Author Topic: Mindfulness and codependence thread  (Read 81110 times)

lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #45 on: November 14, 2019, 09:24:03 AM »
OK, T went straight into ACT memory reconsolidation session yesterday. 

There are two things she loves.... for herself, and for clients....

1) Moving through the ACT EMDR memory reconsolidation with client/T in session.

2) Desensitization the client can perform with a strict focus on emotions and sensations... giving them a number from 1-10, then doing 10 quick back and forth passes 10 times.  Check the 1-10 number.  If it's the same 2 or 3 times, quit.  If it continues getting better, continue until it's zero.

She's sending me a link.... I think it's the Nova Reconsolidation Memory Hackers info.

So, I feel really good about the session.  Memories apparently change every time we pull them up.  We brought up a painful memory, and did EMDR on it.  We went on for maybe.... 45 minutes total....  bringing up the memory...... EMDR.... then I could begin changing the memory.... the picture in my mind..... changing it to something pleasing... an outcome I wanted.... more EMDR.... then I went from the beginning of the picture... I chose very early childhood through the moment, then added another, and another..... changing them.... for me it was entering these events as an adult.  Helping my mother parent.... attending to my siblings, and myself while Mom did what she was doing as a very young parent.... things that were normal for her, but allowing us, her children to travel through normal childhood phases without being punished for Mom's lack of supervision, and ignorance of normal childhood phases.

We paired the old memory with the new memory... back and forth, back and forth.

We traveled through the entire story with the new pictures.... to the end.

Finally, we traveled through my entire life bringing up every sad/painful/difficult emotion I could recall.... more EMDR.

I can't remember the exact order, but we also colored over the old images with a color of my choice, green, and when she moved her hand, I pictured it covering over the old image until it was filled in.  THEN we replaced it with the new image.

I was to let it sit, and not think about it too much, bc the memory does change. The work we did needed to just be.   No thinking about what we replaced.

All through this process T continued checking in with somatic experience.... where, what did it feel like, put a number on it.....

closer to the end she shifted to focus on the ease in my body, where... what it felt like.....and focusing on that.   The comfort eased into the more tense painful areas still under pressure at that point.  The pain/tension was stomach, chest, throat, jaw, and head when we began.  At the end the bodily sensations were at an zero: )

I was happy with that session.  At one point I couldn't bring up the most disturbing image when asked to. It was just sketchy, and eluded me, where at first it felt huge, popped right up and brought big emotions with it. 

If I think about it nom, there's no emotional response at all.  It's like that memory has been overlayed with a postive happy experience, and changed... hopefully, and I believe... forever.

I'll research the science behind it, bc that's what I do.

I wish I'd made notes yesterday, but I was just too busy.

Lighter




lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #46 on: November 19, 2019, 11:43:15 AM »
I have 2 paperwork things to tackle.... maybe 3, but I'm trying to notice the anxiety, and deal with it as it comes up without ramping up the fear.

WIll see how that goes.

Lighter

Twoapenny

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #47 on: November 27, 2019, 03:39:14 AM »
Are you finding the new memory stays with you, Lighter, or do you find that the original memory works its way back in?  It's such a lot of work you're doing at the moment, are you finding it tiring or does it perk you up?  How did you get on with the paperwork?  Just that word is so loaded now, lol, I can see myself ending up living in a cabin with no post box and no email so that paperwork can never find its way to me again.  Lol.  I hope the sessions are carrying on well, they seem to be helping you a lot xx

lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #48 on: November 27, 2019, 09:20:16 AM »
The memory hasn't changed.... that is to say... the new installed memory is the default setting that pops up when I think about it. 

The old memory isn't in the files, or so it seems.  When I try to recall it, it's like.... I SEE a flash of it, then it automatically changes... like an old slide projector.... to the new memory.   

I don't know if it will stay that way, but I BELIEVE it will.  The T asked me to put a percentage on my belief around that, and I was amazed to find my answer was unreservedly 100%.

I left everything be, and didn't revisit those memories right away, as instructed. 

So....memory reconsolidation.

::nodding::.

I'm heading out the door for another session of just that thing. Different year, same kids, I assume the same changed story..... I didn't think about what I'd LIKE the real memory to be.  The answer washed over me, and appeared, and it was good.

See you later; )

Lighter


Hopalong

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #49 on: November 27, 2019, 02:50:59 PM »
It all sounds like such a powerful system for processing trauma, Lighter.
I'm so very glad you found it.

Adding another thing to the list of what to be grateful about! I'm glad for you.

Hang in, and Happy Thanksgiving!

hugs
Hops
« Last Edit: November 27, 2019, 03:40:14 PM by Hopalong »
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #50 on: November 28, 2019, 12:39:51 PM »
Thanks, and Happy Thanksgiving to you too, Hops: )

Lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #51 on: December 06, 2019, 02:46:38 PM »
::munching blueberries the size of grapes::

They're really good.  Most are tart and sweet, just the way I like them.  I don't like bland ones, and the occasional moldy one doesn't upset me.  The discomfort, if there's any discomfort now... and there is.... is more about MY eating something I bought for the girls. 

Usually I don't eat fresh fruit in the fridge.   If the girls don't eat it, then it typically dies, or I've frozen it for smoothies, or as little blueberry popsicles,  which youngest dd likes.   I've felt that way about food for years.... eating what they left, not preparing a plate for myself, bc money was scary, and anxiety always kills my appetite anyways. 

It's concerning,  but I'm managing to stay in observer mode.  Mostly.

SO... yesterday with T we explored feeling worthy enough, and that lead to an hour long dash down one triggered rabbit hole after another.

I'm not over the legals, I have more hard feelings for third party bystanders and enablers than I do toward my ASPD N husband as my expectations for him came into focus pretty quickly.  Not so with the systems, law officers, and people who should do the right thing, but have so often fallen down, failed, done the wrong thing or just a little favor for a buddy(Judge in the case I'm thinking about THIS SECOND), then thrown the case into a baby judge's lap so he didn't have to look at what he'd done, or deal with it.  Maybe putting faces in the room where he threw a stink bomb (fig.) just isn't pleasant, but WTH has to happen when people without standing to BRING a case get to file an Appeal, and win it, on the case that was thrown out?  That makes my eyes cross, and there are years of this kind of sabotage and heinous fuckery I'll have to finish processing, and put behind me.

So, we did an excercise where I talked about a time I felt empowered, what was I wearing (favorite boots), what color comes up around that (black) how it felt to BE in that space.... I felt in control, remembered the click of my heels, and the purpose in my strides.... always very physical.... I felt that power in my hips.

Then we shifted to a time I felt vulnerable, and at the mercy of.  That color was gray... it was dark, and lonely, and I could picture a grey sky framed by leafless black trees.... but gray was the color not feeling worthy. 

We put the black in one hand and the gray in the other, T mirroring me, and held them like little balls about a foot apart.  The right hand, holding the black... tingled like crazy. The left hand felt lighter.  Now, we're sensing how each hand feels... the brain processes in symbols and finds it hard to hold two opposing ideas at the same time, and will make sense of them.  I won't bore you with it all,  but we moved the hands closer together, and talked about how that felt, and what I saw when I pictured the gray... then pictured the black.  What were the changes, etc. 

When we eventually merged hands my fingers experienced an electrical shock so intense I was surprised there wasn't any noise associated with it.  A few fingers actually hurt.  We explored the black and feeling empowered, then examined the gray and back and forth... not sure exactly how that went, bc I was trying to FINISH it.  Sometimes I go in thinking I'll really pay attention and try to remember what happened, but it never goes that way, bc I can't do both, and I'm there to process as priority.

