock the tools up BUT you can put boundaries in place... S CAN'T GO INTO THE TOOL SHED or borrow tools any longer bc A, B, C and D.

About his refusal to contribute, express gratitude (maybe he feels it? I have no idea) or honor you as a human being..... you can't control that and I know better than to try. THAT has to be worked out by Hol. Watching you set and hold boundaries will help Hol feel better about doing it herself, when the time comes, if the time comes. Just saying.... tools, in my family, are sacred. We return them in better shape than we borrowed them. Them's the rules. I've gotten several spontaneous genuine "thank you" hugs from Hol - but never once have those words left his mouth... like he's a "little prince" and just expects everything to flow to him from everyone.

Whatever he expects.... you can't know. What he's allowed to take and have, from you and your coffers, is another matter.

It's an understatement to say I don't like this aspect of him. And given that the rest of the time, he simply lurks around here like a ghost (except for working on HIS stuff) I truly don't know much else about him. But often our children hook up with people we don't like. I don't have to like him... but one thing you simply do NOT do, is make a personal demand from one's benefactor (his checkbook balance aside) in an attempt to protect your male ego territorial rights. I don't don't care WHY he's behaving as though he's experiencing a psychotic break with reality. I DO care he's doing it TO you, while leveraging Hol emotionally. His inability to reason or use logic is concerning, IMO. Especially, when you don't step up into that role of protector, provider and equal partner. I can see where B would threaten him that way. But then, most people would try to talk through those kinds of things and get to know - or at least SPEAK to a new person that's coming into your home, or at least where you're living, if you were concerned, right? So appears to be acting as a child acts..... asking his mother/protector/caretaker to his dirty work, while avoiding direct confrontation or accepting responsibility for his actions and words... for forcing Hol to make irrational demands on YOU. S can't see how......
how.....
what IS this request/demand/threat he's forcing Hol to make on his behalf...
of you and B?

It's something a child would do. I saw my brother do it when he was about 7 yo..... it's very childlike. I've seen no indication S is an adult, in any sense of the word. IF he's a 7yo child, and I suspect he is.... what does that mean? I haven't thought about it much, but food for thought.

Perhaps he'd respond positively to being spoken to like he's a child>?

B isn't a physically big guy. Divers are necessarily smaller to get into awkward places working on ships & subs. He also doesn't project a dominating, controlling or "bad person" menacing energy around him - in public or private. He's capable, yes. So this is all S's insecurities, and I haven't seen enough redeeming qualities to consider him a permanent "feature" here. Not with how close he is to ex-girlfriends. One of which, seems to have the same entitlement attitude he does. She was dropping broad hints to Hol during the last visit (oh, yes... I'm so intolerent & rigid, right? /read: sarcasm) about designing/building her own house out here. EXCUSE ME???? I don't think so.
OMG the entitlement craziness is catching!

It's not like I had much of a choice about S moving in here. Hol presented it to me; was dead set on it; and it would've definitely risked our relationship for me to say no. I think you did just the rigth thing, Amber. And I've been bringing my wishes & concerns to her about his behavior ever since. When I informed youngest dd I was going to bring my concerns TO her young bf, dd got much more invested in problem solving, which meant SHE was let down, over and over again, by the boy in very poignant, impossible to miss or ignore ways. I feel this was part of why she SAW who he is, and I was only saying out loud what I was GOING TO DO.... speak directly to bf, lay out my boundaries and consequences for failing to comply. DD really wanted to skip that, though there were times she seemed relieved she could step down... she was at the point she WANTED me to speak up.That has covered the continuum, of me asking her to ask him - since he doesn't talk to me or acknowledge me when I talk to him - to modify his habits/behavior... to my nuclear melt-down over the tools when I was trying to work. He really shouldn't have access or the right to use your tools, Amber.... IME, of course.

She is definitely squarely in the middle here. And I know the same things that irritate me are going to irritate her when they don't change. You betch'a. I know that he doesn't have clue one what the word commitment means. I don't care what he feels or thinks or knows. I care that Hol is drawn to men who criticize her, don't support her and can't enter into adult reciprocal relationships. I care about her seeing this, and deciding if that's what she wants to spend her time doing, or not. But it's like if she brought home a stray dog that had problematic behaviors that weren't able to be changed or commandable - and has the clear & obvious traits of turning on you. (And yes, that fact about not being able to change people when they tell you who they are, came out my mouth during the group meeting in front of him.) I am going out of my way to not make her misery any bigger than it is, and to remain non-confrontational or force her into any decisions. Just as long as you aren't allowing your boundaries to be crossed. It's right and good to allow Hol to make her decisions about her boundaries. It's not OK for her or S to decide what you have a rigth to protect, for yourself, or not, IME. YOu get to set those boundaries, regardless of any discomfort it creates for Hol or S. That's how it works. You show Hol how to DO it. Hol feels more pressure and has the chance to understand what she's up against more quickly IF you hold your boundaries for your own sake... nothing to do with making choices for Hol. Just you and your stuff.But I'm not letting her try to polish this turd and pretend she's happy when she's not. She brings up issues often, before I utter a word. And since I express emotions with my whole body - she clearly knows when I'm upset or angry.
Maybe try saying...
"let me know how that works out for you."

There's something chilling to FEEL lone is completely on their own, when in a bad situation. To be left to their own devices.... all the energy Mom puts into it.... withdrawn, sans emotion. Besides, Hol knows how you feel. Saying it or showing it again hasn't worked. Maybe pulling back entirely, in regard to her relationship to S, will help Hol reflect.

Until she makes the decision on her own, that this isn't what she wants to live with... I feel like my hands are tied. But then, I've also been running through a couple hard & fast "no's" that might be forthcoming after I've calmed down a little. As far as I'm concerned - if B's presence here, without any overt actions on his part - is so upsetting to S that he must leave - I don't really care. And if Hol is fool enough to chase after him, I won't try to stop her. That's the spirit, Amber.
Wish them well, then go back to your joy. Show Hol how it's done. This guy is a player, a taker, and he doesn't WANT to fit in and participate and shoulder the work here. And he doesn't care anywhere in his psyche want anyone else wants. That's only your problem with regard to his touching YOUR things.... with you giving or not giving him things and food out of your own pocket, and how he affects Hol.

Unfortunately, all you can do is what you're doing... keep your hands off the HOL/S relationship, and focus on you and your stuff. I say consider telling him he's not allowed to touch your tools. I'm n ot sure why this is a problem.

Not something I want around here. Period. My concern is Hol; and getting her the therapy she needs to stop repeating this pattern. Exactly.Her anxiety levels are off the charts; and so is her energy to "do". She is positively excited about moving into the hut and his resigned, OK, I'll help you do that - if we can do this tomorrow - and no, I require a nap or food, or a walk right now instead - is truly grating on her. When she wants to be heard & her feelings/thoughts/ideas validated she seeks me out... because he really only sees her as the object that provides for his needs/wants and just isn't there for her - or gets angry at her for disturbing him. You have great compassion for her and her plight. I hope you find ways to help Hol feel the weight of her situation.... so she doesn't feel you're carrying it with her. Let her have the entire weight of it, Amber.. if you can.

Hol's a smart girl. She cares what you think. It'possible she'll care more if she doesn't feel you're walking with her on this difficult path. You don't have to share your opinion one more time... she already knows. Lighter

I know what happens when resentments build up over a long time of trying to resolve a problem that only gets pushed off the table because it's not "convenient" at this very moment.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 08, 2020, 09:57:55 PM: I don't know if it'll help Lighter... but Hol set up my garage - where the auto tools are - for him, with barely a "by your leave". It was another of her - this is happening - and the situation immediately went down the tubes. Yes, she has stuff stored there for now too. She can't stand to walk in there and look at it either. So he uses the tools from the large tool chests and just sets them down. Inside; Outside where they rust. (The infamous shovel DID show up again. It'll need some TLC when B get here, to get the rust off and put an edge back on it. I bought another one and HID IT. But the meltdown I had over tools was effective; even tho both Hol & I were afraid I was gonna stroke out right then. I just hate the meltdowns immensely. One shouldn't have to go to those extremes to get the point across that it's a BOUNDARY.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 09, 2020, 05:09:59 PM: All that is necessary, to get a boundary across, is to enforce the consequences consistently, IME.

Calmly.

Without emotion, but with conviction and follow through that never fails, IME.

It's unclear to me whether S is still allowed to borrow, lose, misplace and destroy your tools, or not.

I suspect B will clarify the situation, when he arrives, if it's not cleared up before then.

You don't need a man to do that for you, Amber.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 09, 2020, 06:54:53 PM: The plan is - all his stuff will move to the Hut - WHEN the garage is built. That has not started yet. At that point, things will get locked. If they want to borrow something, the question will be asked THEN, when do expect to be done with said tool. Communication - as I've plainly stated in the basic farm meeting about how this CAN work - is absolutely essential around here, even over things like that. And since that's the last thing he wants to do - it's time for Hol to say, I'm not going to ask, you have to talk to mom.

Buck & I stayed up well past the witching hour last night... just being in our shared space - albeit at a distance. I really needed that change of scenery.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 09, 2020, 08:09:11 PM: Quote
it's time for Hol to say, I'm not going to ask, you have to talk to mom.

Amen and bravo, Amber!

Triangulation is absolutely toxic and exhausting and I bet you are heartily sick of it (if not actually sickened by it).

So glad for you that you're renouncing the pattern. It'll take her a few tries but if YOU hold your own boundaries firm, she might begin to catch on.

Two forward, one back = forward.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 10, 2020, 01:03:36 PM: Ya know...

it seems equitable and just, that if I can put up with how S is... and Hol does too (for now)... that they are going to have to put up with B (and his not being "like them"). I get a sense (no time to talk right now with her) that Hol gets that. As well as seeing that the list of accusations levelled against B, fit just as well -- and within our actual experience for that matter -- to S.

How easy is that for a solution? Assuming it's accepted, of course. Chances are, there is going to be continued resistance come up.

I can only take it as it comes.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 11, 2020, 08:10:39 AM: My head is not in a happy place. I recognize this as a totally stressed out space.

No more has been said between Hol and I on the topic at hand, since last week. So I've just been feeling all the swirling yuck in my own head. Not even Buck can get through and have an effect - and I'm pretty sure he feels that. Even if I don't want that...

Hol and I have chatted about misc stuff; I saw a design for leather along the lines of what she makes I thought she'd be interested in. Progress at the hut. Talked w/contractor yesterday since without any notice whatsoever... his guy started digging out at my shale pit without any coordination with me. Too close to the property line for comfort. And the utility right of way. But it's pretty clear there's some new distance between Hol & I. And that my fuse has been lit; but so far the explosion has been contained.

Which is why I feel so crappy. I'm doing that every moment of every day... because she's off busting her butt to finish up this project & make her new nest and get moved out to give me my space back and start figuring out how we coordinate after that... while S lollygags, wanders around, and snacks and naps all day long. I feel like the whole "request" to dis-invite Buck from coming here was a huge ungrateful, betraying slap in my face. Couple that, with the implied criticism of my judgement, perception, and ability to take care of myself...

and while it's all a mountainload of bullshit, it's pressing me down. The old 16-ton anvil or stinky turkey buzzard again. It's the kind of thing where if I spilled something, I might just break down in tears kind of deal. Like I can't do anything right; and everything I say, do, be, am - is somehow "wrong".

All because someone ELSE sees things differently and thinks they're "right". Maybe for them, they're right. But not for me. They can't make those decisions for me; not my "caretaker" or parent; I'm not being some romantically blinded naive little girl or desperately lonely widow here. As is documented here - I've handled my questions, doubts, concerns in a responsible fashion.

Yesterday, the guy installing my flooring called to tell me when they're delivering the wood and doing the install, so I'm going to try to finish the stone before then. Then over the weekend, I start dismantling/moving my bedroom so they can pull up the carpet and lay the hardwood. Hol is going to be moving at the same time but she said she'd help. So I'll be trimming stone veneer with a tile saw today; joy joy. I need to get my head on a little more balanced than this before I dive into that. Power tools, yeesh.

But it might look like progress in my 'hide out" space which is about the only place left in my house I feel comfortable in and that someone doesn't feel entitled to leave his messes. I need to shop for a big rug for the bedroom too. I feel a splurge coming up........ maybe..... if I can find something more classic and not so "trendy".

OH... and it's apparent one of them was sleeping in the other guest room. I'm guessing Hol from the beeline to the coffee pot.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 11, 2020, 09:01:00 AM: Oh, (((((Amber))))).

I can so imagine how painful this has been:
I feel like the whole "request" to dis-invite Buck from coming here was a huge ungrateful, betraying slap in my face. Couple that, with the implied criticism of my judgement, perception, and ability to take care of myself...

It's no wonder there's new distance between you and Hol. As horrible and strange as it must feel, perhaps in some way that feels "wrong" it's also "right." Intense closeness and too much analytics between parent and child can so backfire. I know my D (which isn't fully parallel but maybe in some small way) went nuclear and extreme to finally individuate herself, and in hindsight, I saw how much too involved and enmeshed I was...and how out of desperate anxiety over her well being as the bipolar deepened I advised too much, analysed too much, talked too much, and so forth. And in the long run none of my "helpful" wisdom saved her. Her being fully in charge of her own destiny hit me in the face like a dead fish, and I know her life is an enormous struggle to survive. Character wise, as I experienced how she'd treat me, and to me her entitlement and cruelty were huge disappointments and also my fault--I felt responsible for everything. I kept forgetting that she'd had TWO parents, and the influences that created her were partly me but also many others, including genes she could not help. She found and claimed her own highway and she is on it. Sometimes painful things happen in families no matter WHAT one's good intentions are.

I forgave her long back and forgive myself too, but I've never been through a more painful reckoning. You and Hol are very different people and I'm NOT thinking total estrangement will happen to you. But that is why (hope this isn't just pure projection, so take it all with a shaker of salt) I think a bit more distance between you would perhaps be healthy. When a child is one's biggest focus and biggest "project", stuff warps. Adult distancing and practicing regular boundaries keep things the right shape or help them re-shape into a more viable form.

You love her so much and your mountain compound dream has been full of love and energy and creativity. It may still turn out that way, or it may become a simpler "live near" kind of thing. A grandchild might still come along, or new friendships with people who live nearby, who can come out to visit post-covid and sit on the porch with you or you and Buck and talk and be your present friends. Your peers. I wish that for you.

Be good to yourself. You are not just building a rock wall, you're climbing one. One step at a time, keeping your balance, and trying to enjoy the climb itself...that's just about where you are.

Something I was perversely glad to read was you acknowledging how very much it has HURT, bringing you to tears. You sound always so knowledgeable and competent and in control and directing and planning...all of which is TRUE about you. But you seldom portray your vulnerable side, the simple hurt of being mistreated or misunderstood. Much less by the person you love most in this world.

I know what happened with Hol would really hurt my heart in your shoes. And I'm glad you're not suppressing that. You will heal and there's every chance you and Hol will eventually find new tracks individually that will result in your relationship working a lot better. But I don't think you can MAKE it happen. Once she is deeply into her own growing up, say in a few years maybe? (sorry!) she'll have more insight and maturity than she does now. Getting T will help and doing it entirely independently of you and not processing it with you would help even more. Girl's got to grow up.

I think a parent acknowledging their actual helplessness to steer their children's lives after a certain point (surely, age 40 is that point) -- releasing the outcome, is the only power we have left. Letting them go. Even in the most functional families, letting go is a gift. But it huuuuuuurts. It's a muscle we didn't know we had to use.

Oddly, that pain can lead to peace. Even relief.

Meanwhile, you and B deserve your own time, your own shared spaces, your own private happiness that is literally NO one's business but yours. I hope you won't discuss your relationship with B with Hol. I hope you will just live it.

And if she ever begins to comment on it again, I would Shut That Door firmly. More importantly, not open it in the first place. She'll share it with S or others in her entourage and it's not private and she is not your friend, she is your child. Likewise, if you can keep your talking about Hol to B as simple as you can for the sake of you both. He'll understand that bruise and be tender with it. But you don't want it to dominate your new beginning together.

Best of all, imo, would be whether or not Hol chooses to find a T, that YOU do. For yourself.

You've been through enough on your own.

hugs and comfort,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 11, 2020, 03:31:35 PM: Amber:

You care what Hol thinks, so it feeeels really bad when she's suffering and distanced from you, but this isn't the end of your relationship with her. There will be endings..... Hol will move out of your house and into the hut. S and Hol may break up. B will join your little farm and Hol will forge whatever relationship she'll have with him....... I trust they'll work that out. I think you should to.

I don't know that you care what S believes.... I doubt you care much, but it's a slap in the face, and that's disconcerting as hell, IME. Not shattering, but...... sets the world topsy turvy for a while. Till things come clear, and they will, IME.

Breathe.....
focus on self care.

Let Hol do her own breathing and pondering on things. This sleeping apart, S shirking work while Hol and you struggle to get things done...... Hol FEEEELS everything S does and doesn't do...... deeply, I'm sure. I think she's feeling quite a lot of shame and humiliation, to be honest. I think both your fuses are lit. Just keep sending the message you know she'll handle what's on her plate, bc you believe in her. Leave her to it. Tend your own plate, as you seem to be doing.

I'm already looking down the road to when you, Hol and B are stretching your relationship legs on the farm together. It feels like you'll all 3 find your wind and hit your strides.

S' opinions aren't important. Don't allow him to take up valuable real estate in your head, Amber. There are so many more worthy people and things to think about.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 11, 2020, 09:55:22 PM: I think the "distance" I notice - is simply me detaching. The conversation between Hol & I the day after the "slap in the face" cleared things up between her and I. I am intentionally not following up on that; waiting for her to do her own processing. And we both play those cards close to the chest until we're sure we know what we're talking about. Hol and I have TALKED; about other things... and still have the dynamic we always had. So we're not closed to each other.

She will decide what to do about S in her own time; on her own. If B & I are respectful of that process, all we ask is that others be respectful of ours. Who knows? Once he's really HERE, we might decide it's not going to work. That is a built-in "escape clause" in our plan - with no hard feelings. He's even willing to do whatever is legally comfortable in this instance.

S can't say that. And ya know? That's now HIS problem. I don't have to explain, justify, or compare. S is NOT MY PROBLEM. And that is how I'm detaching. I also don't have to do any more than I've promised Hol, either. I know she is immensely grateful and appreciative; and I know how uncomfortable she was being put between S's "needs" and my wants. I think I still come out ahead on the comparison of "perceptions" too - because I did second guess myself for most of a year; I made the effort and paid the fees to investigate if B's story checked out. Hol did not; I won't compare. We chose different paths for different reasons - and she has to deal with hers. That was made abundantly clear to her the day after the confrontation.

I didn't take his head off; I didn't dismiss him or laugh at his concerns. I simply argued my case. I was angry that I had to do that -- AGAIN. After all I've done to protect myself - and them - from getting involved with someone with ulterior motives. As if I'd just give up; give in. LOLOLOL. She knows better and even said it out loud in front of him - that I would do what I thought in my best interests, regardless. Yep; she knows Mom. She will eventually come around to seeing B without suspicious glasses on. Or she won't. But she's not going to have to defend herself from him, so that kinda counts for something. He's going to make her life easier, since he takes it on himself to do what needs doing - even preventatively. This is something TIME will clear up.

I have the clear advantage of having known him years longer than she has. And this decision about him moving started being seriously entertained years ago. She wasn't privy to that; she wasn't even around; as I told her: I haven't shared everything with you. B's D was getting ready to enter HS, when the invitation to visit was made. Now she's off to college. The "due diligence" aspect has been satisfied. All I'm focused on is the interpersonal stuff at this point; whether we're compatible ENOUGH; whether those deep expectations will pan out from the flirty promises. And there's real life, too - we're older folks; not in terrible health given how hard we've both lived. Things happen externally to all of us, that require adaptation and adjustment.

Since I'm leaving the issue be and not "saying" any else about it for now... it gives Hol a chance to process the underlying emotional stuff. I have full confidence she will - as it suits her. I don't have to like her conclusions. But it doesn't mean that we can't both live our lives fully within the context of making the place work and be what it can be.

I hope S is taking notes. <insert evil grin> My idea of "evolved" is light years past his; and I came by it the hard way. I didn't just read or watch a youtube about it. Hol is his - to keep or lose - as it manifests. And I'm a LOT easier going than she is.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 11, 2020, 11:01:14 PM: Not because I'm doubting she has one, but because I've never heard much about her vision:

Quote
But it doesn't mean that we can't both live our lives fully within the context of making the place work and be what it can be.

Is "making the place work" the same vision of the mountain for Hol as for you? I've heard about her doing some leather work there, and wishing to have a child, but not much more. Is she all in on the family compound/business/enterprise dream herself? Or is it more about a cool place to live and invite friends to, near you, and with space for her creative work?

I am trying to comprehend whether you're on the same page, or close enough. Sounds as though Buck's very ready to become part of your vision.

I would imagine you have thought it through and far ahead in a lot of detail, so am just wondering what Hol's dream is. What she'd like the shape of her life to be. I hope she is on board because that would be easier for you. Making films in big cities is pretty different from a cooperative bucolic arts compound, oui? Then again, maybe the bucolic arts compound is just as you said, a perfect place for her to retreat to. (And making films is a pretty team-based kind of career so it actually might fit really well once the rest smoothes out. I hope it restarts for her soon.)

hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 12, 2020, 09:19:53 AM: Well, the visions are pretty close - except I'm intent on living pretty privately, not a lot of company and she wants to be able to share the space and ambiance - and add her urban soundtrack into the hills (where I'm more likely to play bluegrass & bagpipes - or tibetan monks).

She wants to raise goats for making cheese; I'm looking at heritage breed cows - dexters - which provide milk and are a decent beef cow. I don't like pigs; anyway shape or form. S keeps ducks, geese & guinea keets - and when all this construction stuff dies down - we'll probably both have chickens, layers & meat. I want to stock the pond with fish. Buck wants to put an alligator in it - LOLOL.

She is planning to move her sewing, quilting, leather operation to the hut - which opens up the studio again. After making Buck a shirt and a parka - first sewing projects in 20 years - my old Husky decided to have a computer crash. Only local - but not close at all - place to get it looked at turned out to be a Mennonite quilt shop... and while I was there (machine fixed for free, along with the magic button combination to fix it again) I bought another mechanical one. Straight sewing machine, no embroidery, no computer. I was drooling over the industrial machine they had in the shop. I've wanted to get a loom, because I should be able to find wool to spin & weave around here. Textiles is something we want to keep going with - along with the self-sufficient garden/livestock plan.

Buck of course, needs a metal & mechanics shop. Since Holly has been learning to weld - she can refine her skill there and she's already a decent mechanical brain. B also is rock hound... and is eager to search the hills, cliff and fields for fossils, and whatever else might have lain hidden in the woods for a long time. Not to mention, he was quoting Chaucer last night... and regularly spews some Shakespeare play or another out of the lesser known ones.

I occasionally have flights of fancy about getting a horse - morgan or fjord pony - that can act as an all purpose farm animal: drive, ride & plow, timber, etc. And then I nix it - because the highway is way too dangerous for horses. Except right after the shutdown in the spring, there wasn't any traffic - especially big trucks - to speak of. Who'd have thought life would bring circumstances to the point that actual "horse" power would be feasible this soon?

New technology is blending with the old ways and I think Hol is about as committed to my idea of low-impact, but sustainable life style here. She is doing a lot of research into methods; her friend M is a master gardener & advocate of permaculture - which is the revival of old ways again - LOL. And so far, all of us can be reasonably comfortable sans the conveniences of modern life. I might have the worst internet addiction - but that's partly because the sources of local, regional & state news are pretty scanty and WV went online back when we built the first homestead. There are still pockets around that don't have fiber available yet... but there are a LOT of workarounds.

Hol is the lawn mowing queen and champion wood splitter. She also likes to build with rocks - she was my helper on those projects at the first homestead. The bobcat makes that work a lot faster, safer, and fun. She has a head full of ideas for plantings at the hut. I still have herbs in seedling pots to transplant and it's just been too danged hot & dry - and soo much OTHER crap going on. Every year, I think - this is the year I'll not have anything else to deal with and have permanent dirt under my nails. And every year, I end up saying - well there's always next year.

It has been interesting and fun to meet more of her friends; and there are overlaps in interests... so I would welcome them to the county & surrounding ones too. But I just don't want a large group of people all doing their own thing at all hours all the time out here. She's been told point blank - after I'm gone - she can do as she likes with the place. I really won't care. And there are some of her friends who are closer to "inner circle" people - who bring compatible skills and personalities and energy to contribute; so it's not like she has to ask permission to have guests in the hut. She knows to let me know if she's hosting bigger groups for a camping weekend or whatever. I've been able to be OK during those too... and enjoy the solitude I'm afforded by not being the central HQ for festivities. So it works out pretty well. (At 40-ish, most of her friends are past the hell-raising, invincible, "hold my beer & watch this" phase; that helps too.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 12, 2020, 10:42:29 AM: Oh my gosh, Amber. I love SO much about all of this.
I'm just having happy ping-ping-pings because:

I looooove goats. Used to milk some for a friend up near the mountains when he went away (when I lived out there too). Baby goats are the bomb. And the cheese...

I like aquaculture over gators, but B must have a right to his own little pet, eh?

I used to ride and looooove being near horses, but no longer for harnessing and sitting on. I hate bits. To me a horse's nostril is one of the most beautiful shapes in nature. And a horse was my friend once in a way that humbled me.

I wish I still sewed. Nmom had incredible standards for sewing...no garment came from her old Singer that did not have exquisite French seams. Dayyum. And I lived with a super talented weaver once. Same house, also included potters. Have you thought of a potting studio? Bet Buck would be awesome at that, dunno why.

Permaculture is EVERYTHING! I am so excited that Hol really does have a strong vision and it's so creative and sustainable and well aligned with yours.

As to hordes of guests or loud music...it's good most are in their 40s now and that she's clear on permissions required. I hope they'll all be considerate and wonderful to you and not disturb your peace. I have no advice except set those boundaries early and hold them consistently with no apology or anxiety. I know you can.

Where's my hut going? I'm not picky.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 12, 2020, 05:27:57 PM: Not all of those things may manifest in reality however. I'm pretty realistic about how much I can/want to do. So, one goal at a time before I find myself in over my head. LOLOL.

Mon/Tues the hardwood is getting installed in the bedroom. I used all the stone I had, and did not finish on the wall. Out of adhesive, too. And of course, now that's out of stock at my home depot... and I'm not driving 50 miles to where they do have it... because I need to empty my bedroom and closet enough that they can get in and lay the flooring before Monday. LOLOL.

As far as what we want to do out here, I think all of us are on the same page - but it's not going to fly that one person isn't contributing to the daily chores and only taking care of his own stuff. I haven't required it till now; waited to see if he'd offer - nope. He does have his projects - the ducks & geese are providing eggs and we could eat them. Chickens will come into the picture once everyone is settled again. So, we'll see. When it comes time for Hol to fill her propane tank and figure out how to get internet down there... see if he's paying his share or not.

Yes, I worry about personalities being compatible here, but IT'S NOT MY JOB TO MAKE THEM GET ALONG. People can't act like grownups and behave - or "Happy Trails".... I got other things to think about, manage, organize and work on. It's not my job, and I'm not his mommy, to pick up after him or manage his emotions for him by making sure he's never ever uncomfortable about anything else going on here, at my - or B's - pleasure. End of negotiation. Don't like those terms? Well then, you know how to get back to your farm and I'm sure both ex GF's will welcome you and soothe your wounds.... NOT. LOLOL.

This here "country" ain't a democracy even if I will listen to everyone from time to time. It's also not a dictatorship - because I have no interest in spending my time trying to manage other people. But I do have expectations and standards.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 12, 2020, 08:08:54 PM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on August 12, 2020, 05:27:57 PM
So, we'll see. When it comes time for Hol to fill her propane tank and figure out how to get internet down there... see if he's paying his share or not.Yup.
Yes, I worry about personalities being compatible here, but IT'S NOT MY JOB TO MAKE THEM GET ALONG. People can't act like grownups and behave - or "Happy Trails".... I got other things to think about, manage, organize and work on. It's not my job, and I'm not his mommy, to pick up after him or manage his emotions for him by making sure he's never ever uncomfortable about anything else going on here, at my - or B's - pleasure. End of negotiation. Don't like those terms? Well then, you know how to get back to your farm and I'm sure both ex GF's will welcome you and soothe your wounds.... NOT. LOLOL. You got that right, Amber.

This here "country" ain't a democracy even if I will listen to everyone from time to time. It's also not a dictatorship - because I have no interest in spending my time trying to manage other people. But I do have expectations and standards.
::reminded of the O-Ren Ishii's speech to the Tokyo crime bosses ::.
If anyone has anything to say... they should respectfully come to you and say it. You're open to discuss all topics EXCEPT for how you conduct your private life. Paraphrasing here.

::NOD::.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 15, 2020, 08:38:13 AM: My bedroom looks really strange with all my little still lifes/altars moved out. But it feels like the timing is right - all that "stuff" suited the hermit phase I started out here in, recovering and reclaiming "me" from all the change I'd lived through in the past couple decades. I feel like that's finally finished. So now - making space for Buck - and making the room as comfortable and healthy as I can make it. Still want to change out the french door with a good slider... but that can happen later.

Upstairs and downstairs - are the shrinking Holly piles of stuff. We are keeping fingers crossed that this week she can get serious about moving in. Yes, she's already pushing it as much as possible... while not getting in the contractor's way. And we're already starting to transition from the daily morning "what's going on" conversation to a once a week pow-wow.

There are some developments on the Hol & S front; and "little Amber" (pre-Twiggy days) made a cameo appearance to make a non-verbal but unmistakable comment. For now, I'm going to stay mum on the details -- but suffice it to say that Hol is making short work of deconstructing the imbalances in this relationship -- all she said to me yesterday was apparently she wasn't allowed to expect any more from him in the relationship because "that's who he IS" and yet, it's decidedly NOT OK for Hol to be who SHE IS. We had talked about "capability" the night before and how, while it's always possible for people to change & grow at some unknown future time... what they are capable of in the present is also important. Because that's where you're building communication (minimal in his case) and emotional connection (she's doing that all alone) and trust (:rolling my eyes so hard I'm looking out my ass:) -- she can almost certainly COUNT on him, to have some excuse when she wants to do something and even ASKING for help isn't getting her any. Because he's constantly "stuck" in his "present state" of "being who he is" and will not disturb that for what anyone around him wants/needs/expects.

So she's been doing all the moving in, and keeping quiet too... and I can see the wheels turning. A week ago she came out with: she wished she could move into the hut 3 weeks before he did. (Referring to his pigpen habits.) They have not talked since he yelled at her two nights ago and she slept in the other room. We got up and didn't see his car - thought he'd left - and sadly that was a false alarm. The temperature & atmosphere around here felt way lighter, fresher, less toxic even just believing he was gone. He's parasitical.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 16, 2020, 10:59:40 AM: Amber:

It felt like a penny dropped as I read that last post of yours.

There's nothing wrong with S, or how he behaves in you space. He'll be just what he is, wherever he goes.

He's not going to change.

The only change will come from you and Hol.

Any time spent feeling upset over S (for me) is wasted... he is what he is.

What Hol is, or what she becomes.... that's the great mystery I want to see unfold

What you're willing to put up with and how you'll rule over your boundaries.... THAT's fascinating stuff, IMO.

I'm on the porch, in what feels like an Autumn breeze, watching many hummingbirds flit in and out, fly by together, and feed at the edge of the porch, or check out all the red lamps, just in case they have sugar juice too, lol.

Something clicked for me, as I read your post.
We spend so much time focused on S.... the story was never about S.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 16, 2020, 12:42:37 PM: Perhaps Lighter. Perhaps S is for Hol, what the tarot readers call a karmic relationship - one that we learn some big life lessons from. As for me: I saw the writing on the wall a year ago. But feeling that my hands are tied - and it's NOT MY PLACE to make a final decision of whether he fits in here or is good for Hol, or even is reciprocating as much as he's gotten being here... is a pretty crappy place for me to be in. Given my nature, I'm going to have negative feelings about him - even IF energy-wise - I've spent time here alone with him (when she was in jail) and we can share a space "peacefully" with only his refusal to clean up after himself and being entitled to use & abuse my tools to irritate me. We simply did NOT interact. That is his standard way of dealing with the whole world around him. It's really not personal in my case. However, it's going to be VERY personal in Hol's case; and this is what is coming up for her, over & over again. He does the same with her - until he's uncomfortable in some way and then he's explosively angry with her.

For the most part I am detaching from much of anything to do with it. I have other things to do. (B has been a little neglected lately. But he's quite busy too.) It's in her hands; she is a big girl and I have faith she'll do what's right for her. She knows I have her back if she needs me; and I don't rise to the state of even non-verbal comments until he's being a real PIMA, in my house - and trying to tell me what I should do and be like, for the sake of his comfort. As if he's the only one who matters. There is another part of me; perhaps "little Amber"; who was wise all those years ago and is wiser still now... or my shadow side... that is working on a force field around my space and reclaiming it. It will likely be another two weeks before they're completely moved out. I am self-validating the role of "Queen of my Estate"... knowing just what I can/can't do without "unintended consequences"; knowing what is "right use" of power and what is definitely NOT; and staying strong within those boundaries. And giving her all the space & time she wants to invest in what I know, she knows is not currently what she wants. We have discussed if that's likely to change. She is still hopeful; but the last blowup has shrunk that hope somewhat.

They stayed in the hut last night; kind of camping - mostly just starting to claim the space. I even offered to make & deliver a pizza for them, if she texted me. I'm not being a bitch in this situation, but I'm not going to be pushed around either -- or let her get pushed around or manipulated. I am trying to model a helpful & respectful behavior. Hol and I checked in briefly about how she feels now; what she's thinking going forward. She is going to give him a chance to settle into their space and see if he can begin to open up to her a little more and they can find a way through the repetitive non-reciprocal nature of their private & mundane life. She will be not be overjoyed & happy if they decide it's not going to work - and that he can't accept that she is who she is, too and that she likes and respects herself this way and that's NOT being his mommy. And she is steady in the self understanding that she can't be guilt-tripped by him. She sees it when he tries it. Quite the contrary. When he threatened leaving after this last argument - which was pretty one-sided; him yelling only - she said "Go then" and went to sleep in the other room. This morning, she wisecracked that she's taking care of 3 dogs. Yeah, it's clear to her. I'm not worried on that front. She is giving him the benefit of the doubt that he will make good on the promises he's made - all conditional on being in the hut.

And he is clearly avoiding me. He's consistently told Hol I terrify him; I'm crazy; demented and having poor judgement, etc etc etc crap. Yet it didn't stop him trying to shove his entitled demand at me, to see B the way he sees him. (So, yeah it's going to be complicated - what in life ISN'T??) B has agreed to let me handle this, with some qualifications that I'm OK with. We both have extensive parenting experience and so, this situation isn't going to interfere with us. And B negotiates fairly. I know he's a man of his word, so I have a high level of trust there.

Life, however, is messy. And unexpected things happen all the time. I can't foresee everything or control those things, nor should I try in most cases. I have a high level of trust in Hol, too. And I know when it comes to relationships, she's already learned some hard lessons about guarding her own self-interests. But the times I thought he'd left or did actually leave, I certainly felt the energy in the whole space around here CLEAR UP DRASTICALLY.

I can, without malice, be a bull in a china shop with a floor full eggshells. With a giant happy grin on my face. To say I resent the NEED TO BE, because it's impossible to have a grown up rational conversation with someone who won't talk or acknowledge that my feelings are important too, without someone feeling intimidated or only considering their OWN wants & needs - and not the others around them - is an understatement. The respect that has been afforded has not been reciprocated. And that was a basic truth I dropped on Hol almost a week ago - that it's hard to have real love without respect for the other person. Just tossed it out as a non-sequitor. Someday, I'll hear her say it in another context.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 16, 2020, 04:08:35 PM: Thanks CB & Lighter. Honestly, I think I've spent enough brain-time on this subject - and as they spend more & more time at the hut (she's been here helping me with things to heavy to move by myself) - I can let it go and it's MUCH easier to just check in with her during our pow-wows once a week.

:shrug: Maybe he will change enough to convince her it's worth it. Maybe he won't. Will I still have to field Hol's need to express her frustrations? Probably. But I'll just tell her what she told me - talk to S and tell him how you want it done. Her kitchen counter butcherblock - all custom made by a friend of hers - now has spots on it after one night in the place because he doesn't pay attention to what he's doing and doesn't notice he made a mess - and doesn't feel it's his job to clean up after himself. Her response to that was: can you at least TRY? (Yes, she knows that it can be sanded & refinished but ONE NIGHT? REALLY??) I just looked at her and said, now you know how I feel. She didn't say if he even apologized; I have heard him do so in the past - while at the same excusing him from trying to do better, by simply saying "that's who I am". SIGH.

And we can do that; be that honest. As long as we don't push on the boundaries we've both developed over the past 2 years... we can say almost anything to each and have it acknowledged, and allow explanation or defense of self. Without it becoming an "argument" - because neither is wishing for the responsibility of controlling the other. That is way too advanced in human interpersonal relations for S.

When her complaining starts to take up too much of my time, which it has done in years past because she wouldn't just make her decision and carry it out, then I can/will be a tad more blunt and limit my time on it.

Instead of letting this take up room in my head, when they're moving out... I'm moving on to my happy place: Buck and decorating plans. And my new "studies" on some old interests. He COULD be here in as little as a month; just depends on how things go at his place.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 16, 2020, 04:15:27 PM: Uggghh.
I'm very sorry you're living with this kind of resentment and undercurrent stress, Amber. NOT what the mountain dream was about.

About this:
....or let her get pushed around or manipulated.

FWIW, short of him being physically abusive to her (zero tolerance of course)...is it possible Hol will learn her own boundaries better if her capacity for learning from her mistakes is assumed?

IOW, if she herself recognizes being dominated or manipulated? If you alert her to those, in my understanding that could slowly train her to believe that she can't develop the capacity to alert herself. Undermine her own agency because you are ready to leap in front of her or advise her or spot her.

I don't mean this in an unkind way, but Hol may need to fall. And bounce. Even painfully. Before she builds a stronger sense of self.

She's got a mother tiger when she might need a mother giraffe, serenely munching a good distance above her drama.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 16, 2020, 05:05:54 PM: Hops Hon, I KNOW she's got this, all by herself. I'm just calling her out to explain how SHE sees it and inquiring as to where her boundaries are. I'm absolutely NOT going to attempt to set them. If anything, I'm more easygoing and forgiving than she is. I'm only reassuring myself that she sees it. She wouldn't let me step in, anyway.

She's ALSO a mama tiger. Which why I'm detaching and letting it go along with all the stuff in my house... that isn't mine and I don't WANT. ;) The whole house will be cleaned top to bottom and then smudged. I might even wash windows.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 17, 2020, 08:50:57 AM: And the floor installers are here bright & early. Slept on the couch last night - I don't know what time it was when Hol came down for her midnight snack; then S was up early - twice. So I just got up & made coffee. But the guy brought a helper and they've just about got the carpet out of the room already. Maybe I can sleep in bed again tonight... which would be nice.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 17, 2020, 11:19:39 AM: I

want

PICTUUUUUUUUUuuuuuuuRRRRRRREEEEESSSSSS!
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 17, 2020, 12:26:58 PM: OK Lighter... I will find a picture service that lets me post links here. Not doing much today except designing and shopping - in my head for now - as I check the progress the guys are making. Might require a few computers - as I have pics everywhere at this point. But without the historical pics (from when I bought the place) you won't have a lot of context.

Usually you can password protect folders on those sites, which I can post here.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 17, 2020, 01:59:07 PM: Testing 1-2-3.... some pics of the Hut.

https://postimg.cc/gallery/18Mrb4n

ETA: YES! Worked first time, every time - no PW needed!
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 17, 2020, 06:53:56 PM: Ohhhhhh, it is soooooo beautiful.
I'm in transports of unrealized-mountain-houseishness....

WOW. I can just imagine how the hut and its landscaping and weathering will mature into a Really Comforting, Beautiful Home.

Kudos, Amber! And thank you for going to the trouble to give us these glimpses.

Hugs and huge hoorays,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 17, 2020, 08:30:01 PM: You're welcome. I MIGHT have time to get the other album populated - but those pics are on the office laptop downstairs (need to do some work in there anyway - but have to put my bedroom stuff back FIRST and get it out of the main living area).
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 18, 2020, 01:06:03 AM: Thank you, Amber! That was so satisfying! I love all those big, clean windows and skylights. The concrete tub and metal railing appeal to my industrial chic affections.

Is the concrete tub working out? I've never seen one before. Countertops, yes. Tubs, no.

Having your home back will be such a treat! Here comes cooler fall weather and B!

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 18, 2020, 06:57:53 AM: On the tub, there is still an issue with the tub filler. Because it's a deep soaking tub, there are no faucets/spigot inside the tub; instead the filler is floor mounted and intended to reach over the side... but the spout isn't long enough. Hol was thinking S could make a trough - like a downspout shield - that would direct the water but that still remains to be seen. Old sink hand pumps used to have that kind of shovel trough...

S has been spending every waking minute either in the garage or at the hut. He commandeered one of her fabric shelves for his books... and has been sitting around daydreaming in some la-la land state expecting her to keep him company and bring him "snacks" from the house. Avoiding me, is another way to explain that, methinks. She on the other hand keeps showing up here, saying she can't just relax there when there are still things that need to be finished and the rest of her stuff to go in. I understand that bit. And since he's not really interacting with her and talking about either future plans for planting or their relationship with her or helping her "do"... she's bored. She is still "doing" because she needs to organize and figure out where things are going to "live" in the house. And I think she is also thinking about what DOESN'T belong in the house....

my lips are sealed on that topic. But I can see some of her distress on her face. This phase of moving into the Hut was supposed to be celebratory and joyous for her... but by co-opting the process to suit himself and upending all her plans... out of his perceived "need"... it's been ruined for her. Knowing her, it's not lost on her that he's quite comfy and can't be bothered to do what's needed to help get one step closer to HER finally being able to relax & enjoy it -- with someone also caring about her.