I was feeling OK when the hour was up, but then.... I wasn't.  T used EMDR.  I focused on the somatic sensations, which were all neutral... shocking considering the emotional upset, but in these cases I focus on the feelings of neutrality while doing the EMDR.  it was really difficult to follow her fingers with my eyes for some reason.  Sometimes my tongue wants to help out, but not this time.   It was just so darned hard... like my vision wanted to stop on her face.  VERY hard to think about bodily sensations and follow the fingers.  Each time she stopped and checked in... I felt better.  This is called desensitizing, and I can do it on my own.

There was another pass or two with focus on anything that felt pleasant in the body,and I have to say... .just feeling neutral was a very pleasant feeling for me. 

Tupp.... it's nice to put the story on the shelf, then do really important work by focusing ONLY on the somatic sensations.  I think it takes the retraumatizing factor down to a footnote very quickly, then helps to process the source trauma, but that's what happened last week, and I'll post about that on it's own.

Lighter

lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #52 on: December 06, 2019, 03:51:55 PM »
Fork.  I can't find my notes on last week's T session, but will put down what I remember.

This was the second time we processed a particlary triggering story, and I notice I'll just blather on and on if the T doesn't stop me pretty quickly.... put the story on the shelf then move on to what we're there to do. 

I AM RIGHT THERE, in that moment, unable to distinguish between then and the present.... I am engaged fully, as I was in those moments.  She sees that, and cuts it right off.  We focus on the sensations, we do some EMDR, we check in and note any changes, then dive back into the sensations.

At a point we bring up the event, and I think about it from beginning to end while doing EMDR.  Check in with how I'm feeling, focus on that and do more EMDR. 

It's like we bring up the distress, then calm it down, bring it up, calm it down, and so on.  Put numbers on it.  In this case I had a very sharp stabbing pain in my back, left side which is associate with being chakras, and being betrayed in a nutshell.  Made sense to me.

Next we go through the story and loop it from beginning to end more than once while doing EMDR, then check in on feelings, and address them witih EMDR.

I'm not sure what happens next, so will jot down approximates....
Bring up someone INTO the scenario we look up to, trust, feel protected by and advocated by.... I chose myself, again, grown, calm, and helping everyone in the scene, which was intuitive for me.

I went through the story as I wished it had happened, and that went pretty quick, compared to the other stuff.  I noticed the original story was getting more difficult to bring into focus, when I tried, and was just not coming up for me when I tried to picture it as we went along.

Then it was time to put everything in to a box from the original story, or from a set of years, or an entire lifetime, or just an entire childhood, and I chose all the upsetting incidents I could recall, put them in the box, and chose total destruction through burning.

I built the fire in my firepit, and there were family membersd... everyone close, all deceased, and my siblings when they were younger, and our grandparents and parents comforted sibs and my younger self while I burned the entire  box to ashes.  Mom served food from a picnic basket.... children napped.... everyone sat in the old time yard chairs from my Paternal grandparent's yard. 

When the deed was done, I think we got up, and headed toward a bridge to our new lives.  At the bridges edge we stopped to empty our pockets of everything from the past that needed to be left behind.  I just had us take off all our clothes, and walk across the bridge in white cotton shifts, shorts and tee shirts. 

When we got there we explored how that felt, then pictured a fountain.

Babies played in the spray, and grandparents sat on the edge, or in chairs by the side, and I dived in, and twirled, and did backflips in the water over and over... just all in, immersed, and refreshed.

I didn't think about the original story, bc in memory reconsolidation you want to let the new story continue processing as is.  Every time we bring up a picture or story it's changed.  Never static.  It was easy to leave it alone, as it was the first time we did this for a different story..... I'd say I was 4 yo for the first one, and 11yo for the second story.

Those two stories were traced back from current trigger stories, and we worked on them until there was zero emotional charge involved with any aspect of the original story or the present-day triggers we started with.

It's easier to lean into the discomfort of this work when I know and trust it leads to processing the story, and into a serene place of relief, and gratitude it's done.  I believe it will last, and so far so good... it's 100% remained in place.  Old stories gone. 

New stories in place... I experience so much relief where there was a lot of pain, tough emotions, and painful bodily sensations.  Like a thousand pounds lifted.  I don't care what the pounds were, or where they went, though I visualize them as
engaging unprocessed emotions in the amygdala....
the T assists with brain integration, helping to bring other parts of the brain online to support the amygdala, relieve tension around the story and in the brain, and make it possible to move that story into the processing center, then present it again and again to be processed until the brain has calmed enough to complete processing and file it into historic files in just the way I would have had that story go IF I HAD CONTROL OVER THE SITUATION. 

I can't tell you how satisfying it is to EXPERIENCE that outcome, and process.... just the details that come out of my mouth when asked how I'd rather have had that experience go.... I'm always shocked by the details and direction, and those things come without having to think, typically, or with very little reflection.  It feels like just the right answers were always there, waiting.

This is a pretty close approximating, and I didn't remember the fire, or the bridge, or the fountain from the first time we completed this process.  It felt like we were doing this for the first time. 

Shiftring into fight or flight mode feels a lot like being blindfolded and gagged.... sat on..... forced into a corner.....  unable to move or shift out of that space, and it's EVERYTHING.....
I just didn't have the ability to remember those parts of the process when we completed the experience the first time.

I must not have had access to the parts of my brain that create new memories while I was IN that place..... and this time.... that I can remember more.... for me means I've calmed my brain enough to have some restored access during times of intense stress.... of reducing the stress, and it's hoped every time we get through this, along with consistent practice to fire and wire new neural pathways... I'll achieve more resilience, finish processing the unprocessed triggers from most to least powerful,  until I'm able to regulate my emotions consistently as default setting.  If not, I'll know how to calm myself and move into a place where I can regulate my emotions.

Sometimes when we do check ins at the end of a session, something will come up... 2 sessions ago it was a T who harmed me and my children... the court appointed T who terrorized us an entire summer, and made my children fearl they'd be taken from me and given to their paternal grandparents in 2013.... THAT woman, the thought of her... that she made my youngest feel responsible for that terror....  is still in place, and T said it's my own self judgment that's behind that, which shut me up, and made me think. 

Just shutting down the cycle is an amazing thing.  Bringing my attention to it.... and knocking the stuffing out of rage that's building and building... is an amazing thing.

Yesterday T told the story of monks burying a golden buddha in mud when their village was ransacked and overtaken by an enemy.  Years later, after all the monks were gone, a child saw the glint of gold, leading to uncovering this beautiful buddha, and that reminded me of Tupp.   

Just clearing out all the mud, and garbage, and judgments other people installed when we weren't able to defend ourselves, or make sense of it at the time. 

Now that we're adults, and capable of defending ourselves.... and in my case, with help from a good T maybe to show me how, and keep me focused....
we uninstall the garbage, and remember what was always there.

And that brings me back to the gray black excercise.  We're reconsolidating and changing the garbage stories INTO the original truth.

It's not hard.  It's not a difficult process.  It's relieving stress in the brain so the brain can do what it does efficiently WHEN IT'S NOT STUCK IN FIGHT OR FLIGHT MODE/amygdala/reptilian brain.  We're remembering what's been there from the start, and will always be there.

One last thing about yesterday's appointment.... I didn't realize I held some of the beliefs around the story of my ASPD N husband, and the first night he assaulted me and I thought I would be killed while listening to my oldest 4yo dd call our for me.... THAT is something I've never processed, and thinking about it was like experiencing someone else's feelings and thoughts about it, bc I just haven't done it.  Ever. 

I didn't recognize my own belief system about it.  I'd never asked myself, or allowed myself to process it. 

It's time, and that one thing leads to a hundred, IME.

The journey continues.

Lighter


Twoapenny

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #53 on: December 08, 2019, 03:38:18 AM »
::munching blueberries the size of grapes::

They're really good.  Most are tart and sweet, just the way I like them.  I don't like bland ones, and the occasional moldy one doesn't upset me.  The discomfort, if there's any discomfort now... and there is.... is more about MY eating something I bought for the girls. 

Usually I don't eat fresh fruit in the fridge.   If the girls don't eat it, then it typically dies, or I've frozen it for smoothies, or as little blueberry popsicles,  which youngest dd likes.   I've felt that way about food for years.... eating what they left, not preparing a plate for myself, bc money was scary, and anxiety always kills my appetite anyways. 

Interesting, Lighter, I'm very similar.  I'll go to great lengths to do nice meals for son but when it comes to myself it's often bits cobbled together in a 'that'll do' manner.  I bought a cookbook in the charity shop last week that suggests meals made from foods that help with certain types of health problems - things to keep your heart healthy, things to balance your blood sugar, things to help with anxiety and so on.  A lot of the meals look really nice but they contain ingredients that I don't usually buy because of the cost and it was interesting for me to notice how difficult I find it to spend money on food and cook myself good meals every day, rather than every now and again.  Mmmm, more to ponder.

It's concerning,  but I'm managing to stay in observer mode.  Mostly.

SO... yesterday with T we explored feeling worthy enough, and that lead to an hour long dash down one triggered rabbit hole after another.

I'm not over the legals, I have more hard feelings for third party bystanders and enablers than I do toward my ASPD N husband as my expectations for him came into focus pretty quickly.  Not so with the systems, law officers, and people who should do the right thing, but have so often fallen down, failed, done the wrong thing or just a little favor for a buddy(Judge in the case I'm thinking about THIS SECOND), then thrown the case into a baby judge's lap so he didn't have to look at what he'd done, or deal with it.  Maybe putting faces in the room where he threw a stink bomb (fig.) just isn't pleasant, but WTH has to happen when people without standing to BRING a case get to file an Appeal, and win it, on the case that was thrown out?  That makes my eyes cross, and there are years of this kind of sabotage and heinous fuckery I'll have to finish processing, and put behind me.

Yes, exactly the same, Lighter!  My mum was only able to carry out that decade long campaign of abuse because so many people helped her.  That people who have chosen to do a job that involves helping vulnerable people (as all public sector jobs do, in one way or another) and then chose to ignore the procedure and legislation and lie and manipulate the situation to give more power to the abuser than the abusee - that bothers me so much more than anything my mum did.  And more so because it means we know we don't have a safety net.  The services and support systems that are supposed to be there when we need protection or help are so flawed that they can do us more harm than good.  Certainly for me, it's what makes me want to keep away from them.  And it's a frightening world when you know you can't rely on doctors, the police, social workers, judges and so on to just do their job properly, regardless of their personal feelings about a situation.  Very scary.

So, we did an excercise where I talked about a time I felt empowered, what was I wearing (favorite boots), what color comes up around that (black) how it felt to BE in that space.... I felt in control, remembered the click of my heels, and the purpose in my strides.... always very physical.... I felt that power in my hips.

Then we shifted to a time I felt vulnerable, and at the mercy of.  That color was gray... it was dark, and lonely, and I could picture a grey sky framed by leafless black trees.... but gray was the color not feeling worthy. 

We put the black in one hand and the gray in the other, T mirroring me, and held them like little balls about a foot apart.  The right hand, holding the black... tingled like crazy. The left hand felt lighter.  Now, we're sensing how each hand feels... the brain processes in symbols and finds it hard to hold two opposing ideas at the same time, and will make sense of them.  I won't bore you with it all,  but we moved the hands closer together, and talked about how that felt, and what I saw when I pictured the gray... then pictured the black.  What were the changes, etc. 

So interesting that it actually creates a physical sensation.  Do you think you are more emotionally/spiritually sensitive than an average person or do you think anyone doing this would experience the same thing?  it sounds quite incredible.  Does if feel scary while you do it?

When we eventually merged hands my fingers experienced an electrical shock so intense I was surprised there wasn't any noise associated with it.  A few fingers actually hurt.  We explored the black and feeling empowered, then examined the gray and back and forth... not sure exactly how that went, bc I was trying to FINISH it.  Sometimes I go in thinking I'll really pay attention and try to remember what happened, but it never goes that way, bc I can't do both, and I'm there to process as priority.

I was feeling OK when the hour was up, but then.... I wasn't.  T used EMDR.  I focused on the somatic sensations, which were all neutral... shocking considering the emotional upset, but in these cases I focus on the feelings of neutrality while doing the EMDR.  it was really difficult to follow her fingers with my eyes for some reason.  Sometimes my tongue wants to help out, but not this time.   It was just so darned hard... like my vision wanted to stop on her face.  VERY hard to think about bodily sensations and follow the fingers.  Each time she stopped and checked in... I felt better.  This is called desensitizing, and I can do it on my own.

There was another pass or two with focus on anything that felt pleasant in the body,and I have to say... .just feeling neutral was a very pleasant feeling for me. 

Tupp.... it's nice to put the story on the shelf, then do really important work by focusing ONLY on the somatic sensations.  I think it takes the retraumatizing factor down to a footnote very quickly, then helps to process the source trauma, but that's what happened last week, and I'll post about that on it's own.

Lighter

'm scrolling down to read the next bit, Lighter :)  Lol xx

Twoapenny

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #54 on: December 08, 2019, 03:54:02 AM »
Fork.  I can't find my notes on last week's T session, but will put down what I remember.

This was the second time we processed a particlary triggering story, and I notice I'll just blather on and on if the T doesn't stop me pretty quickly.... put the story on the shelf then move on to what we're there to do. 

I AM RIGHT THERE, in that moment, unable to distinguish between then and the present.... I am engaged fully, as I was in those moments.  She sees that, and cuts it right off.  We focus on the sensations, we do some EMDR, we check in and note any changes, then dive back into the sensations.

Yes, exactly the same.  It's almost like an out of body experience for me.  I know I'm spiraling, I know I'm out of control, I know I'm reacting to something from the past and not from the present - but I can't step in to do anything about it.  It's like watching a crash in slow motion, when you can see the cars are going to hit but there's nothing you can do to stop it.

At a point we bring up the event, and I think about it from beginning to end while doing EMDR.  Check in with how I'm feeling, focus on that and do more EMDR. 

It's like we bring up the distress, then calm it down, bring it up, calm it down, and so on.  Put numbers on it.  In this case I had a very sharp stabbing pain in my back, left side which is associate with being chakras, and being betrayed in a nutshell.  Made sense to me.

Yes, makes sense to me as well.

Next we go through the story and loop it from beginning to end more than once while doing EMDR, then check in on feelings, and address them witih EMDR.

I'm not sure what happens next, so will jot down approximates....
Bring up someone INTO the scenario we look up to, trust, feel protected by and advocated by.... I chose myself, again, grown, calm, and helping everyone in the scene, which was intuitive for me.

It's telling that you choose yourself, Lighter, to stand up for yourself.

I went through the story as I wished it had happened, and that went pretty quick, compared to the other stuff.  I noticed the original story was getting more difficult to bring into focus, when I tried, and was just not coming up for me when I tried to picture it as we went along.