This is one reason I just jumped into getting the hardwood down in my bedroom. It was something I could tackle myself - clearing the room & putting stuff back - mostly by myself. And instead of putting everything back to surround myself with myself again... now I'm making room for B. And there will be some intentional "curating" of what comes back into the space and what goes elsewhere. I need to do some detective work to find 4 boxes of the stone I'm using on the wall where the fireplace was... everywhere I've looked it's not available. So I'm calling the manufacturer today about where to find it or maybe they can help me out. The color with the floor and original pine walls is PERFECT. It's all a soft blend, no dramatic contrasts. A soothing space in other words. B needs that too. With his quirky additions. Yesterday he was telling me about an alpaca hide he got through customs after a mission somewhere in S. America and has had all these years, safely tucked away. It'll be nice in here.

Ideally, the stone would've been done before the floor went in - glue & all that mess - but it didn't work out that way. I had to fully occupy and exhaust myself.

I'm checking out some rugs, too - but the floor is so pretty I don't want to cover it all up. I washed my curtains but they still need ironed... so I'll be busy - at an easy pace - all week. (Still will dig out the house pics tho.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 18, 2020, 08:43:16 AM: Babbling... burbling... while I have a chance. I soon have to get the trash out since we were all pooped last night. Decorating is my "happy space" I think. Altho since it cooled off a little, I have cooking/baking on the brain too.

The college B's D is going to keeps moving the start date. We're looking at the middle of Sept now. He still has to do some more clean up on his house & get it sold; and he's hoping to get up here before then, for another visit. In the meantime, he's having some go-rounds again with the hospital & the lawyer is chomping at the bit now to "have at them" for what B's been through with them. In the last 4 years, every single "treatment" has created another serious, irremediable problem for him. And he still keeps going; as he says - they haven't killed him yet. But that's diametrically opposed to what "health CARE" is supposed to be about. Of course, they're held harmless for any serious side effects.... that's the chance you take. But with 4000 pages of medical history in their hands documenting all his allergies to drugs... it still hasn't stopped them from screwing him up even more. The recurrent meningitis is just the latest one and it seems to be becoming more frequent.

Poor guy even thought to ask me, if I'd still have him if they had to amputate a leg. It's all I can do some days, to keep him oriented to possible positive outcomes or potential solutions. He does the same for me, with the stresses involved in my situation.

Right now, I'm feeling like I'm in limbo. Hol wants to wait till the contractors are completely done to move everything in. And then she wants to do her "happy place" nesting thing too. I'm looking forward to having my house back to normal for a bit before B is here again. I am just DONE with the whole S thing and it's HER PROBLEM to resolve however she chooses to do it... as long as it's not impacting me. THEN, I will speak my piece plainly. And I'm at the point that I'm not diplomatic or tactful and I'm not going to go through years (again) of being her sounding board for the decisions she makes that are making her miserable. I'm not going to be an enabler for her to "put up with him", period.

As far as I'm concerned, he lost the right to have a voice in what goes on here when he put his "feelings" and "judgement of B" over mine. He is persona non grata. But I understand that Hol has always taken in stray animals and attempted to domesticate them. (Yeah, that's mean. But like I said, I truly am tired of trying to pretend I don't have negative feelings on this topic. That's just unhealthy.) And no way do I feel obligated to distort myself into a pretzel to accommodate unreasonable expectations or demands... like she does right now. She doesn't have to like that either. I'm staying inside my boundaries... and she knows it's all her to choose, decide, make it work or not... whether that's by herself or with participation from him.

Meanwhile, "happy places"..... are keeping me sane.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 18, 2020, 11:04:22 AM: Amber, gooooood for you.

You're creating more than one kind of space:

--emotional/mental space by detaching from Hol's labor pains to give birth to her maturity (a long labor that nobody else can do). Bravo. You're also detaching from her final judgment whenever it comes about S. She'll either get there or won't. Knowing all the ins and outs of his character and minor doings (like swiping a shelf) are a waste of your own mental space, imo, so the more you do this mental/emotional distancing, the better. For both you and Hol, ultimately.

--comforting, beautiful physical space to share with B. It sounds absolutely gorgeous and what a welcome for this weary man. And beautiful for you as well, as your artist side is creating the feeling, the calm and the gentleness you want to be able to rest in. Lovely. It won't be fake "spa"/"hotel suite" HGTV superficial. It sounds authentic, beautiful and warm. And for once this is for you (and B), about you, and as you envision.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 18, 2020, 12:16:37 PM: Well, Amber.... I hope you can withdraw with love from Hol's process.... but maybe shine a little light on what appears to be a pattern for her in relationships?

One of my girls has labeled it a "daddy issue" and SEES it for herself, and in her last relationship, which apparently she's still tethered to by internet... in case he changes. In other words, it's over, BUT if he manages to make huge change (unlikely) she'd date him again.

It looks like dd hasn't finished all the lessons there yet. I'm amazed and happy she's SEEING it as childhood trauma issues popping up... needing work.... getting attention. She has distance on it I never had at that age, for sure.

From here..... I so want to tell Hol to consider looking over her history..... asking her if it has any meanting THEN telling her to let you know how things work out for her....and drop it. Go back to what you've been doing.... editing, curating and considering what a comfortable life, for yourself and B, will look and feel like. On the feet. On the eyes... the way you feel when you occupy your space.

I noticed you shift from Hol BACK to yourself, B and your space... to the future... to B's ongoing struggle with the healthcare system and perhaps legal battles, and whatever comes next for him and his health.

I also think it's time you put a deadline for being OUT of your house and IN the hut, for Hol and the boy. Your post felt like Hol is determining that, stretching out the date, for whatever reason.... her comfort, perhaps. I don't think she needs more comfort... as you said...you're done being her sounding board to enable her to keep repeating mistakes and stay in untenable situations.

Maybe shifting her INTO the hut, sooner than later, will help her shift out of her old habits.... just squeaking by and hanging on to something that's not going to work, OR needs a strong kick in the rear to improve, or not improve.

I'm all about economy of motion, and you have a house to prepare for the new life you're launching.
It's difficult for me to imagine you putting up with the boy's ongoing messiness, and Ho's stuff all over the place..... even for one minute longer than necessary. HOL can put up with her stuff all over her place, and the boy's mess , without involving you. Why should you suffer too?

Something to think about, and it doesn't have to be delivered with drama... it can be a very calm boundary. It can be a very good lesson on HOW to be assertive AND kind, but firm.

I have the feeling Hol will deploy these very useful tools for herself.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 18, 2020, 03:44:11 PM: You ladies are getting a good handle on the actual situation, as I'm seeing it anyway. Clarification is needed on one point: because the CONTRACTOR over-extended himself, there are more & more delays about getting to final inspection point and occupancy permit. Camping down there when no one is around is one thing - but technically speaking, they aren't s'posed to MOVE IN, yet. That said - Hol said if there's no one here this week from the contractor crew (plumber is here today) - then SHE & S will start hanging doors. She is very TIRED of waiting and all the excuses for why he has to keep other customers happy when at most - two days work for a 3-4 man crew and they'd be done. (Except for negotiated things on the exterior.)

She just said next week she's going to bring everything here from the storage unit - DONE OR NOT; it's just one trailer load with my jeep. Then, she will work on all of the stuff - including projects she's taking on for herself. And the contractor will have to work around her. Occupancy permit or NO. I've had a conversation with the contractor too. And made it abundantly, unequivacably, passionately clear that it was past time for them to move out of my house.

What she CAN'T do - while there is necessary work to be done - is just sit down there & relax. Which is what S is doing. Basically to avoid being around me. I understand that.

Yes I'm detaching in as many places/ways as I can see where it is the right thing to do. Yes I'm shifting to looking forward - first to that time alone to reclaim my space as who I am now, after 4 years here; 2 of which integrated Hol, then S, into the picture. Then, to Buck. We have already talked at length about patterns in relationships and even explored past history with her Dad to an exhaustive degree. (Funny; those sectors on my neural hard drive seem to have been erased almost completely... LOL. GUESS WHY? I know only that it adversely triggered the previous trauma; not how or why - and it's not important now.) I've shared my own experience and what I know from conversations with people who have been through this kind of thing... what I've learned in T and relearned in real life. It's up to her now. She can check in; can ask questions; can discuss things pretty intuitively and eruditely... and we can own up to our own personal differences, knowing there's no one "perfect way to be" that fits everyone... and discuss those too. Without it being taken personally; as a criticism or "should".

We've both learned a lot from each other. Tried on bits & pieces of the other's personality for "fit". Usually what's borrowed is given back - but an adaptation is gradually made in both our understandings and standard protocols. There's been joint evolution going on - in our individual work too. And it doesn't mean we have a strictly cerebral relationship; there is STILL a lot of essential warmth and reciprocal "giving" going on - even when we disagree on some things.

There is still that little emotional "tug" though... about her moving on to a new phase - despite her not wanting to be in my way (or A&B's way) and me eager to have to my space back. It's totally irrational; totally emotional. Because she can be here or me there in 5 minutes tops. And we will see each other often throughout the week.

Going down to studio now to see what she's up to with the dresser she's spiffing up and to repair a canvas for her and give each other pep talks. LOL. And plan... lots of planning going on. So less personal conversation... more fun stuff. Since my bed was set up again last night, I slept wonderfully. She's continuing having disturbing dreams and midnight rambles & snacks. I think her subconscious is working overtime on her stuff. I've got some more stuff to think about ordering, trying to find, etc.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 18, 2020, 04:23:48 PM: Oh, yes, Amber.

More fun.

You've said everything to Hol you can say..... it's out there. Her mind seems to be working on it, even as she sleeps... so more fun seems exactly right.

She'll figure her stuff out.

You design and put your life in order. Savor these final moments of her in your home, as there's no changing the timeline, it seems.

More joy. Yup yup yup.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 19, 2020, 06:13:58 PM: In these days of incredibly frustrating customer service, long wait times, etc - comes a little ray of sunshine:

Yesterday I called the distributor for the stone veneer I need 4 more boxes of to finish the wall in the bedroom (prior to wood trim). This afternoon I got a call back from them, saying Home Depot would have it back in stock next week. I made sure to let him know I truly appreciated the callback.

It just makes a person's day, to give/receive those little kindnesses.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 20, 2020, 11:52:03 AM: That's great, Amber.

I'm glad to hear it.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 21, 2020, 10:05:19 AM: My tough, gritty & gruff, plainspoken all-man marine posted this last night when he couldn't sleep. This kind of thing keeps bubbing up from him - totally unexpected; not to "type" - and shows the levels of complexity that are impossible for a puzzle-solver like me to not love....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TT5u2xVEO5M&feature=emb_logo
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 21, 2020, 03:21:52 PM: Men need beauty, sweetness and stuff that goes to the heart as much as women do. If not more, given how they're programmed in this culture.

SO nice that B knows this and shares it too.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 21, 2020, 04:32:50 PM: That was so touching, Amber.

It felt like SEEING B come into focus.... rich colors, and depth of emotion...... thank you for sharing that.

Does he often have trouble sleeping? Is it pain, or worry?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 21, 2020, 06:21:57 PM: Some of both Lighter. He slept great when he was here.

There were many many nights I'd be up most of the night or several times a night those first months alone. It makes such a difference knowing that someone who cares is there. As Hol & S spend nights here & there at the hut - I'm re-experiencing a little of that kind of insomnia. But it's really minor. I have my routines pretty well down these days - even if I make exceptions to it here & there.

Right now, the time B & I can chat freely is after 9 or so; and it usually wraps up no later than midnight. Usually. LOLOL. Depends on what else is going on that we're chatting about. I have a feeling today's events will lead to an actual phone call... LOL.

Seems his D and her girlfriends got the wrong idea about his secret "trips"; the haircut for the Navy gig... and scheduled an "intervention" with him.... because they've only seen him hug two women in 18 years... and the way they connected the dots... they came up with him exploring latent homosexual tendencies. (I'm still laughing my butt off here over this...) After the girlfriends left, B came clean and explained to the D about me. And swore her to secrecy so his Ex doesn't get wind of it and cause trouble. Altho, at this point - it's a) none of her business and b) nothing she can do about it either. He's just a tad paranoid about dealing with drama.

I did warn him, that he'd have to tell her sooner or later - and sooner was preferable, since at 18 she should already know how to keep some things quiet, so as not to create drama. She was already stressed out enough, worrying about him when she went away to college.

This is still fabulously hilarious for me. I'm betting he sees the wisdom in my advice now. LOLOLOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 21, 2020, 07:43:46 PM: Hee. Sometimes it pays to be honest. Not that B exploring his sexuality would be a bad thing.

Just what, exactly, is B afraid ex will DO when she finds out about you?

And....
How likely is it his DD will keep that secret?

Depending on the answer, maybe he should have let his dd's imagination continue running away with itself.

Hurry up, B!
Quick!
Go.
Run!
NOW!
Time to go to WV before your ex discovers Amber!
::whispering::.
I hope his DD doesn't give away his position.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 21, 2020, 07:53:49 PM: She'll just create a whole drama - and possibly beg for money he doesn't have. And make herself out to be a martyr in the process; she's not well either - COPD and recurrent pneumonia. One of B's allergies is to drama. LOL.

He owes her half the proceeds of the house, when he sells it. And to keep the peace, he's kept her on his health insurance but because she is perenially broke also paid all her co-pays.

As far as I'm concerned, he's done right by her and doesn't have to give another inch. Not when she's constantly berating him, criticizing him, and running him down to Boo. Mostly due to his medical issues, btw. It's not serious "trouble" - it's just stuff that irritates him immensely. And that type wouldn't hesitate trying to reach out me with her sob story either. For financial help.

So - he's adamant about keeping HER in the dark and I can't say I blame him.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 21, 2020, 11:55:09 PM: I don't envy B's predicament. He has unfinished business with the ex... it will affect his dd..... ex will put the dd in the middle..... B will suffer, bc his dd will be made to suffer. Such is life when we make children with PDs.

Do you think B has any co dependency issues? It seems such an odd thing for a soldier to have such an aversion to conflict, but there it is.

Dear, gentle B.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 22, 2020, 01:48:14 AM: DD is adopted; Ex left shortly thereafter because B was injured and she just didn't feel "that way" about him anymore. DD is what kept him alive till we met.

I can relate.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 22, 2020, 05:35:13 AM: So B's ex took the child with her as an infant, and B lost regular contact?
Or had less frequent contact than he was expecting as a father?

That's tragic if so.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 22, 2020, 10:33:19 AM: I think B was very involved Dad, sounds like.

It made my stomach flip to read what happened.....the wife left B cause of his injuries.

That she bullies him over them....she sounds like a sociopath. Not that she is, just saying. It doesn't speak well of her to run him down to their child, in any case.

Lord.
And he kept her on his insurance AND paid her copays for HER medical problems.....all while NOT making fun of her or her health issues to their dd.

Putting MANY miles between them will be a good thing, B and ex.

I wonder if he'll be able to break all contact.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 22, 2020, 11:17:31 AM: B raised the D; Mom wanted to be gone. Until 18; now Mom feels like her opinion matters more than his. LOLOL.
He handles this way better than I would... hasn't seen Ex since HS graduation a couple months ago. He is pretty much as no contact with her as he can be. Distance is even better; and why there was such secrecy about what he was planning. He really didn't want to be found, after he sells his house, gives her 50% and he takes off. Lots of self-preservation in there with the secrecy.

One of the ways I got involved talking to him all those years ago was him asking the women on the forum for some help to buy D a good sports bra. He didn't know where to start. But he is now a veteran of Victoria's Secret... LOLOL. And the guy's "bench"... waiting. I got involved again with the prom dress - the prom that didn't happen due to Covid.

His oldest D - biological - is the same age as Hol. The one who lives in London. But she ended up living with mom until her teenaged years, when mom couldn't handle her anymore. B was still enlisted & active initially; so I'm guessing it was shortly after his injury that he got BL back on track. She's an engineer; thinking software engineer. But she likes tinkering with tools as much as B does. And there's at least one grand-daughter too. She's old enough to be his realtor.

Then, there's all the kids he's fostered over the years. So, he seems to come by "strong fatherhood" pretty naturally. There are some differences between he & I over philosophy that way, the way there usually are - but except for the "adult daughter follies" we don't have to actively parent. I raised Hol very very differently than most people did in the 80's-90s. And it has made her extremely self-sufficient and independent; but it also has it's drawbacks too. We've talked about it in those terms; and she's at the "no parents get it completely right even when they don't do something wrong" stage about it.

Brianna, B's D, wants to be a tattoo artist - which Hol did for about 10 years. So, she'd welcome Brianna to come stay and talk about that and maybe get our brand of Amazon female mentoring too. Hol has two step-brothers (Ex #2's boys) and she's been in contact with them; saw the oldest one out in Portland when she was on her road trip. So she's no stranger to blended families.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 22, 2020, 12:15:03 PM: B sounds like the kind who's calm at the surface, but paddling like hell under the water. To keep all those children on track, be enlisted, get injured, go through his own recovery... he had to paddle like mad.

It's difficult to imagine a woman abandoning a child, any child, bc that's how my mind works. I know it happens. I know worse happens. B's ex wanted that child badly enough to go through the adoption process. It certainly appears like selfish and harmful behaviors in all directions....and....
it just keeps coming up for me, not as a judgment...
but as a behavior style....
psychopathic.

YET, she appears to have fostered children?

In any case, I'm hoping B can make a clean break, and getaway.

It sounds like he's deserving.

What, if anything, is the adopted daughter saying about her mother's sudden bossy boots reappearance into her life?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 22, 2020, 05:04:24 PM: She's not saying too much Lighter. She does speak up when Ex's ideas and hers conflict - or when Ex is being unfair to B in some way. I can only imagine what kinds of abandonment issues MIGHT be experienced in a case like this. But if I know B, he's done everything he can to make sure the D isn't in anyway blaming herself for someone else's choice in the matter. Still, those kinds of feelings really HURT.

Got my bedroom curtains ironed & rehung; after all the work in there they were pretty dusty. Still waiting on my rug; pad is supposed to be delivered today. Hol is attending to some homeowner tasks that she wasn't waiting around for contractor to take care of. She is hoping to get to inspection & occupancy late this week so she can move all the rest of her stuff there.

It's quiet around here. And I'm remembering how I go about doing things again. Instead of getting pulled in this direction or that - or navigating around people eating at all times of the day whenever they're hungry. Thinking about when is a good time for overhauls of hvac/hot water systems. I'd LIKE to get the furnace replaced this fall and a/c upgraded... both heat/cooling with two zones for upstairs & down... leaving the ground floor as is.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 22, 2020, 07:37:40 PM: I can't feel comfortable demonizing a woman I don't know enough about, or labeling her "psychopath" or "sociopath" or "PD." (Could be true, could be partly true in some ways, could be hyperbole or pot-stirring.) I don't know what her issues really are, and don't know anything whatsoever about their actual marriage.

B sounds like a wonderful father and as though he's threaded the needle with his ex as well as he could. In addition to really being there for children. Bless 'im.

I found that although I loved M, when I listened to him denigrate the "crazy" mother of his children I was disturbed by his glee. She had her own desperation.

Sisterhood is sticky, for me. Even for strangers, until I learn otherwise directly. Or at least, it just feels like a moral imperative for me, not to pile on for my own entertainment or satisfaction. So far, I feel I don't know enough about her life to have a view.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 22, 2020, 08:16:38 PM: I'm kinda the same way Hops. I only know what Buck has said about her; but I do know it takes two to tango in ALL cases. And while I feel his hurt at the suddenness of her pronoucement is genuine and it was a long relationship... I don't know all the details either. I have read enough of the military wives' support pages & stories to know that it puts incredible stress on a relationship. There is an awful lot of lonliness in those marriages. And depending on length of deployment - people change too.

But I'm not about to go into detail with B about my marriages and don't expect him to about his. At our age, it would be rarer than hen's teeth to find someone who'd never been in a close committed relationship and had their share of lessons learned; pain; and regrets, sometimes. In fact, I'd be real gun-shy of someone who made it to 60 WITHOUT having had that kind of relationship!

Sometimes, there's such a thing as "over sharing" that doesn't really contribute anything to learning about a person, as they are now. Society seems to have expectations that this is a good thing for people to do. I question that premise. I think sometimes, that's how patterns get repeated within relationships. It's more complicated than that, sure... but I think that level of "confession" contributes to it. I'm much more interested in a clean slate approach, discovery, exploration, and actual first hand experience than trying to work out what went wrong in the past, in a present relationship. It kind of contaminates things, I think.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Meh on August 23, 2020, 12:31:14 AM: Interesting about sharing too much.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 23, 2020, 07:38:47 AM: I know G, right? I'm kinda the poster girl for that phenomena. LOL. But I am aware enough to only do that certain places, like here. Still, I know people who do more of it, in more "gory detail" than me.

And lately, I'm relearning the "discretion is the better part of boundaries" lesson again. Even with people I trust. The misunderstandings, endless clarification, twisting things around into their own frame of reference that goes on when people open up with each other can be endlessly frustrating for me, at times - when all I want is to be heard, taken at face value, and not have to endlessly support those statements of emotion with explanations, footnotes & bibliographies.

I realize I'm often guilty of the same thing too. But I'm not entirely sure where people learned to do that, if it's just lazy thinking/being, or social conditioning. Along the same lines with that observation is the contamination of discussion forums with the "conversation style" of social media -- instead of actually talking TO another person, people simply post oversimplified "statements" - whether visual (memes) or verbal quips. That's a take it or leave it conversation style. Hit & run even.

I'm trying to improve my conversation skills. Seems worthwhile in this day & age. I've even taken to writing letters to Buck. When he was here, he pulled one that was all folded up out of his wallet. Letters are a REAL attractive means of communication for me. Hand written is a requirement.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 25, 2020, 07:31:23 AM: Going through a bit of bleak time here.

Hol is attempting to talk to S about their relationship - and he's flat out stated he's afraid to talk. She's told him that is NOT an option, because he's not showing her he wants to engage in relationship with her either; and she's tired of him being unhappy while WITH her. She has offered even, to help him be happy SOMEWHERE ELSE. So, her anger and disappointment and frustration are building up. I successfully fended off last night's attempt to offload some of that anger on me, by trying to paint me as a political stereotype and didn't take it personally. Because it was clear she wasn't going to sleep until her energy dissapated some. Without directly calling out this dysfunctional strategy. (Saving that for when she's not so full of anger and can "hear".)

Buck's last medical device - the nerve stimulator - is now on the fritz. Battery isn't holding a charge; and it's gotten so bad now he can't get it to start. Which means his pain levels are escalating to the point of not sleeping again. The device support team made him an appt to "look at it" for SEPT 27th. When this thing isn't working, he has trouble standing and walking. And of course the pain makes him grouchier than normal. Not only is that appt close to when he was planning to move, but he won't be able to be ready by then... if he's in so much pain now.

Hol has invited a couple of friends out - and that may distract her & cheer her up a little bit. We'll see.

As for my situation, I'll probably try to call B later on today. See how he's doing; what if anything he's been able to change in his favor. For myself, I'm going out into the wide world today... grocery shopping.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 25, 2020, 12:49:47 PM: Ooof. That's a lot, Amber.

I'm sorry Hol is confiding in such detail, and offloading her process onto you. It must be both hard to hear it and hard to not listen endlessly. Rock, meet hard place. But it also sounds as though she's moving forward. Baby steps. Nothing avoidable about what she's going through. She will learn crucial things as we all have had to do when relationships aren't right. I'm glad you're allowing her to learn them on her own.

Terribly sorry about B's pain. That SUCKS. Big time. Really, really tough. You don't need a stick in the spokes but life keeps tossing those anyway. When there's physical pain on top of emotional things to handle, it's exponentially tougher.

Sigh. Hang in there, mountain woman.

Hugs and comfort,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 25, 2020, 01:48:51 PM: Amber:

I'm afraid I never grasped fully Buck's device situation. It's great to hear he HAS a device that was working well....finally.

That he's waiting again for care is frustrating and super unfair. I hope he can contact whoever helped get medical attention quicker, to be up and running for last training mission, and move that appointment up. Maybe? Don't ask, don't get. Just an idea. I also ask to be put on wait lists for cancellations. It always works. Every time, but I have to ask.

It makes me sad so many vets wait and wait for critical care. It's inexcusable, imo.

I have grocery shopping on today's list too. Cleaning out fridges first. Enjoy your time out in the world: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 25, 2020, 01:56:25 PM: I agree, Lighter. Inexcusable.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 25, 2020, 03:06:02 PM: Oh he asks... and then someone in a cubicle without a medical degree decides it's "unnecessary" and he starts the whole process over again. Including calling/writing his senators, DOD, VA mucky-mucks. He's gone to the media.
He and I have been through this together every couple months for 3-4 years now. Long distance of course, but I'm here for him. Even when he admits he's whining - and refuses to tell his other friends on the forum because he's getting sensitive about the sympathy and pity he gets. I'm one of the handful that actuallly gets angry he's treated this way and I make suggestions that he might not have tried yet.

Both medical negligence and medical malpractice apply in his situation, as legally defined. No one I know believes this is necessary, to go to lawsuit lengths. But there is literally nothing ELSE left that he hasn't tried. He knows I will help if he needs me too - whatever the situation is.

Lighter - originally, he had a morphine pump (for pain mgmt) and the stimulator for the nerves in his back & legs. Each has failed once or twice over the years, needing to be replaced. The last time they replaced the pump - something in their protocols slipped and he was infected with staph -- which went inadequately treated until it had ramped up to be septic & resistant to most antibiotics - except the one he's deathly allergic too. While he was in the hospital, someone didn't read his chart and started an IV drip of that particular antibiotic - which caused him to go into cardiac arrest. They kinda sorta got the infection under control finally after his persistence, when the pump started pushing out through the original incision used to place it (they are supposed to be anchored internally). So his last surgery was to take the pump out. He was managing pain OK between what his T prescribed for him (guy is a psychiatrist) and some herbal things I could suggest he safely try. Yes, I did extensive homework on those and his other meds.

Sigh. So after his trip up here in June, he started noticing that the stimulator battery was discharging a LOT, shortly after being charged instead of lasting a few days or a week - depending. He'd had a consult with the device support people who informed him that the surgeon from 2 surgeries ago, placed the paddles in the wrong place - which was why his pain levels were increasing. Those internal paddles, I'm guessing relatively small, are secured along the spinal column at certain vertebra to stimulate the proper nerves for his legs to work right. Think internal TENS unit. He suspects, the device support people aren't sure but said it was possible - that the workaround they suggested for the incorrect paddle placement - to turn it up higher - has shortened the life cycle of the device.

Due to the MUSC docs, and their approach to things - if the stimulator needs to be replaced (according to device manufacturer's assessment) then he MUST have the morphine pump re-inserted. (No one will say WHY; he's asked; he's been managing quite well WITHOUT IT. He doesn't WANT it; doesn't want to go thru detox again.) HOWEVER they will not attempt any surgery until his infection is cleared - and that is managed the total clown show in Infectious Disease... who have told him to his face, that they simply can't treat his infection; there is nothing they can do... and they are treating antibiotic courses like opiod narcotics... DESPITE his primary care doc referring him for specific doses of specific antibiotics for a duration of x number of days. They also misdiagnosed his rash/reaction to the steroid shots that they insisted was a symptom of staph. (which is an internal spinal column/bloodstream infection; it never STARTED as a skin infection; something wasn't properly sterilized or got re-contaminated in the surgical process)

If all of this is confusing, I understand. I always understood "First, do no harm" to mean, do what you can - instead of do nothing. When they don't act on the referral advice of an outside doc (who has a copy of all 4000 pages of his history since the accident in '94)... and he can NOT go to another hospital system, per the VA... I understand why his T is still seeing him monthly, doing what he can for pain mgmt... and checking for depression symptoms and uncontrolled anger. Fortunately, he's good on the anger issues - fantasy notwithstanding. And his down moods don't last long; not with me doing my best work in comedy ever. He still isn't giving up - even if some of the worst days he feels like he's been thrown on the reject pile to just die already - and THAT'S why I go out my way to find whatever I can to support him, emotionally.

One light at the end of the tunnel would be if he got his official retirement papers - all signed & approved - by the Navy. Then he could change to the Tricare insurance -- and choose his own docs/hospital. But it can take up to 6 months for that retirement package to go through the bureaucratic process. And no, there's no way an NCO has enough pull to get that fast-walked.

It's just SOOOOO frustrating - and this particular part of the circle is also physically debitlitating. I am now threatening to kidnap him... and deliver him into the hands of real professional docs. LOLOLOL.

SHHHHhhhhhh.... I sent him a Youtube vid of a belly dancer to try to distract him....
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 25, 2020, 03:59:14 PM: Oh Christ Almighty. Makes me burn.
I understand the sitch.

PRAYING, sez this agnostic, for his retirement asap.
TriCare for Life, yesssss.

Meanwhile, I offer the cockatoo video.
And tell B he has an old lady elsewhere offering him the tenderest support.

Helplessly,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 25, 2020, 09:36:55 PM: I will Hops. Thanks.
Right now, I'm trying to relax him and cheer him up enough to sleep tonight.

He says it helps to know people care. So I will need to find a good moment to suggest that instead of withdrawing and being quiet about his trials and tribulations... he might find a way to ask for support (instead of pity). I think he's isolated a bit long, for his own good. And we all know how hard it is sometimes to ask for what we need. LOL. But given how hard this has been for him, his T must be a miracle worker to get him this far.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 27, 2020, 06:55:23 AM: Thunderstorms Tues night have affected my cell tower. So, if I'm not around much it's coz I just don't have a signal until they fix whatever is wrong with it. Been 24 hrs already.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 27, 2020, 05:04:03 PM: Had a pleasant chat with ATT's tech support this morning. The tower had two issues, that got resolved today. So I'm back in business again and trying to get caught up.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 27, 2020, 06:23:48 PM: Soooo glad you're back, Amber.

Can't imagine where we'd be without you.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 28, 2020, 08:31:17 AM: Thanks (((((Hops))))).
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 28, 2020, 05:13:52 PM: So this weekend commences "Operation Hut Move". Weather permitting. Depending on whose forecast you watch we could get sprinkles, occasional thunderstorms (it's thundering as we speak), or the remnants of Laura.

Sealer went down on the great room floor downstairs; it should be dry enough for them to move the left over building materials from the two smaller rooms (technically bedrooms) to there. And Monday, the small rooms will get sealed. Hol is going to empty the storage unit this weekend into the great room downstairs.

I requested a 911 address, which we only found out today was required before final inspection. (Could've been done any time after the building permit was issued, but contractor didn't tell us that.) Electrician was here today, but doesn't feel like putting up sconces in downstairs bath; taking them off for wallpaper to go up; which can't be done until tile is completed next week... and then putting the sconces back up. Plumber comes next week - but NEEDS the tile done in that bath to finish his work.

So they're spending more & more time at the hut; including overnight. Which suits me fine - unless they head up here to shower & sleep, after midnight, to be out of worker's way the next morning.

On the one hand - I'm loving the peace & quiet; on the other - echoes of "empty nest" are there. But that's OK, coz she's "here" - without being in my space. It just might WORK.

Buck is having one more "go round" with MUSC. With the stimulator failing, he literally doesn't have any choice except to go back to them and pray they don't make things worse. There's a new doc as head of Infectious Disease, and they have to work/consult with the new primary doc. B gave them 30 days to get his pain under control so he can sleep; or replace stimulator - position paddles CORRECTLY - and then, IF the same neurosurgeon is there, that doc will insist on the morphine pump going in at the same time (why, he's never explained. I've been chewing B's butt to find out and if that's really needed since he was doing well enough without it). Of course, no surgery can even get scheduled, until he's certified clear of infection. That requires another round of ABs (or two) with an appropriate non-allergic drug and a letter certifying clear or not - to neurosurgeon.

B has told them, if they can't clear the infection THIS TIME, then he wants to be released from their care. That SHOULD enable him to go elsewhere. I am just a spectactor (and chief worrier) in this new circus. It's his body & life. And he can NOT finish up his to-do list if he's not able to walk and do. But I did clearly express how I feel about all this. It is the LAST thing I wanted to think about the LAST month (I HOPE) before he finally comes to live here. I know how long his recovery time is - and that's if a new problem isn't introduced and all goes well. It dredges up old fears and experiences. And I am well aware of the worst that could happen.

But the main thing is - this stuff is all a part of him; it's what he has to live with since the injury. It is difficult for me; but it's not impossible. I did sign up for helping him through this. It isn't ALL that he is, that is for sure. It's just the reality of his body he deals with everyday. And I suppose it sounds worse than it is - because I have such trepidation about allowing them to perform surgery on him again. But I have no say in the matter; and the stubborn man is doing it so he can get his D established at school (or plan B, if that doesn't materialize in this time of Covid)... and get moved here. I can't be mad at him. But I still think it's a big risk.

So you can put my anxiety level on that continuum we're talking about too. I know it's true, that all good things come to those who wait - especially gracefully - but my patience is stretched pretty thin these days and I'm a little spooked by stuff going on in the world these days. There is only so much I can do about that stuff in the world; and while it's not the same as "I don't care" - I can't focus on that without sliding into frustration & depression. So I focus on what I CAN do, to be ready for a month from now; adjust to the Hol not being here as much and regaining full control of MY space again... making it "just so" for me. And I can do stuff to weather the ups & downs of the world... to prudently cushion us from from the strange goings-on. It's all part of self-care, IMO. Resilience.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 28, 2020, 05:42:41 PM: Oh, Amber....

I think I'm.....
nauseous reading about more surgery, the creation of possible more problems, even if B gets IN and gets care.... they might actually make things worse.

Again.

You are made of super strong stuff, and so is B.

I'm sending big pink and white waves of healing light B's way.

::crossing fingers they get that infection under control, pronto::

I can't wait to read about your space as you morph it into what you want it to be for you... now: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 28, 2020, 08:25:54 PM: Yeah, I know Lighter. I felt like he just told me I didnt matter to him at all. My first instinct was to be mad at him. He KNOWS what I went thru with Mike. But I didn't react that way.

I calmed down and realized that he wouldn't be physically able to do what he plans to do in the next 2 months without SOME assistance - and at the moment, he has no choice (as absurd as that is) about where to seek assistance. It's sure not his fault his med devices went bad on him. I was just reflexively being self-centered and on the verge of a pity-party. I nipped that in the bud right quick. What with the tension I've been living with on a daily basis around here - that news was like the straw on the camel's back to me. And I catatrophized it in a nano-second. I didn't even go to sleep believing in that story line at all. PHEW... talk about the past leading one astray... it was a close call.

But I guess practice of discipline over mouth & fingers (typing) does work. Even 10 minutes of real thinking (versus just emotionally reacting) was enough for me to outline back to him that I got it; why he has to entertain this. And the fact is - the ultimate goal is to get moved here with me. When we'll find him different docs & treatment. But I did point out, that I'm not just someone he's trying to get TO, in a couple months. Au contraire. I am right here, right now... and I would hope he would include me in discussion/decisionmaking of this magnitude. Just dropping it fait accompli on me, just about sent me over the edge. He has every right to do it that way, mind you. He's a grown man. But oh lordy, that put me through 10 minutes of sheer panicked hell.

I know he's been stressed out too. And he's always said he doesn't talk easily about his emotions. But this wasn't even about emotions (and I think he's pretty danged clear about them). But then - he hasn't slept much in 3 weeks either. I can forgive him his style of telling me about this. He didn't mean to scare the crap outta me. But he sure heard me when I told him about it doing so.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 28, 2020, 09:45:24 PM: Oh, hon. That was really hard.
But GOOD for you for catching your reaction and depersonalizing it. Bravo.

Just reading about what he's going through left me thinking if it took a morphine pump, bring it on. I'm glad you were able to give him space again, to feel what he has to feel and find his own way through.

He hasn't forgotten the big A&B goal, I think. He's trying to make it happen.

And worst case? We're all mortal. But he is not Mike and if god forbid you face another loss some day, one loss is not like another. Not when you continue to grow and deepen and heal as much as you have. B has got so much life force going that I can't imagine you are not going to enjoy quite a few years with him. Whatever it takes to reduce/control his pain.

It does sound like he has a rational plan. Very much so. So in a way, I feel relieved that he took care of those decisions on his own. Yes, he could improve how he keeps you in the loop. But maybe it's more important to him to make his own choices about his own body, at a time when it's demanding he attend to it. And feeling pressured to get your buy-in just might be a step too far.

You like 'em strong and independent, right? You got it!

No despair. You two are good, still very good.

That's what I believe, fwiw.

Big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 28, 2020, 11:59:04 PM: Amber:

I wouldn't be surprised if B carries some fear around your willingness to go through ongoing medical stuff. Maybe his stoic process is a bit about having to do it on his own, always, and fear it will always be that. Him. On his own. Coping. Trying to get to you....you choosing not to wait.

I have the feeling he's more vulnerable than you know, but maybe I'm reading too much into what you've shared. No....I think he'd have to super human to escape despair after all he's endure, particularly with 3 weeks of poor sleep.

Despair is a dark hole of WHAT IF, IME. This is a man used to solving problems. My heart breaks when I think THIS treatment is the thanks we extend to our injured vets, Amber.

I wonder what B does with that in his darkest moments. He holds it together better than I would, me' thinks.

As for your reacting.....who wouldnt? It's a gut punch. Maybe B anticipated you'd be very reactive? More reactive? His track record with a not very supportive partner likely has him waiting for the other shoe to fall....even if he's not aware of it.

In any case, I hope you both keep lines of communication open. You guys seem to do a pretty good job navigating the surgeries. You'll do it again if it comes to that.

Again, I don't really understand the medical issues. It seems like B is heroically overcoming obstacle after obstacle in ways I marvel at. The problems sound critical to me.

If B finally makes the move to the farm, can walk, can sleep and isn'texperiencing debilitating pain and infection....
I know I'll sob with relief.
::Praying for best possible outcome::
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 29, 2020, 09:44:11 AM: Oh... thanks you guys. I'm touched; especially about the understanding you're extending to B.

Yes, he's the independent problem solver. Yes, that's exactly what I saw that was soooo attractive this time around. There are subtle things going on. One is the idea that our relationship will be one of living life together - but remaining independent in more ways than a traditional marriage or committed relationship usually entails. In other words, we're together by choice - not a binding contract. The only similarity is that we're both monogamous by nature. Financially, our invididual situations are complicated as it is; it makes sense to keep things separate etc... we have full life histories behind us... and life-long ways of being/living... and this just seemed to make the most sense to me so that if for any reason, one of us said "oops, I think we made a mistake" we could part friends, no harm no foul. And of course, we're both avoiding/resisting that dependency on each other that seems to develop in marriages.

That whole idea left my mouth, and got proposed to him last year... spontaneously. It was something we'd jokingly & lightly tossed around before that visit. As a "something to look forward to after the D goes to college and it's just a visit; you'll like it here". Apparently, last year went really well -- :D.

No, he didn't believe me when I told him a few surgeries before he showed up here: chicks dig scars - don't worry about it. (I didn't know the background behind his self-consciousness then.) I can sense he was deeply hurt by the ex over that; after all they'd been together 18 years when she dropped that bomb on him and left. Surely, she saw him as more than his medical stuff?? Yeah, she did - a source of money. He hasn't wandered down the paths of the details of that relationship - or his one before that - with me. And I'm not pressing him. Told him, one of my main relationship rules was "don't ever confuse me with an ex-wife"... LOLOL. I'm different; so is he. And I'm hoping that a different structure to the relationship itself will help me remember not to superimpose some conditioned "pattern" of how it's supposed to be; and how we each are within that. I'm working hard on maintaining that this is some brand spankin' new relationship and DIFFERENT.

And the only way this can work is if we start from that place of mutual respect - the love was extra and unexpected; but it's pretty strong. Underneath the strong, can-do tough guy... I know; I can SEE - a deep pool of intense emotions. And he's extremely shy about that. That's OK; I'm thrice bitten - thrice shy too. So long conversations about feelings just are outside the range of possibility right now. But we DO tell each other our stories; and it shows up there. And we both know how to SHOW each other those feelings... so what's to talk about? Sometimes I think people spend too much time talking about relationships and not enough time being IN relationship. He is a sensitive romantic under all his psych "armor"... and that pings loud & clear off my artistic romantic side... but, for the most part we're practical, pragmatic direct people who value having a partner to go through life with.

Yes Lighter. Over the last 4-5 years, this group of friends we're online with watched him sink down further into hopelessness & frustration over the medical crap. Mel, another woman and I, would touch base about what we were perceiving... and trying out ideas to help him, on each other. Then, I think it was 2 surgeries ago... something in me shifted and I was ready to jump in and advocate for him; fight for him. Now, I'd already heard other vets stories of their trials & tribulations so it wasn't some revelation to me. And I didn't dangle myself as some kind of "reward" for sticking it out and making it to the other side either. Nothing like that was going on at the time. It was just a simple - "you'll have to come visit me when I get settled in WV". And then I proceeded to use foxhole humor - as dark, twisted and wry as possible with a lot of creative twists - to cheer him up and give him a pep talk. Teased him about sexy nurses; hospital gowns; rappeling out of the hospital room when he'd had enough torture...

and then, when he insisted that it would take less time for him to fix my jeeps than to explain to me how to do it (and deal with my frustration & clumsiness with that kind of work) and showed up and actually DID it - like first thing after putting his stuff in the room he was in - and I got that happy domestic glow of "all is right with this picture"... that was pretty much all it took for me, to start talking to him... look into his eyes as he talked about himself... etc swoon scene. LOL. I watched him closely working on the rubicon and directing his "go-fer" to get this or that or hold something. Watched his hands move through all the complicated pieces with patience and knowledge of what to do - just like I've watched the older generation of men in my life, all my life - my stepdad, dad & grandpa. Wizards of mechanical things, and construction and tools just look like they were made for those hands. When I'd ask questions, he'd explain and SHOW me. (That's a big one, because I want to know how to do it myself.)

When he can't sleep - for whatever reason - he makes paracord straps, bracelets, etc. It's basically macrame. He sharpens knives and looks at them online. He keeps his hands busy... while his mind seeks that flow & zone. And he'll sleep. Until the pain wakes him again. He's even more OCD than I am... LOLOL. So for him, now, that's keeping him on an even keel; sane. He pets & plays with the kitties and the D's new kitten she brought home.

Oh, communication isn't bad at all. If there is silence - right now, it usually means he's sleeping or trying to. Before, it was because he was busy working. But there is a rhythm to it. We'll touch base usually every 3-4 hrs or more often than that. Just a quick - look at that! or here's where I am and what I'm doing - or another step crossed off the list of to-do's to finally get here and have space for him to claim. It's usually only at night that we venture into the more personal emotional side of things. And mornings, sometimes.