Then it was time to put everything in to a box from the original story, or from a set of years, or an entire lifetime, or just an entire childhood, and I chose all the upsetting incidents I could recall, put them in the box, and chose total destruction through burning.

I built the fire in my firepit, and there were family membersd... everyone close, all deceased, and my siblings when they were younger, and our grandparents and parents comforted sibs and my younger self while I burned the entire  box to ashes.  Mom served food from a picnic basket.... children napped.... everyone sat in the old time yard chairs from my Paternal grandparent's yard. 

I love that there was a picnic :)  Does T talk you through that story or do you create that in your mind?

When the deed was done, I think we got up, and headed toward a bridge to our new lives.  At the bridges edge we stopped to empty our pockets of everything from the past that needed to be left behind.  I just had us take off all our clothes, and walk across the bridge in white cotton shifts, shorts and tee shirts. 

When we got there we explored how that felt, then pictured a fountain.

Babies played in the spray, and grandparents sat on the edge, or in chairs by the side, and I dived in, and twirled, and did backflips in the water over and over... just all in, immersed, and refreshed.

I didn't think about the original story, bc in memory reconsolidation you want to let the new story continue processing as is.  Every time we bring up a picture or story it's changed.  Never static.  It was easy to leave it alone, as it was the first time we did this for a different story..... I'd say I was 4 yo for the first one, and 11yo for the second story.

Those two stories were traced back from current trigger stories, and we worked on them until there was zero emotional charge involved with any aspect of the original story or the present-day triggers we started with.

It's easier to lean into the discomfort of this work when I know and trust it leads to processing the story, and into a serene place of relief, and gratitude it's done.  I believe it will last, and so far so good... it's 100% remained in place.  Old stories gone. 

It's amazing that it's re-wiring your brain like this.  And doing physical good, I imagine, by unlocking and unblocking things.

New stories in place... I experience so much relief where there was a lot of pain, tough emotions, and painful bodily sensations.  Like a thousand pounds lifted.  I don't care what the pounds were, or where they went, though I visualize them as
engaging unprocessed emotions in the amygdala....
the T assists with brain integration, helping to bring other parts of the brain online to support the amygdala, relieve tension around the story and in the brain, and make it possible to move that story into the processing center, then present it again and again to be processed until the brain has calmed enough to complete processing and file it into historic files in just the way I would have had that story go IF I HAD CONTROL OVER THE SITUATION. 

I can't tell you how satisfying it is to EXPERIENCE that outcome, and process.... just the details that come out of my mouth when asked how I'd rather have had that experience go.... I'm always shocked by the details and direction, and those things come without having to think, typically, or with very little reflection.  It feels like just the right answers were always there, waiting.

This is a pretty close approximating, and I didn't remember the fire, or the bridge, or the fountain from the first time we completed this process.  It felt like we were doing this for the first time. 

Shiftring into fight or flight mode feels a lot like being blindfolded and gagged.... sat on..... forced into a corner.....  unable to move or shift out of that space, and it's EVERYTHING.....
I just didn't have the ability to remember those parts of the process when we completed the experience the first time.

I must not have had access to the parts of my brain that create new memories while I was IN that place..... and this time.... that I can remember more.... for me means I've calmed my brain enough to have some restored access during times of intense stress.... of reducing the stress, and it's hoped every time we get through this, along with consistent practice to fire and wire new neural pathways... I'll achieve more resilience, finish processing the unprocessed triggers from most to least powerful,  until I'm able to regulate my emotions consistently as default setting.  If not, I'll know how to calm myself and move into a place where I can regulate my emotions.

Will be so amazing for you to get to a point where all you're dealing with is right here and right now, Lighter, and being able to put all that energy into creating things that you want, rather than dealing with things that you don't.  So amazing and much deserved.

Sometimes when we do check ins at the end of a session, something will come up... 2 sessions ago it was a T who harmed me and my children... the court appointed T who terrorized us an entire summer, and made my children fearl they'd be taken from me and given to their paternal grandparents in 2013.... THAT woman, the thought of her... that she made my youngest feel responsible for that terror....  is still in place, and T said it's my own self judgment that's behind that, which shut me up, and made me think. 

What does she mean by your self judgement, Lighter?  I was a bit confused by that.  It's quite early here :) Lol

Just shutting down the cycle is an amazing thing.  Bringing my attention to it.... and knocking the stuffing out of rage that's building and building... is an amazing thing.

Yesterday T told the story of monks burying a golden buddha in mud when their village was ransacked and overtaken by an enemy.  Years later, after all the monks were gone, a child saw the glint of gold, leading to uncovering this beautiful buddha, and that reminded me of Tupp.   

Lol, I often look in the mirror and think I look like I've been dug up, Lighter :)  Lol

Just clearing out all the mud, and garbage, and judgments other people installed when we weren't able to defend ourselves, or make sense of it at the time. 

Now that we're adults, and capable of defending ourselves.... and in my case, with help from a good T maybe to show me how, and keep me focused....
we uninstall the garbage, and remember what was always there.

And that brings me back to the gray black excercise.  We're reconsolidating and changing the garbage stories INTO the original truth.

It's not hard.  It's not a difficult process.  It's relieving stress in the brain so the brain can do what it does efficiently WHEN IT'S NOT STUCK IN FIGHT OR FLIGHT MODE/amygdala/reptilian brain.  We're remembering what's been there from the start, and will always be there.

One last thing about yesterday's appointment.... I didn't realize I held some of the beliefs around the story of my ASPD N husband, and the first night he assaulted me and I thought I would be killed while listening to my oldest 4yo dd call our for me.... THAT is something I've never processed, and thinking about it was like experiencing someone else's feelings and thoughts about it, bc I just haven't done it.  Ever. 

Terrifying, Lighter, and more so because of the kids.  I had one aggressive incident with son's father.  He had me backed against a wall and was screaming in my face - not physically touching, but very aggressive, very violent, very unpleasant.  Son was asleep in his cot, very young at the time, but what was going through my mind was that I could easily get away from this idiot and get out the front door - but I couldn't easily get away, get up the stairs, get son, get back down the stairs and get past him to get out the front door with son in my arms.  And if I got out I wouldn't have any feeds, nappies or a change of clothes for son, either.  It makes a huge difference when your kids are being exposed to that level of violence as well.  We were, as children, although with us it was usually my mum attacking my dad.  Makes it a much harder thing to deal with and yes, processing will be tough.  But such a relief, I would have thought.  You might need to change your name from Lighter to Lightest :)  Lol

I didn't recognize my own belief system about it.  I'd never asked myself, or allowed myself to process it. 

It's time, and that one thing leads to a hundred, IME.

The journey continues.

Lighter

Phew!  A lot of work, Lighter, but so rewarding!  I am thinking I might look for an EMDR therapist to help me process everything that comes up as I tackle my paperwork mountain next year.  32 boxes and lever arch files, all representing nearly two decades of abuse, inequality and repeated experiences.  Mmm.  Might be worth investing in some practical support to get through that.  I will look into it further.  Thank you so much for sharing all of this.  I'm glad you are finding it all so useful xx

sKePTiKal

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #55 on: December 08, 2019, 06:11:49 AM »
Thanks for describing this therapy Lighter. I'm finding it very interesting - but I don't believe (I could always be wrong) that it would work with my brain. Hol's on the other hand, might respond really well. Dunno.

It's so hard to predict what will work; how one might benefit... since we all live safe within our ego's comfort zone fantasy about ourselves. (Even though we believe the opposite.) LOL... sorry, it is very early this morning and I've been filtering a lot projection from Hol again from my own stuff.