He does have "dark night of the soul" times - whether it's an anniversary of losing a buddy in battle, the battle itself, or some other major milestone. And he goes "dark" and withdraws into himself to do what is required to honor those events, and let it go just a little more without forgetting. I do the same thing from time to time. So I can respect that need to do so and not worry about him. Our spiritual/mystic sides are pretty compatible - his native traditions and mine work well together and we've noticed, sensed and thought about a lot of the same things over the years.

As far as avoiding despair - he does what he CAN do for right now. And that's more than you'd expect; but he pays for it in pain later. He is very persistent and determined to make progress every day toward the to-do list - some would say stubborn LOL - no matter what it costs him.

As soon as the mulltiple test results are back, he'll have some idea of what is going to happen when with the hospital. And then it's my turn to keep the overnight watch, to keep him safe. LOL. He says he MIGHT be taking the D to college next weekend... it's still tentative. If that's the case - I might go there for his surgery and immediate recovery days. D knows about me now. And she'll be beside herself thinking he's alone after a surgery - when she should focus on her classes. Right now, that's just an idea in my head. I haven't said anything to him, yet.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 29, 2020, 12:44:31 PM: Hmmm. Boy are you a good thinker, (((((Amber))))).

This is what popped into my head (about being there for his surgery/recovery).

I thought: Why not ask, but without trying to convince?

IOW: If you'd be okay with it, I'd like to be there for your surgery and to help after. Would you like that? Whatever you decide is fine with me.

Kinda thing.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 29, 2020, 01:56:09 PM: I wouldn't just drop in on him Hops. Of course I would ask.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 29, 2020, 03:10:22 PM: I hope he says Yes, Amber.
I think it could be a beautiful bonding time,
hard as it may be.

(Nah, I'd never think you'd just appear.)

hugs and hopes,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 29, 2020, 06:47:21 PM: Warning.... B and his situation, as far as I can guess, is about to be processed in this post, mostly with very few facts and likely misunderstandings about any facts you have shared, Amber. Proceed with caution, a huge grain of salt, and perhaps not at all.

B's needs vs his wants, according to Lighter, which isn't worth much, if anything, bc Lighter doesn't know much about the situation, but.......

B WANTS to keep the peace with his ex, which makes sense.

B NEEDS help, bc he's struggling physically with pain, mobility and insomnia...... infection..... lack of competent medical care...... access to medical care seems restricted and ongoing pain makes it difficult to think clearly. OR DOES he NEED HELP? Who's helped him, post surgery, in the past? Anyone at all? I keep thinking what he's going through is major, but I can't tell based on B's going through this maybe? alone?

I see the benefits of allowing B to handle it on his own, to preclude the stirring the pot as dd readies for college during COVID. I am all for peace where children are concerned. Protect and give them wings... all that.

On the other hand.... IF the ex isn't a sociopath, bent on turning the DD against her father bc he's somehow broken and deserving of ridicule bc of his scars and injuries..... wouldn't she be a good person to take the DD to college and get her settled in. And... how does B KNOW what he ex is saying to the adopted dd? Does dd tell him? Is he present when she SAYS these things? Is he reading texts or e mails? Letters? Is the woman standing in the driveway or at the business or in the HOME saying these things? Not my business... I know that, but I'm processing anyway, bc I've never actually done it, up to this point.

So, CAN the ex take dd to college, if B can't do it? I wouldn't allow anyone to take my precious child to college, and settle her in IF I COULD BE THERE myself. But... there are times when letting go, and letting my children figure things out feels just right... like relaxing in a cool pond..... and letting the water support me. I have to let go of many bothersome ideas and things, first... what's lurking in the holes on the bank.... the algae creeping towards me..... possible snakes and snapping turtles.... then forgetting those things and focusing on the water and sky and the feeling of being refreshed and in nature has space to be what it is.....ME in my moments, NOT worrying about daughters with the ability to care for themselves, even though my heart would break in letting go the trip to college, and seeing everything is just right and safe and comfortable for my child. Heck, there might be fear about the ex really connecting with the dd. I dunno.

As Hops mentioned, we don't know the ex's story..... if the mother is toxic, or a loving woman who left her newly adopted dd for reasons that make sense (COULD any reason make sense?) and now has good intentions toward that child, even though she's saying negative things about the only present parent in her life.... the father. Again, how do we know what she's saying and how she's saying it?

And my mind continues probing the edges of what the ex is DOING in her adopted daughter's life NOW that she's grown and on her way to college. Why show up now? Why bark orders and assume authority when she's been absent so long. Does she fear she'll lose the insurance and co payments now that the child is an adult? If so, why? He's never been obligated to pay those things, why would dd going to college change that? It wouldn't. It's his plan to see the house... that's likely the BIG factor here, but why? If it puts money in her pocket, why remain clinging to B, all the while bad mouthing him, allegedly, and being a terrible person no one would want to do anything for, if that be the case.

I understand caring for someone I've cared for for 18 years, even if they've hurt me and left me with health issues, a newly adopted dd, and taken my older child physically away from me. I understand paying for things that make her OK, bc the children NEED for her to be OK, and I WANT her to be OK, and I want as much serenity for both my dds as can be managed.

And so B has a sensitivity to conflict regarding the ex. The ex left him, and shouldn't be bothered if he has a gf, BUT B represents her as a sort of con woman who'll interject herself INTO your life, Amber, and make claims on your money, as well as his, IF she knows about you. That was the idea I got from one of your posts, Amber... not that it was what you meant, but again... I don't know. Just spit balling here with what I have to go on.

The ex is an unstable con woman, or she's not. It's either true, or it's false. The ex is either a deeply disordered individual, who B remained married to for 18 years, adopted a daughter with AND would have remained married to all this time IF given the chance OR he's misrepresenting her, and has reasons to do so. People change. People lose their minds after years of being stable. They meet other people, get scared, and they run away from big scary change, which was B's situation with the injuries he sustained.... in all ways.

I'm getting to my point, which is Hop's idea about you being there with B during the surgery, Amber.

IF it's SO important to B that you never meet the ex, never experience her, that she never has to experience you.......
the ex's reactivity to HIS having a new gf.... that;s something I want more information about. I don't think it's a silly small thing, and I want to know specifics about this ex person's behaviors so I DON'T have to worry.

What does B owe you or anyone, regarding his history with this woman? Maybe nothing. Maybe something. That's yours to figure out, Amber.

B was free to date and marry and have relationships with anyone he chose after the divorce. If B is saying he had to hide all his relationships from the ex.... or that he didn't have any relationships BC of the ex's reactivity...... that's ringing really OFF to me. AND... maybe throwing more red flags on the field.

The ex is either a cruel person who makes fun of B's scars, or she's not. B is either reactive and off base, OR he's misrepresenting the situation on purpose or bc his experiences have colored his POV..... or he's telling it straight, and the facts is the facts.

I normally don't think about it this much, but I always see red flags before I stop thinking about it, Amber.

Since you believe in B.....
since you believe he's representing the situation as he believes it to be.... I have to go with your gut and B's actions.... caring for an adopted dd while struggling with physical wounds and surgeries ON HIS OWN, and with a divorce from a woman who allegedly filed it, AND abandoned her newly adopted dd... I keep writing that, over and over, and that means I'm reacting to the ABANDONED A NEWLY ADOPTED CHILD then PING..... I'm off again. I just can't make it square up, for me, which isn't important, and means nothing, I realize.

You have information and feelings backing up B's narrative that the ex is likely going to interject herself into his personal life, but to what degree should be be worried about that, if at all? With my history, it would be illogical for me to NOT want to know what I'm about to be dealing with, if anything, really.

What CAN she do, and what problems can she create? He presents her as a sort of waifish person.... requiring his help with medical insurance and bills, with her hand out, but all the while ridiculing him for his wounds and scars suffered in battle and from surgeries....... which honestly paints a picture of a bully, stomping around, sticking their finger into
the emotional and physical wounds of someone she was married do, and cared about supposedly, for 18years, for what reason is she doing that, AND why would B continue to reward that behavior? Never mind. I know why, can think of many reasons, but not understanding means imagination has it's way with me, finally, on this thread.

WHO does that? Who leaves a newly adopted child BEHIND in a divorce, after the trouble it took to adopt that child? Ugh. My heart pulls and bleeds thinking about that child's face when she learns new mama is hitting the road, with the real dd, and not coming back. IF that's what happened, OMG.
Heart.
Bleeding.

And we're back to the original red flags of B not wanting you in or around his world..... his ex, his business, for reasons of peace in his life, which I get...... and you haven't met his dd, but you know she exists and you know she's her daddy's girl. At least you know he told you his dd knows about you. B is trusting she won't tell her newly engaged mother about you...... it seems pretty important to B that she doesn't......

::sigh::.

I have to wonder.... who raised this child while he was in the field?
Who cared for her while he was in hospital?

Because I've experienced a man who brought me a Christmas tree, professed deep love with the words of a young vulnerable boy.... creating feelings of love and bonding (with an ASPD N) I read your story about the jeep fixing trip and feel fairly neutral about it. I'm not triggered BUT I notice the same falling and feeling and intense feelings of commitment I had.

About keeping you separate from his entire family life and world..... I recognize that also. There were reasons ASPD kept me separate from his FOO..... and most of his life..... bc he had deniability, and was hiding a life he didn't want me to know about. It meant he didn't get caught in lies as often... could lie at will, without consequences, and his life of subterfuge was much easier, bc I pretty much let it go that way.

And so, in closing.... I gently point out my experiences and causes for all the red flags I perceive on the field.

I agree with Hops..... B needs you by his side if he's recovering from major surgery that could go bad in SO many ways, IME.

He might consider having you there, or not.

As the woman pledging her heart to this man, for the foreseeable future in her mind, it seems reasonable B would invite you in, at this point, and begin
sharing
his
life,
problems,
and joys...
with you.

But I don't know what the X factor of the ex really IS, do I?

I don't know how much sharing you require, honestly. Less than most, certainly, and I SO GET THAT as a woman who didn't require her husband AT the hospital during either birth, or require a visit, for that matter. I don't require a lot of attention BUT I DO REQUIRE HONESTY, to know I'M SAFE, to know I'm not being put in HARM'S WAY, and I dimon't want to be blindsided by something important, conned or made a fool of. Since all of the above happened, I guess you could say I might be playing devil's advocate here.... a little.

I know what nutsy koo koobatshit kerazy making stunts people can pull, how they absolutely should be avoided at all costs and how much regret is involved when all steps to mitigate that harm are not taken... what that feels like. It would suck if B has everything dialed in, as well as it can be dialed, and your mixing into his life, before he sells the house and makes a break DOES create complications and unforseeable chaos you end up wishing you'd avoided, kwim?

THat.... Holy cow, if I only knew then what I know now.... feeling..... is a really tough thing to fee, IME.

Every attorney I ever had needed to learn the hard way, with me paying all the bills and suffering for their refusal to LISTEN or understand what I was plainly telling them.....

so here I am. Wondering what B means, exactly, when he wants to keep the ex in the dark. IS he downplaying how bad the crazy would be? Is he overstating it? IS IT IMAGINARY in his head?

Sharing more than the edges of my causes and conditions with you, Amber, and my process here.... you could have stopped reading many paragraphs ago, and that's OK.

For me, this would be where I'd WANT the rubber to meet the road....my inclusion in B's life, as his partner...NOT future partner, but actual partner in life, at this point...... I'd want to BE there, at his side, maybe during his trip to drop the dd at college, and certainly advocating for him at the hospital, which seems a no brainer to me, bc we all need advocates when in hospital, IME. I'm not saying it's necessary, or that it's the best or right thing... I'm saying what I WOULD WANT.

I'd want to be there for the surgery, or anything serious going on healthwise, but that's me and I can't always be trusted, bc of.... the codependence... thing.

BEING THERE would require a POA, perhaps, giving you control over what happens to him IF, God forbid, the worst happens and he's unable to make decisions for himself AND.... who IS his POA, or decision maker SHOULD something go sideways? His dd? His OTHER dd? And.... IS anyone advocating for him at the hospital? Or... was there anyone advocating, before the time of COVID? It might be everyone's banned from the hospital, besides actual patients.... seems likely.

I guess what I'm getting to is....
IS his ex wife the person who makes decisions for B, if he can't? DOES she go to the hospital, or did she, when he had prior surgeries?

It's never been clear to me, nor should it have been, WHAT B's relationship with the ex is like, if it's like anything at all. I'm just saying..... her LIVING with him would account for him wanting to keep you out of sight, out of mind in reference to the EX, IMO. THAT is one of the only things that makes sense to me, regarding his secret squirrel policies regarding the ex, AND.....
I'm almost done here....
would it be upsetting to you IF that were the case? Maybe she lives in a little in law suite? Maybe she lives in another County? It seems odd that you don't know, IF you don't know, and perhaps you do.

I wouldn't be bothered by anything OTHER than the fact he wasn't up front with it. I wouldn't be jeloaus or care if he was taking care of her, providing a place to stay, time with dd, even if they occasionally shared a bed, which I doubt they do based on B's account of how the ex FEELS about his injuries, etc.

Would I be bothered if he planned to sell the house, her house too apparently, hand her money then disappear, after taking care of her in recent years or months without telling her was going to disappear and let her fend for herself without warning? She SHOULD be fending for herself, but..... it seems a little whonky to my spidey sense.

There's a part of me that tightens up, truthfully, at leaving her in the complete dark, no written forwarding address and no way to find him, though rationally he has every right at this point, since their shared child... is she a shared child if the mom didn't have any contact all the years she was growing up? And DID she have contact, or was it zero contact?

I think I'd care IF I was being given false information, one sided designed to mislead me information, or information that was half true, based on truth, but not really, kwim?

I care about honesty. Always have. Being married to a scam artist provides the ability to see from a dark POV, even if I don't want to see it.... the red flags draw my attention, and I'm putting it here so you might have benefit of my process, in hopes it provides more clarity for you, Amber.

That's one thing I noticed about the chicken littles in my life.....
I appreciated them sharing their process bc then I didn't have to go there, not in the slightest, bc they'd gone there FOR me, shared their thoughts, allowing me to discern what I needed from it, then on I went, back to my regularly scheduled program.

Ignore the entire post if necessary.

When you have a chance, Amber, I'd love to see you start a thread on using plants as medicine, how you grow them, and how you make them into useful things.

::leaving the field... going to eat chicken pot pie::.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 30, 2020, 03:42:02 PM: THANK YOU lighter: for taking the time to process all that out and put it all down. You care a lot, to do that for me. I appreciate it! It is however, quite familiar as this is the same thing, that Hol has expressed to me. She is also a Capricorn. LOL. Must be something about how y'all think and look at things.

I am not at all troubled about not having many more details about his ex, in his current situation, because it's clear he still has a soul-wound from the betrayal; and a bit of shame too - about feeling like a fool; feeling tricked after all those years only to have her bail, just as they were starting their own family. He is now, wiser and isn't likely to let his guard down with her again. (Or me either, not to put too fine a point on it.) She is needy, because of her own health issues making it impossible for her to work. And she does use that "oh poor me" to gain some assistance through the D, who feels sorry for her and sometimes from B too - because the D wants him to be more compassionate & helpful to "poor mom". They have had only minimal contact (mom & D) over the 18 years; she was adopted as an infant and so doesn't have any recall of her mom abandoning her & B. I am positive that eventually he'll be a little more forthcoming about stuff like that.

I didn't press him to "tell all" because I'm perfectly capable of checking her out on my own; which I did. Yes, her name is on the house deed. And when he sells it, per the divorce agreement, she gets half. No, I haven't told him I've done this either. No she hasn't been concerned enough about B to be there for him for the later surgeries. He has indicated that right after he was injured, that she did help him as best she could - and that was probably as much of a turn off for her, as his scars. She absolutely DOES require that when she's ill or in the hospital that he bring D to be with her. During hurricanes, she has taken shelter with them - and he described to me, how he goes to one room in the house and she another (probably D's room) and they interact as little as possible for the duration, which is his preference and requirement for offering safety and shelter. Which IMO, is more than generous under the circumstances - but it keeps the D from becoming an anxious, angry ball of energy directed at Dad.

Most of these conversations were face to face, so I could look in his eyes and observe his body language. I've gotten pretty good at reading the tone in his voice, too. Yes, I realize I got the "reader's digest" version of the story and that the details of it are likely pretty messy, still hurtful, and more than likely worse than he's shared to date. I wouldn't dare to begin filling him in on the gory details of my divorces and the arguments, etc. And I don't much see the point in that unless it's cathartic to talk about it or instructive about how I see relationships in general. Making it easier to let old hurts go. In my case, I was almost always the one doing the leaving; because I saw the writing on the wall quicker, I guess. The few times I have been left instead - while I was counting my lucky stars to be out of the relationship, there is still a small bit of those awful feelings about rejection left behind long after.

Which is why, I'm insisting on a non-traditional form of committed relationship. As comfortable as I feel about moving forward with him, and the high level of trust I have in him (and in my work on myself) there is always a risk involved. Unknowns and try as we might - expectations & hopes that sometimes are disappointed.

He is not close with family at all; old hard feelings exist between them, even. He does stay in touch with one cousin, who I am also familiar with and to. So except for his kids, and a handful of people he still trusts, he is almost untethered to his whole past life. So at his age, he sees this as an opportunity to start over and not be obligated to the people in his past. His whole nature revolves around being the fatherly type - so when his kids need them, he'll be out the door to them asap. It is how I am with Hol, too. I respect that in him.

He has expressed the desire to live quietly, peacefully, without games or drama - he's had his fill of that. Hence, his much tighter and stronger boundaries with people and his wariness of trusting people too soon. I understand that too.

I will remind you, that B & I go back YEARS prior to his first visit last year. We talked to each other and interacted within a group of mutual friends who have become pretty close over the years and are very supportive of each other, even beyond just talking online - much like us regulars here. Many have met in person; or gotten together to help each other out IRL... celebrated new children, held hands through losses... that group has even rallied for B, with various ideas, care packages, and what-not during his surgeries. And it finally got through to him, that they would stand by him... just as I have... and he was deeply touched and told them so, very simply.

The POA thing has crossed my mind too. His D is 18 now and is most likely his current POA. It's on my list of things to discuss with him, when he's here. Not to make any changes - but to inquire as the facts and ASK if he's planning to leave things that way. Hol is mine; and with her living here at the moment I see no need to change that. Should she start working again and having to go states away to work... then, I'd rethink that and consult with her about it. Before suggesting any changes. (She's likely to include that in any discussion of going to work in say, New Mexico or where ever, knowing her.)

Red flags, to me, always relate to a fear of unequal power within the relationship or about the other person or even oneself. Uncertainty about the future is always going to exist, starting something new. But I simply don't have the level of fear I used to, because by now, I've already experienced MOST of the crap that goes on in relationships and people's lives. My biggest fear, of course, is that he'll die before he even gets here to really START this relationship. But that's simply true of anyone all the time. So I know how irrational it is; and I know why sometimes it looms large for me. And so does B. He goes out of his way to reassure me he's not going anywhere any time soon, except to come here. He is the one insisting on equal power for both of us within the relationship; and it's not a trick. He gets pretty put out if I start "assuming the subordinate role"... but gently reminds me, that he LIKES me independent and standing on my own power. It's much more attractive to him than the alternative. But he ALSO fends off all my attempts to "caretake" him, too. LOL. He sees my reflexive tendency to those things and regrounds me and reorients me.

Overall, that just seems to be WAAAAAYYYY more healthy a relationship structure than anything else I've gone through to date. And since I'm determined NOT to relive any of those, I do pay attention for anything that might echo those old experiences. I am giving up no independence or personal power, in exchange for being loved this go round. We are still able to care about each other and do nice things for each other - giving up those natural human rights as a condition of being loved simply doesn't figure into our relationship. For either one of us.

Yes, I've spent even more time THINKING about this, what I know; what I don't; what I NEED to know vs stuff I just don't HAVE to know, to know "who he is". As a person. I've been over this ground about this for over a year now with myself. I'm comfortable; it's easy; yes - I worry about his health and physical ability at the hands of people who've put him through hell... and almost killed him more than once. So when I talk about the FEELINGS involved - it's because I know I've already addressed the thinking stuff; practical stuff; as well as I can to date and I can relax just feel for a change - without mixing all that up together into a giant tangled ball of yarn.

I trust me, in my OCD attention to those details and my ability to see and hold in my mind, all the possibilities and still not get frozen into paralysis. I trust my intuition and sixth sense about truthfulness and transparency; and being able to "read" people. I'm moving forward because there isn't anything so far left unaddressed by me or him, to my satisfaction. And when there IS some question that comes to my mind, I address it to him - and get an answer, without equivocating or excuses. Yes, his current situation is a bit sensitive but it's about to become his PAST situation for him.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on August 30, 2020, 06:17:41 PM: I'm releived B stops any attempt to caretaker him on your part. I don't know why, but it seem really important to some part of me. I know what it is... my ASPD told me he needed healing.... and he wanted to be caretaken physically every moment we were together. WHen I had children, it became a problem. It wasn't like WE, he and I had children. it was ME who had 3 children, including him.

B certainly seems overtly self sufficient, though I don't know how a man in his line of work raises an infant on his own... was she strapped to his back while he went on missions?

Question.... IS B the guy you almost went out to help..... from your past? From your other message board? Or was that someone else? It seems that person had a daughter too? I don't think it is.

It's funny Hol and I have similar red flags showing up. Not that I believe any are true or real. I just need things to
square
up. The ex being at the house during hurricanes makes sense, and I'm glad his dd seemed to get what she needed. I find people who can BE around exes are typically sane, nicer and very decent kind of folk, IME.

If you feel things make sense, then I trust your gut and your ability to discern enough truth.

I felt happy when I read B reassures you he'll be around for a long time, and the only place he's going is to you.

That's hopeful and comforting, IMO. I'm sure B intends it to be.

Any movement on the idea of you being there for any potential surgery?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 30, 2020, 08:10:28 PM: Ah, forgot the question about raising her. His active duty was "suspended" in '94. D was born 2001 or 02. (Boy does that make me feel "old"... Hol and B's oldest - BL - were born in '78.) But he was never formally released from service - so when they needed this training done, he was reactivated - even with his issues. That paperwork is in now, and it's been almost a month since then... so he should (but neither of us is holding our breath) start hearing something about it pretty soon. I figured it could take as long as 90 days to process completely.

Yes he was qualified; certified to dive. For all the physical issues with his back & legs, being in the water is second nature to him. He loves it and his physical problems are actually less of an issue diving. He had a blast! And got closure with that part of his life. I'm so happy it went well for him. This kind of ending is what is he's looking for in other areas of his life, too.

That request for my travel & assistance was another former military member - he was a medic & surgeon; an officer with an attitude. Cliché snotty officer. But he WAS the one who helped me a lot, when Mike was ill. And he was straight up with me. Hol was in the city, at former BF's house when I got the request and they had another fight the same the evening... and I was on the phone with her till pretty late. And then she was headed back here the next day. No way I could take off, especially since this friend couldn't tell me how long he needed my help... and Hol clearly needed me here when she got home. So it never happened. I'm glad; because something felt "off" to me, about all of that.

LOL. Since the presentation of S's "need" for me to refuse B coming here - for the sake of S's comfort... Hol and I went through all of these concerns in depth AGAIN... and she's now satisfied that a) I've thought it about a lot too and asked questions and listened to the answers thoroughly and b) she's willing to accept that her "perception" always forgets how long I've known B prior to his first visit here - he's still really new to her, in other words. But she is very gregarious and outgoing when she wants to be and will take the time to get to know him before immediately jumping to conclusions, based on HER past experiences. I've told her a number of times that B & I were friends before Mike died. B even called me and offered support and let me call & talk to him late nights when i couldn't sleep (he tends to be a night owl)... so we weren't just casual friends. He wasn't exactly what I consider "inner circle" back then - but he was closer than a lot of people were.

It's important to me that she and S are comfortable with my decision and give my judgement & B some trust - until there is reason to NOT TRUST. Hol is working on trying to calm S's unfounded anxiety down and sort out why he even withdraws from her into self-imposed silence and solitude for days at a time. I don't envy her the task she set herself, and disagree that it's her job to solve the puzzle or convince him to open up to her. But then - c'est la vie and it's her life. She is coming to terms with herself over whether she wants to continue on like this or make changes. That's totally up to her; she knows what I think about him... and that's all the further I go, except occasionally helping her put feelings in this pile and thoughts/plans in that pile... to get some clarity on her own path. No different than what I do here, talking to you all about what you might be going through.

One of the best discoveries I've made, during this deeper getting to know Buck - is that who he is and how he behaves with me empowers me to be "more me". It's not like some "master plan" of his or anything like that; it's how we are together. I can be so open with him, straightforwardly just being me without any eggshells anywhere in sight... that some days I just stop and marvel at that. Self-consciousness and always couching my expressions with an apology or explanation or "preamble"... are falling away. It's kinda like I've been hiding my light under a bushel basket and all he did was take it off my head to get a better look at me. LOLOL. Or I flung it away and decided I didn't want it or need it anymore - especially taking the chance at possible new romance. I desperately wanted to STOP HIDING. LOLOL.

And as it turns out, the effect of that is all through my life now. With everyone, more & more. It's not just something between he & I. I kinda like it.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on August 31, 2020, 04:12:10 PM: What a wonderful statement, Amber:

Quote
I've been hiding my light under a bushel basket and all he did was take it off my head to get a better look at me. LOLOL. Or I flung it away and decided I didn't want it or need it anymore - especially taking the chance at possible new romance. I desperately wanted to STOP HIDING.

Not only did you take a chance on the possibility of good things happening, you've ALSO been reality-based all the way through. So if it hadn't worked out with A&B, I'd never have doubted that your strength of mind and heart would carry you through disappointment, too.

I'm so impressed.

It's such a beautiful thing that you've both hung in there, fighting not just for yourselves but for each other. B is a very lucky man and I hope the universe gets him to you soon.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on August 31, 2020, 06:54:45 PM: Thanks Hops. It's a grey flannel chilly wet foggy day here.

Funny thing about this past year. It's included really getting to the end of the grieving process; letting my old connection with Mike go; navigating boundaries with Hol and her circus of flying monkeys... while maintaining a strong attachment with her...

all of the hard, serious, deep thought about my capability to be in a new relationship, a relationship with B, what that's going to require of me at times, and enjoying myself to extent that I can... those wings are still unfolding...

and I'm sitting here feeling stronger than ever; more whole than I have EVER; and not even all that serious all the time anymore. I don't really ruminate on anything or worry for long about things... even B's medical stuff. He's convinced me it's all working out according to his plan so - I'm letting him take care of it and simply waiting along with Hol for the "final move in" to the Hut. Then I have free rein to have at MY space again. ;)

I am going to go pick out a new kitten from the litter S's barn cat has had, to keep Freddy company.

All things in due time. Including the upcoming time, when we can finally venture out into the wide world again and enjoy some pursuits from the "old normal" again.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 01, 2020, 12:18:21 AM: I hope you don't NEED S and Hol to trust you, your decisions or B in order for you to be OK.

You might not receive any of those things, from BOTH S and Hol anyway, and if you don't.... what should it really matter TO YOU?

You don't require their approval or permission in any way, shape or form.

You also don't have to listen to their worries or complaints,bc they already laid them all out for you. Thanks. Done.

Fini until there's information that brings more clarity, or changes something and I doubt S will ever be rational about his "feelings" in this matter. I might be wrong, but I suspect S ius super comfortable following his feelings without any self-reflection at all.

How it affects Hol.... is another matter, but you don't have any control over that. You never will, and giving S what he says would MAKE him feel safe wouldn't, IME. He'd come up with some other thing, and present it as the next THING that would make him feel safe and it would never end, IME.

Hol wants to puzzle that man out, and she will... until she's done trying. There are lessons for her there. I hope she sees that, gains some distance and gets very curious as to why she's chosen him.
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 01, 2020, 08:40:14 AM: Oh, "needing" that would be completely out of character with where I am now Light. What I said was:

Quote
It's important to me that she and S are comfortable with my decision and give my judgement & B some trust - until there is reason to NOT TRUST. Hol is working on trying to calm S's unfounded anxiety down ...

I meant it just the way I wrote it. They are certainly free to question it from time to time and I don't exactly "care" what S thinks about B. He wouldn't think that if he tried to talk to B - but since he barely talks to Hol at this point there's not much chance of that. S seldom talks TO ME - will sometimes acknowledge I've spoken to him. He told Hol he doesn't feel safe to talk to any of us; words wouldn't be right; someone would get mad... etc etc.

Hol feels VERY comfortable talking to me, even about difficult things. That's not changed. And she won't hesitate even when risking my anger. I've give S no real reason to fear me - and B certainly hasn't - so worrying about his comfort is part of my nurturing side. If there is no real reason to fear - why is he fearful?

And maybe he needs to talk to someone about that. Like a therpist. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 01, 2020, 02:56:28 PM: Ya, thinking S has issues he's brought into his adult life.....from his past.

You're right..... you wrote "it's important" and you didn't write "I need" in reference to S and Hol trusting you or your decisions, etc. I think I was trying to validate that, but it went off the rails.

S' stance sort of unhinges me, though I'm certain he's suffering and is aware something is OFF with the way he refuses to interact with others. Hol wants to FIX it. The more she tries, the harder he resists. They're well matched to work on those issues. I hope they can.

It pinged very sad for me when you wrote S can't speak, bc he's afraid someone will get angry. Paraphrasing.

Whether it's true or not, I picture a very angry parent, ruling him in his head, with S cowering and hiding behind his defenses, which come off as selfish and self contained.

Something formed his aversion to conflict, long before you went off about the tools, IMO.

::counting down to B's arrival::.. Well..... hoping hard in your direction, anyway; )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 01, 2020, 08:54:40 PM: Yeah, I've been trying to only lead by example. Hol & I can have loud, vehement disagreements - and be laughing with each other by the end of it. Anger by itself doesn't have to lead to permanent life conditions that are irreversible or unconquerable. I'm just trying to show him that intense emotional expression doesn't always lead to bad things. I don't create those situations - there's plenty of opportunity for him to watch while being "off stage" as it were.

But, I don't over invest in teaching what someone doesn't want to learn anymore. And since I'm not exactly believing his brand of "voicelessness" is trauma-based (since there have been no explanations at ALL to believe so; and as long as we've talked here on the board, I have seen the patterns, behaviors, that are more common in our collective traumas) - it rings highly unauthentic and even manipulative - to my ears. And sometimes when Hol is describing interactions with him, she sees that too.

So - yeah; I'm up the nosebleed section of the drama-opera house... making my critiques and judgements, while trying to remember that my perception and ideas can be totally wrong. Not my problem; not my monkeys. More delays with contractor, too. So they are between both places during a week right now. Hol is beyond being patient anymore; contractor has made mistakes we're only now finding out about; and I'm biding my time and keeping my boundaries high. I have found that iPad headphones are a great boundary marker... LOLOL.

Buck and I are due for another conversation about what's going on. Tomorrow he finds out if he's really taking D to college on the weekend. She just got hired for an on-campus job at one of the fast food kiosks, and is overjoyed. Most of what B & I need to do is talk about logistics and the medical stuff... and see what timing is going to be like. It looks like the kids might be between two houses for another month even. No one is happy about that.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 01, 2020, 11:32:27 PM: Ye, Gods, Amber.

I can't imagine what another month will look like.

I guess like the last few months.

You have a lot of patience for this situation.

Tell B Hello.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 02, 2020, 10:05:57 AM: Dear Amber,

WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY was that post not in ALL-CAPS with a lot of BOLD and when you're feeling calm a little ITALIC with some Mutant Ninja Turtle Green in
MOTION
for freaking emphasis?

And we haven't even mentioned FONTS? Or Font SIZE?

Is there an
I-can't-believe-I-have-to-wait-another-month
font?

Really.
You are, after all, an artist.

An extremely durable and patient one.

huuuuuuugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 02, 2020, 12:27:28 PM: LOLOLOL.

Because no matter how embellished the inner voice is right now - it is literally out of my control. I can't make the correct lumber show up; weld up the railings to the right size (until the screened porch is built, neither can the welding company)... etc ad nauseum.

So, what's the point of yelling out loud about it? Doesn't help anything; doesn't make me feel better either. And it's for SURE that this too shall pass. So I have to do something OTHER than I want to do right now. I'm thinking about online "window shopping" for a new look in clothes that I can pull off, been playing with some new face creams from a company Hol has been using, Sephora (really, really like the Tatsua water cream; used for years by Geishas)... maybe buy some fingernail polish/remover that isn't so toxic and isn't gaudy as hell...saw a shade of lipstick I like that will go well with mutzki coloring... and might see if I can get an appt with at my salon for a shape up to the hair I'm growing out long again.

Yes, there ARE more "constructive, useful" mundane things I can do... but I'm in a strange mood today and so is Hol, and she's already changed her hair color this morning. I don't want to solve the world's problems, decode the mysteries of the universe or even my own overly-complex brain... and even though housecleaning would get my gears moving in the "doing" realm again...

I. DON'T. WANNA.

LOLOLOL. I wanna be 10 lbs lighter and my middle 10 inches trimmer (and stronger)... my skin to look smooth & plump and my hair to behave itself, instead of going all Albert Einstein on me.

I wanna wow B the next time he sees me; knock his socks off. Discombobulate his normal, big strong guy and everything's under control demeanor.... and make him stutter and drool. BOOTS, I need new BOOTS... just texted Hol the new plan for the day... she can be a great partner in crime on this kind of mission.

I think I'm ready to stop being invisible and shed my "widders weeds".
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 02, 2020, 12:58:14 PM: Wasn't there a bunk house under way....or..... on the list of things to do?

THAT would have been SO HELPFUL, IME.

To have a space that's NOT IN YOUR SPACE, but IS on the farm.

For Hol, for S, for her friends, your friends, B's dds if they're there.

We used to use have access to the guest cottage on the island and it
was
so
nice
to
have
that separate building.... even though it's just steps away from the cottage. It made all the difference with regard to headspace. Not fancy, just..... away. Any distance is a relief.

People could mozy into the kitchen, from the guest cottage, but I always knew they'd back. We could meet on the beach, or plan an outing..... with their stuff IN THEIR SPACE and my chaos in my space. And there was always chaos. And sand. And WORK with little children going on. I didn't want to be judged all the time..... and I was one of those moms who let her kids run around they way they wanted..... in sarong and nothing else? OK. Naked? OK. And everyone dragging in sand all the time...... just, NO.

I'm not the energizer bunny, though I'm sure I looked like one, just trying to remain sane, keep everyone fed.... heck.... a bunk room WITH a kitchen. YES.

I remember little apartments in barns that seemed rustic, but I was drawn to them every time, bc...... I like my own space.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 02, 2020, 02:36:44 PM: That idea got scratched off the list Lighter.
Partly I realized I didn't want that many people getting comfortable just hanging out here. Partly we NEED dedicated work spaces for different kinds of work.

The studio is the closest, facilities wise, to being separate temporary living space. I can sleep 10 in my house. Almost all of Hol's "guests" are experienced campers with their own gear. And she'll have a guest room and both her sofas are extra large & comfy.

The bunkhouse idea was when I was contemplating some living space for a semi-permanent group (without having a clear idea of what the purpose of that would be). I just got off on a tear with idea.

The internet is not playing nice with my idea of window shopping makeover ideas. :mad: But instead I knocked a couple of to-do's off the post-it list for today.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 03, 2020, 10:43:05 AM: Is it possible to have PMS symptoms, long after menopause?

The past couple days - absolutely NOTHING has gone right around here and both Hol & I are one spark away from melting down. Not with each other; just at "stuff".

Even went through the releasing all the crap I can't do anything about... and I'm still at that point where I'm a totally incensed bitch or going to break down in tears.

-Tech issues - last 3 weeks/month (couldn't even load any pages to window shop girly stuff yesterday)
-Contractor issues
-Buck is super busy managing things on his end; dealing with not breaking down in tears Sat; when he drops D off at college.... (I'm trying to help with that, but there is only so much to be done about feelings; they simply pass when they do)
-weather has turned gray & gloomy & wet; there have been some interesting mist effects to at least keep the scenery interesting but the trees are starting to turn and we HAVE to get things that are going to the hut, to the hut so I can finally function again & organize my spaces.

In. Out. In. Out. Patience; this too shall pass.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 03, 2020, 11:41:49 AM: Tears
are
good.

Releasing
healing
designed for a reason

Detoxifying
letting go
expressing stress (instead of holding it in like I did for way too long thus setting myself up for stroke, arrythmia, etc)

No
more
fears
of
tears!

CRY. It doesn't mean failure, disaster, collapse, inadequacy, weakness.
It means: Ahhh, good. Got that out.

huuuuuuugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 03, 2020, 12:47:17 PM: Oh, no worries there Hops! I have a whole selection of Outlander clips that are guaranteed tear-jerkers. It doesn't matter HOW it's initiated, I find.

Also saw an Amazon Prime movie that wasn't quite what I anticipated from the description - revolved around a lesbian love affair - called Summerland, that was quite good overall. It was funny, sensitive, heartbreaking, but had a happy ending. I'm a sucker, I think for a genre of British movies/series that I don't know what to call it. Lots of descriptive visual "narrative" and telling of the story through dialogue/plot evolution. Anything that isn't just pandering to kneejerk emotional "buttons".

American film & tv simply don't have much on offer - and haven't since the 70s pretty much - of things like this. Life, love, human nature and gentle humor. One series Hol & I found on Netflix, I can recommend is positively HILARIOUS in the old sit-com style is the Kaminisky Method. Micheal Douglas plays an acting teacher in his 50s/60s... whose best friend is played by Alan Arkin (who is GENIUS in this series). Both of us laughed so hard we practically peed ourselves. Good fiction is my constantly faithful refuge and "go to"...

I think I'm starting to feel the falling apart of the conversational skills of people online. This is about the last place I frequent where we all talk TO each other, rather than AT each other - or just to hear ourselves talk. That's contributing to my crankiness. And then, I also think the full moon is too. Buck is busy and doesn't have as much time to spend with me, even in short snippets. But Hol's friend M just arrived... so that may be including me at some point today or this evening.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 03, 2020, 01:19:11 PM: You got this, (((((Amber)))).

You're in Transition Time, and even when that leads to happy, it's a little destabilizing for anybody. It's normal to feel a little "off." And lonely. Change is happening in your life and you are catching a wave, trusting you'll float. I do.

B is busy, Hol is too, and you're feeling this poignant time of being Amber On Her Own. You are a person, not a project manager. All will be well.

Your independent spirit is an inspiration but you still deserve whatever self-comforting distracts and soothes during an unsettling time. (For me, oddly, it's great espionage series, like Berlin Station (in English) on EPIX and The Bureau on Sundance Now.) I've found it well worth the $6 or $7/month or the free trial periods on some of these streaming networks to catch some Really Good TV. I just stick a cancellation date on my calendar in case I don't want to continue.

As to perfecting your natural beauty to make B go speechless when he sees you? No staging necessary, girl. It'll be that one moment that just says, Hello again.

Take a break. Try just being safe and cozy and young at heart and soak up some stories. Outlander was that for me too. Just an amazing escape.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 05, 2020, 10:30:28 AM: Hol has offered to come up to the house at midnight and grab a glass of milk, eat a sleeve of Oreos, and leave the dishes in the sink. LOLOLOLOLOL. She is a good "neighbor". Comes up to hang out with me for a short time, a couple times a day. It's gonna start wearing on her, I think. But then, even when S is "hanging out" with her he isn't there. She's starting to notice things like that... and I have a feeling this weekend will see another studio "session" where she can "let it all hang out" & the eggshells be damned. I really am enjoying the peace & silence & lack of activity around me - unless I'm engaged in doing something. And I NEEDED this right now.

I let my head get in a space over B, where I started to feel as if he was eventually going to disappoint me massively; break my heart; leave me hanging... waiting.... waiting.... waiting... (and no, Hol's & Lighter's "red flag warnings" didn't generate that). It was him being busy and not staying in contact with me; me not being available when he was ready to chat and talking to forum friends instead... etc.

In a nutshell - I created an expectation from the barest of outlines of his "plan" that he would be here permanently within a month of dropping his D off at college. That's happening today. I let myself get into "patiently waiting mode" and trying to distract myself with whatever (and it's not working)... and progressively feeling more & more desolate, with only one antidote possible. I was bored, restless, ready to climb the walls, and starting to get ego-mad at the wild suspicions running through my head... feeling like an "also ran", not important, etc pity-party crap.

Amber makes dumb mistakes sometimes; especially when dealing with herself. But, since I don't beat myself up for 'em anymore... that frees up the space & creativity to solve the real issue. Which is that I was putting my life on hold, waiting for my brave & honorable knight on his white horse to show up and rescue me from myself & my mental suspicions... and make everything unicorns & rainbows again. (Twiggy - you silly goose - exactly HOW has that fairy tale crap worked out for you, all the OTHER TIMES? Sorry Charlie; that's not real life.)

I have always created my own obstacles and limitations and challenges ("you can't do what you're craving to do in the house until Hol is completely moved out"; just isn't rational or realistic, for instance). And putting myself in suspended animation - is NOT GOOD - waiting for B to work things out on his end. He and I have started to talk about this in little chunks at a time. I have things I WANT DONE and accomplished so I can store left over materials, put tools away, get organized... and ready for winter. Neither he or I completely control all the external things in his life, right now... so any "plan" is going to have unexpected hitches in it. Those are coming up re: the Hut, too. But she's got hot water now... and says she can see the moon rise above the ridge from the window over the bathtub. :D

B is actually the one, that sparked the realization of what I was doing to myself when he said his D was accusing him of being clingy - the emotions of letting her go, the whole "empty nest" experience, has settled on him and he DOES feel things intensely, this I know. He just doesn't always express them easily. But he KNOWS what he's feeling; and doesn't seem inhibited sharing it with me - he just doesn't get into the gory details, the way Hol or I would.

I have made this very same mistake, over & over & over & over again. And if I don't see it in time, catch it like this, years will go by of getting into that habit (a la Mike's "neediness") and it turns into resentment and blame. I determined from the get-go, that A & B were going to do things differently. He would have things he would go off and do, on his own or with other people and so would I. It's just the character; flavor of mature people having relationships. Ooopsie. Some "romantic idealist" dropped the ball and reverted to little girl heart-dreams. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. There's nothing wrong with that per se; but it's not terribly functional in real life.

So this is a big milestone day for B & D; whatever I end up telling him about this headspace I've been in, and the agony I've put myself through needlessly - can WAIT. I truly am not so important in THAT PICTURE, that I can't wait my turn. They need this time together - and the further adjustments that I already KNOW come later - and he deserves time with his own feelings & experience of all this... without me being a busy-body or saying "but what about me???" I do believe, I'm more grown up than that - despite Twiggy's residual mutterings. I know what it's like to be in his shoes and have someone do all that to me, too.

And I just don't have a NEED or REQUIREMENT for my self, to choose to do that. I can sort this bilge out on my own, & be a lot more coherent and clear when we CAN talk and he's done his duty with his impeccable care and caring and his feelings have settled down some from that.

After all - I have "things to do" too... and time's a-wastin'. I don't need to always be all "up in my head" about this. It will happen as it happens... and he's still running HIS show and will be when he gets here. Time for Twiggy to learn "new rules" about how "things are supposed to be". FINITO.

Oh... and this morning... he posted in the forum and sent me a "vacation" idea - apparently it's possible to rent the smaller cabins on the Dutton Ranch - where Yellowstone is filmed. In Montana. It's called something else - Chief Joseph Ranch - in real life. He certainly knows the way to this girl's (Twiggy's) heart. LOLOL. They're already booked into next year... yes, they have horses!! No, I don't have boots... but my internet's functioning better and I've been window shopping. Looks like cowgirl stuff is the best selection of women's farm work clothes, going. (Duluth Trading is off my preferred list, since they stopped making my favorite shorts.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 05, 2020, 11:41:02 AM: BRAVO, Amber!
You fought through an internal backslide, saw it for exactly what it was, mapped your way out of the old grooves and you're climbing up a beautiful canyon on your own strong legs.

You're stopping the always-waiting, alwaysinthefuture state.

You're coming back into the present. You're refusing to become over dependent. Bravo!

Stop waiting, resume LIVING...in the present. B is the spice, the scent coming across...but no matter how often we watch Outlander it's really important to remember we ain't going through the stones. Time has its own rules and we don't get to rewrite them. Damn, tho.

Little question:
Quote
whatever I end up telling him about this headspace I've been in, and the agony I've put myself through needlessly

Maybe it'd be a gift to yourself to NOT tell him much about that. To process it on your own because you can (already have, really) and savor that recognition of your own maturity. Could be a gift to him too, maybe?

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 05, 2020, 12:47:51 PM: Maybe Hops. Maybe I'll keep most of it to myself - and give him the gist - because it's something that even one or ten "success" moments in seeing it for what it is, will likely pop up again another time in another form, for another reason. So it's - like it or not - part of who I am, and what I'm dealing with, when dealing with myself. And better he knows I'm at war with myself in those moments, than him.

Fortunately, his own experiences lived, gives him some understanding of that.

I know in greater detail than I want, to my dismay, how things like that unsaid can later become "you always" things down the road in relationships. I'd kinda like to avoid that this time. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 07, 2020, 08:37:17 PM: Just "the gist" sounds wise to me.

Any news on B?

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 07, 2020, 09:31:41 PM: He's still processing his empty nest Hops. I'm giving him as much space as I can for that. It's big; and for him - it's the moment he wasn't sure he'd be alive for. So it has to settle some.

LOL... his D sounds homesick a bit already. And worried about him.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 08, 2020, 01:56:28 PM: You really do know him, I believe, Amber. If I'm wrong I'd be as disappointed as you would be though without the loss.

You'll find out more as it unfolds and the challenge is to keep your balance during the threshold time...in but not in, together but not together, in the present and waiting.... And if the not-knowing or not-seeing concrete plans and progress, you know you still have choice. You can draw any line any time you feel it's appropriate.

This has all been like a very slow painting, I think, and I also think (no, I know) that you are going to be able to handle whatever comes next. You'll be able to speak, to assert, to decide, to shape your life just as much after-B-arrives or if-B-doesn't as you have been up until now.

I can imagine how you feel mounting stress about it (it's a marathon) and I'm glad you can vent. You don't need rescuing, you do need reminders of your strength and capacity not to abandon yourself or the boundaries you need for balance. You deserve them. And whatever focus it takes to stay in honest dialogue with YOURSELF, I know you can summon.

You are whole now. You have been for a long time.

big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 08, 2020, 05:04:18 PM: NEWS:

Hol got the official OK to move in, albeit some temporary deck railings need to get installed this week. But even Hol can do that, as needed.

Buck's house should be listed this week. Neighbor has his house listed, too - but neither could sell due to neighbor building chicken coop over the easement between the lots - and actually on B's property. Neighbor had to pay for survey today. B's was done years ago. Now, neighbor has to move or tear down the coop. B is pleased - but expected - this result. He said he's already gotten some nibbles, as the realtor "unofficially" talked to some people about the property. I suspect a developer wants the land; but the value of the property has tripled since it last was sold to B... so he should make out OK.

That's the last item on the to-do list for him. :D

I am typically not a patient person. And the more volatile events are while I'm waiting... the less patient I get. This past year has been excruciating for me. I knew what I was signing up for, so I can't really complain can I? But it has been harder on me than I expected. I realized I was kinda in a paralysis-limbo state: waiting for Hol to move out so I can reacquaint myself with how I was doing things without always having someone in my way, or critiquing or trying to "help". And that includes self-motivation. Waiting on Buck - because his input is important to me, too. And I need his help on certain projects.

But somehow I was able to shake that off this week and get my butt moving some again. Ignoring Hol & B, as much as possible... and it's helped a lot that they've been also been doing their own things and busy; and I really appreciate the bit of solitude that's come with that. It's so much easier to sort out just what is going on in my own head - by myself. LOLOL. Knuckles has been keeping me company and he's not demanding at all. So all that, on the way to explaining that I'm just going to go about living my life, doing my things as I see fit - until such time as someone proposes an activity that I'm interested in or spending some time together. There has been talk of B coming to call again soon; like this month or next. I did tell him I'd like him to be moved in by Nov. 3rd; but he didn't promise anything. By now, I expect medical appts to throw a monkey wrench in that. Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised. But I'm not holding my breath. There does exist the possibility that the school his D is at may close, if there's much of a Covid outbreak, too. She is not sharing a dorm room; and that's actually making the transition harder for her. She's lonely and there doesn't seem to be the usual freshman activities to meet her classmates. No sports. Classes are 100% online for the first 2 weeks, too. 3 of her HS friends are on campus though. She has an on campus job. So it may just be the usual freshman, first time away from home on her own vapors. She does seem prone to anxiety.

I just find myself not willing to sit around waiting, hoping for him to be able to break free to finally move "SOON". He said he will be able to; I trust him; but I'm no longer gonna sit around & mope & wait for the phone to ring. Winter is coming. And with the cooler weather, I'm finally able to heave-to and get my stuff done. Put my house to rights again; give it a good cleaning; start tackling some of the projects that have been on the list for over a year - upgrading old systems, etc. Maybe I'll even get some rip van winkle time this winter. Missed it last winter.

Maybe I'll even do some shopping, finally. Expenditures on the hut should start shrinking rapidly.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 09, 2020, 08:12:40 AM: Quote
This past year has been excruciating for me. I knew what I was signing up for, so I can't really complain can I?

You sure can. I'm glad to read this. Not about your being in so much pain, but because it's unvarnishedly compassionate to yourself to call your experience what it was and what it has felt like to you. If that's "complaining" well, bust me too. Bust the world.

Good news about B's house being about to be listed! Have you been there, or seen pix? It must be in a growing area (if anything's growing right now, economically) if a developer is eyeing it. Or an area of good land, anyway.

Wondering....the details about what B's daughter is going through prompt me to ask:
--have you ever met and talked to her? sorry if you did report that and I forgot
--is B relaying the story about her loneliness and anxiety and boredom? It's really good three friends of hers are there too. So if I have it straight: She has moved away from home (to a different city? same state?) into her own apartment and for two weeks school will be online only, then restart more conventionally (presumably with social distancing). When I was young I would've found that really hard too. The dorm, the other newbies, all of us stumbling through it together, was really where comfort was.

Is her college in a southern state? Generally, some have been slower to embrace virus guidelines. I hope she's smart and safe. If she's influenced by her Dad though, I bet she is.

Even more good news in your post:
Quote
I'm no longer gonna sit around & mope & wait for the phone to ring. Winter is coming. And with the cooler weather, I'm finally able to heave-to and get my stuff done. (http://I'm no longer gonna sit around & mope & wait for the phone to ring. Winter is coming. And with the cooler weather, I'm finally able to heave-to and get my stuff done.)

Knowing that Hol and S are almost out of your private space (with Hol still available) feels miraculous. I can imagine that it's been a relief lately with them almost-gone to have the time and uninterrupted head-space to shift into Amberlife, Amberchoice, Amberdoes, again.

I can almost feel that subtle new vigor of fall, like the coolness slipping into the air.

I am hoping for an iota of your productivity this fall.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 09, 2020, 09:28:09 AM: Thanks Hops. Emotionally, this whole past year has been a rollercoaster. Not being a stranger to these kinds of things - when has my life ever been consistently stable?? - I at least have some knowledge/skills to manage, maintain & take care of myself.

I've pics of B's house; not quite the full on realtor showcase - but snippets of different places. He is also a fireplace type... :D

His D is in a dorm on campus. But yes, alone in her room. For now. I've not met her, but seen LOTS of pics. Very pretty & talented young lady. And yes, she finally knows that I exist and how I figure in his planning. I haven't talked with him about that yet. For all he can focus, his attention wanders a lot. LOL.

She's in a smaller university city in a southern state. But the school virus rules are a pretty high bar. I think she'll be fine; this kind of thing is normal. I've dealt with enough freshmen while working, to know a lot of the things they experience during that first month of being out on their own for the first time - even with the massive support structure of the college around them. They're all different of course; it seemed to me that international students were more independent and self-sufficient - but perhaps that's the result of self-selection to attend school in another country?

Just like I'm gradually reclaiming space in the house - and adapting that as my creative whim prompts - I'm doing the same thing with my overall "me space". So much activity going on around here... around me... and I'm generally the rock in the stream that it's flowing around. But this rock is starting to grow moss... and feels like it's time to roll around a little bit and maybe settle into another spot and show another side of itself to the sun.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 14, 2020, 08:18:09 AM: I have no idea how Hol is going to fit everything else she has to move, into the hut.

She had friends here camping over the weekend, and busted her butt all week prior, to get the hut functional and cozy. I hung out for a bit Sat afternoon, through dinner... but it IS a smaller space, 9 people (including her & S) is a lot for me... and I took my cue to leave when they went to enjoy the bonfire. Too many conversations, too many egos, too many separate goings on in one space for me. She even said last night, she was happy to see them go just to be in HER house with S and the dogs... and unwind.

She wants to do some internet research, so will probably be up today, since she gets no signal down there, to speak of. Our internet is still kinda wonky. But it's happening across the country... B's had issues too. So I suspect there's something going on upgrade wise that's causing glitches/outages... or something else, that the big providers don't want to admit.

On the one hand, it's REALLY feeling good to have my space back... and be alone... and some of the tension is finally releasing. My routine is already gravitating back to what worked for me, before she and then S, moved in. But there is still a lot of her stuff occupying my space. No way it's all going to fit down there, even with her genius for fitting 10# of stuff into a 5# bag. Be interesting to see how she deals with that... and how long it's going to take. Contractors are back again today, but their work is in the downstairs bath and outside now. So it won't be much longer that I will be having to navigate the constant in/out traffic and paying them. I put off upgrades on my house & studio, to get her situated this year.

LOL... separate houses is the ONLY way, it was going to be possible for us to co-exist here. When we do sit down & compare notes, the wavelength is much better than it was. We're both more relaxed and in a better head space. Less stressed.

So, today is just going to be my taking stock of where I am with MY STUFF... I picked up the stone to finish the wall in the bedroom. I still have to trim the closet door that doesn't fit now the hardwood is down. I have a sun shade to attach off the back deck so I can have my hidden little private outside space... and there is a lot of stuff Hol borrowed for the weekend that needs to come back and get put away.

I've called my handyman project guy to put up a new gate, where we changed the end of the driveway... and the alarm system goes back up - and gets expanded. Hopefully, it'll receive a signal down at the hut. She needs her woodstove connected too... night time temps are going down into the 40s in the next couple weeks...

I have SOOOOO much to do outside, to get caught up, that I think I'll finish what I can on the bedroom stuff first - that way it'll be "done" and off the list completely.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 14, 2020, 09:41:04 AM: Amber:

I remember when you started posting about the hut.....it seemed a distant plan, but here you guys are! Finishing the hut!

Woo hoo!

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 14, 2020, 10:12:05 AM: Amen to that Woo-hoo, and add a Wow!

That's such a huuuuuuge thing to check off a To-Do list.

My mind boggles.

hugs and congrats!
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 14, 2020, 02:46:23 PM: We're both exhausted - LOL. And enjoying having separate spaces - even though we're "neighbors" and visiting back & forth, for short amounts of time...

I'm going down later to drop off mail and pick up a kitten. (He's a cutie - if it's a he.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 14, 2020, 05:00:18 PM: Are you hoping for a boy or girl kittie?
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 14, 2020, 05:32:02 PM: I'm good with either one; right now he/she has a new bed in the bathroom under my sink. With Freddy around I figured it would be good to keep them mostly separate for a bit till kitty adjusts to not having mama & it's litter mates. I did let Freddy in for a minute and he went right for the wet food bowl - piggy face. He wasn't happy to get ejected... but baby kitteh needs to get a little bigger before they get acquainted. About 8 weeks old.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 15, 2020, 12:08:39 PM: Getting caught up on sleep and resting and playing with both kitties (Freddy's pride is injured that I brought another cat into the house).

Going out today to resupply the kinds of food I eat - since the kids have transferred most of their stuff to the hut and have plenty left over from the weekend's camping gathering of Hol friends.

I have to start setting up to run the woodstove. Weekend temps are looking more like Halloween or November than September.... and I still have some herbs to get in the ground - they're looking pretty rough now, as is. Need to set up to finish wall... and catch up with my "spring clean up" that I didn't do. And I JUST. DON'T. FEEL. LIKE. IT. Still.

Hol continues to drop in and chat over coffee or get a better cell signal. But she's starting to sound like me, about my tools & kitchen... and the usual suspect is the reason why. Her friends who came to visit also got on her nerves this time for the same reasons - I guess she should've enjoyed her pristine house for a few weeks on her own before inviting people who can't be expected to know how to care for things or treat hers like their own to spend a weekend.

Buck is busy purging the stuff he's kept for 20-30 years, and didn't even remember he had... before preparing for the next load up here. And dealing with more med stuff... now the stimulator is trying to exit his body; again, looking as tho it wasn't properly secured in a pocket during the last surgery. It's coming to the surface through his skin. It doesn't help he doesn't have much body fat - just muscle and skin. He figures 45 days before it becomes enough of a "crisis" that the hospital will have to do something. He's waiting to hear back from the surgeon's office as it is, after showing the T, the pic of the situation. And no, the Navy still hasn't processed his retirement paperwork (expected no sooner than October) ...

I'm glad I finally decided to just stop obsessing on a specific date when he'd be back/finally moved in. Otherwise I'd be totally nutz by now. Just continuing on with the stuff I know I need to do. Tired of waiting for Hol, too. So... now I'm just dealing with me again and I'm finding out just how many levels of exhaustion exist in attempting to cope with other people around me... expecting my time, attention, compassion, help, caring, and keeping entertained... so as to not go nutz themselves.

Hol was the big one. EVERY time, I tried to just have some down time to relax... there she was again; needing... and taking it poorly that I just wasn't overly engaged. Handle your own shit, kid... the consequences of your choices, your own frustrations, etc ad nauseum... NOT. MY. PROBLEM. Why are you talking to me - and then not liking what I have to say, again?? Go away, kid, ya bother me. (W.C. Fields)

And that boys & girls... is why mom built you your own house. NOW GO HOME. LOLOLOLOLOL.

I'm only now beginning to feel like my nerves are calming down. Living with her - and her crisis mentality (catastrophizing PLUS imagining what-ifs and "all the things") - was taking a bigger toll on me than I realized. Yes, I'm a verbal processer too... but I talk to my SELF, and don't NEED others in the processing... LOLOLOL. Not all our interactions were like that. Some real positive ones, and reciprocal giving back too.

But it's finallly stopped LONG ENOUGH for me to see what it was doing to me. It's not that she's toxic for me, per se (she CAN BE if my guard isn't up; is working hard not to be... and is just as difficult in her overcompensation that way). She's just EXHAUSTING, energy-wise.

Today looks like it might be another "Hi, I'm back day...". She was here for coffee & to grab a few things to move this morning and has been texting coordination info back & forth...

NO WONDER I've been redoing my room and setting up a private patio... where I can hide again. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 15, 2020, 12:35:30 PM: I hope soon Hol stops her over-dependent stuff with you, Amber. Finds a T.
You are wise not to manage or analyse any more than you feel compelled to.
That kind of connection, while comforting, can also become like an addiction.
She's got a ways to go but it's a good step that she has her own damn building now.

I too find it odd that she invited a bunch of friends so quickly. But I forget youth.
Wonder how she'll weather real mountain solitude should she become solo again some day.

Sending you peaceful patio vibes.
It'll all get sorted, all of it, one day at a time and no faster.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 15, 2020, 12:50:41 PM: Amber:

I hope your patio is ready for the fall. Maybe keep it to yourself and turn off your phone when you're there?

I won't give advice, but your last post seemed a bit stressed around Hol. Maybe drop all judgment read through it again.

You seem to be doing well with letting her carry her own stuff. Even when she wants you to climb under it with her again. Well done.

I hope B ' s device gets sorted. I've come to the conclusion he must be Super Man, so will resist writhing over his lack of competent medical care....for once.

So.
Frustrated.
For.
Him.

Enjoy your new 😸

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 21, 2020, 08:50:23 AM: For someone who isn't getting alot done in the physical world right now - I sure am busy. Before I know it, it's 3 pm and I'm ready to call it a day.

Stinkerbell the wildcat keeps me busy... we're still trying to find our comfy rhythms & schedule. She just deleted a paragraph... sigh. She's very sweet when she sits still - which is for about 60 seconds. LOL.

Hol is in/out of the house alot. Sometimes I get a heads up, sometimes she just shows up. She needs to borrow something, or works on sorting out the big pile of clothes (all from thrifting) to donate, sorting out old snippets that once upon in her life were significant enough to hang onto for a decade... and opening the boxes she moved and wasn't comfortable opening for a decade at Bovies. There is an equinox fire sacrifice of some symbolic "letting go" items planned this week.

S leaves for a job this weekend; it sounds like his work is slowly starting to pick up again. Hol has been thinking about applying for an asst mgr position at a local cafe. It's only open a few days a week, I believe... but it'll help add some structure to her life. And use up some time that right now she uses in looking for and manufacturing "problems". We've discussed the futility of that a lot... but she doesn't seem able to grab ahold of it and change it. Maybe she doesn't really want to... ya know?

B is having another round with the docs at the hospital. He went to the ER around midnight last night with an urgent problem; his preferred surgeon was on call. Not that he ever got to see/talk to her. Once again - they did the minimum and sent him home just before dawn. Speaking of never-ending problems... they're not his fault, of course. But this crap is getting so absurd - just enough treatment, to deal with the "emergency" - and gather data - but never dealing with solving the problem. The solution is plain as day even to ME. I know he's assertive enough. LOL.

I am still resting up. Letting my mind settle. I'm ready to finish the stone - but there are some other tasks that need doing as well... and my cell tower has been having frustrating signal issues for two months now. There have been multiple calls to ATT, by both Hol & I, and they have yet to give us an ETA on when it'll be fixed. I'm paying for almost a business level connection/bandwidth and yet I still can't pics via my phone outside of Hol and my ipad. Any webpage that has pics on it loads slower than dial up used to be - IF it loads. Download sales reports? Fuggedaboutit. So no online shopping is possible except between the hours of 10 pm and 10 am. Even my Kindle hasn't been able to connect.

I need to research alternatives for internet, phone & tv... but hey - those websites have pics and my brain wants to shutdown during those better hours. So I'm gonna light 'em up again today - ASSUMING of course, that my call goes through. There was a time I wouldn't have been able to call 911. Couple days. Text messages can be delayed 30 minutes to hours. Support is absolutely not forthcoming with information - they just read off the prepared troubleshooting cheat sheets... and I've already done ALL of that 100 times now, hoping this time it'll help.

We are just about at the point of getting rid of ALL of it and doing without. Oh, I can't even get a conventional landline out here either. Buck & I should have the ham radio antenna up on his next trip; when ever that'll be. I may have to have more help with the antenna & radio setup but that's doable - ASSUMING I have some other form of communication to talk to my mentor out on the west coast.

These kinds of things don't infuriate me anymore, the way Hol is still experiencing. I know entropy has been at work in these complex systems for over a decade now. I've accepted it - but they still present challenges to work around, overcome, or outsmart. Or just accept and adapt to them. LOLOLOL. There are always options. And at some point, things will change again. Will it be "fixed"? maybe. Am I hoping that'll be the case? I wasn't born yesterday.

Meanwhile there is PLENTY of other stuff to do an deal with and engage in.

Y'all hang in there. We had frost this morning, which is kinda early but it helps my energy so I'm not complaining.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 21, 2020, 11:21:41 AM: DAMN! You without internet? Cannot fathom it. Much less a squirt of worry...you can still be here I hope? Drive to town and post from a parking meter, we don't care!

But do care it's such a hassle. I have mountain friends who put in their own satellite antenna, kind of a dish thing. Dunno, I'm sure you've already researched all appropriate options for your location.

Have to say I LOOOOVE the name Stinkerbell. And this made my morning laugh!

Quote
She just deleted a paragraph...sigh

Conjured up pure kitten so completely. :)

Her nickname's Stinky, right?...

Very very sorry B is going through more pain and all of the rest of it. SO maddening. Foremost to him (pain never becomes a friend). And it backwashes on everyone who loves him.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 21, 2020, 12:54:06 PM: Stinky.

Hee.

Always funny : )
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 23, 2020, 12:11:46 PM: Freddy and Stinker are getting acquainted; slowly. Each one has stood their ground and hissed, so far. Freddy likes to get comfy and just watch the youngen being silly. He is really putting on winter weight & coat already - because his night time bed spot isn't as attractive, even with the little one put to bed in the bathroom (so mom can unwind... enough to sleep).

It's strange to see a big old tom totally freaked out by a tiny, even for her age, kitten. LOLOLOL. But then, I remember how much mio-mio scared him, too. Eventually, he'll be called on to teach the little one the ropes of being outdoors... but maybe not till spring. She needs to be stronger & bigger first. She still wants the security/comfort of cuddles and tries to nurse still. Not hungry - just that comfort instinct - and I'm now her new kitty mommy. LOLOL. Buck has a kitten too; his D discovered it just before going to college - and his is doing the same thing.

My decision to stop sitting around like some fairytale lady in a tower waiting for her knight to arrive... and do what I know I need to do and want to do and can do... is helping me quite a bit. I don't have a lot of patience, for "future orientation" in my thinking... because the future is usually something I create myself. I'm rested; my mind is clear enough to manage even Hol's "issue of the day" without being steamrolled; and while it feels like there's more space/distance between Buck & I as a result... my tasks aren't going to wait around for him to show up and help. Hol has adopted better habits about her boundaries, too - because she has a home to run too. I was down there a couple times... but I am very comfy just being in my own space. So we're making "dates" to hang out together instead of just being in the same space all the time. I think we both like it - and she's beginning to become aware of how much she was depending on me for attention... and suggesting solutions to her "problems". Again. New part of the spiral, and I'm feeling quite good about it.

Buck is being stubborn about the things he needs to accomplish and how he wants to do that - for himself. Whether I like it or not; whether my patience is wearing thin or not. And he knows it's getting that way. The medical stuff also makes me upset and want to interfere and "help" -- but he's not terribly open to me helping. Some of it is not wanting to be dependent; some of it is just male ego and pride in being self-sufficient. Which I'm not at all about to deny him.

And I know somedays, he's simply in too much pain to do much of anything except be grumpy. That is just part of the reality with him.

He also overcompensates by withdrawing when something has frustrated him to the point of anger, too. And he really pulls away then. I have a feeling he's been around people who couldn't separate someone else's anger from feeling like it was being taken out them when he expressed it and reacting strongly to that. (That could just be me projecting but I don't think so. Too many unnecessary apologies.) He has NEVER yet once directed anger at me, even when I strongly objected to something he was planning to do or the way he planned to it. We negotiate that stuff; make a deal. So far, that's working well.

So, there is ebb & flow here. Communication could be better and more open right now... but I know he's trying to figure out what he CAN do within the circumstances he's dealing with right now. I've got stuff to do, and I don't need my phone ringing every 5 minutes with a text to feel "seen" by him. Or appreciated. I'm off thinking my own thoughts, still accepting that this may not actually happen - because life and his medical challenges, you know. And maybe we can resolve those better here; maybe we can't... and we both have to live with it the way it is. I remind myself often - that partners can die at ANY age; and it wastes a lot of time that we could instead spend on making "happy", to obsess on that fear.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 23, 2020, 05:20:59 PM: Wow, Amber, I'm really impressed.

I don't think you're arbitrarily withdrawing from B. Maybe you're being a bit more self-protective by no longer assuming he'll show. That's got to have been a verrrry difficult transition for you to make, but bravo.

And hopefully he WILL soldier on through his remaining obstacles and make it happen. As long as it's about practical obstacles and not ambivalence or uncertainty about making the commitment, this is resolvable, eh? But you're right...that's HIS job. And if he keeps you waiting TOO long you may not be able to keep the lights on for him. That's reality, not a Nicholas Sparks movie.

Do you have a strong sense of either being the predominant thing in him?

I'm glad you're refocusing on your own life and not building in B's help, though it sure would be nice if that were still going to happen.

Ambiguity and limbo are hell. Hope you continue to feel steady...but scream here if you wobble. Nothing wrong with not being all-Amazon all the time.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 24, 2020, 01:36:48 AM: ((Amber))
Even if it's not ok....it's ok.

Breathe. Live your amazing life. B will join you sooner or later, if he can.

I believe that.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 24, 2020, 09:31:06 AM: I believe that too Lighter. I have a strong sense that this IS what he wants. And he is doing all he can, to "make it so".

I had been putting things on hold, till the hut was done. And I wanted to wait till B was here, to make new decisions. So in a way, I created a "condition"... nothing new will happen till B gets here was the condition. And now that we're well into the 2nd year, I am kinda shaking that off. Why should I make progress at the farm dependent on B's presence? I functioned just fine without him... or at least I think so.

It's merely a mindset shift for me. And it's really helping me move into my motivated, doing space again. I have only two small pieces of stone to put up in the bedroom... then I can trim that out, get the electrician back and finish that room for this year. Next year, I'll probably replace the french door with a slider. It might could still happen this year; B and I could actually do it ourselves - IF he was here. But it's getting increasingly chilly at night now... and the door I have functions fine. I was just hoping to arrange furniture differently. It CAN wait.

Next spring is going to have to be a new roof on the house, too. So why not tackle the system upgrades over the winter? Hot water heaters, furnaces? Garden prep - which got neglected when we had two straight months of solid 90 degree and humid (but very little rain) heat. The more I do now, the less I have to do later.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 24, 2020, 10:44:49 AM: Yes yes yes. It feels so good to have things ticked off the list, Amber. You're fully capable of moving forward.

B arrives when he arrives, but you're already there.

Already home.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 24, 2020, 10:45:11 AM: COOL. Just two pieces of stone left!
I love it that you're making a new gorgeous bedroom, period.

And....solarshinglessolarshinglessolarshingles?

I'm desperate for somebody I know to re-roof with solar shingles.
See no reason why people shouldn't redesign their houses to accommodate me, right?

LOL.

Hugs and more kudos for re-entering your own life as it presently is,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 24, 2020, 03:21:20 PM: Nope; going with a metal roof - with some additional insulation between sheathing & metal. Because of the wind we get here (especially on top of the cliff where I'm at) shingles of any kind simply don't last. I don't need (or want) the solar; that's Holly's gig. I have LOTS of propane storage and whole house generator. It's not even their biggest one - but I've got more that switches over to the genny in a power outage, than I really need. (I can turn things off to conserve fuel, at my discretion.) It is usually a big bill when the tanks are filled; but it's looking like I'm only scheduled about twice a year now. No, you can't see them; buried.

Hol's big solar array definitely provides enough power for her house. All the normal amenities, sans dishwasher and a/c. I like her ship's lights outside; they have red bulbs and don't seem to attract as many bugs as my LEDs do... and the red light preserves a person's night vision. She also has a generator to charge batteries, during prolonged overcast. (Which has already started, along with my winter regimen of taking Vitamin D3.)

I went down to the hut last night for girl's night pow-wow. S headed into the city for a job this weekend. I'd been down previously, for the "housewarming" campout and it was just too many people for me. But with just us & the dogs & the rest of the baby kittens... the house was easier to sense. From the location, to the design, and the choice of materials and amenities/layout... she's done a really impressive job. It's my kind of "magic" to go from ideas to manifesting the physical reality of a thing. And there's not a thing unbalanced or unplanned about the house. I forgot to ask how she slept last night; her first night alone all the way down there. She's even rigged up a pantry in her mudroom closet.

Our aesthetics are different, but they're not that far apart. So I haven't spent any time in "her" house for a decade or more. It hasn't changed much; but this is just the settling in phase for her. It's going to change a good bit over time. She has a strong attraction to the strange, the quirky, and unusual. Her bedroom door has a frosted glass window that's painted with "Girls" on it. LOL. The floor plan is mostly open on the main floor and the bulk of the space downstairs is a great room too. It functions very well with her extremely casual lifestyle - and strong connection to the outdoors. LOTS of deck room. We hung out in the space that will be a screened porch just off the mudroom. Lots of 70s and mid-century furnishings mingled with a farmhouse table and repro danish modern chairs in the dining room. We just do "eclectic" differently, is all. But what she does WORKS really well. Most of the furnishings are vintage; and since she's been "thrifting" since she was 15, there are only a few "new" pieces in there. Most of them are artisan friend created pieces, like her main kitchen counter.

Maybe it's just the proud mom, but I think she has a shot at being a good designer or architect. She'll never bother pursuing that tho - this is just for herself; to enjoy and share.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 25, 2020, 10:58:38 AM: My mother wished been an architect.

The Hol Hut sounds just right for that space and for Hol. I'm so happy she's IN!

How does your house feel now?

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 26, 2020, 10:46:30 AM: My house is still crazy - I have a growing, curious, and stinky kitten right? The old man, Freddy, has made the normal kitty introductions: stare down & hissing... and now he's eating the little one's soft food if I don't watch him and they're playing. "Playing" mostly consists of the old man teaching the whippersnapper to become a real "cat". But I am the substitute kitty mama... so the rest of the time, Stinker is all over me - and I mean all over. Last night she crawled up my arm and over my shoulder and would've gone to the top of my head - like she does in bed, propped up pillows... but she couldn't balance up there and I shook her off.

I feel like I have a parrot on my shoulder. Arrrrggghhh! LOL.

---------

So. Buck is having the stimulator removed Tuesday. The paddle that's trying to escape his body is inflamed with infection and leaking (including spinal fluid) through various stitch holes in scar tissue. It's outpatient surgery... but it's possble (and the best outcome) if AFTER the surgery he is admitted and getting set up for IV antibiotics again, in a long enough course to actually CLEAR the infection.

I've done more research because it sounded absurd that he was told the infection was because of the metal in his body. Seems the devices & parts are coated with something that the infection really DOES adhere to. The manufacturer & FDA , NIH, etc are aware and have been for a few years.

My phone has been ringing - instead of notifying me of text messages the past couple days. He needs to talk. Afraid all his medical stuff is disappointing me or making me want to run the other way. Of course, that's what he's experienced in the past with other women. I ain't those other women.

His communication style is simple, direct and to the point. Even when he's talking about feelings. He means what he says and says what he means. I like that. But there's no way he could disappoint me because his medical care providers don't have what it takes to care for a goldfish. That's not something he's doing on purpose "to me".

But I'd bet money, someone told him that - and more - in the past. Hurt him, and so it "stuck". When I have him all to myself, I'll ask him - I can ask him anything, it seems, without seeing walls go up. Until then, I won't pick at that. Just reassure him I'm not going anywhere.

If they do admit him, they're going to have to let him up to move around because not having the stimulator could a) cause problems; weakness in his left leg and they may have to give him a special brace - and b) more pain than he's used to managing. If they just put a picc line in and keep him overnight/couple days and send him home... he'll be better off. Its torture to him to be kept in bed. He always feels better when he's up and doing. He knows he's got a strong mind-body connection.

So 2 weeks is the recommended antibiotic course; then they should wait 2 weeks and if needed, do another one. He wants to come up here in October; make the final move in November. He is still doing some clean up/repair on his house to get it officially on the market (and has unofficial offers) so I might get a hell of a birthday present this year. Just in time for the holiday madness - which I haven't really participated in for some years. But he'll definitely want to meet Mike's D and her kiddos; I have yet to meet her new guy - coz they are so busy all the time. And then we roll into Hol's birthday blowout spectacle.

But I'm still not counting on those chickens hatching. Things happen we can't foresee; plans are made to be adapted; and I just keep on keepin on.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 27, 2020, 01:48:18 AM: Quote
I feel like I have a parrot on my shoulder. Arrrrggghhh!

This cracked me up, Amber...I am so enjoying that vision of you with Stinker. So funny. Kittens are amazing creatures!

I'm glad B's TENS paddle (I know it's the grownup version) is coming out. The description of the infection clinging to it was horrifying but made a lot of sense. I so hope the two rounds of antibiotics kill that for once and all. Though it's hard to think of him having to live with more intense pain since the paddle-thing isn't workable. I hope it's not inevitable that any such device is permanently ruled out....

Good that he's calling and talking it all out with you. That's really good. A lot less macho and cowboy. At some point in life, cowboys have to just walk a while.

Many hopes it all goes well...and meanwhile, it's also good that you're back in Amberskin, living in Amberland, and not moving into the henhouse. (How to Strangle a Metaphor, Part I.)

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 27, 2020, 09:19:32 AM: Oh Hopsie.... woohoo....
What were you doing up at 1 am? The sleep thing not going that well yet?

I can't talk; I had to put Stinker in the bathroom about that time, she wouldn't let me continue drifting off from my book. I'm on Book 40 of a long epic series, that is total trash reading... but it's useful for bedtime reading.

I can deal with strangled metaphors... they may not always be elegant, but they are definitely more "real" to me, since it's part of my "and" equation theory of perceptual experience. LOLOLOL.... most valuable thing I learned in art school... how to make something sound intriguingly obscure & esoteric & apt at the same time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 27, 2020, 11:23:36 AM: Hi you!
Well I'm not hitting it right 7 nights a week, and I think the last two (later onset) got squirrely because I suddenly have a little cluster of man stuff. Last night, that caused me to review one last time the ENTIRE thread here on M.

(But btw, since I started ashwagandha, the QUALITY of my sleep is much better. Amazing.) I'll need to get good and tired or whomp myself with a leftover Ambien to get back to nodding off earlier. But overall, the whole thing is still much better. I'm cranking the SAD light right now, and that also helps. Have to calibrate the amount of time depending how early or late I woke up and such but it does make a big difference. Keeping it up all winter long.

So this afternoon I go meet storyteller man at a lovely brewery at the base of the mountains. It'll be fun no matter what, already figured that out. Just kinda wishing I wasn't carrying the Covid fifteen, but so it goes.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 27, 2020, 03:16:02 PM: Well, I've seen it said that a good night's sleep helps promote weight management Hops. I dunno the science/statistics behind that, but I don't think it can hurt. Cortisol LOVES when you don't get enough sleep...

I hope you have a lovely, peaceful meeting today.

I TRIED to finish the stone today. These were very complex cuts to go around the outlet boxes. I made a pattern, cut, dry fit and then custom adjust the cuts. But I got impatient and use of my "persuader" - rubber mallet - unfortunately created problems on the last one. So I've walked away. There is typewriter pecking going on in studio as Hol works up her resume for a part-time asst mgr position at the local events cafe. We both agreed it might be good for her to have some structured time again, and since this 15 hrs a week or less, and they have live music and Hol knows a LOT of musicians in B'more... she's willing to give it a shot until the film industry starts up again. Too much free time & her mental foibles are NOT a good combo. Especially since S has started to pick up jobs here & there now, setting up large events in DC again.

Nothing much going on around here today.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 30, 2020, 10:59:04 AM: Buck's surgery was last night. Too bad the surgeons can't sew - he's leaking through his bandages AND the extra padding provided to absorb what should be just a little leakage on the stitched incision. Some time later today, they'll insert the picc line and hopefully release him tonight, end of day. This was relatively minor surgery and is usually an outpatient deal.

But the complication of the infection he got from a PREVIOUS surgery in THAT HOSPITAL... means they kept him overnight. And it's precisely more of a contamination/spread issue in his blood. This problem needs fixed before he goes home because it's a bit of a yoga challenge to change bandages on your own back. So, just more of the same. Maybe he just needs to get a Bio-Hazard tattoo. ;) Except ya can't get tattoo'd with this kind of infection.

I was getting worried. He went down to surgery around 6; didn't call me till almost 10. He was still pretty groggy; still coming back from whatever they gave him for pain. Then he kept texting me all night. LOL. Between him and Stinker I didn't get a lot of sleep. Good thing I don't have anything majorly challenging to do today. Almost like it was planned this way.

I've been sorting out my kitchen, divvying up extra herbs/spices to Holly, deep cleaning, reorganizing from the move-in starting point 4 years ago... and asking myself why I thought I needed ALL these gadgets. Started cooking "thank you Amber" dishes again for myself and freezing parts of the batches. It's almost time for me to make another batch of small pans of lasagna and freeze them too. Every week, I'm cleaning out more junk food or stuff that got lost in the freezer and has been there more than a couple years to see how much room I've got to put in a big order of meat with a local farm. I need to compost all the extra pantry provisions I brought from the beach... and reorganize that space too.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on September 30, 2020, 12:03:07 PM: Maybe buy a very efficient freezer to keep'yer meat, Amber? I' m channeling Pink Floyd today, apparently.

I've been thinking about a freezer chest for the island, that can be unplugged mist of the time....just used for fish and as energy efficient as can be managed.

Seems it would simplify, but then....so is keeping our fridgefreezers clean and pretty empty most of the time. Eating fresh is good too, IME.

Tell B I'm sending healing pink light his way, please.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on September 30, 2020, 03:50:15 PM: (((Amber)))--
Something so consoling about your simple re-engagement with home stuff like downsizing spices and puttering. I liked reading that. Ahhhhh.

I am thinking of B and knowing how hard it is not only to go through such painful surgery and recovery, but how hard it is on YOU to wait for his wellness.

So hope it comes faster than it has before and brings him to you, better. You have been a really astonishing partner/companion to Buck in all this, and I hope hugely that both of you get the chance to settle in to that comfort of love and partnership in the real.

You're an amazing partner and I know he knows how lucky he is.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on September 30, 2020, 07:46:47 PM: Well, seems I posted too soon.

Cat scan revealed a wire or tube from one of the medical devices was left behind; Infectious disease won't treat infection until that's removed; surgeon won't remove it - apparently not REALIZING that if a wire, then the bacteria is sticking to the metal or if a tube, ditto PLUS it could be why he leaks spinal fluid and has this frequent recurrence of meningitis symptoms.

Meanwhile B is in limbo; held hostage while someone learns to communicate better and DO THEIR JOBS correctly. This time, Infectious Disease is correct - whatever was left behind has to go before treating the infection. And now we WAIT. Sigh.

This is maddening. I'm trying to keep him entertained from a distance - because of course, with Covid the policy is no visitors unless immediate family. But I didn't sleep much last night - and I know I'm going to conk out early tonight. Good thing he can entertain himself.

-------------------

He almost spooked me. Last week, his D did something of which he didn't approve and in the process of talking it out, said that I was his only light now. For whatever reason, that sounded wrong to me at the time. And I think I know why now. It reminded me of how Mike wanted to always be joined at the hip with me and made me feel guilty even when I was only going to the salon for the two hours to get my hair done. (When I colored it.)

So I found a way to explain it without a million digressions or ramblings... and he came back with: you don't have to worry about that with me. I may not want a LOT of new people in my life, but I'm quite happy going out hunting critters with the guys or fossils by himself... working in his shop. I guarantee I won't be underfoot or chasing you around ALL the time. And he WANTS to cook his dishes. And is no stranger to washing dishes either. Does his own laundry (due to the infection; he's overly cautious about that but it IS smart). Knows how vacumn cleaners work... and has already started learning where things are in the kitchen so he doesn't have to ask all the time.

And I know he's a neat freak. If he's making a mess while working, he ALWAYS cleans up. When you live on a submarine, space is at a premium and you get in the habit. I guess since this is the Mike anniversary season, that comment got an immediate emotional reaction from me while I didn't know why (what he meant was really quite sweet)... until I connected it to Mike's emotional dependency and how that got translated into actual restrictions on me and yes, I cooperated; but it bothered me more than I was willing to admit. And due to his passing & the whole grieving process... things like that got pushed more to my subconscious.

He is so understanding, he gets that I'm still working through stuff. And reassures me that he's not like that... and doesn't get offended that I freaked out a little, over it. He's an amazing partner too. Worthy of my best efforts to be good to him, too.

There have been sooooo many things like this over the course of the last 14 months that we've already worked out between us. Yes, we've been apart - at a distance - but we've been working on communication and the relationship during that time. Developing trust. Letting love settle softly around us... no drama (well, except this wretched hospital experience & Hol's dramas)... between us, NO DRAMA.

One of the things about the house... is that I had to adjust shortly after I finally got mostly unpacked, to Hol, then Steve being here. I'm finally getting settled and having had so many different kinds of situations here already - know what I want to do in this next phase. Buck and I have similar taste and prefer "simple" and functional to any big statements. I'm looking forward to seeing how his treasures fit in... and I'm purging certain things again, too. Fossils, geodes that he's found. Antique items... and we can sit and design in our imaginations together and brainstorm. A creative partner. We make each other laugh. And we can read each other's body language and facial expressions like we've been together a long time; finishing each other's sentences almost. But with his southern accent sometimes it's more fun to hear what expressions he uses... so I don't finish too many. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 01, 2020, 02:17:05 AM: Skep, I'm so sorry that Buck's been through yet another incompetence. My mind truly boggles at the way in which medical professionals can just mess up so frequently and no-one does anything about it. I really hope that once they sort this mess out he will have at least some time without anymore medical dramas. Poor guy.