Success is never final, failure is never fatal.

lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #56 on: December 08, 2019, 01:39:59 PM »
Thanks for describing this therapy Lighter. I'm finding it very interesting - but I don't believe (I could always be wrong) that it would work with my brain. Hol's on the other hand, might respond really well. Dunno.

It's so hard to predict what will work; how one might benefit... since we all live safe within our ego's comfort zone fantasy about ourselves. (Even though we believe the opposite.) LOL... sorry, it is very early this morning and I've been filtering a lot projection from Hol again from my own stuff.

Amber:

IME I've had this type of relationship with 2 male attorneys.... they were attorneys I spoke with, and didn't hire in the moments I'm referring to. 

These attorneys seemed to posess a baseline confidence and ability to keep their egos OUT of the discussions.  We'd talk.  They'd ask pointed questions that were productive, and helped them research the laws and all possible interpretations.
 I had all the information I could ask for, and best chance of making a good plan.   

Many experiences with attorneys seemed to be fear based on their part.  They had egos as big as the moon hanging out there, bleeding, ready react, and punish me for asking a question, or for clarification on some complicated point.  That was counter productive to our relationship, to say the least, and to some degree, that ego involvement with Ts has been destructive as well.

This new T is 13 years in recovery, was raised in a PD FOO, has centered herself with mindful practice, yoga, and operates in from an intuitive place that resonates with me, and how I operate.  We speak the same language, so it seems. No barriers there is a good thing. 

 That means we can focus on my mission, and move at a fast paced clip while avoiding rabbit holes, and defensiveness on both our parts. 

She's done her inner world work, and that helps her keep her ego and frustrations out of the work, IMO, which is necessary,  bc my egos all over the place right now. 

Considering my interest in brain body integration I'd say I was ready for exactly what she's practicing/teaching.  Another time, and that wouldn't have been the case. 

We're e all human, and there's reactivity for all of us.  We can live with it, without awareness, or we can engage mindfulness practice, and learn to regulate our emotions, as this T practices daily.

My father spoke with scathing words, and style.  It's been installed in my brain, and it comes out when I'm very upset.  I know I mean to trigger emotional responses when I'm telling a truth, and I want to go there with economy of motion.  I have to say...  just bc I can, doesn't mean I should, and it's hindered my ability to be understood all my life. 

I don't believe I could work with a T who isn't practicing mindful awareness, and that's about me, not them.  It would be too difficult to stay on track, and not go down their rabbit holes, IME.

The same with attorneys.... if they have emotional distance,  and can stay focused on the mission, the mission gets attention. If they focus on my style, or PD facts that make no sense in their frame of reference... then the focus their lack of understanding, my frustration, their ego scuffs, and iwe might win the case, but everyone's bruised, and feeling beaten, and sure resolution and final understanding feel like an exciting balm, but darnit.... any professional beginning with a baseline ability to regulate their emotions has a huge leg up in any profession they practice,  IME. 

I think that's what Doc G has, and why he can connect well with patients, and help them.

Hmmm..... could it be that simple?

Lightwer


 

lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #57 on: December 08, 2019, 04:25:48 PM »
::munching blueberries the size of grapes::

They're really good.  Most are tart and sweet, just the way I like them.  I don't like bland ones, and the occasional moldy one doesn't upset me.  The discomfort, if there's any discomfort now... and there is.... is more about MY eating something I bought for the girls. 

Usually I don't eat fresh fruit in the fridge.   If the girls don't eat it, then it typically dies, or I've frozen it for smoothies, or as little blueberry popsicles,  which youngest dd likes.   I've felt that way about food for years.... eating what they left, not preparing a plate for myself, bc money was scary, and anxiety always kills my appetite anyways. 

Interesting, Lighter, I'm very similar.  I'll go to great lengths to do nice meals for son but when it comes to myself it's often bits cobbled together in a 'that'll do' manner.  I bought a cookbook in the charity shop last week that suggests meals made from foods that help with certain types of health problems - things to keep your heart healthy, things to balance your blood sugar, things to help with anxiety and so on.  A lot of the meals look really nice but they contain ingredients that I don't usually buy because of the cost and it was interesting for me to notice how difficult I find it to spend money on food and cook myself good meals every day, rather than every now and again.  Mmmm, more to ponder.


I think I was a pretty "normal" parent before my ASPD H went off the rails.  I could likely say I was somewhat self-focused (self-ish seems wrong) as a single person sailing through life with very little responsibility, save herself, home, and work out group/social group... they were the same.  I remember looking at older photo albums of my life... after having children, and those photos created discomfort for me.  It was ME enjoying my life, enjoying boys, enjoying my power at every level, and I don't know exactly what that means, except there was a change after that first physical assault that rocked my biology on a cellular level.  I couldn't breathe, couldn't eat,  lost so much weight I was sick, and that was really confusing bc everyone was telling me I looked great or telling me I wasn't special bc I'd lost the weight.... in other words.... they were envious and wanted to take me down a peg when I was in shock, and didn't need to be knocked down any more.  I needed support, and someone to acknowledge my crisis.  Anyway.... at some point my fight or flight system (Parasympathetic Nervous System PNS) flipped into the ON position, and it stayed on, with short bouts of flipping back,
 but at a point my brain and body didn't see anything to be gained by switching, bc it was just harder, and so.....my adrenals were shot, and my "normal" was living in fight or flight mode.  I remember watching it with some alarm.  Understanding it was happening, but just not able to figure out a better way.  That affected my parenting, food issues, healthcare issues, school issues, everything to do with parenting, and there were good and bad consequences to that I'm just now exploring. 

The codependence might have been a thing for me, but the fight or flight coupled with parenting, and ongoing crisis/threat/danger ramped everything up..... for better or worse.  I believe I was doing my very best in those circumstances, and I'm going to give myself a pass, undo some of the habits I developed during that time, and replace those habits and pathways that no longer serve. 

I guess I'm saying I likely have some issues around worthiness from growing up with young golden child parents who had zero information about discipline, vs punishment and awareness around childhood phases.  My mom SHOULD have been a beauty queen, and gone to college, and carved a life for herself before having children, bc her message to us was she made a mistake... we were mistakes.... if she had it to do over again she never would have had us, and we shouldn't repeat her mistake, which is why I was 36yo when I considered having children, and wouldn't have been surprised if I didn't have them at all.  I'm not judging that, I'm just aware it's what it was. 

My choices also inform my decision to NOT CARE about stuff, and how things look.  I mean... there's resistance there that's difficult to explain until you look at my upbringing.  Explains a lot, and I'm ready to process it and let it go now. 

It's concerning,  but I'm managing to stay in observer mode.  Mostly.

SO... yesterday with T we explored feeling worthy enough, and that lead to an hour long dash down one triggered rabbit hole after another.

I'm not over the legals, I have more hard feelings for third party bystanders and enablers than I do toward my ASPD N husband as my expectations for him came into focus pretty quickly.  Not so with the systems, law officers, and people who should do the right thing, but have so often fallen down, failed, done the wrong thing or just a little favor for a buddy(Judge in the case I'm thinking about THIS SECOND), then thrown the case into a baby judge's lap so he didn't have to look at what he'd done, or deal with it.  Maybe putting faces in the room where he threw a stink bomb (fig.) just isn't pleasant, but WTH has to happen when people without standing to BRING a case get to file an Appeal, and win it, on the case that was thrown out?  That makes my eyes cross, and there are years of this kind of sabotage and heinous fuckery I'll have to finish processing, and put behind me.