I have personally found any military guy I know to be extraordinarily neat and can only think it a good thing. We used to go to a sports club for disabled kids years ago and the guy that ran that was ex Army (PT instructor). Lovely guy, so good at what he did, everything ran like clockwork but his brain used to melt at people turning up late, not being where they were supposed to, having a shirt on that wasn't ironed. You could see it was deeply wired into him that other people not being like that boggled his mind (in a kind of cute, funny way, he didn't get cross about it, just kept telling people they needed an Army training course). He was very cute.

I think it's very easy for a comment (his only light) to mean very different things to different people, and it's hard when someone from the past would have meant that in a different way to the way Buck means it. I would have flipped out a little too; it's great that he understands and is enough of his own man to be able to keep his stuff and your stuff connected but not enmeshed. He sounds like a good un.

I am really looking forward to the day when you post on here some stuff about the projects you and Buck have been getting up to and how you're sat by the fire after dinner, just talking about the day and fending off crazy cats. No drama, no complication, just easy companionship and shared time. It won't be long now :) xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 01, 2020, 08:37:51 AM: Tupp, that's exactly what we talked about when he called later last night. He's obviously bored and has been walking off a paced mile every couple hours in the halls. The nurses are absolutely beside themselves trying to find ways to help him. One brought him coffee last night after supper. They all know him, and care - because he's been there the whole 4 years once or twice a year, they've been in nursing school.

An ER doc I know from our other forum, said that this hospital & the docs embarrass him.

Our conversation later that night, was about him seriously considering speeding up his timeline to move and just which bridges to his life there he was willing to burn, just to get where people are more decent to each other. As you know, some of us don't do well with bureaucratic processes - especially when it involves lack of accountability and CYA and lack of communication/coordination in what is supposed to be a "CARE" system.

Sounds like he's willing to cut his losses and just get out of there, and get started all over again. He is concerned about coming here "hat in hand"... not having acquired his pension, freedom of insurance/choice of docs, and the proceeds of his half of the house. This is going to an issue with him; he's sensitive about being a provider. I've tried to explain that I don't see him that way and don't feel like he's taking advantage of me. It's an issue for me, too - because Mike was perfectly fine not having anything to work at and DID financially take advantage in ways I still resent. I should've been more assertive about what I wanted, instead of trying to let him satisfy his shopaholic happy compulsion. B absolutely can't NOT work at something. He'll go stark raving mad. Climb the walls.

I can most definitely keep him busy. And I have a very good contact for referrals within the medical system here. So I think we can get him healthy again too. Which is his major obstacle right now. It's going to be an ongoing thing; I knew that ahead of time. But he's not as bad off as the prevailing medical opinion down there seems to expect or even trying to make him into. :mad:

He's a "left foot, right foot", keep going forward guy. And that deep-seated provider mentality and must feel useful and productive characteristic is a good match for mine. We can carry each other, as needed, instead of one of us always carrying the other. And while for gov purposes he is considered disabled, there is no way this man is that disabled... he's better off now, than he was 20 years ago because of his determination to suffer what was necessary to get here. And I'm not going to let this hospital's sloppy and cold attitude about correcting THEIR errors finally demoralize him into giving up. He'll not be good as new - but none of us are what we were when we were 20-30. Even Hol is realizing that at 42.

Life ain't perfect. But if one can sit still and be quiet, you'll see that there are enough moments - maybe MORE than enough - that are close enough to perfect to compensate for the other crap we all go thru.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 01, 2020, 04:04:59 PM: Quote
not having acquired....

is really

....not having YET acquired.... am I right?

If those are sure things then I wouldn't fear taking him on.
Are you sure? It's an enormous commitment. And maybe
it's just the right one, in which case, bonzai!

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 01, 2020, 07:41:31 PM: Those are sure things Hops. Did my own research on that. Bein' it's the gov't... it's complex, convoluted and worse than any contract I've ever read.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 01, 2020, 10:22:40 PM: I vote B moves sooner than later.

I vote he gives up on his current clown posse medical system.

A wire....
left in his spine....
and the doc won't touch it.

Insane clown posse.
( Youngest DD likes that band.)

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 02, 2020, 08:37:34 AM: It is insane Lighter. Yesterday, they kept him prepped for surgery to take that wire/tube out... (a 180 from the impasse) and I just found out they didn't do it last night. He is going to try to get discharged around noon today... and there is no way he's keeping any appts associated with that place again.

We talked about it. There just isn't any point in him staying there and dealing with a "care" system that has made so many mistakes, it's almost killed him a couple of times. He'd rather be shot at than trust them again. I thought I'd seen the worst possible medical confusion dealing with Mike; but that was simply because of the profession's taboo over just saying to my face that he was dying and the best we can do is make him comfortable. What Buck has been thru takes the cake. But he's still hopeful, and overcoming to the best of his ability.

If he doesn't live there, the VA/DOD can't expect him to get care there. It's to the point, that I'm sure they resent the fact that he's gotten himself so much stronger than their expectation for someone in their 60s who's endured this type of injury for 20 years and found some "mind-body" ways to deal with the pain... that he's a threat to the steady insurance income they get from him. Yeah, that's really negative and judgemental and jaded/cynical. But that's what I've seen happen over the last 4 years to him.

I'll never understand why the least invasive/least dangerous treatments aren't used more often. Hol ran into that too, when she broke her ribs... they expected her to go to bed, even overnight in the hospital, and beg for pain meds and moan & bitch... and we went to pick up her meds and grab her favorite fast food sandwich on the way home. The doc couldn't believe she was walking about a mile or two every day with broken ribs. The mindset just can't deal with people who know their own bodies and knows how to make it feel better and don't just lay there and give up.

My to-do list is getting longer. I start the process of getting referrals for new docs here, from Mike's D. She's head of Trauma now... and probably knows the best spinal/neuro surgeons personally. Same same with the infection. And he's going to have to do all the navigating bureaucracy with military/VA... I don't have enough familiarity or patience for that. And then there are inside/outside jobs that HAVE to get done here for winter.

I know he is perturbed about needing to accept my help; he's all wrapped up in owning that role/image for himself. We'll need to have a discussion about male ego in general terms, I think. LOL. Followed up by the conversation about "keeping score". But this is what NEEDS to happen; get him moved and start the process all over with new docs, the 4000 page med history, the previous 42 surgeries and addressing the immediate concerns - and THEN coming up with a plan for ongoing medical support/monitoring. I'm not just going to "take over"... I'm just going to stop him beating his head on a brick wall without LETTING me help. He's still in charge. But I'm just as stubborn and hardheaded as he is... and his way of doing this isn't working anymore. ;)

The biggest concern is doing what is necessary to start the IV antibiotics to clear the infection. It's the infection that is the biggest threat at the moment. And it's not something he can just "live with". It's something that has to be addressed and if another surgery has to happen first, then so be it. Then maybe his idea of allowing a couple years to go by without any artificial devices is possible. It won't be, if the infection is allowed to continue.

ETA: I'll know more in about an hour.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 02, 2020, 09:54:48 AM: I'm
So
Relieved to see B is changing tactics....
YES!!
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 02, 2020, 10:10:52 AM: I am holding my breath for an hour.

MUCH comfort and hope,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 02, 2020, 10:12:55 AM: Another vote for him moving in with you sooner rather than later, Skep. And for what it's worth, my jaded, skeptical view of healthcare in general is that there's no money to be made out of healthy people, or out of people knowing how to look after themselves and just letting nature take it's course at times. Not suggesting that Buck can heal on his own, of course, but I'd lay money that being there with you will do him the power of good in more ways than one. Yep, I can see he might not like that feeling of relying on someone but it won't be forever and there's bound to come a time when you'll need to lean on him so it will level out. Fwiw I keep two synopses of my son's situation (as his notes run into thousands of pages); one that bullet points everything from the outset (a long doc but once the initial bit was set up I just added to it each time something major occurred) and one that bullet points the here and now situation. An awful lot of the information is repeated on various reports and assessments so the actual info needed gets kind of buried, which is a pain. So it could be a 'the night's are drawing in' activity supplemented with hot chocolate and biscuits :) And now my weird paperwork OCD is itching to come over there and sort it all out for you :) Lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 02, 2020, 10:25:36 AM: OH.... thanks for the offer Tupp and the vote of confidence!

I'm pretty good at that kind of distillation too. And I don't really dread it, because it helps my peace of mind to have a big picture, trends, and absolute bottom lines all defined. And I've been reading scientific/medical stuff for over a decade now.

There's more, but right now this is all a very active "work in progress" - and I have a list of other things to get to, too.

OH, one of the big changes around here, since building the Hut, is that for Hol to get an address, the county 911/GIS office wants to name my driveway and change my house number & street address... to be able to give Hol a house number/address. LOLOLOL. They calculate house numbers by exact tenths of a mile distance - and in this case, since there are two residences and my dirt road has been improved so much to allow for hut construction - they have to do this to stay consistent with their system. So far, I know what the road name will be; I should get the house numbers next Tues. That office tech only works 2 days a week. ;)

I don't know how long that's going to take, but we'll both have to change addresses for EVERYTHING. Most I think, can happen online (I hope). But that's going to depend on having a good cell signal.

Wheeeeeeeeee. 0 to 90 mph in less than a second.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 02, 2020, 01:18:11 PM: Damn!
Call 'em quick and ask if YOU can offer road name preferences!!

I love naming stuff, will drown you in unsolicited suggestions.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 02, 2020, 02:19:45 PM: Nope, I can't name it; already asked when I realized how long their proposed name was. The county system is based on historical place names; which I'm all for - I've read a good bit of the history of this place. And since it's really a "place name" instead of a road that goes somewhere... I think I like it. Covers all ~150 acres. I'll have to check Google Earth and see if my driveway name gets updated in a few months. LOLOLOL. Right now, they have my address shown as being on the other side of the ridge - which isn't surprising since GPS craps out right about there too. Hol says her phone app says you have to walk the rest of the way, from where our mailboxes are at the highway. LOLOLOL.

If you don't know what you're looking for as you're driving the highway - you'll completely miss my road (as it's called now) and since my new address won't be the same road and you won't be able to get to here EXCEPT via the first road - my fingers are crossed the post office will let me move the mailboxes the mile up the road to my driveway (will get marked private shortly). I'm not holding my breath though.

Guess I'll have to shop for a couple signs for my place. To keep the UPS/FedEx guys happy and my neighbors who often have to give directions to the delivery guys from having to explain "we're not who you're looking for, no matter what your GPS or Google says".
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 02, 2020, 10:06:22 PM: The Google maps lady once directed me straight into a Pennsylvania cornfield.

Not a joke.

:)
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 03, 2020, 07:36:10 AM: It's 10 years ago, now... but I rented a car at O'Hare to drive to my Dad's funeral and asked for a map. The last time I'd driven in Chicago was 10 more years before THAT. The agent just looked at me funny and asked if I wanted recreational attractions or restaurants/hotels... and I had to explain I wanted a roap map. They didn't have one anywhere in the office. I stopped at a gas station somewhere in Indiana and got one. Fortunately, my memory is such that the route numbers and landmarks were still in my head - even in a stressful, time sensitive situation (I couldn't get an earlier flight as I was vacationing at the beach when the call came) - I made it just fine. I had to change clothes when I got there.

I can drive from the beach to Michigan, without a map because the roads & exits are engraved on my memory. But I now ALWAYS pack my own current atlas. I still have my fear of getting lost or turned around in cities. Out in the boonies, I'm better off... and known the general compass direction I'm driving... and haven't been shy about stopping and asking directions if I'm that far off the beaten trail. I just take immense pleasure in knowing that there are still places that aren't identifiable by satellite or GPS coordinates around. I even have a star, constellation identifier that doesn't work here - because it can't verify my GPS location. LOLOLOL.

That's how you know you're really in the boonies. :D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 03, 2020, 10:05:17 AM: Boonie Girl,

With you on all that, and hooray for real maps!
I enjoy them less these days because of glasses-switching, but that's because I've been relying on varying drugstore readers for too long. I definitely need a proper prescription. Coming back home last night I missed an exit and had a nice long detour. Finally faced facts...I MUST have prescription glasses for driving. Things are just getting fuzzy in the dark. Damn, I'll have to break my winning streak of not going indoors anywhere.

One thing I feel compelled to add to the B saga, even though it's not really necessary. I just want to pipe up for docs who really are in it for the right reasons. We've all met burned-out or indifferent medicos, but there are also many who do it because they care about people and want to relieve pain and cure disease. I think an overwhelmed, underfunded system that doesn't support them and reduces them to paper pushers (keyboard clickers) has changed things for patients but I don't believe most docs are bad or indifferent people. I'm terribly sorry B has dealt with poor medicine and medical errors so much. To live in such pain really grates on the spirit.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 03, 2020, 12:25:29 PM: Agreed on the docs, Hops. I know some fine ones. This complaint isn't against docs/nurses (who did everything in their power to help him over the last 4 years)... it is TOTALLY against the system that has been made rediculously cumbersome and complex. I laugh maniacally at times, at how the patient record database is essentially useless despite the massive financial investments and time it took to get it up & running when the humans don't bother looking at it and READING it. Of course, most of 'em are under pressure to get a patient in/out in 15 minutes or less. As if that's good medical practice. :rolling eyes so far I'm looking out my rear end: (I wonder if rolling my eyes that far would help stop the cataracts I seem to be developing?)

Now that he's home, he's following his own healing protocols. Figure a week at most, before he tries to get back "at it" again, knowing him. Meanwhile I've asked him to think long and hard about just what absolutely has to be done - and what he's willing to let go - to get here and have some support and the possibility of finishing up getting him physically ready to be well. And to please be flexible about taking things one day at a time, and not sticking to any original plan or goal... IF the situation warrants an adjustment in "timeline, how, goals met".

This is going to cost me a whole batch of oatmeal raisin cookies, with some molasses/spice cookies for good measure.

He drives a hard bargain. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 03, 2020, 12:34:13 PM: Quote
:rolling eyes so far I'm looking out my rear end:

Amen and amen! And you're absolutely right, it's an inefficient, underfunded system that reflects America's terrible drift toward profits over people, over and over again. It bugs me most in education but B's story is an outrageous example of getting caught in the maw of all that.

I am SO glad you're going to help him step aside. If anybody could be an ally and supporter to someone going through this kind of battle, it's Amber the Amazon.

B is a lucky man, and I hope he'll get to the mountain soon.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 03, 2020, 01:30:20 PM: Thanks Hops - I know he's workin' on it. 3 days post-op and he's back on light duty. Picking up meds, misc errands, moving around so he doesn't sit & get stiff - or have nothing to do but pay attention to the minute shades (and not so minute) of pain.

I am still sorting/organizing in the kitchen & dining room. Visually, it's just too busy for me to look at. So I'm making another pass at the "ticky tacky" stuff; stuff I rarely use (do I really need a butane torch for creme brulee?? hmmmm. I guess that depends on if I'm going to keep trying to make it, huh?) My canisters are breeding; I have 3 kinds of rice, bulgur, couscous, flour- sugar- etc ad excessium.

Once upon a time - B.H. (before Hol) - I had things pretty well organized and ready for kitchen business. She had other ideas - and since she was cooking and baking too - I "gave way". And I wasn't even at the point then, where I was asking myself: why on earth did I keep that?! Ingredients got stashed where ever there was room, instead of refilling vacumn canisters... so the cupboards are so full, I can't quickly take inventory on what to shop for. And I do believe there is at least one cabinet I want to change - it's too deep for canned goods and things get lost in the back of the shelf.... et voila... idea of a better solution popped into my head - door needs to be on the long dimension.

I have all the crazy colors of beach-vibe old linens that I brought with me, and was changing color schemes of things gradually... and so it's all a mish-mosh, looks cluttered & "busy"... and it bothers my OCD. I could/should be doing other more "important" things... but THIS is what I want to do and what I'm doing.

So there. :P
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 03, 2020, 04:30:40 PM: You GO, Amber.

Immerse yourself fully in what you're doing.

You'll get to the other stuff soon enough.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 05, 2020, 05:16:44 PM: Well, I had to take a break and dive into number crunching for the business. It's a pretty scary scenario - and I gave into panic & anxiety a bit. I find if I allow that to run free, and exhaust itself (usually less than 24 hrs) then my head clears and I'm able to make the decisions - or at least recommendations for a group decision - that need made.

For more than 5 years, we've been hoping that X event passing would lead things to improve. Beginning in March of this year - thank you virus - every month, we've watched sales slide as any large projects that would involve our tools has been shelved because of the insanely high level of anxiety & uncertainty everyone everywhere is feeling. Especially in business - no one is taking any risks whatsoever. Can't say I blame 'em -- but it hurts our sales.

There is absolutely no indication that the 30% contraction in our sales market is temporary at this point. Which means it very well could be permanent -- setting us back to net income levels more consistent with 2009, when brother & I took over the company. Which means all of us are going to have to tighten our belts & budgets. Thankfully, most of the Hut expenses are done. And I worry most for the shop employees as they're getting older, and price inflation has shot up this year, especially in groceries. So I have to find a way to get them involved in the decision making process, letting them choose what suits them the best... to reduce our expenses. (Personnel & benefits are our biggest expense true; - more this year will shift to medicare as their primary health insurance but I also don't want to lose their knowledge/skills either, but perhaps making them just look elsewhere. Then, there's the need to bring in younger people and get them acclimated and trained.)

I've gotten Hol involved to brainstorm ideas, so far. This moves to the Board of Directors (myself, brother & guy in charge) soon. Borrowing money is the absolute LAST thing on the options list; and I will continue to avoid that any way I possibly can. Fortunately, the guys welding in their home shops or garages have increased to be about a third of our sales - they're taking on side jobs many of them and helping keep tractors, farm equipment and heavy equipment operational.

I am convinced that no matter the election results - there isn't going to be an end to this risk averseness in the business community. I don't KNOW, but would love to think that this is as low as things will go - but I ain't betting the farm on that. So, we'll see what happens. How we might be able to adapt/reorganize to live with lower sales.

Meanwhile, Stinkerbell I noticed, is growing tomcat equipment. It's all as tiny and dainty as he is right now. LOL. But perhaps that's why Freddy has taken on training the little stinker. He'll be tired tonight; Hol took all the kittens in for shots and to get Mama fixed. Gracie has had 3 litters just this year. It's a kindness to the cat, even if she is a good mama.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 05, 2020, 07:57:29 PM: Oh Jeez, Amber. Good thing you have strong arms to carry that heavy plate...

Covid Not Enough?
Ailing lover not enough?
Now...the business?

YET. You are rational and calm and capable. I think if your employees knew how much you were thinking of them, in their life situations, right now, they'd be grateful. I'm very sorry.

I know you'll do the very best you can by them, and tighten your own belts without too much angst. It is a good thing you've gotten so much done on the mountain already. Anything more is icing on a cake.

If frugality and self-reliance have to kick in, I can't think of anyone better suited.

I hope things turn around enough to keep the ship afloat, or at least with enough sales coming in to keep the doors open.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 06, 2020, 07:57:32 AM: The whole thing is sort of a balancing act. And nothing is consistent month to month; year to year. It truly is my fault that I while I have been paying attention, I HAVEN'T paid close attention to how close to the edge things were getting. So much so, that our usual comfy "cushion" just isn't there anymore.

When the bookkeeper alerted me back in March... I started paying much closer attention but still didn't do a deep dive. Everything would be OK; it always has been. :rolleyes: Over the summer, I started tracking things closely... and coming up with options for balancing the situation. It's not like I hadn't predicted the current major imbalance years ago. But surely - surely - this was just a temporary situation, right? After all, even before the last election we were already talking about this and still believing that there was positive change just over the horizon....

I think I'm ready to change the Benegesserit prayer to: "Hope is the mind-killer".

It's not that I, or even we, did absolutely nothing to make small adjustments. It's getting to the point that for all intents & purposes, no one wanted to believe that this wasn't temporary. That it was permanent. And the few really "hot sales" years were the aberration. (Money people constantly sell the illusion that "growth is always infinite"; total P.T. Barnum hucksterism. Last time I talked to my guys, they were asking ME for advice/crystal ball predictions. LOL.)

So, facing the pit of the stomach fear is kinda my way of kicking myself. Head on; worst-case scenario. GO THERE. Have all the feelings, the absurd thoughts, get it out of my system. Rest, sleep, do the mundane stuff I do around the house to "make order" from chaos.... And then approach the problem again. Today I have one question to ask the bookkeeper... and then I'm ready to present the full slate of options along with my recommendations and how quickly to implement them.

I ain't giving up without a fight. ;) Business is SIMPLE. Or it should be. And once more people remember that, and this entropic mess that exists in our economy is finally decentralized again... (no, bigger isn't always better; just like growth isn't infinite) then certainty and predictability (or what can exist within reality) can return again, and people will take calculated, prepared risks again. And yes, the economy will start to grow - on a more solid foundation. The REAL economy - not this monopolistic, financialized, crony-capitalist wall st. thing that is some Frankenstein's monster.

I need to have a conversation with Buck. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 06, 2020, 05:39:17 PM: Amber, I truly hear your sorrow for not having anticipated all this or not having tracked it very closely while you were preoccupied with the mountain.

I'm sure you and your brother are not the first employers to feel caught off guard by how bad things can get, with all the losses of jobs and health coverage, etc., that might possibly come with it. I'm sorry you and your employees are in this boat but guilt won't help.... It's the corporate sociopaths who discard 'em without a thought we don't need---folks like you who face the pain and also the responsibility are the good 'uns.

Trot out that amazing executive function and you'll make the best that you can now of a bad situation. I'm sure it feels awful but it's your role in this horrid time. You'll do it better than most and with empathy and a functioning conscience, that's very clear.

Good on you! Be kind to yourself while you work through it. I hope you and your brother find solidarity in the tasks.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 07, 2020, 09:14:10 AM: Sunday was my day to immerse in the "horror of the situation" Hops. By noon, Monday... I knew what I needed to know be as informed as I could be with actual data. The rest of this situation requires ye olde crystal ball... intuition... some dusty, dry, reports reading... and digging down into trades literature... and maybe even throwing the i-ching.

By Monday, I need a building permit for the metal shop and final decisions on construction. Materials availability is starting to become a factor. Then there is the actual work I'm trying to do/get done before the snow flies. So, quick construction is a plus. That is also making it difficult to estimate jobs. I need to follow up on a couple of rent-a-men this week for a couple smaller jobs as it is.

Organized as much as I can be; pulling in favors where I can; scrambling and juggling. Good news is contractor's excavator is here; finishing Hol's pond. Top soil from that is gonna get used for raised beds and landscaping around the hut. A pad will get leveled for her garage - freeing up the garage under my studio again, for MY tools.

The weather is cooperating today... for me to take care of aesthetics (read: cleaning) the front porch which hasn't been in 2 years due to constant use and mess... and I can no longer STAND it. This one gets done before I work downstairs on the wood storage and the bit of garden I have going.

All this frantic work... is because obstacles, priorities, indecision on various people's parts and reality/weather earlier in the year. And it means I'm going through millernery wardrobe changes several times a day. But at least I'm not getting caught up in the constantly ratcheting up volume & cacaphony of the news...

I need these little breaks, to reflect on what's been accomplished; where I'm at in the timeline; what else needs to be dealt with that has slipped through the cracks of attention, when it's stretched thin. (Those are the things that'll keep me awake into the wee hours. OCD.) And I can keep going until I hit the wall. Buck can make me stop before I get to that point... but right now, he is doing the same thing where he is at, to get here. But in a few weeks, he will be here again.

So.... don't worry about me if there's more time between posts. I'm trying to squeeze every possible thing into the remaining weeks before cold weather sets in... and I'm running out of time. I'm good at this; as long as I know it has an endpoint... and I can go back to being rip van winkle this winter. Sit by the fire, drink tea... and snuggle my stray tomcats... of which, Buck is pack leader. LOLOLOL. Make cookies.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 07, 2020, 11:06:10 AM: I'm sorry you've got all this other stuff to deal with as well now, Skep. I'm glad you've got Buck there - by phone at the minute, hopefully really there before too much longer. Business stuff is way over my head so I've nothing useful to suggest but I really hope that there is/will be some way you can weather the storm, even if it means some things need to change or it all looks a bit different once you come out the other side. In all honesty I don't think anyone really saw this as being a long term thing - I think most of us thought it was a bit of a rough patch that would right itself one way or another. Although numbers are high here, it doesn't seem to be doing as much damage as it was and most businesses here are getting by in their various ways so I hope the same happens over there soon as well x
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 07, 2020, 08:00:06 PM: Keep us posted with short summaries as you can, Amber...
be thinking of you.

We (I) don't need every nut and bolt of the plans but would love to know you're okay. Just the headlines.

And ignore that if you need a total break for a while, it happens! (I just have separation anxiety, LOL.)

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 08, 2020, 08:15:50 AM: Tupp, the duration of this situation is the crux of the issue. There is one imbalance that kinda snuck up on us, over the years. And then there's the fact that sales have slowed down a lot longer than we even knew there was a virus in the "wild". Yesterday was wild... to put it mildly.

But, before lunch I found 5 errors in the data in the accounting system... started the process to build B's shop... and helped out Hol with fancy dinner preps when I asked for her help filing my papers into some kind of order (it was done before she showed up... LOL) and regaling her with the details of the finances. I wrote notes on the reports, so if at some time in the future she's having to do the same thing, she has some explanations and the history.

Then, I started hosing off my porch before it turns chilly again.

Yeah, I went to bed early and if it weren't for Stinker... would've slept like a rock. Today is run to the stores, mail B's cookies, maybe stop at the permit office... and tomorrow run the other direction.

B says he will likely be here for the full blue moon on Halloween; and Hol is having some friends over for a bonfire, too. Some day, I'll clean house... LOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 08, 2020, 10:18:41 AM: The full blue moon....
🎃
B at the bonfire with Amber.

That all sounds really good: )
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 08, 2020, 11:02:53 AM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on October 08, 2020, 08:15:50 AM
Tupp, the duration of this situation is the crux of the issue. There is one imbalance that kinda snuck up on us, over the years. And then there's the fact that sales have slowed down a lot longer than we even knew there was a virus in the "wild". Yesterday was wild... to put it mildly.

But, before lunch I found 5 errors in the data in the accounting system... started the process to build B's shop... and helped out Hol with fancy dinner preps when I asked for her help filing my papers into some kind of order (it was done before she showed up... LOL) and regaling her with the details of the finances. I wrote notes on the reports, so if at some time in the future she's having to do the same thing, she has some explanations and the history.

Then, I started hosing off my porch before it turns chilly again.

Yeah, I went to bed early and if it weren't for Stinker... would've slept like a rock. Today is run to the stores, mail B's cookies, maybe stop at the permit office... and tomorrow run the other direction.

B says he will likely be here for the full blue moon on Halloween; and Hol is having some friends over for a bonfire, too. Some day, I'll clean house... LOL.

The house dust can wait, Skep, it won't go anywhere! You sound like you've got plenty else going on at the moment. I'm glad Buck will be there soon. I think the scale of the pandemic and the fallout from it has caught everyone by surprise. I think we're all used to being able to fix problems in some way or other and it baffles me that in this time of technology, science and medicine we've seen the most advanced countries in the world buckle and collapse so quickly. I certainly thought it would all be over by now and I know I'm not the only one. I hope there are some options for you going forward xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 10, 2020, 09:12:23 AM: Sigh. I'm tired.

SOME of the business panic has died down again. Knowing how frustratingly maddening trusting technology can be - I keep hard copies of all the important reports. The dining room table serves to lay everything out to the same page - for the last five years. A number that should've been consistent every year, wasn't. (My brain has the oddity in it's wiring, of being able to shift from the "meaning" of the number to simply seeing the numbers as objects within a larger pattern.) So I got the teacher's red pen out... and in going through those previous year's reports found a handful of my own notes from the last time we reduced the dividend. Sometimes it's hard even for me to decipher my own chicken scribbles... but what stood out for me, was quite significant.

The purported alarm was over two numbers that would imply disaster, if that one little note wasn't part of the equation. The big number was deducted ALREADY from income; and the little number - while successively shrinking over the years - was what was left over after all the accounting was accounted for. But it's still a positive number. The alarm was created, based on the opposite understanding.

I had to remind my bookkeeper of that; letting her know I had it in my notes... while I was learning to read these reports. We also addressed the discrepency in the number that should've been the same every year - and she knows what mistake happened. We laughed about it some... but I sure am glad I took bookkeeping in HS. And worked with databases. And did the troubleshooting on database and web application software. I had an uncanny knack for letting my intuition sniff out where the problem was - or what didn't "look right". It was hard to shift back into that mindset after 10 years away from it... especially in the middle of a major panic attack; the alarm that was created was akin to an immediate life/death survival struggle -- because the implied message she was giving me was that the business was essentially bankrupt. And that was so far from what I knew to be true - because I've been keeping a close eye on these reports since Easter, when she started dropping hints about this. There was NO WAY I missed an implication that huge - unless I'd really gone around the bend.

Turns out I didn't. And this whole thing might have been motivated by attention-seeking. (While real errors were allowed to persist and would eventually snowball into a total mess.) She wanted to tell me she decided to retire next spring. She's 78; learned the new software - with grumbling & difficulty, but did it and that's a serious accomplishment - and because I'm not even in the same state, and am trying to just have my own life after all these years - that also creates the impression that I don't care. But that's why I have a "guy in charge" on site, day in and day out... and the top 3-4 people in the office/shop to handle the mundane affairs. The guy in charge is on vacation for 3 weeks. And the last time he took an extended vacation, this same kind of thing happened with her.

I could spend the time to try to analyze this situation, change my behaviors somewhat - but to what purpose? My motto has always been to be friendly with the employees - but NOT friends. Just like in this situation, if I had to make hard decisions about reorganizing the business or downsizing it... I couldn't afford to be friends with some of the employees and still be fair & objective. Not without putting myself through even more agony.

The best thing for me to do when blasted with adrenalin like earlier in the week, is some physical task that requires paying attention (like washing dishes) but doesn't tax my brain. So my porch is cleaned off now and re-arranged for winter. Today's job is going to be string trimming. I've been going to sleep reasonably early, and carving out that early morning quiet time for myself again.

Hol's dropped in on a daily basis; usually mid-morning coffee and coordinating the day's activities. Sometimes longer. One of her girlfriends is coming out this afternoon; maybe an overnight. Hol spent a whole day trying to get the wood splitter running. Frustrated beyond belief, she was. She had all but taken the carbuerator apart. And one of the guys working here took a look at it for her. Exhaust pipe plugged up by mud dauber wasps. She would not have welcomed my getting involved; didn't want that at all. Resented me asking Buck about it too. But she is coming to appreciate why mom wants the important equipment under shelter when not in use. Why I want things grouped together by use. Tools cleaned & put back - and I'll settle for just put back.

Buck is making plans to get here end of the month; another week long visit. He has a couple more medical appts coming up; at this point he's pretty sure the hospital is going to just release him from care; completely. Which suits him FINE. There is left over stuff that is still problematic for him, going forward. But he really doesn't want them to deal with it. Still nothing from the Navy.

I told him last night, I was hoping this trip would be the last. And of course, these dates aren't completely written in stone either. There is always SOMETHING that comes up that creates a delay. Something important enough to stay there and deal with. I can't help being disappointed at this point. And that's even after I've determined to just continue on "doing" what I need to do here, and deal with that... and not let myself depend on the happy energy created when he's around, to "do" or to sit around & mope because it's going to be longer than I thought till the next, or even last time... when he'll just "be here". I'm even forgetting to carry the phone around with me... while I just do what I'm doing in my own space. This is getting tedious for me in a superficial, ego way.

It doesn't feel like I'm changing my mind about the commitment; my feelings for him haven't changed; but I also don't feel like pining away for something that isn't going to - or can't happen - within the timeframe we tentatively agreed to. I could just be tired, too. Some of the "shiny" is wearing off in this phase of surfing the waves. Patience, my ass. I've been taking care of myself long enough - and taking care of how many others? to greater or lesser degrees - that I'm just fine. The only thing I want - that I can't do for myself - is have someone else take care of me sometimes. (Yeah, my mom called again yesterday. Same shit, different day. Once again an hour's tirade on how ill-used she is... and no interest in me, my life, or taking care of me. She doesn't even bring up Buck; and I know I told her. The universe sometimes puts up neon signs with stuff we need to pay attention to.)

I have some easy ideas of what I might do to perk myself up a little bit.

It's going to rain the next couple days, so if I hope to have another task done in prep for next week, I must needs plod on.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 10, 2020, 10:11:17 AM: Tired is understandable, Skep. I'm glad the business situation isn't looking as bad as it seemed to be, but it's tiring when you have to keep on top of things yourself even when other people are involved in doing the job. There is a lot to be said for old school methods of bits of paper spread out and checking it line by line - I've done it loads with my son's stuff over the years and it's amazing how one small mistake (genuine error) one sheet can spread and create a completely different story. Good to be able to check it.

I agree, pining for Buck won't make things happen any faster. He'll be there when he's there, hopefully sooner rather than later, but it's out of your hands so keeping active and getting on with things makes sense to me. It's a shame your mum can't be a little bit more supportive. Even just a tiny bit can mean a lot. I'm hoping you can maybe sleep a bit easier now you know the business situation isn't as dire as it seemed and that the better sleep will help you feel better xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 10, 2020, 10:13:47 AM: You sound very relieved, Amber. The book keeper's attention seeking was....
meant to panic you? You think? Sounds exhausting to me.....not acceptable. If I weren't so wrung out, I'd rant with more gusto on your behalf.

I'm hoping B makes it to the farm this month. Until then, business as usual. Enjoy the weather, your farm and tasks at hand : )
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 10, 2020, 10:35:20 AM: I wonder if a new, PT bookkeeper-in-training (a whiz) could be hired now, to work alongside soon-retired woman? With understanding that this provisional PT position would go FT upon her retirement if all checks out and it goes well? Just a thot.

I don't blame you about B. I'd be disappointed too. Is there a shred of concern that he's foot dragging or is it purely the load of things he's got to sort out? I forget what they all are but recall first it was getting his D off to college, and next was selling his house? Not sure I've remembered it right.

If D is sent home due to covid, can she live there independently? Maybe he's not selling his house until he's sure about that?

Damn. I get it. But love your reaction, which is to carry on inside YOUR life while you ponder and figure it out. I Like the idea of you not being glued to your phone either, since I've always felt that texting isn't relating even though it gives that illusion and dopamine hits. Phone calls give real connection though, and feel more adult. (Translation: feel more geezer, like myself).

Frustrated for you, admiring your coping. How about a huge cozy nap in the new bedroom today, or just some lolling time and maybe journaling? Pros and Cons of this or that?

hugs and comfort,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 11, 2020, 10:47:30 AM: Hey Lighter...

the weird thing about my situation is I'm 2 days away from where the business is located. MOST of the time, since people have been there so long, everything runs smoothly. And anything that comes up can be handled by the guy in charge, since he's been there so long. I can trust his judgement; I've only had occasion to question him or propose alternatives one time... and in the end, his instinct was right anyway.

Guy in charge is on vacation till the end of the month. Thinking back... this attention-seeking behavior has raised it's head more than once. Sometimes it was difficulties with another employee; sometimes it was creating a "problem" out of thin air. I LIKE her. I really do. And she knows I consider her the "memory" of the company... and trust her. It's game-playing, pure and simple. Pecking order rivalry stuff. It happens in group dynamics. USUALLLY, it's nothing serious; harmless. But it's always dramatized to be.

People who are compulsive game-players will assume that everyone thinks the same way they do... and are up to the same mind tricks. For some people, that's the only group dynamics they know; have been around. If shown another way... a bit of enlightenment occurs. If the group leader is aware of this tactic within the pecking order, and enforces some rules to circumvent the motivation for it in the first place... most of it can be avoided. But that strategy requires a secondary effort too - with individual and personal attention to each person; actual caring. And given the distance I am from the company - and the demands/activities in the rest of my life - I'm not so good at that second part. Team leadership 101 requires the leader put forth as much time & effort as everyone else. No one gets to just sit around and say I want... you do.... and point.

So in a way, it was a harmless - but terrifying - wake up call for me. She usually goes to my brother. Having spent his life as a team coach, he's really much better at Part 2 than I am. And then my brother will say something to me.

Yes, Hops. The wise thing to do is hire someone on before she retires so that the stream of workflow in the office stays continuous and doesn't bog down while someone tries to figure things out. We've talked for at least 5 years about hiring/training someone new and younger for each position so people can retire knowing they haven't left us scrambling. (Loyalty is that high in some cases.) When guy in charge comes back from vacation, we'll review the job description and update it... and start the search. I almost expect the outgoing BKeeper to be real prickly about the incoming... but that's because outgoing & I both date back to the green ledger sheets and hand calculations. No one CAN replace her... but perhaps we can find someone who's more expert with the software, has a solid acounting background (not just bookkeeping) and can easily learn the intricacies of our cobbled together system. And then we have a retirement party to plan. :D

Buck heard me about the disappointment, and the waning patience on my part. Plans have firmed up for the end of October trip. It just won't be the last trip, like I'd hoped. He is bringing a truck/trailer load. Despite him enjoying projecting the gung-ho, git R done, move fast image... the fact is, a large and significant portion of his life is all closing at once. Albeit, at different rates of momentum. That's a lot to process - mentally and emotionally. And unless he's really called to rush it from within himself... it's going to take time. When it feels "time" to him... it's time. I'm a little different, in that I do my deciding, waffling, second-guessing and most of my beating myself up BEFORE I decide to take action and what action I'll take.

But once I decide, then I release the process of HOW it happens in the interest of making it happen... understanding that there will some things that are difficult, not to my standards, and "expedient" over "how it should be" all along the way. It's full steam ahead... damn the torpedos... LOLOLOL.

He keeps a lot of that processing over the past private. We've talked enough about it, that I understand, or think I do. I don't have curiosity about going deeper. At least, not in a "gory detail" way. Like most people, something will nudge a memory... and he tells me the story of what happened.

So, the knowledge that the road trip is "on" now; coming up; put him in a playful mood. Which makes me smile and want to play too. I realized he and I really do play well together. We like doing a lot of the same things - not just talking about them, dreaming about them, but actually getting out there and DOING them. It takes me a "buddy" to do things with, to go do a lot of things. I'm not thrilled about doing things on my own, although I have done. We also work well together... even given our differences in how we work. And doing things together is how we learn more about each other. I know how incredibly patient he can be... and how easily frustrated he can get too over certain things too. He's discovered that I'm not a cringing, wringing my hands type of female. I'll dive right into mud or dirt and do what needs doing... even if I don't want to. And sometimes I have to psych myself up to that, depending on the situation. He knows for a fact that I can use tools - but the deeper mechanical knowledge of things is still not high on my list of learning priorities. That's changing, lately. But that's because he's a master at those trades and is a patient teacher.

At 64, finishing up and closing out all the past major parts of one's life... and how/why X Y Z happened... and all the thoughts/emotions about it... only to jump off the cliff and start something brand-new, that gets him back to where he started; aspects of HOME... the closing of a full circle... is a freakin' big huge life deal for him. It's even a test of how much he's learned about himself; how he interacts with people... and yet it's all new. I had the same sense; that both of us know our roles so well; they're second nature - but we're not locked into them. There is still more to explore, discover, and learn... but it's much more fun to do so with a buddy. :D

Yes, there's love. In all it's permutations & silliness sometimes. An appreciation of who the other IS. How we're stronger and deeper together, than separate. Somehow, we're both past wanting to force things into some kind of pre-determined pattern of relationship. It's awkward & confusing sometimes. But that's where the mutual respect comes in... and we can enjoy our differences. I think we both sense that when he's permanently here, is when things will really begin. And we're taking our own sweet time doing the survey of how the "land lies" first... and checking in with ourselves to make sure this is doable; we still want to do this. Delaying the moment of no return... even though this isn't going to be a legally binding relationship. At least, not right now. We both have valid reasons for why we'd rather not do that.

He keeps saying he's simple to operate - feed him, give him something to do, help him sleep. But simple is often very profound. And he may be extremely self-deprecating, but some of the rest of us, are extremely observant and highly intuitive... able to sense what is non-verbal. And able to separate out projections from self, from what is sensed. Much of what passes between he and I that is significant, involves no talking whatsoever. But we DO communicate pretty well verbally, too. Still learning some idiosyncrasies there... but it's not challenging.

I don't think he's seen actual snow for a long time. The pretty leaves are starting to drop from the trees now... and it won't be much longer.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 12, 2020, 10:25:32 AM: I've been sleeping; a soft steady rain has contributed to a serious depth to that sleep. And serious dreaming. Lots of processing going on in those dreams. There was a long complex one about Ex #2. Last night's was a different topic and I knew what it was before I made coffee. But there is no point in trying to remember or analyze either of those - or any of that kind of dream making it's way into consciousness.

These are kinda like emotional adjustments taking place below the surface. Something minor; but a necessary tweak - like during a massage when just the right knot relaxes to bring a better balance to chi flow. It means I'm waking up more rested than usual; less scattered or anxious;

There isn't a lot going through my head right now. I decided to give the business stuff a real rest for a bit and will go back to it later, when the fright I had is more distant in memory. There are lots of other things I can do today, tomorrow and consecutive days that will help me keep things more in balance when I get back to the paperwork.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 15, 2020, 02:50:24 AM: You sound a lot more peaceful, Amber...
as though that gentle rain and deep sleep refreshed you at a level you haven't gotten to restore in a while.

I hope that more hope and comfort join hands and walk on in to hang out with you.
Soon! And staying!

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 15, 2020, 08:29:09 AM: Still plugging away on numbers, looking how I can make things balance. June was our worst month; things have gotten a little better since then. Personnel costs became a greater percentage of sales this year - too high a percentage, actually - due to how far sales have fallen. I've spent YEARS trying to figure out what the deal is there; I am aware of patent violations by the Chinese (it's a real thing)... but to prosecute that would cause us to go broke anyway. Unless something happens at the National level - like a class action suit - we could sign on to.

I'm mostly focused on finding things I can cut expense wise - that are reversible; without laying anyone off or cutting hours. On the off chance, the sales picture improves. It's not something that's specific to my company, how we do things or how it's run. Business activity - in our area of the market - is just that slow. We've been aware for years, that our personnel costs were increasing. Some of that is healthcare - and we have room to cut there, without doing to much damage; it's quite generous at the moment. Some of that is payroll increases too.

Once I put out the immediate fire, then I have to look at whether this economic slowdown is as permanent as I believe it is. From all I've seen so far - and a lot of that kind of information is evaporating from the 'net - the whole world is going through an economic contraction to rival or surpass the Great Depression. Now, that wasn't the end of the world - or even companies. But it did hurt an awful lot of people. Severely.

To make the best decision for the future, I've got to delve into a lot of stuff that's foreign to me; process it; strip out the BS happy talk; look at hard facts - if there are indeed any hard facts published anymore anywhere (even the gov numbers have been tweaked to present a more positive picture)... the old canard about statistics is very very true, IMO. Even Mike would tell me he could make the numbers say anything he wanted.

I've accepted this. As best a person can, I guess. I've not been one to look at reality as I WISH it would be, or how it ideally could (even being a romantic)... I can only chart my course based on WHAT IS. That means rooting out all the tendency to denial, blindspots, and being ruthless with myself.

Buck is giving me space for this. But I think after today, I'm pulling him back in close. This situation affects all of us. Hol is facing the fact that there might not be any work in film, even next year. She mentioned yesterday that Burger King is hiring. Yeah, she's way overqualified. And speak o' the devil... here she is. Planning our day commences.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 15, 2020, 12:08:27 PM: Amber, this sounds like a heavy task. Very heavy.
I'm awed by your calm and your capability (including commitment to reality).

I agree with you about a worldwide depression being likely. How could it not be, given the pandemic's impact? The ripple effects will hit everyone. Already are hitting so many.

I hope you can save your business. What's your brother's take on all this?

I am cleverly comparing this with my joist problems. One pushy plumber, one unvetted contractor, and a negative cascade could easily begin. (Hoping it won't be as bad as all that but facing that it's possible.) I feel vulnerable and imagine you do too, in a different way.

Glad you're okay, farm's okay. Alarming that Hol may need to work in fast food. I hope you're not supporting her forever but assume you're ready to if you must.

I hope Buck can arrive soon to give you moral support through all of it. I hope he's hearing that the time to be all in has arrived, and that he can work through his farewells to previous chapter with more dispatch.

You seem to thrive when challenged in large and complex ways. I hope it won't tax you so much that self-care takes a hit, eh? Be extra good to yourself now....

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 15, 2020, 01:20:52 PM: LOLOLOLOLOL.

I seem to cyclically have these kinds of things to deal with Hops. It ain't intentional and I don't court these kinds of things for the drama-effect, to feel sorry for myself, or from self-sabotage. After I found myself in the co-owner position, and having to make financial decisions way above my paygrade... I dove in and spent about 2 years both in intensive reading/hands-on decision making -- and taking on more responsibility at a higher level than I'd ever WANTED. I figure it was my version of an MBA. (Self-didact here.) That all started 11 years ago.

I've had to eat crow; deal with conflicts; resolve very sensitive/delicate situations... hone my diplomatic skills; expand my communication ability; and meet other people's expectations of what I was supposed to be like - in a way, that was just me. It comes with the job description; it's why I make the big bucks.

But, to be perfectly honest, after Mike died and I moved a year later - I allowed myself to put that down; on the back burner... let it run itself. So I could explore what I might do here at the farm. (And hasnt THAT been a roller-coaster 4 years?) And no, my brother didn't step up into that role much more - even after he left his coaching job. He understood what I've said about the situation we're in; agrees with my overall goals of what we need to do - and he's just as partial as I am to find a way to make this work without cutting hours or laying anyone off. So we're on the same page. I just don't think he can even go as deep as I do, into the financials or do that kind of analysis. So, OK; he's better at people skills. That works. Right now, I've distilled things down to 3 options that can perhaps tide us over... and still leaves room for more downsizing, if called for. Flexibility is always my over-ruling strategy. I hate being trapped.

I've had my moments of full-on panic attack; I've experienced the full picture of worst-case scenario; all without reacting or making a hasty decision. I knew the homework part had to be part of the process - and I break up the tedium with other kinds of things to do. I'm OK with it. I've always understood that money can go just as fast as it can come in to someone's life. This isn't QUITE that drastic; as scary as it is.

But I think I'd rather brush-clear or move rocks than use this kind of energy on this kind of task. Blech. I can't even blame myself for needing/wanting to put this down for a time. With all the change I was processing after Mike, I simply didn't have the extra brain capacity to nitpick things to death. (Not like anyone else was keeping that close an eye on it either.) And I don't even CARE that it's falling to me now. It just needs to be done.

As trite as it is, Buck said the one thing I most needed to hear: You'll make the right decision and do what's right.

And when I wind down for the night, I don't think about this. I've carved my head space up into compartments so that I don't spend any more time than I have to or want to on stuff. I always make time for me and what I want to do, these days. No one else works longer than 9-5; I ain't gonna either.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 16, 2020, 08:11:56 AM: Ah, brave words.

Brother called me yesterday evening. Attempting to steamroll me into "his way or the highway" - even tho the actual decisions he was pushing, were what I'd said we HAVE to do, to have any chance at surviving. I simply agreed with him, and left it go at the cordial stage - albeit, with some expression of how all this is making me FEEL. He didn't care to hear that; he did anyway. I'm not so sure he heard me, when I expressed my fear of not doing ENOUGH to succeed at this point - doing more later may just be throwing more good money after bad and not accepting the writing on the wall. Won't know until the end of the month comes out; or for sure till the end of the year.

All in all, it wasn't a bad conversation except for me realizing a few things - or perceiving them. He seemed to anticipate pushback and resistance, even while he was agreeing with my top recommendations. I had no desire to offer any. Just additional information I wasn't willing to put in an email. I expected some kind of reassurance at expressing how serious I see the problems are; the lack of possibility of solutions (barring some miracle); and just general kindness, I guess. After all - I was the one banging my head through the numbers buried in years of paperwork. Trying to get a handle on the big picture and work down into the absolute truth of the situation. While he was on vacation. So, that part hasn't changed a bit. I'm pretty sure he's in denial about what dire straits we face. I get the feeling that if I put in the extra time to build spreadsheets or make pretty, illustrative graphs - the reaction would be the same. Or perhaps he's one of those people who feels like nothing matters enough to shake his reality, I dunno. I can't presume to know... just intuitive sensing I have about his reaction.

And I feel alone. Lonely; in my apprehension of the situation. Again. Buck listens. Hol listens. They both HEAR me too. Even when they don't have anything helpful to suggest or reassuring to proffer - at least I know I'm not alone. You guys listen too. And that helps, truly. Hol is involved in finding out her Dad broke a hip and had surgery yesterday. Buck had his staples out from his surgery and before he got home, had to stop and get dissolving sutures put in to stop the incisions from separating and bleeding. Just a normal day, in his experience with that hospital.

I can deal with the feeling alone; been here before. I can deal with the bitter reality of helplessness that exists, at finding an effective solution WITHOUT affecting the employees, at this time. I did warn Bro, that it's going to be necessary to make adjustments there too to some extent; I don't know what extent yet - that depends on sales and some corrections in the accounting software data. But I'm pretty disappointed at having my feelings about trying to protect the employees dismissed and unacknowledged; unrecognized even - while implications of the total opposite were being brought up. I do recognize, that Bro owns those implications and he was projecting.

There are a couple things I have to do this morning. Immediate action. And then, the paperwork goes in a pile and I close that place in my mind - to go do other things this weekend. It's 10 days till Buck arrives. And my friend Deb is talking about at least an overnight respite a couple weeks after that. IF she can arrange care for her mom that long. This is so heavy, it's even hard for me to be happy that Buck's coming back again. My tendency is to try to protect him from how I'm feeling; not dump it all out on him - it's not his problem. I'm cocooning and trying to shift into looking at the impacts of this change of income on my personal situation.

I know the heaviness will shift; one way or the other. it's just a matter of time. I know there really isn't any place to place blame or responsibility for finding ourselves here. Whatever lessons the universe is trying to teach, are just a bit beyond me at the moment... but I will continue to function until I rest enough to face this all again.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 16, 2020, 12:05:37 PM: I am full-time useless on business and high-finance (even low-finance) strategies and know those subjects are in your capable hands. But I sure grasp that there's real sorrow involved, maybe some guilt, and plenty of worry about hard decisions about jobs that could impact employees. Those are painful shoes to be in and I admire your acceptance of the responsibility face on, whether you were late to the assessment or not. You're there now, you care and are doing your best.

Only thing that popped out to me otherwise was this:

Quote
He seemed to anticipate pushback

and

Quote
I expected some kind of reassurance

Anticipating and expecting are painful things. I actually read this (in that flash-instant when something first hits)...as:

My brother experiences me as stubborn or argumentative, maybe doesn't feel respected by me.

I keep hoping my brother will be protective and calming toward me and understand my feelings, and he won't/can't.

Both of those interpretations (if I'm anyway close to the ball field much less a base--always questionable!) struck me as leftover hurts from childhood. Representing a kind of longing in both of you for a closer relationship you haven't managed so far. Or that may not be possible because of your different personalities and histories.

I can't imagine amid a serious business emergency that you have time or energy to go into heavy analysis of your sibling relationship. But if you can count on the comfort of Buck, Hol and friends--maybe you can just in the short term find ways to convey to Bro that you respect him, he's worth listening to, and you regard him genuinely as your equal. He might have been feeling a little diminished.

Just a hunch, I'm just wondering if it might help. And wondering if after the crisis is done with, you might re-approach Bro in a new chapter, and find out what healing is possible for you two. (Or not, it may not be a pressing goal.)

Hugs and comfort--
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 17, 2020, 09:35:13 AM: Thanks Hops. Yes, you read the "hints" I dropped correctly; there is an old childhood wound there left over from Twiggy days. No, I'm not diving into it right now - and taking on a 2nd huge project that might completely destroy what progress we've made to this point, at being able to work together. I was simply accutely aware of it - and a bit sensitive to it, given how open I was being emotionally about all this, in the first place. I'm pretty sure he believes that all is well and perfect in how he sees things. It's what humans are wont to do, right?

I can simply make note of it; understand this is why we'll probably never be close; and let it go.

I deliberately put the whole mess of paperwork and thinking about all the details DOWN, after lunch - after taking steps to at least put 3 things into immediate effect/action. Then I used every trick in the book to keep my monkey mind occupied until I could sleep... but at some point I was able to write about it to Buck. The bigger picture sort of thing. Told him I needed someone to brainstorm with... and that Hol wasn't up to it yet. She's trying; she's applying what she knows in other realms as best she can; and she DOES understand finances well. And she is compassionate about my feelings too.

She and I are starting to do the "pull away" phase again of living our own lives. Which is proper and correct. We have plenty of opportunities to interact with each other and plan/work together on projects and chores so it's a new balance - that we're kinda sorting out. It's a good, healthy thing, IMO.

The idea of putting the "problem" down for a time lets the emotions settle or pass; gives my brain a rest so I can come back to it later, with fresh eyes. I might even go work on that canvas - which has been in a rest period for months now - again. But there are more practical issues that need addressed and that's where I'm starting today. And those things being accomplished usually give me such a sense of satisfaction that even in stressful situations - they generate a bit of efficacy and positive "pay it forward" type energy to help carry me through a little more gracefully.

It's going to be OK. Buck got me to crack a big grin and laugh out loud last night with an image of his kitties clinging all over him, attracted by the smell of a silver cream I got him, to help his incisions heal without getting infected. So goofy and off the wall... and the antithesis of the big, bad warrior wolf... who wouldn't laugh?

One of my favorite "give it hell" tasks is brush clearing. And since it's fall - it's a great time to get to that and keep moving onto prepping the garden a lot better for spring this coming year... and firewood... and airlocks... and the million other projects. I'm done catastrophizing over this situation; it will be what it will be. And I still CAN do lots of things to improve my views, keep the fire/insect and rodent risk down, and move another inch closer to self-sufficiency on the farm.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 19, 2020, 08:43:16 AM: Had a surprise visit from Mike's D and the "littles" - who aren't so little anymore. Logan's 12; and since his school is all virtual, he stays home and minds his little sister Harper (who's 7) while Mom works. She has in person classes - 5 to a room, two days a week. And she's huge!! Wearing 10/12s already. They hadn't been here since school shutdown around Easter... and it was time to visit the Hut.

We had a nice visit. But, I thought it would cheer me up more than it did. It did not. So I'll keep applying my current strategy to get things accomplished around here... and see if that will help. There is no real obvious reason for my current state of mind/emotion. Maybe ignoring it and working the list(s) will get me moved around to another more pleasant state.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 19, 2020, 09:37:34 AM: I'm glad they got over to see you, Skep, and sorry it didn't lift your spirits more - although understandable given the big question marks hanging over you at the moment. Personally I think getting out of bed and getting anything done is a win - I hope that crossing some things off the to do list helps a bit xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 19, 2020, 01:22:29 PM: I'm so glad they visited, Amber. Even if it wasn't an immediate lift. What might be nice is that since you've maintained a connection, they'll come again now and then over the years. Might mean more to you later than it can right now.

And "no real obvious reason" for a down-tilt in mood?

How about pandemic, winter coming, business reverses, Buck not yet home, etc? Hmmmm. Let me check..... Aha, thought so!

ALL are on the Official List of Life Stresses and Changes That Can Affect Mood.

Only good thing about change is that even change changes, eventually.

Hugs and comfort,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 20, 2020, 01:14:42 PM: Thanks much Hops. I am sure this is temporary; mostly brought on by having to postpone the start of building the shop - and that's a direct result of the immediate changes I made to the business. Once I get a better sense of my financial picture, it'll probably be back on. Contractors are still working at the hut.

Backhoe is down for tire issues, so that building site isn't cleared or leveled yet anyway.

But Buck and I have been "playing" a little, even though I'm falling asleep way before he's even tired yet. And we've exchanged commitments. :D When he's here next week, we'll talk about just what we both mean by that, the shop, when the final move looks like it'll happen, etc. That's definitely cheering me up.

Meanwhile, here's my handsome man. I found all those old pics of the farm to upload, too - while I was searching for business docs.

https://i.postimg.cc/5N5xMvVP/EAD65592-495-C-4-C68-9202-A3325500-B306.jpg
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 20, 2020, 01:37:21 PM: Ooh Skep, twit two! I can see why you're so keen to get him down there lol. Very handsome, and very kind eyes. See if he's got a brother living in England for me :) Lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 20, 2020, 01:40:15 PM: Awwww, he's just lovely, Amber.
A beautiful man.

SO happy to hear your relationship is moving forward.

Boy have you been patient. He's a lucky man.

Happy hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 20, 2020, 08:34:06 PM: He has a daughter in London - and probably more than a few friends and acquaintances still there. He was stationed in Scotland & Ireland for some years. ;) Yes, he has a very kind heart - for those who share love with him and treat him well. He's fond of oatmeal raisin cookies. But, he cooks & bakes too. Fastest way to a woman's heart - offer to make dinner. I'll just have to get him to cut down on the hot peppers & sauce.

I'm getting kinda giggly again, over him. LOLOLOLOL.

My internet signal is still beyond frustrating. It keeps fading in/out from the tower. Makes absolutely no sense. I couldn't upload any pics after that one. I'll keep trying over a couple days, then post. Gotta move some things off the old laptop. But I'm still cleaning house (kitchen is about done) and I need to bake some more cookies. :D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 21, 2020, 12:08:15 AM: A man who cooks WITH hot sauce. You hit the jackpot, imo, Amber.

I love the spicy food, yum.

I'm glad he had you giggling again: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 22, 2020, 09:37:04 AM: Hol got another big chunk of stuff moved yesterday. S is sick and so wasn't helping her move her heavy armoire down 2 flights of steps (it comes apart). Then he needed to be babied all night and kept her awake until around 5 am. Now she's running his dog into the vet for a lyme booster, a Lowes run for something she needs, and groceries. Yeah, she does all the cooking and cleaning too.

So, yeah... she's been venting to mom in between. I even got a "are you still awake" text last night coz she couldn't fall asleep... I suggested a hot toddy - and she said he wouldn't drink it; and had to point out it was for HER. LOLOLOL.

Anyway, I'm able to do a much more thorough cleaning of more of my space now. And I'm doing that and saving the paperwork for the weekend. I got TWO full canisters of dirt & dog hair just from the catwalk between the upstairs bedrooms yesterday. Working on a third too. No wonder the space felt awful...

The deep clean is therapeutic. I don't have to "think" - just be present & LOOK & and obviously cleaning isn't all that physically taxing - more aerobic - and the end result is immensely satisfying for me. De-cobwebbing the ceiling beams and cleaning the ceiling fans requires a long (and heavy) extension pole - but I had one for the beach house's 22 ft ceilings. I always do that job first, because it is taxing. I just sat and looked at the ceiling and catwalk last night in the almost dark. Enjoying it for the first time in 2 years.

I want to mop floors too. So... time to get on with it.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 24, 2020, 04:07:06 AM: Not a good day yesterday, Amber?

You were just enjoying the deep-cleaned catwalk etc.

Uh oh. Mebbe you overdid it. And you were doing floors too.

Hope all is well or soon will be.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 24, 2020, 10:10:03 AM: Just another round of Hol's relationship drama. It's the classic cycle - with some details unique to her and S. Partly, she just needs someone to listen to her vent, partly wants a critique of her thinking/understanding of "what's fair" in love & war... and trying to decide which one she's really engaging in.

There's been some evolution in her thinking on the topic. Which is probably a good thing; there is some connecting this situation to other issues she's working on. And I end up just being the sounding board and pointing out, when she's putting herself down unfairly... for whatever reason she tends to do that. And then, while listening - and watching - and trying to "see"... I'm trying to form my own (private) understanding of what's off-kilter in her collection of ideas - or just the balance of importance she puts on some over others.

It requires me to stand within my self, as solidly as I can so SHE can see what's coming up in her feelings, thoughts and out her mouth. Without influencing. And that's exhausting. Because then I have her stuff in my brain - and it takes me a bit, to put me back. I'm trying to see from her perspective and compare with my own to find the one little dysfunctional bit of the process. I can always tell her, I can't spare the energy for that kind of thing - but she really doesn't have anyone close, or that she feels she can trouble with her stuff at the moment.

Wrapped up in that, is her grappling with whether or not she can expect people to have her back - reciprocally - as she has theirs. And yes, our history is full of times we've gone above & beyond to have each other's back. So she knows it's a real thing that people do for each other. (Maybe she's doing too much for others initially, and when they aren't up to giving back when she needs them , busy with their own life, or simply don't have that ability... she seems to excuse them as being "just human"... but never expects that she might be as well. As if she isn't supposed to feel hurt, disappointed, abandoned or bereft... hmmm. Idea to ponder.)

She has about 6 more weeks of phone meetings with her substance abuse counselor; who she despises. But going through the process has made her more determined to find a therapist to deal with her issues - whether conditioned patterns or trauma or whatever. I think she's finally ready to tackle that. Poor counselor; from what Hol's shared the woman is truly trying to help but perhaps doesn't have the right skills to deal with Hol's big personality and strength. LOL... she told Hol she was intimidating. THAT wasn't helpful... but I can see why Hol gives that impression. She doesn't mean in a physical sense; but intellectually and emotionally.

I've been told that at various times too. One reason I hid myself under a bushel basket and have invariably been told I'm a hard person to get to know. Hol is different - because she doesn't hide her true self; and people merely ASSUME it's a mask covering some deep dark secret pain. We've talked about that and because she didn't live with me for some years of her teenhood - recognize that the possibility that there is something there is real; something she has firmly rejected as part of herself. But she wants a selected, capable therapist for that work - not someone with a social work degree, who also has the authority to put her back in jail. Obviously, that's not a safe therapeutic environment.

So yeah; not a great day. Not a terrible day. Just a long one. I feel like I'm running around all day long putting out fires that never go completely out; just die down until the next gust of wind fuels it back up again. In a 360 degree range... nothing ever gets resolved... just cycles back around.

I've got to go back out shopping for next week; butcher didn't have any lamb ground and I forgot to ask for bacon too. Then the regular grocery store for sundries & kitty foodz.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 24, 2020, 10:49:30 AM: I am soooooo glad Hol has come to that conclusion about serious therapy.

Someone as smart as she is could make tremendous tremendous strides if she does the deep dive. I hope you know enough locals to ask for references to the most experienced and hopefully brilliant psychologist in the area. There will be a good one who's chosen life in a smaller, human-scale city for very positive reasons.

I can understand how draining it was. (And btw, serious kudos to you for deliberately avoiding an enmeshed or codependent response. BRAVO.)

All in, it sure sounds like a very good development.

Rest up, you. You can reset your compass heading to your own life.
(You know you got to.)

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 24, 2020, 01:04:47 PM: Thanks Hops.

I hated to tell her this morning, that while I understand I'm her only option available to hand to talk to (apart from the person she wants/needs to talk to but won't with her) - that I think she needs to also talk about this with some of her closer, more mature friends. I think she's seeing the situation as something being wrong with her - because she wants/needs a strong connection with her partner; she denies that however. Says she sees it's a normal expectation. And while she realizes she can't "fix" him... there is still something keeping her from a decision that would let her break this repeating cycle of hurt & disappointment & feeling abandoned. And move on.

'Coz face it - she's TOLD me this is what she feels, so why continue the agony until it grinds her down into questioning her own worth again?? This is what I don't get. Yes, breaking up will hurt all around. Perhaps she's associating that with some kind of failure? There was a mention of "gamesmanship" within relationships - that I immediately questioned. A relationship can't survive if the currency of it - is who's on top this week. It's a fancy euphemism for power struggle, IMO. And I've had enough experience with that to know it's not worth the energy and can kill the affection that exists between two people.

She'll leave it be for a few days while she thinks/feels/maybe makes some decision(s). Then she'll be back with another place on the spiral, in the cycle. She didn't take that long deciding he would move in; so I guess it's a bit of "the devil you know" and possibility of regret motivating her dragging her feet.

Lordy, all I want to do is focus on my OWN relationship and clarifying just what it is going to be. I really didn't envision Buck & I parenting at this depth. Don't wanna do it either.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 26, 2020, 10:02:54 AM: Monday morning check-in...

Buck arrives tomorrow late; assuming no delays on the road. Hol's been keeping to the hut; doing some more work there - still moving out/moving in. I have a couple things yet to do that are of importance to me... and while he keeps asking about the "to-do" list... I'm keeping mum.

I feel like we have to talk. He's indicated he has some things to say too. Nothing "bad"... but I'm feeling confused, I think I know why - but I'll only know for sure when he's right here. I've already started my "preamble" to that conversation. This time, we won't have the kids in/out so much... or needing attention (I hope) or fed or in the kitchen or upstairs or whatever. I'm excited to see him again; but I'm also holding back my feelings because I'm afraid of being disappointed again.

Business stuff on my plate too. And I'm going to be winging it all week in different hats - so I don't know that I'll come to any conclusions of any import until B leaves again... and it still might take me awhile. Therefore, I probably won't update y'all that much this time, until I feel like I have something concrete and clear to communicate. Or I go over the edge about something... LOL. As confused as I feel... who knows? But at least I feel comfortable flying by the seat of my pants now... and I'm not rehersing anything ahead of time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 26, 2020, 11:26:46 AM: Well whatever is going on, Skep, I hope things settle and get sorted out for you, personally and with the business. I think you deserve a bit of plain sailing from here on in xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 26, 2020, 12:25:03 PM: ME TOO, Tupp!
Thanks.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 26, 2020, 03:14:24 PM: ((((Amber))))

Quote
I feel like we have to talk. He's indicated he has some things to say too. Nothing "bad"... but ....

Maybe making "we have to talk" the backdrop tilts this toward a negative or something "bad"? It's a famous line for relationships in trouble or impending breakups. Of course you will talk, you both have a lot to share and catch up on. You'll know whether his messages are reassuring or the opposite. But imo, you don't need to know before it happens, hon. You are strong and mature and can take in the present. I think it's anxiety talking.

Quote
I'm feeling confused, I think I know why - but I'll only know for sure when he's right here. I've already started my "preamble" to that conversation.

Just an idea: doesn't a "preamble" perhaps tilt the whole talk in a shaky direction?
My thought is: just be present, be honest, be yourself. Perhaps: Don't prepare a strategy or a speech. You two CAN communicate. Let yourself breathe. Trust yourself that you can and will cope with whatever rises up. Preambles and strategems and speeches are for courtrooms. (Nothing wrong with thinking about a specific statement or two you want to be sure to get off your chest at some point. But remember if you forgot one, you could always come back to it, right?). Summit meetings are for countries, not happy couples.

To me, the following is where you got down to it, and I totally get it. This is real and so normal. And, simple, elemental, and so honest.

Quote
I'm excited to see him again; but I'm also holding back my feelings because I'm afraid of being disappointed again.

I know! I'll write you a script! No preamble, appointment or pledge needed!

"I'm so excited to see you again. I'm also holding back my feelings because I'm afraid of being disappointed again."

Genius. Whoever came up with this? Oh right, it was YOU. And maybe this is all you need to tell him at first.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 27, 2020, 01:24:41 AM: It's going to be OK, Amber.

Just go on and be your wise warrior self and B will be his.

All will be well, even if it's not what you were expecting.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 27, 2020, 12:51:08 PM: Think I had a panic attack yesterday; or maybe just amped up anxiety is all it was. B called from the road already, and just talking to him helps me calm down.

Since the weekend, I've been busy, excited, planning little "surprises" for him... deliberately not putting together a "honey do list"... because unless he starts getting restless, I just want to spend time with him. There are a couple outings on the agenda - but they're optional and mostly just to get him acquainted with the area.

It seems whatever emotion I'm having - it's not just a mild feeling. It's intensified up to the maximum right now. Like a thousand volts of electricity running through me. I still have enough to keep me busy today - and not just let myself dwell on feelings. But I'm not ruminating on anything. Not even really THINKING right now. Just keepin' moving. It's not a state I'm in very often. New and different. No point in analyzing it either, I don't think. Just let it be what it is and maybe later on I'll have a clue or theory about what's going on with me right now.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 27, 2020, 04:49:06 PM: You will.

It'll ALL make sense in time.

Wise move to channel that anxiety into action, girl.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 28, 2020, 02:02:26 AM: And he's still on the road. I ate 5 hrs ago. I'm keeping the shepherd's pie warm for him. Made a pot of coffee (it helps him sleep in some strange way). I'm drinking most of that pot; with some Irish additive... otherwise the coffee will keep me awake. I'll make him another pot.

He's about an hour out now. Been on the road since 9:30 am. He isn't the kind of person that needs a LOT of sleep, but this last stretch through my hills has me sitting up waiting for him. He has to go slow with the load he's pulling.

I am crazy calm, now. It's all OK. He's coming home.

Hol gave me my birthday present early; she hit Vic's Secret when she was in town today. I have a weakness for satin PJs. They're just the right weight for fall. Not overly racy; but luxurious. It was a really nice thing to do. Despite her rough edges, she really is a good kid. She and S will probably go hiking tomorrow. So we can sleep in. She found out today that one of S's ex-girlfriends - that he's still friends with - has cancer. That "girl" can't be 40 yet. I've only met her briefly - but that's kinda hitting me. Why so many young people? Mike wasn't even that old; his mom was in her 80s when she passed.

And I've cycled back into being really emotional again. LOLOLOLOLOLOL. I think I was afraid of being misled by emotions and not being "rational" - and so shut all that down for a bit... except it was still there subconsciously; and hence the strange panic attack yesterday. If I deny my emotions - I pay for it. Or so it seems. That might not be accurate - but sometimes the intensity of emotion is just too much for me. My imagination & flights of fantasy run wild & free... and I KNOW I need to be more balanced. Or so I've been told. Part of me thinks those cautionary limitations, keep people from actually LIVING life - meeting the adventure head on. Diving in; off the cliff. No risk; no gain. I think I'm about over playing it so safe, that I don't actually LIVE. So adjusting the line of the balance.

I've always had that wild hair side of me. But I've seldom given it free rein, because it didn't seem prudent or wise or protective. Maybe I need to drop some of the protective boundaries a bit. Not to the point of foolhardiness... but enough that I might actually have some damn fun? And feel ALL the feelings? And be as real as I can be? Instead of guarded six ways to Sunday - so that I don't get to enjoy anything. That doesn't seem like any sane way to live. Where I sit now.

I don't have kids to raise; Hol has a good head on her shoulders even if she is struggling right now. I don't have to make a living to support myself in my old age - if I outlive my current money, or some catastrophe strikes - I grew up dirt poor; I can do that again and still make "happy". By some odd coincidence, I've met someone on the same wavelength at this age... and I "KNOW" him. And vice versa. And he makes me giggle like a school girl. And he's all man... and while I still have my issues with that, they're known & minor. He's not going to stifle me - au contraire, he empowers me to be more me. Witihout doing anything except being him.

OOOOHHHHHHH..... and he's close now. I know he's tired; he's sore from sitting all day. God bless him, I've got dinner, coffee & cognac, and a shower for him.

Anddddd... scene closes. I'll be back later girlfriends. :D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 28, 2020, 07:09:49 AM: I can hear you purring from here, Amber.
I'm glad you two are going to have this time!

Meanwhile, just so you know....alcohol doesn't counteract caffeine.
You just have caffeinated alcohol. LOL.

I think you'll work out the balance of listening and letting all your wild hair fly just fine. I don't blame you for some last-minute fear but don't believe it's running you.

Hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 29, 2020, 01:10:33 AM: Yeeee.....
this is happening!
Just keep breathing, Amber: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 29, 2020, 09:13:59 AM: Questions... answers... calmness...
and some amazing unprompted comments.... so that I don't care that it's raining all day.

:D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on October 29, 2020, 09:25:49 AM: Big smile for you!

So glad.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on October 30, 2020, 07:01:50 AM: I'm glad there is a smiley face there, Skep. I hope you and Buck are soon in a more permanent situation together and that the talking through stuff yields good things (I'm sure it will) xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on October 30, 2020, 11:52:10 AM: He's out working for a bit; rain stopped. But it's getting chilly - I'll be laying a fire from the kindling he split yesterday.
Yes, all is happy out here. So far. Only seen Holly briefly the last few days; she picked up some extra veggies for me at the store.

I'm finally getting rested. He induces the relaxation reflex for me. :D Even when he's doing something that I don't think he should attempt by himself. But, he's already proven that he CAN do it by himself - and as long as I'm paying attention, I can only speed up the job - my help is limited because I'm not strong enough or smart enough (on my own) not having attempted such things by myself before - but I can follow what he's doing and be that 3rd or 4th hand.

No med devices, except the cage that stabilized his spine. Pain is well under control... sans pharma... and even the infection markers are down by half now. He's probably going to try to put on a little more weight/muscle and get his strength/stamina back where it works for him. But this is the healthiest he's been in years.

He tossed me a future curveball idea to chew on last night. Talk about out of left field (yes, I was a left field outfielder)... it's wild & crazy, but rather than saying anything now, I said I'd have to think about it.* The last move isn't going to happen until after the first of the year. I've been able to say my piece about that and he's heard me. It's not "excuses" - it's life and the way he wants to do things, for his own peace of mind.

*more on this later - because it's such a huge deal and something that was totally off my radar screen; I was stunned speechless and I really DO have to think about it before I have any idea how I feel about it.

Life with this man is going to be a constant adventure. But his priority is taking care of me. Hell, that's unusual enough that I'm going to need months to process all differences I'm seeing... and how I feel (which is mostly cozy & comfortable & open enough to just spit things out for a change).
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on October 30, 2020, 05:28:44 PM: That was an amazing update, ((Amber.))

Good on' ya for taking time to process before commenting.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 03, 2020, 08:49:43 AM: WARNING: before settling down into this & successive posts - which might take all day, given I gotta vote & meet with contractor this morning - grab your tea & biscuits and get cozy. Verbosity forthcoming; processing is much simpler than usual for some reason - but still LOTS.

---------------

B took off yesterday afternoon, to make it back in time to pick up D at college in NC and take her back home to SC to vote (her first election; that state's rules) and the worst of the wind storm around - allegorical and meteorological - is starting to die down.

It was well after midnight when he pulled in last Tuesday. Then, after 12 hrs on the road - the last 6 after dark when it's hard for him to see - it took a couple hours to unwind enough to try to sleep. I had kept the sheherd's pie warm for him - but he couldn't eat at that point. So "fortified" coffee was substituted instead. I know better than drinking coffee any time other than in the morning... but by then, my nerves were shot too. It was almost noon before we started getting motivated the next morning.

This was the first time he's been here without the kids in the house. So when he was sufficiently awake, he started unloading while I futzed in the kitchen, to feed him. Then, I went out to help him finish up. Once he starts a task - he'll stick with it - no drink, no food until it's done - and that could be 3 am. So I kinda have to put my foot down, bribe him, and otherwise get his attention off the task enough to realize he has other needs. This is not a bad thing, per se; it just needs moderation for his own good.

I realized that "arrival day" that life with this man is going to be a constant adventure. LOLOL. He calls it needing adult supervision... but it's clear we can decide what needs doing and he doesn't need or want me around to do it. (Sometimes the two sets of hands is safer or easier or faster.) This lets me use the "divide & conquer" strategy that works so well on a farm. I wasn't that successful at getting Hol to see how it worked. Took longer. B just knows that system works real well.

Communication, privacy, time-outs/downtime vs togetherness... all that just naturally is a good fit between us. We are the same way as far as organization and habits. Because one of his eardrums is punctured (product of his work)... he is hard of hearing. That's kind of frustrating; plus he talks to me when I'm doing/listening to something else - so I don't hear him all the time either. But he isn't resistant to hearing aids. I spent too much time close to those big Marshall amplifiers back in the day but my problem is just focus. LOL.

We were watching some tv after dinner, and he just came right out with - "if you want to, we could adopt another kid". I was a tad STUNNED; coming out of the blue like that... my intuition tells me it's something he's given a lot of thought to and is drawn to and then waited to see whether that felt right, when he was with me.

So I told him as much of the truth as I knew right then - the thought had crossed my mind but I didn't know how I felt about it. I'd spent my 20s as a mom, and with Hol boomeranging several times - was still kinda looking forward to being footloose at this age. I can definitely see us parenting together; again that's just something that's naturallly there between us even though my experience is that my ideas on parenting aren't exactly compatible with many men's ideas. So, I told him I couldn't decide that on the spot and needed to think about it.

Explained how Hol and I have talked about it for a long time; not just since the miscarriages. And how sensitive that topic was for her. I can just imagine her reaction to an announcement like that! Even though I know she'd do her best to be happy for us, it would be a constant thorn in her side. My lips are sealed on that topic (with her) until I have sorted out his/my feelings on this. I'm picking up an inkling of an impression that he thinks women are always looking for the next little one to raise - and his nurturing side, goes there too. I want to untangle this some more and won't "decide" anything until he's been here awhile. It would make more sense, to perhaps educate Hol on the process and help her through her own decisions. But we'll see. That idea would take a major adjustment on my part; my previous planning.

So, he's used to shouldering massive responsibilities after raising his own adopted daughter as a single father in this society. (Lots of horror stories with the system in that experience. Tupp could relate.) Now that she's beginning her own life - he's facing the same kind of empty nest issues moms do. The "needing to be needed" is painted large there, I think. Plus he's a very active personality; prefers to constantly be engaged in something all-consuming.

----------flash forward to yesterday; leave taking -----------

He was getting awake after a rough night with his back pain, and intent on finishing one more job around here when he said he had something weird to ask me. I was already doing my organizational flitting around; tidying up. So, I stopped in mid-flight and said, "what's that babe?" He asked if I still wanted to do this. I had to sit down.

Halloween night, we'd built a fire pit blaze... and both of us relinquished some important aspects of our past that we'd been identifying with, clinging to for definition. And lots of truth spilled out - both the stories and the emotions. I didn't want him to leave so soon. The connection between us is that strong - but we're still just beginning to learn to adapt to each other and having someone like the other in our lives again. So there are strong feelings there.

He wasn't looking at me, so I put my hands on his face and made him look at me and said yes. The tears started to roll. The depth and kind of betrayals and abandonment he's suffered make what I've been through look like a cakewalk. The details about that came out after that, later in the day. He wasn't looking for a relationship when he came here to fix up my jeeps a year ago; after 20 years his life seemed all sorted out to be some solitary journey. But he's been strong enough to walk out of his own darkness toward the light and get physicallly more healthy over that time too.

Hol is already looking for a version of the "gory details" of what our visit consisted of... and she's bewildered by how mum I am. I haven't come up with a "reader's digest version" yet for public consumption and I don't know how much he's willing to be open about with anyone but me. So I don't feel at liberty to blab much about it.

Suffice it to say, that we both stripped all the ego-narratives away from our images (to the best of our ability right now) and showed each other exactly who we were hoping that we wouldn't be rejected. And we're both unbelievably shocked and immensely grateful that we found the opposite of rejection.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on November 03, 2020, 10:37:57 AM: Just popped in, ((Amber)) so happy to read your update.

1st.....the sharing and time alone sound amazing and I know long awaited. Keep those moments as close to yourself as needed. You don't owe anyone any version...none at all, imo.

THIS is your journey. Your relationship. Private and intimately your own.

About adopting a child together,
there's much work, joy and discovery for B and you before adding another person to this great unfolding, imo.

I imagine empty nesting will be super hard, for B and me and so many. I will try not to touch the frog here.....take your time. You have a relationship to build. Yourself IN that relationship to get to know, and B has the same mission.

I imagine the lack if chaos in his life is a bit jarring...maybe scary to face. Throwing himself into another war might actually feel comforting to contemplate for him....dealing with the social services, a child's pain and trauma, etc.....it would take everyone's eye off the ball, and onto a great unknown focus.

However maternal and amazing that is...
you have unfinished business to tend to.

I do worry a bit about B standing still for a moment.....I wonder if he can.

He deserves to stop and breathe and ficus on who he is now, with you, and as empty nester warrior learning to join with an amazing peer companion warrior....

and just BE, for a while.

I sense he's grounded in protecting and saving others. Maybe exploring that aspect, a bit, through the lense of codependence and having more choices, if it seems appropriate.

I'm very excited for you both, Amber.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 03, 2020, 10:38:02 AM: That is lovely, Amber. And moving.
Thanks for sharing this.
Love is in the room.

As to adoption, yikes. My brain came up with:

Start a metal shop apprenticeship for young teens.
Foster dogs.
Mentor/help a kid or sibling pair in a local public school. The poorest two.
Figure out an entrepreneurship idea and teach it locally to a kid.
Give free drawing/painting lessons to poor local kids.

Find out where the greatest local need is that you and B could
volunteer for together that affects children, and do that. If he's craving fathering.

Dunno, but a man with great physical challenges who's retirement age
might be getting on a bit to be weighing adoption? Fostering, though,
could make a lot of sense, imo. He could explore foster grandparenting.

This is the time when a couple in love just lets the wild ideas rip. And needs most
to hear anything and let it all fly. However....whatever the emotional bonding ideas/dreams are, keep those toes muddy.

Last thought: I would worry if you get A&B involved with adoption. And why is a plan for Hol coming up? Boundaryboundaryboundary. I wouldn't bring it up, press it forward, or come up with workarounds or strategies why y'all can be exceptions to the usual screening expectations. Just because Hol might want a child doesn't mean it's a great idea for her to acquire one. Remember her actual mental health and addiction risks and judgement and reactions to things. She might not be stable enough even if she did pass screenings. Nothing evil about that but lord...adding in that "project" might be not good for her or for you or A&B, much less for a child.

hugs and happies,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 03, 2020, 04:27:03 PM: Hey Hops.... slow down. We are a long ways away from all that. I think B was just testing the waters with an idea. Stinker was being his sweet little self and super cuddly on my lap. Seeing me that way - likely popped the idea in his head. As for Hol - I meant my comments in relation to the age difference. She would be just as likely to vigorously reject and criticize any such idea suggested to her - and certainly is beyond being persuaded or pressured into anything. (Albeit there is still the S situation for her to sort out.) At least, that was the only time adoption was brought up/discussed... so while I intuit a lot of things about why it did... I fully understand I could be wrong in it. I just know now, that there might be some past experiences that might've prompted the question of me. And it's part & parcel of the relationship shifting into more serious territory. (Love some of those ideas on your list!)

Lighter, I think I can negotiate him into moderating this habit of his that he's gotten into, living alone. I made a point to let him know, that I'm needing some maintenance, too. ;) He's receptive and sweetly responsive when I say things like that - without any weirdness tacked onto it. He might be afraid of what would run through his head or what he'd feel... if he didn't stay busy. He might not too. Some people just like being constantly busy; it's their style of being - it's not good or bad - and there isn't any need to change it UNLESS it does result in neglecting a partner's need for connection. It's a good sign that he welcomes my participation and responds to my prompting him back from "the zone". He's absolutely unused to having to consider his partner in the balance & rhythm of work/leisure. It feels awkward for him a bit; that's obvious. I'm pretty flexible these days - but with age comes that need to eat/sleep on a fairly regular schedule. So we'll see how flexible he is, too. OH... and I have my own things like that, that need to adapt out of consideration for a partner too. I've rather enjoyed the years I could just suit myself, but not enough that I need to make it an issue. There will be some definite "me breaks" with B; and that will be fine with him. As much as we enjoy being together - we each have some strengths that were developed in solitude.

All my impressions and intuitions are just that - based on what I perceive, in some cases confirmed by direct communication - but perhaps not everything, in detail just yet. The validity of the relationship doesn't necessarily hinge on those impressions/intuitions... because eventually we DO end up talking about everything; it's just a little at a time. I'm trying to keep those things I might intuit in the "not yet validated/proven" category. Even when a lot of the time, it does bear out. But for myself, I can't let myself think that my intuition is absolutely spot-on, without that verbal confirmation. I've been wrong ENOUGH times I won't let myself believe I'm right just on the basis of perception/intuition.

Oh - who mentioned physical challenges? He's been without the pain mask (stimulator/pump) completely for a couple weeks now. I didn't notice it being an obstacle for him at all. He said there was one point, his leg gave out on him and he is going to begin lobbying DOD - who wrote him the Rx - to also supply the recommended knee brace that no one else has available. He's almost completely off pain meds, too. There was one night his back flared up and he took something and slept on the couch instead of tossing & turning. He doesn't realize I'm not that easy to wake up. ;)
And his infection markers are down 50% now too - and he's still taking the antibiotics. I honestly can't keep up with the man. Wears me out.
IMO, at his age, he is the furthest thing from decrepit I've seen in a LOOOOONNNNNNNGGGG time.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 04, 2020, 09:42:48 AM: Rereading all this...

first description of the visit/occurances... is me just beginning to "think" about things. Telling the "what" was said/happened... all the various thoughts (which are not the same as actual decisions which are also a long way from action)... and trying to find ways to describe the feelings. There was no time to think when he was here; too busy "being" and "doing". There was plenty of time to talk, which I pretty much required, but didn't demand.