Yes, exactly the same, Lighter!  My mum was only able to carry out that decade long campaign of abuse because so many people helped her.  That people who have chosen to do a job that involves helping vulnerable people (as all public sector jobs do, in one way or another) and then chose to ignore the procedure and legislation and lie and manipulate the situation to give more power to the abuser than the abusee - that bothers me so much more than anything my mum did.  And more so because it means we know we don't have a safety net.  The services and support systems that are supposed to be there when we need protection or help are so flawed that they can do us more harm than good.  Certainly for me, it's what makes me want to keep away from them.  And it's a frightening world when you know you can't rely on doctors, the police, social workers, judges and so on to just do their job properly, regardless of their personal feelings about a situation.  Very scary.
I guess I'm identifying the whole lack of mindfulness/awareness thing as reason people... all people.... are easily manipulated, and triggered into performing bad acts, and heinous fuckery going against every law, rule, moral boundary... .  It's super apparent in life and death situations involving vulnerable members of society... children and victims of domestic violence in all it's forms... financial, emotional, physical, legal... all of them, and that's what I focus on NOW bc it happened TO ME and my children. 

If I sat back, and looked around I'd see it everywhere, in all situations, bc it's part of the human condition.  Sometimes I'm reactive, and sometimes it's a neighbor, and sometimes it's a police officer, sometimes a FOO member, sometimes my child, or a teacher, or attorney..... everyone benefits from learning skills that build resilience and emotional regulation.  I imagine a world where teaching that to all children, and people in positions of authority and trust going forward, and I can see improvement everywhere.  I'm hopeful.   


So, we did an excercise where I talked about a time I felt empowered, what was I wearing (favorite boots), what color comes up around that (black) how it felt to BE in that space.... I felt in control, remembered the click of my heels, and the purpose in my strides.... always very physical.... I felt that power in my hips.

Then we shifted to a time I felt vulnerable, and at the mercy of.  That color was gray... it was dark, and lonely, and I could picture a grey sky framed by leafless black trees.... but gray was the color not feeling worthy. 

We put the black in one hand and the gray in the other, T mirroring me, and held them like little balls about a foot apart.  The right hand, holding the black... tingled like crazy. The left hand felt lighter.  Now, we're sensing how each hand feels... the brain processes in symbols and finds it hard to hold two opposing ideas at the same time, and will make sense of them.  I won't bore you with it all,  but we moved the hands closer together, and talked about how that felt, and what I saw when I pictured the gray... then pictured the black.  What were the changes, etc. 

So interesting that it actually creates a physical sensation.  Do you think you are more emotionally/spiritually sensitive than an average person or do you think anyone doing this would experience the same thing?  it sounds quite incredible.  Does if feel scary while you do it?
When I was working out with my martial arts instructor, he gave me a book on Chines medicine that had me seated, hands apart in front of my belly, playing with the feeling created by widening and playing with hand position to feel the energy.  It was interesting, and I COULD feel it... above my thighs, between my hands in front of my belly button, it was curious but didn't mean much outside I SAW there was something to ancient Chinese medicine, even if I didn't understand it.  That was introduced in martial arts bc we were learning to do harm and trauma to people, and we were required to learn how to heal... the yin and yang principles.
 Martial Arts instructor was big on the isms... as he put it.  Taoism mainly.

The brain integration work helped understand energetic fields better, bc working on some people created all kinds of tingling and what felt like sparks... some didn't.  Having brain integration performed ON me...  I could feel energetic work IN my brain, like someone touching my brain, and it was real.  Same with a point to the left of my belly button..... and that stabbing pain in my back had me arched up on the table during a session once... I was in terrible pain during a treatment session during a training session. 

Everyone has an electrical circuit,  Tupp.  Some are very sensitive to it, and others aren't.  I don't think I'm particularly sensitive.  For one thing, during a training session I almost threw up, and got really sick during an intense session performed on another student with a big emotional issue.  The instructor moved away, and I almost darted from the room thinking I had food poisoning.  Instructor later said she was glad I felt that. I got the feeling she understood I had more sensitivity than she originally thought I did.... backhanded compliment delivered in a weird package, IMO. 

Our chakras, and meridians are real, can be tracked scientifically, have been documented in medical journals, and we all have them.  I spent a weekend suffering a headache after one brain integration session that was too much work at once... I feel asleep in the bathtub afterwards once, and woke up in cold water.  Very odd, but proof work was happening, IME. I also couldn't type as well afterwards, and if I didn't share before... before I traveled I had a session to deal with breathing... I've always been a shallow breather bc of tense stomach muscles, and my feet had issues.  The foot part was interesting with improved mobility and pain relief... joints had locked up around old injuries, and unlocking them helped a lot, etc.  When we got to the breathing.... that's when I felt that first ligth tough inside my stomach.... like someone was inside, poking.  I'm not careful enough with myself, and jumped up to see if there were any differences with the Brain Integration practitioner telling me to go slow.... and I found myself doubled over unable to breathe.  It was terrifying. I bet I posted about it here, but I was looking around for relief, about to run out the door when practitioner convinced me to get back on the table..  she'd help me.... and I remember shaking like I shook when the first epidural of my life was too strong, tensed up my muscles so I thought they'd break... it felt like I'd shake myself off the table.  That shaking started at the top of my body in this case, and as I resisted it,  moved down to my feet, and bounced my feet around, then I fought it back up top... EXHAUSTING and I just couldn't let it be, and have it's way, and release..nope nope nope. Honestly, I think it's the same principle as animals shaking off their trauma....  my nervous system was ready to do that work, and trying..... I just couldn't take that kind of loss of control and fought it.   When I went back and asked to repeat that work, ready to relax into it, we couldn't make it happen again. 

The work, IME, can be done in different ways, with different people, using different modalities, and on our own.  We all have access if we're interested in learning, and practicing, IM
E.
[/b]

When we eventually merged hands my fingers experienced an electrical shock so intense I was surprised there wasn't any noise associated with it.  A few fingers actually hurt.  We explored the black and feeling empowered, then examined the gray and back and forth... not sure exactly how that went, bc I was trying to FINISH it.  Sometimes I go in thinking I'll really pay attention and try to remember what happened, but it never goes that way, bc I can't do both, and I'm there to process as priority.

I was feeling OK when the hour was up, but then.... I wasn't.  T used EMDR.  I focused on the somatic sensations, which were all neutral... shocking considering the emotional upset, but in these cases I focus on the feelings of neutrality while doing the EMDR.  it was really difficult to follow her fingers with my eyes for some reason.  Sometimes my tongue wants to help out, but not this time.   It was just so darned hard... like my vision wanted to stop on her face.  VERY hard to think about bodily sensations and follow the fingers.  Each time she stopped and checked in... I felt better.  This is called desensitizing, and I can do it on my own.

There was another pass or two with focus on anything that felt pleasant in the body,and I have to say... .just feeling neutral was a very pleasant feeling for me. 

Tupp.... it's nice to put the story on the shelf, then do really important work by focusing ONLY on the somatic sensations.  I think it takes the retraumatizing factor down to a footnote very quickly, then helps to process the source trauma, but that's what happened last week, and I'll post about that on it's own.

Lighter

'm scrolling down to read the next bit, Lighter :)  Lol xx
« Last Edit: December 08, 2019, 04:31:55 PM by lighter »

lighter

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #58 on: December 08, 2019, 06:31:10 PM »

Yes, exactly the same.  It's almost like an out of body experience for me.  I know I'm spiraling, I know I'm out of control, I know I'm reacting to something from the past and not from the present - but I can't step in to do anything about it.  It's like watching a crash in slow motion, when you can see the cars are going to hit but there's nothing you can do to stop it.