In the wide open space of solitude, one thinks all kinds of thoughts. Like what would I be doing if I were single, 25, looked like that again... etc silly day dreams - but FUN day dreams. So yes, I have thought about parenting again, and there is a special feeling when a partner will at least entertain the idea. It's not something I've experienced before. It's like an additional connection between us... a node of compatibility maybe.

Ex #1 tolerated my first pregnancy; didn't want me to go through with the second (Hol). Ex #2 was completely uninterested in being a parent - with 4 kids around. He tried, but only achieved part of the role of a father. Michael only had adult kids to interact with so it wasn't exactly "parenting" - except with his adopted D. So, when B brought up the idea, after me being stunned...

what's left in feelings is that he finds me worthy of the maternal role; he respects in me that innate characteristic. Because his former relationships didn't provide that perhaps?. And maybe that explains better what I mean about an extra connection; extra dimension to the emotions between us. That was the LAST thing I expected him to bring up. So there would be a lot of talking/discussion before any decision would be made - and it's not a requirement for him. In fact I almost expect him to be kind of relieved at not having that role forced on him - once we have a chance to revisit it. I'm pretty sure curiosity about my feelings on the topic doesn't equal ONLY something he actually WANTS to do; so this is just where I'm thinking all the thoughts about what see, hear, sense, intuit, and can piece together about the topic. And yes, I'm wild & crazy ENOUGH to at least consider why it would/wouldn't be a good idea in reality. And my feelings? Yes.... those too. (Most of our conversations are about lots more pragmatic/practical things.)

A LOT of what we talked about this trip will be revisited more than once.

Words are so damned inadequate (for me) for describing feelings. And I don't have Hops' knack for poetry which can get a lot closer; more accurately. I think in terms of processes, systems, interactions of words, gears, chronologies... which are all linear. Emotions are more like water, which can spread in all directions at once.

Yes, I'm pretty bowled over by how intense this emotional connection with B is. But my logical, practical brain hasn't stopped working leaving me a mere puppet with no autonomy. And I'm not expected to be either. In fact, that equality between us just intensifies the feelings. I don't NEED him financially, for emotional security, for anything really. And he doesn't NEED me either for all those things that indeed, truly matter, when people are younger.

What we're finding, I think, is the freedom of being together and loving and respecting each other without all those pressures added into the mix. It can be confusing and scary; it doesn't fit the programmed & conditioned patterns we grow up with. So the traditional "structural framework" of relationships to be X, Y, and Z is just irrelevant. Our roles aren't as rigidly/clearly defined out of necessity... we can take turns, there are things that individually one of us is better at - but the other CAN do almost as well. And we can enjoy the hell out taking turns and being who we are - without also having to fit into any pre-defined patterns or molds.

There is a strong healing aspect for both of us, in this. But that's still out in fuzzy feeling territory; potentially very hopeful and not actualized fully yet. He is aware of that; acknowledges it too. I fully expect we'll butt heads on some things; it's pretty much a given since we're both strong independent (read: hard-headed stubborn) cusses. But it hasn't happened yet and I'm not walking around waiting for that to happen, expecting it or testing it.

I never expected that we would "get" each other - the inner workings of each other - like we do. But it's a real thing and it's amazing. I feel different; like a weight is off my shoulders almost. It's a huge thing and my theory is there's probably a lot of moving parts to it. Yeah, it's taken time. We've sorted through a few verbal misunderstandings. Comparatively easily. This is an adventure I never really saw coming.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 04, 2020, 03:12:43 PM: I'm really happy for you, (((((((Amber)))))).
So very very glad.

You deserve love.
You deserve a partner with strong arms and a good heart.

You deserve to experience trusting and being trusted.

When your world is aligned with love and goodwill, beauty comes.

I'm just so glad for you. And for B too.
The abstractions aren't telling me much (they might Twiggyize, which you don't need in this context), save that you are feeling something you have hoped to feel, receiving and giving, and not afraid.

Big smile here. Your hopeful, happy energy comes through.

Give that B a big smack on the cheek from a far-off admirer. (Or not!)

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on November 05, 2020, 06:04:36 PM: What Hops said.

Really happy for you, Amber.
Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 10, 2020, 07:11:09 AM: Things are as good as a person could imagine out here on the farm. Except Buck's not here and we're back to our normal distance communication routines again.

I'm fighting a cold, allergies and/or sinus crap due to the cold/windy weather we had - and now this gorgeous weather due to a high pressure system that's been parked over us. It's not horrible, but the first day of it I did just allow myself to lounge all day in my jammies in bed. Hot medicinal tea, and all the yummy food I could scrounge to shove in my face. Including the last quart of homemade chicken noodle soup I had in the freezer.

The weather - while lovely - seems weird, since a week ago when Buck was here, we had a fire going in the stove at night. Stinker is going through a growth spurt and poor Freddy has lost his patience with the little terror.

New gate is up for the driveway; he'd forgotten to make a way to latch it... found 2 horseshoes in his truck and welded those on. I like it! It's a real nice touch. Now I need some signage to orient people to the new address.

Hol has been working on the hut; painting her flights of fancy in color... dealing with 3 other kittens (one has found a home). She is kinda thinking about what her options are for employment since it appears there won't be any long enough stretches of work in production for another year yet. The job is physically/mentally taxing and she took note of all the people she worked with who were dealing with broken bodies at 50. So this "respite" at the farm to regroup has turned into a mid-life course correction.

She helped me finally hang my stained glass wolf way up high over the front door in a window and Buck's Red Deer skull & antlers he took in Scotland.

It's the time of year to deal with both my jeeps for winter; and get ready for snow season - if it ever comes. Buck filled my kindling rack when he was here... So except for cleaning up that patio there isn't much to do. I looked at the push mower Hol said was making a weird noise... and the oil is really low. I hope that's all it is. All the gas tanks on equipment need treatment for the winter; and stowed away; tires inflated, etc.

And I'm wracking my brain trying to choose presents for people for the holidays already.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on November 10, 2020, 12:36:18 PM: I just picked up the Yukon ,break work, and my water pump sprung a leak as I drove into my driveway. Had to have it towed right back to the mechanics.

Your maintenance seems to be going more smoothly, Amber.

I my list live reading about your full wood rack, and hanging beloved things that bring you joy.

Question....how are you feeling about separation from B now?

Is it easier now you have a set timeline?

You seem really relaxed in this last post to me, Amber.

I'm glad Hol seems to be focused on herself, and not S. I hope that's true.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 10, 2020, 08:00:33 PM: I still don't like the separation. I know he has to have time to tie up his years there and make sure his D is settled. It's different this time - because we have had time to talk; openly and without reservation - or fear. Lingering questions have been answered - removing my over-active imaginations tendency to doubt.

And we spoke our truth about wanting to be together. It's simple and unadorned. He had the same kinds of fears I did; the same doubts. That this was just too good to be true; we were waiting for something that just doesn't exist to show up and blow the specialness of the connection to smithereens. We've both been burned that way in the past. And neither of us is willing to sacrifice our self-reliance or independence again BUT WE STILL WANT THIS CONNECTION, so we're having to invent our own way forward. No programmed conditioned "roles"... except what each is good at. Wants to assume responsibility for. And that also takes time.

The mutual respect - for the things we've been through, how we perservered, and who we are as a result of all that - is brand new for both of us. The more mundane reasons people "need" another within relationship don't exist for us. Security, a co-parent, even companionship... just don't figure here. For me, it's who he is all at once - the many many things. For him, it's similar - but he's blown away by me being able to express affection for him. (And the story that explains the reason why is heartbreaking to me. I know how that feels.) Yet he's not stuck in that. He's funny; insightful; creative; and sweet & kinder than almost anyone I've known previously. And I don't know exactly how I knew it was within him... but he's able to show it easily these days.

Sometimes you get lucky; and sometimes you hit the lottery.

We stay in contact all day long; unless one of us is working... and even when we are there is a maintenance "ping" that doesn't need an immediate response... just hi, what are you doin? In the mornings, and evenings, communication picks up. And now that the anxieties we had have been brought out into the open, they've dissipated. So we're both kinda resting in just being this connected. Example:

I was grocery shopping; picking out canned food for Stinker. He texted to remind me that Freddy likes the soft treats. And he is as mystified as me, how he knew I was in the cat food aisle right at that moment. LOL. There are LOTS of things like that. Hol & I kinda have that level of connection; but I've not known a man that had that much intuition/sight before. Maybe it's a function of the connection; I dunno.

But we seem to be able to give each other what we need on the emotional level (another first for me) and so I let myself half-believe that we were brought together just for that reason. He's not comfortable with very many people... yet we were instantly comfortable with each other. Too many people have tried to take advantage of his inherent kindness.

The timeline remains flexible. Too many things we can't control. But he'll be as frustrated as I will be if that happens. And he's worth the wait. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on November 12, 2020, 07:17:21 AM: What an amazing unfolding, Amber.

Don't forget to dance on this comfortable, happy glow.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 12, 2020, 09:56:03 AM: Well, if the rest of the world would sort themselves out and people would act with some sense... THEN, I could dance. And I will dance with him. Regardless.

Yeah, I'm setting conditions again. But it honestly does "intrude" unnecessarily (and uninvited) into our lives.

I'm grumpy. Been fighting a head cold - sinus involved - for a week, and disappointed Hol who hoped I'd hang out at the hut while she had a visitor last night - and chicken & dumplings - for making my own chili (extra spicy) and going to bed at 9.

She and I have been cleaning house. My friend Deb is coming for a short R&R visit Friday. I am horrified at the state of the room she & S were in. No wonder he kept fighting allergies/colds/flu. It's really a simple equation...

Then, I've done something to my ipad. Only 1 cable will charge it - while the others did just yesterday. I can't get the plug in the socket... hmmm. I don't think I have the patience to deal with that today. Buck is suffering through another round of meningitis - altho less than a month ago his bloodwork showed a 50% decrease in infection markers. He's complaining he didn't get a toaster for having it 10 times in 4 years. LOL. Other than that - it's the same old same old for him.

And it's raining; and getting cold. Time to start the D3 vitamins.
BLECH.

I'm either going to make an appie pie or hot apple dumpling w/honeycomb ice cream for Deb's & my birthday treat this weekend. Being grumpy means I'm getting over my cold. Kinda. (I've been sleeping VERY well this week, so it's not that.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 12, 2020, 12:05:18 PM: Sunnex Biotechnoligies, Amber. I swear. (I have one tower model that is life-changing.)

I hear you about it all. And I'd bet just having to say good-bye was rough.

You and B will figure this out. I'm glad Hol is finally in her hut.

SO nice that your friend can come. Has she quarantined/tested?
I would love to have another friend in my "pod". Just don't know anyone other than M who's as careful as he and I are.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 12, 2020, 08:22:54 PM: My friend hasn't quarantined per se. Her job split workers in half and half work one week, while the other half is out. She takes care of her 80-something and increasingly frail mom - so she is being extra careful. And I'm seriously not that worried about it. S went to visit a friend of his; she works at Whole Foods - and he was down sick with the flu for several days. Didn't test. My sinus issues are a direct result of being outside for hours in in the cold & wind and having my headband slip off my ears while working. Hol didn't get sick; I didn't get my sinus from them. Been here done this before.

That said... we will still take ordinary precautions.

I am this evening teasing Buck, tempting him, with things I like to bake at the holidays. LOLOLOL. Poor man is drooling; but he says he's a decent cook & baker too. Maybe I need to test that theory??

He's not here au corporeal; but he knows a way to be here for me from a distance. It's what his life has been; he just hasn't had anyone who could play back and be there for him too, this way. And it's not forever. It's just till he finishes up his "list".

And meanwhile, I'm practicing my independence while within relationship. I am finding they can co-exist without a lot of conflict. WHO KNEW? I kinda suspect it requires both partners to have about the same level of maturity though.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 16, 2020, 02:24:16 PM: Farm (my house) pics:

https://postimg.cc/gallery/KMCQ1Hy

The reno work on the living room (whole house actually) was to replace windows/doors. In the living room, I removed two full glass doors to gain extra wall space and improve the insulation. Worked, too. Contractor thought I was nutz, but I insisted. Stone wall & hardwood went up & down this year, in my bedroom. Along with the master bath redo. Sort of to appease myself while we were pouring money into building the hut. It was stuff that I'd wanted to do when I moved in - but priorities.

Since this place was a vacation home primarily, no one was here much to suffer the drafts in the winter. So what I've been doing is to make first - more snug & functional, and then to improve the aesthetics.

The deer head on the living room hearth chimney is a new addition from Buck; red deer that he took in Scotland. I think our tastes will blend OK, when all is said and done.

We had a bad wind storm last night; I sure do appreciate my generator! Most of my lights work, I have heat & water & ac in the summer - and I can watch tv via the disc player even when my internet is out, like it was last night. Propane stove, electric oven - this genny actually had the capacity to run my oven too. No microwave, but the coffee pot is on the genny... :D

There was some extended discussion over how time is calculated. My way, I moved in Nov. 2016 - making it 4 years I've been here. Hol posted a pic to Facebook, the night before the movers got here - and FB says it was 3 years ago. Either way, a LOT has been done out here in that time. There's the whole "Hut complex" - complete with pond and garage - and soon to be greenhouse. There is a 24x30 barn out by the garden area, too - and Buck's shop will go nearby there. The studio and that garage under it - need some attention - but my new motto is "rome wasn't built in a day".

Obviously, my anxiety over not having anything to do but stay stuck grieving over Mike was rather serious and my decision to give myself a project that'll last years is not a bad way to go, solving that. We do set our schedules for our individual comfort zones... and one winter pining away was enough for me. Getting ready for another big life adjustment in a couple months when Buck finally gets here... and I've got a couple months of "slow time" to let that settle around me. Might be getting the wheels turning for his shop about that time too. But I'm watching my pennies closer than I was, these days... and I've put that analysis on hold for a little while longer.

I hear being active and engaged helps with health and mental acuity as we age. :rolleyes: I think I have still have the over-compensation gene. LOLOLOLOLOL.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 16, 2020, 05:14:54 PM: Oh SEND ME THAT GENE!

The place is so beautiful, and so much like I'd pictured in my head. I love the scenery (having grown up with identity-forming experiences in these mountains and having lived/worked in Appalachia)....and about the interior--the lovely warmth of the woods, the well-chosen furnishings, the windows, the stone. It's just wonderful. To me the goal isn't GORGEOUS, it's about HOMEY. You done got homey done, girl. It's beautiful. Welcoming. Calls to every sense of home.

I can't imagine the impact on Buck. It's just perfectly open, offering space for two, welcome to him. That deer head looks bronzed. It is taxidermied?

I'm very happy to hear B is arriving in a couple months for good. That is freaking awesome. It makes all your dreaming real. I am so very happy for you both.

Big happy hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on November 16, 2020, 11:32:26 PM: Well done, Amber. You figured out how to post pics again, SO satisfying. Thanks!

You gave pretty good descriptions as you worked and planned. Things look familiar....can picture you and B snuggling kitties in snowy weather.

Things are coming together: )

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 17, 2020, 07:25:51 AM: I think he poly'd the skull & horns Hops. He stripped & boiled the skull himself. 50% native american, ya know? ;) He and I actually connected through that kind knowledge initially - I learned so much of it as a child from my grandpa and our many family outings to remote, deep woods reservations. Culturally, we are just a natural fit - between the viking, pirate, old hippie, VN war and native backgrounds. His submarine life is all his, however. I tried going on the sub that was open to the public in Baltimore harbor... and didn't last 15 minutes. Claustrophobia.

Thanks for the house reviews! I have another guest room to set up; he's bringing his mom's bedroom furniture - ca. 1920s - so that'll become the updated "bunk room" - a double bed, and two twins. Us girls were talking about the easiest way to remodel the ship-like tiny bathrooms up there last weekend.

Technically, I guess my house is called "post & beam" - the exterior walls are 8" log, and while it's not a true "timber frame" (which I've drooled over for 40 years) this floor plan was one I was in love with through 2 out of my 3 "lives" (and ex's) in this current incarnation. The main living area is the middle floor (like a lot of beach architecture) - with 2 bedrooms up and a 3rd on the ground floor (which is my office now) - along with all the mechanical/utility space and a double garage. Both buildings - house & studio - have 360 decks - which for the sake of maintenance, I really want to shrink the sq footage.

Holly and I have enough ideas about what to do with houses... as it is... and now Buck has his ideas too. I really appreciate having a creative "partner in crime". Us girls can do a lot of stuff on our own... but throw in a guy with an engineering mindset and mechanical ability who lives to work... and well, I expect we'll be getting more stuff squared away around here. OH... I'm beginning to see his leadership qualities shine forth too. Definitely not drill sargent material... he's learned a lot about team building.

I know I'm mostly hitting the positives right now. There are a LOT of simple joys in life that, IMO, are an antidote to the things outside of our own control. I am thinking hard, and working through, this inspiration I've had about my concept of what relationships "require". Since it seems to be what B wants too - and he KNOWS what I mean when I talk about it - I'm pretty confident we'll figure it out organically. Hol and S are working through his (S) lack of openness too - and seem to be in a more cozy place with it right now. So in my corner of the world - things are pretty much as good as they can be. I can only really care about the things that are mine to take care of - the things I might be able to do something about. And I just am not going to let media or anyone else tell me that I must care about x, y, or z or I'm a bad person. Not true.

That kind of implied message - subtext - is the same thing used in the old "save this dog" or "you can feed this child (on another continent) for 50 cents a day" fundraising manipulation. It's emotional blackmail as far as I'm concerned. There are kids right here in my county that can use new shoes & a hot lunch. And the church ladies know all of them. The old saying "charity starts at home" is especially poignant for a lot of us here. Not just in our community - but our actual FOOs.

There is a term I'm hearing in the online Tarot community - Lightworker. It includes the reiki healers, etc. And it's kind of new ag-y and fuzzy & vague, but the name is apt. There are always the people who bring that kind of caring into their local sphere... and since we're all stuck at home anyway, seems like a great time to pursue knowing our neighbors and helping where we can. I think it might be good, when the gloom and futility of our current lockdown circumstances are getting to ya - to think on ways you could brighten someone else's day. Even anonymously. ;)

This is one of the characteristics that Amish/Mennonite culture can contribute to help heal some of the ills around us.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 17, 2020, 10:47:17 AM: I love the way you boundary your self-esteem from external sources and draw purpose from the wells that make sense to you, Amber. Nobody's else's wells, your own.

I especially like this and thanks for the reminder:
Quote
There are a LOT of simple joys in life that, IMO, are an antidote to the things outside of our own control.

House, man, nature, work, art.

Doesn't get much better than that!
It's so nice to hear you happy.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 18, 2020, 09:41:39 AM: It comes and goes, Hops. But I do feel genuinely happy more often.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 21, 2020, 09:37:54 AM: Things are moving into "the holidays" mode around here again. And again, it's hard for me to juggle that (which I equate to fun, downtime) with all the work projects I have taking up residence in my head.

There was a chance that B might come up, and of course - my imagination built some lovely stories about that possibility. LOL. His D will be off for T'giving break before going back to school for finals. My brain knows that this is a huge life process for him; the end of an era - the closing of that chapter. It's important to him to meet his own standards about "how" that happens. For his own self-respect. So I'm not feeling much disappointment. In a way, it's a "sign" of how he'll treat me. Maybe. But I can respect his process and standards. How he's learning to let the D go and grow up.

Hol went up to the city for a couple days to help her friend - who was partnered with Hol's boss, who died last fall - empty the special effects van. It was good for her head to be somewhere else than here for a couple days - around the friends who have come here to visit. They both realized that this job was harder for Hol than Mel. Hol had spent a LOT of time working with boss in that van. But H was able to talk about that - almost cheerfully too - realizing the happiness amid all the work frustrations, personality issues, etc and get some closure - FINALLY - herself. Just the other day, she was talking about an experience and referred to the boss as if he was still here. (Mom didn't point it out; I figure she was aware of what words came out of her mouth.) Hol is going thru the process of reinventing her life without that job being the centerpiece of it. Another ending that is also a beginning.

The business numbers are stagnating. Our "cushion" of cash is running out with no positive signs available that sales will turn around in the near future. On that topic - avoidance and procrastination have been my friend. It's scary to think that my only source of income - now with dependents again - might go away. Scary thoughts tend to push me into extreme reactions and I SOMETIMES make bad decisions from that place. So, I'm taking my own sweet time, dealing with this in chunks.

Essentially, the business needs to be downsized relative to the drop in sales. Payroll has increased as a percentage of sales - because of the big drop in sales. We never worried about that when sales were good. Nothing lasts forever. And fortunately, all my "working poor" life lessons are still stuck in my head. And this trend started a few years ago - so it's not a surprise to me... and I had some idea of what we would/could do to downsize even back then. Is it mean of me to resent actually being faced with the situation? Maybe. So far, I'm just letting the feeling rest in the back of my mind and not letting it take hold. Too much to do and I don't want to be stuck in negativity. I'm trying to find a middle path through keeping the balance sheet solid and taking care of my people.

Maybe it's synchronicity; but my investment guy called yesterday. With him, since he was a friend, he gets the full picture... and I put him to work for me on a couple things too. That's why they make those fees, IMO. I just need information right now... and no, I'm not investing any more under the circumstances. I have other options for the cash. And I'm fully capable of managing that myself.

B and I are in a good place. We're cozy; all the angst of a new relationship seems to be passing; getting lighter; the doubts, uncertainty, questioning on trust/emotional issues. Still nothing we can't discuss... but we don't navel gaze or nitpick through things much. We seem to be agreed on relationship structure and don't spend too much time thinking about the future given all the variables that are up in the air about it right now. Keeps expectations more grounded and reality-based.

My head is overfull of too much to think about again. And so far, it's not out of control coz I'm just picking one or two things per day to accomplish - and finding some interesting distractions for a time-out from all that. But Hol is a pretty good cohort in crime for brainstorming, planning, logistics, and just generally living one day at a time... so we're having a meeting of the minds this morning before my shopping run.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 22, 2020, 09:44:29 AM: Anyone else have the thought that sometimes we can become too attached to "looking at ourselves", "working on ourselves"... and it eventually becomes an escape? So that instead of DOING something different, or doing something ABOUT (changing) ourselves... we're just mesmerized and frozen in the self-care, self-analysis stage?

It's akin to just scrolling your feed on social media - in that it tricks the "monkey mind" into thinking it's "doing something" (and even assigning an importance to it)... when in reality, it's like playing solitaire - just passing time and hoping that something comes along that's different. No active participation; passively waiting for "life to happen".

Sure sometimes this does feed our sense of connection... but lately, I'm sensing it's more of a crutch for me. A diversion that I don't really need - but that I've convinced myself is important for my life.

:scratching my head: :stretching:

I dunno; maybe it's time I do less of this. Just Sunday morning rambling thoughts.

----------------------------------------------

I stumbled on an idea for a new kind of job, while having conversations re: Covid, the economy, my personal business side of things. I ran it past Hol, who is simply looking for a way to make money - that matters to other people. It is to become a combo babysitter/tutor while kids are at home in distance learning scenarios. I think she'd be good at that. And if it freed up parents to work... and keep their jobs... they could afford to pay her a decent weekly amount without breaking their budget. Kids would have some disciplinary oversight, and adult supervision/tech help/tutoring... and she would get to know a lot of the people around here and be of service. Not just taking & filling drive-thru orders. PLUS, she could take on as much or as little as she wanted... because we're talking the middle school cohort, where a lot of the kids are on staggered in-person schedules and they're almost at "latch key" maturity... but not quite.

Yes it means breaking isolation. But any job outside of at home would do that. Just sharing... because I know it fills a gap that exists in these new circumstances.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 22, 2020, 10:48:17 AM: I like the Hol-job idea except for how scary it might be if she brought the virus home to you and/or B. Asymptomatic carriers and such in others' homes. You are in a tough dilemma right now with the business and I assume the mountain has carrying costs that aren't going away. Post-vaccine, though, things will get better.

With her film experience, I wish Hol could develop some online materials for education, if there's not a glut in the market. If she got certified as a teacher (much of which can happen online) it'd be awesome though not instant. When schools open again safely, maybe she could work as a substitute around the area? Ten years ago my D made $200/day doing that, which really surprised me. (No education degree required.)

Regarding the family company (and I'm thinking you'll have already thought of virtually every possibility, but wth)...is there any possibility that with a new administration supporting green jobs development and infrastructure, that the company could retool in some way (or part of it) to make greener thingamajigs? Of course that's probably very expensive too. Does it already do any government contracts? Women-or-minority-owned businesses are often eligible for contracts at the top of the list. (The last company I worked for became employee-owned, which was also an interesting process to go through.)

Rambling jumble and I really don't know enough about your business to fantasize, and you are grounded in the reality of it, whatever shape that is. I know it's hard.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on November 22, 2020, 11:29:21 AM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on November 22, 2020, 09:44:29 AM
Anyone else have the thought that sometimes we can become too attached to "looking at ourselves", "working on ourselves"... and it eventually becomes an escape? So that instead of DOING something different, or doing something ABOUT (changing) ourselves... we're just mesmerized and frozen in the self-care, self-analysis stage?

Skep, yes. Absolutely. For me it's been a bit like that thing when you decide you want to buy a certain kind of car - and then everywhere you go you see that make and model, even though you'd not really noticed them before. Counseling helped me more than I can ever put into words, I think, as have many self help type things, and all of you guys on here, but I think it also made me notice very little thing a person does and made me hyper aware of my own dysfunction/triggers/aspects of my personality that I'm not keen on. I had a thing in my head for a long time that I needed to become a perfectly functioning human but, of course, there's no such thing. I'm finding accepting my own faults and just letting them be harder than accepting other people's, which is odd. But yes, I think it is very possible to avoid action by over analysing and inadvertently paralysing ourselves in the process.

And yes to the child minding slightly older kids thing - I think a lot of families are struggling with those sorts of issues at the moment and paying someone else to sit with them for at least part of the day is probably cheaper than one parent having to give up work or cut their hours right down. It sounds like a good plan xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on November 22, 2020, 11:30:55 AM: Oh I meant to just quote the bit you said and I don't know how to change it now, hopefully it makes sense lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 22, 2020, 01:40:17 PM: Quote
I'm finding accepting my own faults and just letting them be harder than accepting other people's, which is odd.

Oh AMEN.
And again!

May be odd but it's the core of self-doubt, self-criticism, and when it's bad, even self-loathing.

So love for our real inner child, the kind friend voice in our heads first and foremost, alla that...needs to become the main show, not a guest appearance. Imo.

It's what I need, anyway. Even the smallest "wins" over the critical inner voice feel like sunlight breaking right through the ceiling.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 22, 2020, 04:53:51 PM: AHA!

That "inner critic" that motivates me to just get on with what I know I need to do... does come with a particular identifiable voice of my mom. Perhaps I need to swap that for my own "mom voice"; give the critic a voice-over makeover...

Might give that a try; see if it's possible; see if it changes effectiveness any.

Can't hurt.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 22, 2020, 05:04:40 PM: Are you supposed to be "effective" on steroids???

You're already the most insanely hardworking and productive person I've known, in the real physical world anyway. (M is champion in the intellectual, books-and-articles world.)

Sheesh. Mebbe that voice can be just your KIND adult inner voice. Not bashing you about effectiveness and productivity exclusively...equally pleased with you when you laze and relax and create or ... well, cupcakes. (Available for productivity encouragement when needed, but not as her only lines in the play.)

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 23, 2020, 08:34:31 AM: Hops, at this point in my life the scales tip a lot more into the lazing, thinking, vegetating side of things than say 20 years ago. I get that's a natural thing - and I have fully enjoyed (and almost stagnated) - in that place. I've even guarded and defended that place, for awhile. Protective of the chance to, for once, do THAT to my heart's content. For me, I feel better - physically and emotionally - when I'm up and moving and not in my head so much. The things I want only come from some ONE putting in the efforts to "make it so".

Oh, it's lovely when someone offers to do it for me. But it also denies me that opportunity to keep active and push myself to do a little more... which is how I increase what I CAN do. I had to have that conversation with friend John when he was here. He was oh so helpful... but I am working on re-inventing how I get things done. Motivate myself. Do things my own old-ass self. It was wonderful to have some years just for contemplation; I really needed that time.

This is a different wavelength; different gear... and while I'll still take whatever time I need to look inward... I don't really NEED that much anymore. I'm restless to get my body moving and doing... that will put the final polish on the work I did sitting on the sofa, sleeping, throwing the clock, calendar and responsibility to others -- to the 4 winds.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 23, 2020, 10:48:02 AM: What's nice is how well you both know and champion yourself, Amber. I really like your confidence in what works well and makes things better, and what doesn't.

I'm just going to work on being inspired. I personally have taken contemplation into what you referenced earlier, almost a paralysis of over-reflection.

I've learned to avoid action, the discomforts of moving after too much sedentary behavior (and the falls). I am just going to have to gut it out to get moving consistently again.

Small steps ARE okay, but I need to take some every day. And what you do with your life really is invigorating to read about. Thanks for sharing it. I know when I read about you relaxing I think it's important, as though I know you're overdoing...but I don't really have a reason to conclude that.

Long caregiving habits give me tendencies to look at others' massive productivity accounts with concern instead of celebration, which is dumb. You've been creating your own balance (and very successfully) for years.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 24, 2020, 07:50:25 AM: Thanks Hops.

But I haven't done anything much different. Just stopped bullshitting myself - ie, pretending to be what I'm not and it's now much easier for me to navigate things in life - just being "me" without layers in between. I got out of my own way. Since it feels good to do this - maybe that's the reason it seems I have more confidence? It's not buried under the illusion of massive effort or work or elaborate theories (artist's statements, oh my) of how/why I do things.

Kinda going minimalist and simple with my interface with the world right now. (Will it last? Stay tuned next week! LOLOLOL)

Sigh. 5 years ago, I didn't know that on this date, in the morning, that Mike would be gone by 5 pm. I knew it was inevitable; we were all simply waiting. Thanksgiving was the 25th that year. I remember - but there aren't any big feelings around it anymore. I've done a LOT of processing in 5 yrs, about our relationship... the good, bad & ugly. There isn't any big "hole" that needs filled in my life; I just let it heal and became whole again.

So, when Hol needed a place to land and put herself back together again - I had me to give, again. This time, she was able to give back - actively. The work we've done together - by ourselves and collaboratively - has helped each other be stronger and clearer than either of us were before. Mz. Talk Everything To Death, Hol.... kinda taught me how to "use my words" to talk about feelings better. LOL. I've been teaching her that she's big enough to contain even her most intense emotions... and let them sort out before taking action to relieve the volcano.

THEN, a year or so later, the occasional phone calls w/Buck turned into an active problem-solving situation - the work my vehicles needed. I just asked him recently how he decided to come all that way, just to get me out of a mechanical meltdown. It's over 500 miles. He was in-between surgeries, dealing with infection... watching his business get torn apart by ne'er-do-well partner. He didn't need a flailing woman putting out an SOS for the cavalry (w/tools & experience).

He said he felt something from his distance; wasn't sure what it was. And that decided him to make the trip - to find out what it was. LOLOL. Yeah, he found out all right. It's been decades & decades since I was that "forward". It kinda came outta nowhere for me, too. We were, at the time, friends. Had a history of talking to each other about our lives, back & forth... and the things we were interested in.

Watching him work, cooking for him while he worked... it felt like we were having an emotional level conversation; back & forth exchange emotionally. He was down the hill at the studio garage... but there was still an exchange. I know I've been talking about fantasy a lot lately; I've spent the days since June 14, 2019 trying to figure out WHAT this was... because I wasn't imagining it; it was happening when I sat next to or opposite him, talking too. It still happens.

With cell service getting unreliable here... I've seen texts stack up before they come in from him. And there are up to hour delays now delivering messages. But we still have this weird communication connection. We know when each other is asleep... or preoccupied over something; he knows when Hol & I are in deep discussion; and we know when we're missing each other -- without the words going back & forth.

Because I had no trust that this wasn't just my imagination or fantasy, I didn't just jump at first. It was pretty obvious to everyone that I was keeping a good bit of me, "in reserve". Not letting him in and not sharing that; not at that point. But over time, that connection convinced me to tentatively trust that he wasn't playing me... and the next visit a year later, whatever that connection is was even stronger.

Strong enough not to be devastated or immoblized by yet more physical distance and "waiting"... while he finishes tying up the loose ends of his life there. I have things to do, too. I think this is the most amazing thing; this connection that doesn't diminish even when we can't be together for months or a year. The total independence that's possible for each of us; without even tarnishing the commitment & connection. It's a marvel to me because I've not ever experienced - or even read fictional descriptions - of such a possibliity. Maybe Outlander is that, a little.

I am romanticizing and idealizing a bit much over this I guess. Oddly, on this day of all days too. But I don't feel disloyal to Mike; it was what it was; what we were to each other and I don't have any regrets or guilt anymore about it. People die. And we remember them -- but we are still free to share love with others, IMO. If it sparks again. I was OK if it didn't; and I'm simply awed that it did and in such a distinctly all at once way. That first 12 hours with Buck - I was able to see who he is; I "knew" him... (even though Hol says/believes this is not possible) and it was like finally being "home" again. It's a special weird thing; and he felt it too.

I think we tend to recognize others of our "tribe" -- and that is way more and way different than just having genetics or this-life experiences in common. I know I've met many over the years. People I haven't seen in years... yet could sit down with them today and it would be as if we'd gotten together the day before. People in our "Korass" to borrow yet another Vonnegut term.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 24, 2020, 11:44:19 AM: That's a beautiful saga, Amber.

And it doesn't matter if it seems like a mystical-Outlanderish connection or however feels right to describe it, because it is working for you. You're doing trust. In the universe, in him, but most of all in yourself.

I'm just tickled to read it. Your perspective on Mike is wise too. Warts and all, and you truly loved the man. And now you're accepting the gift of B to love. People die, we all will, but the capacity to choose to love does not.

It's wonderful. It was good to read also how much you and Hol have been healing and learning, too. I'm really glad things are settling down for her. Absence (meaning out of your house) really has helped the heart grow fonder, and what a relief.

Your patience and peace around waiting for Buck is really a lovely kind of strength and I'm so impressed you can do that so well. Next time he comes through the stones, you'll probably put waffles on a plate for him just as he comes through the door.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 25, 2020, 11:23:24 AM: LOL... or run away totally freaked out that he's here permanently Hops. (I don't THINK I will, but I do acknowledge it feels a little scary; which could just be "the unknown future" freaking me out a little. Or exhilarated excitement & overwhelming joy that gets translated in my warped brain as fear.)

There isn't much left on his to-do list anymore. The retirement stuff has been happening; he didn't think to tell me; I had to ask. Now, all he needs is his new VA card officially registering his "seperated" status - then he can come here and start over with new doctors. (Already got recommendations from my nurse step-daughter). Most of his appts/docs still see him - but they're absolutely not providing any treatments; just a way to ding the insurance for an office visit.

His D is home for T'giving and he's helping her with DMV stuff so she can have her vote actually count (her temporary license was expired on election day; so she was a provisional ballot) and can take a car back to school with her next semester. I think she'll be able to live off campus too - which will be better than living in a dorm, virus wise. She's working too; on campus food vendor.

That leaves just listing the house and getting it sold. (Which can happen after he moves, as long as someone keeps the yard tidy. Sometimes that can be arranged thru the realtor.) And of course - there's the purging and packing going on. My hunters have offered to help him move a big piece of shop equipment - they're truckers. So that's an option for the actual move.

Hol is having a friend over for dinner tomorrow; they've decided to do funny dress-up black tie. Not the traditional dinner either; she's either making tamales or something along those lines. Yes - separating our daily life has been very helpful for all of us. Even S is speaking to me more often, like a real person does. LOLOL.

I'm dragging my feet about getting moving today; I need to run to a local shop - to look for Christmas gift stuff and make pumpkin pie. I'm doing a more traditional dinner for myself - and either reading or finding a new "epic saga" to watch when I finish Downton Abbey. There are some work decisions I have to do today - but I'm hoping email was the extent of it.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 26, 2020, 01:57:27 PM: Amber, you just sound so clear, and solid, and well-anchored both within yourself and in your activity.

Dunno quite how to explain it, but I just feel happier and happier reading you these days. I don't think it's ALL to do with your having found love with B, but that's surely part of it.

It's as though finding that new space for your heart-life has grounded all the rest of your life, while you participate in and weather all its ups and downs.

I am so very happy for and about you!

big hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 26, 2020, 03:29:09 PM: B might've been a catalyst - but I think what happened is something huge shifted, remember my 16-ton turkey buzzard? I got out of my own way... and lifted the prohibitions I had in place - to keep me "safe". What it was doing was simply shutting off my connection to other people and the world.

DIRECT is more the word I'd use about me these days; I am directly my self and feel just as, if not more, safe this way than the overly guarded self I used to be.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on November 27, 2020, 06:24:06 AM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on November 26, 2020, 03:29:09 PM

DIRECT is more the word I'd use about me these days; I am directly my self and feel just as, if not more, safe this way than the overly guarded self I used to be.

That is chiming with me so much just now, Skep, and I'm not really straight enough about it in my own mind to explain why but yes, I get it. Almost like being strong enough now to be unguarded which is safer - the risks have reduced? And so putting your true self out there is attracting the right sort? Instead of the guarded self which inadvertently invites those who will trample on you? I can't find the right words just now but I think I get it. And if it is what I think it is, then I'm delighted for you! Lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 27, 2020, 10:36:49 AM: Thanks Tupp. Yes, I think you do know exactly what I'm trying to find words for.

I was kinda watching this; observing; yesterday. I had no choice but to call my "problem child" and resolve an issue. After all these years, she'll be 44 this year, she broke down & bawled like a baby... proclaiming she just wanted to talk to her mommy. (I've had her blocked on my phone for exactly a year so she couldn't do that; for my own peace of mind. And to protect myself from being re-hurt.) For 30 years - I was the last person she cared about. And true to form - her words said one thing, but all she wanted to talk about was herself. No interest in my plans for the day, my life - or whether I was healthy. Nada. I did get a token apology when I told her what I did - and that the reason I did is because she'd said some terribly ugly and hurtful things to me. Way more direct about my thoughts, feelings and how that informed my actions. Nothing bad happened. She doesn't care enough about me to be upset about that.

Then, I spent the evening at the hut. S had an old girlfriend - that he's still friends with - over. I took pie & whipped cream and we just hung out. Us girls had a nice giggle-chat; and I could talk business and Covid with the friend. I actually conversed w/S too... he seems more relaxed in the house HE lives in, than being in MY house. LOLOL. OK, whatever, that's probably pretty common. Nothing felt weird or uptight... but then, I've never felt that anywhere Hol lived. It was nice little evening and I had plenty of time to myself.

I'm taking a lot MORE, too. This weekend. Making some wooly bullies (moth repellent sachets) for a friend's gift and doing some more financial/farm planning... and decisions. Mama Captain is taking the ship full speed ahead.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on November 27, 2020, 12:38:23 PM: That's amazing, Amber. I admire your courage in letting your hurtful D back in, to some degree. I'm sorry she's still not mature enough to notice you as a human being rather than solely parent-to-blame. The estrangement expert, Dr. Jonathan Coleman, says in his books parents of estranged adult children can NEVER expect to be seen and heard that way. Even a token apology would be something amazing to me.

I'm so glad you had a happy evening at the hut and have got your mojo back! It really does seem as though you have an entirely new chapter underway and it's wonderful to hear about.

Hope the mountain always gives you back more strength and inspiration.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on November 27, 2020, 01:20:11 PM: Buck says he sees more frequent evidence of my strut returning. (Bob Seger tune... "He loves to watch her strut") It has literally been since the 80s when I had that - despite my difficulties living as a single mom, and then art school & the always-right, stubborn, perfectionist that was Ex#2.

There are a couple different versions of the strut. Sometimes, it's because I know I physically look good (oh, vanity... never goes away) and that usually happens when I'm feeling good. There's the "going to conquer the world no matter what" strut. And then, "I know something you don't know" strut... LOLOLOL.

Fairly harmless, and I don't bother with worrying about other people's reaction to it - because I'm truly not trying to make anyone feel less than - or that I'm any better than anyone. It used to be a "thing" for me though; that trying to be invisible so I wouldn't attract either unwanted attention or I was so over-responsible about other people's feelings that I would dim my light so as not to be a reason for them feeling bad. I think all I accomplished with that "thing" was simply adding tense energy to interactions. For everyone.

Now onward to taking care of a bit of a list of tasks; nothing heavy-duty... maybe a little fun, too.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 02, 2020, 10:18:52 AM: Phew. Most of my Christmas shopping is done. Hol is a tough one this year. I even found a present for S this year. I am only buying things that I know people will really use this year. I saw a pair of supersoft & fuzzy slippers that I thought Hol would like (and I did too)... they're backordered until Jan/Feb!! Why are they in the catalogue then?

Maybe I'll order her a pallet of paver blocks. LOL. The mud around the hut is pervasive. I can always get her trail bologna & a wheel of baby swiss. :D

I made a list of ingredients to get for ALL the things I might possibly bake for Christmas, except for maybe Lebkuchen... which seems redundant with the frosted gingerbread cake. Most of what I'm considering is more candy than cookies this year. Fudge, pralines, marshmallows... and the like.

I haven't cut greens yet, because it's COLD out there and the wind is fierce. Have a feeling Hol & I will meet up in studio later today or tomorrow. So woodstove duty takes up time - but it's oh so worth it when the wind is blowing. But between the kitchen and woodstove - I'm running the steps a lot to keep everything moving along just right. I may have a commission to make another anorak, like I made Buck but in wool, over the winter, too. For a friend.

Things are moving along on B's end but no word yet on whether he'll be here around Christmas or not. Construction is now in winter mode - all weather dependent. There is a load of materials for framing out Hol's garage coming next week. They still need to finish the deck railings and build steps down to the field off there. She's painting baseboards, a little every day; has some fake greens & lights up over her huge doors.

And I'm still getting plenty of "rip van winkle" time. Started from the beginning in Outlander, again. Something to watch that isn't dependent on my cell signal. Trying to see if I can associate it with my life, for a third iteration... mental exercises about emotions kinda. LOLOL. Who knows what I'll stumble across?

Both B and I are getting antsy about getting him moved here. But once again - I feel it's required that I take stock and analyze what I currently know about both of us. I think, to quiet the monkey mind's refrain about looking before you leap. If nothing showed up in over a year with getting to know him, inside & out, I don't want to manufacture anything to fuss over from my fears & triggers, ya know? I won't get around to it, if I keep myself focused on other things that require me to concentrate a little.