At a point, we bring up the event, and I think about it from beginning to end while doing EMDR.  Check-in with how I'm feeling, focus on that and do more EMDR. 

It's like we bring up the distress, then calm it down, bring it up, calm it down, and so on.  Put numbers on it.  In this case, I had a very sharp stabbing pain in my back, left side which is associated with chakras, and being betrayed, in a nutshell.  Made sense to me.

Yes, makes sense to me as well.

Next, we go through the story and loop it from beginning to end more than once while doing EMDR, then check in on feelings, and address them with EMDR.

I'm not sure what happens next, so will jot down approximates....
Bring up someone INTO the scenario we look up to, trust, feel protected by and advocated by.... I chose myself, again, grown, calm, and helping everyone in the scene, which was intuitive for me.

It's telling that you choose yourself, Lighter, to stand up for yourself.

I think it helps me to hold my parents with compassion and give them the help they didn't have while raising young children.  Their parents didn't know better.  Their parents knew they were "special" and IMO my grandparents saw us, the grandchildren, as extensions of their children.... not separate, or worthy of the same gc treatment, certainly.  Well, my brother was golden child II on my father's side of the family, but that had all kinds of biases towards men tied in also.  My mother's side didn't see any grandchildren as important as my mother.
 My mother's figure was more important than breastfeeding babies, for instance.
 There was never a question mom would swallow that little pill that made her milk fall out at once.  God only knows what they put in those earlier man-made formulas doctors shoved down mother's throats as "better than mother's milk."  Asses. See there?  I identify that harsh judgment and I do think it points to my inability to release judging myself.  It comes and goes, IME.   


I went through the story as I wished it had happened, and that went pretty quick, compared to the other stuff.  I noticed the original story was getting more difficult to bring into focus when I tried and was just not coming up for me when I tried to picture it as we went along.

Then it was time to put everything/pictures/stories/pain into a box from the original story, or from a set of years, or an entire lifetime, or just an entire childhood, and I chose all the upsetting incidents I could recall, put them in the box, and chose total destruction through burning.

I built the fire in my firepit, and there were family members... everyone close, all deceased, and my siblings when they were younger, and our grandparents and parents comforted sibs and my younger self while I burned the entire box to ashes.  Mom served food from a picnic basket.... children napped.... everyone sat in the old-time yard chairs from my Paternal grandparent's yard. 

I love that there was a picnic :)  Does T talk you through that story or do you create that in your mind?

I'm super private, so I mostly go through these steps on my own, without telling T about it as it happens.   I don't think I could speak about it,
 bc I'm just THERE, in that place visualizing, and it takes a lot of energy.  A LOT of energy.  Afterwards, the T always asks questions about how things went, besides asking me about how the feeling in my body changed or didn't change.  She wants to know who I picked to be present, what we were doing, if I burned the box of pictures down to complete ash..... she asks for details, but only after I've processed in my own way, in silence, during EMDR to the finish.  If she asks for any detail in the middle, I don't remember it, and I think I'd be put off by it, and perhaps thrown out of the moment. 

About what the T says when she asks me to choose someone... .she'll say some people select a Saint, or a protective family member, or a superhero, or themselves as an empowered competent adult, and give me choices. I think I just nod when I have it, and I don't necessarily tell her what I picked... maybe after that EMDR moment passes, and we're checking somatic responses she asks. 
If I was the T I'd want to know!  I'd want more feedback, and this T does ask for it, eventually, but I doubt I'd share much if she didn't gently enquire, and she begins her inquiries by sharing her experience with that kind of session, or of another person's experience or of common experiences which do make me curious,
 and engages me from a place of wanting to see how my experience stacks up to other people's.   I find myself really interested in hearing more, and I give her something of my experience,and she reciprocates, and it's a give and take.
  I would shut down if I felt she was barging into my experience for the sake of entertainment, which used to bother me with my FOO.  She gently tip toes around my boundaries in a super respectful, overtly compassionate manner that IMHO is required to get to this place FOR ME.  A bossy T, telling me what I MUST DO, how and when would not suit me at all, IME.

Like I said before, I remember more as the sessions go on.  Maybe discussions afterwards, with me back in a good place, are what stick, or help the memories stick with more detail, and expanded content?


When the deed was done, I think we got up, and headed toward a bridge to our new lives.  At the bridges edge we stopped to empty our pockets of everything from the past that needed to be left behind.  I just had us take off all our clothes, and walk across the bridge in white cotton shifts, shorts and tee shirts. 

When we got there we explored how that felt, then pictured a fountain.

Babies played in the spray, and grandparents sat on the edge, or in chairs by the side, and I dived in, and twirled, and did backflips in the water over and over... just all in, immersed, and refreshed.

I didn't think about the original story, bc in memory reconsolidation you want to let the new story continue processing as is.  Every time we bring up a picture or story it's changed.  Never static.  It was easy to leave it alone, as it was the first time we did this for a different story..... I'd say I was 4 yo for the first one, and 11yo for the second story.

Those two stories were traced back from current trigger stories, and we worked on them until there was zero emotional charges involved with any aspect of the original story or the present-day triggers we started with.

It's easier to lean into the discomfort of this work when I know and trust it leads to processing the story, and into a serene place of relief, and gratitude it's done.  I believe it will last, and so far so good... it's 100% remained in place.  Old stories gone. 

It's amazing that it's re-wiring your brain like this.  And doing physical good, I imagine, by unlocking and unblocking things.

I see it as relieving stress in the brain, bringing up traumatic events, moving them into processing centers/midbrain/feeling areas, checking the somatic input, working on the somatic with EMDR, checking the feelings, presenting the story to the brain again with EMDR, then checking the feelings, and how it looks, what's changed, etc.  EMDR on the feelings to further reduce stress,  then checking, and we just keep presenting the information to the brain, over and over while relieving stress.  We don't move on to the next phase till we get to zeros or near zeros. 

New stories in place... I experience so much relief where there was a lot of pain, tough emotions, and painful bodily sensations.  Like a thousand pounds lifted.  I don't care what the pounds were, or where they went, though I visualize them as
engaging unprocessed emotions in the amygdala....
the T assists with brain integration, helping to bring other parts of the brain online to support the amygdala, relieve tension around the story and in the brain, and make it possible to move that story into the processing center, then present it again and again to be processed until the brain has calmed enough to complete processing and file it into historic files in just the way I would have had that story go IF I HAD CONTROL OVER THE SITUATION. 

I can't tell you how satisfying it is to EXPERIENCE that outcome, and process.... just the details that come out of my mouth when asked how I'd rather have had that experience go.... I'm always shocked by the details and direction, and those things come without having to think, typically, or with very little reflection.  It feels like just the right answers were always there, waiting.

This is a pretty close approximating, and I didn't remember the fire, or the bridge, or the fountain from the first time we completed this process.  It felt like we were doing this for the first time. 

Shiftring into fight or flight mode feels a lot like being blindfolded and gagged.... sat on..... forced into a corner.....  unable to move or shift out of that space, and it's EVERYTHING.....
I just didn't have the ability to remember those parts of the process when we completed the experience the first time.

I must not have had access to the parts of my brain that create new memories while I was IN that place..... and this time.... that I can remember more.... for me means I've calmed my brain enough to have some restored access during times of intense stress.... of reducing the stress, and it's hoped every time we get through this, along with consistent practice to fire and wire new neural pathways... I'll achieve more resilience, finish processing the unprocessed triggers from most to least powerful,  until I'm able to regulate my emotions consistently as default setting.  If not, I'll know how to calm myself and move into a place where I can regulate my emotions.

Will be so amazing for you to get to a point where all you're dealing with is right here and right now, Lighter, and being able to put all that energy into creating things that you want, rather than dealing with things that you don't.  So amazing and much deserved.

Sometimes when we do check-ins at the end of a session, something will come up... 2 sessions ago it was a T who harmed me and my children... the court-appointed T who terrorized us an entire summer, and made my children fear they'd be taken from me and given to their paternal grandparents in 2013.... THAT woman, the thought of her... that she made my youngest feel responsible for that terror....  is still in place, and T said it's my own self-judgment that's behind that, which shut me up, and made me think. 

What does she mean by your self-judgement, Lighter?  I was a bit confused by that.  It's quite early here :) Lol

T wants me to understand I've always done the best I could in every moment, considering the circumstances, widen my gaze, and understand that everyone is doing their best with that they have.  My judging someone else means I haven't dropped judgment.  I'm still flipping back into that mode.  If I'm judging others, I'm certainly judging myself,  and if I'm judging others I haven't widened my gaze to understand all humans are flawed, and doing their best, which relieves me of the need and desire to judge anything or anyone.  Things aren't personal. They just are.

Two appointments ago we worked on cutting energetic ties with imaginary scissors.  This was about that backstabbing pain again.  She associated this with energetic ties between people that keep us joined.  She said I could ask higher powers of my choice, that make sense to me, to help.  For instance, I could ask a beloved Grandfather to use his pocket knife, so familiar from our fishing trips.  Someone who believes in Saints, and is comfortable asking them for help might picture that Saint using a sword to cut that tie, and so on.   


Just shutting down the cycle is an amazing thing.  Bringing my attention to it.... and knocking the stuffing out of rage that's building and building... is an amazing thing.

Yesterday T told the story of monks burying a golden buddha in mud when their village was ransacked and overtaken by an enemy.  Years later, after all the monks were gone, a child saw the glint of gold, leading to uncovering this beautiful buddha, and that reminded me of Tupp.   

Lol, I often look in the mirror and think I look like I've been dug up, Lighter :)  Lol
Today I honestly considered getting dreadlocks.  For real, lol. I'm questioning my idea of what I should look like, and what society tells me I should look like.  Widening my gaze; )

Just clearing out all the mud, and garbage, and judgments other people installed when we weren't able to defend ourselves, or make sense of it at the time. 

Now that we're adults, and capable of defending ourselves.... and in my case, with help from a good T maybe to show me how, and keep me focused....
we uninstall the garbage, and remember what was always there.

And that brings me back to the gray black excercise.  We're reconsolidating and changing the garbage stories INTO the original truth.

It's not hard.  It's not a difficult process.  It's relieving stress in the brain so the brain can do what it does efficiently WHEN IT'S NOT STUCK IN FIGHT OR FLIGHT MODE/amygdala/reptilian brain.  We're remembering what's been there from the start, and will always be there.

One last thing about yesterday's appointment.... I didn't realize I held some of the beliefs around the story of my ASPD N husband, and the first night he assaulted me and I thought I would be killed while listening to my oldest 4yo dd call our for me.... THAT is something I've never processed, and thinking about it was like experiencing someone else's feelings and thoughts about it, bc I just haven't done it.  Ever. 

Terrifying, Lighter, and more so because of the kids.  I had one aggressive incident with son's father.  He had me backed against a wall and was screaming in my face - not physically touching, but very aggressive, very violent, very unpleasant.  Son was asleep in his cot, very young at the time, but what was going through my mind was that I could easily get away from this idiot and get out the front door - but I couldn't easily get away, get up the stairs, get son, get back down the stairs and get past him to get out the front door with son in my arms.  I have more experiences of being trapped, thinking I'd die, while frantically trying to think my way OUT of the house, with my purse, with my car keys, with my children.... just not die, and which door I might get to, and the desperate acceptance I'd have to go without the girls or we'd all be done,  and these racing terrible truths... that I'd never be able to outrun him in the street, or to the door.... putting the butcher block between us, then the dining room table... and I could have circled forever, bc not circling was death.  I think I'll be working on this stuff in the next session, and it's not scary.  I lean in bc I want to release the energy tying me to it, and be free of it.  I deserve to be free of it, and that's the mission now; )  And if I got out I wouldn't have any feeds, nappies or a change of clothes for son, either. Once I dreamed a nuclear blast was heading towards us, and I was getting things together for after we were killed by it.  I got diapers, and clean foot in jammies together, and it felt SO real.  The mommy imperative...  the desire to care for our young... to attend to them is so strong. In some of us anyway.  Not all. It makes a huge difference when your kids are being exposed to that level of violence as well.  I think all violence is detrimental to the children.  The statistics say exposure to parent on parent violence is just as detrimental as experiencing the violence for children.  We were, as children, although with us it was usually my mum attacking my dad.  Makes it a much harder thing to deal with and yes, processing will be tough. For me, the physical assault was devastating, and threat to my children all but shut me down emotionally, and physically.  I don't know what the massage T did, but he hurt me quite badly in order to get my lungs working again.  I think something was locked, and pressing into my lungs, as I recall.  It's all a blurr.  Interpersonal terrorism should be reevaluated, IMO.  The same way the courts changed their view of chokeholds...  terrorizing dependent family members and children should be reevaluated with stiffer mandatory punishments that deter, or stop abusers in their tracks bc they're in jail, trying to get bond, IN a system that's difficult to get out of once they're in. Take some of the pay off OUT of the equation. Educating everyone, so those abused are more likely to report the first or second assault... teaching people what abuse looks like, etc.  So many people are raised in abusive homes, it feels and IS normal to them.  Honestly, men hitting little children, and babies for heaven's sake.  Why would we allow that, particularly female children? I never wanted that to be my children's normal... being hit by men who are supposed to love and protect them.   That's just nuts  It never made any sense to me when I started researching discipline, and really LOOKED at my childhood, and how most people in this culture approach child discipline.  I taught my girls no one had the right to put hands on them in anger.  They shouldn't accept name-calling, raised voices, or word salad when engaged or trying to engage in discussions.  But such a relief, I would have thought.  You might need to change your name from Lighter to Lightest :)  Lol

You know, that's a great idea, ((Tupp!))
Lighter


I didn't recognize my own belief system about it.  I'd never asked myself, or allowed myself to process it. 

It's time, and that one thing leads to a hundred, IME.

The journey continues.

Lighter

Phew!  A lot of work, Lighter, but so rewarding!  I am thinking I might look for an EMDR therapist to help me process everything that comes up as I tackle my paperwork mountain next year.  32 boxes and lever arch files, all representing nearly two decades of abuse, inequality and repeated experiences.  Mmm.  Might be worth investing in some practical support to get through that.  I will look into it further.  Thank you so much for sharing all of this.  I'm glad you are finding it all so useful xx

Hopalong

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Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread
« Reply #59 on: December 08, 2019, 06:31:13 PM »
This is some of the most intensely detailed stuff I've read about work within those energy or energy-conceived parts of our existence.

I don't have much to add to it, except that I think it's powerful.

Closest thing I ever experienced was repeated shiatsu massages at one point in my life after an injury, from a practitioner I knew and trusted. She ended every session with Reiki, which I didn't understand but trusted because I trusted her.

I always felt more than my hurt body was helped by those sessions. She later died in an accident in S. Africa where she was helping people affected by the AIDS epidemic, which tells you something about the kind of person she was.

Hugs
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."