Business is going to quietly run into the start of the new year without any major drama. Guy in charge found one place we can save a big chunk of change in the health insurance that doesn't drastically impact the employees in exchange for potential raises next year (dependent on sales); we've cut the Christmas bonuses this year - but everyone will still get one. We should still be in the black this year; just barely - but that does reduce the taxes that bro & I will pay.

My BRAIN is over-active with all this stuff. But my body still hasn't gotten out of my cozy bed nest yet. LOLOL. So, it's about time I get them synchronized a little closer and headed in the same general direction.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on December 02, 2020, 01:26:59 PM: You sound happy, busy and pretty content to me, Amber.

Go cut greens when the wind dies down. It's spectacular at my Dad's farm right now. Perfect for missing and decorating for Christmas.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 06, 2020, 09:39:21 AM: Christmas Kitchen Wench needs to get out of bed and dressed and start her shift today - yesterday was almond & hazelnut biscotti, today is Alaska Molasses cookies (kind of a lace cookie) and MAYBE something else on the list. But it's C O L D out; Hol's been proposing a studio day all week and neither of us has made it yet (she's busy at the hut). I haven't heard from her yet, so no idea what might happen today.

Stinker hurt one of his back legs while I was out, last week. And he's still limping. Vet x-rayed him, but couldn't get the image to load and hasn't called me back yet. Kitty's not in pain, just can't put weight on it and it might be dislocated; not broken - he's still zoomy around the house, even stairs - and it's not swollen. It did hurt for a couple days. I smooshed a low dose aspirin and put some crumbs in his food. Time to feed the little monsty too. Before Freddy the Fat (coz he's been eating Stink's food) comes back in.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 10, 2020, 08:42:13 AM: And I'm crashing pretty hard. Last couple of early mornings - why are all my "have tos" hitting at this time of year? on top of Christmas? - 3 early mornings this week, no downtime... move move move.

Stinker's xray did show dislocation & swelling; vet is recommending better imagery and an orthopedic vet - because he's worried the growth plate in that knee might have a hairline fracture. I'm supposed to keep a 4 month old ACTIVE kitten in a carrier except for 30 minutes a day. RIIIIIIIIIIIGGGGGGHHHHHTTTT. What about litter box? What about muscular atrophy? Especially for a growing kitten. And he quickly slipped out of the harness I have for him, so leash isn't going to work -- his gymnastics to eat the leash are worse for him than just moving on his own.

I'm trying to get an appt with a vet qualified to do the imagery; then my choices equal surgery or putting him down, according to my usual vet. Because he will always be lame; my "free" in/out cat. According to this vet. Because of a silly injury. Except he's NOT lame. He is getting around - and very quickly too - despite that leg. I have some medication for him, pain reliever & anti-inflammatory; except he hasn't seemed to be in pain - both Hol & I have felt that joint and no reaction from him. Not till the vet tried to pop the joint back with concurrent swelling preventing it.

So, if I can get more imagery and a second opinion, I'll go from there. He's restricted to the bedroom and bath for now. Can't do much jumping in here and reinjure himself.

There's more baking I want to do - but I've also got some errands to run, too. More "have-tos". Stink will have to wait for me, in the carrier while I'm gone. If I can keep him "quiet" - a relative term - and get the swelling down, he may be able to pop the knee cap himself - he's been stretching that leg out behind him a lot. Trying.

Bad dreams this week - most involving Mike. Hol's had 'em too. And I haven't slept well. Watched The Call of the Wild with Harrison Ford; and it made me cry... woke up crying this morning too. I think I've just exhausted myself; nothing else to give. Anyone. Maybe I can send Hol to the store...
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on December 10, 2020, 09:30:30 AM: Oh Skep, I'm really sorry to read that you've crashed a bit. So much going on for you and you've had a lot of stress to deal with for such a long time now (often other people's! Such is life). And now poor kitty as well. Second opinion sounds like a good idea. I'm no expert but I've seen so many pets adapt to whatever injuries or difficulties they have so I hope someone else can suggest something more positive. Would dearly love to be there just now to make you cups of tea, run errands and keep you tucked up on the sofa watching films and giving yourself some much needed TLC. I hope you're able to go at a bit of a slower pace for a while and let everything catch up and settle down again xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 10, 2020, 10:47:15 AM: It'll be OK Tupp; it always is.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on December 10, 2020, 12:32:49 PM: Rest ((((Amber))))
Cry when it comes up...just let it all come out without stopping it.

It's going to be ok.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 10, 2020, 10:41:28 PM: Quote
3 early mornings this week, no downtime... move move move.

Maybe "downtime" is uptime.
The chance to float, to rest, to let yourself lift on the currents of what YOUR life force wants you to do. Nobody's else's.

Comfort here for you. Any time.

Big hugs, chamomile, quiet, stillness and peace--

Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 11, 2020, 07:20:27 AM: 4th early morning; only open time orthopedic vet could see Stinker yet this week is 10 this morning. One, maybe two days of sleep schedule adjustment I can handle - not this many. My whole being rebels.

Didn't help that Hol kept picking at me - to the point of implying that I was selfish - for not running myself into the ground to try to help the poor little kitten that can't help himself. Great teaching moment, though - I think she heard me, when I said if I don't take care of myself FIRST I can't take care of kitten... and being badgered about it, was counterproductive. The words that came out of my mouth weren't so tactful. Told her to back off; she wasn't helping me get past feeling overwhelmed by constantly pushing me to do - in that very moment - the opposite of what I needed to do. And barely taking a breath before she presented yet another reason or option or personal opinion about me simply not being ABLE to step up and do exactly what she would do - and suffer no ill effects. She goes non-stop when she's "on a mission".

Last night's sleep was better. Going over the mountain this morning was NOT on my agenda and I'm missing all the decent weather to take care of some things that need doing here - not to mention the baking. But Stinker has been super-cuddly; I think the medicine is helping. But the virus protocols bother me; I don't like not being in the exam room with him - because I see things the Doc doesn't see about kitty's reactions.

This is mostly about having my schedule - and my sense of autonomy - completely blown to hell, as I'm at the mercy of the vet's schedules. Just like Mike's dr. appts... plus covid protocols... plus being in the mindset to accomplish OTHER kinds of things... plus missing B... plus just the dumb holiday pressure crap -- which yet again, is so completely disupted from "normal" it just doesn't feel anything close to "right".

Shopping this year, has been all online - and I'm fighting items being backordered; and not finding out until after I've checked out... and shipping mixups - not just with my change of address, but the mail in general. Everyone I know is purging their home... so what to buy that isn't going to be just taking up more space?? Yes, I got creative... to get around that. I still haven't cut any greens yet.

Both jeeps needed minor work & inspections this month... and Hol is transferring her old jeep to me to register as a farm use vehicle - and that's waiting till next week. Then there's the financial stuff, business, etc. Most importantly - I get into "fight mode" when other people attempt to impose what they believe my priorities, and therefore my schedule should be. Mind yer own damn business, and I'll mind mine.

So, exhaustion. Thankfully - it doesn't seem like anyone feels the need to travel & get together this year. That would send me right over the edge; B already has his hands full trying to keep me grounded - even though he's just as busy. He's tolerant of my long silences - because I've been in the car so much and I just can't talk/text and drive at the same time. For some reason it's easier if someone is sitting next to me, but the technology crap shuts down my driving response. So I just don't do it in the car.

And to top it off - she was trying to tell me her way of overcoming my feeling exhausted and overwhelmed with "too much at once"...... LOLOLOLOLOLOL..... as if ANYONE could do the same to her and she wouldn't just throw something and walk away. I don't need anyone to manage my feelings, thank ye just the same. I just need the time/space to do it myself. Jeezeeeee Louise.

I think she's bored. But she rejected my offers to come with me on some of these excursions. She has to stop 3-4 places and take her time looking at things while I just go get what I want and get home again. And that's just perfectly FINE... we be different. And she's free to do as she likes; I only want the same.

:P
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 11, 2020, 08:01:45 AM: I just sent this to Hol; she identifies strongly with being an empath. But as described above - she dives across the co-dependent line (just as I do) a little more than she should. Puts on the super-hero cape, ya know? It's very helpful to hear the descriptions of both compared, explained, and what the healthier options are.

It's just very very clear, heard this way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_gW-u3CB8I
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 11, 2020, 01:17:49 PM: Fantasy script:

A feels overwhelmed with too much to do. Shares that with H.

H has choices
1) Mom, you're incompetent and clearly ready for a nursing home.
2) I've got time, how about letting me take Stinker in for his checkup?

Is Hol able to drive? If so, be nice if you were able to delegate something like a vet visit. Surely she's competent to bring you a clear summary.

I'm trying to figure out if maybe an Amber-has-to-do-everything-herself mood is in play? Or if it's that there are other reasons it doesn't feel right to delegate a Stinker vet visit to anyone else.

I'm also figuring out that the interpersonal tensions are way more complex and nuanced than I'm getting, which makes sense. So guessing it might also be intrapersonal is just that, a guess. Feel free to toss my thoughts or tell me to stop over-interpreting That Which I Do Not Completely Understand!

I'm just really sorry you're feeling this way, Amber. I hope soon the stress will reduce and you can relax. All the ordering and worrying about this equipment or that tool, etc. sounds really tiring to me too. Toss in holidays and a pandemic....

Big hugs, more chamomile, more opting out of That Which is Not Essential....
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on December 12, 2020, 01:25:50 PM: I watched twice, Amber. Great message. Thanks for posting it.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 12, 2020, 05:23:51 PM: I liked it too.

Having a quiet day. Watching the Hobbit. :D

Hops - Hol did offer to drive kitty. But time & effort wasn't the main issue. It was her trying to make the decisions about my kitty... and the prioritization of kitty's needs over human needs. All I really needed was a few hours of peace & quiet instead of having an argument thrown at me every 5 minutes. And I couldn't just ignore her; she'd show up and continue making her case. Sigh.

We worked it out. All is well. She is very much like her dog - a pitbull - when she thinks a little too much of her "right" to step across boundaries and there is a poor defenseless creature who isn't being tended to her standards. Stinker isn't in pain; and he's even getting around OK. I opted for more information, better imaging and a second opinion from the orthopedic surgeon vet. They'll send me an estimate for surgery - which apparently is quite pricey, and doesn't guarantee he won't reinjure it later doing something else he shouldn't. He is saying the surgery isn't absolutely necessary - but Stinker will probably be more of a house cat, than outside cat. And always limp.

His point was many people in the world don't have access or money for adequate healthcare; and to spend so much on a cat - even one as sweet as Stinker - is an odd ordering of priority. No mention of having to put the cat down by Dr. Morales either. Stinker wasn't going to go outside till spring anyway.

Now there's a chance of a decent snow mid-week. Things should be real quiet then. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 12, 2020, 08:02:41 PM: I understand, Amber, that makes sense.

If Stinky isn't in pain I'd be content with a mild limp and indoor life.
If $$ doesn't permit more extensive treatment.

Much as I am in love with pets, I've always felt I'd never give
them chemo, for example. Rather a gentle appointment for a gentle exit.

I'd also not like anyone else, family or not, telling me what to do with a pet I love and have accepted responsibility for. I'm sure you'd never let Stinks suffer.

(I do get the picture about Hol's pushing. My D gave me a great deal of grief about my final appointment for our previous dog, whom I loved deeply. She just didn't want her to go and I, who had observed B-dog closely day in and out for years, knew the joy of life had left her and she was dealing with both chronic pain and incontinence. She 'told me' she was ready. In fact, another time I'd even do it somewhat sooner.)

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on December 13, 2020, 01:05:32 AM: Well Skep, my kitty means as much to me as any human (in fact she means more than most humans do to me!) so I completely understand getting different opinions, accepting a 'less than perfect but still very nice life' option if that becomes the best one available and spending as much money as is available if that's needed. I have spent a small fortune on my cat over the years but it's what's kept her healthy so it's money well spent. I was watching an animal rescue programme yesterday (I am a sucker for those rescue shows) and two cats had legs amputated after accidents and both were whizzing around on three legs without a care in the world. So I don't imagine a pain free limp is going to hold Stinky back much in the future. It sounds like you're doing the sensible, rational thing to me. Maybe you need a number code to get in the front door that you can change when you need a bit of peace and quiet ;) Lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 13, 2020, 07:23:41 AM: Tupp - that's funny about the doors, 'coz those are the locks on the Hut. She has a key to my place - a precaution that's sensible. But out here, we don't lock the doors. Yet. Don't have to.

Yes, I think a reasonable amount of care & repair for pets - especially for pain relief - is essential. But I'm not going to spend more for more care for an animal than many humans get. This surgery can cost a grand or so. And then, there's the really long recovery period which will make eating & kittybox a challenge to say the least - AND hurt more.

The first vet jumped to the extreme worst-case scenario - and according to the surgeon, a lot of the potential consequences apply more to dogs than cats. But since I knew kitty wasn't in pain it shocked & scared me to hear all that. So I declined his referral to his preferred surgeon - who he said was only in Winchester a couple days a week anyway - and called another one of my choosing. And when Hol heard the worst-case - she immediately jumped to: must save kitty at all costs mode. Her anxiety has been just a tad intense lately (virus stuff).

That's where her lawyerly argumentative characteristic comes from too. She only pauses long enough to breathe and find another angle to a) guilt someone into doing what she thinks is the correct thing to do and b) appeal to reason using all the available logical consequences of each choice -- in a biographical, footnoted exhaustive fashion. Anxiety and competitiveness (I will be the MOST comprehensively caring person EVAH) contribute to this. I know this about her, not a surprise. And sometimes it's actually a good characteristic. It has it's uses.

I was juggling way more that week than I normally have to - and deadlines were involved too. So her coming at me, that way, wasn't helpful to ME. And she simply didn't want to hear about my feelings - or acknowledge them as "the right feelings" for the situation. Previously, my fight/flight reflex would've reacted as if she were a threat. I could see it start to build... so that's why I told her to back off. It's a little raw; but it's direct and a warning about a boundary. And she doesn't take stuff like that personally. We can say worse than that to each other w/o repercussions or spiraling. Situationally dependent of course.

Stinker knew; and gave me some cuddle time right then... and in 5-10 minutes the whole overwhelm state had passed. Hol & I parsed the whole interaction later. I think she finally "saw" how her doing what she fully believes is the right thing to do - goading someone else into her way of thinking/action-oriented response, at whatever cost to oneself - isn't always the best tack to take. She even linked it to the origin of this behavior. So it really did turn out to be a teaching moment... and she'll be more intentional about when to apply that in the future. That behavior is why a lot of people label her as "intense". And while it has it's place - it's not a universally applicable interpersonal strategy.

And I think we uncovered another layer on her deeper anxiety too. For the first time, she grieved over some of her personal life choices and just really WAS the feeling. As cerebral as I am -- she puts me to shame. But I've learned how to let myself just FEEL my feeling till it passes. She's just beginning. I think it'll help her some. I know it relieved a lot of internal pressure that she was trying to keep contained with logic and rationality.

I'm going to try to appeal to her need to physically work today - there are a few things we have to do in preparation if there really is going to be upwards of a foot of snow here next week.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 13, 2020, 08:54:08 AM: PS - I'm actually feeling much better now. Like I said - everything passes. None of this is earth-shatteringly devastating either. Just daily, run o' the mill variations.

And I know why-fore it seems every day it's someone else's turn. So trying to maintain constancy as I can. ;)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 13, 2020, 02:00:08 PM: Glad it's lifting, (((((Amber))))).

Imo, it's good that you honored and articulated your UNhappy feelings while they were surging. For me, doing that is half the reason things can pass and change.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 13, 2020, 04:55:34 PM: Back to Kitchen Wench mode (and we're all ready for a foot of snow - so now we probably won't get it; note to self: look for snowshoes). Just need to clean woodstove and split some kindling again.

Today's confection - Chocolate dipped coconut macaroons. I want to make a quick batch of fudge and dark chocolate sea salt caramels... then leave everything else to Christmas week. Pistachio shortbread, mixed nut chocolate covered toffee... etc. Whatever I feel up for. Of course, I wanted to make "everything" - including the homemade marshmallows. Backing off; spreading it out; it's gonna be a long winter.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on December 14, 2020, 12:46:49 AM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on December 13, 2020, 04:55:34 PM
Back to Kitchen Wench mode (and we're all ready for a foot of snow - so now we probably won't get it; note to self: look for snowshoes). Just need to clean woodstove and split some kindling again.

Today's confection - Chocolate dipped coconut macaroons. I want to make a quick batch of fudge and dark chocolate sea salt caramels... then leave everything else to Christmas week. Pistachio shortbread, mixed nut chocolate covered toffee... etc. Whatever I feel up for. Of course, I wanted to make "everything" - including the homemade marshmallows. Backing off; spreading it out; it's gonna be a long winter.

Oh my days, Skep, that all sounds delicious. I am on a diet :) I'm going to imagine I'm eating all of those delights while I work my way through an apple :) Lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 14, 2020, 06:42:03 AM: EVIL! Pure EVIL!
How could you do this to me....

Fatwood.
I ordered fatwood.
$tupid but will make it easy.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on December 14, 2020, 07:54:11 AM: Hmmmm....homeade caramel. Yum.

Light
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 14, 2020, 09:24:45 AM: STOPPPPPPP!

LOL.

Dunno why I've lost VESMB emoticons.

:)
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 14, 2020, 10:31:51 AM: Well there's 1/2 an inch of wet sticky white stuff all over everything this morning. And still giant snowflakes are coming down; looks to be another couple hours. (Big storm supposed to be day after tomorrow.) I WAS gonna make a quick run into my little town this morning - but it turned white too quick. So yes, caramel - and I'm thinking gingerbread marshmallows for hot chocolate too.

I DO apologize - I'm not trying to fuel temptation for anyone - but this is my way of tuning out every damn thing I think is wrong and abnormal right now. The vast collection of things I'm making is for multiple boxes I'm giving away to others next week - trying to spread peace & goodwill to select people who are probably feeling the dissonance of these times as intensely as I am. And it keeps me moving, organized and busy - instead of plunked in front of a screen and getting pulled into bad news or escaping into fiction. So will shovelling the white stuff. LOL. It's not just a "southern thing" - we did that a lot in the mennonite tradtion too. Food is the universal love language. :D

But first - I must go clean up the woodstove after the last fire and make some logs smaller. Fatwood is good for easy firestarting, Hops. I also use the compressed paper briquets (but they aren't really necessary this year; my wood is dry and well seasoned this year). Do the dishes, take a quick shower... and perhaps make my run out this afternoon. But my postoffice is closed for lunch between 1 & 2; and I need to send a bunch of certified mail.

There were some very interesting, open and honest and romantic statements made last night in B's & my "private text time". Things are moving along from both our sides to make this move of his happen. I'm happy with what he feels (happy) and how he expresses that. The separation we're living with right now doesn't seem to be a hindrance to feelings - yes, physical proximity would be LOVELY - but it's only going to postpone his final transfer here. We have so more than physicality to base this partnership on that the distance isn't that hard to bear.

We're both kinda surprised about that, actually. I realized this morning, that this relationship is very very very different from anything I've experienced in the past - and the reason I'm not seeing any of the things I fear (from past experience) is because of that huge difference. It doesn't seem fair to keep feeling afraid of stuff that doesn't exist with him & I. Especially when I can just be happy instead. Yeah, challenges and obstacles - life - is still gonna happen. But we work really well together and will just deal with it. I'm not over-extending myself; doing too much. And he's holding down his end - without interfering with mine - too. And still we just want to be together.

I am completely flummoxed trying to find a description or definition of what kind of relationship this is. It's got about everything in it. So I'm just letting it be what it is and not trying to "file" it in any category. (That would be a limitation, methinks.)
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 15, 2020, 07:56:03 AM: Just TEASING you about the treats production, hon...
I was laughing and delighted by it. I'm happy for you
that you have such a lovely outlet and also for the folks
who are lucky enough to receive that joyful baked bounty!

Also soooooo happy to read your description of what's happening
with you a Buck. Damn, girl. You have hit the love jackpot, sounds like.

Gotta go tidy up so the cleaning person can do her healing magic
this afternoon.

Hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 15, 2020, 08:35:22 AM: Today is "intermission" between white sticky stuff falling from the skies. Couple little errands to run on my side of the mountain today; couple things to order too... and I need to check in with my shop.

Baking continues; Holly requested I make the gingerbread marshmallows yesterday - and they are currently setting up to get cut & dusted with powdered sugar today. Planning for hot chocolate & homemade marshmallows tomorrow. At some point today, I need to get the snow plow on the ranger, too. Or we'll be trying to do it - when it's warmer tomorrow - while snow falls at a rate of 2" per hour (according to some forecasts). Neighbors goodies delivered over the weekend.

My big Bunn coffeemaker died again; the hotplate doesn't like being cleaned. But the morning has been saved by my Secret Squirrel gift - a french press. I have an old Melitta (and filters) too - that I've managed not to break in 3-4 moves through 2 husbands.

Hol's going to be "over the mtn" all day today, dropping one of her kittens off to be neutered - Peter is the biggest tom out of Stinker's litter - and he's quite the terrorist. So she's visiting a friend, shopping, and generally hanging out all day till she can pick Peter up and head back. I've heard nothing so far from surgeon vet. And given how happy and mobile Stinker is right now - I doubt I'm going to put him through that close confinement for a month. It involves more painkillers too - and while he's good at taking the liquid meds, painkillers mess with brains. I don't want to take that chance with him. His personality is just quirky enough right now.

Got enough kindling split to get me through till it stops snowing. And now for the daily woodstove cleaning chore. LOL. Unless last night's fire burned hot enough, I always have to clean the glass and scoop the ashes out.

Buck went looking for a power steering pump for his truck yesterday at a junkyard (auto parts store ordered the wrong one). Ended up getting hired part time (2 days a week + commission) until he moves. Coz he "knows stuff" like how to remove windshields without breaking them, and other tricks of the trade. And he's been gettiing boxes delivered with some little luxuries... since he can't be here. He's been having trouble finding one brand of socks he likes... so I'm going to use those as padding around his cookies when I ship them. MAYBE get out by Saturday; MAYBE. Propane tanks got filled yesterday. Reminded me to have Hol check hers; she should be OK. Solar panels weren't getting much sun lately - and Rick came and pushed down some bigger trees that were shading the panels. I think she's going to hear her generator a lot the next few days.

I need to order snowshoes; I think we might get as much as 2 ft of snow out of this storm. Definitely over a foot. Everything the other side of the mountain will shut down (if they aren't already from the virus); already planning for it - a couple inches of snow is enough for them. I imagine my side of the mountain will shut down by noon.

I might have a sewing commission; another parka like the one I made for B. But the guy currently has his hands full, taking care of his business'es crew; several of which have tested positive or are sick from virus. I'll contact him later when he's not so busy. So far - all my presents that were shipped have arrived except one item for B that's backordered.

Almost time for me to order seed starting stuff. The wheel keeps turning around here... and I need to think about a canning kitchen, too. A lot more jars & lids; and a few odds/ends. I was going to try to move my garden implements out of the space where the metal shop's going... but now the barn is full of Buck's stuff and the jeep; and the plan to move the mower to the other garage isn't going to work, coz Hol wants to put the pontiac in there before it snows. If it fits - LOL.

I WILL get my rip van winkle time, seriously, I WILL. It'll start in a week or so, I hope. :D
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 17, 2020, 10:35:19 AM: Some places on the deck, I have closer to a foot of snow. As an "essential" part of the shovel brigade, the upper deck gets cleaned off first - so it doesn't melt & refreeze at the ground level. We don't have to go anywhere; there is very little traffic sound from the direction of the highway; so I doubt the mailbox is overflowing. I hear roads over the mtn are still iffy too.

The steps o' death & broken bones can melt on their own and wait. Some snow is easy to clear; some isn't. I won't know till I start which kind this is.

But first, I have to call into the shop.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: lighter on December 18, 2020, 02:20:27 PM: We had rain....no snow. Roads were fine.

Is your woodpile full? Have you lit any fires yet, Amber?

It warms my heart to picture you baking and tending a cozy fire: )

Careful with'yer bad self on that ice.

Lighter
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 19, 2020, 08:54:30 AM: Tending my downstairs fire, requires specifically timed trips up & down... it's a small firebox... and the recipes I'm working with require constant stirring until an exact temp is reached. So the 2 aren't compatible - except at certain stages of the process.

Hol came to help me shovel the deck so it didn't make ice below. She & Helga made tracks in the drive to the road; that was plowed. I took the ranger to the mailbox yesterday; pushed a little snow, but in 4x that little vehicle is an absolute BEAST of traction. Since it sips gas compared to all the other wheeled creatures here, it's worth it's weight in gold. We converged on the studio later to chew the fat & get a break from both our 4 walls. Had more snow that evening too. Feast of Saturnalia. ;)

I missed a couple shop emails and immediately had that -- oh, now I feel like a total schmuck, worthless human creature reaction. But since it was late at night, I decided to just call in the call in the morning. Approval/decisions from me required - since my bro is once again awol and not in the loop about what's going on. I don't mind if he does that - but then, he is forfeiting his justification for being angry about not being consulted when decisions have to happen on the fly. I am not his secretary, required to brief him on situations he doesn't think are important enough to stay in contact with the shop or me about.

I CAN and DO have a much better work-life balance than I did years ago. But I am still on call 24/7 as the buck stops with me, in this position. I don't have to feel bad about having a life - and not ALWAYS on top of things. I am allowed to forget for a couple days that we have big things in progress.

And I've just kinda shut down the kitchen for a couple days - few more things to make for us but I am almost ready to pack & ship the long-distance boxes and deliver the local ones. It's warming up and the snow is evaporating - but the nights are cold enough to put ice on the ponds.

Buck has had a rough week; his kitten had a swollen leg and when he took her to the vet, he eventually diagnosed pneumonia and while they were starting medication, poor little thing started hemoraghaging and didn't make it. That night one of his older stray take-ins passed too. And I'm beyond frustrated that his Christmas present is backordered. I'm trying to get an ETA from this week.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 19, 2020, 04:28:24 PM: Kitchen Wench is back at it again... LOL as many boxes as I'm packing I may not have enough!
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 19, 2020, 05:34:28 PM: I'm sorry about Buck's kitties, nothing sadder when the animal innocents suffer and go.

Happy for Kitchen Wench and happier for the recipients!

Hear you about the business squeeze, and some guilt there. I vote you're doing the best you can and mostly on your own. If you reassure them, I hope they'll take comfort all will be well or if not perfect, at least with a sound plan, in 2021.

Meanwhile you still get to enjoy this time. I've been green about the stillness of snow on a mountainside...it must be very extra beautiful right now.

Soak it in. The peace. Long may it last.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 20, 2020, 11:02:51 AM: Oh yes... soaking it in. This whole week there is no agenda; no plan. Well, except the kids are clearing snow at the hut so contractors can drop off garage trusses (other framing material is here) and the solstice/conjunction fire tomorrow.

And I'm finishing up packing goody boxes; couple to take to post office tomorrow -- they won't get there by Christmas, but people still gotta eat after. A couple things for the kids to wrap... their big present (besides a house & garage) is going to be a greenhouse... which hasn't been ordered yet. Hol needs to consult her buddy about heating/cooling options so it can be a year-round growing space.

Buck is back to his nightowl ways; last txt was after 3 am. Just woke up. Me, I'm sleeping long... moving at a comfortable pace... thinking about seeds, growing space/equipment for me, orchard trees, etc...and maybe buying myself a couple presents. ;) I don't seem to be craving as much rip van winkle time -- but it just seems to be what happens when it doesn't get light until 8 am and gets dark by 5.

Not reading anything serious. Tuning out all the noise online. Playing around with a new circle of acquaintances with woo-stuff... but not seriously. Almost ready to break out the planning book... get the contractor on notice about metal shed... see what Buck needs that I can help with... to get him here. All told, things turned out OK at the business. We're still in the black; barely. Everyone is getting a full paycheck and has good health insurance paid for by co. They got Christmas bonuses; less than previously... but these days, that's doing pretty damn good.

I'll scry the crystal ball and future predictions later; AFTER the solstice/conjunction - because the massive change has to start before I will be able to have any inkling of which way it's going to go. Right now, too many big question marks out there and unknowns and stuff intentionally hidden... unless you know what you're looking for and where to look.
One thing I can say with certainty: this is the year we kick it up a notch developing the farm... working on ideas for income and get a better plan organized.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on December 20, 2020, 11:27:29 AM: I'm glad things have settled a bit, Skep, and are looking a bit less daunting business wise. And that the baking is on track! Nothing nicer than a box of home made something from someone, in my opinion. I hope the Solstice provides some space and a clear start. I've been cleaning all day so that we can have a quiet, reflective day tomorrow - hopefully a walk on the beach if it stops raining but if not, we've got quiet space at home to reflect on this year and start working on plans for next. I have to say I'm amazed to read you'll be kicking it up a notch at the farm - you always seem to be going at top notch already! Look forward to reading more about whatever plans your endless energy brings :) xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 21, 2020, 09:33:39 AM: Well, there is 3 of us here Tupp; all able-bodied and know the meaning of work - soon to be 4 - if the rumblings, rumor and breadcrumbs of info I get from Buck mean he's getting close to being here. I know he's working on getting his D's other parent to chip in for tuition. When I look back - it's amazing how much has changed here; and after the metal shop, the only other building project we couldn't do ourselves would be the studio remodel and possibly a livestock barn - depending on whether or not, any of us feel like taking on that responsibility. Milk cows are labor intensive, but then there can be butter & cheese. (I'm not overly fond of goats/goat cheese.)

Mike's D, sent Hol & I pictures of her new engagement ring last night. She and her guy have been together 4 years. With her two kids, and their crazy schedules - she's now moved up to mgmt between the health system's trauma centers and he's still a med chopper pilot - we've still not met him. We call him her "imaginary boyfriend". LOLOL. But that's a bit of happy news and I'm pretty sure it's the right thing at the right time for her. She just finished her master's in nursing, too.

Weather is going to be a challenge around here; expecting very cold temps this coming weekend. So more snow removal (to prevent ice) is on the agenda - and slowing down a little bit. Shipping out goodies today and making one more grocery run. Steve will slaughter a couple of his drakes and smoke/roast them and Hol is in search of farro for pomegranite, blue cheese & walnut salad. I'm going to bake bread, warm up my spiral ham, and grab some good cheese for sandwiches. Mac & cheese, or something like to go with. Expecting some venison tenderloin, too - Rick took a buck over T'giving season... so I need a box of goodies for him too.

Mr. Stinkerbell is in NO way challenged getting around on this gimpy leg!! He and Freddy have regular intervals of kitty tussling, chasing, and napping. Stinker is still getting places (and trying to) he shouldn't even attempt. And I WISH he'd stop tickling my face with his whiskers at 3 am... sigh... yes, he's a super-cuddler and how can you be mad at that? But jeez.... let mama sleep, already!!

There is supposedly a bonfire and solstice/conjunction festivities scheduled for tonight. I might need a nap. Late night w/Buck last night. This is still - in some ways - a challenging transition for him. Me too... he brought up not feeling the "Christmas spirit" for the last 4 years. A lot of those, he was in or just getting out of the hospital. I remembered back to that first one, after Mike died at T'giving... only thing I remember from that one in 2015, is Bovie smoking ducks and Disturbed released their version of Sounds of Silence. LOLOL. Then the year I moved, I didn't do much. Deb & Hol came for visits but I think I was alone that year. Now I work hard at getting a quiet evening when I want one!! LOL.

Hol has become the virus commissar, so a lot of her soirees/camping adventures have been curtailed. We have chosen not to entertain her more challenging (interpersonally) friends & acquaintances; and her close friends are all going through some major life stuff. We're as much in lockdown as is practical. Just not taking chances right now. So, it's also freeing up emotional and headspace to think about how much stuff we really can let go -- and what other things might need some investigation. Like reworking the studio space for more production... looking at the snow-revealed landscape to see where some modifications for planting might happen... re-arranging rocks, etc. Since I bought the backhoe, that stuff is a lot more possible. And it appears Steve has the knack of using heavy machinery. He brought the bobcat up the driveway yesterday and went to the top of the hill with it - scaring me that he'd roll it - but he is very good with it. I am happy he's found another niche, to be useful around here. They're expecting a big truckload of trusses for the garage tomorrow. Yes, those guys will work in the cold - just not snow/rain.

My big Bunn coffeepot died again; so it's time to order a new one - since I gave Hol the last new one I got when the pot died the first time. And like it or not - I MUST get up and get stuff packed up, addressed and sealed up to ship today so it's at least there by new years. LOL. I have to pick Hol up too.

One foot in front of the other = ONWARDS!! Forward motion.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 24, 2020, 04:10:48 PM: Well, I got the few presents I got for the kids wrapped today. Only real kitchen work is making my favorite bread - recipe makes 2 loaves - and I'll deliver a loaf and presents later. Hol & S have a friend coming out for a couple days. S harvested one of the drakes and Hol will make dinner tomorrow. I'll cook a spiral ham and some kind of sides tomorrow for sandwiches and take that and some sweets down. Hang out awhile.

We're still waiting on presents to be delivered. Obviously a rough year for that kind of thing. I woke up feeling as bereft as I did after Mike died. Coz Buck isn't here... and then I insisted on "doing something" until the mood lifted. Its been pouring rain all day and never really got light. No way I'm giving in to that kind of gloom. But I can't fake it either. I just WILL be OK on my own and live my life until he can be here.

Watching Fellowship of the Ring. Waiting on bread to rise.
This year's holiday will be what it will be. We're warm, dry, have good food.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 24, 2020, 09:17:55 PM: Good (no, great) attitude, (((((Amber)))).

I understand the melancholy.
That human calendar has its hooks in us.

But you're doing really super well, it sounds.

Hang in there. This time next year I hazard you
and Buck will be feeling all the good holiday feels
together.

Meanwhile, big hugs,
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on December 25, 2020, 06:11:59 AM: I'm glad you've got that 'go away, gloomy feelings' ability. It's can be so hard to give ourselves that kick up the backside to get out of bed when you waking up feeling that way. I hope the day feels easier - pressies, kitties, freshly made bread and some good films to boot. Merry Christmas from over the pond :) xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 25, 2020, 09:35:44 AM: One of my fav "rock & roll" Christmas tunes...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfY4b1NszpY

Yes, just getting up doing - what, at the root, was all stuff I WANTED done - helped me shake off the wobblies. And that's my motivation: it's stuff I want to do, really want to do -- whether anyone sees/acknowledges it or not -- because it's the kind thing, it's being neighborly, or spreading cheer & goodwill to all mankind... small gestures & smiles have a ripple effect... maybe especially when some people don't understand...

that is an effective teaching method.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on December 25, 2020, 10:26:46 AM: Quote from: sKePTiKal on December 25, 2020, 09:35:44 AM
One of my fav "rock & roll" Christmas tunes...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfY4b1NszpY

Yes, just getting up doing - what, at the root, was all stuff I WANTED done - helped me shake off the wobblies. And that's my motivation: it's stuff I want to do, really want to do -- whether anyone sees/acknowledges it or not -- because it's the kind thing, it's being neighborly, or spreading cheer & goodwill to all mankind... small gestures & smiles have a ripple effect... maybe especially when some people don't understand...

that is an effective teaching method.

Definite nodding to the small gestures, Skep. I've said for a long time that people doing little things makes a big difference - holding a door open, saying good morning, leaving a pot of jam on a doorstep - it all makes a difference. I'm glad you shook your wobbles off xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 26, 2020, 09:40:30 AM: My goodness it's cold here! But it's not so bad outside, at my house on the top of the cliff - as it is down in the bottom of the hollar at the Hut. The wind is forced through a tunnel of the two close ridges and with an ambient temp of 24-28 degrees - the wind chill goes to zero right quick! Both houses are pretty cozy; I still have a draft that I can't quite find in the living room but I just close the curtains and it helps.

I heated up my de rigeur spiral ham and cut it all off, packing up a couple pounds for the Hut, a loaf of my country white bread and a tin o' sweets and grabbed a bottle of champagne that had been hanging around in the fridge for a year or so... and delivered presents and hung out a bit. The friend who's staying with them, talks non-stop about herself - essentially an anxiety-tic - and I started to notice my "flee reflex" kick in, LOL... contant, repetitive noise drives me nutz... so I made my excuses while Hol was prepping their dinner and escaped back up the hill. To finish the Fellowship of the Ring, watch some past Olympic Gold ice skating performances, read, snuggle with kitties... and occasionally chat back & forth with B. He's in a not sleeping mode again; phone woke me at 4m with a silly mistletoe pic from him.

I gave Hol a heads up that I'm going to shift into planning mode again next week - and doing mode, depending on weather - and that'll require a studio meeting, with all the lists. I haven't gotten an ETA from B yet; he keeps saying play it by ear. Hmmph. I think I'm about done waiting; within reason. And I'm into my "stare into the void" and "imagine the next steps" phase of my planning. The quiet part. If he wants to be included in that - he'd best make that known to me in a practical way. I'll probably call him later today.

This endless waiting feels too much like how I felt after Mike passed. And that simple fact adds a layer of irritation and suspicion, to the mix. Is he serious or isn't he? It isn't a good idea to leave me alone - after saying I won't be. And I realize I might just be making a problem where there isn't one... so for now, I'm keeping that just between us girlz.

Found out last night that all of Autumn's household has tested pos for the virus; she & fiancee are sick sick; Logan has a cough... and the littlest, Ms. Harper - is asymptomatic. Told her to let me know if she needed anything. Hol & I can tag-team to help her out. So much for frontline people getting the vaccine, I guess.

Thinkin' maybe I'll start re-arranging furniture. Just for something different to look at. :grump:
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Twoapenny on December 28, 2020, 10:12:34 AM: Sorry to hear of those with the virus, Skep, and hope they aren't too badly affected and start to feel better soon. And sorry that Buck hasn't lit a bit more of a fire under his plans yet so that you've got a firm date in mind - I'm guessing even if it were further down the line than you'd like any date would be better than no date. So I hope whatever he needs to sort out gets sorted sooner rather than later so that you can just get cracking. Waiting on other people does my head in, I've no patience lol. Fellowship of the Ring and kitty snuggling sounds nicer than Hol's drone along friend :) I hope you can get on with some planning and doing soon - I've had three days of doing not much over Christmas and I have to admit, I'm happier when I'm busy. Cleaning today, re-organising food so we don't waste any and packing away the Christmas decs - I'm much happier! Lol xx
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 28, 2020, 10:13:37 AM: Yeah. Open mouth and actually SAY what's bugging me after I said I wouldn't. SMDH. And no, it wasn't just going away; hence the expression of truly uncomfortable feelings. And no, I didn't bother doing the deep-dive analysis FIRST... and I couldn't ignore it anymore and just wait it out. SIGH.

So, it came out worse than my normal ungraceful delivery. Funny how some words simply can't be unsaid - and yet others are of no consequence at all.

But, B is not terribly sensitive, or insecure in himself - he let me have my say, explained yet again that things have to be a certain way in his logistics of the move and is just fine about my hissy fit over the long-assed wait and feeling like we haven't even begun an actual "relationship" -- and that I don't rate that high in his set of priorities. Anyone else (in my experience) would come back with a question about whether I still wanted to pursue this and take offense at my feelings. Even to the point of running away himself. Not B.

Yeah. All this bubbled up from the old "I don't matter" wound. And that was partly due to me, not really taking the time for the self-care I need this time of year. Kicking myself now - because I really do know better than this and where I got way-laid was too much alone time and letting my head have free-rein without the focus of doing what needs to be or can be done right now. Including things for me. I've been pushing all that to the back burner, bottom of the list again. And then, got frustrated over the online shopping/shipping delays - that I can't do anything about; and just felt just.... whiny, dis-satisfied, and generally unpleasant to be around (and trust me, it's even worse being me in that state).

So... I have a list (as usual). And I'm going to start knocking things off the list again. The worst thing I can do for my mis-wired brain is to sit around waiting for Prince Charming to show up and make everything OK - when there are things I have to do prior to his arrival and things to do for myself - and things that I am fully capable of doing for myself, including putting my head back into a better space.
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: Hopalong on December 28, 2020, 10:36:44 AM: I'm super-sorry the virus has hit your daughter, Amber. That's nerve-wracking. What is her job in health care (and is she healthier herself now?). Many good vibes heading her way. Do you mean by "spelling" that you and Hol will be going to her home?

I am very impressed by your honesty and openness about the bout of anxiety and irritation you had over the waiting time with Buck. And his response to it. I hope you won't bash yourself too much. You really have knit the reasons together now (echo of Mike grief, early abandonment wounding, insufficient self-care due to Type A Farmer behavior--okay, I made that one up).

Forgive yourself, make whatever amends you think you must, and you've already moved on. I do think it's a hint that self-care could include supportive Zooming with a smart counselor though, if you're interested. Might drain off the edges so both the waiting and the adjustment to your new shared life are easier and happier. ??

Speaking as one who permanently benefits from therapy. And who may Zoom it forever. I no longer believe I'll ever be rid of all my early wounds, and a happier life is about accepting there will always be vulnerable places (and some triggers). So, I commit to healing all I can--which can be a LOT, protecting the rest, and continuing to grow.

hugs
Hops
Title: Re: Farm Doin's - 2020
Post by: sKePTiKal on December 28, 2020, 11:54:37 AM: Funny you should mention the life-long need to deal with those issues, Hops. I had a similar thought, rereading my post searching for the inevitable typos.

Right or wrong, my choice about that is to simply accept that I have old injuries - like my rediculous ankle - that flare up from time to time. I choose to try to live with it. Because I don't think it can be "fixed" or will every go completely away - no matter how good I get at recognizing the signs. How much practice I have. Truth be told, I'm a tad proud of my scars. (Go figure.) Those old injuries are now part of my character - the story of "how I got to be this way" - like some people do with tattoos.

Most of the time, those old wounds only bother me because I can manage them, most of the time; I know what works - most of the time. And I've chosen to bear those myself without looking for someone to "take it out on". I am conscientious - again, most of the time - about not spreading that negative crap around. But we is all humanz.

And my priorities were amiss, my expectations too high (from Buck), communication too terse, by putting myself completely at the bottom of the list during the holiday. It's a CHANGE that this year, Hol & S are in the hut; doing their thing for the holiday. I wasn't excluded and invited more often than I accepted. But hey - that's all part of what went wrong. LOL. And while - by now - I should've seen this coming; I just didn't.

No permanent damage done; just more bumps & bruises. Un-necessary ones; but life happens.